Galiano Island Local Trust Committee regular meeting, February 18, 2025

[0:00:05] Voice 2: Okay, ready to go. Okay, welcome everybody to the Board of Variants for Galeano Island.

[0:00:25] Voice 2: Like just to state that we're, I'm here attending virtually the traditional territories of the

[0:00:32] Voice 2: WSANUCH people and I'm very grateful to be here. My name is Kim Stockdill and I am the Board of

[0:00:39] Voice 2: of Variants Secretary. And since we do not have a chair for the Board of Variants yet, we do have

[0:00:47] Voice 2: an agenda before us. And silly me, I actually don't have the agenda before us, but he knows

[0:00:55] Voice 2: that the first item on the agenda is the selection of the chair. And I've emailed those procedures

[0:01:02] Voice 2: to each of the Board of Variants members. I just want to confirm that you've received those?

[0:01:07] Voice 6: Yes.

[0:01:08] Voice 6: I've received mine, yes.

[0:01:09] Voice 6: Okay.

[0:01:12] Voice 2: So in terms of the chair election procedures, would somebody like to nominate a Board of

[0:01:23] Voice 2: Variants member?

[0:01:25] Voice 2: I

[0:01:25] Voice 3: would like to

[0:01:26] Voice 7: nominate anybody

[0:01:27] Voice 3: other than me, as I haven't been out of this for a little

[0:01:30] Voice 3: while, and I don't have really strong internet connection.

[0:01:35] Voice 3: So I'm concerned that I might fall by the wayside.

[0:01:38] Voice 3: So what I'm doing is not nominating myself and asking nobody else to nominate me due to my ability to stay with this meeting.

[0:01:49] Voice 6: Well, in that case, I would nominate Bert because he has some experience here.

[0:01:54] Voice 6: I mean, mine is too, but it's a long time ago.

[0:01:56] Voice 6: I think Bert's more current than possibly us two.

[0:02:01] Voice 8: Thanks, Dennis.

[0:02:02] Voice 8: I'm willing to accept.

[0:02:03] Voice 8: Except I have recently, well, I'm on the board of variants for North Pender and South Pender.

[0:02:08] Voice 8: And I've been in meetings this past year on both of those boards.

[0:02:13] Voice 8: So I'm used to the process.

[0:02:15] Voice 8: So thanks.

[0:02:17] Voice 3: That'll be helpful.

[0:02:18] Voice 8: Looks like you're in a warm spot, Dennis.

[0:02:21] Voice 6: I'm way down in southern Mexico right now.

[0:02:24] Voice 6: That's why I'm dressed like this.

[0:02:25] Voice 6: I wasn't expecting this meeting.

[0:02:27] Voice 6: I'm sorry.

[0:02:30] Voice 3: I thought I'd just been to gym class.

[0:02:33] Voice 6: i

[0:02:33] Voice 8: thought you i thought you should uh make an acknowledgement of the uh the first nation land

[0:02:39] Voice 8: that you're uh you're on now where are you uh

[0:02:44] Voice 6: we're just out we're just outside of puerto

[0:02:46] Voice 6: escondido which is way down south in oaxaca state it's almost in guatemala and uh by the way we are

[0:02:53] Voice 6: on uh the equivalent of first nations land here it is indigenous

[0:02:57] Voice 6: land that uh we're on cool

[0:03:00] Voice 3: good

[0:03:01] Voice 3: that's good

[0:03:01] Voice 2: to hear wonderful so going back to the procedures is there any more nominations

[0:03:12] Voice 2: hearing no further nominations the nominations are declared closed so if we only have the one

[0:03:19] Voice 2: nominee uh then the board of variants uh member burt hall will is declared as the chair of the

[0:03:26] Voice 2: board of variants so i will pass it over to you chair and i did notice in the agenda which i did

[0:03:32] Voice 2: not have before me that i skipped over the approval of the agenda so perhaps i could i

[0:03:38] Voice 2: give that back to you to see if there's um if the board uh approves the agenda as is okay thanks kim

[0:03:44] Voice 8: uh is there any um additions necessary for the agenda if not then we will consider it to be

[0:03:53] Voice 8: approved. On to item four, which is the minutes of the August 19th, 2021 meeting. And Priscilla,

[0:04:04] Voice 8: you're the only incumbent that was on the board at the time. So if there's any discussion about

[0:04:12] Voice 8: that particular meeting, perhaps you could provide that. Otherwise, it's strictly administrative to

[0:04:19] Voice 8: to approve those.

[0:04:22] Voice 3: I was incumbent on the board,

[0:04:24] Voice 3: but I was not at that meeting.

[0:04:25] Voice 3: I have not discussed or seen this piece of land.

[0:04:29] Voice 3: And part of my reticence here is when I have been

[0:04:35] Voice 3: on the board of variants, we have always visited sites

[0:04:37] Voice 3: and I feel slightly off my game with not being able to see,

[0:04:43] Voice 3: actually see the site.

[0:04:45] Voice 3: So many things become apparent when you're there in person.

[0:04:48] Voice 3: and you can also ask questions that are timely

[0:04:51] Voice 3: and are really related to the land.

[0:04:54] Voice 3: So I have no administrative comments to that meeting.

[0:04:59] Voice 3: That's the question, right?

[0:05:01] Voice 8: Yes.

[0:05:02] Voice 3: Okay.

[0:05:03] Voice 8: Okay, well, your point is taken.

[0:05:05] Voice 8: I know on other variance requests,

[0:05:10] Voice 8: I have attended the sites,

[0:05:11] Voice 8: so we can maybe get into that at a later time,

[0:05:15] Voice 8: but we do have-

[0:05:16] Voice 3: I would appreciate that.

[0:05:17] Voice 8: We do have photos from the staff attendance on the site.

[0:05:23] Voice 8: Okay.

[0:05:24] Voice 8: So back to the minutes, I'll just say that we had to approve some minutes where there were no incumbents from a meeting on the South Pender Board of Variants.

[0:05:36] Voice 8: And we were told that even though there is really no way to check if those minutes are

[0:05:44] Voice 8: accurate or not, administratively, we just by virtue of the process, we need to approve

[0:05:50] Voice 8: those.

[0:05:51] Voice 8: So I'll start with that.

[0:05:52] Voice 8: And does anybody...

[0:05:54] Voice 8: That sounds very administrative.

[0:05:56] Voice 3: Well,

[0:05:57] Voice 8: we did talk at that meeting about perhaps revisiting the process.

[0:06:04] Voice 8: And Kim, you might want to pay attention to this, because we suggested at that Board of Variants meeting that sometime shortly after the meeting, perhaps they could be reviewed, the minutes could be reviewed by the board, so that we can get those comments back while it's in our memory, as opposed to the next time the board might meet, because it may be several years from now before that happens again.

[0:06:30] Voice 8: So I'll

[0:06:32] Voice 3: leave that with staff.

[0:06:33] Voice 3: Very good observation. Useful for everybody.

[0:06:37] Voice 8: Okay. I'll leave that with staff to take care of.

[0:06:40] Voice 8: And that said, if we have no comments about those minutes, then I suggest that we just approve them.

[0:06:48] Voice 8: Any dissension?

[0:06:52] Voice 8: Consider it done. Thank you.

[0:06:55] Voice 8: On to the application at hand, which is 2024-0273 Carruthers.

[0:07:05] Voice 8: So, Kim, do you do a preamble on this for us?

[0:07:11] Voice 8: Yeah,

[0:07:12] Voice 2: absolutely.

[0:07:13] Voice 2: I'd be happy to go over the staff report if the chair and board agrees.

[0:07:19] Voice 2: I'm happy to do that.

[0:07:20] Voice 2: And I just wanted to note that the applicant, Michael Carruthers, as well as Brent Davis and Aaron Willows, are also here in attendance.

[0:07:29] Voice 2: So after I present on the staff report, if you have any further questions, they're here to answer those questions for you.

[0:07:35] Voice 8: Very good. Thank you.

[0:07:37] Voice 2: Where are they here?

[0:07:39] Voice 2: They are, so they have their camera and microphone off right now.

[0:07:43] Voice 2: So Michael, his camera's on now.

[0:07:45] Voice 2: Due to bandwidth, though, we always say, you know, if you can keep your camera off for the time being, that's great.

[0:07:52] Voice 2: But when we, after I presented the staff report and there's questions at that point in time, then they can turn their camera on and also their microphone.

[0:08:02] Voice 2: Thank you.

[0:08:03] Voice 8: No idea.

[0:08:05] Voice 8: Okay, just so we know who's on the call with us then.

[0:08:10] Voice 8: Sorry, Erin Willows is?

[0:08:12] Voice 8: is

[0:08:12] Voice 2: she's the archaeologist hired by the applicant okay

[0:08:17] Voice 8: um and michael crothers is the proponent

[0:08:21] Voice 8: that's correct

[0:08:22] Voice 8: there's uh brent uh dennis dennis

[0:08:25] Voice 2: yes is the professional engineer oh the engineer

[0:08:29] Voice 8: okay

[0:08:30] Voice 2: yes and we also have bruce belcher who is a planner too in the victoria office who's been

[0:08:37] Voice 2: assisting with this application and was also the one to make a site visit a few weeks ago in the

[0:08:44] Voice 8: snow okay good to know thank you and we

[0:08:47] Voice 8: have and then we have carly recording that's right good

[0:08:50] Voice 8: okay good now that's

[0:08:51] Voice 3: really good to know i wouldn't have intuited that that there were

[0:08:54] Voice 3: that the rest of the people were here and i'm glad they are

[0:08:59] Voice 8: okay back to you um back to you

[0:09:06] Voice 8: Kim to give us a I guess a preamble on what to expect here. Thank

[0:09:12] Voice 2: you Chair. So there is a staff

[0:09:14] Voice 2: report attached to this agenda for the Board of Variants application 2024-0273 and the purpose of

[0:09:24] Voice 2: this staff report is to go over and appeal to the Board of Variants to vary the Galliano land use

[0:09:30] Voice 2: bylaw for the front interior side lot lines and the setback to the natural boundary of the sea

[0:09:37] Voice 2: for an existing sewage absorption field septic tanks and retaining wall on the subject property

[0:09:45] Voice 2: so page one of the staff report you can see the the list of the three variances

[0:09:52] Voice 2: requested and those are also attached in the the notice for the board of variants the applicants

[0:09:59] Voice 2: also provided a rationale which is attached to the staff report and the applicant's rationale

[0:10:08] Voice 2: they stated that the existing septic field there's actually a dwelling unit and a cottage

[0:10:14] Voice 2: that are on the subject property and the septic field for the cottage is getting older and

[0:10:21] Voice 2: starting to fail therefore upgrades are required and the intention is to connect the cottage

[0:10:29] Voice 2: to the septic field for the dwelling unit.

[0:10:33] Voice 2: This plan also requires an upgrade to the tanks

[0:10:37] Voice 2: to accommodate the addition of the cabin,

[0:10:41] Voice 2: and also there's a proposal for a new bathroom in the house.

[0:10:46] Voice 2: So the site is quite, there's a steep slope.

[0:10:50] Voice 2: As mentioned in the staff report,

[0:10:53] Voice 2: there is a portion of the property in the steep slope development permit area,

[0:10:57] Voice 2: and the majority of the property is actually registered in archaeological site and that's

[0:11:03] Voice 2: why the applicant has actually provided a report by Aaron Willows who is joining us today

[0:11:08] Voice 2: and the report states that due to the archaeological characteristics of the property

[0:11:15] Voice 2: and the property is primarily within the archaeological site that the tank should

[0:11:22] Voice 2: not actually be buried anywhere on the property and in fact they should be raised just to ensure

[0:11:27] Voice 2: sure that the midden on the property stays undisturbed. In addition, the property owner

[0:11:34] Voice 2: hired a professional engineer who's joined us here, Brent Dennis, and has provided guidance

[0:11:40] Voice 2: in terms of the septic requirements and location. And they've stated that, or within those report,

[0:11:47] Voice 2: they stated that the area where the proposed above-ground tanks are located is suitable

[0:11:53] Voice 2: due to the steep slopes elsewhere on the property

[0:11:57] Voice 2: and the inability to actually dig the tanks down.

[0:12:01] Voice 2: The recommendation is to keep them above ground.

[0:12:07] Voice 2: And the intent is also to build a retaining wall

[0:12:11] Voice 2: around these tanks and also cover them with dirt

[0:12:16] Voice 2: to protect them from UV light.

[0:12:22] Voice 2: Just going through the staff report here.

[0:12:24] Voice 2: So, in terms of an impact to neighboring properties, the impact is pretty minimal, based on the fact that the property to the south is a cemetery, and also notice was circulated to adjacent property owners, and we've received no comments back.

[0:12:41] Voice 2: In terms of the Board of Variants looking at this application in terms of a minor being a minor variance and undue hardship, the Local Government Act establishes that a Board of Variants may order that a minor variance be permitted, provided that the Board finds that undue hardship would be caused to the applicant if the variance is not granted.

[0:13:08] Voice 2: And I'll come back to that a little bit later as well.

[0:13:12] Voice 2: And the applicants have provided a response to that question as to what they believe would be undue hardship if the variance is not granted.

[0:13:21] Voice 2: The intent of the regulations that are being varied.

[0:13:25] Voice 2: First, the setback to the natural boundary of the sea.

[0:13:28] Voice 2: In the staff report, staff have listed the intent of the setback, primarily to protect the natural environment, the sensitive shoreline, align the land use bylaw regulations with those of the Ministry of Health and Island Health, and to limit any visual impacts of adjacent properties.

[0:13:46] Voice 2: And that's similar to the intent of the front and interior size setbacks.

[0:13:51] Voice 2: And it's also to maintain that rule character and to ensure that whatever is proposed is respectful of the residential development within the area as well.

[0:14:05] Voice 2: I did briefly mention that an archaeological report was provided.

[0:14:10] Voice 2: And the staff report highlights the recommendations from that report.

[0:14:15] Voice 2: And just note that the archaeological reports cannot be released publicly, but I'm very thankful that Erin Willows has joined us today to answer any specific questions the Board of Variants may have.

[0:14:27] Voice 2: I just want to highlight also the legislative requirements.

[0:14:32] Voice 2: The Board of Variants, the powers within, is really outlined in the Local Government Act.

[0:14:38] Voice 2: and it is up to the board of variants to determine what constitutes a minor variance

[0:14:45] Voice 2: and whether or not undue hardship has been proven. So this is highlighted in the staff report

[0:14:52] Voice 2: section 540 a1 of the local government act states that if a person alleges that compliance with

[0:15:02] Voice 2: any of the following would cause a person hardship and one of those is a bylaw respecting the

[0:15:08] Voice 2: the siting dimensions or size of a building or structure. Furthermore, Section 542 of the Local

[0:15:16] Voice 2: Government Act establishes that a Board of Variants may only order that a minor variant

[0:15:23] Voice 2: may be permitted if the Board of Variants agrees with the following, and there's a list in the

[0:15:29] Voice 2: staff report, and those are that the Board of Variants has heard from the applicant or those

[0:15:35] Voice 2: persons notified under section 541. The Board of Variants finds that undue hardship would be caused

[0:15:44] Voice 2: by the applicant if they had to comply and is of the opinion that the variance or exemption does

[0:15:50] Voice 2: not do any of the following and that results in an inappropriate development of the site,

[0:15:55] Voice 2: it adversely affects the natural environment, substantially affects the use and enjoyment of

[0:16:01] Voice 2: the adjacent land, varies permitted use and densities under the applicable bylaw, defeats

[0:16:07] Voice 2: the intent of the bylaw, or varies the application of applicable bylaw in relation to residential

[0:16:14] Voice 2: tenure, rental tenure.

[0:16:17] Voice 2: So staff have confirmed that the requirements as set out in the Local Government Act have

[0:16:23] Voice 2: been met, and those are stated in the staff report.

[0:16:27] Voice 2: So, at this point, the Board of Variants should really be satisfied that all requirements have been adhered to, and those are listed on page 8 of the staff report.

[0:16:37] Voice 2: And just to highlight those again, the Board of Variants must be satisfied that the variance is minor in nature.

[0:16:44] Voice 2: The owner would experience a hardship if the appeal is not granted.

[0:16:49] Voice 2: The variance would not result in inappropriate development of the site, adversely affect the natural environment, and would not result in substantial effect of the use and enjoyment of the adjacent land, and would not defeat the intent of the bylaw.

[0:17:06] Voice 2: And so I have provided a draft motion for the Board of Variances consideration there.

[0:17:12] Voice 2: That's on page eight of the staff report.

[0:17:15] Voice 2: So what I'll do at this point, Chair, is to turn it back to you.

[0:17:19] Voice 2: Staff, I'm happy to provide any answers to questions you have in terms of legislative questions or procedural.

[0:17:27] Voice 2: As I mentioned, the applicant is here and also Brent Davis and Aaron Willows.

[0:17:32] Voice 2: Thank you.

[0:17:33] Voice 8: Thank you, Kim.

[0:17:35] Voice 8: And we shouldn't be remiss to mention that Bruce Belcher did attend the site on our behalf.

[0:17:42] Voice 8: And if we have questions about the site itself and whether there's any other possible ways to solve these problems, we should ask him, having seen the site.

[0:17:53] Voice 8: I think it's important to note also that the buildings have been there for a significant length of time, and this has nothing to do with the building.

[0:17:59] Voice 8: So the only thing that we're meeting to discuss is the septic tank location and whether to vary the setbacks from 7.5 on the road setback to 7.1 and on the side yard boundary adjacent to the cemetery from 6.0 meters to 0.4 meters.

[0:18:21] Voice 8: And then, secondly, there's an existing septic field, dispersal field, that's in place, and the plan here is to bring it into compliance of the bylaw by allowing a variance on its location, if I read it correctly, such that the septic field will be in the same location.

[0:18:47] Voice 8: the new septic field would replace the old one in the exact same location with a more modern and

[0:18:53] Voice 8: better system to protect the environment while staying in the same place and not excavating

[0:19:01] Voice 8: anything outside of that area that might infringe on the archaeological importance of the site. Is

[0:19:07] Voice 8: that correct? Okay, just wanted to make sure I understood it fully then. So that said, let's

[0:19:16] Voice 8: uh open it up to uh dennis and priscilla for any questions um

[0:19:21] Voice 3: before we do that if you wouldn't

[0:19:23] Voice 3: mind just to hear and also dennis just to hear me i would very much like to hear from um aaron

[0:19:30] Voice 3: willows in a more expanded form and perhaps the other person who um uh is the septic person and

[0:19:40] Voice 3: And whoever else, anybody else

[0:19:41] Voice 3: might think would have the kind of information that is specific to their area, because I think that would very much add to the conversation and the conclusion that we've drawn.

[0:19:55] Voice 8: Okay, very good, Priscilla.

[0:19:56] Voice 8: Can I

[0:19:57] Voice 6: also add a comment to that?

[0:20:00] Voice 6: that um i noticed the uh aaron willow's comments were reflecting um the situation of the tanks

[0:20:08] Voice 6: which is one thing but we never had her comments on the field and that's why i asked to see if she

[0:20:13] Voice 6: could attend and then give us that information i realized that the survey itself and the information

[0:20:17] Voice 6: is confidential but i thought she could spread some light about the sighting of the field and

[0:20:24] Voice 6: just to give us some background about that from her point of view okay

[0:20:28] Voice 8: very good i agree with

[0:20:29] Voice 8: both of those points. So Erin maybe you can expand on what we know about the archaeological importance

[0:20:35] Voice 8: and the impact that these variances might have on that.

[0:20:40] Voice 9: Yes, so the site itself is highly

[0:20:42] Voice 9: significant. It's known to have ancestral remains including on this specific property that were

[0:20:48] Voice 9: identified back in the 1970s and then again during our work. So part of the approval for our Heritage

[0:20:55] Voice 9: conservation act permits was the property owner working with the existing design to minimize any

[0:21:00] Voice 9: additional excavation where not necessary so just kind of working with the system

[0:21:05] Voice 9: just to really reduce the risk of any unnecessary impacts to the site especially with ancestral

[0:21:10] Voice 9: remains the preference from the wasanich nations is always to leave them in situ when possible

[0:21:15] Voice 9: however once they get exposed then it can get complicated and we have to get consent from all

[0:21:20] Voice 9: all the different nations so when we can avoid ground disturbance knowing the remains um they're

[0:21:25] Voice 9: in proximity to house and in the slope and then up on the kind of higher area in the back avoiding

[0:21:30] Voice 9: all those areas was ideal so we were supportive of the alternative to use as much of the existing

[0:21:36] Voice 9: infrastructure as possible.

[0:21:39] Voice 8: Aaron when did you do your assessment of the site?

[0:21:42] Voice 9: Um I did my first

[0:21:43] Voice 9: site visit just to do a quick walk over in 2021 and then did the assessment in 2022 2023. thank you

[0:21:55] Voice 8: okay uh priscilla and dennis any erin do you know i think go ahead go ahead um

[0:22:02] Voice 3: i i looked at the

[0:22:03] Voice 3: site gallagher bay as as a a long time any of us who've traveled back and forth on the ferries are

[0:22:09] Voice 3: are really familiar with that beautiful little bay it's a very um um circumscribed bay between

[0:22:18] Voice 3: two sandstone rocky shores and um i i sure see the value in not disturbing any more beyond the

[0:22:29] Voice 3: colonial houses you know that were put in probably 30s 40s or something like that any of that area

[0:22:37] Voice 3: and um i would very much want to be assured that there is i hear about a retaining wall being put

[0:22:44] Voice 3: in dirt being brought in to me it looks like pretty much that whole upland would have been a

[0:22:50] Voice 3: um a midden it just looks like the perfect place for all the places that i've looked around i

[0:22:56] Voice 3: i don't know if that's what you found uh so that's that's really critical to me it's a um

[0:23:03] Voice 3: um you know that there is i'm glad that the um septic is being upgraded because obviously that's

[0:23:10] Voice 3: going to go right into the ocean the way probably the way it was set up i'm uh thoughtful about the

[0:23:17] Voice 3: cemetery i know that there is um that cemetery has is no longer in use it's a very dense and

[0:23:25] Voice 3: old settled area and that means a lot to me um also being the keeper of the cemetery on saturn

[0:23:32] Voice 3: So I see a number of old uses of that place that are settled and have value. So the value that I see is that the septic would be not running into the ocean. And since the slope on it is very acute, I would want to be satisfied that it's going to be taken care of in the upland.

[0:23:55] Voice 3: but I'm not sure about if someone is considering putting a retaining wall plus dirt that I am

[0:24:02] Voice 3: hoping is brought in from somewhere else but I don't know what what are your thoughts on that

[0:24:08] Voice 9: my um so there is the existing retaining wall that's there and originally there was discussion

[0:24:14] Voice 9: of whether that was going to be refurbished but because of the site being right there and the

[0:24:18] Voice 9: ancestral remains being known from kind of just being behind that wall for the work in the 70s

[0:24:22] Voice 9: the alternative was just to help with erosion just some oh got Michael there I

[0:24:29] Voice 4: don't know if

[0:24:30] Voice 4: you were in the loop on the retaining wall Aaron the retaining wall is just a small like a few feet

[0:24:34] Voice 4: high wall in front of the tanks just to help hold the dirt in it's not the retaining the beach

[0:24:39] Voice 4: retaining wall the retaining wall and the variance what we had talked about with Brent was putting

[0:24:44] Voice 4: just a small stone retaining wall along the front of the septic tanks and then that way we could

[0:24:49] Voice 4: pile the dirt behind it and it would take up you know less dirt basically by having a small

[0:24:54] Voice 4: retaining wall just to like

[0:24:55] Voice 8: yeah that's

[0:24:56] Voice 4: and i just

[0:24:56] Voice 8: wanted to make sure aaron was aware that

[0:25:00] Voice 8: that's the retaining wall that i believe priscilla is concerned okay

[0:25:02] Voice 9: no i'm not as familiar with that

[0:25:04] Voice 9: i

[0:25:04] Voice 4: should confirm that that's

[0:25:06] Voice 8: good thanks michael so so to be clear then where the tanks are being

[0:25:10] Voice 8: located they're proposing a retaining wall um i guess um the question priscilla's got is there

[0:25:16] Voice 8: any concern about putting that new retaining wall in as it pertains to your work i don't know

[0:25:20] Voice 3: couldn't tell how tall the tanks were you're talking about to save them from uv damage about

[0:25:26] Voice 3: putting dirt on them what fill me fill me in on that as it were please somebody maybe we might go

[0:25:35] Voice 5: on

[0:25:35] Voice 8: brent oh there he is okay i was going to

[0:25:36] Voice 8: say you might want to help on this one

[0:25:38] Voice 5: yeah yeah um

[0:25:40] Voice 5: The tanks are polyethylene. And the only thing that degrades polyethylene over time really is

[0:25:48] Voice 5: UV light. So regardless of how they get installed, they should be protected from that.

[0:25:55] Voice 5: And certainly there's different ways to keep the UV light off. But in this situation,

[0:26:02] Voice 5: we also have some concern about earthquake stability.

[0:26:09] Voice 5: And so putting a soil berm around the tanks

[0:26:13] Voice 5: handles both of those concerns.

[0:26:16] Voice 5: And the retaining wall is just to,

[0:26:20] Voice 5: the tanks, by the way, are about four feet,

[0:26:23] Voice 5: four and a half feet high.

[0:26:24] Voice 3: Right, that's what I needed.

[0:26:26] Voice 5: Yeah, so you can imagine that about a two to one

[0:26:29] Voice 5: or three to one slope,

[0:26:30] Voice 5: If we don't retain it, it's going to cover a

[0:26:35] Voice 5: great deal of the area.

[0:26:39] Voice 5: And so that's the purpose of the retaining wall.

[0:26:42] Voice 5: As Michael said, it reduces the amount of soil that's required to accomplish the task.

[0:26:48] Voice 5: And, you know, typically it then, well, I guess it's an opinion, but in my opinion, it takes less away from the look of the property, tries to retain as much of the natural property as possible.

[0:27:08] Voice 5: So,

[0:27:09] Voice 8: just looking at the proposed site plan, which is on page 2 of Attachment 2, Plans and Photos.

[0:27:28] Voice 8: so on on page three there's photos of the tanks as they're sitting on the property right now

[0:27:33] Voice 8: and on page two it shows where the tanks are relevant to the property lines and it shows

[0:27:39] Voice 8: the retaining wall behind them on the cemetery side the way i just understood your description

[0:27:45] Voice 8: was they would be on the downhill side to prevent the um the fill from sloughing down the hill so

[0:27:52] Voice 8: i'm

[0:27:52] Voice 3: unclear also thank you well i

[0:27:56] Voice 5: have not seen the document you're looking at uh maybe

[0:27:59] Voice 5: michael can address that yeah

[0:28:02] Voice 4: i'm not sure which document you're referring to either i did we did

[0:28:05] Voice 4: get a survey done by peter thompson where he had put on the projected side of the wall

[0:28:09] Voice 8: that's the

[0:28:11] Voice 8: one oh

[0:28:12] Voice 4: i thought

[0:28:12] Voice 8: it and it shows the retaining wall uh on the cemetery side of the tanks

[0:28:17] Voice 4: um

[0:28:19] Voice 4: the the drawing that i remember seeing there was he had drawn the wall and in front of the tanks

[0:28:24] Voice 4: on the property side and then behind the tanks there's a small gap between the tanks and the

[0:28:29] Voice 4: property line is that is that a different drawing that you have

[0:28:33] Voice 6: uh can

[0:28:34] Voice 4: i just ask a question

[0:28:36] Voice 6: i'm a little confused here uh what the issue of the retaining walls like what are we talking about

[0:28:42] Voice 6: what what is the concern there uh the where are they which side they're on i i don't quite follow

[0:28:46] Voice 6: the arguments like what we're what is the issue with which side they're on oh

[0:28:53] Voice 5: i'm

[0:28:54] Voice 8: not sure that

[0:28:55] Voice 8: it matters yeah at

[0:28:57] Voice 6: the end of the day i don't

[0:28:58] Voice 6: see any i

[0:28:58] Voice 5: don't see any issue yeah the tank

[0:29:01] Voice 5: for the tanks themselves it doesn't matter you could just have a one large sloping berm all the

[0:29:06] Voice 5: way around but the retaining wall is like say to reduce the amount of soil dramatically that would

[0:29:12] Voice 5: be used and to retain and not interrupt portions of the yard that that it doesn't have to and the

[0:29:22] Voice 4: other thing we had thought of putting it in front the property starts to drop off in front of it as

[0:29:26] Voice 4: as you head towards the cabin

[0:29:27] Voice 4: and the property goes up slightly behind the tanks.

[0:29:30] Voice 4: So it seemed more necessary to have one in the front

[0:29:32] Voice 4: to hold the dirt and behind it

[0:29:33] Voice 4: because the ground starts going up,

[0:29:35] Voice 4: it's sort of not a natural retaining wall,

[0:29:38] Voice 4: but because it's going up,

[0:29:39] Voice 4: we'll need less dirt on the backside,

[0:29:41] Voice 4: like on the cemetery side of the tanks,

[0:29:43] Voice 4: we'll need less dirt than on the other side.

[0:29:47] Voice 8: Well, I guess back to the archeological question,

[0:29:50] Voice 8: Aaron, is there any concern about building a retaining wall

[0:29:54] Voice 8: in the vicinity of the tanks as it relates to the protection of the

[0:30:00] Voice 8: archaeological importance of the site

[0:30:01] Voice 9: generally no um the biggest question we have if i haven't

[0:30:05] Voice 9: seen the drawings um is if any excavation stated for the wall uh we know like the upper site

[0:30:10] Voice 9: deposits there are disturbed so if there does need to be any ground disturbance for placements

[0:30:15] Voice 9: of boulders however it's built um it has to be quite limited and then effectively if you build

[0:30:20] Voice 9: a retaining wall and cap it with soil you're also protecting the site and preventing erosion so

[0:30:25] Voice 9: So enhancing the site overall.

[0:30:26] Voice 9: So it's generally seen as a net benefit.

[0:30:30] Voice 8: So you're saying that if the retaining wall was constructed in such a way that it was built on top of, like, say, a rock wall built on top of the existing soil, then it wouldn't be concerning to you.

[0:30:42] Voice 8: But if it was dug into the soil to have a footing and like a concrete retaining wall, that might be of concern because it's being dug into the mitten and the remains.

[0:30:51] Voice 8: Exactly.

[0:30:51] Voice 9: Any additional soil disturbance requires an amendment to the permits.

[0:30:57] Voice 4: Okay, I can I can just add to that that is the plan is just like rocks placed on the ground, basically, we have a stonemason on the island here.

[0:31:04] Voice 4: that's looked at it and that's the plan early on, we had talked about maybe driving pilings into the ground put stuff in, but we kind of want to stay away from.

[0:31:12] Voice 4: Doing any disturbance where there's driving things in digging so the idea of just laying large boulders across the top on the ground.

[0:31:18] Voice 4: seem to avoid a lot of that the whole point of having the tanks above the ground, we thought we don't want to cause any additional disturbance so.

[0:31:24] Voice 4: So, and the rocks wouldn't be too high, just enough to kind of retain some soil and reduce the amount of soil we need.

[0:31:31] Voice 8: Okay, thanks, Michael.

[0:31:33] Voice 8: Dennis, did you have some questions to Aaron in particular about the archaeological aspect of this?

[0:31:42] Voice 6: Well, no, actually, I want to divide this into two parts, the tanks and the septic keel.

[0:31:49] Voice 6: um i've had a good look at the information provided and we've asked extra questions and

[0:31:55] Voice 6: first about the tanks um i really have no objection to what is happening with the tanks i mean it

[0:32:02] Voice 6: seems to meet uh aaron's requirements they meet the engineering requirements we have not had any

[0:32:07] Voice 6: complaints it doesn't disturb anything really it's a minimalist so in terms of the tanks i i don't

[0:32:15] Voice 6: have any concerns. No one has raised any issues, no neighbors, no hybrid department. So as far as

[0:32:21] Voice 6: I'm concerned, the tanks are fine. There are variants, but it's acceptable to me. Now the

[0:32:27] Voice 6: septic field I'm a bit more interested in. As a former public health inspector, I had a good look

[0:32:35] Voice 6: at the design of it. And I asked questions about the topography of the land and what Aaron had to

[0:32:41] Voice 6: to say about possible sighting and everything and again the topography seems to show that that's

[0:32:46] Voice 6: probably the best site for it and also it's the existing site from before it and i had a good look

[0:32:52] Voice 6: at the design of the system and it seems to be i mean if it's going to work properly you will not

[0:32:59] Voice 6: get effluent spilling out of it from another area it's designed to actually basically contain that

[0:33:03] Voice 6: after it. So leaching towards the sea, I would have to ask the engineer to speak about that.

[0:33:10] Voice 6: But just, I don't see it myself so far, but perhaps he can discuss that.

[0:33:15] Voice 6: And that's basically my concerns. I've had a lot of them addressed by the information that was

[0:33:20] Voice 6: given to me.

[0:33:21] Voice 8: Very good. Yeah, I agree. Breaking it into the two components is probably a good

[0:33:29] Voice 8: strategy here so um why don't we just hear from priscilla because i'm on side with your argument

[0:33:37] Voice 8: about the tanks as well so priscilla do you have any concern about the variance on the location of

[0:33:42] Voice 8: those tanks now that you've heard from uh

[0:33:44] Voice 3: yes it matters to me to hear from aaron what the

[0:33:50] Voice 3: considerations are almost all the small bays on saturn were um had the same progression we all

[0:33:56] Voice 3: all thought they were great. They usually have fresh streams down to them. They had access to

[0:34:01] Voice 3: fishing and most of them were out of the main wind. And so we have this kind of collision

[0:34:07] Voice 3: pretty regularly with people in the 70s or 30s deciding, of course, that the middens were great

[0:34:14] Voice 3: places to live because we all need the same things. And so that's of interest to me. And

[0:34:20] Voice 3: And I have an overall interest in the number of the three variations that are being asked for.

[0:34:32] Voice 3: But in terms of dealing better with septic, it seems like this is what's going to occur.

[0:34:39] Voice 3: I'm very familiar with housing sites that once permission is given that roads need to come in and equipment needs to come in and trees need to be taken down.

[0:34:50] Voice 3: So that's something that I, that's where people say, well, that's just the practical way to get there.

[0:34:57] Voice 3: But if you have a site in which you are concerned that there are human remains not very deeply in the soil,

[0:35:03] Voice 3: then I would ask, Erin, that there is some oversight of that when the actual thing occurs

[0:35:09] Voice 3: or some discussion with Brent Dennis about where you want people to be careful with excavators and things.

[0:35:17] Voice 3: that's up to you that's just my on the ground experience yeah

[0:35:22] Voice 9: absolutely and um capping the

[0:35:25] Voice 9: site that would require so if there's soil being brought in and put on the site that does require

[0:35:29] Voice 9: um an amendment to our existing site alteration permit and then with that go a specific methodology

[0:35:34] Voice 9: that outlines all the steps to be taken to reduce or eliminate any potential site impacts like if

[0:35:40] Voice 9: machinery is coming in um if mats need to be put on the ground things to prevent any ground

[0:35:45] Voice 9: disturbance. Everything that we've done with the property owner so far has been very mindful and

[0:35:51] Voice 9: respectful in terms of trying to keep as minimal a footprint as possible.

[0:35:56] Voice 3: Oh, thank you. That helps

[0:36:00] Voice 3: me with my concerns. And I'm really glad to hear that we've reached a level that we really take it

[0:36:04] Voice 3: seriously and that we do it from the start to the end. And it sounds like the proponent and the

[0:36:11] Voice 3: the owner is interested in complying and listening to the actual care that you require to have taken

[0:36:17] Voice 3: care of that. So thank you.

[0:36:19] Voice 6: Erin, can I ask another question? Will there be some First Nations

[0:36:23] Voice 6: oversight when they actually do start the digging for the septic field?

[0:36:29] Voice 9: Yeah, if available. It just

[0:36:31] Voice 9: depends on what the capacity is for the different communities. Penelaket, for the remains that we

[0:36:36] Voice 9: We have identified so far they've been involved in the reburial process.

[0:36:42] Voice 8: So this would be by invitation then, Aaron?

[0:36:45] Voice 8: Like you would, the work is going to happen on this period of time.

[0:36:49] Voice 8: You're invited to attend to observe and make sure there's no concerns?

[0:36:54] Voice 9: Yes, we notify all the nations and then they have an opportunity during the referral period

[0:36:59] Voice 9: to make any comments on our methodology and what's been proposed.

[0:37:03] Voice 9: So far, everything has been very supportive, especially with the minimal, how minimally invasive everything has been, which we don't see a lot of the

[0:37:11] Voice 9: time in terms of residential development and renovations.

[0:37:16] Voice 3: That speaks well. I'm glad.

[0:37:18] Voice 6: Yeah.

[0:37:19] Voice 6: So can we hear from

[0:37:21] Voice 6: the engineer about the septic field?

[0:37:24] Voice 6: Yes.

[0:37:25] Voice 5: Sure.

[0:37:26] Voice 5: Well, there's a few things on this site.

[0:37:30] Voice 5: and I'm glad you talked about the soils being brought in and managed properly because that's

[0:37:35] Voice 5: also in the wastewater regulation in our standards of practice. The erosion and sediment control

[0:37:43] Voice 5: is important. We don't want to put a bunch of fresh dirt in there and then have the rains come

[0:37:50] Voice 5: and wash a bunch of it down onto the beach or anywhere else.

[0:37:53] Voice 5: So those techniques are typical.

[0:37:58] Voice 5: And I find that that's in a lot of different regulations,

[0:38:02] Voice 5: the building codes and whatnot.

[0:38:03] Voice 5: So it's not unusual that it be concerned in more than one of the regulations.

[0:38:10] Voice 5: The field itself, when we first looked at it,

[0:38:15] Voice 5: it has the distinct appearance of having been off-site soils brought in as fill to bring

[0:38:21] Voice 5: the levels up and to and create a flat surface. I did research back to the fellow that did the

[0:38:31] Voice 5: installation many years ago of course most of the records and and memories have been lost

[0:38:37] Voice 5: lost uh but uh he concurred that uh the field is uh to his recollection recollection was mostly

[0:38:46] Voice 5: fill that was brought in uh and this is not unusual in the gulf islands as you know because

[0:38:51] Voice 5: the bedrock is sticking out everywhere and you're lucky to have uh 18 inches of soil if if that

[0:38:58] Voice 5: that sometimes. So that being said, the system has been used

[0:39:03] Voice 5: for decades. And in looking around, along the beach line and

[0:39:09] Voice 5: whatnot, I saw no evidence of breakout onto the beach. So an

[0:39:15] Voice 5: evidence of breakout, even if the house hasn't been used for a

[0:39:18] Voice 5: year or two, you know, 30 or plus years of use, you're going

[0:39:23] Voice 5: going to see the residual uh typically it's black uh staining of of of the rocks and whatnot

[0:39:31] Voice 5: um and uh i didn't observe that in any in any great amount that i would say that that was caused

[0:39:38] Voice 5: from a leak or breakout from that field so it it has the ability to uh in the old days dispose of

[0:39:48] Voice 5: the effluent nowadays we have to treat the effluent before we dispose of it or as we use

[0:39:54] Voice 5: the term disperse it and so the upgrade to that field the best thing to do to reduce any impact to

[0:40:04] Voice 5: even the fill that was that we believe was brought in was to excavate the trenches as they were

[0:40:12] Voice 5: and remove the disposal type of equipment that's in there

[0:40:17] Voice 5: and put in a treatment and dispersal system,

[0:40:20] Voice 5: which allows us to not only treat the effluent better

[0:40:26] Voice 5: than it would otherwise,

[0:40:29] Voice 5: but the field would be able to handle a great deal more,

[0:40:33] Voice 5: a higher volume of effluent.

[0:40:37] Voice 5: And that was required because we were adding the cottage

[0:40:39] Voice 5: to the house system so it needed to have higher capacity uh so uh and in terms of looking around

[0:40:50] Voice 5: the property for other locations where we could have put something every other location would

[0:40:56] Voice 5: have required uh disturbance of uh in situ soils and uh if you go a little bit north of

[0:41:05] Voice 5: the field just past the the cabin the cottage you get into the well setback so the well on site

[0:41:14] Voice 5: those of you that have been involved in septic systems before you'll recall that there's a 30

[0:41:19] Voice 5: meter setback from any well and uh so the where the well is located which is really a groundwater

[0:41:26] Voice 5: well behind the garden shed in the middle of the uh the property uh 30 meters from that in

[0:41:33] Voice 5: that direction uh covers off almost to the cottage and in the other direction it covers off any

[0:41:40] Voice 5: available land where you could construct a dispersal field so that became problematic so

[0:41:47] Voice 5: it it became uh really the only and the best solution was to reconstruct the field that's

[0:41:54] Voice 5: existing and we're not going outside the boundaries it's exactly the same footprint

[0:41:58] Voice 5: print um so there's no there's no extra excavation other than digging up the three trenches pulling

[0:42:04] Voice 5: out the uh products that are in there for disposal and putting in the dispersal system

[0:42:10] Voice 5: and then you know uh capping it off with the soil that we that was there to start with so there was

[0:42:18] Voice 5: no soil removed from the site and there was no soil to be uh added i don't is that well there

[0:42:26] Voice 3: there is soil to be added for the berm and the covering of the tanks for the

[0:42:30] Voice 5: tanks. Yeah. But not for the field, not for the dispersal field. Right.

[0:42:34] Voice 3: I think for someone like me who wasn't way up on septic,

[0:42:37] Voice 3: I need to keep that stuff being clarified. Um,

[0:42:42] Voice 3: because in your mind, you're very specific about it. In my mind,

[0:42:45] Voice 3: I'm looking at the whole system.

[0:42:49] Voice 7: I'm

[0:42:49] Voice 3: not countering you is what I want to assure you of.

[0:42:52] Voice 3: I just need to

[0:42:53] Voice 3: think about it. Um, and it's in the, in its entirety.

[0:42:58] Voice 8: One of the tests that we have to have here is about hardship, and I guess one place to look or one thing to consider is, is there any other alternative locations?

[0:43:13] Voice 8: Now, Brent has already given his perspective on that, but we have Bruce on the line here who has walked the site, and I just want to make sure we give him a chance to corroborate on these analysis and findings.

[0:43:31] Voice 3: And, Bert, I would just like to add to that that what we're dealing with is that there are three setbacks that are being asked for, and then there is the regulated setback from the well.

[0:43:43] Voice 3: So those are the changes that the proponent is asking for.

[0:43:53] Voice 6: On that last point, I think I asked Kim about this earlier, and maybe she can add more information.

[0:43:59] Voice 6: It isn't actually the field itself that would be within the perimeter distance to the well.

[0:44:07] Voice 6: It would actually be a part of the system that isn't the field.

[0:44:11] Voice 6: Is that correct,

[0:44:13] Voice 5: Kim?

[0:44:16] Voice 2: I would have to say, I believe it was Bruce that replied to that.

[0:44:21] Voice 2: But I don't believe, and this goes back to, Brent, I believe the filings in your report, there was something checked off.

[0:44:27] Voice 2: is that correct that it would be located within 30 meters of the well is

[0:44:31] Voice 5: that where this question

[0:44:32] Voice 2: came up

[0:44:33] Voice 5: yeah though the the only thing that's within 30 meters of the well is the existing

[0:44:38] Voice 5: tank under the deck of the house uh where the sewage departs the house goes into that tank and

[0:44:45] Voice 5: that tank is now converted to purely a lift station so it's not actually considered part

[0:44:52] Voice 5: of the septic system and and then the uh all of the sewage is pumped over to the new tanks

[0:44:58] Voice 5: now that pipeline goes through the well setback and uh there's actually some current ongoing

[0:45:05] Voice 5: discussions at the provincial level as to whether that pipeline it seems silly but whether that

[0:45:12] Voice 5: pipeline is actually part of the system because the system and the regulation is defined as the

[0:45:17] Voice 5: the tanks in the field and it kind of ignores the piping but in the world of engineering of course

[0:45:24] Voice 5: our first concern as an engineer is to protect the protect the public

[0:45:33] Voice 5: and in that vein in another part of the health act it gives instruction that no matter what

[0:45:44] Voice 5: you're doing you have to protect the health of the public and um uh so that's sort of an overarching

[0:45:51] Voice 5: requirement so for those of us that are that understand that uh that that pipe goes through

[0:45:58] Voice 5: the well setback we take precautionary measures uh with that pipe uh so that it's um uh so that

[0:46:07] Voice 5: if there is a break in the pipe we're channeling the effluent out where it'll be seen immediately

[0:46:12] Voice 5: and dealt with um and uh and not contaminate the well so and and that's that's a very standard

[0:46:20] Voice 5: thing that we do on a regular basis so other than that uh so the the lift station at the house

[0:46:27] Voice 5: is inside the uh the well setback just barely actually um and is a very low risk because

[0:46:35] Voice 5: if it uh spills it's going in the opposite direction it's already well down gradient

[0:46:41] Voice 5: gradient. The pipeline was my biggest concern. That's been taken care of in the design. And then

[0:46:47] Voice 5: the new tanks and the existing field to be renovated are outside that 30 meters and

[0:46:56] Voice 5: are also far enough away, not just far enough away, but they're also down gradient. And if

[0:47:02] Voice 5: there was any kind of spill there, it's not going towards the well. Well, it'll go down

[0:47:10] Voice 5: gradient to the beach, which again will be immediately seen and taken care of.

[0:47:16] Voice 6: It would be my understanding that the system leaving the pumping station would push sewage

[0:47:25] Voice 6: down to the septic field, so when it wasn't pumping that pipe would actually be empty, correct?

[0:47:33] Voice 6: uh

[0:47:34] Voice 5: yes it's it's not it's not uh the gradient on it isn't um significant uh but it will drain back

[0:47:45] Voice 5: into the uh the lift station at the house when the pump shuts off and

[0:47:52] Voice 2: cherry if i may drain that

[0:47:53] Voice 6: sorry go ahead kim

[0:47:54] Voice 2: um in terms of the land use bylaw as well the 30 meter setback is actually

[0:48:00] Voice 2: for the sewage absorption field so that's the regulation in the land use bylaw we only have

[0:48:07] Voice 2: the setback to the field itself so that does so the proposal as it stands does meet the regulations

[0:48:12] Voice 2: in the land use bylaw thanks

[0:48:15] Voice 8: kim i just wanted to point out that in the report which is what

[0:48:18] Voice 8: the motion refers to we are only looking at varying the setback from the ocean for the septic

[0:48:26] Voice 8: field and varying the setback from the front property line and from the side property line

[0:48:33] Voice 8: for the tanks so um with this that the the um setback from the well is not part of our

[0:48:41] Voice 8: part of our motion yes that's correct to determine yeah so can we go back to bruce just to see if

[0:48:50] Voice 8: if he's got any insight having been our eyes on the site

[0:48:55] Voice 8: after having heard from Brent and Aaron.

[0:49:00] Voice 8: Have you got anything further that we should know about, Bruce?

[0:49:04] Voice 1: I think everything's been cleared pretty well.

[0:49:08] Voice 1: But in terms of my visit, when I talked with Michael and visited the site,

[0:49:12] Voice 1: it seemed like it made rational sense to locate the tanks where they are,

[0:49:18] Voice 1: specifically due to the grade of the property

[0:49:20] Voice 1: and that they would be adding a significant amount of soil

[0:49:24] Voice 1: to be building up to keep the tanks above ground

[0:49:28] Voice 1: and not be obviously damaging the existing archaeological sites.

[0:49:35] Voice 1: So yeah, I think locating them on the edge of the property

[0:49:40] Voice 1: and where the property is at its highest along that edge,

[0:49:43] Voice 1: I think it makes sense.

[0:49:44] Voice 1: um and uh yeah i don't know if i have anything else to add for that okay

[0:49:50] Voice 8: so from a hardship

[0:49:51] Voice 8: perspective um we sort of need to consider if there's any like reasonable alternatives to

[0:49:58] Voice 8: these locations and from what you've just said am i right to say that you think that this is the

[0:50:06] Voice 8: best spot on the property to be able to put the tanks because really the field is not an issue

[0:50:11] Voice 8: here because it seems to be the only place to be reported yeah

[0:50:15] Voice 1: i think this is definitely the best

[0:50:18] Voice 1: uh location and it's and it is as far away from that uh front lot line without being in the

[0:50:25] Voice 1: development permit area which was by design um and uh yeah anywhere closer to or outside of the

[0:50:33] Voice 1: interior lot line would uh require significantly more soil to to build up the the tanks okay thanks

[0:50:41] Voice 8: I also note that the site plan shows that these tanks are more than 15 meters back from the ocean, which I think is one of the other setback considerations.

[0:50:52] Voice 8: And it's just barely at that line.

[0:50:54] Voice 8: So this means it's pushed away from the sea and it's a little closer to the road in order to meet that other setback.

[0:51:01] Voice 1: That's right. Yeah.

[0:51:04] Voice 8: Great. Okay. Dennis. Thank you, Bruce.

[0:51:09] Voice 8: Bruce. Dennis, any?

[0:51:13] Voice 6: Yeah, just I consider the application of the system to be the whole thing.

[0:51:19] Voice 6: So I'm thinking of the tanks, the pumping station, the piping, the septic field.

[0:51:25] Voice 6: I mean, that's all a system that needs itself, you know, different parts of it that could be complete.

[0:51:32] Voice 6: So that's why I was concerned about the pipes coming from the pumping station to the septic field.

[0:51:38] Voice 6: I still didn't get that clear so the effluent will drain back to the pumping station rather

[0:51:43] Voice 6: than to the field if it if the pump is shut off is that I have one question first is that correct

[0:51:48] Voice 6: yes

[0:51:48] Voice 5: it is yeah okay

[0:51:50] Voice 6: um will there be any traffic over that uh pipe that goes between those two

[0:51:55] Voice 6: points uh

[0:51:56] Voice 5: there's no driveway through there so uh there's no as far as I know and Michael can

[0:52:04] Voice 5: And add to that, there's no plans to have any traffic over that pipe.

[0:52:12] Voice 6: Does Michael want to add to that?

[0:52:13] Voice 6: Yeah,

[0:52:14] Voice 4: I can just confirm that.

[0:52:15] Voice 4: The property, we park on the road end, and there's no driveway that comes into the property.

[0:52:20] Voice 4: So there's no vehicles that would be driving over any part of the septic system.

[0:52:25] Voice 6: Okay, thanks very much.

[0:52:30] Voice 6: Any

[0:52:30] Voice 8: other questions then, Dennis?

[0:52:34] Voice 6: No, I think I'm fine with it.

[0:52:37] Voice 6: But any other issue about the distance to the well and stuff,

[0:52:41] Voice 6: again, it is an island health issue, not really ours.

[0:52:48] Voice 8: Agreed.

[0:52:49] Voice 8: Okay, thanks, Dennis.

[0:52:51] Voice 8: And Priscilla?

[0:52:53] Voice 3: I think my concern is having traveled by that little bay so often in my life

[0:53:01] Voice 3: and thinking and looking at that and my experience on Saterna Island

[0:53:04] Voice 3: and also on some of the other islands, is we are varying lot lines in order to accommodate,

[0:53:13] Voice 3: which I think is the greater good, is what sounds like a more functioning septic system,

[0:53:19] Voice 3: which is always of concern when you're by the water.

[0:53:23] Voice 3: By varying those lot lines, you, Michael, will sell this land at some time,

[0:53:28] Voice 3: as I see you have gray in your beard and I have lots in my hair.

[0:53:32] Voice 3: So I think a little further down the line, we know that the seas are rising. They're certainly rising around Saturna and pulling out middens and trees that are on the shoreline. And so changing some of those lot lines, is it your intent, is the house and the cottage going to remain the same size?

[0:53:57] Voice 3: are you planning that's a very densely settled little lot you have right there that encompasses

[0:54:03] Voice 3: the entire bay uh when i look at it on the map and see things there's that i don't know about

[0:54:11] Voice 3: galliano's land use bylaws so if you increase the cottage do you um would you need more septic

[0:54:18] Voice 3: capacity or or um yeah

[0:54:23] Voice 4: so i'm the uh i'm the tenant and caretaker in the cabin i'm not the

[0:54:28] Voice 4: property owner oh

[0:54:29] Voice 3: i didn't know that i thought you on the property all

[0:54:32] Voice 4: right i wish i'm glad i

[0:54:34] Voice 4: i'm glad i don't it's very expensive to do stuff like this but i'm the tenant i've been the tenant

[0:54:39] Voice 4: on the property for six years and the caretaker on the property um that there's no plans to expand

[0:54:44] Voice 4: the footprint of either building partly because of the archaeological concerns and permitting and

[0:54:50] Voice 4: all that they're not going to be made any bigger than they already are and i as far as i know you

[0:54:56] Voice 4: never know with people but i don't think the owners have any plans to sell the property at

[0:55:00] Voice 4: any time in the near future very long term and which is partly why going through this process

[0:55:05] Voice 4: they're trying to do everything right you know involving brent and aaron and just trying to do

[0:55:09] Voice 4: everything proper so that the property can be done in a legal, proper way, which is unusual for

[0:55:16] Voice 4: Galliano and the Gulf Islands to do everything properly. It certainly

[0:55:20] Voice 3: is. Well, I wouldn't say

[0:55:21] Voice 3: that. I think people are becoming more and more aware that playing by the rules, I think we needed

[0:55:29] Voice 3: flexibility in, say, the 1970s, but we're pretty well now aware since there are so many more of us

[0:55:35] Voice 3: that if we if we like it here then maintaining that is important and I look at that little bay

[0:55:41] Voice 3: I see it's got eel grass it's got a set aside it's got a place for herring is noticed on the

[0:55:48] Voice 3: mapping and it's in a DPA area which tells me that it is it is of a high level of

[0:55:59] Voice 3: of ecological capability and and of importance and that's why I ask because lots of times people

[0:56:06] Voice 3: People get variations on lot lines, and it's because they have plans and decisions down the road.

[0:56:11] Voice 3: We can never control that, but things like wells and the reach of septic systems and their capability allow people sometimes to develop a lot more than they are willing to talk about at the beginning.

[0:56:24] Voice 3: You're the tenant, so that's nothing you're going to know anything about, but I would like to tell you that that is of concern to me.

[0:56:30] Voice 3: the First Nations aspect of it, and keeping that for coming generations, and also that we work as

[0:56:38] Voice 3: much as we can to maintain the natural flora and fauna and the ecosystems. Can

[0:56:46] Voice 6: I ask a question?

[0:56:48] Voice 6: Sorry, Priscilla.

[0:56:50] Voice 7: I just wanted

[0:56:51] Voice 6: to ask a question of Brent. I'm hoping I might put

[0:56:55] Voice 6: but Priscilla's mind is a bit more at ease.

[0:56:58] Voice 6: The septic system is built for what is there now,

[0:57:02] Voice 6: or it's built for future expansion?

[0:57:05] Voice 5: It's built for exactly what's there now.

[0:57:09] Voice 5: When I first start with clients, I always talk about the future.

[0:57:13] Voice 5: Priscilla, you're absolutely right.

[0:57:15] Voice 5: People are very concerned about the value of their property

[0:57:19] Voice 5: going forward for resale.

[0:57:21] Voice 5: It's always a consideration,

[0:57:22] Voice 5: And sometimes it's actually quite often when people have future plans, it's, of course, cost effective to build the septic system large enough at this point to accommodate that.

[0:57:34] Voice 5: In this situation, there is no extra capacity in that septic system.

[0:57:37] Voice 5: system so uh for uh for an expansion of either of the structures uh when they apply for a building

[0:57:49] Voice 5: permit they would have to prove that the septic system was suitable for the proposed development

[0:57:55] Voice 5: and if not which it wouldn't be uh they would have to have an engineered redesign of the system to

[0:58:01] Voice 5: handle the capacity which would have to go through this whole process it would be in the variance

[0:58:06] Voice 5: areas because that's

[0:58:08] Voice 5: where it is and uh so we'd be they they would be going through this entire

[0:58:12] Voice 5: process all over again just added uh even if they just added a a bunkie or a a small addition to

[0:58:20] Voice 5: the house that added a bedroom uh they'd have to go through the whole process again that really

[0:58:25] Voice 3: sets my mind at ease quite a bit i really appreciate hearing that from you that's happened

[0:58:30] Voice 3: happened a number of times on Saturna, and I appreciate that for people where the value of

[0:58:36] Voice 3: their property is their sole consideration, that they would want to plan ahead that way. So I see

[0:58:43] Voice 3: this as an unusual and very complete piece of land. It owns that bay, and that matters to me.

[0:58:52] Voice 3: Thank you for thinking about that and allaying my concerns about that, because if we're going

[0:58:57] Voice 3: going to give these variations on three different lot lines, and it's already in a development

[0:59:02] Voice 3: permit area, and it has already been identified as having eelgrass and capacity for small feeder

[0:59:09] Voice 3: fish to breed in that particular bay, then that matters to me. So I appreciate that. The other

[0:59:17] Voice 3: thing is that it's got the cemetery right next to it, which is of historical interest to colonial

[0:59:23] Voice 3: settlers on galliano

[0:59:24] Voice 7: so

[0:59:25] Voice 3: thank you i i've appreciated the consideration and dennis your

[0:59:30] Voice 3: input on on how do you set up septic systems like that and and the recent regulations um brent

[0:59:37] Voice 3: that's good information for someone like me who doesn't put in septic systems but appreciates them

[0:59:43] Voice 3: highly so thanks so bert thank you that's answered a lot of my concerns i i want everybody to notice

[0:59:51] Voice 3: So those are, one of them is a huge ask for setbacks on lines.

[1:00:00] Voice 3: the footprint so that's that is a consideration that's a that's a big ask i don't think i've ever

[1:00:07] Voice 3: had three lot lines being held up for consideration on one parcel that's that's quite a lot yes

[1:00:16] Voice 8: agreed okay um so i'm just going to refer back to the staff report because the considerations that

[1:00:26] Voice 8: We have to, or the points we have to consider in this application is six points.

[1:00:33] Voice 8: The variance would not result in defeating the intent of the bylaw.

[1:00:37] Voice 8: I don't think there's any question about that.

[1:00:41] Voice 8: The variance would not result in substantial effect of the use and enjoyment of the adjacent lands.

[1:00:49] Voice 8: I think we've covered that.

[1:00:52] Voice 8: Variance would not result in adverse effect to the natural environment. I think this improves that.

[1:00:59] Voice 8: So we've covered that off. The variance would not result in inappropriate development of the site.

[1:01:03] Voice 8: We just discussed that. You know this is limiting the development to what is there now. So the last

[1:01:10] Voice 8: two parts which are the important ones is, is this minor in nature? And again the request is for

[1:01:21] Voice 8: going from 7.5 to 7.1 on the road setback for the tanks 6.0 to 0.4 on the side setback

[1:01:31] Voice 8: considering that the side setback is to a cemetery i think that in my

[1:01:37] Voice 8: mind constitutes minor

[1:01:40] Voice 8: the variance from the ocean from 30 to 9.1 as i think the report says is really to bring the

[1:01:50] Voice 8: existing field into compliance with um with the bylaws um i would consider these to be minor in

[1:01:57] Voice 8: nature and i would beg anybody to have their input now if they don't consider that i'd

[1:02:06] Voice 3: like to add

[1:02:07] Voice 3: one thing burt to what you've said and i am in pretty full agreement with what you've said

[1:02:10] Voice 3: uh the cemetery is up for discussion the people who own the land there have asked that to uh no

[1:02:17] Voice 3: No one else is being buried there.

[1:02:19] Voice 3: And when you say that you consider that to be minor,

[1:02:26] Voice 3: know that that's a changing part of land of Galliana

[1:02:29] Voice 3: with this point.

[1:02:29] Voice 3: It's under discussion and under dispute

[1:02:31] Voice 3: as to where it will go further.

[1:02:34] Voice 3: So I think the only thing I'd like to comment

[1:02:36] Voice 3: is on your labeling it minor

[1:02:42] Voice 3: when it is a piece of land in active movement

[1:02:48] Voice 3: right now and i know that that's nothing that we we don't control the future but i just want to say

[1:02:54] Voice 3: that sometimes when we make assumptions about something because that's what it is immediately

[1:02:58] Voice 3: in front of our eyes um it's moving okay

[1:03:03] Voice 6: understand my comment my comment on on this issue would be

[1:03:08] Voice 6: that i was concerned as well changing from 30 meters to 9.1 from the shoreline but at the same

[1:03:15] Voice 6: time if we if they cannot do this they definitely have a hardship because they have nothing

[1:03:22] Voice 6: so uh in my opinion we have to consider that a minor and for the other ones um again i i don't

[1:03:29] Voice 6: want to consider what could happen in galliano with other properties and i'm only involved with

[1:03:33] Voice 6: this one so i see that as minor as well because it's not infringing on anyone that i see in this

[1:03:41] Voice 6: particular issue and i'm not looking forward to what's going to happen in galliano in the future

[1:03:45] Voice 6: and other sites i'm just saying right here what we're dealing with i will consider it minor thank

[1:03:50] Voice 8: you um and that's um that would echo my position on both of those matters and those are the all

[1:03:58] Voice 8: of the matters that we need to consider so if we have considered those and we're ready to move

[1:04:05] Voice 8: forward we do have a draft motion on page eight of this staff report which i can read out and if

[1:04:14] Voice 8: If we get a seconder on the motion or amendments to the motion, then we can consider those.

[1:04:18] Voice 8: But I will then make the motion that having considered the matter set out in Section 542-1-C of the Local Government Act and having found that undue hardship would be caused to the applicant if Section 531-1 of the Local Government Act is complied with,

[1:04:37] Voice 8: with the Galliano Island Board of Variants

[1:04:41] Voice 8: approve application GL-BOV-2024-0273 in brackets.

[1:04:50] Voice 8: Carruthers is presented and has presented

[1:04:54] Voice 8: and shown on schedule A of the same notice of hearing.

[1:04:59] Voice 8: I so move.

[1:05:03] Voice 6: Well, I will second it if you need a seconder,

[1:05:07] Voice 6: I'm in favor of this.

[1:05:09] Voice 8: Thank you, Dennis. Then we, all we have to do is vote on it. So all those in favor. Aye. Aye. Aye. Thank you. Okay. Back to you, Kim.

[1:05:25] Voice 8: Thank

[1:05:29] Voice 2: you, Chair. So as for the business today, that concludes the staff report and the Board of Variants for consideration. So the next steps is our legislative clerk will then get a hold of Michael and then send that formal notice. So that may take a few days.

[1:05:49] Voice 2: And at this point, we have no further items on our agenda.

[1:05:51] Voice 2: But I will note that I will look into the draft minutes situation and the delay in that.

[1:05:57] Voice 2: And I'll get back to you informally to the Board of Variants members to see if there's any improvement there.

[1:06:03] Voice 3: I think another issue

[1:06:05] Voice 2: that we were very

[1:06:06] Voice 3: interested in, and that is the ability of the people who are on the Board of Variants to actually make a site visit.

[1:06:14] Voice 3: that I feel quite, I feel very responsible about this small piece of land. And while we're talking,

[1:06:23] Voice 3: and we are only limited to very secular things about sewage and how you deal with it,

[1:06:32] Voice 3: seeing the land and being on there in place would certainly shorten the meetings and would give

[1:06:41] Voice 3: people, the chance to ask their questions as they look at the land. You know, I get the tanks are

[1:06:46] Voice 3: four and a half inches wide. I don't know how many truckloads of dirt this is going to be the

[1:06:51] Voice 3: equivalent to. I am only going by the fact that the First Nations person has said that they will

[1:06:58] Voice 3: continue to have oversight if they have the staff. So that helps

[1:07:04] Voice 8: me a lot.

[1:07:05] Voice 8: lot i'd like to speak a little bit to this so i think we can thank brent uh michael

[1:07:12] Voice 8: aaron for their um attendance to the meeting because i don't think they need to be part of

[1:07:18] Voice 8: this and then maybe um maybe we could have bruce and kim stay on the line we'll have a quick

[1:07:23] Voice 8: discussion about the process for having the board of aaron's visit um sites in future great so

[1:07:29] Voice 8: So thanks. Thank you.

[1:07:31] Voice 5: If I could just say one, one last item off topic.

[1:07:36] Voice 5: I hear the confusion around sewage regulations all the time from folks that

[1:07:42] Voice 5: are interested.

[1:07:43] Voice 5: I work all over the province and I've been involved in more of these than you

[1:07:47] Voice 5: can imagine the but I'll just throw an offer out to the

[1:07:52] Voice 5: Islands Trust and to the regional district.

[1:07:55] Voice 5: I'm on the board of directors of a new organization called the Canadian

[1:07:59] Voice 5: and on-site technical resource association uh we're 15 of the top practitioners in the province

[1:08:06] Voice 5: our members actually wrote the standard of practice and the engineering guideline for

[1:08:14] Voice 5: wastewater and we're currently working with a few different levels of government

[1:08:17] Voice 5: for regulatory purposes so if anybody at any time on any particular project would like some

[1:08:25] Voice 5: uh third party uh input uh by all means you can contact me to get through to the katra

[1:08:31] Voice 5: and uh we'll see what we can do most of the stuff we do believe or not is pro bono

[1:08:38] Voice 5: so if that doesn't if

[1:08:40] Voice 5: that doesn't encourage you i don't know what would

[1:08:42] Voice 3: you're a hero

[1:08:43] Voice 5: that sounds

[1:08:44] Voice 3: really good

[1:08:48] Voice 6: something

[1:08:49] Voice 3: that maybe

[1:08:50] Voice 6: you're not considering something maybe you're not considering but for

[1:08:53] Voice 6: For something like $300 or $400, every realtor can get a drone survey of a property

[1:08:58] Voice 6: and give you a good picture of what it looks like.

[1:09:01] Voice 6: Even that would be assistance, and it's not expensive at all.

[1:09:06] Voice 8: We'll leave those with staff to consider for opportunities in the future.

[1:09:14] Voice 8: Good.

[1:09:15] Voice 5: Okay.

[1:09:16] Voice 5: Well, thank you, everybody.

[1:09:17] Voice 8: Nice

[1:09:17] Voice 5: to meet you, and

[1:09:18] Voice 5: have a great day.

[1:09:19] Voice 9: Thank you.

[1:09:20] Voice 4: Thanks, Aaron.

[1:09:21] Voice 9: Thanks, everyone.

[1:09:22] Voice 9: Bye.

[1:09:23] Voice 4: Thanks, everyone on the board.

[1:09:24] Voice 4: Thank you.

[1:09:25] Voice 4: Thanks, everyone, for your time and getting this through. I'm really excited to have a septic.

Galiano Board of Variance     
Minutes of a Hearing   
February 18, 2025 ADOPTED 1 of 3 
 
Galiano Island Board of Variance 
Minutes of a Hearing 
 
 
Members Present: Bert Hol, BOV Chair 
Priscilla Ewbank, BOV Member 
Dennis Perch, BOV Member 
 
Staff Present: 
 
Kim Stockdill, Island Planner 
Bruce Belcher, Planner 2 
Carly Bilney, Recorder 
Applicants: Michael Carrothers 
 
 
 
Others Present: 
Brent Dennis 
Erin Willows 
 
There were no members of the public present. 
 
 
1. CALL TO ORDER 
 
Island Planner Stockdill called the meeting to order at 12:36 p.m. She acknowledged that 
the meeting was being held on the territories of the Coast Salish Peoples. 
 
2. APPROVAL OF AGENDA 
 
By general consent the agenda was approved as presented. 
 
3. SELECTION OF BOARD OF VARIANCE CHAIR 
GL-BOV-2025-01 
It was Moved and Seconded, 
that Galiano Island Board of Variance appoint Bert Hol as the Galiano Island 
Board of Variance Chair. 
CARRIED  
 
4. MINUTES 
 4.1 Galiano Island Board of Variance Minutes Dated August 19, 2021 
By general consent the Galiano Island Board of Variance meeting minutes of 
August 19, 2021 were adopted. 
 
Date: 
Location: 
February 18, 2025 
Electronic Meeting 
A D O P T E D 

 
Galiano Board of Variance     
Minutes of a Hearing   
February 18, 2025 ADOPTED 2 of 3 
Support was expressed for having the Board of Variance review the completed 
meetings minutes soon after the meeting, rather than at the next Board of Variance 
meeting so the discussion is still fresh in Board members’ memories. 
 
5. APPLICATIONS 
 
5.1  PL-BOV-2024-0273 (Carrothers) - Staff Report 
Island Planner Stockdill reviewed the staff report. The following comments were 
made: 
• The variance would allow for the replacement of the old septic dispersal 
field by a modern one in the same location 
• The property is in an archaeologically important area and the property owner 
is working with the existing design to reduce the risk of unnecessary 
disturbance to the site  
• Archaeologist Erin Willows visited the site in 2021; her assessment supports 
using as much of the existing infrastructure as possible 
• The property owner has been mindful and respectful of reducing or 
eliminating ground disturbance 
• An updated septic dispersal field would reduce the chances of effluent 
entering the ocean 
• The proposed retaining wall would be a 4.5-foot stone wall that holds soil in 
around the septic tanks 
• The tanks are made of polyethylene and the soil would protect them from UV 
light; a soil berm would also alleviate concerns about earthquake stability 
• First Nations have had opportunity during the archaeological referral period 
to comment on the proposed work, and the plan has received support so far; 
First Nations may provide oversight when the work is being done if they are 
available 
• Wastewater control is important; the septic field system has been in use for 
decades and no evidence of breakout onto the beach could be found; in 
modern systems, the effluent is treated before it is dispersed  
• Every other alternative location for the septic field requires soil disturbance 
• There is an existing tank under the house into which the sewage goes once it 
departs the house; it is not considered part of the septic system 
• The proposal meets all other regulations in the land use bylaw 
• Planner Belcher visited the site and expressed support for the proposed 
location of the tanks and field  
• The residents park on the road and there will be no driving over the septic 
system 
• Concern was expressed about what a property owner might do in the future 
with expanded lot lines 
• The septic system is built for what is currently there, and there is no extra 
capacity in the septic system for an expansion of either dwelling (even a 
small bunkie or additional bedroom) 
• Should the owners wish to expand either dwelling in the future, they would 
need to go through the variance process again 

 
Galiano Board of Variance     
Minutes of a Hearing   
February 18, 2025 ADOPTED 3 of 3 
 
Chair Hol noted that the Board of Variance is of the opinion that the variance does 
not do any of the following: 
 
• Result in inappropriate development of the site 
• Adversely affect the natural environment 
• Substantially affect the use and enjoyment of adjacent land 
• Vary permitted uses and densities under the applicable bylaw 
• Defeat the intent of the bylaw 
 
Comments were made that use of the cemetery next to the subject property is 
currently under discussion. 
 
GL-BOV-2025-02 
It was Moved and Seconded,  
that, having considered the matters set out in s.542(1)(c) of the Local 
Government Act, and having found that undue hardship would be caused to 
the applicant if s.531 (1) of the Local Government Act is complied with, the 
Galiano Island Board of Variance approves application GL-BOV-2024-0273 
(Carrothers) as presented and shown on Schedule A of the GL-BOV-2024-
0273 (Carrothers) Notice of Hearing.  
CARRIED 
 
Island Planner Stockdill commented that staff will follow up on the request from 
the Board of Variance to review minutes for approval prior to the next meeting. Brief 
discussion ensued about the process of having Board of Variance members 
conduct site visits to properties they are adjudicating.  
 
Engineer Brent Dennis noted he is a board member with the Canadian Onsite 
Technical Resource Association that developed the standards of practice and 
engineering guidelines for wastewater, and offered to provide third party input on 
future applications. 
 
6. ADJOURNMENT 
 
By general consent the meeting was adjourned at 1:46 p.m. 
 
                
 
               _________________________                                                    ________________________ 
            Recorder                      Date