Denman Island Local Trust Committee public hearing, May 7, 2024

[0:00:00] Planner McCargar (probable): that one because i was the one that worked on the project for these particular bylaws so i'll just

[0:00:05] Planner McCargar (probable): do i'll be very brief uh this the report in the package today provides some background information

[0:00:11] Planner McCargar (probable): on proposed bylaws number 228 and 229 and recommends that the bylaws be given final

[0:00:16] Planner McCargar (probable): adoption proposed bylaws 228 and 229 have been through public hearing past third reading past

[0:00:23] Planner McCargar (probable): executive committee approval and recently obtained approval from the minister of municipal affairs

[0:00:28] Planner McCargar (probable): fairs, the next step is for the LTC to grant final adoption. All LTC conditions have been met for

[0:00:35] Planner McCargar (probable): these bylaws. And if the LTC concurs, staff, the next steps would be staff consolidate and update

[0:00:42] Planner McCargar (probable): the OCP and LUV to reflect the policy and regulatory changes. So if you have any questions,

[0:00:51] Planner McCargar (probable): I'm here to answer them now. And the recommendations are on page two of your

[0:00:57] Planner McCargar (probable): agenda package.

[0:00:58] Voice 4: All right so trustees do you have any questions or comments or concerns or

[0:01:03] Voice 4: anything else?

[0:01:05] Voice 6: Just a quick comment if I may. Considering this these changes have been in the

[0:01:13] Voice 6: works for 12 years possibly and very excited to see it come to an end and I have to say the

[0:01:22] Voice 6: turnaround from the ministry was super fast so I'm encouraged that things are working quickly

[0:01:28] Voice 6: from their end and I have no other comments to make other than I would be happy to make a motion

[0:01:33] Voice 6: but I can't see it

[0:01:35] Voice 4: um is a possibility uh for somebody to share a screen and get the motion

[0:01:44] Voice 4: up on the screen to make things easier oh there we go uh well that's not very exciting

[0:01:58] Voice 4: that's even more boring come on what

[0:02:14] Planner McCargar (probable): do you see right now

[0:02:16] Planner McCargar (probable): we see

[0:02:16] Voice 4: the environment finally changed strategy contacts okay and i'm pretty sure the motion

[0:02:23] Voice 4: wasn't there i looked and it wasn't

[0:02:27] Voice 3: okay the motions are on page two i think of the agenda

[0:02:32] Voice 6: i know i'm not clever enough to have this screen open and went there thank you so much there we go

[0:02:39] Voice 4: there we go thank you i

[0:02:42] Voice 6: move that the denman island local trust committee bylaw number 228

[0:02:47] Voice 6: cited as Denman Island Official Community Plan

[0:02:50] Voice 6: 2008 Amendment No. 1

[0:02:52] Voice 6: 2018 be adopted.

[0:02:53] Voice 6: All

[0:02:54] Voice 4: right. This is a secondary.

[0:02:55] Voice 4: Trustee Borthwick, any further discussion?

[0:02:58] Voice 4: If not, call the question. All in favor?

[0:03:01] Voice 6: Aye.

[0:03:01] Voice 4: And that carries.

[0:03:06] Voice 3: And we have a second motion.

[0:03:08] Voice 6: Sam, do you want to take a whack at...

[0:03:10] Voice 3: If you're willing to do it, I would be grateful.

[0:03:12] Voice 3: I'm down with a cold at the moment, so...

[0:03:15] Voice 6: Got you, buddy.

[0:03:16] Voice 6: I move that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee

[0:03:18] Voice 6: bylaw number 229 cited as the demand on land use bylaw 2008 amendment number one 2018 be adopted

[0:03:26] Voice 4: back into the trustee forthwick any further discussion not call the question all in favor

[0:03:32] Voice 4: and that carries all

[0:03:34] Voice 6: right

[0:03:35] Voice 4: so that was fun all right so we move on to the second part which is

[0:03:41] Voice 4: a major project demo housing project a review project review approaches process option staff

[0:03:47] Voice 4: staff report that

[0:03:50] Voice 2: would be me oh so

[0:03:52] Voice 4: now i'm getting it right it's planet shadwick that's

[0:03:54] Voice 2: right yeah um yeah so you've got uh the staff report in front of you here this is this is

[0:04:00] Voice 2: essentially um to launch into the next um the next phase of um of stage two of the the denman

[0:04:10] Voice 2: island housing review project so um as identified in the report the the denman housing uh review

[0:04:17] Voice 2: project started in 2022 um and it involved uh consultant in facilitating uh public engagement

[0:04:26] Voice 2: we got a consultant report then we had um stage two and the first portion of um stage two um

[0:04:32] Voice 2: involved um um the focus was uh public engagement to identify um options uh for ocp and leb

[0:04:42] Voice 2: be amendments and the housing APC was was sort of the focus of that piece and facilitated the

[0:04:52] Voice 2: majority for all of the gathered all the feedback from the public in order to report and the last

[0:04:58] Voice 2: meeting we had we reviewed staff analysis of the of the HAPC's report and so where we're at now is

[0:05:08] Voice 2: we need to get the go-ahead to move forward with the next phase. So we've got a revised project

[0:05:16] Voice 2: charter and an action plan which basically brings together all of what we've discussed thus far

[0:05:25] Voice 2: and an implementation checklist which will help us to track the project.

[0:05:30] Voice 2: And in addition to those pieces, staff have proposed a process for the project overall to help move the project as efficiently as possible while considering good sort of engagement with fair and effective and respectful engagement with the COMOCs.

[0:05:59] Voice 2: So staff has begun to have some discussions with the Comox staff. As you recall, the LTC supported the development of a capacity engagement strategy with them and some capacity funding that was moved from the previous budget to them to help them engage in this process.

[0:06:24] Voice 2: And that's been very welcomed. And like I say, we're in the process of developing a process with them to look at how we look at this process.

[0:06:33] Voice 2: So staff have gone through all of the options and tried to think about the things where it is essential to have that respectful engagement.

[0:06:46] Voice 2: And specifically, that's around areas where we would see larger growth, like permissions and density. And so in order to move, to not hold back other things that wouldn't necessarily require that same level of detailed discussion with the nation, as well as analysis of, you know, we've talked about suitable land analysis and understanding of the ecological impact.

[0:07:16] Voice 2: and the water and so forth. They're very much connected. The staff have indicated that

[0:07:24] Voice 2: the ecological protection is also important to them as well as

[0:07:30] Voice 2: protection of their archaeological sites. So essentially what we've done is we've identified

[0:07:43] Voice 2: um four stages um one of the stages um so uh sort of yeah so did i just have to remember

[0:07:59] Voice 2: phases and stages um so yeah so four stages in phase in this phase two so um these include um

[0:08:11] Voice 2: So, the first one would be looking at the land use amendments that require, that are

[0:08:21] Voice 2: amendments to the land use by-law that require limited analysis.

[0:08:25] Voice 2: And what I'm going to do is I'm going to just mention these and then we can go through them,

[0:08:28] Voice 2: we can go through the list.

[0:08:31] Voice 2: Then there's ones that are OCP amendments that require limited analysis, so they're

[0:08:38] Voice 2: not big changes in potential density and then there's the ones that require more analysis and

[0:08:44] Voice 2: that's so that's where we're talking about working with the the nation understanding their interests

[0:08:49] Voice 2: understanding the ecological impacts and such and then the other thing that we have have proposed

[0:08:56] Voice 2: and has been was supported at the previous meeting by the LTC was to move at this moment the TUP

[0:09:07] Voice 2: requirement for accessory dwelling units into forward as a minor project so that allows it to

[0:09:13] Voice 2: move forward quickly independently independent of the other of the other options it enables

[0:09:21] Voice 2: an additional staff person to be working essentially on this project and and it may be

[0:09:30] Voice 2: as we move through the list of things or as we start to move do the work on on some of this

[0:09:36] Voice 2: stuff. They may be interested in moving other things along in a minor project's track, and

[0:09:44] Voice 2: it could be because they need a little bit more analysis, for example. I think the report does

[0:09:51] Voice 2: mention one option you may want to consider putting in that way is if you want to

[0:10:00] Voice 2: revisit the density or create a density bank that's different um um the the report does

[0:10:06] Voice 2: indicate that once the tup um requirement is removed that the density bank should really

[0:10:14] Voice 2: also be removed because it's potentially going to legalize um more units than the density bank

[0:10:20] Voice 2: currently allows which is seven um and um um and uh uh trustee uh graham pointed out as well that

[0:10:30] Voice 2: um the changes that have been made uh with the uh the last two bylaws relating to the agricultural

[0:10:36] Voice 2: land reserve may also put more create more density so therefore uh the density bank is really not

[0:10:42] Voice 2: holding i mean any weight um if you if you move forward with anything that's going to have that

[0:10:48] Voice 2: density. So that's something to think about too. So what I was thinking is we could go through,

[0:10:55] Voice 2: I'll take any questions you might have on this general proposal of the way to move forward,

[0:11:06] Voice 2: and then I'll go through each one of the goals and the related actions and get your feedback.

[0:11:14] Voice 2: Okay,

[0:11:16] Voice 4: trustees, any questions or comments at this point?

[0:11:22] Voice 4: They seem very muted.

[0:11:26] Voice 4: Trustee Graham.

[0:11:27] Voice 6: Sure, I'll take advantage of, of course,

[0:11:30] Voice 6: Sam Berthwick suffering from bad cold.

[0:11:34] Voice 6: Great idea to prioritize those elements

[0:11:38] Voice 6: that require very little study.

[0:11:41] Voice 6: I understand the purpose of having the other categories

[0:11:46] Voice 6: makes perfect sense.

[0:11:47] Voice 6: So, yeah, just to comment, no questions.

[0:11:50] Voice 6: I'd love to go through them with you.

[0:11:52] Voice 6: Yeah, likewise,

[0:11:56] Voice 3: yeah, I think it's really great that we can get moving on some elements

[0:11:59] Voice 3: faster, and obviously some components of this are going to take more time, but it's great

[0:12:04] Voice 3: not to hold up those elements with everything else.

[0:12:10] Voice 3: I will, and I think, Planner Chadwick, you just felt a foul of my only thing that I struggled

[0:12:17] Voice 3: with in reading through this report which is um the the numbering system is getting into to

[0:12:27] Voice 3: there is one sentence in particular just like it took me a couple of tries

[0:12:31] Voice 3: to get past the word salad but it was

[0:12:34] Voice 2: phase

[0:12:35] Voice 3: one of one of two of i

[0:12:38] Voice 2: know it's called

[0:12:39] Voice 2: and

[0:12:39] Voice 3: it's the nature of the beast and i yeah i hear

[0:12:43] Voice 2: you it was hard it was hard to write that

[0:12:45] Voice 2: sentence yeah

[0:12:47] Voice 3: no i edit these are this is the way that things happen but um yeah if we can find ways

[0:12:53] Voice 3: especially as we move forward in in doing communications work around this um i think

[0:12:57] Voice 3: it's going to be possibly useful to re-categorize some things just so that everybody's number one

[0:13:04] Voice 3: working from the same playbook but that that playbook is uh parsable easily um that might

[0:13:09] Voice 3: might be helpful i i don't want to add more work to your plate but

[0:13:12] Voice 5: yeah we

[0:13:13] Voice 3: see that being something

[0:13:14] Voice 3: thing where we get where we run into criticism down the line and uh that can be a whole conversation

[0:13:20] Voice 3: that is not helping us move forward so also i want to make it easier for everyone to understand

[0:13:26] Voice 3: anyways thank you absolutely

[0:13:29] Voice 2: thank you uh justy bothwick um yeah simplicity is always best so

[0:13:33] Voice 2: if you ever if you have suggestions of how to make things simpler absolutely we're all ears

[0:13:39] Voice 2: um and so the i think before we launch into the list of things um um we do have two

[0:13:49] Voice 2: we have two essentially two projects they're the same project but so we have two work plans

[0:13:54] Voice 2: and so i think i might just um pass it over to um to planner mccarver um and questions you might

[0:14:01] Voice 2: have for her related to that minor project piece i'll

[0:14:08] Planner McCargar (probable): just uh share my screen here so that we can

[0:14:11] Planner McCargar (probable): put the project charter for the minor project up on the screen can you see that yes

[0:14:17] Voice 4: um

[0:14:18] Planner McCargar (probable): and then i

[0:14:19] Planner McCargar (probable): don't know that we really need to go through it in any detail but um it's here for your review and

[0:14:24] Planner McCargar (probable): really looking for the ltc's endorsement today on this project charter if you have any questions or

[0:14:30] Planner McCargar (probable): there's anything that's unclear you'll note in the work plan overview i didn't put in any

[0:14:38] Planner McCargar (probable): any community engagement. So there'll be one community information meeting ahead of the

[0:14:44] Planner McCargar (probable): public hearing. So those will just be together. And I just wanted to confirm that that was the

[0:14:50] Planner McCargar (probable): direction that the LTC wanted to go. And then if there's, yeah, any questions around objectives in

[0:14:56] Planner McCargar (probable): scope, out of scope, I think it's pretty straightforward. But now is the time to really

[0:15:00] Planner McCargar (probable): make sure that um we've got it correct yeah

[0:15:05] Voice 4: i guess i'll ask the trustees um like i think that

[0:15:08] Voice 4: this was one of these um uh suggested amendments that was pretty universally supported amongst the

[0:15:16] Voice 4: community so it shouldn't be that controversial needed um i.e it doesn't need an extensive amount

[0:15:23] Voice 4: of public input because it is widely supported is my correct in assuming that trustee graham

[0:15:31] Voice 4: um

[0:15:33] Voice 6: as far as the removal of the temporary use permit definitely um the elimination of the

[0:15:40] Voice 6: residential density bank which i wholeheartedly agree is exactly the way we should go um is going

[0:15:48] Voice 6: to require some explanation but when people realize that the uh now adopted bylaw 228 and 229

[0:15:57] Voice 6: which gives anyone with agricultural land the opportunity to build an accessory dwelling unit

[0:16:02] Voice 6: And that in itself will extinguish the seven densities which are sitting in the bank.

[0:16:09] Voice 6: And so the bank, I was part of the local trust committee when the bank was created.

[0:16:16] Voice 6: It was a great idea for the time, and we've got a couple of great affordable housing projects that, if they ever get built, will satisfy the reason why the bank was created in the first place.

[0:16:33] Voice 6: But we're in a different world, and the changes that we're making are not looking at making new lands available.

[0:16:41] Voice 6: We're not looking at subdivision.

[0:16:42] Voice 6: um we're we're actually uh now developing policies and and regulations which talk to

[0:16:50] Voice 6: sharing of land which has a very strong historical background and uh history attached to it so i

[0:16:58] Voice 6: agree with you chair mod i'm quite happy to have the community information meeting prior to the

[0:17:02] Voice 6: public hearing on the same day and roll that into one of our meetings and uh that's those are my

[0:17:08] Voice 6: thoughts excellent

[0:17:09] Voice 4: so we have a good path forward then so

[0:17:19] Voice 6: do you need a motion to uh adopt that i

[0:17:22] Voice 2: think we're good we just had some questions there and um um marlis i'm thinking well you've got

[0:17:27] Voice 2: everything up um yes thank you you got my report up um maybe we can have a quick look at um at the

[0:17:34] Voice 2: uh the project charter for the the other pieces the revised um project charter um so you can see

[0:17:44] Voice 2: I've um I've identified that oh that's the old one more or less yeah there we go um I've identified

[0:17:54] Voice 2: the different phases here uh and the and the rough timing um and you can see I've where I've said um

[0:18:01] Voice 2: community engagement were required so there is an opportunity through any process including

[0:18:08] Voice 2: this process to um do community engagement on whatever elements you may want so you may want

[0:18:14] Voice 2: you know, if you want to do a larger community engagement, you can do that. But if there are

[0:18:17] Voice 2: specific, very specific questions that you have on specific things, that's also an option and

[0:18:25] Voice 2: opportunity throughout any of this. So when we go through the list, there may be things that you

[0:18:29] Voice 2: might think may need some engagement. Just let us know and let us know how you'd like that

[0:18:37] Voice 2: engagement to go forward. And again, you don't have to decide now. You can, you know, when things

[0:18:43] Voice 2: percolate in the community, you might get a better sense of things that you might want some engagement

[0:18:47] Voice 2: on. If you go down a bit more or less, the one thing that I'll point out on budget, just so that

[0:18:53] Voice 2: you know, is because we have separate budgets for major and minor projects, that's the way

[0:19:00] Voice 2: we administer things. So when things are moving through the minor project stream, they will have

[0:19:08] Voice 2: their own budget that's independent of the the budget that was allocated for the major project so

[0:19:14] Voice 2: um the two thousand dollars that maybe probably won't be needed but in case we need some legal

[0:19:20] Voice 2: review or what have you um that's coming out of a separate budget and if for example you were

[0:19:25] Voice 2: going to tuck another project like you want to create a new density banker or or what have you

[0:19:30] Voice 2: into that or whatever it might be um it would also have its own own budget that would be independent

[0:19:36] Voice 2: from the the overall allocation for this project which is ten thousand dollars for this um actually

[0:19:41] Voice 2: it's it's more than 10 it's uh what is it it's 12 it's it's 15 yeah so it's 15 for this um fiscal

[0:19:51] Voice 2: and um last year's fiscal budget money was um provided to the first nation so the engagement

[0:19:59] Voice 2: piece is pretty much covered well it is covered um so it's a very healthy budget um and um you know

[0:20:08] Voice 2: well so we don't have any we won't have any problems there um um marlis do you want to go

[0:20:15] Voice 2: um to the to the implementation list the action implementation plan um to the green blue yeah

[0:20:27] Voice 2: Yeah. Yeah. So, um, is that large enough on the screen? This is Yeah, so this is the

[0:20:34] Voice 2: Yeah, I don't know. I can see it. Okay. But um, so the

[0:20:39] Voice 6: you could make it a little bigger for us.

[0:20:42] Voice 6: Thank you.

[0:20:44] Voice 2: So the way the action plan, the action plan essentially is just a way of taking all of

[0:20:50] Voice 2: the things that we've talked about before, and putting them into and so they'd already been

[0:20:56] Voice 2: been grouped uh um in the previous staff report under sort of goals goal areas um and i've just

[0:21:05] Voice 2: i've just created a created objectives related to those goal areas and what that helps to do

[0:21:11] Voice 2: is and if you go down a bit more on the site we can kind of give an example um if you go down to

[0:21:17] Voice 2: goal three because goal three is it you know so what that help what what that helps to do is um

[0:21:24] Voice 2: you know, 20 years from now, we can look back at that and say, were the land use regulations

[0:21:30] Voice 2: streamlined? Were housing options expanded? So it provides an opportunity for some kind of

[0:21:38] Voice 2: measurement in the future. And it also just is a really nice way to frame out the actions because

[0:21:43] Voice 2: the actions all kind of neatly fit under objectives. So it's just really an organizational

[0:21:48] Voice 2: organizational feature that's been added. There really hasn't been any additional ideas or content

[0:21:56] Voice 2: added. So if we go straight down to the list, then we can start to go through the actions

[0:22:02] Voice 2: that are under each one of these goals and objectives. And what I'm trying to get from you

[0:22:09] Voice 2: is a read on whether, you know, these goals are sitting well for you and whether you have

[0:22:16] Voice 2: particular interests questions concerns about the um what's identified as actions and if there are

[0:22:23] Voice 2: things that you want to move for example you know the the the staff report does speak to um

[0:22:29] Voice 2: uh to the fact that you can't you know if you think something needs a little bit more analysis

[0:22:34] Voice 2: we can move it it may be that through that throughout the process we'll discover that as well

[0:22:38] Voice 2: and then we can move it into um into uh the the um the um other stream of uh of work um

[0:22:50] Voice 2: that takes more time so right now they are organized by um phase the each a b and c so

[0:23:02] Voice 2: So those are the, so basically A, we're doing first, B, we're doing, I mean, some of this

[0:23:11] Voice 2: work has happened concurrently as well.

[0:23:12] Voice 2: It's the timing.

[0:23:14] Voice 2: So the 2A components, or those are the ones that are requiring limited potentially, like

[0:23:29] Voice 2: those are the ones that are land use bylaw related.

[0:23:34] Voice 2: um and and then 2b would be the ocp and then further down we've got c which is the more would

[0:23:42] Voice 2: require more so let's go back up and we'll just go through them so we talked about the tup so

[0:23:47] Voice 2: that's straightforward um like i've mentioned before like i think there'll be a decision point

[0:23:52] Voice 2: at some point like i think um i think what we need to know from the ltc is whether we should

[0:24:02] Voice 2: just go ahead and eliminate the density bank as part of that project right now so we need a

[0:24:06] Voice 2: decision related to that um i'm seeing a thumbs up from trustee graham trustee

[0:24:14] Voice 4: is nodding his head

[0:24:16] Voice 4: so i think you've got so

[0:24:18] Voice 2: we've got a yes okay excellent um so the reforming of the land use

[0:24:24] Voice 2: regulations is um is an absolute requirement um when we started looking at it it's it's really

[0:24:32] Voice 2: It's really challenging. It'll allow the rest of the process to go a lot more smoother, and it'll enable a much more efficient update of the bylaws.

[0:24:45] Voice 2: So, any questions around that piece?

[0:24:48] Voice 4: Well, reformatting, that's basically just changing the layout, or is that actually drilling down?

[0:24:54] Voice 4: It's

[0:24:54] Voice 2: just changing the layout, yeah.

[0:24:55] Voice 2: Yeah. So we are trying to move towards consistency across the trust area.

[0:24:59] Voice 2: And Marlos can tell you just with the recent updates with that last amendment that it's very challenging to update that bylaw.

[0:25:10] Voice 2: And it's very confusing for planners and bylaw officers and even lawyers, as we've heard.

[0:25:18] Voice 2: So it's just a very good thing to do.

[0:25:21] Voice 2: um no

[0:25:23] Voice 4: i just i recall from last year um uh when the the ben phala was was going to be updated

[0:25:30] Voice 4: that there were a lot of categories that got picked out um by mr dingman that just really

[0:25:36] Voice 4: seemed like it they needed to be looked at like there there were things like a home not looking

[0:25:43] Voice 4: like a home um improperly surfaced driveways things like that that you know just seemed to be

[0:25:49] Voice 4: i don't know what the proper word is but it it seemed a little bit too specific a little bit too

[0:25:57] Voice 4: detailed um and like i think just if just going down through through that proposed bylaw from

[0:26:03] Voice 4: last year there were there were a lot of things in there that people were really scratching their

[0:26:08] Voice 4: heads as to why is that in there uh

[0:26:11] Voice 2: yeah well so we're right this is really speaking specifically

[0:26:14] Voice 2: of the formatting um and and one of the one of the things in particular there is like all of the

[0:26:20] Voice 2: the other islands have for all of the site-specific zones have charts that have that are very clear

[0:26:27] Voice 2: that indicate the location of the the actual location of the of the lot and with the Denman

[0:26:37] Voice 2: one you have to go and refer to the map to find the location so it's and I think we're going to

[0:26:44] Voice 2: be adding more site-specific potentially too right through through this so we just want to get ready

[0:26:48] Voice 2: for that anything else on that should i move to the next move continue to move through so there's

[0:26:55] Voice 2: you know there's a few other things like like like updating the the land use bylaw definitions to

[0:27:00] Voice 2: ensure ensure consistency that's pretty straightforward um now this is one that that

[0:27:06] Voice 2: uh i know a trustee graham you had some thoughts about um i see your hand up um i'll let you go

[0:27:12] Voice 2: ahead dr

[0:27:13] Voice 4: graham thank

[0:27:14] Voice 6: you i didn't want to miss um if you could just scroll back up to the water

[0:27:21] Voice 6: balance assessment now um that may or may not happen in in the foreseeable future it's dependent

[0:27:27] Voice 6: on budget um i wouldn't want the um suitable land analysis work to be waiting for a water balance

[0:27:35] Voice 6: um layer to be added so i'm i'm i understand the purpose of this suitable land analysis i want to

[0:27:42] Voice 6: to be able to use it with the current data

[0:27:43] Voice 6: that's available right today.

[0:27:45] Voice 6: Okay, so

[0:27:46] Voice 6: I see some nodding.

[0:27:47] Voice 2: Yeah, that's totally what the intention is.

[0:27:49] Voice 2: I mean, if we luck out and we get that data,

[0:27:52] Voice 2: but it isn't actually, you know,

[0:27:54] Voice 2: Gabriela is going to be doing that work

[0:27:57] Voice 2: and creating a methodology in the next fiscal.

[0:27:59] Voice 2: So it's likely that that won't happen

[0:28:02] Voice 2: the earliest till next year,

[0:28:04] Voice 2: but there's ample data to look at other aspects of the land.

[0:28:10] Voice 2: But that's a really good question.

[0:28:11] Voice 2: Thank

[0:28:12] Voice 6: you for that assurance. And now I'm waiting with bated breath to hear what you're going to talk about that I've already mentioned.

[0:28:20] Voice 2: Yeah, well, I'm reviewing. Oh, yeah, I'm not I'm not there yet, but we will get there.

[0:28:33] Voice 2: So this is just technical stuff here. I mean, this this next one is resuming existing site specific exemptions in light of the TUP changes.

[0:28:41] Voice 2: That's pretty straightforward. Like there's there are exemptions that currently allow accessory dwelling units, but they may allow them outright.

[0:28:47] Voice 2: right they'll be allowed out right um um so permitting units in community service

[0:28:53] Voice 2: zone i know there was you had a bit of conversation about this really that that

[0:28:58] Voice 2: would be the only uh the recommendation from the the housing apc was in all zones that currently

[0:29:03] Voice 2: don't have um um uh residential but but really what you know those other zones are

[0:29:12] Voice 2: our conservation um i can't remember the other ones but the most appropriate would be community

[0:29:18] Voice 2: service and you we had some conversation about that and that would be sort of the the one area

[0:29:25] Voice 2: unless there are places where you have like part you know and and i think maine's going to be

[0:29:31] Voice 2: exploring this too like where there are other agencies that own land uh if you want to provide

[0:29:36] Voice 2: an opportunity for them to create uh caretakers uh home or what have you those are the kinds of

[0:29:42] Voice 2: things to to think about with respect to this yes trustee graham um

[0:29:47] Voice 6: i don't want to speak for

[0:29:49] Voice 6: the devon conservancy association but i if i did i would say they are not interested in having

[0:29:55] Voice 6: the uh any densities applied to conservation lands or

[0:30:00] Voice 6: park lands on denman um and i totally agree with that and then the only other uh i think potential

[0:30:06] Voice 6: zone would be um institutional where the school is and i can't imagine why anybody would want

[0:30:13] Voice 6: a density attached to a school with all of the um other agencies which were involved with

[0:30:18] Voice 6: with the ministry of education lands and the fact that it's downtown uh which doesn't have

[0:30:25] Voice 6: a septic sewage system and is already um yeah so um i i don't want to i don't want to dwell on on

[0:30:33] Voice 6: that particular suggestion of the housing advisory planning commission i think we have enough on our

[0:30:37] Voice 6: plates with the residential lots the small ones and the large ones personally right

[0:30:42] Voice 2: yeah so so i

[0:30:44] Voice 2: would say um yeah with respect to that you know we just changed the we just changed zoning on

[0:30:50] Voice 2: the school board property to facilitate housing on to support the housing on on main island so

[0:30:55] Voice 2: um there's an example where that has happened but uh you know denman may not be interested in that

[0:31:01] Voice 2: um but you know you can just keep in mind that this is about providing the opportunity

[0:31:07] Voice 2: opportunity may not occur um so we can so this is where um if you want to take it off the list

[0:31:16] Voice 2: now we can take it off the list or if you want to keep it on the list and for staff to provide a

[0:31:20] Voice 2: bit more analysis around it we can do that as well so

[0:31:25] Voice 6: i would take it off the list myself

[0:31:31] Voice 3: i'd be fine with that too okay

[0:31:35] Voice 2: so like things like putting housing above the fire hall

[0:31:40] Voice 2: that sort of thing is not not of no interest at this point we

[0:31:48] Voice 6: don't have a fire hold it

[0:31:50] Voice 2: you have a little fire building my co-parent uh designed it i know that

[0:31:54] Voice 2: there

[0:31:55] Voice 3: is a plan to put in a new fire hall and i know

[0:31:58] Voice 6: we've got a

[0:31:59] Voice 2: really skookum one new one

[0:32:01] Voice 6: but that's the time for the community to to consider changes and then at that point we can

[0:32:07] Voice 6: you know the community may want to amend um the the regulations and that's fine but

[0:32:11] Voice 6: what we're looking for is is more um not so broad right

[0:32:17] Voice 2: okay um now consistently with all

[0:32:20] Voice 2: That's pretty much happened right now with the adoption of 228, 229.

[0:32:26] Voice 2: And, you know, we can have a look and see if there's anything there.

[0:32:30] Voice 2: But I think we're pretty consistent at this point.

[0:32:39] Voice 2: Permitting alternative types of units.

[0:32:41] Voice 2: So that's being more explicit about permitting.

[0:32:47] Voice 2: uh like there are examples and and um other trust areas where it is more explicit so we can

[0:32:53] Voice 2: have a look at that um and just write that language in to the bylaw um um legalizing

[0:33:08] Voice 2: housing on a site-specific basis so this was the one trustee graham that i think you had some

[0:33:12] Voice 2: thoughts about and i i i actually was agreeing with you when we had a chat so maybe i'll let you

[0:33:19] Voice 2: speak to that happy

[0:33:22] Voice 6: to so there's two things to consider assuming that we go ahead and allow

[0:33:29] Voice 6: adus on small lots large lots all residential lots we're going to capture probably the bulk

[0:33:37] Voice 6: of those wonderful landowners who have been providing housing for decades but the odd

[0:33:43] Voice 6: there is the potential for a property out there that's been doing it historically for quite some

[0:33:47] Voice 6: some time. And rather than put the requirement to establish that use and all the evidence that

[0:33:56] Voice 6: would have to be gathered for the local trust committee, then to approve that, that can slow

[0:34:01] Voice 6: down the whole project. So my suggestion is let's make the changes that we're going to make with the

[0:34:06] Voice 6: communities to support to the small lots, the large lots, the residential lots. And at the end

[0:34:11] Voice 6: of that, then put it out there to the community that if we missed you, if you just happen to be

[0:34:16] Voice 6: one of those odd properties that has been supplying um uh housing illegally for so many years uh please

[0:34:22] Voice 6: come to the local trust committee make your case at which time we will look at whether we want to

[0:34:27] Voice 6: make that a site-specific song so that that's my suggestion trustee

[0:34:35] Voice 4: borthwick seems to be nodding

[0:34:36] Voice 4: in appreciation so i think we have an agreement okay

[0:34:42] Voice 2: so staff will take that as a as a move this

[0:34:46] Voice 2: to later um project and it makes logical sense okay um make existing multi-families only more

[0:34:59] Voice 2: flexible so that so right now you have a couple of properties that have that so that's we're

[0:35:07] Voice 2: talking denman green um um we're talking um i've forgotten the name of the other lane

[0:35:15] Voice 6: Pepper Lane,

[0:35:18] Voice 2: right. And Pepper Lane, you know, the project's not going ahead, but you don't know, you know, the zoning is still there.

[0:35:26] Voice 2: There's an opportunity to make the zoning more flexible. So I think in both those cases, they're quite specific.

[0:35:35] Voice 2: Making it more flexible would allow for more flexibility in building type and that sort of thing.

[0:35:43] Voice 2: um again i mean nothing's guaranteed in terms of anything getting built um but you can create

[0:35:50] Voice 2: flexibility in the zoning to potentially make it easier to have other forms of housing so that if

[0:36:00] Voice 6: i may through the chair um so those two properties right now are uh i'm going to say site specific

[0:36:08] Voice 6: they're they're quite specific with the zones so would that not require the owner of that property

[0:36:14] Voice 6: then to revisit their their wish and retool their applications so that they might actually get it

[0:36:21] Voice 6: built at which time that we would look at it or are you suggesting that we envision something that

[0:36:26] Voice 6: that would work and hope that they agree with us so i mean

[0:36:33] Voice 2: you have the ability to zone anything

[0:36:34] Voice 2: however you'd like uh you just can't down you know i mean the the legislation with respect to that

[0:36:42] Voice 2: that you just can't zone anything completely out of where it loses its value.

[0:36:50] Voice 2: So you can change the zoning without consultation.

[0:36:56] Voice 2: I mean, it's nice to consult with the people who own the land, of course.

[0:37:03] Voice 2: But you do have the ability to do that.

[0:37:05] Voice 2: And I'll just give another example from Main Island.

[0:37:09] Voice 2: like there there's an area that zoned for seniors housing for uh 16 built eight duplexes of seniors

[0:37:16] Voice 2: housing so that was recently or will be soon changed uh through their their land use bylaw

[0:37:22] Voice 2: update um or review to allow um to remove the the focus on seniors specifically for example so

[0:37:32] Voice 2: that's that's an example of of um allowing more more flexibility and i think in that case yeah

[0:37:38] Voice 2: Yeah. Yeah.

[0:37:40] Voice 6: So if I may, if I can continue my my monopolizing of a conversation here, let's say I've got it.

[0:37:49] Voice 6: But again, I would love to be able to zone a piece of property for tiny homes, which people already own, which would reduce the requirement for a nonprofit organization to find themselves in possession of 10 million dollars to build them.

[0:38:06] Voice 6: And so I would love to see, I don't know how long the Denman Works is going to wait before they finally give up on trying to get the money to build that wonderful development that they had planned across from the hall.

[0:38:23] Voice 6: and i don't know the right approach to them to say well would you consider retooling your

[0:38:31] Voice 6: application because the denman local trust committee would be quite happy to make it

[0:38:36] Voice 6: easier for people to end up living there i i don't really understand the mechanism there so

[0:38:41] Voice 6: you're saying yes we could zone it well that wouldn't be fair to them at the moment because

[0:38:45] Voice 6: they have a rather complicated application being reviewed by bc housing so you don't want to

[0:38:51] Voice 6: suddenly changed the zoning and suddenly now their application doesn't work anymore

[0:38:54] Voice 6: and and having a conversation with them well i i did have a brief conversation with them and they

[0:39:00] Voice 6: basically said no we're going to wait until we get the money but i know the way the world works

[0:39:05] Voice 6: you're you're only going to wait so long to the point where either your board collapses or you or

[0:39:11] Voice 6: you finally decide that there's we've got this piece of property let's do something you know

[0:39:18] Voice 6: let's house somebody and at which point i think they would come back to the local trust committee

[0:39:23] Voice 6: and ask us well what do you think at which point we could say hey we thought about this zone

[0:39:32] Voice 6: but we haven't actually done it but we could rezone that piece of property so to me there's

[0:39:38] Voice 6: it's putting on a piece of property that we don't own yeah i'm like yeah

[0:39:43] Voice 2: so this is where again

[0:39:45] Voice 2: Again, because I haven't tucked into this, right?

[0:39:50] Voice 2: So all of these things will require some additional analysis.

[0:39:53] Voice 2: So I'm not familiar with whether they're covenants, how restrictive they are, like how much work it would take, you know, because that's another consideration if you're going to rezone.

[0:40:02] Voice 2: If there's covenants that are kind of on the, that are very specific to the zoning as well, right?

[0:40:11] Voice 2: That they sort of, they work together there.

[0:40:14] Voice 2: So there could be the requirement to amend those as well.

[0:40:19] Voice 2: But what this project provides an opportunity to begin to have that conversation that could be done as part of this project.

[0:40:27] Voice 2: So it may be that once we look at things, you could, again, I'm just speculating because I haven't had a look at it very closely yet because you haven't said you want me to you yet.

[0:40:39] Voice 2: um um but if you if you want to go down that track we can have a look at it we can have a

[0:40:45] Voice 2: conversation with uh with uh the the non-profit that owns that land and and maybe you know maybe

[0:40:53] Voice 2: there's an opportunity to have um to to have its own for both right like you you can open it up so

[0:41:00] Voice 2: that it's it's flexible enough that that they could still pursue what they're wanting to but

[0:41:06] Voice 2: but if they have a default opportunity potentially.

[0:41:09] Voice 2: But right now, the way that I understand it

[0:41:11] Voice 2: is it's very, very specific what it's zoned for.

[0:41:17] Voice 2: So really at this point, it's the question to you is,

[0:41:21] Voice 2: do you want to keep that,

[0:41:24] Voice 2: do we want to have that conversation

[0:41:25] Voice 2: as part of this project?

[0:41:29] Voice 4: Well, I think part of this, listening to Trustee Graham,

[0:41:33] Voice 4: is that if you go up a couple of lines

[0:41:35] Voice 4: to the permit alternate types of units um you've restricted the wording sort of says rv you're

[0:41:41] Voice 4: yes i'm assuming tiny houses would be um encompassed in that um so when that takes place

[0:41:49] Voice 4: assumably if if that type of change incorporates the the multi-family zoning

[0:41:56] Voice 4: then by default we're already streamlining that process um that's my read of things

[0:42:05] Voice 2: yeah i mean it depends on how restrictive current zoning is right and then it may be that it's an

[0:42:11] Voice 2: easy fix that maybe that it's it's more difficult like i say i haven't i haven't had a good look at

[0:42:15] Voice 2: it yet so i'm just i'm plugging my computer so i'm just gonna just gonna get my chair

[0:42:30] Voice 2: yeah so like i said if you keep it on the list for now really that's my signal to

[0:42:35] Voice 2: have a bit a bigger look at it and then and then i can come back and i can like identify some

[0:42:40] Voice 2: some options so

[0:42:48] Voice 6: sounds good to me okay

[0:42:53] Voice 2: we'll keep it on um okay yeah so oh yeah so the um

[0:43:03] Voice 2: the vacation rental permissions um again there was a legal review sometime last year and there

[0:43:12] Voice 2: are some small changes that could be made to to make sure that what you what is currently intended

[0:43:17] Voice 2: intended is actually um what is supported so um this is really just a technical this is just a

[0:43:27] Voice 2: technical amendment to um you know support what you what's already intended by the existing

[0:43:32] Voice 2: yep you got a question i

[0:43:39] Voice 6: got the well um at our last uh local trust committee meeting we made

[0:43:43] Voice 6: some changes on based on recommendation from a director um of uh bylaw compliance and enforcement

[0:43:51] Voice 6: enforcement and I think I think that the changes that we made are going to simplify um the work

[0:43:58] Voice 6: that bylaw compliance and enforcement is doing so I don't think we need to worry too much about that

[0:44:03] Voice 6: I know the community I haven't heard anybody on them and talk about we need to have certain

[0:44:08] Voice 6: vacation rentals and and I've always heard people say they're quite happy with the traditional bed

[0:44:14] Voice 6: and breakfast that have always operated on them and they're quite happy with that so I don't want

[0:44:19] Voice 6: want to spend too much time um and

[0:44:21] Voice 2: again this yeah

[0:44:22] Voice 6: yeah

[0:44:23] Voice 2: yeah totally this is more this is a

[0:44:25] Voice 2: technical thing to support what you already want to be happening right make sure that it's it's it

[0:44:31] Voice 2: is um completely what you want through

[0:44:34] Planner McCargar (probable): the chair if i just to add on to what trustee graham was

[0:44:37] Planner McCargar (probable): saying there what you did at the last meeting was pass a standing resolution that gives direction

[0:44:42] Planner McCargar (probable): for bylaw officers uh currently but the bylaw still doesn't read as you would like it to so

[0:44:50] Planner McCargar (probable): in order that so basically we would amend the bylaw so that it is you know explains exactly

[0:44:57] Planner McCargar (probable): how you would want it to be interpreted and then we could remove that standing resolution

[0:45:02] Voice 6: so i'm wondering if that's something that the local trust committee consider as a minor project

[0:45:08] Voice 6: project um when we have um capacity so

[0:45:14] Voice 2: again it's just this is a really minor technical change

[0:45:19] Voice 2: um is

[0:45:19] Voice 6: it okay as

[0:45:20] Voice 2: long as it's minor

[0:45:21] Voice 6: it just seems like it's not mine it's minor okay it

[0:45:23] Voice 2: is it's

[0:45:24] Voice 2: really i i'm correct marlis like you're more familiar with that but as far as i understand

[0:45:31] Voice 2: it's just it's really just tweaking a few words yeah

[0:45:34] Planner McCargar (probable): yeah from what i haven't so yeah gone into

[0:45:37] Planner McCargar (probable): it in too much detail but from we have we do have a legal opinion and i think it really is as simple

[0:45:42] Planner McCargar (probable): as just correcting a few things in the bylaw but i yeah i don't know

[0:45:46] Planner McCargar (probable): it would need to be a minor

[0:45:47] Planner McCargar (probable): project okay

[0:45:49] Voice 5: cool um

[0:45:52] Voice 2: okay and so now on our list of bylaw uh so the easier thing so this is an

[0:45:59] Voice 2: expansion of secondary suite permissions in water service areas so this would be um um you know

[0:46:06] Voice 2: something that if if um if the cbrd considers that uh a possibility then it's uh it could be

[0:46:16] Voice 2: fairly straightforward again it's nothing that we haven't looked into it yet water

[0:46:20] Voice 6: service area so

[0:46:21] Voice 6: that what is that dock no

[0:46:23] Voice 2: that's that's where you've got water being provided so that would

[0:46:26] Voice 2: be the water district oh

[0:46:29] Voice 6: oh okay yeah

[0:46:30] Voice 2: right

[0:46:32] Voice 4: and would that be not unlike what we did in

[0:46:34] Voice 4: main island where it would require rainwater catchment in such so it hopefully wouldn't be

[0:46:39] Voice 4: a burden on the water system so

[0:46:42] Voice 2: that's another so that the rainwater catchment is an is another um

[0:46:47] Voice 2: um that's another uh that that that falls under the goal of uh yes environmental protection or

[0:46:57] Voice 2: whatever so that is that is that would be a part of all of this is is the rainwater catchment for

[0:47:02] Voice 2: all new builds but that's included a bit further down this is so this is all under the the goal of

[0:47:10] Voice 2: uh diversifying housing options and then there's a goal of uh sort of affecting the environment there

[0:47:16] Voice 2: it's related to protecting the environment minimized minimizing environmental impact

[0:47:21] Voice 2: and that's that's all part of the uh the the p28 p2a stream so the land use by a lot easy

[0:47:31] Voice 2: easy fix stream um yeah so then so with diversifying housing options we get into

[0:47:41] Voice 2: the the options that would require land use or um ocp change and so um these would include things

[0:47:53] Voice 2: so so we've got policies related to alr exclusion for affordable housing so um

[0:48:00] Voice 2: Um, the ALR exclusion would be a, uh, LTC decision.

[0:48:06] Voice 2: So there's an opportunity to put some guidelines, um, around that.

[0:48:12] Voice 2: It would always be a decision that would be made by the LTC.

[0:48:16] Voice 2: Um, but there's not, like I said, there's an opportunity to put some guidelines in the

[0:48:19] Voice 2: OCP.

[0:48:20] Voice 2: Um, that's what that's related to.

[0:48:23] Voice 2: I see nodding hands.

[0:48:24] Voice 2: I don't see trustee Graham on my, I mean, trustee Borthwick on my screen.

[0:48:28] Voice 2: I can only see like three faces.

[0:48:35] Voice 2: I

[0:48:35] Voice 6: think it's fair to say with the high percentage of land on DIMM and in the Agricultural Land

[0:48:40] Voice 6: Reserve, it's really important that we do have policies that if, again, it's a non-profit

[0:48:45] Voice 6: that has a great idea and a perfect piece of property is in the ALR, we want to be able

[0:48:50] Voice 6: to send that application to the ALR with a strong recommendation from the local trust

[0:48:56] Voice 6: committee for exclusion yeah

[0:48:59] Voice 2: and that's where we can put some words in related to that into the ocp

[0:49:06] Voice 2: um so these next ones um are next three are related to um facilitating the donation of land

[0:49:15] Voice 2: for to non-profit or the government agencies for uh um affordable development of affordable housing

[0:49:22] Voice 2: not um so that includes um and these were these were things these were stuff these were staff

[0:49:29] Voice 2: suggested um uh options to make it like i said to to help to facilitate um donation of land so

[0:49:39] Voice 2: um it includes the reduction of um minimum personal parcel size to facilitate donation

[0:49:45] Voice 2: of land and so with respect to these covenants would be involved potentially um uh to

[0:49:53] Voice 2: To really ensure that whatever land is falling, is subdivided for, or minimum parcel size is facilitated for, would all be only for housing that would be built by not-for-profit or non-governmental organization, very specifically for affordability.

[0:50:18] Voice 2: so permitting subdivision in exchange for uh donation of land um and then this other one is

[0:50:28] Voice 2: allowed like this this is this is the this is this is this one is you know potentially uh this

[0:50:35] Voice 2: is a more heavy-handed one um and this would be allowing subdivision only if land is donated so

[0:50:42] Voice 2: that's where you would actually be down zoning and only allowing um if the land is donated for

[0:50:48] Voice 2: affordability so that's where you know there may be some controversy over that particular

[0:50:52] Voice 2: suggestion the other ones are a little not not quite as it would be restricting what what's

[0:50:58] Voice 2: already um what already exists dr

[0:51:04] Voice 4: graham so

[0:51:06] Voice 6: i'm gonna this is gonna sound bad but i i actually

[0:51:10] Voice 6: don't like either of those two um policies we we have on them we have currently three properties

[0:51:17] Voice 6: which are zoned for multifamily development,

[0:51:21] Voice 6: one of which has already been built.

[0:51:23] Voice 6: The other two are waiting for money.

[0:51:25] Voice 6: Not one of those pieces of property was donated.

[0:51:30] Voice 6: And yeah, I wouldn't want to spend too much time

[0:51:36] Voice 6: developing language or OCP policies,

[0:51:40] Voice 6: which would encourage these two policies myself.

[0:51:43] Voice 6: The word subdivision is a red flag,

[0:51:45] Voice 6: which was going to cause all sorts

[0:51:47] Voice 6: of consternation on Demin.

[0:51:49] Voice 6: And a reduction in minimal parcel size, I think, is another thing that's, you know, anyway, that's my feeling on that one.

[0:51:59] Voice 3: Trustee Morswick?

[0:52:01] Voice 3: Yeah, I would agree there.

[0:52:04] Voice 3: I think creating more parcels, however they come together, is not the drive here.

[0:52:09] Voice 3: And I think we would see some concerns about density increases and things like that.

[0:52:18] Voice 3: I think, yeah, David Graham's quite right.

[0:52:21] Voice 3: to point out that the properties that are being approached for affordable housing have all been

[0:52:27] Voice 3: purchases or potential purchases. So yeah, I echo that sentiment.

[0:52:34] Voice 2: Okay, so remove the

[0:52:38] Voice 2: permit reduction in parcel size and permit subdivision in exchange for donation. Okay.

[0:52:45] Voice 2: Okay. And that other one, and yeah, that one is in there. That is, I think that's a whole

[0:52:56] Voice 2: big conversation. And I don't know if you want to go there with this project.

[0:53:05] Voice 6: Are you talking about the policies to support variants for proof of water for co-operatives?

[0:53:12] Voice 2: No, this is about only allowing subdivision if the land is donated.

[0:53:16] Voice 2: Oh

[0:53:17] Voice 6: yeah, no, I'm sorry. I've already spoken on that one. Yeah, I'm happy to remove those.

[0:53:22] Voice 6: Okay.

[0:53:28] Voice 2: Oh yeah. So adding policies to support development variants for proof of water for

[0:53:36] Voice 2: cooperatives. Yeah. So this is, I added this one, staff has added this one, and this is just

[0:53:42] Voice 2: reflective of what we see happening with Coho. That there is, you know, that's where you have

[0:53:58] Voice 2: You have a community that has an agreement to look after the water, and that's a circumstance that, you know, provides a bit of, as much as you can have more of a guaranteed edge, that you would have consistent water catchment.

[0:54:23] Voice 2: um so there's an opportunity to um bad policies to provide that opportunity for uh well to more

[0:54:33] Voice 2: explicitly like essentially you can you can you you can you can you can currently apply for

[0:54:40] Voice 2: but this would just be more explicit it would just be um identifying like that support within

[0:54:47] Voice 2: the ocp more more directly again it would still be a decision uh for the existing ltg at the time

[0:54:56] Voice 6: i think this is a great policy i think it speaks to the inventiveness and courage of the triple

[0:55:02] Voice 6: rock co-op to not punch a bunch of holes in their land but to ask people to collect rainwater and

[0:55:10] Voice 6: use that i think this is brilliant so i love it right

[0:55:14] Voice 2: um so yeah so here we've got ocp policies

[0:55:21] Voice 2: to support home-based assisted living in tiny home villages again that's just um no policy

[0:55:26] Voice 2: that would explicitly support those types of arrangements yeah um and then this pothouse

[0:55:37] Voice 2: kind of idea has come up a few times so looking at allowing for variations and how in housing that

[0:55:42] Voice 2: that support shared facilities um and I'm not quite sure I mean I have to look at that in in

[0:55:48] Voice 2: more detail um to see whether we're looking at a different definition of dwelling or what have you

[0:55:55] Voice 2: but it would it would take a little bit of uh thinking about I see not yeah

[0:56:01] Voice 6: I mean I I would

[0:56:03] Voice 6: be amazed if there aren't examples of this kind of um sure there are

[0:56:08] Voice 6: already yeah so I'd be curious

[0:56:11] Voice 6: to see what they look like yeah

[0:56:13] Voice 2: it would yeah so um we'll keep it on the list to explore um

[0:56:18] Voice 2: so then we're getting into the uh the things that would expand potentially increase density

[0:56:25] Voice 2: in a

[0:56:26] Voice 2: larger way um that would require a bit more um uh analysis of the conditions of the land etc

[0:56:35] Voice 2: and also um respect for the first nations interests and engaging in that discussion so

[0:56:41] Voice 2: So that's around the sort of outright expansion of accessory dwelling unit permission, as well as secondary suite permission beyond the water service areas.

[0:56:57] Voice 2: So those are basically, those are really the two main things that we would want to have that discussion.

[0:57:06] Voice 2: We would want the nation to have an opportunity to talk about what their concerns would be.

[0:57:12] Voice 6: Right. When we have those discussions, I think it would be really helpful if the nation knew that we were restricting the size of accessory dwelling units on small lots as they have done.

[0:57:27] Voice 6: I think Maine is the poster child for that kind of work. So if you've got a really tiny lot, you can have a really, really tiny little ADU and it's got to have a rainwater catchment.

[0:57:36] Voice 6: So I want the nation to know that we're not proposing changes that have not considered the impact on the environment.

[0:57:48] Voice 6: That's really important.

[0:57:50] Voice 2: Yeah.

[0:57:50] Voice 2: And I think by taking the time to understand that more fully using the data we currently have available to us,

[0:57:59] Voice 2: I think the nation is going to be quite excited

[0:58:02] Voice 2: about looking at our data as well

[0:58:04] Voice 2: to know that we've actually got it

[0:58:06] Voice 2: is of interest

[0:58:08] Voice 2: to them so once we get to have that sharing

[0:58:10] Voice 2: and that discussion

[0:58:11] Voice 2: I think it's good

[0:58:14] Voice 2: there's some good things happening

[0:58:16] Voice 2: on that front

[0:58:17] Voice 2: and they're really great and easy

[0:58:20] Voice 2: to work with

[0:58:20] Voice 2: so I'm sure

[0:58:25] Voice 2: it'll be a good process

[0:58:27] Voice 2: and that's

[0:58:28] Voice 2: yeah i think you're talking about so that flexible housing approach where the opportunity to have

[0:58:32] Voice 2: even more more than one or two or maybe even three if they're small yeah exactly and and um

[0:58:38] Voice 2: and trustee graham uh i don't you know you had also um raised the question of uh at some point

[0:58:45] Voice 2: uh around um um and i think it's been talked about before uh with everyone about the tiny homes

[0:58:54] Voice 2: tiny homes on wheels and that's something that we can have a look at in more detail too what does

[0:59:00] Voice 2: it mean it's difficult when building permits are involved um but um where building permits aren't

[0:59:09] Voice 2: involved there may be more opportunity to support those as as units and because they don't impact

[0:59:19] Voice 2: the land as much as a permanent structure would there may be more opportunity for flexibility

[0:59:25] Voice 2: around that so that would be part of this whole discussion good

[0:59:29] Voice 6: yeah yeah

[0:59:31] Voice 6: that's really important

[0:59:31] Voice 6: um historically that that has provided a ton of illegal housing on them and for decades and

[0:59:37] Voice 6: decades so it's it's it's incumbent of us to at least acknowledge that and to try and rationalize

[0:59:42] Voice 6: the those existences in whatever way we can let's say we are not going to bring building permits to

[0:59:48] Voice 6: not on my watch and so we're lucky to have the sighting and use permit as our

[0:59:53] Voice 6: as our only tool um as our only permit right not tool permit

[1:00:00] Voice 5: yeah

[1:00:00] Voice 6: and you mentioned it's a liability issue but if we can shift the liability to the landowner

[1:00:05] Voice 6: uh that i don't i don't know why the trust would have any liability but anyway if we can

[1:00:13] Voice 6: it's

[1:00:14] Voice 2: more about it's responsibility right so it and and and how you look at responsibility is um

[1:00:19] Voice 2: is varied right it's your responsibility to support people to have homes so if if that you

[1:00:28] Voice 2: you know, responsibility can be seen in a whole other way and

[1:00:31] Voice 2: how you weigh that, right?

[1:00:32] Voice 2: And so if we can find, you know, again, I think that not having building permit creates

[1:00:38] Voice 2: a different context.

[1:00:43] Voice 2: So if staff are going to have a good look at that.

[1:00:46] Voice 5: Okay, good.

[1:00:54] Voice 2: Yeah, so continuing down the list.

[1:00:57] Voice 2: Yes, we're talking about the flexible housing that would anything that's really creating

[1:01:01] Voice 2: more units.

[1:01:01] Voice 2: um there's also uh it falls into that other other uh section um and and i will point out that the

[1:01:13] Voice 2: green things that are highlighted in green are things that are not specifically done through

[1:01:19] Voice 2: this project but are being done or or will be done or could be done at another level so

[1:01:27] Voice 2: So, and these are things, you know, just to capture the recommendations of the HAPC.

[1:01:32] Voice 2: So the expediting multi-unit rezoning applications, that is something that is being looked at

[1:01:38] Voice 2: at the trust-wide level.

[1:01:42] Voice 2: So then we move into the goal four, which is minimizing the environmental impact on

[1:01:47] Voice 2: land, and that involves, you know, again, we've talked about the use of the suitable

[1:01:54] Voice 2: land analysis and that again connects with uh with the the conversation with the nation um and um

[1:02:03] Voice 2: implementing this idea of a maximum combined floor area for multiple dwellings um that's all part of

[1:02:10] Voice 2: that larger conversation um and then this is something that came up um at the last meeting

[1:02:17] Voice 2: we had was this idea of reducing lot coverage so we haven't really discussed this and whether it's

[1:02:24] Voice 2: something you want to look at um so this is this is different from the implementing maximum combined

[1:02:30] Voice 2: floor area for multi-fold dwellings this is about reducing existing lot coverage and i think and

[1:02:38] Voice 2: also in that conversation at last uh at our last meeting when we we talked about the housing um

[1:02:45] Voice 2: the idea of floor area and uh floor area as well as an impervious surfaces came up so i've added

[1:02:52] Voice 2: added that for discussion here and to see if that is something you want to look at.

[1:02:58] Voice 2: There are other LTCs that have looked at this and like I think North Pinder, for example.

[1:03:08] Voice 2: So yeah, opening that up for conversation to see whether it's something you want to

[1:03:14] Voice 2: look at here.

[1:03:15] Voice 4: Mr. Graham.

[1:03:17] Voice 6: Yeah, this is something where I really think we can give back to the environmental movement a recognition that if we reduce the amount of land that we manage, that's the right term, human impact on that land, then we allow more land to become more natural.

[1:03:39] Voice 6: I think we would need some data. I don't know if the trust has the ability to tell us, well, where are we sitting? How many lots have exceeded their lot coverage? How many lots have been developed and they've got lots to spare? Because it would be a shame to just make a change without knowing the potential impact.

[1:04:01] Voice 2: Yes. So I can speak to, in terms of that, I'm not sure that we would have exact numbers. I do know that we, and I can have a look at that because we do have, I don't know how updated.

[1:04:10] Voice 2: the

[1:04:11] Voice 5: maps

[1:04:13] Voice 2: are and whether they actually not I'm not sure how easy it is to extrapolate that I

[1:04:18] Voice 2: know when I when mapping mapping has the ability to to create maps that have the lots and then you

[1:04:25] Voice 2: can see that the footprint of the building on on them but I don't know how easy like if those

[1:04:30] Voice 2: numbers are all um right if

[1:04:34] Voice 2: they're easy like if you press a button and then you get the total

[1:04:37] Voice 2: number but it's certainly something i can look into okay

[1:04:40] Voice 6: just to add to the discussion when we're

[1:04:45] Voice 6: talking about that i think it would be helpful to have some sense as to what what do people on

[1:04:51] Voice 6: denman island what are they using are they using their their maximum lot coverage right now so you

[1:04:56] Voice 6: know you couldn't reduce it or are they oh gosh no they're they're barely even using half of the

[1:05:01] Voice 6: lot coverage that they that they have available to them okay enough said okay

[1:05:06] Voice 2: so we'll keep it

[1:05:06] Voice 2: on the list and i'll see what i'll see what kind of information we have available that kind of

[1:05:11] Voice 2: speaks to that question um

[1:05:15] Voice 2: and then there you are uh chair mod system system system requirements for

[1:05:22] Voice 2: new builds and um i think that seems to be something that everybody's quite uh supportive

[1:05:29] Voice 2: of so then we get into the so these are the things that are are not specific to the work

[1:05:34] Voice 2: that marlis and i are doing um but related um um and it's you know it's work that that you know

[1:05:41] Voice 2: we're doing in other spheres um um but it's not you know our focus is to get the bylaw amendments

[1:05:48] Voice 2: done so all of this other stuff takes time as well so um and that time needs to be allocated

[1:05:54] Voice 2: so um the you know allowing the affordable the affordability piece is again it's it's that is

[1:06:03] Voice 2: discussion that is an exploration that's happening on many levels um you know with with with experts

[1:06:10] Voice 2: um other planners in other jurisdictions everybody's exploring and trying to figure

[1:06:15] Voice 2: this one out for rural areas so it's not it's not there's not nothing being done um there's a lot

[1:06:23] Voice 2: being done it's just that that we haven't figured it out exactly yet um um yeah there were some the

[1:06:33] Voice 2: The bylaw enforcement related things are, we do have this bylaw enforcement review underway

[1:06:39] Voice 2: at the trust level.

[1:06:42] Voice 2: The engagement and the engagement pieces, I think, you know, there's a lot of real

[1:06:49] Voice 2: opportunity there to develop these education resources.

[1:06:52] Voice 2: But again, that's something that, you know, we need to be writing the bylaws right now.

[1:06:56] Voice 2: And that, you know, it could be something at the end of this project that you decide

[1:06:58] Voice 2: that part of the implementation is to is to do an education piece um the advocacy so the advocacy

[1:07:08] Voice 2: stuff can be written in you can identify advocacy policies in the ocp um and what i would encourage

[1:07:16] Voice 2: is to be very very specific and i think if if all the ltcs can have similar advocacy policies

[1:07:23] Voice 2: You know, it really does demonstrate something, but there's an importance to focus on some specific things.

[1:07:32] Voice 2: And these are the ones that, again, the Housing APC had identified, and there are things that have been identified before as well.

[1:07:42] Voice 2: And there are some things that the Trust Council is working on that are part of the Housing Action Plan.

[1:07:51] Voice 2: so um yeah so these are and i think it's important just to record them and have them there right

[1:07:59] Voice 2: because you want you don't want them to just be left there uh you know 10 years from now we can

[1:08:07] Voice 2: check up and see where they're at yeah trustee grant yeah

[1:08:12] Voice 6: thank you for that um it's really

[1:08:14] Voice 6: important that we don't lose these ideas these were hard um these were created primarily by the

[1:08:20] Voice 6: the Housing Advisory Planning Commission.

[1:08:22] Voice 6: There was a lot of conversation at the table.

[1:08:24] Voice 6: A lot of Islanders put their thinking caps on

[1:08:27] Voice 6: and came up with these advocacy policies

[1:08:30] Voice 6: and obviously the bylaw enforcement

[1:08:33] Voice 6: and education and engagement on cost

[1:08:38] Voice 6: and options and environmental alternatives, et cetera.

[1:08:41] Voice 6: So it's not that we don't want to do these things.

[1:08:44] Voice 6: We do, but our priority is to get people housed legally

[1:08:48] Voice 6: legally, and these things need more time. And the fact that we've captured them in our housing plan,

[1:08:55] Voice 6: they're not going anywhere. And so this documentation will always be available to

[1:09:00] Voice 6: the government local trust committee of the day. Thank you.

[1:09:06] Voice 2: Yeah. And if I may, I would also add that having these goals really clearly identified,

[1:09:12] Voice 2: including the advocacy pieces, will be useful. We don't know what kind of programs are going to be

[1:09:18] Voice 2: coming up for um support uh what they're going to look like um and so having all this recorded is

[1:09:24] Voice 2: it is demonstrating the thought that has gone in uh by the community and by the the trustees to

[1:09:30] Voice 2: um to really identify the needs of the community so um yeah so we've uh we've gotten to the end of

[1:09:42] Voice 2: the list um so uh yeah just i'm interested to know if there are any other questions um in terms of um

[1:09:54] Voice 2: in next steps once you um support the recommendations um we'll staff will begin to

[1:10:03] Voice 2: address each one of the things on these lists and in some cases

[1:10:07] Voice 2: is um as we dive into it it may raise some more questions for us that will come back to you some

[1:10:14] Voice 2: of them may be more straightforward but it's going to be a bit of an iterative process where

[1:10:19] Voice 2: we'll come back with um um you know some clear suggestions of things that are clear to us uh and

[1:10:27] Voice 2: then we'll come we'll come back with some questions that things that may need to be dealt a bit more

[1:10:32] Voice 2: deeper in or we need we need some clarification from trustees about okay

[1:10:41] Voice 4: cool so there are two

[1:10:45] Voice 4: motions sitting there or three motions um are you wanting those to be adopted at this point is that

[1:10:53] Voice 4: the suggested road forward yep i

[1:11:01] Voice 6: move if i may absolutely

[1:11:03] Voice 4: i

[1:11:04] Voice 6: move that the deminal local trust

[1:11:06] Voice 6: committee endorsed project charter dated may 7th 2024 for the housing related temporary use permit

[1:11:12] Voice 6: review project as a minor project okay

[1:11:15] Voice 4: seconder trustee forthwick any further discussion i don't

[1:11:19] Voice 6: think we amended that at all uh that did include the removal of the density bank so that's that's

[1:11:24] Voice 6: cool okay no more questions okay

[1:11:27] Voice 4: call the question all in favor and that carries uh

[1:11:32] Voice 6: i moved at the

[1:11:33] Voice 6: The Demin on the Local Trust Committee endorsed

[1:11:34] Voice 6: the Demin Island Housing Action Plan as amended

[1:11:39] Voice 6: and shown in attachment five of the staff report

[1:11:42] Voice 6: dated May 7th, 2024.

[1:11:45] Voice 4: Seconded.

[1:11:47] Voice 4: Trustee Forsbrook, any further discussion?

[1:11:49] Voice 4: Final question,

[1:11:50] Voice 6: all in favor?

[1:11:51] Voice 6: Well, I'm hoping you captured those amendments.

[1:11:54] Voice 6: Yeah.

[1:11:55] Voice 6: Very good.

[1:11:56] Voice 6: Okay, sorry, sir.

[1:11:57] Voice 4: Okay, so all in favor.

[1:12:00] Voice 4: That carries.

[1:12:02] Voice 6: And finally, the Demin on the Local Trust Committee

[1:12:04] Voice 6: endorse the revised project charter for phase two of stage two of the demin on housing review project

[1:12:09] Voice 6: based on the process recommended in the may 7th 2024 staff report all

[1:12:15] Voice 4: right no discussion i'll

[1:12:17] Voice 4: call a question on the favor that carries hoo-ha

[1:12:23] Voice 5: so

[1:12:25] Voice 4: we now have a road forward all right so is

[1:12:32] Voice 4: there anything else um that needs to be discussed or contemplated at this point or are we free to

[1:12:40] Voice 4: We go out and frolic in the sunshine.

[1:12:42] Voice 4: We have a thumbs up.

[1:12:45] Voice 4: And I think Trustee Borfolk's heading back to bed.

[1:12:50] Voice 6: Hot scotch and honey.

[1:12:53] Voice 4: Well, I'd rather be sick on Dem than anywhere else, I think.

[1:12:56] Voice 4: It's a wonderful place to get better.

[1:13:00] Voice 4: It's a healing community for sure.

[1:13:03] Voice 4: All right, then.

[1:13:05] Voice 4: So I guess we'll call for adjournment.

[1:13:09] Voice 4: So all in favor?

[1:13:11] Voice 4: That carries.

[1:13:12] Voice 4: Thank you very much, everybody.

ADOPTED 
 
 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 1 
Local Trust Committee Minutes 
My 7, 2024
 
 
Denman Island Local Trust Committee 
Minutes of Special Meeting 
 
Date:  
Location:  
May 7, 2024 
Electronic Meeting 
 
Members Present: David Maude, Chair 
 David Graham, Trustee 
 Sam Borthwick, Trustee 
  
Staff Present: Renée Jamurat, Regional Planning Manager 
 Marlis McCargar, Island Planner 
 Lisa Millard, Meeting Administrator / Recorder 
  
Others Present: There was 1 member of the public in attendance. 
 
1. CALL TO ORDER 
“Please note, the order of agenda items may be modified during the meeting. Times are provided 
for convenience only and are subject to change.” 
Chair Maude called the meeting to order at 2:00 pm.  He acknowledged that the meeting was 
held on the territory of the Coast Salish First Nations. 
2. APPROVAL OF AGENDA 
A Town Hall was added to the agenda as Item 3 and subsequent agenda items were 
renumbered. 
By general consent the agenda was approved as amended. 
3. TOWN HALL 
 No members of the public spoke during the Town Hall. 
4. BUSINESS ITEMS 
4.1 Bylaw Nos. 228 (OCP) and 229 (LUB) Adoption - Staff Report 
Planner McCargar stated that the bylaws have proceeded through public hearing, third 
reading, Executive Committee approval, and approval from the Minister of Municipal 
Affairs, and that the next step is for the Local Trust Committee to grant final adoption. 

 ADOPTED 
 
 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 2 
Local Trust Committee Minutes 
My 7, 2024
 
DE-2024-29 
It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee Bylaw No. 228, cited as “Denman Island 
Official Community Plan, 2008, Amendment No. 1, 2018”, be adopted. 
CARRIED 
 
DE-2024-30 
It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee Bylaw No. 229, cited as “Denman Island 
Land Use Bylaw, 2008, Amendment No. 1, 2018”, be adopted. 
CARRIED 
 
3.2 Major Project: Denman Housing Review Project - Review of Process Options - Staff 
Report 
Planner Chadwick noted the following: 
 The revised project charter and action plan reflect previous direction from the Local 
Trust Committee; and 
 Staff have proposed a process to help move the project forward with consideration 
of fair and respectful engagement with the K’ómoks First Nation and have identified 
areas where a more detailed engagement process might be required, as well as 
areas that will require limited analysis. 
 
Planner McCargar summarized the Housing Project Temporary Use Permit Review 
aspect of the project charter and noted that there will be a community information 
meeting followed by a public hearing on the same day. 
 
Discussion ensued and Trustees confirmed that the amendment to remove the 
Temporary Use Permit was supported by the community. They also noted that this will 
result in the removal of the density bank; however, the reasons that the bank was 
created in the first place are no longer relevant to community discussions and concerns. 
 
Planner Chadwick, then, reviewed the revised project charter for the Housing Review 
project and the Trustees commented as follows: 
 They are not interested in densities being applied to parkland; 
 They do not think there is interest in allowing housing on properties zoned 
institutional; 
 They can look at legalizing housing on a site specific basis; 
 If they are going to allow alternative dwelling units on residential lots it is important 
to capture the properties that have already been providing housing; 
 If a land owner has been supplying housing and they get missed in the changes 
there should be opportunity for them to request the Local Trust Committee to 
create a site specific zone; 

 ADOPTED 
 
 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 3 
Local Trust Committee Minutes 
My 7, 2024
 
 An agricultural land reserve exclusion would require a Local Trust Committee 
decision and there is opportunity to create guidelines around that; 
 Subdivision and reduction of parcel size are not a direction they want to go; 
 They would not necessarily agree to facilitating a land donation for the development 
of affordable housing; 
 Remove the reduction of parcel size aspect and permit subdivision in exchange for 
donation of land; 
 Remove the suggestion to only allow subdivision if the land is donated; 
 It is important to let the K’ómoks Nation know that the Local Trust Committee will 
not be considering changes that would negatively impact the environment; 
 Tiny homes on wheels can be looked at in more detail; and 
 They want to maintain the siting and use permitting tool. 
 
DE-2024-031 
It was MOVED and SECONDED  
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee endorse the Project Charter, dated May 
7, 2024 for the Housing Related Temporary Use Permit Review Project as a minor 
project.  
CARRIED 
DE-2024-032 
It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee endorse the Denman Island Housing 
Action Plan As amended and as shown in Attachment 5 of this staff report dated May 7, 
2024.  
CARRIED 
DE-2024-033 
It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee endorse the revised project charter for 
Phase 2 of Stage 2 of the Denman Island Housing Review Project based on the process 
recommended in the May 7, 2024 staff report.  
CARRIED 
4. ADJOURNMENT 
By general consent the meeting was adjourned at 3:18 p.m. 
 
_________________________ 
David Maude, Chair 
Certified Correct: 
_________________________ 
Lisa Millard, Recorder