Salt Spring Island Local Trust Committee community information meeting, May 26, 2022

[0:00:00] Voice 5: looks

[0:00:00] Voice 11: like it's working what's that looks like it's working so

[0:00:04] Voice 5: far so good it's going up it's

[0:00:07] Voice 5: not up yet

[0:00:15] Voice 4: all right

[0:00:16] Voice 11: so that's working and then i'll hit record

[0:00:27] Voice 11: you

[0:00:31] Voice 5: guys i'm going to go into record

[0:00:33] Voice 5: board. Are you ready to open the meeting? Yeah, sure. Good morning.

[0:00:51] Voice 4: I'd like to call this meeting of the North Under Local Trust Committee meeting is being recorded and live streamed. I'm Laura Patrick, the chair of this local trust committee. And I always open the meeting by acknowledging how fortunate we are to be gathering together on the traditional unceded territories of the Coast Salish people. It was a year ago that we all learned about

[0:01:28] Voice 4: about the findings of the Kamloops Residential School

[0:01:32] Voice 4: and the ongoing discoveries that many other schools

[0:01:37] Voice 4: brought us all, again, attention to this history.

[0:01:43] Voice 4: Through the truth and reconciliation calls for justice,

[0:01:47] Voice 4: it's important that we all take this time

[0:01:49] Voice 4: to learn and understand.

[0:01:51] Voice 4: And hopefully over this past year,

[0:01:53] Voice 4: we've begun that process to understand the history

[0:01:56] Voice 4: in the effects of the residential schools again i said or patrick on salt spring joined today by

[0:02:04] Voice 4: trustee morrison and trustee ben mcconkey and together we make up your local trust

[0:02:10] Voice 4: this is a place where we'll make good decisions regarding land use planning and other related

[0:02:16] Voice 4: matters uh and uh just that we've got people coming in from uh i can see here online our

[0:02:26] Voice 4: Our minute taker, Pat Todd.

[0:02:29] Voice 4: We have our regional planning manager, Robert Kojima.

[0:02:33] Voice 4: We have our planner, Kim Stockdale.

[0:02:35] Voice 4: And we have our planner, Marissa Chadwick.

[0:02:38] Voice 4: Thank you for being here today.

[0:02:41] Voice 4: Despite the fact some of our employees,

[0:02:43] Voice 4: and we have Robin Elchuk who's hiding behind there

[0:02:46] Voice 4: helping me with the making the review for the programming.

[0:02:48] Voice 4: So thank you, Robin.

[0:02:51] Voice 4: Despite the fact that some of them may be coming from their own homes here

[0:02:56] Voice 4: and if you're in front of you this is a workplace and i know that you'll treat this respectfully for

[0:03:03] our employees and uh sorry i'm just i always have a script of course i don't have a

[0:03:11] Voice 4: wing in it how

[0:03:12] Voice 4: am i doing um so we have an agenda before us today are there any additions or changes that need to be

[0:03:22] Voice 4: made to the agenda i

[0:03:23] Voice 10: just had a question um how come the fees bylaw is on our agenda

[0:03:30] Voice 4: follows the community there's a community information meeting and then it's here so

[0:03:34] that you can after you can decide okay let's do so it's it's here for you to decide actions related

[0:03:42] to it after

[0:03:42] Voice 10: the information i see okay it's like this uh maybe you added david carter's

[0:03:47] Voice 10: no but david marler's note was added to that yeah i'm just wondering

[0:03:53] Voice 3: okay okay thank you

[0:03:59] Voice 4: okay um uh

[0:04:02] Voice 10: the only thing i mean we received a lot of correspondence

[0:04:06] Voice 10: i'm not sure how you if you want to take time in our agenda to uh chair patrick to address

[0:04:11] some of the correspondence because you know we see correspondence from you know the concerns over

[0:04:18] or tree

[0:04:18] Voice 10: cutting we've received correspondence regarding uh various issues i'm wondering do

[0:04:24] Voice 10: we just do you want to deal with that when we get to correspondence in the agenda or is there

[0:04:27] Voice 10: anything along that we should create a new agenda item for well

[0:04:30] Voice 4: i guess i'll look to you is there

[0:04:32] Voice 4: anything that you would particularly think needs its own time to talk about or is a general

[0:04:37] Voice 4: conversation under correspondence appropriate well

[0:04:40] Voice 10: there's nothing that is on your mind guys then

[0:04:41] Voice 10: during correspondence can i just bring up some of the issues absolutely discuss them and see if

[0:04:45] Voice 10: there's any

[0:04:45] Voice 7: action yeah i

[0:04:48] Voice 13: would like to bring up correspondence related to the lgb review under the

[0:04:51] Voice 13: lgb so

[0:04:52] Voice 7: 13

[0:04:53] Voice 13: .2 yeah um i'd like to bring up any correspondence related to the land use violence

[0:04:58] Voice 13: related like in that discussion so it's one okay because there's a few things although

[0:05:05] Voice 13: technically isn't one of those but but yeah so thinking about whatever is correspondence

[0:05:11] Voice 13: for sure

[0:05:11] Voice 5: yeah yeah sure okay okay

[0:05:15] Voice 4: so that's all right then we approve the agenda through

[0:05:18] Voice 4: general consent yeah yep excellent uh so this brings us uh to our reports uh who'd like to go

[0:05:26] Voice 4: first christy morrison

[0:05:28] Voice 4: sure

[0:05:29] Voice 2: um

[0:05:30] Voice 13: so i think um one of the things i would like to name first and this

[0:05:37] Voice 13: This is not a local issue, but as an educator, I feel the need to say it.

[0:05:43] Voice 13: I just want to say that my heart goes out to the folks in Evaldi, Texas, for the shooting

[0:05:48] Voice 13: in the school.

[0:05:50] Voice 13: I had a number of people phone me and talk to me about that who are in that area.

[0:05:56] Voice 13: So it just was a personal connection.

[0:05:58] Voice 13: I know that we have much better laws and much healthier systems in Canada, but we still

[0:06:04] Voice 13: have those issues happening in Canada.

[0:06:06] Voice 13: so i just want to acknowledge that loss today or yesterday um and um and just the the ongoing

[0:06:16] Voice 13: nature of of you know mental health and wellness that we're suffering under so many different

[0:06:22] Voice 13: aspects um here too like with our stresses of living in difficult housing situations coming

[0:06:31] Voice 13: out of the pandemic and as people shift and adjust to that i just kind of want to acknowledge that

[0:06:37] Voice 13: because i feel like we we need to um and as we start into i think it's going to be a very

[0:06:43] Voice 13: difficult six months um you know working towards the last of the trust policy statement working

[0:06:49] Voice 13: towards our land use bylaws um you know shifting whoever is in the new seats potentially here

[0:06:56] Voice 13: in the trust programs committee um i really want us as a community to think how we want to be

[0:07:03] Voice 13: together you know we don't all agree that's fine not agreeing is fine but let's be civil to each

[0:07:09] Voice 13: other and let's think about how we can actually hear each other well so i think that's kind of

[0:07:16] Voice 13: the method that i want ben and i don't agree but we can still we can still you know be civil to

[0:07:21] Voice 13: to each other um and I think in there's heightened tensions because of the last two years of just

[0:07:27] Voice 13: exhaustion I feel it myself I've been traveling like a godly mile for work and I'm about to leave

[0:07:33] Voice 13: again today so I just really need people to just be civil and kind um and I appreciate all of the

[0:07:42] Voice 13: notes and correspondence that I've got that even when you don't agree has been civil and and

[0:07:48] Voice 13: and just wonderful to like understand and get why you think the way you do um i do have to say that

[0:07:56] Voice 13: if people come at me harsh i don't read it because i don't need that i there's no requirement for me

[0:08:02] Voice 13: to read things that are vile and so um that's kind of where i stand on this show and i don't

[0:08:09] Voice 13: think that we should expect that of staff or our community to have to hear so i do want to stress

[0:08:15] Voice 13: stress in our meetings that we cut in on on things like that if it happens because it's

[0:08:19] Voice 13: we're likely to get into the heated part of our conversations so i think that that's where where

[0:08:25] Voice 13: i stand on those things um and you know i'm looking forward actually to just hearing people's

[0:08:31] Voice 13: opinions around when this bylaw and to and that these bylaw and just making some decisions to go

[0:08:38] Voice 13: forward um that can then be out for a larger community conversation and it'll be clear what

[0:08:43] Voice 13: we're talking about thank you yeah

[0:08:48] Voice 10: thanks trustee morrison for those slides um i guess i mean i

[0:08:51] Voice 10: maybe a different experience like i actually enjoy uh angry correspondence because it shows to me

[0:08:56] Voice 10: that a it's an opportunity for me to help educate folks onto what the good work the trust committee

[0:09:01] Voice 10: is doing on behalf of the community uh also um it gets people engaged so whether they're angry

[0:09:07] Voice 10: or not

[0:09:07] Voice 10: i mean the job of the public official is to absorb criticism on some level and it's

[0:09:12] Voice 10: It's not easy, and it's not for the faint of heart at all,

[0:09:15] Voice 10: but I certainly don't take anything personally.

[0:09:17] Voice 10: There's lots of folks in this neighborhood that, unfortunately,

[0:09:21] Voice 10: someone's got to take the brunt of the criticism at some point

[0:09:23] Voice 10: in order to make things better.

[0:09:25] Voice 10: So I hear what you're saying, and I agree with your call

[0:09:28] Voice 10: for civility and conversation.

[0:09:30] Voice 10: I think our community, since we've emerged from the pandemic,

[0:09:33] Voice 10: is doing a pretty good job, and I hope we can keep that vibe happening.

[0:09:37] Voice 10: On that note, I received a number of correspondence

[0:09:41] Voice 10: comments uh regarding the uh trust programs committee the concerns over tree cutting bylaw

[0:09:45] Voice 10: which i'm not i it would be great to have an update on that to clarify uh the executive

[0:09:50] Voice 10: committee and what's going on with the minister nathan collin and the cao and chair lucko with

[0:09:55] Voice 10: regards to that um there's there was a facebook post about the island's trust potentially creating

[0:10:01] Voice 10: fire concerns um by creating a true bylaw putting people's homes at risk and so this i had informal

[0:10:09] Voice 10: formal conversations with members of the fire department um who reiterated once again that they

[0:10:14] Voice 10: do not like being politicized and that the fire department is not a political work group uh and

[0:10:20] Voice 10: that if there's any concerns about personal safety uh to not politicize them uh so that was

[0:10:26] Voice 10: interesting we had a trust programs committee uh meeting virtually that you chaired uh trustee

[0:10:31] Voice 10: morrison uh where folks were able to give a feedback and it was interesting to uh hear

[0:10:35] Voice 10: trustees different opinions on their perception of what it's like on fetus compared to what it's

[0:10:40] Voice 10: like on pender certainly very disparate islands uh i chaired the transportation um uh meeting

[0:10:46] Voice 10: hosted by matt which is moving around pender society uh there is a referendum proposed by

[0:10:51] Voice 10: the capital regional district that will be on october 15th uh the proposal is to create a

[0:10:58] Voice 10: transportation commission uh potentially creating an inter-island very uh community bus

[0:11:05] Voice 10: it was included at the end of this meeting that this was poorly

[0:11:14] Voice 10: inter-island ferry to be lumped in with trails and community bus it certainly i hope the crd

[0:11:19] Voice 10: goes back to the drawing board uh but nonetheless there was a rallying point for community members

[0:11:24] Voice 10: to really engage in improving our transportation infrastructure

[0:11:28] Voice 10: as we see big trucks going down the road

[0:11:32] Voice 10: and the kids have to bike rodeo,

[0:11:33] Voice 10: but they have nowhere to ride their bikes on them.

[0:11:36] Voice 10: Certainly that has improved.

[0:11:37] Voice 10: I also want to note that the passing of Jim Dunlop,

[0:11:42] Voice 10: Jim Dunlop was a huge part of our community.

[0:11:44] Voice 10: He started the pipe band,

[0:11:45] Voice 10: and the Legion had a proper service for him,

[0:11:49] Voice 10: and I was honoured to play the trumpet

[0:11:50] Voice 10: and observe him in silence for Jim.

[0:11:53] Voice 10: also there was a uh a special concert that i hosted uh i know this is not trust related but

[0:11:58] Voice 10: it is because it's for dan charman dan charman was a member of the advisory planning commission

[0:12:03] Voice 10: for many years he was a big part of uh work with the islands trust and uh both those guys jim dunlop

[0:12:09] Voice 10: i just wanted to give a shout out to them just being beauties of our community so um that's i

[0:12:16] Voice 10: could obviously go on but i'm more interested to hear from the members of the community here today

[0:12:19] Voice 10: and thank you chair patrick and for staff organizing today's meeting

[0:12:25] Voice 4: thank you jesse

[0:12:27] Voice 4: morrison for um talking about conversations and community if any of you follow or get the

[0:12:35] capital daily uh email

[0:12:37] Voice 4: from victoria's victoria paper they had an interview today of a of a

[0:12:44] Voice 4: well it's a kind of steep preview interview of a big interview coming in a few days soon

[0:12:49] soon of a Pulitzer winning journalist on these issues about our communities, the issues that

[0:12:59] we're seeing from homelessness to civil issues and how

[0:13:05] Voice 4: just his observations are from around

[0:13:08] Voice 4: the world. This was not just what's there. So very enlightening to read. I encourage you to

[0:13:14] Voice 4: to take a look at that um trust council is coming up in june june 21st through 23rd it'll be virtual

[0:13:23] Voice 4: we'll all be on the computer uh the evening of the 21st is the delegation and town hall

[0:13:30] Voice 4: session beginning at 7 p.m

[0:13:32] Voice 5: and

[0:13:34] Voice 4: the agenda will be out just like two weeks or so before that so

[0:13:38] Voice 4: keep an eye if you're not subscribed to the website subscribe to the website it'll be sent

[0:13:43] Voice 4: an email when the agenda is public so that we won't miss it uh this week the uh salt spring

[0:13:52] Voice 4: local trust committee met with minister fleming and we certainly i was

[0:13:56] Voice 17: taking a very

[0:13:56] Voice 4: broad and

[0:13:57] Voice 4: he's the minister of highways and transportation we were taking a very high level approach that

[0:14:03] Voice 4: uh the islands have been left out of the south of vancouver with transportation strategy which

[0:14:09] Voice 4: we thought was not good uh can't say we got a lot of interest from him on including us into that or

[0:14:17] Voice 4: opening that plan at all but we were talking about the benefits of having a strategy for all of the

[0:14:23] Voice 4: islands all of our road issues instead of each island out there just having to yell and scream

[0:14:28] Voice 4: about what they want for ministry of highways and transportation to be nice to know where we fall in

[0:14:33] Voice 4: the overall picture of the southern gulf island so i can't say we convinced him or sold him on moving

[0:14:39] Voice 4: that direction but we had a very long audience with him very much knows about all of the issues

[0:14:45] Voice 4: on each of these islands intimately so we'll keep at it and uh it's important and we stressed the

[0:14:53] Voice 4: importance of working with us how land use and roads aren't a separate issue they are related

[0:15:00] um i can't

[0:15:02] Voice 4: i can't say too much about the tree cutting um the trust council did direct staff

[0:15:06] Voice 4: to work with the ministry staff on tree cutting authority.

[0:15:12] Voice 4: I know Russ Hudson-Piller did give us an update

[0:15:15] Voice 4: through the UBCM, which is the Union of BC Municipalities.

[0:15:20] Voice 4: I think regional district in Nanaimo had requested

[0:15:23] Voice 4: that same authority and was told no

[0:15:25] Voice 4: through the UBCM process.

[0:15:28] Voice 4: My understanding from Russ Hudson-Piller

[0:15:32] Voice 4: is that ministry staff, again,

[0:15:34] Voice 4: they're not interested in giving us

[0:15:36] Voice 4: the municipal authorities so what we know is a tree cutting bylaw but that's the the

[0:15:41] Voice 4: province is not just going to say here you have that authority to go run with it they'd be they

[0:15:47] Voice 4: would contemplate something that would work in our geography and that it would require an amendment

[0:15:56] Voice 4: to the act or its own authority through the act not just give us this authority through the

[0:16:01] Voice 4: municipal pilots so um that's sort of where the conversation is that is not something that happens

[0:16:07] Voice 4: quickly and um and i'm sure russell reported back to trust council as to their interest in pursuing

[0:16:13] that or not so um that would

[0:16:15] Voice 4: require again further direction from trust counsel to you know to

[0:16:20] Voice 4: enact that both steps that's all i have on treatment can

[0:16:24] Voice 10: i just add something really

[0:16:25] Voice 10: quick because it relates to your report as kind of i don't know if it's breaking news or whatever

[0:16:30] Voice 10: But the reason why, this is from ministry officials, the bridge was stopped was because they took the machines across and the bridge started to sway a little bit.

[0:16:43] Voice 10: So there are concerns right now over whether or not they can get the equipment even over to face the dip.

[0:16:50] Voice 10: So South Pender is facing some challenges and North Pender.

[0:16:54] Voice 10: Now, this is not confirmed in an official report, but there are concerns over the structure right now, and that brought major concerns for me.

[0:17:03] Voice 10: I learned this information last night, and it needs to be clarified.

[0:17:07] Voice 10: But certainly, Rob, Minister Fleming, who I know from UVic days, it would be prudent for Minister Fleming to certainly address these concerns immediately rather than later.

[0:17:19] Voice 10: So thank you for that, Chair Patrick.

[0:17:21] Voice 10: And

[0:17:22] Voice 4: he seemed extremely well briefed on the issues of various items.

[0:17:28] Voice 4: Okay.

[0:17:29] Voice 4: So this is your opportunity to speak to us.

[0:17:33] Voice 4: We want to hear your questions and comments at this time.

[0:17:36] Voice 4: And later in the agenda, we'll be discussing various things.

[0:17:39] Voice 4: We don't have any applications for us.

[0:17:43] Voice 4: We're never reading.

[0:17:47] Voice 4: So we always ask that you direct your comments to us.

[0:17:53] Voice 4: elected officials not audience or staff it was asked that you speak about issues not individuals

[0:18:00] Voice 4: be clear concise respectful i don't run a clock but i will ask you to wrap up if you're

[0:18:08] Voice 4: carrying on and um and always like i said i know i count on to be respectful and it is about

[0:18:15] Voice 4: talking to the issues and trying to offer solutions ideas thoughts of how to uh how

[0:18:21] Voice 4: to improve something because that's what we want to hear do you want to add something yeah just

[0:18:27] Voice 4: really want some dishes if you can catch that i will do my

[0:18:31] Voice 10: best sure patrick just a question so

[0:18:33] Voice 10: in the last meeting minutes um people are referred to no no we don't have to approve

[0:18:38] Voice 4: the minutes but

[0:18:39] Voice 10: it's a question for the minute taker it's just a public the minister this is

[0:18:43] Voice 10: public attendee and traditionally in our minutes it's like so-and-so said but the name is clearly

[0:18:49] Voice 10: defined it's spelled um so i'm wondering what how that's going to are we going to keep that

[0:18:54] Voice 10: traditional language this is public attendee number one well

[0:18:57] Voice 4: if you will state your name

[0:18:59] Voice 4: clearly and then our reporter can catch your name we had some audio issues last time so i think

[0:19:06] Voice 4: there were some challenges okay this is a different recorder so pat's here so if you could state your

[0:19:10] Voice 4: name clearly and then pat will uh will uh uh let us know if she couldn't hear you can

[0:19:17] Voice 13: you can you

[0:19:17] Voice 13: text of her in the chat the name too just to reconfirm it when you hear or

[0:19:21] Voice 4: i don't have it

[0:19:23] Voice 4: i can try to capture that for you um okay pat we'll do our best and so and it's best

[0:19:32] Voice 4: too if you could just uh step forward this microphone is very good so warn you if you're

[0:19:36] Voice 4: whispering back there it is a very good microphone but so that everyone can hear you if you could

[0:19:40] Voice 4: just at least step forward you don't have to be right behind the microphone it will pick you up

[0:19:44] Voice 4: but just to make sure we can hear you loud and clear so who would like to talk to us today

[0:19:51] Voice 4: all right yeah it's just probably right over here on the side and it'll get you okay if you want

[0:19:58] Voice 4: you can sit down too you don't have to stand outside

[0:20:00] Voice 15: my name is dayton funk uh we recently

[0:20:04] Voice 15: bought property here um yeah we haven't uh completed our planning because we have a lot of

[0:20:13] Voice 15: there's been a moving goal post here as far as secondary suites development properties so

[0:20:24] my

[0:20:24] Voice 15: question is do i address uh draft bylaw 224 now or wait till it comes up later

[0:20:34] Voice 4: oh this is

[0:20:35] Voice 4: your time yeah so what your comments we want to hear from you now and then we'll consider

[0:20:39] Voice 4: your comments when we have our conversation later okay

[0:20:42] Voice 15: so my question is uh we have a problem

[0:20:47] Voice 15: and uh earlier when we when we started the project we were planning to build a home that's

[0:21:01] Voice 15: larger insulated the floor plan at the time measured the other side so of course i complained

[0:21:11] Voice 15: about it and now it's been it's going to be adjusted I believe to interior walls thank you

[0:21:20] Voice 15: anyway so now we're getting to the part where uh in 224 it was briefly outlined that um you're

[0:21:30] Voice 15: going to adjust the floor area on properties and we're looking at uh minimizing our impact on

[0:21:40] Voice 15: on the dpa that we're in and originally our original plan was to put a cabin

[0:21:48] Voice 15: above the accessory building similar to a carriage house added to our

[0:21:56] Voice 15: dwelling that would have a secondary suite because we're three family units is my son

[0:22:02] Voice 15: my other son and his wife my wife and myself so three units we're looking for three spaces

[0:22:07] Voice 15: um according to the bylaws the accessory building won't allow that so again um i'm looking at is

[0:22:20] Voice 15: there a uh bylaw that will address a carriage house separate like i couldn't find carriage

[0:22:29] Voice 15: house anywhere in your bylaws is it there you know because yeah sorry would

[0:22:39] Voice 18: you like me to ask

[0:22:40] Voice 18: to the question sure okay uh so right now the land use bylaw would not support carriage houses

[0:22:47] Voice 18: the proposed draft bylaw 224 wouldn't outright permit carriage houses but it would allow a

[0:22:55] Voice 18: property owner to vary the floor area of a cottage so it could be increased so there could then be

[0:23:02] Voice 18: an additional story so it wouldn't um outright for the carriage house but a property owner could

[0:23:08] Voice 18: both for a tdt application to increase the floor area and um and then that's

[0:23:15] Voice 15: yeah i guess another

[0:23:16] Voice 15: question is what's the rationale for not having a cabin built over top of a garage or a cottage

[0:23:23] Voice 15: over the garage i

[0:23:24] Voice 4: think that's i think that's something directed to us to think about so i

[0:23:27] Voice 4: think that you raise a good question and that's something i

[0:23:30] Voice 15: know there's one suggestion another

[0:23:32] Voice 15: Another suggestion is in your correspondence here,

[0:23:39] Voice 15: you're measuring floor area at feet and metric.

[0:23:44] Voice 15: Like it would be nice to have all one,

[0:23:47] Voice 15: either address it all with metric

[0:23:48] Voice 15: or address it all with periodontal

[0:23:51] Voice 15: because it's kind of confusing when you're

[0:23:53] Voice 15: got to run through a calculator and figure out where you are.

[0:23:57] Voice 15: That's just a suggestion.

[0:24:01] Voice 15: That's all I have.

[0:24:02] Voice 4: Are you building a super insulated home?

[0:24:04] Voice 4: is that what you're

[0:24:04] Voice 15: applying to but uh like the first because the the secondary suite was

[0:24:12] Voice 15: is maxed out at a certain size if you go two foot walls you

[0:24:17] Voice 5: lose the hundred square feet inside the

[0:24:19] building that could

[0:24:20] Voice 15: change that could change from one bedroom to a two bedroom you know it just

[0:24:25] Voice 13: well it's good to hear that the because that adjustment to the new bylaw was intended for

[0:24:30] Voice 13: that very reason to allow

[0:24:31] Voice 15: for well that works for one part of our problem it doesn't work

[0:24:35] Voice 15: the other part yeah

[0:24:36] Voice 13: the other one isn't a change just to be clear it's actually potentially is an

[0:24:40] Voice 13: increase option because right now you can't do that yes

[0:24:44] Voice 15: so that's good to know one more question

[0:24:47] Voice 15: variance now if it comes to the point where we have to go through a variance to

[0:24:53] Voice 15: put a suite above our garage is that a possibility or do i have to

[0:25:01] Voice 15: rewrite a bylaw it's

[0:25:03] Voice 18: a possibility so your property would be permitted a dwelling unit

[0:25:07] Voice 18: a secondary suite and the secondary suite would have to be attached to the dwelling unit

[0:25:12] Voice 18: and then you're permitted the cottage and so you'd be actually that uh carriage house would

[0:25:18] Voice 18: actually be considered a cottage you'd just

[0:25:20] Voice 18: be burying the the maximum floor area but we could

[0:25:23] Voice 15: have the garage the carriage and the potentially

[0:25:25] Voice 18: it's at the

[0:25:26] Voice 15: discretion so because you're coming

[0:25:28] Voice 15: know what the fees by law do i apply for my variance before i do this design it's a good

[0:25:34] Voice 15: question because it's

[0:25:36] Voice 15: gonna change i've already i've already gone into this thing for 10k so i

[0:25:42] Voice 15: just in biologist reports and surveys and so an extra 2200 bucks nothing but uh i still

[0:25:50] Voice 10: so dean on the record an extra 222 dollars is nothing

[0:25:58] Voice 13: nothing

[0:25:58] Voice 15: compared to what i've already said

[0:26:02] Voice 15: okay well thank you thank

[0:26:04] Voice 14: you excuse me could i get dayton's last name please

[0:26:07] Voice 4: f

[0:26:08] Voice 14: -u-n-k

[0:26:09] Voice 4: f

[0:26:11] Voice 14: -u-n-k thank you you

[0:26:13] Voice 4: bet okay who else would like to address us today

[0:26:16] Voice 4: hello don uh

[0:26:18] Voice 7: don corbin i would like to briefly address the two issues

[0:26:24] Voice 7: is one concern i have with a possible conflict of interest on the ltc with respect to land use

[0:26:31] Voice 7: bylaw amendments and secondly the role of non-resident trustees on this uh commission

[0:26:38] Voice 7: uh the land use bylaw amendments if i understand them

[0:26:42] Voice 7: things that i'm concerned about when they restrict housing sizes

[0:26:46] Voice 7: of on properties and second they restrict to private dogs now by restricting housing floor

[0:26:55] areas on properties you've obviously altered the property rights of the owners and

[0:27:02] Voice 7: you reduce the

[0:27:04] Voice 7: supply of lots that support large and improved houses now social science would tell us that

[0:27:14] that by restricting supply, you're going to increase

[0:27:19] the equilibrium prices of properties and houses

[0:27:23] that are larger

[0:27:24] Voice 7: because of grandfather issues

[0:27:27] Voice 7: that would be allowed under the new bylaws.

[0:27:33] Voice 7: If any of our local trustees find themselves

[0:27:37] Voice 7: in a situation where they are in the position

[0:27:42] Voice 7: of being able to grandfather a house

[0:27:45] Voice 7: that is larger and would be permitted under the new bylaws i would submit there is a presumptive

[0:27:53] Voice 7: interest of a financial financial benefit these these houses will become more scarce these for

[0:28:00] the problem smaller properties that can support these houses will become more scarce and therefore

[0:28:07] Voice 7: there will be a financial financial interest in them i'd like to submit to the chair that she

[0:28:15] should ensure that there is that the situation doesn't exist on our local trustee so we can be

[0:28:26] confident that there is no ongoing conflict of interest over this issue

[0:28:31] with the members of the local trust committee um now

[0:28:39] Voice 7: i'd also like to address briefly the

[0:28:42] Voice 7: the role of non-resident trustees on on this uh on the local trust community my understanding is we

[0:28:49] now have

[0:28:50] Voice 7: two non-resident trustees local trustees is no longer a resident on north pender and i have

[0:28:59] Voice 7: in previous meetings submitted that there is an issue of legitimacy legitimacy because

[0:29:06] Voice 7: none of the local trustees were elected but in play so we now have a local trust trust

[0:29:12] Voice 7: trust committee that has if i'm correct two non-residents and no elected people from north

[0:29:20] pender i would suggest that that raises the issue of legitimacy to make any substantive changes

[0:29:28] uh to north pender bylaws i would urge that both the chair as a non-resident trustee and

[0:29:41] uh vote against and argue against any substandard changes in our bylaws

[0:29:49] Voice 7: any substandard changes be put off to the post october elections thank you

[0:29:57] Voice 4: i have the

[0:30:00] Voice 4: competence and the legitimate legitimacy of this local trust committee and i also have confidence

[0:30:05] Voice 4: in our system of conflict of interest and how it would work so thank you for raising those issues

[0:30:12] Voice 10: just a second sorry speaker accused members of being in a conflict of interest like like this

[0:30:20] Voice 10: is just a fun thing that community members like to do throw conflict of interest where's your proof

[0:30:25] Voice 10: Don, you can't just go accuse that local trust committee, for example, in your correspondence of being deceitful, which you said in all the correspondence, you accuse us of being deceitful, then you're accusing us of conflict of interest, excuse me, but this is extremely serious, Don, you can't

[0:30:44] Voice 15: just do that.

[0:30:47] Voice 4: we're not going to debate like that let's i don't want to debate

[0:30:50] Voice 4: come

[0:30:51] Voice 7: on

[0:30:57] Voice 10: we can speak better than this if you have a serious conflict of interest

[0:31:01] Voice 10: there's channels to do that and you know that gone you don't just come to a community meeting

[0:31:06] Voice 10: where we're trying to do the best for the community and just ambush it and say we're

[0:31:10] Voice 10: accusing a conflict of interest without any evidence you're better than this don come on

[0:31:16] Voice 10: be careful be careful what you're accusing us of something extremely serious i haven't accused

[0:31:21] Voice 10: anybody of anything you're inferring it and it's not fair let's not

[0:31:27] Voice 4: debate this issue let's this is

[0:31:29] Voice 4: confidence in our process i

[0:31:35] Voice 10: know but but chair patrick you got to remind folks as a member of

[0:31:38] Voice 10: the public if they make a big accusation like that it's like what are you doing there's fair

[0:31:43] Voice 10: enough if there's a conflict of interest absolutely i 100 agree that that should be investigated but

[0:31:48] Voice 10: to come and infer it and create stir up stuff in the community we just talked about civility this

[0:31:54] Voice 10: is where i i finally lose my patience and it's like let's take a moment to reflect on this

[0:31:59] Voice 10: stop accusing our public officials without any evidence or inferring things like that

[0:32:04] Voice 10: it's not appropriate. So I apologize for raising the tone of my voice. That's a very serious thing,

[0:32:11] Voice 10: Chair Patrick, and it needs to be treated seriously.

[0:32:13] Voice 4: I understand. Thank you. Who'd

[0:32:18] Voice 4: like to address us next?

[0:32:20] Voice 19: Sorry. Thank you, Chris Roper. First, I'd like to put my

[0:32:29] Voice 19: word in for the trust members here. Speak to us, please. The trust members,

[0:32:34] Voice 19: First, thank you very much for your time and your patience with us here on Pender.

[0:32:38] Voice 19: I greatly appreciate it.

[0:32:41] Voice 19: I just wanted to inquire if there was a bit of an update in the ILO presentation for personal helicopters on Pender.

[0:32:49] Voice 19: I've been trying to see a little bit online, but I've been not very successful at getting actually online.

[0:32:58] Voice 19: Even today, I was having trouble getting into the meetings.

[0:33:01] Voice 19: I was late in person.

[0:33:02] Voice 19: person. But could I get a bit of an update? And before I close, I would like to say that

[0:33:08] Voice 19: Robert's rules and all this other stuff, we do have to be respectful, because it is a really

[0:33:13] Voice 19: small island. So we have small islands, you have to do small things. Otherwise, it becomes really

[0:33:20] Voice 19: big. So again, an update would be appreciated. Did you want to provide an update?

[0:33:27] Voice 19: Sure.

[0:33:27] Voice 18: Yeah, the LTC gave direction many, many months ago to add in the draft bylaw 224 under prohibition in all zones, helicopters and helipads, other than for emergency and evacuation use.

[0:33:44] Voice 18: So, that will be in Prohibitive Use in the Land Use By-law, but as we know, aeronautics is federally regulated, so, you know, it's not within the LTC's jurisdiction, but if that were to ever change in the future, at least the LDC will address it.

[0:34:03] Voice 19: And does this require a revoke, or does it just get implemented? What's the process?

[0:34:07] Voice 19: So

[0:34:08] Voice 18: the LTC will give different readings to this bylaw, four readings in total.

[0:34:15] Voice 18: There will also be a community information meeting and a public hearing process.

[0:34:19] Voice 18: So if this is something that you want your opinion on recorded, the public hearing would be the time to do that for yourself.

[0:34:27] Voice 18: But in terms of the LTC, they have the authority to adopt this bylaw.

[0:34:32] Voice 1: Thanks, Chris.

[0:34:33] Voice 1: thank you

[0:34:33] Voice 18: uh

[0:34:34] Voice 1: mick collins magic lake states this is just a question for clarification of procedure

[0:34:41] Voice 1: so the next item is called a community information meeting may we ask questions

[0:34:47] Voice 1: after a presentation or is it

[0:34:49] Voice 4: a one-way

[0:34:50] Voice 1: flow so

[0:34:51] Voice 4: you'll i should have said that at the beginning

[0:34:53] Voice 4: yes you'll have an opportunity during the community information to get asked to seek

[0:34:57] Voice 4: further anyone

[0:35:00] Voice 11: else

[0:35:02] Voice 2: george george larue for the record now i sent you a note this morning

[0:35:09] these sort of things they get done in the middle of the night this

[0:35:13] Voice 2: time of year but that's what it

[0:35:14] Voice 2: is so i'll just read it into the record i'll probably miss some of it but you've got the

[0:35:19] Voice 2: official version but when i last spoke to you back in march i raised some concerns about

[0:35:25] about the way in which you were advancing a new DPA

[0:35:30] around groundwork.

[0:35:31] I

[0:35:35] Voice 2: didn't receive any response.

[0:35:36] Voice 2: Sometimes with public officials,

[0:35:38] Voice 2: you get the polite nothing letter

[0:35:40] Voice 2: that has to go to the second page.

[0:35:42] Voice 2: So it looks like somebody actually did something,

[0:35:44] Voice 2: but it's a polite nothing letter.

[0:35:45] Voice 2: I didn't even get that.

[0:35:47] But I'm pretty alarmed with the pressure

[0:35:50] that's being put on to

[0:35:51] Voice 2: advance this OCP amendment.

[0:35:55] Voice 2: This is not something that should just be done

[0:35:57] Voice 2: on a whim and some beliefs.

[0:35:59] Voice 2: It needs thoughtful and reasonable consideration.

[0:36:01] Voice 2: I recall Robert Kojima saying many moons ago when there was some discussion among you about

[0:36:07] Voice 2: let's add some more area to the BPA.

[0:36:10] Voice 2: He said, no, you can't just do that.

[0:36:12] Voice 2: There's a process that has to be ground-proofed.

[0:36:14] Voice 2: A bunch of things have to be done.

[0:36:16] Voice 2: It has to be headlines drawn on maps.

[0:36:19] Voice 2: In this case, you're being asked today by recommendation from staff to endorse a draft

[0:36:27] Voice 2: bylaw which means it can go to early referrals so you can advance and accelerate your process

[0:36:34] and hopefully advance it through first second and third reading all in the same day because you do

[0:36:39] Voice 2: the early referral or something like that why i don't think it's clear that the technical case

[0:36:47] has

[0:36:47] Voice 2: been made for dpa what we have is a proposal based on some science presumably which are model

[0:36:58] model-based desktop analyses that aren't ground-proof.

[0:37:01] Even GWS said we need to do ground-proofing,

[0:37:04] and that's what we're relying on to a large extent.

[0:37:08] Maybe you've been given a map today.

[0:37:10] We've not seen a map, but

[0:37:11] Voice 2: we were told there might be one.

[0:37:13] Voice 2: We haven't seen it, but you're being asked to endorse it.

[0:37:17] And if you have seen the map, that'd be good to know.

[0:37:20] But if you haven't, you're

[0:37:20] Voice 2: being asked to endorse it today,

[0:37:22] Voice 2: not even seeing a map, and not even the public seeing the map.

[0:37:26] Voice 2: The usage rates used in there are completely unrepresentative

[0:37:30] Voice 2: of what happens on this island, particularly in the area of parks and agriculture.

[0:37:35] Voice 2: You know that.

[0:37:36] Voice 2: The areas they were using for their assumptions didn't reflect what goes on here at all.

[0:37:44] Voice 2: Vulnerability was classified as 10% of the recharge use.

[0:37:49] Voice 2: Why does the area north of us in the Nile use 50% of Gabriel Isle?

[0:37:54] It's not explained.

[0:37:56] But we color it red because it gets everybody's heart beating,

[0:38:00] and we believe it's another crisis.

[0:38:02] Is it?

[0:38:03] I'm not sure.

[0:38:05] Voice 2: The proposal isn't costed at all.

[0:38:07] Voice 2: There's nothing I've seen anywhere

[0:38:09] Voice 2: that costs out this proposal.

[0:38:10] Voice 2: The absorption rate going into all the other islands.

[0:38:14] Voice 2: How do we get it applied through all the islands?

[0:38:16] Voice 2: We have a cookie cutter like this one right now in Gallium.

[0:38:19] Voice 2: How do we stamp that out across all islands?

[0:38:21] Voice 2: So what's the cost of doing that?

[0:38:23] Voice 2: How many staff are gonna be required

[0:38:24] Voice 2: and staff hours over the coming years?

[0:38:26] Voice 2: A, to implement this rollout

[0:38:28] Voice 2: and B, to maintain it after that.

[0:38:31] Voice 2: And what's it going to accomplish?

[0:38:33] Voice 2: I would say it's square root of nothing, frankly.

[0:38:39] Voice 2: GWS said themselves,

[0:38:42] Voice 2: you really need to do some groundwater monitoring.

[0:38:45] Voice 2: I know one monitoring well in North Pendry

[0:38:47] Voice 2: and one in Trincomalee, I suppose.

[0:38:50] Voice 2: They're not showing degradation,

[0:38:51] Voice 2: at least the one in Paisley isn't,

[0:38:53] Voice 2: because I've analyzed 160,000 data points to look at it.

[0:38:58] Voice 2: The assessment of water through real use,

[0:39:01] Voice 2: real world water use examination,

[0:39:03] Voice 2: you have to ground-proof this thing.

[0:39:04] Voice 2: You need to install some hydrometric stations to monitor the surface water levels to determine whether there really is an issue, and perhaps some climate monitoring stations so we know what's really happening with temperature and precipitation.

[0:39:18] Voice 2: We can't even get good reliable data on that, but we're going to do this on science.

[0:39:23] Voice 2: So it seems to me that doing the work that GWS recommended would be far more useful, as opposed to advancing the new BDPA based on some beliefs, some virtue signaling, some theoretical models, and a perceived need to control by regulation.

[0:39:42] I don't think that's the right approach. Thanks

[0:39:45] Voice 2: for letting me go a little longer, Laura.

[0:39:47] Voice 4: Thank you, George. I think we'll be discussing later

[0:39:49] Voice 2: in the agenda, so thank you.

[0:39:52] Voice 4: Who else would like to talk to us today?

[0:39:56] Voice 5: michael my

[0:40:05] Voice 9: name is michael sketch s-k-e-t-c-h and i live on north pender island um chair patrick i

[0:40:12] Voice 9: have a page and a half which is probably about four minutes is that reasonable trustee

[0:40:20] Voice 9: um north pender trustee trustees i'm i'm going to address the land use or an aspect of the land use

[0:40:28] Voice 9: bylaw review project particularly rezoning by the ltc by first amending the land use bylaw then the

[0:40:37] Voice 9: ocp and a situation in which important policy issues may be eclipsed uh of course the usual

[0:40:44] Voice 9: rezoning is a an applicant making a rezoning proposal it's quite a rigorous process which

[0:40:50] Voice 9: usually involves consultants reports etc these two rezonings are entirely different

[0:40:55] Voice 9: and they are from the public perspective slipped in the back door demanding the land use bylaw

[0:41:02] Voice 9: and down the road

[0:41:04] Voice 9: probably next trustee term looking at the OCP. These are both very serious

[0:41:09] Voice 9: policy matters I think and I hope to illuminate that in what I say now. The land use bylaw review

[0:41:17] Voice 9: on today's agenda is guided by the project charter both a substantive policy amendment to the OCP

[0:41:25] Voice 9: and OCP mapping amendments establishing new land use designations are out of scope.

[0:41:35] Voice 9: However, the Port Washington Road and Driftwood rezoning is agreed to date by staff and trustees

[0:41:41] Voice 9: offend each of the out of scope terms. Please remove both rezoning proposals from the current

[0:41:49] Voice 9: land use bylaw review project. I'll give the rationale for not considering the Port Washington

[0:41:55] Voice 9: washington road rezoning first then the driftwood from 1910 to 1994 the port washington store parcel

[0:42:04] Voice 9: extended to the natural boundary a shed extended from just above the natural boundary out over the

[0:42:11] Voice 9: foreshore subdivision to two parcels was in about 1994 from 1994 the 1200 port washington road parcel

[0:42:22] Voice 9: is a 0.02 acre sliver of land at the natural boundary

[0:42:27] Voice 9: on which rests a small part of the 1500 square foot shed,

[0:42:32] Voice 9: zone commercial.

[0:42:34] Voice 9: Most of the shed is on the foreshore, zone W4,

[0:42:39] Voice 9: and from about 1910 to 1994 was used for storage.

[0:42:43] Voice 9: After 1994, the shed was converted for residential use.

[0:42:49] Voice 9: Although easements on title for sewage disposal

[0:42:51] Voice 9: and water well access on the upland parcel,

[0:42:55] Voice 9: sewage disposal was direct deposit to ocean.

[0:42:59] Voice 9: Island residents complained,

[0:43:02] Voice 9: but there was no enforcement of common sense restrictions

[0:43:06] Voice 9: due to the lack of cooperation between the land

[0:43:09] Voice 9: and foreshore jurisdictions

[0:43:12] Voice 9: for parts of the shared structure.

[0:43:15] Voice 9: Today, amending the land use bottle

[0:43:17] Voice 9: to permit residential use of the shed

[0:43:20] Voice 9: may in and of itself resurrect that very problem without an OCD amendment. The 1201 Port Washington

[0:43:30] Voice 9: Road parcel is 0.22 acres with the residents on each parcel required setbacks for water well to

[0:43:39] Voice 9: sewage field and for structures from the natural boundary are problematic. A current title search

[0:43:48] Voice 9: shows that the upland store parcel, as well as the store has been demolished, is owned by a company

[0:43:55] Voice 9: and the sliver parcel at the natural boundary with a part of the shed is owned by two individuals.

[0:44:02] Voice 9: A common sense amalgamation of the two parcels may be difficult. Residential use of the foreshore

[0:44:09] Voice 9: is a major policy concern for both residents and the First Nations interest. I suggest that the

[0:44:16] Voice 9: slip this in through the residential zoning through the back door on land you file amendment

[0:44:21] Voice 9: is is not the correct approach and my second concern a resounding concern is for the tourist

[0:44:30] Voice 9: commercial commercial land behind the driftwood adjacent rural and commercial zones for rental

[0:44:35] Voice 9: housing the rural land behind the driftwood was considered for residential housing in the early

[0:44:43] Voice 9: early 2000s. The policy issue of residential density adjacent the commercial zone was dominant,

[0:44:50] Voice 9: a town where there had been none. The rezoning was defeated with a level of public participation

[0:44:56] Voice 9: not seen since. But the policy issue of whether or not to concentrate residential and commercial

[0:45:03] Voice 9: land uses, an aspect of smart growth, hasn't been addressed by the community in the OCP,

[0:45:09] Voice 9: and it should be first, not last.

[0:45:13] Voice 9: The argument against the smart growth model used for expanding urban mainland areas

[0:45:18] Voice 9: on a predominant rural trust area island

[0:45:22] Voice 9: is that concentrating development adversely affects the natural entities

[0:45:28] Voice 9: which sustain the built environment, particularly the freshwater supply.

[0:45:33] Voice 9: The driftwood area is known for limited potable water

[0:45:37] Voice 9: and both trust area policy and the ocp policy caution against increasing density such as would

[0:45:45] Voice 9: be the case by converting seasonal tourist common tourist residential to full-time residential land

[0:45:52] Voice 9: use that's increasing density affordable housing units could be distributed on currently vacant

[0:46:00] Voice 9: magic lake subdivision lots each with access to water and sewer the crd is planning to fund such

[0:46:07] Voice 9: housing initiatives in the southern Gulf Islands electoral area and I would refer you to the 11th

[0:46:13] Voice 9: of May report by Justine Stark former finance trust planner which is extremely well written

[0:46:19] Voice 9: and recommends cautions against clustering or or packing housing together but rather to distribute

[0:46:28] Voice 9: it for that very area for that very reason for the LTC to simply amend the LUP and then the OCP

[0:46:36] Voice 9: PMAG schedule to prevent rental residential use on what is now tourist commercial zoning

[0:46:41] Voice 9: behind the driftwood would sidestep the precautions a landowner rezoning application

[0:46:45] Voice 9: offers. Please remove both rezoning proposals from the current land use bylaw review project.

[0:46:53] Voice 9: Thank you very much.

[0:46:57] Voice 5: Anyone else that wishes to address us? Sorry. My

[0:47:13] Voice 12: name is Jane Baker

[0:47:14] Voice 12: acre and I own property at 2680 Galleon Way. I moved off to the island because my husband

[0:47:22] Voice 12: went to long-term care and rented my own house. My husband has since died. I can't move back

[0:47:31] Voice 12: morally, ethically. I don't feel right about kicking out a renter who has two young boys,

[0:47:38] Voice 12: no place else that she could possibly rent on this island and continue to work. There's

[0:47:43] Voice 12: just no rentals a few years ago a survey was sent out shortly after my husband and i bought the

[0:47:49] Voice 12: property and it asked what solutions you might have for improving the rental situation or the

[0:47:57] Voice 12: housing situation on the island and right off the bat is that i'd be quite willing to build

[0:48:02] Voice 12: a carriage house or garage or the carriage house above it even now

[0:48:06] Voice 12: if it were possible for me to

[0:48:08] Voice 12: a garage carriage house anything extra on my property so that i can move back and live on it

[0:48:16] Voice 12: i would do that um my question i guess in a bit i would have liked to have been on the back of

[0:48:23] Voice 12: mr funk's presentation um is i can't add a basement i would but i'm my house is on a pad

[0:48:33] Voice 12: there's no other building on my property there's no footprint that i can do anything with i would

[0:48:39] Voice 12: have to add and you said at this point in time carriage houses as such as a separate entity

[0:48:47] Voice 12: why when we see what a terrific housing problem there is on this island

[0:48:57] Voice 4: land use bylaws evolve and that's the existing bylaws had not envisioned that type of housing

[0:49:04] Voice 4: so we're hearing today and as we go through our land use bylaw those are the things that we'll

[0:49:08] Voice 4: we'll be talking about

[0:49:09] Voice 12: so the other thing i'd like to point out is i realize that resources

[0:49:12] Voice 12: are short on the island and this is the biggest concern of all of course would be sewer and water

[0:49:18] Voice 12: even electrical infrastructure um i've been living in my rb full time and probably will be for a while

[0:49:26] Voice 12: until this young lady's son's call it could be a few years from now or she finds alternate housing

[0:49:32] Voice 12: um i can go sorry this could be too down to earth but i can go seven days with no problem

[0:49:38] Voice 12: whatsoever before i empty the tanks on my rv so each tank is 30 gallons so that's 60 gallons a

[0:49:45] Voice 12: week that means that my input is 60 gallons a week i don't know what you guys use in your houses but

[0:49:52] Voice 12: i guarantee you it's more than 60 gallons a week so i have to wonder why it isn't possible to set

[0:50:00] Voice 12: up small housing or tiny tiny housing in a complex somebody's got a piece of land 10 28 acres

[0:50:08] Voice 12: where you could you know have composting toilets water recovery um minimal water reuse

[0:50:19] Voice 12: you could use solar and actually the cost wouldn't be that high and i'm pretty sure we could get

[0:50:26] Voice 12: government funding or grants for it has anything like that been considered because again there's

[0:50:33] Voice 12: no trailer parks on this island it doesn't seem to be any place that we can put tiny homes keep

[0:50:39] Voice 12: it small when it's small you know you tend to only have one or two people but what it would support

[0:50:45] Voice 12: are the people who come to this island in the summertime to work and right now i don't see

[0:50:50] Voice 12: i don't see this being a long-term solution how long are we going to keep our stores and our

[0:50:56] Voice 12: restaurants in this island i don't know how many of the owners have talked to me over the years and

[0:50:59] Voice 12: that i can't i can't find housing for the people that i hire i can't find housing for them so

[0:51:11] Voice 12: has anybody come up with that that small tiny home solution a group home

[0:51:20] Voice 12: they're not big

[0:51:21] Voice 12: but young people don't need big places they need a bathroom a place to sleep

[0:51:25] Voice 12: a little place to sit little tiny kitchen they don't care about having big places they're here

[0:51:31] Voice 12: for six months at the most working do you have anything like that yeah so

[0:51:36] Voice 13: can i just respond so

[0:51:37] Voice 13: so this has been a conversation going on for a significant amount of time on the island so um

[0:51:42] Voice 13: so rob fenton is one of the big folks who's thinking about that um and if you haven't

[0:51:48] Voice 13: reached out to him it's worthwhile okay um he's probably in the book um and there's others who

[0:51:55] Voice 13: have been thinking about different affordable housing options um the crd largely has that sort

[0:52:00] Voice 13: of portfolio in space for our area it's really thinking about like what is the zoning that we

[0:52:08] Voice 13: can do and we'll get into this a little bit um probably as we go through the conversations today

[0:52:14] Voice 13: but a lot of our concerns and it's recorded on all the things in the last couple years

[0:52:19] Voice 13: is um has really been around issues of safety and housing um so allowing options that are

[0:52:26] Voice 13: are in character for the rural community and like fit with safe housing so we're not

[0:52:32] Voice 13: providing options that are going to put people in substandard housing for year-long things tiny

[0:52:39] Voice 13: homes i'm all for tiny homes if they're built properly and they're inspected so they're

[0:52:43] Voice 13: beautiful so but the crd doesn't allow for a tiny home to be a home like it's so that's a crd

[0:52:50] Voice 13: related building code issue so we have to that crd has to work through that issue before we

[0:52:56] Voice 13: could really zone for tiny crd

[0:52:57] Voice 12: doesn't allow tiny homes to be a home even though

[0:53:00] Voice 4: it's a home

[0:53:00] Voice 4: it's this building building so it's a professional issue and there is conversation adam olson has

[0:53:10] been very active in working with some tiny home contractors trying to get to

[0:53:17] Voice 4: ministry's attention

[0:53:19] Voice 4: attention that we would like the province to move on making that legal year-round residential use

[0:53:29] Voice 12: yeah i would live in a tiny home in order to get from home and

[0:53:31] Voice 13: so definitely feel free to reach out

[0:53:34] Voice 13: and have tea for like a longer conversation on this issue but um yeah i'm happy to have that

[0:53:38] Voice 13: conversation it's an interesting question all right

[0:53:40] Voice 10: and can i just briefly address this

[0:53:43] Voice 10: this LTC here has done the following things we have I think gone and kind of said preserve and

[0:53:51] Voice 10: protect well we've increased density we approved basement suites in secondary suites in Magic Lake

[0:53:57] Voice 10: and the islands here in doubling potentially the density unfortunately you can't force someone to

[0:54:02] Voice 10: build a basement suite you only have one building permit to my knowledge on Sunrise where they

[0:54:07] Voice 10: actually did that they rented it out so that's we we did that the second thing we did was put a

[0:54:11] Voice 10: temporary uh pause on bylaw enforcement uh people living in rvs because they're just you know they're

[0:54:18] Voice 10: coming out of covet and we thought well the next ltc can certainly deal with this issue if it

[0:54:23] Voice 10: becomes more of a problem but we're not having our bylaw enforcement go and kick people out of

[0:54:27] Voice 10: temporary housing currently right uh the other thing we've done is we've this this area is we

[0:54:34] Voice 10: have two areas zoned on north pentland currently for this tiny home village or what we just we need

[0:54:41] Voice 10: the money we need uh the political will of beyond our jurisdictional control as trustees we deal

[0:54:48] Voice 10: with land use planning right now we discuss this in other areas there are some trustees that think

[0:54:54] Voice 10: you know we should get more involved in housing uh but this trust trust committee has a plum tree

[0:54:59] Voice 10: court that couldn't get the money to build their expansion but they have all the plans drawn up

[0:55:04] Voice 10: this area that we're sitting on right here the anglican church is available for affordable

[0:55:08] Voice 10: housing units however uh the anglican church had some controversy in esplanade malls they don't

[0:55:14] Voice 10: want to touch controversy now we also have before us has been mentioned by mr sketch uh proposal to

[0:55:20] Voice 10: convert tourist commercial into uh rental zoning behind the driftwood so this ltc i mean like where

[0:55:29] Voice 10: do we stop with increasing density is the question because you know a trustee said to me uh that you

[0:55:36] Voice 10: You know, Hong Kong still has problems with homelessness.

[0:55:38] Voice 10: It still has problems where people have nowhere to live, right?

[0:55:42] Voice 10: And we've talked about densification on a small island.

[0:55:45] Voice 10: You know, it's not a problem that just is solved.

[0:55:49] Voice 10: However, solved immediately.

[0:55:51] Voice 10: However, this LTC, I think, has done everything we can

[0:55:55] Voice 10: to open up possibilities for people to find homes.

[0:55:58] Voice 10: Now, if you have a suggestion on what more we could do,

[0:56:01] Voice 10: I'm all ears for that.

[0:56:02] Voice 10: yeah

[0:56:03] Voice 12: obviously if you guys hands are tied behind your back i'm just saying that if i could build a

[0:56:08] Voice 12: carriage house so i could come home i would okay um so not being able to do that is obviously

[0:56:15] Voice 12: it's a problem that's not you guys and i need to go talk to someone

[0:56:18] Voice 13: the carriage house is something

[0:56:19] Voice 13: that

[0:56:19] Voice 6: one is actually

[0:56:21] Voice 13: in our account thank you

[0:56:24] Voice 13: thank you thank

[0:56:25] Voice 6: you jane anyone

[0:56:27] Voice 4: else that wishes

[0:56:27] Voice 4: to address this we're going to move into the fee bylaw conversation so you'll have an opportunity

[0:56:34] Voice 4: need to address this uh ask questions comments in a moment so that brings us to the next item

[0:56:42] Voice 4: on our agenda which is the piece by law 266

[0:56:46] Voice 10: no we're in the minutes we have to prove our

[0:56:47] Voice 10: no

[0:56:47] Voice 4: that comes next is

[0:56:49] Voice 10: it oh i'm sorry i don't know what okay

[0:56:52] Voice 4: it's uh just later in the meeting here

[0:56:57] Voice 4: so how would we like to do the community information meeting

[0:57:00] Voice 4: I

[0:57:02] Voice 3: could give a quick summary of sort of the steps that got us to where we are today, and then the trustees could obviously make their comments.

[0:57:12] Voice 3: Sure.

[0:57:17] Voice 4: Over to you.

[0:57:19] Voice 4: Okay,

[0:57:19] Voice 3: so FEE by-law, it's a trust-wide initiative, meaning all local trust committees are looking at this.

[0:57:26] Voice 3: It goes back to 2019.

[0:57:30] Voice 3: In 2019, the Regional Planning Committee, which is a committee of the Trust Council,

[0:57:38] started a review of fees.

[0:57:39] In

[0:57:40] Voice 3: May 2021,

[0:57:42] Voice 3: we endorsed a

[0:57:46] fee by-law, increased fees substantially

[0:57:50] from

[0:57:50] Voice 3: what it does have currently.

[0:57:53] Voice 3: And the goal of the Regional

[0:57:55] Voice 3: Planning Committee at that time was to more closely

[0:57:57] Voice 3: reflect the actual cost of the processing

[0:58:00] Voice 3: application. Governments can recover

[0:58:03] the

[0:58:07] Voice 3: application and most don't.

[0:58:08] Voice 3: The proposed fees in this by-law program would get

[0:58:14] Voice 3: closer. That was the goal. Looking at

[0:58:18] Voice 3: this over two years,

[0:58:19] Voice 3: June 2021,

[0:58:22] Voice 3: 2021 so almost a year ago now trust council requested local trust committees consider

[0:58:28] Voice 3: adoption of the new bylaw they are a new fee bylaw based on this fall 21 trust committee

[0:58:37] Voice 3: passed a resolution on federal trust committee passed a resolution staff to prepare draft bylaw

[0:58:42] Voice 3: which we did in january we enabled the fees bylaw until after the governance review was

[0:58:50] Voice 3: to the public uh the last meeting in april uh again received it and the community information

[0:59:02] meeting before the trust made to consider

[0:59:07] Voice 3: thank

[0:59:15] Voice 8: you very much all right

[0:59:16] Voice 5: trustees do you want to

[0:59:17] Voice 5: add anything uh

[0:59:23] Voice 10: yeah robert how do i explain this to someone at the pub how would you explain this

[0:59:29] Voice 10: complicated fee in precinct fee i mean relatively complicated to someone at the pub i would say

[0:59:37] Voice 3: the fees haven't been or

[0:59:38] Voice 10: sorry i sort of tea a coffee house i shouldn't just imply alcohol

[0:59:44] Voice 10: everyone's sober and assuming in your scenario so

[0:59:47] Voice 3: uh i would say the fees bylaw hasn't been

[0:59:50] Voice 3: increased for over 15 years we're recovering only a tiny proportion of the actual cost of

[0:59:56] Voice 3: processing the applications

[0:59:57] Voice 3: and the philosophical

[1:00:00] Voice 3: of the principle approach is the person making the application proposal should pay at least

[1:00:08] Voice 3: a proportion of the cost to go with the process in that application because otherwise the general

[1:00:14] Voice 3: taxpayers do and most local governments um struggle with this principle and they land

[1:00:21] Voice 3: somewhere in the middle developer making the application pays a portion of the cost and some

[1:00:29] Voice 3: of it it comes generally yeah okay

[1:00:36] Voice 10: so then my next question would be um why has this not been adopted

[1:00:44] for 15 years do you recall the justifications

[1:00:47] Voice 10: from previous trustees as to the reasons why they did

[1:00:50] Voice 10: not do this and why this is now on our trust committee so

[1:00:55] Voice 3: like the current process uh it's

[1:00:58] a model the existing fee bylaws were

[1:01:01] Voice 3: a very similar process many years ago eight years ago

[1:01:05] Voice 3: or whatever it was where trust council committee went through trust council trust council said yep

[1:01:13] Voice 3: the model fee bylaw we went over the customers went to open trust committees similarly there

[1:01:19] Voice 3: was some angst on the part of the trust committees about adopting it because again

[1:01:25] and eventually we thought that it and um they haven't been revisited since then

[1:01:36] Voice 3: okay with some

[1:01:37] Voice 3: minor amendment

[1:01:41] Voice 10: now at the last meeting i also asked you know what so that for a temporary use

[1:01:46] Voice 10: permit i think the current price is seven hundred a thousand excuse me a thousand now it's going to

[1:01:54] Voice 10: to be 2100 2150 is there a way to britain to explain to folks what where that money goes to

[1:02:03] Voice 10: like physically here's your check and then what happens or is it just kind of like well this is a

[1:02:10] Voice 10: lump sum and here you go because i think that's the crux of the issue is folks are not understanding

[1:02:17] Voice 10: where their money is going right now and is there a way to be as transparent as possible

[1:02:22] Voice 10: to explain to folks at the coffee shop well actually twenty one hundred dollars is spent

[1:02:29] Voice 10: because on this temporary use permit for let's say uh stvr short-term vacation uh there's you

[1:02:37] Voice 10: know eight hours because the person has to fill out the form and then that costs whatever 50 bucks

[1:02:43] Voice 10: an hour for the staff and then you see the breakdown of the cost is that possible is that

[1:02:48] Voice 10: something that's uh easily to to kind of write down so i can explain to folks where their money's

[1:02:54] Voice 10: going

[1:02:54] Voice 3: so that's some of the more detailed work the planning committee did back into some of those

[1:03:00] Voice 3: packages into those details but generally there's a few things and anyone who's to apply for a

[1:03:09] Voice 3: variance over the years kind of gets it it's like yeah they make their application then they're

[1:03:13] Voice 3: talking to the planner there's often changes this is back and forth planner comes out with a site

[1:03:19] Voice 3: visit uh that's got a cost associated with it uh then there's a notice prepared

[1:03:34] Voice 3: distance um you see the stack reports

[1:03:40] and then uh

[1:03:42] Voice 3: it's not just the planner's time there's also the planner's time and there's

[1:03:50] Voice 3: a multiplier okay

[1:04:00] Voice 10: so i'm understanding how to talk in the coffee shop i'd say the the cost

[1:04:05] Voice 10: of the fees are going on to the person applying less than it being rather than being spread out

[1:04:11] Voice 10: to all property owners and then i'd say the fees are going towards staff time so that's what you're

[1:04:18] Voice 10: paying for you're paying for the staff to process this physically that's where the cost largely

[1:04:23] Voice 10: there's other costs okay

[1:04:25] Voice 3: and

[1:04:28] Voice 10: yet but there still is no there's not necessarily there is so i'd have

[1:04:33] Voice 10: to go into the regional planning minutes or whatever and find out that they broke down

[1:04:38] Voice 10: hourly what it takes to process a short so say for example a short-term vacation rental temporary

[1:04:44] Voice 10: sperm yeah

[1:04:45] Voice 3: there was an example application okay

[1:04:47] Voice 10: and then they concluded that it's 20 that cost

[1:04:51] Voice 10: twenty one hundred dollars

[1:04:52] Voice 3: average cost the

[1:04:53] Voice 10: average cost okay okay those are sorry i'm

[1:04:57] Voice 10: dominating the questions um

[1:04:59] Voice 13: is there a plan for those notes to be dragged out of the financial

[1:05:06] Voice 13: planning committee to talk on points for just the

[1:05:09] Voice 5: regional plan uh not

[1:05:13] Voice 13: on my part okay so if you can

[1:05:17] Voice 13: make them figure out what the text is for a motion to add to the final conversation because if you

[1:05:22] Voice 13: pass the few violence i would want to also pass something that gives a one pager that we can take

[1:05:30] Voice 13: to the coffee shop with us to talk to people about and it would accompany all applications

[1:05:35] Voice 13: so people understand when they get the bill in front of them for this this is the breakdown

[1:05:39] Voice 13: wise that's not something we're just going to do nope i know

[1:05:43] Voice 13: and i actually think it should

[1:05:44] Voice 13: be done for the entire trust area that's all you should take okay so then we need a motion to put

[1:05:49] Voice 13: that for this council because i just don't want to lose traveling so that we recommend as a ltc

[1:05:56] that if we pass these that we pass them with the

[1:05:59] Voice 13: understanding that trust council will consider

[1:06:01] Voice 13: how to communicate this properly communications are nemesis in the test so all right um i think

[1:06:11] Voice 13: i'm mostly for

[1:06:13] Voice 10: community information maybe we can yeah

[1:06:15] Voice 13: so just let me think if i have any questions

[1:06:17] Voice 13: questions um so i guess one of the questions i had was there is when you look at the old

[1:06:27] Voice 13: document if i'm reading this correctly um the old document said for major types of applications it

[1:06:33] Voice 13: was like 7 800 is that the old number that's

[1:06:38] Voice 8: not worth the new one that's what

[1:06:40] Voice 5: i thought but it

[1:06:40] Voice 5: looked like it was for rezoning technically

[1:06:48] Voice 3: uh major 7800 that's

[1:06:56] Voice 13: the current numbers

[1:06:57] Voice 13: that's that's the that's the numbers that will change to what were the original numbers

[1:07:03] Voice 3: for 3 400 amendment thank you

[1:07:13] Voice 4: that's good to know all right let's say the other point is this

[1:07:20] Voice 4: fee by law has a built-in uh inflation increase so that you won't have to this

[1:07:27] Voice 4: issue where it gets left for 15 years before it gets updated again

[1:07:31] Voice 13: and the the other question

[1:07:33] Voice 13: i had was how many other islands so there are 13 local trust area trust committees right

[1:07:38] Voice 13: how many other islands have approved so we've just looked at this quite a few um

[1:08:05] Voice 3: So I just

[1:08:11] Voice 13: want to make that yesterday.

[1:08:13] Voice 3: It's quite a few.

[1:08:14] Voice 13: Okay, thank you.

[1:08:17] Voice 10: Yeah, do you have any concerns over folks that are not of means being impacted by this?

[1:08:23] Voice 10: like um what i mean by that is and maybe this is a question we can discuss after is you know

[1:08:29] Voice 10: temporary use permits are are incur have been encouraged by staff and by planners and i've

[1:08:34] Voice 10: been to many meetings before i was a trustee to kind of let folks try stuff out see if this works

[1:08:41] Voice 10: and i'm i'm wondering if the the new cost might deter or prevent you know local businesses from

[1:08:50] Voice 10: maybe you know trying something out under a temporary use permit because it's the cost is

[1:08:55] Voice 10: and the the hassle is such so astronomical uh now it's doubling by 100 whatever i'm just wondering

[1:09:03] Voice 10: you know if i guess i'm asking a political question staff but i i'm are there any concerns

[1:09:10] Voice 10: from staff that this may impact uh lower income folks trying to be involved uh in the democratic

[1:09:16] Voice 10: process.

[1:09:17] Voice 3: Sure. I mean, if that's a concern I personally would have for any, any sort of

[1:09:22] Voice 3: people, it's not necessarily, you know, sometimes people, we see people who are in a situation

[1:09:40] Voice 3: that's maybe not just a problem. It's not, it's not a there. There's also concerns about

[1:10:07] Voice 3: Yeah.

[1:10:17] Voice 10: So that, that there is an impact there potentially if, if, if what we don't want

[1:10:23] is to encourage folks to participate in illegal activities if they think they perceive the fees

[1:10:29] as being unreasonable and over overzealous

[1:10:33] Voice 10: then that you might may see an increase in

[1:10:36] Voice 10: illegal activity on on the island um can

[1:10:40] Voice 13: i pause this conversation until we get to the actual

[1:10:42] Voice 13: conversation well

[1:10:44] Voice 10: i was just asking uh planet gmo has been part of this discussion for 15 years

[1:10:48] Voice 10: just to

[1:10:48] Voice 4: your point fair enough

[1:10:50] Voice 4: there is a sponsorship opportunity for community groups

[1:10:54] Voice 4: and not-for-profits that are doing things so that is a route for those people all right well then

[1:11:01] we're going to this is your opportunity to have

[1:11:03] Voice 4: ask us questions or comments about about the bylaw

[1:11:07] Voice 4: and so similarly like we had earlier i'd just like you to step up forward and

[1:11:13] Voice 4: um again director questions to to us and uh i know he will be respectful um as always so please um

[1:11:25] Voice 4: we'd like to go first it's

[1:11:29] Voice 7: a brief question i understand chair patrick indicated there's

[1:11:32] an inflation adjustment process which will continue to increase these fees over the years

[1:11:38] my question would be why is there not a productivity improvement adjustment which

[1:11:43] of decreasing speeds because there surely is room for a more efficient process you know all these

[1:11:51] speeds of the islands because

[1:11:54] Voice 4: their average cost is all we're allowed to do there would have to

[1:11:59] Voice 4: be some checking type their efficiencies what is just

[1:12:03] Voice 3: generally i'd add you know we have the

[1:12:04] Voice 3: internal local planning services review over the last couple years we're implementing the

[1:12:09] Voice 3: the direction of that already has um now there's the governance

[1:12:16] Voice 5: review as well identifying

[1:12:18] Voice 5: recommendations

[1:12:18] Voice 3: um some of this will be coming to trust down to one of which coming to trust

[1:12:23] Voice 3: council in january just to allow staff to um issue development permits internally uh processing

[1:12:39] applications across the regional teams in a single you

[1:12:51] Voice 7: follow up if these things are happening

[1:12:53] Voice 7: mean if there's an automatic inflation adjustment the price will go up and understand how the cost

[1:13:05] will

[1:13:05] Voice 7: be adjusted downwards given the improvement here may take place so this seems to be only a

[1:13:15] Voice 7: ratchet up the possibility for improvement but no no no link between those improvements and

[1:13:23] actual people

[1:13:28] Voice 13: um so is there a plan i assume there is given the various conversations at

[1:13:34] Voice 13: test council to continue the monitoring of costing for permits generally so we will continue to

[1:13:42] Voice 13: understand what the average cost is uh

[1:13:45] Voice 3: the average cost of processing applications yeah different

[1:13:49] Voice 3: kinds and we're actually going to separate out we're going to try to well there's two things

[1:13:54] Voice 3: i guess one is the current time collection software trying to get is to fix it it's an

[1:14:02] Voice 3: in-house program so we can also separate out and plan our contract inquiries separately for

[1:14:08] Voice 3: yeah complications about the other thing is the grant the bulk of it purchasing almost certainly

[1:14:38] Voice 3: so

[1:14:42] Voice 13: i guess my question is i totally understand i've read all the governance report i've been

[1:14:47] Voice 13: on this particular issue for like three and a half years um and so what i would love to see

[1:14:53] Voice 13: is language that we could add to our bylaw so we could suggest um how we would

[1:15:00] Voice 13: monitor or adjust every year based on the new average cost data so like if we have the ongoing

[1:15:08] Voice 13: data for average cost of permits then once a year or once every two years or something we should be

[1:15:13] Voice 13: able to look at our fees by a lot and adjust it for the average cost data

[1:15:17] Voice 3: so i would say that

[1:15:18] Voice 3: would be again something that trust council should tell mutual planning committee to work

[1:15:23] Voice 3: absolutely

[1:15:23] Voice 8: but we can do it here first and then we can

[1:15:26] Voice 3: propagate it so i can't think of a way how

[1:15:34] Yeah,

[1:15:39] Voice 8: no, I get on that.

[1:15:44] Voice 3: Sure, probably.

[1:15:53] Voice 4: Good question.

[1:15:54] Voice 4: No, thank you, Don.

[1:15:57] Voice 14: Excuse me.

[1:15:58] Voice 14: Can I get the name of the last speaker, please?

[1:16:01] Voice 14: Don Corbin.

[1:16:02] Voice 14: Don?

[1:16:05] Voice 14: And if Planner Kojima could try and speak into his microphone more consistently, I'm losing you.

[1:16:12] Voice 1: Okay, thanks, Don.

[1:16:14] Voice 14: Thank you.

[1:16:14] Voice 14: you

[1:16:16] Voice 1: again i haven't read all this material so maybe you can just take a case of somebody

[1:16:25] Voice 1: developing a half acre lot in magic lake states without talking temporary use permits

[1:16:30] Voice 1: resumings variances just what would be the development fees that the trust would charge

[1:16:38] Voice 1: on an average half acre lot with a 2,400 square foot house on it?

[1:16:45] Voice 3: Well, if they don't need to make an application to us,

[1:16:47] Voice 3: we can't charge anything for that.

[1:16:49] Voice 3: That would be a building permit fee only.

[1:16:52] Voice 1: So there's no island trust fees

[1:16:55] Voice 1: that relate to the normal cost

[1:16:57] Voice 1: of development by the CRD?

[1:16:59] Voice 1: No.

[1:17:00] Voice 1: So, yeah,

[1:17:00] Voice 3: it's the CRD charges for charges of building permit fee.

[1:17:04] Voice 3: We have a function.

[1:17:05] Voice 3: The CRD has told us and the other regional districts,

[1:17:08] Voice 3: well in the trust area that we have to check the zoning for them and tell them whether or not the

[1:17:16] Voice 3: proposed house complies with zoning we don't get a fee for that can't charge a fee for that and to

[1:17:22] Voice 3: date the regional districts are not prone or interested in cost sharing or revenue sharing

[1:17:28] Voice 3: rather to do that function so this would not

[1:17:32] Voice 3: have an

[1:17:33] Voice 1: impact aside from the normal cost for

[1:17:39] Voice 1: development so

[1:17:40] Voice 13: i just want to stress the development permit because that's there are

[1:17:44] Voice 13: lots of development permits that cross over a magic lake so it magically so i live in a development

[1:17:49] Voice 13: permit area and i had to do a whole development process because i live on the waterfront

[1:17:53] Voice 13: like on the one lake and so um that idea of like how that would increase the cost so i

[1:18:02] Voice 13: do you know what the development permit application is trying to our current sort of what older one is

[1:18:07] Voice 13: only 200

[1:18:08] Voice 3: and it was purposely set that way by the local trust committee of the day when you

[1:18:15] Voice 3: adopted the development permit areas yeah as a boss leader if you like yeah

[1:18:21] Voice 13: so this one

[1:18:22] Voice 13: so mine i think falls into like the thousand dollar range now yeah um i think but understand

[1:18:30] Voice 13: understand that it wasn't just whatever it was a couple hundred dollars when I did it it was a

[1:18:34] Voice 13: couple hundred dollars plus a environmental report plus that you know because all the

[1:18:39] Voice 13: dps generally also come with development like professional reporting requirements I think

[1:18:45] Voice 1: this you know there's never a time to to a good time to increase things right so if you look at

[1:18:52] Voice 1: the total cost of development in terms of water, sewer, electrical cut, CRD, all the rest of it,

[1:19:01] Voice 1: and you're looking at trying to do something about affordable housing, the optics are not great at

[1:19:08] Voice 1: the time when you're doing a government's review that says there's ample ground for efficiencies,

[1:19:13] Voice 1: you've done a land use bylaw and a visioning thing all going on at once, and here for me suddenly

[1:19:21] Voice 1: way maybe it's high time this this appears on an agenda um so uh i'll leave that that's more

[1:19:35] Voice 4: michael michael sketch next time thank you michael

[1:19:41] Voice 9: sketch norris bender um i've mentioned this

[1:19:44] Voice 9: before but the fees bylaw does not allow or charges a surcharge makes a surcharge of 20

[1:19:52] Voice 9: percent for applications after the fact and i would like to see in that five fees bylaw

[1:19:58] Voice 9: um the ability for the lcc to hear um an applicant uh where there has been a legitimate

[1:20:06] Voice 9: um reason for application after the fact and if the the lcc were to determine that that was a

[1:20:14] Voice 9: reasonable reason for um a late application that they would waive the 20 search yard there's no

[1:20:22] Voice 9: provision for that in the in the bottle and my question would be why not i think it's a reasonable

[1:20:30] Voice 9: um caring um provision thank you thank

[1:20:37] Voice 4: you questions to ourselves i

[1:20:41] Voice 2: have to say something

[1:20:44] Voice 2: george george larue now as a business person and a bit of a math guy or numbers guy i find this

[1:20:50] Voice 2: really fast we're going to base this on the average cost of the applications we're not going

[1:21:00] Voice 2: to keep track of how much it takes to process individual applications so we have to work at

[1:21:05] Voice 2: the aggregate level of math so we have a bucket of costs the trust only does land use planning

[1:21:13] Voice 2: by extension the total cost of the trust should be divided by the total number of applications

[1:21:24] Voice 2: that's an interesting point secondly what happens two years from now when the number of applications

[1:21:32] Voice 2: reduces by half what happens to the average cost but double you allow for amendment of this every

[1:21:44] Voice 2: year your costs will be dependent upon the number of applications because you won't be reducing

[1:21:49] Voice 2: staff because there's half as many applications because you'll have other work that you'll fill

[1:21:55] Voice 2: in with there's no incentive in this to your point there's no incentive in here for efficiency

[1:22:03] Voice 2: i don't

[1:22:10] Voice 4: know if you're the local government act is specific about what we can charge for

[1:22:15] Voice 4: application right so we

[1:22:17] Voice 4: cannot

[1:22:18] Voice 3: exceed the average cost of processing that correct

[1:22:23] Voice 3: So it is only what's, there's a box for that.

[1:22:27] Voice 3: And in terms of efficiency, I'm not sure the fee bylaw is intended to drive efficiency.

[1:22:33] Voice 3: That's review, you know, the review of LPS, the government's review, and so on.

[1:22:41] Voice 3: And the initiatives to, you know, rock data or software and so on, those are things that

[1:22:47] Voice 3: we're

[1:22:53] Voice 5: going to do.

[1:22:56] Voice 5: Yeah.

[1:23:00] Voice 4: Did you hear it?

[1:23:00] Voice 4: Sorry, Cass.

[1:23:01] Voice 4: Thank you.

[1:23:02] Voice 15: uh yeah we're going through to a development program and uh based on the fees of the biologist

[1:23:12] Voice 15: the geologist the surveyor if somebody said to me before we bought the property

[1:23:18] Voice 15: that it's costing you 10k plus another 2200 per development permit i might pay twice about it

[1:23:27] Voice 15: but here we are uh the 2200 in my opinion is relative to anything else everything costs

[1:23:38] Voice 15: the bucks so it's it's not like one is way high compared to everything else it's relative

[1:23:46] Voice 15: and if you went to a garage to get your car fixed the guy is probably getting 40 bucks an hour

[1:23:54] Voice 15: but they're charging 150. just cost of doing business so i'm not suggesting that we should

[1:24:04] Voice 15: lower the price but i'm just saying that uh it's just basically the cost of doing business thank

[1:24:11] Voice 15: you anybody

[1:24:14] Voice 4: else questions comments all right if not we'll be discussing this later in the agenda

[1:24:22] Voice 4: and i really appreciate all your comments um as always your local trust committee does want

[1:24:28] Voice 4: want to hear from you and so please always uh reach out and have your voice heard okay

[1:24:37] Voice 4: so now i think we can finally get to the minutes there yeah

[1:24:42] Voice 10: i realize why i'm confused because in

[1:24:43] Voice 10: the agenda package the minutes are first and then there's data blurb and stuff so that's why

[1:24:50] Voice 10: all

[1:24:50] Voice 4: right so we have the the minutes from the april 28th meeting i know i have one minor

[1:24:56] Voice 4: to change it myself but are there any additions or corrections that need to be made to the minutes

[1:25:00] Voice 4: yeah

[1:25:01] Voice 10: i've got a couple um so for example in the minutes of last month's meeting the public

[1:25:07] Voice 10: comments from the public are not people are not identified also there was a request from trustee

[1:25:13] Voice 10: morrison uh because the public attending comment was don corbin and then don corbin after making

[1:25:18] Voice 10: his comments immediately left and trustee morrison wanted to note it that he immediately left after

[1:25:23] Voice 10: making the comments so i'm wondering

[1:25:25] Voice 8: if we can

[1:25:25] Voice 10: make an amendment to that um again what's that

[1:25:30] Voice 10: yeah sure um and uh why don't we

[1:25:34] Voice 4: do this one at a time so pat can have a chance

[1:25:36] Voice 4: i

[1:25:37] Voice 10: guess the question is like is that important i think it's important that folks

[1:25:42] Voice 10: identify themselves and we got a record of who they were the only thing is i can't exactly

[1:25:46] Voice 3: so i believe that the minutes guidelines are to not record and

[1:25:51] Voice 5: attribute them

[1:25:56] Voice 3: but it is practice to stand up

[1:25:59] Voice 3: i don't

[1:26:07] Voice 10: understand what that means so it's not a policy it's a policy it's

[1:26:12] Voice 3: a policy

[1:26:24] Voice 3: there but this was said by a member of the public that was simply so long but it's crap long-standing

[1:26:30] Voice 3: so i

[1:26:34] Voice 13: i would like names and if we could i don't know can we have this recorded or streamed right

[1:26:39] Voice 13: we do have the recordings so it would be nice to go back and know more because it is like the

[1:26:44] Voice 13: reason that we i think have long-standing practices because it's a community conversation

[1:26:48] Voice 13: and it's good for people in the community just to be clear

[1:26:53] Voice 8: that they're contributing

[1:26:56] Voice 8: yeah that's a trust council

[1:26:58] Voice 8: that's a discussion that's interesting so what do you want to do

[1:27:04] Voice 8: about this for the minutes are you asking for the names we've attributed i would like it the

[1:27:08] Voice 8: names could be added but

[1:27:09] Voice 10: the problem is i can't remember who probably attendee i don't know

[1:27:12] Voice 4: yeah we'd have to go back i mean we'd have to go back to this

[1:27:15] Voice 4: yeah if

[1:27:17] Voice 14: i could just add part of the difficulty being is i can't see the speakers and not being

[1:27:25] Voice 14: from north pender i don't recognize the people are like if it's an off-island recorder it's

[1:27:32] Voice 14: different for me on main island because i generally know um who's speaking so it is

[1:27:38] Voice 14: important for people to identify themselves if it's an off-island recorder how's

[1:27:43] Voice 8: it been going

[1:27:44] Voice 8: today

[1:27:44] Voice 14: um about 75 i've had a lot of cutting out and a lot of background interference but that's

[1:27:53] Voice 14: I also receive the tape afterwards when I'm transcribing the minutes so that I can go back

[1:28:02] Voice 14: and check as much as possible.

[1:28:05] Voice 13: So given that we're doing mixed technology and in person,

[1:28:09] Voice 13: can I suggest that just during the moments when we have public speaking, if one of the other staff

[1:28:14] Voice 13: just opens an email to you and drops all the names, like speaker one and the name, so that

[1:28:20] Voice 13: that you can actually have a list from the room.

[1:28:23] Voice 13: Is that possible for Kim or Robert,

[1:28:26] Voice 13: just to open an email to the recorder

[1:28:28] Voice 13: and just drop the names in?

[1:28:32] Voice 13: Yeah.

[1:28:32] Voice 13: We can write them down,

[1:28:33] Voice 18: but there's no guarantee that they'll get those.

[1:28:35] Voice 18: No, but

[1:28:36] Voice 13: as much as we could.

[1:28:37] Voice 13: And then just, yeah.

[1:28:38] Voice 18: If you better people,

[1:28:40] Voice 18: every time they speak, say their name clearly.

[1:28:42] Voice 18: That's the only

[1:28:43] Voice 14: way that we can get it.

[1:28:44] Voice 14: Yeah.

[1:28:45] Voice 10: Really the issue is we're having trouble

[1:28:47] Voice 10: finding minute takers on the island.

[1:28:49] Voice 10: Okay.

[1:28:50] Voice 10: Yeah.

[1:28:51] Voice 10: yeah great but so then i guess we'll have to approve the minutes by general consent for that

[1:28:55] Voice 10: last month i mean what else you want to do you want to do an investigation find out who these

[1:28:59] Voice 10: people were but it's not i'd rather just move on with the meeting you know i mean i just wanted

[1:29:04] Voice 10: to raise it just yeah i wasn't sure what the policy was robert clarified the policy and hopefully

[1:29:09] Voice 10: from every minute taker can we can slow down and make sure they speak uh their name to the

[1:29:13] Voice 10: minute so then i i don't have any changes to the next

[1:29:17] Voice 13: so the i would like to change about

[1:29:19] Voice 13: me recording the dawn of the meeting right after he criticized my reputation or however that went

[1:29:26] Voice 13: down how would you like that noted um just immediately following the comment that was about

[1:29:34] Voice 13: from him um that

[1:29:38] Voice 4: was the public attendee number one wasn't it

[1:29:41] Voice 13: can you give me the page number here oh

[1:29:43] Voice 4: sorry page four you've

[1:29:57] Voice 14: frozen yeah i think it's

[1:30:01] Voice 14: Yes, I am. Thank you.

[1:30:04] Voice 13: Yeah, so if we can, at the bottom of public attendee one, just make a note that I requested, so Trustee Morrison requested, it's on page four, on page four, that Trustee Morrison requested to note that public attendee one, Don Corbin, left the room.

[1:30:19] Voice 14: Okay.

[1:30:23] Voice 13: Left the meeting.

[1:30:25] Voice 13: Did you get that, Pat?

[1:30:26] Voice 14: Yes, I did. Thank you.

[1:30:28] Voice 4: Thank you.

[1:30:29] Voice 4: I also had one very minor change on page four under the chair's report.

[1:30:33] Voice 14: Yes.

[1:30:34] Voice 14: The

[1:30:34] Voice 4: last bullet, it said the EC will be meeting with the MOTI in May.

[1:30:40] Voice 4: That was the Salt Spring Island Local Trust Committee.

[1:30:45] Voice 14: Okay.

[1:30:46] Voice 14: Thank you.

[1:30:48] Voice 14: With MOTI.

[1:30:50] Voice 14: Meeting with MOTI?

[1:30:51] Voice 4: Yeah.

[1:30:51] Voice 4: It was just replaced EC with Salt Spring.

[1:30:53] Voice 4: Okay.

[1:30:54] Voice 14: Thank you.

[1:30:58] Voice 4: Any other changes?

[1:30:59] Voice 4: No.

[1:31:00] Voice 4: can we approve the minutes as amended through general consent yes thank

[1:31:05] Voice 6: you okay

[1:31:07] Voice 4: the next

[1:31:08] Voice 4: year is that we have the agricultural advisory planning commission minutes here for our

[1:31:13] Voice 4: information and i thank the uh members of the agricultural advisory planning committee

[1:31:19] Voice 4: commission for their work um

[1:31:22] Voice 8: yeah so no it

[1:31:25] Voice 8: would be if it pertains to this

[1:31:26] Voice 8: discussed well they

[1:31:28] Voice 10: they made a motion uh that they reviewed the staff memorandum of april 19th

[1:31:34] Voice 10: recommends the maximum health size on any lands classified as alr landfall at the al

[1:31:40] Voice 10: you are and that any rules on lots greater than 16 acres have the same house sizes limits asset

[1:31:45] Voice 10: by the al you are so uh do we need to respond to them or i

[1:31:50] Voice 4: think that's something for us to

[1:31:52] Voice 4: considered in the land use bylaws so i would recommend we take that yeah something like that

[1:31:57] Voice 10: okay sure sounds good yeah okay then i'm sorry yeah

[1:32:00] Voice 13: it can if we're i'm just wanting to catch

[1:32:03] Voice 13: us before we go tonight so i'm good for us to approve the minutes but we

[1:32:07] Voice 4: don't approve them

[1:32:07] Voice 4: we receive them yeah yeah they approve right yes yeah

[1:32:13] Voice 13: are we moving on tonight now uh yes we are

[1:32:16] Voice 13: are you ready can i ask this for a five minute break it turns out that two months ago i did

[1:32:20] Voice 13: actually slip the desk so i'm having trouble sitting so if i can if we can just take a five

[1:32:24] Voice 13: minute break nope that's

[1:32:25] Voice 4: fine so uh we're just going to take a five minute break the machine

[1:32:29] Voice 4: is still here recording and uh uh live streaming so if you're speaking could

[1:32:59] Voice 11: you tell me generally

[1:33:00] Voice 11: how many people there are in the public that are attending today

[1:46:01] Voice 4: yes i'm back

[1:46:06] Voice 14: yes i was blacked out there for a bit but okay

[1:46:11] Voice 14: all right

[1:46:12] Voice 4: thank you yes we are thank you so much that was weird

[1:46:21] Voice 5: Yes

[1:46:22] Voice 4: we are. Sorry about that folks, we're back.

[1:46:27] Voice 4: Okay, all

[1:46:30] Voice 7: right,

[1:46:33] Voice 4: gonna call, get back

[1:46:34] Voice 4: to order after a recess. We're on item 9.1 on the agenda, page 17 on the agenda package,

[1:46:42] Voice 4: follow-up action list. Are there any questions for staff or any items that staff need to bring

[1:46:47] Voice 4: to our attention uh

[1:46:48] Voice 3: i think that's that can update you that phil's trying to set up the

[1:46:51] Voice 3: meeting with the fire department it's supposed to happen both this is around the sdrs

[1:47:01] Voice 13: can we also have do we have an agenda for that meeting yet

[1:47:06] Voice 3: we were going to meet with the staff we're going to meet with the fire department

[1:47:10] Voice 3: staff okay

[1:47:12] Voice 13: we're not meeting with them

[1:47:13] Voice 3: not less we could meet with them yeah yeah

[1:47:22] Voice 13: that's fine i

[1:47:23] Voice 13: guess the the other question that i would love it if you talked about with them is like i know that

[1:47:28] Voice 13: they had a plan for water for like ponds and securing um water reservoirs across the summer

[1:47:34] Voice 13: um access so like access to some of the private ponds or just just a water system to be able to

[1:47:41] Voice 13: to fight fire across the island.

[1:47:43] Voice 13: I was just curious if they needed any additional things

[1:47:45] Voice 13: from us related to that, because I

[1:47:47] Voice 13: know that there were some concerns about,

[1:47:49] Voice 13: they were working on private agreements to have access,

[1:47:53] Voice 13: but it would also be good to know

[1:47:55] Voice 13: for their long-term planning if there's

[1:47:57] Voice 13: a goal to have more public designated access

[1:48:00] Voice 13: for that purpose.

[1:48:04] Voice 5: Any other questions or comments on the

[1:48:06] Voice 4: follow-up action list?

[1:48:08] Voice 5: That

[1:48:10] Voice 4: brings us to correspondence.

[1:48:12] Voice 4: correspondence we have two pieces of correspondence on the that we have in the package first is from

[1:48:21] robert fenton on recreational vehicles

[1:48:23] Voice 4: on page 23.

[1:48:27] Voice 10: so what i don't understand what did

[1:48:29] Voice 10: what happen at the crd level does anybody anyone have an idea i

[1:48:37] Voice 4: look he's reporting it looks like

[1:48:40] Voice 4: he went and had a meeting i think that's what he's telling us about um i can tell you about

[1:48:45] Voice 4: about tiny homes on wheels that Salt Spring,

[1:48:50] Voice 4: Salt Spring Island tiny home contractors

[1:48:54] Voice 4: have put together a proposal for Adam Olson

[1:49:01] Voice 4: to bring to Minister Eby.

[1:49:03] Voice 4: Minister Eby had suggested we sandbox or pilot tiny homes

[1:49:07] Voice 4: to sort out some of these issues.

[1:49:09] Voice 4: And we're like, well, wait a minute, they're already here.

[1:49:12] Voice 4: Why don't we just use the sandbox being the ones

[1:49:15] Voice 4: that are already built and you know people are living in as a um you know as a way to answer

[1:49:23] Voice 4: some of the issues and find them because right now they are not certified for year round for

[1:49:29] Voice 4: residential use at all tiny homes on wheels i

[1:49:33] Voice 10: was mainly interested in the correspondence because it

[1:49:36] Voice 10: says dave howell has like so rob saying dave howe our crd director has advised that he will support

[1:49:43] Voice 10: a request from the pender housing coalition uh that i'd be allowed to speak with the crd directors

[1:49:48] Voice 10: at that meeting and request the crd directors pass a resolution requesting the provincial

[1:49:53] Voice 10: government consider changing the code to allow for rhts to be considered accommodation legal

[1:49:59] Voice 10: under the code so he wants us to pass us the same resolution but we had told him i thought to go to

[1:50:07] Voice 10: the crd first and speak to the board of directors and ask them what they think first because that's

[1:50:12] Voice 10: their department building and then so i understand what happened in the chronological thing or

[1:50:18] Voice 10: whatever rob's trying to get done here

[1:50:19] Voice 13: so my my my sort of he wants us to get this done and get

[1:50:24] Voice 13: anybody passing motions is my take on this correspondence and my answer

[1:50:28] Voice 13: to it is no not

[1:50:29] Voice 13: total crd ways in because it's not our box and i just really don't want to i i just want to have

[1:50:37] Voice 13: the crd own their responsibility basically that's where it boils down to and once they have like

[1:50:43] Voice 13: named what what they're willing to back then i think we can say something or not

[1:50:49] Voice 5: yeah so

[1:50:50] Voice 13: and that's what we had decided on before so i don't think there's anything to that so that

[1:50:54] Voice 13: my answer to passing motion now would be no i want to wait and see what crd does

[1:50:59] Voice 13: the issue

[1:51:00] Voice 4: it's like we can consider citing a use but it's for legally the buildings that are

[1:51:06] Voice 4: considered yeah you know for residential and

[1:51:08] Voice 13: that's that's the catch right because basically

[1:51:11] Voice 13: if it becomes uh if they change the building code to include tiny homes we almost don't even need

[1:51:16] Voice 13: to do anything because like everything's already zoned for like live the halls like we may need

[1:51:22] Voice 13: to alter something slightly if they do different classifications but really right now like we've

[1:51:29] Voice 13: just said we're densities like densities here here here here and so if they shift the form of

[1:51:35] Voice 13: a building what's counted in the building we may need to adjust something slightly but it's not

[1:51:39] Voice 13: necessarily a massive rework for us it might be like even a technical edit at some level to like

[1:51:45] Voice 13: think about so but we can't do anything until they change that so yeah

[1:51:50] Voice 10: well rob said he's going to be

[1:51:52] Voice 10: here at the meeting i just wanted to bring up his issues um i was just surprised to see here

[1:51:58] Voice 10: our crd director support potentially this change um when the crd actually is in the best position

[1:52:06] to really take leadership in uh creating more affordable housing options for islanders

[1:52:13] uh that that the

[1:52:14] Voice 10: crd director would approve recreational vehicles for housing and change

[1:52:18] Voice 10: the building code i just the policy is just not clear to me what what where the crd stands on this

[1:52:24] Voice 10: would be interesting to find out from their meeting what they have to say and i certainly

[1:52:27] Voice 10: agree with you just more so with the direction there so i just want to bring that up just

[1:52:32] Voice 4: receive that for now 11.1 1.2 is the crd pender parks recreational zoning um if i may just give

[1:52:43] Voice 18: a bit of an overview so this is the letter from crd staff and also the pender parks and rec

[1:52:51] Voice 18: Right, Commission, to include in the land use model review

[1:52:55] Voice 18: that the LTC is doing right now,

[1:52:57] Voice 18: to possibly add in the water sick zone a community dock use,

[1:53:01] Voice 18: and it would be the same dimensions of the private docks

[1:53:05] Voice 18: that are permitted on Magic Lake,

[1:53:06] Voice 18: and also rezone the Auckland portion.

[1:53:10] Voice 18: It's a very small strip, but it's currently some rural residential,

[1:53:13] Voice 18: so that would have to be rezone to a community park use,

[1:53:17] Voice 18: and also the OCP designation would have to change.

[1:53:20] Voice 10: sort of planter stock build that so that's gone but that's no uh i don't know the appropriate

[1:53:24] Voice 10: thing no person's land yeah it's

[1:53:27] Voice 10: not rural residential it

[1:53:28] Voice 18: is no rural residential the

[1:53:30] Voice 10: strip that's called magic lake park yeah but that's on

[1:53:33] Voice 18: the northern end yeah

[1:53:35] Voice 10: wait not the

[1:53:36] Voice 10: burn we're talking about the

[1:53:38] Voice 18: other end the

[1:53:39] Voice 10: other end is a road yep

[1:53:41] Voice 18: and there's a small strip that's

[1:53:43] Voice 18: rural residential community park so

[1:53:46] Voice 13: where they have the the winter um festival there

[1:53:49] Voice 13: there. Like the big

[1:53:53] Voice 18: map here.

[1:54:00] Voice 18: Really hard to see. But this

[1:54:02] Voice 18: little strip here. This is actually zoned rural residential

[1:54:06] Voice 18: rating here. So that portion there would have to be three

[1:54:08] Voice 18: zones to allow. So we'll include those amendments as part of

[1:54:16] Voice 18: your. Yeah,

[1:54:18] Voice 13: I think that's probably worthwhile just to get

[1:54:21] Voice 13: it because it is actually being used as a park right now so that for folks who can't see it is

[1:54:26] Voice 13: just the end of the lake by privateer's road where it goes up there and that's already considered a

[1:54:32] Voice 13: park you want to see

[1:54:34] Voice 3: the new revolution right now just included in my last 225 and 229 223.

[1:54:41] Voice 3: 3223.

[1:54:43] Voice 5: Yeah.

[1:54:44] Voice 13: What that resolution sounds like.

[1:54:48] Voice 13: Just

[1:54:48] Voice 10: I was on top of this two years ago. So the fact that you're telling me this is rural residential.

[1:54:56] Voice 10: Does that mean you went and investigated further since, like, I asked Justine Stark at the CRD, because here's the site plans I have, and it's just a road.

[1:55:06] Voice 10: It's not rural.

[1:55:06] Voice 10: So

[1:55:07] Voice 3: roads are zoned, right?

[1:55:08] Voice 10: So that road is zoned rural residential.

[1:55:10] Voice 3: yeah yeah but whenever the zoning was created back in the 60s yeah it was just drawn along

[1:55:15] Voice 3: but it's

[1:55:17] Voice 10: actually serving as a park right yeah yeah yeah

[1:55:20] Voice 10: so okay so justin justin wasn't clear

[1:55:23] Voice 10: on this that's really that's interesting

[1:55:24] Voice 3: it's pretty cheap um detail yeah what the bathroom

[1:55:33] Voice 3: extends to so

[1:55:35] Voice 10: right now there's a whole bunch of canoes on a rural residential thing and so we're

[1:55:39] Voice 10: in the zone we've zoned it for community service community

[1:55:43] Voice 18: park community

[1:55:44] Voice 10: parks yeah yeah community

[1:55:45] Voice 18: and

[1:55:46] Voice 10: then allow potentially them to build up okay thank you that solves that long-standing

[1:55:53] Voice 10: mystery of what was wanted yeah so that's great thank you

[1:55:55] Voice 13: so we're taking a new emotion now or

[1:55:57] Voice 13: yeah well why don't we bring it into the land use pilot discussion kim but you can do that all right

[1:56:03] Voice 4: so we'll pick this up in a few moments uh was there other correspondence you wanted to discuss

[1:56:09] Voice 13: I have one more question about the dock, the correspondence with the park.

[1:56:13] Voice 13: It's different from what we just talked about.

[1:56:15] Voice 13: So I just want to make sure that, do we need to then also include the dock, like some kind

[1:56:25] Voice 13: of a motion for zoning the dock too?

[1:56:28] Voice 13: That's right.

[1:56:29] Voice 13: Because like one of the things that, and this gets into, like these are sort of remedy community

[1:56:37] Voice 13: community-based things versus the we can talk about it later but the two that were brought

[1:56:41] Voice 13: up earlier about rezonings which were the fort wash and the dripwood this one i feel

[1:56:47] Voice 13: like is much more just a remedy of like past dumb zoning kind of issues so um but i don't

[1:56:55] Voice 13: know if the zoning for the dock falls right like the the land i agree needs to be community

[1:57:00] Voice 13: park the dock i'm not sure if that should be a separate you know ltc sponsored rezoning so that

[1:57:07] Voice 13: it no because we're still going to have community conversations about the whole of the lub so i

[1:57:11] Voice 13: would also like a motion to have the dock included in the lub review because then it can be discussed

[1:57:18] Voice 13: by people and if we need to pull it out because people think it's a separate reason to do that

[1:57:23] Voice 13: but it would be good to just put it in and have communication okay sorry that was a processing

[1:57:28] Voice 13: processing verbally sorry but that's all right all right any other correspondence yeah just i

[1:57:34] Voice 10: want to know okay so rob fenton wrote us regarding uh supporting uh you know travel trailers as

[1:57:41] housing essentially i

[1:57:43] Voice 10: want to know that michael simons who was a member of our board of variants

[1:57:46] Voice 10: at one point and uh he wrote a number of correspondences and he offered a counterpoint

[1:57:52] Voice 10: um without proper regulation of any sort of random trailers uh they could become permanent

[1:57:57] Voice 10: installations regardless of what standards they were built to how they were maintained

[1:58:00] Voice 10: the argues by definition these types of units were never intended as permanent residences and

[1:58:05] Voice 10: they were not designed or built to appropriate standards the visual effects of allowing

[1:58:09] Voice 10: proliferation of such installations should not be neglected either also consider that such units

[1:58:14] Voice 10: would potentially add to the burden on infrastructure without adding to the property

[1:58:17] Voice 10: tax base for supporting the infrastructure i just wanted to note that was i'm not sure if that was

[1:58:21] Voice 10: added to the public record or what have you but there are we aren't just hearing the same one

[1:58:26] Voice 10: inside of the argument there's two sides to this discussion i just wanted to raise those issues

[1:58:30] Voice 4: any other correspondence okay um that will take us on to um applications and referrals

[1:58:40] Voice 4: um we have 12.1 which is a salt spring referral this uh just so you know this is very early this

[1:58:48] this is uh uh this was intended to go out

[1:58:52] Voice 4: for referral in a research kind of capacity of

[1:58:55] Voice 4: of improving the by-law to make it work.

[1:59:00] Voice 4: So just know that it is in a very rough early form

[1:59:06] Voice 4: for a by-law.

[1:59:08] Voice 4: But so as you think of, if you wanna make comments, it's-

[1:59:13] Voice 10: Well, can I ask you a question?

[1:59:14] Voice 10: Sure, go ahead.

[1:59:15] Voice 10: So, I mean, it's kind of maybe a philosophical question,

[1:59:18] Voice 10: Chair Patrick, because I did bring up the issue earlier.

[1:59:20] Voice 10: I'm just curious to know your thinking on this.

[1:59:22] Voice 10: Salt Spring has issues with housing.

[1:59:24] Voice 10: Everybody knows that.

[1:59:25] Voice 10: there's a lot of political discussion about it um you know that the decision to increase density

[1:59:31] Voice 10: you know how do how have you how's your local trust committee come up about that and i guess

[1:59:37] Voice 10: i guess what i'm saying is um you can certainly increase density and it'll help people temper

[1:59:42] Voice 10: you know for a couple let's say a decade or two then more people come and then at what point do we

[1:59:50] Voice 10: you know the philosophical question at what point do we say just a second here

[1:59:53] Voice 10: you know how much

[1:59:56] Voice 4: more density can we take well this is this is

[2:00:00] Voice 4: really, say, not a density question. You have more liberal suite and cottage bylaws than Salt

[2:00:07] Voice 4: Spring has. We have probably one of the most strict suite and bylaw of cottage in the entire

[2:00:15] Voice 4: Islands Trust area. In fact, we only have seasonal cottages as the only thing that's allowed. So this

[2:00:22] Voice 4: bylaw is really about saying where you can build a seasonal cottage, which you think of it, when do

[2:00:27] Voice 4: people use their seasonal cottages right when our

[2:00:29] Voice 4: water is the most restrictive anyway um so what's

[2:00:34] Voice 4: the difference between a seasonal cottage versus a full-time cottage being used for residences so

[2:00:40] Voice 4: this final is basically saying if you can have a seasonal cottage why can't you have a primary

[2:00:46] Voice 4: residence and then have one either a secondary suite a cottage or the carriage houses that

[2:00:53] Voice 4: you've heard discussed as long as you have just only one of those additional items to your primary

[2:00:58] Voice 4: residents where you're already allowed to smoke out it so it's not a increase in densities it's a

[2:01:06] Voice 4: redefinition of use i guess you could say yeah um and um what we're hoping to see in here is if you

[2:01:14] Voice 4: look at central sandwich has a covenant requirement so that you don't just it's not an outright use

[2:01:20] Voice 4: that you would have to covenant that use so that it would be used for rental full-time rental

[2:01:26] Voice 4: purposes cannot be short-term vacation rental cannot be stratified and uh but could be used as a

[2:01:33] Voice 4: caretaker employee family use um so we're looking at some mechanisms so that they're not you know

[2:01:43] Voice 4: used for other other reasons it's

[2:01:46] Voice 10: interesting so you said salt spring had us very strict had more

[2:01:49] Voice 10: strict rules regarding densification or housing or intensity or what what was do you recall in

[2:01:55] Voice 10: your history of understanding salt spring politics what was the reasoning for that

[2:01:58] Voice 10: strictness of the bylaws like why were they so what why was that the case

[2:02:03] Voice 4: robert knows the answer

[2:02:04] Voice 3: no i don't know the answer specifically about salt spring but if you go back to all southern

[2:02:08] Voice 3: gold violence bylaws they had the same provisions they were seasonal cabins

[2:02:14] Voice 3: 500 square feet typically and all the southern

[2:02:16] Voice 3: gold violence changed their bylaws about 25 to

[2:02:19] Voice 3: 30 years ago to make them cottages that could be rented or used or used by family basically

[2:02:28] Voice 3: So this

[2:02:29] Voice 4: is, we've had a severe loss of rental housing just like you have. And so that this is an attempt to, you know, open the restrictions on those cottages but focus them more toward that rental market, not just an outright use.

[2:02:50] Voice 4: Yeah,

[2:02:50] Voice 10: I guess it's mainly having a philosophical discussion. It's like, okay, so the act of the Islands Trust states that we're here to preserve and protect, you know, for the benefit of British Columbians.

[2:03:01] Voice 10: You know, how do you, where does this lead is what I'm wondering. Like, it sounds like you guys are doing kind of a, the approach is more exploratory. Is that right?

[2:03:12] Voice 10: We

[2:03:12] Voice 4: want to get this bylaw right. So that's why we kind of did this early referral. It was intended to be more of a research. We wanted to know, so Central Saanich requires this covenant. Is it working? Is it working to restrict that type of housing to be available to rental?

[2:03:28] Voice 4: so we wanted to take a more inquisitive approach to our referral processes like this was intended

[2:03:33] Voice 4: to be so we're kind of in a research phase of making sure because we want to get it right we

[2:03:38] Voice 4: want to get this bylaw right so that we're not creating housing that turns into yeah anyone can

[2:03:43] Voice 4: just move here we have a severe uh shortage of housing for the workforce our hospital is down

[2:03:49] Voice 4: 35 vacant positions right now every you know there's no place for anybody to the rental

[2:03:56] Voice 4: rental markets collapsed so um we we on salt spring are the housing project that this is being

[2:04:03] Voice 4: created under recognizes that the mandate of section three also refers to a healthy diverse

[2:04:10] Voice 4: community okay

[2:04:11] Voice 10: last question i don't want to sound like dylan friedman but here i go it's like

[2:04:16] Voice 10: should then the philosophical question be i'm not like i don't have an answer for this it's just

[2:04:21] Voice 10: how it helps it helps me delivery should shouldn't then the market deal with itself like if we don't

[2:04:26] Voice 10: have a hospital we don't have workers for it well then people move you know like should that be more

[2:04:33] Voice 10: the approach like or should we be trying to kind of constantly stop the bleeding of the you know

[2:04:41] Voice 4: i was gonna say this is about equity as well i hear people are still people are moving to the

[2:04:46] Voice 4: islands people have money they can afford to build the houses we're losing people who have

[2:04:55] Voice 4: lived here for decades who've had to leave the islands because they have nowhere to live

[2:05:00] Voice 4: so it's it's the who do we need to have in our community who needs to be living on our islands

[2:05:07] Voice 4: I want to live on an island that has a diverse population yeah that's important to me so one

[2:05:14] Voice 13: One of the things that I think about this is, and so I lived in Boulder for a number

[2:05:20] Voice 13: of years, and Boulder had this problem in the 50s and 60s, kind of 60s-ish, and they

[2:05:26] Voice 13: had a really interesting conversation related to exactly that, like, how do we actually

[2:05:30] Voice 13: foster a really diverse community that's not necessarily, like, segregated and, like, you

[2:05:37] Voice 13: know, that's more interwoven in the community, right?

[2:05:39] Voice 13: So it's not like an affordable housing development all in one area that's, like, you know, run

[2:05:43] Voice 13: down or anything like that and so one of the things that they did at the time was they because

[2:05:48] Voice 13: they can find the city because they realized they didn't want the city encroaching onto the

[2:05:52] Voice 13: surrounding area that the value of being there was the character of being in the mountains and

[2:05:57] Voice 13: having all the space around it so by by drawing a line around the city itself and saying there's

[2:06:03] Voice 13: no development the rest of these spaces are going to be protected in farms and for local food

[2:06:09] Voice 13: production in parks and whatever they jacked up the price of property in boulder right because

[2:06:15] Voice 13: it's finite now so but what they did as a alternative measure to handle the affordable

[2:06:19] Voice 13: housing problem is anytime you redevelop property um you have to have 25 or 20 of the property has

[2:06:27] Voice 13: to be affordable housing with a covenant for like 25 years on

[2:06:30] Voice 8: and

[2:06:31] Voice 13: so that allows for a constant kind

[2:06:34] Voice 13: of flexible housing situation is integrated into the whole of the city and i think that's a really

[2:06:41] Voice 13: interesting idea it's a little bit trickier in a rural setting to figure that out because you're

[2:06:48] Voice 13: not saying necessarily that a single property has multiple deadlines on it although in this case

[2:06:55] Voice 13: potentially you are but putting a covenant on secondary suites or other things that they can't

[2:07:01] Voice 13: be missing and we we're doing that to some degree already that they can't automatically be um

[2:07:07] Voice 13: that cottages and secondary suites can't automatically be for short-term rental that

[2:07:12] Voice 13: they have to be for long-term rental or caretakers or whatever like that allows for lots of

[2:07:20] Voice 13: possibilities like you were saying earlier for diversifying housing stock already in our landscape

[2:07:26] Voice 13: without having to build a big complex that's

[2:07:29] Voice 4: the concept of this is trying to take advantage of

[2:07:31] Voice 4: built existing density yeah so but when

[2:07:34] Voice 13: one last point to your broader philosophical question is

[2:07:38] Voice 13: there's still some line that we have to draw in the sand if we want this to be a protected area

[2:07:44] Voice 13: in terms of the trust mandate that you can't endlessly increase that density right like you

[2:07:50] Voice 13: have to there has to be some line on it well

[2:07:53] Voice 10: yeah that's why i guess what i'm saying is like

[2:07:54] Voice 10: Like if politics, of course, like you're going to look like a hero if you go around saying houses for everyone.

[2:08:00] Voice 10: And really the tricky issue is saying, wait a second, what are the impacts on our local community?

[2:08:06] Voice 10: Where are we going with this?

[2:08:08] Voice 10: And what is the long-term vision for this?

[2:08:10] Voice 10: And so I'm not sure exactly how to answer the bylaw referral, you know, but we want to support any, I certainly want to support anything that helps us better understand what's going on, you know.

[2:08:23] Voice 10: I don't want to

[2:08:23] Voice 4: address the hero comment because I know that was directed to me.

[2:08:26] Voice 4: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

[2:08:29] Voice 10: no, no, no.

[2:08:31] Voice 4: The key thing that is important is, like I said, is a diverse, healthy community.

[2:08:39] Voice 4: Susan Lowe from the Ministry of Housing or whatever David Eby's ministry is called, it's a long name, she talked to the ABI-CC last month.

[2:08:48] Voice 4: and she talked extensively about like housing needs assessments and the things that we

[2:08:53] Voice 4: traditionally do make us sort of talk about them you know sort of this other group of people that

[2:09:01] Voice 4: need to be housed she said she said we should start with the conversation of who do we need

[2:09:07] Voice 4: in our community what is our community what do we need here what kind of housing do they need

[2:09:12] Voice 4: sort of this more philosophical conversation and then look and say well our land use bylaws

[2:09:18] Voice 4: us aligned are we aligned with those needs are we you know are we creating that and that's you know

[2:09:24] Voice 4: some of the things that we haven't done and we've created a product that is desirable as we know

[2:09:31] Voice 4: people are coming and paying huge money for these houses and um and we didn't pay attention i mean

[2:09:38] Voice 4: we as a regulatory body so it's making sure that we have that and we've lost that we've lost that

[2:09:46] Voice 4: that diversity of options so it's we need options of houses to match you know the options of who the

[2:09:53] Voice 4: people are yes sorry trust me um

[2:09:56] Voice 13: so just feedback i have feedback on this um so feed and i'm for

[2:10:02] Voice 13: some reason it's the most slippery page on my package what what page am i supposed to be it's

[2:10:08] Voice 13: 26 right 26. yeah okay i don't know why um love feedback i don't like this draft by law

[2:10:17] Voice 13: okay so the thing i like about what i see here is i like the definition of

[2:10:26] Voice 13: uh accessory dwelling unit that it actually makes for a varied type of use of secondary options

[2:10:34] Voice 13: and it names even though we don't necessarily have approval for the building code once the

[2:10:39] Voice 13: the building code would come through,

[2:10:40] Voice 13: it would name accessory dwelling units

[2:10:43] Voice 13: to include secondary suites, tiny homes,

[2:10:45] Voice 13: garden suites, seasonal cottages,

[2:10:48] Voice 13: or full-time rental cottages

[2:10:50] Voice 13: that can be placed on an adjacent

[2:10:52] Voice 13: or new unit on the same lot.

[2:10:54] Voice 13: I like that idea

[2:10:55] Voice 13: because then we're not having to do like a carriage house

[2:10:58] Voice 13: separate from this, separate from that.

[2:11:00] Voice 13: It's all an accessory dwelling unit.

[2:11:02] Voice 13: And I think that kind of definition

[2:11:04] Voice 13: is actually really helpful in some ways.

[2:11:06] Voice 13: um we still may want to name out particular things for other reasons right like i know

[2:11:14] Voice 13: when when the uh secondary suites was approved they were explicitly excluded from um short-term

[2:11:21] Voice 13: vacation rental i think it was right and and so then that becomes a separate discussion it doesn't

[2:11:28] Voice 13: automatically get woven into the same discussion like we'd have to think that through again

[2:11:33] Voice 13: potentially but um i just i kind of like it as like being able to be a little more flexible for

[2:11:40] Voice 13: the varying situations that we see emerging as people are trying to find solutions without being

[2:11:45] Voice 13: too cumbersome so that i like um density wise i am always trying to think about and i think this

[2:11:54] Voice 13: is a longer conversation the next trust council our local trust council will have to figure out

[2:11:58] Voice 13: but there is something in our conversations this year that we didn't fully get a grip on but that

[2:12:05] Voice 13: is about um like housing square footage density splitting that could be done um among different

[2:12:14] Voice 13: types of buildings that's the

[2:12:16] Voice 4: flexible housing like

[2:12:17] Voice 13: an island yeah that flexible housing option

[2:12:19] Voice 13: that i find fascinating and it might be really a good option in particular areas um but i feel

[2:12:26] Voice 13: like we have to kind of get through this conversation before we get into that conversation

[2:12:30] Voice 13: because it's a little bit more complicated and nuanced and without this type of stuff that we're

[2:12:34] Voice 13: doing here it's way too complicated to have that conversation because what we're doing with the

[2:12:39] Voice 13: Lenny's bylaw separates magically differently than others and a lot of those conversations

[2:12:44] Voice 13: are very specific so anyway I just think it's an interesting thing and so I don't know I just

[2:12:52] Voice 13: think that it it allows a lot of good options i don't know that i would do the 3.15.1 where it

[2:13:02] Voice 13: sticks where it says a detached accessory dwelling unit must be operated must not be operated as a

[2:13:07] Voice 13: bed and breakfast home-based business so i don't know that i so it's only on a temporary basis

[2:13:14] Voice 13: so i don't know that i would exclude that i think it would just require permitting

[2:13:19] Voice 13: to include it so maybe and maybe that's what that means but i think there's lots of possibilities

[2:13:26] Voice 13: for small businesses or for bed and breakfast i don't know different things that could be

[2:13:31] Voice 13: individually decided upon as you kind of go along it's not a given that you can do it but

[2:13:35] Voice 13: you can ask to do it you know and then we can ask your neighbors and see like who cares you know

[2:13:41] Voice 13: because lots of people have that kind of stuff going on and it's good for what you were talking

[2:13:45] Voice 13: about earlier like novel ways to start different businesses and things i've got a growing business

[2:13:51] Voice 13: myself that potentially will get to that point right and so but that's that's good for our

[2:13:57] Voice 13: economy that's also diverse for our situation so anyway uh that would be my only question

[2:14:04] Voice 13: i think overall and i mean there's probably lots of edits it'd be interesting to just note whatever

[2:14:11] Voice 13: they get to, Kim, for us in the next LTC may not know that this exists or not, so just

[2:14:18] Voice 13: flag it for conversation when it gets passed on Salt Spring, whatever version, to bring

[2:14:22] Voice 13: it back into the housing conversation here.

[2:14:24] Voice 3: What you could do is you could add accessory dwelling units to your projects list.

[2:14:29] Voice 13: Oh, that's a good idea.

[2:14:30] Voice 3: And then probably one of your latter meetings of this term,

[2:14:34] Voice 13: take

[2:14:35] Voice 3: an opportunity to go through

[2:14:36] Voice 3: that list and kind of put in a place where it's presented to the next delta c that

[2:14:42] Voice 13: would be good

[2:14:42] Voice 13: so if we can just make a note to flag that condition okay all right um i'm sorry then

[2:14:50] Voice 13: did you want to well

[2:14:51] Voice 10: no it's just the thought occurs to me that i mean ganges and all this

[2:14:56] Voice 10: what's going on i mean a lot of it also is the responsibility of the federal government policies

[2:15:01] Voice 10: and the provincial government policies with regards to not addressing affordability so

[2:15:07] Voice 10: the federal government i know that like it the liberal party of canada i mean one of the reasons

[2:15:14] Voice 10: why pierre paul the bear is extremely popular in the conservative movement right now is because

[2:15:18] Voice 10: he's going around saying i can't afford this home i gotta tear it down and he's going after the

[2:15:22] Voice 10: liberals because they're they're not dealing with appropriate the appropriate policies to ensure

[2:15:27] Voice 10: that you know middle-class families can afford can get higher in the can move up somehow everyone

[2:15:33] Voice 10: feels a little stuck and so in some ways now the local governments are left to deal with

[2:15:37] Voice 10: um kind of irresponsible policies uh left by the federal government and provincial government

[2:15:43] Voice 10: and i mean i guess what i would say is you guys are doing the best you can i mean as trustees

[2:15:48] Voice 10: you've got to sit there you got to listen to all the community issues and you got to respond uh

[2:15:52] Voice 10: and it's a very challenging issue but it's also just a group i always want to reflect that it's

[2:15:56] Voice 10: also linked on the feds and on the province to really they could do some significant changes

[2:16:00] Voice 10: changes potentially no

[2:16:02] Voice 4: question uh that's an all-party thing i actually in my report at local

[2:16:06] Voice 4: trust committee last week i tried a different approach i said hmm i

[2:16:10] Voice 4: said we all know those

[2:16:11] Voice 4: signs around our community cut broom in bloom i don't know if you get them on your island they

[2:16:16] Voice 4: are all over salt spring i said we don't treat invasive species as an issue that happens everywhere

[2:16:23] Voice 4: in the world so let's not feel that on our islands we well we cut our the broom and we try to control

[2:16:28] Voice 4: the invasive species because it's going to hurt our island if we don't so housing is the same

[2:16:33] Voice 4: thing yes there's lots of reasons why the housing issue is where it is but i said it is our island

[2:16:40] Voice 4: and we need to to deal with it best we can with the tools we have and the authorities we have

[2:16:46] Voice 4: and uh so it's an all hands on deck all levels of government lots of lots

[2:16:51] Voice 8: of places to point

[2:16:52] Voice 4: fingers

[2:16:53] Voice 5: as to why where

[2:16:53] Voice 4: we are yeah

[2:16:55] Voice 10: um i guess i would make a motion at the end by heart you know

[2:16:58] Voice 10: thank you for this information thank you for the philosophical conversation because it relates to

[2:17:01] Voice 10: on it actually relates

[2:17:02] Voice 10: to nearly every decision we're making i'd say so

[2:17:04] Voice 10: i think it's an important

[2:17:04] Voice 10: conversation to have i learned a bit here so uh i would make a motion that north pender island's

[2:17:09] Voice 10: interests are unaffected by bylaw pat

[2:17:11] Voice 5: did you

[2:17:13] Voice 11: get that last

[2:17:18] Voice 4: path no

[2:17:19] Voice 14: i just have to turn my mic on

[2:17:21] Voice 14: and off there you go um but anyway yes i got it thank you all

[2:17:25] Voice 4: right is that seconded yeah second

[2:17:27] Voice 4: by trustee morrison discussions and that's carried thank you and thanks for that feedback that's

[2:17:35] Voice 4: great that's the purpose of this one okay so that takes us on to the next item here which is the

[2:17:42] Voice 4: means by law 13.1 page 35 in the agenda package um

[2:17:47] Voice 3: so the latest staff report from the last meeting

[2:17:49] Voice 3: is on page 52 the older information is there contacts for the information trustees what would

[2:17:59] Voice 4: you like to do with these bylaw um

[2:18:01] Voice 10: i'm i'm personally not comfortable moving these bylaw

[2:18:06] Voice 10: forward uh currently what

[2:18:11] Voice 13: would make you more comfortable i have a couple things i would like

[2:18:13] Voice 13: altered in it but what would make me more comfortable what

[2:18:17] Voice 10: would make me more comfortable

[2:18:18] Voice 10: would be uh well as nick pointed out when he's here uh the optics of this are are not uh good

[2:18:27] Voice 10: for the island's trust under the current political climate uh the last people are asking right now in

[2:18:34] Voice 10: the community more than ever i would say about uh the legitimacy of the island's trust and its

[2:18:41] Voice 10: ability to fill its mandate uh and whether or not they're getting any value for uh what they're

[2:18:47] Voice 10: are paying. Passing this currently would create potential unrest in the community and leave the

[2:18:57] Voice 10: trust subject to even more attacks. And I certainly think we should listen to maybe the fact that

[2:19:08] Voice 10: elections coming and that this could be definitely a discussion at a campaign for a candidate says,

[2:19:14] Voice 10: says I actually think that I support the fees be really clear and then the constituents can

[2:19:20] Voice 10: determine whether or not they support it or not in this particular circumstance and this isn't

[2:19:24] Voice 10: necessarily something we've been working on for three and a half years uh it's something that's

[2:19:28] Voice 10: come up uh since I guess it was last whatever fall um I just think this would erode some trust

[2:19:36] Voice 10: in the analyst trust the way it's currently presented and it requires a large communication

[2:19:40] Voice 10: communication strategy that um i i other than 15 people attending a community information meeting

[2:19:46] Voice 10: i don't think most islanders understand or comprehend the changes or why the changes

[2:19:51] Voice 10: are happening and i'm doing my best to try and explain the books but i i honestly for me it

[2:19:56] Voice 10: comes down to timing of this um and making sure that all islanders understand where these fees

[2:20:02] Voice 10: will go i also have concerns about impacting lower income members of our community um those

[2:20:08] Voice 10: Those are some of my reasons right now for deferment.

[2:20:12] Voice 13: So I would like us to, and I think it's a motion that we have to make.

[2:20:18] Voice 13: There's two or three things that I think trust counsel needs to reconsider about this that I would like bumped back to trust counsel.

[2:20:27] Voice 13: One is, I actually think, believe it or not, I agree with Don Corbin on this.

[2:20:32] Voice 13: I think that we should figure out how to put a clause in the fee bylaw that is about annual or every two year recalibrating the fee schedule to the actual average cost of the, you know, the monitoring.

[2:20:53] Voice 13: And I don't have to say that Robert, but if you know the monitoring of the average costs that goes on range the different types of permits, not individual permits but different types of applications calculate

[2:21:05] Voice 3: the average cost.

[2:21:08] Voice 13: Yeah, so not how to calculate the average cost but just that there is an average confirmation

[2:21:13] Voice 3: so just

[2:21:14] Voice 13: just let me get it get it straight ahead so like there is an average cost of applications by type.

[2:21:21] Voice 13: that is now being like calculated and every year that could be scheduled you know like we could

[2:21:29] Voice 13: create a schedule of what those average costs are based on the data that we have and that's ongoing

[2:21:33] Voice 13: and that that schedule would then automatically update the fee bylaws at least on our end and

[2:21:40] Voice 13: hopefully others would implement that too because that would essentially diffuse any of the problems

[2:21:47] Voice 13: related to efficiencies as they

[2:21:49] Voice 13: improve because

[2:21:51] Voice 13: we would have a built-in mechanism

[2:21:53] Voice 13: in the fee bylaw for distributing

[2:21:55] Voice 13: those efficiencies into the fee bylaw

[2:21:57] Voice 13: schedule. And I know that's

[2:22:00] Voice 13: not simple, but I think that it's reasonable

[2:22:02] Voice 13: given the

[2:22:05] Voice 13: like if we can

[2:22:06] Voice 13: calculate for inflation and we're collecting

[2:22:08] Voice 13: data related to

[2:22:11] Voice 13: fees, average fees

[2:22:12] Voice 13: anyway, there's no reason we couldn't have a

[2:22:14] Voice 13: standard schedule of fees and that

[2:22:16] Voice 13: our bylaws reflect it.

[2:22:19] Voice 13: I just I just I would like trust councils or financial planning committee or whoever

[2:22:24] Voice 13: regional committee I guess did this I would like regional planning committee to actually come up

[2:22:29] Voice 13: with options around that or have a discussion on it because it seems reasonable given the

[2:22:34] Voice 13: governor's report says there's efficiencies to be had that they be passed on to the consumer

[2:22:38] Voice 13: so I

[2:22:41] Voice 4: I think I think what I'm hearing I think the probably the good the appropriate question

[2:22:45] Voice 4: would be is to ask um i guess redirect the trust council asking you know for a method to you know

[2:22:55] Voice 4: confirm the reconfirming visit on the regular yeah on

[2:23:01] Voice 4: some yeah regular on a regular basis or

[2:23:04] Voice 4: something like that so that just yeah didn't happen trust council yeah

[2:23:09] Voice 13: i'm saying something

[2:23:11] Voice 13: different i'm not i'm not saying that it would necessarily be that we would revisit the bylaws

[2:23:16] Voice 13: on a regular level that we'd actually schedule like the fees into the bylaws and that the schedule

[2:23:24] Voice 13: would be updated every year automatically because i don't want us to have to proactively come back

[2:23:30] Voice 13: and every trust council change their feedback laws regularly that is likely not to happen for

[2:23:35] Voice 13: another 15 years so like like inflation we just need to put a marker in there that like go look

[2:23:41] Voice 13: at this table and it just gets re like mapped into as a schedule for the keep on for a year

[2:23:48] Voice 13: so i don't know what that looks like because i'm sure that from inflation it will adjust it every

[2:23:53] Voice 13: year right like for every two years or whatever i

[2:23:56] Voice 3: hear what you're saying but i'm not sure if

[2:23:58] Voice 3: that's possible but if we want yeah trust council to ask our pc to look at that yeah

[2:24:04] Voice 13: yeah so i would like a motion for that because i think that will address one of my biggest

[2:24:10] Voice 13: as concerns which is the implementation of the government's report which will probably

[2:24:15] Voice 13: frankly it's been given some changes are right now like the it's likely it's going to take a

[2:24:23] Voice 13: couple years to get the full impact of those in but i also think that i don't want the general

[2:24:28] Voice 13: public bearing the cost of development permits i personally am not okay with that so

[2:24:34] Voice 13: i or permits

[2:24:36] Voice 13: generally so i'm okay generally with the fees increased i understand inflation is a thing

[2:24:44] Voice 13: it costs to do development i get all that so that's one thing

[2:24:48] Voice 13: so but i do think that efficiencies in

[2:24:52] Voice 13: the trust are one of the biggest political conversations that are going on right now

[2:24:57] Voice 1: and

[2:24:58] Voice 13: the governance report is in the motion to try and address that i was really impressed with some

[2:25:03] Voice 13: the recommendations and once they fully get implemented and improving it's possible that

[2:25:08] Voice 13: the fees come down for application it's possible and i just

[2:25:11] Voice 13: want a mechanism so that it automatically

[2:25:14] Voice 13: happens so any idea on what that sounds like it's emotional could

[2:25:23] Voice 5: possibly keep it yeah um

[2:25:28] Voice 5: i think you can frame it uh just

[2:25:31] Voice 4: frame the conversation

[2:25:32] Voice 13: around okay so i am happy to do

[2:25:36] Voice 13: an individual move on that if we need to if that's the easier move i'm happy to do a request for

[2:25:42] Voice 13: motion because i think they're not due until june 2nd for trust council so i'm happy to do that as

[2:25:47] Voice 13: an individual and figure that out but because i don't have it ready for today it's just not a

[2:25:52] Voice 13: thing i can do today so the other question that i had was around the 20 after the fact waiver

[2:26:01] Voice 13: i think that was mr sketch i think commented on

[2:26:05] Voice 13: that so under 4.1 um so i i'm nervous about that

[2:26:14] Voice 13: like being a default because there is possible situations that is there a mechanism for us as a

[2:26:21] Voice 13: little trust committee or does it only go to executive for us to waive it if there's executive

[2:26:26] Voice 3: executive committee can can refund all or a portion of the fees for community groups

[2:26:31] Voice 3: trust council policy okay so

[2:26:34] Voice 3: for example but not

[2:26:41] Voice 13: like any general so like okay

[2:26:44] Voice 4: you could change

[2:26:45] Voice 4: this no

[2:26:45] Voice 13: yeah you

[2:26:46] Voice 4: could change this in your version of the bylaw you could say you don't want that

[2:26:49] Voice 4: okay there's been changes

[2:26:51] Voice 13: yeah because i'm thinking about like the the situation that i

[2:26:54] Voice 13: i just went and visited last sunday where an elderly couple has a building with a tent like

[2:27:01] Voice 13: a yurt on their property that may be under bylaw enforcement they may be required to do a permit

[2:27:07] Voice 13: for a variance for that they didn't really know like like there was a bunch of extenuating

[2:27:12] Voice 13: circumstances around like they were trying to actually do the right move so they didn't cut

[2:27:16] Voice 13: a bunch of trees off their property and so like it's a complicated situation right and the end

[2:27:21] Voice 13: end result is where the year is is a better environmental decision though socially it might

[2:27:27] Voice 13: be causing some challenges in the neighborhood so i like mandate wise like a better environmental

[2:27:33] Voice 13: decision is a good decision like if that's if we agree to give the variance in the long run so

[2:27:39] Voice 13: i don't know there's just something in there about how do we vary for those situations that

[2:27:44] Voice 13: i don't necessarily think that this allows so i would want 4.1 to come out of this i guess is the

[2:27:51] Voice 13: a point blank um i guess i'd want not it to come out but i would want it to like that we have an

[2:28:00] Voice 13: option to waive it like that's all just that we have an option to waive it i

[2:28:07] Voice 3: don't think that

[2:28:08] Voice 3: can be delegated to local trust committees to give them discretion about waiving fees

[2:28:13] Voice 3: so is

[2:28:16] Voice 13: this our bylaw or is this trust so

[2:28:18] Voice 3: then

[2:28:21] Voice 13: we can change it i think you could take it

[2:28:23] out but i don't think you can give yourself the authority on a case-by-case basis to waive things

[2:28:29] or not

[2:28:30] Voice 3: really or i don't think that that would be a pretty significant amendment to the approach

[2:28:37] Voice 3: local trust committees on an individual basis reduce fees for individuals okay that's an

[2:28:46] Voice 13: interesting question because

[2:28:47] Voice 3: i mean yeah but through right not yourselves but a future local

[2:28:52] Voice 3: trust committee give them the authority to waive fees on a case-by-case basis yeah

[2:28:58] Voice 13: but then it

[2:28:59] Voice 13: shouldn't be a local trust committee file if we don't have some authority locally do you know

[2:29:04] Voice 13: what i mean like it's either a trust council by law then they should just pass it and buy it from

[2:29:08] Voice 3: council because as an administrative bylaw these could could have been adopted by trust so that

[2:29:12] Voice 13: would have been the better move if we can't change that i think yeah in

[2:29:15] Voice 3: terms of the amount okay so

[2:29:17] Voice 13: So that would be my motion, actually, would be that we push this back to Trust Council

[2:29:23] Voice 13: and the Trust Council itself decides to pass them across the whole of the trust or not

[2:29:28] Voice 13: so that they're even across the trust and we can do this out because it seems like every

[2:29:33] Voice 13: one of these questions is related to the broader trust.

[2:29:36] Voice 13: Like either we can customize these and take them deeply for our own location or we can't.

[2:29:42] Voice 13: So, and I hear you in terms of, and then the other thing I would want to put on the

[2:29:47] Voice 13: a list of things to talk to trust counsel about we can create a list such a list is the communications

[2:29:52] Voice 13: thing that Ben raised like not having a solid communications plan for how things go out into

[2:29:58] Voice 13: the community is going to

[2:30:00] Voice 13: us as the Adams trust right now just because of the timing of all the other conversations going on

[2:30:06] Voice 13: the the regional planning committee has has it's not the last year they have had this for

[2:30:11] Voice 13: three years under my understanding the feedback review is that not true yeah

[2:30:17] Voice 3: it started in 2019

[2:30:18] Voice 3: referred to trust counseling so they have

[2:30:21] Voice 3: had it referred by trust right

[2:30:24] Voice 13: so they have had this for

[2:30:26] Voice 13: three years and the fact that it comes out in the same moment when we're dealing with a whole bunch

[2:30:31] Voice 13: of changes is just killing us and there's no like like communications plan and strategy in the trust

[2:30:39] Voice 13: to manage all these things right now because of staffing yeah

[2:30:42] Voice 3: this went to trust council

[2:30:43] Voice 3: yeah

[2:30:43] Voice 13: that

[2:30:45] Voice 3: was the point when trust council should have yeah as

[2:30:47] Voice 3: a body yeah we want a communication

[2:30:50] Voice 3: no

[2:30:50] Voice 13: i totally and i actually think i might have argued about that at the time actually i know i

[2:30:55] Voice 13: i talk communications quite often at trust council so i can't remember if i actually said that at

[2:31:00] Voice 13: the time but you're right like it's trust counseling so basically i just want to take

[2:31:05] Voice 13: this back to trust council and have additional conversations with trust council because the

[2:31:10] Voice 13: timing and all the other pieces and then some of the new ideas that have come up i think are

[2:31:14] Voice 13: important to being heard so

[2:31:15] Voice 3: that's probably the most expeditious approach yeah rather than trying

[2:31:19] Voice 3: yeah

[2:31:20] Voice 13: i agree so i will try to collect my thoughts and just bring it forward i'm wondering if

[2:31:27] Voice 10: we can defer this for next meeting and then have a really cohesive plan about how to how to approach

[2:31:36] Voice 10: this what

[2:31:37] Voice 13: would be the difference between doing that now or next meeting well

[2:31:39] Voice 10: there's a bunch of

[2:31:40] Voice 10: points i've got raised today at the meeting i gotta think about yeah i mean

[2:31:43] Voice 10: i heard from the

[2:31:44] Voice 10: general public it's it's it's i mean do we have to decide something right now i know you guys like a

[2:31:50] Voice 10: decision so we don't

[2:31:52] Voice 10: have to make decisions right now yeah

[2:31:54] Voice 8: unless

[2:31:55] Voice 10: you're really keen to get this

[2:31:57] Voice 10: before i don't it's too late to give it to the executive for approval and

[2:32:00] Voice 10: agenda no

[2:32:01] Voice 13: no it's not

[2:32:02] Voice 13: but

[2:32:03] Voice 10: if you want to put it on the trust council agenda and and then get us to discuss it there

[2:32:08] Voice 10: and i mean that'd be a fun conversation you know i mean what i mean by that is deliberative

[2:32:14] Voice 13: yeah so i would because it's wrapped up in a lot of other things that are going on right now on

[2:32:19] Voice 13: trust council with the government so i so the question i think we have right now is do we do

[2:32:26] Voice 13: this as a local trust committee or shall i just go ahead and do it as a request for whatever the

[2:32:33] Voice 13: decision rfd for and as an individual i'm happy to do it either way we don't have a thing in front

[2:32:40] Voice 13: of us right now to be able to do that as a other than just a general idea that and what would that

[2:32:44] Voice 13: be like a motion saying the north window local trust committee wishes to put an item on the

[2:32:48] Voice 13: agenda to discuss it as well yes okay

[2:32:51] Voice 13: so let's do that if we if we're good to do that as a committee

[2:32:55] Voice 13: then i would like to do that and then i can try and synthesize some of our thoughts before trust

[2:32:59] Voice 13: council yeah one

[2:33:01] Voice 10: of those thoughts for me would be uh we can you know how do we charge less to people

[2:33:07] Voice 4: all right so what if you want to swing

[2:33:12] Voice 13: a motion okay okay that the north pender island local

[2:33:18] Voice 13: trust committee request that trust council or executive let's just just call it trust council

[2:33:31] Voice 13: the trust council add to its agenda a discussion of the model fees bylaw

[2:33:42] Voice 3: June for the June for

[2:33:43] Voice 13: the June 2022 meeting but when you got that if you could read that back

[2:33:54] Voice 11: June 25th

[2:33:55] Voice 14: that the North Pender local trust committee request trust council add to its

[2:34:00] Voice 14: agenda a discussion of the fees bylaw number 226 uh for on for the June was it the 21st

[2:34:10] Voice 14: meeting just

[2:34:11] Voice 4: the June but it's

[2:34:12] Voice 4: just just the model fee bylaws is the the name you don't have

[2:34:16] Voice 4: have to say

[2:34:17] Voice 4: you don't have to say bylaw two two three just okay be bylaws in the june meeting

[2:34:24] Voice 4: june

[2:34:25] Voice 13: 2022 meeting for

[2:34:27] Voice 14: the june meeting okay and

[2:34:29] Voice 13: then if you can make sure it says the north pender

[2:34:31] Voice 13: island local trust all right

[2:34:35] Voice 4: um is that seconded

[2:34:37] Voice 6: yes second second

[2:34:39] Voice 4: by trustee mcconkey any

[2:34:41] Voice 4: discussion i'll call the vote all those in favor that's carried okay so we'll pass that on yeah

[2:34:50] Voice 4: probably yeah make your notes and that will wrap the conversation um okay next thing land use bylaw

[2:34:57] Voice 4: review project 13.2 it begins on page 60 of the agenda package over to the planner stock bill

[2:35:04] Voice 4: Thank

[2:35:04] Voice 18: you. So the staff have attached three bylaws for the LTC's consideration, and there's a summary of each three bylaws in the staff report.

[2:35:15] Voice 18: The bigger one is bylaw 224, which is the new bylaw, land use bylaw that would replace the old 103.

[2:35:24] Voice 18: And as you can see, we have finally have the new updated land use bylaw map that unfortunately

[2:35:32] Voice 18: was not attached to bylaw 224 in the agenda, but that's been updated on the website and

[2:35:37] Voice 18: it's available for community members to view on the project's website as well.

[2:35:42] Voice 18: And then we have bylaw number 223, which is the OCP amendment bylaw and a land use bylaw

[2:35:49] Voice 18: on 229 which are amendments to the land use bylaw that require the enabling policies um in that ocp

[2:35:57] Voice 18: draft bylaw so step our ltc at the last meeting requested staff to report back on

[2:36:05] Voice 18: options to incentivize secondary suites in terms of maximum floor area so outline three options

[2:36:13] Voice 18: for the ltc's consideration the first one is to exclude secondary suites from the maximum floor

[2:36:20] Voice 18: area of the dwelling unit which we talked about last time so if there's a maximum floor area of

[2:36:25] Voice 18: 2500 square feet uh property owner would be able to have a 900 square foot secondary suite on top

[2:36:32] Voice 18: of that um which would total 3400 square feet an issue with that though is down the road if the

[2:36:39] Voice 18: property owner decides to remove the secondary speeds like the kitchen and so forth it would

[2:36:44] Voice 18: be converted back into livable space and then they have dwelling units they seize the maximum floor

[2:36:49] Voice 18: area of dwelling a second option is to exclude floor area secondary speed from the total area

[2:36:58] Voice 18: of all buildings you know how we have that chart in bylaw 224 uh one that's the maximum uh floor

[2:37:05] Voice 18: area for a dwelling unit and the other column is the total area of all buildings so um we could

[2:37:13] Voice 18: exclude secondary suites from that calculation and that would potentially support future

[2:37:19] Voice 18: amendments through a land use bylaw to allow secondary suites necessary structures which we've

[2:37:25] Voice 18: been talking about like carriage houses and so forth so um this could support additional

[2:37:32] Voice 18: additional buildings on the lot if the dwelling has a secondary suite as the floor area of the

[2:37:37] Voice 18: secondary suite would that not be included in the total floor area of all buildings so although

[2:37:43] Voice 18: um it wouldn't solve anything right now it would be an incentive down the road if the

[2:37:49] Voice 18: OTC decides to do further amendments to use bylaw to support detached garages to turn them into

[2:37:56] Voice 18: care chances and the third option would just be no changes to the lub the draft led number 224

[2:38:03] Voice 18: so there's three options for the ltc's consideration i do just want to talk about

[2:38:08] Voice 18: briefly um the timeline and if the ltc does give first reading to these three bylaws

[2:38:15] Voice 18: um how the ltc would like to structure some of these community information meetings

[2:38:20] Voice 18: meetings to inform the community and also to gather communication.

[2:38:24] Voice 18: So staff definitely support at least one in-person community

[2:38:29] Voice 18: information meeting, which would be more of a open house scenario where we could

[2:38:34] Voice 18: have boards up and the maps and having one on one discussion.

[2:38:39] Voice 18: And then the second part of that CIM would be more of a formal town hall

[2:38:43] Voice 18: where we would have a Q&A session and there could also be options for

[2:38:48] Voice 18: or as you're meeting as well,

[2:38:50] Voice 18: because I know some community members

[2:38:51] Voice 18: may not be on island to attend the CIM.

[2:38:55] Voice 18: So it'd be great to also have an online option.

[2:38:58] Voice 18: And those would potentially be scheduled

[2:39:01] Voice 18: for over the summer months,

[2:39:03] Voice 18: which I know is approaching quickly

[2:39:05] Voice 18: and it may be difficult to schedule those.

[2:39:07] Voice 18: So that's something that we really need

[2:39:09] Voice 18: to turn our minds to.

[2:39:11] Voice 18: I've also included the policy statement

[2:39:15] Voice 18: directive checklist for each of the bylaws

[2:39:17] Voice 18: for the LTC to consider and those would have to be endorsed if the LTC gives first reading to the

[2:39:23] Voice 18: draft bylaws and we have been discussing potential amendments to the draft bylaws and that's under

[2:39:31] Voice 18: alternative one on page 64 so there's some draft resolutions for the LTC to consider

[2:39:37] Voice 18: and we would like to make amendments to draft the draft bylaws so certain points that staff

[2:39:44] Voice 18: we're looking for um either clarification or direction from the ltc is around secondary speeds

[2:39:51] Voice 18: also the minutes we received from the agricultural apc by the supports the 500 meter square maximum

[2:40:00] Voice 18: floor area for dwelling units in the alr drop by log 224 currently has that so that's great

[2:40:07] Voice 18: But the AAPC also noted that a support for those dwelling units in the rural zone for a lot greater than 16 hectares, that they should also be permitted 500 meters squared.

[2:40:23] Voice 18: So that's an amendment the LTC could consider.

[2:40:27] Voice 18: Other items are rezoning that portion of Magic Lake to legalize the community park, legalize the use of the community park.

[2:40:37] Voice 18: Also amending the W six zone to allow one community dog from magic lake and also direction or the CIA and how the LTC like them to be structured and possible dates right.

[2:40:50] Voice 5: that's it

[2:40:51] Voice 13: down to that.

[2:40:54] Voice 13: There were two other things that came up earlier related to or to.

[2:40:59] Voice 13: uh for residential rezoning right right yeah and then

[2:41:04] Voice 18: um we're watching the journey for washington

[2:41:07] Voice 18: driftwood center you want to discuss and a notable correspondence you had brought that up as well

[2:41:12] Voice 18: which women about correspondence for the project just some

[2:41:15] Voice 3: correspondence you've perceived yeah

[2:41:17] Voice 13: okay and then there was one at a time which is the first

[2:41:21] Voice 13: one secondary suites that's on page 62.

[2:41:27] Voice 13: two staff

[2:41:27] Voice 10: have uh stated that they prefer option two which just you just explained uh exclude the

[2:41:34] Voice 10: ferry of the ferry the floor area of a secondary suite for the total floor area of the buildings

[2:41:40] Voice 10: what would the negative impacts of that be will be the concern i would have yeah

[2:41:44] Voice 13: i want to know

[2:41:45] Voice 13: if the concern for one happens if you do two that's right like

[2:41:51] Voice 13: can if for a number if you

[2:41:53] Voice 13: choose option number two could somebody have a secondary suite in their building have a bigger

[2:41:59] Voice 13: building with the suite out and still have the same problem as we have in option one uh they

[2:42:05] Voice 3: they would still have the the house the house that's called the house right where the suite

[2:42:10] Voice 3: has to be not be able to receive that you

[2:42:15] Voice 3: could have a

[2:42:16] Voice 18: similar issue in item number three because

[2:42:19] Voice 18: if you have a carriage house and then they take the second or convert the carriage house back to

[2:42:27] Voice 18: their own livable space and yeah that they could then it's

[2:42:29] Voice 13: going to be two separate buildings

[2:42:31] Voice 13: okay

[2:42:31] Voice 18: yeah

[2:42:32] Voice 13: so they can still be living in it but it's like you know granted having to go

[2:42:36] Voice 13: sleep in a carriage house is kind of an issue as opposed to like yeah so

[2:42:39] Voice 3: one of the other

[2:42:39] Voice 3: advantages of option two is that it achieves the goal of minimizing the massing yeah

[2:42:45] Voice 13: yeah i get it

[2:42:46] Voice 13: okay i like that for option two as well uh

[2:42:50] Voice 10: you also state that it would lay the foundation for

[2:42:53] Voice 10: future amendments to land use bylaw with the intention of providing more flexible housing

[2:42:56] Voice 10: options uh you also state that this option could support additional buildings on the lot if a

[2:43:01] Voice 10: dwelling has a secondary suite as the floor area the secondary students would not be included in

[2:43:04] Voice 10: the total total flooring so you're kind of the implications of that is that this would allow

[2:43:09] Voice 10: future local trust committees to be deal with it in a case by uh you know as things develop within

[2:43:16] Voice 10: in the community right because you're kind of not sure how people are going to react when you change

[2:43:19] Voice 10: it we'll make them amendments to a bylaw and you can only have a professional opinion that's kind

[2:43:24] Voice 10: of based on well these models but really we don't know how it's going to happen so that's option two

[2:43:29] Voice 10: to me seems i mean that's a good opinion yeah uh

[2:43:32] Voice 10: to make it so uh it's not super set in stone

[2:43:35] Voice 10: uh that that they're that's too that's not uh too inflexible in future trust making so if that's

[2:43:41] Voice 10: professional opinion i mean i i support that yeah i

[2:43:45] Voice 10: definitely

[2:43:46] Voice 13: don't like option one so that's a no

[2:43:49] Voice 13: go for me because i i see the problem too so option two i think from what i'm hearing i'm

[2:43:55] Voice 13: hearing a nod over here and a different you know here so i just want to confirm

[2:43:59] Voice 13: that with option two the envelope that is the house square footage you couldn't put

[2:44:06] Voice 13: the secondary suite in the house and have it the house be bigger that's correct because the house

[2:44:13] Voice 13: would still have to meet the maximum and

[2:44:15] Voice 18: i'm good with option

[2:44:16] Voice 13: two yes my one concern is that and so

[2:44:18] Voice 13: i'm good with option two okay so i like the idea of option two it also addresses some of the things

[2:44:24] Voice 13: that we've heard today as possible things that could go forward if we as we start to adjust

[2:44:28] Voice 13: housing more deeply it opens room for them so okay

[2:44:31] Voice 4: yeah i'm good with that so we can agree to option

[2:44:35] Voice 4: option two for secondary suites through general consent.

[2:44:39] Voice 4: Yeah, that was presented.

[2:44:43] Voice 18: Okay, the Dalton.

[2:44:46] Voice 10: The Agriculture Advisory Planning Commission.

[2:44:49] Voice 18: Yes, so for rural zones,

[2:44:50] Voice 18: permitting a house on a lot greater than 16 hectares

[2:44:54] Voice 18: to have a maximum floor area of 500 square meters.

[2:44:58] Voice 18: There would only be a handful of these properties

[2:45:02] Voice 18: that would be zoned rural and be greater than 16 hectares.

[2:45:07] Voice 18: i don't have the calculations yeah not

[2:45:10] Voice 10: a huge not

[2:45:11] Voice 18: a huge impact yeah

[2:45:12] Voice 3: for one consideration of that

[2:45:15] Voice 3: those very large robots are subdividable

[2:45:23] Voice 13: yeah it's interesting so there's no way to grant that with the idea that you give up some kind of

[2:45:30] Voice 13: subject visibility well variants what

[2:45:33] Voice 4: we're doing on salt spring for the large for farms outside

[2:45:37] Voice 4: outside the ALR.

[2:45:38] Voice 4: So we have farms that aren't in the ALR

[2:45:41] Voice 4: for allowing them to subdivide that division potential

[2:45:46] Voice 4: covenant for dwellings.

[2:45:48] Voice 4: So, you know, if they could subdivide into three lots,

[2:45:52] Voice 4: they could have three dwellings,

[2:45:53] Voice 4: but give up that subdivision potential.

[2:45:56] Voice 13: Yeah, I'm totally for that option,

[2:45:58] Voice 13: but I just don't necessarily want to stage it in right now

[2:46:02] Voice 13: without having that broader competition,

[2:46:03] Voice 13: but i'm totally for that as a thought in the future um yeah so

[2:46:09] Voice 3: that's approach is called

[2:46:10] Voice 3: equivalent to lots yeah and so some you just have that ability where you can build a house

[2:46:17] Voice 3: without subdividing the covenant to regulate that north kind of

[2:46:24] Voice 10: used to have that in the

[2:46:25] Voice 3: previous land use bylaw and got rid of it so that's why

[2:46:38] Voice 13: Okay, so last thought is, even if they subdivided it, when they subdivided it, it's not like

[2:46:44] Voice 13: they couldn't just like that.

[2:46:49] Voice 13: So they could subdivide it down to 10 acres, I guess.

[2:46:52] Voice 13: So they could end up with a 10 acre place with house and a...

[2:46:57] Voice 3: And through this...

[2:46:59] Voice 3: It's also an average, a lot average of 10 acres.

[2:47:02] Voice 3: So you can have even more of a cluster, right?

[2:47:04] Voice 3: Right.

[2:47:05] Voice 3: mentally five thousand square foot house on a smaller one through

[2:47:09] Voice 18: the subdivision process we do

[2:47:10] Voice 18: look at the property and if they would create any non-conformity situations and if that's the case

[2:47:16] Voice 18: then we'd also request a development variance permit um i would imagine to vary

[2:47:23] Voice 13: potentially the house size yeah but doesn't that get us into a situation if it's already

[2:47:28] Voice 13: done that we have to just approve it because we don't approve subdivision well

[2:47:32] Voice 3: it would be

[2:47:32] Voice 3: a condition under something oh

[2:47:34] Voice 13: okay actually yeah okay i don't know how i feel well

[2:47:38] Voice 10: so i mean they

[2:47:39] Voice 10: do the folks on the commission made really good points here the agriculture alc did extensive

[2:47:44] Voice 10: consultation across the provinces with local governments to arrive at the recommended maximum

[2:47:49] Voice 10: house size of 500 meters square for the primary dwelling and 90 meters square for the secondary

[2:47:53] Voice 10: line that's kind of the crux of the issue the committee is not aware of any reasoning from the

[2:47:57] Voice 10: local trust committee or the trust that indicates a lower house size limit should be applied to alr

[2:48:01] Voice 10: land other than the land that then that provided by the alur in our view rural lot of greater than

[2:48:10] Voice 10: 16 acres uh or less than 16 acres should have the same house size limit as that set for the alar so

[2:48:17] Voice 13: i agree with that if we could stop it being subdivided so if it can't get below 16 acres

[2:48:23] Voice 13: i'm all with it right but the problem is that our rules also allow that lot to be subdivided whereas

[2:48:29] Voice 13: as the alr land is not subdividable below 25 acres i think it is

[2:48:34] Voice 3: well there's no subdividable

[2:48:35] Voice 3: yeah so

[2:48:37] Voice 13: so so so this alr line i'm fine with the decision for the alr my concern is the decision

[2:48:44] Voice 13: for the rural land because the rural land is subdividable still so it can be smaller with

[2:48:49] Voice 13: a bigger building on it in the future that having a bigger house on a big lot fine but the problem

[2:48:55] Voice 13: is that the big lot won't always be a big lot potentially and we we already have a rule in play

[2:49:01] Voice 13: that says there is you can subdivide up to 10 acres down to 10 acres right so that's my concern

[2:49:09] Voice 13: is that if we have you know if we're making a rule generally that says you know these are our

[2:49:16] Voice 13: guidelines for you know x then basically i want them just to come and ask for variance if there's

[2:49:23] Voice 13: there's only a handful and the rural residential and they want a bigger house then they should just

[2:49:27] Voice 13: come and ask for grants and they should then we can individually ask them well we'd love to do

[2:49:32] Voice 13: that but can you give up some you know confirm put a covenant on it so you're not dividing it or

[2:49:38] Voice 13: you know we can have a conversation basically if and if there's only a handful i'd rather just do

[2:49:43] Voice 13: that for those real real

[2:49:44] Voice 10: ones how many parcels of rural land are taking like in how much land

[2:49:51] Voice 10: we talking about here like that's what i'm not that's maybe that's what planner stockdale was

[2:49:55] Voice 10: alluding to she doesn't quite know i

[2:49:57] Voice 18: don't know the exact number unfortunately i mean this is

[2:50:00] Voice 18: something an amendment you can make down the road when i have the information yeah i

[2:50:05] Voice 18: can bring that

[2:50:05] Voice 18: back at the next ltc meeting and then you can amend the bylaw even after first reading if you'd

[2:50:11] Voice 18: like to if you want to wait until you have that the numbers how many lots would this be applicable

[2:50:16] Voice 18: so

[2:50:17] Voice 13: so i'm okay so the one of the issues that we have is that it would be good to put some things

[2:50:23] Voice 13: in right now and get it out for first reading because of the timing of the summer like i really

[2:50:27] Voice 13: want to make sure to be like into first reading for the summer commentary period and don't miss

[2:50:32] Voice 13: this window of good opportunity so i'm okay with putting it in the bylaw right now as long as we

[2:50:39] Voice 13: flag it for serious conversation when we go to second reading or whichever the number reading

[2:50:44] Voice 13: is so that we can really revisit it and look at it with the numbers right because that's

[2:50:48] Voice 13: the strategy yeah

[2:50:49] Voice 10: i mean it's just it's hard to make yeah i

[2:50:52] Voice 10: mean you've raised an interesting

[2:50:53] Voice 10: point uh it would be great to have some more information on it but i i i mean i can fear over

[2:51:00] Voice 10: land being subdivided i mean i don't i don't know how much i don't know how many subdivision

[2:51:08] Voice 10: applications have we had in our term like it's not it's not like taken off you know

[2:51:15] Voice 13: it's like

[2:51:15] Voice 13: what what

[2:51:16] Voice 10: problem are we trying to solve yeah

[2:51:18] Voice 13: there is increased pressure of some division

[2:51:20] Voice 13: because lands are getting so expensive here it's a real

[2:51:23] Voice 13: thing yep

[2:51:24] Voice 10: but if you want to do that if

[2:51:25] Voice 10: that's okay and then we can bring that up that's all right yeah

[2:51:29] Voice 13: right gentlemen um the other one

[2:51:33] Voice 10: was community park uh and the w6 dock yes so

[2:51:37] Voice 10: i don't know what do we need to provide direction

[2:51:41] Voice 10: for it let's

[2:51:41] Voice 13: do we want to do the w6 dock do we want because that was my question i think we're

[2:51:45] Voice 13: good already to go ahead and do the like rural or whatever zone it is right now into park that was

[2:51:51] Voice 13: not an issue the dock do you want to have any conversation about it in terms of the dock on

[2:51:56] Voice 13: the lake allowing it or do we just want to i guess my question is is it okay to put the dock in the

[2:52:03] Voice 13: luv like in the luv review or do we want a separate consultation process because people

[2:52:08] Voice 13: might care if there's a doctor i

[2:52:10] Voice 10: would be i would be surprised if people would be opposed to building

[2:52:14] Voice 10: a dock the magic lake itself needs major rehabilitation certainly building a dock maybe

[2:52:20] Voice 10: people will get on and can go holy cow we need to do something about all this milfoil yeah so i'm

[2:52:25] Voice 13: okay i i

[2:52:26] Voice 10: would i would have i have no objections at all and

[2:52:29] Voice 18: we can include it into bylaw 229 which

[2:52:32] Voice 18: goes along with the ocp bylaw so it wouldn't necessarily slow down by one two to four yeah

[2:52:38] Voice 18: amendments for the dock and also the community park could be added into the final draft bylaw

[2:52:44] Voice 18: to tonight yeah that's

[2:52:45] Voice 4: fine did you have some wording for a potential motion on that update

[2:52:48] Voice 18: i believe person where's my send

[2:52:52] Voice 5: one to you

[2:52:53] Voice 6: okay

[2:53:03] Voice 13: yeah thank you all right so

[2:53:04] Voice 13: pat pay attention

[2:53:05] Voice 13: motion coming? Can you just forward it to Pat? Yeah. Okay.

[2:53:11] Voice 4: Kim is going to send you the motion,

[2:53:13] Voice 5: Pat. Thank you.

[2:53:19] Voice 13: So that the North Pender Local Trust Committee amend draft bylaw numbers 223

[2:53:25] Voice 13: and 229 by rezoning the northwest end of Magic Lake to permit a community park. So that's the

[2:53:32] Voice 13: first one i

[2:53:35] Voice 6: second that motion oh sorry

[2:53:37] Voice 4: trustee mcconkey seconded that with a pencil in his mouth

[2:53:42] Voice 4: pardon me is there any discussion i'll call a vote all those in

[2:53:48] Voice 13: favor and that's carrie

[2:53:50] Voice 13: all right the second one is that the north pender local trust committee amend by

[2:53:54] Voice 13: draft bylaw numbers 223 and 229 by adding a community dock as a permitted use in the water

[2:54:02] Voice 13: six down a

[2:54:04] Voice 8: second of course like

[2:54:05] Voice 13: my trusty mcconaughey any discussion

[2:54:06] Voice 18: yes if i may just add

[2:54:09] Voice 18: one thing did you want to restrict it to one community dock and make sure that it's only on

[2:54:13] Voice 18: magic lake because water six is actually so good point sorry about that yeah no i should have

[2:54:18] Voice 18: mentioned that so you could add by adding one community dock on magic

[2:54:24] Voice 18: lake as a permitted use

[2:54:27] Voice 18: in the water-sick zone.

[2:54:39] Voice 5: Did you get that, Pat?

[2:54:41] Voice 4: I don't know if you got the motion

[2:54:43] Voice 4: yet.

[2:54:45] Voice 4: Add one community

[2:54:47] Voice 4: dock on Magic

[2:54:48] Voice 4: Lake. Yes.

[2:54:50] Voice 4: Thank you. I've

[2:54:52] Voice 14: got the motions.

[2:54:53] Voice 14: Thank you. But

[2:54:54] Voice 14: you got that. Did that

[2:54:55] Voice 14: change? Yes. Yes, I did.

[2:54:57] Voice 4: Thank you. All right. Is that seconded?

[2:54:59] Voice 14: Yep. It was seconded.

[2:55:00] Voice 4: Is there any further discussion?

[2:55:03] Voice 4: No. I'll call the vote.

[2:55:05] Voice 4: All those in favor?

[2:55:07] Voice 4: and that was carried okay what else well sort of uh

[2:55:15] Voice 18: port washington and driftwood center

[2:55:19] Voice 18: morrison you wanted to bring those two items up yeah um

[2:55:23] Voice 10: when you when you say port washington

[2:55:25] Voice 10: like which the

[2:55:26] Voice 18: old store rezoning it from the commercial use to the rural residential two

[2:55:31] Voice 18: that's a part of bylaw 223 and 229.

[2:55:37] Voice 13: yeah so the and the reason that i wanted to bring that up

[2:55:41] Voice 13: and i'll put a motion on the table maybe first and then we can discuss it and either mix it or

[2:55:45] Voice 13: address it um so that the north pender local trust committee amend draft bylaws number 223 and 229

[2:55:54] Voice 13: by retaining the commercial zoning at 1200 and 1201 port washington road so that's the motion

[2:56:02] Voice 13: plus

[2:56:03] Voice 10: you want to say you want to keep it as commercial so

[2:56:08] Voice 13: yeah i don't actually want to

[2:56:09] Voice 13: keep it as commercial in the long run i just don't want to keep it as part of my lu5 luv

[2:56:14] Voice 13: bylaw amendment because it breaches the project charter at the point was brought up earlier and

[2:56:18] Voice 13: i think it's a good point and i think it has to be the applicant has come forward

[2:56:24] Voice 5: is there anything

[2:56:36] Voice 10: else outside of the project charter that we're dealing with in this lub then

[2:56:39] Voice 10: if we're following that principle are there other things within the project charter that we're going

[2:56:45] Voice 10: outside of the school if that's the one not

[2:56:46] Voice 18: that i'm aware of and which one which so

[2:56:50] Voice 10: this is this

[2:56:51] Voice 10: is kind of hey i can get the zoning done for this changed kind of thing and not have to pay so much

[2:56:57] Voice 10: coin to get through the process and do you deal with that do you give it up that's what's going

[2:57:03] Voice 10: on not why you don't answer that but that's what's going like yeah but i mean okay no i understand

[2:57:10] Voice 13: what you're saying i guess that's i'm just i don't want to put the land use bylaw changes at risk

[2:57:17] Voice 13: because we're inside or outside the charter like I mean do we adjust the charter I just don't want

[2:57:22] Voice 13: to have the all the other work here like as far

[2:57:25] Voice 3: as the charter goes it's a guideline okay

[2:57:27] Voice 13: so we can just adjust that it's

[2:57:30] Voice 3: to keep let's try and keep the process going

[2:57:33] Voice 13: and so I guess I just need uh I need a little clarity because there's two of them one is this

[2:57:44] Voice 13: one and one is the uh c2 zoning at the driftwood those were the two that were raised and so the

[2:57:52] Voice 13: the port wash road going from commercial zoning to it was going to rural residential with just

[2:57:58] Voice 13: one building so if it was multifamily residential it would have had to be changed to like it's not

[2:58:05] Voice 13: a multi-family residential okay so and the concern that was raised is that there was a conversation

[2:58:13] Voice 13: originally, like way back when that was commercial zoning, that there was some concern about people

[2:58:18] Voice 13: living on that property because it was sewer or something like that?

[2:58:21] Voice 3: So yeah, originally there

[2:58:23] Voice 3: was a store, it was called Pumpkin Hall. Yeah. But to build a new house.

[2:58:30] Voice 13: Right. So that would

[2:58:32] Voice 3: Okay, so as

[2:58:43] Voice 3: long as you're

[2:58:43] Voice 13: confirming for me that it doesn't impact

[2:58:45] Voice 13: impact the rest of the land use bylaw that we can talk about one at a time in separate ways but

[2:58:50] Voice 13: if it's not a problem for it impacting that then i don't know well

[2:58:58] Voice 10: if one of the purposes of the

[2:59:00] Voice 10: land use bylaw was to kind of sew up some of these historical zonings that don't make any sense yeah

[2:59:05] Voice 5: and

[2:59:05] Voice 10: try to modernize it at least that was one of my intentions yeah i

[2:59:08] Voice 10: mean this commercial zoning

[2:59:09] Voice 10: has been sitting there for decades poor washington store has been torn down uh it's basically a

[2:59:16] Voice 10: a parking lot right now uh there there is a direction in the official community plan that

[2:59:21] Voice 10: says we should spread out commercial development and certainly commercial development on the island

[2:59:26] Voice 10: is highly concentrated right now um so that was that was my only concern but i mean what it was

[2:59:31] Voice 10: we can't force someone to use the zoning to build a business there there is a potential to you know

[2:59:37] Voice 10: the app person in the communities asked to change the zoning um i mean to be honest how my personal

[2:59:46] Voice 10: feelings on this are you know sad to see that uh that local businesses couldn't take opportunities

[2:59:51] Voice 10: for the zoning and use it appropriately to build some type of local business and create a more

[2:59:56] Voice 10: vibrant area like a little store or something kind of cool you want to go to salt spring

[3:00:00] Voice 10: very little stores and and we're eliminating that and turning it into a rural residential

[3:00:06] Voice 10: um but you can't force the property owner to start businesses and facilities so you know to me i'm

[3:00:12] Voice 10: kind of like this is an add-on i i i don't see a huge problem with it but it's uh yeah it's just

[3:00:20] Voice 10: kind of uh it's a little bit random you know like uh to get this thrown into the project so i agree

[3:00:26] Voice 5: yeah that

[3:00:26] Voice 10: said i mean i'm willing to support it the change to rural residential because it's just

[3:00:30] Voice 10: not being used yeah as

[3:00:31] Voice 10: commercial and the zoning is not hasn't changed and what are we what else

[3:00:35] Voice 10: we're supposed to do just keep it as zoning and keep it as kind of unuseful land like so i think

[3:00:41] Voice 13: what i would like to do actually i've just i think this actually thought these two pieces fall into

[3:00:46] Voice 13: my bucket of like it's better to have the the change in the landing by one as long as it's not

[3:00:52] Voice 13: affected the whole project get comment on it and then like revisit them very specifically

[3:00:57] Voice 13: so if they can be on our very specific revisit list after the it's

[3:01:02] Voice 18: on in file 229 as well okay

[3:01:04] Voice 18: this goes along with the ocp it won't impact this yeah

[3:01:08] Voice 13: but what i mean is like those i just want

[3:01:10] Voice 13: those changes sort of refreshed on the agenda specifically because what i what i worry about

[3:01:17] Voice 13: is that we get feedback on i just want to make sure that they that people comment on them so

[3:01:22] Voice 13: that we know because we have had some comments on them and it would be good just for people to be

[3:01:26] Voice 13: flagged in the community information meeting that these are very specific changes and that way if

[3:01:31] Voice 13: people don't want it to be residential because they do want a commercial area by not basically

[3:01:38] Voice 13: means that the landowner has to do some work to convince people that it should be residential in

[3:01:43] Voice 13: his own application or it just stays commercial and you can never build a residential there and

[3:01:49] Voice 13: something he can't do residential and so he would have to sell it to somebody else so it still has

[3:01:55] Voice 13: that possibility as a community goal for commercial there and but the community needs to weigh in on

[3:02:01] Voice 13: that pretty heavily so

[3:02:02] Voice 18: what we can do is that the cim is put up these i mean we'll make them nicer

[3:02:06] Voice 18: describe what these properties are this is the port wash old port washington store this is the

[3:02:11] Voice 18: driftwood center and then we can have a section below where people can even write their performance

[3:02:16] Voice 18: now that'd be great thank you yeah

[3:02:18] Voice 10: i need to i would love to hear a convincing argument to not

[3:02:20] Voice 10: allow this change in zoning you know

[3:02:23] Voice 10: right now i'm just you know i've heard from anybody so my

[3:02:27] Voice 13: yeah and i have an argument for that but i think i'd rather just hear community feedback before i

[3:02:31] Voice 13: like totally cinch that one way or the other because my my biggest concern is that once you

[3:02:37] Voice 13: move it to a residential and somebody actually builds a house on it that's it there's no more

[3:02:41] Voice 13: commercial potential right

[3:02:42] Voice 10: and the

[3:02:43] Voice 13: loss of commercial potential with the ocp saying we

[3:02:46] Voice 13: should have distributed potential isn't it and

[3:02:48] Voice 10: we get that but we can't force people to open a

[3:02:50] Voice 10: business but

[3:02:51] Voice 13: we can force people not to build residence on it

[3:02:54] Voice 10: that's yeah well exactly so yeah

[3:02:58] Voice 10: it's an interesting one i certainly want to hear from folks in the community about this that'd be

[3:03:03] Voice 10: really interesting to me

[3:03:04] Voice 4: so any other topics yes

[3:03:06] Voice 10: so a topic uh excuse

[3:03:08] Voice 14: me there wasn't there

[3:03:10] Voice 14: There wasn't a motion put forward,

[3:03:12] Voice 14: so you want to read?

[3:03:13] Voice 4: There was a second.

[3:03:14] Voice 4: Okay.

[3:03:15] Voice 4: Okay.

[3:03:16] Voice 4: Thanks for checking.

[3:03:19] Voice 10: Yeah, I just want to bring up page 68.

[3:03:21] Voice 10: There's in the plan, bylaw 223, the subject property change from rural to industrial.

[3:03:29] Voice 10: And that's the current spot where there's a T&P operating as waste management.

[3:03:33] Voice 10: And as I've stated before many times, this is not something that I'd be willing to support.

[3:03:38] Voice 10: for this change as part of this land use by-law agreement.

[3:03:41] Voice 10: Mainly because there's industrial land sitting there empty,

[3:03:46] Voice 10: two parcels that can be utilized for it.

[3:03:49] Voice 10: And we're increasing industrial land,

[3:03:51] Voice 10: which I think goes against the preserve and protect mandate,

[3:03:55] Voice 10: increasing industrial land.

[3:03:57] Voice 10: So I'm not comfortable voting in favor of that addition

[3:04:01] Voice 10: to the by-law as it currently stands.

[3:04:04] Voice 10: So I'm not sure if you need a discussion

[3:04:06] Voice 10: or we need to you know finally have a vote on that or what what how we kind of proceed with that

[3:04:12] Voice 10: we voted it in

[3:04:13] Voice 13: last meeting yeah yeah so

[3:04:16] Voice 13: and that is in the same category as these other ones from

[3:04:19] Voice 13: my point of view is it's in there to get community comment right for the first reading and then it's

[3:04:25] Voice 13: specifically itemized like these other ones we just discussed for like second reading so that

[3:04:31] Voice 13: we like make very clear boats on those items again just to make sure that they stay in there or not

[3:04:39] Voice 10: because otherwise

[3:04:39] Voice 13: if we don't have it in there we don't get comment and so i would like it to be in

[3:04:44] Voice 13: there for comment okay

[3:04:46] Voice 10: well the only thing is is like we've had the waste management on the agenda

[3:04:51] Voice 10: of the ltc for a decade uh so a little bit will the land use bylaw review get taken over by a

[3:04:57] Voice 10: discussion of waste management and the call the comments will be retained to that okay well i

[3:05:04] Voice 10: think that's what will happen and it'll turn into discussion about waste management where to put

[3:05:08] Voice 10: industrial land but concerns over us even bringing this to the public the way it is if

[3:05:15] Voice 13: you want to

[3:05:16] Voice 13: make do another vote on it we can but it was voted in last meeting so yeah

[3:05:20] Voice 10: sure i'd like to make a

[3:05:21] Voice 10: motion that the local trust committee removed page uh 68 and the uh i don't even know how to

[3:05:31] Voice 10: how to say this uh plan number one from bylaw two two three yeah yeah i'll

[3:05:38] Voice 4: second it uh okay

[3:05:39] Voice 4: yes

[3:05:42] Voice 14: did

[3:05:44] Voice 4: you get that

[3:05:44] Voice 14: motion uh remove page 68 and plan number one from bylaw 223 i believe

[3:05:52] Voice 13: i think it's just plan number one i don't think you have to just

[3:05:54] Voice 14: plan number one oh okay okay

[3:05:57] Voice 14: and

[3:05:58] Voice 13: that was seconded by trustee morrison any discussion so i won't support that motion but

[3:06:03] Voice 13: i'm happy to have that conversation and we have had that conversation almost every time it comes

[3:06:07] Voice 13: up um and i understand the need to reaffirm it for you but i run it in there for comment

[3:06:13] Voice 10: yeah it's not about reaffirming it's just about understanding the justification

[3:06:19] Voice 10: I still have not ever left any of our discussions with believing like there was a logical explanation of why we, the trust committee is approving the expansion of industrial land.

[3:06:31] Voice 10: That's what that's what's not clear to me. And, and does that not go against the preserve and protect Mandy.

[3:06:37] Voice 10: I've yet to hear if that's that's what I'd like to find out, so I can so I can understand what and I always leave not understand the logic.

[3:06:45] Voice 13: yeah and i i don't really want to expense explain it again i i'm happy to like reference other

[3:06:52] Voice 13: videos where i've explained it before but i'm just i'm not going to

[3:06:55] Voice 5: explain it today i think

[3:07:02] Voice 5: as we

[3:07:02] Voice 4: go into the community information meeting as we talked about communications over and over

[3:07:06] Voice 4: and over again is to frame these conversations you're inviting feedback on these issues so

[3:07:11] Voice 4: i mean i think if it's framed properly it's like this isn't about trying to

[3:07:16] Voice 4: throw the whole project up under the bus this is a project that has lots and lots of elements in it

[3:07:22] Voice 4: and i think keeping the message very clear that you're looking for specific feedback on these

[3:07:28] Voice 4: things um will help um for me in regard to the preserve protect mandate we still have

[3:07:36] Voice 4: communities that we have to function that function on these islands and having you know industrial

[3:07:44] Voice 4: land and commercial land is a necessity so it's the right amount and the location um so

[3:07:52] Voice 4: finding the conversation from the communities is i support some okay

[3:07:59] Voice 10: but like i guess what i'm

[3:08:01] Voice 10: saying is like if you've explained it so many times the community people that i've spoken to

[3:08:05] Voice 10: they don't understand it like they don't understand the justification for increasing industrial land

[3:08:11] Voice 10: that's that that's so you want to have the conversation and you you want to go and ask

[3:08:16] Voice 10: people's opinions but the rationale is not clear to members of the community that i've discussed

[3:08:21] Voice 10: with like numerous times so that's why i was asking for an opportunity to i mean i don't

[3:08:26] Voice 10: understand the reticence to communicate what the issues don't

[3:08:29] Voice 13: frame it that way please don't frame

[3:08:31] Voice 13: it as reticence to communicate i've communicated every single time i understand that you're saying

[3:08:38] Voice 13: there isn't understanding the community people i've talked for within the community do understand

[3:08:43] Voice 13: it so i need to speak to those people individually at the community information meeting which is why

[3:08:48] Voice 13: i still have it so i'm happy to come to the community information meeting and have all

[3:08:53] Voice 13: those conversations with community members directly but i just don't want to do it here

[3:08:59] Voice 13: so i'd rather

[3:09:02] Voice 13: do it there all at once holistically that's what i'm asking for

[3:09:05] Voice 10: okay well i mean it would help me i would love to support what you guys are talking about but i

[3:09:11] Voice 10: don't understand i've been in all the meetings with you guys i still don't understand so you

[3:09:15] Voice 10: can tell me you've explained it a whole bunch of times but that doesn't help me understand

[3:09:19] Voice 10: how to support the work trust me like no

[3:09:23] Voice 13: i understand what you're saying so like the short

[3:09:27] Voice 13: i mean the short really kind of super frustrating frankly because like i know that you don't agree

[3:09:33] Voice 13: agree with it because of like the things that you said and i debated those specific things multiple

[3:09:38] Voice 13: times and i agree with what laura just said that you know we don't have a zoned clearly useful

[3:09:48] Voice 13: outside of one single person's ownership piece of property for waste management that's a freaking

[3:09:55] Voice 13: problem on our island okay done that's my explanation i want the community to give me

[3:10:01] Voice 13: some input or I want Jim Allen to sell

[3:10:03] Voice 13: his frickin' property to somebody who will run a waste

[3:10:05] Voice 13: management plan. I can't

[3:10:07] Voice 13: control that. So what I can

[3:10:09] Voice 13: control is getting some land

[3:10:12] Voice 13: actually zoned that

[3:10:13] Voice 13: is used for waste management.

[3:10:16] Voice 13: So give me an alternative.

[3:10:19] Voice 10: Well, the alternative

[3:10:20] Voice 10: is to allow the business owners to

[3:10:22] Voice 10: resolve their issues.

[3:10:23] Voice 13: It's eight years.

[3:10:24] Voice 13: They're not resolving it.

[3:10:25] Voice 10: But why is it up to

[3:10:26] Voice 10: the local trust committee to resolve business owner and landowner issues?

[3:10:28] Voice 13: Because it's waste management.

[3:10:29] Voice 13: because it's a it's an issue on the island to have waste management okay

[3:10:34] Voice 10: so then now we're

[3:10:35] Voice 10: getting progress because it's a local government

[3:10:36] Voice 13: related issue that we still have to have something

[3:10:39] Voice 13: known for waste management okay

[3:10:41] Voice 10: so fair enough yeah so

[3:10:44] Voice 10: that so you're saying in this particular

[3:10:46] Voice 10: circumstance because it's a public service that's

[3:10:49] Voice 13: right we

[3:10:50] Voice 10: have to expand industrial land

[3:10:52] Voice 10: even though industrial land exists already for it to take place so the trust has

[3:10:57] Voice 10: to then therefore

[3:10:58] Voice 10: step in and resolve because property owners and business owners don't cooperate that's right okay

[3:11:04] Voice 10: that's

[3:11:05] Voice 13: right and i would be happy to unzone some of the land that's not being used to swap it out

[3:11:10] Voice 13: i would be happy to do that that's an option that we could think about like if the community comes

[3:11:16] Voice 13: back and says yes that's a good idea because this is offers i'm like great and but we don't want to

[3:11:22] Voice 13: increase industrial land that would be excellent feedback okay and then we would literally look

[3:11:27] Voice 13: at other industrial land and say could we take away some of the zoning of other industrial land

[3:11:32] Voice 13: to swap that out if they're the calf on a rural industrial farm i am completely okay with that

[3:11:37] Voice 13: so

[3:11:37] Voice 10: it's just it's just amazing that crd's gotten away with so

[3:11:44] Voice 10: we've had we have to increase

[3:11:46] Voice 10: industrial land on the island and or because property owners and business owners don't get

[3:11:53] Voice 10: along crd doesn't want to touch it so we feel there's a need from the trust committee to step

[3:11:59] Voice 10: in to resolve it and

[3:12:00] Voice 13: we don't have to increase industrial land we have the choice to swap out

[3:12:05] Voice 13: industrial land if we want to we can do that we can remove zoning so we could say that the two

[3:12:12] Voice 13: pieces of land that are like the adjacent one for instance that it has potential it's most logical

[3:12:19] Voice 13: in so many ways to to be um the waste management because it's right next to the recycling center

[3:12:24] Voice 13: if it's not being used for that and i believe it's zoned for that isn't it are we we're adding

[3:12:30] Voice 13: the zoning for waste management to it yeah so like that piece of land if it's not used for that

[3:12:37] Voice 13: then we could just take it away take the zoning away from it right and so we have the potential

[3:12:45] Voice 13: to keep the same amount of industrial land overall but to trade it across the island

[3:12:51] Voice 13: we totally have that right so i would not use the rhetoric basically is what i'm saying

[3:12:59] Voice 13: that we're increasing industrial land what we're doing is we're getting comment from the public

[3:13:03] Voice 13: on industrial land and if they don't want an increase but they want that spot then we have

[3:13:08] Voice 13: to take it from somewhere else i

[3:13:14] Voice 10: mean so that's an interesting strategy i mean i i would prefer

[3:13:18] Voice 10: the strategy that people in there just do their jobs i

[3:13:21] Voice 13: would prefer that too but

[3:13:23] Voice 10: by allowing us

[3:13:24] Voice 10: by giving concessions like this we're just saying well crd you're off the hook property owners

[3:13:29] Voice 10: business owners oh well you don't get along we'll keep you know we'll solve it for you i guess it's

[3:13:35] Voice 10: that's the that's the principle maybe which we disagree on it's it's it's how we go about doing

[3:13:40] Voice 10: this and i know we said numerous times you know why does the trust get involved in areas it

[3:13:45] Voice 10: shouldn't right and i mean to me this is an example this could have all sorted itself out on

[3:13:51] Voice 10: its own

[3:13:51] Voice 13: but the

[3:13:53] Voice 10: trust is in my opinion the direction right now is the trust is getting

[3:13:57] Voice 10: concessions to try and you know to work with this to try and solve it to expand some industrial land

[3:14:05] Voice 10: and do some trade-offs whereas we could have said no sort it out and it would have been uncomfortable

[3:14:10] Voice 10: there would have been some closures and some strike downs we would have felt some pretty big

[3:14:14] Voice 10: key but i mean the principle of it is that people need to do their jobs and and also landowners need

[3:14:24] Voice 10: to be more cooperative and i don't know it's i'm not sure i'm convinced this is the correct

[3:14:31] Voice 10: principle we should have gone about this so but i understand as a result of the conversation you

[3:14:36] Voice 10: explained to me that i i do understand what you're going getting and i think it's important to be

[3:14:41] Voice 10: transparent about it so and

[3:14:43] Voice 13: just to be clear i've explained that before i have explained that before

[3:14:46] Voice 13: so and and the framing that you have of framing it as you know what you just explained i would

[3:14:53] Voice 13: frame it differently i would frame it that land use changes across the island we're seeing that

[3:14:59] Voice 13: with the port wash road we're seeing that in other places land use shifts and changes across the

[3:15:03] Voice 13: i am not a fan of expanding industrial land in the trust area i am a fan of trying to find and

[3:15:11] Voice 13: meet the community's current needs um to figure out practical solutions to what we have and i

[3:15:19] Voice 13: think that if the community says no they want that spot for the it's working like nobody is

[3:15:26] Voice 13: really having it because the idea of putting a temporary use permit was just to see how it worked

[3:15:30] Voice 13: and if it's working in that spot then i would actually ask when we get into second reading

[3:15:37] Voice 13: to think about where we're going to take industrial land from because i think that

[3:15:41] Voice 13: i personally can can't support the increasing overall of industrial land in the trust area

[3:15:47] Voice 13: so i think that we would need to take land the industrial zoning away from someone so and there's

[3:15:54] Voice 13: a few options of where to do that and i have them in my head based on to come up with after we go

[3:16:01] Voice 13: through public consultation so i wouldn't frame it as we're consistently expanding but i absolutely

[3:16:09] Voice 13: would agree with you on oh my gosh can people just like not think at a community level about

[3:16:15] Voice 13: we started

[3:16:18] Voice 10: the term with gulf excavating on jim allen's property and we're ending the term

[3:16:25] Voice 10: with a cement plant on a property it's a second and the the waste transfers

[3:16:32] Voice 10: thing at the same property just in the different part so yes industrial land has expanded i don't

[3:16:38] Voice 10: know how else to frame that and i think that goes against the preserve and protect manning

[3:16:45] Voice 10: in my opinion so my con my motion relates to should we bring this up in the community and

[3:16:51] Voice 10: discuss it sounds to me like you guys want to i just wanted to make it clear that you know i

[3:16:58] Voice 10: i have great opposition to this and and i will i will continue to express that opposition

[3:17:06] Voice 10: as uncomfortable as it is no

[3:17:08] Voice 13: that's okay that's fair so

[3:17:10] Voice 10: thank you for listening yeah i don't

[3:17:11] Voice 10: know if you want to vote on the motion

[3:17:13] Voice 4: no further discussion i'll call the vote all those in favor

[3:17:17] Voice 4: so just to be clear the motion is to remove it oh sorry thank you so can

[3:17:21] Voice 5: we have the motion yes

[3:17:22] Voice 5: read past the motion path that

[3:17:28] Voice 14: the north pender local trust committee direct staff remove plan

[3:17:32] Voice 14: number one from bylaw 223 thank you

[3:17:36] Voice 14: so

[3:17:37] Voice 4: all those in favor trustee mcconkie voting in favor all

[3:17:41] Voice 4: those opposed that would be uh deb and um myself

[3:17:46] Voice 6: that

[3:17:48] Voice 4: is defeated okay any other discussions on the

[3:17:53] Voice 4: land use bylaw uh

[3:17:54] Voice 18: the number of cims and the structure it sounds like you agree with the

[3:17:59] Voice 18: structure but how many in-person cims would you like to see how many online what's the schedule

[3:18:05] Voice 18: like for the summer we could just have a brief discussion about that now while we're all here

[3:18:13] Voice 18: right yeah we also july june 30th

[3:18:17] Voice 18: we have a june 30th meeting coming up which is right before the long weekend

[3:18:25] Voice 18: so that's also meaning that we may want to consider moving online or the

[3:18:29] Voice 10: june 30th meeting

[3:18:31] Voice 10: is going to be is problematic i'm wondering if we can change that forever is that i know that's very

[3:18:37] Voice 10: more hard for you or

[3:18:39] Voice 4: exchange it for a special

[3:18:41] Voice 3: yeah because at this point i don't foresee other

[3:18:47] Voice 3: than Mr. Funk is this is the only application and i don't anticipate it may not even be ready

[3:18:55] Voice 3: okay

[3:18:56] Voice 13: i guess that's the other question i have to clarify are we get are we moving into second

[3:19:01] Voice 13: reading today our first reading today yeah okay

[3:19:04] Voice 8: so that's so if

[3:19:06] Voice 13: we don't need that meeting to

[3:19:07] Voice 13: move that into first reading so we can get into community information meeting i'd be all for just

[3:19:11] Voice 13: canceling that meeting having the community information meetings whenever we can figure

[3:19:15] Voice 13: them out you

[3:19:16] Voice 18: can even do june 30th as the online cim so that date still works

[3:19:22] Voice 18: information

[3:19:23] Voice 13: meeting okay sorry i'm actually i'm translating in my hand

[3:19:26] Voice 13: it's the day

[3:19:27] Voice 4: before july 1st so probably not an ideal time to get people's attention

[3:19:38] Voice 5: Okay,

[3:19:43] Voice 13: I need some suggestions. So I and also the just the timing, community information meetings, we really need to make them outside the work.

[3:19:52] Voice 3: Yeah.

[3:19:53] Voice 3: Yeah,

[3:19:55] Voice 18: there's July 23, which is a Saturday.

[3:19:59] Voice 18: July 2,

[3:20:05] Voice 18: that would be the long weekend, Saturday.

[3:20:08] Voice 13: And why do we think the long weekend is not good?

[3:20:11] Voice 4: holiday weekend yeah

[3:20:13] Voice 13: everybody and their dog will be on the island

[3:20:16] Voice 4: will they

[3:20:16] Voice 13: want to go to a community information meeting i don't know i'm just saying every

[3:20:20] Voice 13: so i get a big shake of it i know it's

[3:20:24] Voice 1: not a good look yeah no it's not a good look yeah

[3:20:26] Voice 4: and our staff should have the holiday weekend off as well

[3:20:29] Voice 18: i'll speak

[3:20:31] Voice 4: for them personally

[3:20:32] Voice 18: i am away

[3:20:33] Voice 18: for two saturdays in july that's i am for my summer vacation but i have august it's completely

[3:20:39] Voice 18: we can just boom boom boom yeah august is better so

[3:20:47] Voice 10: we can't can we can can we just

[3:20:49] Voice 10: have like three community information meetings virtually in july on a thursday or something

[3:20:57] Voice 11: yeah and

[3:20:59] Voice 10: do trustees need to attend the community information meeting no no

[3:21:03] Voice 10: we don't have to

[3:21:03] Voice 10: so even if it doesn't line up with everybody one at least one of us could be there and

[3:21:07] Voice 10: listen to the concerns of folks

[3:21:08] Voice 5: why don't

[3:21:09] Voice 10: we just go like july 7 14 21st or july 7th and july 21st

[3:21:15] Voice 18: when's your holiday it's the 9th until the 24th um but potentially i can be available for the 21st

[3:21:22] Voice 18: so i could do the 7th and the 21st yeah

[3:21:25] Voice 10: and then the key being that you present what's being

[3:21:28] Voice 10: we want to communicate this is the only method in which we can communicate with folks what's

[3:21:32] Voice 10: going on in the land use bylaw review they can watch the recordings later that that's key just

[3:21:36] Voice 10: getting you speaking and explaining what's going on is probably key and

[3:21:40] Voice 18: then i think it'd be

[3:21:41] Voice 18: important then to have an in-person cim in early august okay would a saturday work better or would

[3:21:49] Voice 18: that be something in the week it's

[3:21:52] Voice 13: still going to be better for in-person ones i think to be either

[3:21:55] Voice 13: in the evening or the weekend just for there's so many people and they were working yeah so august

[3:22:01] Voice 13: Saturday the 6th or 13th

[3:22:03] Voice 10: let's just say 6th

[3:22:04] Voice 18: yeah and then so if you don't

[3:22:05] Voice 10: mind at the end of this

[3:22:06] Voice 10: meeting setting the dates yes we can confirm as

[3:22:09] Voice 10: trustees if that's a big huge problem sounds like

[3:22:11] Voice 10: the only in-person would be a 6th so that's so I

[3:22:14] Voice 13: can't do the 6th I'm traveling back but that's

[3:22:17] Voice 10: that's fine I what about you I mean I could show up for

[3:22:20] Voice 18: the 13th because it would be nice for you

[3:22:22] Voice 18: 13th okay

[3:22:23] Voice 18: yeah

[3:22:25] Voice 5: so that's three opportunities for folks to

[3:22:33] Voice 10: learn have questions answered

[3:22:35] Voice 10: accepted you know bottoming okay that's great and

[3:22:38] Voice 18: then we can discuss the june 30th now if

[3:22:41] Voice 18: you wanted just to cancel that or it could be at just a quick one hour zoom meeting if we do

[3:22:45] Voice 18: have an application

[3:22:48] Voice 10: uh sorry one more time june 30th

[3:22:55] Voice 18: is our regular schedule it's the next meeting

[3:22:57] Voice 18: we don't necessarily have anything on the agenda but we could do a quick one hour zoom meeting in

[3:23:02] Voice 18: case we do have an application or if you need some updates to the or would like to see the

[3:23:09] Voice 18: draft no

[3:23:10] Voice 10: i'd be happy to have a long meeting on the 28th of july

[3:23:15] Voice 10: what do you think guys

[3:23:16] Voice 4: june 30th that's our regular scheduled meeting oh

[3:23:19] Voice 10: that's our regular

[3:23:20] Voice 10: okay yeah

[3:23:21] Voice 18: because

[3:23:22] Voice 10: we're having three cims basically july and august the big work of the

[3:23:26] Voice 10: trust committee is the land use bylaw then if we have any applications or anything we can deal with

[3:23:31] Voice 10: that on the 20th does that make sense what do you think is that cool yeah

[3:23:35] Voice 13: the 28th um so i'm taking

[3:23:37] Voice 13: two weeks of holiday in my life period um and they're mid so it's the middle of july it's the

[3:23:43] Voice 13: end of july

[3:23:44] Voice 5: so

[3:23:45] Voice 13: that meeting i can't guarantee i'll be there and if i'll be there virtually

[3:23:49] Voice 13: um within july would

[3:23:52] Voice 10: you be okay with a virtual meeting i'm

[3:23:53] Voice 13: okay with it

[3:23:54] Voice 13: virtual meetings

[3:23:54] Voice 10: yeah just

[3:23:57] Voice 13: i'm on a boat in england so which is possible but i'm not going

[3:24:03] Voice 13: to guarantee that i can be there so having said that i'm happy also just to forward my comments

[3:24:08] Voice 13: well

[3:24:09] Voice 10: because there's no meeting on in august can you move the potential date to the week

[3:24:15] Voice 10: or the august 11th and then there's a cmm of 13th that would be way better without can

[3:24:21] Voice 13: we do that

[3:24:21] Voice 13: can we move the july 28th meeting to the 11th and then cancel the june meeting

[3:24:25] Voice 13: so

[3:24:26] Voice 10: we're cancelling june 30th are we screwed

[3:24:29] Voice 18: just as long as we have availability paul oh

[3:24:32] Voice 18: so july 28th will be moved to august 11th 11th oh my god did we actually manage to schedule

[3:24:40] Voice 18: something and um i'd like to actually if i may schedule that zoom cim that was for the 21st to

[3:24:48] Voice 18: the 28th if that's okay that's fine it doesn't matter to me one way or the other yes okay okay

[3:24:52] Voice 18: let's do that then yeah

[3:24:54] Voice 5: okay yeah

[3:24:57] Voice 13: i i'm trying to turn over a new leaf where our actual lives

[3:25:00] Voice 13: are actually respected so i'm just saying i'm like so

[3:25:07] Voice 10: we have the cim on the 7th of july the 28th of

[3:25:11] Voice 10: july correct and the 13th of august that's

[3:25:14] Voice 3: correct july ones are resume okay

[3:25:17] Voice 10: and then the in person

[3:25:21] Voice 10: would be on the 13th so i guess that would be important for folks in in person especially i'll

[3:25:32] Voice 10: make sure i promote the in person on the 13th perfect

[3:25:35] Voice 18: so we have a we already gave direction

[3:25:37] Voice 18: to schedule these special meetings for the cim so we don't need a motion for that but i'd imagine

[3:25:42] Voice 18: we need a motion to change the date of july 28th to

[3:25:47] Voice 10: august 11th to make a motion to change the

[3:25:49] Voice 10: local trust committee meeting from july 28th to august the 11th

[3:25:54] Voice 4: let's see if that so it was

[3:25:57] Voice 4: a regular scheduled meeting on july 28th moved to yes i've got that

[3:26:03] Voice 4: great seconded by christy

[3:26:07] Voice 4: morrison any discussion all those in favor that ferry and then a motion to cancel the june 30th

[3:26:13] Voice 4: meeting i'd

[3:26:14] Voice 10: like to make a motion to cancel the june 30th local trust committee meeting

[3:26:17] Voice 4: second

[3:26:18] Voice 4: second trustee morrison any discussion all those in favor that's carried too

[3:26:24] Voice 11: pat all right one

[3:26:27] Voice 13: clarification one clarification that i need is the cims do you know what the timing in the day

[3:26:34] Voice 13: CIM says? It would be

[3:26:36] Voice 18: structure for the Zoom meetings

[3:26:38] Voice 18: would most likely start at 10

[3:26:40] Voice 18: but that can change due to

[3:26:42] Voice 18: your

[3:26:42] Voice 13: schedule or

[3:26:43] Voice 13: as long as you tell me when they are

[3:26:46] Voice 13: and I get them in there now

[3:26:47] Voice 13: and then the Saturday in

[3:26:49] Voice 18: person would be

[3:26:50] Voice 18: revolving around the ferry schedule

[3:26:52] Voice 18: I'm not sure when the ferry comes in on Saturday

[3:26:54] Voice 18: I

[3:26:54] Voice 3: usually start a bit later

[3:26:56] Voice 3: on Saturdays and finish later

[3:26:58] Voice 3: if necessary

[3:26:59] Voice 3: which day?

[3:27:01] Voice 3: we talk on the

[3:27:02] Voice 13: saturday the 7th and the 21st would be starting around 10 and then uh i could

[3:27:10] Voice 18: consider even though the 28th or the 7th perhaps the 7th doing an evening zoom session if that's

[3:27:16] Voice 18: easier one evening and one during the day if that would capture community

[3:27:23] Voice 13: members who work

[3:27:24] Voice 13: i could do

[3:27:25] Voice 18: it a cim that starts at 6 30 yeah

[3:27:28] Voice 13: that might be nice or

[3:27:29] Voice 18: perhaps the 7th of july

[3:27:31] Voice 18: okay let's do that so 7th of july will be at 6 30 and then the cim on july 28th will start at 10

[3:27:37] Voice 18: and

[3:27:39] Voice 13: is it july 28th or 21st

[3:27:40] Voice 18: i thought it got changed 28th so 28th will start at 10 a.m

[3:27:45] Voice 18: which is great because that's the regular time of the what would have been the regular meeting

[3:27:49] Voice 18: and then on july 7th start at 6 30 and

[3:27:59] Voice 13: then so the 11th was the regular time and then the 13th

[3:28:04] Voice 13: was a little later because

[3:28:06] Voice 10: 13th you get in at 9 48 according if the cumberland's running on time yeah

[3:28:10] Voice 10: so usually yeah

[3:28:11] Voice 3: so we usually don't start till five minutes okay the earliest set up with the

[3:28:16] Voice 3: ferry on the file yeah

[3:28:18] Voice 13: for for us one of the important things about the saturday meeting is

[3:28:22] Voice 13: that it at least goes past one o'clock because of the market closing so then all the vendors

[3:28:26] Voice 13: in the market can still come if they want to do it okay all right any

[3:28:32] Voice 12: other things that we have

[3:28:34] Voice 12: a whole pile of motions on

[3:28:36] Voice 4: page 60. sir yeah

[3:28:40] Voice 10: i can i can take a stab at that

[3:28:41] Voice 4: so um

[3:28:46] Voice 10: unless there's any other we covered all the things that you needed

[3:28:50] Voice 10: it's

[3:28:51] Voice 18: just a matter of saying if you are giving first reading make sure you say as amended

[3:28:54] Voice 18: okay just

[3:28:57] Voice 10: the first time okay i'm

[3:28:59] Voice 15: going to go ahead here

[3:29:00] Voice 15: uh

[3:29:01] Voice 10: and say this is on page 60 so i'm

[3:29:05] Voice 10: going to be reading from the um the record the staff recommendations uh that the north

[3:29:13] Voice 10: pender island local trust committee draft bylaw number 223 said it was north pender island fish

[3:29:17] Voice 10: community plan bylaw number 171 2007 amendment number one 2021 be read a first time as amended

[3:29:25] Voice 4: second second by trustee morrison any discussion i'll call the vote all those in favor that's

[3:29:31] Voice 4: carried let's

[3:29:32] Voice 10: make a motion that the north pender island local trust committee proposed bylaw number

[3:29:35] Voice 10: 20 224 senator's north penn around local north pender island land use pilot number 224 to 2022

[3:29:40] Voice 10: be rated a first time as amended second

[3:29:43] Voice 4: second by trustee morrison any discussion

[3:29:46] Voice 4: all the vote all those in favor that was a carriage fall

[3:29:53] Voice 11: asleep here okay

[3:29:55] Voice 10: uh i'd like

[3:29:56] Voice 10: to make a motion of the north pender island trust committee draft bylaw number 229

[3:30:00] Voice 10: said it as north canada island ladies file number two two four two zero two two amendment number

[3:30:04] Voice 10: one twenty twenty three ready first time as amended second

[3:30:07] Voice 4: second by trustee morrison any

[3:30:08] Voice 4: discussion all the vote all those in favor carried but

[3:30:13] Voice 10: to make a motion that north canada local trust

[3:30:15] Voice 10: committee has reviewed the islands trust policy statement directives only checklist and determined

[3:30:20] Voice 10: that bylaw number two two three senators north canada official community plan bylaw number 171

[3:30:25] Voice 10: 20 2007 amendment number one 2021 is not contrary or at variance with the island's trust policy

[3:30:31] Voice 10: statement second

[3:30:32] Voice 4: second by trust morrison any discussion call the vote all those in favor

[3:30:36] Voice 4: gary i

[3:30:39] Voice 10: move that the north panoramic trust committee has reviewed the island's trust

[3:30:43] Voice 10: policy statement directives only checklist and determined that bylaw number 224 said

[3:30:46] Voice 10: it is north panoramic land use bylaw number 224 2022 is not contrary to or at variance with the

[3:30:52] Voice 10: island's trust policy statement

[3:30:52] Voice 4: seconded by trustee morrison any discussion all the vote all those in

[3:30:57] Voice 4: favor that also carried lastly

[3:30:59] Voice 10: i move that the north panoramic trust committee has reviewed the

[3:31:01] Voice 10: island's trust policy statement directives only checklist determined that bylaw number 229 said

[3:31:05] Voice 10: it is north panoramic land use bylaw number two two four two two two zero two two amendment number

[3:31:09] Voice 10: one two zero two two is not contrary to or at variance with the island's trust policy state

[3:31:14] Voice 4: second second by trustee morrison any discussion all those in favor

[3:31:19] Voice 4: carried this process is going to move to community information and get input from the public

[3:31:28] Voice 18: so thank you i'm just thinking about the cims we can put a note in the pender post about these

[3:31:37] Voice 18: dates because did you want to do a specific mail out to

[3:31:41] Voice 13: property owners with these three dates

[3:31:43] Voice 13: would actually yeah we have a budget for that still don't we where

[3:31:47] Voice 3: the budget it's

[3:31:50] Voice 3: fiscal year now so it's pretty tight for this fiscal year so

[3:31:54] Voice 3: basically you'll pay for the cim

[3:31:56] Voice 3: over budget if you wanted to do a mail out and then mail out some time consuming

[3:32:01] Voice 3: so

[3:32:02] Voice 13: maybe what like the pender post in the online is like two-thirds of the community

[3:32:08] Voice 13: but one of the things I would suggest is if you can send us like both Ben and I text that you

[3:32:16] Voice 13: might recommend for our posts that we also put our trustee posts and put those dates in our posts

[3:32:22] Voice 13: okay I

[3:32:23] Voice 13: have not been good about keeping like updating posts because I could date just five

[3:32:27] Voice 13: five right now but I will intentionally try to make it what is it now 26 so they will the June

[3:32:34] Voice 13: there is no June one right but we can get it into the July post so I'll give myself a note

[3:32:42] Voice 13: so you can just email us a short list of what the content of whatever you might put in

[3:32:48] Voice 13: and then we will amplify that all right

[3:32:58] Voice 5: so the that

[3:33:03] Voice 4: leaves up no other business on the

[3:33:05] Voice 4: line is by level so that goes into the next item then is 13.3 on the agenda which is the

[3:33:10] Voice 4: groundwater project which is on page 189 of the agenda package and i believe marissa chadwick has

[3:33:19] Voice 4: joined us on that conversation i'm here um

[3:33:24] Voice 16: and i will note that i am a planner and not a

[3:33:30] Voice 16: hydrogeologist and so the purpose of um uh this report that i'm presenting to you is to speak to

[3:33:38] Voice 16: the guidance and the exemptions within the area and get any questions you might have

[3:33:46] Voice 16: and make sure that you have clarity on what is contained there. I will note that I do

[3:33:55] Voice 16: have a map that does identify some of what has been, what will be provided to you in

[3:34:04] Voice 16: a more detailed methodology from William and uh what what you see here is a this is the area that

[3:34:15] Voice 16: has been identified as critical um this is not made sure of the public at the moment because

[3:34:20] Voice 16: it needs to be accompanied with the tricky type methodology um before and we're very close to

[3:34:28] Voice 16: being able to provide that like things actually um that kind of that methodology will be shared

[3:34:34] Voice 16: with um uh the galliana galliana testimony next week at the meeting um so or i guess it's week

[3:34:42] Voice 16: monday uh it's the same methodology that we'll be proposing for north pender which looks at um

[3:34:49] Voice 16: it looks at areas that have been defined to be critical based on the science um like i said i'm

[3:34:56] Voice 16: I'm not a geologist, so we can focus more on the discussion of that when we have William present.

[3:35:04] Voice 16: And the methodology will all essentially look at lots and the amount of coverage,

[3:35:13] Voice 16: the options that will be presented will look at the amount of coverage of area,

[3:35:20] Voice 16: area. So, where there is a significant amount of coverage, and the amount of area will be

[3:35:28] Voice 16: options that will provide it for you. That's where we will focus the DPA area. But like

[3:35:35] Voice 16: I said, the purpose of what I have to present to you is just to identify what's actually

[3:35:42] Voice 16: they think opposed for those exemptions to the to the DPA. So

[3:35:49] Voice 16: those areas where DPA may cover what within that area would not

[3:35:54] Voice 16: be would not be would be exempt from having to apply for

[3:36:00] Voice 16: development for it. And then what are the kinds of

[3:36:03] Voice 16: guidelines that you may see in in a development permit. So I

[3:36:08] Voice 16: wanted to sort of step through those so that we can have a

[3:36:11] Voice 16: conversation um you know if there are questions about about what those are so on the exact so if

[3:36:18] Voice 16: i went through the um so you've got in front of you you have the the ocp um amendment so before

[3:36:27] Voice 16: i go into the dpa i also just wanted to identify that the ocp amendment includes some of what i've

[3:36:35] Voice 16: term general amendments so there's just some basic changes to the OCP that address some language

[3:36:44] Voice 16: there is the updating of a map to identify groundwater regions and that'll be provided

[3:36:50] Voice 16: to you when you have the other mapping there's some language like I said and all there is a

[3:36:57] Voice 16: section in there that talks about development of a groundwater strategy and that's been

[3:37:04] Voice 16: change to refer to the

[3:37:06] Voice 16: violence trust fresh water sustainability

[3:37:08] Voice 16: strategy so

[3:37:09] Voice 16: those are the

[3:37:11] Voice 16: general

[3:37:13] Voice 16: changes that have been proposed in that

[3:37:16] Voice 16: bylaw

[3:37:18] Voice 16: so I'll just pause there to see if you have any

[3:37:20] Voice 16: questions about the

[3:37:22] Voice 16: more general

[3:37:24] Voice 16: changes that have been proposed

[3:37:25] Voice 16: I

[3:37:31] Voice 13: I'm not sure that I'm ready to have this

[3:37:33] Voice 13: conversation unfortunately just because I

[3:37:35] Voice 13: have a lot of questions about the science and my brain is just like stuck on that like and so i

[3:37:41] Voice 13: i'm not even sure if i can process the other amendments and suggestions without believing

[3:37:47] Voice 13: the methodology more deeply i'm like well i'm struggling with that

[3:37:50] Voice 16: yeah yeah i understand and

[3:37:52] Voice 16: that's why we thought we would separate the two so to to understand when you're actually starting

[3:37:59] Voice 16: to look at the science, what is the science, like what is the implication of applying the science.

[3:38:06] Voice 16: So that's basically what the exemptions and the guidelines provide. So if you can sort of switch,

[3:38:12] Voice 16: turn your mind to what are the implications of defining an area on our island that would be

[3:38:20] Voice 16: required for development permit area. And keeping in mind that development permit areas don't

[3:38:25] Voice 16: restrict development they just uh they they they just um uh they they just force basically an

[3:38:36] Voice 16: application process on a on an athlete on somebody who may want to want to do some changes on their

[3:38:42] Voice 16: land so from you know any kind of development to variances um so to place restrictions on what

[3:38:49] Voice 16: they can do so with that perspective um there are like i said the development permit uh area

[3:38:58] Voice 16: um the amendment identifies exemptions so if you are going to define an area that the that a

[3:39:09] Voice 16: development permit development permit will be required you have to go through your process

[3:39:14] Voice 16: there are exemptions to this and I have I have sort of lumped them into different categories.

[3:39:20] Voice 16: So there are there if there is an area that the development permit area has been identified to

[3:39:27] Voice 16: apply to and a hydro geological assessment has identified straight out that there's no

[3:39:32] Voice 16: no there would be no impact whatsoever to the to the the groundwater to the recharge area.

[3:39:44] Voice 16: then that would be exempt.

[3:39:45] Voice 16: So this would be, there are these kinds of exemptions

[3:39:47] Voice 16: that exist in other DPAs.

[3:39:49] Voice 16: For example, I mean, I don't know if it exists,

[3:39:53] Voice 16: but it might, like steep slope.

[3:39:55] Voice 16: Like I think it would be written in that the planner says

[3:39:58] Voice 16: that it doesn't apply to the plot, because it's not

[3:40:00] Voice 16: going to slope.

[3:40:02] Voice 16: There's no slope, right?

[3:40:03] Voice 16: So that would be the kind of case,

[3:40:04] Voice 16: like if it's clearly obvious and you've

[3:40:06] Voice 16: got a professional opinion, then a DPA wouldn't be needed.

[3:40:11] Voice 16: The construction repair and maintenance.

[3:40:13] Voice 16: So, in this case, maintenance or parents essentially not, not altering the footprint would be not not included.

[3:40:26] Voice 16: We've added the clustering of buildings within 1000 meters per foot home plate so the idea being that if you are concentrating your development on your lot you're not making a big impact to your impacts to the, the actual.

[3:40:41] Voice 16: um the land the recharge area is is um much smaller than if you were sort of stretching it out

[3:40:48] Voice 16: um farm so that so in that case that that that identifies it as an exemption um can

[3:40:56] Voice 13: i can i just

[3:40:57] Voice 13: make a point on that one yeah um home plate is like which cause was that again i just

[3:41:02] Voice 13: so it was spread there yeah so that underscore uh okay here it is t so it's 5.2.12.6 yeah wow

[3:41:13] Voice 13: it's a lot of points um on page 198 and so um the home plate language i noticed in here

[3:41:21] Voice 13: was only said in that clause and nowhere else so that's a little bit of a definitional related

[3:41:29] Voice 13: an issue like you might understand what so if you need so you need it defined yeah so

[3:41:38] Voice 2: so how does this work on the ground

[3:41:40] Voice 10: like average property owner joe said josephine uh

[3:41:46] Voice 10: sitting there and how does that they're in a neighborhood let's say mckinnon style road or

[3:41:52] Voice 10: like somewhere where there's high density like how does this work

[3:41:56] Voice 6: like

[3:41:57] Voice 10: so yes you've identified

[3:41:59] Voice 10: let's say assuming the area is identified as as you know groundwater problems low recharge then

[3:42:06] Voice 10: what yeah so

[3:42:07] Voice 16: if so they want to build their house and they're like oh i'm in a development permit

[3:42:12] Voice 16: area yeah um

[3:42:13] Voice 16: then this is where um there are so if it's well so okay so they want to do something on

[3:42:22] Voice 16: that their land right so the exemptions are speaking to the things that they can do that

[3:42:25] Voice 16: even if they're in that development permit area there are things that they can do on their land

[3:42:29] Voice 16: without having to apply for a development permit.

[3:42:33] Voice 16: So they can, you know,

[3:42:34] Voice 16: maintenance to their home they can do.

[3:42:37] Voice 16: They can, you know, there's a removal

[3:42:42] Voice 16: up to five trees of 20 centimeter diameter a year.

[3:42:47] Voice 16: There's a few other things that they can do.

[3:42:49] Voice 16: They can remove invasive species.

[3:42:51] Voice 16: They can remove dangerous trees, all those sorts of things.

[3:42:57] Voice 16: but say that that what they want to do is outside of that so they want to put a deck on to their

[3:43:03] Voice 16: house or maybe they're building a new house so that's when you look at then um that's where you

[3:43:09] Voice 16: would have to apply for a development permit and that's where you'd have to bring in um an expert

[3:43:14] Voice 16: uh to help identify um the impact that that particular proposal will have to the the

[3:43:22] Voice 16: groundwater to the recharge area and the expert will have access to the science that we've got

[3:43:35] Voice 16: to their own analysis and knowledge and they will determine the extent to which that may impact it,

[3:43:44] Voice 16: what could be done to alleviate or reduce the impacts.

[3:43:49] Voice 16: And so, for example,

[3:43:51] Voice 16: if they have to remove a number of trees

[3:43:56] Voice 16: to get their Dachshund or what have you,

[3:43:58] Voice 16: then maybe they would have to replant in certain species

[3:44:03] Voice 16: and that sort of thing,

[3:44:04] Voice 16: because that's the kind of thing that we have

[3:44:05] Voice 16: in some of our other development area guidelines.

[3:44:09] Voice 16: So essentially there would be,

[3:44:13] Voice 16: or maybe the design may have to change because it's been determined that on this piece of land

[3:44:19] Voice 16: this particular area is particularly vulnerable so you may have to shift your driveway over here

[3:44:26] Voice 16: for example um so again like the guidelines speak to um you know some of those those uh

[3:44:33] Voice 16: potential uh things that that that means is through the development from it

[3:44:38] Voice 3: folks over

[3:44:39] Voice 3: So what you're kind of seeing here is the shift from all that work that William did with GWU Solutions and so on, and then he's taken it and gone, okay, these are the critical areas, and now we're shifting to the planning lens, and we're saying, with this discussion with William, it's like, okay, so what does that mean?

[3:45:00] Voice 3: the same question you asked what does this mean and we're asking a little bit differently by saying

[3:45:05] Voice 3: what does this mean in terms of how do we regulate or how do we propose to regulate what types of

[3:45:11] Voice 3: activities should we propose to regulate and so that's where we got into the discussion with okay

[3:45:16] Voice 3: so um you know what amount of land alteration should require for professional report and what

[3:45:23] Voice 3: should be exempt what about these little small lots that are caught within these areas and the

[3:45:29] Voice 3: the answers are like, no, the small lots don't really matter.

[3:45:32] Voice 3: It's land alteration on large parcels that matter.

[3:45:36] Voice 3: And so that's by putting these exemptions in,

[3:45:39] Voice 3: that's kind of focusing the need for professional analysis

[3:45:44] Voice 3: onto these large scale land alteration activities.

[3:45:50] Voice 3: And there's two ways of exempting a small scale work

[3:45:55] that's

[3:45:56] Voice 3: not going to impact the groundwater.

[3:45:57] Voice 3: water one is by not designating really small parcels within the gpa even though they may be

[3:46:04] Voice 3: within a critical critical area and the second is by having exemptions in to the to the guidelines

[3:46:12] Voice 3: and it's it's looking like it would be similar to the in a sense to the geotechnical bpas

[3:46:20] Voice 3: the applications you get on Sydney Island where there's exemptions and then the ones you see

[3:46:27] Voice 3: are have a professional report with a bunch of recommendations in the professional report

[3:46:32] that could then be translated into a permit

[3:46:34] Voice 13: so I guess what question I have related to that

[3:46:39] Voice 13: and it's it's only because I've seen how professional reporting hits the ground

[3:46:44] Voice 13: right where applicants hire a professional you know many of our professionals are

[3:46:50] Voice 13: fabulous but there has been a few situations where you're like really like this is really

[3:46:55] Voice 13: what the professional report says that you can kind of treat our pairing area like come on like

[3:46:59] Voice 13: and so so anyway i i worry that that's the model that we're obligating when we have a

[3:47:06] Voice 13: fresh water specialist or groundwater specialist on staff so why isn't it that our groundwater

[3:47:11] Voice 13: specialist is the one who reviews it

[3:47:13] Voice 3: so the advantage of having the professional hydrogel

[3:47:17] Voice 3: just on staff is they would review like william will review okay

[3:47:21] Voice 13: whereas

[3:47:23] Voice 3: we don't have a

[3:47:24] Voice 5: geotechnical

[3:47:24] Voice 5: engineer no but i

[3:47:26] Voice 13: guess i'm wondering why would we charge basically why are we making applicants

[3:47:30] Voice 13: pay for a report when we have somebody professionally already on staff right so then

[3:47:34] Voice 3: the taxpayers would be paid to really um to shift entirely right he would be like a consulting

[3:47:43] Voice 3: consulting professional, going out onto sites and doing that work.

[3:47:47] Voice 8: Yeah.

[3:47:48] Voice 8: Yeah.

[3:47:48] I mean, essentially you'd have to hire somebody to do the rest of the work that William currently

[3:47:53] does, which is, you know, reviewing applications, engaged in, you know,

[3:47:58] Voice 16: larger projects and

[3:47:59] Voice 16: about some things.

[3:48:00] Voice 16: So it would be a whole other job for him.

[3:48:07] Voice 13: Yeah.

[3:48:07] Voice 13: And I think that's part of myself as a trustee, still not completely understanding what he

[3:48:12] Voice 13: he does if it's not like that's just like why so

[3:48:17] Voice 3: it's everybody's right it's like yeah no and i

[3:48:21] Voice 13: don't need an explanation right now necessarily i'm just saying that that's partly my challenge

[3:48:25] Voice 13: is like i know what the professional problem the problems are when we have professional model

[3:48:30] Voice 13: alone and i do agree with you what you just said like that having somebody else out to review those

[3:48:35] Voice 13: reports and give like a alternative kind of perspective like a trust perspective on that

[3:48:40] Voice 13: is super helpful um so i get all that and then you know this will hopefully like resolve in my

[3:48:46] Voice 13: head as the work for various governance reviews or you know implementation efforts but um yeah

[3:48:53] Voice 13: anyway i guess that was my question okay

[3:48:56] Voice 10: so no one's great good questions uh as usual i

[3:49:01] Voice 10: okay so what are we trying to solve this chair patrick's favorite comment what are we trying

[3:49:05] Voice 10: to solve over groundwater sustainability on large parcels of land well

[3:49:12] Voice 16: on the island

[3:49:13] Voice 16: okay but

[3:49:16] Voice 10: this this is designed to allow for exemptions uh for folks on the little parcels

[3:49:23] Voice 10: of land so they're not going to get overly governmentized or overly regulated and it's

[3:49:27] Voice 10: effectively sorry go ahead

[3:49:29] Voice 16: um there are the exemptions that are in the in written into the

[3:49:36] Voice 16: but there are there's also how how the um the actual boundaries are chosen and so the methodology

[3:49:43] Voice 16: that we will be um we will be sharing with you um basically exempts those smaller lots

[3:49:50] Voice 16: and looks at so magically you know there are parts of of of critical area in there

[3:49:58] Voice 16: but they're limited and that area is already built up so it's probably already been impacted

[3:50:03] Voice 16: so there's no need to think of an order of a small lot to go through a process um so that

[3:50:10] Voice 16: yeah so essentially that it will be the boundaries that will exempt those smaller

[3:50:15] Voice 16: with those smaller lots okay

[3:50:17] Voice 10: so then josephine public has this big parcel of land and then they

[3:50:24] Voice 10: want to make changes let's say they want to construct some stuff they would and they're

[3:50:29] Voice 10: in this new dpa area they would then have to ask the islands trust committee first of all

[3:50:35] Voice 10: hopefully they don't pass that you know they don't have to deal with this dpa that deals with

[3:50:39] Voice 10: with nature, but they're also having to get

[3:50:43] Voice 10: not only a biology report,

[3:50:44] Voice 10: they'd have to get a water hydrology report.

[3:50:47] Voice 10: They'd have to get, what other reports am I missing?

[3:50:51] Voice 1: Potentially, yeah, whatever,

[3:50:53] Voice 10: depending on the media.

[3:50:54] Voice 10: But this water hydrologist would go in and say,

[3:50:57] Voice 10: yeah, no problem, their change is based on their plan.

[3:51:01] Voice 10: So they, and then say, make recommendations

[3:51:04] Voice 10: to the trust committee.

[3:51:05] Voice 10: The trust committee would then determine whether or not

[3:51:07] Voice 10: they agree with the hydrologist and then

[3:51:11] Voice 8: my way in on that

[3:51:12] Voice 10: yeah and then you'd make a decision

[3:51:14] Voice 10: for to approve the yeah yeah

[3:51:18] Voice 16: so the so the the professional will provide

[3:51:20] Voice 16: yeah exactly like they

[3:51:22] Voice 16: would provide some um recommendations and those would be reviewed by staff and then yeah

[3:51:28] Voice 10: so right

[3:51:29] Voice 10: now the concern is that these on these large parcels of land they can get developed and the

[3:51:34] Voice 10: water can get the groundwater can be especially in low recharge areas can impact the neighboring

[3:51:41] Voice 10: communities that's the concern okay so what what was mr what what do you have any because mr george

[3:51:49] Voice 10: had some points that he wanted to bring up and i'm i'm wondering if we need to discuss mine when i

[3:51:54] Voice 10: address that you know

[3:51:56] Voice 10: or did you have a response maybe or go ahead you know yeah i'm understanding

[3:52:00] Voice 10: now the process a lot better

[3:52:01] Voice 5: so

[3:52:02] Voice 10: i appreciate you answering the question

[3:52:03] Voice 4: well one of the questions

[3:52:06] Voice 4: i want to ask is you know this this local trust committee received from a first nation back in

[3:52:12] Voice 4: march of 2021 a request that we'd be talking to them at the problem definition phase and so forth

[3:52:19] Voice 4: so is our have we done that what first nations engaged this was the email that we got um what

[3:52:29] Voice 4: What have we, have we had any First Nations engagement on the development of this approach?

[3:52:37] Voice 16: Well, we will be following our usual engagement process.

[3:52:40] Voice 16: I think that's a challenging question for our organization in general, because I don't know that we have successfully done that with any other project.

[3:52:49] Voice 16: And it's, it's a, I think it's a much bigger question and a bigger process.

[3:52:53] Voice 16: So, um, so I guess my question would, my direct answer would be no, we haven't done that.

[3:53:00] Voice 16: And the more complicated one is that it would be, it's a, I think it's a bigger, it's a bigger question that is more of a trust wide discussion, how we actually do that.

[3:53:15] Voice 16: so

[3:53:16] Voice 13: i would be happy to put a motion on the table related to both actually i think we've missed this

[3:53:24] Voice 13: in our land use bylaw motion potentially so we might need to but i would i think one of the

[3:53:32] Voice 13: things that we need to and we've agreed to in our reconciliation work as trustees is that we

[3:53:38] Voice 13: actually invite men as opposed to just do the historical practices referrals and things like

[3:53:44] Voice 13: that and so one of the things we could do is we could put a motion that says we like would

[3:53:49] Voice 13: have liked a letter written to officially invite in uh you know first nations to the land use bylaw

[3:53:55] Voice 13: ranking process to be in conversation with us as trustees or staff like like directly to them um

[3:54:01] Voice 13: and that might be one thing that we could do for the land use bond i think we could do it

[3:54:05] Voice 13: equally for this um as a sort of slightly different than normal of course we always do

[3:54:10] Voice 13: referral letters and things like that but this is a little bit more government to government

[3:54:13] Voice 13: kind of approach that might be a little bit easier and we don't need to worry about we don't have

[3:54:18] Voice 13: policy we could just try it right and see how they respond because we have relationships both

[3:54:22] Voice 13: and i have relationships with people in the same age for sure and like maybe there's others who

[3:54:27] Voice 13: want to comment on this but um i think it's worth it to try that i

[3:54:32] Voice 16: i mean just i i think you're

[3:54:35] Voice 16: probably beyond that with both projects at this point but the problem that's an issue

[3:54:41] Voice 16: and so I just wonder if it would be something to think about for the next project simply because

[3:54:49] Voice 16: this project or at least two projects have already sort of progressed yeah I see the water

[3:54:54] Voice 4: differently in some ways

[3:54:56] Voice 4: because you're we're creating something new that could be replicated

[3:55:01] Voice 4: across the gulf islands this is this sort of a trial location of here in Galleon or the only

[3:55:08] Voice 4: only two islands bringing this forward,

[3:55:10] Voice 4: but it could occur across all the islands.

[3:55:12] Voice 4: I think this is where the opportunity of engaging early

[3:55:19] Voice 4: in sort of what are the objectives

[3:55:20] Voice 4: that we're trying to achieve are objectives

[3:55:25] Voice 4: that have been developed through this conversation

[3:55:30] Voice 4: where First Nations may influence

[3:55:33] Voice 4: or have different objectives that could apply

[3:55:38] Voice 4: apply to the project so i think that's that's where that's why i'm raising it more for this

[3:55:44] Voice 4: issue right now in particular i mean landing is respectful um but we're sort of working with

[3:55:52] Voice 4: long-term things that have existed where this is something new yeah

[3:55:58] Voice 13: and i think they i i

[3:56:00] Voice 13: respectfully disagree on this one because it doesn't matter where we are in this process

[3:56:05] Voice 13: at the moment we it's an oversight for us not to think about that on big projects like this

[3:56:11] Voice 13: in our LTC and we can say that in our letter that like you know we have a letter you know

[3:56:18] Voice 13: realize that we haven't done this at the ground floor but we you know have been in this process

[3:56:23] Voice 13: we really want to make sure that your comments are included and thoughts are included as we go out

[3:56:28] Voice 13: so I think that we need to do that for the LNG spot and I think we should do that for this one

[3:56:33] Voice 18: we did send out an early letter a couple years ago but there hasn't been any contact since then

[3:56:39] Voice 18: so that has been an area that we can improve on so

[3:56:43] Voice 13: we should just do it as part of our like we're

[3:56:45] Voice 13: in force reading now but i actually would love to see that letter and to like actually make sure

[3:56:51] Voice 13: that we we take the humble stance yes and then the tone of it so that it's not just a like it's

[3:56:57] Voice 13: from us as an ltc and it's like you know yeah um so i don't know if you need a motion related to

[3:57:05] Voice 13: this project the groundwater project for that but i do think it's probably worthwhile

[3:57:09] Voice 13: to think about as well i

[3:57:11] Voice 4: i think we should do it but i mean the groundwater like i said has a chance

[3:57:14] Voice 4: to do this right in the beginning but i'm uh to look at this from the perspective of that as well

[3:57:22] Voice 4: Yeah,

[3:57:23] Voice 13: but nurses argue that it's not the beginning.

[3:57:26] Voice 4: We haven't, yeah.

[3:57:28] Voice 16: I have a question.

[3:57:30] Voice 16: So if you move forward with that, my question is,

[3:57:33] Voice 16: do you want to move forward with just presenting them with the DPA,

[3:57:40] Voice 16: the guidelines and the exemptions,

[3:57:44] Voice 16: or do you want to wait to have a conversation

[3:57:45] Voice 16: around what you're identifying for boundaries?

[3:57:48] Voice 16: race like do you want to introduce the science in that um uh in that uh expression of um uh

[3:57:57] Voice 16: desire very quickly i

[3:58:00] Voice 10: don't know if i can answer your question but i just want to just riff for

[3:58:04] Voice 10: two minutes here the intent for me when starting this was that i've always known since i was a

[3:58:10] Voice 10: little kid that we don't have very much water because it was like don't flush the toilet bin

[3:58:14] Voice 10: unless you have to blah blah blah and we went and got to our neighbor's house and got water

[3:58:18] Voice 10: water was a concern my intent was to find out information on where the groundwater is at

[3:58:23] Voice 10: right and and we've got we've got some maps and it's been interesting and that's really

[3:58:29] Voice 10: great presentations now we're at the political point where i thought the maps would have a more

[3:58:36] Voice 10: shocking uh reaction from the community and it's this dull nothing it like more people are concerned

[3:58:44] Voice 10: about tree bylaws and their house burning down because the honest trust endorses that then they

[3:58:53] Voice 10: then like the fact that there's some maps that have come out where it's like whoa you you have

[3:58:59] Voice 10: very limited recharge and there's some weird disconnect and now we're going and saying hey

[3:59:05] Voice 10: let's add regulations to um protect the resource but what the disconnect has happened i feel like

[3:59:14] Voice 10: like COVID played a factor in this because it's like,

[3:59:17] Voice 10: why aren't people more like, Holy crap,

[3:59:19] Voice 10: my property value here could plummet because I don't have water.

[3:59:24] Voice 10: I don't think people understand where the,

[3:59:26] Voice 10: like where the maps are or where they were at.

[3:59:28] Voice 10: Like even when I show people like on South pender,

[3:59:30] Voice 10: how little precipitation gets relatively down the animal,

[3:59:33] Voice 10: people are like,

[3:59:34] Voice 10: Holy crap.

[3:59:35] Voice 10: What am I getting? Can you see this? Right. And,

[3:59:38] Voice 10: and so because, because there's this, like,

[3:59:41] Voice 10: it's almost like everyone's a little bit back here and we're like just with regards to really

[3:59:46] Voice 10: understanding how where we're at now we're we're over here going let's add regulations

[3:59:53] Voice 10: and it's almost like the the term like the tour is a bit of a tortoise back here and

[3:59:56] Voice 10: and george has really good points where he's like what are you doing

[4:00:00] Voice 10: we can figure this out without regulations and then i go i would say to george i'm like well

[4:00:04] Voice 10: jesus what in 30 years from now when i'm 70

[4:00:11] Voice 16: you

[4:00:12] Voice 10: know what i'm saying i know

[4:00:14] Voice 16: exactly what you're saying and uh williams referred to it

[4:00:16] Voice 16: as the don't look down uh perspective yeah yeah yeah

[4:00:20] Voice 16: look up um and you know i uh i took my first

[4:00:26] Voice 16: course in climate change in 1992 and they were using modeling and they had predictions and um

[4:00:33] Voice 16: the only thing and what's been wrong about their predictions is that things are happening earlier

[4:00:39] Voice 16: so you know this is what we call the procrastinary principle right um you can you can wait uh you can

[4:00:47] Voice 16: do all of the studies in the world um measure everything you can wait till you got the money

[4:00:53] Voice 16: to do that and do it but the time you by the time we've done that um you're you're experiencing the

[4:00:59] Voice 16: things that were predicted to happen so yeah that's uh that's sort of what we're working with

[4:01:04] Voice 16: with

[4:01:04] Voice 13: with this uh with this project yeah one of the other aspects to this though um and literally

[4:01:12] Voice 13: this is where i'm going traveling the next round here is i'm so the area that i work in professionally

[4:01:17] Voice 13: is something called climate empowerment and climate empowerment is basically the problem

[4:01:22] Voice 13: on how to get the tortoise to catch up with like the reality of the data right and there's some

[4:01:27] Voice 13: other points that that george made about the data which i'll come back to because that's my like

[4:01:31] Voice 13: questions that i have but having said all that um one of the challenges i think are i think the

[4:01:39] Voice 13: challenge that we're having like and i don't feel that personally i'm happy to like move ahead with

[4:01:43] Voice 13: different aspects if i think if i personally think that the science is solid and like i've read every

[4:01:48] Voice 13: detail of it and feel confident you know have some groups of folks who are super into the whole

[4:01:54] Voice 13: issue here hopefully review it and think together about it then i'm good to go with that i'm happy

[4:02:00] Voice 13: to stand out on a political edge and like make the argument and helpfully educate people while

[4:02:04] Voice 13: doing that however it is an increasingly problem big problem for any government or organization

[4:02:12] Voice 13: organization to make changes without having backlash if we are not bringing along our

[4:02:18] Voice 13: population through educational materials and like it's easy to understand clear like the data the

[4:02:27] Voice 13: maps those were freaking awesome maps and some of those crd reports and we have them in our like

[4:02:31] Voice 13: i've used those multiple times and people are like damn because like you can see the difference

[4:02:35] Voice 13: with these four islands right and so but that is not the image that the average person in this

[4:02:41] Voice 13: community has in their head right and so i do think that this is a larger conversation that

[4:02:47] Voice 13: we have to have everywhere like every time we do a project related to this we have to have like

[4:02:52] Voice 13: like communication tools developed with it right away that help as we move along for people to

[4:02:58] Voice 13: understand the work with us we cannot be waiting and having people dragged along we have to like

[4:03:02] Voice 13: go together so um so that's a sort of parallel issue anyway what decisions do you need from us

[4:03:10] Voice 13: today related to this i'm not ready

[4:03:12] Voice 13: to take this into first reading i have to just name that yeah

[4:03:14] Voice 16: i mean it sounds

[4:03:18] Voice 16: like the direction like so so so what's what's here what was before was uh

[4:03:23] Voice 16: just to endorse the the guidelines of the um and the uh the exemptions and um and there

[4:03:31] Voice 16: and there there is no intent in in the recommendation to move this forward until

[4:03:36] Voice 16: the science has actually been looked at so that's that's about looking at the

[4:03:40] Voice 16: dpa boundary options one of the options that's been identified here um is is to hold a special

[4:03:47] Voice 16: uh a special meeting uh to to actually dive into understanding the methodology that the

[4:03:55] Voice 16: the dpa boundaries would be uh based upon um and like i said we're we are like you know ours uh

[4:04:04] Voice 16: we're very close to having that methodology ready for Galliano and that'll be on their

[4:04:13] Voice 16: agenda next week and it'll be so we'll be following a similar agenda so our methodology

[4:04:21] Voice 16: so what I would recommend is it sounds to me like there is interest in a better understanding

[4:04:28] Voice 16: of the science and that may be something that you know we've suggested it before um and it

[4:04:35] Voice 16: may be something to consider again is to just have a focus meeting um to to really understand that

[4:04:42] Voice 16: piece um

[4:04:43] Voice 4: i still don't understand the guidelines as well as to what exactly they are uh because

[4:04:54] Voice 4: Because this is just about the recharge area.

[4:04:58] Voice 4: So this is the topography of the ground.

[4:05:02] Voice 4: This has nothing to do about withdrawal.

[4:05:05] Voice 16: That's right.

[4:05:05] Voice 16: It's about recharge.

[4:05:07] Voice 4: I understand.

[4:05:09] Voice 4: But we're not explicit.

[4:05:11] Voice 4: We just say where a professional hydrology engineer has made.

[4:05:16] Voice 4: So I guess that would only link to then the one exemption.

[4:05:21] Voice 4: And

[4:05:22] Voice 13: I guess these are principles.

[4:05:23] Voice 13: My understanding is these are basically the principles by which you'll go back and draft actual bylaws.

[4:05:29] Voice 13: This is just the sort of guiding principles behind them.

[4:05:32] Voice 3: No, this is the draft. This is the draft.

[4:05:34] Voice 13: This is the draft.

[4:05:35] Voice 13: So that's the

[4:05:35] Voice 3: part that's missing is

[4:05:37] Voice 3: the report, like the report requirements.

[4:05:42] Voice 3: Like which part of the report would be in the development of critical information bylaws?

[4:05:46] Voice 4: But it's not clear to me like when a report's needed.

[4:05:52] Voice 4: It just says where a geologist says this, but it didn't say when, you know, or is it just I must have, you know,

[4:06:01] Voice 4: because I assume you looked at the regional district of Nanaimo's development permit area for aquifer protection.

[4:06:08] Voice 3: So that's the

[4:06:09] Voice 3: development approval information bylaw, has all the reporting requirements and standards and the credentials needed.

[4:06:15] Voice 3: so this is from

[4:06:16] Voice 4: their their OCP so this is the OCP guy it says yes

[4:06:21] Voice 3: so they must be prepared

[4:06:22] Voice 4: they've

[4:06:23] Voice 3: incorporated their development approval information into their OCP

[4:06:29] Voice 4: I'm just I mean I'm just trying to think of the public receiving it when what do I need to do

[4:06:35] Voice 4: to me the guidelines are this is what

[4:06:37] Voice 16: I need to do like

[4:06:38] Voice 16: Robert said would be in the

[4:06:46] Voice 3: So, I think one of the things we're seeking today was, like, the discussion that Trustee

[4:06:53] Voice 3: McConkie had, like, they walked me through this so that when he's in the pub and someone

[4:06:59] Voice 3: comes up to him and says, what are you doing with this groundwater stuff that's going on?

[4:07:03] Voice 3: You can sort of explain as a trustee, yeah, we're looking at some regulations, it's going

[4:07:08] Voice 3: to affect large lots, it's going to affect major developments.

[4:07:10] Voice 3: on large lots small scale development and it's going to go through a process

[4:07:16] Voice 3: so i

[4:07:21] Voice 13: guess like when i look at these files and when i look at the motion or the guidelines when

[4:07:27] Voice 13: i look at the motions the first two motions related to generally endorsing these amendments

[4:07:35] Voice 13: amendments and generally endorsing the preparing a draft amendment for approval like I think

[4:07:42] Voice 13: I don't have a big issue with those the last one in terms of um requests staff to send bylaw 228

[4:07:54] Voice 13: to relevant agencies and first nations for early referral so I think that's okay but I I really

[4:08:01] Voice 13: want and that's once the development uh

[4:08:04] Voice 16: found the option for development so that's once you

[4:08:08] Voice 16: you've got you know once we proposed a boundary based on methodology based on the science yeah

[4:08:14] Voice 13: so we're not there yet so

[4:08:15] Voice 13: like three doesn't seem like it's it seems like it's too early to say to

[4:08:20] Voice 13: do well three is actually

[4:08:21] Voice 16: um the way that three has been drafted is is it basically what it's

[4:08:26] Voice 16: saying so if you agree to one and uh and three you're basically saying to staff that you're okay

[4:08:32] Voice 16: with the exemptions and you're okay with the guidelines so we don't need to do any more

[4:08:36] Voice 16: uh detailed work on that and that the the work focuses really on the black boundaries okay

[4:08:46] Voice 13: all right so i think that's probably true i would like to talk briefly with everyone here

[4:08:51] Voice 13: about commercial for a second because there are some small commercial areas up there that I just

[4:08:58] Voice 13: want to be a hundred percent clear for our explanation purposes what this is saying about

[4:09:04] Voice 13: them right so can you paraphrase that in your because I read it here under where is it six

[4:09:12] Voice 13: no it's uh seven so commercial land uses is amended to remove subscription to my like this

[4:09:18] Voice 13: is so legalese it's dense like i just look at it i'm like what and i like i read this stuff all the

[4:09:23] Voice 13: time so um like what is it saying about commercial land in terms of water in those small lot

[4:09:37] Voice 13: commercial spots oh so uh sorry which one are you looking at i literally just want that answer

[4:09:47] Voice 3: what are you looking at

[4:09:48] Voice 13: i'm so i was looking at one of the like swap out this for that kind of

[4:09:52] Voice 13: pieces and it's confusing me so so basically i just want to know for the small lots up on

[4:09:57] Voice 13: mckinnon road which i know are commercial what's the

[4:10:01] Voice 13: situation so so you will

[4:10:02] Voice 16: receive the methodology

[4:10:04] Voice 16: yeah and the methodology will say that we're looking at uh lots with um well the choices

[4:10:13] Voice 16: will be up to 10 acres of coverage of what's identified to be critical recharge area just

[4:10:20] Voice 13: commercial it's only what

[4:10:22] Voice 13: i want to keep

[4:10:23] Voice 16: looking at the whole

[4:10:24] Voice 16: island right up to 10 acres of

[4:10:26] Voice 16: area that that is identified to be critical recharge or up to this they'll be an opportunity

[4:10:34] Voice 16: for decision or up to five five acres of area on a lot that's um that's uh considered to be critical

[4:10:43] Voice 16: recharge so that the choice will be there so if you have if you're a small lot of uh um you know

[4:10:49] Voice 13: say you decide so i'm going to pause i'm going to just pause you i'm sorry because i do understand

[4:10:54] Voice 13: all the things you're telling me but it's not answering my questions about commercial well

[4:10:57] Voice 8: straight

[4:10:58] Voice 13: answer about commercial that i want in this is that if it's commercial i want it on that

[4:11:03] Voice 13: okay that's actually basically what then that's what we can do right like when we go to define

[4:11:09] Voice 13: the boundaries you can say if it's commercial yeah that's really even if it

[4:11:12] Voice 16: doesn't fit in

[4:11:13] Voice 16: that's

[4:11:14] Voice 13: really what i want because

[4:11:15] Voice 16: commercial could be more

[4:11:16] Voice 13: intense in some ways and i just

[4:11:17] Voice 16: want yeah

[4:11:17] Voice 13: so i mean that that choice that you reacted to that that yeah so i think that's one

[4:11:22] Voice 13: of the things that i would like to see in the guidelines is i would like things that are either

[4:11:26] Voice 13: commercial or mostly like um we don't i don't think we have any in that area but like the

[4:11:33] Voice 13: commercial covers are folks that we're working with on canon right so those are all commercial

[4:11:38] Voice 13: yeah so basically if it's commercial it would be nice to be on that because then we have some

[4:11:44] Voice 8: included

[4:11:44] Voice 13: in the dpa because then we can have a conversation about how they're managing their

[4:11:48] Voice 13: water and

[4:11:49] Voice 16: it's i mean we can um we can uh we'll prove i mean that's what we're working on right

[4:11:55] Voice 16: now it's maps with land use that there's a nascent john so you'll be able to see where

[4:11:59] Voice 16: the pressure is and where the where the the uh the recode areas fall and then you can just like

[4:12:06] Voice 16: say yeah and industrial and

[4:12:10] Voice 13: industrial commercial industrial it

[4:12:13] Voice 4: should be on there and is this

[4:12:14] Voice 4: because this is intent to be the quality of the water then would be for the recharge areas not

[4:12:21] Voice 4: to have contaminated sites because that's the regional district and i will then specifies that

[4:12:25] Voice 4: if you're doing any of those industrial uses that are listed that could cause that so they're very

[4:12:32] Voice 4: specific but

[4:12:34] Voice 13: my thought is that if we have commercial or industrial map then they are

[4:12:38] Voice 13: required to have some kind of water management strategy or basically they come to us for

[4:12:43] Voice 13: discussion to like think with us

[4:12:44] Voice 16: yeah so they decide for the permit and uh whatever is they'll

[4:12:51] Voice 16: be required no

[4:12:54] Voice 10: it's interesting um can i just read from henderson's 1997 ground this is really

[4:13:01] Voice 10: interesting because it pertains to today's conversation the groundwater management issues

[4:13:05] Voice 10: facing the gulf islands are not unique rather they are common to many coastal communities

[4:13:12] Voice 10: in conjunction with a legal framework it is imperative that island residents accept

[4:13:16] Voice 10: ownership for the groundwater resources if islanders do island residents do not take a

[4:13:22] Voice 10: proactive approach to mounting managing their groundwater resources government will take control

[4:13:27] Voice 10: the situation once groundwater supplies have been overdeveloped or contaminated a reactive approach

[4:13:33] Voice 10: based on discussions with many island residents they're a very independent group who would no

[4:13:38] Voice 10: doubt prefer to manage their own destiny now this is an interesting point he makes here the success

[4:13:45] Voice 10: of any groundwater management plan will require political will along with the political will there

[4:13:50] Voice 10: is a need to simplify groundwater management and call violence there should be one government

[4:13:56] Voice 10: an agency charged with the responsibility of overseeing the gulf islands is henderson's

[4:14:02] Voice 10: conclusion uh this agency must have the cooperation of other agencies who move this

[4:14:06] Voice 10: doubling block a fragment uh the input of violent residents would be crucial now

[4:14:14] Voice 10: are we by adopting this are we because i think henderson was on the ball whatever 30 years ago

[4:14:21] Voice 10: are we addressing his concerns by adopting your recommendations so

[4:14:27] Voice 16: i would say that an

[4:14:28] Voice 16: attempt to address those concerns done through the development of our freshwater sustainability

[4:14:34] Voice 16: strategy which is the the um the island stress strategy that and that identifies the challenge

[4:14:43] Voice 16: and it also um it also uh identifies actions to address that through collaborative efforts

[4:14:51] Voice 16: And I mean that's the only way through the agencies talking with each other, it would be it will be a long time before you could actually find one, you know that scenario, but, but it will require dialogue and collaboration.

[4:15:05] Voice 16: And I also just wanted to speak to the communications piece and just identify the Freshwater Sustainability Strategy identifies communications as an absolute priority.

[4:15:23] Voice 16: And it was something that there was a business case put forward to the Trust Council that was turned down.

[4:15:28] Voice 16: by turning down a business case uh you're not only turning down the funding for it but you're also

[4:15:34] Voice 16: turning down staff time um allocated towards that so we absolutely see the need for exactly what

[4:15:41] Voice 16: you're talking about with these projects but we do not have um we do not have the

[4:15:47] Voice 16: the resources the staff resources to be able to effectively um provide that that kind of

[4:15:55] Voice 16: communication yeah

[4:15:57] Voice 4: sorry well i was going to say i'll send you it just came out yesterday or just

[4:16:03] Voice 4: was distributed yesterday a discussion paper on what's called water objectives under the water

[4:16:08] Voice 4: sustainability act in the province and it and it's um um it is other another other tools in the

[4:16:17] Voice 4: toolbox that are when we talk about housing there's everybody has a piece of the pie the same

[4:16:22] Voice 4: with water um and that is intended to be more of a kind of a clear set of the

[4:16:30] Voice 4: objectives that work with you know the water purveyors and everybody else that has their

[4:16:34] Voice 4: hands in the pot um and i think that that's the one thing say on salt spring we have swipa who

[4:16:44] Voice 4: has a direct conversation with the province in an advocacy role if you want or they're at the

[4:16:51] Voice 4: take their member that are there and actively working and the province has been clear from

[4:16:56] Voice 4: the beginning that even if they were to consider water objectives or water sustainability management

[4:17:02] Voice 4: plans as tools that could be used they work like we work with land use planning they're not a

[4:17:07] Voice 4: replacement of um that it would be salt spring and the southern gulf islands as the region

[4:17:14] Voice 4: that they would consider and and that's the one thing is i'm looking for ways our voice from these

[4:17:22] Voice 4: other islands can be heard um you know that to call the province's attention to work work with

[4:17:32] Voice 4: us and to exercise some of these tools that have never been exercised in a under an act the province

[4:17:38] Voice 4: um so it's not a replacement it's a complementary activity okay

[4:17:46] Voice 13: i think i'm feeling burnt out

[4:17:50] Voice 13: frankly um it's been a really long meeting and i'm hitting a wall here so i'm wondering what

[4:18:00] Voice 13: what is it that we need to do right now other than like these motions seem to be more

[4:18:07] Voice 13: or just to keep you moving in a particular direction?

[4:18:11] Voice 13: This

[4:18:11] Voice 3: was also your opportunity to say,

[4:18:13] Voice 13: no, no, this is not what we had.

[4:18:15] Voice 13: Yeah, I don't feel that way, although maybe Ben does.

[4:18:19] Voice 13: I'm not sure yet.

[4:18:20] Voice 10: Oh, no, I appreciate you wanting to get things done.

[4:18:23] Voice 10: I'm mainly asking, Henderson had a clear objective.

[4:18:26] Voice 10: One government agency should help with managing groundwater

[4:18:31] Voice 10: in order to address the constraints.

[4:18:32] Voice 10: right now we're creating more government and not achieving necessarily the objective of what

[4:18:39] Voice 10: henderson had proposed which would be an effective way so that was one concern i had about this that's

[4:18:44] Voice 10: one of

[4:18:44] Voice 5: the big concern

[4:18:45] Voice 10: i have about this is if this was free and it didn't take a bunch of people

[4:18:48] Voice 5: to

[4:18:49] Voice 10: help us administer it boom let's do it yeah right

[4:18:51] Voice 10: but the problem is is it's creating another

[4:18:53] Voice 10: branch of government i don't understand the consequences of that that's my concern that's

[4:18:57] Voice 10: the one it's

[4:18:58] Voice 3: not it's not a great branch of government sorry it's another it's another type

[4:19:14] Voice 10: so that said i support that that's why i agree in fact that i support the idea of what's going

[4:19:19] Voice 10: on in 30 years well i regret not being completely like let's keep going let's keep going let's keep

[4:19:24] Voice 10: keep going uh so

[4:19:25] Voice 1: that's why i'm just

[4:19:26] Voice 10: verbalizing my internal thoughts but fair enough it can lead

[4:19:27] Voice 10: to anywhere you know what i mean so if you're i'd

[4:19:30] Voice 13: be happy to move

[4:19:30] Voice 10: this forward and um but i'm not

[4:19:33] Voice 10: sure it sounds like number two you weren't interested in moving forward so

[4:19:36] Voice 13: i'm not sure

[4:19:37] Voice 13: that i'm interested in moving forward with regulation until i see the science so like

[4:19:41] Voice 13: that's my problem it's like i have to believe that the maps are solid before i can move anything

[4:19:48] Voice 13: else i think what you have here with a couple alterations that we just talked about around

[4:19:52] Voice 13: industrial and commercial looks reasonable to me but i need to believe in the science myself

[4:19:58] Voice 13: before i can yeah let's continue on the regulation part so um and i need to think about like maybe

[4:20:07] Voice 13: it becomes more of an advocacy tool that we have in pocket the regulations like this is an option

[4:20:15] Voice 13: for us to do but that we don't do them because we actually think that it's i don't know i have

[4:20:22] Voice 13: to think a little bit about it too i guess so but i like what you have here is the take-home messages

[4:20:27] Voice 13: i like what you have here i have to think about whether i think in a regulatory and advocacy

[4:20:32] Voice 13: approach is the way to go right now and but i need the maps and i need the data to like

[4:20:37] Voice 13: that's where i'm at

[4:20:38] Voice 16: yeah so i come back to my question for you is like how would you how would

[4:20:42] Voice 16: you like us to provide that to you what's the best scenario um yeah that's right

[4:20:47] Voice 16: that's your other

[4:20:48] Voice 16: the question yeah getting your head around it yeah i like

[4:20:52] Voice 13: the idea of a special meeting a lot

[4:20:54] Voice 13: it's just this one thing to focus on because it's complicated and it's like needs our full

[4:20:58] Voice 13: attention and a lot of caffeine so i'm like really into that i don't know where that fits

[4:21:05] Voice 13: in our summer so like do you want to do you have options we

[4:21:08] Voice 3: can we can work

[4:21:09] Voice 3: front schedules okay

[4:21:11] Voice 13: um do you want to know the blackout dates

[4:21:14] Voice 3: yeah so

[4:21:15] Voice 13: the blackout dates for me and for if you want us here in person versus virtual it's

[4:21:20] Voice 13: slightly different virtual okay virtual is a little bit more flexible so the blackout dates

[4:21:25] Voice 13: for me are the 15th of july to the 31st of july um and other than that i probably can be pretty

[4:21:33] Voice 13: flexible for when it happens that

[4:21:37] Voice 16: would be a meeting with william like a public meeting

[4:21:41] Voice 13: yeah

[4:21:41] Voice 16: and

[4:21:45] Voice 13: and i would like to be able to have it in a way that i don't know can i make this

[4:21:52] Voice 13: but i think what

[4:21:52] Voice 10: would really help at that meeting the trustees lead it with questions yeah

[4:21:57] Voice 5: yeah like

[4:21:59] Voice 5: Like

[4:21:59] Voice 10: what, what, what happened is we, um, yeah, there's a long talk and I find that

[4:22:07] Voice 10: our LTCs are really quick at deliberating and getting to, to getting specific questions.

[4:22:12] Voice 10: So if there's a really brief presentation and then we can get into it, I know William

[4:22:15] Voice 10: likes to be thorough, uh, but that would be a recommendation for just how the meeting

[4:22:19] Voice 10: would be run.

[4:22:20] Voice 10: And then maybe we can have like a, you know, questions asked, answered questions, asked

[4:22:23] Voice 10: question, you know, rather than a long, I

[4:22:26] Voice 13: don't even have a presentation.

[4:22:26] Voice 13: I would like the package, and then I would like to ask questions and he can have slides ready that he knows are likely to answer questions I'm happy to

[4:22:35] Voice 13: give them questions in advance.

[4:22:38] Voice 13: Yeah,

[4:22:39] Voice 10: I mean, like, also just some feedback like, you know, I'm just a schmo here, right, and for the past three years, it's been the way that this has been presented to me, it's been, it's been challenging to understand exactly what's going on.

[4:22:55] Voice 10: and now now it's now because we're near the end of our term you know we're already getting

[4:23:01] Voice 10: perceptions that we're pushing something through right and

[4:23:04] Voice 16: it's a bit of a drag right

[4:23:06] Voice 10: and

[4:23:07] Voice 16: again we've slowed it down a bit um because of what you're expecting i'm a planner i'm not

[4:23:13] Voice 16: a hydrogeologist it's taken a while to understand it myself and we haven't presented the methodology

[4:23:19] Voice 16: methodology yet because we need it to be very very clear once it's out yeah

[4:23:23] Voice 3: that's that's great

[4:23:24] Voice 16: so that's a

[4:23:25] Voice 16: good point yeah

[4:23:25] Voice 13: yeah so i'm happy if you want to um like said if you send us

[4:23:32] Voice 13: the methodology when it comes out in a couple days and i'm happy to like you know i'm gonna

[4:23:37] Voice 13: like sit down and read that thing like from front to back so i would love i can make a set of

[4:23:41] Voice 13: questions that i think can help guys conversation and but i do really need it not to be like

[4:23:47] Voice 13: william to be dense to hear and he's got a lot of good things to say but we have to have this

[4:23:58] Voice 16: and

[4:23:58] Voice 4: my other thoughts which i don't talk about yes

[4:24:02] Voice 4: we didn't fund doing the state of the water

[4:24:04] Voice 4: reporting that was asked for at trust council but this would require communications funding for

[4:24:11] Voice 4: or North Tender to understand what's coming.

[4:24:16] Voice 4: Because it's, I heard you earlier say,

[4:24:18] Voice 1: oh,

[4:24:18] Voice 4: look, my property, it's lost value or something.

[4:24:21] Voice 4: Well, that's not what this is intended.

[4:24:23] Voice 4: This is water recharge areas.

[4:24:26] Voice 4: So it's making sure we have that information

[4:24:29] Voice 4: so people have the

[4:24:29] Voice 13: language to understand what's coming.

[4:24:31] Voice 13: Yeah, we need to start baking that into any project charter,

[4:24:35] Voice 13: just like as like, instead of asking for it

[4:24:40] Voice 13: as an abstract as a separate thing just baking it into the project to

[4:24:45] Voice 8: build that that's right

[4:24:48] Voice 13: yeah okay

[4:24:49] Voice 3: resolution to schedule a special meeting

[4:24:52] Voice 3: i moved

[4:24:54] Voice 13: at north pender island local dress committee

[4:24:58] Voice 13: direct staff to schedule a special meeting related to the water recharge project did you get that

[4:25:09] Voice 11: yes i did thank you you

[4:25:11] Voice 4: that's seconded yes

[4:25:13] Voice 10: of course yeah

[4:25:14] Voice 4: any discussion

[4:25:16] Voice 4: all those in favor that was carried thanks professor thank you okay well thank you

[4:25:27] Voice 4: and uh so that'll carry on here so we have the top priorities report projects list where we're

[4:25:33] Voice 4: going to add the accessories oh

[4:25:35] Voice 13: yeah what was it

[4:25:36] Voice 4: yes yes

[4:25:38] Voice 13: i guess we need to

[4:25:39] Voice 4: i know that the north

[4:25:40] Voice 13: north pender island local trust committee um is it requested yep just request

[4:25:47] Voice 13: staff to add

[4:25:52] Voice 13: accessory dwellings to the accessory dwelling units accessory dwelling units to the project list

[4:26:00] Voice 13: Yes.

[4:26:06] Voice 14: Yes, I did.

[4:26:06] Voice 14: Thanks.

[4:26:07] Voice 5: All right.

[4:26:07] Voice 4: Is that seconded?

[4:26:09] Voice 14: Yes, I second.

[4:26:09] Voice 4: Any discussion?

[4:26:11] Voice 4: Call the vote.

[4:26:12] Voice 4: All those in favor?

[4:26:13] Voice 4: Carried.

[4:26:16] Voice 4: Do we have the applications?

[4:26:17] Voice 4: Any questions on any of the applications?

[4:26:20] Voice 5: No, I can ask it.

[4:26:22] Voice 5: I'll review it another time.

[4:26:24] Voice 4: You've got

[4:26:25] Voice 18: your end of the year.

[4:26:27] Voice 18: Our reports are here.

[4:26:32] Voice 13: Which page

[4:26:33] Voice 13: is the end of the year page?

[4:26:35] Voice 4: 2100.

[4:26:35] Voice 4: 2100.

[4:26:36] Voice 4: 111.

[4:26:41] Voice 13: so this is our end of the year budget for what we've spent so that's last fiscal last fiscal

[4:26:49] Voice 13: so from what i understand last fiscal we underspent by nine thousand dollars is that right correct

[4:27:02] Voice 13: so why is that because

[4:27:06] Voice 3: you didn't get to public hearings because

[4:27:07] Voice 13: we didn't get into public hearings

[4:27:08] Voice 13: So did that money carry over? Do we still get that money?

[4:27:11] Voice 3: No, it started again.

[4:27:13] Voice 3: So what I requested for the projects is enough to cover the CIM,

[4:27:19] Voice 3: the public hearings for the land use bylaw.

[4:27:22] Voice 3: Okay,

[4:27:23] Voice 13: so like the $4,000 for the soil bylaw that's on here?

[4:27:30] Voice 13: We don't get that $4,000?

[4:27:32] Voice 3: All budget unspent amount goes into reserves at the end of the fiscal year.

[4:27:37] Voice 13: Okay, so I am definitely having an issue with that. And I don't know how to, who to bring that to. No, but no, but just to be clear, the issue is that we start a project, it takes three years, we want to make sure the budget funding is there for that work, because for the reasons that we just talked about today, right?

[4:27:55] Voice 13: we just want to make sure that we have mail out money

[4:27:58] Voice 13: or whatever it is for the project

[4:28:00] Voice 13: so where what is the thing that i need to do to make sure that happens is that uh

[4:28:05] Voice 13: this financial planning conversation that's

[4:28:08] Voice 3: an accounting practice in this conversation

[4:28:12] Voice 3: okay the fact that it's an ongoing frustrating issue is that we can't do multi-year budgeting

[4:28:19] Voice 3: projects right but yeah we have to do a budget for every fiscal year okay you have to try and

[4:28:25] Voice 3: estimate so we plan for the best case scenario okay in combination with the worst case scenario

[4:28:32] Voice 3: so what i will say for budget for a project is uh we need money for public hearing because we're

[4:28:40] Voice 3: going to be really optimistic if we get to public hearing this fiscal year

[4:28:43] Voice 3: a bunch of community information meetings and bailouts for all those costs plus oh we might need

[4:28:49] Voice 3: so when you add all those together you're at six seven thousand dollars

[4:28:58] Voice 3: don't get to the public so that's the that's the uh the downside of it and then the positive aspect

[4:29:08] Voice 3: is oh you're like a job we don't need yeah

[4:29:12] Voice 13: so i guess we're one of the problems that we're having

[4:29:16] Voice 13: at the trust council i think is that we get all this money absorbed into reserve and then people

[4:29:22] Voice 13: don't understand that reserve could be like it's not for projects that are also ongoing like that

[4:29:28] Voice 13: we could change that practice in the trust like there is ways just going to do it so um okay so

[4:29:36] Voice 13: i'm going to write myself a note to bring that

[4:29:37] Voice 4: up it's also about that's

[4:29:39] Voice 13: a problem for

[4:29:39] Voice 4: me better

[4:29:40] Voice 4: yeah for whatever why the trust was designed the way so all the money is managed at the trust

[4:29:46] Voice 4: council not the local trust committee i i think is a bit of a mistake when we've been talking about

[4:29:51] Voice 4: how to plan for projects better and work better together at the other islands boy money is a big

[4:30:00] Voice 4: to do that you know we should be having more budget conversations about the cost of our

[4:30:05] Voice 4: projects and making sure that we've worked in you know proper communication plans and all of that

[4:30:11] Voice 4: and i think the more we become aware of the budget and it'll help manage the project better

[4:30:19] Voice 4: because to me a scope and budget go hand in hand yeah

[4:30:24] Voice 13: i just i've slowly started to get a grip on

[4:30:26] Voice 13: the way the islands trust budget moves and flows around this whole bin that is slush on the whatever

[4:30:34] Voice 13: what is it called the surplus

[4:30:36] Voice 5: that moves

[4:30:37] Voice 13: into circles and the reserve well

[4:30:40] Voice 5: no the reserve

[4:30:40] Voice 13: the reserve

[4:30:41] Voice 13: but i've just understood now the way that the reserve and i've had quite a lot

[4:30:45] Voice 13: of conversations with julian about the understanding that more deeply because

[4:30:49] Voice 13: finances hasn't been that thing historically but we're having to answer a lot of questions

[4:30:52] Voice 13: and it's an issue the way the way that so i'll just make a note to bring that in june okay keep

[4:30:58] Voice 13: going i

[4:30:59] Voice 4: have a finance committee yeah so i can

[4:31:02] Voice 13: never make the mirror in the middle of the week

[4:31:07] Voice 4: um so the adopted policy standard resolutions any changes i've got the conservancy report here

[4:31:14] Voice 4: it's good information to review and that brings us to is there any other business

[4:31:21] Voice 10: it was a town hall i haven't

[4:31:23] Voice 4: got there yet that's

[4:31:25] Voice 10: a new business no other business

[4:31:27] Voice 10: this is we covered every uh topic possible i think

[4:31:31] Voice 4: we did that's great so

[4:31:33] Voice 4: our next meeting

[4:31:34] Voice 4: our next regular meeting now is not till july 11th or 28th or august 11th august 11th okay so

[4:31:47] Voice 4: a lot

[4:31:47] Voice 10: we will be having a community in several communities there'll

[4:31:50] Voice 4: be lots of community

[4:31:50] Voice 4: and information meeting is coming please register on the website um or subscribe to the website so

[4:31:57] Voice 4: you'll get emails for all the information and then that

[4:32:01] Voice 4: brings us to a town hall we do not rework any

[4:32:03] Voice 4: decisions we made today but uh happy to uh hear anything anyone who wishes to address this all

[4:32:14] All right, and that's Amber that's how

[4:32:16] Voice 17: we ended up over at

[4:32:28] Voice 17: four.

[4:32:29] Voice 17: Sorry

[4:32:29] Voice 14: to interrupt. I can't hear this person. Oh,

[4:32:32] Voice 17: sorry. She's

[4:32:33] Voice 14: she's moving.

[4:32:34] Voice 17: Thanks, Matt. Thank you.

[4:32:37] Voice 17: It's just

[4:32:37] Voice 17: it's been it's your comment about business owners

[4:32:40] Voice 17: not getting along it was at that time uh when we made our application three sets of trustees ago

[4:32:49] Voice 17: um gulf excavating was still working there there was no and that when the new trustees came in

[4:32:58] Voice 17: they put it on hold and there was a big huge study for four years so it was it wasn't because we

[4:33:06] Voice 17: weren't getting along there it was we were stopped where we were and that's where they decided they

[4:33:13] Voice 17: wanted us the community decided that that's where we wanted they wanted us to go but in the meantime

[4:33:19] Voice 17: gulf moved from because they were having problems from there to four four one five

[4:33:25] Voice 17: so it's

[4:33:27] Voice 17: not it's not that land owners weren't or business owners weren't getting

[4:33:31] Voice 17: anymore

[4:33:31] Voice 10: but i guess my point was the trust did get involved the trust involved itself

[4:33:36] Voice 10: instead and that's the point i was trying to get and the question is where does the trust

[4:33:41] Voice 10: involve itself which is kind of in our debating point and trust council all the time i mean

[4:33:45] Voice 10: there's no answer yeah

[4:33:46] Voice 17: it's just the trust the previous trust yeah yeah

[4:33:51] Voice 10: thank you for clarifying

[4:33:53] Voice 10: that's fair enough yeah all right

[4:33:55] Voice 4: um michael's michael sketch thank you that

[4:34:03] Voice 9: was quite a meeting

[4:34:04] Voice 9: and congratulations a lot of really important issues um i'd like to speak to two items um

[4:34:12] Voice 9: the first is that um there's a good analogy between the the science that's gone into

[4:34:18] Voice 9: to groundwater research.

[4:34:20] Voice 9: And in the 80s, the Office just asked the Land Commission

[4:34:25] Voice 9: to do a survey of soils in the Southern Gulf

[4:34:28] Voice 9: that was extremely detailed.

[4:34:30] Voice 9: There were 2,200 points, site points on North Bender,

[4:34:34] Voice 9: not on South Bender.

[4:34:35] Voice 9: And that information has been added to files

[4:34:39] Voice 9: and the Land Commission uses that data in their mapping

[4:34:46] Voice 9: to identify prime agricultural land we should be preserving protecting prime agricultural land

[4:34:53] Voice 9: we don't have a dpa for it but they're sometimes mistakes but the land use planning process

[4:35:01] Voice 9: should through the trust policy statement identify valuable agricultural land and not mess it up

[4:35:08] Voice 9: in theory here we have water and we've got some absolutely invaluable mapping done or at least

[4:35:15] Voice 9: the beginning to it it could be amended but the key point is that we we at least have a start on

[4:35:20] Voice 9: the mapping now after the mapping what do you do with it the as as you say where we had a way of

[4:35:29] Voice 9: doing this the object is to make sure that when an application for change in land use comes in

[4:35:35] Voice 9: that these various factors are taken into account we don't destroy groundwater and we don't destroy

[4:35:40] Voice 9: destroy prime agricultural soil and one way is a development permit area but it's only one way the

[4:35:47] Voice 9: other and other is to make use of the Islands Trust Act which established a federal a Federation and

[4:35:57] Voice 9: we have not yet made use of the trust area services and their oversight ability in law

[4:36:04] Voice 9: over the local planning service.

[4:36:07] Voice 9: So supposing we had, the trust had,

[4:36:10] Voice 9: a registered professional agrologist,

[4:36:13] Voice 9: a registered professional hydrologist

[4:36:16] Voice 9: in trust area services,

[4:36:18] Voice 9: and each and every application that came to the Islands Trust,

[4:36:21] Voice 9: trust area-wide, was referred to these experts

[4:36:24] Voice 9: to identify the touchstone areas where we need trouble.

[4:36:31] Voice 9: and that would be an equivalent process to a dpa and it would make proper use of the trust

[4:36:40] Voice 9: area governance structure that's set up in the act i'm going to take that that argument to trust

[4:36:45] Voice 9: council in june and i think it's really worth very carefully thinking about it would get around

[4:36:51] Voice 9: the problem of the professional reliance model i have given examples to the trust committee over a

[4:36:59] Voice 9: a hydrologist who cooked the books for a particular development and proved groundwater, but it

[4:37:07] Voice 9: was a fiction.

[4:37:08] Voice 9: At one time of the year he could do that, and that would not be the conflict of interest

[4:37:15] Voice 9: in that model.

[4:37:17] Voice 9: And the second thing I'd like to point out is that there were about 20 people on a waste

[4:37:23] Voice 9: management four-year project um and that the purpose because the local government act requires

[4:37:30] Voice 9: land being assigned to waste management we have none for the type of waste management

[4:37:36] Voice 9: that super debts are doing and not then not now and uh so that project was devoted to identifying

[4:37:43] Voice 9: land for zoning and that the project was shelled but the outcome of that were 13 properties that

[4:37:51] Voice 9: it by potential and what is now mooted was the prime option for all the reasons that that uh

[4:38:00] Voice 9: ten thousand dollars of of uh consultants at whatever time the second round and a commissioner

[4:38:07] Voice 9: north and south tender identified so this didn't come out of nowhere um and it's necessary under

[4:38:13] Voice 9: the local government act that's why you're doing it that's your job we need land zone not yesterday

[4:38:20] Voice 9: day but now and then we've got an operator willing to do the work and they're not they're not on land

[4:38:25] Voice 9: zone for the purpose so where do they sit thank you very much for all your work

[4:38:32] Voice 4: thank you michael

[4:38:33] Voice 4: let's

[4:38:33] Voice 10: make a motion to adjourn

[4:38:35] Voice 4: second second

[4:38:44] Voice 14: chair patrick what was amber's last name again

[4:38:51] Voice 14: D-E-T?

[4:38:51] Voice 14: B-U

[4:38:52] Voice 4: -R-D-T-T.

[4:38:56] Voice 14: Oh, Burdette.

[4:38:57] Voice 14: Yes.

[4:38:58] Voice 14: Thank you.

[4:38:59] Voice 14: Thank you.

[4:39:01] Voice 14: All right.