Saturna Island Local Trust Committee regular meeting, February 16, 2023

[0:00:00] Trustee Maude: All right. Good morning, everybody. Thank you for joining us for this. Now, this is both an

[0:00:05] Trustee Maude: electronic and in-live meeting. It's going to be recorded, and it will be on our website

[0:00:10] Trustee Maude: in the days to come. I want to begin the meeting by acknowledging we're fortunate to be able to

[0:00:16] Trustee Maude: gather today at locations across our traditional territory of the Coast Salish people. I'm David

[0:00:21] Trustee Maude: Watt from Main Island, and I am the chair of the Central Island Local Trust Committee. I'm joined

[0:00:29] Trustee Maude: here today by trustee milton and person and trustee boland is online on our zoom meeting

[0:00:37] Trustee Maude: from arizona so she has a big smile on her face we also have director paul brent from the cre who

[0:00:46] Trustee Maude: is here to give a brief report i assume and tell us all his wonderful things and we have

[0:00:51] Trustee Maude: planner brad smith um and you're so what you're what is your actual title planning technician

[0:00:59] Trustee Maude: planning technician bruce belcher so that's that's called us um so i don't think we have any staff

[0:01:09] Trustee Maude: joining online so we're cool there um and i think we can just go into our process here i just the

[0:01:18] Trustee Maude: the other interesting thing that she just acknowledged is that pat todd my recording

[0:01:21] Trustee Maude: secretary she's joining us um via uh soon and then ronald milchak who has been very kindly

[0:01:29] Trustee Maude: setting up all of this wonderful masterful magic so appreciate her efforts um so first thing on our

[0:01:37] Trustee Maude: um we have here's approval of the agenda um so you have an additional item yes i have

[0:01:45] Trustee Maude: uh

[0:01:46] Trustee Middleton: wanted to try and if um we could um this would be printed in and then probably forgot it but i

[0:01:56] Trustee Middleton: know i sent it to the stradale taxi address so this is basically an administrative amendment to

[0:02:01] Trustee Middleton: the bylaw compliance procedures um by resolution no by standing resolution

[0:02:11] Trustee Maude: okay so we have on the

[0:02:16] Trustee Maude: agenda 16.5

[0:02:17] Trustee Middleton: so we did that i just hadn't written it okay

[0:02:22] Trustee Middleton: so this is he's waiting to have the content

[0:02:24] Trustee Maude: but it's good for sure okay that's perfect that's exactly so then it's not an addition so

[0:02:28] Trustee Maude: if i consent then we'll adopt agenda unless trustee bone has any conditions

[0:02:35] Trustee Maude: so okay so we'll adapt that by consent um trustee records start

[0:02:42] Trustee Middleton: with trustee milton okay

[0:02:44] Trustee Middleton: Okay, just get myself together here, photogenic, you know, the audiences out there, you guys, I know you're used to the way I put myself together when rolling out of bed, but the broader public has certain expectations, so I'd certainly like to meet.

[0:03:03] Trustee Middleton: so without further ado um i was advised to give an update on a project that i've been working on

[0:03:12] Trustee Middleton: that i inherited from former trustee brent who was taking the lead on it and this is in regard

[0:03:18] Trustee Middleton: to land donation that judy myers who owns property on the would be the east side of paris road as

[0:03:26] Trustee Middleton: as you're going down into the Saturnia Beach,

[0:03:30] Trustee Middleton: as I wish to donate to the Nature Trust of BC.

[0:03:34] Trustee Middleton: Now, the Nature Trust of BC, as I'm sure you're aware,

[0:03:36] Trustee Middleton: has been slowly amassing property.

[0:03:39] Trustee Middleton: They either see a conservation vision

[0:03:41] Trustee Middleton: or they have their eye to an oil lease.

[0:03:44] Trustee Middleton: I'm not sure which,

[0:03:45] Trustee Middleton: but they're building basically piece by piece to add,

[0:03:50] Trustee Middleton: of course, they don't really want to,

[0:03:52] Trustee Middleton: or they want to conserve in perpetuity

[0:03:54] Trustee Middleton: the uh the environment basically is looking what they do and so it's been a bit of a difficult

[0:04:01] Trustee Middleton: process to get um uh over some issues with judy's property uh but we're getting there

[0:04:07] Trustee Middleton: so brad has been very helpful you know i've been working back and forth in terms of

[0:04:12] Trustee Middleton: the issues are you have to make some provision to retain a portion of the land which judy wants

[0:04:18] Trustee Middleton: to do for her heirs for use of the cabin which is just a small portion of the land

[0:04:24] Trustee Middleton: but in order to facilitate that there's been probably won't get into it now it's been

[0:04:29] Trustee Middleton: twinned with a couple of other land use application rezonings because Judy of course

[0:04:36] Trustee Middleton: has what is it about five densities bad on that property and so there is no use or interest of

[0:04:42] Trustee Middleton: the nature trust of BC of course and so using some of the proceeds potentially from sales of

[0:04:52] Trustee Middleton: the density allow the acquisition fund to come to 115 which is what their board insists the uh

[0:04:59] Trustee Middleton: the fund be before you they purchase property on this case 100 as a donation but the remaining 15

[0:05:06] Trustee Middleton: percent is to pay for a survey appraisal and then the original initial management and then some

[0:05:13] Trustee Middleton: number of years of funded management and this is one of the reasons why the nature trust of

[0:05:18] Trustee Middleton: BC has been very successful because they're very conservative in how they approach acquisition so

[0:05:23] Trustee Middleton: they'll never get them they'll never ever use debt for instance to get themselves into uh

[0:05:28] Trustee Middleton: into properties that they wish to preserve so it's it's going to be some ongoing work and

[0:05:33] Trustee Middleton: the elements of it will come to the local trust committee through various bylaws

[0:05:37] Trustee Middleton: um rather the transition of densities um and it's a tremendous gift from

[0:05:47] Trustee Middleton: from from uh from judy and the the as part of the work we've done that the actual standing

[0:05:52] Trustee Middleton: in praise was almost 900 000 all its value of the land so um you know obviously some of that

[0:05:58] Trustee Middleton: will be retained with the cabin but uh still it's it's a very generous gift and judy and her late

[0:06:03] Trustee Middleton: husband known that for many years i think prior priscilla and your late husband john owned it and

[0:06:09] Trustee Middleton: so

[0:06:09] Voice 5: it's you know it's it's holy christ what an accrual for what we paid for it

[0:06:21] Trustee Middleton: so that we're fairly sure is going to go ahead there's issues around because

[0:06:28] Trustee Middleton: the access to the subdivision license occupation was not actually even it's just uh it's uh it's

[0:06:37] Trustee Middleton: just uh permission to access food parks land this causes nature to have some concerns about

[0:06:43] Trustee Middleton: the permanency of their component and whether or not an easement uh that may or may not exist

[0:06:52] Trustee Middleton: would ever be required to have a road built through which of course violates their uh

[0:06:55] Trustee Middleton: principles of conservation in perpetuity i don't think so but we do recognize why

[0:07:02] Trustee Middleton: they are concerned when we looked at the documentation so that that process is um

[0:07:07] Trustee Middleton: is ongoing but it would be you know really quite something it would be from uh others

[0:07:13] Trustee Middleton: have expressed this vision on me this was before me but you know you would have potential protected

[0:07:18] land i.e hiking potential from uh from boot

[0:07:24] Trustee Middleton: code all the way down to um more or less nervous bay

[0:07:28] Trustee Middleton: through the joint sections of the nature trust of bc and the various where you're currently

[0:07:34] Trustee Middleton: be disconnected sections of the National Park Reserve and you know potentially we could convince

[0:07:39] Trustee Middleton: the National Park to even do a walk-in campground at one point along there and this is years down

[0:07:45] Trustee Middleton: the road of course but um it would allow that possibility this is sort of one of the missing

[0:07:49] Trustee Middleton: pieces and Brad and I walked in it's a beautiful beautiful probably you guys all know it better

[0:07:55] Trustee Middleton: than we do I'm sure but it's a really beautiful piece of property and so on so let's kind of like

[0:08:00] Trustee Middleton: the update on that is for people to know about um and secondly the governance committee has kicked

[0:08:05] Trustee Middleton: off doing some of the looking at some of the governance modernizing governance of the trust

[0:08:10] Trustee Middleton: which is that sounds a bit esoteric but we've had a good start we've got a good committee we

[0:08:14] Trustee Middleton: have an ex-provincial judge and the uh and who's a trustee and we have uh the ex-chief uh um um

[0:08:24] Trustee Middleton: commissioner for the bc uh securities commission compliance department so these people are no

[0:08:30] Trustee Middleton: shrinking violence and so they're but they're also very fair and very procedurally minded and

[0:08:34] Trustee Middleton: and i think they'll they'll be uh a great addition to the work we're doing so one of the things we're

[0:08:40] Trustee Middleton: looking at immediate meeting procedures so the local trust level it's not so bad but at the

[0:08:45] Trustee Middleton: trust council level generally people find the formal construction of the meetings prohibits

[0:08:55] Trustee Middleton: dialogue and dialogue is what's going to be required to cross the bridge between differences

[0:09:00] Trustee Middleton: of uh that shows a values or preservation goals so that's um that's going to be some ongoing work

[0:09:07] Trustee Middleton: that i can report so i think that's probably enough from me thank you very much trustee

[0:09:11] Trustee Middleton: all yeah

[0:09:15] Voice 4: hi hi everything okay you can hear me clearly we're

[0:09:21] Trustee Maude: doing good thank you

[0:09:22] Voice 4: sure um yeah

[0:09:24] Voice 4: well of course i have been being onboarded and i've been learning the ropes and i have to say

[0:09:32] Voice 4: the staff of the islands trust has done a sterling job of the unending task of getting us all up to

[0:09:41] Voice 4: to speed with how things work so that's ongoing I'm on the financial planning committee and I'm

[0:09:49] Voice 4: on the regional planning committee on the financial planning committee we've had some

[0:09:56] Voice 4: challenging meetings where we try to really understand and look into the budget which of

[0:10:04] Voice 4: course came to us from the last year's term we actually didn't see it until late November

[0:10:09] Voice 4: So there have been several meetings on that and some progress made, and that will go now.

[0:10:19] Voice 4: The next iteration is Trust Council in early March.

[0:10:24] Voice 4: I think what it highlighted was the difficulty in really understanding fully all the aspects of it.

[0:10:33] Voice 4: And some of the recommendations from the governance committee, sorry, the governance review, which the governance committee has ownership of, were about maybe improving and making more transparent the kind of planning process so that when the budget was finally in front of you, it was easy to understand how all the pieces had come together and to challenge them along the way.

[0:11:02] Voice 4: Either way, anyway, now the Financial Planning Committee have formed a small working group to work on that with a process, not the content, but a process to be ready for first review in the middle of April.

[0:11:22] Voice 4: So I'm on that three person, three trustees on the working group, one Laura from Salisbury Island and Christina from South Pender and myself.

[0:11:35] Voice 4: And we will work with Julia, who is the director of administrative services and generally solely responsible for the finance.

[0:11:46] Voice 4: Well, not solely, but she does much of the financial and putting together.

[0:11:51] Voice 4: So we work with her. So that's kind of a step forward as as Lee said, we are making progress on making some updates and reforms and making some plans.

[0:12:04] Voice 4: And I think I'll leave it at that. I've been I've said enough, but I'm still learning.

[0:12:10] Voice 4: So I'll just listen in.

[0:12:14] Voice 4: We're lucky that Lee and David are both experienced

[0:12:19] Voice 4: and that I can afford to lean on their experience

[0:12:25] Voice 4: and take their direction a bit.

[0:12:27] Voice 4: So I'm looking forward to the meeting.

[0:12:29] Voice 4: Thank you.

[0:12:30] Trustee Maude: Thank you, Dr. Gold.

[0:12:32] Trustee Maude: Okay, from my perspective, I think, you know,

[0:12:36] Trustee Maude: the two big things that are happening

[0:12:38] Trustee Maude: or what your two trustees touched on is the government's committee and the finance committee

[0:12:43] Trustee Maude: and we're really lucky to have their resources at those committees because there's a lot happening

[0:12:50] Trustee Maude: a lot of changes and i think a lot of positive changes um certainly in march for any trust

[0:12:57] Trustee Maude: council the two things we're focusing on will be adoption of the budget which hopefully be easier

[0:13:04] Trustee Maude: than last year because some people aren't uh the other thing is we're going to be doing is i'm

[0:13:11] Trustee Maude: doing a review on my law enforcement um so we're going to have the trustees going to spend almost

[0:13:16] Trustee Maude: the full day on what our practices and procedures are and and perhaps look towards doing a review

[0:13:24] Trustee Maude: there um i must say that this trust council is a pretty good one is sitting around the table we

[0:13:32] Trustee Maude: have a lot of talent we have a lot of people but the important thing is a lot of nice people and

[0:13:38] Trustee Maude: everybody's getting along um oftentimes with with trust counselors seems to be friction

[0:13:44] Trustee Maude: and then there's sort of the hat kills the mccoys and nobody's getting along nobody's communicating

[0:13:49] Trustee Maude: this one's not like that it's just really really good so i think the next four years

[0:13:54] Trustee Maude: i think it's going to be quite positive for the trust um particularly with the work that

[0:13:59] Trustee Maude: the basement undertaking uh with the governance committee and the review the hopeful we're hoping

[0:14:05] Trustee Maude: that the province is going to do a review of the trust as a whole and sort of bring us into some

[0:14:11] Trustee Maude: sort of i don't know which century we're going to pick that we're going to get brought into

[0:14:15] Trustee Maude: because so much of our foundation dates back to the 1970s and it's we're lagging and and it would

[0:14:24] Trustee Maude: be nice for the province to take the time to look at us put us under a magnifying glass and give us

[0:14:29] Trustee Maude: some new marching orders so i will just leave it at that thank you um so and next up we have the

[0:14:36] Trustee Maude: electoral area director's report and we happen to have one of those right here

[0:14:42] Voice 9: there we go

[0:14:43] Voice 9: so i'll start off um actually lee used up the seven of my nine minutes so i'll keep it short

[0:14:53] Voice 9: So I want to commend the Local Trust Committee for continuing on with the initiatives in

[0:15:00] Voice 9: respect of parks and continuing to work with the Nature Trust.

[0:15:07] Voice 9: CRE is indeed working with the Nature Trust as well, and we find a much different organization

[0:15:14] Voice 9: to deal with than other conservation organizations because they do have a community focus.

[0:15:19] Voice 9: And so they're in the process right now transferring or providing an easement and the use of a well for Lyle Harbor Boot Cove that's on their property that may help ameliorate the boil water advisory, advisories we're having.

[0:15:38] Voice 9: So, you know, it's a great organization.

[0:15:41] Voice 9: It's acquired 143 acres last year of parkland that connects Boot Cove to Harris Road, and

[0:15:49] Voice 9: Boot Cove and Main Road to Harris Road.

[0:15:51] Voice 9: So it's really interesting and it's tying together these disparate parts of Parks Canada,

[0:15:58] Voice 9: so it's awesome.

[0:15:59] Voice 9: So I'm here today, but I've also been going to other local trust committees, such as on

[0:16:05] Voice 9: Gallaudet and on Pender.

[0:16:07] Voice 9: Haven't been to Maine yet, but we've done the community information in, I've been over

[0:16:12] Voice 9: there a few times.

[0:16:13] Voice 9: And so the idea is, and we're seeing it with Adam Olson too, is we're going to try to work

[0:16:18] Voice 9: much more closely together than we have in the past.

[0:16:23] Voice 9: CRD's strategic plan is almost wrapped up.

[0:16:26] Voice 9: Housing is by far the highest priority.

[0:16:29] Voice 9: And so the CRD is built somewhere close to, in tandem with BC Housing and CMHC has built

[0:16:36] Voice 9: somewhere close to 2000 units of affordable accessible housing. Most of that's on the

[0:16:43] Voice 9: peninsula. There's not much happening. There's nothing, some stuff has happened on Salt Spring

[0:16:50] Voice 9: Island, but so far nothing on Southern Gulf Islands. That's going to be my focus. And so

[0:16:55] Voice 9: there's been real challenges in rezoning for affordable housing on our islands. We have a

[0:17:00] Voice 9: plum tree court on pender island and we now have what started off as galliano green what about

[0:17:06] Voice 9: almost two decades ago uh on on galliano obviously and it is now achieved it's rezoning so

[0:17:15] Voice 9: we're going to be focused on that and main island is not far behind we've got nothing on

[0:17:20] Voice 9: so i would blame the trustees from the last number of terms for being um you know really

[0:17:26] Voice 9: not and so that's pretty much it for me that i think is relevant to this trust committee thank

[0:17:32] Voice 9: you

[0:17:32] Trustee Maude: thank you director bradley certainly we look forward to a more engaged relationship with the

[0:17:38] Trustee Maude: cnd it's most pleasure so now we move on we have a little town hall session here um if anybody has

[0:17:49] Trustee Maude: any questions or concerns and if asking us to raise your hand and identify yourself for the

[0:17:57] Trustee Maude: recording secretary and we'll go one at a time and i see one hand up so we will do one hand

[0:18:03] Voice 5: hi my name is priscilla um and i had a favor or i'm not quite sure how to put this forward

[0:18:11] Voice 5: forward. We would like to ask for two cadastral maps of the Trent and hopefully so with all

[0:18:24] Voice 5: the section lines involving elevations on it. And I would like to because whenever you're

[0:18:31] Voice 5: filling in a map with lots of people's work, you need a clean copy at the end. So the reason

[0:18:38] Voice 5: is is that uh given our great um appreciation of the islanders who have been here for a long time

[0:18:47] Voice 5: and the actuarial tables of how long we get to live uh we have a lot of very good information

[0:18:54] Voice 5: here on the island and we are all getting older so specifically uh barry and barry right here

[0:19:02] Voice 5: and crooks and john games right there and i think john money will also um be interested in helping

[0:19:10] Voice 5: us with this is the logging history of saturn island as far as they know it and i would like

[0:19:16] Voice 5: that information because much of the regrowth of the island and much of its next usage is sometimes

[0:19:24] Voice 5: determined by what happened, what regrowth we've had and what recovery from particulars of logging.

[0:19:35] Voice 5: So I was hoping that you all who used to have absolutely splendid mapping capability or do

[0:19:42] Voice 5: still have some of that and would be willing to donate to, I think your maps are usually

[0:19:49] Voice 5: something like this and something like that to the cost i'd be really interested if we could have

[0:19:56] Voice 5: not on the section lines but who wants what i don't know if that's within your capability

[0:20:01] Voice 5: or if you were even interested in this request community so

[0:20:06] Trustee Maude: if that's something we can

[0:20:09] Voice 6: i think that mapping could create and print out maps with the cadastral fabric with the property

[0:20:17] Voice 6: lines if that's what you're seeking uh the work to put the ownership of each lot uh it's probably

[0:20:24] Voice 6: less realistic on the map itself but not

[0:20:27] Voice 5: necessarily sorry i don't mean like who owns it

[0:20:30] Voice 5: where it's been split

[0:20:32] Voice 6: like where it's been subdivided you mean yeah

[0:20:36] Voice 5: that's what i mean

[0:20:36] Voice 6: thank you yeah i mean the most current cadastral would be available uh would that necessarily show

[0:20:43] Voice 6: all the historic section lines as well as the new lines. I'm not sure if it would or not.

[0:20:47] Voice 6: Well

[0:20:48] Voice 5: the section lines have been solid since

[0:20:51] Voice 5: fixed for a long time. What's that?

[0:20:53] Voice 5: The section lines have been fixed for a long

[0:20:56] Voice 6: time. So what do

[0:20:56] Voice 6: you mean by the section lines? I'm thinking like the like

[0:20:59] Voice 1: if there's previous subdivision the

[0:21:01] Voice 6: previous subdivision boundary lines.

[0:21:02] Voice 5: Okay well I think subdivision is quite different from the

[0:21:05] Voice 5: section lines.

[0:21:05] Voice 6: Yeah fair. So I mean I think it would be up to the LTC to direct staff to

[0:21:22] Trustee Middleton: We would need to, I think, understand precisely what the questioner wants so we can probably

[0:21:30] Trustee Middleton: ask more questions in order to get the kind of information that you're seeking and then

[0:21:35] Trustee Middleton: figure out because you're, I think, after sort of a historical overview of the process

[0:21:41] Trustee Middleton: of logging such an island that's what you're so that the it department wouldn't have they would

[0:21:46] Trustee Middleton: have no way of getting that without actually doing interviews and maybe comparing aerial photos and

[0:21:51] Trustee Middleton: such so it's it's a worthy project but i don't think it's just as simple as asking them i'm not

[0:21:56] Voice 5: asking the island's trust to figure out where the logging has occurred i'm wanting to use the um

[0:22:04] Voice 5: the memories of the three people i think you

[0:22:08] Trustee Middleton: just said the exact same

[0:22:09] Voice 5: thing that you were saying

[0:22:10] Voice 5: Okay, I'm

[0:22:11] Trustee Maude: not expecting that, so basically just be a motion for staff to work with a few guys too.

[0:22:17] Voice 6: Yeah, I would think so.

[0:22:19] Voice 6: We can provide a map, if we have the data available. I think that's a reasonable thing if there is work to do with staff interacting with the community, all that's taking staff time to work through answering these questions.

[0:22:33] Voice 6: That's a different question. That's probably a project of the Local Trust Committee to direct

[0:22:39] Voice 6: staff to take the

[0:22:41] Voice 6: time to do that.

[0:22:42] Trustee Middleton: I can see it being that, because here's what I understand is how that would happen, is the base mapping will be prepared.

[0:22:48] Trustee Middleton: Obviously all the sectionalized stuff, that's clearly already exists, that the Council Trust obviously has all that.

[0:22:54] Trustee Middleton: And then it would be like almost like a bit of a workshop session to sit down with some of the people with the knowledge, like, you know, John, Mary and Ron,

[0:23:01] Trustee Middleton: and others and actually sort of work through to the best of their knowledge what the you know

[0:23:08] Trustee Middleton: logging activity has been and when roughly and then that would be expressed in you know another

[0:23:13] Trustee Middleton: cartographer but there'd be ways to then express that through mapping you see the change over time

[0:23:19] Trustee Middleton: you could perhaps there's a history of aerial photography before satellite photography I'm

[0:23:23] Trustee Middleton: sure that the CRD or the trust has and that's how I envisage the project you're talking about

[0:23:29] Trustee Middleton: and it certainly sounds uh of interest there's no doubt but but it is something that would involve

[0:23:37] Trustee Middleton: a couple go-arounds with map preparation and then interviewing with the community i think unless i

[0:23:44] Trustee Middleton: i

[0:23:45] Voice 5: i was envisioning something um far less um complex and what you're describing

[0:23:52] Voice 5: before we all kick off those of us of this generation i'd like to have that information

[0:23:58] Voice 5: I was envisioning a pencil and writing that stuff in.

[0:24:03] Voice 5: I do realize that numerous pieces

[0:24:05] Voice 5: have been logged more than one time,

[0:24:08] Voice 5: but I think that we can get that down

[0:24:10] Voice 5: in a much more graphic and old fashioned manner.

[0:24:15] Trustee Maude: So I'm going to see Trustee Boland has her hand up.

[0:24:18] Voice 4: Yeah, hi, thanks.

[0:24:20] Voice 4: There is also, it's probably a limited time span,

[0:24:25] Voice 4: but there's the Madrone report

[0:24:26] Voice 4: that was done for the Islands Trust on land disturbance.

[0:24:33] Voice 4: I don't know if there are data sets from that

[0:24:37] Voice 4: that could be shared in addition to maps,

[0:24:40] Voice 4: but that's just a thought.

[0:24:41] Voice 4: I just thought it's an extra piece of information.

[0:24:44] Voice 4: Yeah.

[0:24:45] Trustee Maude: Oh, thank you.

[0:24:46] Trustee Maude: So what you're looking for is a map

[0:24:51] Trustee Maude: that you can take your crayons with and color.

[0:24:54] Trustee Maude: so you just you're you're not looking for anything beyond just the base thing so

[0:25:01] Trustee Maude: that's a good start that i'm sure is no

[0:25:04] Trustee Middleton: problem that that would just be cranking out the existing

[0:25:08] Trustee Middleton: what would be there's a name for the layer that you would use you wouldn't have to do anything

[0:25:14] Trustee Middleton: and then we could do sort of an informal start on the workshop and see if people want to

[0:25:19] Trustee Middleton: to volunteer their time, bring up pencil cranes,

[0:25:22] Trustee Middleton: and see what we get.

[0:25:24] Trustee Middleton: And then we can go from there, I guess.

[0:25:29] Voice 5: Jerry says, biggest you can get, workshop.

[0:25:33] Voice 5: Are we going to do more workshop?

[0:25:35] Voice 5: I thought we might do lunch.

[0:25:36] Voice 2: This is the local information that you believe in.

[0:25:38] Voice 5: Yeah.

[0:25:38] Voice 5: I think we're considering lunch maybe.

[0:25:42] Trustee Maude: My only suggestion was working with staff.

[0:25:45] Trustee Maude: If you guys just don't just talk back and forth,

[0:25:47] Trustee Maude: make sure you get the right map of the right size so i think we

[0:25:50] Voice 6: could produce a 24 by 36 map

[0:25:54] Voice 6: and if you want to if i think it would be useful for you to direct staff to

[0:26:01] Voice 6: work with this new bank on map preparation

[0:26:08] Voice 6: sorry yeah

[0:26:14] Voice 6: And what would be helpful if you could send me an email with a really specific ask of

[0:26:18] Voice 6: what you're asking for, that would be the easiest for me then to ask some of them out.

[0:26:23] Voice 6: So you need a motion to accept.

[0:26:25] Voice 6: I think it would be good to have a motion for you to direct staff to provide for that.

[0:26:30] Trustee Middleton: Sure, I'll move to direct staff to work with Ms. Priscilla Eubank to prepare.

[0:26:38] a base map for use by the community in

[0:26:44] Trustee Middleton: documenting historical forestry activity.

[0:26:48] Trustee Middleton: Wow, great.

[0:26:50] Voice 8: Okay,

[0:26:50] Trustee Maude: so now we'll make sure that Pat's got that okay.

[0:26:56] Trustee Maude: This is the magic of working with remote people.

[0:26:59] Trustee Maude: So Pat's just going to write it out and then she'll read it back to us.

[0:27:03] Voice 1: Could you spell the woman's name for me, please?

[0:27:09] Voice 5: nobody can do that e-w-b-a-n-k e

[0:27:15] Voice 1: -w yes e-w-e-n-k

[0:27:20] Voice 1: e-w-b-a-n-k e-w-b-a-n-k eubank perfect

[0:27:27] Voice 5: okay

[0:27:28] Voice 1: and okay so to direct staff to work with miss eubank

[0:27:32] Voice 1: to prepare a base map for work with community to document historical logging

[0:27:39] Voice 1: activities

[0:27:40] Trustee Maude: sounds great all right do we have a second for that motion

[0:27:46] Trustee Maude: any discussion if not we'll call the question all in favor and that carries thank

[0:27:52] Voice 5: you perfect

[0:27:53] Trustee Maude: Perfect. All right. Anybody else have any questions or?

[0:27:58] Voice 9: Director Rantz.

[0:27:59] Voice 9: I just want to show support for the request

[0:28:06] Voice 9: for the Islands Trust funding of the indigenous element

[0:28:10] Voice 9: of the wetlands project.

[0:28:13] Voice 9: Very quick background is historically we've been told

[0:28:18] Voice 9: that communities really don't know how to engage

[0:28:22] Voice 9: with First Nations, they need professional staff to do so.

[0:28:26] Voice 9: And what I have seen on the Southern Gulf Islands is just the opposite.

[0:28:31] Voice 9: It's that our communities have done an exemplary job of engaging

[0:28:37] Voice 9: with First Nations without any assistance whatsoever with staff.

[0:28:41] Voice 9: And we have allocated a lot of monies to support First Nations engagement,

[0:28:48] Voice 9: engagement and those monies need to be used to help support community engagement because that

[0:28:54] Voice 9: is how reconciliation is going to go forward thanks thank you

[0:28:59] Trustee Maude: all right anybody else okay

[0:29:03] Trustee Maude: if not we'll move on um we don't have community information meeting we don't public hearing we

[0:29:08] Trustee Maude: have three sets of minutes that we need to adopt by consent um we have uh local trust

[0:29:16] Trustee Maude: committee special meeting being stated december 14th any corrections errors or omissions

[0:29:24] Trustee Maude: so three sets of minutes so if not um

[0:29:29] Trustee Maude: we can tell those two sets of minutes and then the rest of them okay i'm being a bad chair

[0:29:39] Trustee Maude: counting was not part of the resume so so we have two minutes so so the first set december 14th

[0:29:46] Trustee Maude: by consent uh yeah okay and the second sentence local trust committee public hearing record

[0:29:51] Trustee Maude: dated December 14th for receipt. So that's simply for receipt. So again, no, nothing there.

[0:30:00] Trustee Maude: and then we have second section 28 resolution without meeting report dated february to obtain

[0:30:04] Trustee Maude: 23.

[0:30:07] Voice 12: so again just for adoption i think those

[0:30:16] Voice 6: are just for this seat yeah 9.2 so that's 9.1 you need

[0:30:20] Voice 6: to adopt okay so we're done

[0:30:23] Trustee Maude: um all right so we'll move on to the follow-up action list um which is

[0:30:30] Trustee Maude: on pages 11 to 13. um anything you want to walk through plenary smith

[0:30:37] Voice 12: um

[0:30:38] Voice 6: i won't walk through each

[0:30:40] Voice 6: item but i would flag that uh with respect to uh mr and mrs kirk's application that your bylaw

[0:30:47] Voice 6: have been approved by the executive committee violence trust and now with the ocp amending

[0:30:53] Voice 6: any bylaws with the minister of municipal affairs for approval and so we don't have any lever to

[0:31:01] Voice 6: pull in terms of timing for that decision but when a minister's decision is rendered assuming

[0:31:07] Voice 6: they approve the bylaw which is the typical pathway then you would be in the position where

[0:31:11] Voice 6: you could then the local trust committee could consider adoption of your bylaw and that would

[0:31:16] Voice 6: be the end of your rezoning process and at that time the dead cities would actually be that i

[0:31:22] Voice 6: we've already probably paid for would actually be transferred to your land

[0:31:28] Voice 6: i don't know if there's anything else in that list that uh trustees are interested in

[0:31:33] Voice 6: talking about just it is

[0:31:36] Trustee Middleton: becoming a bit of an outstanding cleanup matter but if we can just

[0:31:38] Trustee Middleton: keep them on there for now this is the southern resident resolutions sorry

[0:31:42] Voice 4: may i ask something

[0:31:44] Voice 4: yeah sorry uh the so uh brad if you don't mind it's with the minister and you can't

[0:31:52] Voice 4: uh estimate the timing but i'm just wondering if it's worth considering a special meeting

[0:31:59] Voice 4: if it comes back you know our our local meetings are not very ready so if it came back say next

[0:32:07] Voice 4: week perhaps we that we would have a special meeting to uh finalize it would that be appropriate

[0:32:15] Voice 4: or not or you could

[0:32:16] Voice 12: adopt them by rwm sure

[0:32:18] Voice 4: okay that's good for me is that okay with everybody

[0:32:22] Voice 4: everybody else and do we need it other than wait another you know whatever it is so

[0:32:30] Trustee Maude: the request is

[0:32:30] Trustee Maude: as soon as it gets back that we would like to sort of address and likely but whatever resolution I'll

[0:32:37] Trustee Maude: be eating would be the first

[0:32:38] Voice 6: you could pass a resolution that directs stuff now to seek a

[0:32:44] Voice 6: resolution without meaning motion for that bylaw or you could wait until they're received and stuff

[0:32:50] Voice 6: could initiate a resolution by email what more seamless if you really foresee that you have no

[0:33:00] Voice 6: need to have a discussion around uh anything else with respect to that application uh upon

[0:33:06] Voice 6: receipt from the minister i think it's reasonable to direct stuff now to do an rwm okay okay so

[0:33:15] Voice 6: So, Mike,

[0:33:15] Trustee Middleton: do you want to do that?

[0:33:17] Voice 4: Okay, so I'll have a go.

[0:33:20] Voice 4: So I move that on receipt of approval by the Minister of the...

[0:33:28] Voice 4: I don't know how to describe it now.

[0:33:30] Voice 4: I

[0:33:30] Voice 6: think you just call it By-law 136.

[0:33:33] Voice 4: Okay, approval of By-law 136 that staff...

[0:33:41] Voice 4: Do

[0:33:41] Voice 6: you want some help?

[0:33:42] Voice 4: Yes, request a presentation.

[0:33:44] Voice 4: That

[0:33:45] Voice 6: the LTC directs staff to initiate an RWM for By-law 136 and 137 upon receipt of ministerial approval of By-law 136.

[0:33:58] Voice 4: Perfect. Thank you.

[0:34:00] Trustee Maude: Well done, Mary.

[0:34:02] Trustee Maude: Pensionable time.

[0:34:04] Trustee Maude: Okay, we'll just wait for Pat to read that back.

[0:34:07] Voice 4: Do I get a gold star or does Brad get the gold star?

[0:34:11] Trustee Maude: You can share.

[0:34:17] Voice 1: Direct staff to arrange an RW resolution without meeting upon receipt of ministry approval

[0:34:30] Voice 1: of by law 136 direct

[0:34:33] Voice 6: stuff to initiate a resolution without meaning for by law 136 and 137. Oh,

[0:34:42] Voice 1: Oh, okay, By-law 136 and 137.

[0:34:48] Voice 6: Okay,

[0:34:49] Voice 1: upon receipt of Ministry approval.

[0:34:52] Voice 1: For

[0:34:52] Voice 6: By-law 136.

[0:34:55] Voice 1: Oh, for 136, okay.

[0:34:57] Voice 6: By-law 137 does not need Ministry approval.

[0:35:00] Voice 6: Oh, okay.

[0:35:02] Voice 1: So direct staff to initiate a resolution

[0:35:04] Voice 1: without meeting for By-law 136 and 137

[0:35:09] Voice 1: upon receipt of Ministry approval

[0:35:10] Voice 1: approval of bylaw 136 perfect

[0:35:13] Trustee Maude: perfect all right any discussion good call question all in favor

[0:35:22] Trustee Maude: and that carries all righty anything

[0:35:27] Trustee Middleton: else so just uh housekeeping detail these uh from 14th

[0:35:31] Trustee Middleton: Feb 2020 in regard to SRKW sanctuary zone and well watch regulations um it obviously needs

[0:35:41] Trustee Middleton: cleaning up we don't have to do that today we need to get a little more information and we can

[0:35:45] Trustee Middleton: update these and uh transform them into something useful for 2023.

[0:35:52] Trustee Maude: perfect now what was there was

[0:35:55] Trustee Maude: one item that was the follow-up action list that paid back quite a few years as i recall um it

[0:36:03] Voice 6: might be that one because it moved

[0:36:05] Trustee Maude: over a few times

[0:36:06] Voice 6: yeah yeah

[0:36:08] Trustee Maude: okay i think it was that one yeah

[0:36:09] Trustee Maude: all right fair enough all right so that's a football patch list yes okay we'll flip the page

[0:36:19] um all right applications referrals

[0:36:21] Trustee Maude: um essay rxn

[0:36:23] Voice 12: 2022.2 games staff report

[0:36:26] Voice 12: thank you

[0:36:36] Voice 6: chairman um so this staff report is to present a preliminary report for the rezoning

[0:36:42] Voice 6: acquisition by Mr. Gaines who's with the audience here for his parcel at Fort Clark by East Point

[0:36:48] Voice 6: Road. He's seeking rezoning of the waterfront portion of the lot from rural residential to

[0:36:56] Voice 6: rural general to allow for a minimum average density calculation to be used to create two

[0:37:05] Voice 6: new waterfront lots as part of his broader subdivision proposal on the parcel to create

[0:37:11] Voice 6: nine new lots which would leave uh the remainder um and so just a new staff report here you have

[0:37:21] Voice 6: in figure two the proposed subdivision lot layout with the nine new laws depicted on the corner of

[0:37:27] Voice 6: his uh existing large

[0:37:29] Voice 12: reversal and the two waterfront

[0:37:37] Voice 6: lots uh you can see uh located on

[0:37:40] Voice 6: the water with the lot line separating them that's the area there that's currently zoned

[0:37:45] Voice 6: rural residential and the the size of that portion of the lot given your bylaws with the split zoning

[0:37:53] Voice 6: requirements require you to treat each zone type separately Mr Gaines does not have a large enough

[0:38:01] Voice 6: rural residential zone portion there to create even one single lot as opposed to the two or

[0:38:07] Voice 6: three that he was hoping to create and so that's why he's seeking to result into rural general

[0:38:13] Voice 6: so that he can use the other lots that are zone row general on the upland portion to ensure that

[0:38:22] Voice 6: minimum average lot size requirement is

[0:38:24] Voice 12: met we point out a couple key

[0:38:34] Voice 6: points around

[0:38:36] Voice 6: there is a covenant on the property restricting the density to 16 overall

[0:38:42] Voice 6: all uh lots including the remainder so potentially Mr Gaines could create 15 new lots with the

[0:38:50] Voice 6: remainder on that portion his subdivision which he does have a subdivision application

[0:38:57] Voice 6: through the ministry and that is how this rezoning was triggered through my review of that proposal

[0:39:07] Voice 6: there's a covenant that restricts it to 16 total densities so in the future Mr Gaines

[0:39:12] Voice 6: could create another six new lots with the with the remainder which would change shape of course

[0:39:17] Voice 6: but would still be the remainder it's consistent in in general with the other stress policy

[0:39:26] Voice 6: statement except for perhaps with respect to 4.42 which with respect to ensuring fresh water

[0:39:35] Voice 6: resources are protected and water quality is maintained and so staff make the recommendation

[0:39:41] Voice 6: that as a condition of rezoning, Mr. Gaines be required to demonstrate proof of water

[0:39:47] Voice 6: for each of those two new proposed waterfront lots, as well as demonstrate septic viability.

[0:39:55] Voice 6: And so both of those would require a professional assessment.

[0:40:00] Voice 6: Proof of water, presuming he's using groundwater, would require the wells to be drilled

[0:40:05] Voice 6: and hydrogeologist to do a pump test

[0:40:07] Voice 6: in accordance with provincial and trust standards.

[0:40:12] Voice 6: And the septic assessment can just be done

[0:40:15] Voice 6: with the subject professional confirming

[0:40:16] Voice 6: that there is an area viable

[0:40:18] Voice 6: to create a subject field for each lot.

[0:40:23] Voice 6: And if the LTC passed that resolution

[0:40:29] Voice 6: and staff would provide Mr. Gaines

[0:40:31] Voice 6: with the terms of reference that provides specific standards

[0:40:34] Voice 6: standards that are required to be met and there are archaeological sites uh located on the water

[0:40:43] Voice 6: uh registered sites on either side as shown on page 20 of this staff report there's also

[0:40:51] Voice 6: archaeological potential identified on the waterfront portion of Mr Gainslott so staff

[0:40:57] Voice 6: recommend or suggest that the local trust committee could seek some kind of covenant

[0:41:04] Voice 6: to protect the foreshore area of the property.

[0:41:08] Voice 6: Currently, there are only the standard setbacks

[0:41:11] Voice 6: of seven and a half meters.

[0:41:16] Voice 6: So you could look to create some kind of section 219

[0:41:19] Voice 6: covenant.

[0:41:20] Voice 6: In addition, Mr. Gaines is gaining, in a sense,

[0:41:24] Voice 6: the use of that area.

[0:41:26] Voice 6: Right now, he couldn't create any separate lots.

[0:41:30] Voice 6: So in a subdivision, he would need to hook that portion

[0:41:33] Voice 6: to one of the lots upland,

[0:41:36] Voice 6: that meets the minimum average size.

[0:41:38] Voice 6: And so in a sense, while he's not gaining density

[0:41:42] Voice 6: because he's using density that exists on the lot,

[0:41:45] Voice 6: he is gaining a benefit of creating

[0:41:49] Voice 6: those two waterfront lots that wouldn't otherwise

[0:41:52] Voice 6: be able to be created.

[0:41:54] Voice 6: And so staff draw to the intention

[0:41:58] Voice 6: that the local trust committee could see

[0:42:00] Voice 6: your community benefit in exchange for the rezoning that community benefit could be the

[0:42:07] Voice 6: potential restriction or a receipt of one or more of the densities that exist that would exist on

[0:42:15] Voice 6: that on that upland portion that could be used in your community density reserve for then some

[0:42:22] Voice 6: future ecological protection initiative on your island or you could see that and or some other

[0:42:31] Voice 6: community benefit and that's really up to the trust committee at their discretion to decide what

[0:42:36] Voice 6: that community benefit um what is

[0:42:40] Voice 6: appropriate and

[0:42:42] Voice 8: um yeah i think i will pass it back to the chair

[0:42:46] Voice 8: now and uh we do have the applicants so trust me it's a question sir um i've not done this very

[0:42:57] good report thank you smith um

[0:42:59] Trustee Middleton: i was just um the one thing that um i was curious about was the uh

[0:43:07] Trustee Middleton: the terms of reference it it seems that um not knowing exactly what those deep i mean well maybe

[0:43:17] Trustee Middleton: i should just ask through the chair what what is the content of that terms of

[0:43:22] Voice 6: reference uh so

[0:43:24] Voice 6: I think probably the most salient point would be the volume that you would be required on

[0:43:29] Voice 6: each new lot with respect to that terms of reference it was essentially just frame up

[0:43:34] Voice 6: the most of it is the process that is required to confirm water quality and quantity

[0:43:42] Voice 6: so like the process steps but your your land use bylaw does not have a minimum standard

[0:43:49] Voice 6: standard for water per day. And so in conversation with Robert, he suggested a minimum of 2000

[0:43:59] Voice 6: liters per day would probably be appropriate for each lot and would be consistent with

[0:44:06] Voice 6: the development regulations on other islands where there are water requirements. Of course,

[0:44:16] Voice 6: Mr. Gaines at some point in the future would also need to prove water subdivision stage. The LTC could defer approval of, or could defer requirement for proof of water to subdivision, much like you have done with Mr. Cripps' property.

[0:44:38] Voice 6: property. But in this case, because without water, those lots

[0:44:44] Voice 6: wouldn't be viable. It becomes a bit new to create that zone to

[0:44:49] Voice 6: create that potential if there's not viable water and septic

[0:44:53] Voice 6: there. Staff recommend and would typically recommend that in a

[0:44:59] Voice 6: case like this that proof of water at time of rezoning is more

[0:45:03] Voice 6: appropriate.

[0:45:03] Voice 6: So okay,

[0:45:04] Trustee Middleton: thank you for that. That's helpful. And I've just

[0:45:06] Trustee Middleton: consultant i've made a couple notes from this with i think i had a site visit with mr gaines

[0:45:12] Trustee Middleton: who probably a year and a half ago now sometime ago and um so there's a point i noted there that

[0:45:18] Trustee Middleton: i'll bring up but it's the very important point the quality and quantity definition because

[0:45:24] Trustee Middleton: this has been our issue for us in the past and that we've wanted to um get away from for

[0:45:31] Trustee Middleton: subdivision approval from the approving officer that people have to drill into groundwater

[0:45:35] Trustee Middleton: water because that's seen as only one method of providing water and but in absence of the

[0:45:43] Trustee Middleton: definition of quality and quantity at the local level um we had to defer to the provincial standard

[0:45:50] Trustee Middleton: which did require the well right so we couldn't actually we couldn't actually say no catchment

[0:45:55] Trustee Middleton: potential is x and so therefore in uh the local trust committee's view sufficient quality and

[0:46:01] Trustee Middleton: quantity is demonstrated because of course um we all share the same climate here and catchment of

[0:46:07] Trustee Middleton: x thousands of leaders would be possible per year um now i know we're sort of working on

[0:46:13] Trustee Middleton: that there's a spending resolution that actually is asking that trustee brent actually right now

[0:46:18] Trustee Middleton: director brent made that actually uh said we want to rely on that not just the um requirement to

[0:46:26] Trustee Middleton: access uh ground groundwater by drilling a well but you know before i sort of make a point further

[0:46:35] Trustee Middleton: than that i realized from my notes that mr gaines is here so he can ask that question i believe

[0:46:40] wells are already drilled on those properties

[0:46:42] Trustee Middleton: so this could all be new despite the good intentions

[0:46:46] Trustee Middleton: of our point to our water rainwater collection so perhaps would you be able to answer that question

[0:46:53] Trustee Middleton: I

[0:46:53] Voice 2: can answer that question. At some point, for Mr. Modlock's benefit, he's probably the one trustee that hasn't had any involvement, whatever, in this long process that I have been involved in.

[0:47:09] Voice 2: And I would like to spend a little time at the chair's

[0:47:16] Voice 2: permission to sort of update the whole thing a little bit.

[0:47:20] Voice 2: And maybe the picture would be clearer

[0:47:24] Voice 2: as to why I am finding myself in this predicament of having

[0:47:28] Voice 2: to rezone.

[0:47:29] Voice 2: And from my point of view, it's a down zoning.

[0:47:32] Voice 2: I'm going from a potential of three lots down to two.

[0:47:36] Voice 2: and so it's a long complicated story and exactly how we arrived at this is beyond my comprehension

[0:47:47] Voice 2: to be honest but we are at this point and I understand that and I acknowledge that but

[0:47:54] Voice 2: possibly if I could put up hold up a map and I think the former trustee and his job as

[0:48:04] Voice 2: regional director would probably be a good guy to have hold one end of the map for me so I would

[0:48:11] Voice 2: like to briefly go over this I knew there was a purpose to me being

[0:48:33] Voice 12: um this

[0:48:36] Voice 2: road was initially where my parents owned this property

[0:48:41] Voice 2: it was a logging road that basically followed the ocean and my father being a local person

[0:48:55] Voice 2: was asked by the lighthouse keeper and his wife if they could improve that the old logging road to the extent that they could drive through it from each point and have access a lot farther.

[0:49:10] Voice 2: As far as that seems all right with me. So that was in the early 50s I guess.

[0:49:20] Voice 2: and replaced for many years at the end of the process of before I applied for this subdivision

[0:49:29] Voice 2: the highways department through section whatever it was right of access to the surface of the rules

[0:49:37] Voice 2: said we own this thank you very much but we don't like it very much it's very difficult to ever do

[0:49:47] Voice 2: anything with so my father and i went to him and said okay we will build this road and give it to

[0:49:56] Voice 2: you for the park um as long as we have access or the old road is is given up so that was fine

[0:50:06] Voice 2: that went ahead years past um i decided in the early 70s i'm sorry to start my subvention

[0:50:17] Voice 2: And the road was started, the negotiations were probably in 1970, the road was I think completely tied up in 1973.

[0:50:28] Voice 2: They didn't do anything for at least 10 years. I applied for a subdivision and did one, two, three plots.

[0:50:38] Voice 2: That was one individual sub-division, sat on it again for years, about 2007, the gentleman

[0:50:47] Voice 2: came along and asked if we could have a lot, and I said sure, but he wanted a bigger lot

[0:50:53] Voice 2: than this, because this was laid out on a basis of eight waterfront lots, so I gave

[0:50:58] Voice 2: him a bigger lot, which meant that I wasn't going to be able to get all eight, I was going

[0:51:05] Voice 2: to settle for settlement um i looked at the ground after that and decided probably would be better to

[0:51:11] Voice 2: do two lots um and in 19 or sorry in 2002 may i stress it we're upgrading the bylaw

[0:51:26] Voice 2: and i said oh wait a minute um this is a long-term project i'm part way through it

[0:51:34] Voice 2: um what can you do to allow me to continue what i have laid out in plan and they said well i guess

[0:51:44] Voice 2: we could put you in rural residential and then you can have one acre waterfront lots i said great

[0:51:50] Voice 2: that works for me that went ahead and at no cost to me the honest trust the upgrade of the bylaw

[0:51:57] Voice 2: did that and i thought my you know my problems are solved um and uh so much to my surprise

[0:52:11] Voice 2: because i guess i didn't do my homework or change with friends i didn't know

[0:52:16] um when

[0:52:17] Voice 2: this application was put in and by the way when i beat this block i don't say i'm in

[0:52:23] Voice 2: of the rural residential zone i had the right to make that law but it was approved and passed in

[0:52:31] 2007 i believe um

[0:52:33] Voice 2: and so when this application came in i was told i can't do it because we're

[0:52:37] Voice 2: talking about acreage um i was amazing surprised and it was pointed out to me that in the ocp it

[0:52:46] Voice 2: says in split zones these things happen and what i would suggest is that this is only a one-acre

[0:52:57] Voice 2: waterfront loss that ever occurs again it's not very useful uh if it's if the parent parcel the

[0:53:06] Voice 2: other zone parcel doesn't accommodate that as part of the zone it takes place in forest and

[0:53:14] Voice 2: and rural residential would take place in two other zones there.

[0:53:21] Voice 5: John, what is that?

[0:53:23] Voice 5: Sorry?

[0:53:24] Voice 5: You just referred to that.

[0:53:26] Voice 5: If that takes place, which that?

[0:53:29] Voice 9: It takes place in forest zone.

[0:53:32] Voice 2: Oh, in

[0:53:32] Voice 9: rural residential

[0:53:35] Voice 2: forest, you get the average crosses over.

[0:53:38] Voice 2: or the density of the forest land

[0:53:42] Voice 2: can be applied to the rural residential land,

[0:53:46] Voice 2: but not in rural residential

[0:53:50] Voice 2: and rural general can use it.

[0:53:54] Voice 2: You have to have five acre average

[0:53:58] Voice 2: in the parcel that's rural residential,

[0:54:01] Voice 2: which in my opinion makes very little use

[0:54:05] Voice 2: anywhere and you never use it

[0:54:07] Voice 2: because it's only applicable on nursing farms.

[0:54:10] Voice 2: So I think the bylaw following this should change

[0:54:15] Voice 2: to reflect the fact that it's not a workable zone

[0:54:18] Voice 2: as written.

[0:54:20] Voice 2: So anyway, to end the story,

[0:54:22] Voice 2: I am now in a position where I would like to utilize

[0:54:29] Voice 2: my law firm.

[0:54:30] Voice 2: And when I put in this application

[0:54:33] Voice 2: due to the very high price of land,

[0:54:35] Voice 2: I decided that I would go back

[0:54:37] Voice 2: to create the three logs that I had the acreage to create on a one acre basis,

[0:54:43] Voice 2: even though I had formerly thought of only doing two.

[0:54:49] Voice 2: And so that's why there are wells.

[0:54:51] Voice 2: I built a well here, a welder was on island.

[0:54:55] Voice 2: I built another and another well.

[0:54:57] Voice 2: So I set it up at that time to do two larger logs.

[0:55:02] Voice 2: So the wells are there.

[0:55:03] Voice 2: where the percolation has been done as part of a subdivision application, only I have

[0:55:10] Voice 2: percolated for three lots, which it is capable of carrying the effluent from three lots.

[0:55:17] Voice 2: It will certainly carry the effluent from two because there's extra area.

[0:55:22] Voice 2: area. So, you know, it's, to me, something has happened here then, and I don't exactly

[0:55:35] Voice 2: know why it happened, but it's caused me a range of difficulty. And I've tried to pay

[0:55:43] Voice 2: the parks dedication and give them public access to ocean dedication years ago, and

[0:55:50] Voice 2: And I hate to be required to give up any of my density

[0:55:55] Voice 2: because the density in the five acre average

[0:55:58] Voice 2: on the double filings for development is very sparse.

[0:56:02] Voice 2: And I support that.

[0:56:04] Voice 2: I was part of the plan to adopt that here,

[0:56:07] Voice 2: but I really don't think that I should be asked

[0:56:11] Voice 2: to provide an amenity because of the requirement

[0:56:15] Voice 2: to in effect down the zone

[0:56:18] Voice 2: to allow me to answer any questions you might ask if that exploration is

[0:56:31] Trustee Maude: trustee bowen do you have any questions uh

[0:56:34] Voice 4: no thank you for the explanation john i have one

[0:56:37] Voice 4: one thing uh brad i did ask you and you provided me thank you much with

[0:56:42] Voice 4: an estimate of the average lot size which i think is a useful number just to kind of

[0:56:49] Voice 4: it gives you a kind of a mental picture of the visual situation so could you tell us that please

[0:56:56] Voice 4: if you don't mind let me

[0:57:00] Voice 4: find the email I sent you yeah

[0:57:02] Voice 4: I just think it's a useful thing as a

[0:57:07] Voice 4: kind of an aid memoir to actually what's happening here when we talk about the densities etc

[0:57:14] Voice 6: So, with respect to, so just to speak to Mr. Gaines' points there, so the use of the term

[0:57:30] Voice 6: down zone, I think in this case, doesn't apply, technically, not from a planning perspective,

[0:57:37] Voice 6: perspective, because currently right now, and I understand that Mr. Gaines, I don't

[0:57:47] Voice 6: know all the history, but his understanding, or there was something missed along the way

[0:57:51] Voice 6: where the bylaw was amended, and he didn't

[0:57:55] Voice 8: know

[0:57:56] Voice 6: that it was being amended, and that amendment

[0:57:58] Voice 6: then created a minimum average lot size that wouldn't allow you to develop those very

[0:58:03] Voice 6: or as much loss so in a sense

[0:58:05] Voice 6: uh historically if that is true he would have had three densities

[0:58:09] Voice 6: there but uh purely from a planning perspective right now there are zero densities right now on

[0:58:15] Voice 6: that waterfront portion and rezoning into rural general creates the possibility for two densities

[0:58:24] Voice 6: on that so and when you were talking about down zone you were talking about a more restrictive

[0:58:30] Voice 6: restrictive zoning being applied that typically reduces but

[0:58:37] Voice 4: what I was talking about was I think

[0:58:40] Voice 4: you gave me a number that was yeah I

[0:58:42] Voice 12: was just speaking to Mr Gaines's

[0:58:44] Voice 6: point with respect to

[0:58:47] Voice 6: the use of the term downtown it really isn't

[0:58:50] Voice 6: from from a purely Atlantic perspective where

[0:58:52] Voice 6: we are at now it's not technically downtown i just wanted to make that um with respect to uh the

[0:59:01] Voice 6: minimum averages and so uh the bylaw states that the minimum average for rural residential which

[0:59:06] Voice 6: is the waterfront portion you can have a a a minimum lot size of one acre which wouldn't be

[0:59:13] Voice 6: able to be done on his lot but the minimum average is two hectares and so if you had a one acre lot

[0:59:20] Voice 6: you would need a nine acre lot to get to your uh two uh hectare average and so uh with respect to

[0:59:28] Voice 6: the split zoning provisions in the bylaw uh the as mr gaines was stating uh the bylaw requires that

[0:59:36] Voice 6: you uh compare those minimum densities on each zone type so in this case uh he has lots of lot

[0:59:43] Voice 6: lot to create this minimum average for his rural general portion, but he doesn't have

[0:59:49] Voice 6: enough rural residential portion of his lot to create those waterfront lots he's seeking.

[0:59:56] Voice 6: And so by rezoning from rural residential to rural residential, he's able to create

[1:00:00] all

[1:00:00] Voice 6: of the lots become rural general and the lot averaging then works for all the lots because he has a great big remainder portion in particular that.

[1:00:10] Voice 6: And so, just doing the calculation with respect to the nine lots, and then the remainder included the average lot size becomes 3.76 hectares if it's re-zoned to rural general.

[1:00:24] Voice 6: for the 10 lots, the nine new lots, plus the remainder,

[1:00:28] Voice 6: which is obviously well over the minimum average.

[1:00:31] Voice 6: And so that's where he is,

[1:00:35] Voice 6: or that's why the benefit of rezoning to row general.

[1:00:39] Voice 6: So he can use the upland portion of the lot

[1:00:42] Voice 6: to make those averages compliant.

[1:00:46] Voice 6: Is that

[1:00:46] Voice 12: what you were looking for?

[1:00:47] Voice 4: Yeah, yeah.

[1:00:48] Voice 4: It was just that I thought it was a very decent average size.

[1:00:51] Voice 4: That's all.

[1:00:52] Voice 4: it was I think you came out with 9.3 acres yeah yeah

[1:00:57] Voice 6: so when it's so so when we're talking about

[1:01:00] Voice 6: rural general lots uh you're well above yeah and Mr. and Mr. Gaines would still have in the future

[1:01:06] Voice 6: the potential to create new lots that would bring that average size down further um yeah

[1:01:14] Voice 6: sure

[1:01:15] Voice 4: and the waterfront lots are actually over two acres each so I think that's it's just yeah

[1:01:20] Voice 4: i'm new to this so i'm i'm just kind of contemplating

[1:01:24] Voice 6: the space that table would have

[1:01:26] Voice 6: been helpful to have on the staff report it was very valid thank

[1:01:30] Voice 4: you for providing it thank you

[1:01:34] Voice 9: since i was standing up there it strikes me that there was a social contract

[1:01:39] Voice 9: uh at some point in time the development of our official community plans and one of the elements

[1:01:43] Voice 9: of that social contract was is that we did not want rampant development on the island so there

[1:01:49] Voice 9: there was to be a stage,

[1:01:51] Voice 9: it was recognized there would be a stage development.

[1:01:54] Voice 9: In order for a stage development,

[1:01:56] Voice 9: it's slowly developing lots.

[1:01:59] Voice 9: And so one of the consequences of that

[1:02:02] Voice 9: in this particular case is that zoning changed.

[1:02:07] Voice 9: And so, yes, indeed, it appears that,

[1:02:10] Voice 9: well, there was this definite slow development.

[1:02:16] Voice 9: There seems to have been a penalty associated with it,

[1:02:19] Voice 9: which I don't think was part of the social contract.

[1:02:21] Voice 9: And that's just my view of what I understand took place

[1:02:24] Voice 9: in terms of the social contract,

[1:02:27] Voice 9: the limiting of the population of 2,500, lots 800,

[1:02:32] Voice 9: we're nowhere near any of those.

[1:02:34] Voice 9: So I think we need to recognize it's not a plan

[1:02:36] Voice 9: thing, okay?

[1:02:38] Voice 9: It's more a community thing.

[1:02:41] Voice 9: And so we have to balance, I believe, community

[1:02:43] Voice 9: and planning elements when we're determining these things.

[1:02:49] Voice 5: I'm somewhat in agreement with what Paul says, which is unusual, that those social contracts

[1:02:58] Voice 5: and our desire to develop in Soli, that also comes with the benefit in that if you're developing

[1:03:04] Voice 5: lot by lot, then I believe you don't have to, if you're not in the large lots subdivision,

[1:03:10] Voice 5: we were less equipped for donations to the community and that was not a given that we

[1:03:17] Voice 5: follow that that we follow the slow and measured development as john has favored

[1:03:24] Voice 5: because we had seen what happens when you have when you get hit by a developer and they do all

[1:03:31] Voice 5: sorts of development so i would be very pleased if the slow development regime was um

[1:03:39] Voice 5: have some sort of legal support to it but it doesn't in my understanding and um the other

[1:03:49] Voice 5: thing here is that is there a possibility to make this a one-up i do understand about the

[1:03:55] Voice 5: donations to the road and how that went and how how that has evolved very slowly and i can understand

[1:04:02] Voice 5: that if you're not attending all the meetings you may not be apprised of a shift that applies to

[1:04:09] Voice 5: your to your land uh do we not have administratively a if some policy changes

[1:04:22] Voice 5: that would affect um different portions of land is there a notification that goes out to

[1:04:28] Voice 5: landowners who might find themselves in this um in a situation like this i also have mixed

[1:04:36] Voice 5: zoning so i can tell you i haven't been paying very much attention either and i probably should

[1:04:43] Voice 5: should be attentive to that so if a change comes by in terms of zoning and what constitutes this

[1:04:50] Voice 5: or that are the people who's uh when you know the configuration of lots there wouldn't be a

[1:04:57] Voice 6: uh a specific collection of names and a mail load or email mail i mean i'm not sure

[1:05:06] Voice 6: uh the the

[1:05:07] Voice 6: history or or when or how um i guess really i think mr uh mr games's uh point of 4.11 that provision

[1:05:27] Voice 6: where it restricts the ability for lots to be smaller than two hectares,

[1:05:36] Voice 6: the rural residential lots.

[1:05:37] Voice 6: I have no context of when that was inserted in the bylaw

[1:05:41] Voice 6: and how it affected Mr. Gaines' previous agreement.

[1:05:45] Voice 6: So there's no real paper trail or...

[1:05:48] Voice 5: Well, I think I'm looking...

[1:05:50] Voice 5: This situation seems to bring that up, that that might be...

[1:05:54] Voice 5: Yeah,

[1:05:55] Voice 6: I don't think the Island Trust would have the capacity to, I mean, and I

[1:06:00] Voice 6: don't understand, I don't have any context of how that provision was created.

[1:06:06] Voice 6: So

[1:06:06] Voice 5: I don't know what...

[1:06:07] Voice 5: I do understand that there is

[1:06:08] Voice 5: staff, when staff changes, there is often no institutional memory of what has occurred.

[1:06:15] Voice 5: And it seems like this might fall into that category.

[1:06:19] Voice 6: In what way?

[1:06:20] Voice 6: mean well the

[1:06:22] Voice 5: certainly the um helpfulness that occurred with the roads and the changes to that

[1:06:29] Voice 5: and how that affected yeah

[1:06:31] Voice 6: and so that's why staff are not recommending that they

[1:06:36] Voice 6: require density or some kind of community amenity we are raising that point to the local trust

[1:06:42] Voice 6: committee to have this conversation around whether they are of the view that a community amenity

[1:06:48] Voice 6: in this case is appropriate.

[1:06:50] Voice 5: That's very helpful.

[1:06:51] Voice 5: Thank you, Brian.

[1:06:51] Voice 5: I'm going to tell that.

[1:06:52] Voice 5: My next question was just about the First Nations use

[1:06:58] Voice 5: or something of habitation, evidence of habitation.

[1:07:06] Voice 5: Did I hear you say that?

[1:07:07] Voice 6: There are registered archaeological sites on either side

[1:07:16] Voice 6: side of uh mr games's rural residential zone portion of his waterfront lot there so those

[1:07:23] Voice 1: are

[1:07:23] Voice 6: sites that are registered federally so there's no one to contain archaeological materials probably

[1:07:28] Voice 6: probably uh shellman but the the the data is restricted to it being an archaeological site

[1:07:37] Voice 6: we also

[1:07:38] Voice 6: have another database that shows archaeological potential and so it is

[1:07:44] Voice 6: you know, a data algorithm. It's not ground proof. No one has been there saying, well,

[1:07:49] Voice 6: this looks like a site that might be used, but they would use, you know, topography and,

[1:07:55] Voice 6: you know, slope and, you know, distance to water and all those.

[1:08:02] Voice 6: So

[1:08:02] Voice 5: my question is a general question and that's identified on anybody's land. Does somebody,

[1:08:08] Voice 5: when they're exactly, definitely going to be a change of use, does somebody come out

[1:08:13] Voice 5: and check it out or do you and

[1:08:15] Voice 6: so to develop on the land

[1:08:19] Voice 6: a property owner is required to either obtain an archaeological permit in some cases

[1:08:26] Voice 6: and so the staff report there is information and that has been provided that recommending

[1:08:33] Voice 6: that they contact the bc archaeological branch for any development on any land base really

[1:08:40] Voice 6: in some cases in this case for example because there are those known sites so close by the

[1:08:45] Voice 6: archaeological branch if at some time that there's going to be a house or some kind of excavation on

[1:08:51] Voice 6: that land base the archaeological branch may require that mr games actually obtain a permit

[1:08:56] Voice 6: in other cases it's enough for the property owner to go ahead with the development and if they

[1:09:05] Voice 6: encounter any archaeological material and then they would need to immediately stop

[1:09:09] Voice 6: and so in some cases you know if you're way up on the top of a ridge and there's no

[1:09:17] Voice 6: there's no sites identified and there's no or very little archaeological potential then

[1:09:23] Voice 6: there's probably very little risk that you are actually going to encounter archaeological

[1:09:27] Voice 6: materials

[1:09:27] Voice 5: in a case like this and not very strongly applied what's that so this whole

[1:09:32] Voice 5: archaeological thing is quite hazy and none i

[1:09:36] Voice 6: wouldn't hazy wouldn't be the word that i would

[1:09:39] Voice 6: use well

[1:09:41] Voice 5: let me say it sounds like there's something in effect but in actuality it's

[1:09:46] Voice 5: just mostly judgment call and

[1:09:48] Voice 6: so no it's uh the the bc government has requirements around

[1:09:52] Voice 6: archaeological materials and the management of those and so technically on every property

[1:09:58] Voice 6: a property owner is required to consider the potential for ecological material in all cases

[1:10:06] Voice 6: they should probably contact the government they probably don't always and at that point that

[1:10:16] Voice 6: lever of government would decide if they need a permit to develop to develop on that property

[1:10:20] Voice 6: In this case, because it's not our jurisdiction, but because the property is located between two known historical uses of First Nations, staff would recommend that Mr. Gaines at least have that conversation with the province.

[1:10:39] Voice 6: Thank you.

[1:10:39] Voice 5: This is a more generalized question because you brought that up and I was wondering what the, if the trustees were needed to do something or anybody who owns that piece of land. It is a general question.

[1:10:51] Voice 5: The

[1:10:52] Voice 6: comment that staff provide to the trustees in this case is that to protect the waterfront portion of that waterfront, given that there's known sites, the LTC could require that a section 219 covenant be applied to protect a larger portion of the waterfront from development than what the standard setbacks would be.

[1:11:16] Voice 5: Okay, I think I understand. Thank you.

[1:11:18] Trustee Maude: sir you have any questions and also just your name for the secretary uh

[1:11:22] Voice 7: john hutchinson and a

[1:11:25] Voice 7: point about just on potential archaeological sites vast amount of property on saturn has

[1:11:34] Voice 7: that designation because it's been historically in the past properties were designated as that

[1:11:40] Voice 7: if there was a midden even in the nearby vicinity and so what it is it's a highlight to let

[1:11:47] Voice 7: the property owner, because this happened to me, let the property owner be aware that this is there

[1:11:54] Voice 7: and if you're building in this area, you will require a heritage branch. If you're not,

[1:12:03] Voice 7: you would be to be aware that should you notice anything and your contractors,

[1:12:08] Voice 7: they shut down immediately if anything is spotted. So it's generally applied and that's why

[1:12:17] Voice 7: why it says potential, it doesn't mean it is.

[1:12:20] Voice 7: And lastly, I just hate to comment

[1:12:23] Voice 7: that I actually agree with Paul and Percilla,

[1:12:26] Voice 7: which is very unusual for the three of us.

[1:12:31] Voice 5: What is it, John?

[1:12:34] Voice 8: We have a quarrel.

[1:12:38] Voice 8: Well, hold on, hold on.

[1:12:39] Voice 8: Since you're a resident,

[1:12:41] Voice 8: both of those are theological stuff.

[1:12:46] Voice 8: If one subscribes, and there's no point in re-zoning if it's not in the assembly.

[1:12:52] Voice 8: If one subscribes, it gets referred to the archaeological branch.

[1:12:55] Voice 8: They have all the data about potential sites and so on.

[1:12:58] Voice 8: And they're the ones that really should decide whether an archaeological survey needs to be done.

[1:13:04] Voice 8: And normally they do require something if it is a water transfer.

[1:13:07] Voice 8: Existence of site nearby where the site shows that there's potential sites on the property.

[1:13:13] Voice 8: So I don't see why we should get involved with the rezoning process.

[1:13:17] Voice 8: So

[1:13:17] Voice 6: staff aren't recommending an archaeological survey.

[1:13:20] Voice 6: Staff are suggesting that the Local Trust Committee could create a covenant on the waterfront portion

[1:13:26] Voice 6: to further ensure protection of any First Nations values that may exist there,

[1:13:32] Voice 6: given the known sites really close by, and all bylaws get referred to First Nations.

[1:13:39] Voice 6: and so First Nations would be receiving this

[1:13:42] Voice 6: and First Nations will probably see those archaeological sites

[1:13:46] Voice 6: on either side of the map

[1:13:47] Voice 6: and they may come back and say,

[1:13:49] Voice 6: we are concerned that this potential rezoning

[1:13:52] Voice 6: has potential impacts to First Nations archaeological resources.

[1:13:59] Voice 6: So that is why staff are providing that advice to the local trust.

[1:14:04] Voice 6: And they can take it everywhere.

[1:14:07] Voice 2: May I make a comment?

[1:14:09] Voice 2: When the initial three lots that were shown at the eastern end of the property, which is the

[1:14:15] Voice 2: portion of the west iron number seven, and the beach at the west end, there were definitely

[1:14:23] Voice 2: archaeological sites there. A gentleman by the name of Mr. Glom reached out to me at the time

[1:14:34] Voice 2: of the first three-lot subdivision application.

[1:14:39] Voice 2: I said, I do not believe there are any sites there.

[1:14:44] Voice 2: And formerly there was a logging road traversing

[1:14:48] Voice 2: and a dump site for logging in the 40s

[1:14:52] Voice 2: that took place in that portion of the property.

[1:14:57] Voice 2: And then the public road went over it for 99 years.

[1:15:01] Voice 2: and he actually came and looked at the ground and decided that I was right there was no indication

[1:15:09] Voice 2: there and since then there have been three houses built on the eastern end there was never any sign

[1:15:17] Voice 2: of any in any of those footings and I did two of them two of the three and so the reason that it is

[1:15:27] Voice 2: is not indicated there on land is when you get to the eastern end where the first lot was created

[1:15:37] Voice 2: the bank is significantly lower than it is in the portion that's currently developed

[1:15:42] Voice 2: and the indigenous people were water oriented and when they could haul out and get their access from

[1:15:48] Voice 2: the boats and the canoes to their land that's where they dwell and that was not the case much

[1:15:55] Voice 2: much like cliffside ones turn too high and too steep

[1:15:58] Voice 2: to provide water access.

[1:16:01] Voice 2: So I'm quite sure that there is no midden there

[1:16:06] Voice 2: as I have dug the burr holes again very recently

[1:16:09] Voice 2: and discovered absolutely no midden.

[1:16:12] Voice 2: To require setbacks for buildings

[1:16:16] Voice 2: to the greater gaps

[1:16:21] Voice 2: would be quite detrimental in my opinion.

[1:16:24] Voice 2: in and I've been building houses on this island for a couple of years to the tune of about

[1:16:29] Voice 2: 86 of them, I believe. So I've been on the land and in the ground pretty extensively

[1:16:36] Voice 2: to move the houses back, the front of the buildings back from the ocean beyond the required

[1:16:43] Voice 2: island's trust setback of seven and a half meters to 15 would put the two houses that

[1:16:50] Voice 2: that will be there in the future,

[1:16:54] Voice 2: help the bank behind, make costs higher,

[1:16:59] Voice 2: make damage to the environment and the terrain

[1:17:03] Voice 2: significantly more impactful.

[1:17:06] Voice 2: So I don't think there's any real need to do that.

[1:17:12] Voice 2: And I'll make a last comment, these are the wells.

[1:17:15] Voice 2: I couldn't find the well logs because my wife is away,

[1:17:20] Voice 2: But the wells in question, one produces about eight gallons a minute, and the other about six and a half.

[1:17:28] Voice 2: And they were public at the time that they were tested on their viable work.

[1:17:39] Trustee Maude: I can circle back to Trustee Middleton's concerns about supply of water.

[1:17:45] Trustee Maude: water, because I know what the Ministry of Highways and the

[1:17:49] Trustee Maude: substitution process says is provision of water, of potable

[1:17:53] Trustee Maude: water to the satisfaction of the local trust committee. So in

[1:17:56] Trustee Maude: January 1, is it already, when the ministry comes back with

[1:18:02] Trustee Maude: the, as long as the local trust committee is satisfied that you

[1:18:06] Trustee Maude: are providing potable water, potable water resource, they'll

[1:18:09] Trustee Maude: accept that. So there

[1:18:11] Trustee Middleton: is that provision.

[1:18:12] Trustee Middleton: Well, my understanding was we have to actually have a

[1:18:14] Trustee Middleton: quality and quantity named in order to satisfy them and local trust committees were forcibly

[1:18:21] Trustee Middleton: removed from that business around the walkington scandal time so we're trying to get back into

[1:18:26] Trustee Middleton: that business but i don't think we have sufficient definition of potable water to satisfy it

[1:18:32] Trustee Middleton: and now in this case it's sort of a moot point because the wells aren't exactly thrilled today

[1:18:37] Trustee Middleton: can

[1:18:38] Voice 6: i say though that on saturn you don't right but not many of the other islands

[1:18:44] Voice 6: potable water standards are well uh described in my law socaliano for example

[1:18:52] Voice 6: they have very specific leaders per day for your

[1:18:56] Voice 6: different uses and requirements to demonstrate

[1:18:59] Voice 6: quality as well and same with septic and so as we've talked about with your your projects that

[1:19:06] Voice 6: i do think that is a real gap that the saturn bylaws don't have a minimum standard of water

[1:19:12] Voice 6: regardless of whether that is a source through groundwater which is by far the most technically

[1:19:20] Voice 6: simple and efficient way to get proof of water as Mr. Hall can attest to on your laws they're

[1:19:28] Voice 6: trying to to use anything but groundwater right you're in

[1:19:32] Trustee Maude: this right to

[1:19:32] Voice 6: get provincial approval

[1:19:35] Voice 6: and so yeah

[1:19:37] Trustee Maude: no it is it's one of the most important things with the trust areas

[1:19:41] Trustee Maude: else separately they remain on nothing's defined all that it says that if if a well is to be used

[1:19:48] Trustee Maude: for the purpose of self-sabotage um it must be done to the appropriate standards there's

[1:19:56] Trustee Maude: nothing there's no

[1:19:57] Trustee Middleton: standards there's no standards and there's there's nothing else very well this

[1:20:03] Trustee Middleton: is very good i mean because i think maybe my memory is faulty but perhaps because we've got

[1:20:07] Trustee Middleton: the uh the wizened former trustee brent here i recall me being told for years that it was a

[1:20:14] provincial authority

[1:20:15] Trustee Middleton: to determine quantity and quality for purposes of subdivision and we had

[1:20:20] Trustee Middleton: no say in the matter it

[1:20:22] Voice 6: is ultimately a provincial authority but we we have minimum subdivision

[1:20:28] Voice 6: stamp like you have

[1:20:29] Voice 6: subdivision regulations in your bylaw which were around hook loss and

[1:20:34] Voice 6: and panhandles and depth to weight ratio.

[1:20:39] Voice 6: Galliano also has standards for potable water

[1:20:43] Voice 6: and standards for septic

[1:20:45] Voice 6: and the provincial approving officer

[1:20:48] Voice 6: would look to those standards.

[1:20:49] Voice 6: And so when a subdivision is referred to the Islands Trust,

[1:20:53] Voice 6: which we receive all of them on Galliano,

[1:20:57] Voice 6: we would reply saying trust bylaw regulations

[1:21:01] Voice 6: require that they meet this minimum standard

[1:21:04] Voice 6: of whatever figures per day for saturn we can't do that because we don't have those moments there

[1:21:08] Voice 6: and so then the province is left

[1:21:11] Trustee Middleton: determined i mean i would say that's good news and obviously

[1:21:15] Trustee Middleton: we have it flagged we'll speak in a minute it's still on our project so we can maybe speak to

[1:21:21] Trustee Middleton: that point because yeah we well per trustee brent's resolution last term you know that was

[1:21:28] Trustee Middleton: sort of finding out you're basically saying what trustees sorry minor smith has just said

[1:21:34] um and this was highly controversial but we're hearing now that it really shouldn't

[1:21:39] Trustee Middleton: be and there's

[1:21:40] Trustee Middleton: progress that we can make there so that's great so and

[1:21:43] Voice 9: we were told it couldn't be in a bylaw at

[1:21:45] Voice 9: this stage yet that's why it's a standing resolution right and there were issues around

[1:21:49] Voice 9: that but there's other jurisdictions where you're

[1:21:52] Voice 6: talking about for not groundwater

[1:21:53] Voice 6: water puddle

[1:21:55] Voice 6: yeah rainwater

[1:21:56] Voice 9: attachment right

[1:21:57] Voice 6: so the the scale and the standards are based on

[1:22:00] Voice 6: groundwater yeah so

[1:22:01] Voice 6: that's where you could be start to become more forward thinking which is

[1:22:06] Voice 6: creating a standard that that creates a minimum volume and but also potentially creates other

[1:22:13] Voice 6: avenues to achieve the other one just one last final comment here for me some of that work has

[1:22:19] Trustee Middleton: been done and on the east point uh water conservation uh bylaw work it defines volume

[1:22:27] Trustee Middleton: and quantity and catchment area for um rainwater

[1:22:31] Voice 6: so it's good excellent and so just backing up to

[1:22:35] Voice 6: uh the the wells exist on the lot uh staff would still recommend that uh you direct them to

[1:22:46] Voice 6: demonstrate proof of water through a hydrogeologist doing a pump test of those wells to verify that

[1:22:52] Voice 6: there is sufficient volume to demonstrate proof of water unless you have pump test results from

[1:22:58] Voice 6: a hydrogeologist that are relatively recent no

[1:23:01] Voice 2: um traditionally um we didn't have to deal with

[1:23:05] Voice 2: hydrogeologists um they're very expensive at the time to get them here about a thousand dollars um

[1:23:12] Voice 2: The well logs that were produced by well builders,

[1:23:16] Voice 2: reputable well builders over many, many years

[1:23:19] Voice 2: are accepted as being valid.

[1:23:24] Voice 2: The testing for probability was a secondary matter,

[1:23:28] Voice 2: but the volumes on those wells

[1:23:33] Voice 2: that I have the well logs somewhere to justify or verify

[1:23:39] Voice 2: was done by the welder and what they do is they make a little pond and put a pipe in it

[1:23:45] Voice 2: and blow compressed air down until they dry up the well of the surface run-in water and the flow

[1:23:55] Voice 2: that remains with air pressure being blown down is the volume permitted on that uncanned reactor

[1:24:03] Voice 2: after traditionally and so that's the volume of number is from that testing the probability is

[1:24:15] Voice 2: from the last season that was done so

[1:24:19] Trustee Maude: it certainly the pump test needs to have proper consideration

[1:24:24] Trustee Maude: because i know several instances i mean where pump tests were required and beautiful wells

[1:24:30] Trustee Maude: were destroyed because what happened is they pumped up they drew a draw into a sea water

[1:24:35] Trustee Maude: so it's it's it's something that needs to be weighted but anyhow i

[1:24:39] Trustee Maude: think we should move forward

[1:24:42] Trustee Maude: because we're going to spend a lot of time on this we have a couple recommendations before

[1:24:45] Trustee Maude: so

[1:24:46] Voice 6: one of the main concerns of staff with those wells would be salt water intrusion

[1:24:52] Voice 6: given that they're located so close to the water the province will require

[1:24:56] Voice 6: require a hydrogeologist report to prove water.

[1:25:00] Voice 6: So even if you don't see proof of water

[1:25:03] Voice 6: at time of subdivision,

[1:25:04] Voice 6: which staff highly recommend you do,

[1:25:07] Voice 6: at time of subdivision,

[1:25:08] Voice 6: the province will not rely on well logs.

[1:25:11] Voice 6: They will require a minimum 12 hour standard pump test

[1:25:16] Voice 6: being completed by a hydrogeologist

[1:25:19] Voice 6: and the report submitted that demonstrates proof of water

[1:25:21] Voice 6: that is standard.

[1:25:23] Voice 6: And so, at some point, Mr. Gaines is going to have to do that work.

[1:25:28] Voice 6: My recommendation is that you do it now, because if you rezone those properties to allow for density, and in the future there's not a lot of water for those densities, then the rezoning becomes sort of moot.

[1:25:44] Voice 2: It does fall out at this time.

[1:25:58] Trustee Maude: So with

[1:25:59] Voice 4: respect to the proof of water, the wells exist.

[1:26:05] Voice 4: So in the future, there has to be, according to provincial standards, a test.

[1:26:11] Voice 4: However, there's also still the option to do rainwater collection.

[1:26:16] Voice 4: And I would add that I did examine the provincial report on the risk of saltwater intrusion, and it's quite low in that area.

[1:26:25] Voice 4: There are areas, obviously, where the geomorphology, there could be, you know, flooding, there could be high well density with over pumping.

[1:26:38] Voice 4: But in that particular circumstance, the risk of saltwater intrusion is very low, especially with that high bank behind.

[1:26:47] Voice 4: so um i did look at it carefully over the last couple of days and um i'm not saying it will

[1:26:53] Voice 4: never ever ever happen but it is relatively quite low in that particular um shoreline area thank you

[1:27:02] Voice 4: thank

[1:27:03] Trustee Maude: you all right so we have a couple of recommendations before us you want to proceed

[1:27:08] Trustee Maude: with those we have more questions um

[1:27:11] Trustee Middleton: i'm i'm prepared to uh proceed and um i know it's always

[1:27:15] Trustee Middleton: helpful in public that people have expressed this what is the rationale for the thinking

[1:27:20] Trustee Middleton: that has resulted in the recommendation and uh trustee bono may also pre you know be interested

[1:27:26] Trustee Middleton: in uh providing the rationale and i think just out of respect for staff when we differ perhaps

[1:27:33] Trustee Middleton: from their conclusions we explain why and it's just a sort of a more respectful way to go and so

[1:27:40] Trustee Middleton: So if you're willing, Chair, I would make the recommendation, but then bail out to give

[1:27:45] Trustee Middleton: a rationale as to why I've come to that conclusion.

[1:27:47] Trustee Middleton: Yeah.

[1:27:48] Trustee Middleton: Okay.

[1:27:48] Trustee Middleton: And after hearing everything that I've heard.

[1:27:51] Trustee Middleton: So I would, first of all, make the recommendation that the Staten Island Local Trust Committee

[1:27:56] Trustee Middleton: direct staff to proceed with application GLRZ 2023.1 bracket gains and to prepare draft

[1:28:03] Trustee Middleton: bylaws.

[1:28:04] Trustee Middleton: Okay.

[1:28:05] Trustee Maude: Should we

[1:28:05] Trustee Maude: get that on the table?

[1:28:07] Trustee Maude: Should

[1:28:07] Trustee Middleton: we get that on the table, Pat?

[1:28:08] Trustee Maude: i assume has that because it's in the minutes or in the agenda package so pat you're on board

[1:28:15] Voice 1: yes i've got that in my package thank

[1:28:17] Trustee Maude: you very much so seconder trustee baldwin second okay

[1:28:23] Trustee Maude: yeah

[1:28:23] Trustee Middleton: and so in terms of some of the excellent points and very well raised in the east africa

[1:28:30] Trustee Middleton: and i understand of course when the context is the current zoning i absolutely agree

[1:28:35] Trustee Middleton: with the conclusions Pana Smith has drawn.

[1:28:40] Trustee Middleton: Looking, and I think our applicant, of course,

[1:28:43] Trustee Middleton: because he has history and he represents it well,

[1:28:45] Trustee Middleton: has given us a good historical context.

[1:28:47] Trustee Middleton: And I know that in other considerations in my time as a trustee,

[1:28:51] Trustee Middleton: there's been issues with the rural residential

[1:28:53] Trustee Middleton: and the rural general divide.

[1:28:56] Trustee Middleton: So clearly there's a bit of a problematic history

[1:28:58] Trustee Middleton: in how this came to pass.

[1:29:01] Trustee Middleton: And I could therefore, I take the applicant's point

[1:29:04] Trustee Middleton: that this was a consequence that was unintended and unknown to him when he had a long-range view of development.

[1:29:14] Trustee Middleton: And I do believe that the older families on the island shared that view because it was explained to me by previous long-time trustees

[1:29:25] Trustee Middleton: needs that the official community plan went to a great deal of length to lay out an opportunity for

[1:29:35] Trustee Middleton: people who were perhaps most vested in terms of what the zoning would do to their land holdings

[1:29:40] Trustee Middleton: and how they might act on zoning or therefore influence or get behind what the zoning might

[1:29:46] Trustee Middleton: be and that would be the crooks family the gains family the money family and perhaps to a degree

[1:29:51] Trustee Middleton: Mr. Hall, and the agreement of the zoning and the density caps was sort of a trade-off

[1:29:57] Trustee Middleton: to allow a longer-term process.

[1:30:00] Trustee Middleton: process of development to keep a smaller scale yet more viable house building industry and I

[1:30:06] Trustee Middleton: think that's true is it documented anywhere is it the bylaw no it isn't but I do think it rings

[1:30:11] Trustee Middleton: true and I think this development is an output of that strategy and so it you know so given the

[1:30:18] Trustee Middleton: context I therefore don't believe it's appropriate to try to uh achieve an additional density into

[1:30:25] Trustee Middleton: into the community amenity density reserve.

[1:30:28] Trustee Middleton: Were this a fresh slate development without that context,

[1:30:32] Trustee Middleton: I wouldn't support entirely the planners recommendation,

[1:30:36] Trustee Middleton: but given the historical context,

[1:30:38] Trustee Middleton: I don't believe that that is appropriate.

[1:30:41] Trustee Middleton: And so that's why I move this, I make this motion

[1:30:46] Trustee Middleton: and we can get to point two in a second

[1:30:49] Trustee Middleton: after perhaps we hear from yourself, sir

[1:30:52] Trustee Middleton: and Trustee Mullin.

[1:30:58] Voice 4: I don't have anything additional to add to that.

[1:31:00] Voice 4: I am on board with that description of the context.

[1:31:05] Voice 4: Thank you.

[1:31:07] Trustee Maude: So, call the question.

[1:31:09] Trustee Maude: Okay, all in favour?

[1:31:11] Trustee Maude: And that carries.

[1:31:13] Trustee Middleton: So, as far as point two, I am now inclined,

[1:31:17] Trustee Middleton: and I'm happy to explain this without putting it on the,

[1:31:20] Trustee Middleton: I don't necessarily want to vote it down on the chair.

[1:31:23] Trustee Middleton: It's your prerogative.

[1:31:24] Trustee Middleton: if you may say that recommendation number two should be should be uh put on the floor in order

[1:31:29] Trustee Middleton: to be uh not dealt with but perhaps before we do that i could just say that because i think this

[1:31:35] Trustee Middleton: knowledge of the wells is you know i i've forgotten it and thank you to the acronym for

[1:31:42] Trustee Middleton: elaborating it sort of makes this point move for us to do this initial screening when we know

[1:31:50] Trustee Middleton: because we don't have the local standard,

[1:31:53] Trustee Middleton: the ministry is gonna have to do this anyway.

[1:31:56] Trustee Middleton: And so for us to, and this perhaps gives us a chance

[1:32:00] Trustee Middleton: to maybe get ourselves our skates on

[1:32:02] Trustee Middleton: and perhaps create quality and quantity standards

[1:32:06] Trustee Middleton: prior to the subdividing officer being involved

[1:32:09] Trustee Middleton: and that actually might give rainwater collection

[1:32:11] Trustee Middleton: a chance to be the mode of provision of potable water.

[1:32:16] Trustee Middleton: And then secondly, as far as the archeological evidence,

[1:32:19] Trustee Middleton: I think I had asked of that on my site visit

[1:32:22] Trustee Middleton: and what I saw concur, I'm no archaeologist,

[1:32:24] Trustee Middleton: but what I saw concurred with the applicant.

[1:32:26] Trustee Middleton: And I also know that we're gonna have a revision

[1:32:29] Trustee Middleton: to First Nations and the archeological branch

[1:32:32] Trustee Middleton: is involved in, you know, the subject approving officer

[1:32:36] Trustee Middleton: that does the appropriate investigation at that point.

[1:32:39] Trustee Middleton: So I would say, well, the point is well taken.

[1:32:42] Trustee Middleton: I think the knowledge that the applicant has of the land,

[1:32:45] Trustee Middleton: again, provides context.

[1:32:47] Trustee Middleton: context and so I would be inclined to just support the recommendation at point one and not require

[1:32:54] Trustee Middleton: any of the elements of lot number two yes sorry number two uh recommendation number two because

[1:33:01] Trustee Maude: that's what they're the recommendation so you can you can move one not the other okay so trustee

[1:33:06] Trustee Maude: bone do you have any thoughts on recommendation number two um

[1:33:12] Voice 4: I I see it from the same point of

[1:33:14] Voice 4: view by the way brad thanks for forwarding that terms of reference and i have taken a look at it

[1:33:20] Voice 4: um you know perhaps we do need um to look at the standards from other islands and consider

[1:33:28] Voice 4: how we might do that but i think it would be better to do that as a kind of a long-term

[1:33:34] Voice 4: consideration and not just um kind of stick it onto the back of this right now so i would rather

[1:33:42] Voice 4: go with a very clean simple approval and allow the other um forces and activities to take place

[1:33:51] Voice 4: subsequently by the way it was a great press uh great preparation of information and um and thank

[1:33:59] Voice 4: you for answering my follow-up questions so thoroughly but yeah i would go with option one

[1:34:05] Voice 4: one and just leave option two on the table thank you okay

[1:34:09] Trustee Maude: so are any other motions related to this

[1:34:13] Trustee Maude: I

[1:34:13] Voice 8: just

[1:34:16] Voice 6: want to point out to the LTC that in the staff report it does speak to your requirement

[1:34:21] Voice 6: to consider the stress policy statement 4.4.2 as well as your OCP policies around ensuring

[1:34:29] Voice 6: ensuring uh use and development does not impact water quality or create contamination and so I

[1:34:38] Voice 6: just want the LTC to be aware that if you decide to not require any further water or septic uh

[1:34:46] Voice 6: testing that you will need to at some point turn your mind to whether if you met you have met those

[1:34:51] Voice 6: uh that policy statement and ocp uh provision and

[1:34:56] Trustee Middleton: i would just simply add that in my time

[1:34:59] Trustee Middleton: several such subdivisions have approved without such requirements and so presumably if they

[1:35:04] Trustee Middleton: if they uh pass the the the lens of the policy statement which we know has not changed in

[1:35:10] Trustee Middleton: 25 years i i don't see this one being a particular risk of offending the um the the policy statement

[1:35:18] Trustee Middleton: and checklist for myself i'm willing to bear that risk and not have the applicant go down a tunnel

[1:35:24] Trustee Middleton: of uh trouble shall we say of you know not having this the necessary um uh tests or proofs i mean

[1:35:34] Trustee Middleton: i guess we're just talking really long which is the water which are just the mere fact that wells

[1:35:38] Trustee Middleton: are already drilled to me is uh is the test that has been applied since my time as a trustee to any

[1:35:46] Trustee Middleton: any other development and so given the historical nature of this development as in the stage

[1:35:53] Trustee Middleton: as the replicant pointed out which is why the wells were took originally I think that

[1:35:59] Trustee Middleton: this use is consistent with that approach and then I know that from what I've heard

[1:36:06] Trustee Middleton: trustee poland say that she's had obviously a very very detailed look into perhaps the

[1:36:14] Trustee Middleton: risk as we pointed out with the contamination actually could speak to that chair if you're

[1:36:20] Trustee Middleton: people who can entertain her yeah just involved yeah

[1:36:27] Voice 4: i actually uh went to the provincial document

[1:36:30] Voice 4: uh which this you know it's a very detailed document created in the last couple of years

[1:36:36] Voice 4: I can't remember the date, possibly 2019, and it uses an estimate of the pumping threat,

[1:36:47] Voice 4: which would be high density areas with wells.

[1:36:51] Voice 4: It states things like even allowing for that there are wells, et cetera, that on the Gulf

[1:36:59] Voice 4: Islands, if it's for domestic use, then generally it doesn't incur a high threat.

[1:37:05] Voice 4: It talks about the aquifer situation.

[1:37:12] Voice 4: It combines the pumping threat and the aquifer, I think it's called vulnerability, as two aspects.

[1:37:19] Voice 4: And in the bedrock here, it also states that if there's a high slope, the slope behind will give you a good head of water.

[1:37:30] Voice 4: And therefore, the risk of saltwater intrusion in land that slopes deeply up is really confined to, you know, the shore.

[1:37:42] Voice 4: So if you don't drill your well kind of in the 25 feet close to the shore, which is usually not done, then it's fairly low.

[1:37:51] Voice 4: so if you look at the maps where it combines all of these various risks that particular stretch

[1:37:57] Voice 4: and those two lots are not marked as vulnerable they're marked as very low risk of saline

[1:38:05] Voice 4: intrusion and i don't think there are many wells in that area and the lot sizes wouldn't give you

[1:38:14] Voice 4: high well density i believe thank you thank you i can provide

[1:38:20] Voice 4: that reference if anybody wants it

[1:38:22] Voice 4: it's the one i think that the there is a map in the islands trust document library

[1:38:28] Voice 4: and i have to say there's no attribution on the map but i'm assuming it came as a

[1:38:33] Voice 4: result of that report and i do have the reference for the report as well thank you

[1:38:40] Trustee Middleton: Just a last brief comment on the chair and have that I just have a little respect for

[1:38:45] Trustee Middleton: climate's work and of course seeking the best advice that's available of the trust and I think

[1:38:49] Trustee Middleton: of course it's entirely appropriate that you do so and I am just basically offsetting the risk

[1:38:57] Trustee Middleton: that he has pointed out with the historical context I mean I don't deny that there might

[1:39:02] Trustee Middleton: not be or that there might be a risk but I think that that sort of that shall we say almost a

[1:39:08] Trustee Middleton: community benefit of going along with the slow development process that you know started in the

[1:39:12] Trustee Middleton: 70s i think of office is is sufficient rationale to offset the risk that he has identified so

[1:39:18] Trustee Middleton: certain respective conclusions but that just want to point out why why i'm differing um in in terms

[1:39:25] Trustee Middleton: of my uh approach here okay thank you all right so if that's that with

[1:39:33] Trustee Maude: that file we can move forward

[1:39:34] Trustee Maude: to uh reports so we have work program reports so we have a local trust committee work program

[1:39:42] Trustee Maude: report the staff report is attached

[1:39:44] Voice 8: right so

[1:39:50] Trustee Maude: is there anything that anybody

[1:39:54] Trustee Maude: um wants to advance or defense or did

[1:39:59] Voice 7: did that need a motion to pass it

[1:40:02] Trustee Maude: did we did we did the

[1:40:02] Trustee Maude: motion before

[1:40:03] Voice 7: you get it

[1:40:03] Trustee Maude: you're passionate oh your train is going down the track

[1:40:07] Voice 7: too fast

[1:40:11] Trustee Middleton: is i might say just based on that i wouldn't put it as a the current priority but

[1:40:18] Trustee Middleton: i do think based on the results of this you know the the application that we've just um

[1:40:26] Trustee Middleton: had before is to at some point look at the split zoning issue between maybe between all

[1:40:32] Trustee Middleton: zones on on the island and implications it might be that if there's enough development done that

[1:40:38] Trustee Middleton: the implications that arise from split zoning are you know the effort would not be worth it um

[1:40:43] Trustee Middleton: but maybe if i could just put there on a future project to review uh split zoning requirements

[1:40:53] Trustee Middleton: i'm not saying we do anything right now i'm just saying flag it for you know if

[1:40:57] Trustee Middleton: if that it might be uh of use but it's a crazy way to not

[1:41:03] Trustee Middleton: forget that there might be something

[1:41:04] Trustee Middleton: to be done with that here

[1:41:05] Trustee Maude: so do you need a motion to fight or to fight against this fighting it

[1:41:10] Trustee Maude: flagging

[1:41:11] Voice 8: what sorry just

[1:41:13] Trustee Middleton: to we would what basically i'm saying is we add to the

[1:41:18] Trustee Middleton: future projects list uh we don't necessarily bring them to action yet but we have to the

[1:41:25] Trustee Middleton: future projects list review split zoning requirements of the ocp or you know

[1:41:32] Trustee Middleton: okay

[1:41:33] Voice 6: so

[1:41:37] Trustee Middleton: i i move that we add a review of split zoning requirements instead of turning on these

[1:41:43] bylaws to the future projects list and

[1:41:49] Voice 12: you've got that pat do

[1:41:54] Voice 5: you repeat that

[1:41:55] Voice 1: one more time please

[1:41:55] Voice 1: certainly

[1:41:58] Trustee Middleton: that we add move that we add review split zoning requirements in the saturnal land

[1:42:05] Trustee Middleton: use bylaw to the future projects list

[1:42:09] Voice 12: okay

[1:42:19] Voice 1: uh to add review of saturn bylaw

[1:42:24] Voice 1: for split zoning to futures project list sure

[1:42:27] Trustee Middleton: that that captures

[1:42:28] Trustee Maude: it yeah okay uh seconder trustee

[1:42:32] Trustee Maude: all. Second, do you have a comment?

[1:42:38] Voice 4: Nope, that's fine. I found the same. When this whole topic

[1:42:43] Voice 4: came up, I read it. It was like a sort of a primer in trying to understand land use bylaws. So

[1:42:51] Voice 4: I had a good sort of use case to get me started. And thanks, Brad. You were very helpful in that

[1:42:57] Voice 4: respect thank you any

[1:43:01] Trustee Middleton: further discussion no and we may choose to do nothing just if we have a

[1:43:05] Trustee Middleton: further look and decide if this flight is on the way okay so

[1:43:11] Trustee Maude: call the question on favor

[1:43:14] Trustee Maude: okay that carries and while i'm on this can i

[1:43:19] Voice 6: report that action is complete

[1:43:29] Trustee Middleton: on that side. I guess I can't

[1:43:31] Trustee Middleton: speak against Disney.

[1:43:33] Trustee Middleton: You're welcome. It's my pleasure.

[1:43:36] Trustee Middleton: Okay, so this is maybe for your guidance, Chair, if you could issue some guidance here, because I

[1:43:41] Trustee Middleton: don't honestly know where this perhaps should go. You will

[1:43:45] Trustee Middleton: see from the business item later where I talk about the

[1:43:49] Trustee Middleton: bylaw enforcement processes and procedures that I've effectively

[1:43:53] Trustee Middleton: laid down an idea that I would like

[1:43:57] Trustee Middleton: to perhaps see as a project which is that we review with an eye to modernizing to best practice

[1:44:04] Trustee Middleton: the subjournal island bylaw compliance procedures um and i in the piece i've set out just some you

[1:44:15] Trustee Middleton: know ideas around complying with the npc on this person's best practices report which was

[1:44:19] Trustee Middleton: released last year and then when i looked i realized that our bylaw which underscores

[1:44:24] Trustee Middleton: enforcement is actually 30 years old now a lot's changed email has happened the internet has

[1:44:29] Trustee Middleton: happened you know there are a lot of things that could be done potentially differently i would

[1:44:34] Trustee Middleton: suggest i think our plan would probably say that if that's going to be work that that should be uh

[1:44:39] Trustee Middleton: on the you know the work plan or the future projects list for you know accessing moving

[1:44:46] Trustee Middleton: forward to the projects list to you know get staff time but i i take whatever you want to deal with

[1:44:52] Trustee Middleton: this i'll take your lead so

[1:44:58] Voice 12: it's quite a horse type issue is trustable and you knew that

[1:45:07] Trustee Maude: no

[1:45:08] Voice 4: i am we were looking at those together and uh indeed the conflict i i actually started to

[1:45:15] Voice 4: look across all of the islands to um see you know what was what was in each island with respect to

[1:45:24] Voice 4: that and and that's how we kind of came across this discrepancy so i've i support um you know

[1:45:33] Voice 4: eradicating the discrepancy uh and looking ahead to doing something more substantial

[1:45:53] Trustee Middleton: Am I

[1:45:54] Voice 4: off-topic? I couldn't hear you.

[1:45:58] Trustee Maude: We're just picking on you.

[1:45:59] Voice 4: Okay, okay. Well, it's not fair to pick on me because I can't hear everything perfectly.

[1:46:11] Trustee Maude: So you're just wondering what it

[1:46:15] Trustee Middleton: may be this best that we do the work and then I'm sure

[1:46:21] Trustee Middleton: we can make a motion to add it to a project so exactly

[1:46:23] Trustee Maude: yeah okay yeah so this is this

[1:46:25] Trustee Maude: is basically current gotcha the future is coming in about five minutes okay so anything

[1:46:33] Trustee Maude: anything else underneath any of these local trust committee work program active projects or future

[1:46:38] Trustee Maude: projects um

[1:46:40] Voice 4: but the one that uh and I don't think we can um do anything for the moment but I know

[1:46:48] Voice 4: that there's um to be a kind of a well there was a staff report on a for affordable housing

[1:46:54] Voice 4: initiative. And I believe they're to come back with some other potential ways forward in the

[1:47:04] Voice 4: next month or two. And that's the one that I think that Saturna in particular should consider

[1:47:11] Voice 4: jumping on board. But I don't think we have enough information to do that right now.

[1:47:16] Voice 4: How do you feel about that, Lee or David? I'm just

[1:47:23] Voice 12: trying to find it in the

[1:47:26] Voice 12: the interest

[1:47:29] Voice 4: there's not there's not a lot we know but it is kind of bubbling along

[1:47:34] Voice 4: behind the scenes and i think it's one that we should do so so what do

[1:47:38] Trustee Maude: you think is behind the

[1:47:39] Trustee Maude: scenes it's not on our list right now i

[1:47:42] Voice 4: thought it was on the list it was it not one of the

[1:47:44] Voice 4: suggestions from brad it's

[1:47:47] Voice 6: 35 of robert's report of our page in this report under strategic

[1:47:53] Voice 6: strategic initiatives okay what

[1:47:55] Voice 6: are you referring to

[1:47:56] Voice 4: possibly yeah

[1:47:59] Voice 12: 35 so

[1:48:04] Voice 4: strategic

[1:48:05] Voice 12: initiatives so

[1:48:06] Voice 12: page

[1:48:11] Voice 4: 34 35

[1:48:14] Voice 12: yeah yeah

[1:48:17] Voice 4: yeah i see it yeah yeah so i don't think i was just maybe for future we

[1:48:26] Voice 4: put a consideration of that on a follow-up list or something it's the only one that springs out

[1:48:33] Voice 4: to me that we should keep an eye on but we don't have to commit to it right now i

[1:48:39] Trustee Maude: think probably

[1:48:40] Trustee Maude: between now and the next meeting they're rich but they're they're thinking caps on and go okay

[1:48:47] Trustee Maude: this is where we should go yes

[1:48:50] Trustee Middleton: in my general sense i know when we have finite resources in our

[1:48:55] Trustee Middleton: planner and i've sort of been informally just to again share in the public venue my um approach is

[1:49:05] Trustee Middleton: the uh the land trust and nature trust applications have been quite intensive in terms

[1:49:10] Trustee Middleton: of the amount of work it requires as a planner and so i've sort of been thinking that while they're

[1:49:14] Trustee Middleton: at priority which can't keep the work did not embark on a work program that will take a lot

[1:49:22] Trustee Middleton: of our partners time and actually keep keeping sort of a little more available just to you know

[1:49:27] Trustee Middleton: dive into these uh nature trust um complex bylaw the situation so that that's uh um you know i but

[1:49:37] Trustee Middleton: i take your point that we should think about this and we can come back at the next meeting

[1:49:41] Trustee Middleton: any reviews fair enough orientation shall

[1:49:46] Voice 12: we say all right so we can move on to the applications

[1:49:49] Voice 12: And that's just for our information.

[1:49:56] Voice 12: Any questions at all?

[1:50:03] Voice 12: We have a trustee and local expense report.

[1:50:08] Voice 12: Any questions on that?

[1:50:13] Trustee Maude: So now we're on to adopt policies and standing resolutions.

[1:50:17] Trustee Maude: Are we clear on those?

[1:50:22] Trustee Maude: Local Trust Committee web page.

[1:50:27] Trustee Maude: Anything to be added or subtracted?

[1:50:30] um no i can report that at the request of staff i did a short

[1:50:36] Trustee Middleton: biography of myself

[1:50:41] Voice 12: all right yes trustee bowling anything no

[1:50:46] Trustee Maude: no okay um i was just concerned report is attached there

[1:50:52] Trustee Maude: for our information um then we move on to new business so we have a letter from the

[1:51:01] Trustee Maude: static community council staff regarding draft 2021 islands trust policy statement amendments

[1:51:09] Trustee Maude: again i believe just for our information it's extensive and it's very well written

[1:51:18] Trustee Maude: um oh and then it's me um this is basically an email from the main island local trust committee

[1:51:28] Trustee Maude: um with regard to setting and use terms um so there's perhaps interest from the crd um

[1:51:39] Trustee Maude: to exploring getting out of the building permit business which would be put us into the sighting

[1:51:45] Trustee Maude: and use permits business um those are used up on them and hornby um i just i was up on denver

[1:51:53] Trustee Maude: when actually a couple of weeks ago and i had quite an interesting conversation with the

[1:52:00] Trustee Maude: contractor he's one of the big contractors and and he said if he had to go to the conventional

[1:52:07] Trustee Maude: building permit process on the call balance we just retired he said the setting and use

[1:52:14] Trustee Maude: permits work really really well i asked him about mortgages insurance all that he says

[1:52:19] Trustee Maude: know how to make sure we're talking oh

[1:52:21] Voice 12: that's interesting

[1:52:22] Trustee Maude: and i don't know if our regional

[1:52:24] Trustee Maude: director has anything he wants to say

[1:52:27] Voice 9: i know we're we're looking at it at the crd although

[1:52:31] Voice 9: you know there's an element of the crd that are are looking at it it's not the building

[1:52:36] Voice 9: inspection department for obvious reasons um but what i would like to do is i would like to hear

[1:52:42] Voice 9: hear from John Gaines, who's spoken about this many years ago.

[1:52:48] Voice 9: And I'm just wondering if you've changed your thoughts

[1:52:51] Voice 9: on siting and use versus building inspection, Chris's.

[1:52:56] Voice 2: Well, it would be very nice from the contractor's point of view

[1:52:59] Voice 2: if the process was streamlined somehow or other,

[1:53:05] Voice 2: seeing the different agencies that we have to deal with.

[1:53:10] Voice 2: because I don't know how viable or doable that is,

[1:53:13] Voice 2: but I know now, and thankfully my son has to deal

[1:53:17] Voice 2: with this problem and I don't,

[1:53:20] Voice 2: is that it can take six to eight weeks

[1:53:23] Voice 2: to get the Island's Trust to view the application

[1:53:27] Voice 2: and a further eight to 10 weeks

[1:53:30] Voice 2: for the building department to issue a building permit.

[1:53:34] Voice 2: it and when you're doing maybe two to three houses a year maximum which those contractors do in the

[1:53:42] Voice 2: islands i had 40 odd years and did 82 houses so that kind of averaged out the process of keeping

[1:53:54] Voice 2: staff and crews in place and employed becomes very very difficult the system needs to be fixed

[1:54:01] Voice 2: somehow because it is broke um and i hope that everybody that's involved at your level

[1:54:10] Voice 2: can think about it and deal with it and try and make it better because it's it's not

[1:54:20] Voice 6: just it doesn't take a little bit lower the audience trust eight to ten weeks to rebuild

[1:54:25] Voice 6: premise to 10 business days

[1:54:27] Voice 6: max probably unless there's some kind of issue or problem that you

[1:54:30] Voice 6: need to deal with respect to variants or development grants or something like that

[1:54:35] Voice 6: uh if it's a clean compliant application it looks like more than no more than two or three weeks

[1:54:49] Voice 6: yeah i would say that's pretty standard very seldom would it extend for other than two or

[1:54:56] Voice 6: three weeks to at least do that initial review from it itself i think yeah yeah

[1:55:02] Trustee Maude: well i think

[1:55:03] Trustee Maude: but it's a two-step process but this is young man who's destined it goes on now so our step

[1:55:11] Trustee Maude: doesn't take 10. that's for sure

[1:55:13] Voice 9: i'm taking this picture okay and we're going to get its address

[1:55:20] Voice 9: I have

[1:55:21] Voice 4: a question yeah maybe Brad are you familiar with the software implementation

[1:55:30] Voice 4: city view that's going on and how will that will that improve things will it allow people

[1:55:38] Voice 4: better information what exactly will it achieve and will you will that view integrate with the

[1:55:45] Voice 4: crd process i'm

[1:55:47] Voice 6: not sure what what are you referring to the city view yeah

[1:55:50] Voice 4: the implementation

[1:55:51] Voice 4: of the planning software that's uh grant funded and being executed within the islands trust

[1:56:01] Voice 6: to be honest i'm so out of the loop with the regionalist level stuff going on being on the

[1:56:06] Voice 4: ground here i

[1:56:07] Voice 6: i uh aware of that

[1:56:10] Voice 6: um sorry

[1:56:12] Voice 4: i'm sorry for putting you on the spot then

[1:56:14] Voice 4: No worries. It's okay.

[1:56:15] Voice 6: I don't claim to know everything. My wife might argue otherwise. I would say, though, that the process moves as quickly, I think, as we have manpower to move it. There's no real technical impediment to slowing us down. It's just a matter of volume and dealing with the volume of the permits as they come in.

[1:56:40] Voice 6: And, of course, training new staff and other things can take a bit of extra time, but certainly not in the magnitude of months to get that review back.

[1:56:55] Voice 6: And there's no cost to that process as well.

[1:57:00] Trustee Middleton: Thank you.

[1:57:01] Trustee Middleton: And I think under a siting and use regime, the trust would still fulfill that role because that's what the trust is doing, looking at zoning and the actual siting of the construction itself.

[1:57:12] Trustee Middleton: But I really like that safety and I was quite impressed by the two of you. I have to say that it came up on the table so soon into this term, because from my view, it offers, aside from sort of streamlined procedural approach, it allows that building practices maybe get to a more kind of green or passive house standard more quickly than the building code would allow them to, because of course the building code is a big beast.

[1:57:42] Trustee Middleton: hard to move and it applies across a has to in a sense applied across the country and

[1:57:47] Trustee Middleton: regional variations so i think this is an excellent initiative entirely suited to the

[1:57:52] Trustee Middleton: the creativity and the skills of the of the construction industry and the gulf islands

[1:57:57] Trustee Middleton: and the people who want to build here and i strongly support this so if we can

[1:58:03] Trustee Middleton: write as an ltc a very very positive letter in support of this i i would be very pleased

[1:58:11] Trustee Maude: um yeah that's i think that's what director brent is sort of looking towards is the feedback from

[1:58:19] Trustee Maude: the individuality of ccs as to where we feel we would be at i know from now on trust perception

[1:58:27] Trustee Maude: also too is we actually would actually be getting a fee so instead of doing these reviews now at no

[1:58:32] Trustee Maude: charge to the crd because the evil crd doesn't pay for that service um is that we actually we would

[1:58:40] Trustee Maude: have a paper setting so we actually would get some revenue coming in

[1:58:44] Trustee Middleton: for our staff yeah i mean risks

[1:58:47] Trustee Middleton: okay the risks are buildings are built to a code that is uh or a bill below a code that and

[1:58:54] Trustee Middleton: therefore impacts safety or fire safety or you know longevity or but we see this use on several

[1:59:02] Trustee Middleton: like hornby denman i know the speedy and i'm sure you can point to examples of more practice there

[1:59:09] Trustee Middleton: but in general it seems that the housing stock has remained viable, property values have increased at the same rate as on the other islands.

[1:59:18] Trustee Middleton: And so I definitely think, and I'm not saying we have all the answers here, but I'm just saying this is something that I would hope our LTC can strongly support,

[1:59:26] Trustee Middleton: and offer whatever assistance to our regional director, we may be able to, to bring this into the light of day.

[1:59:34] Trustee Maude: And to be clear, too, is when you get a signing, you still have to build as per code, to the

[1:59:40] Trustee Maude: building code, so there's not any exceptions or any skating around, but your level of creativity

[1:59:45] Trustee Maude: is broader, because you don't have a building inspector looking over your shoulder saying,

[1:59:51] Trustee Maude: well, you really can't do that.

[1:59:54] Trustee Maude: You can get a little bit trusty balling.

[1:59:57] Voice 4: Yeah, just a thought, and this is my financial...

[2:00:00] Voice 4: planning hat on so and maybe uh paul can speak to this are there other regional districts with

[2:00:06] Voice 4: an appetite to do the same because the real saving to the islands trust or the impact would be

[2:00:12] Voice 4: uh like if there was a broader application of this it might really uh help but um and i can

[2:00:21] Voice 4: see indeed that there would be it says the next step would be a full public process and um yeah

[2:00:29] Voice 4: Yeah, on the face of it, I support it,

[2:00:31] Voice 4: but I would want to know an awful lot more

[2:00:34] Voice 4: about what the sort of ups and downs were

[2:00:37] Voice 4: and what the consequences were.

[2:00:38] Voice 4: But I am interested to know if other regional districts

[2:00:41] Voice 4: might embark on the same journey.

[2:00:46] Voice 9: I can't speak for the regional districts.

[2:00:49] Voice 9: What is the regional district that is,

[2:00:51] Voice 9: it's a very progressive one that's up by then.

[2:00:56] Voice 9: And one of the co-ops with the city.

[2:00:59] Voice 9: is it not

[2:01:00] Voice 4: strathcona strathcona

[2:01:05] Voice 9: i'm pretty sure anyway they've done some very good stuff with respect to economic development

[2:01:12] Voice 9: up there that's a capital regional district look at the i'm going to call it the skunk

[2:01:18] Voice 9: works that's looking at citing and use is also thinking that there could be a called building

[2:01:24] Voice 9: building code light where it's citing and use but there is just a maybe just two inspections one

[2:01:31] Voice 9: framing and then one file one or near file because it seems to me based on the files that I've been

[2:01:39] Voice 9: getting more and more involved with since I never know I was going to be that involved as the

[2:01:44] Voice 9: regional director of building permits but it seems that every time we turn around when you say we get

[2:01:51] Voice 9: it engineered so engineers hold that tend to hold the liability so it would seem fairly reasonable

[2:01:57] Voice 9: right now if we're already asking uh that everything be engineered right that we'd go

[2:02:05] Voice 9: citing abuse and engineers could hold liability for everything else and we could do also building

[2:02:11] Voice 9: inspection light on a transitional basis so good thoughts so

[2:02:20] Trustee Middleton: chair how would you like to proceed in

[2:02:24] Trustee Middleton: getting a letter together or support for a letter well it would be

[2:02:29] Trustee Maude: a motion um

[2:02:31] Trustee Maude: that either you as trustees can elect to to draft something yourselves or you can start the chair

[2:02:37] Trustee Maude: to write a letter to himself although it would be that he would ask you back to you know ltc um

[2:02:46] Trustee Maude: just endorsing the idea did

[2:02:48] Voice 5: marie just say that there was going to be a public um

[2:02:54] Voice 5: informational yeah

[2:02:55] Trustee Maude: well this is baby steps the question is right now do you support the idea

[2:03:02] Trustee Maude: and then if all all local trust committees come back and say they support the idea

[2:03:06] Trustee Maude: idea, then it becomes a bigger, big public public

[2:03:10] Trustee Maude: consultation process. So this

[2:03:12] Voice 12: is the baby step. This is the

[2:03:14] Trustee Maude: way to the door.

[2:03:16] Voice 6: There would be a lot of community consultation needed

[2:03:20] Voice 6: with the CRD with respect to removing that service as well,

[2:03:23] Voice 6: right?

[2:03:23] Voice 6: Which

[2:03:24] Voice 9: is why I spoke about building inspection light. So

[2:03:28] Voice 9: they certainly know that. I mean, it's been a discussion

[2:03:31] Voice 9: even before uh this most recent initiative came up with the illness trust i've been talking about it

[2:03:39] Voice 9: at the crd and yeah so this has been in discussion at the crd it's live i understand now it's being

[2:03:49] Voice 9: talked about amongst the local trust committees in the southern gulf island which is a good thing so

[2:03:54] Voice 9: So this is about exploring an option to a system that is, I would say, has been failing

[2:04:01] Voice 9: us in the last two to three years, if not longer.

[2:04:06] Voice 9: So

[2:04:07] Voice 5: just my confusion is, did I understand that Denman Hornby and Mesquitee already have

[2:04:12] Voice 5: this in place?

[2:04:13] Trustee Maude: Denman Hornby has it in place.

[2:04:15] Trustee Maude: Mesquitee has no purpose.

[2:04:17] Voice 5: So, I had it.

[2:04:22] Voice 5: And they're in our Gulf Islands. Oh, it's by regional

[2:04:24] Voice 6: area, so it's

[2:04:25] Voice 5: not throughout the Islands Trust. Got it. Thank you very much.

[2:04:28] Voice 6: So the Comox Valley Regional District doesn't provide building inspection service to Denman and Hornby.

[2:04:34] Voice 6: So instead, to fill that, the Islands Trust has a siting and use permit process.

[2:04:40] Voice 6: And as Chair Mott said, regardless of whether you have building inspection service or not,

[2:04:46] Voice 6: you still are required to build the building okay

[2:04:49] Voice 5: thank you that was my confusion seemed like it was

[2:04:52] Voice 5: implemented but not and that's i would ask a person um who has co-built their own house and

[2:05:00] Voice 5: stuff and been alongside the builders here i would like to know more i see that you guys are

[2:05:07] Voice 5: endorsing it early i would like to know more about it and certainly it plays into affordable housing

[2:05:14] Voice 5: as no one can afford to build a lower cost house by themselves and meet the requirements

[2:05:25] Voice 5: for engineering for the many hydro, I've never heard of that, hydro engineer, on and on and

[2:05:33] Voice 5: on.

[2:05:33] Voice 5: So those two things are connected in my mind.

[2:05:37] Voice 5: So thank you.

[2:05:38] Voice 5: So

[2:05:38] Trustee Maude: Trustee Bowman, do you have anything more?

[2:05:40] Trustee Maude: Or as Trustee Nelson has been scribbling away.

[2:05:43] Trustee Maude: way so yeah

[2:05:44] Voice 4: no just uh in response to priscilla yeah i think i listened into main island's

[2:05:50] Voice 4: discussion and i think it was about the fact that without a letter to trigger the process

[2:05:55] Voice 4: nothing will happen so it's more like a um you know if we express interest then um further

[2:06:03] Voice 4: work will be done and in the um in the agenda priscilla you'll find a link i don't think it's

[2:06:11] Voice 4: very helpful though the link to the hornby bylaw is a bit that the information is a bit bleak

[2:06:18] Voice 4: behind it would i think would be fantastic to get somebody um maybe one of the hornby trustees

[2:06:26] Voice 4: to give us a primer on how it works i wonder if we could do that we could do that behind the scenes

[2:06:36] Voice 4: ask them maybe and then see if there's appetite to share that information but yeah i support the

[2:06:43] Voice 4: letter for sure certainly

[2:06:44] Trustee Maude: trustee graham works in the contracting industry but they're from denver

[2:06:49] Trustee Maude: he could personally talk to so yeah mr middleton okay so i'm a

[2:06:54] Trustee Middleton: family chair i moved to last step

[2:06:56] Trustee Middleton: to write a letter uh of support to the i guess it's the main island local trust community chair

[2:07:05] Trustee Middleton: to investigate implementation of citing and use permits and ask crd on the ask of crd to

[2:07:17] Trustee Middleton: discontinue usability permits in the saturn of local trust area to consider i just put

[2:07:25] Trustee Middleton: discontinued but you might want to order that so quite a difference there

[2:07:33] Trustee Maude: okay how much have you thought about thank

[2:07:38] Voice 1: you uh ask ask staff to write a letter of support

[2:07:43] Voice 1: to the main island local trust committee chair indicating support of citing and use permits

[2:07:49] Voice 1: it's an ask of crd that's right that's right i

[2:07:54] Trustee Middleton: guess to maybe we'll uh what we'll do is

[2:07:59] Trustee Middleton: out of respect for trustee bowman's research request i've said uh to main island ltc

[2:08:07] Trustee Middleton: uh so letters for to main island ltc to investigate implementation of cycling and use permits

[2:08:16] Trustee Middleton: permits and their ask of the CRD, which you might not have done, to discontinue use of

[2:08:27] Trustee Middleton: building permits in the Saterna Local Trust area.

[2:08:33] Voice 1: Okay, now I'm even more confused.

[2:08:35] Voice 1: So instead of what we had beginning, it's to ask staff to write a letter of support

[2:08:43] Voice 1: to main island local trust committee to investigate institution of citing and use

[2:08:49] Voice 1: permits and ask of capital regional district so

[2:08:55] Trustee Middleton: close so to investigate implementation

[2:08:58] Trustee Middleton: of citing and use permits okay and there meaning the main island ltc

[2:09:05] Trustee Middleton: ask of the CRD to discontinue use of building permits in the Saterna local trust area.

[2:09:26] Voice 1: To investigate implementation of siting and use permits and ask of Capital Regional District

[2:09:34] Voice 1: to discontinue use of building permits within the local trust area?

[2:09:39] Trustee Middleton: yeah that's very good i would just insert the word there in front of ask of crd just to reference

[2:09:48] Trustee Middleton: the main to blame the main island local trust committee basically and so which kind of

[2:09:55] Voice 1: okay so citing and use permits and what was

[2:09:59] Voice 1: the next word

[2:10:00] Trustee Middleton: there and there asked of the crd to

[2:10:05] Trustee Middleton: can discontinue use of building permits so t-h-e-i-r there yeah

[2:10:12] Voice 1: i got that i i'm just

[2:10:14] Voice 1: that bottom part kind of doesn't make

[2:10:16] Trustee Maude: so maybe instead of there they may not work across committee

[2:10:20] Trustee Maude: no

[2:10:20] Voice 1: i understand that

[2:10:22] Trustee Maude: to

[2:10:23] Voice 1: okay to investigate implementation of citing and use permits

[2:10:29] Voice 1: permits, and they're asked of CRD to discontinue use of building permits within the local trust

[2:10:37] Voice 1: area.

[2:10:40] Trustee Middleton: Good enough.

[2:10:41] Trustee Middleton: I mean, it's not exactly, but

[2:10:42] Voice 6: it's like, yes, it's a positive.

[2:10:45] Voice 6: Thank you, Chair.

[2:10:46] Voice 6: Just to make the point that typically a letter like that would be coming from the, written

[2:10:50] Voice 6: by the local trust committee, not staff, so I think it should be something like directly

[2:10:57] Voice 6: for the LTC chair to write a letter to himself.

[2:11:01] Voice 6: Okay, so it's one to the main and two to itself.

[2:11:08] Fair.

[2:11:09] Can we direct you to do that?

[2:11:11] I mean, we can do it.

[2:11:12] Yeah,

[2:11:15] Trustee Maude: well, you can come from a local trust committee

[2:11:16] Trustee Maude: rather than coming from the chair.

[2:11:18] Trustee Maude: Sure, but

[2:11:19] Trustee Maude: typically it's not being written by staff.

[2:11:21] Voice 6: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[2:11:22] Trustee Maude: So Trustee Millington will work back to,

[2:11:26] Trustee Maude: we'll set it up and I'll sign it

[2:11:30] Trustee Maude: it'll be a joint effort and many even trustee board will come

[2:11:33] Trustee Maude: so

[2:11:34] Trustee Middleton: sorry after that and therefore modify a little further

[2:11:44] Trustee Middleton: um so we just say move after move um that we say that the ltc write a letter of support

[2:11:54] Trustee Middleton: that the Saturna LTC write a letter of support

[2:12:00] Voice 12: to investigate.

[2:12:02] Trustee Middleton: I'll try it.

[2:12:08] Voice 1: It's moved and seconded the LTC write a letter of support

[2:12:12] Voice 1: to Saturna LTC chair to investigate implementation

[2:12:19] Voice 1: of siting and use permits and their ask of CRD

[2:12:23] Voice 1: to discontinue use of building permits

[2:12:25] Voice 1: within local trust area so

[2:12:28] Trustee Maude: it would be the main ltc chair

[2:12:33] Voice 1: okay uh direct oh sorry okay

[2:12:41] Voice 1: yeah i got that at the beginning part yes ask staff a letter of support to the main island

[2:12:46] Voice 1: local trust committee chair right okay all

[2:12:50] Trustee Maude: right so second and trust people yeah

[2:12:53] Voice 12: any further

[2:12:54] Trustee Maude: the discussion no question all in favor that carries okay then we have a letter from matthew

[2:13:02] Trustee Maude: the consent to realign of main games roads the games family

[2:13:16] Voice 6: it's just on danger but it's not the game's family

[2:13:19] Voice 6: that's yeah so

[2:13:23] Trustee Maude: sorry so so this is a but this is a staff report with a recommendation on it

[2:13:30] Trustee Maude: so it's not just a letter

[2:13:31] Voice 6: right yeah when i originally put on the agenda i thought it would

[2:13:36] Voice 6: just be the letter but i'm

[2:13:37] Voice 6: talking with robert it needed a cover covering stuff so you want to ask

[2:13:42] Voice 6: briefly about your staff report sure so it's really simple the property owner is seeking to

[2:13:48] Voice 6: to adjust the right of way that Modi has approved

[2:13:55] Voice 6: to align with how it's drawn on the original plan.

[2:14:00] Voice 6: And so the property owner has submitted

[2:14:05] Voice 6: through their agent this request,

[2:14:09] Voice 6: and they're seeking the chair to sign the plan.

[2:14:14] Voice 6: and amending pages that have been provided by the lawyer

[2:14:21] Voice 6: so that they can adjust the right of when.

[2:14:24] Voice 6: And so there's two covenants in place on the property.

[2:14:27] Voice 6: One of them has to do with the building of structures

[2:14:29] Voice 6: and the other one has to do with water supply

[2:14:34] Voice 6: and neither of them in the staff view have any impact on,

[2:14:40] Voice 6: or the road alignment would have no impact

[2:14:41] Voice 6: on the interest of the LTC with respect to those covenants.

[2:14:45] Voice 6: so staff are recommending that the chair sign the two application reference lines any questions

[2:14:53] Trustee Maude: comments

[2:14:55] Trustee Middleton: um this my understanding is this is basically the what the group of 30 called the

[2:15:01] Trustee Middleton: west inc entrance to their property and the realignment of the right-of-way to the actual

[2:15:08] Trustee Middleton: the actual road that it has built, right? Got it.

[2:15:13] Trustee Middleton: Yeah, no, I'm in support for sure, it makes sense.

[2:15:17] Trustee Middleton: Trustee Borland?

[2:15:19] Voice 4: I'm almost afraid to ask a question

[2:15:21] Voice 4: cause I've been mired in one of these road things already.

[2:15:28] Voice 4: But anyway, I just have,

[2:15:29] Voice 4: so basically it's to return these portions

[2:15:33] Voice 4: to the lots in some way,

[2:15:36] Voice 4: um or is it neutral in the end but to be honest i support it i'm just kind of curious about it

[2:15:43] Voice 4: that's all it looks it's like a very thorough piece of work yeah

[2:15:47] Voice 6: i would say on page 65 is the

[2:15:49] Voice 6: best uh uh visual

[2:15:52] Voice 12: description that's where i am yeah especially

[2:15:55] Voice 6: the the the the as built road

[2:15:58] Voice 6: The road probably is curved there to address topography and the roadway itself in the green there.

[2:16:07] Voice 6: So they're just adjusting and I guess portions of the lot that's being returned would be returned to whatever it would be currently sitting on.

[2:16:17] Voice 6: Yeah,

[2:16:18] Voice 4: it's almost actually an artistic sort of graphic thing that you could put on the wall that sort of yellow snake with the green stripe through it.

[2:16:34] Trustee Middleton: just a

[2:16:35] Voice 2: comment i have some historical local knowledge on that

[2:16:42] Voice 2: i've known games road those have been in conjunction with loonies logging and that's

[2:16:48] Voice 2: the portion that's involved on the loonies logging land but the department the ministry

[2:16:53] Voice 2: of highways at the time required Gaines Road as a cul-de-sac which was useful to Gaines and Williams

[2:17:01] Voice 2: logging but the highways department required that the right-of-way be gazetted and extent surveyed

[2:17:08] Voice 2: and gazetted and extended to lands beyond which is group of 30. it was totally impractical piece

[2:17:15] Voice 2: of ground that they put it over here caused thousands of truckloads of fill to be put in

[2:17:20] Voice 2: place to build the road there the old logging road which went in the natural geography offsets

[2:17:27] Voice 2: it goes there goes this way they've realigned it and that portion should go back to the land

[2:17:32] Voice 2: to the lot that it went over from the common sense solution to

[2:17:36] Trustee Middleton: a promise that's wrong

[2:17:38] Trustee Middleton: i'll issue your permission chair i'll make the motion that the subject of the trust committee

[2:17:43] Trustee Middleton: consents with the proposed realignment of gaines road and designates the chair of the local trust

[2:17:49] Trustee Middleton: committee to sign the plan applications for reference plans epp 86340 and epp 86342

[2:17:59] Trustee Middleton: second

[2:18:00] Trustee Maude: trustee poland yep

[2:18:01] Voice 4: any

[2:18:02] Trustee Maude: further discussion no call question all in favor yep

[2:18:08] Trustee Middleton: and that's a good report it gives us good comfort there so thank you i

[2:18:12] Voice 6: just have with respect to

[2:18:15] Voice 6: process to sign those documents i think you will need to sign them in front of a notary or

[2:18:19] Voice 6: a lawyer and so we'll have to facilitate that for you

[2:18:23] Trustee Maude: at some point

[2:18:24] Trustee Maude: um i'm an ec next wednesday in in person in victoria yeah i'll see what we can do

[2:18:32] Trustee Maude: it's okay because isn't um david marlin or notary

[2:18:37] Voice 6: perhaps yes i'll figure what what the best easiest

[2:18:41] Voice 6: The easiest process is for you to sign.

[2:18:42] Voice 6: Perfect, thank you.

[2:18:44] Voice 4: Do I, I'm just scrolling to the bottom, is it just the chair who has to sign or?

[2:18:49] Voice 6: You've directed

[2:18:50] Voice 3: the chair to sign

[2:18:51] Voice 6: on behalf of the LTC through your resolution.

[2:18:54] Voice 6: Okay, thanks.

[2:18:55] Voice 6: Okay, thanks.

[2:18:58] Trustee Maude: No trips on Monday.

[2:19:00] Trustee Maude: Alright, so funding reimbursement for approval of the Westland Bookwatch event.

[2:19:07] Trustee Middleton: So, do you want to speak to this?

[2:19:09] Trustee Middleton: is absolutely and i know that our planner and um his his boss mr kojima they don't have the

[2:19:16] Trustee Middleton: authority to um to to do this so this is not a you know poke at them it's just what we've done

[2:19:24] Trustee Middleton: in the past is the local trust committee has supported some reconciliation events um we we

[2:19:31] Trustee Middleton: we funded uh partly the 13 moons project which led to the signing of the moon's uh mural at the

[2:19:38] Trustee Middleton: church. The site was chosen by elders of the sale people, so that was their choices where it should

[2:19:46] Trustee Middleton: go. And then we also supported the long trip of Saanich English Dictionary, which was a huge work

[2:19:55] Trustee Middleton: completed by community members and John Elliott and the Saanich Tribal School and I forget the

[2:20:02] Trustee Middleton: name of a professor at the University of Florida who was their co-author. It's a book that they

[2:20:07] Trustee Middleton: then the spanish uh school donated to our library so we have a copy in the library and the launch

[2:20:13] Trustee Middleton: event was a big launch and it was a very very good event um and so the trust committee supported that

[2:20:19] Trustee Middleton: uh we also not in the vein of reconciliation supported the consultation between

[2:20:26] Trustee Middleton: uh transport canada and departments of fisheries and oceans on the oceans protection plan

[2:20:33] Trustee Middleton: most specifically the southern resident killer whales uh exclusion zone and that was held here

[2:20:40] Trustee Middleton: that was incredibly there was like a hundred and somewhat people there so we supplied av services

[2:20:46] Trustee Middleton: all of which were not strictly land use planning all of which required me to write a letter

[2:20:53] navigating the cones so

[2:20:55] Trustee Middleton: to speak but subsequently there's been a policy that perhaps um brad could

[2:21:00] Trustee Middleton: could speak to that means we're not permitted to at the local trust level support community groups

[2:21:07] Trustee Middleton: now this project is basically was on the vein of our reconciliation um initiative um with uh

[2:21:18] Trustee Middleton: um mr paul philip kevin paul who's a national poet of some note came and read poetry at that

[2:21:27] Trustee Middleton: at the Wetland Project event here on the island

[2:21:30] Trustee Middleton: at Adam Wilson's mother's in Texas facility.

[2:21:36] Trustee Middleton: It's trying to launch, of course, as you all know.

[2:21:38] Trustee Middleton: And so they asked for our support.

[2:21:41] Trustee Middleton: And so this is when trustee Brent and I were in place.

[2:21:44] Trustee Middleton: Time was somewhat of the essence.

[2:21:46] Trustee Middleton: So Paul and I just paid it, it's $850,

[2:21:51] Trustee Middleton: but my view is, you know,

[2:21:53] Trustee Middleton: it's not going to bankrupt Paul and I.

[2:21:57] Trustee Middleton: especially because Paul owns me canned food now and then, so I'm okay.

[2:22:01] Trustee Middleton: But it seems the principle is correct that the local trust committee support this project.

[2:22:06] Trustee Middleton: So I guess I'm making a point of asking the trust to support it.

[2:22:10] Trustee Middleton: I know Brad and Land Use Planning can be the authorizer.

[2:22:15] Trustee Middleton: It was suggested I talk to the Director of Administrative Services about the mechanism and I will do so.

[2:22:20] Trustee Middleton: So I guess we don't have to argue the point right now.

[2:22:22] Trustee Middleton: I'll talk to the Director of Administrative Services,

[2:22:25] Trustee Middleton: but I was just looking for a resolution

[2:22:27] Trustee Middleton: from the local trust committee that this in fact be,

[2:22:31] Trustee Middleton: this expenditure in fact be supported by the Saturn LTC.

[2:22:37] Trustee Middleton: And I can take it hard if the chair wants to play that role

[2:22:40] Trustee Middleton: by all means, but that's all it is.

[2:22:43] So it's kind of a lot more long-winded

[2:22:45] than it perhaps needs to

[2:22:46] Trustee Middleton: be, but that's the story.

[2:22:50] Trustee Middleton: So do you have a suggestion motion?

[2:22:52] Trustee Middleton: Yeah, why don't I move that the Saturna LTC pay the invoice for Philip Kevin Ball's poetry

[2:23:05] Trustee Middleton: recital at the Wetland Project book launch event.

[2:23:11] Trustee Middleton: You want to put something in about reconciliation to tick that administrative box?

[2:23:16] Trustee Middleton: in support of local community to nation reconciliation thank you how could you

[2:23:23] Trustee Maude: I can get

[2:23:29] Voice 1: the part about the wetlands um from the agenda package pay the invoice for

[2:23:36] Voice 1: the wetlands in support of local reconciliation yes

[2:23:42] Trustee Middleton: so community to to first nation

[2:23:46] Trustee Middleton: reconciliation

[2:23:48] Voice 1: okay sorry i got i missed that in okay for the wetlands in support of

[2:23:56] Voice 1: local

[2:23:58] Trustee Middleton: community to first nation reconciliation local

[2:24:03] Voice 1: community to first nation's reconciliation

[2:24:08] Voice 1: okay yes

[2:24:09] Trustee Maude: okay all right i want to read that back okay

[2:24:15] Voice 1: the saterna local trust committee

[2:24:17] Voice 1: committee pay the invoice for the wetlands I'll get the full titling in support of local community

[2:24:24] Voice 1: to First Nations reconciliation perfect

[2:24:28] Trustee Maude: okay second trustee yep okay and discussion trustee

[2:24:34] Trustee Maude: no

[2:24:34] Voice 4: no

[2:24:36] Trustee Maude: you're happy with that any further discussion no call question all in favor

[2:24:40] Trustee Maude: that carries thank you excellent thank you and next we have biolog notification requirements

[2:24:51] Trustee Maude: on subterna okay

[2:24:54] Trustee Middleton: this is me again um now i just have to pull this up from the email so

[2:24:59] Trustee Middleton: oh there it is great so pat this is doesn't she die for it

[2:25:04] Trustee Middleton: so so basically i spoke to it a little bit earlier on the work project thing and i think

[2:25:11] Trustee Middleton: i would like to make a motion to that effect after we've done this commission chair but basically um

[2:25:18] Trustee Middleton: there was quite a bit of discussion at the trust council in regard um uh the process and protocols

[2:25:24] Trustee Middleton: of by-law enforcement on all other items not not any issue here i think paul would agree with me

[2:25:31] Trustee Middleton: that we've had generally quite a positive experience of um of uh by law enforcement

[2:25:37] Trustee Middleton: of the alice trust and enforcing these bylaws i think to a degree if i don't uh step out of

[2:25:45] Trustee Middleton: balance here because we didn't enact the bylaw enforcement notification system or the ticketing

[2:25:52] Trustee Middleton: system because we i think successive local trust committees didn't feel it was appropriate for

[2:25:56] a community of this size and so out of the discussion

[2:26:00] Trustee Middleton: there was a recently released

[2:26:02] Trustee Middleton: report by the bc ombudsperson on best practices in local government by law enforcement and it was

[2:26:08] Trustee Middleton: very good it basically talked about you know clear expectations between the public and by law

[2:26:15] Trustee Middleton: enforcement enforcement so that the public has confidence in the bylaws and generally the idea

[2:26:22] Trustee Middleton: of creation of bylaws that are worth enforcing and and appropriate and so um in there the the

[2:26:29] Trustee Middleton: The Islands Trust has specifically mentioned that the Saterna Local Trust Committees have authority for authorizing entry upon private property by law enforcement staff.

[2:26:42] Trustee Middleton: Now, this was of note to me because at the last term or the term prior, Paul and I revised the land use bylaws, and we inserted a clause in there and it came to enforcement that we modeled off the SCIDI, which said,

[2:26:55] Trustee Middleton: prior to entry on private property,

[2:26:58] Trustee Middleton: the bylaw for purposes of enforcement,

[2:27:00] Trustee Middleton: the bylaw enforcement, and it's repeated in here,

[2:27:04] Trustee Middleton: you'll see when I read it saying,

[2:27:05] Trustee Middleton: the bylaw enforcement officer will give 24 hours notice

[2:27:08] Trustee Middleton: of their intent to come to your property.

[2:27:12] Trustee Middleton: It seemed a reasonable and short term window

[2:27:16] Trustee Middleton: and facilitative of good relations

[2:27:20] Trustee Middleton: between bylaw enforcement or trust committee

[2:27:22] Trustee Middleton: ultimately in the community.

[2:27:23] Trustee Middleton: Well, this is now seen by the ombudsman as sort of a bare minimum.

[2:27:29] Trustee Middleton: We'll get to that in a second, but what I noticed is, so bylaw 119 is our land use bylaw,

[2:27:36] Trustee Middleton: which is where in there it says you'll be given 24 hours notice before an officer attempts

[2:27:41] Trustee Middleton: to enter.

[2:27:42] Trustee Middleton: But it's actually bylaw 30, I learned, that gives authority to representatives of the

[2:27:49] Trustee Middleton: the trust to enter private property and it doesn't require 24 hours notice so i am simply making a

[2:27:56] Trustee Middleton: standing resolution here we obviously need to change the bylaws and bring them in alignment

[2:28:00] Trustee Middleton: that's a longer term process but what i'm doing here is basically just aligning the 30 year old

[2:28:06] Trustee Middleton: bylaw 30 by a standing resolution with the two-year-old or one-year-old actually uh local

[2:28:13] Trustee Middleton: by law number 119.

[2:28:15] Trustee Middleton: And so I'll just read it.

[2:28:17] Trustee Middleton: It sounds way more complicated when I go on about it

[2:28:20] Trustee Middleton: rather than just read it.

[2:28:21] Trustee Middleton: So I'm going to say,

[2:28:22] Trustee Middleton: be it resolved that clause two

[2:28:25] Trustee Middleton: in Saturno Local Trust Committee by law 30,

[2:28:29] Trustee Middleton: a bylaw to authorize inspection of alleged infractions

[2:28:32] Trustee Middleton: against regulations is replaced on an interim basis

[2:28:36] Trustee Middleton: with the wording of clause 1.4.1

[2:28:39] Trustee Middleton: on from Saterna Local Trust Committee bylaw 119,

[2:28:43] Trustee Middleton: land use bylaws amalgamated.

[2:28:46] Trustee Middleton: This clause reads,

[2:28:47] Trustee Middleton: the Islands Trust bylaw enforcement officer

[2:28:50] Trustee Middleton: or any other person designated

[2:28:52] Trustee Middleton: by the Saterna Island Local Trust Committee

[2:28:54] Trustee Middleton: to administer this bylaw is authorized to enter

[2:28:58] Trustee Middleton: at any reasonable time and after having given

[2:29:01] Trustee Middleton: 24 hours prior notifications to the occupier

[2:29:05] Trustee Middleton: upon any property that is subject to regulation under this bylaw for the purpose of determining

[2:29:11] Trustee Middleton: whether the regulations are being observed bear with me this standing resolution will remain in

[2:29:18] Trustee Middleton: place until such time a review of bylaws number 130 and bylaws number 119 section 1.4 inspection

[2:29:26] Trustee Middleton: and enforcement can be reviewed and reenacted through public process embodying bylaw enforcement

[2:29:32] Trustee Middleton: best practices outlined in the 2022 ombudsperson of bc report concerning local government bylaw

[2:29:40] Trustee Middleton: enforcement policy and practice nice there you have

[2:29:44] Trustee Maude: it okay so trustee do you want to second

[2:29:48] Trustee Maude: that motion uh

[2:29:50] Voice 4: i uh i do uh there were a couple of you in the version in the email you've corrected

[2:29:57] Voice 4: a couple of things, I think.

[2:30:00] Voice 4: read it more. There was clause in one and report wasn't there. So I'm assuming that

[2:30:05] Voice 4: the text is okay.

[2:30:12] Trustee Middleton: And

[2:30:13] Voice 4: I think some places calls instead of clause. So

[2:30:17] Trustee Maude: So Pat has what was emailed this afternoon or this morning. So Pat has that writing as

[2:30:27] Trustee Middleton: the motion so can i add there's one word i missed that it's on the very last sentence okay where it

[2:30:34] Trustee Middleton: starts uh best practices outlined in the 2022 ombudsperson of bc we should then have the word

[2:30:43] Trustee Middleton: report yeah i

[2:30:46] Trustee Middleton: missed that and then it looks like i already caught another misuse of the word clause

[2:30:51] Trustee Middleton: At

[2:30:53] Voice 4: the second sentence, this cause reads the island's trust final should be this clause,

[2:31:00] Voice 4: I believe.

[2:31:00] Trustee Middleton: Good catch.

[2:31:01] Trustee Middleton: Okay.

[2:31:02] Trustee Middleton: So Pat, then, as she says, the second sentence, I misspelled or autocorrected cause and I

[2:31:11] Trustee Middleton: wrote cause.

[2:31:12] Trustee Middleton: So that should be clause.

[2:31:13] Voice 4: I'm just proving that I actually am reading all of this carefully.

[2:31:21] Voice 1: Yeah, I actually just translate that in. So, yeah.

[2:31:25] Voice 4: Okay. Thank you.

[2:31:26] Voice 8: So yes,

[2:31:29] Voice 4: I support that with those, you know, type corrections. Yeah.

[2:31:34] Trustee Maude: Perfect. All right. So that's all for the discussion.

[2:31:39] Trustee Maude: All right. So we'll call the question. All in favour?

[2:31:42] Voice 12: Yep.

[2:31:43] Trustee Maude: And that carries.

[2:31:44] Trustee Maude: Great. Thank you very much.

[2:31:46] Trustee Maude: Thank you.

[2:31:46] Trustee Maude: us one more the turn is always fun

[2:31:53] Voice 12: uh

[2:31:53] Trustee Maude: so upcoming meetings with the next regular meeting is scheduled for may 18th 2023 here

[2:32:00] Trustee Maude: and now we have a town hall if anybody has anything further to say or offer

[2:32:07] Trustee Maude: uh

[2:32:09] Voice 5: i wanted to say and i'm sorry brad's not here that how much i appreciated the um

[2:32:19] Voice 5: uh workmanship and attention to detail that draft for him to considering

[2:32:29] Trustee Middleton: i wanted to

[2:32:32] Voice 5: say how much i appreciated the dialogue um between uh brad's function and his

[2:32:39] Voice 5: uh need to very carefully examine things um in a very detailed manner as they reflected in the

[2:32:46] Voice 5: land use bylaw and um and then the input from lee and also john being prepared for this particular

[2:32:55] Voice 5: situation with the map and being able to discuss uh the history of it and um how it how it played

[2:33:05] Voice 5: out in actuality in real time so if we hadn't you hadn't been i used the word tenacious you're

[2:33:13] Voice 5: really up on your stuff and i i like that i appreciate that because there's other times

[2:33:19] Voice 5: when i disagree with this sort of i hesitate to use this but it's certainly been in my experience

[2:33:23] Voice 5: the old boys network of ah well we'll just blah blah blah and that gives me confidence in the

[2:33:30] Voice 5: system you were talking about you thought that the new uh ltc the overriding group that gets

[2:33:37] Voice 5: together when all the trustees get together you thought that it was workable and it not only has

[2:33:42] Voice 5: to be workable but it has to be people have to have confidence in it that both of these methods

[2:33:48] Voice 5: the the all of the reports and all of the policies that we put in place are being thoughtfully

[2:33:58] Voice 5: considered and they're taken on balance and if the public doesn't have confidence in that

[2:34:05] Voice 5: then you get a situation where there's a lot of collision of values because this we are talking

[2:34:11] Voice 5: about conservation versus development pretty much it's what it always comes down to and to save us

[2:34:22] Voice 5: to know that we can have confidence in that is very very important so i very much appreciated

[2:34:28] Voice 5: your attention to detail i don't want more development than john is allowed because we

[2:34:37] Voice 5: talked about all of these policies john in particular and very we first worked at that

[2:34:42] Voice 5: And yet I want there to be some amount of reasonable workability, a place where we can consider both parts.

[2:34:52] Voice 5: So thank you. I think maybe you might have come across as nitpicky and kind of keeping right to it.

[2:34:59] Voice 5: But I thank you for bringing that perspective. And you seem to easily know things and you really have done your work.

[2:35:05] Voice 5: And Lee, I very much appreciated your input that you've been out with John to check it,

[2:35:12] Voice 5: to look at the land, and asking the right questions.

[2:35:15] Voice 5: For me as a citizen, that's very important.

[2:35:18] Voice 5: And I appreciated John being very prepared.

[2:35:22] Voice 5: Thank

[2:35:22] Trustee Maude: you very much.

[2:35:24] Trustee Maude: Some of these things are waiting for us, so we do our best.

[2:35:28] Voice 5: They are.

[2:35:29] Voice 5: You're not even in your home community.

[2:35:31] Voice 5: You're going off to Main Island.

[2:35:33] Trustee Maude: but i i will say as i said earlier is this trust council as a whole i think you would be very

[2:35:41] Trustee Maude: impressed with this is everybody brings something unique to the table we have a lot of pretty smart

[2:35:48] Trustee Maude: people there and we've had a couple of trust council meetings and have nothing but respect

[2:35:55] Trustee Maude: for all 26 people sitting around the table and the communication is happening back and forth

[2:36:00] Trustee Maude: between all the trustees and the civilized conversations is it's really good so because

[2:36:09] Voice 5: those aren't questions that we are addressing and how we go forward in the trust area they aren't

[2:36:14] Voice 5: yes and no questions at all and and they're critical and important to me

[2:36:23] Trustee Maude: and yes i will be going back to my community that's that's what my primary job is to keep the

[2:36:31] Trustee Maude: it may read together not fighting and not screaming and just sort of keep their border

[2:36:37] Trustee Maude: within the room so we've

[2:36:39] Voice 5: left out well

[2:36:40] Trustee Maude: it would be new to trustee grant down to the point so

[2:36:45] Trustee Maude: i think i've done my job um

[2:36:47] Voice 2: the first one directed towards the building inspection and that

[2:36:55] Voice 2: possible change. There is another factor that is out there and to be honest I don't know exactly

[2:37:04] Voice 2: whether it's a CRD requirement or a wider provincial requirement but homeowner warning

[2:37:12] Voice 2: protection is now an issue. Some contractors have it, others don't. Private individuals have to

[2:37:19] Voice 2: demonstrate its vulnerability uh it's another overlying thing that needs to be followed and

[2:37:26] Voice 2: put together when you're making that having that discussion i'm glad you're having that discussion

[2:37:32] Voice 2: second to that we'll thank the trust committee and the staff for the meeting today and the good work

[2:37:40] Voice 2: they've done and their willingness to listen thank you thank you very much can

[2:37:49] Trustee Middleton: i i'm sorry

[2:37:50] Trustee Middleton: i forgot the business item before people leave and we can't do the business plan i have a motion

[2:37:56] Trustee Middleton: if you'll entertain it absolutely so uh this is i guess police i forgot a bit sorry please

[2:38:09] Trustee Middleton: so place a review of bylaw 30 and bylaw 119 section 1.4.1 on this the projects list

[2:38:24] Trustee Middleton: and then it's a bit awkward but it'll do to embody best practice as outlined by the dc

[2:38:31] Trustee Middleton: ombudsperson in their 2022 report okay

[2:38:38] Trustee Maude: so pat will give that back to us when she's

[2:38:41] Trustee Maude: finished scribbling. Just

[2:38:44] Voice 1: give me one second. Well, then we're not. Okay, sorry. Okay, so it's it's

[2:38:59] Voice 1: that for the staff to place a review?

[2:39:04] Trustee Middleton: Yeah, I guess. However, I think that's how it goes is direct

[2:39:07] Trustee Middleton: staff to place review of bylaws 30 right

[2:39:11] Voice 1: and bylaw 119 and

[2:39:14] Trustee Middleton: by the 119 section 1.4.1

[2:39:21] Trustee Middleton: on the project list to

[2:39:24] Voice 1: embody best practice ombudsman report as

[2:39:29] Trustee Middleton: outlined by the vc ombuds

[2:39:31] Trustee Middleton: its person in their 2022 I

[2:39:34] Voice 1: guess

[2:39:35] Trustee Middleton: we should say by law practice report

[2:39:42] Voice 1: practice report practices

[2:39:47] Voice 1: practices

[2:39:48] Trustee Middleton: thank you that's better okay

[2:39:50] Voice 1: um okay to for staff to place a review of bylaw 30

[2:39:54] Voice 1: and bylaw 119 section 1.4.1 on the projects list to embody best practice as outlined in

[2:40:05] Voice 1: ombudsperson report 2022 bylaw practices report yeah

[2:40:11] Trustee Maude: good enough that'll work

[2:40:12] Trustee Maude: that'll work okay second yeah

[2:40:16] Voice 5: well

[2:40:17] Trustee Maude: any discussion i think i've said enough

[2:40:28] Trustee Maude: I just want

[2:40:33] Voice 9: to want to know if Trustee Middleton prepared his biography in such a way as to exceed

[2:40:41] Voice 9: the word count of every other trustee's biography in toto my

[2:40:48] Trustee Middleton: biography is like the old testament

[2:40:50] Trustee Middleton: to the other's chapters, single chapters of the New Testament.

[2:40:54] Trustee Middleton: Give the people substance and grounding.

[2:41:01] Voice 4: I want to know if the chickens came into it.

[2:41:06] Trustee Middleton: I

[2:41:07] Trustee Maude: update the biography month.

[2:41:10] Trustee Maude: So we don't have a closed meeting.

[2:41:13] Trustee Maude: So back to central adjourn.

[2:41:16] Trustee Maude: Thank you.

[2:41:17] Trustee Maude: Thank you very much.

[2:41:18] Trustee Maude: Thank you, everybody.

[2:41:19] Voice 4: It was great from this end.

[2:41:21] Voice 4: And I really appreciate everybody's contributions.

[2:41:24] Voice 4: And especially as Priscilla alluded to the preparation by Brad,

[2:41:30] Voice 4: which made it just easier. Thank you.

[2:41:32] Trustee Maude: Excellent. Now you can go back to your snowman.

[2:41:35] Voice 4: Yeah.

[2:41:36] Voice 4: Thanks, Mary. Have

[2:41:38] Voice 6: a nice afternoon.

[2:41:39] Trustee Maude: Thank you.

[2:41:40] Trustee Maude: Thank you, Pat.

Saturna Local Trust Committee 
Regular Business Meeting 
February 16, 2023 ADOPTED Page 1 of 7 
 
Saturna Island Local Trust Committee 
Minutes of Regular Meeting 
 
Date:  
Location:  
February 16, 2023 
Saturna Recreation and Cultural Centre 
104 Harris Road, Saturna Island BC 
 
Members Present: David Maude, Chair 
 Mairead Boland, Trustee 
 Lee Middleton, Trustee 
  
Staff Present: Brad Smith, Island Planner 
 Bruce Belcher, Planning Technician 
 Pat Todd, Recorder 
  
Other Present: There were approximately seven (7) members of the public in attendance. 
 
1. CALL TO ORDER 
Chair Maude called the meeting to order at 11:32 a.m.  He acknowledged that the meeting was 
being held in traditional territory of the Coast Salish First Nations. 
 
2. APPROVAL OF AGENDA 
The following additions to the agenda were presented for consideration: 
 16.5 To create a proposed motion for the Bylaw Procedures for Saturna Island. 
By general consent, the agenda was adopted as amended. 
 
3. TRUSTEE REPORT 
Trustee Middleton gave an update regarding a generous land donation by Judy Meyers to 
Nature Trust of B.C.  Elements will come before the Local Trust Committee (LTC) such as bylaws 
and density.  There are some issues to overcome.   
Governance Committee of the Islands Trust has formed a strong team.  One factor being 
reviewed is meeting procedures and the need to increase dialogue. 
Trustee Boland spoke to staff being tremendously helpful as she “learns the ropes”.  The 
Financial Committee is working on the budget which will go to Trust Council early in March. The 
Financial Committee is making efforts to increase transparency of budget design and format.  
There are three Trustees, of which she is one, on the working group to look at process which will 
be reviewed in April 2023. 
 
A D O P T E D 

 
Saturna Local Trust Committee 
Regular Business Meeting 
February 16, 2023 ADOPTED Page 2 of 7 
4. CHAIR'S REPORT 
Chair Maude stated there are a lot of things happening with regards to the Islands Trust 
currently and Chair Maude believes that there are many positive changes.  Items include budget 
and review of practices and procedures of Bylaw Enforcement.  Chair Maude spoke to the Trust 
Council being very strong team of individuals who are working well together and that would like 
to have a Provincial Review of the Trust as there is a need to update policies. 
 
5. ELECTORAL AREA DIRECTOR'S REPORT 
Capital Regional District Director (CRD) Brent commended the LTC for continuing to work with 
Nature Trust of B.C. which acquired 143 acres last year.  An easement for the well on the 
property is underway.  CRD Strategic Plan is almost completed with housing of primary 
importance.   There have been many projects funded however none have happened on 
Southern Gulf Islands and therefore this will be one of the items of focus and the CRD is looking 
forward to working closely with the Saturna Island LTC.  
 
6. TOWN HALL AND QUESTIONS 
Priscilla Ewbank:  requesting maps detailing logging history on Saturna Island.  Planner Smith 
stated that he could print out maps with property lines and information that is available. To 
review these maps would likely require community input.  There is an Islands Trust (IT) report 
regarding land disturbance that might be helpful with the review of the maps. 
SA-2023-001 
It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
That Saturna Island Local Trust Committee direct staff to work with Ms. Ewbank 
to prepare a base map for work with community to document historical logging 
activity. 
CARRIED 
 
Member of the public:  spoke in support of funding request for the Wetland Project book 
launch.  This project is both sound with regards to Ecology and with Post Geographical Art 
(Saturna Booktalk).  Feels Islands Trust is very good regarding engagement with First Nation. 
 
7. COMMUNITY INFORMATION MEETING - None 
8. PUBLIC HEARING – None 
 
9. MINUTES 
9.1 Local Trust Committee Special Meeting Minutes Dated December 14, 2022  
By general consent, the Local Trust Committee meeting minutes of Dec. 14, 
2022 were adopted. 
9.2 Local Trust Committee Public Hearing Record Dated December 14, 2022  
  Received for information. 

 
Saturna Local Trust Committee 
Regular Business Meeting 
February 16, 2023 ADOPTED Page 3 of 7 
 
9.3 Section 26 Resolutions-without-meeting Report Dated Feb 2023 
  Received for information. 
 
10. BUSINESS ARISING FROM THE MINUTES 
10.1 Follow-up Action List Dated Feb 2023 
Planner Smith reported that the rezoning application bylaw has been approved by Trust 
Council and has been forwarded to Ministry.   
 SA-2023-002 
 It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
that Saturna Local Trust Committee direct staff to initiate a Resolution- without-
Meeting for Bylaws No. 136 and 137 upon receipt of Ministry approval of  
Bylaw 136. 
CARRIED 
11. DELEGATIONS - none 
12. CORRESPONDENCE- none 
 
13. APPLICATIONS AND REFERRALS 
13.1 SA-RZ-2022.2 (Gaines) 
 Planner Smith reviewed the application for rezoning from Rural Residential (RR) to Rural 
General (RG).  Subdivision application is with Ministry.  Spoke to the recommendations 
in the report. 
  Discussion 
 There isn’t a standard for water volume used per day in Saturna land use bylaw; 
 Could defer proof of water to subdivision process; 
 Definition of quantity and quality of water, at the local level, is important; 
 The province requires proof of a sufficient well however there are potentially 
other options for sufficient water e.g., catchment water; 
 This property has two existing wells; 
 Need to balance community consulting and community input with planning; 
 Registered Archeological sites and noted sites of Archeological potential; 
 Sites are highlighted on the map of the property so that the owner is aware of 
building outside of protected area; 
 Staff recommends a Covenant to protect any potential Archeological sites.  The 
proposed Bylaw is sent to First Nations, prior to adoption, so that First Nations 
can note any concerns; 
 and 
 The provincial authority requires a groundwater and a hydrologist report to 
rezone the property and IT Bylaws could augment. 
 

 
Saturna Local Trust Committee 
Regular Business Meeting 
February 16, 2023 ADOPTED Page 4 of 7 
Applicant:  
 Reviewed the long and complicated processes undergone to date;   
 There have been a number of changes throughout the years and does not feel 
an Amenity should be required; 
 Development to date has not revealed any additional archeological material; 
and 
 Increased set-backs would be detrimental to applicant plans and would increase 
costs and damage to terrain. 
Planner Smith spoke to the applicant’s points and that rezoning creates the possibility 
for 2 densities and RG averaging would work for all lots.   
SA-2023-003 
It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
That Saturna Island Local Trust Committee direct staff to proceed with 
application SA-RZ-2023-1 (Gaines) and to prepare draft bylaws. 
 
CARRIED 
14. LOCAL TRUST COMMITTEE PROJECTS 
SA-2023-004 
It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
That Saturna Local Trust Committee direct staff to add review of Saturna Island 
Bylaw for Split Zones to Futures Project List. 
CARRIED 
15. REPORTS 
15.1 Work Program Reports  
15.1.1 Local Trust Committee Work Program Review – received for information 
15.1.2 Active Projects Report Dated Feb 2023 – received for information 
15.1.3 Future Projects Report Dated Feb 2023 
 Review of Bylaw Compliance; 
 Eradicate discrepancy; 
 Affordable Housing Initiative has been noted in Strategic Initiatives; and 
 Trustees to consider projects and bring forward to the next LTC meeting. 
15.2 Applications Report Dated Feb 2023 – received for information 
15.3 Trustee and Local Expense Report Dated Dec 2022 – received for information 
15.4 Adopted Policies and Standing Resolutions – received for information 
15.5 Local Trust Committee Webpage – will be updated upon conclusion of meeting 
15.6 Islands Trust Conservancy Report Dated Nov 2022 – received for information 
 

 
Saturna Local Trust Committee 
Regular Business Meeting 
February 16, 2023 ADOPTED Page 5 of 7 
16. NEW BUSINESS 
16.1 Letter from W
̱
SANEC Leadership Council Staff regarding Draft 2021 Islands Trust Policy 
Statement Amendments - Received and reviewed.  This letter is very informative. 
16.2 Mayne LTC request re Siting and Use Permit Option 
Chair Maude spoke to the request and discussion regarding the CRD not being 
responsible for building permits for islands using Siting and Use permits.  Noted that 
some of the islands are already utilizing this process. 
CRD Director Brent reported CRD is looking at situation and options.  There are building 
inspection issues and often engineering reports required. 
Mr. Gaines stated construction/development would be much easier if process were 
streamlined. 
Planner Smith identified that building permit review applications move as quickly as 
manpower allows.   
 SA-2023-005 
 It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
That Saturna Island Local Trust Committee write a letter of support to Mayne 
Island Local Trust Committee Chair to investigate implementation of Siting and 
Use Permits and their ask of Capital Regional District to discontinue use of 
building permits within Local Trust area. 
CARRIED 
16.3 Letter from Matthew Tolan re: Consent to Realignment of Gaines Road 
  Planner Smith reviewed request to adjust right-of-way. 
SA-2023-006 
 It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
That the Saturna Island Local Trust Committee consents with the proposed 
realignment of Gaines Road and designates the Chair of the Local Trust 
Committee to sign the plan applications for Reference Plans EPP86340 and 
EPP86342. 
CARRIED 
 Planner Smith to facilitate signing of documents. 
16.4 Funding reimbursement approval for Wetlands book launch event 
  Trustee Middleton reviewed history of supported projects/events. 
   SA-2023-007 
   It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
That Saturna Island Local Trust Committee pay the invoice for Wetlands book 
launch event in support of local community to First Nations reconciliation. 
CARRIED 
 
  Trustee Middleton will co-ordinate payment with Financial Services. 

 
Saturna Local Trust Committee 
Regular Business Meeting 
February 16, 2023 ADOPTED Page 6 of 7 
16.5 Bylaw notification requirements on Saturna 
  Trustee Middleton spoke to discussion at LT Council.   
   SA-2023-008 
   It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
that it be resolved that Clause 2 in Saturna Local Trust Committee Bylaw 30 – A 
Bylaw to Authorize Inspection of Alleged Infractions Against Regulations – is 
replaced on an interim basis with the wording of Clause 14.1 from Saturna Local 
Trust Committee Bylaw 119 – Land Use Bylaws amalgamated.  This clause reads 
“The Island Trust Bylaw Enforcement Officer or any other person designated by 
the Saturna Island Local Trust Committee to administer this Bylaw is authorized 
to enter, at any reasonable time and after having given 24 hours prior 
notification to the occupier, upon any property that is subject to regulation 
under this Bylaw, for the purpose of determining whether the regulations are 
being observed.”  This Standing Resolution will remain in place until such time a 
review of Bylaw No. 30 and Bylaw No. 119 Section 1.4 “Inspection and 
Enforcement” can be reviewed and re-enacted through public process 
embodying Bylaw Enforcement Best Practices outlined in the 2022 
Ombudsperson of British Columbia report concerning Local Government Bylaw 
Enforcement Policy and Practice.   
CARRIED 
 
17. UPCOMING MEETINGS 
17.1 Next Regular Meeting Scheduled for May 18, 2023 at the Saturna Recreation and 
Cultural Centre, Saturna Island 
 
18. TOWN HALL  
Priscilla Ewbank:  spoke in appreciation of Planner Smith’s attention to detail, professionalism 
and thoughtful decisions and considerations. 
A member of the public:  regarding building inspections the Home Owner’s Warranty needs to 
be a factor in the discussion.  Some builders have official certification while other don’t. 
SA-2023-009 
It was MOVED and SECONDED,  
That Saturna Island Local Trust Committee direct staff to place “Review of Bylaw 
No. 30 and Bylaw No. 119” on the Projects List to embody Best Bylaw Practices 
as outline in the Ombudsperson Report 2022. 
CARRIED 
19. CLOSED MEETING – None 
  

 
Saturna Local Trust Committee 
Regular Business Meeting 
February 16, 2023 ADOPTED Page 7 of 7 
 
20. ADJOURNMENT 
By general consent, the meeting was adjourned at 2:15 p.m. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
_________________________ 
David Maude, Chair 
 
 
Certified Correct: 
 
_________________________ 
Pat Todd, Recorder