Salt Spring Island Local Trust Committee regular meeting, May 30, 2024

[0:00:03] Voice 14: Hey, thank you. I see Ross has his hand up there.

[0:00:17] Voice 3: Hello?

[0:00:19] Voice 11: Yeah,

[0:00:20] Voice 3: there you are.

[0:00:21] Voice 3: Oh, okay. I just want to bring forward the topic of education about our food. And I'm actually a longtime Islander and I farmed here for a long time. And now I'm retired and I have a small holding in A1, actually.

[0:00:40] Voice 3: but I've chosen to engage young people and students and I've had numerous school kids come

[0:00:51] Voice 3: here to learn about poultry and about bees and our big gardens and fruit trees and everything we do

[0:00:58] Voice 3: here and I mean I learned from my grandparents and my parents about farming and growing food and

[0:01:05] Voice 3: i understand the value of healthy food and i'm really concerned about what we do or do not know

[0:01:12] Voice 3: about uh uh where our food comes from and i'm looking ahead to i mean i've got a whole bunch

[0:01:20] Voice 3: of grandkids like lots of them but anyway i'm concerned about them moving forward and uh uh

[0:01:26] Voice 3: i want them to know where they can get healthy food and we live in this paradise called salt

[0:01:33] Voice 3: and not in an apartment on the 16th floor in downtown Vancouver somewhere so we have a

[0:01:40] Voice 3: wonderful opportunity to teach our young people grow our own food and that's just I'm very quite

[0:01:49] Voice 3: passionate about it and I actually work with the Farmers Institute at some level with volunteering

[0:01:54] Voice 3: and promoting education at that level and I just really quite concerned about what what our young

[0:02:01] Voice 3: Young people don't know about where their food comes from.

[0:02:05] Voice 3: And I want Salt Spring to be able to continue to provide for them.

[0:02:11] Voice 3: So that's it.

[0:02:14] Voice 7: I don't know.

[0:02:17] Voice 14: Thank you for that.

[0:02:21] Voice 14: Yeah, certainly education is very important,

[0:02:27] Voice 14: and especially in terms of setting up that succession that was mentioned earlier

[0:02:32] Voice 14: and keeping farming going.

[0:02:37] Voice 14: I see Trustee Harris has joined us.

[0:02:40] Voice 14: Trustee

[0:02:41] Voice 4: Peterson, just have to interrupt.

[0:02:43] Voice 4: Ross, could you provide us with your name for the minute?

[0:02:46] Voice 4: Ross McLeod.

[0:02:48] Voice 4: Thank you, sir.

[0:02:53] Voice 14: Okay.

[0:02:53] Voice 14: So, Trustee Harris, we're essentially just having a fairly open discussion,

[0:02:59] Voice 14: roundtable here with the Ag Alliance and the Ag APC folks.

[0:03:04] Voice 14: Thank you.

[0:03:05] Voice 14: um apologies to everybody for being late here so

[0:03:08] Voice 14: thank you and so also ross if you're done speaking

[0:03:17] Voice 14: if you could put your electronic hand down then that helps me um for managing the the hands and

[0:03:26] Voice 14: i don't see any other hands up but uh hoping there's some more discussion here sue has her

[0:03:41] Voice 1: a hand up

[0:03:41] Voice 8: i see susan yeah

[0:03:45] Voice 18: i'm i'm also a farmer here a grower on the island and i just want to

[0:03:51] Voice 18: echo what ross said about education because um one of the challenges uh in a good way is that

[0:03:59] Voice 18: we lose a lot of our customers to their own gardens uh because they start coming to the

[0:04:04] Voice 18: market and then they get interested in growing and it's only when they don't do very well at it

[0:04:08] Voice 18: that they continue to come to the market or get what they aren't growing but um the uh yeah the

[0:04:15] Voice 18: direction that the food industry is going is um uh pretty um off-putting uh if you know what

[0:04:26] Voice 18: good food tastes like and is and how it should be grown so um i've always felt like it's really

[0:04:32] Voice 18: just the educational aspect of that's why we would you know if we had that we would get

[0:04:38] Voice 18: a lot more people say even to the market because to shop at the market is the least expensive way

[0:04:46] Voice 18: to get farmed food although our grocery stores sell our stuff which is great

[0:04:54] Voice 18: but I that's always been the the part that's hard to to get is people really paying attention to

[0:05:05] Voice 18: what it means to buy local and organic and to also be supporting their um their own ecosystem

[0:05:13] Voice 18: well

[0:05:19] Voice 9: thank you for that anyone else

[0:05:23] Voice 11: uh ann yes

[0:05:29] Voice 1: following on from these comments i mean i think

[0:05:31] Voice 1: it just emphasizes to me how we need to in all these policy documents and community plans and

[0:05:39] Voice 1: things like that we really do need to have those kind of statements in there about how important

[0:05:44] Voice 1: it is to the community and to our youth and everybody is not that people understand the

[0:05:53] Voice 1: importance of agriculture and farming on this island and appreciate the good food the things

[0:05:58] Voice 1: we've been talking about so i think i'm a bit nervous about the official community plan because

[0:06:08] Voice 1: it's not a comprehensive look from my understanding it's picking certain aspects of it that you think

[0:06:15] Voice 1: need to be addressed and there's always more work than can be done so i don't want us to get lost

[0:06:22] Voice 1: in that if the focus is on housing rules or something like something else so um how do we

[0:06:33] Voice 1: make sure that comes through this i guess what i'm wanting to know thank you yeah

[0:06:41] Voice 14: it looks like

[0:06:41] Voice 14: Like Trustee Patrick wants to reply there, and then I'll come to you, Merv.

[0:06:45] Trustee Patrick: Well, Anne, I think the fact that you're organized, Ag Alliance and others really help because the official community plan, it's going to be a public process.

[0:06:55] Trustee Patrick: We're going to be hearing from the community on what aspects we open up.

[0:07:03] Trustee Patrick: Well, we said we're limiting it to housing. Housing is a kind of a broad term.

[0:07:07] Trustee Patrick: We have to feed the people that are in the housing, so it relates.

[0:07:11] Trustee Patrick: So, there is going to be a public engagement process, and we want to hear from you. So I think that the voice, your voice is going to help direct what aspects of it. It's what needs to be corrected in the existing plans and regulations to help us. So, pay attention, engage and participate.

[0:07:40] Voice 9: Thanks Laura. Merv?

[0:07:44] Voice 6: Yeah I've farmed on Salt Spring since 1970 and retired 10 years or so ago.

[0:07:55] Voice 6: Big concern I have is trying to make sure that we could not differentiate between

[0:08:05] Voice 6: agricultural areas within ALR and without ALR. I think that to me that's one of the big things

[0:08:12] Voice 6: But I'm here for the fact that it appears that there's a different set of rules for farmers that are within the ALR and farmers without the ALR.

[0:08:23] Voice 6: And I think that I'm not sure what the trust involvement is in that and what the trust actual position is on that.

[0:08:33] Voice 6: I'm interested.

[0:08:36] Voice 21: Mr. Chair, if I could just ask a follow-up on that.

[0:08:39] Voice 21: Sure.

[0:08:40] Voice 21: sure i guess i'm looking for a bit of specifics on that um because i i think it's it's true that

[0:08:46] Voice 21: farmers kind of get a raw deal when it comes to being regulated uh more than anybody else because

[0:08:50] Voice 21: you've got uh you know maybe the alc maybe the ministry of agriculture maybe island trust maybe

[0:08:55] Voice 21: crd um you know depending on what what line of business you're in maybe maybe the ports i don't

[0:09:01] Voice 21: know um but it does seem like it's just trying to figure out what type of what kind of what whose

[0:09:05] Voice 21: policy are we talking about um when it comes to the agricultural land commission um you know there's

[0:09:11] Voice 21: there's a reasonable amount of engagement but i would say it's a fairly in in in that nexus of of

[0:09:18] Voice 21: ministry of agriculture and alc we don't have a great deal of influence on policy beyond the

[0:09:23] Voice 21: the site level work that we do in terms of applying for changes to the alr such as non-farm

[0:09:30] Voice 21: uses exclusions inclusions etc um but i am what i am i am curious about the concerns i've heard

[0:09:37] Voice 21: around local policy uh and whether there's actual concern with um ag policy and i will just back up

[0:09:45] Voice 21: to say that the ocp and the zoning bylaw um do have some policy positions that contain some

[0:09:50] Voice 21: policy provisions around how we should treat um alr and non-alr lands um mostly around the subject

[0:09:58] Voice 21: of applications regarding the ALR, right?

[0:10:01] Voice 21: So it really does mostly relate back to that.

[0:10:05] Voice 21: And then in some cases,

[0:10:06] Voice 21: I think they're just simply farming provisions.

[0:10:10] Voice 21: So there's certain elements of farming

[0:10:13] Voice 21: that are just by right,

[0:10:16] Voice 21: the Right to Farm Act applies in one sense,

[0:10:19] Voice 21: but then there's the bona fide agricultural uses in the ALR.

[0:10:22] Voice 21: Most land use bylaws tend to lean on the ALR lands

[0:10:26] Voice 21: and just provide those zoning provisions so as not to contravene the Agricultural Land Commission Act

[0:10:31] Voice 21: because they can't do otherwise, right?

[0:10:33] Voice 21: Whereas they may be able to regulate outside of those areas.

[0:10:37] Voice 21: So there might be some of that going on in terms of like whether you're in or out of ALR.

[0:10:43] Voice 21: But I'm curious to know if there's experiences beyond that that I'm not aware of because I'm not a farmer.

[0:10:49] Voice 21: Are there experiences at this table of a sense that there are trust bylaws or plan policies that are not, that don't serve the interests of these groups?

[0:11:06] Voice 8: Anne?

[0:11:09] Voice 1: Well, a couple come to mind immediately.

[0:11:12] Voice 1: One is composting rules and regulations around that and what you can do on ALR land and what you can't do and how that interacts with the Islands Trust.

[0:11:22] Voice 1: So that's one area.

[0:11:24] Voice 1: And then there's the whole rooster question about, you know, and whether that's appropriate in a rural zone to have roosters as opposed to an agricultural zone.

[0:11:42] Voice 1: But I think we've got to think in terms a little bit of what we want on the island.

[0:11:50] Voice 1: And I mean, you say that talk about the right to farm and that's on ALR land, but we don't

[0:11:55] Voice 1: actually want a thousand sow pig barn on a piece of ALR land on Salt Spring.

[0:12:01] Voice 1: I don't think anybody wants that.

[0:12:03] Voice 1: It would just be devastating to the environment and for the size of the area we have, even

[0:12:11] Voice 1: though probably in the agricultural world, it would be thought of as appropriate.

[0:12:17] Voice 1: So I think that's the challenge.

[0:12:19] Voice 1: You know, what kind of agriculture do we want here and how do we make sure that we can do that agriculture throughout the island on land where we want to grow food?

[0:12:34] Voice 14: Yeah, thank you, Anne. That's a good point.

[0:12:37] Voice 14: What's appropriate for Salt Spring in terms of scale and location?

[0:12:49] Voice 8: Merv,

[0:12:53] Voice 14: you have to unmute yourself, sir.

[0:12:58] Voice 6: As far as I'm concerned, as far as the scale of agricultural and salt spring, I think the constraints that we have being on a small island with all of the problems with ferries and bringing in supplies and getting our product off the island, I'm not too concerned about particularly about scale, I think.

[0:13:26] Voice 14: Hey, thank you. Kevin?

[0:13:36] Voice 11: Kevin, go ahead.

[0:13:36] Voice 11: Yes,

[0:13:37] Voice 20: okay. Yeah, I'm just following up a bit on what Ann said with operational size or type on Salt Spring,

[0:13:49] Voice 20: when the appropriateness of it, and, you know, there needs to be an understanding, I think, or guidelines for,

[0:14:01] Voice 9: and I don't...

[0:14:10] Voice 9: Uh-oh, we've lost you, Kevin.

[0:14:13] Voice 9: i

[0:14:13] Voice 21: think i think you just accidentally muted videoed out yeah is that

[0:14:19] Voice 14: okay yeah yeah we can

[0:14:21] Voice 14: hear you oh no now you've turned it off again how

[0:14:25] Voice 20: about now there you go yes okay yeah um

[0:14:29] Voice 20: you know i think there is room for some guidelines on on alr land as well as non-ar land in terms of

[0:14:38] Voice 20: you know expectations of people that want to farm and um and expectations of people that are living

[0:14:47] Voice 20: in areas that where there's some farming or or uh or in the ALR where there may be lots of farming

[0:14:53] Voice 20: and so like right now it's like a big gray area and it's like um there's no understanding at all

[0:15:01] Voice 20: it's just that a person does what they do because they have what they have and um i think it's very

[0:15:09] Voice 20: important that there's um some sort of security out there for people who want to farm and and

[0:15:16] Voice 20: have um basically some sort of a um a guideline that that they can follow and people will be

[0:15:26] Voice 20: be satisfied with that and there won't be issues nuisance issues maybe environmental issues

[0:15:36] Voice 20: that that will follow so yeah i think it's very important that that we do structure going forward

[0:15:41] Voice 20: in such a way that people can feel assured if they want to farm that they're going not going

[0:15:47] Voice 20: to be bothered by certain things well

[0:15:52] Voice 8: thank you for that trustee harris

[0:15:53] Voice 7: interesting conversation

[0:15:57] Voice 7: You know, going back to what Mervyn said about the scale, I kind of tend to agree that I don't know if we need to worry about that being that, you know, the economics of farming, you know, really rely on a reality, a cost reality.

[0:16:18] Voice 7: reality so it's just not economically feasible to have a large-scale um operation like a hog

[0:16:27] Voice 7: operation or something like that that may be of a bother to somebody because it's just the

[0:16:31] Voice 7: economics of shipping all that meat off it's not like we're gonna um be able to um to market all

[0:16:38] Voice 7: that here on salt spring um you know i kind of see it as we maybe we need some more farming here

[0:16:44] Voice 7: So I'm not sure if that's interesting to see where that would go. I don't know if we need more regulation. It doesn't seem like, to me, a first thought, it wouldn't be something that would be needed is more regulation. But interesting conversation. Anyhow, thanks.

[0:17:02] Voice 7: yeah

[0:17:05] Voice 14: thank you for that uh and and i think uh part of what i heard uh what i think i heard

[0:17:10] Voice 14: kevin saying is that um it's uh guidelines or what have you be more about sort of providing some

[0:17:17] Voice 14: some surety for folks who do want to farm and um that their their proposals or what they're

[0:17:24] Voice 14: thinking of this they can have some idea of whether that's um going to fit in with the

[0:17:29] Voice 14: legislative framework and and hopefully be deemed socially acceptable too i guess uh kevin back to

[0:17:36] Voice 14: you and then i see a couple hands up uh from the from the attendees that i'll go to yeah yeah

[0:17:47] Voice 20: exactly i didn't mean more regulation or regulations as such i meant um um guidelines

[0:17:54] Voice 20: such that people can work together um find that they have common interests and and um

[0:18:02] Voice 20: And, you know, we can get away from this idea of people, one person, one neighbor combating another or something like that, where it's very destructive.

[0:18:15] Voice 20: And I think agriculture should be a positive experience on this island.

[0:18:19] Voice 20: And I think guidelines are one way to help achieve that.

[0:18:27] Voice 14: Yeah, thank you. And then, of course, to sort of provide some common sort of basis of understanding.

[0:18:32] Voice 14: understanding uh let's see Elsie's hand up again do you want to go Elsie there

[0:18:41] Voice 15: can everyone hear

[0:18:42] Voice 15: me yeah fabulous um yeah I have to I really wanted to agree with Kevin on going forward

[0:18:49] Voice 15: with figuring out with what's allowed because currently in rural properties that are zoned for

[0:18:55] Voice 15: agriculture the islands trust allows for anything under 4550 kilograms of animals which is just like

[0:19:07] Voice 15: an absolutely ridiculous number but if that's the guidelines that people are going for

[0:19:11] Voice 15: and then you know running into non-agreeable relationships with their neighbors because they

[0:19:20] Voice 15: they have you know 50 kilograms of animals you know there has to be some sort of allowable or

[0:19:28] Voice 15: understanding or something of what we can do in certain areas of salt spring because currently

[0:19:36] Voice 15: i'm on the butt end of a lot of very angry people in salt spring and i find it very difficult

[0:19:42] Voice 15: to say here are the rules that the islands trust has zoned the property for and then having to like

[0:19:49] Voice 15: explain to them why they can't farm the way they want to farm and so i'm i would love some

[0:19:55] Voice 15: clarification or they don't have to be like hard rules but guidelines would be fantastic

[0:20:01] Voice 15: just to like take the pressure off of me because i'm i'm getting five to ten calls a year from

[0:20:08] Voice 15: angry from people trying to farm on salt spring who are just hitting complaints and having to

[0:20:13] Voice 15: deal with the crd and the islands trust is said they could do it but the crd says they can't and

[0:20:19] Voice 15: And it's just, it's a very frustrating place for me to be.

[0:20:22] Voice 15: I'm fortunate.

[0:20:23] Voice 15: I'm on ALR land and I can farm as I see fit and I'm protected.

[0:20:28] Voice 15: But that does, you know, 30% of the farms, producing farms on Salt Spring Island are

[0:20:34] Voice 15: not on ALR land.

[0:20:35] Voice 15: And what kind of protection are they being afforded?

[0:20:40] Voice 15: Thank you for listening.

[0:20:43] Voice 14: Oh, thank you for expressing that.

[0:20:45] Voice 14: I think certainly yourself and others who are actively farming are probably the best place to sort of know what those issues and concerns are and maybe to get together and try and collect some of those.

[0:21:01] Voice 14: um also you you sort of touched on one of the issues that i'm aware of uh happening uh on salt

[0:21:08] Voice 14: spring which is the the multiple jurisdictions that we have the islands trust rules and then

[0:21:14] Voice 14: we have the crd rules and uh certainly i've read lots about the the rooster issue there

[0:21:21] Voice 14: i mean i think that's just that's just one maybe glaring example but there's probably others that

[0:21:26] Voice 14: i'm not aware of um elsie did you want to add something or you just still have

[0:21:35] Voice 15: your hand up

[0:21:35] Voice 15: yeah yeah um i was just going to say if you ever want to talk to me i'm happy to talk to you i have

[0:21:41] Voice 15: a bunch of case files of people who have contacted me and requested guidance with dealing with the

[0:21:49] Voice 15: islands trust and the crd and um there's some very glaring examples that uh that are just

[0:21:56] Voice 15: unfortunate for people that have tried and bought property where they've been told they're allowed

[0:22:00] Voice 15: to farm and now are being either ticketed or taken to court or anyways it's very frustrating

[0:22:09] Voice 15: for small scale farmers to start up on salt spring and i think it shouldn't be those are the people

[0:22:15] Voice 15: we want here those are the people that are going to grow into big farms i mean the average medium

[0:22:19] Voice 15: age of farmers on salt spring i think it's like 67 right now we should be fostering the younger

[0:22:29] Voice 15: ones to come in and you know it's a lot of learning and i think there's a lot of room for everybody

[0:22:35] Voice 15: thank you yeah

[0:22:37] Voice 14: and i think that goes back to to kevin's uh point about having having some

[0:22:42] Voice 14: guidelines or information so that people do have that sense of uh especially people starting out

[0:22:48] Voice 14: some some sense of of surety around what they're what they're uh able to do in a way that in terms

[0:22:57] Voice 14: of the jurisdictional uh legislative stuff and also i guess maybe it's a bit of social license

[0:23:02] Voice 14: in there as well i'm just looking for more hands there is anyone else want to add something

[0:23:17] Voice 11: trustee patrick i'd

[0:23:18] Trustee Patrick: love to make sure that we allow some advertising space here for the farmland

[0:23:22] Trustee Patrick: and trust in their uh activities that they're going to be having that's

[0:23:32] Voice 19: up to the chair of the

[0:23:34] Voice 19: meeting is that is there

[0:23:36] Voice 19: room for that yeah

[0:23:38] Voice 14: i seems to me there's some room i don't see anyone

[0:23:41] Voice 14: objecting all

[0:23:42] Voice 19: right okay um we're having our annual general meeting uh it's actual annual

[0:23:48] Voice 19: general meeting day tomorrow with uh the burgoyne valley community farm from uh tours and uh people

[0:23:56] Voice 19: hosting and uh ann will be there to talk about the ecodrome and we'll have people walking about

[0:24:03] Voice 19: and you'll get a chance to meet our new farm manager and seeing the community gardens and

[0:24:07] Voice 19: some of the different uh rental farms that we've got there at the community the burgoyne valley

[0:24:12] Voice 19: Valley Community Farm. That's from 12 to 2.30. And then we'll be hosting again at The Root

[0:24:22] Voice 19: at the Food Hub on Bettis Road, where you'll get a chance to meet our current tenants that are in

[0:24:28] Voice 19: the building and using the kitchen and using the space and can tour our restoration garden that

[0:24:35] Voice 19: that we have transformed that very difficult site

[0:24:38] Voice 19: into a lovely, productive garden

[0:24:41] Voice 19: that is becoming a beautiful showpiece of restoration.

[0:24:47] Voice 19: And yeah, meeting board members in our meeting,

[0:24:49] Voice 19: our annual general meeting itself begins at five.

[0:24:53] Voice 19: So that's our big day tomorrow.

[0:24:55] Voice 19: Everyone is welcome.

[0:24:56] Voice 19: And we have food coming out from our kitchen.

[0:24:59] Voice 19: And some of our tenants are sampling,

[0:25:02] Voice 19: offering samples as well

[0:25:05] Voice 19: of other foods that they

[0:25:07] Voice 19: have available from

[0:25:08] Voice 19: what they're doing there

[0:25:10] Voice 19: so that's happening tomorrow

[0:25:13] Voice 19: please feel free to come

[0:25:14] Voice 19: that

[0:25:19] Voice 8: sounds delightful

[0:25:21] Voice 8: Ross I see your hand up

[0:25:23] Voice 8: I hope that

[0:25:30] Voice 3: this resonates with everything that's being

[0:25:32] Voice 3: said here but I remember

[0:25:34] Voice 3: in the 80s Dan from

[0:25:36] Voice 3: Salt Spring Seeds saying to me

[0:25:38] Voice 3: rate yourself as long a list as you

[0:25:40] Voice 3: want about all the material things in your life and then you start striking off the things you

[0:25:45] Voice 3: can do without and it gets down to a pretty short list and so i think we're talking about food here

[0:25:51] Voice 3: and i think that's on the short list so that's it

[0:25:54] Voice 16: thank you

[0:26:02] Voice 14: for that reflection uh

[0:26:04] Voice 11: anyone else

[0:26:08] Voice 11: else trustee patrick yeah

[0:26:14] Trustee Patrick: i just i want to reiterate as we look at the you know the ocp

[0:26:19] Trustee Patrick: is a big general document and the the vision and the objectives and the and the are generally

[0:26:25] Trustee Patrick: pretty good and i think it's our chance to put our thumbs up and down saying is it strong enough

[0:26:30] Trustee Patrick: because i think some of the issues that people are coming up against like the roosters or because

[0:26:36] Trustee Patrick: the demographic changes that are occurring people are coming here for different reasons

[0:26:39] Trustee Patrick: reasons and i and i and i think this group is you know and i'll say myself as well you know we want

[0:26:46] Trustee Patrick: to make sure that agriculture is maintained grows thrives and and so that's what we need to make

[0:26:53] Trustee Patrick: sure we're looking at these documents through that lens to make sure we're not inadvertently

[0:26:56] Trustee Patrick: having the opposite happen we want to make you know we want to enshrine that this this use because

[0:27:03] Trustee Patrick: to me this is this is salt spring this is what it is and so important to me is the agricultural

[0:27:08] Trustee Patrick: cultural base of our island thank

[0:27:15] Voice 11: you for that kevin yes

[0:27:20] Voice 20: um further to that um i think there

[0:27:23] Voice 20: needs to be an an awareness with the realtors of this island like when they're selling properties

[0:27:29] Voice 20: like if we have a some sort of a handout that people considering to live here um that um that

[0:27:39] Voice 20: that could say to them how important agriculture is to the island.

[0:27:49] Voice 8: I think

[0:27:50] Voice 8: you might have muted yourself.

[0:27:53] Voice 20: Yeah.

[0:27:55] Voice 20: So when they're introduced to this island,

[0:27:57] Voice 20: they understand that agriculture is an important part of the island.

[0:28:01] Voice 20: It's not all about going to the beach or sailing their yacht or whatever.

[0:28:06] Voice 20: It's also a fundamental and primary production

[0:28:10] Voice 20: that's very important on this island.

[0:28:12] Voice 20: and um so and i think that gets lost when when realtors get selling properties to people

[0:28:19] Voice 20: and um you know i mean this it in the fraser valley it was always like that as well i mean

[0:28:27] Voice 20: our problems with neighbors in the farming industry always arose from people buying properties

[0:28:33] Voice 20: that weren't aware of what it's like to live in a farming area and that's where all the complaints

[0:28:40] Voice 20: the neighbor complaints came from from from non-farming population and and we don't want to

[0:28:47] Voice 20: have the same thing here so i think we have to be careful and and ensure that people um

[0:28:55] Voice 20: when they're looking at property here and want to want to come live here that they understand that

[0:29:00] Voice 20: that that those are part of the activities that occur here uh i'll finish off of that

[0:29:15] Voice 9: thank you for that uh

[0:29:17] Voice 14: ross i see your hand is is it still up or did you have something to add there

[0:29:26] Voice 8: okay i see it's down

[0:29:30] Voice 16: anyone

[0:29:33] Voice 14: else like to add anything for the discussion today

[0:29:37] Voice 14: see laura i

[0:29:38] Trustee Patrick: just want to do more of a follow-up at our last meeting i know we talked about

[0:29:41] Trustee Patrick: agricultural housing and we did raise a motion uh at our at our next local trust committee meeting

[0:29:49] Trustee Patrick: to bring it to the attention of the group that's going to be working on the housing

[0:29:53] Trustee Patrick: needs assessment to see if we can get that data point added to that process.

[0:30:08] Voice 14: Okay, I see a hand up. We haven't heard from Donna yet.

[0:30:17] Voice 17: All right, can you hear me?

[0:30:20] Voice 11: Yes, go ahead.

[0:30:21] Voice 17: Perfect. I guess I'm in a bit of a unique position in that I have, I'm a small scale chicken farmer.

[0:30:28] Voice 17: And I also am a hairdresser. So I speak to people all day long and have been since the beginning of this year when the rooster issue, the current big rooster issue came to my attention.

[0:30:39] Voice 17: we started an online petition and we have almost 3,000 signatures so I think it's important I don't

[0:30:49] Voice 17: think I'm saying anything new here but it's important to note that almost 30 percent of

[0:30:55] Voice 17: Salt Spring has signed our petition and every single person who sits in my chair hears about

[0:31:01] Voice 17: this whether they like it or not and everyone except maybe two people since the beginning of

[0:31:08] Voice 17: January are very concerned about this and support agriculture and maintaining it as it's been and

[0:31:22] Voice 17: are really concerned about the direction that things seem to be going in and so I just wanted

[0:31:28] Voice 17: to chime in and let you know that I talked to a lot of people and this is a very forefront concern

[0:31:36] Voice 17: concern for a lot of people right now in the community oh

[0:31:42] Voice 14: thank you for that uh Elsie I see

[0:31:45] Voice 14: your hand up again I'll

[0:31:57] Voice 15: meet myself there yeah

[0:31:58] Voice 14: there you go

[0:31:59] Voice 15: fantastic thank you uh my question

[0:32:01] Voice 15: was actually for the trustees and I want to know going forward how can you help us with um I guess

[0:32:11] Voice 15: our current issues whether it is uh the zoning bylaws or um how to talk to people going forward

[0:32:20] Voice 15: And just like where you guys are able to actually like enact change for us, because currently we've, I feel a lot of us feel like we've been hitting our heads against a brick wall a little bit lately. And yeah, I was just wondering what is in your capability to help us going forward with protection on farmers and farming rights on people who are not on AOR land? Thank you.

[0:32:47] Voice 15: thank

[0:32:53] Voice 11: you for that see some nodding uh trustees someone on a laura well i think

[0:33:02] Trustee Patrick: um well i i can only speak for myself i mean i i want i believe we must do a better job

[0:33:10] Trustee Patrick: protecting agriculture it is like to me it's salt spring so much of salt spring is uh you know

[0:33:17] Trustee Patrick: that's it's history for uh even it's a indigenous people this was this was farming

[0:33:23] Trustee Patrick: Farming for them, it's not using the word farming isn't appropriate, but food was grown on this island from time immemorial, and it is important.

[0:33:36] Trustee Patrick: And we can do what we can to make sure our bylaws are clear.

[0:33:42] Trustee Patrick: we've got this process coming forward here is our chance to to tweak if necessary to improve

[0:33:49] Trustee Patrick: and clarify um that this is an important value of the island um i see the agricultural community as

[0:33:58] Trustee Patrick: well you know the ag alliance i think is a is a great vehicle to make sure the voice is out there

[0:34:05] Trustee Patrick: and heard and I I'm pretty confident that it it will ride through the through the process as being

[0:34:14] Trustee Patrick: a strong value and we just have to lean into that thank

[0:34:24] Voice 11: you those thoughts uh trustee Harris

[0:34:26] Voice 11: yeah

[0:34:27] Voice 7: I'm not you know the question from Elsie I don't really maybe you could be a bit more clear

[0:34:35] Voice 7: so you're asking about rural zone properties and you say you're butting you know banging into a

[0:34:41] Voice 7: brick wall um could you just sort of expand on that a little bit go

[0:34:55] Voice 10: ahead i'll see if you wanted

[0:34:56] Voice 10: to oh great thank you

[0:34:58] Voice 15: um yeah so we've had uh numerous complaints to me and other executive

[0:35:04] Voice 15: members of the poultry club about birds that they've had on their lands whether they're poultry

[0:35:09] Voice 15: farmers or hobby farmers um and i find it very frustrating when the islands trust zoning permits

[0:35:18] Voice 15: that use of their land but I have to now combat the or talk to them about combating the CRD

[0:35:25] Voice 15: coming in and either threatening them with tickets and removing birds or forcing them to relinquish

[0:35:32] Voice 15: birds and I just they these people have bought these properties because it says that they're

[0:35:39] Voice 15: allowed to farm on them and farming birds is like well within the Islands Trust bylaws and

[0:35:47] Voice 15: use of land permitted use of land and um i guess i'm just looking for like clarification on how

[0:35:54] Voice 15: you guys are able to help us like either have a clearer sense of what is able to be done on

[0:36:02] Voice 15: these parcels of land or because like currently it's like they're one acre properties and your

[0:36:10] Voice 15: your bylaw says anything under 4,550 kilograms of animals is permitted, which to me is just like an

[0:36:17] Voice 15: absurd number for a one acre parcel. So it's just, they don't seem like very well thought out

[0:36:24] Voice 15: from my point of view. And I'm just, I'm wondering how you as a trustee can help either protect

[0:36:31] Voice 15: farmers who are allowed to do according to the Island Trust bylaws, what they're doing,

[0:36:37] Voice 15: doing or I guess to amend them to reflect what should be or would be reasonable to do on those

[0:36:45] Voice 15: properties and sizes of land well

[0:36:49] Voice 7: it's interesting if it's allowed on you know as far as the if the

[0:36:53] Voice 7: zoning allows it then you know again what's going what is the CRD doing um going against that and

[0:37:02] Voice 7: and clearly we would, you know, it's tough.

[0:37:04] Voice 15: We're currently taking a family to court for $10,000 in fines

[0:37:09] Voice 15: is what's going on currently, so it's a little frustrating.

[0:37:13] Voice 7: But it's interesting because if the bylaw says that you can do that there,

[0:37:18] Voice 7: then how the heck is that supposed to hold up in court?

[0:37:20] Voice 7: It's just, I don't, you know, this is very concerning.

[0:37:23] Voice 7: And so we clearly don't want to have more regulation and say,

[0:37:27] Voice 7: okay, well, you can't do that.

[0:37:29] Voice 7: but maybe it's up to you know people that are farming to sort of use their better judgment

[0:37:36] Voice 7: um when it comes to that as far as getting along with your neighbors goes so i you know i don't

[0:37:41] Voice 7: know where the line draws there but as far as as far as that trust goes if the if if the bylaw says

[0:37:47] Voice 7: you can do that there you can you can farm like that there then that's what the bylaw says and so

[0:37:54] Voice 7: So, you know, clearly we don't want us to amend the bylaws and say you can't do that there.

[0:38:01] Voice 7: Maybe, you know, clearly there's, you know, the Islands, again, the Islands Trust, we've had a governance review last term, it was deemed dysfunctional in need of a major restructuring.

[0:38:13] Voice 7: So that's part of the problem here. The Islands Trust is dysfunctional.

[0:38:17] Voice 7: So, you know, when, how do we talk to the CRD? How are we supposed to iron this out?

[0:38:21] Voice 7: i don't have an answer to that um i other than it you know we need a restructuring and um possibly

[0:38:28] Voice 7: there needs to be a municipality here to deal with this kind of stuff in a more um you know

[0:38:32] Voice 7: meaningful and cut and dry way um but yeah so a really good question leaves some thoughts to

[0:38:39] Voice 7: to uh to ponder on um it'll be interesting to see what happens in court with the crd i'm not

[0:38:47] Voice 7: sure how a judge is supposed to err on the side of the crd when the bylaw clearly the land use

[0:38:52] Voice 7: bylaw clearly states you can do that there um unless there's this noise you know the noise

[0:38:59] Voice 7: aspect of it um and then that's up to the neighbors to hopefully deal with that um it's a shame that

[0:39:05] Voice 7: it's gotten to this and i wonder if it could have been alleviated i don't know um but anyhow i hope

[0:39:12] Voice 7: sure that doesn't answer your question but um that's my two cents thanks

[0:39:19] Voice 11: uh trustee patrick we

[0:39:22] Trustee Patrick: actually do have a joint meeting coming up um with the crd um and the

[0:39:26] Trustee Patrick: islands the local trust committee and we're still building the agenda so i think this is something

[0:39:31] Trustee Patrick: that is worthy to discuss at that meeting so thanks okay

[0:39:41] Voice 14: thank you for that reminder

[0:39:44] Voice 14: um donna i see your hand up hi

[0:39:50] Voice 17: so just back to elsie's question i think one thing that would be

[0:39:55] Voice 17: super helpful in the whole community as a whole is there's other rural communities who have

[0:40:01] Voice 17: added stipulations or amendments to their their bylaws for example I believe at Souk

[0:40:10] Voice 17: their rural zoning agricultural like I'm not talking ALR land because they have their own

[0:40:15] Voice 17: specific protections but rural land they have exemptions so you so livestock noise is not

[0:40:24] Voice 17: something you can complain about it's protected that's the word i'm looking for so there could

[0:40:30] Voice 17: be something you could add into um into the 10 000 pounds of animal that those sheep are allowed

[0:40:39] Voice 17: to make noise or those horses are allowed to make noise or those roosters and chickens because

[0:40:44] Voice 17: there has been complaints about someone's hens now which is ludicrous considering you're allowed

[0:40:49] Voice 17: hens in downtown vancouver so there could be something you guys could build into the bylaws

[0:40:55] Voice 17: that allow for a protection from whatever agriculture activity is decided is allowed

[0:41:02] Voice 17: on that property uh

[0:41:09] Voice 8: trustee harris that's a great idea thank you for that and

[0:41:17] Voice 14: i was just gonna um

[0:41:18] Voice 14: on that last point uh there about about that i was actually just gonna ask uh our staff our

[0:41:26] Voice 14: planning manager if you had any thoughts on that notion on

[0:41:33] Voice 21: on creating more stringent

[0:41:37] Voice 21: rules around uh or more protective rules i suppose around the around the keeping of poultry

[0:41:46] Voice 21: is that what i'm hearing well

[0:41:48] Voice 14: and i think it may it may be i mean certainly the focus right now is

[0:41:53] Voice 14: on on poultry but if if there's a uh agricultural in this case uh animal livestock um use permitted

[0:42:04] Voice 14: then

[0:42:04] Voice 11: the

[0:42:05] Voice 14: the sort of types of noises that would normally be associated with them i guess um just

[0:42:12] Voice 14: just your thoughts sort of from a legislative standpoint i'm not asking you to take a position

[0:42:17] Voice 14: particularly but um just just around how how viable that is from a legislative point of view

[0:42:25] Voice 14: i

[0:42:29] Voice 21: don't i think beyond our our strictly land use powers um which is i mean really that's the extent

[0:42:35] Voice 21: of what we can do um you know again the the regional we don't really have a direct authority

[0:42:42] Voice 21: over what regulations the regional district puts in place however they do not have the ability

[0:42:47] Voice 21: to create land use regulations um however through provisions of various services they may

[0:42:54] Voice 21: there may be enforcement um so i mean i'm not really too sure what it is that we could we could

[0:43:01] Voice 21: do um beyond beyond the you know the we do allow agriculture fairly permissively um in the island

[0:43:09] Voice 21: trust so um however you know the restriction is going to be at the least permissive regime in

[0:43:14] Voice 21: this point at this point it's um it's the cid in this case okay

[0:43:21] Voice 14: thank you uh trustee harris

[0:43:23] Voice 7: i guess that brings us back to the municipality versus the current um governance and clearly in

[0:43:31] Voice 7: other areas that donna you have been mentioning for a municipality and are able to to make these

[0:43:39] Voice 7: these types of uh bylaws where the noise is is added into that um i

[0:43:45] Voice 9: think

[0:43:47] Voice 7: that's really where

[0:43:48] Voice 7: we need to go here on something in order to deal with this kind of stuff because that's what it's

[0:43:52] Voice 7: now just uh

[0:43:56] Voice 9: dada

[0:44:05] Voice 14: i see your hand again oh

[0:44:09] Voice 17: can you hear me yeah okay i guess i didn't unmute sorry

[0:44:14] Voice 17: um i guess i'm a little bit unsure of what you mean and i think i'm talking to

[0:44:21] Voice 17: jamie who's who's the gentleman that you were just asking the laws the legislative question

[0:44:27] Voice 17: to i'm sorry i've forgotten your name

[0:44:28] Voice 14: oh oh that's uh chris hutton our regional planning

[0:44:31] Voice 14: planning manager

[0:44:32] Voice 17: yes so the the bylaw i'm referring to is an islands trust bylaw that

[0:44:39] Voice 17: that allows agricultural use under the rural zoning.

[0:44:43] Voice 17: So I'm unsure why the CRD would be the ones

[0:44:49] Voice 17: to make a change to that bylaw or an amendment

[0:44:51] Voice 17: or an addition to it to allow for agricultural noise

[0:44:56] Voice 17: or livestock noise.

[0:44:58] Voice 17: Can you just explain that further to me?

[0:45:01] Voice 21: So I think that what's the issue with the roosters

[0:45:06] Voice 21: is that the current enforcement

[0:45:09] Voice 21: or now court action is around noise abatement

[0:45:12] Voice 21: and the interpretation of what constitutes a farm use, right?

[0:45:15] Voice 21: What falls under the Right to Farm Act.

[0:45:18] Voice 21: So the argument here appears to be that the roosters are saying,

[0:45:24] Voice 21: or the people who have the roosters are saying this is a farm,

[0:45:27] Voice 21: but it's a very small place,

[0:45:29] Voice 21: which does not meet necessarily the threshold

[0:45:33] Voice 21: to be considered a farm in the view of the regional district.

[0:45:36] Voice 21: So if the regional district, I mean, it's not a land use bylaw at all, the land use bylaw is the Salt Spring Island Local Trust Committee land use bylaw, so it lies with this group here, and that simply says agriculture is agriculture, and that roosters can crow.

[0:45:55] Voice 21: um however in in the crd um that the the determination of whether the farming right

[0:46:03] Voice 21: to farm act applies um i think is what's at question here in this lawsuit if i'm if i'm

[0:46:08] Voice 21: the court action if i'm to understand it um and if if it does not apply then the nuisance bylaw

[0:46:15] Voice 21: of the capital regional district does apply we can't pass a bylaw like we're we're we're

[0:46:22] Voice 21: essentially parallel entities in this in this case right then we're we regulate in the same

[0:46:28] Voice 21: space but in different ways where the island's trust can regulate as a place that's as a body

[0:46:34] Voice 21: that says yes on this land you can have um chickens and roosters um the the capital regional

[0:46:42] Voice 21: district can apparently have a noise abatement or a nuisance bylaw um that applies to these lands

[0:46:49] Voice 21: as well um so if the rooster crows at a certain volume then um then it constitutes noise and that

[0:46:55] Voice 21: is the argument of the capital regional district okay

[0:47:01] Voice 8: it's

[0:47:02] Voice 21: it's about as clear as i can be without

[0:47:04] Voice 21: i mean i i don't think it's really a good a constructive uh conversation to say that

[0:47:11] Voice 21: to pontificate on on the the goodness the rightness or wrongness um of a of another

[0:47:17] Voice 21: other organization and its actions. So I'm not going to weigh in on that. But it's just to say

[0:47:27] Voice 21: that it is, I mean, we do both regulate in the same space. And Trustee Patrick has pointed out,

[0:47:32] Voice 21: this is probably a really good opportunity to discuss with the CRD and come to some more

[0:47:39] Voice 21: streamlined agreement on how agriculture is regulated at various scales.

[0:47:46] Voice 21: else thank you

[0:47:48] Voice 21: thanks

[0:47:53] Voice 8: ann um

[0:47:57] Voice 1: yes i'm wondering if there's a room anywhere to

[0:48:01] Voice 1: i know it's hard in bylaws but if we're talking policy documents and everything else

[0:48:07] Voice 1: going back to what donna says why can't we make a statement that says you know agriculture includes

[0:48:15] Voice 1: livestock with livestock carrying out their natural behaviors as almost as guidance to the

[0:48:22] Voice 1: the crd if you like um it's the crd we need to change their bylaw and give the exemption

[0:48:28] Voice 1: for agricultural noises but the islands trust could without i think i mean maybe i'm wrong but

[0:48:38] Voice 1: you know with some information note or something that isn't a rule could describe what that means

[0:48:45] Voice 1: when we say agriculture life or livestock farming is allowed without getting into whether you can

[0:48:52] Voice 1: make noise bylaws or not and it it just reinforces the idea that we should be able to do these things

[0:49:01] Voice 1: and hopefully the crd will get the message when they read that that you know this they got some

[0:49:10] Voice 1: on their bylaws thank you all

[0:49:22] Voice 8: right thank you for that looking don't see any hands up at the moment

[0:49:35] Voice 8: everyone's ruminating

[0:49:36] Voice 12: oh there i see another hand up that's elsie again go ahead

[0:49:44] Voice 15: elsie again

[0:49:46] Voice 15: here we go uh sorry

[0:49:48] Voice 12: i didn't sorry i did not mean to to imply anything there

[0:49:52] Voice 12: okay

[0:49:52] Voice 15: it's okay please go ahead

[0:49:54] Voice 15: i think i think for agriculture to continue on salt spring we

[0:49:59] Voice 15: We really want to attract younger farmers and younger farmers don't have the money to buy

[0:50:07] Voice 15: box club farm that's up for sale right now. They have money to buy one acre plots that allow for

[0:50:15] Voice 15: farming. And I think those interests and those people who want to get started and to continue

[0:50:24] Voice 15: our history and customs should be afforded some sort of like either guidelines or protection and

[0:50:32] Voice 15: I think that falls on the trustees to ensure that for people and I think it's a really really very

[0:50:40] Voice 15: very important to attract new blood to this island to continue with food production thank you yeah

[0:50:55] Voice 8: thank you for that you

[0:51:00] Voice 14: see we're running about 20 after six but we have more time scheduled uh so

[0:51:04] Voice 14: i'm certainly not wanting to cut this discussion short if there's folks have more to say uh there's

[0:51:13] Voice 14: a few people we haven't heard from that i'd be happy to hear from um and there we go i see

[0:51:19] Voice 14: jillian do

[0:51:31] Voice 10: you want to go ahead and unmute julian yeah

[0:51:37] Voice 13: um i'm not a farmer i am an artist actually

[0:51:41] Voice 13: um but i know quite a few farmers on this island and i've certainly bought um lots of produce from

[0:51:47] Voice 13: farmers on this island i am uh just want to bring something to the table that hasn't been brought up

[0:51:53] Voice 13: yet i'd like to see the issue of regenerative farming versus um non-regenerate non-regenerative

[0:52:02] Voice 13: practices um uh as part of what is being discussed here and what would be dealt with in the community

[0:52:11] Voice 13: assessment project because I think in the interest of the LTC's preserve and

[0:52:16] Voice 13: protect policy it would be really good if this island could be a fantastic

[0:52:22] Voice 13: example of the benefits of regenerative farming for the health of the ecosystem

[0:52:29] Voice 13: for animals people plants and and to be producing quality food without doing any

[0:52:38] Voice 13: damage to the ecosystem in the wider essence of what that is that's it okay

[0:52:50] Voice 14: kevin for some reason

[0:53:05] Voice 9: we're not hearing

[0:53:06] Voice 14: you sir i see your mute is not on but we we're not uh getting your audio somehow

[0:53:14] Voice 20: is that better now there

[0:53:16] Voice 14: you go yeah okay

[0:53:18] Voice 20: good um yeah i we're lacking the crd as part of these

[0:53:23] Voice 20: discussions and I know that they don't want to discuss this until after the

[0:53:28] Voice 20: court case which is fine but I think we should have the CRD in the room also as

[0:53:35] Voice 20: part of these discussions because they're fundamental and in how we go

[0:53:39] Voice 20: forward in the future and to it for us to be talking you know sort of off to

[0:53:45] Voice 20: the side when the when the main focus seems to be the CRD you know I think we

[0:53:52] Voice 20: we need to rearrange perhaps, you know,

[0:53:57] Voice 20: how we are discussing these issues

[0:53:59] Voice 20: and who we're discussing them with.

[0:54:05] Voice 14: Yeah, thank you.

[0:54:06] Voice 14: And of course, that is an important point.

[0:54:10] Voice 14: I think the local trust committee,

[0:54:13] Voice 14: at least from my perspective,

[0:54:14] Voice 14: I think we're looking forward to our opportunity

[0:54:17] Voice 14: to sit down with CRD next month,

[0:54:21] Voice 14: um despite having uh protocol agreements and and such um sometimes it's important to

[0:54:31] Voice 14: uh to exercise those and and get the meetings um started so that there are regular communications

[0:54:39] Voice 14: and and and better opportunities to i guess in this case to add advocate in turn on behalf of

[0:54:47] Voice 14: of farmers to the CRD and encourage dialogue, I guess it would be my perspective on that.

[0:54:58] Voice 14: But certainly, we can't force another jurisdiction to do things.

[0:55:06] Voice 14: But when we do have agreements, we can exercise them and have those conversations

[0:55:12] Voice 14: and encourage them to have the conversations

[0:55:16] Voice 14: with the other local groups.

[0:55:21] Okay,

[0:55:23] Voice 14: I see another hand up.

[0:55:25] Voice 14: Go ahead, Trustee Patrick.

[0:55:27] Trustee Patrick: No, well, I appreciate that suggestion, Kevin,

[0:55:30] Trustee Patrick: and I think that's something we should always be looking at.

[0:55:32] Trustee Patrick: We shouldn't meet just for the purpose of meeting.

[0:55:35] Trustee Patrick: The idea is to have conversations to help us respond better

[0:55:40] Trustee Patrick: to the agricultural community,

[0:55:41] Trustee Patrick: community, but we can certainly talk with the CRD. If you think there's value to have CRD

[0:55:47] Trustee Patrick: representation here or the LCC representation, we can certainly look at expanding the invite list.

[0:55:56] Voice 8: Yeah, thanks. Good point, Laura.

[0:55:59] Voice 14: Dawn, I see your hand.

[0:56:05] Voice 17: Yeah, I do think it's important that this discussion doesn't wait for the current

[0:56:11] Voice 17: rooster case because the way the court systems work, it could be months and months. It could

[0:56:17] Voice 17: could be next year before we have an answer on this case and i think there's you can talk about

[0:56:23] Voice 17: this issue and completely avoid talking about chickens and roosters you can talk about sheep

[0:56:28] Voice 17: and you can talk about goats and you can talk about pigs it doesn't there's no reason the crd

[0:56:33] Voice 17: can't come to the table and talk about zoning agriculture noise um noise exemptions for

[0:56:42] Voice 17: livestock etc without going anywhere near this rooster case yeah

[0:56:52] Voice 14: i agree i i think it's uh

[0:56:54] Voice 14: perfectly reasonable to have those conversations without getting into into the mire of the

[0:57:00] Voice 14: specific case that's before the courts sheila

[0:57:03] Voice 8: yeah

[0:57:04] Voice 19: it's just occurred to me that through this

[0:57:06] Voice 19: community assessment um process i just i don't think i've got the words right on that um

[0:57:13] Voice 19: community assessment. Yes. You mentioned data collection, and I think there's an

[0:57:18] Voice 19: incredible opportunity here. I'm imagining the actual volume of food production occurring in

[0:57:24] Voice 19: these one acre plots. And how much information do we have about that, the importance of our food

[0:57:31] Voice 19: system by those small holdings uh be them poultry market gardens um look and and finding a way for

[0:57:42] Voice 19: that data collection process to capture what they can for an understanding of that very very

[0:57:49] Voice 19: important uh systemic part of our food system um cultural part of our food system that as has been

[0:57:58] Voice 19: described people are coming to this island to try and grow their own food and can only afford these

[0:58:03] Voice 19: small holdings they're contributing a huge amount of our valuable food system to our valuable food

[0:58:10] Voice 19: system so to try and capture that information into some solid data into that assessment process i

[0:58:15] Voice 19: think could be very very valuable for us to get a good feel for that element of our food system

[0:58:21] Voice 19: yeah

[0:58:26] Voice 9: thank you for that point okay

[0:58:34] Voice 10: anyone who hasn't

[0:58:36] Voice 14: spoken want to chime in or

[0:58:38] Voice 14: anyone who has and want to add anything uh

[0:58:45] Voice 11: trustee harris i

[0:58:46] Voice 7: have you know i have a question um just

[0:58:49] Voice 7: out of curiosity um might help me how many people here have um have been to the property

[0:58:59] Voice 7: pretty in question where this court case is happening

[0:59:03] Voice 7: with the Brewsters.

[0:59:07] Voice 7: I don't know if there could be a show of hands or something.

[0:59:22] Voice 14: Well, Trustee Harris, I don't see any hands up,

[0:59:25] Voice 14: so I'm not entirely sure whether that's an answer

[0:59:29] Voice 14: to your question or not, but.

[0:59:32] Voice 7: Yeah,

[0:59:32] Voice 14: it would be helpful just to,

[0:59:33] Voice 7: yeah, it'd be interesting to see you.

[0:59:35] Voice 7: So I'm assuming that nobody here has been there.

[0:59:39] Voice 7: I should have put up my hand, I was there,

[0:59:41] Voice 7: but maybe some others have been.

[0:59:43] Voice 7: just be nice to know thanks oh

[0:59:50] Voice 8: i see some i see another hand in the

[0:59:54] Voice 8: merv go ahead yeah

[0:59:58] Voice 6: i think probably

[1:00:00] Voice 6: the conversation which may be a little bit difficult but should there be some sort of a

[1:00:07] Voice 6: limit to the size of an agricultural operation like if somebody had um that egg and it squealed

[1:00:19] Voice 6: all night would that constitute egg if a person had a pet rooster and then another one would that

[1:00:31] Voice 6: that constitute agriculture? I think that conversation should be had. I don't know where

[1:00:39] Voice 6: you'd make a line, whether it's three chickens that you're feeding yourself. Anyway, that's

[1:00:48] Voice 6: a conversation I'm sort of thinking that we should think about.

[1:00:58] Voice 11: Yeah, thank you for that.

[1:01:05] Voice 10: Pam and John, did you have something to add?

[1:01:12] Voice 5: Yeah, just following on what Merv said, I think this rooster case is just the beginning,

[1:01:21] Voice 5: that something is shifting and the rooster case is a symbol of it, which is people are moving

[1:01:25] Voice 5: here to grow their own food for a reason because they know that things are going sideways and they

[1:01:33] Voice 5: want to be able to grow their own food and not be so dependent on the system that may not supply us

[1:01:38] Voice 5: us here or anywhere in the way that we've been used to.

[1:01:41] Voice 5: And so if the CRD is pursuing this

[1:01:45] Voice 5: because they have a minimum size definition

[1:01:48] Voice 5: for what constitutes a farm,

[1:01:50] Voice 5: that may be part of the problem,

[1:01:52] Voice 5: which I think Murr was alluding to,

[1:01:56] Voice 5: that our system as it was constituted

[1:02:00] Voice 5: at a different time in the past

[1:02:02] Voice 5: may be coming up against the present reality,

[1:02:04] Voice 5: which is that people on whatever piece of land they have

[1:02:08] Voice 5: or their neighbor's land, or several people getting together, or a community neighborhood,

[1:02:13] Voice 5: whatever, are growing food that they need to grow, not merely out of lifestyle or economic necessity,

[1:02:22] Voice 5: but out of actual necessity. So I think it's worth not approaching this rooster case as though it's

[1:02:30] Voice 5: the only one we're going to ever have, but rather as a sign of something that's coming that we need

[1:02:35] Voice 5: to deal with and in my opinion pretty quickly um so that's it thanks yeah

[1:02:46] Voice 8: thank you for those

[1:02:46] Voice 8: thoughts anyone

[1:02:54] Voice 10: else like to add to the conversation here okay

[1:03:10] Voice 14: well i'm not seeing any

[1:03:12] Voice 14: more hands again i'm not uh no interest in rushing the uh the conclusion of the meeting but uh

[1:03:22] Voice 14: let's give another minute and maybe maybe something will pop up for someone uh out of

[1:03:27] Voice 14: of the reflection of what we've been hearing tonight.

[1:03:29] Voice 14: I think it's been a good conversation so far.

[1:03:31] Voice 14: I've certainly got some good perspectives

[1:03:34] Voice 14: on the agricultural situation over on Salt Spring there.

[1:03:50] Voice 14: Okay.

[1:03:51] Voice 14: Well, I'm not seeing anyone jump forward.

[1:03:54] Voice 14: So I'm feeling like maybe we might be

[1:03:59] Voice 14: at the end of the conversation for this evening,

[1:04:01] Voice 14: but don't see any big waving hands.

[1:04:06] Voice 14: So, but I would like to thank everyone for coming out and sharing your thoughts with us.

[1:04:15] Voice 14: As Jesse Patrick pointed out, we do have a meeting with CRD coming up June 17th.

[1:04:23] Voice 14: And I would expect that we can share some of what we've heard tonight in terms of the community concerns around those multiple jurisdictions, sort of conflicts here between noise concerns and land use.

[1:04:44] Voice 14: And I guess I'm not sure if it's entirely fair, but I sort of see that conflict as sort of reflecting a bit of gentrification.

[1:04:55] Voice 14: That would be one of the things I would perhaps characterize that, but not living on Salt Spring.

[1:05:04] Voice 14: I don't want to cast any aspersions where it's not appropriate.

[1:05:08] Voice 14: But but I think that that can be a concern in our in our small communities, which are, of course, really desirable in terms of the lifestyle and folks wanting to come and live in these islands.

[1:05:22] Voice 14: So I think it is is a it's a reality. It can be a reality and it's certainly a real concern.

[1:05:29] Voice 14: So I think since I'm not seeing any more hands up, I just want to thank everyone for joining us tonight and wish you all a good evening.

[1:05:40] Voice 14: And certainly in terms of the LTC's projects, feel free to reach out to your trustees or to staff with any of your thoughts or concerns or any updates on opportunities to engage in the projects.

[1:05:58] Voice 14: Thank you very much, everyone.