Islands Trust Council regular meeting, March 7, 2022

[0:00:48] Voice 4: Good afternoon, everyone. I'll just give it a couple more minutes before we start the meeting. Hopefully you can hear. I see we have 19 attendees so far and they're still coming in. You are still coming in. I'll just give it a moment and we'll start the meeting.

[0:01:13] Voice 4: We seem to have stabilized. People have stopped arriving. Hopefully nobody has any technical

[0:01:28] Voice 4: issues of getting in. Good afternoon. This is the regular meeting of the Galeano Local

[0:01:36] Voice 4: Trust Committee for March the 7th of 2022. And welcome to this meeting. I want to acknowledge

[0:01:52] Voice 4: that we are meeting across the traditional territories and the areas of where the First

[0:02:00] Voice 4: First Nations, the Coast Salish peoples indeed, worked and lived and gathered food for millennium.

[0:02:08] Voice 4: We are grateful to have the opportunity to be here.

[0:02:12] Voice 4: There are a number of Coast Salish nations that would have either lived directly on Galeano

[0:02:20] Voice 4: or at least come and used and would have been part of their traditional gathering, hunting grounds,

[0:02:27] Voice 4: and and also other activities they were it I'm always mindful I try and be

[0:02:38] Voice 4: mindful that they were good stewards of this area exceptionally good stewards

[0:02:46] Voice 4: and try and understand how they stewarded this land in this in this area

[0:02:52] Voice 4: in ways that we can learn from on a regular basis.

[0:02:58] Voice 4: It's a challenging time to be carrying on with sort of local business,

[0:03:06] Voice 4: but given the events in the world, we come through,

[0:03:12] Voice 4: we're still dealing with a pandemic.

[0:03:15] Voice 4: And of course, now we have the events in Ukraine to try and assimilate

[0:03:20] Voice 4: into our life, but we will do our best.

[0:03:23] Voice 4: my thoughts are with the people there all of those affected and both directly and of course

[0:03:30] Voice 4: many of us are affected indirectly by the thought of what is going on over there

[0:03:37] Voice 4: so you will note because you're here that we have reverted after a brief foray into

[0:03:46] Voice 4: into in-person meetings in the fall of 2021 with our broadcast capability to

[0:03:52] Voice 4: electronic process. I would hope that, my hope is that we will be able to move out of this and

[0:04:03] Voice 4: back into in-person meetings shortly. There is certainly a sense that we are moving into a

[0:04:12] Voice 4: different phase of the pandemic that will allow that to occur. For example, you'll hear from us

[0:04:16] Voice 4: later, we're having our Trust Council meeting in person tomorrow, starting tomorrow in Nanaimo.

[0:04:21] Voice 4: other organizations are meeting in person we had made the decision earlier on to have this one

[0:04:27] Voice 4: electronically to allow for people to attend and so we are continuing to do that

[0:04:34] Voice 4: and we know that many people can join us from various parts of

[0:04:40] Voice 4: the Salish Sea and we're grateful for the opportunity to do this we hopefully the

[0:04:47] Voice 4: The electronics will continue to work and you will be able to view and participate.

[0:04:54] Voice 4: So this meeting is being both, there's a webinar that anybody that is here as an attendee is present at.

[0:05:04] Voice 4: It's also being broadcast simultaneously.

[0:05:06] Voice 4: I say simultaneously because I know it's about a 20 second delay, but I've tried to run them both at the same time and it doesn't work.

[0:05:14] Voice 4: and uh and it's also being recorded and will be up on our website uh you find it if you go back

[0:05:22] Voice 4: to the meeting date eventually the recording will be up there in the next couple of days

[0:05:27] Voice 4: and so you can watch it and i know people do so um when you have the the time that and the

[0:05:34] Voice 4: availability to do that uh our process is with these um these meetings of course that you will

[0:05:41] Voice 4: will see the various people that are on your screen, you will see staff, you will see the

[0:05:45] Voice 4: trustees here, see and hear the trustees. And occasionally you'll see, sometimes you'll see

[0:05:53] Voice 4: applicants appear and talk as we have discussions with applicants or presenters. We don't have a

[0:05:59] Voice 4: delegation today um but we do have uh we do have um some applications so um that's uh the way

[0:06:10] Voice 4: we'll work and then there'll be two opportunities later in uh in a while in a bit at the beginning

[0:06:16] Voice 4: of near the beginning of the meeting and near the end uh where we um uh where you will have

[0:06:25] Voice 4: have an opportunity to speak to the local trust committee about issues on our agenda and otherwise

[0:06:31] Voice 4: and I will address that more as we get to the first town hall public participation section

[0:06:39] Voice 4: and that's and at that point you will have an opportunity to be able to speak and be

[0:06:44] Voice 4: turn your camera on if you wish. I have I think that's all I really need to say right now

[0:06:53] Voice 4: I'll say some more when we get to the town hall section there a little bit

[0:06:57] Voice 4: more welcome to the 21 attendees so I have an agenda and I know there's one

[0:07:04] Voice 4: item that I've been asked by staff to put under new business which is a

[0:07:11] Voice 4: potential change to the to the May meeting date and I'll just put that

[0:07:18] Voice 4: under 16.4 um oh and i forgot i should introduce everybody that you see so um so as i said my name

[0:07:27] Voice 4: is dan rogers and i'm a member of the executive committee of islands trust and a vice chair as a

[0:07:32] Voice 4: vice chair and i assigned to chair a number of local trust committees including galliano gabriel

[0:07:37] Voice 4: and main and happy to be here um with you today and look forward to being back on the island you

[0:07:43] Voice 4: have your two you'll see two local trustees trustee jane wolverton nice to see you jane

[0:07:49] Voice 4: and trustee tahira rockefeller nice to see you tara you'll also see a number of staff i'll start

[0:07:55] Voice 4: with uh carly bilney who's our recorder at the moment um her camera's off but you'll hear me

[0:08:01] Voice 4: talk to carly from time to time and you i think her camera was on a little earlier uh and uh you

[0:08:07] Voice 4: You also have Robin Eljec from the South Office,

[0:08:10] Voice 4: who's running the controls in the background

[0:08:12] Voice 4: and sort of spaceship intersign.

[0:08:16] Voice 4: You also will see you have the planner Brad Smith with us,

[0:08:21] Voice 4: island planner Brad Smith,

[0:08:22] Voice 4: and you'll hear from him from time to time.

[0:08:24] Voice 4: He's the island planner assigned to Galliano.

[0:08:27] Voice 4: You'll see fresh router specialist William Shilba,

[0:08:31] Voice 4: who's been with us for,

[0:08:33] Voice 4: when I was talking to him the other day,

[0:08:35] Voice 4: it was five years.

[0:08:36] Voice 4: So he's been working on this and he'll be doing a presentation a little bit later along

[0:08:40] Voice 4: with Island Planner Nerissa Chadwick, whose camera is off at the moment, who has been

[0:08:47] Voice 4: working with William on the freshwater strategy.

[0:08:56] Voice 4: So I know I'm supposed to do a riser report from the from the last meeting that we adopted

[0:09:04] Voice 4: adopted uh in camera minutes uh from april the 12th of 2021 and june the 14th of 2021 when we

[0:09:13] Voice 4: went in camera back in um february and we also appointed members of the apc and i've lost my

[0:09:22] Voice 4: notes as to who we appointed and i don't know if carly you have that in front of you do you

[0:09:29] Voice 15: no not in front of me sorry

[0:09:30] Voice 4: um i'll dig it out and i apologize i was reminded just before uh we uh

[0:09:38] Voice 4: we went to um uh the meeting that uh that we that i had to do that and i had forgotten so i'll go

[0:09:46] Voice 4: find my notes from uh 20 from february and i'll report that out maybe in my my chairs uh role

[0:09:54] Voice 4: report um so i have that one item to add at 16.4 uh trustees is there anything else to add to the

[0:10:03] Voice 4: agenda or to move around um

[0:10:06] Voice 18: i think uh former trustee pottle had suggested that we add the

[0:10:11] Voice 18: governance review um i know that it's it's on the agenda for the trust council but i didn't

[0:10:18] Voice 18: know whether we wanted to have even a little discussion of our impressions or at this point

[0:10:24] Voice 18: I know it hasn't been

[0:10:26] Voice 18: formed okay

[0:10:27] Voice 16: it's

[0:10:28] Voice 5: up to you too um

[0:10:30] Voice 16: seeing as I wasn't prepared for that I would

[0:10:33] Voice 16: not be in favor of that but if you want to put it on we could well

[0:10:38] Voice 4: yeah it's up you don't have

[0:10:41] Voice 4: to speak you want it on the agenda trustee Wolverton yeah

[0:10:44] Voice 18: why don't we just put it on and

[0:10:46] Voice 18: then you know we may or may not uh have much time to address it but it is coming up tomorrow and it

[0:10:53] Voice 18: It is, I mean, tomorrow will be the sort of formal receipt

[0:10:58] Voice 18: of the report and with the contractors there as well.

[0:11:02] Voice 4: Where would you like it on the agenda?

[0:11:03] Voice 4: Would you like it on there at the beginning

[0:11:05] Voice 4: or in the new business item?

[0:11:07] Voice 18: It could be in the new business.

[0:11:09] Voice 4: Okay, then I'll put 16.45 governance review report.

[0:11:19] Voice 4: Okay, anything else?

[0:11:23] Voice 4: Nothing, then I'll, with those two amendments,

[0:11:25] Voice 4: amendments, I'll take the agenda adopted as amended. Thanks very much. So the first item on

[0:11:34] Voice 4: the agenda is trustee reports. So I'm going to just, I'm going to turn it to trustee Wolverton,

[0:11:43] Voice 4: just because you're unmuted, and let you give your report. And I'm just going to turn my camera off

[0:11:48] Voice 4: for a second while I try and find my notes from the camera session last time. So I'll review.

[0:11:53] Voice 4: to you.

[0:11:53] Voice 18: Okay. I actually managed to get a short break on Vancouver Island a couple weeks ago.

[0:12:03] Voice 18: And one of the things that I was able to do then is to read the essays by Jean Barman,

[0:12:09] Voice 18: On the Cusp of Contact. And I would highly recommend that book for understanding the

[0:12:17] Voice 18: contact between the settlers and the Indigenous people here. Much of it is centered on Vancouver

[0:12:23] Voice 18: and Victoria, but also a little bit on the Gulf Islands. So what's been happening for me,

[0:12:30] Voice 18: lots of inquiries about setbacks and various cottage sizes, those kinds of things.

[0:12:38] Voice 18: I've heard residents' concerns about the misinformation circulating on social media

[0:12:43] Voice 18: about the trust the regional planning committee has forwarded the planning services uh best

[0:12:52] Voice 18: best management practices to uh trust council to look at um i think there's some there's some

[0:13:01] Voice 18: good stuff in there um just wanted to remind people that the roberts bank expansion deadline

[0:13:06] Voice 18: deadline for public comment is March 15th. So that's fairly important if you have a view

[0:13:15] Voice 18: on the expansion of the Roberts Bank, which would be huge, 400 acres of concrete. And

[0:13:25] Voice 18: then the EcoFootprint is, they're working away, this is the Conservancy project, and

[0:13:34] Voice 18: And they are collecting or putting together the interviews that they've had with various people on the island.

[0:13:42] Voice 18: They've collected a lot of oral histories.

[0:13:44] Voice 18: And then they've also been doing some work at the school where they're looking at what people, what the kids, where they think Galliano could go in the way of improving our eco footprint.

[0:14:04] Voice 18: That's it.

[0:14:06] Voice 18: Oh, one other thing. Just that the census came out after our last meeting, and so we've gone from 1,044 residents to 1,396, and from 564 of the 1,170 dwellings occupied to 726 of the 1,216 dwellings. That's all.

[0:14:33] Voice 5: Thank you, Trustee Wolferton. Trustee Rockathaw?

[0:14:36] Voice 5: um

[0:14:37] Voice 16: yeah just to remind the public that there's trust council next week on the

[0:14:41] Voice 16: tuesday through thursday uh we publish the uh address for the the website address for the

[0:14:47] Voice 16: agenda and times um in the active page and there's opportunity for public comment um if you just look

[0:14:54] Voice 16: at the agenda you'll see the times um that's all for me today thanks thanks

[0:15:01] Voice 4: um i will i'll be a bit

[0:15:06] Voice 4: longer. I did find the people we appointed the APC, and I know it's on our agenda later today

[0:15:14] Voice 4: that there are still some vacancies, but we did appoint five people. This is my rise in report

[0:15:21] Voice 4: from the in-camera meeting. We've appointed five people to our APC, Aldi Genova, Karen Harris,

[0:15:28] Voice 4: Lauren Stefanak, Patrick Ramsey, and Robert Mattson were all appointed to the APC, reappointed

[0:15:34] Voice 4: it actually in each case to the APC.

[0:15:37] Voice 18: Chair Rogers, your screen is off.

[0:15:42] Voice 4: Oh, I had muted and forgot to turn my camera on. Sorry about that. Anyway, I don't need to run

[0:15:49] Voice 4: through those names again. Thanks very much. So that was my rise in report along with the

[0:15:56] Voice 4: adoption of minutes from the last in-camera meeting. Yes, I just want to follow up briefly

[0:16:04] Voice 4: on what Trustee Rockefeller said.

[0:16:06] Voice 4: We do have the trust council.

[0:16:09] Voice 4: It starts tomorrow in Nanaimo.

[0:16:13] Voice 4: I think we're gonna have somewhere between 18 and 20

[0:16:17] Voice 4: of the trustees present,

[0:16:18] Voice 4: and there'll be some that will be there electronically,

[0:16:21] Voice 4: which is the way we've designed our system now.

[0:16:26] Voice 4: It's a bit, I don't know what to say, perplexing,

[0:16:32] Voice 4: But according to the motions passed by the Trust Council in December, I believe, this will actually be our last in-person Trust Council for this term, because we voted to move to only two in-person a year, mostly as a cost-saving measure, because it's far less expensive to have them electronically.

[0:16:56] Voice 4: electronically. I guess that could always be revisited, but that's the plan. So we're in

[0:17:03] Voice 4: Nanaimo. The public comment period is on tomorrow evening, starting at seven o'clock. You can find

[0:17:12] Voice 4: all of the information, presuming you're not in Nanaimo, online as to how to join that. There are,

[0:17:20] Voice 4: There are, I believe, eight delegations, maybe seven, I forgot, I actually have forgotten, maybe, maybe, maybe only seven. And then we have a town hall period, public participation is what we're referring to it now, more often.

[0:17:37] Voice 4: And so that will be coming by no later than 8 o'clock and we'll run for an hour, give you an opportunity to make your views known to the whole Trust Council.

[0:17:51] Voice 4: There are, well, there are always important pieces of information on the agenda, including updates on our reconciliation activities and what we're doing on the various committees and planning.

[0:18:02] Voice 4: planning. There are three major pieces on the agenda. We have set aside the whole of

[0:18:08] Voice 4: Tuesday afternoon, starting at 1 o'clock, to receive and discuss formally the governance

[0:18:17] Voice 4: review that was issued and I think was made public about, I don't know what day it was,

[0:18:24] Voice 4: perhaps around the 15th to 20th of February. I'm not sure the exact date of when it was

[0:18:28] Voice 4: when it was uh put onto our agendas and and made public uh it was received in conference before

[0:18:35] Voice 4: that anyway it's out there uh and we'll be at and there are i believe two and maybe three or maybe

[0:18:43] Voice 4: more members of the consultants of coming to answer questions and present their report and

[0:18:52] Voice 4: then there'll be opportunities for trustees to work through what what they want to how they

[0:18:58] Voice 4: they want to receive and deal with.

[0:19:03] Voice 4: And I use that word deal with,

[0:19:04] Voice 4: that phrase deal with advisedly,

[0:19:07] Voice 4: but how they want to respond

[0:19:09] Voice 4: or what they want to do next in relation to that report.

[0:19:13] Voice 4: On Wednesday morning,

[0:19:16] Voice 4: there is a presentation from the consultant

[0:19:19] Voice 4: that we hired related to the trust policy statement

[0:19:24] Voice 4: review process and public engagement process.

[0:19:27] Voice 4: and there'll be questions and commentary around that as you may you probably know uh if you're

[0:19:34] Voice 4: paying if you're following our process we there is now a um a survey online that is uh related

[0:19:44] Voice 4: to this phase which can fight phase three of public engagement and that's uh there and available

[0:19:50] Voice 4: all you have to go is to islands 2050 and you can find it it's there's there's all of the information

[0:19:56] Voice 4: you need. I can tell you probably by the time we get to Trust Council on Wednesday,

[0:20:01] Voice 4: all of the local engagement opportunities dates will have been finalized, as well as the

[0:20:09] Voice 4: trust-wide engagement opportunities, which are more electronic in nature. But there are a number

[0:20:16] Voice 4: of ways that you, if you're interested in the trust policy statement, can engage. And then

[0:20:21] Voice 4: Wednesday afternoon, we have set aside a fair amount of time to discuss our budget,

[0:20:29] Voice 4: which has come from the Financial Planning Committee, which I sit on, and so does Trustee

[0:20:33] Voice 4: Rockefeller. We forwarded a budget coming forward that has received quite a bit of commentary

[0:20:43] Voice 4: for certain and um i'm sure we'll have a relatively uh vigorous discussion around what should be in

[0:20:54] Voice 4: the budget it's interesting and just my personal observation my experience has been in my seven

[0:21:00] Voice 4: years or seven budgets that we've done that um that the budget the most vigorous budget discussion

[0:21:08] Voice 4: The discussion tends to be in December, but I think this one and then March tends to have settled out as to where we're settling. But this time, I believe there will be some discussion. There will then be all the regular stuff as we go through until the end of March. Sorry, it's the end of the meeting on Thursday.

[0:21:27] Voice 4: And that's my report. There's lots of things happening out there. One of the items I always like to draw people's attention to is that one of the budget proposals is to continue the cultural heritage mapping project, which is very important on a trust-wide basis for us, both in terms of our reconciliation efforts and to understand better what the situation is.

[0:21:57] Voice 4: is on the ground and the main areas in the islands.

[0:22:02] Voice 4: And that's a project that's proposed and run through,

[0:22:07] Voice 4: I think the RPC, but it's on in our budget

[0:22:10] Voice 4: and there's a number of other things as well.

[0:22:12] Voice 4: So that's my chair's report.

[0:22:16] Voice 4: I think we'll, if there's nothing else from the trustees,

[0:22:20] Voice 4: I'll move into the public participation town hall section.

[0:22:26] Voice 4: So we always have this complication that if someone wants to speak to one of two affordable housing projects that we have, the trustees recuse themselves from those discussions.

[0:22:38] Voice 4: So at this point, what I would ask for is if anybody wishes to address the Local Trust Committee on something other than Giggers and or Galley.

[0:22:58] Voice 4: And I'm sorry, something's just happened with my screen. There we go.

[0:23:02] Voice 4: So please put your hand up.

[0:23:04] Voice 4: You will have your,

[0:23:08] Voice 4: you should have at the bottom of your screen

[0:23:13] Voice 4: the ability to put your hand up.

[0:23:16] Voice 4: And I see that we now have a number of hands that are up.

[0:23:20] Voice 4: I'm going to ask people because it is a, you know,

[0:23:23] Voice 4: as always is a busy agenda and we have some timeframes

[0:23:27] Voice 4: that you try and be as succinct as you possibly can and concise.

[0:23:32] Voice 4: I don't like to set absolute timeframes around these things

[0:23:36] Voice 4: because I like to allow people to feel like they're being heard.

[0:23:40] Voice 4: But if we could try and keep it to three to no more than three to four minutes,

[0:23:45] Voice 4: I would appreciate that.

[0:23:47] Voice 4: So the first hand I saw was Art Moses, Mr. Moses.

[0:23:52] Voice 4: And we did get yours and Mr. Mummison's email from last night.

[0:23:59] Voice 4: at least I've received it in the Reddit so we have that as well so just so you know so if we

[0:24:05] Voice 4: could make Mr. Moses promote him so that he can speak and if you wish to turn his camera on

[0:24:23] Voice 26: am I yeah we

[0:24:25] Voice 26: can hear you

[0:24:25] Voice 4: we can hear you we can't see you it's up to you whether you wish

[0:24:28] Voice 4: to turn your camera

[0:24:29] Voice 26: I'll put myself on there thanks very much Mr. Chair Trustees I want to

[0:24:36] Voice 26: to address the Crystal Mountain proposed rezoning

[0:24:40] Voice 26: for the at the north end.

[0:24:47] Voice 26: Yes, we did, Tom Momsen and myself penned a letter,

[0:24:50] Voice 26: sent you a letter and highlighting our serious concerns

[0:24:55] Voice 26: with the water management plan

[0:24:57] Voice 26: or the draft water management plan

[0:24:58] Voice 26: that's linked to the planners report in the package.

[0:25:05] Voice 26: and I'm not going to of course read that that letter but I want to amplify and emphasize a

[0:25:12] Voice 26: couple of points and I would say when we're talking about the governance review thing for

[0:25:19] Voice 26: the islands trust this what we have to say I think is relevant to the to the to the governance review

[0:25:26] Voice 26: because one of the you know one of the things that the governance review points out is that

[0:25:31] Voice 26: that there is no comprehensive analysis

[0:25:33] Voice 26: of the trust areas capacity

[0:25:35] Voice 26: to sustain current population and activity

[0:25:40] Voice 26: or its ability to accommodate more growth and development,

[0:25:44] Voice 26: especially of climate change not considerations.

[0:25:47] Voice 26: And I would say that the problems

[0:25:49] Voice 26: with the water management plan

[0:25:52] Voice 26: that we've highlighted in our letter indicate that

[0:25:55] Voice 26: or an illustration of that.

[0:25:57] Voice 26: We just cannot understand how such a serious underestimation of water use in this large development for visitors could go forward.

[0:26:14] Voice 26: You can understand how it is that the water, the plans for water on this development are so underestimated, so low, that defies belief.

[0:26:28] Voice 26: Maybe there's an explanation for it, but I don't know what it is.

[0:26:33] Voice 26: The water is contemplated for the paying guests, most of whom will live for up to six months at a time in the complex.

[0:26:42] Voice 26: that's far less than what's required for individuals anywhere else if you compare it to

[0:26:49] Voice 26: well how is that well if you take the caretakers residents well I'm not going to get into a lot

[0:26:55] Voice 26: of numbers but for the maybe for the benefit of people who haven't seen the letter just the

[0:27:02] Voice 26: for people to realize that the water management of plan besides the 19 on area a the lower part

[0:27:10] Voice 26: part of the retreat area.

[0:27:12] Voice 26: It assumes that in addition to the 19 people

[0:27:15] Voice 26: who will be staying there during the dry summer months,

[0:27:17] Voice 26: some eight additional people, visitors, day visitors,

[0:27:21] Voice 26: staff and teachers will be there up to eight more,

[0:27:25] Voice 26: a total of 27.

[0:27:27] Voice 26: And if you divide 27 into the remaining demand,

[0:27:34] Voice 26: daily demand, peak daily demand number,

[0:27:37] Voice 26: which comes out to 1916 liters per day the plan leaves only 71 liters per day per person

[0:27:45] Voice 26: that's a fifth of what's allocated for the caretaker house which was 350 liters per day

[0:27:52] Voice 26: that's per person per day that's unbelievable if you look at the average use in canada

[0:27:58] Voice 26: provided by natural resources canada it's 249 liters per day we're talking about per person

[0:28:06] Voice 26: per day we're comparing that to 71 71 liters per day um look at the the water management plan from

[0:28:15] Voice 26: the affordable housing projects galley 230 liters per person per day giggers a range of 167 to

[0:28:26] Voice 26: food per day these are projects that have done a lot of work to satisfy the concerns of the

[0:28:35] Voice 26: the island's trust of the local trust committee yet crystal mountain is going to get away with

[0:28:42] Voice 26: 71 liters a day and if you let be the upper ridge which is controversial in itself

[0:28:49] Voice 26: where they have yet to grow well the water management plan supposes consumption of 284

[0:28:56] Voice 26: liters a day among three people that's a that's consumption of 94 liters a day

[0:29:01] Voice 26: serious underestimates don't understand how that could be and in fact there there's no estimate of

[0:29:08] Voice 26: the of the water use if if the uh if there were 35 right the the day use limits that you have

[0:29:15] Voice 26: proposed for the uh for the for the development uh with with the exception of one time of 35 with

[0:29:24] Voice 26: with exception of one time a year for a special event,

[0:29:27] Voice 26: the day use limits, the use would be even less.

[0:29:33] Voice 26: And that's a reason, a very strong reason.

[0:29:37] Voice 5: Could I ask you to wrap it up, please, Mr. Moses?

[0:29:41] Voice 26: Yes, he should not agree to Crystal Mountain's request

[0:29:44] Voice 26: for more opportunities to load more people

[0:29:48] Voice 26: onto the development for so-called special events.

[0:29:51] Voice 26: They're allowed one that should stay at one

[0:29:53] Voice 26: if you're going to go ahead on that basis.

[0:29:55] Voice 26: My final point is that we also note that the water management.

[0:30:00] Voice 26: plan from crystal mountain does not follow the local trust committee motion of october of 2020

[0:30:06] Voice 26: which directed the applicant to include in its plan a water catchment system designed to

[0:30:11] Voice 26: supplement groundwater supply for potable water in peak use low flow periods the only mention in the

[0:30:18] Voice 26: in the uh water management uh notices i don't understand how how that has uh could possibly

[0:30:29] Voice 26: possibly pass muster with the LTC.

[0:30:31] Voice 26: So, given these defects in the water management plan,

[0:30:34] Voice 26: I can't see how this proposal could move one inch further.

[0:30:40] Voice 26: Thank you.

[0:30:41] Voice 4: Okay, thanks.

[0:30:42] Voice 4: Next up we have Mr. Momsen and I did note Mr. Momsen

[0:30:47] Voice 4: that your letter was jointly authored with Mr. Moses.

[0:30:50] Voice 4: So we'd ask you not to necessarily review the same grounds

[0:30:55] Voice 4: so we can move Mr. Moses back and have Mr. Momsen come on.

[0:31:27] Voice 21: There he is. You'll be able to

[0:31:36] Voice 4: unmute yourself now, Mr. Momsen. There you go.

[0:31:43] Voice 4: Okay,

[0:31:44] Voice 25: sorry about that. It was in a different spot than I expected it. So yeah, I will not

[0:31:49] Voice 25: sort of, I will very, very briefly cover what we've written. But actually, I'm sort of very

[0:31:58] Voice 25: confused about the entire process at this point, because I'm missing the part where preserve and

[0:32:02] Voice 25: protect is the guiding principle on this Crystal Mount proposal. And where's the emphasis on

[0:32:08] Voice 25: transparency? I mean, we've asked so many questions that were unanswered. In fact, we have

[0:32:15] Voice 25: not received a single response to anything that actually deals with data or conceptually either.

[0:32:23] Voice 25: So as I've pointed out before, this rezoning proposal ignores large parts of our OCP

[0:32:29] Voice 25: and banned landlord bylaws.

[0:32:31] Voice 25: The OCP is already a compromised document

[0:32:34] Voice 25: and as such, any attempt to move the dial should be rejected.

[0:32:38] Voice 25: And this Crystal Mountain proposal

[0:32:41] Voice 25: is definitely moving the dial massively

[0:32:43] Voice 25: and also sets dangerous precedents.

[0:32:46] Voice 25: The OCP is simply a guideline.

[0:32:48] Voice 25: It is the will of the islanders.

[0:32:50] Voice 25: As such, any application must be in compliance with the OCP.

[0:32:54] Voice 25: The planner's role is to make sure applicants fit the OCP,

[0:32:57] Voice 25: not as appears in the current approach to twist the OCP to fit the applicant's wishes.

[0:33:03] Voice 25: Okay, so that's my short preamble.

[0:33:08] Voice 25: Today's LTC includes a water management plan.

[0:33:10] Voice 25: This is clearly incomplete and has stated the planners have not had the time to study and comment in detail.

[0:33:15] Voice 25: So why did this make it on the agenda at all?

[0:33:20] Voice 25: I don't really understand this.

[0:33:22] Voice 25: So I will just point one thing out that Art and I didn't really cover, it's not in detail.

[0:33:31] Voice 25: There's no drawdown study was ever done here, although the Gali proposal could not be advanced

[0:33:40] Voice 25: until that was done. And also they looked at neighboring wells, why not here? I mean,

[0:33:46] Voice 25: there should be equal treatment across the island, the island's not that big.

[0:33:51] Voice 25: besides i feel that in general there is no overruling sort of mantra for the for all

[0:34:00] Voice 25: islands because we have all the same problems with water so why do we have to go from island

[0:34:04] Voice 25: to island every ocp struggles with how much is water is available and how can it be used so

[0:34:10] Voice 25: that's a general problem here and so i don't understand why the proponents and the staff

[0:34:17] Voice 25: completely ignore the fact the aquifer is already under stress. In fact, the highest level of stress

[0:34:25] Voice 25: and my calculation oversubscribed already, including here at the North End. So then next

[0:34:32] Voice 25: one, I really object to the inclusion of 0.877 on daily visitor use on 37 participants and a

[0:34:38] Voice 25: once a year exception that is open-ended. My calculation is given the sustainable yield of

[0:34:44] Voice 25: the well the well be oversubscribed at 14 people on site so and besides the plan doesn't have any

[0:34:53] Voice 25: estimates of how much water will be used by 35 people or on those excess days and i think those

[0:35:01] Voice 25: excess days has to go i mean the demand this this mission creep first they wanted 35 now they want

[0:35:07] Voice 25: one times a year, open-ended, now six times a year open-ended.

[0:35:13] Voice 25: That's not reflected in the water demand and besides also not in the scaling

[0:35:18] Voice 25: of the wastewater treatment.

[0:35:20] Voice 25: So the agenda also includes some rewording and shoehorning the application

[0:35:25] Voice 25: into community facility and utilities.

[0:35:28] Voice 25: The proposed text squeezes CM Spiritual Education Center right between

[0:35:32] Voice 25: community housing one and utility service I designed utility service

[0:35:37] Voice 25: designed for uses of the scene at community housing halls schools libraries

[0:35:41] Voice 25: and so on emergency services now where is the reference to community anywhere

[0:35:47] Voice 25: in this in the Crestle Mountain proposal I don't see it the proposal belongs into

[0:35:52] Voice 25: the commercial section plain and simple and finally curiously neither planner

[0:35:58] Voice 25: and all the trustees and this is what you mentioned chair rogers is refers to the big

[0:36:04] Voice 25: picture like a whole trust approach to planning carrying capacity of the islands this applies

[0:36:10] Voice 25: to population natural environment biodiversity especially in light of climate crisis

[0:36:15] Voice 25: sea level rise drought water supply and wildfire okay so i would like to hear at some point i'd

[0:36:23] Voice 25: I'd like to hear some responses to the briefs we sent in

[0:36:27] Voice 25: and the questions I've asked here.

[0:36:29] Voice 25: Okay, thank you.

[0:36:32] Voice 4: So can I just, I'll just say two things to Mr. Momsen.

[0:36:36] Voice 4: One is the reason it's on our agenda is that from time

[0:36:39] Voice 4: to time staff likes to update us as to where things are.

[0:36:44] Voice 4: Even if there's no specific staff recommendation

[0:36:47] Voice 4: or anything we occasionally will get from on a project,

[0:36:52] Voice 4: we'll get an update.

[0:36:52] Voice 4: We've had updates on other applications as we go along, and this was an opportunity because

[0:37:03] Voice 4: the water management plan had been provided to put it on and have us and the community

[0:37:11] Voice 4: aware of what the plan is.

[0:37:13] Voice 4: Because if we don't put it on an agenda, then the community, unless they go looking for

[0:37:17] Voice 4: it on the website, don't necessarily see it.

[0:37:20] Voice 4: So that's why it would appear on our agenda right now as a further information, not only for us, but for members of the public at large, and allow people to comment on it.

[0:37:32] Voice 4: So that's why it would appear on the agenda.

[0:37:34] Voice 4: You'll note there's no specific recommended next step or a process from the planner in that regard.

[0:37:41] Voice 4: regard. In regards to your question about the response regarding the five papers that you've

[0:37:49] Voice 4: provided to us, I guess I'm a little, well, first of all, I know that we got very, very recently

[0:37:59] Voice 4: something from the Crystal Mountain Society that didn't make it to us in time for this agenda

[0:38:06] Voice 4: package or to get out the public that will eventually get out there where they which which

[0:38:12] Voice 4: is I gather their attempt to respond but my understanding if you're talking about the LTC

[0:38:19] Voice 4: and the staff I mean we take all of that input and respond to the issues that are raised

[0:38:26] Voice 4: as opposed to provide I'm not I don't it's not my intention to argue with you or give you

[0:38:32] Voice 4: answers. We make decisions about what the issues are that are there. And I guess we're going to

[0:38:38] Voice 4: talk about this a little bit later. So if there's specific questions that you want to have the local

[0:38:45] Voice 4: trust committee answer, but mostly what we do is we take submissions from people as input and

[0:38:51] Voice 4: utilize it in our decision-making process as we go forward. Sometimes we'll take one of those and say

[0:38:57] Voice 4: amongst each other uh the three of us and with the staff and go this point's been raised what

[0:39:02] Voice 4: do we think about that um but you know that's what community information meetings are for that's what

[0:39:08] Voice 4: uh that's what um uh your ability to reach out directly to the proponents for is to is to uh

[0:39:16] Voice 4: is to get you know any information or questions that you may have answered as opposed to us

[0:39:21] Voice 4: us engaging in an argument, if you will. I use that word argument loosely, so I'm not suggesting

[0:39:30] Voice 4: you're being argumentative. I'm just saying that we don't necessarily spend our time addressing all

[0:39:38] Voice 4: of the issues in writing back to you, but rather take the information and utilize it in our

[0:39:44] Voice 4: consideration process. So thank you. I just wanted to address those two points that you read, because

[0:39:49] Voice 4: I you can we can disagree all we want about what decisions we make we can disagree all we want

[0:39:55] Voice 4: about about our um about the outcomes that we come to and fair enough have no problem with all of

[0:40:02] Voice 4: that I am quite conscious of ensuring that we have an open and transparent process so I'm going to

[0:40:10] Voice 4: ask you to move Mr. Mommison I think the next person on the list was Sheila Anderson we got

[0:40:47] Voice 21: Dr. Camera there

[0:40:47] Voice 4: just need only by muted.

[0:40:49] Voice 4: Go ahead, please.

[0:40:51] Voice 13: Thank you.

[0:40:54] Voice 13: Yes, I just wanted to briefly summarize my concerns

[0:40:59] Voice 13: at this stage regarding Crystal Mountains application.

[0:41:04] Voice 13: Like the previous two speakers,

[0:41:06] Voice 13: I'm very concerned that the briefings

[0:41:10] Voice 13: that were submitted back in October

[0:41:12] Voice 13: and the petition has not really been,

[0:41:15] Voice 13: if not responded to directly,

[0:41:16] Voice 13: even discussed in any detail the issues that were raised and that's quite a while to wait and it's

[0:41:24] Voice 13: just not clear that any of that information is sinking in so that concerns me and I wanted to

[0:41:30] Voice 13: let you know that I'm hoping that something can be done. The other thing I noticed in looking at

[0:41:38] Voice 13: the information in the agenda package is this covenant that you're attempting to use and I

[0:41:46] Voice 13: i have some real concerns about it partly from past experience um but when i look at it and

[0:41:53] Voice 13: there's a number of components you're trying to protect in terms of natural features vegetation

[0:41:58] Voice 13: etc it's not clear to me how that covenant will be effective because there's no monitoring built

[0:42:06] Voice 13: into this there's no rent charge built into this so how in fact will it be useful and if there's

[0:42:14] Voice 13: anything you're trying to put in that covenant which in fact should be in a bylaw and this

[0:42:18] Voice 13: applies to anything you should put it in the bylaw because then it's more um enforceable

[0:42:25] Voice 13: and i guess you know when i say from past experience it's the covenant you put on dl 37

[0:42:36] Voice 13: to restrict truck traffic on sundays to address the concerns of neighboring property owners

[0:42:43] Voice 13: from the noise pollution safety etc um that appears to be quite unlikely to ever be enforced

[0:42:52] Voice 13: effectively because there's there's no way it's all word of of a neighboring resident who sees

[0:43:00] Voice 13: the trucks are running on a sunday and a huge hassle to go through to get that reported and

[0:43:07] Voice 13: then you don't know whatever happens about it and then a month later you see more trucks on a sunday

[0:43:13] Voice 13: So it's an ongoing, it's more putting a burden on the concerned neighbors than it is on the actual property owner, it seems.

[0:43:22] Voice 13: So, and it's not attached to any bylaw.

[0:43:25] Voice 13: This covenant you're proposing is not there physically available to the average person to know it even exists.

[0:43:33] Voice 13: And that's a concern because if the Islands Trust isn't monitoring every detail on that thing, who is?

[0:43:41] Voice 13: is you're just relying on neighbors and what they might notice or hear chainsaws and cutting down

[0:43:46] Voice 13: trees you know and they don't even know so that's it that's a really i just really want you to think

[0:43:52] Voice 13: about that that what are you actually doing with this covenant you know certain things that can be

[0:44:00] Voice 13: monitored accurately and followed like water uses maybe but all this other stuff i just i just really

[0:44:08] Voice 13: question it so those are my two main areas of concern and i'll leave it at that um i i just

[0:44:15] Voice 13: really would like to not see this advanced in any way i would like you to really sit back and

[0:44:21] Voice 13: consider you know if this should even be considered any further for the use of this

[0:44:29] Voice 13: particular land for what they're proposing and it's as the briefing showed there's many problems

[0:44:35] Voice 13: and um you know i'll just say personally i think the land would be better off with one

[0:44:42] Voice 13: one house on an f3 property with a third party covenant which is monitored regularly and has

[0:44:50] Voice 13: a rent charge if they violate it and limits the cut rate to a sustainable level ensures native

[0:44:56] Voice 13: species are used and prevents pesticide or herbicide use that would be a benefit so i um

[0:45:04] Voice 13: I just urge you to rethink what you're doing here

[0:45:06] Voice 13: and not spend any more staff time on this.

[0:45:10] Voice 13: Thank you.

[0:45:10] Voice 4: Thank you.

[0:45:14] Voice 21: Mr. Ronsley would be the next person.

[0:45:22] Voice 21: And again, I want to urge you to try and be brief.

[0:45:25] Voice 21: We've already, it's already quarter after one.

[0:45:52] Voice 21: Go ahead.

[0:45:53] Voice 21: I can't, I can see you, but I can't,

[0:45:56] Voice 21: I can't hear you, Mr. Ronsley.

[0:46:09] Voice 21: Now you have to unmute yourself.

[0:46:15] Voice 21: There.

[0:46:16] Voice 21: Now we can see you.

[0:46:17] Voice 21: Go ahead, sir.

[0:46:17] Voice 21: okay i'll

[0:46:18] Voice 27: just take a couple of minutes but i do have a statement um first of all good afternoon

[0:46:23] Voice 27: um the the agenda for today's local trust committee meeting includes an update to the

[0:46:30] Voice 27: galliano island local trust committee on the application by the crystal mountain society to

[0:46:35] Voice 27: rezone its forestry zone lot my purpose in speaking to you today is to say that from the outset

[0:46:42] Voice 27: set, this update is grossly deficient. It addresses only two of many fundamental problems

[0:46:50] Voice 27: with the Crystal Mountain proposal. The two issues are the applicant's water management plan

[0:46:57] Voice 27: and the question of limits to daily visitor use. These are important questions, but it should not

[0:47:04] Voice 27: be assumed that they are the most serious problems or deficiencies with the proposal.

[0:47:08] Voice 27: I want to emphasize that the problems with the Crystal Mountain proposal are profound.

[0:47:15] Voice 27: They strike at the very core of the society's activity, which is not legal on the property and continues to the present day.

[0:47:25] Voice 27: The Crystal Mountain Society appears intent on dismissing legitimate concerns from the community without providing any response to them.

[0:47:36] Voice 27: Instead, they persist with demands for special allowances that are based on nothing more than

[0:47:42] Voice 27: what they say are necessary for the society's activities. For example, the Crystal Mountain

[0:47:49] Voice 27: land use proposal continues to demand not one but two separate development sites and now not one

[0:47:57] Voice 27: but six days during the year when the limits of daily use are exceeded. These demands are not

[0:48:05] Voice 27: just unreasonable. They distract from what is really needed. What is really needed is focus

[0:48:12] Voice 27: on the long-term implications and not simply the short-term needs of the current property owners.

[0:48:20] Voice 27: The principle of good governance by this local trust committee or any governing body requires

[0:48:27] Voice 27: that all aspects of a submission be seriously considered.

[0:48:32] Voice 27: This local trust committee cannot claim

[0:48:34] Voice 27: that they do not know about the other problems

[0:48:37] Voice 27: with the Crystal Mountain proposal.

[0:48:39] Voice 27: These concerns have been submitted to them repeatedly

[0:48:43] Voice 27: and in writing by a number of Galliano Island residents.

[0:48:48] Voice 27: The residents have not received a response.

[0:48:51] Voice 27: They feel blown off at the same time

[0:48:54] Voice 27: that the application appears poised to move forward

[0:48:57] Voice 27: as if everything is okay except for just a couple of last things to work out so let me summarize

[0:49:04] Voice 27: what the problems are

[0:49:05] Voice 4: actually mr

[0:49:07] Voice 4: gronsley and i'm not sure because we all know the five papers

[0:49:13] Voice 4: we know the issues that have been raised we talked about them at length so why are you

[0:49:18] Voice 4: summarizing them all again so because

[0:49:20] Voice 27: um i think because we haven't heard a response well i

[0:49:24] Voice 4: I answered Mr. Momsen about what the concern

[0:49:28] Voice 27: about not responding.

[0:49:31] Voice 4: I didn't understand anybody to say we want fulsome written responses.

[0:49:36] Voice 4: We would take those papers and we would utilize them in our consideration.

[0:49:40] Voice 4: And as I indicated, I had urged the Crystal Mountain Society to reply.

[0:49:46] Voice 4: And we recently got something that I haven't had an opportunity to read yet.

[0:49:50] Voice 4: So that will become

[0:49:51] Voice 4: part of the public record.

[0:49:53] Voice 4: My

[0:49:53] Voice 27: intention is not to argue with you, Chair Rogers,

[0:49:56] Voice 27: so I'll go to my final, my final,

[0:49:58] Voice 27: my

[0:49:58] Voice 21: final sentence, okay.

[0:50:06] Voice 27: As I said, these issues are already

[0:50:08] Voice 27: before the Local Trust Committee

[0:50:09] Voice 27: and have been for some time.

[0:50:11] Voice 27: Neglect of legitimate concerns

[0:50:13] Voice 27: as expressed by members of the community

[0:50:15] Voice 27: goes against the principles of good governance.

[0:50:18] Voice 27: My personal belief is that the Local Trust Committee

[0:50:21] Voice 27: has not responded to legitimate concerns

[0:50:24] Voice 27: that have been raised for the simple reason

[0:50:26] Voice 27: that there are no good answers so it's now past time for our local trust committee to reject the

[0:50:31] Voice 27: crystal man land use proposal there are simply too many problems with it thank you thanks very much

[0:50:37] Voice 4: yeah not trying to be argumentative i'm just trying to keep us moving through

[0:50:42] Voice 4: uh um ms dotey please i

[0:51:12] Voice 18: can

[0:51:14] Voice 5: hear you now

[0:51:16] Voice 18: oh

[0:51:18] Voice 4: i'm sorry oh she was there and now i don't see her

[0:51:24] Voice 4: either. Oh, she's put her hand down. So, Risa Smith, please, Ms. Smith.

[0:51:35] Voice 5: Oh, now she's put her

[0:51:36] Voice 5: hand back up. There's Risa.

[0:51:51] Voice 21: Unmute. Can

[0:51:53] Trustee Smith: you hear me now? You can now.

[0:51:55] Trustee Smith: Okay. Oh, my system is just

[0:51:56] Trustee Smith: completely screwy. Anyways, that's okay. I can't see my notes, but I'll go ahead anyways. I am

[0:52:02] Trustee Smith: speaking about Crystal Mountain, and I was glad to hear, Trustee Rogers, that you said you wanted

[0:52:08] Trustee Smith: people to feel that they were being heard. And I think the reason we're speaking and we seem

[0:52:13] Trustee Smith: repetitive is because we don't feel heard. And, oh, just a minute, I can put my video on.

[0:52:20] Trustee Smith: And I definitely don't feel heard. I feel incredibly slighted and incredibly disturbed

[0:52:28] Trustee Smith: by the process that's going on. We submitted a petition with 180 signatures on it from such a

[0:52:35] Trustee Smith: small community. And there has been no reaction that that's a significant number of people in

[0:52:42] Trustee Smith: this community. One trustee has actually said to people in the community that petition doesn't mean

[0:52:47] Trustee Smith: anything to her because she gets lots of them. I'm not aware of any others that this local trust

[0:52:52] Trustee Smith: committee has received. We were told by you, Trustee Rogers, no offense, but that we would

[0:52:58] Trustee Smith: get a response. And so far, I don't expect that response to be in like a discussion on every item.

[0:53:05] Trustee Smith: But I do respect the response to be reflected in subsequent planners' reports on this proposal, yet that has never happened.

[0:53:15] Trustee Smith: And we even heard a discussion at one point where one of the issues, which was fragmentation, we heard a planner, which is trust policy, a planner say that he doesn't believe in fragmentation, which is trust policy.

[0:53:31] Trustee Smith: No,

[0:53:32] Voice 4: he didn't say that. He said he didn't believe this was fragmentation.

[0:53:36] Trustee Smith: well it's i'm an ecologist it

[0:53:38] Voice 4: was a man i know who you i know there's a debate around this and

[0:53:41] Voice 4: i don't want to get a discussion but i want you to reflect what we said accurately okay well that's

[0:53:46] Trustee Smith: not what i heard but that's fine my point is that we haven't got a response in that's reflected in

[0:53:53] Trustee Smith: any of the subsequent uh iterations of this proposal and in particular i would say that

[0:54:02] Trustee Smith: that I'm quite disturbed about this water plan

[0:54:05] Trustee Smith: that we just see, which I recognize isn't finished yet,

[0:54:08] Trustee Smith: but we have two trustees who ran on a mandate

[0:54:11] Trustee Smith: that they felt water was the single most important issue

[0:54:14] Trustee Smith: on the island.

[0:54:15] Trustee Smith: Both of them have said that because it is,

[0:54:18] Trustee Smith: because everybody recognizes that.

[0:54:19] Trustee Smith: And yet this proposal is not being required

[0:54:23] Trustee Smith: to do some of the basic things to show

[0:54:26] Trustee Smith: that they are not impacting

[0:54:28] Trustee Smith: an already oversubscribed watershed.

[0:54:31] Trustee Smith: watershed I just don't understand that that's in our briefing zone but why they wouldn't be

[0:54:36] Trustee Smith: required to do a drawdown study yet affordable housing projects which clearly are a community

[0:54:44] Trustee Smith: need are required to do that so I think I will leave this just in the sense of that I have had

[0:54:51] Trustee Smith: a look at the governance report that you're going to be discussing tomorrow and I was quite surprised

[0:54:57] Trustee Smith: because I thought maybe this is just a reflection of what's happening on Galliano, but I see that

[0:55:02] Trustee Smith: a lot of people in the islands feel that there's a lack of a democratic process,

[0:55:07] Trustee Smith: and particularly a lack of transparency on how decisions are made. And that is how I am feeling

[0:55:14] Trustee Smith: right now, very disturbed that my own trustees and my own local trust committee, and I sit on

[0:55:21] Trustee Smith: the Islands Trust Conservancy, I think everyone there has shown me a lot of respect, I contribute

[0:55:26] Trustee Smith: contribute to the trust significantly for free in that context. And I am just absolutely distraught

[0:55:35] Trustee Smith: by the lack of respect for the effort that went into our briefing notes and the fact

[0:55:39] Trustee Smith: that none of it has been reflected in subsequent iterations by the by the plan. Well, that's not

[0:55:47] Trustee Smith: the plan. I'm just saying in the reports, they don't reflect anything. So you've said that people

[0:55:53] Trustee Smith: people have read them and are listening to them, but we don't see it reflected. And that is

[0:55:57] Trustee Smith: incredibly disturbing. And my last thing I want to say, I will submit a little briefing paper I

[0:56:04] Trustee Smith: wrote on this topic, that perhaps you're not aware that wellness tourism is the fastest growing

[0:56:10] Trustee Smith: tourism in the entire world. And Canada, the country we live in, is number eight for wellness

[0:56:17] Trustee Smith: tourism. Wellness tourism is a particular kind of tourism. It's a commercial activity. Some of it is

[0:56:24] Trustee Smith: run by nonprofit societies, some by businesses. It doesn't matter. It's a particular and there's

[0:56:30] Trustee Smith: nothing against I have nothing against wellness tourism. But this proposal is a wellness tourism

[0:56:37] Trustee Smith: proposal. It is clearly belongs in the commercial section. And we have never had any response on why

[0:56:45] Trustee Smith: Why it isn't there where it belongs, except that it's where Crystal Mountain wants it

[0:56:51] Trustee Smith: as a community utility.

[0:56:53] Trustee Smith: That's all we've heard.

[0:56:54] Trustee Smith: We haven't seen any real justification for that other than it's what the developer wants.

[0:57:01] Trustee Smith: It makes no sense.

[0:57:02] Trustee Smith: So why?

[0:57:04] Trustee Smith: And there's been no response to that.

[0:57:06] Trustee Smith: So you can see why I'm not someone who usually gets emotional in these situations, but I

[0:57:12] Trustee Smith: I am very emotional now because I feel that I've put a lot of work into being evidence-based,

[0:57:20] Trustee Smith: rational, and I hear you say that you want us to feel heard, but then I want you to hear me saying

[0:57:27] Trustee Smith: I actually feel that I haven't been heard at all and that the people who signed the petition have

[0:57:33] Trustee Smith: not been heard either. So I'll leave it at that. Thank you.

[0:57:42] Voice 4: Okay. I just want to make sure we're

[0:57:45] Voice 4: are all on the same page about some things. We got this petition in October. We haven't had a

[0:57:53] Voice 4: mid-October. We haven't, we've had one very brief staff report before today around a couple of

[0:58:01] Voice 4: minor issues, and today's is around a couple of other issues. We haven't had a, I guess I don't

[0:58:11] Voice 4: know what it is i i appreciate i i believe you when you feel you don't want it hurt but i guess

[0:58:16] Voice 4: i would like to know what that would look like given that this has not appeared in a in a comp

[0:58:22] Voice 4: in a comprehensive way on our agenda since the since the petition and the documents were filed

[0:58:31] Trustee Smith: what it would look like would be that we would see reports from the planner but there have been

[0:58:37] Voice 4: no reports we're not there yet we were waiting throughout until the new year for the for the

[0:58:44] Voice 4: water data logger to be finished we made it clear we weren't going to move anywhere forward until

[0:58:50] Voice 4: the data logger work data was provided then we canceled our meetings in in uh in january and

[0:58:57] Voice 4: and then we had a meeting in february where it wasn't on the agenda so i guess i really want to

[0:59:03] Voice 4: know and I hear you I totally hear you and I totally respect the work that you guys put into

[0:59:08] Voice 4: it but I want to know what you guys would what this this commentary what it would have looked

[0:59:14] Voice 4: like

[0:59:14] Trustee Smith: okay so in the in this the material for today's meeting in the planners report there

[0:59:21] Trustee Smith: are proposed bylaws clearly there's a there's a proposed bylaws those proposed bylaws don't

[0:59:30] Trustee Smith: reflect anything of what we've submitted so they're in the material for the meeting so the

[0:59:37] Voice 4: proposed bylaws are exactly the same as what we've done to date except that there's a now an answer

[0:59:44] Voice 4: to okay i i feel like i don't want to have this debate i i'm sorry i'm taking the time now but

[0:59:49] Voice 4: all they contain is is the definition of retreat user which we asked to be put in there

[0:59:55] Voice 4: so that's that's what that's what the

[0:59:59] Voice 4: Beep.

[1:00:00] Voice 4: extent of those are otherwise they

[1:00:02] Voice 4: look the same as they did in September or whenever we we've last

[1:00:06] Voice 4: dealt with them in Folsom so well anyway

[1:00:10] Voice 4: anyway I hear you I believe you I hear you but I I'd

[1:00:13] Voice 4: really like someone to tell me given the the the the way that we had to cancel some meetings given

[1:00:20] Voice 4: that we've had other applications on our agenda and we haven't had this one fulsomely on our

[1:00:24] Voice 4: agenda since what it would have looked like for you to feel heard um and so i'll just put that

[1:00:31] Voice 4: out there and just leave it there thank you for your commentary

[1:00:33] Trustee Smith: and i'll write i'll put in writing

[1:00:35] Trustee Smith: that i'll answer you thank you

[1:00:36] Trustee Smith: miss

[1:00:40] Voice 21: kutz go ahead you'll be able to unmute yourself now okay can you

[1:01:06] Voice 1: hear me i

[1:01:07] Voice 6: can okay

[1:01:08] Voice 1: great thank you hello chair and trustees i will be fast um so i'm also speaking

[1:01:15] Voice 1: about the Crystal Mountain development application. So one of my greatest concerns is also

[1:01:21] Voice 1: the issue of water which seems to be a hot topic. As we all know being islanders water is a precious

[1:01:27] Voice 1: resource and it's not unlimited. My own well had issues this summer and after speaking with a well

[1:01:31] Voice 1: specialist he said that he's seeing this with increasing frequencies or weather gets hotter

[1:01:35] Voice 1: and drier and wells have to pull deeper for water. Crystal Mountain has their most populated and

[1:01:41] Voice 1: longest retreats during the summer months. This is when the most water will be used at the site

[1:01:46] Voice 1: and also when the least water will be available. I read through the water management plan and I

[1:01:50] Voice 1: just, I don't really see how it adds up. I know it's a draft. I think it's negligent to be basing

[1:01:56] Voice 1: these estimated numbers of water usage on lowest possible numbers. For example, the estimated

[1:02:02] Voice 1: water usage is being based on the idea of 27 participants and the two caretakers.

[1:02:07] Voice 1: But I think teachers, volunteers, and other participants that are staying off site

[1:02:11] Voice 1: private residences need to be taken into account um krista mountains also asked for this special

[1:02:17] Voice 1: six days where they can have more than 35 people so in all likelihood this would also occur in the

[1:02:21] Voice 1: summer months when and put additional demand on the aquifer um i think if a proper estimation is

[1:02:27] Voice 1: to be done i think it should be estimated on numbers based on at least 35 people if not more

[1:02:31] Voice 1: um also the daily demand seems strangely low i did a bit of research and average daily water

[1:02:37] Voice 1: use of Canadians is varies but generally between 300 and 450 liters a day for the average person

[1:02:44] Voice 1: based on the amounts in the water management plan it's about 90 liters a day I understand

[1:02:49] Voice 1: they you know they probably wouldn't be showering every day and things like that but it still seems

[1:02:52] Voice 1: like a big undershot I do think these estimations are indicative of the water of water use will

[1:02:58] Voice 1: actually be taking place I do sorry I'm reading off the thing so I don't blather if you so if

[1:03:05] Voice 1: if you multiply 35 people by 200 liters a day, which is still likely under, it's actually about

[1:03:10] Voice 1: 7,000 liters a day, so it's more than, much more than double what's in the water management plan.

[1:03:15] Voice 1: I highlight this just to show the importance that these numbers are, can quickly inflate,

[1:03:20] Voice 1: just as water use can quickly inflate, and I feel that strongly that due diligence should

[1:03:25] Voice 1: be given to the issue of water with any and all developments on Galliano. It's better to

[1:03:28] Voice 1: overestimate use rather than underestimate. My second quick point of concern is the number of

[1:03:33] Voice 1: people, participants, teachers, volunteers on the site is going to be extremely difficult if not

[1:03:37] Voice 1: impossible to enforce. I don't know who would oversee or if it would just be based on trust

[1:03:44] Voice 1: that the applicant would adhere to the restrictions. If it is to be based on trust then I believe it's

[1:03:49] Voice 1: important to look at the actions of the applicant historically and how restrictions on land use

[1:03:53] Voice 1: have been ignored in the past. I believe this development can is going to set a dangerous

[1:03:57] Voice 1: precedent on the island to other property owners that would also like to develop their properties

[1:04:02] Voice 1: in similar ways um and it's hard to allow one and now but not others in the future anyways thank you

[1:04:08] Voice 1: very much for your time suzanne

[1:04:17] Voice 21: fournier please uh

[1:04:46] Voice 8: good morning can you hear me uh yes you can

[1:04:51] Voice 8: hear me yes or no okay great thank you i'm trying to uh get the video i i apologize but it's um

[1:05:00] Voice 8: it's a little challenging because the process says to join as a panelist is dan still here is

[1:05:05] Voice 8: chair rogers still here dan have you uh stepped out or are you in the room i

[1:05:15] Voice 18: think he's disappeared

[1:05:16] Voice 18: so hang on uh suzanne till he okay

[1:05:19] Voice 8: certainly till

[1:05:21] Voice 18: he gets back in i know i've been having

[1:05:22] Voice 18: trouble with my internet today too yeah

[1:05:26] Voice 8: and here at the north end we're completely reliant on

[1:05:29] Voice 8: beacon or wi-fi or cell data there he is uh thank you chair rogers and galliano trustees

[1:05:38] Voice 8: You have already heard from a physicist, an ecologist who works at the national, international

[1:05:45] Voice 8: level, a physician, a journalist, and other residents of the North End.

[1:05:51] Voice 8: It's a combined expertise that is quite impressive, which is why we question when the trustees

[1:05:58] Voice 8: say that they don't consider petitions or that the mail is running 50-50.

[1:06:03] Voice 8: There's a very substantial weight and breadth of opinion that has been contributed on one

[1:06:10] Voice 8: side and on the other side, two-line statements that amount to a kind of friends endorsement.

[1:06:18] Voice 8: We are the ones who live with it.

[1:06:20] Voice 8: In fact, the North End neighborhood is already dealing with the applicant's commercial visitor

[1:06:24] Voice 8: accommodation and the impacts.

[1:06:28] Voice 8: Crystal Mountain has already started its retreats.

[1:06:31] Voice 8: how does this affect us you wonder in addition to the water use and other impacts it means that we

[1:06:39] Voice 8: have a large number of mostly urban mostly internationally based wellness tourists who

[1:06:45] Voice 8: move into our neighborhood who drive along country lanes very quickly who don't understand

[1:06:51] Voice 8: rural water use and are taking up the spots in our neighborhood that could be reserved for example

[1:06:59] Voice 8: example uh conservation or Rockfish Rockfish technicians daycare workers are people who live

[1:07:06] Voice 8: and try to rely on our community's housing base which as you know is extremely precarious

[1:07:11] Voice 8: um I I know that other people have touched on this so I'll be brief in this point

[1:07:17] Voice 8: um this is clearly commercial visitor accommodation the applicant advertises heavily

[1:07:23] Voice 8: I believe that saying that they're paying guests are entitled to all of Galliano's resources,

[1:07:31] Voice 8: our water, our roads, our beach access, all public amenities, stores and community centers.

[1:07:39] Voice 8: And what they are contributing in return is zero access to their land, no public trails,

[1:07:46] Voice 8: no public access.

[1:07:50] Voice 8: Yes, we have heard one trustee say that the people who signed the petition don't understand

[1:07:57] Voice 8: the issues because they have said that they don't understand that we are getting a large

[1:08:02] Voice 8: chunk of land.

[1:08:03] Voice 8: So

[1:08:03] Voice 4: I'm going

[1:08:04] Voice 4: to stop you, and I don't like to stop you, but I've asked many times

[1:08:08] Voice 4: people not to personalize these things, to talk to the issues, and I'm asking you to

[1:08:15] Voice 4: do that again.

[1:08:15] Voice 4: Please talk to the issues.

[1:08:17] Voice 8: thank you i will the 18 acres of land to be set aside are not land which can be built on

[1:08:23] Voice 8: there's steep slopes and wetland uh it's not a high priority for the islands trust conservancy

[1:08:29] Voice 8: which has um you know very clear mandate and instructions on what kind of land it is to take

[1:08:37] Voice 8: into its um its roster of of uh environmental um environmentally sensitive land um meanwhile it's

[1:08:48] Voice 8: kind of like the emperor's new clothes we know that the applicant took in two hundred thousand

[1:08:53] Voice 8: dollars in revenue during a coveted period they held two retreats uh during a pandemic which were

[1:09:00] Voice 8: were opposed by the public and the neighborhood.

[1:09:03] Voice 8: And the only response in, I guess,

[1:09:07] Voice 8: a response to repeated comments and complaints by residents

[1:09:12] Voice 8: was a phone call, a verbal request

[1:09:15] Voice 8: from the Island Health Public Inspector

[1:09:18] Voice 8: that they not use the six outhouses

[1:09:20] Voice 8: that they've used for 20 years.

[1:09:23] Voice 8: It appears that they did follow that mandate,

[1:09:26] Voice 8: but the aquifer continues to be drained.

[1:09:30] Voice 8: There's a huge amount of volume of gray water, buried trash, and going into the water which drains into Spotlight Cove, on which so many houses depend in the local neighborhood.

[1:09:45] Voice 8: This is not personal. It's very much a practical issue.

[1:09:48] Voice 8: you we want to be assured that if this extremely dense intense resort development goes into our

[1:09:56] Voice 8: neighborhood be it for wellness tourism or be it for any other use um that we are not stuck with an

[1:10:04] Voice 8: yet another de facto resort which will continue to expand considering bodega ridge and bodega cove

[1:10:11] Voice 8: both have extensive plans one of them has actually proposed a hotel a wine bar

[1:10:18] Voice 8: a store which might be welcome could

[1:10:21] Voice 4: I ask you to wrap it up please it's taken

[1:10:23] Voice 4: we're running really

[1:10:25] Voice 4: running late yes

[1:10:27] Voice 8: because it's hard to sign on and

[1:10:29] Voice 8: there's been a lot of back and forth but I will wrap up quickly we are asking

[1:10:36] Voice 8: asking that this application really should not go any further we have provided all kinds of

[1:10:43] Voice 8: information um I understand the chair's applicant um the chair's explanation of how and why that

[1:10:50] Voice 8: will be responded to but in the meantime we feel the applicant is not actually doing their work

[1:10:55] Voice 8: the Upper Ridge remains a planning conundrum for Crystal Mountain for our OCP for the LTC planners

[1:11:02] Voice 8: and the neighborhood there's no proof of potable water after 20 years of them

[1:11:07] Voice 8: holding de facto retreats up there no solution to septic and traffic between

[1:11:12] Voice 8: the two sites is not possible by foot only on public roads the other day I had

[1:11:19] Voice 8: to pass it

[1:11:20] Voice 4: no seriously I need you to wrap it up and you're starting to tell

[1:11:23] Voice 4: another story so let's please just wrap it up

[1:11:26] Voice 8: okay and also we see nothing that

[1:11:31] Voice 8: that addresses the remediation of 20 years of gray water

[1:11:34] Voice 8: and sewage on houses below.

[1:11:39] Voice 8: We'd like to see the trustees personal responses to this

[1:11:42] Voice 8: and we look forward to seeing the practical answers

[1:11:45] Voice 8: and solutions or a hope to the application.

[1:11:48] Voice 5: Thank you.

[1:11:49] Voice 8: Thank you.

[1:11:51] Voice 4: Next we have Carmita.

[1:11:56] Voice 4: I'm assuming Carmita you're not speaking on Giggers.

[1:11:59] Voice 21: So please go ahead.

[1:12:33] Voice 21: You need to unmute yourself, Carmita.

[1:12:36] Voice 23: Yes, now I found it.

[1:12:38] Voice 23: Yes, no, it's something that both can be there,

[1:12:41] Voice 23: Trustee Rockefeller and Trustee Wolverton.

[1:12:45] Voice 23: See, Trustee Wolverton doesn't have to leave.

[1:12:49] Voice 23: And it's that I would like to talk about the deep subsidy

[1:12:53] Voice 23: that units in both affordable housing projects.

[1:12:56] Voice 23: It's not about one or the other.

[1:13:00] Voice 23: The number of deep subsidy units,

[1:13:02] Voice 23: units, it should be explicit in the House's agreements of both projects. It should not

[1:13:11] Voice 23: be an intention from the part of the applicants. The affordability of a project should be measured

[1:13:20] Voice 23: by how affordable it is for the residents of Galeano who have the lowest income. PC

[1:13:29] Voice 23: The C-Housing defined deep subsidy income limits for residential units with less than two bedrooms as a gross household income that does not exceed the maximum all-age security plus guaranteed income supplement.

[1:13:46] Voice 23: The figure for 2021 is $19,813.

[1:13:53] Voice 23: dollars. The deeply subsidized unit should be there also for residents with disability pensions

[1:14:04] Voice 23: and income assistance. I am saying this because I haven't seen in the housing agreement

[1:14:10] Voice 23: the number of deep units subsidized. According to VC Housing, one bedroom deep subsidy unit

[1:14:19] Voice 23: units should have a rent of $375. This is according to the staff. And if you compare

[1:14:29] Voice 23: this with 30% of busy housing income limits, one bedroom could go to a maximum rent of

[1:14:37] Voice 23: $1,893. One of the projects mentioned in the website that the project goal is to relieve

[1:14:46] Voice 23: poverty. In order to relieve poverty, to apply the moral values of diversity and equality,

[1:14:59] Voice 23: you trustees are the only one that can guarantee that by approving the resumption,

[1:15:09] Voice 23: these are projects that provide affordability to the most vulnerable residents of Galeano.

[1:15:17] Voice 23: The applicant have asked to the LTC and the planning department for flexibility in the rental structure to be able to obtain funds.

[1:15:29] Voice 23: But this should not be done by sacrificing the deep subsidy units, units that will be the open doors to the residents who otherwise will not be able to afford housing at all.

[1:15:45] Voice 23: I urge you, trustees, to demand that in the housing agreement, the number of deep subsidized units will be explicit, as well as the definition of deeply subsidized units.

[1:16:05] Voice 23: The two affordable housing projects in front of you are not just for a near future, but for many, many years to come.

[1:16:16] Voice 23: The Board of Directors of the Affordable Housing Society, as well as the administration, will change with time.

[1:16:26] Voice 23: But the housing agreements will be there to ensure affordability for residents whose incomes depend on all-age security, disabled pensions, and income assistance.

[1:16:42] Voice 23: Thank you.

[1:16:44] Voice 4: Thank you.

[1:16:45] Voice 4: uh we i see that uh calling dhoti is back um i assume you want to speak and yes we could move

[1:16:55] Voice 4: karmita back and karmita if you could put your hand down thank you

[1:16:58] Voice 18: there's also a kasha forest

[1:17:00] Voice 18: yes

[1:17:01] Voice 4: i know i've got a kasha and then we're going to have to go into the recusal

[1:17:06] Voice 4: i if this is the problem it's hard for us to get our work done um anyway i guess part of our work

[1:17:13] Voice 4: is listening to the community. Afternoon.

[1:17:23] Voice 24: Can you hear me?

[1:17:24] Voice 21: I can.

[1:17:25] Voice 24: Yes. Great. I attended the

[1:17:28] Voice 24: wells and groundwater licensing webinar in February. And one of the things I found interesting

[1:17:33] Voice 24: was that according to the provincial authorities, water licenses are required for short-term

[1:17:40] Voice 24: vacation rentals. And I'm not sure that is well known or understood in our community. So even

[1:17:47] Voice 24: Even STVRs being run as home occupations require water licenses, according to the provincial authorities.

[1:17:56] Voice 24: And anyway, that was

[1:17:57] Voice 24: an interesting tidbit of learning that I wanted to pass on.

[1:18:01] Voice 24: Thank you. That's it for me.

[1:18:03] Voice 4: Thanks, Ms. Doty.

[1:18:05] Voice 4: Yes, and we've seen some recent reports that there was not, even after all these years,

[1:18:12] Voice 4: there wasn't as much uptake of the water licensing.

[1:18:14] Voice 4: But let's not get to go down that road, because William Schubel will want to talk about it for quite a while.

[1:18:21] Voice 4: I'm just kidding, William.

[1:18:24] Voice 4: And then Akasha Forrest.

[1:18:26] Voice 4: And then I'm going to ask if anybody wishes to speak to the galley application.

[1:18:48] Voice 21: Good afternoon, everyone.

[1:18:50] Voice 21: Can

[1:18:50] Voice 14: you hear me?

[1:18:51] Voice 4: Yes.

[1:18:52] Voice 14: Okay.

[1:18:53] Voice 14: So I will be brief.

[1:18:55] Voice 14: And I do have three questions based on the Plano's report for Crystal Mountain.

[1:19:01] Voice 14: and I'm not sure if they can be answered now, but there are three questions.

[1:19:07] Voice 14: Okay, the first one is that the data collection for the water management report was set for September to January,

[1:19:15] Voice 14: and I think several people have already talked to their concerns around that,

[1:19:21] Voice 14: and my question is, will there be data collection for the peak months of the summer

[1:19:29] Voice 14: in order to establish the use of water by Crystal Mountain

[1:19:36] Voice 14: and the cumulative water use by the neighborhood

[1:19:40] Voice 14: during the driest months of the year?

[1:19:44] Voice 14: So that's question number one.

[1:19:46] Voice 14: Should I just go ahead with the other two?

[1:19:48] Voice 4: Well, I'll just tell you that we haven't discussed it

[1:19:50] Voice 4: as a local trust committee,

[1:19:51] Voice 4: so I can't tell you that we're going to direct that or not.

[1:19:53] Voice 4: I can't answer that question.

[1:19:55] Voice 14: Okay. All right.

[1:19:56] Voice 14: Right. Number two is I see that in the planners report there under the descriptions or definitions of sleeping hut and tent platform.

[1:20:12] Voice 14: They list these units as single occupancy. And my recollection is that occupancy rates are unenforceable.

[1:20:21] Voice 14: I'm not sure if I have that wrong, or if there is some information I'm missing on that.

[1:20:29] Voice 14: So are occupancy rates enforceable?

[1:20:33] Voice 4: Planner Smith.

[1:20:36] Voice 28: In this case, they are enforceable, just as they would be in a hotel room or any other

[1:20:42] Voice 28: setting like that where you are paying a nightly rate, or the enforceability of occupancy rates

[1:20:51] Voice 28: applies more to the rental tenancy act and rentals of 30 days or more

[1:20:55] Voice 14: okay so the uh so the occupancy

[1:20:58] Voice 14: rates would be enforced by whom islands

[1:21:05] Voice 28: trust by law enforcement staff okay

[1:21:08] Voice 14: thank you and the next

[1:21:10] Voice 14: question i have is um under community facilities i think it says um it says part 2.1 part 4 and

[1:21:23] Voice 14: And in brackets, it says creation and extension of zones.

[1:21:26] Voice 14: Section 4.1 is amended and it continues.

[1:21:31] Voice 14: And my question is, I'm concerned about the creation and extension of zones.

[1:21:37] Voice 14: My understanding is that it normally would be through an OCP review process that the

[1:21:44] Voice 14: community decides on the zones that it wishes to have in its community.

[1:21:49] Voice 14: for example, light industrial use or any number of possibilities, I'm wondering how come we have

[1:22:01] Voice 14: a creation and extension of a zone, which is for community facilities to apply to, in this case,

[1:22:08] Voice 14: to Crystal Mountains, but could apply to other people seeking this zone without community input

[1:22:13] Voice 14: input on the establishment of that zone. So I guess the question is, who has decided

[1:22:19] Voice 14: the creation and extension of the zone is authorized?

[1:22:27] Voice 4: Well, Akasha, that's, of course,

[1:22:31] Voice 4: the point that has been made by a number of speakers today, including Ms. Anderson and

[1:22:37] Voice 4: others that we should not put it there. But it is not an unusual process for an LTC to

[1:22:47] Voice 4: amend an OCP during the course of an application. We see it from time to time if it's felt that the

[1:23:01] Voice 4: the OCP is needed to be amended.

[1:23:07] Voice 4: And so that's a decision that the LTC can make at any time.

[1:23:13] Voice 4: And they do it.

[1:23:15] Voice 4: We do it.

[1:23:16] Voice 4: We've amended OCPs.

[1:23:19] Voice 4: We've got proposals to amend the OCP on one of the affordable housing projects.

[1:23:23] Voice 4: We've got a proposal to, and we've got a proposal here to amend an OCP.

[1:23:27] Voice 4: yeah so it doesn't always have to be i guess my point is your point is is that the ocp would

[1:23:34] Voice 4: usually be part of a broader review of the ocp and even in galliano which has done a lot of work

[1:23:41] Voice 4: recently it's been 11 years since they they since the ocp was reviewed uh fulsomely and goodness

[1:23:49] Voice 4: knows when it might get back around to galliano again um and then so i just want to just want to

[1:23:57] Voice 4: say one thing is without a public process well this is the public process for that right

[1:24:02] Voice 14: um what

[1:24:03] Voice 14: i wanted to say though is i do understand that uh that zones are amended from time to time but the

[1:24:10] Voice 14: creation and extension of zone of a zone is quite different so

[1:24:16] Voice 4: amendment to the ocp so it's and i i

[1:24:20] Voice 4: could take your point i take it all right and then finally

[1:24:23] Voice 14: i did there was one thing i forgot to say

[1:24:25] Voice 14: under the water thing. I'm curious why the information that was put together by the water

[1:24:36] Voice 14: expert, Dr. Shulva, Mr. Shulva, under the regional groundwater availability project that shows

[1:24:44] Voice 14: the north end, including the Crystal Mountain proposed site, is a class one high vulnerability

[1:24:51] Voice 14: vulnerability um site for water and i would what i'm wondering about is that when this information

[1:24:59] Voice 14: comes to us how does it how could we have this information continue to appear in the staff

[1:25:09] Voice 14: reports particularly when it's relevant to an issue like water use it would be very helpful

[1:25:16] Voice 14: to have the map that shows in relationship to the rest of the island the vulnerability of um

[1:25:22] Voice 14: of this water aquifer so that's basically a comment but also could we have relevant documents

[1:25:29] Voice 14: that that go with subjects that are being discussed be included in the staff reports

[1:25:35] Voice 14: and that's it thank you so much thank

[1:25:38] Voice 4: you um so i don't want to keep us moving is there anybody

[1:25:41] Voice 4: I see there's a hand up now.

[1:25:44] Voice 4: Akash, if you could put your hand back down.

[1:25:46] Voice 4: Thank you.

[1:25:48] Voice 4: If we can move Akash back,

[1:25:50] Voice 4: West Forest back.

[1:25:51] Voice 4: Is there anybody that wishes to speak to Gali?

[1:25:59] Voice 4: So, Carmina, you want to say something

[1:26:01] Voice 4: different than what you've said already?

[1:26:04] Voice 4: Because I'll have to recuse

[1:26:06] Voice 4: Trustee Rockefeller if you do.

[1:26:08] Voice 4: Okay, your hand is still up.

[1:26:10] Voice 4: So, Trustee Rockefeller,

[1:26:10] Voice 4: can you step aside for a minute, please?

[1:26:27] Voice 21: Yes.

[1:26:28] Voice 23: It's just about Gali.

[1:26:30] Voice 23: It's about the rental structure of Gali, where it's about the 30% with respect to the before-tax median household income for the southern Gulf Islands electoral area.

[1:26:48] Voice 23: Now, the statistics of the census from Statistics Canada, there is also statistics for Galeano.

[1:26:58] Voice 23: And I look at the census of 2016 because there is no yet incomes in the census of 2021.

[1:27:10] Voice 23: And there is a difference between the incomes, median incomes for households in the Southern Gulf Islands and Galeano.

[1:27:21] Voice 23: The South and Gulf Islands are higher.

[1:27:25] Voice 23: And if you have the median total household income for Galliano is $43,904.

[1:27:36] Voice 23: But for South and Gulf Islands is $54,037.

[1:27:45] Voice 23: That means more than $10,000.

[1:27:47] Voice 23: And if you look for one person, household, Galeano median income is $23,968, and Southern Gulf Island is $30,528.

[1:28:06] Voice 23: So what I say is why instead of tied it to Southern Gulf Island, when we have a statistic for Galeano, how not to tie it to Galeano?

[1:28:18] Voice 23: Especially that if you look at the affordable definition, affordable unit, I think, definition on the OCP is tied to Galeano income.

[1:28:32] Voice 23: So I just say this for you to consider this because we have the statistics, we have the numbers for both.

[1:28:40] Voice 23: Thank you.

[1:28:43] Voice 4: Thank you. I don't see any other hands up to speak to Gali.

[1:28:47] Voice 4: So I'm going to now ask Trustee Rockefeller, can we let Trustee Rockefeller come back?

[1:28:52] Voice 4: Does anybody

[1:28:52] Voice 5: wish to speak to Giggers?

[1:28:57] Voice 5: I'll have Trustee Wolverton stand aside.

[1:29:00] Voice 5: As soon as we have Trustee Rockefeller back, we'll hear from

[1:29:07] Voice 4: you, Ms. Marguson.

[1:29:08] Voice 18: I've sent her a note.

[1:29:10] Voice 4: There, she's back.

[1:29:11] Voice 4: So if you could step aside, Trustee Wolverton.

[1:29:14] Voice 4: I see only one hand up for Giggers.

[1:29:20] Voice 4: Yes, Ms. Marguson, we can promote you.

[1:29:24] Voice 4: and you go ahead please thank

[1:29:32] Voice 10: you can you hear me ken

[1:29:34] Voice 4: yeah

[1:29:35] Voice 10: um i just want to make a quick general

[1:29:38] Voice 10: comment just after hearing some of the comments um already in town hall and um and then i'll just

[1:29:44] Voice 10: get very quickly to my specific comment and question but um i perhaps the amount of discussion

[1:29:50] Voice 10: and questions and concerns that are being raised in town hall about applications before the trust

[1:29:57] Voice 10: is something that needs to be addressed in some.

[1:30:00] Voice 10: way because it appears that many people no matter what the application and concerns are are feeling

[1:30:08] Voice 10: that their concerns are actually not being reflected in staff reports or in discussion

[1:30:14] Voice 10: at the trust and that a great amount of time is being spent uh researching various issues that

[1:30:22] Voice 10: raise concerns and it often feels like it isn't addressed in in any way in the discussion so

[1:30:30] Voice 10: that's just my general comment um my more specific comment um relates also to comments that were made

[1:30:40] Voice 10: about crystal mountain in terms of water concerns and last month the ltc was presented with the

[1:30:46] Voice 10: trust policy directives checklist that indicated that the Giggers rezoning application is consistent

[1:30:53] Voice 10: with the freshwater resources directives. These directives in place to protect and preserve our

[1:31:01] Voice 10: groundwater state in part and I'm quoting neither the density nor intensity of land use is increased

[1:31:09] Voice 10: in areas which are known to have a problem with the quality or quantity of the supply of fresh

[1:31:15] Voice 10: My question resulting from the February 7th LTC meeting is, how can this rezoning application proposing increased density and intensity of land use be regarded as consistent with this directive when there has been no indication in the applicant's submitted water reports or in the LT discussion that already occurring water problems in several wells,

[1:31:45] Voice 10: directly adjacent to the proposed development were investigated or even recognized.

[1:31:52] Voice 10: A monitoring report for our own well was submitted to you in January

[1:31:57] Voice 10: that clearly demonstrated during the dry season

[1:32:01] Voice 10: steadily falling well levels to almost nothing in our own well at one point in the summer

[1:32:09] Voice 10: and very problematic well interference from wells on other nearby properties.

[1:32:15] Voice 10: yet this has been ignored by the applicants and by the LTC it appears. Why? In the interest of

[1:32:25] Voice 10: due diligence and the precautionary principle we are requesting that our well monitor report

[1:32:31] Voice 10: be reviewed and addressed by the freshwater specialist in relation to the GIGR's recently

[1:32:38] Voice 10: submitted data logger report and other hydrogeology reports and in closing i just want to say that

[1:32:47] Voice 10: the fact that this is housing rather than a wellness retreat does not make our water concerns

[1:32:55] Voice 10: any less important nature does not favor one use over another in providing essential resources

[1:33:05] Voice 10: thank you very much thank

[1:33:08] Voice 5: you anybody else wish to speak on uh giggers nope okay well then i'm

[1:33:19] Voice 5: going

[1:33:20] Voice 4: to oh i'm going to take this opportunity to close town hall um and i'm going to take

[1:33:27] Voice 4: uh three minutes just so i can and we can bring that trustee wolverton back but we'll be back

[1:33:32] Voice 4: we don't need to put a sign up i'll just i'm just going to turn my camera off for a couple

[1:33:36] Voice 4: minutes i'll be right back and we'll carry on with the agenda

[1:33:39] Voice 21: thank you very much hello i'm here

[1:35:00] Voice 21: just on a short break trustee wolverton what was that we're just on a short break

[1:35:11] Voice 21: i

[1:36:08] Voice 4: saw trustee wolverton so she'll be i'm sure she's right back

[1:36:12] Voice 4: and miss marcus and if you could put your hand down thank you that would be appreciated

[1:36:16] Voice 21: it okay

[1:37:12] Voice 4: trustee wolverton's back trustee rockefeller is here i wasn't

[1:37:16] Voice 18: sure how long

[1:37:17] Voice 18: we were breaking sorry

[1:37:18] Voice 4: yes of course you weren't there we were just taking a brief

[1:37:21] Voice 4: comfort break um and uh i assume planner smith you're um i assume you're back when we get to

[1:37:30] Voice 4: material that involves you there you are all right so let's uh work our way through the agenda

[1:37:35] Voice 4: there's no CIM, there's no public meeting hearing.

[1:37:38] Voice 4: We have minutes from February the 7th.

[1:37:43] Voice 4: Is there any questions arising from those minutes

[1:37:45] Voice 4: from other trustees?

[1:37:46] Voice 4: Yes, Trustee Wolff.

[1:37:48] Voice 4: Those are,

[1:37:48] Voice 4: by the way, just for the members of public,

[1:37:50] Voice 4: that's on page four of our agenda package.

[1:37:52] Voice 4: Go ahead, sorry.

[1:37:53] Voice 18: So on page seven, it says, and number 12,

[1:37:58] Voice 18: it says a meeting was held between 2.13 and 2.20,

[1:38:01] Voice 18: and I think it's just missing the word break,

[1:38:03] Voice 18: a meeting break.

[1:38:03] Voice 4: yeah i think that that's right i saw that as well yeah

[1:38:06] Voice 18: yeah nothing important um it looks like

[1:38:09] Voice 18: jennifer margerson still has her hand up i don't know if that i

[1:38:13] Voice 4: assume i assumed that was a legacy

[1:38:15] Voice 4: hand because town hall was closed but um uh miss margerson if there's something urgent you want me

[1:38:23] Voice 4: to know you could perhaps drop me an email um and uh um so uh there are no we're at resolutions

[1:38:35] Voice 4: without meeting there's no advisory planning committee meetings uh so we're actually at um

[1:38:41] Voice 4: we're now at business arising from the minutes which starts at page 14

[1:38:45] Voice 4: uh of our agenda package and we have the follow-up action uh report so trustees do you have anything

[1:38:53] Voice 4: Mayor Mrakas, Anything you want to ask planner Smith or any other planet related to anything in the follow up action before nothing from you trustee Rockefeller nothing from you trustee over to anything from you planner Smith no, thank you for your update.

[1:39:09] Voice 4: Mayor Mrakas, Then we don't have any delegation, so the first item on the next item on the agenda, then, is the.

[1:39:15] Voice 4: Mayor Mrakas, Is the correspondence and we've sort of treated it as sort of an update related to the giggers.

[1:39:23] Voice 4: While there's no staff report attached to the letter from Wiser Projects, I thought this would be an opportunity to talk about this for a moment.

[1:39:36] Voice 4: So, Trustee Wolverton, I'm afraid I'm going to have to ask you to step out for a second again, as we have, in case there's any issues that come up.

[1:39:44] Voice 4: Just for the members of the public, this letter came from the housing consultants for the Giggers board.

[1:39:51] Voice 4: board we subsequently got a letter later and you may recall from February we had a discussion

[1:39:59] Voice 4: around the housing agreement and gave our views about the status of that and this is

[1:40:07] Voice 4: a response to that and we subsequently got a proposed housing agreement late last week

[1:40:16] Voice 4: from the applicant but the staff has not had a chance to uh discuss or to um uh to um uh or have

[1:40:25] Voice 4: it reviewed by the the legal team yet so it's not a formal proposal but i thought we could take an

[1:40:31] Voice 4: opportunity to to uh discuss the the letter um because i have some reflections upon it and i'm

[1:40:39] Voice 4: I'm not sure if anybody's here for the applicant.

[1:40:42] Voice 4: Oh, there's Eleanor.

[1:40:44] Voice 4: Yeah, you could promote Ms. Gibson.

[1:40:48] Voice 21: Are you the only one?

[1:40:59] Voice 21: Yeah, so we'll bring her

[1:41:00] Voice 4: over too.

[1:41:01] Voice 4: And this is Ms. Gibson's works for WISER project.

[1:41:05] Voice 4: I think she's the author of this correspondence.

[1:41:08] Voice 4: Is that okay with you, Trustee Rockefeller,

[1:41:10] Voice 4: that we have a bit of a brief conversation

[1:41:14] Voice 4: and a reflection related to this correspondence

[1:41:16] Voice 4: and the proposal?

[1:41:17] Voice 4: Okay. Hello. Welcome back to the LTC.

[1:41:22] Voice 4: Planner Smith, do you want to put any context around this or do you want to just introduce it as correspondence?

[1:41:29] Voice 28: Just to reflect at the last LTC meeting, LTC directed the applicant to come back to the LTC with adjustments to their rent structure in consideration of the concerns the LTC raised at that meeting with respect to affordability.

[1:41:46] Voice 28: and this is the letter they've come back with and as it came late uh in the agenda deadline

[1:41:52] Voice 28: staff have not had a chance to uh look at it or consider it in any great detail

[1:41:56] Voice 28: thanks okay

[1:41:57] Voice 4: thanks do you want to make any introductory comments related to your

[1:42:01] Voice 4: correspondence yeah

[1:42:06] Voice 2: thanks trustee rogers um i don't have too much to to add um i just thought

[1:42:11] Voice 2: i would be here to answer any questions and clarifications if yourself or trustee rockefeller

[1:42:16] Voice 2: had any and as you mentioned we submitted this correspondence sort of at the deadline to be

[1:42:22] Voice 2: included in this agenda so we understand there's no staff report and late last week we did submit

[1:42:27] Voice 2: a revised housing agreement that sort of accompanies this this correspondence that

[1:42:33] Voice 2: incorporates the rental structure that we're proposing here and so we're hoping that out of

[1:42:40] Voice 2: this meeting we get some direction from the LTC to be able to proceed with reviewing that housing

[1:42:45] Voice 2: agreement and if it satisfies all the parties moving forward with it so yeah

[1:42:50] Voice 2: I'm happy to answer any questions or clarifications if you have any thanks

[1:42:55] Voice 4: so

[1:42:56] Voice 4: there's a bit unusual that we would review this without a staff report

[1:42:59] Voice 4: attached but I thought it gives an opportunity to have a bit of

[1:43:03] Voice 4: conversation and reflections trustee Rockefeller do you have any commentary

[1:43:07] Voice 4: you'd like to or questions you like to ask

[1:43:09] Voice 16: um yes so I did have a bit of

[1:43:12] Voice 16: comments the without staff reviewing it it was I didn't have their expertise also to fall back on

[1:43:20] Voice 16: so I may have some errors in my own research um I appreciate that the applicant attached a housing

[1:43:27] Voice 16: income limit um when I looked at the BC housing income limits it looks like they're quite a bit

[1:43:33] Voice 16: higher than the the regional conditions which are OCP states it has to include fixed below average

[1:43:41] Voice 16: rates within the region. So when I looked at the BC Hills, it just looked like the average rent

[1:43:47] Voice 16: would be like $2,000 to $3,000 a month, which I feel like is a bit high when you look at our

[1:43:54] Voice 16: Galliano median income is from 2016 was $43,000 annually. So I was kind of hoping to have it

[1:44:04] Voice 16: attached more to maybe even something. I did talk to the planner briefly, and he did send me just

[1:44:10] Voice 16: the galley proposal because it has been accepted or whatever and I think it seems more along the

[1:44:20] Voice 16: lines of what I was thinking so that's kind of where I'm at there thank you so

[1:44:29] Voice 4: I don't know if

[1:44:30] Voice 4: you want to respond to that before I give you my commentary it's up to you yeah

[1:44:35] Voice 2: I can just briefly

[1:44:35] Voice 2: respond and I yeah I definitely understand the concern that sort of broader data doesn't

[1:44:42] Voice 2: necessarily reflect the southern gulf islands and the reality there um our sort of strategy with

[1:44:48] Voice 2: using the housing income limits determined by bc housing is that um it's reliable and regularly

[1:44:53] Voice 2: updated um so while not it might not be a perfect representation of galliano island um it is of sort

[1:45:00] Voice 2: of the broader region and it'll be updated regularly it was also the direction we received

[1:45:04] Voice 2: from bc housing um in thinking about the affordability structure we did reach out and ask

[1:45:09] Voice 2: If we were to receive funding through BC Housing, what's the metric that we would use for those

[1:45:16] Voice 2: rent geared to income units in that scenario?

[1:45:19] Voice 2: And they suggested the Victoria housing income limits for that.

[1:45:24] Voice 2: And we actually also reached out to CMHC with the same question, just looking at the median

[1:45:28] Voice 2: market rents, which is a different mechanism we haven't pursued.

[1:45:32] Voice 2: But the advice from both was that using Victoria is the closest sort of benchmark, but that

[1:45:39] Voice 2: that as projects from both parties

[1:45:41] Voice 2: might get funded in the islands,

[1:45:42] Voice 2: they might be able to refine that data further.

[1:45:45] Voice 2: So in the future,

[1:45:45] Voice 2: they might have more finer grain data for Galliano.

[1:45:48] Voice 2: And also when we ran the numbers

[1:45:51] Voice 2: based on this affordability proposal,

[1:45:54] Voice 2: the rents actually wouldn't be as high

[1:45:56] Voice 2: as you just mentioned.

[1:45:59] Voice 2: It obviously depends on the unit size,

[1:46:02] Voice 2: but the income limit for a family

[1:46:06] Voice 2: is somewhere in the $70,000, $78,000 range,

[1:46:10] Voice 2: which means rents would still be under $2,000 for those units.

[1:46:14] Voice 2: And for studio and one bedrooms,

[1:46:16] Voice 2: they'd be obviously much, much more affordable

[1:46:18] Voice 2: and would be probably more in line

[1:46:19] Voice 2: with what Galliano residents can afford.

[1:46:23] Voice 2: And

[1:46:24] Voice 16: so I do totally understand here.

[1:46:25] Voice 16: I thought it was a range from $77,000 to $117,000

[1:46:30] Voice 16: with the BC Hills.

[1:46:32] Voice 16: uh

[1:46:34] Voice 2: no it's it's 78 or so is is the limit for the three bedroom i don't think that's correct

[1:46:40] Voice 2: that's

[1:46:41] Voice 28: incorrect the upper limit for uh two or more bedrooms is 117 000 and uh less than two

[1:46:50] Voice 28: bedrooms is 78 000 so okay

[1:46:55] Voice 16: so the so my yeah

[1:46:58] Voice 16: yeah yeah

[1:46:59] Voice 28: so my concern my concern from a staff

[1:47:02] Voice 28: perspective with the new proposal is that i think there are two uh considerations that need to be

[1:47:10] Voice 28: considered uh one is who the unit is being rented to and uh from a affordability uh perspective

[1:47:19] Voice 28: that is capping maximum income and that's what the hils are intended to do the other part is

[1:47:26] Voice 28: actually the rent itself that will be charged and in this case using those limits of HILs actually

[1:47:35] Voice 28: create potential rents that are higher than the current Victoria CMHC market rents in their latest

[1:47:44] Voice 28: 2021 report versus the GALI proposal which addresses the upper the affordability of

[1:47:54] Voice 28: of income using the HILs and ties the actual rent

[1:47:58] Voice 28: to the median income of Southern Gulf Island residents.

[1:48:03] Voice 28: So that then ensures affordability

[1:48:06] Voice 28: because those incomes are much lower

[1:48:08] Voice 28: than the regional average.

[1:48:14] Voice 2: If I can just respond to that,

[1:48:17] Voice 2: apologies if I wasn't clear about the housing income limits

[1:48:20] Voice 2: and the interpretation of those.

[1:48:22] Voice 2: What we did in our financial analysis

[1:48:25] Voice 2: And then the intent in this letter and in the subsequent housing agreement is to use

[1:48:32] Voice 2: the housing income limits published in September of this year, which are relevant for 2021

[1:48:40] Voice 2: and into 2022.

[1:48:41] Voice 2: And those are updated on a yearly basis.

[1:48:43] Voice 2: And I'm just looking right now and for Victoria, the maximum income for three bedroom is $79,000.

[1:48:49] Voice 2: And then on the lower end, a one-bedroom would be $47,500 annual income, annual gross income.

[1:48:58] Voice 2: So those are the numbers that we've been working with.

[1:49:00] Voice 2: And we'd be happy to refine the language a bit more to make it more clear that it's not the range, that $78,000 to $117,000 that we're referring to, but it's these benchmarks in the document from September 2021.

[1:49:17] Voice 16: I think because this is a complicated aspect of the application and I would really like to get it accurate and have the professional advice as I was chair Rogers in my, I would like to wait for a staff report on this letter, but that's just my position.

[1:49:35] Voice 16: Thank you.

[1:49:36] Voice 4: Well, let me just, I have just, I'm just going to weigh in here just for a moment. I mean,

[1:49:43] Voice 4: I'm, contrary to some, anyway, nevermind.

[1:49:48] Voice 4: I went back, my concern is that I've gone back to the OCP

[1:49:54] Voice 4: and it sort of reflects what I would have understood

[1:50:00] Voice 4: about an affordability housing agreement,

[1:50:03] Voice 4: which as Planner Smith says,

[1:50:06] Voice 4: sort of would contain a couple of criteria.

[1:50:09] Voice 4: One is where you set the rents.

[1:50:12] Voice 4: and the second is and so that's a rental issue and how you make that affordable and the second is how

[1:50:19] Voice 4: you determine who's qualified to to live there those are two separate things and and i think

[1:50:26] Voice 4: one of the my initial reaction is is is that the hil house is is more related to the second

[1:50:35] Voice 4: question of how you determine who can and who's qualified to live there as opposed to setting the

[1:50:40] Voice 4: rent. And when I read the OCP, which is section 1.6 BII, sorry for that, it's on page 10 of the

[1:50:50] Voice 4: OCP, what it says is applications shall include provision of a housing agreement, ensuring that

[1:50:59] Voice 4: for affordable housing, the rental lease sale or share prices are fixed below average rates within

[1:51:08] Voice 4: within the region and the agreement may limit occupancy

[1:51:11] Voice 4: of the dwellings to rental lease, et cetera, et cetera.

[1:51:14] Voice 4: And so the second part is about how you limit who can come.

[1:51:18] Voice 4: But the first one is where you set the rents.

[1:51:23] Voice 4: And I would read that the region,

[1:51:26] Voice 4: I mean, I've heard the opinion expressed today

[1:51:30] Voice 4: that it should be just Galliano.

[1:51:33] Voice 4: I know that there's proposals out there

[1:51:35] Voice 4: that it should be the southern gulf islands uh and and certainly i would i would think that it should

[1:51:41] Voice 4: be not victoria um because victoria is a very different economy anyway so i've concerned how

[1:51:49] Voice 4: when we only have one part of the ocp met in terms of or using the housing income limits

[1:51:57] Voice 4: which is about who qualifies to actually set the rental piece i.e what the rents should be and how

[1:52:05] Voice 4: you set those i i i i somehow not seeing how that meets the intention of the oc or the wording of

[1:52:12] Voice 4: the ocp but go ahead i'm sorry that's my reflection but feel free to respond if you wish yeah thanks

[1:52:20] Voice 2: trustee rogers and um yeah i appreciate that it's um there's there's different mechanisms

[1:52:26] Voice 2: and definitions and it's hard to make it can be hard to make them reconcile um and i think

[1:52:31] Voice 2: I hear what you're saying that the housing income limits help determine who's eligible,

[1:52:36] Voice 2: but what we've done in this case is use the actual numbers of the housing income limits

[1:52:41] Voice 2: to determine what the maximum rent for affordable units would be. So for an example,

[1:52:47] Voice 2: one bedroom or less, the housing income limit is $47,500 a year. And so if we divide that by

[1:52:54] Voice 2: 12 to get a monthly number and then determine what 30% of that is. And what we're saying is

[1:53:02] Voice 2: we won't be charging more than 30% of the housing income limit for those units. So 30%

[1:53:11] Voice 2: for a $47,500 gross income would be just about $1,200 a month. So that would be the absolute

[1:53:20] Voice 2: absolute maximum rent if if this housing agreement and this structure was adopted that we could

[1:53:26] Voice 2: charge and so that would be true of each of them um

[1:53:30] Voice 4: and so for a one bit how do we have this

[1:53:32] Voice 4: discrepancy between 47 000 and 78 000. I don't understand I

[1:53:37] Voice 28: think and this is the challenge of

[1:53:40] Voice 28: diving into this without any analysis so yeah

[1:53:42] Voice 4: well maybe we should just leave it then so so

[1:53:45] Voice 28: So my understanding of the income limits was the low to moderate income limits is what they're proposing.

[1:53:53] Voice 28: What I'm hearing now is different to that understanding.

[1:53:58] Voice 28: It's the overall HILs.

[1:54:02] Voice 28: And so what she's proposing with those numbers may actually achieve affordability.

[1:54:09] Voice 28: But I

[1:54:11] Voice 4: have no time to look at that.

[1:54:12] Voice 28: It's difficult.

[1:54:13] Voice 28: I'm

[1:54:14] Voice 4: going to pick up on Trustee Rockefeller's point.

[1:54:18] Voice 4: Yeah,

[1:54:18] Voice 28: so I'm just backtracking.

[1:54:20] Voice 28: My initial concerns in looking more at what Lenny's actually pointing to may be alleviated using these HIL income limits that are lower than the numbers that I was thinking they were proposing.

[1:54:35] Voice 4: Okay.

[1:54:37] Voice 4: So, Trustee Rockefeller, I sort of interrupted you.

[1:54:41] Voice 4: you wanted to just defer this until we had a staff report oh

[1:54:44] Voice 16: no i you weren't interrupting

[1:54:46] Voice 16: me i actually was just um i wanted you to know where i was comfortable at moving today because

[1:54:51] Voice 16: i because we don't seem to understand what's being proposed i didn't think it was an adequate

[1:54:57] Voice 16: time for me to make a decision

[1:54:58] Voice 4: exactly and that's the sort of way so you've got our reflections on

[1:55:02] Voice 4: the letter and i but it sounds like some communication between you and between you

[1:55:09] Voice 4: and the elen you eleni and the and brad and some clarification of what you're intending here um

[1:55:15] Voice 4: might might lead to something yeah trustee sorry bradsman planners better

[1:55:21] Voice 28: understanding through

[1:55:23] Voice 28: this conversation and using the housing income limit set as eleni is pointing to it's my view

[1:55:30] Voice 28: uh and of course it's a decision of ltc uh but it's my view that uh uh it may reach those

[1:55:39] Voice 28: uh that that requirement of affordability and instead of deferring doing anything uh ltc could

[1:55:46] Voice 28: direct staff to uh put that proposal to legal counsel to ask the same question around consistency

[1:55:54] Voice 28: that you did with the bc housing one well

[1:55:59] Voice 4: i i think i think i'm i'm fine with that um i don't

[1:56:03] Voice 4: know about you trustee rockefeller uh

[1:56:08] Voice 16: i mean is that not kind of what the motion we made at the

[1:56:11] Voice 16: last meeting was if

[1:56:13] Voice 28: the motion that the last meeting was really for them to address the

[1:56:19] Voice 28: concerns and so if you feel that the concerns are being addressed um i don't know if eleni

[1:56:26] Voice 28: you maybe you could share your screen and you could share those uh uh income limits that you're

[1:56:32] Voice 28: proposing eleni so they better understand where you're what you're referring to

[1:56:36] Voice 16: because i have no

[1:56:36] Voice 16: idea yeah

[1:56:37] Voice 4: and i'm a little uncomfortable with with sort of going this way and sort of making

[1:56:42] Voice 4: a decision on the fly in the absence of i mean as i understand it we're we've been talking apples

[1:56:48] Voice 4: and oranges and um that's that's a that's a place i'm not real comfortable and sort of i'm

[1:56:55] Voice 4: comfortable in having you send it to the lawyers once you have some clarification as to what's

[1:57:02] Voice 4: being proposed i still see an issue of whether whether using housing income limits is an

[1:57:09] Voice 4: appropriate way to set affordable rates because those seem to me to be different criteria however

[1:57:15] Voice 4: perhaps it is a way to do it so um can

[1:57:19] Voice 28: i share my screen for one sec i mean uh uh i ltc can decide

[1:57:25] Voice 28: whatever they want to do i think the applicant is keen to move this forward as quickly as they can

[1:57:29] Voice 28: And I can at least share my screen and Eleni and I, I think I now understand what Eleni is proposing, which I didn't before this.

[1:57:42] Voice 28: And perhaps give you some comfort that moving towards at least putting this to the lawyer and I mean the other option, I mean the galley option is, is, it's, yeah, anyways, I'm just going to stop there I'll let LTC decide.

[1:58:00] Voice 4: I'm going to go back and address what the motion was in February, because I think you probably have enough dark staff to enter in a new cost rate with the applicant for legal review and the housing agreements.

[1:58:20] Voice 4: So you've got that. You've got a motion to enter into a cost recovery agreement.

[1:58:31] Voice 4: and we asked staff to request that the applicants make amendments to the draft housing to reflect

[1:58:36] Voice 4: the concerns around affordability and and then we passed a motion to down the road pass so you've

[1:58:43] Voice 4: got the the two things if you if you want a specific motion to take what what you get

[1:58:49] Voice 4: clarification about what it what the proposal actually is to legal counsel we can do that

[1:58:55] Voice 4: but it sounds to me like this is a discussion you can have i i'm not real comfortable with

[1:59:02] Voice 4: sort of walking through um the the the numbers until you guys have until staff and you the

[1:59:10] Voice 4: proponent have sort of clarified what exactly what we're talking about i

[1:59:14] Voice 28: think i get what we're now

[1:59:15] Voice 28: talking about so

[1:59:18] Voice 4: you've got just you've got the sorry go ahead so

[1:59:21] Voice 28: i if let me so i think i get

[1:59:23] Voice 28: what they're what they're talking about and now that i get that it makes sense to me that it could

[1:59:29] Voice 28: be the basis of a housing agreement that that clause and i can try to explain that by sharing

[1:59:36] Voice 28: my screen and eleni can uh uh help to support that uh i think uh the most useful resolution

[1:59:44] Voice 28: to actually move forward would be would be for ltc to either uh accept this uh subject to legal

[1:59:52] Voice 28: Council agreeing it is consistent with the OCP as a whole or

[2:00:00] Voice 28: as the basis for a housing agreement and then we can start to turn our minds to actually

[2:00:04] Voice 28: developing that housing agreement with this overarching question finally resolved with

[2:00:11] Voice 28: legal counsel's backing I think how Eleni's explaining it to me I think as long as the

[2:00:17] Voice 28: calculations in the HILs are less than the market rents which I think they would calculate to be

[2:00:23] Voice 28: given the lower numbers uh than i was initially uh considering it would meet the ocp consistency

[2:00:31] Voice 28: test uh without direction to move forward i guess we just come back with that legal opinion at the

[2:00:38] Voice 28: next meeting and you decide then to move forward so it wouldn't really say that much but well that

[2:00:44] Voice 4: well i would prefer that because it sounds to me like you're just i mean just speaking for myself

[2:00:50] Voice 4: but that you're just now sort of getting what it is they're actually

[2:00:54] Voice 4: proposing to us. And it's correct.

[2:00:57] Voice 4: Then that's probably the best

[2:00:58] Voice 28: pathway, but, but a resolution,

[2:01:00] Voice 28: I think directing staff to specifically directing staff to send this to

[2:01:07] Voice 28: legal counsel, I think would be a useful direction for staff to have.

[2:01:11] Voice 28: And then we will send this proposal to them and then come back to LTC with

[2:01:19] Voice 28: our analysis backed up with legal counsel's advice if that's exactly does

[2:01:25] Voice 4: that work for you trustee Rockefeller okay so Carly if we could I think

[2:01:31] Voice 4: trustee Rockefeller just made a motion because she put her thumb up that we

[2:01:36] Voice 4: request staff to refer the Giggers proposal to legal counsel for

[2:01:46] Voice 4: for consistency with the OCP and bring the draft housing agreement back for

[2:01:56] Voice 4: a local trust committee consideration at a,

[2:02:02] Voice 4: at a future LTC meeting. And I know Carly,

[2:02:07] Voice 4: you were probably already had that all written out.

[2:02:11] Voice 8: I got it. Yep.

[2:02:13] Voice 4: Yeah. Well that's truck. Is that work for you? Trustee Rockefeller?

[2:02:17] Voice 16: Yep. That sounds good. Thank you.

[2:02:18] Voice 16: Does

[2:02:19] Voice 4: that work for you at Planner Smith?

[2:02:20] Voice 4: Yeah,

[2:02:21] Voice 28: I think it just signals the challenge of receiving information so late as well.

[2:02:26] Voice 4: Yeah. Okay. So, okay, so that's great. So there's a motion. I guess we'll hear a little more about whether we think that this meets that affordability test that set out in the, in the section of the OCP that I mentioned.

[2:02:41] Voice 4: and we so we need to make that's my that's where I was coming from is making sure that we've

[2:02:47] Voice 4: we met that two-part criteria so I'll call if there's anything further trustee Garofalo do

[2:02:52] Voice 4: you have anything further you want

[2:02:53] Voice 16: just to make sure that the public and everyone knows where

[2:02:55] Voice 16: I also really my strong intention is to make sure that housing is affordable for the community

[2:02:59] Voice 16: that's my ultimate goal here

[2:03:01] Voice 4: right okay so yes go ahead before we vote thank

[2:03:08] Voice 2: you yeah no I

[2:03:09] Voice 2: I appreciate your concerns and the path forward makes sense.

[2:03:13] Voice 2: I just something that might help in the consideration at the next LTC meeting when this comes forward again and hopefully to help Planner Smith understand our rationale is just if we used market rents to determine the affordability,

[2:03:29] Voice 2: you know, set by CMHC median market rents, those rents are not necessarily tied to any kind of regional income.

[2:03:36] Voice 2: And so we use the strategy of looking at what the income is with the housing income limits and figuring out what would be affordable for those incomes.

[2:03:46] Voice 2: So hopefully that helps clarify a little bit.

[2:03:48] Voice 2: And I also just wanted to confirm that with the motion that was just passed, staff will

[2:03:55] Voice 19: bring

[2:03:55] Voice 2: our, right, with the motion on the table, yeah, that the rent structure will go to a legal review.

[2:04:06] Voice 2: And I'm just curious if the housing agreement, which we did submit fairly late, if that will move with sort of the letter that we submitted and those will both be assessed at the same time?

[2:04:15] Voice 2: i

[2:04:17] Voice 4: would guess so but you could ask planner smith that i

[2:04:24] Voice 28: think we've already got direction to

[2:04:26] Voice 28: draft that housing agreement so if well so i think uh it would still like at some point that housing

[2:04:36] Voice 28: yes i think that we could if if if legal counsel were to say this is uh consistent we could then

[2:04:44] Voice 28: bring a housing agreement forward that is that framework but ltc still needs to decide if it's

[2:04:50] Voice 28: the framework they want and that's the question they're not wanting to answer today they want

[2:04:55] Voice 28: more information which is yeah and

[2:04:57] Voice 28: i think we

[2:04:57] Voice 4: i think we made it fairly clear last meeting and

[2:05:02] Voice 4: again this meeting is not the remainder of the housing agreement that's that's an issue it was

[2:05:07] Voice 4: just how do we how do we ensure that the affordability piece is built in there in a way

[2:05:13] Voice 4: that we're comfortable with okay so i'm going to call the vote all in favor and that passes

[2:05:19] Voice 4: unanimously. Thanks very much. Is there anything else regarding this correspondence that we need

[2:05:24] Voice 4: to deal with today? Thank you for attending, Ms. Gibson. It's always good to hear your

[2:05:30] Voice 20: input

[2:05:30] Voice 4: and thanks for the correspondence and your work. I'm going to, how are you doing,

[2:05:38] Voice 21: Trustee Rockefeller? You get to go away. I think Dan got booted.

[2:06:01] Voice 21: I have no idea what's going on. I told Jane

[2:06:05] Voice 16: to come back.

[2:06:06] Voice 16: Yeah.

[2:06:06] Voice 4: Okay. So I'll ask, but Jane's had a couple of breaks. I'm fine to keep moving

[2:06:12] Voice 4: as long as everybody else is. So let's have Jane to come back and we're going to move on to Gali.

[2:06:17] Voice 4: And I saw somebody here from Gali.

[2:06:22] Voice 16: Should I go then, Dan?

[2:06:24] Voice 4: Yeah. Okay. Thanks.

[2:06:25] Voice 4: We'll let you know when we're ready to go. I know Mr. Hobo was here. Is there

[2:06:31] Voice 4: anybody else uh from galley that wishes to be part of the uh presentation you

[2:06:39] Voice 21: can move um

[2:06:43] Voice 21: i actually don't see him anymore yeah mike hobo's there uh as is colleen

[2:06:54] Voice 18: dotey i

[2:06:56] Voice 4: think yeah i don't

[2:06:57] Voice 4: know who's coming i don't see mr can we move mr hobo over i i don't i hope he's still here

[2:07:03] Voice 4: there's

[2:07:04] Voice 18: something called small communities initiative that has a hand up

[2:07:08] Voice 4: oh that's

[2:07:09] Voice 4: that's probably there, somebody else.

[2:07:13] Voice 18: You've disappeared.

[2:07:17] Voice 4: Yes, there I am.

[2:07:23] Voice 5: I'm having trouble with my screen now,

[2:07:25] Voice 4: everything's gone wacky.

[2:07:28] Voice 3: Yes, Chair Rogers, I believe one or another,

[2:07:33] Voice 3: there are two possibilities from New Commons Development,

[2:07:37] Voice 3: our development partner,

[2:07:38] Voice 3: that's the Small Communities Initiative.

[2:07:41] Voice 28: so

[2:07:41] Voice 3: that person should be Ada

[2:07:45] Voice 28: should be here is

[2:07:46] Voice 3: it Ada yeah Ada and Dion were on a tag team this

[2:07:50] Voice 3: afternoon depending on timing sounds

[2:07:51] Voice 28: like Dion's away so okay

[2:07:54] Voice 4: and so for the members of the public

[2:07:56] Voice 4: we're at page um 18 of the application of the package uh if we want to promote if we could

[2:08:05] Voice 4: could promote one of the...

[2:08:09] Voice 18: Small Communities Initiative, I think.

[2:08:11] Voice 18: Right,

[2:08:13] Voice 5: why don't you go ahead and we'll get him promoted

[2:08:17] Voice 4: and see somebody.

[2:08:21] Voice 4: If you want to start Planner Smith, they're here now.

[2:08:27] Voice 4: They'll be able to turn their camera on.

[2:08:30] Voice 4: Okay, over to you Planner Smith.

[2:08:32] Voice 4: We'll hear from you first,

[2:08:33] Voice 4: any questions from Trustee Wolverton and I,

[2:08:35] Voice 4: and then turn it over to the applicant.

[2:08:40] Voice 28: are you just finding my spot here thank you chair rogers pretty straightforward staff report uh

[2:08:56] Voice 28: just bringing back um information for the local trust committee with respect to

[2:09:03] Voice 28: the legal review of and proposal of uh that was presented last meeting with respect to the rent

[2:09:11] Voice 28: structure for their housing agreement and also uh bringing to ltc for the first time

[2:09:16] Voice 28: a list of proposed conditions for a potential section 219 covenant that have been developed

[2:09:22] Voice 28: by staff and uh reviewed quite extensively with the applicant for for general agreement so

[2:09:28] Voice 28: uh i'll just uh pass that over to you back over to you to

[2:09:35] Voice 4: me oh okay um do you have any questions

[2:09:39] Voice 4: regarding the staff report trustee wolverton for this for the planner

[2:09:43] Voice 18: yes i do um i just wanted to

[2:09:48] Voice 18: to know in the in the draft covenant conditions there's mention of the uh water system and

[2:09:55] Voice 18: stormwater design or the and just saying that um um the uh uh hold on so that a lawyer is to

[2:10:11] Voice 18: provide additional comment on the what the water management plan and i'm just wondering when that

[2:10:17] Voice 18: is expected so

[2:10:21] Voice 28: the the the this document if ltc uh passes the resolution then this document would

[2:10:29] Voice 28: be vetted to a legal counsel for them to uh develop the covenant based on the yeses okay

[2:10:38] Voice 18: okay um

[2:10:40] Voice 28: those are just yeah general notes yes

[2:10:44] Voice 18: i think that i think that was

[2:10:47] Voice 18: was all in the covenant stuff, it's fairly straightforward.

[2:10:54] Voice 20: I

[2:10:59] Voice 18: had one question just for the applicant about septic

[2:11:04] Voice 18: and whether that has been located yet

[2:11:08] Voice 18: or location determined.

[2:11:12] Voice 3: Okay.

[2:11:13] Voice 3: Maybe if I may start the response

[2:11:17] Voice 3: and I will certainly, I think have somewhere to say,

[2:11:20] Voice 3: But the engineer, Brent Dennis, has paid a site visit about nine or ten days ago and examined a couple of different possibilities along with some island contractors along to kind of help look at things.

[2:11:40] Voice 3: and but I don't believe unless we have now received it either could confirm I don't think

[2:11:47] Voice 3: we've received his report back and I see she's shaking her head no so we don't have the report

[2:11:53] Voice 3: back from his site assessment and with you know any proposed design or yeah so we it's to come

[2:12:05] Voice 3: own

[2:12:06] Voice 20: okay thank you um

[2:12:11] Voice 4: i have a question and i can sort of just ask it to whomever would like

[2:12:16] Voice 4: to answer it because i just want to make sure that everybody i it took me a moment to uh the

[2:12:22] Voice 4: planner smith tried to explain it to me but i won't and i think i understand now but i'd like

[2:12:26] Voice 4: to make sure that that it's sort of discussed publicly i'd like the recommendation is for

[2:12:32] Voice 4: option with option two in the in the rent structures and can you just explain how the

[2:12:41] Voice 4: concept of 30 percent of representative medium household income units will and then it says on

[2:12:49] Voice 4: average so how does the on average work so that we can be sure how that would would would play

[2:12:58] Voice 4: out because what would that would that allow for example for the possibility of a of a sort of a

[2:13:04] Voice 4: couple of some market rental units but they would be offset by other units or is that or what's the

[2:13:10] Voice 4: intention there yeah

[2:13:11] Voice 3: that that's that's the basic intention and brad may have a comment and item

[2:13:16] Voice 3: he has as well i think yeah so that's

[2:13:19] Voice 20: yeah sorry go ahead sorry

[2:13:21] Voice 17: um yes so basically the intent is

[2:13:25] Voice 17: is to have basically 30% on average,

[2:13:29] Voice 17: which means that certain units,

[2:13:30] Voice 17: so this is based on CHF kind of program.

[2:13:36] Voice 17: And typically-

[2:13:37] Voice 4: CHF, sorry.

[2:13:37] Voice 17: Sorry, BC Housing, Community Housing Plan Program.

[2:13:41] Voice 17: Oh, okay, okay, sorry,

[2:13:42] Voice 5: BCHF, sorry, yeah, go ahead.

[2:13:44] Voice 17: So, and basically there is a potential

[2:13:47] Voice 17: to have different kind of affordability levels

[2:13:50] Voice 17: in this project.

[2:13:52] Voice 17: So certain units would be at 50% or even, you know, less than, and then this would allow for the opportunity to have a couple of units that are at market trends, but by market trends, it's still an affordable market trends, right?

[2:14:09] Voice 17: Right. They are not. How can I explain this? Market trends defined by CMHC.

[2:14:20] Voice 17: So and then that would offset the cost for deep, deep affordability units like medium and affordable market units.

[2:14:31] Voice 17: So

[2:14:35] Voice 4: it would adopt adapt to a variety of different funders.

[2:14:40] Voice 4: um for example the bc housing as you say fund was set up to have 20 30 50 i think i got my

[2:14:50] Voice 4: numbers right i might have my number i may have got my math wrong it's been i've heard it it's

[2:14:53] Voice 4: been a while

[2:14:54] Voice 3: you've got it right it usually said 50 30 yeah

[2:14:59] Voice 4: right and uh and that was in order to

[2:15:02] Voice 4: make a project be able to be sustainable as well as affordable um and those are those are two

[2:15:08] Voice 4: different financially sustainable and so this would this would allow for that kind of if that's

[2:15:14] Voice 4: where the funding comes from but there might be different funding okay thank you i just wanted to

[2:15:19] Voice 4: sort of to understand that um we had i mean i have my own view about this but i just wanted to give

[2:15:27] Voice 4: you the opportunity to address we had some commentary in town hall that that um these

[2:15:33] Voice 4: these projects should ensure that the,

[2:15:36] Voice 4: and I don't want to put words in Ms. Meinhardt's mouth,

[2:15:41] Voice 4: but effectively said the poor would have somewhere

[2:15:45] Voice 4: they could go, but,

[2:15:47] Voice 4: and that we should ensure that this housing is serviced.

[2:15:51] Voice 4: So what can you say about that?

[2:15:54] Voice 4: You probably heard her commentary about that,

[2:15:57] Voice 4: and I wondered if you had any reflections upon that.

[2:16:02] Voice 3: um do you want to comment i have a comment but sure

[2:16:07] Voice 17: you can go ahead yeah

[2:16:09] Voice 3: you know and i did

[2:16:11] Voice 3: hear some of the comments in in town hall and uh certainly the intent of this project is to

[2:16:21] Voice 3: provide housing for folks who would qualify and their bc housing for the deep subsidy

[2:16:26] Voice 3: units, for example, but you've already commented, Chair Rogers, and this is a key thing,

[2:16:33] Voice 3: the sustainability of the project requires a mix of units, and it's just the financial reality

[2:16:41] Voice 3: of the costs of construction and operation, so I think our intent is to maximize within

[2:16:51] Voice 3: within that parameter to maximize the, you know, number of deeply subsidized units and

[2:17:01] Voice 3: affordable units,

[2:17:03] Voice 20: but

[2:17:04] Voice 3: we have to be able to build this project.

[2:17:08] Voice 20: So

[2:17:10] Voice 17: basically, when we talk about the average, so obviously, there is, you know, feasibility

[2:17:16] Voice 17: of the project and this is where market kind of units come in place but as michael said the

[2:17:24] Voice 17: intention is not to maximize like overall on average everything will be at 30 percent right

[2:17:33] Voice 17: so it doesn't matter which kind of uh final like structure of rents we go for the overall project

[2:17:41] Voice 17: like or looked at in a as a whole is going to be affordable so if there are a couple of units that

[2:17:50] Voice 17: are costing at market trends uh defined by cmhc uh that is really just to offset the cost for

[2:17:59] Voice 17: you know um like the deep subsidy or uh you know high uh high affordability units so it's really

[2:18:11] Voice 17: not like i don't see um i don't see a concern of projects serving anyone other than you know

[2:18:19] Voice 17: there is a needs assessment obviously and um for southern gulf islands and um this project

[2:18:28] Voice 17: is intended to serve uh the community as you know affordable i don't want to use the word poor but

[2:18:38] Voice 17: But since Chair Rogers, you

[2:18:40] Voice 17: said it, I don't know.

[2:18:40] Voice 4: I didn't use it.

[2:18:41] Voice 4: It was Carmita who used it.

[2:18:45] Voice 17: I mean, yeah, in the town hall it was used.

[2:18:47] Voice 17: But it would be for obviously lower, like, medium households, medium income households that obviously cannot afford, you know, say, Airbnb prices.

[2:19:02] Voice 17: I

[2:19:03] Voice 18: mean, we have a lot of people who work at multiple jobs and, you know, so overall they don't necessarily make a huge amount of money, but they can live on it, you know, and I think if they have the opportunity to have secure housing, secure long-term housing, I think that's where I'm hoping, you know, our community will be able to provide.

[2:19:31] Voice 18: I.

[2:19:31] Voice 4: Okay. Thank you. Sorry, I just thought we should put that out there. Okay. Trustee

[2:19:38] Voice 4: Wolverton, do you have any other questions or can we move? Do you have any, do you want

[2:19:43] Voice 4: to make any motions?

[2:19:45] Voice 18: Yes, I'm back with my recommendations now. Go ahead.

[2:19:51] Voice 18: Okay. So I

[2:19:53] Voice 18: recommend that the Galliano Island Local Trust Committee direct staff and legal counsel to

[2:19:57] Voice 18: draft a housing agreement based on the proposed option two rent structure as described in

[2:20:02] Voice 18: in the March 7th, 2022 staff report

[2:20:06] Voice 18: for application GLRZ2021.1 galley,

[2:20:13] Voice 18: and including household income limits

[2:20:16] Voice 18: based on low to moderate income limits

[2:20:18] Voice 18: as determined periodically by BC Housing.

[2:20:22] Voice 4: I'll second that.

[2:20:23] Voice 4: Do you want you to speak to your motion, Trustee Wilberton?

[2:20:26] Voice 4: No, that's fine.

[2:20:27] Voice 4: And neither do I.

[2:20:28] Voice 4: I think I'll just say I agree with what Mr. Hubbell said

[2:20:34] Voice 4: about the process and what's trying to be achieved.

[2:20:38] Voice 4: Also I'll call the vote and that passes unanimously.

[2:20:40] Voice 4: There's a second suggested motion here.

[2:20:43] Voice 18: That the Galliano Island Local Trust Committee

[2:20:45] Voice 18: direct staff and legal counsel to draft

[2:20:47] Voice 18: a land title act section 219 covenant

[2:20:50] Voice 18: based on the staff recommendations in attachment one

[2:20:53] Voice 18: of the March 7th, 2022 staff report

[2:20:57] Voice 18: for application GLRZ 2021.1 galley.

[2:21:03] Voice 4: Second that motion.

[2:21:04] Voice 4: Do you wish to speak to your motion at all?

[2:21:06] Voice 4: If not, I'll call the vote.

[2:21:07] Voice 4: All in favor?

[2:21:08] Voice 4: That passes unanimously.

[2:21:10] Voice 4: Is there anything further that we need

[2:21:11] Voice 4: related to this, Planner Smith?

[2:21:16] Voice 4: No.

[2:21:16] Voice 4: Trustee Wolverton, do you have anything further?

[2:21:18] Voice 28: No.

[2:21:19] Voice 4: We

[2:21:19] Voice 28: would initiate a cost recovery agreement

[2:21:21] Voice 28: for both of those pieces of work as a next step.

[2:21:24] Voice 28: Okay.

[2:21:26] Voice 4: i think we passed a motion last in february to do that if i'm not mistaken i'm not mistaken so

[2:21:30] Voice 4: yes um

[2:21:31] Voice 4: so thank you very much unless there's something else from the applicant we look forward

[2:21:37] Voice 4: to hopefully some speedy progress on the housing agreement and coming to some understanding around

[2:21:43] Voice 4: that so that we can get to the other part of our motion from february which is to get to the

[2:21:47] Voice 4: CIM and public hearing. Thank you. Thanks very much. Thank you.

[2:21:52] Voice 4: Thank you very much.

[2:21:57] Voice 4: So the next item on our agenda is 13.2, which is the staff report regarding Crystal Mountain. So

[2:22:06] Voice 4: we need to bring Trustee Rockefeller

[2:22:10] Voice 21: back. And in fact, we seem to have lost Trustee Wolverton too.

[2:22:31] Voice 21: You can still hear me. Can you, Brad?

[2:22:43] Voice 4: Okay, so it's not me this time. I

[2:22:46] Voice 4: don't know what's going

[2:22:47] Voice 4: on. I'm sitting in downtown Vancouver in order to get internet and I got booted out of the

[2:22:55] Voice 4: meeting twice by Zoom or somebody and I don't know what happened. It just sort of crashed and

[2:23:02] Voice 4: burned. Might be the computer. Anyway, we're all back now. So we're now at page 27 of the

[2:23:09] Voice 4: uh uh the application of the sorry of the agenda and that's the updated report um updated and uh

[2:23:20] Voice 4: lcc information requests on crystal mountain um so planner smith again over to you thank you

[2:23:34] Voice 28: so it's just a staff memo here for local trust committee bringing some updated information with

[2:23:41] Voice 28: respect to crystal mountain and a few things for them to consider so over the past few months a

[2:23:47] Voice 28: bunch of these things have been requested by ltc the first one being the definition of retreat

[2:23:53] Voice 28: user that was presented the previous staff report is now added to the bylaw 257 ltc has directed

[2:24:01] Voice 28: staff to provide language with respect to a potential bylaw amendment on restrictions on

[2:24:08] Voice 28: maximum day use that's presented for consideration by LTC with a couple questions there whether to

[2:24:15] Voice 28: include the bylaw or not LTC could decide that and the applicant is also asked for

[2:24:22] Voice 28: six days per year where they could exceed that 35 person maximum as opposed to one

[2:24:28] Voice 28: so that's something else LTC could consider direction previously provided by LTC on the

[2:24:36] Voice 28: section 219 covenant has been considered and you now have a draft covenant there in front of you

[2:24:41] Voice 28: the data logger report information that the ltc directed the applicant to collect is summarized

[2:24:49] Voice 28: and there's a draft water management plan attached with staff still need to review it

[2:24:56] Voice 28: the applicant is still working on the statutory right-of-way component and the

[2:25:03] Voice 28: that uh ltc is also still uh uh sitting on a previous recommendation uh with respect to

[2:25:10] Voice 28: endorsing the island's trust policy checklist so that is uh represented here uh again just for

[2:25:17] Voice 28: ltc's information i'll leave it there thanks okay

[2:25:24] Voice 5: trustees question for the planner and do we have

[2:25:28] Voice 5: the applicant here i

[2:25:33] Voice 28: assume keith is here i

[2:25:34] Voice 4: didn't see him but that doesn't mean anything oh yeah

[2:25:37] Voice 4: there he is keith erickson's here there's

[2:25:39] Voice 16: also someone

[2:25:41] Voice 4: that says cms so if we could bring the

[2:25:43] Voice 4: applicant over but if you have any questions for the planner so cms has their hand up uh robin and

[2:25:49] Voice 4: then there's a fellow gentleman by the name of keith erickson as well there i see you found him

[2:25:53] Voice 4: so okay over to you trustees for the planner um

[2:25:59] Voice 18: i have a question about when the water management

[2:26:03] Voice 18: plan is going to be back before us uh

[2:26:10] Voice 28: william and i will provide comments in the next few weeks when

[2:26:15] Voice 28: we find time on this latest draft and then uh a future meeting it's there's a lot going on so

[2:26:25] Voice 28: hard to uh i'm also away for a couple weeks over spring break so uh that's going to pause

[2:26:32] Voice 28: Mayor Mrakas, I don't know if it's going to cause my productivity, a little bit, but if not next meeting that the meeting after that, then, depending on we were I really have had no chance to to scratch the surface of it other than just a quick review and the applicant was keen to have this on it on the agenda, at least as a draft, so you can see progress is being made.

[2:26:53] Mayor Mrakas,

[2:26:59] Voice 5: Questions trustee rock.

[2:27:01] Voice 5: Mayor Mrakas, Anything further questions trustee will return.

[2:27:06] Voice 5: i

[2:27:09] Voice 4: want to follow up on something that oh sorry you unmuted so if you have a question go ahead

[2:27:14] Voice 18: not just yet carry on okay

[2:27:18] Voice 4: i want to follow up on a point and a question um that uh former

[2:27:25] Voice 4: trustee um sheila anderson made in her submit her commentary um and i wanted to see what

[2:27:35] Voice 4: And I don't know the answer to this offhand,

[2:27:39] Voice 4: but he was questioning the efficacy of putting matters

[2:27:42] Voice 4: in a Section 219 covenant rather than in the bylaw.

[2:27:50] Voice 4: I mean, my reflection, my immediate reaction was

[2:27:53] Voice 4: that whether it's in the bylaw or covenant,

[2:27:56] Voice 4: it's still sort of often left to neighbors

[2:28:03] Voice 4: to make a complaint that's what bylaw enforcement for the most part operates on information brought

[2:28:10] Voice 4: to their attention of by people in the neighborhood or or people on the island that

[2:28:14] Voice 4: have a concern and and that would be the same with a covenant but it i guess that there i wonder is

[2:28:20] Voice 4: is um the other commentary was is there's no provision at least so far for monitoring or

[2:28:31] Voice 4: or I think the term used is rent structure.

[2:28:37] Voice 4: I never quite understood how rent plays into covenants,

[2:28:42] Voice 4: but how that term got attached to covenants.

[2:28:45] Voice 4: But anyway, that is the term that's used.

[2:28:48] Voice 4: And I wondered, Planner Smith,

[2:28:49] Voice 4: if you had any commentary about the efficacy

[2:28:53] Voice 4: of a 219 versus a bylaw

[2:28:55] Voice 4: and the efficacy of installing a monitoring provision

[2:29:01] Voice 4: into a covenant um like this i know they're paying um or there's an amount being set aside

[2:29:09] Voice 4: i'm not sure if it's an upset amount or or amounts being set aside to the itc for the part that's

[2:29:16] Voice 4: being proposed to transfer to them but that's different that's um that's i think a one-time

[2:29:22] Voice 4: amount to allow for the the expenses for that as opposed to mon i don't know maybe it isn't

[2:29:26] Voice 4: different i don't know anyway i've talked enough that's my question i was pondering that what i

[2:29:31] Voice 4: thought was a a valid question and a point about about these types of of scenarios uh

[2:29:42] Voice 28: so i would

[2:29:43] Voice 28: say that both are legal instruments of course so they're both legally enforceable uh there are

[2:29:48] Voice 28: things that are more appropriate to put in bylaw and things that are more appropriate to put in

[2:29:52] Voice 28: covenant uh for example restriction you know environmental protections are are better suited

[2:30:00] Voice 28: in covenant rather than or the establishment of new development permit areas is something else

[2:30:06] Voice 28: you could consider um i think uh in this case there's also often overlap in the provisions

[2:30:14] Voice 28: with respect to uh uh limitations or restrictions for example with crystal mountain the bylaw sets

[2:30:22] Voice 28: out in specific terms the number of structures and the square footage of those and more typically a

[2:30:29] Voice 28: a more well-developed site plan

[2:30:33] Voice 28: then falls into a covenant, which is the case here.

[2:30:37] Voice 28: LTC could decide to put that detailed site plan

[2:30:40] Voice 28: and bylaw as a schedule if they preferred to do so.

[2:30:44] Voice 28: So there are some mechanisms

[2:30:46] Voice 28: where you could have some choice.

[2:30:49] Voice 28: And I think there are some of those conditions

[2:30:50] Voice 28: where bylaw provision just would not be appropriate

[2:30:55] Voice 28: and vice versa.

[2:30:56] Voice 28: so

[2:30:57] Voice 4: and and the question of monitoring in a in a section 219 covenant is that is that something

[2:31:05] Voice 4: that we see from time to time i'm not quite sure i'm maybe getting it mixed up with other things

[2:31:10] Voice 28: you could certainly establish some kind of monitoring condition that would require

[2:31:15] Voice 28: say a monitoring report every such and such time period you could also set a

[2:31:23] Voice 28: a uh like a i can't remember the actual term uh miss anderson used it but uh essentially a bond

[2:31:31] Voice 28: a bond uh that you establish it's a

[2:31:35] Voice 4: rent structure a rent a rent charge that's

[2:31:38] Voice 4: what i was saying is

[2:31:39] Voice 4: that i never quite understood how rent gets into these things but

[2:31:42] Voice 28: it's a rent charge so i think

[2:31:44] Voice 28: they it's like a bond where you would put up a rent charge so that if you were found in

[2:31:48] Voice 28: non-compliance of us of conditions you could be uh that fee would would be uh levied to you uh

[2:31:59] Voice 28: uh yeah so it's like a like a like a penalty structure in a sense

[2:32:06] Voice 28: so so that's

[2:32:07] Voice 4: not currently contained in your draft section 219 correct

[2:32:11] Voice 28: it does show up in

[2:32:13] Voice 28: some covenants and and not others so ltc could direct us to to explore both those avenues if

[2:32:21] Voice 28: you deem that uh important but i think it would be clear to understand what those rent charges

[2:32:26] Voice 28: are being applied to oh

[2:32:28] Voice 4: no i agree

[2:32:29] Voice 28: and whether that the they are uh you know i

[2:32:34] Voice 4: mean one of the

[2:32:34] Voice 4: reasons i think about this is this is a covenant on a private property some covenants are attached

[2:32:42] Voice 4: attached to um like property that the conservancy comes on and that people have access to so that

[2:32:49] Voice 4: you can get people can see but in this case it's on a it's a covenant on a private piece of property

[2:32:55] Voice 4: that not everybody would necessarily have access to all the time anyway it's just a thought i

[2:33:00] Voice 4: thought i mean those comment that commentary made me think about that about whether there was i mean

[2:33:07] Voice 4: My impression has always been that whether it's a Section 219 covenant or a bylaw, my understanding has always been that the bylaw enforcement will treat them the same effectively.

[2:33:22] Voice 4: I'd

[2:33:23] Voice 28: point you to Part 6 of Section 219 of the Land Title Act, which speaks specifically to rent charges.

[2:33:30] Voice 28: And it says a covenant registrable under this section may include as an integral part,

[2:33:35] Voice 28: an indemnity of the covenancy against any matter agreed to by the covenant or and the covenancy

[2:33:40] Voice 28: and provision for the just and equitable apportionment of the obligations on the covenant

[2:33:44] Voice 28: so ltc is a pretty broad authority to seek a rent charge for any matter they see uh as fit okay

[2:33:51] Voice 28: i

[2:33:52] Voice 18: see keith keith has his hand at keith erickson oh

[2:33:56] Voice 5: sorry um does he

[2:34:02] Voice 28: he might want to

[2:34:03] Voice 28: be promoted if he does he he

[2:34:05] Voice 5: is on our page here oh there he is

[2:34:07] Voice 4: mr erickson welcome i

[2:34:10] Voice 6: i just just thought i'd chime into the equation there that um

[2:34:15] Voice 6: um most of the provisions that are in the covenant um on on this property are um

[2:34:25] Voice 6: to do with with development and so at the time of a building permit that building permit would

[2:34:32] Voice 6: be referred to the islands trust and the islands trust would then check to ensure that all of the

[2:34:40] Voice 6: conditions spelled out in the covenant were being met prior to the issuance of that building permit

[2:34:48] Voice 6: So that is a mechanism for monitoring, so to speak.

[2:34:54] Voice 6: And I just want to throw that out there.

[2:34:56] Voice 4: Yeah.

[2:34:58] Voice 4: Except that most of the, as you say, some of them are,

[2:35:01] Voice 4: but some of them are about tree cover and some of them are about native species

[2:35:05] Voice 4: and some of them are about environmental issues, I suppose.

[2:35:08] Voice 6: The tree, the protection of the sort of larger trees,

[2:35:16] Voice 6: That is also tied to development in the sense that you're not able to build a structure within a certain distance of those trees to protect the critical rooting zone.

[2:35:26] Voice 6: And then the forest cover component isn't tied to development and does not have a mechanism for monitoring built into the covenant at Kerr.

[2:35:42] Voice 6: so that is one piece where that uh it is not triggered by a development okay

[2:35:53] Voice 4: these we we now have our um if you have no more questions for the planner we have

[2:35:57] Voice 4: the representatives of crystal mountain uh i can see you all you've been in the shadows but i

[2:36:03] Voice 4: recognize the three faces and uh mr erickson do you have questions for the uh for the applicant

[2:36:10] Voice 4: and related to any of the issues that are before us today either coming out of the commentary we

[2:36:16] Voice 4: got at town hall or otherwise yes trustee wolverton and

[2:36:20] Voice 18: yeah i have a couple questions uh

[2:36:23] Voice 18: one for the the applicants and then i'm wondering whether uh we could call on uh

[2:36:30] Voice 18: freshwater specialist william shelva to comment a little bit on the the water issues but what i

[2:36:36] Voice 18: wanted to ask the applicants you've asked to increase from one day to six days of when more

[2:36:45] Voice 18: than the 30 35 people could be present on the land and i'm just wondering if you could comment on

[2:36:53] Voice 18: what that is about like what would what would be the purpose of that

[2:36:58] Voice 12: sure um you know when we

[2:37:01] Voice 12: spoke to everybody uh membership and board and we started thinking you know into the future

[2:37:07] Voice 12: and a little bit about what's happened in the past we came up with different occasions they've

[2:37:14] Voice 12: been rare one would be a visiting teacher of note say another it could be workshops of different

[2:37:23] Voice 12: kinds we could have open houses where we invite the public through and theoretically you know if

[2:37:31] Voice 12: we made that open to Galliano to walk the land and and see the facility that it could be more than

[2:37:37] Voice 12: 35 people um and the other thing uh could be work parties uh in terms of you know

[2:37:46] Voice 12: having many hands on deck to uh do different things and and our hope is also to be able to

[2:37:53] Voice 12: share this facility with our host nation, Penelakut, to open it up to traditional teachings,

[2:38:03] Voice 12: whether that be medicine walks or even for them to use the facilities themselves and have larger

[2:38:12] Voice 12: teachings. I would hate to not be able to offer them, you know,

[2:38:16] Voice 12: more than the 35 people if there

[2:38:18] Voice 12: were that many people who actually wanted to take part on something like that.

[2:38:25] Voice 12: okay

[2:38:25] Voice 18: thank you you

[2:38:33] Voice 4: you wanted to ask uh william shul but he turned his camera on briefly and then

[2:38:36] Voice 4: turned it off again

[2:38:37] Voice 18: okay yeah i just um hi william um i just you've heard a lot today about water

[2:38:46] Voice 18: and that's certainly a a big concern of all the neighbors um and i i wondered if you could comment

[2:38:54] Voice 18: on um the estimate of water use for the kind of use that that is being described um sure

[2:39:07] Voice 7: yeah thank you for that question trustee wolverton so um in in all of the water

[2:39:16] Voice 7: science that we are undertaking um and the type of science uh and analysis that

[2:39:27] Voice 7: consultants have to undertake for a development water use is often the most elusive parameter to

[2:39:34] Voice 7: obtain values for the best way that we can do it is to monitor water use and that has been done

[2:39:44] Voice 7: in several small water systems in the in the southern gulf islands and for one of

[2:39:54] Voice 7: the applications for affordable housing hydrogeologist Kohat did a analysis of looking at different

[2:40:05] Voice 7: reported water volumes from other small water systems mostly on main but then also other ones

[2:40:13] Voice 7: and have and provided that analysis the LTC and that's available for the purposes of determining

[2:40:23] Voice 7: determining water use for the CMS, I think a difference that we can address is between

[2:40:35] Voice 7: a dwelling unit, an occupant, and a visitor. And I think that all three of those

[2:40:46] Voice 7: containers of use can be treated differently. And so if we just forget about dwelling unit

[2:40:54] Voice 7: it right now and identify the differences between an occupant and a visitor often when someone is

[2:41:03] Voice 7: visiting their water use is somewhat supervised and managed especially when it comes to laundry

[2:41:14] Voice 7: and and and kitchen and other types of water intensive uses like irrigation and stuff like that

[2:41:25] Voice 7: And so I would suggest that just taking

[2:41:29] Voice 7: the hypothetical occupant per person use

[2:41:37] Voice 7: is likely gonna differ than a visitor.

[2:41:41] Voice 7: And especially a visitor who is being somewhat supervised

[2:41:50] Voice 7: or supervises is maybe not the right term,

[2:41:54] Voice 7: but where their visitation on the land is directed.

[2:41:59] Voice 7: And possibly informed through the host regarding water conservation and other types of use, where I would consider that unsupervised visitor use would be like a short-term vacation rental where someone rents out a property and there's not like a manager around or something like that.

[2:42:25] Voice 7: so I think I'll leave it at that I know that I've had some back and forth with planners and

[2:42:32] Voice 7: trustees about this very topic and and I would encourage perhaps the LTC or or even the consultants

[2:42:40] Voice 7: to to perhaps define the the types of occupants and and visitors that that are going to be

[2:42:53] Voice 7: attending the CMS and I think that the water management plan speaks to that thanks thank you

[2:43:01] Voice 4: thank you and as I and as I understand it at least my context of all of this is um

[2:43:07] Voice 4: uh the proposal has the I'll call them the living accommodations they're called huts or tents

[2:43:20] Voice 4: are not plumbed they they don't have water use directly involved with them uh or at least

[2:43:27] Voice 4: access and and so um i mean i i'm struck by the i mean the people the folks uh you know they say

[2:43:40] Voice 4: well how can you have this extremely low projected water use given that the land use bylaws says

[2:43:48] Voice 4: you're supposed to allow for this amount and the average use is this amount these are all in

[2:43:52] Voice 4: residential dwellings um and i don't know i don't know how you go i mean personally i wouldn't know

[2:43:59] Voice 4: how to go about making a judgment call about what the usage would be because that's relatively

[2:44:05] Voice 4: key because the amount that they're proposing to use i think is at about 65 percent of the maximum

[2:44:13] Voice 4: daily well production and you know i'm not a water guy but my understanding is is that you

[2:44:22] Voice 4: You like to build in a lot of buffer into before, you know,

[2:44:26] Voice 4: as you approach, you don't want to get too close to the maximum.

[2:44:31] Voice 4: That's just what I've understood from listening to you,

[2:44:34] Voice 4: William and others over the years is you don't want to get too close to that.

[2:44:39] Voice 4: So that number is a 65% is getting up there.

[2:44:45] Voice 4: But on the other hand,

[2:44:46] Voice 4: it's an entirely different physical structure proposal than a,

[2:44:52] Voice 4: series of houses um with each with you know with their bathrooms and their laundry etc there's a

[2:44:58] Voice 4: central laundry there's a central kitchen there's a central bathhouse and that seems to be the way

[2:45:03] Voice 4: the the water usage and i i guess i i guess it's important that we get that described and and and

[2:45:13] Voice 4: some justification for those numbers because i were hearing people i i hear people quite quite

[2:45:19] Voice 4: quite clearly saying those numbers can't be justified.

[2:45:23] Voice 4: So, and that's, I don't know whether you

[2:45:25] Voice 4: and the planner will do that

[2:45:27] Voice 4: when you review the water management plan,

[2:45:29] Voice 4: although I know there's a report from Mr. Kohat

[2:45:31] Voice 4: that talks about that's where those numbers come from.

[2:45:34] Voice 4: And I guess I'm not quite sure what the right structure is

[2:45:38] Voice 4: to have that described and justified.

[2:45:41] Voice 4: I don't know, I'm just talking out loud to some extent.

[2:45:44] Voice 4: extent um

[2:45:46] Voice 7: sure yep um thanks for that trustee or chair rogers um i think that planner smith and i

[2:45:55] Voice 7: uh can do a an analysis on the water use and perhaps frame the topics around occupancy and

[2:46:07] Voice 7: visitor um i i think that the the if the definition of visitor is how much water they use in the hut

[2:46:19] Voice 7: 20 liters per day seems realistic if that's just drinking water um i live on salt spring island and

[2:46:29] Voice 7: i have a very unique water system here and over the holidays my uh line from my artesian well to

[2:46:35] Voice 7: my well house broke. And so I was hauling water in by hand from a neighbor. And it's easy to put

[2:46:42] Voice 7: 20 liters of water down a sink and in one dishwashing. And then nevermind filling the

[2:46:50] Voice 7: toilets. And I understand what that's the toilets is a different situation on CMS. So

[2:46:57] Voice 7: often with occupancy, occupancy is a difficult one for for water demand to begin with. But if

[2:47:05] Voice 7: you're looking at occupants it's it's taking in all of the other types of water use like laundry

[2:47:11] Voice 7: um and and like like kitchen and so if we're just focused on the visitors that and and that part of

[2:47:21] Voice 7: the water demand isn't involved in the visitor water demand then a really low amount of water

[2:47:30] Voice 7: is is not much if it's just for like simple hand washing and and drinking but if if the other types

[2:47:38] Voice 7: of water use like the laundry and the kitchen were to be integrated across the uh across the

[2:47:46] Voice 7: visitors then i believe that the the values are low so but i i think that the water management

[2:47:55] Voice 7: plan has has described that um in my cursory view so um i'm not saying that the water management

[2:48:03] Voice 7: plan says that it is low or not i'm just saying that if if if the water if all the water use on

[2:48:10] Voice 7: the property was to be integrated across the the visitors and if it was less than say you know like

[2:48:16] Voice 7: if it was in the two digits that's that's low um so that's something that planner smith and i will

[2:48:25] Voice 7: have to do analysis okay

[2:48:26] Voice 4: and and also don't forget there is one residence included in all

[2:48:31] Voice 4: this calculation and mr moses and others and mr mum and made that point there's a

[2:48:35] Voice 4: the caretaker's residence which it actually is a residence um as opposed to anything else that

[2:48:42] Voice 4: needs to be included and it's included in the calculations as i understand it in any case

[2:48:47] Voice 4: sorry i've done all the talking for a moment i'll turn to the trustees you have any other

[2:48:51] Voice 4: other questions related to this i have some things to talk to the trustees about but not necessarily

[2:48:58] Voice 4: i

[2:48:58] Voice 18: just wanted to ask the applicant because there's been mention of of most of the

[2:49:06] Voice 18: retreatants would be on the property for six months and that's not what i understood from

[2:49:12] Voice 18: the proposal so i just wanted to clarify who's going to be on the property for six months and

[2:49:20] Voice 18: And then what are the kind of usual lengths of stay for a visitor retreatant?

[2:49:31] Voice 22: No, it is not that most of the people will be there for six months.

[2:49:38] Voice 22: You probably noticed that on our site plan in the buildings, we have five huts that are

[2:49:45] Voice 22: are slightly larger than the others but we would that are designated as longer term retreat

[2:49:51] Voice 22: huts so that's the number that we're looking at for people to stay that long there's a

[2:49:58] Voice 22: number of parameters that that impinge on that one is that people in personal retreat

[2:50:04] Voice 22: like that are uh how would you say it there's there's not as high a demand for that you

[2:50:14] Voice 22: you know, numbers of people for that length retreat, that's a very serious

[2:50:20] Voice 22: program that people undertake to do something like that. It takes a lot of consideration,

[2:50:26] Voice 22: and people who do that, you know, in other places, they are working under the guidance

[2:50:34] Voice 22: of a teacher. They're on their own most of the time, and most of the people that would come

[2:50:42] Voice 22: to crystal mountain even when it's more of a year-round retreat i would say the average retreat

[2:50:49] Voice 22: length would be 10 days to well no actually i would say the average length would be a week to

[2:50:55] Voice 22: 10 days it's not it's not a simple thing for people in this day and age to take off periods

[2:51:01] Voice 22: of time you know from their livelihoods and families and everything else to go into retreat

[2:51:06] Voice 22: it's a commitment it's a serious commitment and well considered um and i would say a week to 10

[2:51:13] Voice 22: days uh some would retreats would be as short as a weekend um and some would be like our summer

[2:51:21] Voice 22: retreat would be as long as a month and i you know i i have to say that i haven't looked at the um

[2:51:30] Voice 22: oh the breakdown for instance that alcoa did a while ago about the numbers of people estimated

[2:51:35] Voice 22: HAB-Masyn Moyer- made it at different times of the year, but that's kind of what that flow is like, although I realized you aren't actually asking about water necessarily with this you're asking about numbers present on the land.

[2:51:47] Voice 22: HAB-Masyn Moyer- Did I leave something out of there, you guys is there other factor that you can think of that would be helpful to describe that.

[2:51:55] Voice 22: HAB-Masyn Moyer- yeah and clearly the the talking about the three hats on the in the upper area.

[2:52:02] Voice 22: um i think we've talked before about about why those and that would be the place where people

[2:52:09] Voice 22: would be you know it's just so much more optimal for long-term retreat to be in a in a removed

[2:52:15] Voice 22: area like that um then down below and i think that that's where one you know given enough time

[2:52:24] Voice 22: to put the center together in stages that you know a long time looking forward you would probably

[2:52:31] Voice 22: find people who are in longer retreated not necessarily six months you know it it might

[2:52:37] Voice 22: be a month or six weeks or two months or anything in between um six months is pretty unusual but

[2:52:44] Voice 22: but we wanted to have that in there so that we have that option of choice right um so anyway

[2:52:52] Voice 22: now i will stop talking and ask you if that generates any questions

[2:52:56] Voice 18: no that's fine that's

[2:53:01] Voice 18: questions

[2:53:04] Voice 5: from trustee rock commentary okay

[2:53:13] Voice 4: um thank you and thank you uh william um

[2:53:18] Voice 4: i mean on some level given that we just sort of we got this in the water management plan etc

[2:53:27] Voice 4: there are a few things that need to be um we should probably talk about uh and then there

[2:53:35] Voice 4: are some issues raised in the in the town hall public participation section that we may want to

[2:53:40] Voice 4: talk about um i guess the first question i'd ask is uh it looks like the the amendment for a

[2:53:54] Voice 4: retreat user has been input into the bylaws are there any questions or issues about

[2:54:00] Voice 4: that um i mean they we aren't we aren't being asked to give any further reading this is just

[2:54:09] Voice 4: a proposed amendment based on a suggestion that we made as a request that we made as a local trust

[2:54:15] Voice 4: committee to add the term for a retreat user so that's it that's in the package in the bylaws

[2:54:22] Voice 4: laws. Of course, my computer has decided to shut down. But the other question we've been asked is

[2:54:33] Voice 4: this issue about exceeding the 35 limit for six days. And I think we should probably talk about

[2:54:50] Voice 4: that. So I'm going to turn that to you, trustees, as to what your feeling about that is. The request,

[2:54:56] Voice 4: instead of being a single day in the year that the request that it be and that it be uh six days

[2:55:03] Voice 4: you

[2:55:05] Voice 18: want me to go ahead sure okay

[2:55:10] Voice 18: i i mean i'm i i can live with something like that i mean if

[2:55:16] Voice 18: if you're talking about um people coming to do restoration work for example um i mean i can't

[2:55:23] Voice 18: imagine that there would be that many people at once um but possibly i mean i think you know what

[2:55:33] Voice 18: i would what i would like to see is certainly more opportunity for um first nations to be involved

[2:55:43] Voice 18: and i mean again i can't see that there would be 35 at a time but it's possible you know so i think

[2:55:52] Voice 18: you know maybe uh things like that do you know allow this is a daytime

[2:55:59] Voice 18: uh maximum that they're that we're talking about um

[2:56:05] Voice 4: although it could extend into the evening

[2:56:07] Voice 4: i

[2:56:10] Voice 18: don't know i mean i maybe the applicants could comment on that

[2:56:19] Voice 5: yeah let let let me let me just

[2:56:22] Voice 5: say this this is about impact

[2:56:27] Voice 4: on neighbors um is what this idea was about is is if we you know

[2:56:35] Voice 4: i don't know where when or where we're going to get to on this application but the whole idea of

[2:56:43] Voice 4: a daily maximum and then providing a a lat i'll call it that for lack of a better word you know

[2:56:51] Voice 4: once a year was was to ensure that the the space did not become a gathering place for large numbers

[2:57:02] Voice 4: of people on a on a regular ongoing basis both for traffic concerns uh potential noise although

[2:57:09] Voice 4: my definition meditation is a bit silent but um uh but but certainly for traffic and and people

[2:57:17] Voice 4: wandering off the property etc is that you didn't end up with a sort of a festival space

[2:57:26] Voice 4: when that's clearly not the the nature of the intention at least as expressed to us

[2:57:33] Voice 4: so that that's the way I understand that restriction it's always

[2:57:39] Voice 4: um it's always uh interesting and and um attractive to create spaces for

[2:57:50] Voice 4: uh for members of the community including the uh uh the indigenous folk to to gather

[2:58:00] Voice 4: um that's the first time i'd heard that that might be an intent involved in this but

[2:58:06] Voice 4: But as I said, it's about the impact on the neighborhood

[2:58:11] Voice 4: of the actual operations, as I think this has come from.

[2:58:14] Voice 4: So that's sort of my perspective.

[2:58:16] Voice 4: Trustee Rockefeller, do you have anything you wanted

[2:58:18] Voice 4: to add to this conversation?

[2:58:21] Voice 16: Yeah, I mean, I think that it's good to,

[2:58:25] Voice 16: if the applicant intends to have a certain group,

[2:58:28] Voice 16: but I'm always going to keep in mind that this applicant

[2:58:31] Voice 16: may not be a future owner of the land.

[2:58:33] Voice 16: So I'm not going to consider the...

[2:58:36] Voice 16: people that will use it on the days that are allowed more people but more is it acceptable

[2:58:43] Voice 16: I feel like six days is acceptable in a year um for the type of retreat that they're proposing

[2:58:49] Voice 16: but I would like to see that the um as the comments in public in town participation was

[2:58:57] Voice 16: that the water management plan includes for those um increased day use I'm just not sure if it does

[2:59:04] Voice 16: but i know we haven't seen the the finalized version of that yet but um that would be one

[2:59:09] Voice 16: of my concerns i

[2:59:13] Voice 20: mean

[2:59:15] Voice 18: i think there also could be a requirement that you know the neighborhood

[2:59:20] Voice 18: is notified in advance maybe like two weeks in advance that something's going to occur

[2:59:25] Voice 18: um so that it's not like it's not a surprise or you know it's just you know i don't know

[2:59:35] Voice 18: something like that

[2:59:36] Voice 20: so well the

[2:59:37] Voice 28: notification is different than than uh than them notifying ltc

[2:59:43] Voice 28: so it would certainly require i did mechanism sorry dan sorry no

[2:59:47] Voice 4: i i was about to say i did

[2:59:49] Voice 4: notice that the way it's drafted right now was notification to the ltc which then puts the onus

[2:59:54] Voice 4: on the ltc to notify the neighborhood which seems a bit incongruous to me

[2:59:59] Voice 4: Thank you.

[3:00:00] Voice 28: the question is whether the neighborhood needs to be notified or not i

[3:00:06] Voice 18: think as a courtesy

[3:00:08] Voice 18: you know this

[3:00:09] Voice 4: is yeah guys i'll i'll i'll just tell you i think this is this is a bigger i think

[3:00:16] Voice 4: it's a bigger deal than me perhaps we think it is and that's just my perspective uh and i know i

[3:00:23] Voice 4: I don't live on Galliano, but it strikes me that events are the sorts of things that generate

[3:00:32] Voice 4: problems between neighbors. And I know any of the residents of Davina Drive could have a wedding

[3:00:40] Voice 4: where they have 100 people for a day, etc. And so, you know, it's a bit of a how much do you

[3:00:47] Voice 4: regulate this sort of thing but this is this is an event space this is a space that's designed

[3:00:53] Voice 4: to attract to bring people in and if you and i don't know just it just strikes me that i would

[3:01:02] Voice 4: like to see some restrictions and i think six days a year my own personal view is a lot but hey

[3:01:10] Voice 4: um as i said i don't live there

[3:01:15] Voice 20: so

[3:01:23] Voice 20: i

[3:01:30] Voice 4: probably personally would not i'm just speaking frankly would not accede to the request to increase

[3:01:36] Voice 4: it to six but i but that's just that's not a that's not a trustee that's not a um a legal

[3:01:45] Voice 4: approach or anything that's just my own personal approach and I would leave it

[3:01:49] Voice 4: to the two of you then if you feel differently that you think that's okay

[3:01:54] Voice 4: and I heard trustee Rockefeller say she'd be okay with six as long as they

[3:01:58] Voice 4: were it was taken into consideration in terms of the water management plan but I

[3:02:03] Voice 4: don't see I although it is effective on in effects the motor management I see

[3:02:08] Voice 4: this also as a neighborhood issue that's just

[3:02:10] Voice 4: the way I would address this

[3:02:12] Voice 20: there

[3:02:14] Voice 4: But there

[3:02:14] Voice 20: are some other

[3:02:15] Voice 4: things to keep in mind as well.

[3:02:17] Voice 4: I want to just keep going.

[3:02:18] Voice 4: I think we should talk a bit about the water management plan.

[3:02:25] Voice 4: We had some suggestions about should there be more monitoring of the well in the dry season.

[3:02:32] Voice 4: I had understood out Mr. Cohut to say on a regular basis that monitoring from September to January provides sufficient information to be able to extrapolate in the dry season.

[3:02:42] Voice 4: but I've also heard William Shulbaugh say the more monitoring the better. I think

[3:02:50] Voice 4: there was also a suggestion that they should be doing a pump test related to

[3:02:54] Voice 4: some of the neighbors wells. I had thought in this situation that Mr. Kohut

[3:02:59] Voice 4: had said that he was relatively satisfied that there would be no impact

[3:03:03] Voice 4: on any of the neighboring wells because of the distance from the wells that

[3:03:07] Voice 4: we've got involved here. I wouldn't mind an answer as to whether that would

[3:03:11] Voice 4: would provide any data for us if there was a pump test

[3:03:14] Voice 4: related to a neighboring well.

[3:03:16] Voice 4: I'm struck by the fact that, of course,

[3:03:18] Voice 4: the neighboring well, the Galli, which was mentioned,

[3:03:20] Voice 4: is very close in proximity to the well on Galli,

[3:03:26] Voice 4: as opposed to that not being the case here.

[3:03:30] Voice 4: We've got a fairly large distance comparatively,

[3:03:33] Voice 4: but I don't know the answer,

[3:03:35] Voice 4: whether that would provide any particularly good data.

[3:03:38] Voice 4: um and and uh i'd also i and i i'd like to specifically ask our staff to to review the

[3:03:46] Voice 4: water usage um projections uh and i heard william uh freshwater specialist shulba say that they

[3:03:55] Voice 4: would do that but those are the three things that sort of strike me related to the water that needs

[3:04:00] Voice 4: to be addressed further yes planter smith can

[3:04:03] Voice 28: i just make a quick point there to clarify and uh

[3:04:06] Voice 28: William can weigh in perhaps if he needs to with respect to those estimates I think it's reasonable

[3:04:14] Voice 28: to correct the estimates just say a maximum of 35 people for example instead of 27 but

[3:04:20] Voice 28: Mr. Cohut has provided his professional expertise with respect to water use per day

[3:04:25] Voice 28: are you asking us to also assess those numbers?

[3:04:29] Voice 4: I understood what William Shubel to say that

[3:04:34] Voice 4: that he would but that's what i thought but maybe i misunderstood that's

[3:04:39] Voice 28: why i'm seeking

[3:04:39] Voice 28: clarification perhaps william could clarify that seeking

[3:04:45] Voice 6: through the chair you're seeking

[3:04:47] Voice 6: clarification from me well

[3:04:49] Voice 4: i had understood you to say that when you review the water management

[3:04:53] Voice 4: plan one of the things you could do is to is to have a look at the at the estimated daily usage

[3:05:00] Voice 4: and and and see if you think that's reasonable or something that's what i understood you to say but

[3:05:05] Voice 4: maybe i misunderstood you uh

[3:05:07] Voice 7: yeah i think that uh planners smith and i can review the other reports

[3:05:14] Voice 7: that were submitted as well as provide some other analysis regarding yeah

[3:05:19] Voice 4: yeah so that that's what

[3:05:21] Voice 4: i was talking about brad so um thanks

[3:05:24] Voice 7: i think

[3:05:25] Voice 7: uh through the chair i i'm i'm i'm sure that might

[3:05:29] Voice 7: need a resolution from the ltc

[3:05:31] Voice 4: yeah no no i i'm getting there okay we're getting there thank you

[3:05:35] Voice 4: I'm just trying to put the issues on the table that I see coming out of today's report.

[3:05:42] Voice 4: I have some more general comments to make as well about where we're going with this, but I don't know.

[3:05:50] Voice 18: Keith Erickson has his hand up.

[3:05:51] Voice 4: Oh, okay. Sorry. I can't, for some reason, see his hand. I don't know why.

[3:05:57] Voice 4: Oh, there you are. Go ahead, Keith.

[3:05:59] Voice 4: Keith, sorry.

[3:06:00] Voice 6: Thanks very much.

[3:06:01] Voice 6: I just wanted to offer a little bit of clarification.

[3:06:05] Voice 6: If there may be a small amount of confusion,

[3:06:09] Voice 6: there was a drawdown test performed on the well

[3:06:13] Voice 6: that monitored two neighboring observation wells

[3:06:17] Voice 6: while it was being done.

[3:06:19] Voice 6: And that report was provided by Mr. Kohut

[3:06:23] Voice 6: and is part of an appendix to the water management plan.

[3:06:27] Voice 6: so that information um is there that's the 2015

[3:06:32] Voice 4: yes and then when

[3:06:35] Voice 4: you say observation wells were

[3:06:37] Voice 4: they wells that were still on this property or were they any of the neighbors wells that's what

[3:06:42] Voice 4: the point that was made to us right

[3:06:44] Voice 6: well i believe i don't i actually would have to reread the report

[3:06:48] Voice 6: but i believe they were the closest wells which may be the ones that are on lot a and lot nine

[3:06:55] Voice 6: respectively but would assumingly those would be the ones that you would want to use

[3:07:00] Voice 6: to provide the best results would be the closest ones but i would leave that to mr kohut to confirm

[3:07:08] Voice 6: um and uh there was one other piece of information that i wanted to uh provide

[3:07:17] Voice 6: um well also yeah there's mr kohut's uh water estimates that he's explained his assumptions

[3:07:25] Voice 6: with that are also part of the water management plan.

[3:07:29] Voice 6: There was something else on the top of my head

[3:07:32] Voice 6: that I can't remember right now, but I'll chime in again

[3:07:35] Voice 6: or I'll raise my hand again if I remember.

[3:07:37] Voice 4: Okay.

[3:07:38] Voice 4: Yes, I see the folks from CMS that want to speak.

[3:07:43] Voice 12: Yeah, there was also an element

[3:07:45] Voice 12: of going door to door in Spotlight Cove,

[3:07:49] Voice 12: giving information to people

[3:07:51] Voice 12: that there would be a water testing happening up at the well on CMS property

[3:07:58] Voice 12: and to watch their water and notice anything unusual and so they two people

[3:08:06] Voice 12: went door-to-door to ask if they wanted to be part of it is

[3:08:13] Voice 4: that again part of

[3:08:14] Voice 4: of back in 2015?

[3:08:16] Voice 19: Yeah.

[3:08:18] Voice 4: Right.

[3:08:19] Voice 4: Okay, maybe I need to go back

[3:08:21] Voice 4: and read Mr. Kohut's reports again.

[3:08:23] Voice 4: I haven't read them for a bit.

[3:08:26] Voice 4: Anyway, those are my questions that I had

[3:08:28] Voice 4: that I think arise out of our, the commentary

[3:08:32] Voice 4: or at least some of the questions that arise

[3:08:34] Voice 4: out of the commentary we received today.

[3:08:36] Voice 4: Yes, Keith.

[3:08:37] Voice 6: Sorry, I just, I remembered.

[3:08:41] Voice 6: The data loggers that were used to produce

[3:08:44] Voice 6: the well monitoring report from January were put and reinstalled into the wells and they're

[3:08:54] Voice 6: logging data right now as we speak. So there is the potential to, or the monitoring is continuing

[3:09:02] Voice 6: and will continue throughout this process. Thank

[3:09:07] Voice 4: you. That's good. And we'll be able to

[3:09:09] Voice 4: to have access to that data.

[3:09:11] Voice 6: Well, yeah, you might want to give direction

[3:09:14] Voice 6: in terms of when you would want that,

[3:09:16] Voice 6: or perhaps Mr. Shelbaugh could provide direction

[3:09:19] Voice 6: in terms of when you want us to pull those

[3:09:22] Voice 6: and download the data, et cetera, and provide a report,

[3:09:24] Voice 6: but it's certainly a possibility.

[3:09:31] Voice 4: Okay, I've been doing all, again,

[3:09:33] Voice 4: once again, doing a lot of the talking.

[3:09:35] Voice 4: Trustees, how would you like to proceed?

[3:09:39] Voice 18: I think you said you had some more general comments

[3:09:42] Voice 18: that you wanted to make well

[3:09:43] Voice 4: i wanted to comment on our process uh but that's a that's a because

[3:09:49] Voice 4: we got a fair amount of commentary i think it's fair to say criticism about our um about our

[3:09:57] Voice 4: process and etc so but um i um i but i don't think that's necessarily related to and maybe i made

[3:10:08] Voice 4: enough comments in the town hall um but maybe it's not related to any decisions we might want

[3:10:14] Voice 4: to make today so i guess uh for from the from the um the planner he asked what we wanted to do about

[3:10:24] Voice 4: the request for the number of days exceeding six days do you want to make it make a decision about

[3:10:33] Voice 4: that sorry exceeding one day that where they exceed the number of 35 do you want to make a

[3:10:37] Voice 4: decision about that today or do you want to defer it or how do you want to go i

[3:10:44] Voice 18: think we could ask

[3:10:45] Voice 18: uh that that information be included in the analysis that freshwater specialist shoba and

[3:10:52] Voice 18: planner smith will do so

[3:10:55] Voice 4: your so your suggestion is we ask that the analysis of the water management

[3:11:06] Voice 4: plan include an analysis of any impacts that a a um any impacts of exceeding the daily maximum

[3:11:19] Voice 4: might have on the water yeah trustee rockefeller go ahead sorry um

[3:11:23] Voice 16: no no it wasn't i was just

[3:11:24] Voice 16: noting if trustee wolverton supports the six days then it's worth doing that but if she doesn't then

[3:11:31] Voice 16: then that's,

[3:11:33] Voice 16: it seems to, I mean, maybe cart before horse.

[3:11:36] Voice 18: Correct.

[3:11:37] Voice 18: I can support the six days,

[3:11:39] Voice 18: but I think that it's important to have that information

[3:11:45] Voice 18: from the freshwater specialist and the planner to see, okay,

[3:11:51] Voice 18: you know, I mean, if in looking at the data, it looked like, okay,

[3:11:55] Voice 18: that's not going to be feasible or it's going to have detrimental effects.

[3:12:01] Voice 18: That's one thing, but if it looks like it is supportable, provided that Crystal Mountain is monitoring how water is used by people who are on the land.

[3:12:17] Voice 4: Well, what do you mean by that? Because do you mean we don't have anything built into our covenant about water use?

[3:12:26] Voice 4: You can monitor, you can have a data logger and you can monitor how the wells are going. Yes, Trustee Rockbaum.

[3:12:31] Voice 4: um

[3:12:32] Voice 16: i think that mechanism would be the provincial water license so um and a meter

[3:12:44] Voice 4: so here's what i'm going to suggest not that i'm trying to tell you guys what to do

[3:12:51] Voice 4: um but what i'm going to suggest is is that we do a sort of a um a bit of an omnibus

[3:12:58] Voice 4: resolution that we ask that the ltc ask the uh uh staff to review the water management plan

[3:13:08] Voice 4: and in and in particular provide advice on a

[3:13:18] Voice 21: um whether

[3:13:28] Voice 4: the sorry advise any feedback on

[3:13:34] Voice 4: provide feedback on a whether the water usage estimates are reasonable be any

[3:13:46] Voice 4: recommendations on alternative pump tests see and see any any reflections on

[3:14:07] Voice 4: on impacts on, sorry, any recommendations on impacts on water use from days where the numbers

[3:14:15] Voice 4: exceed 35. I'm trying to be as descriptive as possible so we get the information we want

[3:14:26] Voice 4: rather than just talking about it and give some direction to staff. And what I'm really saying is

[3:14:34] Voice 4: bring back whatever you think is important that we look at, but those are the three that I think

[3:14:39] Voice 4: that I've heard anyway.

[3:14:41] Voice 4: Don't know what others think about that.

[3:14:46] Voice 4: I

[3:14:46] Voice 18: mean, those sound okay.

[3:14:48] Voice 18: I mean, I look at what Al Kohut says about the pump tests

[3:14:54] Voice 18: and he's saying that, you know,

[3:14:56] Voice 18: the monitoring results that he's just done

[3:15:02] Voice 18: are consistent with the observations and assumptions

[3:15:05] Voice 18: and results reported in the pump test in 2015.

[3:15:09] Voice 18: So, is it necessary to do another pump test? I don't know. I mean, that's where I have to rely on our specialist to indicate whether that is essential.

[3:15:26] Voice 4: Yeah. Well, I think, yeah, I agree with you entirely. That's why I think I put it there is to bring back a recommendation on that issue. And that was because that would entail looking at what was done in 2015 and whether or not, and what Mr. Kohut and others think about the impacts on other wells.

[3:15:44] Voice 4: wells as i said my inclination is what i recall him saying in the cim was he didn't think it was

[3:15:53] Voice 4: necessary like mr kohat because the distances and and how far away and he couldn't imagine how this

[3:16:00] Voice 4: well would impact people in spotlight code etc etc but i guess i'd like to have some another

[3:16:07] Voice 4: view on that so that's why i suggested that

[3:16:10] Voice 18: it looks like cms has a hand up

[3:16:13] Voice 4: yeah it's been up

[3:16:15] Voice 4: for a bit yeah go ahead

[3:16:16] Voice 18: i

[3:16:17] Voice 22: this is sort of down the road because it was actually for back there

[3:16:21] Voice 22: where you were talking about about um occasional day use and just a couple of really small comments

[3:16:29] Voice 22: on that one is you you you um reference well it could go on into the evening if you want to

[3:16:33] Voice 22: restrict it not going on into the evening that's fine um that doesn't really fit in with any intent

[3:16:40] Voice 22: that we have um and we're just trying our best to think of something that would give us a little

[3:16:47] Voice 22: bit of freedom to have you know like a a study workshop or a visiting teacher or something like

[3:16:53] Voice 22: that that doesn't keep us totally bound um and i understand you have concern about parking and

[3:17:00] Voice 22: you know we have a quite a lot of parking um allotted on the property and we can be cognizant

[3:17:08] Voice 22: of that that was part of the reason why i thought the original wording said that the neighbors would

[3:17:14] Voice 22: be notified well in advance of any occasion so i'm a little confused about why it says the ltc now but

[3:17:20] Voice 22: um um anyway that's just a comment to throw into the pot um i think that was it did you guys have

[3:17:27] Voice 22: any other okay thanks so

[3:17:31] Voice 4: thanks so i don't know let's let's i want to come back to that issue

[3:17:35] Voice 4: about because I agree with you I think it should be the neighbors not the LTC

[3:17:39] Voice 4: who's notified but let's come back to the my my suggestion for a motion

[3:17:44] Voice 4: related to the water trustee Rockefeller I

[3:17:50] Voice 16: don't have any comments at the moment

[3:17:53] Voice 5: trustee Wolverton

[3:17:55] Voice 18: I'm fine if you want to move this motion okay

[3:17:58] Voice 4: so Carly did

[3:18:00] Voice 4: you get that yeah

[3:18:02] Voice 15: I got that the LTC asked after review the water management

[3:18:06] Voice 15: plan and in particular provide feedback on a whether the water usage estimates

[3:18:11] Voice 15: are reasonable be recommendations on alternative pump tests and see

[3:18:15] Voice 15: recommendations on impacts on water use on days when the numbers of people on

[3:18:19] Voice 15: the property exceed 35 thank

[3:18:22] Voice 4: you so okay so that's been moved and seconded is

[3:18:26] Voice 4: there any further discussion I'll call the vote on that thanks

[3:18:30] Voice 4: I think it passes unanimously.

[3:18:33] Voice 4: While we're talking about it,

[3:18:35] Voice 4: I personally think it should say,

[3:18:37] Voice 4: the agenda should say subject to,

[3:18:43] Voice 4: well, I guess it won't be once a year anymore.

[3:18:48] Voice 4: Did you want to change that to six times a year

[3:18:51] Voice 4: or do you want to leave that until we get the report

[3:18:53] Voice 4: on the water usage issue?

[3:18:57] Voice 4: Trustee Rockfall.

[3:18:58] Voice 4: Oh,

[3:18:58] Voice 16: sorry, Planner Smith has a comment.

[3:19:00] Voice 4: Oh, go ahead, Planner Smith.

[3:19:01] Voice 4: Just

[3:19:02] Voice 28: to clarify, you haven't actually directed staff to include this in the bylaw, correct?

[3:19:06] Voice 4: That's true.

[3:19:10] Voice 4: So that's true.

[3:19:12] Voice 4: We have not.

[3:19:13] Voice 16: I was going to say, wait on it just until we got the more information.

[3:19:17] Voice 4: Right.

[3:19:18] Voice 4: But I will say as a general term, I think the intention was written notification to the community, the neighborhood, not to the office.

[3:19:26] Voice 4: so you might when we come back to that we'll want to amend that can

[3:19:32] Voice 28: i just speak to that for a second

[3:19:34] Voice 28: chair sure so the the resolution doesn't make it clear so that was staff's assumption that it would

[3:19:40] Voice 28: be notification to the ltc versus the community i guess just from a practical perspective notifying

[3:19:48] Voice 28: the ltc is a lot simpler process than notifying the community and so how do you set up that

[3:19:53] Voice 28: mechanism just notify the community uh would need to be something that uh is considered uh versus

[3:20:00] Voice 28: uh written notification to the ltc so much more clear well

[3:20:03] Voice 4: i appreciate that's true but that's

[3:20:05] Voice 4: not our problem uh

[3:20:07] Voice 28: just it is your bylaw so your bylaw would need to make it clear you couldn't

[3:20:11] Voice 28: just put and then uh provide notification to the neighborhood because that's impossible to

[3:20:17] Voice 28: apply and enforce without fair enough a more restrictive mechanism that's just a point in

[3:20:24] Voice 28: making if you go there i'm not saying uh any anything as to whether you should insert this

[3:20:29] Voice 28: or not i'm just saying if you do change it to community notification you will need to consider

[3:20:34] Voice 28: uh how that notification occurs and and what mechanism

[3:20:39] Voice 28: enforces it yeah defining the

[3:20:42] Voice 18: neighborhood and

[3:20:43] Voice 28: all of those things true

[3:20:45] Voice 5: trustee rockabye um

[3:20:50] Voice 16: yeah so this i mean this was an aside

[3:20:53] Voice 16: a different concern i had just after listening to the public participation period about the

[3:20:58] Voice 16: covenant monitoring and i realized that because we do have the um forest cover aspect if just from

[3:21:05] Voice 16: staff's perspective if it requires a covenant monitoring much like an f3 covenant would

[3:21:14] Voice 16: is

[3:21:15] Voice 4: that are you proposing that um

[3:21:17] Voice 16: no i was just actually wondering if staff thought that was

[3:21:22] Voice 16: necessary or or required just

[3:21:27] Voice 28: i didn't completely understand the question um

[3:21:29] Voice 16: just how the ltc

[3:21:30] Voice 16: included the 60 forest cover maintained on the property and if like an f3 covenant if that would

[3:21:38] Voice 16: require monitoring?

[3:21:40] Voice 28: An F3 covenant would require the establishment of a sustainable forestry

[3:21:46] Voice 28: management plan which would have a clear monitoring component but that's a different. Yeah it's

[3:21:51] Voice 16: different I was just wondering if you thought it was similar enough that we should consider

[3:21:55] Voice 16: something like that or if this is an entirely different mechanism. It's really

[3:22:01] Voice 28: really up to

[3:22:02] Voice 28: to LTC to decide how they're going to enforce their covenant thank

[3:22:06] Voice 16: you but

[3:22:09] Voice 4: I guess if you want

[3:22:10] Voice 4: that if you think that that would be a reasonable thing to put into the covenant a monitoring

[3:22:15] Voice 4: provision you should ask pass a motion asking staff to to propose a monitoring provision in

[3:22:23] Voice 4: I

[3:22:23] Voice 16: know to be honest I hadn't really thought of it because I thought it I remember saying that

[3:22:28] Voice 16: we're going to make a baseline report um and then I felt like we kind of talked about monitoring but

[3:22:34] Voice 16: I don't think we actually included anything so um yeah I guess I'm just considering it now

[3:22:42] Voice 4: okay I just don't want things to be considered and fall off the table if you think they're

[3:22:46] Voice 4: important so oh

[3:22:46] Voice 16: no it's on my table okay

[3:22:49] Voice 4: but I

[3:22:50] Voice 4: think sometimes people think it falls off our

[3:22:51] Voice 4: table if we don't take some specific action on it

[3:22:54] Voice 16: yeah no I you know I

[3:22:55] Voice 16: feel like I will take I just

[3:22:56] Voice 16: um i'm thinking on the fly and it just takes me a second that's all okay

[3:23:00] Voice 4: that's fine uh trustee

[3:23:02] Voice 4: wolverton do you have anything further so is there anything further that you'd um any the trustees

[3:23:15] Voice 4: would like us to do or or uh planner smith is there anything that we've not sort of addressed

[3:23:21] Voice 4: that you'd like us to talk about should

[3:23:25] Voice 18: we pass this motion oh

[3:23:27] Voice 4: did we not call the vote on it

[3:23:30] Voice 4: sorry apologies i'll call the vote all in favor yeah it passes unanimously i apologize i thought

[3:23:37] Voice 4: we had called the vote maybe

[3:23:40] Voice 18: we did um

[3:23:43] Voice 4: is there anything else we sort of talked a little bit about

[3:23:47] Voice 4: water i mean i'm quite conscious of the fact that there's three or four i'll call them large issues

[3:23:53] Voice 4: and then a lot of other things that can take up a lot of time you know there's the forest

[3:23:57] Voice 4: fragmentation issue that continues you know to be in in there there's the issue of the hook lot

[3:24:03] Voice 4: that's out there there's the issue where this where this devout proposed rezoning and uh belongs

[3:24:10] Voice 4: in the in the um uh in the ocp and the land use bylaw and then there's water and then and i don't

[3:24:18] Voice 4: want to and just because i said those four that doesn't mean there's not other considerations

[3:24:22] Voice 4: that we have in there as well.

[3:24:24] Voice 4: Yeah, President DeRocque.

[3:24:25] Voice 16: Yeah, I appreciate what you're saying.

[3:24:27] Voice 16: There's a lot of things at play right now.

[3:24:30] Voice 16: And so just to follow up on my covenant inquiry,

[3:24:34] Voice 16: just so the LTC and public don't think that I'm letting it,

[3:24:38] Voice 16: I just, I'm going to speak with the planner

[3:24:40] Voice 16: in the next month and kind of discuss possibilities

[3:24:44] Voice 16: and evaluate before I come back

[3:24:46] Voice 16: with a recommendation if I consider it.

[3:24:52] Voice 4: Okay.

[3:24:54] Voice 4: And, of course, the over, you know, I mean, and we can never forget the context of this, which is that the proposal is that 75% of the property of the current land is protected under the ITC and that 60% of the remainder is under a covenant to be undisturbed effectively.

[3:25:18] Voice 4: effectively and you know those are not those are very considerable considerations as we as we

[3:25:25] Voice 4: move our way through this but it does not mean we have finally decided and one of the things i just

[3:25:32] Voice 4: wanted to say is one of the reasons you don't see us necessarily making determined statements about

[3:25:38] Voice 4: where we stand at every case we first of all we have to decide as an ltc when we decide to pass

[3:25:44] Voice 4: emotion and ask for things and we have to listen to the community and so part of my process is as

[3:25:52] Voice 4: we get information in we make sure that hopefully the community is aware of it and that it gets a

[3:25:57] Voice 4: chance to see it and react to it and I'm always uncomfortable when we get things three days before

[3:26:03] Voice 4: the meeting because we can't put it into the package and give people chance a chance to look

[3:26:09] Voice 4: at it let alone ourselves to absorb it and be able to discuss it meaningfully so we're working

[3:26:15] Voice 4: through uh these processes as we as we go along and um yeah and we'll keep doing that so anything

[3:26:28] Voice 4: further that you need from us planner smith because otherwise i'm going to move on nothing

[3:26:33] Voice 4: okay thank you very much for your conference thank you to cms for joining us thank you

[3:26:37] Voice 4: Keith for mr. Erickson for joining us and we'll we'll return to this at some

[3:26:43] Voice 4: point as well thank you how are you guys doing the next thing is the grain

[3:26:50] Voice 4: groundwater sustainability implementation project I'm sorry it's

[3:26:54] Voice 4: coming at at 4 o'clock but this is our second project yeah you need a break

[3:27:00] Voice 4: Connor Smith

[3:27:04] Voice 28: staff are suggesting behind the scenes that you potentially

[3:27:07] Voice 28: potentially consider deferring this to the next meeting oh just there's a lot to talk about oh

[3:27:15] Voice 4: you think we should create more time is what you mean

[3:27:17] Voice 28: yeah given where we're at in the day and

[3:27:20] Voice 28: another town hall to come and uh there's probably lots to talk about here and and uh the next meeting

[3:27:26] Voice 28: agenda is looking pretty light at this point particularly with me away for a couple weeks

[3:27:30] Voice 28: so how

[3:27:32] Voice 4: how does that work in terms of this process program project sorry uh rolling out

[3:27:42] Voice 4: yeah go ahead uh

[3:27:45] Voice 7: i'll do i'll defer much of this to planner chadwick but um staff are working on

[3:27:53] Voice 7: um certain mapping options that have not been included in in the staff report so

[3:27:59] Voice 7: So in my perspective, because I'm working on this actively,

[3:28:04] Voice 7: that it won't stop me in my tracks if we don't talk about it today.

[3:28:10] Voice 7: However, I'm not sure about Planner Chadwick if there's certain elements

[3:28:14] Voice 7: that need to be discussed today to continue on the project.

[3:28:17] Voice 7: So I'll just pass that over.

[3:28:19] Voice 7: Thanks.

[3:28:20] Voice 9: I would, through the chair, I would say that there would be value in,

[3:28:28] Voice 9: I mean the resolutions so currently the staff report identifies some options for moving forward

[3:28:35] Voice 9: and there would be value in in in just knowing that that trustees are supportive of the general

[3:28:45] Voice 9: options and so and then support for the resolutions would basically be be to support the drafting

[3:28:53] Voice 9: drafting of the creation of draft the bylaws which of course can we can discuss and we can

[3:28:59] Voice 9: we can discuss the details of what's being proposed now or we can discuss discuss the details

[3:29:06] Voice 9: once they are in a draft bylaw form so we could move ahead in a sort of a let's do a light touch

[3:29:15] Voice 9: now which would basically be just ensuring that trustees understand the process

[3:29:21] Voice 9: and support moving forward and we could do a deeper dive at a later date that's that's one

[3:29:28] Voice 9: option or we can

[3:29:31] Voice 9: defer till to the other meeting what

[3:29:35] Voice 4: do you want to do uh trustees wolverton and

[3:29:37] Voice 4: rockwell

[3:29:40] Voice 18: um go ahead uh that's

[3:29:42] Voice 16: okay just you can make a comment yeah

[3:29:45] Voice 18: i was just so are you

[3:29:47] Voice 18: you suggesting, Planner Chadwick, that we could pass the resolution asking or suggesting

[3:29:56] Voice 18: or requesting that staff prepare a draft bylaw?

[3:30:00] Voice 18: then have all the discussion at the same time yep

[3:30:03] Voice 9: that's what i'm saying if we move forward

[3:30:06] Voice 9: with draft bylaws it doesn't it it doesn't um i mean there's still the there's the opportunity to

[3:30:11] Voice 9: sort of dive in and and get control about what's in in the actual content of those bylaws which

[3:30:17] Voice 9: and sorry and amend them if that's necessary if

[3:30:21] Voice 9: that's yeah

[3:30:23] Voice 18: yeah christy

[3:30:28] Voice 5: rockwell oh

[3:30:29] Voice 16: um i'd be

[3:30:29] Voice 16: supportive of doing that today yeah

[3:30:34] Voice 4: i'll just say i i i know this product project is iterative

[3:30:41] Voice 20: it's

[3:30:41] Voice 4: a bit odd for me to be asking for bylaws to be drafted when we haven't actually seen the map

[3:30:47] Voice 4: yet um about the areas that you're planning to put proposing to be put into a dpa um but i guess

[3:30:56] Voice 4: that's part of what's the iterative part of this is it's evolving they're still waiting for the the

[3:31:03] Voice 4: consideration of where those areas are is that what's going on

[3:31:05] Voice 9: that's right yeah yeah we currently

[3:31:08] Voice 9: have that so what's been proposed is the uh the content for the dpa um and we've done some

[3:31:16] Voice 9: substantial work at looking at the um the boundaries for the dpa um and um and and that

[3:31:24] Voice 9: can be that you know that that will we'll we'll have for a later meeting we don't have that

[3:31:29] Voice 9: currently so um yeah and

[3:31:35] Voice 4: then how then you could and i'll just ask the second question while it's

[3:31:39] Voice 4: on my brain then you can well turn to william and can you tell me how um all of this meshes with

[3:31:48] Voice 4: the province uh because you know they about they do the water licensing etc and so and so i assume

[3:31:57] Voice 4: you've considered all that and hopefully we're working with them how does that all work together

[3:32:02] Voice 4: yeah william so

[3:32:04] Voice 7: as we will find out through the watershed security strategy and fund as that's

[3:32:10] Voice 7: being developed over the next coming years is that local governments play an intricate role

[3:32:15] Voice 7: in protecting the water licenses that the province is giving out and i've put in requests to for the

[3:32:22] Voice 7: Islands Trust to bring to UBCM many times for the province to participate with local government to

[3:32:30] Voice 7: develop aquifer protection areas and critical recharge protection areas. And

[3:32:35] Voice 7: indeed, they have

[3:32:36] Voice 7: done this work with other larger regional districts like the Cowichan and the Chimayness areas where

[3:32:44] Voice 7: if you're driving those areas, you'll see you're entering a groundwater protection zone,

[3:32:48] Voice 7: So those kinds of things.

[3:32:50] Voice 7: And so there has been cooperation with the province

[3:32:55] Voice 7: on the elements in which to put into land use planning,

[3:33:00] Voice 7: which is under the sole jurisdiction

[3:33:03] Voice 7: of the local government.

[3:33:06] Voice 7: So that being said there,

[3:33:08] Voice 7: with some other groundwater policies

[3:33:11] Voice 7: that we've been developing,

[3:33:13] Voice 7: that there has been early referral to the province

[3:33:16] Voice 7: to just understand we're on the right track and and that can be that could be undertaken here

[3:33:26] Voice 7: like as for the so so just to kind of split the hair here that looking at a development permit

[3:33:37] Voice 7: area for recharge is identifying the intrinsic value of the landscape to the groundwater resource

[3:33:46] Voice 7: we're looking at say water budgets and availability and water licensing as it's

[3:33:53] Voice 7: relating to zoning and other density that that is like the the other issue

[3:33:57] Voice 7: looking at availability which is is more aligned with the process of the province

[3:34:03] Voice 7: for sure and both of them are related to groundwater vulnerability and

[3:34:08] Voice 7: sustainability however I think like the number one recommendation for number one

[3:34:14] Voice 7: not the number one but number one recommendation here uh leading to update the existing development

[3:34:21] Voice 7: permit area that galliano already has the elevated groundwater catchment area which is ineffective

[3:34:26] Voice 7: and so um just by way of of galliano having that work done already is kind of like the open door

[3:34:34] Voice 7: to address it um and you know like largely it is the local government that that controls

[3:34:42] Voice 7: controls water licensing in a way vis-a-vis density and zoning and and definitely we have

[3:34:50] Voice 7: to move closer to the province with looking at that and i think the province has to realize

[3:34:55] Voice 7: and which i i believe that they do on an operational level but maybe not on a policy level

[3:35:00] Voice 7: that local government has a huge role to play in protecting recharge areas uh to ensure the

[3:35:08] Voice 7: the licenses that they're giving out will be sustainable and and so um i believe that the

[3:35:15] Voice 7: work that we're doing by taking a evidence-based approach by looking at recharge potential and

[3:35:20] Voice 7: having that mapping and now using that scientific map which is a 20 by 20 meter gridded thing and

[3:35:28] Voice 7: and seeing how will this work with the development permit area and um just to maybe give a little

[3:35:35] Voice 7: little sneak peek or understanding of where staff are looking at this the

[3:35:39] Voice 7: impact to residential zone properties for the recharge development permit area

[3:35:48] Voice 7: is very low actually in our first iteration there are no zone proper no

[3:35:53] Voice 7: residential zone properties that would be included in the DPA and and that was

[3:35:58] Voice 7: an evidence-based process looking at where the potential for significant and

[3:36:02] Voice 7: and critical for recharge areas are.

[3:36:05] Voice 7: And that's just the configuration of Galliano

[3:36:09] Voice 7: having these large properties

[3:36:10] Voice 7: that are mostly forestry zone or parkland

[3:36:13] Voice 7: where other areas like Salt Spring Island

[3:36:16] Voice 7: or North Pend are not the same

[3:36:18] Voice 7: and they'll have different considerations.

[3:36:20] Voice 7: So I'll leave it at that.

[3:36:24] Voice 7: Thanks.

[3:36:25] Voice 4: Thanks.

[3:36:26] Voice 4: We've sort of gotten into a bit of the intro to the project

[3:36:29] Voice 4: and I guess then the question is,

[3:36:31] Voice 4: I heard the trustee say they'd like to perhaps consider as a preliminary step past some of the

[3:36:36] Voice 4: motions or discuss some of the motions so I'll turn it to trustee Wolverton or trustee Rockefeller

[3:36:42] Voice 4: yeah um

[3:36:44] Voice 16: yeah I didn't hear from trustee Wolverton but if she's amenable to addressing these bylaws

[3:36:50] Voice 16: I would I would continue with making motions go

[3:36:53] Voice 5: ahead okay

[3:36:55] Voice 16: um I would move that the Galliano

[3:36:57] Voice 16: Island local trust committee request staff to prepare a draft bylaw to amend the Galliano

[3:37:01] Voice 16: Island official community plan bylaw number 108 1995 to include critical aquifer recharge

[3:37:07] Voice 16: development permit area guidelines map updates and minor updates to relevant sections as identified

[3:37:13] Voice 16: in the March 7th 2022 staff report.

[3:37:17] Voice 4: It's been moved and seconded discussion between the trustees.

[3:37:22] Voice 16: I'm really excited to move forward on groundwater protection as this has been a long time concern

[3:37:27] Voice 16: and the current recharge level of 140 meters,

[3:37:31] Voice 16: I think it is, is well above the proven recharge areas.

[3:37:35] Voice 16: So I'm happy to address it.

[3:37:40] Voice 4: And can I just ask a question?

[3:37:42] Voice 4: I know you're doing the same project on North Pender

[3:37:45] Voice 4: or a similar one.

[3:37:46] Voice 4: And so I'm guessing the drafting is being shared

[3:37:50] Voice 4: between the two.

[3:37:51] Voice 4: This isn't sort of, this isn't just us taking up

[3:37:54] Voice 4: all your time doing this.

[3:37:55] Voice 4: So there's a certain amount of efficiency in doing these.

[3:37:57] Voice 4: yeah

[3:37:57] Voice 9: yeah that's why i suggested that um trustees move forward with the resolutions um north pender

[3:38:03] Voice 9: did last um uh their last meeting and so there is an efficiency that we made there for sure

[3:38:10] Voice 18: yes

[3:38:11] Voice 7: i i'll add to that although there i mean there are efficiencies on the drafting of the

[3:38:17] Voice 7: bylaw side um but the the way that recharge works on north pender and galliano is is inherently

[3:38:25] Voice 7: different and on Galliano are like our first we were planning on providing

[3:38:32] Voice 7: multiple options to the LTC but for right now we really have what staff

[3:38:36] Voice 7: consider is the most favorable option and that's look looking at a at a CAD

[3:38:43] Voice 7: based approach so so the the development permit area map will be will look

[3:38:51] Voice 7: look similar to the CAD with properties inside the DPA

[3:38:55] Voice 7: and properties outside of the DPA,

[3:38:57] Voice 7: rather than little circles everywhere

[3:38:59] Voice 7: that would be very difficult for someone to survey.

[3:39:02] Voice 7: So properties are either in or out of the DPA

[3:39:05] Voice 7: as it sits

[3:39:06] Voice 7: now, yeah.

[3:39:08] Voice 4: Okay, so that's been moved and seconded.

[3:39:10] Voice 4: Is there any, sorry to interrupt again,

[3:39:12] Voice 4: but is there any other further conversation?

[3:39:15] Voice 4: If not, I'll call the vote.

[3:39:16] Voice 4: All in favor?

[3:39:17] Voice 4: So that passes unanimously.

[3:39:19] Voice 4: keep going trustee Rockefeller all

[3:39:22] Voice 16: right that the move that the Galiano Island

[3:39:27] Voice 16: local trust committee requests staff to prepare a draft bylaw to amend the line

[3:39:31] Voice 16: use bylaw to include updates to definitions addition of cistern

[3:39:35] Voice 16: requirements for all new builds and updates to subdivision regulations

[3:39:38] Voice 16: related to potable water okay

[3:39:42] Voice 4: there's a seconder that's been moved and second is

[3:39:44] Voice 4: there any further discussion related to that I'll call the vote all in favor

[3:39:51] Voice 4: okay and go ahead um

[3:39:54] Voice 16: i'll move that the gallon on local trust committee requests staff to identify

[3:39:57] Voice 16: options for changes to zoning regulations informed by gw solutions 2021 groundwater

[3:40:03] Voice 16: availability assessment data okay

[3:40:06] Voice 4: insect moved and seconded uh any further discussion

[3:40:10] Voice 4: yes yeah i

[3:40:12] Voice 9: just wanted to point out that we are um we are sort of a little bit uh a step ahead of um

[3:40:18] Voice 9: north pender at this point in time so when we do come back with um zoning proposals related

[3:40:26] Voice 9: to zoning changes we're able to zoom in a little bit um specifically to those areas of particular

[3:40:32] Voice 9: um that are particularly critical um we've done some uh subdivision um mapping potential mapping

[3:40:41] Voice 9: and uh and so um we will we'll have we'll be able to have a much more wholesome conversation

[3:40:46] Voice 9: at the next meeting

[3:40:48] Voice 4: okay super okay so the way it can look yeah planner sorry william go ahead

[3:40:54] Voice 4: thank

[3:40:55] Voice 7: you i'm sorry if i'm out of order here but just to comment on on recommendation two i know

[3:41:02] Voice 7: it's been passed but

[3:41:02] Voice 21: just

[3:41:04] Voice 7: to open up that discussion is that the regulations to potable

[3:41:07] Voice 7: water, going back to harmonizing with the province, largely that regulation will be

[3:41:16] Voice 7: informed by the work that we have done on Salt Spring Island, where we have been working

[3:41:21] Voice 7: on proof of potable water subdivision regulations for, oh man, it's almost been two and a half

[3:41:27] Voice 7: years where we have had detailed back and forth discussions with the province, even

[3:41:33] Voice 7: even before that bylaw goes to first reading.

[3:41:36] Voice 7: It actually hasn't gone to first reading yet.

[3:41:38] Voice 7: So again, that's our attempt to coordinate

[3:41:44] Voice 7: and collaborate with the province.

[3:41:45] Voice 7: So I just wanted to add that, thanks, Chair.

[3:41:50] Voice 4: We have a motion moved and seconded.

[3:41:53] Voice 4: Is there any further discussion related

[3:41:54] Voice 4: to that third motion?

[3:41:55] Voice 4: If not, I'll call the vote, all in favor.

[3:41:58] Voice 4: So that passes unanimously.

[3:42:00] Voice 4: I have one other question is,

[3:42:04] Voice 4: Do I understand the report correctly that, quote unquote, drastic is the saltwater intrusion mapping?

[3:42:13] Voice 4: No, I completely, and what an acronym, what a terrible, it just scares you.

[3:42:19] Voice 7: So good.

[3:42:20] Voice 7: You look at

[3:42:21] Voice 4: it and you just, it just scares the bejesus out of you.

[3:42:25] Voice 4: So

[3:42:25] Voice 7: I think that what can be utilized by Trust Council is my analysis of all the vulnerability mapping that we have for groundwater.

[3:42:35] Voice 7: But drastic is the intrinsic vulnerability of the aquifer.

[3:42:39] Voice 7: So it looks at the intrinsic properties of the land with its vulnerability to surface contamination or septic.

[3:42:48] Voice 7: So it has been used on North Pender when they were looking at the cement plant.

[3:42:55] Voice 7: And it was on a highly vulnerable area of the drastic mapping.

[3:42:59] Voice 7: And actually that mapping was done for the province.

[3:43:03] Voice 7: And then there was some reanalysis done to look at fracture media,

[3:43:12] Voice 7: specifically for the Southern Gulf Islands.

[3:43:14] Voice 7: So it's a pretty good data set.

[3:43:17] Voice 7: And then the saltwater intrusion mapping is also vulnerability mapping,

[3:43:21] Voice 7: but it's a different product.

[3:43:22] Voice 4: I see.

[3:43:23] Voice 4: and and i noticed that it was the map from or the the saltwater intrusion was 2017 yeah i thought

[3:43:30] Voice 4: that that that had been i don't know what the right word is had been thought to be a bit

[3:43:36] Voice 4: unreliable am i wrong

[3:43:38] Voice 7: yeah no to to just add to the muddy waters here like that map that analysis

[3:43:45] Voice 7: was done by simon fraser university for the province and the province just undertook a

[3:43:50] Voice 7: saltwater intrusion project that was funded partially, not a significant amount by the

[3:44:00] Voice 7: Islands Trust. And I was on, I was the external on that project and it was to identify saltwater

[3:44:08] Voice 7: intrusion from Southern Gulf Islands to Haida Gwaii, which that project has been done. It's

[3:44:14] Voice 7: going to be released to the public. The report is already out there and the data is going out.

[3:44:18] Voice 7: um however after uh analysis of it it seems like it has underestimated saltwater intrusion

[3:44:26] Voice 7: in the gulf islands and so at this current time we're sticking with the 2017 data

[3:44:34] Voice 20: yep

[3:44:35] Voice 4: okay well that's um uh interesting it's

[3:44:42] Voice 7: science in motion well

[3:44:44] Voice 4: it is um i thought it

[3:44:46] Voice 4: had gone the other way so there you go under us anyway uh thank you um uh for that okay uh

[3:44:54] Voice 4: anything further related to this we're going to defer this to the april meeting yes uh planner

[3:44:59] Voice 4: chadwick um

[3:45:00] Voice 9: i i i'm just wondering can you see my screen i just wanted to show you that we we

[3:45:04] Voice 9: have had a lot of fun with mapping yes i know so um the yeah so anyways we've got uh some

[3:45:12] Voice 9: some interesting information to share.

[3:45:15] Voice 4: I spent some time last night or yesterday and last night

[3:45:20] Voice 4: going through all of these maps,

[3:45:21] Voice 4: trying to figure out what they all meant

[3:45:23] Voice 4: and where they all applied in it.

[3:45:26] Voice 4: I was looking forward to, and we'll look forward to

[3:45:28] Voice 4: asking you a series of questions in April about the maps

[3:45:33] Voice 4: because I didn't understand how they all integrated, so.

[3:45:37] Voice 7: Great, on that Chair Rogers,

[3:45:39] Voice 7: If there are preliminary questions, please, if you can, send them to me earlier so I can

[3:45:47] Voice 7: be prepared to answer them.

[3:45:50] Voice 7: I'm pretty good at answering them off the cuff, as you know, but it might be great.

[3:45:56] Voice 7: If I have a suite of questions, I can even provide it in a PowerPoint presentation to

[3:46:00] Voice 7: have a fulsome answer that then can be reflected on after.

[3:46:04] Voice 4: And it won't be just me.

[3:46:05] Voice 4: I know Trustee Rockefeller and Will of the General have questions as well.

[3:46:09] Voice 4: thank you thank you very much everyone uh and we'll see you in april you don't

[3:46:14] Voice 4: need a motion to bring it back you'll just bring it back

[3:46:16] Voice 4: in april um uh thanks that's 14.1 i'm going to

[3:46:23] Voice 4: suggest we just carry through because some of these

[3:46:26] Voice 4: items will be very short um the next item on the agenda is

[3:46:31] Voice 4: 14 sorry 15.1 which is our top priorities report

[3:46:36] Voice 4: report. Is there any changes to that from either of the trustees on any of our projects

[3:46:44] Voice 4: or top priorities? Not seeing any, we'll just accept that for information. We have the applications

[3:46:50] Voice 4: report then, which is a summary for anybody watching. This is at page 83 of the various

[3:46:56] Voice 4: applications that are currently active and open on Galliano Island. Are there any questions

[3:47:03] Voice 4: or comments regarding the status of any of those from trustees no okay then the next item is our

[3:47:13] Voice 4: expense reports here for transparency it's a page 89 in terms of our our trustee expenses etc for

[3:47:23] Voice 4: the year we're coming although this one appears to be the month ending December 2021 which surprises

[3:47:29] Voice 4: of me that's a little i think i've seen one more recently uh but you know what we haven't had a

[3:47:35] Voice 4: ltc meeting or not enough uh then we have uh standards sorry policies and standing resolutions

[3:47:41] Voice 4: anything related to that nothing yes trustee wolverine yes

[3:47:47] Voice 18: um we are writing a letter to

[3:47:51] Voice 18: the local first nations and i wondered if that has occurred annually oh

[3:47:57] Voice 4: the annual letter that's

[3:47:59] Voice 4: a good question uh i don't know i haven't seen it doesn't it doesn't go out under my signature

[3:48:05] Voice 4: and so i don't um unless they put it on without me reviewing it first which is fine but because

[3:48:13] Voice 4: i know we have a template that we send out i didn't know if there's do you know planner smith

[3:48:18] Voice 4: whether that's gone or what the plan is

[3:48:23] Voice 21: what's

[3:48:27] Voice 28: the question chair rogers it's

[3:48:29] Voice 4: about the and our

[3:48:30] Voice 4: standing resolution about the annual letter to the uh the local first nations um i

[3:48:36] Voice 28: assume that

[3:48:37] Voice 28: that hasn't been done

[3:48:39] Voice 4: okay um so i

[3:48:44] Voice 4: think it's supposed to i'm not sure when it goes out in the

[3:48:47] Voice 4: year i i know we've asked before go yes trustee wolverton what you were going to say

[3:48:53] Voice 18: no i was

[3:48:54] Voice 18: going to say i just i think we should uh prepare it to go out i can go out for the first uh first

[3:49:01] Voice 18: first of april fiscal year that's fine

[3:49:05] Voice 18: i'm

[3:49:06] Voice 4: not sure i'm not sure if the the senior policy

[3:49:09] Voice 4: advisor is involved in that uh she's um away for a few weeks so it may not my guess is it'll get

[3:49:19] Voice 4: addressed um with all the other local because i think every local trust committee at least all

[3:49:24] Voice 4: the ones i'm aware of a draft this have adopted this or some similar motion so so but let's let's

[3:49:32] Voice 4: uh maybe with planner smith you could inquire about it when uh the policy advisor is back

[3:49:38] Voice 4: thanks anything else in terms of the um standing resolutions nothing uh there's no conservancy

[3:49:49] Voice 4: report there's a letter here um which is interesting it didn't end up at our last on

[3:49:56] Voice 4: our last ltc which was a letter drafted after in december to rogers communications about the tower

[3:50:03] Voice 4: hour uh and i have to tell you i followed up i i sent the we sent the letter as you can see so

[3:50:10] Voice 4: it wasn't in our package but it's here now for transparency it's a public record and um and uh

[3:50:16] Voice 4: it was sent and i followed up in uh january because i never got a reply and i followed up

[3:50:23] Voice 4: after our february meeting and i asked him again for a reply and i received nothing back um so they

[3:50:30] Voice 4: They appear to be indicating to us, generally speaking, they don't think we have any input.

[3:50:36] Voice 4: I think they've gone ahead and put the equipment on the tower.

[3:50:41] Voice 4: So I think that was the indication that we got at the last LTC meeting, but I'm just

[3:50:48] Voice 4: not sure what else we can do at this stage.

[3:50:51] Voice 4: We have the shoreline protection model bylaw report, which is a fairly extensive briefing.

[3:50:58] Voice 4: I've been thinking about this and what to do with it because we're not going to add it to our, well, we could add it to our projects list for the, we're not going to get any traction around this term.

[3:51:08] Voice 4: I wondered if trustees had given any thought to perhaps referring it to the APC to ask whether they had any comments and ask them the question about when reviewing our OCP and land use bylaws,

[3:51:23] Voice 4: are there what parts of this report would they recommend that the LTC consider adopting

[3:51:28] Voice 4: because I know you already have a DP on on your shoreline not every island does but but it may

[3:51:35] Voice 4: be there's more here I don't know what that's the only thought that I had about this what do you

[3:51:39] Voice 4: think and there's nothing before the APC right now that I think you can think of yeah Christy

[3:51:44] Voice 4: Wolverton I

[3:51:45] Voice 18: think it would actually be a good idea I mean there are a couple things that

[3:51:49] Voice 18: that could potentially be sort of developed for the next term.

[3:51:59] Voice 18: I mean, for example, Galeano has one of the shortest setbacks

[3:52:05] Voice 18: from the natural boundary of the sea at seven and a half meters,

[3:52:11] Voice 18: where most of them are at 15.

[3:52:15] Voice 18: So that's something I think we could be addressing.

[3:52:19] Voice 18: we could also look at what Keats, the work that was done up in Keats, so they could review that.

[3:52:28] Voice 18: But also there's a suggestion of a formation of a community heritage commission,

[3:52:38] Voice 18: and I think that would be a good thing for them to examine and to look at how that might work.

[3:52:48] Voice 18: I mean it there's reference to it but I don't know that any of the islands has adopted anything like

[3:52:53] Voice 18: this um so you know again I mean they talk about a commission that would um you know be able to um

[3:53:06] Voice 18: know or or just in general increase awareness so there are other things I identify uh um

[3:53:14] Voice 18: you know, sites where there are remains or there are artifacts. But in general,

[3:53:25] Voice 18: I think measures, they talk about measures to increase the awareness and appreciation of the

[3:53:30] Voice 18: island's cultural heritage. And I think that could be of great value. We have a lot of new people on

[3:53:38] Voice 18: the island and i think that um in particular uh the first nations heritage is probably not

[3:53:47] Voice 18: understood by a lot of people and and the settlements uh that were here on the island

[3:53:55] Voice 18: um anyway so i i think your idea of referring it there might actually uh be something good for them

[3:54:01] Voice 18: to dive into is that a motion i think so

[3:54:09] Voice 16: i don't

[3:54:10] Voice 18: know it's a long sentence i'm just either than i

[3:54:13] Voice 18: will i wanted to wait to hear what you had to say if you were interested in that too uh what just

[3:54:20] Voice 16: forwarding it to the apc well

[3:54:22] Voice 4: and you want to i want to caution you i've learned this from rpm

[3:54:26] Voice 4: and uh kojima is it's better to ask questions so with specific asks yeah so so what my my thinking

[3:54:36] Voice 4: as i was thinking about this is if we sent it to the apc and asked them uh to to review the

[3:54:43] Voice 4: recommendations in the context of the galliano ocp and then come back with um suggested action steps

[3:54:53] Voice 4: something like that would

[3:54:58] Voice 16: that and capture what you were uh saying trustee wolferton i mean i

[3:55:03] Voice 18: think so i mean i i think that the report is a little disjointed and so um it will take them a

[3:55:09] Voice 18: while to pull out the things that that might be um i mean we already we have quite a lot already in

[3:55:18] Voice 18: our in our uh ocp and land use bylaws but i think there's more that could be strengthened so yes

[3:55:25] Voice 4: other than that you're just going to receive it you could put it on the projects list but i just

[3:55:31] Voice 4: i just wondered whether there was some appetite to do that at this stage just send it off to you

[3:55:36] Voice 4: if you don't want to that's fine too no

[3:55:38] Voice 16: i think it's a good idea

[3:55:39] Voice 18: i

[3:55:40] Voice 16: also think it's a good idea

[3:55:42] Voice 16: i'm just not sure how to phrase the the question like you say i think it's a good idea to um

[3:55:47] Voice 16: phrase questions so we get a good response from the apc

[3:55:50] Voice 4: let's go to the expert in this and ask

[3:55:52] Voice 4: carly what she got from our various uh chatting about it carly did you

[3:55:58] Voice 4: write a draft emotion

[3:56:00] Voice 15: yeah i think i got something i said that the galliano island local trust committee asked

[3:56:04] Voice 15: the apc to review the recommendations in the shoreline protection model bylaw report

[3:56:09] Voice 15: in the context of the galliano ocp and bring suggested actions back to the ltc

[3:56:14] Voice 15: does

[3:56:17] Voice 4: that work for you guys that

[3:56:18] Voice 16: sounds great okay

[3:56:20] Voice 4: so okay okay

[3:56:23] Voice 16: that's

[3:56:24] Voice 4: been moved and seconded

[3:56:25] Voice 4: any further discussion related to this and we'll just ask uh we'll be asking our admin staff to

[3:56:31] Voice 4: refer it off to the apc uh which they do and um that's the next item so i'll call the vote all in

[3:56:37] Voice 4: favor and that actually takes us to our next um item on our agenda which is apc vacancies and i

[3:56:45] Voice 4: I think I recall that we appointed five in February,

[3:56:49] Voice 4: but there were still, is it two vacancies?

[3:56:52] Voice 18: That's correct.

[3:56:53] Voice 4: And did you ask for this to be put on here?

[3:56:55] Voice 18: Yeah, because I know that there were some people interested.

[3:56:58] Voice 18: And so I'm wondering if we could ask people to submit their interest to the trust

[3:57:08] Voice 18: and then have a look at them because it would be nice to have the vacancies filled.

[3:57:17] Voice 4: i mean normally you advertise and i think you did advertise yes so do you just want to

[3:57:25] Voice 4: make it known that we're open to further applications is that basically what you're

[3:57:30] Voice 4: doing or do you want to advertise again

[3:57:32] Voice 18: well we could put it in the trustee report in the active

[3:57:37] Voice 18: page um that's one one avenue we can put it out on social media but i mean i think our official

[3:57:44] Voice 18: official sort of uh route is the active page active

[3:57:50] Voice 4: page from you two or from active page

[3:57:53] Voice 4: from the trust itself yeah trustee rockefeller um

[3:57:57] Voice 16: in just in concern for public money i'm happy

[3:58:01] Voice 16: to include it in the trustee update because we're already paying for the full page ad rather than

[3:58:05] Voice 16: create a new ad that didn't get any uptake in the first place and

[3:58:08] Voice 4: so and and where do applications

[3:58:10] Voice 4: go brad i just remind me do they go to jazz or do you know i

[3:58:17] Voice 28: think they go

[3:58:18] Voice 4: to jazz or do they go

[3:58:19] Voice 4: yeah so i'll

[3:58:22] Voice 16: confirm that and include it in the in the detail i'll i'll message uh planter smith

[3:58:28] Voice 16: independently okay

[3:58:30] Voice 4: so if you guys can just manage that and invite more people to because it'd be

[3:58:34] Voice 4: nice to fill out the the compliment and because they'll now have to meet because we've referred

[3:58:40] Voice 4: something to them

[3:58:41] Voice 28: it's definitely through jazz that work okay

[3:58:44] Voice 4: thanks okay anything further

[3:58:48] Voice 4: related to that uh we had a the next thing was 16.4 i was new to the agenda there was a suggestion

[3:58:54] Voice 4: or request from the planner that we move the may 2nd meeting to may the 9th um i i guess that that

[3:59:04] Voice 4: That would probably mean rebooking the hall because I'm guessing the hall is booked.

[3:59:11] Voice 4: And that's because of the, I forget who was away, but it doesn't matter.

[3:59:17] Voice 4: You and Planner Chadwick, I gather.

[3:59:20] Voice 4: Is that right, Planner Smith?

[3:59:21] Voice 28: Correct.

[3:59:22] Voice 28: RPM Kojima could fill in for me if you do want to just carry forth on the second.

[3:59:27] Voice 28: I'm not sure what the agenda will look like then, of course.

[3:59:30] Voice 28: um

[3:59:31] Voice 4: the only one of the concert well it's still these four weeks between the ninth and the sixth

[3:59:36] Voice 4: which is a bit of a what's pretty normal so that there is an extra week in may

[3:59:42] Voice 4: um so it wouldn't create so trustees does anybody have any considerations about that

[3:59:50] Voice 18: um i'm sorry i'll put my i'm supposed to be out of town oh

[3:59:57] Voice 28: Wow.

[4:00:00] Voice 28: Don't we just keep it on the second and we'll make sure we have planning

[4:00:03] Voice 28: staff to cover it.

[4:00:04] Voice 28: It's probably the easiest.

[4:00:06] Voice 18: Sorry about that.

[4:00:08] Voice 28: It's just, it's just, I won't be there.

[4:00:11] Voice 18: We'll miss you.

[4:00:12] Voice 4: Yes, we will.

[4:00:13] Voice 28: I will miss you from Tofino.

[4:00:16] Voice 28: But not a lot.

[4:00:18] Voice 4: Okay.

[4:00:20] Voice 4: I don't know what the next thing on the agenda was 16.5,

[4:00:24] Voice 4: which is the governance review report.

[4:00:26] Voice 4: I'm not quite sure what it is.

[4:00:28] Voice 4: uh we wanted to talk about this this is um uh trustee wolverton you put it on there's a

[4:00:36] Voice 4: a you know because we still have to go through any commentary at the end of the town in the second

[4:00:42] Voice 4: town hall uh we're going

[4:00:44] Voice 4: to be talking about that tomorrow afternoon at trust council so

[4:00:50] Voice 18: right um i guess uh well maybe as you it'll it'll come up tomorrow um i mean i think they

[4:00:58] Voice 18: I think there's some some interesting suggestions um and I think that the report though is also

[4:01:07] Voice 18: pretty disjointed I mean I I was surprised um at that I expected something a little

[4:01:14] Voice 18: a little more coherent but um anyway um I think I think one of one of the suggestions that I

[4:01:25] Voice 18: And if we expanded on it that I think would be good would be when new trustees are elected. Well, one is the sort of workshop for candidates, but secondly, when new trustees are elected.

[4:01:41] Voice 18: I think one thing that could happen is there could be like a full day prior to, you know, prior to any election of the chair and executive, but a full day where trustees could talk about their interests, their values, their island.

[4:02:08] Voice 18: island you know because i don't i mean we didn't get a lot of time to do that at the beginning of

[4:02:15] Voice 18: the term and then and then we had covid so we we kind of lost out on a lot of really um beginning

[4:02:24] Voice 18: to understand what people where people uh what their interests are what their uh strengths are

[4:02:32] Voice 18: all those kinds of things so anyway that's all i need to say today trustee

[4:02:41] Voice 5: rockefeller do you want

[4:02:42] Voice 5: to share any thoughts about the governance review uh

[4:02:45] Voice 16: no no comment today thank you

[4:02:48] Voice 4: okay well we're expecting more than that tomorrow at the at the trust council it's uh

[4:02:54] Voice 4: um i don't know it's it's uh it's been a long and challenging road to the report

[4:03:04] Voice 4: and um not without some controversy obviously um i don't know it's it identified some issues

[4:03:14] Voice 4: in my mind but i i thought it was a bit late on solutions i've said here's the problem fix it

[4:03:21] Voice 4: um and that's a bit you know that's going to be challenging so i think we're going to have to

[4:03:27] Voice 4: figure out a another process to figure out what to how to identify the issues that it raises

[4:03:35] Voice 18: in what priority I mean it's

[4:03:39] Voice 4: exactly it's

[4:03:40] Voice 18: kind of all over the map um I mean

[4:03:44] Voice 18: um there's one other thing I was going to say it's gone out of my head um

[4:03:52] Voice 21: sorry one moment

[4:03:59] Voice 18: um well I know what I was going to say and I mean

[4:04:02] Voice 18: I was disappointed that they identified

[4:04:05] Voice 18: identified Galliano as an island that hadn't updated its OCP since 1995. And so I, you know,

[4:04:13] Voice 18: I thought, well, that's not correct. And, and then I tried to get it corrected. And when the report

[4:04:20] Voice 18: came out, but it just that that wasn't possible. So I think, you know, it's not

[4:04:30] Voice 4: the only error that

[4:04:31] Voice 4: was in there. There were more.

[4:04:32] Voice 18: Yeah, it's a little bit sloppy on that stuff. So that that

[4:04:35] Voice 18: that, that concerns me.

[4:04:37] Voice 4: Yeah. I mean, and there are some things about in the rhetoric that are

[4:04:42] Voice 4: concerning as well, that, that not necessarily the specifics, but the rhetoric, it identifies a

[4:04:48] Voice 4: level of, uh, dissatisfaction, I guess, um, with a number of some people in terms of how they

[4:04:57] Voice 4: view our, our, the trust. Uh, we heard some of it in town hall today that people feel like

[4:05:04] Voice 4: whatever they're not they don't have trust in the trust or they're feeling disconnected but

[4:05:08] Voice 4: from i mean i have to say it's just come crashing home to me in the last year that they're coming

[4:05:15] Voice 4: to us with from two entirely different perspectives um

[4:05:21] Voice 13: uh

[4:05:22] Voice 4: and the the folk that just

[4:05:26] Voice 4: think we're an inefficient bureaucratic unnecessary organization to those that

[4:05:31] Voice 4: on the other side who think we don't do nearly enough to protect the environment

[4:05:35] Voice 21: um

[4:05:36] Voice 4: i mean i'm being generic uh but that but that's the problem is we're sort of caught in

[4:05:42] Voice 4: a squeeze of two entirely different perspectives of what it is and

[4:05:47] Voice 4: that and that is reflected in

[4:05:49] Voice 4: the some of the commentary about it and and of course that was reflected but i i was a little

[4:05:54] Voice 4: disappointed in some of the mistakes for example there was a fairly prominent and i'll say this

[4:06:00] Voice 4: publicly because i'll say it tomorrow fairly prominent uh uh and and was was relied on to

[4:06:08] Voice 4: indicate that our our structure was was uh inappropriate that the financial planning

[4:06:13] Voice 4: committee was dominated by the executive committee but they got their facts all wrong

[4:06:17] Voice 4: um executive is the minority on the financial planning committee and we specifically step away

[4:06:24] Voice 4: from the from the audit committee we do not sit on the audit committee yet this was this was raised

[4:06:30] Voice 4: as a an example of how our committee structure was dysfunctional and how the executive was

[4:06:36] Voice 19: um

[4:06:37] Voice 4: and and it was wrong yeah um

[4:06:40] Voice 4: and it was so it was a bit disappointing

[4:06:43] Voice 4: there

[4:06:45] Voice 18: were other things about like it says processes are obscure and overly bureaucratic but

[4:06:52] Voice 18: it it doesn't

[4:06:53] Voice 4: specify yeah

[4:06:55] Voice 18: like what is the evidence of that or what are they what's what

[4:06:59] Voice 18: are they referring to so there were quite a number of things like that through the report

[4:07:04] Voice 18: um i'm but

[4:07:06] Voice 4: but there are some good suggestions and it does identify

[4:07:09] Voice 4: some themes about things that

[4:07:11] Voice 4: that the trust should try and address i

[4:07:15] Voice 18: i agree i agree i'm i i just um

[4:07:19] Voice 18: um uh because i come from a like an editing background you know family i mean to me

[4:07:29] Voice 18: like format and how things are structured and is very important okay

[4:07:34] Voice 4: anything further on that

[4:07:36] Voice 4: because if not i'm going to say that we're finished that discussion and and indicate that

[4:07:42] Voice 4: our next regular meeting and i'm very hopeful that it's on april and on april the fourth will

[4:07:46] Voice 4: be actually be in the community south sorry galliano south community hall on april the 4th

[4:07:52] Voice 4: uh we'll we'll have to see how things unfold it's just it's just a reality we don't know

[4:08:00] Voice 4: uh and so with that at the end i'm going to open up the second and ask people again to be brief i

[4:08:07] Voice 4: know that trustee rockefeller has to go to work and i have to catch a ferry because i'm going

[4:08:11] Voice 4: I keep getting a late ferry over to Nanaimo for Trust Council, but I'll open the, first of all,

[4:08:22] Voice 4: I'll subdivide this. Does anybody wish to speak about anything that doesn't involve the two

[4:08:29] Voice 4: affordable housing projects?

[4:08:37] Voice 4: Okay, Carmita and then Art Moses. Does not involve, oh yes, that's

[4:08:42] Voice 4: That's fine, yes.

[4:08:42] Voice 4: Okay, Carmita, go ahead.

[4:08:58] Voice 23: Involve the two, the two trustees can be there,

[4:09:01] Voice 23: like I did today.

[4:09:03] Voice 23: When I spoke about the deep subsidy

[4:09:07] Voice 23: and I spoke about level of poverty,

[4:09:12] Voice 23: after listening one of the application,

[4:09:15] Voice 23: I was so surprised that people were ashamed

[4:09:20] Voice 23: to use the word poor.

[4:09:22] Voice 23: I am grateful to you, Dan Rocher, that you brought my commentary, but it's like everybody was embarrassed about to say poor, and there are poor people on Galeano, like there are poor people everywhere, and it's nothing to be ashamed to be poor.

[4:09:45] Voice 23: I can give you very quickly an example.

[4:09:48] Voice 23: If you are an immigrant and you arrive here when you are older,

[4:09:53] Voice 23: your old pension is only a proportion of somebody who was born in Canada.

[4:10:00] Voice 23: And if you are a woman and you look after your children

[4:10:03] Voice 23: and you didn't begin working until you are older,

[4:10:08] Voice 23: you have no almost Canadian pension.

[4:10:10] Voice 23: So you, what I ask you is to take an action in this project, not to have 100% of the subsidized

[4:10:22] Voice 23: units, but to have a proportion and to be sure they have to tell you the number, not

[4:10:30] Voice 23: just vague ideas.

[4:10:32] Voice 23: Today, listening to the two consultants was very confusing.

[4:10:36] Voice 23: It was very difficult to know really what was happening.

[4:10:41] Voice 23: I think you should not accept vague things.

[4:10:48] Voice 23: You should know, okay, how many units.

[4:10:52] Voice 23: It doesn't have

[4:10:53] Voice 23: to be 100.

[4:10:55] Voice 23: But when poverty exists, you have to take some action.

[4:11:01] Voice 23: You can do it.

[4:11:03] Voice 23: it okay because these are

[4:11:04] Voice 23: going to be affordable because i noticed that chair roger for you it's

[4:11:09] Voice 23: important that legally the ocp is covered trustee rockefeller she's more uh for her is more important

[4:11:21] Voice 23: to be sure that this is affordability for the people on galiano and i think that's the most

[4:11:27] Voice 23: important. Not just if it's legally, it could be accepted for the OCP. It's the

[4:11:33] Voice 23: affordability for the people on the island. Okay. Well, that's all.

[4:11:39] Voice 4: Thanks, Carmita.

[4:11:40] Voice 4: Mr. Moses. Again, I ask that everyone try and be brief.

[4:11:47] Voice 21: I'm sorry. No, we'll move you

[4:11:50] Voice 21: back. Thank you, Carmita. Getting Mr. Moses moved over. Go ahead. I think you should

[4:12:00] Voice 21: you should be able to unmute yourself.

[4:12:01] Voice 21: Thank

[4:12:09] Voice 26: you, Mr. Chair and trustees.

[4:12:18] Voice 26: I just wanted to express appreciation to Chair Rogers

[4:12:26] Voice 26: for appearing to listen to what was said

[4:12:30] Voice 26: during the town hall and for attempting to craft a motion

[4:12:38] Voice 26: that reflected some of that.

[4:12:42] Voice 26: I was, I'll be interested to re-listen

[4:12:46] Voice 26: to Freshwater Specialist Sholba's intervention

[4:12:54] Voice 26: to try and figure out exactly what he was saying.

[4:13:02] Voice 26: But I think he did say at one point

[4:13:06] Voice 26: that if the water use for visitors was transferred across the whole,

[4:13:13] Voice 26: all types of water use was transferred across all uses of water across the retreat center, that

[4:13:27] Voice 26: that the water use in the double digits per day per person

[4:13:36] Voice 26: would be low, would indeed be low.

[4:13:41] Voice 26: I'm appreciative of the chair for listening

[4:13:45] Voice 26: because and for thinking about the neighborhood,

[4:13:49] Voice 26: for considering the neighborhood

[4:13:51] Voice 26: in looking at various aspects of this proposal.

[4:13:55] Voice 26: I never thought that the proposal for that their request for six special events a year, rather than one special event a year from an already large number of 35 as a day use limit, which they would say, well, we'll never reach 35.

[4:14:14] Voice 26: but yeah we want six times a year i never thought that would uh get the time of day from trustees

[4:14:21] Voice 26: but apparently uh our local trustees are just fine with it and that's shocking quite frankly

[4:14:30] Voice 26: that's that was really quite disturbing to see how quickly they like sort of moved into line with

[4:14:36] Voice 26: what what uh crystal mountain people who are you know well known in the community and i guess they

[4:14:43] Voice 26: to have a lot of clout in this community

[4:14:45] Voice 26: because the proposal is not something that's contemplated

[4:14:50] Voice 26: in the official community plan

[4:14:51] Voice 26: and yet some trustees are willing to go along with it.

[4:14:55] Voice 26: It's really quite, that was really quite upsetting.

[4:14:58] Voice 26: The only other comment I would make is that

[4:15:03] Voice 26: the LTC has ignored one aspect of what was pointed out

[4:15:10] Voice 26: to you which is that and there might be an explanation for this but in October of 2020

[4:15:15] Voice 26: meeting a motion was passed requiring that the water management plan contain a water

[4:15:23] Voice 26: catchment system for potable water to back up the water system the groundwater system

[4:15:30] Voice 26: and nowhere in the water management plan is there a water catchment for potable water

[4:15:36] Voice 26: and i don't know why that is and i don't know uh why uh how it is that it's got to this point

[4:15:44] Voice 26: without that motion from october of of 2020 by the trustees uh being respected yeah fair enough

[4:15:51] Voice 4: um you're right that was in your um commentary today and the commentary written commentary and

[4:15:58] Voice 4: we didn't talk about it uh i think just the i'll just call it the fire hose of things that we were

[4:16:05] Voice 4: were dealing with it it got overlooked but if there's a motion to that effect and you say there

[4:16:10] Voice 4: is i'll accept that i'll uh i'll ask the planner to be mindful of that motion and in reviewing the

[4:16:18] Voice 4: water management plan so and i'm sure he will be because that's a motion of local trust committee

[4:16:23] Voice 4: but you're right we didn't talk about it today thanks for that okay thank you take care uh is

[4:16:29] Voice 4: there anybody i don't see any other hands up on janet of uh oh yeah jennifer are you just are you

[4:16:36] Voice 4: speaking on giggers or are you speaking on something else could

[4:16:49] Voice 21: we move jennifer over and

[4:16:50] Voice 21: if she's speaking on giggers i'll ask jane to

[4:16:53] Voice 4: accuse her though i'm sorry i i think it must

[4:16:59] Voice 4: be late in the day i'm reverting to first name basis i'm sorry about that that's

[4:17:02] Voice 10: okay i don't

[4:17:03] Voice 10: mind at all um i i just thought maybe i'll make my comments more generic just in the interests of

[4:17:08] Voice 10: of your time and the lateness of the day.

[4:17:11] Voice 10: So maybe I'll just say that like chair Rogers,

[4:17:15] Voice 10: I had a lot of questions about the groundwater

[4:17:18] Voice 10: sustainability report and was hoping to better understand

[4:17:22] Voice 10: the details and implications today,

[4:17:24] Voice 10: but I will look forward to more information next month.

[4:17:28] Voice 10: I was just very struck by the groundwater vulnerability

[4:17:32] Voice 10: analysis maps that appeared to indicate certain areas

[4:17:36] Voice 10: like the area near me, the aquifer, Cook Cove Aquifer, I guess it's specifically referred to,

[4:17:44] Voice 10: as an area of high vulnerability in terms of the likelihood of contamination and septic impacts

[4:17:50] Voice 10: and saltwater intrusion. And I've been talking to a lot of people on the island about saltwater

[4:17:59] Voice 10: I'm quite shocked about how common it actually is. And I was then interested to hear Mr. Shulba say that saltwater intrusion has actually been underestimated.

[4:18:13] Voice 10: so um i i think that that that worry is a very valid concern for those of us who are very close

[4:18:23] Voice 10: to the shoreline and um for example our property is about 200 meters from the shoreline we don't

[4:18:31] Voice 10: have a waterfront property there is a road in front but um obviously the saltwater intrusion

[4:18:38] Voice 10: has has no interest in those kind of boundaries and we're only about 22 meters above the sea level

[4:18:45] Voice 10: and so i think this is a big topic that is um under discussed and under recognized in our

[4:18:56] Voice 10: community and i understand why people perhaps don't want to admit that that has occurred

[4:19:02] Voice 10: heard in in terms of their wells but so I'll just in closing I guess say I really look forward to

[4:19:11] Voice 10: understanding the maps in the report better and I hope that this will really inform all of us

[4:19:18] Voice 10: you know enable

[4:19:20] Voice 10: all of us to better understand the risks that do exist to our our fresh water

[4:19:27] Voice 10: resources and aid you in your decision-making processes. So thank you.

[4:19:32] Voice 4: Thank you. Ms. Fournier, are you speaking like, excuse me, you're speaking generally or

[4:19:45] Voice 4: about, not about the affordable housing projects? I

[4:20:09] Voice 21: see you, I see,

[4:20:10] Voice 4: there, there

[4:20:12] Voice 4: you're unmuted now, go ahead.

[4:20:15] Voice 8: Oh, I said I am not speaking to either affordable

[4:20:17] Voice 8: housing project okay

[4:20:18] Voice 4: that's fine I didn't hear you you were muted until the

[4:20:21] Voice 4: second go ahead um

[4:20:23] Voice 8: I guess the comments exchanged by neighbors during this

[4:20:27] Voice 8: meeting are something that I would hope the two trustees take under advisement

[4:20:32] Voice 8: there is a real sense of shock that the neighbors concerns have been treated so

[4:20:38] Voice 8: lightly we have the upper hooked lot configuration which Crystal Mountain has

[4:20:44] Voice 8: has not even done a perk test or a potable water test yet we are prepared to take um to lowball the

[4:20:53] Voice 8: water figures although I appreciate further investigation will be done on this and the

[4:20:58] Voice 8: trustees have not addressed the issue of enforcement at all um I mean the neighborhood may receive

[4:21:05] Voice 8: notification that there are six days where a hundred people are going to gather on the

[4:21:10] Voice 8: crystal mountain land and what do we do then do we call jane do we call tahira um i am absolutely

[4:21:17] Voice 8: certain that neither of them would want uh on their small access road this these numbers of

[4:21:23] Voice 8: people going through a rural residential neighborhood um i think it is time that

[4:21:28] Voice 8: the trustees reached out to the neighborhood um we're not a group of rabble rousers we're

[4:21:34] Voice 8: former trustees, physicians, a worldwide known ecologist and physicist. We are shocked you would

[4:21:43] Voice 8: ignore the fact that the Thorsteinsons, which have a provincial water license and have had for 52

[4:21:50] Voice 8: years, are no longer able to use or to find potable water from Spotlight Creek catchment area

[4:21:56] Voice 8: because of the six outhouses upstream that have operated in intensive retreats for 20 years.

[4:22:04] Voice 8: i see chair rogers rolling his eyes well no

[4:22:06] Voice 4: i wasn't rolling my eyes and i i wish people

[4:22:09] Voice 4: wouldn't interpret for that i was i was going we don't know that i've heard that alleged and

[4:22:15] Voice 4: we don't know that that's all i wasn't rolling my eyes though please don't accuse me of that

[4:22:19] Voice 4: i was just

[4:22:20] Voice 8: i was just

[4:22:21] Voice 4: making a thoughtful expression as to whether i agreed with you or not

[4:22:25] Voice 8: okay i think that the trustees should be doing that kind of research they should be determining

[4:22:31] Voice 8: how and when the thirst instance water was contaminated. The need for

[4:22:37] Voice 8: remediation has not been addressed at all from the buried trash pit pits or

[4:22:42] Voice 8: from 20 years of operating outhouses. Perhaps the trustees are too close

[4:22:49] Voice 8: through family and personal relationships. Okay

[4:22:53] Voice 4: I've asked you before

[4:22:54] Voice 4: not to make this personal and you continue to do that. I

[4:22:57] Voice 8: would really like

[4:22:59] Voice 8: not to make it personal is that the neighbors would like the same

[4:23:03] Voice 8: consideration so I would like to know if trustees Rockefeller and Wolverton would

[4:23:08] Voice 8: meet with the neighbors to hear our concerns so that we can understand what

[4:23:13] Voice 8: you actually think because you never address them you don't respond to

[4:23:17] Voice 8: letters the Thorstenson family has yet to receive a call from either of you

[4:23:21] Voice 8: what is going on why the silence well

[4:23:27] Voice 18: I would say she's in that we have met with

[4:23:30] Voice 18: with quite a number of the neighbors.

[4:23:33] Voice 8: Individually only and the remarks that we are given.

[4:23:38] Voice 16: We can only meet individually because we're a quorum.

[4:23:41] Voice 16: So just so you know, we have to meet as individuals

[4:23:45] Voice 16: unless we have a minute taker.

[4:23:48] Voice 8: That could be arranged, I mean.

[4:23:51] Voice 4: No, but then it'd have to be in a formal meeting

[4:23:53] Voice 4: of the LTC and you'd have

[4:23:54] Voice 8: to have a minute taker

[4:23:55] Voice 8: and

[4:23:55] Voice 4: notice and it's a public meeting at that point.

[4:23:58] Voice 8: I suggest that each of the trustees meet separately then

[4:24:01] Voice 8: with the neighbors to hear our concerns, because as you heard, you know,

[4:24:05] Voice 8: an ecologist of worldwide stature say never has a group of people felt so

[4:24:11] Voice 8: ignored.

[4:24:12] Voice 8: Well,

[4:24:13] Voice 4: she didn't say that. She said she felt ignored, but I don't think she,

[4:24:16] Voice 4: please let's not use hyperbole.

[4:24:18] Voice 8: I agree.

[4:24:19] Voice 8: Her

[4:24:19] Voice 4: hyperbole was with her. She didn't say never has such a group of people.

[4:24:23] Voice 4: She said she

[4:24:24] Voice 4: felt ignored. And I acknowledged that.

[4:24:26] Voice 4: And I talked to her about it.

[4:24:28] Voice 8: You acknowledged it.

[4:24:29] Voice 8: and I've

[4:24:29] Voice 4: talked I've met with her I've met with with art I've met with other people from that area

[4:24:35] Voice 4: and I know the other trustees have as well but that doesn't mean we won't meet again

[4:24:38] Voice 4: um

[4:24:39] Voice 16: and just as a note I'm I have responded to the briefs I was sent and I asked I sent it to about

[4:24:46] Voice 16: it was about a two and a half page response um and I sent it to I believe four of the people

[4:24:52] Voice 16: who emailed it to me and I asked them to share it with all the people that were concerned and

[4:24:57] Voice 16: And I'm happy to forward it again to those who didn't receive it.

[4:25:00] Voice 16: And I also have met with about six people who have neighbors and I'm open to

[4:25:05] Voice 16: any other meetings I'm available almost anytime I'll make time for anybody.

[4:25:09] Voice 16: And my, all my contact information is in the active page.

[4:25:13] Voice 8: Thank you for that Tahira, but not just meeting, but listening. I mean,

[4:25:17] Voice 8: when we met with you, we were heard,

[4:25:19] Voice 8: we heard from you that you couldn't even stop an affordable housing complex on

[4:25:23] Voice 8: your doorstep is what you said to us and you also oh

[4:25:27] Voice 16: oh no point of order i am point of order i

[4:25:31] Voice 16: absolutely never said anything of the sort and i actually refuse to be in a meeting with this with

[4:25:38] Voice 16: this commentary because people will not forget what suzanne fournier just said and it in fact

[4:25:43] Voice 16: is not true so i respectfully will believe or she can be removed from the panel yeah

[4:25:49] Voice 4: i think that

[4:25:49] Voice 4: We've crossed the line here, Suzanne, Ms. Fournier.

[4:25:53] Voice 4: In

[4:25:53] Voice 16: what respect?

[4:25:55] Voice 20: Well,

[4:25:56] Voice 4: I think it's really important that we have a conversation

[4:26:01] Voice 4: that you not sort of make accusations like that.

[4:26:05] Voice 4: And I've asked you not to personalize it.

[4:26:08] Voice 4: And you continue to personalize every time you speak.

[4:26:13] Voice 4: And it's very challenging to try and allow for commentary

[4:26:18] Voice 4: when you personalize either about your neighbors

[4:26:20] Voice 4: or about the trustees,

[4:26:21] Voice 4: as opposed to talking about the issues.

[4:26:23] Voice 4: You asked a question, which was fine,

[4:26:25] Voice 4: whether they were prepared to meet with you.

[4:26:27] Voice 4: And they both responded that not only have they met,

[4:26:31] Voice 4: but they would continue to meet.

[4:26:33] Voice 4: And I've met when I've been asked to meet,

[4:26:37] Voice 4: but I appreciate you want to speak to your local trustees.

[4:26:39] Voice 4: But I don't think it's appropriate

[4:26:44] Voice 4: for you to continue to personalize and make commentary,

[4:26:47] Voice 4: Terry particularly given that a lot of times we get I find you know people don't agree with the

[4:26:53] Voice 4: way you characterize things one

[4:26:55] Voice 8: single fact from our five briefs has ever been challenged by either

[4:27:00] Voice 8: this

[4:27:00] Voice 16: is incredibly incorrect information Suzanne Fournier I have a three-page email that responded

[4:27:07] Voice 16: to almost every single claim in those briefs and I said I will not continue with this while I have

[4:27:12] Voice 16: somebody spreading misinformation i cannot participate in a meeting with this okay

[4:27:18] Voice 4: so i

[4:27:20] Voice 4: think you've had your say and i think i'm going to just ask that you uh be we we end the end this

[4:27:27] Voice 4: part of the town hall um and so uh robin can we just yes thanks uh okay so uh that was

[4:27:40] Voice 4: unfortunate um i'm sorry trustee rockefeller uh but the the other thing is so let me just

[4:27:49] Voice 4: ask this question does anybody need to speak directly to either the galley or the giggers

[4:27:54] Voice 4: uh application before we close the town hall okay i see no hands um so we don't need to recuse any

[4:28:11] Voice 4: the trustees and we'll

[4:28:13] Voice 4: and we'll

[4:28:15] Voice 4: so we'll call close the town hall

[4:28:16] Voice 4: there is no closed meeting

[4:28:18] Voice 4: and so I'm with that I'm going

[4:28:21] Voice 4: to indicate trustees is there any

[4:28:23] Voice 4: further business

[4:28:26] Voice 4: then I'm going

[4:28:27] Voice 4: to indicate that the meeting has come

[4:28:29] Voice 4: to an end we'll

[4:28:31] Voice 4: stop the broadcast we'll see

[4:28:33] Voice 4: you on April the 4th

[4:28:35] Voice 4: and

[4:28:37] Voice 4: thank you for joining

[4:28:39] Voice 4: joining us. And we'll continue on with the beating reminder that the Trust Council meeting

[4:28:46] Voice 4: is starting tomorrow at one o'clock. Take care. We'll end the broadcast right now.