Islands Trust Council regular meeting, November 10, 2023

[0:00:13] Voice 8: Well,

[0:00:15] Voice 16: we are live, and we are all present, and this is the regular business meeting of

[0:00:21] Voice 16: the Southpender LTC.

[0:00:22] Voice 16: Thank you to the members of the public for coming today, and local trustees for sitting

[0:00:28] Voice 16: in the room and being amazing as always.

[0:00:31] Voice 16: My name is Toby Elliott.

[0:00:33] Voice 16: I'm the chair of the Southpender Local Trust Committee.

[0:00:37] Voice 16: I'm elected on Gabriel Island.

[0:00:39] Voice 16: And this is my first term serving as trustee.

[0:00:42] Voice 16: And I think we're all just about to celebrate our first year together.

[0:00:46] Voice 16: November 17th was inauguration day.

[0:00:50] Voice 16: So it kind of feels interesting to be back in this room.

[0:00:54] Voice 16: This was the first LTT meeting that I got to chair.

[0:00:58] Voice 16: So we've all been on the learning curve together.

[0:01:02] Voice 16: I'd like to acknowledge that we're meeting on stands

[0:01:07] Voice 16: in the traditional unceded territories,

[0:01:09] Voice 16: and many other Coast Salish people who've been moving and living and working and playing in these lands and waters since the time immemorial, and it is my immense pleasure and honour to be able to visit these places and learn the unique

[0:01:29] Voice 16: um histories and the present day relationships that first nations continue to have that we're

[0:01:36] Voice 16: starting to work together to build some cultural connections between settlers and first nations

[0:01:45] Voice 16: hopefully we won't have to use those kinds of titles one day we'll just be people

[0:01:49] Voice 16: living on the land together i think that would be wonderful i'd like to call this meeting to order

[0:01:55] Voice 16: It is 10 32, and we have an agenda before us.

[0:02:03] Voice 16: Trustees like to Oh, i'm sorry what do you introduce yourselves?

[0:02:08] Voice 16: I apologize

[0:02:09] Voice 8: rushing

[0:02:11] Voice 16: through hi i'm Christina Evans.

[0:02:15] Voice 16: I'm a down on point. I've been your locally elected trustee now for almost a year.

[0:02:20] Voice 16: So this, like Chair Elliott said, it's been, I remember first sitting up here, it was very nerve-wracking, but yeah, I've got to say it's been a pleasure, and I've loved working with everybody, so thank you.

[0:02:36] Voice 4: Hi, I'm Mike Falk, and I've been here a year as well, and it's still nerve-wracking.

[0:02:43] Voice 4: So I'm happy to be here, though, yeah.

[0:02:45] Voice 4: Thank you.

[0:02:46] Voice 4: And

[0:02:46] Voice 16: we've got Kim Stockfield.

[0:02:48] Voice 16: Hello, everybody.

[0:02:49] Voice 16: I've been here 10 years.

[0:02:51] Voice 16: I'm still nerve-wracking.

[0:02:55] Voice 16: You're wonderfully, amily supporting us,

[0:02:58] Voice 16: and I'm always grateful when you come in person.

[0:03:00] Voice 16: It's really good to have the support.

[0:03:02] Voice 16: And in the background, we've got staff in the CILC office,

[0:03:07] Voice 16: Carly Bilney, our recorder.

[0:03:09] Voice 16: Welcome.

[0:03:10] Voice 16: We haven't seen you at this LTP before,

[0:03:12] Voice 16: but thank you for being on hand today to take minutes.

[0:03:16] Voice 16: So back to the agenda.

[0:03:18] Voice 16: Is there anything to be added or changed

[0:03:26] Voice 16: Okay, so we'll adopt the agenda as presented, and move into our trustee report.

[0:03:35] Voice 16: So I just wanted to start by saying how grateful I am to be a part of this community, and to

[0:03:43] Voice 16: show up and be at these meetings and see everybody here, it's very grateful for the amount of

[0:03:50] Voice 16: support and involvement that this community shows. This is a place where neighbors truly show up for

[0:03:58] Voice 16: each other and truly care about one another. This has been an historically passionate island

[0:04:04] Voice 16: where people are very engaged which is something a lot of municipalities really strive for and

[0:04:09] Voice 16: we have it so I'm very proud of that. I'd also like to say how impressed I am for

[0:04:14] Voice 16: for how everyone comes out and joins us at our many meetings and stays engaged and has been

[0:04:23] Voice 16: very open to speak on some sensitive topics with grace and compassion. So I just want to say thank

[0:04:28] Voice 16: you for that. You make me very proud to be a public servant and I'll continue to work hard

[0:04:33] Voice 16: on your behalf. So as a brief update, and I did write into the Pender Post this time, I tend to

[0:04:40] Voice 16: be very private and I'm not very good at writing publicly so I'm going to try and do better there.

[0:04:48] Voice 16: So we had our Trust Council meeting on September 26th and 28th here on North Manda and I'll let

[0:04:54] Voice 16: the other trustees talk about that. I'll just give you a quick brief update on the

[0:05:00] Voice 16: meetings that we've had since our last LTC meeting. So the Trust Programs Committee,

[0:05:05] Voice 16: we had our last meeting on November 6th and we discussed the upcoming speaker series

[0:05:09] Voice 16: that includes available wildfire webinar resources

[0:05:13] Voice 16: and the results from the stewardship education survey

[0:05:16] Voice 16: that went out in September.

[0:05:18] Voice 16: We received an update

[0:05:20] Voice 16: on the Living in the Trust Area project,

[0:05:22] Voice 16: discussing the Trust Area mailing program

[0:05:24] Voice 16: with two updated publications,

[0:05:27] Voice 16: which is planned to go out to 309 new purchases

[0:05:30] Voice 16: within the Trust Area.

[0:05:33] Voice 16: And those were the government

[0:05:35] Voice 16: and other resource contact sheets

[0:05:37] Voice 16: combined with the land use planning contact info.

[0:05:39] Voice 16: and a stewardship tips brochure has been updated within the Think About Trees section.

[0:05:45] Voice 16: We received an update on the trust policy statement status and a reporting back from the joint working group comprised of trust programs

[0:05:53] Voice 16: and regional planning committee members on the applicability of the coming Montfield global biodiversity framework as it relates to the Arnhemst Trust area.

[0:06:02] Voice 16: area. For the financial planning committee we met on October 18th and November 8th and we're

[0:06:10] Voice 16: reviewing the current draft budget that includes the Q2 standard projected forecast for the remainder

[0:06:16] Voice 16: of this fiscal year. The group walked through various sections of the budget draft to explain

[0:06:22] Voice 16: changes from the previous years and this year's budget needs and so these were all going to be

[0:06:28] Voice 16: We've had our meetings and the live sessions will be up soon.

[0:06:34] Voice 16: The Corporate Planning Working Group.

[0:06:38] Voice 16: At the past Trust Council meeting that we had,

[0:06:40] Voice 16: the project charter was endorsed and the working group has been charged

[0:06:43] Voice 16: with continuing its work as presented.

[0:06:45] Voice 16: The working group met on November 7th to discuss next steps

[0:06:49] Voice 16: in the development of the overall process,

[0:06:51] Voice 16: including reviewing of existing policies and procedures with the CAO

[0:06:55] Voice 16: to identify gaps and suggest changes as needed

[0:06:58] Voice 16: to bring the current processes into alignment with the corporate planning process. The vision

[0:07:04] Voice 16: and mission statement work that began at the September Trust Council meeting is identified

[0:07:09] Voice 16: as an important input into any strategy work that may begin in the next year.

[0:07:14] Voice 16: The Reconciliation Learning Group, I missed the first meeting due to a scheduling conflict as I

[0:07:21] Voice 16: was on the road visiting my grandchildren and since then Robin Keithy has resigned and I'm

[0:07:26] Voice 16: I'm not sure of the status of the group at the moment, but I'm hoping it will continue.

[0:07:31] Voice 16: And for the animals in Southern Gulf Island, Durham, I missed the last couple of meetings due to scheduling conflicts,

[0:07:37] Voice 16: but I'm hoping to attend the next one on Monday.

[0:07:39] Voice 16: And I will put all of this together in a report and put that in the Pender Post and in the trustee corner as well.

[0:07:47] Voice 8: Thank you, Trustee Evans.

[0:07:51] Voice 16: Trustee Falk, anything to report out on?

[0:07:54] Voice 16: After

[0:07:54] Voice 14: all that, I don't know.

[0:07:58] Voice 4: No, thank you for all of that, but that's good information, and you're keeping on top of things

[0:08:03] Voice 4: that sometimes I'm not as involved with, so that's great. I've been participating in the

[0:08:11] Voice 4: Reconciliation First Nations Learning Group, and I've been kind of excited about that, but now,

[0:08:18] Voice 4: like you mentioned, that's maybe a change, and we'll get an update on that maybe, but

[0:08:24] Voice 4: Robin, but that's a good thing. One thing I'm wondering is access to these meetings online.

[0:08:36] Voice 4: And apparently we can't do that because of budgeting, because if we asked for that

[0:08:43] Voice 4: through our system here, we would have to, in fairness to all the other Gulf Islands,

[0:08:50] Voice 4: have a budget for all of them to be able to do that and apparently that's uh not uh we're not

[0:08:58] Voice 4: sure if that can happen like there's a there's a license i think maybe maybe somebody else can

[0:09:02] Voice 4: update me on this later but sorry which meetings in specific these meetings here okay i'm i'm

[0:09:08] Voice 4: wishing for people sitting at home or being in mexico or wherever to be able

[0:09:13] Voice 16: to participate to

[0:09:15] Voice 4: be able to participate rather than just listening to the meetings because we talked about the

[0:09:20] Voice 4: ability for people to participate and I made strong statements that I think everybody has

[0:09:24] Voice 4: the right to do that and so

[0:09:25] Voice 4: I want to make sure all the avenues are open for that right

[0:09:28] Voice 16: so

[0:09:28] Voice 4: I'm wondering if there's a workaround that we can do and I've thought you know experienced this

[0:09:34] Voice 4: in other groups that I've done in my work is anybody can have a zoom link for for free and

[0:09:41] Voice 4: And many people have Zoom accounts or whatever, and or Teams or just many of them, right?

[0:09:47] Voice 4: We could just, I could have a second computer here and I could just have a link for everybody to go on in and they could speak through that link.

[0:09:58] Voice 4: So I'm just bringing this up. We don't have, we'll discuss it later.

[0:10:01] Voice 4: I actually

[0:10:02] Voice 4: have some additional information.

[0:10:04] Voice 4: Okay, great.

[0:10:04] Voice 4: So this

[0:10:05] Voice 16: came out from the Financial Planning Committee.

[0:10:06] Voice 16: So can we have a discussion about access to LTC meetings in new business, perhaps, if there's something that we want to talk about together?

[0:10:15] Voice 16: Well, we've already adopted the agenda.

[0:10:18] Voice 16: Yes, but in your reporting out, you're asking questions.

[0:10:21] Voice 16: So now we may have to just make, just for the ease of the minute, take her, because we're moving into discussion.

[0:10:29] Voice 16: discussion.

[0:10:30] Voice 4: Right. I'm open to moving it to where I just want to say that I'm concerned about that

[0:10:36] Voice 4: and I want to see if we can find solutions to it and hopefully if we don't talk about it and figure

[0:10:42] Voice 4: something else out I will attempt to do that at the next meeting to just run it through like just

[0:10:48] Voice 4: have another computer and have people able to participate.

[0:10:50] Voice 16: I was just going to say my statement

[0:10:52] Voice 16: is very quick. It's a Microsoft question. In the financial planning committee it was raised that

[0:10:58] Voice 16: there is a the current zoom license and the laptops based on the um the windows that they're

[0:11:05] Voice 16: using is going through obsolescence so they're going to have to move to a new platform and

[0:11:10] Voice 16: they're going to bring in teams once we move to teams that might resolve that issue okay and what

[0:11:17] Voice 16: i would add to that is that we have funded a meeting facilitator position and the intention

[0:11:22] Voice 16: of that was to be able to manage our hybrid meeting so that people could participate from

[0:11:28] Voice 16: from home but it has taken nine months to post that position and get the PSAC whatever it is

[0:11:38] Voice 16: that is the public service agency's requirement for it but that meeting position would be managing

[0:11:45] Voice 16: online participation that was the intent of the meeting facilitator position that was approved

[0:11:51] Voice 16: at Trust Cancer so when we're having discussions like this it's like if you would like to discuss

[0:11:56] Voice 16: that something that we can have a conversation rather than anyway back to trustees thank you

[0:12:07] Voice 14: yeah that's it for me cool

[0:12:08] Voice 16: okay um uh so reporting out from trust council i'm not sure

[0:12:16] Voice 16: how many folks would have attended um it was a it was lovely to have it on pender uh the penders

[0:12:23] Voice 16: um i would say the the visioning process that we went through was potentially um it would have been

[0:12:33] Voice 16: such a great landing to to be able to land that vision together the islands trust as a whole does

[0:12:39] Voice 16: not have a vision we have a mandate we've got permission we've got a work to do but what is

[0:12:45] Voice 16: the vision the islands trust conservancy actually has a vision statement and so um we did these uh

[0:12:51] Voice 16: um somewhat loose sessions where everybody got to break out into groups and discuss um

[0:12:56] Voice 16: and articulate what we thought could be a vision and we we landed pretty close to a good draft but

[0:13:01] Voice 16: the question was how do we relate to first nations on visioning for the trust how can we

[0:13:09] Voice 16: can we put forward a vision that is uh you know our vision you know for our various communities

[0:13:17] Voice 16: and yet not include how can we create a process in which the voices

[0:13:23] Voice 16: and perspectives of First Nations are part of that vision.

[0:13:27] Voice 16: We were thankful to have Ian Pelkey here from the Lucenic Leadership Council.

[0:13:33] Voice 16: He's a community engagement person and elder,

[0:13:37] Voice 16: and he offered a wonderful vision from the perspective of the Lucenic people

[0:13:43] Voice 16: for the area and that was really fruitful it's um so it's an ongoing conversation and we're going

[0:13:51] Voice 16: to be working towards that in our december trust council meeting how can we create a vision that

[0:13:56] Voice 16: will stand and yet be open enough that first nations and many people groups can see themselves

[0:14:02] Voice 16: in this vision so it's not exclusionary so that's the it's always the tension that we're walking

[0:14:08] Voice 16: with, how to honor and respect and include without speaking for other people. So that was one key

[0:14:15] Voice 16: element. I've been following the debates in the legislature around housing, in particular,

[0:14:24] Voice 16: Bill 44, the housing statutes bill, and the STVR, this short-term vacation rentals, accommodations,

[0:14:33] Voice 16: recommendations, regulations, and there is quite a bit of lively debate among our staff

[0:14:39] Voice 16: how that might implicate the Islands Trust areas. At this point, we believe, or our ministry

[0:14:46] Voice 16: staff has said it would be up to local trust committees to decide whether they opt in to

[0:14:52] Voice 16: some of the programs. This could not be a trust council-wide adoption, so any increases

[0:14:57] Voice 16: and density or um regulating short-term vacation rentals that discussion will have to be held at

[0:15:04] Voice 16: the LTC level so that's the information we have so far um and then in regards to reconciliation

[0:15:11] Voice 16: learning group I was very involved with Robin Keffey in um early strategy sessions for how we

[0:15:20] Voice 16: might um administer this group because it's not a committee it doesn't have the same structure as a

[0:15:29] Voice 16: committee it was meant to be a group where trustees can come even with staff or senior staff as peers

[0:15:35] Voice 16: and we're just learning together we're airing some of the the concerns and the issues how do

[0:15:40] Voice 16: we address this um asking those stupid questions that we all need to ask as we're learning um so

[0:15:47] Voice 16: So the intent is that the learning group is going forward.

[0:15:50] Voice 16: There has been, and I think Claire said this, that culturally committed, which is a group

[0:15:56] Voice 16: that I've been part of for over a year, and it is a group of Coast Salish mentors who

[0:16:04] Voice 16: are committed to helping settler folk and people who are not Indigenous with these tricky

[0:16:10] Voice 16: questions of territorial um and and land sharing and protocol and um and so i think the intent is

[0:16:21] Voice 16: to continue with that and we've got a but the i'm not sure who's got the leadership on that group

[0:16:29] Voice 16: but the group's not going to not happen from my understanding um i think that's all i'll report

[0:16:37] Voice 16: out. I don't want to take too much time. So yes, just chair's report. We don't have an electoral

[0:16:46] Voice 16: area director's report. And so now we move into town hall questions.

[0:16:51] Voice 11: Are questions from the floor

[0:16:53] Voice 11: permitted? Absolutely. I'm just wondering if the First Nations has actually articulated a vision

[0:16:59] Voice 11: for the Gulf Islands or any part of the islands, which comes first, the First Nations vision or

[0:17:08] Voice 11: the gulf islands ltc vision

[0:17:11] Voice 16: that's that is the question that's um we don't want to presume

[0:17:16] Voice 16: that we would articulate a vision for the whole area that would exclude anyone else but it's going

[0:17:24] Voice 16: to be i i think the balance is that if we wait to hear from 39 first nations which each individual

[0:17:32] Voice 16: or a collective vision might be um it it's going to be challenging to offer a vision so

[0:17:41] Voice 16: we can hold a vision and i think first nations can hold a vision and they're not going to

[0:17:45] Voice 16: necessarily be in collision but that's a conversation we need to hold that openly

[0:17:50] Voice 16: and i don't think there's a question of prioritizing one over the other and so we're

[0:17:55] Voice 14: going

[0:17:55] Voice 16: to add that Southpanda has a vision statement. It's the trust area, trust council

[0:18:02] Voice 16: that doesn't currently. Is it the vision statement that you're referring to, the proposed one at the

[0:18:10] Voice 16: last OCP? No, it's

[0:18:13] Voice 16: already in place. Southpanda has an adopted vision. That's wonderful. And we

[0:18:18] Voice 16: have this vision statement, not a vision paragraph or a vision page. Okay. We have a vision statement

[0:18:23] Voice 16: and I

[0:18:24] Voice 16: read that out at the last one that's our current thank you statement

[0:18:26] Voice 16: excellent

[0:18:32] Voice 16: sure and if you could please say your name before you ask a question has any anybody else like to

[0:18:38] Voice 16: address the LTC ask a question speak to an issue um do please keep your comments in a they always

[0:18:44] Voice 16: are respectful kind and mindful that this is a workplace yes in the back Heather party

[0:18:51] Voice 14: just with regard to first nations um will we be and maybe i missed something but will we be

[0:18:58] Voice 14: updated on what's going on in these meetings because sometimes i feel like we're not hearing

[0:19:04] Voice 14: um you know what first nations might be thinking or what the what the whole group might be thinking

[0:19:13] Voice 14: and i i

[0:19:13] Voice 16: think that's something that we need to hear well that's a great question i we have

[0:19:20] Voice 16: requested that a report and a standing line item be added to all of our agendas going forward

[0:19:28] Voice 16: on reconciliation of First Nations Relationship Building and specifically for this LTC.

[0:19:35] Voice 16: So this is the opportunity for reporting out on local topics and opportunities for relationship

[0:19:42] Voice 16: building. So we are going to get to that in this agenda. However, the Reconciliation Learning Group

[0:19:48] Voice 16: is for trustees and staff for internal learning because we need to learn how to do things in a

[0:19:55] Voice 16: good way so that the way that we make decisions is respectful of First Nations it's not going to

[0:20:01] Voice 16: be applied broad scale to all nations they're everyone is different all the local contexts

[0:20:05] Voice 16: are different so I think this way is going to be how we can report out on local topics of interest

[0:20:14] Voice 16: and we'll get to that does that answer your question yes well just maybe the other thing

[0:20:19] Voice 16: that I would

[0:20:19] Voice 14: think about is are all nations who are you know would sort of have been part of this

[0:20:28] Voice 14: territory are they all involved or no yeah

[0:20:31] Voice 16: that's definitely a conversation for sure it's it's asking

[0:20:36] Voice 16: and requesting and waiting to see who would like to be involved and to what level we cannot

[0:20:44] Voice 16: not expect we can only ask julie rankin found with us um what what has the reply been how many

[0:20:52] Voice 16: of the groups have you heard back from or are you getting replies about the reconciliation

[0:20:58] Voice 16: learning group uh just about about um we're just talking about the vision and and

[0:21:04] Voice 8: and that

[0:21:05] Voice 16: can stimulate you getting involvement from them on that oh

[0:21:08] Voice 8: the vision statement

[0:21:09] Voice 16: okay um no we have

[0:21:12] Voice 16: have not yet reached out to all the nations in the trust area and said what do you what would be your

[0:21:17] Voice 16: vision for the trust but I think that is the conversation in December how might we do that

[0:21:22] Voice 16: how how to respectfully ask and then not assume that that's ours to appropriate it's a conversation

[0:21:31] Voice 16: I don't know how

[0:21:32] Voice 10: to ask you haven't even

[0:21:32] Voice 16: asked the question yet we just started the conversation

[0:21:35] Voice 16: in September okay yeah we

[0:21:37] Voice 16: just broached the subject and that was a result of the um the

[0:21:41] Voice 16: the corporate planning process working through saying the trust area does not

[0:21:45] Voice 16: have a vision statement.

[0:21:46] Voice 16: This isn't an integral element to any strategy.

[0:21:50] Voice 16: This has to be addressed.

[0:21:52] Voice 16: So the conversation started in September and it will continue in December.

[0:21:57] Voice 16: So we're early days.

[0:21:59] Voice 8: You

[0:21:59] Voice 16: know, 50 years.

[0:22:02] Voice 16: Let's just celebrate our 50th anniversary.

[0:22:05] Voice 16: Like a vision for the future, right? Not where we've been.

[0:22:08] Voice 16: Yes, it's not, the legislation statement is not to just be representative of today, it should stand for 100, 200 years of the future.

[0:22:16] Voice 16: So that is very important, yeah.

[0:22:18] Voice 13: Yes, sir?

[0:22:20] Voice 13: Paul Petrie, just in relation to Julie's and Heather's comments in terms of feedback from First Nations,

[0:22:30] Voice 13: We did get some feedback from the Osanich First Nation Elders Council to the bylaw 123 statement of acknowledgement.

[0:22:41] It was a very positive and supportive statement that's available.

[0:22:46] Voice 13: I think I've shared it with trustees. Unfortunately, I'm

[0:22:50] Voice 16: just going to interrupt.

[0:22:51] Voice 16: Unfortunately, because that was received, I

[0:22:53] Voice 13: was just going to say that.

[0:22:55] Voice 13: And unfortunately, that was received after the issue had gone to the trust executive who referred it to the minister post-public hearing.

[0:23:12] Their views were not allowed to be considered because of the nature of closure

[0:23:17] Voice 13: after a public hearing.

[0:23:20] Voice 13: However, we do have the statement in Bylaw 123, as it had been presented, that's available for anybody.

[0:23:29] And we do have the statement from the elders in response to that.

[0:23:34] So we know their views on that.

[0:23:37] But that doesn't impact

[0:23:39] Voice 13: our OCP because Bylaw 123 was rejected by the trustees.

[0:23:45] Voice 16: I'm just going to interject here.

[0:23:48] Voice 16: unfortunately because that information was received post public hearing we cannot look at it

[0:23:52] Voice 16: and we cannot disseminate it that was the issue so if they wanted to rewrite something in as a general

[0:24:00] Voice 16: topic then we can receive it but because it was received post post public hearing we can't even

[0:24:06] Voice 16: receive it does that does that help if they if they can rewrite it we can we can then bring it

[0:24:14] Voice 16: forward. It can be reconsidered again if the question's

[0:24:17] Voice 16: reopened. Since now the bylaw, the LTC

[0:24:21] Voice 16: by resolution decided to proceed no further, you can

[0:24:24] Voice 16: now, it has been received and the LTC can look

[0:24:27] Voice 16: at it. Oh, we can. Thank

[0:24:28] Voice 16: you. I misunderstood the process. Yeah, great. Thank you.

[0:24:33] Voice 16: And I'm happy to share. Please resend it if that's okay, maybe. Yeah, I think that's helpful.

[0:24:39] Voice 16: want to proceed yeah yes no yes shelly henshaw himself bender um just at the risk of being a

[0:24:46] Voice 16: little antagonistic i don't want to talk about bill 123 right whether it's right or wrong or

[0:24:52] Voice 16: anything like that but it seems that the islands trust executive has done about face um about

[0:24:59] Voice 16: consultation with first nations household so i'm going to be honest trust executive to advise the

[0:25:07] Voice 16: the trustees about uh procedure and what's appropriate and i would think that would

[0:25:14] Voice 16: include submissions and bylaws that are going to the minister of municipalities and

[0:25:22] Voice 16: so you're talking about first nations are going to be included we're going to listen to them

[0:25:28] Voice 16: they're going to be involved we're not going to impose anything on them but my reading of 123 was

[0:25:36] Voice 16: that's what happened so it seems the islands trust executive has now done a boat face and says yeah

[0:25:42] Voice 16: we're going to listen we're going to wait for first nations as long as it takes we're going to

[0:25:46] Voice 16: work on getting something that they they want that was different though from when 123 went

[0:25:55] Voice 16: absolutely the argument was hey we haven't heard from first nations um so the feedback

[0:26:02] Voice 16: from the minister was in response to bylaw 123 which was recognized by the executive and then

[0:26:11] Voice 16: sent on to the minister for approval it must go through that process and the minister's feedback

[0:26:16] Voice 16: was it doesn't appear that there has been any consultation with first nations because of course

[0:26:22] Voice 16: that was not included and so it was the minister herself who said it looks like there needs to be

[0:26:30] Voice 16: be some more work done. And at that point, this LTC decided to proceed no further. So I'm not

[0:26:36] Voice 16: sure how the executive did it. My understanding is that the executive guides us, right? We put

[0:26:44] Voice 16: questions to the Island Trust executive. They provide guidance with form and procedure, etc.

[0:26:51] Voice 16: And I'm saying they missed the boat on this one. Absolutely. It's

[0:26:56] Voice 16: a very much a

[0:26:57] Voice 16: learning journey

[0:26:59] Voice 16: yeah and where we were at four years ago and three years ago two years ago is quite

[0:27:04] Voice 16: we're progressing day by day trying to do the right thing but i don't know if i can speak for

[0:27:09] Voice 16: previous ecs it's not a unilateral body that does everything in the same way we look for adherence

[0:27:16] Voice 16: to policies and ocps that's that's actually the job is to make sure that the bylaws that come

[0:27:23] Voice 16: forward um are consistent and within the scope of those and so it approved it because it was

[0:27:30] Voice 16: consistent with the ocp and the policies we can't reject it just because we have an opinion about it

[0:27:36] Voice 16: but then the minister returned it and said we need to do more work okay he seems to be going

[0:27:41] Voice 16: in circles because my understanding is what you just said previously i'll agree with you how about

[0:27:46] Voice 16: with that. Okay. I was going to add in as well, the same as we have new trustees sitting up here,

[0:27:54] Voice 16: and we may do things slightly differently. The EC has also undergone the change during

[0:27:58] Voice 16: the elections, and we'll

[0:27:59] Voice 16: also proceed slightly differently. So it's new people,

[0:28:02] Voice 8: new

[0:28:03] Voice 16: understandings.

[0:28:16] Voice 8: This

[0:28:16] Voice 16: is your town hall, folks. So whatever topics you'd like to speak to, yes.

[0:28:22] Voice 12: I'm wondering if we, sorry, Daphne Turco, wondering if we can get an update on your major project.

[0:28:29] Voice 16: That's in the agenda.

[0:28:30] Voice 16: Sweet.

[0:28:31] Voice 16: Yeah. Item 14.1, the Land Use By-law Review Project.

[0:28:35] Voice 5: Perfect.

[0:28:37] Voice 5: Minor project. It's minor project.

[0:28:39] Voice 16: Yeah.

[0:28:39] Voice 16: I'm sorry.

[0:28:41] Voice 16: Well, it's major.

[0:28:42] Voice 16: But

[0:28:42] Voice 5: important to some.

[0:28:44] Voice 5: It's important to some.

[0:28:46] Voice 16: Any other questions? Yes, Paul Petrie.

[0:28:49] Voice 13: Paul Petrie, yes.

[0:28:49] Voice 13: Yes. So just on the minor work project, I've read the staff report that was posted last

[0:28:58] Friday.

[0:29:00] Voice 13: I'm very concerned that the trustees are intent on focusing the work of the LTC

[0:29:05] Voice 13: over the next year or so on reviewing the changes to our land use bylaw before they've

[0:29:11] Voice 13: had a chance to work. These changes would result in at least 14 public meetings before

[0:29:19] Voice 13: the compromise values were adopted after a full public hearing. The changes in my view are

[0:29:27] Voice 13: generous when you consider that the average house size on this island is just under 2,000

[0:29:32] Voice 13: square feet. Those values were well above that. There have been two applications for variances

[0:29:40] Voice 13: under the change with the land use by-law, both of which were approved, so that there's

[0:29:46] Voice 13: clearly flexibility there. There's also protection for neighbors when a variance request is brought

[0:29:55] Voice 13: in so their concerns can be considered. That's a very positive thing.

[0:30:00] Voice 13: There's protection to landholders, owners to rebuild in the event of destruction by fire or whatever, without any further restrictions.

[0:30:10] Voice 13: That is a positive. So there's many positives here.

[0:30:13] Voice 13: And my view is that it really should be given a chance to work before it's placed under review.

[0:30:22] And I guess my bottom line is to spend a budget of $8,500 to redo work that has been done without giving the work that's been done a chance to

[0:30:39] Voice 13: work is really, I guess, wasteful in my view of tax dollars.

[0:30:47] So I have a concern

[0:30:49] Voice 13: about that, and I just wanted to share that with the trustees.

[0:30:52] Voice 13: I do appreciate the work that you do.

[0:30:55] Voice 13: I'm very appreciative of Trustee Evans' report back from the committee that you've been doing.

[0:31:03] Trustee Falk's idea of more inclusive meetings, particularly with COVID still stirring around.

[0:31:12] and also the work that Chair Elliott is doing with respect to reconciliation, all positive.

[0:31:19] So while I bring my concerns to you, it's not all an avenue.

[0:31:24] Voice 13: I just want to say I do think that we're headed down a very unfortunate path in the next 12 to 18 months.

[0:31:32] Voice 14: Thank

[0:31:33] Voice 16: you for your comments.

[0:31:34] Voice 16: yeah

[0:31:35] Voice 12: with reference to the land use bylaw um i'm not sure if everyone in this room is aware but

[0:31:46] Voice 12: every time somebody applies for a development variance permit they have to pay nineteen hundred

[0:31:51] Voice 12: dollars and not everybody can afford to take nineteen hundred dollars out of their building

[0:32:00] Voice 12: budget and throw it away and hope for flexibility because you don't get that back if you're rejected

[0:32:09] Voice 12: so you don't get it back if you're rejected i went through the process so um and being as we

[0:32:18] Voice 12: are two pensioners we have a very fixed budget so to blithely say that people can just go ahead

[0:32:26] Voice 12: and apply for a variance I think is not really a fair assessment because $1,900 means something

[0:32:36] Voice 12: to my house and so I don't I don't think that's fair to say that. I am concerned about land use

[0:32:49] Voice 12: on this island as I'm sure everybody is here. We're all concerned about the environment on

[0:32:56] Voice 12: this island and water use and all of that including you know reconciliation respect for the land

[0:33:04] Voice 12: so when you start to talk about people's personal finances or how people are living on their own

[0:33:12] Voice 12: land especially when nobody can even see their house i think that we're starting to push into

[0:33:21] Voice 12: to areas where people really shouldn't be interfering.

[0:33:26] Voice 12: Yeah,

[0:33:26] Voice 10: I would agree with that.

[0:33:30] Voice 12: Okay, so we're

[0:33:31] Voice 16: not having a vote.

[0:33:33] Voice 8: Everyone is a cheat.

[0:33:35] Voice 8: We

[0:33:35] Voice 16: express your opinion.

[0:33:37] Voice 16: Thank you for your comments.

[0:33:38] Voice 16: Can I have a comment?

[0:33:41] Voice 16: Just let's let the, okay, sure.

[0:33:44] Voice 16: Go for it.

[0:33:45] Voice 16: I was just going to say,

[0:33:46] Voice 16: this is going to be part of the process.

[0:33:48] Voice 16: It's going to be exploring options.

[0:33:50] Voice 16: actions we're going to be going through the process there was um a lot of people on this

[0:33:58] Voice 16: island that are feeling um what's the word that i'm looking for imposed on isn't the word i'm

[0:34:06] Voice 16: looking for i can't think of it um i mean yeah

[0:34:11] Voice 8: that's

[0:34:13] Voice 16: not the word i'm thinking of either

[0:34:18] Voice 16: and there's a lot of people that feel that the way that this had gone to address their needs so

[0:34:26] Voice 16: there are so what i'm hearing is there's two sides where there is a discrepancy of meeting needs so

[0:34:35] Voice 16: going through this process to try and bring us back together like have have more people feel

[0:34:41] Voice 16: heard have more people feel that everything is being respected is the reason why we're going

[0:34:48] Voice 16: through this process and I know that there have been a number of meetings over the over the

[0:34:55] Voice 16: previous term a lot of people felt that it was cut short so we're continuing on with that okay

[0:35:00] Voice 10: Debbie

[0:35:01] Voice 16: Friesen oh sorry I just found out this

[0:35:04] Voice 4: excuse me yeah Gordie Duncan um I'd just like

[0:35:09] Voice 4: to remind everyone that prior to the last term we went through the same process at length and

[0:35:20] Voice 4: developed new plans which I think some in the room know quite a bit about because they're pretty much

[0:35:27] Voice 4: written off the one submitted letter. It didn't seem to stop the last term trustees from bringing

[0:35:34] Voice 4: it all back again even though we already had from the previous term a whole new set of building

[0:35:42] Voice 4: guidelines that were significantly smaller than other like areas. The other thing that I would

[0:35:52] Voice 4: like to mention that a very conservative estimate and I can back these up with numbers that probably

[0:36:01] Voice 4: Probably, conservatively, 25% of the homes on South Bender Island, as a result of By-law 122, are now legal non-conforming.

[0:36:11] Voice 4: I think that's absolutely unnecessary, uncalled for, and unsubstantiated as to why we are having such a large percentage of our homes being legal non-conforming.

[0:36:28] Voice 4: And I don't mean from a perspective that say, well, if your house burns down, you can rebuild it.

[0:36:35] Voice 4: That's one small facet, but there's a very nasty little line at the bottom of that statement that says the owner may well have to prove what they had before they lost it.

[0:36:53] Voice 4: So that's something that's undefined, and we don't know what that means.

[0:36:58] Voice 4: So I think to review one more time, it is not going to hurt because I don't believe that most of the sizes that were developed were compromised in any way.

[0:37:13] Voice 4: They were dictated to us, and that's what we got.

[0:37:17] Voice 4: Thank you.

[0:37:18] Voice 8: Thank you,

[0:37:19] Voice 16: sir, for your comments.

[0:37:21] Voice 16: Yeah.

[0:37:21] Voice 16: Oh, sorry, the

[0:37:22] Voice 16: lady in front first.

[0:37:26] Voice 10: Hi, Debbie Friesen.

[0:37:27] Voice 10: I agree with Gord with what he's saying that we were dictated to we were told that they had the

[0:37:35] Voice 10: mandate when we came to the meetings a lot of us came to the meetings and other people didn't they

[0:37:41] Voice 10: said they were afraid to come to the meetings when actually nobody has ever I've never ever seen

[0:37:48] Voice 10: anybody being rude to to you people in all the meetings I've come I've seen it at the

[0:37:56] Voice 10: north pender but not at the south and so but so i couldn't understand why people would say they're

[0:38:02] Voice 10: afraid to come to the meetings instead they supposedly met at the bakery which isn't

[0:38:08] Voice 10: appropriate they're supposed to come to the meetings or writing letters and they weren't

[0:38:12] Voice 10: and then that gives people power to just pull names out of a hat or actually they never gave

[0:38:18] Voice 10: us names that was also very convenient i didn't feel we were listened to at all and the one time

[0:38:23] Voice 10: I stood up and said, I felt ignored. My husband stood up and said, Well, you aren't feeling it,

[0:38:29] Voice 10: you are being ignored. And there was, I felt like there was just about a riot, because people were

[0:38:34] Voice 10: so upset. And so we were, we were ignored, we weren't listened to, we were the majority.

[0:38:42] Voice 10: And so yes, we have to bring this up. And healing does have to happen. Because I know,

[0:38:48] Voice 10: I don't feel very trustful. And I feel the divide. And I don't like the divide, the way

[0:38:53] Voice 10: way anybody else likes it it's not nice you know we have to to move forward we have to discuss it

[0:39:03] Voice 10: and just because it came it doesn't even i know legally it has to be but none of us asked for

[0:39:11] Voice 10: this change the trustees brought this forth on top of a zillion other bylaws just

[0:39:23] Voice 12: there's got to be common ground we have common ground here

[0:39:27] Voice 3: definitely

[0:39:28] Voice 12: sorry and i don't like

[0:39:31] Voice 12: conflict either i hate conflict as a matter of fact which is kind of a funny word to use when

[0:39:37] Voice 12: i'm talking about conflict um it upsets me i came here because of the feeling of peace we got

[0:39:44] Voice 12: on this island and um my husband and i feel like that's that's lost and we don't dislike our

[0:39:53] Voice 12: neighbors we don't dislike other people who have different opinions for from us but the whole thing

[0:39:58] Voice 12: is is we're allowed to have opinions we had an expression in the army that opinions are like

[0:40:06] Voice 12: rear ends everybody's got one you don't necessarily want to hear it but you know

[0:40:12] Voice 12: so so that being said i mean i respect everybody's opinion here i do

[0:40:20] Voice 8: and

[0:40:21] Voice 12: i'm not going to try to

[0:40:22] Voice 12: change their opinion because they have a right to that opinion but we should be able to have

[0:40:28] Voice 12: open discussion without getting angry with each other and and let's all find a common ground

[0:40:37] Voice 12: put our opinions aside and find a common ground and that could be simply the love of this island

[0:40:46] Voice 16: okay so there is two in the back and then i recognize you

[0:40:50] Voice 16: I wanted to say, you see, from .

[0:40:55] Voice 16: Somebody said that we had the majority.

[0:40:58] Voice 16: Was there a vote?

[0:41:00] Voice 16: I'm just confused because I heard somebody say that.

[0:41:04] Voice 16: We had the majority.

[0:41:05] Voice 8: And this has to do

[0:41:06] Voice 16: with ?

[0:41:08] Voice 16: I was going to say, so there was a petition,

[0:41:12] Voice 16: a supporting survey that was given in the public hearing.

[0:41:17] Voice 16: 62% of all properties had responded.

[0:41:22] Voice 16: Almost 70% were opposed, 10% were undecided because they didn't have enough information,

[0:41:29] Voice 16: there was about 20% support. It was given at a meeting? I handed that in at the public hearing.

[0:41:35] Voice 8: It was not an

[0:41:36] Voice 16: LTC-sponsored survey, it was her own. It was residents that walked in,

[0:41:44] Voice 16: it was because there were residents around calling. The

[0:41:47] Voice 3: petition

[0:41:48] Voice 16: followed what it needed.

[0:41:52] Voice 16: so so there does need to be clarity for the minutes there was no survey undertaken by the ltc

[0:41:59] Voice 16: this was a private survey before the trustee was elected and so we are not going to have a

[0:42:08] Voice 16: discussion about what the vote was or was not because it was not our business to conduct that

[0:42:14] Voice 16: okay great i just wanted to clarify that okay thank you and then next i believe you ma'am

[0:42:19] Voice 16: uh my name is susan and i'm looking at the agenda here and i'm wondering what part of it we're on

[0:42:26] Voice 16: the town

[0:42:26] Voice 10: hall all of these are very

[0:42:29] Voice 16: important things town hall

[0:42:31] Voice 16: yes but we need to have uh we

[0:42:34] Voice 16: need to move along on our on our interview well uh town hall and questions can go as long as we

[0:42:40] Voice 16: need to and the only restriction is i do have to get a ferry sometime off the island um for lunch

[0:42:47] Voice 16: too. The LTC seems to be directed to number 14. So

[0:42:52] Voice 1: it is the

[0:42:52] Voice 16: right of the public to speak to any

[0:42:54] Voice 16: item on the agenda or any item to do with the LTC and that is this is the time to do that. So we

[0:43:00] Voice 16: don't have a formula and framework for it. Number six is town hall and questions. We're at number

[0:43:08] Voice 16: six. We're far afield from town hall questions. We're into motives, we're into possessions and

[0:43:16] Voice 16: platforms we're not asking questions okay noted here we go so um two in the and then you sir and

[0:43:25] Voice 16: then over there and

[0:43:26] Voice 16: so yes and that actually gives us good chance to pause if you've spoken to an

[0:43:32] Voice 16: issue we have heard you it is noted in the minutes you do not need to bring it up again

[0:43:38] Voice 16: this is not a forum to debate one another it is your chance to address the ltc your concerns

[0:43:46] Voice 16: you speak to your issues please speak once it is recorded in the minutes and i'm literally

[0:43:52] Voice 16: reading the minutes from last meeting hearing a lot of the same concerns so perhaps there needs

[0:43:59] Voice 16: to be another forum where everybody talks about these things at length as much as you need to

[0:44:04] Voice 16: but let's hear thank you for your comments your positions your comments to the ltc not to one

[0:44:14] Voice 6: Robert Dill. I've worked a lot with First Nations. We've done over 30 events with them.

[0:44:23] Voice 6: I would suggest, based on their philosophy, to live lightly on the land, to do as little

[0:44:31] Voice 6: as possible, that the idea of how to work with First Nations versus the bylaw questions,

[0:44:44] Voice 6: if you are going to actually hear and incorporate some of the First Nations concerns, moving

[0:44:54] Voice 6: moving the bylaw back is going to be moving away from where their concern is and it might be

[0:45:02] Voice 6: appropriate to leave the bylaw as it is and look at their concerns and then at that point

[0:45:09] Voice 6: make some decisions but I think to move back is going to move you away from where their

[0:45:18] Voice 6: reconciliation is going to be thank

[0:45:20] Voice 16: you for your comments okay

[0:45:22] Voice 5: rick freeson canal road i

[0:45:26] Voice 5: like having these town hall meetings like the degree of passion which people speak to and i

[0:45:33] Voice 5: take comfort in the fact that when we are through with this meeting all the rancor or passion is

[0:45:41] Voice 5: left in the room and outside we're talking to each other just as fellow islanders so i think it's

[0:45:48] Voice 5: good to get it out here but just remember that when we're outside and we're we're working together on

[0:45:53] Voice 5: other things and we don't have to worry about what was what was done in here is going to destroy our

[0:45:59] Voice 5: community or

[0:46:00] Voice 14: divide it thanks

[0:46:02] Voice 16: so two more in the back and yes thank you shelly hands up just a

[0:46:12] Voice 16: quick question um one of the problems i think which they about 122 was the questions that were

[0:46:19] Voice 16: asked was where is the data where are the papers where's the information why are you doing this so

[0:46:24] Voice 16: my question simply is are there documents and studies and papers that could be released by

[0:46:32] Voice 16: the trust to us to look at to help better understand the how sizes the setbacks and

[0:46:40] Voice 16: and why why it's important that would certainly help me understand so did you um did you see in

[0:46:47] Voice 16: the agenda today uh or for today's meeting um the there is a considerable page i think i think there

[0:47:02] Voice 16: was one thing that would happen when i was looking at it there's a

[0:47:06] Voice 16: bylaw amendment wording table

[0:47:08] Voice 16: so for bylaw 122 each of these sections um with staff comments is part of the agenda for today

[0:47:17] Voice 16: and then all of the documents that were part of the project for the previous term are publicly

[0:47:23] Voice 16: available in those agendas which are on the website so there's nothing that is not been

[0:47:30] Voice 16: discussed in a public meeting that has not been minuted and then adopted subsequently and is still

[0:47:36] Voice 16: available on the website and if you want to get sort of a package with the planner we could maybe

[0:47:42] Voice 16: ask for support in that yes yeah i'm happy to answer that question the analysis that staff did

[0:47:48] Voice 16: through the process of bylaw 122 really the only analysis that i completed was looking at previous

[0:47:54] Voice 16: bylaw or building permits the poor period of five years i believe that's what it was and that was in

[0:48:00] Voice 16: the staff report any other analysis was actually done by the previous trustees i believe each

[0:48:07] Voice 16: individual trustee did quite a bit of work using bc assessment but that was done individually by

[0:48:13] Voice 16: a trustee it was a staff initiative all right so your research is part on the web page then

[0:48:21] Voice 16: for us to look at it's no longer on the web page it is but i can send that to you

[0:48:26] Voice 16: that would be great yeah is it not

[0:48:29] Voice 16: part of agenda packages from previous yeah it would be yeah it

[0:48:32] Voice 16: would be so so if it the website is challenging to navigate it's actually been a it's been down

[0:48:40] Voice 16: for the past i know so i was looking at last

[0:48:42] Voice 16: night and this morning yeah times it was down

[0:48:44] Voice 16: for me for difficult and and i apologize on behalf of our communications department's having a

[0:48:50] Voice 16: nightmare right now um so if you know the dates the last ltc meetings and look them up on the

[0:48:56] Voice 16: calendar there is an associated agenda and the minutes are also on that page and the minutes

[0:49:03] Voice 16: will include discussion but the staff reports are in the agendas does that make sense yeah but i

[0:49:09] Voice 16: don't want to read all of them i'm just wondering if somebody could just kindly direct me to where

[0:49:14] Voice 16: i would find that document with me and with your what i could potentially do is if our admin staff

[0:49:22] Voice 16: staff has enough time is uploaded his previous staff reports as part of research under this

[0:49:29] Voice 16: project just so that you don't have to go through old agenda I know how difficult that is so yeah

[0:49:37] Voice 16: I'll make a note of doing that so

[0:49:38] Voice 16: there's a project page on the South Pender page and this

[0:49:41] Voice 16: is that this is defined as the lub project yeah and so hopefully we can see those documents thank

[0:49:46] Voice 16: Thank you. Yeah, no problem. And then there and then Monica and there and then there and I think we're going to close after the email.

[0:49:57] Voice 16: Okay. I just want to mention for those who aren't aware of this, how the process was for the last, for the post sizes anyways and some of the other things.

[0:50:10] Voice 16: I know it's been said that it's been, it went on

[0:50:13] Voice 14: over myriad meetings.

[0:50:17] Voice 14: Actually, if you go back and look at how active the dates and the meetings when certain health

[0:50:22] Voice 14: sizes or changes to the buy-off happen, they happened relatively quickly near the end.

[0:50:30] Voice 14: I'd say probably in maybe an eight-month period, things started to move downwards steadily.

[0:50:37] Voice 14: and I think people aren't aware because we keep hearing the statement that this has gone on for

[0:50:44] Voice 14: so long you know in the last term or couple of terms that I don't think that's that's actual

[0:50:52] Voice 14: so I definitely felt like things hadn't been discussed fully and I think again I heard the

[0:51:02] Voice 14: statement and that I kind of echo everyone's concerns that um things didn't happen I've never

[0:51:08] Voice 14: felt

[0:51:09] Voice 16: or felt that I've hurt anybody at a meeting but I have definitely noticed people that I might

[0:51:15] Voice 16: say hi to and smile at and compete in the community don't do that back to me anymore and that is

[0:51:22] Voice 16: truthful as well so there's things that happen that are at a different level that might not

[0:51:27] Voice 16: happened openly in meeting, which I might welcome, but I didn't have it go out of the meeting.

[0:51:32] Voice 16: So just for the thing to

[0:51:35] Voice 14: digest. We have Monica. Okay, point of information.

[0:51:44] Voice 14: Next Wednesday, November 15th, the library will be hosting a Sinchon language workshop

[0:51:52] Voice 14: from 11 to 1

[0:51:55] Voice 14: it's co-sponsored by

[0:51:57] Voice 14: the

[0:51:57] Voice 14: which means

[0:51:59] Voice 14: a reconciliating action

[0:52:03] Voice 14: committee, a revitalization

[0:52:05] Voice 14: committee

[0:52:05] Voice 14: and there are still a few

[0:52:09] Voice 14: open

[0:52:10] Voice 14: spots and if

[0:52:12] Voice 14: anyone is interested

[0:52:15] Voice 14: let me know and

[0:52:17] Voice 14: I will send you the

[0:52:18] Voice 14: registration

[0:52:19] Voice 14: thank you

[0:52:22] Voice 16: so i was going to come to that in our um new standing report uh 15.6 we've had a little

[0:52:31] Voice 16: conversation about that but i was going to offer you the opportunity to to bring forward any um

[0:52:36] Voice 16: community news regarding reconciliation and we had um mr kyle and then um june last

[0:52:45] Voice 16: You had your hand

[0:52:46] Voice 16: up? Well

[0:52:48] Voice 12: yeah I did but she'll ask it for me because I don't want to ask too many

[0:52:52] Voice 12: questions. I'm not

[0:52:56] Voice 5: sure that doing it by proxy seems to really

[0:53:01] Voice 16: work but I'll entertain it.

[0:53:08] Voice 16: Would you like to? Well I guess in the meantime that question is for me.

[0:53:13] Voice 16: back to a point but to keep moving on my question is when it comes to the legally needed to staff

[0:53:19] Voice 16: or when it comes to legally non-conforming verbiage in just from my understanding in previous

[0:53:28] Voice 16: bylaw changes going back as years decades back and bylaws have changed have they ever had to

[0:53:35] Voice 16: put that statement in or the existing homes

[0:53:37] Voice 12: then that was considered non-conforming or

[0:53:41] Voice 12: were able to do that and not have that statement in there were they like

[0:53:44] Voice 16: just grandfathered from

[0:53:46] Voice 16: that point going forward is this i think we had this discussion i'm just looking at the minutes

[0:53:53] Voice 16: from last time and i will turn to staff but what we had thought about was that we might have staff

[0:54:02] Voice 16: provide a summary fact sheet about each of the issues related to legally non-conforming sites

[0:54:08] Voice 16: and variances. Is that potentially something that could be helpful? I guess I'm just wondering how

[0:54:15] Voice 16: in decades before we'll be able to make changes to bylaws and not have to have such a contentious

[0:54:20] Voice 16: statement. Kim,

[0:54:22] Voice 8: do you have any way

[0:54:23] Voice 16: to answer that? I do. Yeah, so when a bylaw, specifically

[0:54:29] Voice 16: specifically a land use bylaw does get changed generally there will always be situations where

[0:54:37] Voice 16: a house a cottage a shed or so forth will no longer conform to the current bylaw so it does

[0:54:47] Voice 16: have protection under the local government act and the previous ltc what they wanted to do was

[0:54:54] Voice 16: avoid that situation and by putting in those paragraphs it actually makes dwellings

[0:55:04] Voice 16: that no longer comply to that new table that sentence or paragraph actually makes those

[0:55:14] Voice 16: dwellings legal in the bylaw so they're not

[0:55:18] Voice 14: your homes are not legal non-conforming they are legal

[0:55:21] Voice 14: legal there is no legal non-conforming or

[0:55:27] Voice 16: those new regulations in terms of maximum floor area

[0:55:30] Voice 16: it doesn't make them retroactively yeah non-conforming yes okay because of the clause

[0:55:37] Voice 16: the clause then says your building is legal because of da da da da da so there actually is

[0:55:45] Voice 16: i understand there is a concern regarding legal non-conforming but when you read it

[0:55:51] Voice 16: in fact your dwelling is legal

[0:55:55] Voice 15: at

[0:55:56] Voice 13: this point in time at this point

[0:55:58] Voice 15: in time truly

[0:55:58] Voice 13: at this point

[0:55:59] Voice 13: yeah and there's nothing to do with anything that might happen to the environment or disaster that's

[0:56:04] Voice 13: right so that's what i hope

[0:56:08] Voice 16: that brings some comfort and we

[0:56:10] Voice 16: can talk about this more through

[0:56:11] Voice 16: the project i know it's a really difficult um topic to understand and i think it's really

[0:56:19] Voice 16: really important that maybe we host a community information meeting maybe specifically on legal

[0:56:24] Voice 16: non-conforming and we can go over it together okay yeah well um I think the comment was made

[0:56:31] Voice 16: the good place to start might be a summary fact sheet yes and so could we bring that forward as

[0:56:37] Voice 16: a resolution to maybe prepare for our next LTC meeting regardless of whether we have absolutely

[0:56:46] Voice 16: So when we get to that point in the agenda, what we'll do is I'll quickly draft a resolution for the LTC to give direction to staff to draft a FAQ.

[0:56:59] Voice 16: So on page 10 of our previous town hall discussion, it's already in the...

[0:57:04] Voice 16: I'm just going to add it to the work pile.

[0:57:08] Voice 16: I apologize for my...

[0:57:10] Voice 16: Three more papers, right?

[0:57:12] Voice 16: We got it. We got it. Documentation is important.

[0:57:17] Voice 16: Yes, ma'am. Hello.

[0:57:19] Voice 15: I'm Nina Sobrian, the newest Canadian citizen on South Canada.

[0:57:23] Voice 16: Congratulations. Welcome.

[0:57:26] Voice 15: So the question, are there actual scientific studies that support the house size, bylaw changes?

[0:57:33] Voice 15: And if yes, can we see them?

[0:57:37] Voice 16: Can you define scientific studies in your

[0:57:40] Voice 15: area of science?

[0:57:42] Voice 15: with reference to the environment so

[0:57:45] Voice 16: environmental studies environmental

[0:57:49] Voice 16: assessments on the impacts of the bylaw

[0:57:55] Voice 8: no

[0:57:56] Voice 16: no that would be great if we had that

[0:58:00] Voice 8: but

[0:58:02] Voice 16: no i'm not aware of any so yeah

[0:58:05] Voice 16: it is a curious point because in trying to draft a bylaw to protect the environment is it actually

[0:58:14] Voice 16: protecting the environment i guess is

[0:58:15] Voice 16: the reverse way of asking that question um to my knowledge the

[0:58:22] Voice 16: only way to test that is to see the outcomes what is it producing what are we actually doing and

[0:58:28] Voice 16: that is the problem with landis planning not with this island or anybody in particular but you make

[0:58:35] Voice 16: plans based on the lot lines that you've got and the geography and then best guess and then is that

[0:58:42] Voice 16: that going to actually protect the environment? We're testing a bunch of different approaches

[0:58:46] Voice 16: and LTCs across the trust area. And it remains to be seen what avenue. Now, unfortunately,

[0:58:53] Voice 16: we've got most of the housing built. How much more protection can we afford? Can we give the

[0:58:59] Voice 16: environment? It's really the question. What are the other ways? Is it house sizes? Is it other

[0:59:05] Voice 16: means. I don't think there was environmental studies that went into calculating whether

[0:59:12] Voice 16: house sizes would truly protect

[0:59:14] Voice 16: the environment. My best guess, I'm not a planner. Do you have any

[0:59:18] Voice 16: other? So on Main Island, I've referenced this before. I'm really keen to see how this works out.

[0:59:25] Voice 16: They've done an area of, oh gosh, what's it called? I forgot what it's called now,

[0:59:32] Voice 16: But where the groundwater recharge analysis has demonstrated that there's enough groundwater to support additional density, they've got a small area zoned for flexible zoning, where landowners that say own a five acre parcel may be able to build up to two or three structures within a distributed house size.

[1:00:00] Voice 16: and that is their choice whether they want to do that so instead of just one building you might

[1:00:05] Voice 16: have three for your grandmother and your grandchildren

[1:00:08] Voice 8: um

[1:00:09] Voice 16: and so that is based on

[1:00:12] Voice 16: environmental factor the water recharge the water mapping

[1:00:15] Voice 8: water

[1:00:16] Voice 16: mapping analysis has not been done

[1:00:19] Voice 16: on all the islands the um the mapping of the water tables has been done but not the recharge

[1:00:26] Voice 16: charge um and the analysis of where the land could take additional density so to my mind because i'm

[1:00:33] Voice 16: on regional planning committee this is the process that we're working through right now is how do we

[1:00:38] Voice 16: determine the environmental factors for where is it appropriate to put increased intensity of

[1:00:45] Voice 16: dwellings or habitation or what is it where humans have already congregated and we have these centers

[1:00:51] Voice 16: is it where the land can handle it and where do we not put it so that should go into our land use

[1:00:58] Voice 16: planning decision making but i'm not sure what the process was for this particular bylaw

[1:01:03] Voice 16: i'm shut up now because i'm not a planner

[1:01:09] Voice 16: yes that's

[1:01:10] Voice 4: the point you bring up i think if i understand it right it's a special interest of

[1:01:16] Voice 4: mind and is the is the it's what motivates me to go through this process and do it again because

[1:01:25] Voice 4: that was in my opinion not done scientific evidence for justifying the changes that were

[1:01:31] Voice 4: made to house sizes and setbacks and so on it did not come forward was not presented linking it to

[1:01:37] Voice 4: environmental protection and this is our chance to do that right so we should you know you should

[1:01:44] Voice 4: should, I should, we should all look for linking the evidence that we can find. And of course,

[1:01:51] Voice 4: we can't find evidence of something that hasn't happened on our island yet. But maybe we can find

[1:01:55] Voice 4: something that can support one position or another or one action or another in regards to

[1:02:02] Voice 4: size of houses. And I want to say that going over this again, which is, you know, some of you are

[1:02:11] Voice 4: are not wanting to go over this again and I understand that and respect that and some of

[1:02:15] Voice 4: you want to go over it again because you feel like you didn't have the opportunity the first

[1:02:19] Voice 4: time to do it right and I think we need to my sense is that we need to go over it again but

[1:02:27] Voice 4: if we find really good arguments and logic and science supporting exactly what's written now

[1:02:36] Voice 4: in bylaw 122 we will go tick tick tick tick tick that's what we're going to do that's what i'm

[1:02:41] Voice 4: going to vote for if however we find that some things weren't considered and were significant

[1:02:49] Voice 4: the you know the ramification of something that wasn't considered was significant then i think

[1:02:56] Voice 4: we will consider changing it either back to what it was before or to something new and so the

[1:03:02] Voice 4: The opportunity for, or the possibility that this by-law will remain exactly the same is there

[1:03:11] Voice 8: for

[1:03:12] Voice 4: all of it or for individual parts of it.

[1:03:15] Voice 4: We're not doing away with anything, we're revisiting it.

[1:03:19] Voice 4: And in order to address it with scientific,

[1:03:23] Voice 16: right

[1:03:25] Voice 4: from now forward.

[1:03:28] Voice 16: I was just going to layer on that. This is our opportunity to improve.

[1:03:33] Voice 16: It's not necessarily to revert.

[1:03:35] Voice 16: It's not necessarily to remain.

[1:03:37] Voice 16: But this is our opportunity to really take a good future look as well.

[1:03:43] Voice 16: Because we're going to be charged by the government to do our housing needs assessments for 20 years into the future.

[1:03:53] Voice 16: So this really has to have a good look.

[1:03:56] Voice 16: This is something that's new coming down from the government.

[1:03:58] Voice 16: We have to look at this.

[1:04:00] Voice 16: And we have to have a look.

[1:04:02] Voice 16: but this is a great opportunity to make reasoned improvements

[1:04:06] Voice 8: that have community support.

[1:04:14] Voice 8: Good.

[1:04:15] Voice 8: If I may make a comment.

[1:04:18] Voice 16: I did speak in error to Shelley's question.

[1:04:23] Voice 16: The review I did on building permits was actually part of the process

[1:04:27] Voice 16: with North Pender because there was projects going on at the very same time.

[1:04:32] Voice 16: time so the analysis i did on building permits and um the floor areas of those dwelling units

[1:04:40] Voice 16: was actually done for north pender so there was no staff analysis for south pender project it was

[1:04:46] Voice 16: strictly trustee analysis really which was part of the concern which was probably what most people

[1:04:56] Voice 16: were concerned about. And I have posted all the staff reports I could find from the previous

[1:05:03] Voice 16: project on the new project web page under the folder other information. You did that already?

[1:05:11] Voice 16: Yes. Give me a little bit of that. That's great. Thank you, Pam. Swift work. I just wish to point

[1:05:21] Voice 16: point out that because so research that's done by trustees cannot be necessarily included because

[1:05:29] Voice 16: they're not professionals so when it comes to public engagement we're going to talk to

[1:05:35] Voice 16: the audience trust about engaging publicly if we want to do a survey it should be um through the

[1:05:42] Voice 16: ltc and so it's more onerous i get it and and you're a small community and it's great to have

[1:05:48] Voice 16: the personal contact but this is why we need to have public process and professional planners who

[1:05:55] Voice 16: do the work so that we can bring it back and say here it's what's grounded in this is the reasoning

[1:06:00] Voice 16: so let's leave that topic it was requested it just wasn't done oh gosh so we'll close town hall and

[1:06:08] Voice 16: thank you for your questions and comments everybody we're learning a lot every single

[1:06:11] Voice 16: time and i appreciate this has been such an ongoing first year to get on the same page and

[1:06:17] Voice 16: find that common ground but I think we're going to get there. I'm going

[1:06:21] Voice 16: to say actually I would

[1:06:22] Voice 16: like to sort of change over challenging to to this is actually a great first year. Awesome

[1:06:28] Voice 16: I hope so hope everyone feels that way. So we'll move on to minutes 9.1 we have

[1:06:36] Voice 16: adopted already by resolution about meeting the minutes of September 1 2023 and that's included

[1:06:44] Voice 16: in the agenda package so they were adopted already but they're part of this agenda if

[1:06:50] Voice 16: anybody wants to go back and see it we've got a follow-up action list uh page 13 so

[1:06:56] Voice 16: trustees have any questions or wish to ask for updates uh from staff

[1:07:11] Voice 16: no correspondence yeah so correspondence um if you can help us out by writing in your

[1:07:20] Voice 16: letters if the topic is uh you know the current application or a project just just say that in

[1:07:27] Voice 16: your email so that we know where it goes okay so we've got one referral 13.1 of proposed bylaw

[1:07:37] Voice 16: 104 and 141 for saturn island local trust committee so this is an amendment

[1:07:46] Voice 16: I think we've now seen some letters that were written in.

[1:07:50] Voice 16: There was a question posted to the website with websites in.

[1:07:52] Voice 16: Mm-hmm.

[1:07:54] Voice 16: Sorry, so there's been no letters in.

[1:07:56] Voice 16: Oh, sorry.

[1:07:57] Voice 16: In this agenda.

[1:07:58] Voice 14: Sorry.

[1:07:59] Voice 16: I know.

[1:08:00] Voice 16: I know.

[1:08:01] Voice 16: I know.

[1:08:02] Voice 16: Yeah.

[1:08:02] Voice 16: Yeah.

[1:08:03] Voice 16: Yeah.

[1:08:03] Voice 16: Yeah.

[1:08:04] Voice 16: Yeah.

[1:08:05] Voice 16: Yeah.

[1:08:05] Voice 16: Yeah.

[1:08:06] Voice 16: Yeah.

[1:08:06] Voice 1: Yeah.

[1:08:06] Voice 1: Yeah.

[1:08:25] Voice 16: Okay, so this is the purpose of this bylaw is to rezone a parcel to allow for an additional

[1:08:32] Voice 16: dwelling density for shared property is a single property dwelling accessory cottage

[1:08:38] Voice 16: um and so it's just required to refer to all the different agencies and joining ltcs

[1:08:46] Voice 16: and we typically would reply interest unaffected by bylaw unless you believe this

[1:08:51] Voice 16: of wonders interesting i don't i think are so unaffected okay does somebody want to make that

[1:08:57] Voice 16: do you need

[1:08:59] Voice 4: i called um one of our trustees on south on saturn just to discuss this and

[1:09:05] Voice 4: because we've had several referrals not just from saturn but others and i just wanted to understand

[1:09:10] Voice 4: that whole process more because like this one seems like we don't we don't care right i mean

[1:09:17] Voice 4: they're doing what they're doing, we wouldn't want to interfere with what they're doing there.

[1:09:21] Voice 4: And so I just requested if they could contact me if they were concerned, if it was an issue that

[1:09:30] Voice 4: came up that they thought might affect us. I mean we will read them and go through them but

[1:09:35] Voice 8: it's

[1:09:36] Voice 4: kind of like just sort of ticky boxes.

[1:09:38] Voice 16: We have to because of how it's legislated,

[1:09:41] Voice 16: like the way that it's written, because we're within a certain radius,

[1:09:44] Voice 16: us paid enough to tell us

[1:09:46] Voice 4: and they have

[1:09:47] Voice 16: to get our response right

[1:09:48] Voice 4: yeah yeah yeah so anyway i i feel

[1:09:51] Voice 4: we're unaffected so i will make the motion that we are our interest is unaffected by that

[1:09:56] Voice 4: okay seconded

[1:10:03] Voice 16: by trustee evan and any further discussion all those in favor

[1:10:08] Voice 16: and that's carried thank you yes it is a ticky box thing i think that's my new trick term

[1:10:19] Voice 16: it's all a little crazy sometimes all right so now we're going to move into the beat of our work

[1:10:24] Voice 16: today uh 14.1 the land use by law review project the uh report of our planner kim's on page 17 to

[1:10:33] Voice 16: to 40 and Kim would you like to introduce absolutely important take it through it thank

[1:10:40] Voice 16: you chair yes I would um to refresh all our memories at the last meeting on September 1st

[1:10:48] Voice 16: the LTC class two resolutions one um identified um their work program um as a minor active project

[1:10:58] Voice 16: with title of Minor LUB Review Project.

[1:11:02] Voice 16: And the LTC then gave direction to staff

[1:11:06] Voice 16: to draft a project turner

[1:11:09] Voice 16: and to report back with options on this project.

[1:11:12] Voice 16: So that is what this staff report does.

[1:11:15] Voice 16: There is a project turner attached.

[1:11:17] Voice 16: There is a small background on Bylaw 122,

[1:11:21] Voice 16: just outlining the topics that were discussed

[1:11:24] Voice 16: and the dates of the bylaw reading.

[1:11:28] Voice 16: i do want to state that there was a public hearing held on july 23rd of last summer in regards to

[1:11:36] Voice 16: bottom one two two and then at a meeting post public hearing a number of additional amendments

[1:11:44] Voice 16: were made by the ltc but because this meeting was post public hearing uh there were no further

[1:11:51] Voice 16: further comments that you've received from the from the community. So I believe that

[1:11:57] Voice 16: this is.

[1:11:59] Voice 16: Sorry, so that is like, I'm still learning here. So was that sort of a bad, decent process

[1:12:08] Voice 16: to make amendments after public hearings?

[1:12:13] Not

[1:12:14] Voice 16: that well, the LPC really should be making decisions that are what's best for the community

[1:12:21] Voice 16: and what they hear from the public hearing and community information meeting but the ltc has

[1:12:27] Voice 16: the authority to make these amendments as long as they don't amend use or density okay but they

[1:12:34] Voice 16: the ltc has the authority to make amendments to citing and size by post-public hearing but it

[1:12:41] Voice 16: should be based on the comments received at the public hearing gotcha i'll leave

[1:12:49] Voice 4: just for clarity so if they if they were to do that they would have had to have a public meeting

[1:12:57] Voice 4: in order to discuss doing that like how could that happen because i'm not allowed to talk to

[1:13:03] Voice 4: my trustees about business

[1:13:04] Voice 8: except

[1:13:06] Voice 4: at a meeting where we have a recorder and so on so how could

[1:13:09] Voice 4: they have done that is that a possibility yeah

[1:13:11] Voice 16: this was at a community information meeting so

[1:13:14] Voice 16: So it was a LTC meeting, and the topic was post-public hearing.

[1:13:20] Voice 16: So community members, I believe it was an online meeting, actually.

[1:13:23] Voice 16: Yeah, so it was a discussion specifically between LTC and staff.

[1:13:31] Voice 4: Discussion happened there, or it was announced that language was added?

[1:13:36] Voice 4: um

[1:13:38] Voice 16: there so the community information meeting was scheduled with the purpose of discussing

[1:13:44] Voice 16: the land use bylaw and then at that meeting that's when the two trustees

[1:13:50] Voice 16: i think it was

[1:13:52] Voice 16: third reading pardon me it was third reading before it went to the executive

[1:13:56] Voice 16: yes absolutely

[1:13:57] Voice 16: post-public hearing yeah third reading they made additional changes and then

[1:14:01] Voice 16: went to executive yes with no community input gotcha yeah thank you which

[1:14:07] Voice 4: was inappropriate

[1:14:14] Voice 8: it

[1:14:14] Voice 16: was satisfied but right

[1:14:18] Voice 16: yeah it's not a recommendation not a recommendation okay i

[1:14:23] Voice 16: just want but the the is it's legal as long as it's not a decision about

[1:14:28] Voice 16: Citing and use. Use and density. Use and density. As long as you're not making changes on use and density.

[1:14:34] Voice 16: Gotcha. That's really tricky.

[1:14:36] Voice 4: So you and Christina can have discussions as long as it's not about use and density?

[1:14:42] Voice 4: No,

[1:14:43] Voice 16: this is when a bylaw is post-public hearing. So any discussions an LTC has has to be at a meeting.

[1:14:52] Voice 16: but in terms of when a bylaw is post public hearing any decisions made in term if the ltc

[1:15:00] Voice 16: decides to change a use of that bylaw you would have to hold a second public hearing

[1:15:06] Voice 8: so it would

[1:15:07] Voice 16: trigger that requirement but the ltc has the authority to make amendments to citing a size

[1:15:12] Voice 16: without holding a second public hearing gotcha

[1:15:16] Voice 8: sorry i

[1:15:19] Voice 16: didn't mean to interrupt but yeah no

[1:15:20] Voice 15: those

[1:15:20] Voice 16: are great questions thanks for that and this is all laid out in the local government

[1:15:23] Voice 16: act as well and we can go through that as well it might be another worthwhile topic

[1:15:27] Voice 16: and one of our future community information thanks okay um okay going back back figure out where i

[1:15:37] Voice 16: was so um what i did was i put together a table which outlined or identified all amendments that

[1:15:45] Voice 16: were included in bylaw 122 i've identified those amendments determining if they perhaps need a i

[1:15:54] Voice 16: think it was minor a major major discussions meaning perhaps it should start with a referral

[1:15:59] Voice 16: to the apc

[1:16:00] Voice 8: minor

[1:16:02] Voice 16: meaning meaning perhaps it could start at the ltc level and discussions at a

[1:16:07] Voice 16: community information meeting level and then i've added additional comments for the ltc to consider

[1:16:16] Voice 16: the major topics identified were the increase to the setback to the natural boundary of the sea

[1:16:23] Voice 16: from 7.6 meters to 15 the height regulation for dwellings total floor area and maximum floor area

[1:16:33] Voice 16: for the rural residential zones agriculture zone forestry zone natural resource resource zone

[1:16:41] Voice 16: and those other associated amendments and the fourth being the increase to the side plot lines

[1:16:50] Voice 16: um the side plot line setback for dwellings and cottages so those were the major topics identified

[1:16:56] Voice 16: identified the LTC could refer to the APC for initial comment and I've included a recommendation

[1:17:05] Voice 16: on page 17 of the staff report so that would um if I move into the project Charter this project

[1:17:14] Voice 16: Charter is a living document it can be changed this is just version one to give the LTC some

[1:17:22] Voice 16: some discussion points. Staff did put together a approximate timeline and that timeline would

[1:17:32] Voice 16: break down the engagement phase into two phases. The first one being early in the new year would

[1:17:39] Voice 16: be identifying the problems of bylaw 122 and also other minor and technical amendments the LTC may

[1:17:48] Voice 16: want to address that would include a referral to the apc and holding community information meetings

[1:17:53] Voice 16: in person and also electronically and then the second phase of engagement would be after

[1:18:02] Voice 16: staff draft the bot after staff drafts the bylaw there should be then or staff recommend a second

[1:18:09] Voice 16: phase of engagement you could send that to the apc and also hold other community information meetings

[1:18:14] Voice 16: So I've identified the engagement phase there in the staff report.

[1:18:20] Voice 16: In terms of statutory requirements, the LTC does not have to worry about that right now.

[1:18:26] Voice 16: That's when we get closer to when the draft bylaw is completed.

[1:18:32] Voice 16: We can send out formal referrals. I have put a note in the project charter about sending early engagement letters to First Nations as well.

[1:18:42] Voice 16: So if this project proceeds, those letters will go out.

[1:18:47] Voice 16: I've put some additional alternatives the LTC may want to consider on page 20.

[1:18:53] Voice 16: That is to request further information from staff.

[1:18:57] Voice 16: Number two is request revisions to the draft project charter.

[1:19:03] Voice 16: And the third is the creation of a special APC.

[1:19:06] Voice 16: So if the current APC starts to feel overwhelmed with the amount of work, perhaps the LTC can look at creating a special APC through this process.

[1:19:18] Voice 16: And again, the project charter is a living document, so it can be amended and changed as the project proceeds.

[1:19:27] Voice 16: But those changes to the project charter must be done by LTC resolution.

[1:19:32] Voice 16: resolution

[1:19:32] Voice 3: so

[1:19:33] Voice 16: staff have put together three recommendations for the LTC to consider the

[1:19:40] Voice 16: first is to approve the project charter the second is to request staff to refer this staff report and

[1:19:49] Voice 16: also the attachments to the South Pender APC for comment and also to give direction to staff to

[1:19:57] Voice 16: to start scheduling community information meetings

[1:19:59] Voice 16: for this project, both in-person and online.

[1:20:03] Voice 16: And I'm happy to answer any questions the LTC may have.

[1:20:06] Voice 16: That's great.

[1:20:07] Voice 16: Thank you for this

[1:20:08] Voice 8: report, let yourself go.

[1:20:13] Voice 8: Okay.

[1:20:15] Voice 8: So yeah,

[1:20:16] Voice 16: I think we've had a fair amount of discussion.

[1:20:18] Voice 16: Well, we've had a lot of comments directed towards us

[1:20:22] Voice 16: regarding this minor work program.

[1:20:27] Voice 16: And like I said, the reason why we're sitting here

[1:20:32] Voice 16: here is this is still a very sensitive topic pretty much for most people on the island

[1:20:38] Voice 16: on the or another we need to we need to sit down and look at the reasons for keeping something or

[1:20:48] Voice 16: for a potential change to something on the major items that Kim has raised I think that needs to

[1:20:56] Voice 16: come from the APC, the APC should engage with the community and work through that and bring

[1:21:04] Voice 16: those back. And then we've got a starting point. This isn't a work to be undertaken

[1:21:13] Voice 16: just because. There has to be reasons for it. We've got to base this on, and I started

[1:21:25] Voice 16: writing a little suggestions of where this could come, such as environmental impacts,

[1:21:35] Voice 16: the way that the bylaw is currently written. For example, including garage spaces in your overall

[1:21:46] Voice 16: house square footage has resulted in a lot of people separating the garage from the main house,

[1:21:54] Voice 16: which means that they are now using up more of the land for building so an environmental impact

[1:22:03] Voice 16: could be that we don't include garages in the overall floor square footage

[1:22:13] Voice 16: to encourage anyone that's going to be building in the future to cluster together that's one

[1:22:20] Voice 16: One, there are so many things to look at, suggesting a maximum footprint, because the way that the bylaw is written out, you can just have a rancher, and my husband has done that.

[1:22:31] Voice 16: But if there is a maximum square footage, then you'll use up less of the land, but have the ability to go up a floor to a maximum amount of square footage.

[1:22:45] Voice 16: and this and and taking into account living needs and housing needs we have housing needs it is a

[1:22:52] Voice 16: crisis everywhere we have to age in place we have children coming up through the ranks that cannot

[1:22:58] Voice 16: afford to buy we have aging parents that have nowhere to go because the government's already

[1:23:03] Voice 16: told us there's no more room you have to figure yourselves out so there are issues i'm not saying

[1:23:11] Voice 16: i have any answers because i don't want to present any this has to come from the community this has

[1:23:17] Voice 16: to come through your apc so think of think of where we're at think of we have to think of the

[1:23:25] Voice 16: environment we have to think of how people live and we have to think of how people are going to

[1:23:30] Voice 16: live not just today but 20 years in the future so i will leave it so in summary do you think

[1:23:40] Voice 16: do you agree with the major topics to be

[1:23:42] Voice 16: referred to the APC?

[1:23:43] Voice 16: Yes, absolutely. So that's a good place to start.

[1:23:47] Voice 16: 100%. Just a thought.

[1:23:48] Voice 16: What are your thoughts on the project?

[1:23:50] Voice 4: Yeah.

[1:23:52] Voice 4: I've got some comments on the

[1:23:54] Voice 4: engagement phase on

[1:23:55] Voice 4: March 19th.

[1:23:59] Voice 4: I can't

[1:24:01] Voice 4: see a difference in that.

[1:24:02] Voice 4: So what it says is

[1:24:04] Voice 4: one, the Identity Credit Department's amendments.

[1:24:06] Voice 4: For example, the

[1:24:08] Voice 4: maximum floor area regulation are too restricted and would create numerous development variance

[1:24:14] Voice 4: permit applications

[1:24:15] Voice 15: so

[1:24:16] Voice 4: that to me that's not that's not what we're talking about here like

[1:24:21] Voice 4: in my opinion i'm not really interested in whether it creates numerous development variance

[1:24:27] Voice 4: permit applications i mean it's not that i don't care at all but that's not a key issue for me

[1:24:36] Voice 4: um

[1:24:37] Voice 16: so what what would you suggest as a way to identify the problem then because i think what

[1:24:42] Voice 16: well

[1:24:42] Voice 4: because this is going to be i'm assuming this will be uh terms of reference for the apc

[1:24:48] Voice 4: because like when they get we can't just say to them go and figure it

[1:24:52] Voice 16: out right i think that's

[1:24:53] Voice 16: what i was doing as well so what would be

[1:24:56] Voice 16: the wording that you might suggest well

[1:24:58] Voice 4: some some

[1:25:00] Voice 4: Some ideas I've put down so far is,

[1:25:02] Voice 4: one, identify the potential reasons and goals

[1:25:04] Voice 4: for the amendment,

[1:25:06] Voice 4: for instance, to preserve and protect

[1:25:08] Voice 4: South Ender environment or unique amenities,

[1:25:12] Voice 4: because that's directly more charter, right?

[1:25:16] Voice 4: Spell out the details of how the reasons or goals

[1:25:19] Voice 4: are connected to the amendments,

[1:25:22] Voice 4: you know, the current bylaws it stands,

[1:25:24] Voice 4: and how exactly the amendments address specific goals.

[1:25:27] Voice 4: goals. That's the job I would like the ATC to evaluate, if understanding of the goals

[1:25:37] Voice 4: and for the amendments are shared goals or controversial to the constituents. So first,

[1:25:44] Voice 4: I think if we discuss the goals and we all get on the same page and say we all have the

[1:25:49] Voice 4: same goals, if we then move forward, there's a greater chance of working together instead

[1:25:56] Voice 4: Instead of starting to discuss a specific item, meanwhile, we don't even have the same goals.

[1:26:03] Voice 4: So if we have the same goals, we should clarify that.

[1:26:05] Voice 4: So we should start with the goals and make sure that we spend enough time there to see.

[1:26:10] Voice 4: There might still be discrepancies, but then we can understand what those are.

[1:26:14] Voice 4: We can understand that one person thinks this is more important as a goal, and another person thinks this is more important.

[1:26:21] Voice 4: But we should have that discussion.

[1:26:23] Voice 4: discussion. If goals are controversial, more discussion needs to happen. So that's what I'm

[1:26:30] Voice 4: saying there. If goals are shared, evaluate if amendments are successful in achieving the goals.

[1:26:36] Voice 4: The level of successful achieving the goals should be scored, for instance, from one to 10.

[1:26:44] Voice 4: So do you understand that? So if an amendment is made, or if the suggestion to keep it is made,

[1:26:51] Voice 4: we score what what uh how you know how much does it achieve the goal like it might achieve the goal

[1:26:59] Voice 4: a little bit or it might achieve the goal completely right so

[1:27:03] Voice 16: you're going to have to

[1:27:04] Voice 16: have a waiting table in order to evaluate yeah that's

[1:27:10] Voice 16: what i'm suggesting the

[1:27:11] Voice 4: criteria we may

[1:27:12] Voice 4: have to do that yeah um this is just a suggestion right i'm just we can refine this if goals are

[1:27:18] Voice 4: shared and scored above six for the achieving the goals as compared to pre-existing bylaws that's

[1:27:25] Voice 4: 114 I guess before the amendment then we should consider recommending to keep the amendment

[1:27:32] Voice 4: if goals are shared but scored below four and these are just my suggestions at this point I'm

[1:27:37] Voice 4: open to having lots of discussion about that consider reverting to the pre-existing bylaw

[1:27:42] Voice 4: or if a better avenue can be achieved to achieve the goals available we should consider drafting

[1:27:50] Voice 4: a brand new amendment so but i know that's a lot and i haven't gotten given this to you in writing

[1:27:58] Voice 4: so you haven't got a chance to to review this but organized structured process yeah where we do this

[1:28:06] Voice 4: thing of looking at the science what's the reason what's the rationale and we're going to evaluate

[1:28:12] Voice 4: it all in a systematic way in a way that we've kind of agreed to it because i think what has

[1:28:17] Voice 4: has happened in the past is there was literally nothing said about the process and then the

[1:28:23] Voice 4: process happened and there was all kinds of unhappiness on that

[1:28:27] Voice 4: so let's this time let's

[1:28:29] Voice 4: agree to the process make sure everybody can live with it and that's okay we can't all be 100 but

[1:28:34] Voice 4: we can all live with it and then let's go through that process and get in the process to me the goal

[1:28:40] Voice 4: of the process is to give everybody a chance to be heard

[1:28:42] Voice 8: and

[1:28:44] Voice 4: for all of us to have an opportunity

[1:28:46] Voice 4: opportunity to understand our neighbors viewpoints our fellow stakeholders in this that we can

[1:28:53] Voice 4: understand each other even though we may not agree right that's to me is how we're going to achieve

[1:28:59] Voice 4: smiling at each other in the grocery store after these meetings right

[1:29:04] Voice 4: okay

[1:29:04] Voice 16: so i i like how you can lay all of that out

[1:29:09] Voice 16: can we add in there the two elements the environmental impact and the living and

[1:29:15] Voice 16: housing needs impacts those are those are two separate things but they have to be that they've

[1:29:20] Voice 16: got equal importance um and they have they have to wind up getting balanced so it's not just one

[1:29:28] Voice 16: over at the exclusion of the other or to the detriment of another i

[1:29:32] Voice 4: like that yeah absolutely

[1:29:33] Voice 4: like that's right after our discussion about teaching it sorry um where we refined our

[1:29:42] Voice 4: our statement. So to put, not equal weight, but some kind of balanced weight on that. So yes,

[1:29:53] Voice 4: I would absolutely support adding that. And we could look at it even more deeply and see if

[1:29:58] Voice 4: there's something else missing.

[1:30:00] Voice 16: yeah yeah could you could you read through that one more time and we'll get a lot of information

[1:30:05] Voice 16: you just send it to the minute taker so yeah if you've got a block of text like that we'll get

[1:30:13] Voice 16: you to

[1:30:13] Voice 16: send it to the office and we can

[1:30:15] Voice 16: always amend this or go back and forth yeah you know

[1:30:18] Voice 16: the most important thing is the resolution to refer it to the apc but in terms of what questions

[1:30:24] Voice 16: to ask that's something that we can do by email with the bnltc and staff as well yeah i'm thinking

[1:30:30] Voice 16: that we might want to amend the referral to APC to include this, what did you call it?

[1:30:37] Voice 16: I forgot the word for it. It's the engagement

[1:30:41] Voice 4: phase

[1:30:42] Voice 16: is what you called it.

[1:30:44] Voice 16: No, your words. The stuff that you put at that page there that you've got there.

[1:30:49] Voice 4: I didn't put a title.

[1:30:50] Voice 16: Process of evaluating the amendment. Some of

[1:30:53] Voice 4: the merits

[1:30:54] Voice 16: of the amendment.

[1:30:55] Voice 4: Terms of reference. Terms of reference.

[1:30:57] Voice 4: Thank you. Terms of reference for the APC.

[1:30:59] Voice 4: Yes,

[1:30:59] Voice 16: so we can add that wording in then that.

[1:31:03] Voice 16: Could we pause before we, and yes, I agree, rereading it.

[1:31:10] Voice 16: When referring something to an APC, is it more helpful to have an open question and

[1:31:18] Voice 16: let them debate it and have that discussion then come back to the LTC and then they filter

[1:31:26] Voice 16: it through the decisions that they need to go through and then go back for more information

[1:31:30] Voice 16: let's say if they need to refine a question I've not yet witnessed a process where the LTC would

[1:31:37] Voice 16: say here's how we want you to discuss this or here's the framework in which we'd like you to

[1:31:42] Voice 16: debate these ideas so um yeah generally the LTC sends or staff sends specific questions to be

[1:31:51] Voice 14: answered

[1:31:51] Voice 16: right and they have this discussion that apc meeting and the referral is then

[1:31:58] Voice 16: captured in the minutes and also their resolution yeah so

[1:32:04] Voice 16: you can send very specific questions or

[1:32:07] Voice 16: you can also include topics for them to consider and provide general but i found with any apc or

[1:32:17] Voice 16: any community group i find it's helpful for them to to send them specific questions so they know

[1:32:22] Voice 16: exactly what so you want them to yeah because that's the thing we're trying to pull from this

[1:32:27] Voice 16: advisory body is their ideas and opinions and perspectives so we have to be specific about

[1:32:34] Voice 16: the question that and and so what i'm hearing from you and i just want to understand if i got

[1:32:39] Voice 16: this right is you're actually looking for more of a framework of here is how we'd like you to

[1:32:44] Voice 16: consider the topics through this metric of goals and analysis yeah so would the apc have to agree

[1:32:52] Voice 16: to that as a framework well we could

[1:32:55] Voice 4: frame it definitely perhaps like to to me when when i

[1:33:00] Voice 4: when i something is presented to us as trustees my vote is going to be based on this criteria

[1:33:07] Voice 4: that's the information

[1:33:08] Voice 4: you want to get out if i don't get this information if somebody says i

[1:33:11] Voice 4: I really want this, I really want that, but it's not related to the goals,

[1:33:15] Voice 8: then

[1:33:15] Voice 4: it's just right over my head.

[1:33:16] Voice 4: I don't care.

[1:33:17] Voice 4: I can't take it into consideration.

[1:33:19] Voice 4: I will take it into consideration if I get this information.

[1:33:24] Voice 4: And so I'm sharing that.

[1:33:27] Voice 4: That's kind of what I'm doing is I'm sharing that.

[1:33:29] Voice 4: So if you want to convince me of something, this is how you do it, okay?

[1:33:33] Voice 8: We

[1:33:34] Voice 4: can do it just like that, you know,

[1:33:36] Voice 4: or we can make this a terms of reference and say, please do this.

[1:33:40] Voice 4: this way. I'm a little bit of a mixed mind on that because I like mostly to give working groups or

[1:33:47] Voice 4: whatever the opportunity to figure themselves out,

[1:33:50] Voice 8: but

[1:33:51] Voice 4: they should have the clarity on what

[1:33:53] Voice 4: is going to be important, not the specificity.

[1:33:56] Voice 16: And I do agree having worked like based on my

[1:33:59] Voice 16: working background, as long as there is a terms of reference framework, it

[1:34:04] Voice 1: doesn't have to be

[1:34:05] Voice 16: a terms of reference that's dictated but it's a framework to work within so you know make sure

[1:34:12] Voice 16: that the inputs that you're collecting fall within this framework

[1:34:16] Voice 3: which

[1:34:17] Voice 16: also raises the point for me

[1:34:19] Voice 16: we also have to specify in here that are we charging the apc to involve the community

[1:34:25] Voice 16: because if we are i think we have to specify that otherwise they're not allowed to engage

[1:34:29] Voice 16: to the community.

[1:34:30] Voice 16: Yeah.

[1:34:32] Voice 16: Generally, APC, the way they engage is, APCs are in open meetings, so community members

[1:34:38] Voice 16: can come to those meetings.

[1:34:39] Voice 16: It's very rare when an APC, say, puts together a survey and so forth.

[1:34:46] Voice 16: Generally that should be done through the APC.

[1:34:49] Voice 16: Okay, so it's something to consider.

[1:34:50] Voice 16: So they've got open meetings, they can still have community discussion, or is discussion

[1:34:55] Voice 16: with the community not permitted at the APC?

[1:34:59] Voice 8: Depends

[1:34:59] Voice 16: on the APC file. I think discussion is fine, right? It's just

[1:35:04] Voice 16: ultimately the decisions

[1:35:05] Voice 16: of the APC is with the APC members. I've not witnessed that before. I've seen APCs where

[1:35:11] Voice 16: members of the public attend and listen. They do not contribute to this session because that is a

[1:35:15] Voice 16: specific commission that is struck, hopefully with a diversity of voices, to gather representative

[1:35:21] Voice 16: opinions from the public. So

[1:35:24] Voice 1: you don't want other members of the public

[1:35:25] Voice 16: coming in and

[1:35:27] Voice 16: and rashing the discussion and pulling it this way and that way.

[1:35:30] Voice 16: It's got to be a bit of structure, but look at our bylaw must have.

[1:35:36] Voice 16: It must.

[1:35:38] Voice 16: Yes, as I understood it, unless specified,

[1:35:41] Voice 16: the APC couldn't engage with the public.

[1:35:44] Voice 16: So maybe we can go and ask this APC if they would like to,

[1:35:54] Voice 16: it would be valuable to receive input from the public based on finding out the answers to these

[1:36:01] Voice 16: you may have a special apc that is tasked with that a public engagement apc that says here's

[1:36:09] Voice 16: how we should engage with the public and they're going to do the research of what is the right way

[1:36:13] Voice 16: to um you know ask those questions but your apc is from what i understand is a strictly

[1:36:21] Voice 16: strictly legislated body that is struck for that purpose of giving you advice and recommendations

[1:36:26] Voice 16: and it doesn't go out and canvass the community for more advice and recommendations i believe it

[1:36:31] Voice 16: does stay in there that we can charge the apc to do that it says in there as well

[1:36:36] Voice 16: i think we

[1:36:37] Voice 4: have to we'll

[1:36:39] Voice 16: have to come back to that yeah and it may be a question also for david

[1:36:43] Voice 16: marler i'm more of a legislative question if i

[1:36:47] Voice 16: don't want to wind up in this position where

[1:36:49] Voice 16: only a select few speak for the entire island or we've got we've got four or five people

[1:36:59] Voice 16: speaking for an entire island with no input from the island I mean that's

[1:37:03] Voice 16: I think that's

[1:37:03] Voice 16: a dangerous path to go down we have to

[1:37:06] Voice 4: consider that a way or like like the way if the rules

[1:37:12] Voice 4: are that the APC cannot consult with the public then we need to decide on a different way

[1:37:18] Voice 4: way to do this because that's the purpose here the purpose is to not start after everybody gets

[1:37:24] Voice 4: the information or has the opportunity to speak we want you to have the opportunity to begin with

[1:37:29] Voice 4: yeah right

[1:37:30] Voice 4: that's that's how we have a chance of doing this better we haven't got a chance of doing

[1:37:34] Voice 4: this better if we have a rule that says we can't talk until somebody a little bit has decided

[1:37:38] Voice 4: something and then

[1:37:39] Voice 4: you can comment on that i mean what is that well they

[1:37:42] Voice 16: don't decide on your behalf

[1:37:43] Voice 16: They are

[1:37:44] Voice 4: commissioned

[1:37:45] Voice 16: to provide comments and recommendations to us.

[1:37:49] Voice 16: That's right.

[1:37:50] Voice 4: Yeah, but what about everybody?

[1:37:52] Voice 16: No, well, that's why we've built in the engagement-based other community information meetings,

[1:37:56] Voice 16: so to involve the community in general.

[1:37:59] Voice 4: Yeah, so there's going to be a bit of a sensitive dance, I think, to figure out what

[1:38:03] Voice 4: the balance is there,

[1:38:04] Voice 4: because I do believe that ABC might feel a little bit overwhelmed being given this very, very hot topic

[1:38:11] Voice 4: and saying consult you

[1:38:13] Voice 8: know yeah it

[1:38:14] Voice 4: would be a difficult challenge in the past to undertake

[1:38:18] Voice 4: without without being kind of and

[1:38:21] Voice 16: generally not so good their purpose is not to consult it's really

[1:38:26] Voice 16: to deliberate between those so maybe

[1:38:30] Voice 4: we need to have a public meeting public information meeting

[1:38:33] Voice 4: before we assign it to the APC.

[1:38:39] Voice 16: Like have a town hall meeting like we did at the beginning where we have a whiteboard and we come

[1:38:47] Voice 16: up with suggested solutions to various topics and then we move those on to the APC to come up with

[1:38:58] Voice 16: with other solutions and recommendations i would be interested to see if you could

[1:39:06] Voice 16: take it topic by topic because those topics are fairly large and if if you want to test a process

[1:39:16] Voice 16: and see if this is going to work asking an apc to identify the reasons and goals and how it's

[1:39:23] Voice 16: connected to an amendment you could test it with a specific topic yeah and see if that process works

[1:39:31] Voice 16: because yeah this is a bit of a new framework um so that could be an option as well but if you want

[1:39:39] Voice 16: to hold a community information meeting to talk about what yeah we can pick we can pick something

[1:39:47] Voice 16: that's not as contentious to run it through and go through the process and and see how that flows

[1:39:54] Voice 16: kind of workshop it workshop it yeah and and

[1:39:57] Voice 16: and

[1:39:57] Voice 8: then

[1:40:01] Voice 16: the website's broken i was looking trying to look up the apc

[1:40:04] Voice 16: your bylaw number 98 um is the bylaw email it oh you did it thank you um wednesday at 11 51

[1:40:13] Voice 16: dang good one forgive

[1:40:19] Voice 3: us

[1:40:20] Voice 16: as we look up things i can't believe this must be a nightmare for them

[1:40:37] Voice 8: yeah but they don't

[1:40:39] Voice 16: it's not really no up any documents like i did attach it to the email oh

[1:40:45] Voice 16: you did yeah you knew this was going to happen how did you know did you

[1:40:53] Voice 16: okay no i just had a feeling that the link wouldn't work by today's meeting that's why

[1:41:00] Voice 16: i attached it and that was the same with the bov bible i attached that one as well

[1:41:18] Voice 16: Yeah, it doesn't seem to say anything about throwing it back out to community, but it

[1:41:26] Voice 16: doesn't seem to limit that either.

[1:41:27] Voice 16: there?

[1:41:29] Voice 13: Point of order? Yes, sir.

[1:41:32] Voice 13: I've been involved in two APCs, one with respect to

[1:41:36] Voice 13: Poets' Cove Resort issue,

[1:41:39] Voice 8: chaired

[1:41:40] Voice 13: by Jim McDonald some time ago, and also an APC on house size

[1:41:45] Voice 13: under a previous APC. And both of those had open meetings and heard from the public. In fact,

[1:41:55] In fact, Jim McDonald set a second day because too many people came to the first one for the time available.

[1:42:03] He wanted to hear from everyone. And so that

[1:42:07] Voice 13: felt satisfying for the community.

[1:42:09] Voice 13: And that actually, that ATC recommendation really brought the community together because everybody felt heard.

[1:42:19] Voice 16: Yeah, I don't see anything that says that other members of the community can't attend or speak.

[1:42:25] Voice 16: The only thing is, the way that it's written is, the LTCs have to charge the agency with that ability.

[1:42:36] Voice 14: Okay.

[1:42:40] Voice 16: So, as we were just talking about using something maybe a little smaller as a workshopping element,

[1:42:48] Voice 16: What about using the final topic number 2.9 regarding the increase in the water requirements?

[1:43:07] Voice 16: Because that was something that really didn't get any discussion.

[1:43:11] Voice 16: And that might be a good place to start.

[1:43:13] Voice 16: It's something that we don't necessarily need to be conscious.

[1:43:16] Voice 16: Which one again?

[1:43:17] Voice 16: 2.9.

[1:43:19] Voice 16: 9.

[1:43:19] Voice 16: so considering as a first topic 2.9 just for the recorder um as a potential first topic

[1:43:29] Voice 16: the amendment regarding water storage fresh water systems and amounts okay are you sure it's 2.9

[1:43:45] Voice 16: on yours where it says by adding the words excluding a cottage after the words used as a

[1:43:50] Voice 16: dwelling by deleting the wood rainwater and replacing it with fresh water great that that

[1:43:56] Voice 16: didn't that didn't really get any discussion um prior i think this would be a great topic

[1:44:01] Voice 16: to start with i don't think it would be highly contentious run through the process and see if

[1:44:07] Voice 16: it works and see how people feel comfortable with it and then we can move on to the next item

[1:44:15] Voice 16: so yeah so we're considering instead of referring all the big topics just start one with this

[1:44:25] Voice 16: terms of reference yeah so you've asked it by trustee falk um assuming trustee will be in

[1:44:32] Voice 16: attendance remembering the public invited and we see how the process goes yeah that's good

[1:44:40] Voice 14: sounds good um i'm breaking this

[1:44:44] Voice 4: and just ask the question how do a lot of people feel well

[1:44:46] Voice 16: Well, we've got a second town hall.

[1:44:48] Voice 16: I think at this point, because of how we are,

[1:44:52] Voice 16: it might be good just to say,

[1:44:54] Voice 16: do people feel okay with this plan?

[1:44:56] Voice 16: I

[1:44:56] Voice 10: think it's worth a try.

[1:44:59] Voice 5: Just don't give you a simple question

[1:45:01] Voice 5: with non-controversial.

[1:45:04] Voice 16: I just have a question over here, Grace.

[1:45:06] Voice 16: I'm going to actually suggest we take a break

[1:45:09] Voice 16: for refreshments.

[1:45:11] Voice 16: If you want to do a quick canvas of the room,

[1:45:15] Voice 16: because i don't want to actually go away from our agenda too much you have a chance to give

[1:45:19] Voice 16: your comments at the second town hall have some conversations let's think about things

[1:45:25] Voice 16: uh a little bit and come back in 10 minutes and we can open with the request to explain

[1:45:31] Voice 16: what the process that we're suggesting again sounds good all right so we're going to recess

[1:45:37] Voice 16: us for 10 minutes.

[1:46:13] Voice 16: I was going

[1:46:13] Voice 16: to say.

[1:57:32] Voice 16: self-office

[1:57:33] Voice 16: i just want to check

[1:57:34] Voice 8: multiply

[1:57:35] Voice 16: everything

[1:57:48] Voice 5: by three all right cost estimates are

[1:57:50] Voice 5: time it's mine

[1:58:18] Voice 9: Good evening, everyone.

[1:58:21] Voice 9: Just over the break.

[1:58:30] Voice 16: So we're going to resume our discussion. For those watching, we're still in the Latin News

[1:58:36] Voice 16: Bylaw review project. We're discussing the engagement, the phased engagement suggested

[1:58:43] Voice 16: suggested by Planner Stockdale, and how and when things might be referred to the APC.

[1:58:50] Voice 16: I do hear agreement that, in general, I heard agreement from you that the major topics identified

[1:58:57] Voice 16: should be referred to the APC. And just trustee Bulk, are you in agreement with that?

[1:59:04] Voice 16: The major

[1:59:05] Voice 16: topics identified by Planner Stockdale should be referred to the APC?

[1:59:09] Voice 16: Yes.

[1:59:09] Voice 16: Okay, we have agreement on that. We're talking about the process and offering some terms of reference to the South Pender APC.

[1:59:19] Voice 16: I did have some questions on how much external community input could be requested by an APC.

[1:59:31] Voice 16: And then we had a break to talk to community members.

[1:59:35] Voice 16: What is your consensus? What did you hear?

[1:59:40] Voice 16: My very brief survey. Thank you so much, Paul and Monica, for the cookies.

[1:59:50] Voice 8: Yeah,

[1:59:50] Voice 16: I'm hearing that, yes, people in general are good with this, but they want to hear what the process is again.

[1:59:58] Voice 16: Okay.

[2:00:00] Voice 16: for clarification. So what

[2:00:03] Voice 15: do we suggest?

[2:00:03] Voice 16: Do you want to take us through that?

[2:00:06] Voice 16: Tom Stockdale, how about we have a suggestion from you to do a referral in general to the APC.

[2:00:14] Voice 16: Yes, yeah. But we've sort of decided a topic might be best referred to the APC and then

[2:00:22] Voice 16: the terms of reference Trustee Falk suggested could be included as a way of exploring that

[2:00:29] Voice 16: so people want to hear again what those steps would be okay you can take us through that again

[2:00:35] Voice 16: okay so

[2:00:35] Voice 4: yeah before i start what's our process internally for refining this because i this was

[2:00:43] Voice 4: pretty quick you know and i'm not dictating that it has to be word for word do we have a

[2:00:49] Voice 4: an editing process in mind later like

[2:00:54] Voice 4: where does it go from here i

[2:00:55] Voice 16: think planter's doctor you

[2:00:57] Voice 16: suggested we could go back and forth by email absolutely yeah so we don't have to have a

[2:01:01] Voice 16: resolution that includes this whole structured process this could be refined the resolution

[2:01:06] Voice 16: would simply state that you're referring to the apc and what the topic would be the finer details

[2:01:12] Voice 16: of the questions and so forth those can be discussed by email

[2:01:15] Voice 3: and

[2:01:17] Voice 16: i did as robert kojima

[2:01:18] Voice 16: regional planning manager is here because we had questions concerning um if a robert i'm not

[2:01:27] Voice 16: sure if you're here now but if the apc can consult with community members and if they if the apc can

[2:01:36] Voice 16: to what extent and in the meeting or external meeting okay

[2:01:43] Voice 1: thanks um so the purpose of an apc

[2:01:48] Voice 1: is to advise the local trust committee on whatever land use buying matters the local trust committee

[2:01:54] Voice 1: is referred to it so that's that's the that's in the legislation that's the basis of it um

[2:01:59] Voice 1: and however there's nothing precluding an apc from consulting with the community

[2:02:07] Voice 1: either as individual apc members obviously they can just do that generally or

[2:02:13] Voice 1: inviting the public to speak at an apc meeting there's nothing in the apc bylaw that would

[2:02:19] Voice 1: would prevent that or in the legislation um generally though for local I mean that sort of

[2:02:27] Voice 1: delegation of consultation to an APC generally works better seems to work or make sense in like

[2:02:34] Voice 1: a municipal council where they have broad range of issues they're dealing with and for one particular

[2:02:41] Voice 1: planning issue they may delegate in essence to their advisory planning commission to go out and

[2:02:46] Voice 1: and consult with the community on this one issue.

[2:02:49] Voice 1: For local trust committees,

[2:02:53] Voice 1: generally they're seeking advice from the APC.

[2:02:57] Voice 1: Consultation with the community

[2:02:59] Voice 1: is the role of the local trust committee.

[2:03:02] Voice 1: And in essence, if you think about it,

[2:03:06] Voice 1: it's a little unfair to the community to say, go to the APC.

[2:03:11] Voice 1: The APC is going to be holding public meetings

[2:03:15] Voice 1: on this issue. And then they're going to send their response recommendations to the LTC. And

[2:03:20] Voice 1: then you have to come again to the LTC and try and influence the LTC or make your voices known

[2:03:25] Voice 1: to the LTC. So from a practical point of view, it's often local trust committees consider that

[2:03:33] Voice 1: it's their role to get the community input, and the APC is to provide advice.

[2:03:41] Voice 16: vice that is helpful but yeah this is this is a general um practice it's not set no that's correct

[2:03:52] Voice 16: okay um if there is a point of order then the point of order

[2:04:00] Voice 16: means that we've done something

[2:04:01] Voice 16: wrong you can't

[2:04:02] Voice 8: oh okay

[2:04:03] Voice 16: we're we're doing something wrong it's not for you it's not

[2:04:05] Voice 8: read some

[2:04:06] Voice 16: discussion or comment. Okay, so the LTC has some discretion

[2:04:16] Voice 16: in its terms of reference to the APC, so can the LTC set the questions in a certain way and say

[2:04:24] Voice 16: we'd like you to consider this topic by answering these following questions because this is the

[2:04:32] Voice 16: information the LTC wants to pull from this body because we're discussing a framework of

[2:04:40] Voice 16: asking the APC to discuss certain topics in a certain way so that the trustees can

[2:04:46] Voice 16: get the advice that they need that is important for their decision does that make sense yes

[2:04:55] Voice 1: yeah it's often helpful to have terms of reference whether you call it a terms of reference or you

[2:05:02] Voice 1: just have a very specific referral to the APC, it helps APCs focus on what the question being

[2:05:09] Voice 1: asked by the local trust committee is, and to give meaningful recommendations back to the local trust

[2:05:14] Voice 1: committee, in other words, recommendations that the local trust committee is looking for.

[2:05:21] Voice 1: Sometimes I've seen APCs where it's in a kind of an open-ended referral or a vague referral,

[2:05:25] Voice 1: they can spin their wheels a bit so it's helpful to focus the discussion by having

[2:05:32] Voice 1: specific direction to an APC. I think they appreciate that or the chair and the members

[2:05:39] Voice 1: of the APC would appreciate that as long as it's not seen as overly restrictive on their discussion.

[2:05:47] Voice 16: So, I'm puzzling through this in my head, the various scenarios.

[2:05:53] Voice 16: If we go to the APC as per general practice and say, hey, here's our framework, you speak

[2:06:02] Voice 16: only to us and give us your solutions to these issues, then we're going to have multiple

[2:06:11] Voice 16: multiple community information meetings or town halls, whatever, in order to solicit the solutions from the community.

[2:06:20] Voice 16: And then it'll likely have to go back to the APC and run again.

[2:06:23] Voice 16: Or we hold the community information or town hall to solicit solutions from the community first.

[2:06:31] Voice 16: And then we take those and give those to the APC to ponder through and come back with advice on the various solutions.

[2:06:41] Voice 16: maybe that's the way to go that we hold the the those meetings first we get the because we need

[2:06:49] Voice 16: the community input this cannot be a small body of people um coming up with these decisions without

[2:06:56] Voice 16: community input this time so do you have any advice from robert on on sort of a a balanced

[2:07:08] Voice 16: way to work through the process that we don't because i'm cognizant of spending taxpayer dollars

[2:07:13] Voice 16: on more special meetings which you know require minutes and staff time and then APC meetings which

[2:07:21] Voice 16: also require minutes and staff time administrative so how can we ensure that there are more voices

[2:07:29] Voice 16: included than just the APC without calling all these special meetings to discuss a matter that

[2:07:39] Voice 16: it's very clearly laid out you want to discuss that the amendment yeah so basically we're going

[2:07:43] Voice 16: to be workshopping workshopping with the community so does that require a minute taker if it's it's

[2:07:50] Voice 16: not conducting business it's solutioning it's it's um coming up with suggestions from the public

[2:07:58] Voice 16: it's not but what are you solutioning you're asking whether an a specific amendment in this

[2:08:07] Voice 16: bylaw meets um

[2:08:08] Voice 8: that's not what i'm

[2:08:09] Voice 16: suggesting i'm suggesting that we hold a meeting like this

[2:08:12] Voice 16: we have a whiteboard and we said hey so our topic is this what are your suggestions

[2:08:19] Voice 16: then then you're saying you don't want to do it with the apc well that's what i'm saying

[2:08:24] Voice 16: it's either the apc does it or we do it one

[2:08:28] Voice 4: of us has to do it it's to me more and more

[2:08:31] Voice 4: it seems like the APC isn't the right tool for this

[2:08:35] Voice 8: perhaps

[2:08:36] Voice 4: because we're going to have done it

[2:08:39] Voice 4: by the time we like if we talk to the community first and get you know we will be sorry if there's

[2:08:44] Voice 4: enough that a second opinion by another expert group it's still valid

[2:08:49] Voice 4: sending that to the I

[2:08:51] Voice 16: think sending it to the APC for their advice on the on the end solution and then coming back

[2:08:57] Voice 16: would be the correct thing rather than it just sitting with us we should still get

[2:09:01] Voice 16: but we are all it

[2:09:02] Voice 16: does it does sit with you in the end they just give you recommendations

[2:09:06] Voice 16: you have to make the decision it's how do you want to get the information that you need

[2:09:12] Voice 16: to make that decision that's what i'm talking that's your pro that's what we're trying to

[2:09:16] Voice 16: decide on now and i really am going to say i let's not do two processes that are trying to

[2:09:22] Voice 16: do the same thing that's what i'm

[2:09:24] Voice 16: saying like elaine either they see or a community engagement

[2:09:28] Voice 16: So

[2:09:28] Voice 4: there is a guideline in the APC Act, whatever, that the trustees can participate, well, we can be present at the meetings for, what's the term?

[2:09:45] Voice 4: Out of resource capacity.

[2:09:47] Voice 4: Out of resource capacity. So I can't get in there like a dirty shirt, is what

[2:09:52] Voice 4: I'm reading that as, but I want to.

[2:09:58] Voice 4: so that's why i'm saying doesn't seem like it's the right process because that that's the process

[2:10:02] Voice 4: we need you want me you want her you want all of us and we want all of you we want to do this

[2:10:08] Voice 4: together and how are the rules so

[2:10:12] Voice 16: we have to we have to find a way to we

[2:10:15] Voice 4: have to yeah we have to

[2:10:16] Voice 4: find a way to do that so it seems like the apc isn't sort of built for that yeah and the community

[2:10:23] Voice 4: community information meeting is closer to built for that I

[2:10:27] Voice 16: would say it's not a community

[2:10:27] Voice 16: information meeting it's a town hall it's a workshop it's not it's not a community information

[2:10:33] Voice 16: meeting is when you're imparting information this is a workshop it's going to be a special

[2:10:38] Voice 16: meeting because the two of you are there and so it's a legally constituted meeting you can't get

[2:10:42] Voice 16: away from minute taking you

[2:10:44] Voice 4: can't right yeah we're bound by that unfortunately we cannot take

[2:10:50] Voice 16: comments from the public right now i'm sorry everyone

[2:10:56] Voice 16: special meeting special meeting yeah thank you

[2:10:59] Voice 16: um

[2:11:01] Voice 1: so there is um built into the project charter

[2:11:04] Voice 1: that you've been looking at or maybe you haven't got to it yet um there is you know anticipated to

[2:11:09] Voice 1: be um several special media i don't know kim if how many were built into the project charter i

[2:11:15] Voice 1: I can't remember offhand, but it's typically built into a project like this and expectation there are going to be some public meetings and those expenses are built into the budget.

[2:11:24] Voice 1: There are other means by which you can gather community input.

[2:11:30] Voice 1: I mean, we could do an online survey, questionnaire type approach.

[2:11:37] Voice 1: We could just ask people to send emails in and over a period of time, you know, like a consultation period.

[2:11:46] Voice 1: there's yeah there are mechanisms like that uh individually as trustees you could

[2:11:52] Voice 1: sit in the space and for a morning and ask people to come and tell you what they think

[2:12:00] Voice 1: no individually

[2:12:01] Voice 1: here

[2:12:02] Voice 16: yep on one saturday you can be here on another saturday

[2:12:06] Voice 1: yep it's like having office hours or

[2:12:11] Voice 16: yeah i'm happy to do that and i i believe they can actually sit together as long as you're just

[2:12:16] Voice 16: hearing information but not discussing and making decisions is that right robert well it's it's

[2:12:22] Voice 1: leading leading to a decision and there's just the perception of it as well as the problem

[2:12:26] Voice 1: fair

[2:12:27] Voice 16: yeah so there's multiple approaches to soliciting input and on a

[2:12:33] Voice 16: broader basis it

[2:12:34] Voice 16: sounds like the APC will still be useful perhaps for some topics but further down the line you want

[2:12:41] Voice 16: to set up a process that is broader than just consulting with the APC okay yeah

[2:12:47] Voice 4: so I'm kind of

[2:12:48] Voice 4: liking survey and questionnaire and emailing within a time frame that's a good way to get

[2:12:56] Voice 4: information but you know what I was going to share again here we'll call terms of reference but we'll

[2:13:03] Voice 4: call it something else kind of the guiding principles so to frame for it that would be

[2:13:09] Voice 4: the preface for that consultation period yeah so

[2:13:12] Voice 4: write to us but don't write to us what you want

[2:13:15] Voice 4: write to us how what you want achieves a goal describe the goal to achieve how it does it

[2:13:23] Voice 4: that's

[2:13:23] Voice 16: why i think having like as one-on-one in here to have a group of people to help guide the

[2:13:30] Voice 16: solutioning

[2:13:31] Voice 8: process

[2:13:32] Voice 16: initially and then have people write in because otherwise people are going to

[2:13:38] Voice 16: write in this is my position right and you know this is my position and what we're trying to do

[2:13:44] Voice 16: is get away from that and get into so this is this is the problem and this is a solution that

[2:13:51] Voice 16: i see as a potential way to move us forward gotcha so i think like i would i'm going to

[2:13:58] Voice 16: to just volunteer myself right now i will do this in in this space um so what we're what i'm hearing

[2:14:05] Voice 16: is a first special meeting to explore the framework here's the framework here's how we

[2:14:12] Voice 16: want to discuss these ideas and we're going to workshop one and you

[2:14:16] Voice 16: suggested two point whatever

[2:14:18] Voice 16: that was nine you can

[2:14:19] Voice 16: have you can have a range okay so a special meeting to explore the framework

[2:14:25] Voice 16: follow that with a period of surveys and requesting emails in a specific way so that

[2:14:33] Voice 16: you're going to get the information that you need from the public yeah then perhaps there'll be a

[2:14:37] Voice 16: referral to the apc on another topic that's maybe whatever but that you're not ready to make the

[2:14:44] Voice 8: larger

[2:14:44] Voice 16: decision yet yeah great do we have a decision i think so it's very worthy

[2:14:56] Voice 16: oh i didn't say it wasn't simple i said it's wordy

[2:15:00] Voice 16: well you're going to request a you're going to amend the project charter first so we're going

[2:15:06] Voice 16: back to our recommendations um robert anything else i don't want to keep you here but i think

[2:15:12] Voice 16: you were able to answer a question so oh

[2:15:15] Voice 1: it sounds like you're working towards uh

[2:15:17] Voice 1: towards a solution and through the process so that's good i'll just i'll just lurk here for a

[2:15:22] Voice 1: a while we

[2:15:22] Voice 8: are

[2:15:25] Voice 1: interesting aren't we oh yeah

[2:15:27] Voice 16: um great so we've got um let's work through the

[2:15:34] Voice 16: recommendations uh one at a time and we can amend them at any point okay so i will start i move that

[2:15:41] Voice 16: the south pender island local trust committee approved the project charter for the leb

[2:15:45] Voice 16: the amendments project and so we're just going to second it so we can discuss it um trustee falk

[2:15:52] Voice 16: and we can amend the project charter 17 that's still um up for 17 how did i miss

[2:16:03] Voice 16: oh where's the charter it's way down there there there it is no i that the recommendation is on

[2:16:10] Voice 16: page 17 yeah the charter is elsewhere so the charter just establishes the deliverables uh

[2:16:15] Voice 16: elements in scope, out of scope, and then a general work plan overview, but it isn't

[2:16:21] Voice 16: fixed in stone. Like Clanner Stockville said, it's a living document. So it just establishes

[2:16:27] Voice 16: there's a budget. We may need legal opinions. So it's $2,000 budgeted. There may be an APC

[2:16:34] Voice 16: referral. There'll be public engagement monies. And so project charter is essential to getting

[2:16:39] Voice 16: this move forward. I did second

[2:16:42] Voice 16: that actually. That's what I'm saying. I apologize. You said

[2:16:47] Voice 16: we need to second it, not that you seconded it. I second that, just so we can discuss it.

[2:16:52] Voice 16: I

[2:16:52] Voice 4: want to move this through. I'm discussing it now. On page 19 on the bottom there,

[2:16:59] Voice 4: the engagement phase, is it included in what was this motion? Is it the work plan?

[2:17:05] Voice 4: because if it is I would like to make it from the amendment that we it's well

[2:17:10] Voice 16: the charter is this

[2:17:12] Voice 16: document so it does include public engagement options but it doesn't specify what the engagement

[2:17:19] Voice 16: looks like the charter is necessary to set the budget and get the project going

[2:17:25] Voice 16: on those are just

[2:17:26] Voice 16: examples for example that it's for example doesn't mean this is what

[2:17:32] Voice 16: it will be

[2:17:33] Voice 8: it's not an IE it's an EG. So the engagement

[2:17:40] Voice 16: phase could be we'll discuss that in

[2:17:43] Voice 16: item three when we talk about how the community information meetings or all of that the project

[2:17:51] Voice 16: charter does include an engagement budget so regardless of what the engagement is

[2:18:00] Voice 8: what do you need to budget for it right

[2:18:05] Voice 14: yeah it's just it's included

[2:18:07] Voice 4: in the work plan overview and

[2:18:09] Voice 4: Like I started, I think the motion would include this text.

[2:18:13] Voice 4: We should know

[2:18:14] Voice 16: the project charter is just the project charter,

[2:18:17] Voice 16: not the not the entire report or page one to one page 20 to this one.

[2:18:23] Voice 16: That's charter version. That's the charter.

[2:18:25] Voice 4: So it's just the charter. Yeah, yeah.

[2:18:29] Voice 16: And it has a suggested work plan, but that can be amended

[2:18:34] Voice 16: like that, the deliverables and the violence.

[2:18:36] Voice 16: so this is just version one so we have a project charter to work from and it can be that the first

[2:18:43] Voice 16: thing we do is change them so it does include money for community information meetings there's

[2:18:49] Voice 16: $1,500 public engagement hall rental advertising minute taker supplies $2,500 ABC referral there's

[2:18:57] Voice 16: only $500 and all of these can be adjusted as needed it's

[2:19:04] Voice 8: just to get the project going you

[2:19:06] Voice 8: need a charter and one thing to note that um that i'm

[2:19:16] Voice 16: really happy with is the iap2

[2:19:20] Voice 16: engagement level is involved and not consult informal collaborate so

[2:19:25] Voice 16: we're involving the community

[2:19:26] Voice 8: because that's really important if we pass this

[2:19:42] Voice 4: motion are we

[2:19:44] Voice 4: then going to move on to make motions to revise the deliverable milestones no

[2:19:51] Voice 16: i think now is the

[2:19:52] Voice 16: the time to put your comments in on any changes you want to see to the milestones how

[2:20:01] Voice 4: is the time

[2:20:02] Voice 4: to do

[2:20:02] Voice 16: that now is the time to do it the minute taker will take notes can this take your notes

[2:20:06] Voice 16: the motion is to approve the perfect charter as is so if any of that changes are you're thinking

[2:20:13] Voice 16: there should be changes and perhaps we should deny that motion and then make a motion to

[2:20:21] Voice 16: probably it's

[2:20:22] Voice 16: the cleanest way to do it sure or you could say potentially um to what's the

[2:20:32] Voice 16: wording here to adopt to approve the project charter for the land use bylaw amendments as

[2:20:42] Voice 16: amended and then you can include those amendments perhaps there's some other way to do it

[2:20:47] Voice 8: yeah

[2:20:49] Voice 4: it's just we talked about a bunch of different ways of structuring this right

[2:20:54] Voice 4: So if we're going down that road and we're approving something that doesn't say that

[2:21:00] Voice 4: now, I just wanted to get clear on what the process was for doing that.

[2:21:06] Voice 4: So what

[2:21:08] Voice 16: would you like to learn?

[2:21:10] Voice 4: Well, for instance, the review of APC engagement comments, LTC direction to bylaw draft May

[2:21:18] Voice 4: 24th.

[2:21:19] Voice 4: We've now changed that to after the electronic special meeting to review draft bylaw July

[2:21:25] Voice 4: 24th.

[2:21:26] Voice 4: I believe, but actually the one about that even APC referral.

[2:21:30] Voice 16: So if we just...

[2:21:31] Voice 4: Not

[2:21:31] Voice 16: necessarily, because if we're going to hold in-person meetings first,

[2:21:36] Voice 16: that information will be collected.

[2:21:38] Voice 4: Yeah, but that has to be on here. That meeting isn't on here.

[2:21:41] Voice 4: So

[2:21:41] Voice 16: that is public engagement to identify issues.

[2:21:45] Voice 16: After APC referral and public engagement to identify issues.

[2:21:50] Voice 16: So we

[2:21:51] Voice 16: could just remove APC referral.

[2:21:52] Voice 16: That's what I'm saying.

[2:21:53] Voice 16: yeah okay

[2:21:54] Voice 4: so that's the

[2:21:56] Voice 8: first meeting and then uh yeah i

[2:22:04] Voice 4: don't see how we're going to be at a stage

[2:22:07] Voice 4: that quickly if you could i

[2:22:09] Voice 16: would i would i would change january i could even put that to

[2:22:14] Voice 16: november because i can start being in here on saturday mornings or saturday afternoons or

[2:22:20] Voice 8: whatever

[2:22:21] Voice 16: but well we can't spend public money on whole rental unless we decide how many meetings

[2:22:28] Voice 16: is there no rental cost no maybe 50 bucks no needs to what do we need we don't need anything

[2:22:38] Voice 16: i'm just going to physically be here and members of the community can tell me

[2:22:41] Voice 16: well this is what the charter is for public money is spent and it needs to be earmarked

[2:22:48] Voice 16: for specific activities if you're going to hold 20 meetings uh you know that needs to be defined

[2:22:56] Voice 16: that's what i'm saying we can put that in here but it changed from january to november

[2:23:00] Voice 16: it's part of the public

[2:23:02] Voice 8: initial public engagement period that's already in there

[2:23:09] Voice 8: and after hearing our sort of massaging

[2:23:13] Voice 4: the proposal do you see a different do you see a

[2:23:17] Voice 4: way for us to sort of restructure the timeline we

[2:23:19] Voice 16: could first restructure the timeline but again

[2:23:22] Voice 16: And the UPC referral says January to March.

[2:23:26] Voice 16: So my advice is to actually adopt the project charter as is, make a motion to schedule a special meeting, perhaps sometime in January, either in person or electronically.

[2:23:39] Voice 16: And that special meeting can be used to discuss the framework of the questions that you want community members to answer and perhaps a topic.

[2:23:46] Voice 16: it and then each trustee could also schedule individual times either in december or january

[2:23:53] Voice 16: to use this room and that's all built in the budget that could all be found under

[2:23:59] Voice 16: public engagement because that's what we're doing it's just different forms of public engagement

[2:24:04] Voice 16: and then what could happen is after we've done one cim each trustee has done a few of their

[2:24:11] Voice 16: their individual meetings at the first regular LTC meeting

[2:24:17] Voice 16: in 2024.

[2:24:18] Voice 16: I can consolidate that information,

[2:24:21] Voice 16: bring back the project charter to have another look at,

[2:24:26] Voice 8: and maybe

[2:24:27] Voice 16: at that point we make amendments to it.

[2:24:29] Voice 8: But

[2:24:30] Voice 16: what you're proposing right now,

[2:24:31] Voice 16: it still fits in the project charter as I see it.

[2:24:34] Voice 16: Okay.

[2:24:35] Voice 16: Yeah.

[2:24:35] Voice 16: Thank you.

[2:24:36] Voice 16: I guess what I'm cautious of is because

[2:24:42] Voice 16: I did look at the budgets for last term's charter and they were three times what the budget was,

[2:24:49] Voice 16: and we just end up approving it because it's part of the project.

[2:24:53] Voice 16: Part of that was Driftwood advertising, $500 a pop. So my question is, how will

[2:25:03] Voice 16: the LTC advertise the opportunities for the public to come?

[2:25:09] Voice 16: um how we maintain a sense of um neutrality that we're not you know one trustee inviting

[2:25:18] Voice 16: whoever the other trustee inviting whoever like we've got to have a process that we're

[2:25:24] Voice 16: holding up to the public and saying here's how you can engage right and we are spending public

[2:25:30] Voice 16: money so i'm cautious about just saying i will show up at the at the fire hall every saturday

[2:25:36] Voice 16: to hear your comments um that needs to be no i'm sold into this it'll be it'll it'll be requested

[2:25:45] Voice 16: if you can go out through the email blast so it hits everybody all at once there is no you know

[2:25:50] Voice 16: major cost to that there's no cost to my time being in here there's no real cost to renting

[2:25:55] Voice 16: this because this is a community hall

[2:25:56] Voice 3: so

[2:25:57] Voice 16: i can be in here and that's what i was saying i could

[2:26:00] Voice 16: be in here every saturday it's not going to cost anything fifty dollars on saturday it'll cost

[2:26:07] Voice 16: something but yes

[2:26:08] Voice 8: i think but

[2:26:09] Voice 16: i mean half the time they don't even charge

[2:26:11] Voice 16: that's what i'm saying it's this is a free use if you push them they will charge you

[2:26:15] Voice 16: $50 otherwise it's a new default to use without a cost that's and that's what i say we're not

[2:26:23] Voice 16: going to be advertising the driftwood we're not spending we don't do that anymore so that's the

[2:26:28] Voice 16: best way to reach everybody is through the email blast yeah so

[2:26:32] Voice 16: that is just you know and i can

[2:26:34] Voice 16: like i'm gonna pick i'm available this saturday and this saturday yeah i can do the same thing

[2:26:40] Voice 16: if you wish this and it's open to anyone and it's really just a facilitation of the community

[2:26:46] Voice 16: members providing their solutions and going through a solutioning process of the topic that

[2:26:54] Voice 16: we've chosen and how will you collect that information and provide it back to the planner

[2:27:01] Voice 16: I can take photographs of the flip chart and email them to the planner.

[2:27:08] Voice 16: Is that good with you, Kim?

[2:27:11] Voice 16: Yeah, that's okay.

[2:27:12] Voice 16: Okay.

[2:27:12] Voice 16: Yeah.

[2:27:14] Voice 16: Good.

[2:27:16] Voice 16: I just think it's an important element to the solution.

[2:27:23] Voice 16: It's on the right track.

[2:27:26] Voice 16: Okay.

[2:27:37] Voice 4: Yeah,

[2:27:38] Voice 16: we're ready to vote. Just again, we're voting on the first recommendation, the Project

[2:27:43] Voice 16: Charter for the LUB Amendments Project. All in favour? Very well done. Before we move to the

[2:27:55] Voice 16: second one um so do you want to refer anything to an apc at this point i think just referring

[2:28:07] Voice 16: this report to the apc allows them to meet for the first time and get their their um their positions

[2:28:19] Voice 16: sorted because like we haven't given them anything so i don't think they can meet yet

[2:28:23] Voice 15: so

[2:28:24] Voice 16: then they're ready when by the time we get to march or whenever it is that we have

[2:28:30] Voice 16: input from the community collated and say hey they don't have to start by having their

[2:28:35] Voice 16: who's going to take on the charity is going to take on these roles and and get all of that

[2:28:40] Voice 16: sorted i think would be prudent to say yes we are going to be referring to you in the future

[2:28:46] Voice 16: here is the report so you have it in your hand you can receive it and discuss it as needed

[2:28:52] Voice 16: did prior to starting the work do you want their comments do you want the feedback because that's

[2:28:58] Voice 16: what you're asking is yeah the group will meet there'll be minutes taken you're going to ask

[2:29:03] Voice 16: them questions and what are those questions we're not saying that they have to provide comment by

[2:29:08] Voice 16: the next meeting that's comments in the future kim um what i could do instead is informally

[2:29:17] Voice 16: send the staff report to each apc members and just let them know that the project is starting

[2:29:23] Voice 16: and more than likely the LTC will be engaging with the LTC in the new year and I can just provide

[2:29:29] Voice 16: that information that they can read over individually would that be helpful that sounds

[2:29:33] Voice 16: good and I don't need a resolution to do that I can add it to my follow-up action list thanks yeah

[2:29:40] Voice 16: okay great so then we will not do number two okay good um but did you want to have a schedule a

[2:29:49] Voice 16: special meeting in which you're going to discuss the framework that you suggested.

[2:30:00] Voice 15: I

[2:30:00] Voice 16: think we have to pass a resolution so that they can

[2:30:06] Voice 16: schedule the next two community information meetings however far down the road they are

[2:30:11] Voice 16: because the closer we get the more expensive things will come and it depends on how much

[2:30:15] Voice 16: engagement we have and if it's anything like one of the meetings where half the

[2:30:21] Voice 16: audience showed up then it's going to have to involve Poets' Cove or North Panther Community

[2:30:26] Voice 16: or something

[2:30:27] Voice 8: that will actually give you a cost for a whole mental

[2:30:43] Voice 16: i'm just wondering if you need special meeting scheduled at this point if you're holding

[2:30:49] Voice 16: your own what i thought i heard at the very beginning was you'd like to hold a special

[2:30:55] Voice 16: meeting to discuss this framework and explore a topic together i think we can we can i think we

[2:31:06] Voice 16: can agree on which topic to use first now I don't yet have that special meeting that's

[2:31:11] Voice 1: not what I

[2:31:12] Voice 16: was suggesting I was suggesting you have to schedule a special meeting if you want to explore

[2:31:17] Voice 16: a topic together and that's what I'm asking is do you want to schedule that now I think we have to

[2:31:22] Voice 16: okay yeah

[2:31:25] Voice 8: good yeah sure that's good so I

[2:31:34] Voice 16: would move that the South Penner Island Local Trust

[2:31:37] Voice 16: committee request staff to schedule one special meeting to explore a topic in the minor land use

[2:31:50] Voice 16: bylaw amendment project using the framework suggested by trustee falk no i wouldn't support

[2:32:01] Voice 16: support them right then what do you want to do uh the way that you've phrased it implies that

[2:32:10] Voice 16: so first of all the issue here is we have to give staff enough time to schedule

[2:32:14] Voice 16: well in advance the two community information meetings what those topics include are up for

[2:32:21] Voice 16: us to decide later on so we'll have those placeholders for those community information

[2:32:26] Voice 16: meetings as we get closer we can determine the topic if you decide the topic now

[2:32:31] Voice 16: didn't say the topic i said to explore a topic using the framework that he says that's the topic

[2:32:37] Voice 16: is is you you explicitly defined what that meeting is going to be used for okay i'm saying leave it

[2:32:45] Voice 16: open as as recommended so go for it okay good now the cell i moved that the south pender island

[2:32:56] Voice 16: local trust committee requests staff to schedule two community information meetings for the minor

[2:33:00] Voice 16: a land use bylaw

[2:33:02] Voice 8: amendment project. I'll second that. Seconded by Trustee Falk. Okay.

[2:33:13] Voice 16: Is there any discussion? They are community information meetings at some point in the future.

[2:33:21] Voice 16: Do you have any direction to staff as to approximately when or is that all clear?

[2:33:25] Voice 16: And I somehow missed it. I probably missed it.

[2:33:27] Voice 8: I'm confused. Did you have a question about

[2:33:36] Voice 8: a time

[2:33:37] Voice 4: frame between the meeting like how how much would be spacing them out or i'd say that

[2:33:43] Voice 16: we should um leave it open at the moment and the reason being is when we come to our regularly

[2:33:53] Voice 16: scheduled meeting in february we'll have a better idea as to when we that community information

[2:33:59] Voice 16: meeting can develop it could be um stuff stopped in do you have you have something in here that

[2:34:09] Voice 16: identified sort of a time frame when those community meetings could be held?

[2:34:15] Voice 16: They were I believe I said well it could be February to March yeah yeah so what I

[2:34:23] Voice 16: foresee happening is perhaps each trustee holds their individual meetings perhaps in January

[2:34:29] Voice 16: we reconvene in the at the regular meeting in February at that point perhaps we can schedule

[2:34:36] Voice 16: dates for two special meetings, one at the end of February, one at the beginning of March.

[2:34:43] Voice 16: Would that be helpful? Does that? Well, that's why I'm asking why do we need this resolution now

[2:34:50] Voice 16: if we're not yet scheduling dates? The whole point in your view was to make sure we get the

[2:34:56] Voice 16: dates secured. So either we need to set those dates now or we don't need to make the resolution

[2:35:03] Voice 16: because we can't schedule the meetings until we decide in February I think it's more the fact

[2:35:09] Voice 16: that we're saying we're going to have two community information meetings the charter says the charters

[2:35:14] Voice 16: does say that it's all in the work plan like we're asking staff to schedule two community

[2:35:23] Voice 16: information meetings but you're saying okay we're not

[2:35:25] Voice 8: looking at the

[2:35:26] Voice 16: wrong page that's why we're not

[2:35:27] Voice 16: ready to schedule those meetings yet so there's no point clearly if I may um even if the LTC does

[2:35:38] Voice 16: us pass this resolution staff will not act on it um so it can be made today and we've got it in our

[2:35:47] Voice 16: back pocket perhaps if something comes up over december and january and we'll make good as maybe

[2:35:52] Voice 16: we should schedule a quick electronics then we

[2:35:55] Voice 15: don't have to

[2:35:56] Voice 16: do it by the way we have it

[2:35:57] Voice 16: um it is nice to have in our back pocket and for those community members who cannot attend today

[2:36:04] Voice 16: but maybe reading the minutes it may be reassuring to community members that okay yes the LTC

[2:36:09] Voice 16: plans to hold meetings community

[2:36:14] Voice 8: information meetings in the near future really just mindful

[2:36:24] Voice 16: of budget this is all this is coming from is because scheduling meetings are it's immediately

[2:36:30] Voice 16: triggering money so I'm just very cautious that's where this

[2:36:34] Voice 16: is coming from not that I don't want

[2:36:35] Voice 16: you to have your meetings yeah there needs to be a reason I think there's a very strong reason for

[2:36:40] Voice 16: to have these meetings it's in the charter but yeah if you want to any further discussion on this

[2:36:49] Voice 16: all those in favor okay that is carried excellent um would you like to give any further direction to

[2:36:59] Voice 16: staff on any aspect of this project um

[2:37:03] Voice 8: would it be a good idea for me to make

[2:37:11] Voice 16: a motion that

[2:37:11] Voice 16: that the first topic that we're going to have our little workshops on is um item 2.9

[2:37:20] Voice 16: that'd be a good idea or just like leave it open and just trust

[2:37:28] Voice 8: that this is the

[2:37:29] Voice 16: first thing that

[2:37:29] Voice 16: we talk about the um gatherings of each individual each individual trustee will be holding and

[2:37:36] Voice 16: gathering information to bring back at this point it may be worthwhile having an open ended because

[2:37:44] Voice 16: because community members may want to comment on the engagement phases, maybe the scope question

[2:37:49] Voice 16: could be potentially the scope of the project. I fear that if you give them just one thing to speak

[2:37:55] Voice 16: on, they may be frustrated. I think that we can focus those topics after February, or perhaps

[2:38:01] Voice 16: leave your individual gatherings open-ended. But that's certainly up to the, if you decide you have

[2:38:07] Voice 16: say three re-gatherings you could perhaps identify one of those as I just think that anybody who has

[2:38:15] Voice 16: comments regarding maximum floor area can come to that meeting so because

[2:38:21] Voice 3: what I was

[2:38:22] Voice 16: what I was

[2:38:22] Voice 16: thinking of doing was having one of the workshops and starting with the um the water topic for

[2:38:30] Voice 16: for solutioning as as a way to sort of like what's our feet yeah so you quit for one of them

[2:38:37] Voice 16: and then what we could do is draft out a notice indicate what it means you plan to be here

[2:38:43] Voice 16: and then which topic you'd like to focus on and we can post out on the community board here and

[2:38:49] Voice 16: i think it's just the one here yeah okay if you'd like to yeah okay um okay so

[2:38:58] Voice 16: So I move that the South Upenda Local Trust Committee, I might need help with this.

[2:39:11] Voice 16: Would you want

[2:39:12] Voice 16: to advise staff to have a notice sent out that you'll be holding a meeting

[2:39:19] Voice 16: and on that topic?

[2:39:20] Voice 16: Is that?

[2:39:21] Voice 16: Yes.

[2:39:21] Voice 10: Yeah.

[2:39:21] Voice 16: Yeah, so the LTC requests staff to prepare a public notice for a meeting on next date on the topic of, and

[2:39:40] Voice 14: maybe we can fill in the date

[2:39:41] Voice 8: after.

[2:39:45] Voice 8: Yeah, I'm all right.

[2:39:46] Voice 8: we can

[2:39:47] Voice 16: keep it open-ended for as you can say direct staff to prepare a notice for

[2:39:53] Voice 16: trustee i don't know what we want to call it workshops for the land to smile up project

[2:40:00] Voice 16: maybe keep it really open-ended sure then we've got

[2:40:04] Voice 16: little room yeah and then we can sit down

[2:40:06] Voice 16: this date we can talk about this one i just think

[2:40:08] Voice 16: we can talk about this one yeah great good good

[2:40:10] Voice 16: Good. Yeah. Okay. And I would say to, to disseminate via email blast, just make sure that people see it.

[2:40:22] Voice 16: Awesome. Yeah. I like that. Thank you.

[2:40:24] Voice 16: Can you read that back, Kim, just for the sake of it?

[2:40:28] Voice 16: um gosh i don't have the beginning part that the south pender island local trust committee

[2:40:34] Voice 16: direct staff to prepare a notice and a or to prepare notices advertising

[2:40:44] Voice 16: trustee led workshops on the land use bylaw review you guys are good

[2:40:53] Voice 16: maybe

[2:40:54] Voice 4: not trustee led

[2:41:00] Voice 4: or i don't know i don't you're

[2:41:03] Voice 16: hosting you may have we are meeting you can host it

[2:41:06] Voice 16: just checking in with our recorder is everything okay there yes

[2:41:15] Voice 9: thank you i got it

[2:41:16] Voice 16: awesome thank

[2:41:17] Voice 16: Thank you so much. Do I have a seconder?

[2:41:19] Voice 16: Sure.

[2:41:20] Voice 16: Seconded by Trustee Falk. Any further discussion? All those in favor? And that is carried.

[2:41:26] Voice 16: Thank you.

[2:41:27] Voice 16: Great. So we have a work plan. We have a charter. We have budget. We've got very eager trustees.

[2:41:33] Voice 16: You're going to workshop this by-law amendment project, ladies and gentlemen.

[2:41:38] Voice 16: Yes.

[2:41:42] Voice 16: And here it goes.

[2:41:45] Voice 16: I think that's um good good work everybody yeah it's tricky we're gonna figure out our own process

[2:41:52] Voice 16: anything else it's

[2:41:53] Voice 4: gonna be a competition between me and Christina

[2:41:55] Voice 4: I

[2:41:56] Voice 16: think

[2:42:02] Voice 4: we have to put on the table what are you going to bake

[2:42:07] Voice 16: my husband makes the best double chocolate

[2:42:10] Voice 16: I like the term that it's competition. I might actually come for one for fun.

[2:42:18] Voice 16: Excellent. So thank you everyone for your hard work on this and good debates and great suggestions

[2:42:25] Voice 16: on public engagement. You know your community well and I really wish you success and

[2:42:30] Voice 16: I

[2:42:31] Voice 8: will support in the

[2:42:31] Voice 16: wings. I'll bring cookies next time.

[2:42:35] Voice 16: okay um so we're going to move on to the rest of the agenda we have um

[2:42:41] Voice 16: our active projects reports and future projects as always don't know if there's any

[2:42:51] Voice 16: thing new on those epa's are very important i can tell you that much

[2:43:02] Voice 16: um active projects

[2:43:03] Voice 15: or applications and then our expenses and

[2:43:14] Voice 16: adopted policies and standing resolutions is there anything you want to

[2:43:19] Voice 16: hold on one sec are we running through all of this because i'm still i'd like to yeah

[2:43:24] Voice 16: just if

[2:43:24] Voice 8: yeah i was just noticing

[2:43:25] Voice 16: the minor luv lgb project is our active projects before

[2:43:29] Voice 16: we've just discussed it, right? Yep. Okay.

[2:43:33] Voice 16: Then our future projects report. Do we want to walk

[2:43:37] Voice 16: through these? If you want any changes or remove anything from the list, these just sit here until

[2:43:45] Voice 16: they're sort of a... Okay. So just for people listening on the future projects report, we have

[2:43:51] Voice 16: review of existing and potential development permit areas. Number two, sea level rise and

[2:43:57] Voice 16: shoreline erosion number three first language first nations language number four groundwater

[2:44:04] Voice 16: sustainability project number five raptor's nest mapping and number six shoreline review project

[2:44:11] Voice 16: i have nothing to add to that i just wanted to voice it

[2:44:17] Voice 3: why

[2:44:20] Voice 16: was shoreline review project added

[2:44:23] Voice 16: it in may 2023 i don't remember because we moved that from the active to the future

[2:44:28] Voice 16: thanks you're welcome yeah and you've got too many people that you're following

[2:44:36] Voice 16: without agendas i'd be lost i'll

[2:44:38] Voice 8: tell you that

[2:44:39] Voice 16: um so the application on 8970 down point road

[2:44:45] Voice 16: um do you have any because that was sitting with you you had been given authority to sign the um

[2:44:52] Voice 16: I haven't seen anything yet no they haven't provided the covenants yeah we're still waiting

[2:44:56] Voice 16: okay yeah okay thank you thanks let's see this report okay so for our expenses we are still

[2:45:07] Voice 16: underspending on a monthly basis so that's good news and uh I have learned from uh the director

[2:45:17] Voice 16: of administrative services that the budgets for all LTCs are totally out of whack because the

[2:45:24] Voice 16: original budget for this year included a meeting um a meeting facilitator

[2:45:30] Voice 8: which

[2:45:31] Voice 16: would have been a

[2:45:33] Voice 16: staff position and not included in the ltc meeting expenses but because we have to now staff that

[2:45:40] Voice 16: with contract workers it's thrown every other every other ltc of that is is on is over budget

[2:45:47] Voice 16: so this number has no relation to the number of meetings we've held or anything else it's just

[2:45:52] Voice 16: study work yeah but we're actually undiscovered it just it doesn't it really doesn't um anything

[2:46:02] Voice 16: else okay so so um yeah reconciliation first nation is going to standing messages

[2:46:12] Voice 14: i asked if

[2:46:14] Voice 16: you know we're just i was just going through each of the sections because

[2:46:17] Voice 16: you went through them so quickly i didn't realize that i should have gone through them all i had a

[2:46:21] Voice 16: question on page

[2:46:23] Voice 14: 46. 46? 47.

[2:46:29] Voice 4: Send F U A L to trustee Stratton.

[2:46:34] Voice 4: Follow up action list.

[2:46:36] Voice 16: Follow up action list.

[2:46:38] Voice 16: Ah, thank you. I don't like acronyms.

[2:46:42] Voice 16: Yeah. So

[2:46:43] Voice 15: every time we make a

[2:46:44] Voice 16: resolution, give Kim work to do,

[2:46:47] Voice 16: it goes on our follow-up action list and that's oh it's right up there see

[2:46:55] Voice 16: the fuel for the fire okay so just as uh um because we did have we did um have somebody

[2:47:05] Voice 16: write in regarding uh our adoption of minutes and we are working to make sure that we do get

[2:47:13] Voice 16: to approve the minutes by resolution without without meeting as I said within 14 days if

[2:47:20] Voice 16: possible of each meeting so we are working towards that

[2:47:28] Voice 8: now

[2:47:31] Voice 16: can I move to 15.6 thank you very excited so for the first time we're seeing um and I've

[2:47:38] Voice 16: been bringing this to all the LTCs a reconciliation first nation relationship building standing item

[2:47:43] Voice 16: them and what we'd like to do is not make it a project but it's a part of everything that we

[2:47:52] Voice 16: want to undertake and so in the interest of sharing information from community members who

[2:47:59] Voice 16: are connected to initiatives and community to community engagement that's happening with First

[2:48:07] Voice 16: Nations we're not the lead on this I feel like your community is very engaged in this and so

[2:48:13] Voice 16: we've invited people we'd like to invite people to submit items of interest and we'll publish

[2:48:21] Voice 16: them in the agenda as a report so if that sits well we'll be able to see um i would like to invite

[2:48:30] Voice 16: monica and paul to share again just what you did that there's a um tinshawthin

[2:48:37] Voice 16: um language class

[2:48:39] Voice 14: workshop on

[2:48:43] Voice 16: the 15th on the 15th of september and do people need to sign up

[2:48:47] Voice 16: by emailing you you said yes

[2:48:50] Voice 14: um yes if people i can i can give them the um contact info

[2:49:01] Voice 14: registration site right okay that would

[2:49:05] Voice 8: be great and i can

[2:49:06] Voice 14: do it i can do it here before we leave

[2:49:08] Voice 14: but anybody yeah can you share

[2:49:13] Voice 4: a little bit about the benefits for people participating in that like

[2:49:17] Voice 4: what what's the link um

[2:49:19] Voice 14: well some of the leaders um if any elders from the saint religious

[2:49:28] Voice 14: are coming over there give us a background on the language because

[2:49:35] Voice 14: because the concepts of place names, for example,

[2:49:39] Voice 14: are very different from an indigenous perspective

[2:49:44] Voice 14: than they are from a settler, colonial perspective.

[2:49:51] Voice 14: So we'll have some of that.

[2:49:52] Voice 14: And then we've got one or two of the students

[2:50:00] Voice 14: who are becoming instructors in the Central African language

[2:50:06] Voice 8: coming

[2:50:07] Voice 14: to give us some basic imagination and some understanding of certain places.

[2:50:24] Voice 14: It's always very, I find it very interesting to hear the history of these places from one perspective.

[2:50:35] Voice 14: I don't know how many spaces are still available, but no harm in registering.

[2:50:44] Voice 14: And is there a

[2:50:45] Voice 14: cost? No, it's free. It's sponsored by the library and the revitalization.

[2:50:54] Voice 14: That's great.

[2:50:54] Voice 4: Thank you for sharing that. I probably can't take on another language at this point.

[2:51:00] Voice 4: like, you know, to learn a foreign language, but I'm interested in all the other things that you

[2:51:05] Voice 4: mentioned, which is, you know, included there.

[2:51:09] Voice 16: And was there a, yeah, I'll put in just a moment,

[2:51:13] Voice 16: was there a recent salmon cook with young youth in attendance? What was that event, just so we can

[2:51:20] Voice 16: That

[2:51:20] Voice 13: was an issue sponsored by the Pender Island Conservancy Association and Raincoast

[2:51:28] Voice 13: Conservation Society and the Wasanage School Board. One of the instructors

[2:51:36] brought her grade 10 Senchotham class over for a traditional salmon bake with an elder,

[2:51:42] Earl Claxton, with music, with song, with drumming, with engagement. And I guess the key thing,

[2:51:51] and the key purpose of that was engagement

[2:51:55] Voice 13: in their traditional homeland.

[2:51:57] Voice 13: So a lot of this Teplachis revitalization project

[2:52:01] Voice 13: has been focused on connecting the Saanich people

[2:52:05] with their homeland, again, on the land.

[2:52:08] So there are four films that have been completed now

[2:52:12] from that project that have been screened with the elders

[2:52:17] Voice 13: founders and with the community. They screened at Star Cinema for the Wasanage community

[2:52:25] Voice 13: and they're going to be screened at the University of Victoria in December. And when the Wasanage

[2:52:33] Voice 13: school board who owns the films now sees that to release them, then they can be available

[2:52:39] Voice 13: to the community, possibly for a screening at some place in the community where everybody

[2:52:45] but I think fascinating films with elder engagement

[2:52:53] Voice 13: and sort of an important reconnection for them

[2:52:57] Voice 13: with their homeland and also reconnection

[2:53:00] Voice 13: with the community here.

[2:53:01] Voice 13: So it's very much community engagements.

[2:53:05] Voice 13: So they're getting different perspectives,

[2:53:08] Voice 13: but I think Robert has something really important

[2:53:11] Voice 13: to cover as well.

[2:53:12] Voice 13: So, a

[2:53:13] Voice 13: couple of other

[2:53:14] Voice 6: things. Marianne Paré and Kenta just released a short film that was shown at the Pender Island Short Film Festival, and it is a reflection back from Wasanich elders and Pender community members as to the interaction that's happened over the period of time.

[2:53:38] Voice 6: that will be shown again on the island so if you have a chance that's another thing to look into

[2:53:44] Voice 6: and the south pender historical society has got a grant um to do podcasts of uh with signage elders

[2:53:52] Voice 6: um kind of sharing their cities and their connection to sedeus plus also some of the

[2:54:00] Voice 6: South Pender settler families. So we hope to do probably between 12 and 14 podcasts that will be

[2:54:10] Voice 6: available to the community sometime in the spring.

[2:54:13] Voice 16: That's wonderful. Thank you. And who came to the

[2:54:17] Voice 16: museum this year in the summer? That was excellent. Great to listen to. So lots of activity. That's

[2:54:27] Voice 16: That's so great to hear.

[2:54:29] Voice 16: I'm just, thank you.

[2:54:30] Voice 16: And we wouldn't know this, so I appreciate you bringing that up.

[2:54:33] Voice 16: Are there dates to anything yet?

[2:54:35] Voice 4: Or where will announcements be made so we can find out?

[2:54:39] Voice 13: We'd like to know when there is a scheduled date for the films.

[2:54:43] Voice 13: I will send a note in about the showing in Victoria.

[2:54:48] Voice 8: I'm

[2:54:48] Voice 13: not sure what the circumstances are that's being organized

[2:54:51] Voice 13: by a different group on the Victorian side.

[2:54:54] Voice 4: Right.

[2:54:54] Voice 4: Are you publicizing it somewhere else?

[2:54:57] Voice 4: pender as well for the general public uh

[2:54:59] Voice 13: in the pender post center post so

[2:55:01] Voice 16: could we request that

[2:55:04] Voice 16: if there are any items or events um that are coming up in the community that um you could send

[2:55:11] Voice 16: them to the south pender ltc so that your trustees know and then we um we can work together on a

[2:55:20] Voice 16: report to be published in the agenda so the rest of the community can we can note does that sound

[2:55:26] Voice 16: this okay

[2:55:27] Voice 8: appreciate

[2:55:27] Voice 16: your work and thank you so much for sharing today I learned today that

[2:55:32] Voice 16: I can't say it properly Adam Adam Olson is here this morning

[2:55:45] Voice 16: there is a language

[2:55:49] Voice 16: land of the maples and I just want to share that I was like yes

[2:55:52] Voice 16: start with the w so i would love to learn since chatham i've just um i get to go to

[2:56:05] Voice 16: hulk minimum language lesson starting on monday being offered by the name of first nation so

[2:56:11] Voice 16: lots of opportunities and i it's it is so important i've heard um in many contexts that

[2:56:17] Voice 16: even just knowing one or two words um offers such a sense of connection and people feel like oh

[2:56:24] Voice 16: you've taken the time to learn our language and that's immediate um response so that's a really

[2:56:30] Voice 16: good thing to do and that being said thank you

[2:56:35] Voice 8: i

[2:56:36] Voice 16: raise my hands to you it's a really important

[2:56:39] Voice 16: group beginning with St. Jacques then. So yeah, I didn't raise my hands to everything. Thank you.

[2:56:48] Voice 16: Thank you. That's great. Wonderful. Thank you for that. And we'll look forward to working together

[2:56:54] Voice 16: on a report for our next agenda. Oh,

[2:56:59] Voice 16: you want to go? Okay. So 15.5? Sure. Website, webpage.

[2:57:03] Voice 16: page so uh mental trust community is this referring to the trustees corner or what is

[2:57:11] Voice 16: that referring to i have no idea because it's an old item that i've never seen discussed in any

[2:57:17] Voice 16: other city um our website's broken i don't know um but yeah i i recently found out about the trustee

[2:57:26] Voice 16: corner page and so like i said i did write into penta post i'm going to send that over to put

[2:57:34] Voice 16: them in the trustee corner and anything that i'm putting forward to penta post i'm also going to

[2:57:37] Voice 16: put in the trustee corner um so i can start utilizing that can

[2:57:43] Voice 16: we post it ourselves or

[2:57:44] Voice 16: it has to go through staff but you can write anything you want

[2:57:50] Voice 16: it's all about your

[2:57:51] Voice 16: opinions and your perspectives you can include all the links

[2:57:55] Voice 16: weeks that you wish and you can send it to emily emily will post

[2:57:58] Voice 8: it and it goes on pds so it's it

[2:58:01] Voice 16: it's and and some trustees did monthly reports and they're actually really useful to give a

[2:58:07] Voice 16: snapshot of um anything that's not in the altispiece it's a great place to yes i'm

[2:58:15] Voice 16: going to try and start utilizing that um like i said lots of lots of new learning going on right

[2:58:21] Voice 16: All right. So I'm going to move us into new business. There's an item of 60.1 Firework Regulation, and this was your request, Trustee Falk.

[2:58:38] Voice 4: Yes.

[2:58:39] Voice 4: What

[2:58:39] Voice 16: would you like to discuss?

[2:58:40] Voice 16: Well,

[2:58:41] Voice 4: I became aware of this topic with Halloween and on North Bender they had some discussion

[2:58:54] Voice 4: on the forum about fireworks and I'm keenly aware of the environmental impacts of fireworks

[2:59:03] Voice 4: and when I grew up we never had Halloween because I grew up in Norway, but I feel like

[2:59:11] Voice 4: we shouldn't have fireworks

[2:59:13] Voice 4: for every little reason

[2:59:15] Voice 4: I think it's a bad idea

[2:59:17] Voice 4: and so I'm wanting to

[2:59:19] Voice 4: gauge everyone's

[2:59:21] Voice 4: take on that

[2:59:22] Voice 4: and so I wanted to bring it to your attention that I'm

[2:59:25] Voice 4: thinking about it and I will

[2:59:27] Voice 4: consider

[2:59:29] Voice 4: bringing it to

[2:59:30] Voice 4: a resolution to

[2:59:33] Voice 4: address this in some way and I can't

[2:59:35] Voice 4: we're not in charge

[2:59:36] Voice 4: LTP not in charge of

[2:59:39] Voice 4: of fireworks, so that is the CRD.

[2:59:44] Voice 4: And so we could write a letter to them requesting a van,

[2:59:49] Voice 4: I believe is that correct?

[2:59:50] Voice 4: Yeah. If we wanted to, yeah.

[2:59:52] Voice 4: And so I'm just telling you my feelings on it

[2:59:56] Voice 4: and for you to consider it,

[2:59:57] Voice 4: and it might come on the next agenda.

[3:00:00] Voice 8: And

[3:00:00] Voice 4: if we're ready, we can make a decision, you know, yeah.

[3:00:07] Voice 16: My question is, do we have an advocacy position already for the Alliance Trust on fireworks?

[3:00:15] Voice 16: I know we've got lots of advocacy positions. I've never seen one on that.

[3:00:19] Voice 16: Yeah, not that I'm aware of it.

[3:00:22] Voice 16: One option is to invite our electoral area director to our next meeting as well, Paul Brent.

[3:00:29] Voice 16: I don't know if he was here maybe a year ago, so perhaps it'd be worthwhile extending the invitation to our first meeting of 2024.

[3:00:39] Voice 16: Yeah, I'm happy to do that.

[3:00:41] Voice 4: Do you

[3:00:43] Voice 16: want a resolution to do that?

[3:00:47] Voice 16: No, that's okay. I'll add it to my list, my growing list.

[3:00:54] Voice 16: um i was gonna say like speaking on the topic the fireworks are lovely they're fun for younger

[3:01:02] Voice 16: people they're not so much fun as we mature in age um i for one like to go to bed around 8 30

[3:01:09] Voice 16: and i'm a very light sleeper um and then we have lots of people that have seen things or

[3:01:19] Voice 16: being exposed to things that fireworks don't work they

[3:01:24] Voice 16: don't work and you and I've in my family

[3:01:27] Voice 16: I had an uncle where there was no sudden movements there were no loud noises you couldn't speak

[3:01:34] Voice 16: quickly like you couldn't just start a conversation because he would be under the table and wouldn't

[3:01:40] Voice 16: come out for a week so there are people that are so severely affected for 15 minutes of one person's

[3:01:48] Voice 16: fun. I worry about that sort of thing because those effects, that's unfair to impose on people.

[3:01:59] Voice 16: So you've got the environmental aspect, we all know that animals are startled by this and

[3:02:05] Voice 16: a lot of things can get off balance with them, but it's people as well.

[3:02:12] Voice 4: Please send us any comments or any links to articles or whatever. I will post an article

[3:02:18] Voice 4: from the CDC I think um with some background information and I might be getting more so I'll

[3:02:24] Voice 4: try to use that corner thing figure see if I can figure it out and but send me other stuff because

[3:02:29] Voice 4: I you know if there are the opposite perspectives I want to hear it like I want us to talk it

[3:02:35] Voice 4: through so

[3:02:36] Voice 16: the other thing that because I was looking at one of the CRD articles where you

[3:02:41] Voice 16: it can be you have to have a you have to purchase a permit to to have fireworks and you can only let

[3:02:47] Voice 16: them off on this date within this time frame

[3:02:50] Voice 8: and

[3:02:51] Voice 16: then you know if notices are published then people

[3:02:53] Voice 16: are aware so that you know but the way that it is right now it's and not the south panda was

[3:02:58] Voice 16: letting off tons of fireworks i think we're all in bed but it's it's it's just having that

[3:03:05] Voice 16: sort of looking for a consideration of not just your neighbors but everything

[3:03:12] Voice 16: everything used to do fireworks too for me it's called it's called yeah oh how does it

[3:03:29] Voice 8: we're

[3:03:29] Voice 16: almost at the town hall um it

[3:03:32] Voice 5: has to do with fireworks um

[3:03:34] Voice 15: um yeah fast yes sir comments sorry

[3:03:42] Voice 5: are we going to town hall fast or we're going to

[3:03:45] Voice 16: town hall after this discussion yeah okay after the near

[3:03:50] Voice 5: and dear to my heart i'm very interested

[3:03:53] Voice 5: in space program in the space camp many times model rockets fall under fireworks categories

[3:04:00] Voice 5: and they don't blow up at least we hope they

[3:04:06] Voice 8: don't they

[3:04:07] Voice 5: don't make loud noises it's more in the

[3:04:10] Voice 5: lines of it would be similar to banning the gentlemen that like to fly their model airplane

[3:04:17] Voice 5: back and forth

[3:04:20] Voice 8: so

[3:04:20] Voice 5: when you're discussing fireworks there are unintended consequences

[3:04:24] Voice 5: I

[3:04:24] Voice 4: don't know if there's any information on that that can highlight if there's less damage to the environment, less emissions or anything like that.

[3:04:34] Voice 4: That's my concern.

[3:04:37] Voice 4: Things to exclude.

[3:04:38] Voice 4: Yeah, we can exclude things.

[3:04:41] Voice 16: I request Siri to exclude.

[3:04:45] Voice 16: So, I misspoke, but yes, our town hall is still coming up.

[3:04:48] Voice 16: um our next we've got a draft of our meeting schedule that um we do need to discuss and

[3:04:55] Voice 16: approve first um i have no issues with the date okay now one of these i'm going to get the time

[3:05:06] Voice 16: right oh it's been it has been challenging the only thing i'd like to check is just because we

[3:05:14] Voice 16: came from this meeting did you yes put dates together yes right um so i am proposing that

[3:05:22] Voice 16: we move the may 3rd date to may 10th and the september 6th date to september 13th and that's

[3:05:32] Voice 16: in order to allow community members the city staff to attend i think there's a bi-monthly

[3:05:38] Voice 16: meeting on North Pender with one of the trustees Adam Olson and other delegates I think is quite

[3:05:47] Voice 16: important so it's a

[3:05:49] Voice 16: new it's a new forum I think we've had one meeting perhaps already today's

[3:05:55] Voice 16: meeting it starts at 9 30 and it's sort of an ask anything session so you can discuss

[3:06:02] Voice 16: us climate change reconciliation sea cans was one of the issues in magic lake um and really it's

[3:06:09] Voice 16: just a place where information is shared and questions are asked so that's going to be

[3:06:15] Voice 16: happening on the first friday bi-monthly so every second month

[3:06:19] Voice 16: so the next one is january 5th that's

[3:06:23] Voice 16: right at 9 30 and then that one following would be march 1st it looks like so this is not organized

[3:06:30] Voice 16: by the ltc or anyone and i guess adam is a guest trustees can attend and it'd be great if both

[3:06:38] Voice 16: south and north penders were in attendance so you're suggesting just for the minute so we move

[3:06:44] Voice 16: the may 3rd to the 10th that's correct and september 6th to the 13th that's right 13th

[3:06:51] Voice 16: okay time to be asked anything they're 9 30 9 30 yeah yeah um which is unfortunate because it means

[3:07:00] Voice 16: you and i won't be going it was it was a great discussion for the half an hour we were there

[3:07:05] Voice 16: um so of course these are subject to other potential things but that looks good with me

[3:07:15] Voice 16: as well so are those changes good yeah so

[3:07:19] Voice 16: we'll need a resolution to adopt the meeting agenda as

[3:07:29] Voice 16: amended sure that I move that the South Panda Island Local Trust Committee adopt

[3:07:37] Voice 16: the the 2024 meeting schedule as amended okay

[3:07:48] Voice 8: seconded

[3:07:49] Voice 16: by trustee Felk any further discussion all those in favor aye

[3:07:53] Voice 16: that is carried oh and before we move on from this topic I really would love to

[3:08:01] Voice 16: see because you you mentioned the first meeting of our year inviting crd director paul brett

[3:08:06] Voice 16: and we work on inviting an elder to welcome us or to open the meeting um and how would we go about

[3:08:14] Voice 16: that maybe paul and monica is there a potential for and there would be honoraria for that um

[3:08:22] Voice 16: requesting someone to welcome us to the territory and sort of open our year in a good way um

[3:08:31] Voice 8: that's something we would

[3:08:33] Voice 13: want to discuss sure

[3:08:34] Voice 8: uh we're

[3:08:36] Voice 13: not the ones who decide that so uh but

[3:08:40] Voice 13: we can raise if we have a major meeting coming up we can raise it there and then respond back to you

[3:08:47] Voice 16: all right would be great this is something that's down we would definitely look and stuff but it's

[3:08:55] Voice 16: part of our it's a standing resolution anyway so i was just curious if staff had um

[3:09:03] Voice 16: avenues of communication already opened but probably i think this community is

[3:09:11] Voice 16: probably the first the best positioned because you've already got relationships yeah sounds good

[3:09:17] Voice 16: so they get back to us and then we can explore those options it's not um expected that anyone

[3:09:24] Voice 16: anyone would do that for us, but yes, you're great.

[3:09:29] Voice 16: And now, town hall number two. Yes, sir. Anybody else?

[3:09:33] Voice 16: Town

[3:09:34] Voice 8: hall, one, two,

[3:09:36] Voice 16: three, four. Yes, sir.

[3:09:38] Voice 16: John

[3:09:38] Voice 7: Kaherchuk, 9925 Selkirk Street.

[3:09:41] Voice 16: I

[3:09:41] Voice 7: want to applaud you for working through a process to move forward

[3:09:48] Voice 7: with regard to consideration of the land use amendment bylaw.

[3:09:52] Voice 7: two observations. One is we've spoken many a time on concerns as to how we got to where we got to

[3:10:04] Voice 7: and part of what we've talked about in the past was a process whereby you share with people what

[3:10:13] Voice 7: what the implication of a specific part of the byline would be.

[3:10:20] Voice 7: So, for example, setback, what is the implication of the setback?

[3:10:25] Voice 7: And you show illustrations.

[3:10:26] Voice 7: And so we had talked previously about workshops.

[3:10:30] Voice 7: In my experience, workshops are typically led by the planners.

[3:10:34] Voice 7: And it's an exercise because they're very skilled

[3:10:38] Voice 7: and understanding volumes and the implications of bylaws and setbacks and everything else they can

[3:10:44] Voice 7: demonstrate what one direction might be versus another right i am i remain a little concerned

[3:10:53] Voice 7: when i heard you the term workshop because what i also heard was an invitation for people to

[3:10:59] Voice 7: basically kind of tell me what they think i think what's missing is that people largely don't

[3:11:04] Voice 7: understand and so we're we tend to get entrenched in the way that something is because we can see

[3:11:11] Voice 7: it walk around it and live with it versus understanding how something may be better

[3:11:16] Voice 7: so just to illustrate to use an example there is a one example where a property is built to be

[3:11:25] Voice 7: free modified bylaw and then because they could in a sensitive ecosystem they figured out how

[3:11:33] Voice 7: they could actually go beyond that and so they created a condition where they're up to 25 feet

[3:11:41] Voice 7: back from the natural boundary of the sea and then they're cantilevered out about 12 feet over that

[3:11:46] Voice 7: over a sensory ecosystem and when I have the opportunity to show people that that's built

[3:11:53] Voice 7: to the biome people will go well you can't do that but you can because people don't really understand

[3:11:58] Voice 7: understand what we're talking about. It's all rather theoretical. So to have examples

[3:12:04] Voice 7: of things. So I would encourage you to look at the various components that are under consideration

[3:12:10] Voice 7: and find ways to help people understand what those really mean. People like Frank Ducote,

[3:12:18] Voice 7: for example, I worked with Frank in the past in his planning capacity and found him to

[3:12:22] Voice 7: be very informative in terms of this ability to visually convey a planning concept to someone

[3:12:29] Voice 7: that you can see it and go oh okay well that's what this setback means and that's what this is so

[3:12:34] Voice 7: rely upon your staff your staff resources and so forth to to bring that forward another part of

[3:12:42] Voice 7: that is i participate as does anybody in the public in a forum with the city of vancouver

[3:12:49] Voice 7: where they bring current issues that are under consideration,

[3:12:53] Voice 7: whether it's land use or public opinion.

[3:12:56] Voice 8: Those

[3:12:57] Voice 7: are always grounded in, there's been workshopping,

[3:13:00] Voice 7: there's reports being brought forward.

[3:13:02] Voice 7: You start a survey opportunity to collect your opinion

[3:13:07] Voice 7: based on having read what's being suggested.

[3:13:10] Voice 7: And so there's always a brief.

[3:13:13] Voice 7: It always says, here's, we met publicly.

[3:13:16] Voice 7: Here's what we heard. What do you think about this? And so there is that, before you send someone a survey question, because otherwise you're just going to get the same thing you've already heard.

[3:13:29] Voice 7: So there is more work, if you will. So that's the first point. The second point, my understanding is that the composition of the APC has changed.

[3:13:44] Voice 7: and Cameron Thorne is no longer part of it and Cameron represented a dissenting opinion from

[3:13:49] Voice 7: the other three ABC members and so my question to you is are you seeking additional

[3:13:58] Voice 7: members to join the ABC or if you're asking the ABC for their input are you

[3:14:05] Voice 7: taking that in with the understanding that and you know all deference to Gordy and everybody else

[3:14:10] Voice 7: we know where you stand because you've been very clear for years here and so to ask the APC

[3:14:17] Voice 7: for an opinion we already understand where those three people stand so are you broadening the APC

[3:14:25] Voice 7: out or how will you bring a broader opinion to viewing if you ask them for an opinion how will

[3:14:37] Voice 7: you balance that right

[3:14:39] Voice 16: can i just check in with stuff because i believe that um um request for

[3:14:43] Voice 16: to fill that position was sent out was it not no that was for the board of variants that's for the

[3:14:48] Voice 16: board of variants so we didn't send out a request i thought we had to discuss that not that i'm aware

[3:14:54] Voice 16: of that would be an encounter discussion so um can you respond broadly without uh talking about

[3:15:04] Voice 16: individuals yeah um it is as i understood it our intent to put that forward again to ask for

[3:15:14] Voice 16: anybody interested

[3:15:16] Voice 8: to

[3:15:17] Voice 16: put any forward and yes absolutely looking for other opinions

[3:15:24] Voice 16: to sit

[3:15:25] Voice 8: and

[3:15:26] Voice 16: and so that we have a balanced apc that

[3:15:30] Voice 4: was right in the first round so yeah

[3:15:32] Voice 4: Yeah, that was our aim in the first round instead of, of course, being limited to the applications, because we can't

[3:15:42] Voice 8: make you

[3:15:44] Voice 7: into the regulations that can go who can apply.

[3:15:49] Voice 7: Oh,

[3:15:49] Voice 16: no. Is

[3:15:50] Voice 7: there limitations?

[3:15:52] Voice 16: Yes, there are. You

[3:15:53] Voice 16: have to, you have to be an

[3:15:55] Voice 4: resident of the border.

[3:15:57] Voice 4: Well, yes, of course, you have to be, yeah, you have to be able to vote.

[3:16:00] Voice 4: yeah yeah

[3:16:01] Voice 16: um and and further to your the first half of your comment absolutely agree

[3:16:09] Voice 16: um for sure that's the whole purpose of this we are seeking um public input to help with

[3:16:17] Voice 16: with the solutioning um so while somebody may say i think if we went out with a paintbrush

[3:16:23] Voice 16: and painted the sky purple it would improve all of our lives absolutely thank you look is this

[3:16:29] Voice 16: something that's feasible is there something that that would that would work goes off to the apc

[3:16:36] Voice 16: for their review and input staff will be involved and they'll say these are the reasons why it can

[3:16:42] Voice 16: why it cannot can't with these tweaks perhaps it could it's all part of the process but i think the

[3:16:50] Voice 16: first step is engaging with everyone because there are so many people here and we are a community

[3:17:00] Voice 16: And we're relying on the community to see what is

[3:17:03] Voice 8: going to work for us together.

[3:17:05] Voice 8: I think that makes

[3:17:14] Voice 4: sense. My only balance point that I would want to bring to it is that we don't overemphasize an aspect of that background.

[3:17:27] Voice 4: You know, like you could frame it in a way that may seem exclusive to other perspectives or something like that.

[3:17:34] Voice 4: like I would want to not mess with that part of it, so not to make it exclusive. It's a little

[3:17:42] Voice 4: bit like children, you know, when they're playing with a toy and they're screaming, you know, they

[3:17:46] Voice 4: lost their toy or whatever, and they're making a fuss about it. The parent will say, you know,

[3:17:52] Voice 4: do you want this color or do you want that color? Meanwhile, if it was to distract them, right?

[3:17:58] Voice 4: So let's not use it as a distraction to shape where the rest of the conversation goes,

[3:18:06] Voice 4: because somebody else may have a different opinion about something else that's more important than

[3:18:10] Voice 4: how it was framed by one party over the other. Does that make sense? I think so. Yeah, just

[3:18:16] Voice 4: like I'm sensitive by my bureaucracy that sort of puts us in very narrow boxes and we only answer

[3:18:24] Voice 4: are certain things within that, and I resist that. So that's my nature.

[3:18:31] Voice 16: We've got 10 minutes to be able to leave within in-camera sessions.

[3:18:35] Voice 16: Yeah, we've got to move on and not have discussions. So we have, sir?

[3:18:38] Voice 16: Yes,

[3:18:38] Voice 6: so I've got two suggestions.

[3:18:42] Voice 6: You

[3:18:42] Voice 16: were, I apologize, sir. You were next.

[3:18:45] Voice 2: It was something that was quite frequent, something that quite caught my attention at the

[3:18:48] Voice 2: the first time we talked about reconciliation,

[3:18:52] Voice 2: having requested a letter from Wasanich Leadership Council

[3:18:56] Voice 2: with respect to bylaw 123, the failed bylaw.

[3:19:02] Voice 2: And I know how they worked with Wasanich

[3:19:05] Voice 2: and with the constituent communities

[3:19:06] Voice 2: that sometimes they are dealing with hundreds of referrals

[3:19:11] Voice 2: and hundreds of requests for participation

[3:19:13] Voice 2: in one sort of process or another.

[3:19:15] Voice 2: And the fact that we grabbed their attention enough

[3:19:17] Voice 2: to give us one it was it was a sign of their honorings and we believe that their input has

[3:19:23] Voice 2: now fallen kind of off the table or onto the side of something and i don't think that that's a good

[3:19:29] Voice 2: i don't think that's i don't think that's respectful of us to leave it there and i'd

[3:19:34] Voice 2: like to take it forward as how we can uh i get back to them and say oh this is what happened

[3:19:40] Voice 2: and we may ask for your input again or this is how we plan to use your input but just dropping

[3:19:47] Voice 2: and I think it's disrespectful and I

[3:19:49] Voice 16: apologize that was my misunderstanding of process how I was

[3:19:52] Voice 16: um how it was explained to me when we first stepped in was because it was post-public hearing

[3:19:57] Voice 16: we couldn't receive it I wasn't aware that once the bylaw had gone we could so I just sitting

[3:20:04] Voice 16: right here you saw me learn that yeah

[3:20:06] Voice 2: it wasn't really a dig against it was more dig against the

[3:20:10] Voice 2: process at the at our government level our superior levels who uh frankly know that they

[3:20:16] Voice 2: have to engage as government to government and that would mean that forcing this through the

[3:20:22] Voice 2: regular forcing a letter from wasanage to be disregarded uh due to a procedural point that

[3:20:31] Voice 2: would apply to citizens but not necessarily a government to government level i do think that

[3:20:37] Voice 2: that's not good and respectful our

[3:20:40] Voice 16: processes are very much off and very often getting in the way

[3:20:44] Voice 16: a good relationship and i fully recognize that thank you me too yeah okay sir yeah

[3:20:52] Voice 6: so i actually

[3:20:53] Voice 6: wanted to uh elaborate a bit on that so thank you for bringing that up um i i think it's important

[3:21:00] Voice 6: for any discussion that we're going to have in the community to have some kind of framework

[3:21:05] Voice 8: and

[3:21:06] Voice 6: and i i'm going to suggest a few things one i think um it would be good to um maybe put

[3:21:13] Voice 6: put something out to the whole community around what the, first of all,

[3:21:20] Voice 6: the LTC kind of overall position is.

[3:21:32] Voice 6: The second, I think if we can release that First Nations comment back,

[3:21:38] Voice 6: if it can be made public now, I think that's important.

[3:21:41] Voice 6: and maybe a letter back to Vatanić explaining the delay would be important.

[3:21:46] Voice 6: The third thing, I think it would be really useful to have a clarification of non-conforming now being conforming,

[3:21:57] Voice 6: so that the community understands that process.

[3:22:00] Voice 6: And the fourth, I think if we can have as much of the environmental impact that these discussions would have brought up,

[3:22:10] Voice 6: things like water, native plants, tree health. And a couple things that weren't mentioned today

[3:22:15] Voice 6: that I think might be worthwhile putting into future projects is fire protection and blasting.

[3:22:23] Voice 6: So those are all kinds of important things. The second thing I'd like to just offer,

[3:22:29] Voice 6: for years and years when I worked as an architect, I worked on very, very complex projects where

[3:22:35] Voice 6: there was often disagreement in communities and we had to work out a way to resolve that

[3:22:40] Voice 6: and and the process we used was to bring a group of people together um and throw out ideas as to

[3:22:50] Voice 6: how to solve a particular uh issue we'd identify the issue we put it posted up we would have a

[3:22:57] Voice 6: discussion the discussion could only be positive you couldn't be negative

[3:23:00] Voice 8: so

[3:23:01] Voice 6: you could only offer

[3:23:04] Voice 6: suggestions so someone might say something and you could say well yes but I think this might work

[3:23:09] Voice 6: better and then we posted that discussion and so everyone could see the discussion and the

[3:23:17] Voice 6: resolution that came up with and posted it so that people could come back with more comments

[3:23:23] Voice 6: and again only positive that would be accepted and it worked really well as a process to bring

[3:23:32] Voice 6: bring community together, but also to resolve issues in a way that in the end the community

[3:23:40] Voice 6: embraced 100%. So I just saw that as an option you might want to explore.

[3:23:48] Voice 16: We'll go to very briefly. Yes, just,

[3:23:52] Voice 13: I think Gordie might have been first but I'll just

[3:23:54] Voice 13: be very brief. In terms of DAG's suggestion about a methodology for assessing the relative

[3:24:01] Voice 13: benefits of the former bylaw provisions and being changed bylaw provisions from 1 to 22.

[3:24:12] Voice 13: We talked about goals. I think that's really important. We have in our OCP our community

[3:24:19] goals that are established that are basically our community charter and those goals. I think

[3:24:27] the question could be simply straightforward, which of these values are best support this

[3:24:34] particular goal? So we've got two values, the prior values, the current values, and just go

[3:24:42] through our OCP goals and

[3:24:45] Voice 13: seek for and against there. I don't think we need a scoring of one to

[3:24:50] Voice 13: 10 or anything, but, and give you reasons why you think that's the case. So if you're going to do a

[3:24:56] Voice 13: survey my suggestion is that's a very straightforward clean way to do it but it also

[3:25:02] Voice 13: adheres to our ocp goals which until we change our ocp those are our shared goals

[3:25:09] Voice 13: thank you

[3:25:12] Voice 4: um

[3:25:13] Voice 16: very brief because we're

[3:25:15] Voice 16: gonna have to shut the meeting down and leave something

[3:25:17] Voice 16: with

[3:25:17] Voice 4: the quick question i'm i'm confused on the trustees workshops wherever you like to call them

[3:25:24] Voice 4: Are you going to be sitting together or are you going to be sitting separately and a number of topics or a number of days if you want to speak on different topics person would have to come on back to every one of those or how's it all going to work?

[3:25:38] Voice 4: I

[3:25:38] Voice 16: think we can discuss this a little bit.

[3:25:40] Voice 4: Just one more comment to John. I think as an APC member, I can see impartiality.

[3:25:47] Voice 4: Thank you.

[3:25:47] Voice 16: I think we won't have time for our in-camera meeting, so I'm going to see if we can do this

[3:25:55] Voice 16: by an electronic meeting. I don't know. Yeah, okay. We can continue this. We can recess and

[3:26:03] Voice 16: continue the meeting virtually in half an hour on the ferry. Does that make any sense?

[3:26:10] Voice 16: I think we'll schedule a special meeting, an electronic special meeting.

[3:26:15] Voice 16: early well i mean i mean we could if we can recess for half an hour get in the car

[3:26:21] Voice 16: and and then continue if our recorder can stay online it would be more efficient

[3:26:29] Voice 16: so the office i apologize for this i did not manage our time well um we're going to close

[3:26:41] Voice 16: close the open portion of our meeting and adjourn and then reconvene in about 30 minutes

[3:26:50] Voice 16: with the trustees and requesting that staff and recorder attend the meeting so i'm going to read

[3:26:56] Voice 16: out um that the meet um order should i do this can we recess you know because then we'd have to

[3:27:07] Voice 16: reopen so i'm going to move that the meeting be closed to the public in accordance with the

[3:27:12] Voice 16: Community Charter, Part 4, Division 3, Section 91AI, the purpose of considering a personal

[3:27:20] Voice 16: information of an identifiable individual who holds or is being considered for a position

[3:27:26] Voice 16: of an officer, employee, or agent of the municipality, or in a position of the municipality,

[3:27:31] Voice 16: and when the receipt of advice that is submitted to the solicitor by a privilege,

[3:27:36] Voice 16: including any agents necessary for that purpose, and the reporter and staff in the meeting.

[3:27:43] Voice 16: seconded by Trustee Evans. All those in favor? Aye. And that is carried. We'll now adjourn the

[3:27:48] Voice 16: open meeting and we're going to come back in a closed session in 40 minutes at 2.30 p.m.

[3:27:54] Voice 16: Okay. Thank you.

[3:28:03] Voice 9: I'm gonna keep this open for a moment while I figure out how to logistically

[3:28:07] Voice 9: close and then reopen at the end so but I'll make sure you're muted and you are still muted Toby