Denman Island Local Trust Committee community information meeting, December 10, 2024

[0:00:00] Voice 9: The rest of the time, I guess the model is going to run face-to-face.

[0:00:04] Voice 9: Alrighty, so we are recording, we are live-streaming, so good morning!

[0:00:09] Voice 9: Thank you all for joining us today for the regular meeting of the

[0:00:13] Devon Island People's Trust Committee.

[0:00:16] I want to begin the meeting by acknowledging the report should be

[0:00:19] able to gather today in locations across the territory of the

[0:00:22] Voice 9: people's state of the state.

[0:00:24] Voice 9: I'm David Vaughn, I'm elected on the main island, and I'm the

[0:00:27] Voice 9: chair of the Devon Island People's Trust Committee.

[0:00:28] Voice 9: I'm joined today by your two Devon Island Trust Deeds, David Graham and Sam Forthwaite.

[0:00:36] Voice 9: Together we make up the Devon Island Local Trust Committee, the city's main livestream,

[0:00:40] Voice 9: and recorded for those who are unable to attend in person today.

[0:00:43] Voice 9: The recording will be posted on the Trust website for future viewing.

[0:00:46] Voice 9: We have some staff members joining us today.

[0:00:49] Voice 9: today. So we have our planner, Marla Sparley, and we have Nadine Moreau, who is our legislative

[0:00:57] clerk and our wonderful planning support person today.

[0:01:03] Voice 9: I've lost track, who is doing the Zoom

[0:01:08] Voice 9: stuff today?

[0:01:10] Voice 9: Lisa Millar.

[0:01:10] Voice 9: Oh, so Lisa's still with us. Okay, thank you, Lisa. We appreciate all that you provide for

[0:01:15] Voice 9: us. We don't have more people joining us today.

[0:01:20] Voice 9: And we have Narissa Chadwick who's joining us for our housing component and I think I've

[0:01:26] Voice 9: ticked everybody's boxes, thank you very much.

[0:01:30] Voice 9: So we just want to say in this meeting, it's an official forum where local cards make decisions

[0:01:34] Voice 9: about land use in planning matters in this test for a low-income business, I want to

[0:01:38] Voice 9: add this place of employment despite the summer in their own homes, our staff and the right

[0:01:43] Voice 9: to a safe and respectful workplace.

[0:01:44] Voice 9: place so of course we have an agenda um do we have any comments on the agenda if

[0:01:53] Trustee Graham: i may thank you

[0:01:54] Trustee Graham: chair um because of the postal strike our our normal avenue of dispersing information to our

[0:02:01] Trustee Graham: community the grapevine has not been available uh through our mailbox it may have been it may

[0:02:06] Trustee Graham: be available at the store for pickup and it and i don't know if it's available anywhere else but

[0:02:12] Trustee Graham: this is not normal and this community relies on the grapevine i think for a lot of information

[0:02:18] Trustee Graham: not everybody's on the computer uh a lot of us hate the computer and avoid it if we can

[0:02:23] Trustee Graham: and the grapevine is our um is our go-to uh information portal and the the public hearing

[0:02:31] Trustee Graham: notices were published in the grapevine i know they were it's a legislative uh requirement but

[0:02:36] Trustee Graham: they weren't they weren't they weren't brought to our mailboxes like they normally would so that's

[0:02:41] Trustee Graham: a different that's a chain and i have heard from community members that they are concerned that the

[0:02:49] Trustee Graham: public hearing and the community information meeting that precedes the public hearing

[0:02:52] Trustee Graham: is going to happen without as much community information and awareness and involvement as

[0:02:59] Trustee Graham: we would normally have so i'm wondering if we should perhaps and i hate to say this word but

[0:03:06] to postpone until

[0:03:07] Trustee Graham: the time that we know that we can properly disperse information and, you know, make sure that the people that I know want to comment are here. That's my suggestion.

[0:03:22] Trustee Borthwick: Yeah, I have similar concerns. I know it's really important that we have, we're going to do a community information meeting, the community need to have adequate notice and have a chance to be there and speak to it.

[0:03:33] Trustee Borthwick: So I'm very happy to postpone it.

[0:03:35] Trustee Borthwick: I mean, obviously, we want to keep things moving,

[0:03:37] Trustee Borthwick: but this is extraordinary circumstances, and it's important.

[0:03:43] Trustee Borthwick: So I have no problem with that at all.

[0:03:46] Trustee Borthwick: I know it may be frustrating in terms of staff that we have to prepare for it.

[0:03:51] Voice 9: It is the difficulties of the way that we're constituted

[0:03:55] because we're not allowed to discuss things between meetings as a quorum.

[0:04:00] Voice 9: So sometimes these things come at the last minute,

[0:04:03] Voice 9: and the two independent thoughts sort of have now gelled into a suggestion um does staff have

[0:04:12] Voice 9: comment on this sir i

[0:04:15] Voice 3: think the only comment was just that it would be helpful if the ltc could

[0:04:20] Voice 3: decide a future date and i know we we don't know when the postal strike will be over so perhaps

[0:04:25] Voice 3: maybe that's just going to be done by rwm or if you felt to post on it to the march meeting or

[0:04:33] Voice 3: if we wanted a standalone meeting for the public hearing just a little bit of guidance around that

[0:04:41] Trustee Graham: thank you for that um i i wouldn't i wouldn't be worried to push it to march that gives

[0:04:49] Trustee Graham: us enough time to assume the postal strike will be over

[0:04:53] Trustee Graham: i'm optimistic um and if not we'll certainly know that it's not over and we'll take steps to

[0:05:03] Trustee Graham: try and inform our community in a more thorough way. Christmas is never a good time to

[0:05:08] Trustee Graham: try to get gather people for something as important as this so why don't we and the

[0:05:14] Trustee Graham: RWM that you mentioned is resolution without meeting so we do that electronically we can only

[0:05:18] Trustee Graham: do those meetings for administrative decisions and setting a meeting date as an administrative

[0:05:24] Trustee Graham: decision which we can do so why don't we wait till we've looked at our schedule and then and

[0:05:29] Trustee Graham: then make that decision yeah um

[0:05:31] Voice 9: but do you need for the process if we have a regular schedule

[0:05:36] Voice 9: meeting in march do you need an rdf to put it on the agenda you just need an idea to schedule a

[0:05:42] Voice 9: special meeting right here yeah so so basically with the course of things so we don't have to

[0:05:47] Voice 9: worry about motions no if if the consensus is march then yeah that's what's that's the

[0:05:54] Voice 9: direction of staff. I

[0:05:56] Voice 7: think if you could please make a resolution to postpone the meeting for

[0:06:00] Voice 11: today though. Sorry.

[0:06:04] Trustee Graham: So I'm going to request to postpone the media information meeting and the

[0:06:12] Trustee Graham: public hearing regarding proposed bylaws 248 and 249 until a, I'm not even going to say when,

[0:06:35] I have a flagstone article coming out in January, so I'll take advantage of that.

[0:06:44] Maybe that'll get to Lipscomb, I don't know.

[0:06:45] But we can always I have no other changes to agenda.

[0:06:56] Voice 9: So you're fine with the agenda.

[0:06:59] Voice 9: Yeah.

[0:07:05] Voice 9: Yeah, I have no other other issues with the agenda.

[0:07:09] Voice 9: All right. So instead of going off, the agenda has amended.

[0:07:24] Voice 9: So to the

[0:07:28] Trustee Graham: chair, sorry, I have to declare a conflict of interest with this particular

[0:07:31] Trustee Graham: report.

[0:07:32] Trustee Graham: I happen to live on a piece of property which was affected by the decision, so I'll have

[0:07:36] Trustee Graham: to leave and watch some Temple Ball if somebody would like to come and get me when we're finished.

[0:07:41] Trustee Graham: See you later.

[0:07:51] Voice 11: we

[0:07:52] Voice 9: are at page number four which is thank

[0:07:55] Voice 9: you all right so over

[0:08:01] Voice 3: to you yeah so i will

[0:08:04] Voice 3: provide an overview of the proposed amendment to compose file number 249

[0:08:29] Voice 3: So the main focus of the report is to address the ambiguities in the current land use bylaw

[0:08:34] Voice 3: regarding secondary dwellings.

[0:08:36] Voice 3: currently it's unclear whether secondary dwellings are allowed per lot or per primary dwelling

[0:08:42] Voice 3: staff is recommending adopting a per lot approach for clarity and consistency

[0:08:47] Voice 3: and then this is the inconsistency in the current land use bylaw has come about through the temporary

[0:08:55] Voice 3: use permit removal project so through proposed bylaw number 249 we just want to make sure with

[0:09:01] Voice 3: this amendment that it's really clear what the LTC's direction. So the proposed amendments are

[0:09:07] Voice 3: outlined in the attached bylaw and we're seeking your direction on whether this approach aligns

[0:09:11] Voice 3: with the LTC's vision. Staff are recommending the bylaw to explicitly permit secondary dwelling

[0:09:17] Voice 3: units on a per law basis to provide consistency and ensure that the density remains manageable.

[0:09:23] Voice 3: This approach supports sustainable land use and clarifies how secondary dwelling should be

[0:09:28] Voice 3: permitted. By adopting a per lot approach for secondary dwellings that would avoid the potential

[0:09:35] Voice 3: for unintended increases in density, especially on properties with multiple primary dwellings,

[0:09:41] Voice 3: a per lot rule would help ensure manageable density and avoid uncontrolled increases.

[0:09:47] Voice 3: By limiting the number of accessory dwelling units or secondary dwelling units to one per lot,

[0:09:53] Voice 3: lot, we ensure that the density on each property remains controlled. This avoids the risk of

[0:09:58] Voice 3: overdevelopment, particularly on larger lots, which could also lead to the fragmentation of

[0:10:04] Voice 3: agricultural, forested, or natural spaces. And this issue has come up because on Denman there

[0:10:10] Voice 3: are some properties, it is one property and may have three homes, three dwellings, some six

[0:10:17] Voice 3: Six dwellings, two dwellings.

[0:10:19] Voice 3: So it could be two dwellings on 10 acres.

[0:10:23] Voice 3: It could be six dwellings on 150 acres.

[0:10:27] Voice 3: There's

[0:10:27] Voice 1: not a lot of these properties.

[0:10:30] Voice 3: It was hard to find the number because we don't really have that data.

[0:10:34] Voice 3: But I did get the GIS department to run a number of properties with multiple civic addresses to give you a sense.

[0:10:43] Voice 3: So that doesn't guarantee that, but it gives you a sense there was 14 individual properties

[0:10:51] Voice 3: with more than one civic address, so 14 properties that could potentially be impacted.

[0:10:57] Voice 3: But again, I wouldn't focus too heavily on that number, but just to know that this isn't

[0:11:01] Voice 3: widespread, but there are people that have this.

[0:11:04] Voice 3: So just be really clear on whether a secondary dwelling is permitted per law or per dwelling.

[0:11:11] Voice 9: Excellent.

[0:11:12] Voice 9: So any questions?

[0:11:14] Voice 9: Yes. Am I allowed to make a question or comment on this?

[0:11:18] Voice 9: Well, certainly. You know, we sort of, we're not actually, do we not have a telephone?

[0:11:25] Voice 3: So we had done this agenda a little bit differently because we wanted to address this.

[0:11:31] Voice 9: No, no, no. Normally we ask for people, so absolutely this is appropriate for you.

[0:11:38] Voice 9: Good.

[0:11:40] Trustee Graham: Thank you. Good morning, everyone. I am one of David Grant's neighbors. We live

[0:11:48] Trustee Graham: on a property that you actually mentioned. It's six homes on 150 acres. We have 30 acres

[0:11:58] Trustee Graham: in the R2. And the remaining is in the A category. So we have three homes in the R2 and three

[0:12:18] Trustee Graham: homes in the ALC. It was all approved long ago and it's been that way ever since. So

[0:12:28] Trustee Graham: So my concern is if this proposal goes forward, it means that only one of the three homes

[0:12:40] Trustee Graham: in Yard 2 would be eligible to have a secondary dwelling and it would be in a sense a penalty

[0:12:48] Trustee Graham: for everybody else.

[0:12:50] Trustee Graham: Not that everyone is really interested in doing that, but it does take away the opportunity

[0:12:54] Trustee Graham: for that.

[0:12:56] Trustee Graham: um i understand that

[0:12:58] Voice 7: you're concerned about land use and density but

[0:13:03] Trustee Graham: you know we have three houses

[0:13:05] Trustee Graham: on 30 acres there are other places that may have two houses on eight acres i can see where adding

[0:13:12] an addition you know increasing the percent could have more of an effect but it

[0:13:18] Voice 7: just doesn't feel

[0:13:20] Voice 7: fair that

[0:13:21] Voice 11: birds stuck with only one possible in our R2 as opposed to

[0:13:32] Trustee Graham: potentially three

[0:13:34] Trustee Graham: additional secondary developments. So and I have one of the we are one of those 14 properties

[0:13:40] Trustee Graham: so it's not really gonna I don't foresee it having a time of a type of substantial impact on

[0:13:48] Trustee Graham: on

[0:13:50] Voice 11: any of the areas that you have concerns,

[0:13:54] Voice 11: but that's not for me to decide.

[0:13:59] Voice 11: So I would favor, of course,

[0:14:05] one secondary dwelling per house,

[0:14:08] as opposed to the direct offices

[0:14:09] your staff is proposing.

[0:14:14] Voice 9: Okay, so yeah,

[0:14:19] Trustee Borthwick: I mean, well,

[0:14:20] Trustee Borthwick: so obviously that's more of the exception than the rule,

[0:14:25] Trustee Borthwick: But nevertheless, I think that's part of, I think, what we want.

[0:14:30] Certainly what I would like to see is more for us to be able to show nuance in how we

[0:14:37] do legislation.

[0:14:38] Voice 7: And yes, we are the exception.

[0:14:41] Voice 7: So we're in the case.

[0:14:43] Voice 7: We're following a model that we started in the 90s.

[0:14:47] Voice 7: We don't

[0:14:49] Trustee Graham: fit in the box very well, for sure.

[0:14:53] I'd be interested to hear

[0:14:54] Trustee Borthwick: from staff, if you like, Marlon's maybe has something to weigh in with here.

[0:15:02] Voice 3: Well, sort of, it's kind of goes back to what I described as just different scenarios.

[0:15:07] Voice 3: This is sort of a bit of a one size fits all approach.

[0:15:13] Voice 3: Her law is a little bit more conservative and that's where, you know,

[0:15:19] Voice 3: they have a site specific zone that is a very unique situation yeah um so if we were going to

[0:15:27] Voice 3: yeah we'd probably require a little bit more analysis and to really understand the impact

[0:15:33] Voice 3: of her dwelling approach and like i said it's hard to get yeah information because we don't

[0:15:39] Voice 3: necessarily know exactly how many volumes are on each property and yeah

[0:15:45] Trustee Borthwick: um i wonder what uh

[0:15:49] Trustee Borthwick: legislative remedies we have to you know if we adopt this as a general rule and then have

[0:15:58] Trustee Borthwick: space to to sort of you know have options on in specific cases i actually can't develop those

[0:16:06] Trustee Borthwick: things but is there a way to to frame this amendment in such a way that's supposed for that

[0:16:12] Trustee Borthwick: you know that that's already been to show that we've already considered that this is not a

[0:16:16] Trustee Borthwick: a situation that fits every uh every instance uh and gives us some room to to sort of draft around

[0:16:23] Trustee Borthwick: it well it could dovetail with the housing project if you wanted to take the more conservative

[0:16:30] approach for this

[0:16:31] Voice 3: specific amendment and then with the housing project look more specifically

[0:16:36] into

[0:16:36] Voice 3: some of these site-specific zones and whether they would be suitable that was sort of adding

[0:16:42] Voice 3: They weren't necessarily what I wanted to do, but it could be an opportunity within the housing project to look at different zones and whether they would be suitable for multiple.

[0:16:54] Voice 9: I don't know if Planner Chadwick has.

[0:16:56] Voice 9: I see Planner Chadwick has come on the screen.

[0:16:59] Voice 9: Did you have some insight?

[0:17:00] Voice 9: say?

[0:17:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): My thoughts are that I like what Marlis is suggesting, because there could be an opportunity

[0:17:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): to look at the implications in different zones. So because a lot of the initial thinking has been

[0:17:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): done, it would be something that we can continue to have a look at in the context of the rest of

[0:17:31] Planner Chadwick (probable): of the housing project.

[0:17:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): So if you're feeling like you're not able

[0:17:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): to kind of understand the implications of the project

[0:17:43] Planner Chadwick (probable): of this particular recommendation,

[0:17:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): then yeah, my suggestion would be we can look at it further

[0:17:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): as part of the housing project.

[0:17:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): That would be a fairly straightforward thing to do.

[0:17:57] Voice 9: What would you suggest the road forward?

[0:17:59] Voice 9: Should we do a motion or just take this feedback

[0:18:02] Voice 9: back or what's i would like to seek direction well

[0:18:08] Voice 3: through the chair i wonder uh depending on

[0:18:10] Voice 3: which way you're thinking of going it would be to either potentially adopt the resolution presented

[0:18:16] Voice 3: by staff for this project and amend the proposed bylaw and then when we get to narissa's section

[0:18:24] Voice 3: possibly adding to her work this this idea of looking at secondary dwelling units

[0:18:32] Voice 3: in different site-specific zones,

[0:18:34] Voice 3: do you think that would be a good way forward, Nerissa?

[0:18:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): Yes.

[0:18:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): So what you're suggesting is that they go forward and adopt this,

[0:18:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): the changes be made, and then we look at site-specific zones.

[0:18:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): So that's one option.

[0:18:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): An other option would be that this recommendation be looked at in the context of the housing project overall.

[0:19:08] Planner Chadwick (probable): So you're not making a decision specifically to make those amendments right now, but they're sort of being held to be made as part of the larger project.

[0:19:17] Planner Chadwick (probable): And at that point, we can also look at it sort of more holistically.

[0:19:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): automatically so that's that would be another option though so those are the two options that

[0:19:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): i see i

[0:19:28] Trustee Borthwick: mean what i'm i think i think what i'm hearing uh correct me if i'm wrong but what i

[0:19:32] Trustee Borthwick: think i'm hearing here is that um yes there's room to have some nuance in in how this gets

[0:19:39] Trustee Borthwick: how these rules get drafted and how we're you know what we're what we're going forward with

[0:19:44] Trustee Borthwick: it's just a question of at what point do we do each component of it um and i guess my question

[0:19:51] Trustee Borthwick: here and my concern here is making sure that staff time is used efficiently because we've

[0:19:56] Trustee Borthwick: got lots of stuff that I want to see done with the housing projects and I don't want

[0:20:00] Trustee Borthwick: to run into a place where we're adding hours and hours and hours of work into figuring

[0:20:06] Trustee Borthwick: out things by going one way or the other.

[0:20:08] Trustee Borthwick: So if we adopt this now and say, yes, but we want you to make some special considerations

[0:20:13] later on,

[0:20:14] Trustee Borthwick: is that better than let's leave it for now and consider the whole thing?

[0:20:21] in a new light further on the process.

[0:20:25] I know that we've carved off the TUP process

[0:20:27] Trustee Borthwick: as a separate project.

[0:20:29] Trustee Borthwick: So I don't want to have wasted Marlos's time in working on this separately

[0:20:35] Trustee Borthwick: from the rest of the housing project.

[0:20:37] Trustee Borthwick: But also if that's the more efficient and effective way for us to go forward

[0:20:45] Trustee Borthwick: with this, that feels like the better choice.

[0:20:47] Trustee Borthwick: So whichever is going to more smoothly integrate into the process, I think we know that we want to make some changes to lots of things,

[0:20:57] Trustee Borthwick: making sure that we do those in a way that is going to lead to good legislation and be respectful of the resources that we have to use in doing it.

[0:21:08] Trustee Borthwick: I think that's the way to go. I don't want to create a bunch of double work for you guys that I hate that.

[0:21:14] Trustee Borthwick: that so well

[0:21:17] Voice 9: so what is the smoothest path for chris i'm

[0:21:22] Voice 3: actually wondering if we could have a

[0:21:24] Voice 3: five minute recess because

[0:21:25] Voice 3: some things have shifted today i don't know if you're aware

[0:21:31] Voice 3: but we're not doing the public hearing it's been postponed until potentially march yeah

[0:21:37] Voice 3: so i'm wondering if we if we just had a quick chat um maybe we'll come back with some

[0:21:43] Voice 3: that's a great

[0:21:44] Planner Chadwick (probable): idea marlis let's do that okay

[0:21:48] Voice 9: so we'll take like a 10 minute break

[0:21:49] Voice 9: so marlis

[0:21:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): i'll just expect a call from you yeah okay

[0:34:10] Voice 10: All right, so when we

[0:34:11] Voice 9: convene, I understand that Dr. Chadwick has got some insights for us.

[0:34:18] Voice 1: I'll do my best.

[0:34:21] Voice 1: Yeah, so just

[0:34:23] Planner Chadwick (probable): thinking about things in the context of the timing of the TUP project for ADUs

[0:34:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): and moving that forward potentially till March.

[0:34:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): and I had a look at the project charter for the housing review as well and considering

[0:34:45] Planner Chadwick (probable): um efficiency so when I look at the project and we are we're doing pretty well um on moving through

[0:34:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): things um is March is the is March we sorry one thing is uh there is a is there is there's a

[0:35:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): a meeting in february as well is there well end of

[0:35:05] Trustee Borthwick: january schedule yeah but a proposed meeting

[0:35:09] Trustee Borthwick: in january

[0:35:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): end of okay yeah so what we're hoping for with the um so in terms of timing looking at

[0:35:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): the um the project charter for the major project we should be looking at by about so there's a

[0:35:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): there's a couple of things at play here there's the suitable land analysis which because of um

[0:35:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): we've had some challenges with our uh i.t department uh staffing uh challenges but

[0:35:39] Planner Chadwick (probable): we've brought a consultant on to help finish that project for us and we should be able to share that

[0:35:44] Planner Chadwick (probable): in january to inform the phase three of the the amendments for um for the the housing project

[0:35:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): We are waiting on the Comox. They'll be providing us with sort of a formal record of their interests in April. And so with all that to say, we are still on schedule for the major project.

[0:36:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): And if we're moving the TUP into March, then it would make sense to wrap it in together because we could be looking at April May as having the draft bylaws for the whole project together.

[0:36:31] Planner Chadwick (probable): So that would increase some efficiency there.

[0:36:33] Planner Chadwick (probable): there. The initial intent in moving forward with the removal of the TUPs for ADUs was

[0:36:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): that we wanted to move the item that was of large significance to the community as fast

[0:36:52] Planner Chadwick (probable): as possible. And so that's what we've done. But now if we move it, if we're moving it

[0:36:57] Planner Chadwick (probable): now into spring, it almost makes sense to wrap that in as well as this other piece and

[0:37:05] Planner Chadwick (probable): bring it all together as one package.

[0:37:08] Planner Chadwick (probable): So that's sort of where our thinking is at.

[0:37:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): And I think some of this timing could also, like there are still some elements to be,

[0:37:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): that could influence the timing, again, the suitable land analysis, having that available

[0:37:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): and being able to use that in the analysis and the Comox's input.

[0:37:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): And so I think we could be flexible when we come into the spring around, again,

[0:37:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): whether we move elements forward ahead of the major project.

[0:37:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): I think there'll be a critical decision point for us in about February, March,

[0:37:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): March is that we could be making that decision around sort of the end of February I think we'll

[0:37:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): be in a good place to make make a decision around whether we will have a clearer sense of whether

[0:37:59] Planner Chadwick (probable): it makes sense to wrap it in so at this point in time I would say that we my recommendation

[0:38:05] Planner Chadwick (probable): our recommendation Marlis and I would be to to hold back on on what's been put forward for you

[0:38:13] Planner Chadwick (probable): now um given the anomalies that have been discussed um and some of the strategies that

[0:38:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): could actually be incorporated into the larger project um um to hold off on this and wrap this

[0:38:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): one into the major project and then again when we come up on spring we it may be realistic to

[0:38:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): wrap everything together okay

[0:38:35] Voice 9: my one question would be is that can it be wrapped together in

[0:38:39] Voice 9: a separate process because obviously we have one trustee who's declaring conflict on this one issue

[0:38:46] who i think would like to participate in the bigger issues um

[0:38:50] Voice 9: of the project so in coming

[0:38:53] Voice 9: when it comes forward to come in two separate streams so if trustee graham has to recuse

[0:38:59] Voice 9: himself he can recuse himself from just that one component rather than if it comes in a great big

[0:39:05] Voice 9: package yeah potentially that's

[0:39:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): totally possible because the way that we've been moving forward

[0:39:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): with um as we did with the um the phase two to a i i'm doing it i'm moving through the similar

[0:39:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): the discussions for the other ones in a similar way where um we have some agreement on um and

[0:39:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): direction provided on each element of the of the um of the bylaw and so that's where the discussion

[0:39:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): can happen where Trustee Graham is

[0:39:37] Planner Chadwick (probable): recused and we can still

[0:39:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): put forward the package together.

[0:39:44] Voice 9: That would be

[0:39:45] Voice 9: great. I think that works well for everybody

[0:39:49] Voice 9: because with all the energy that Trustee Graham's put

[0:39:54] Voice 9: into this project, if we put it into that

[0:39:58] Voice 9: big box and he felt he had to recuse himself from the big box,

[0:40:02] i don't i think that would be

[0:40:04] Voice 9: very disappointing to both himself and the community so that would

[0:40:08] Voice 9: be

[0:40:09] Trustee Borthwick: great if we can i understand he can recuse himself vote by votes so if there's a particular

[0:40:14] Trustee Borthwick: motion he can't vote on that's that's a separate thing that i don't think that would affect the

[0:40:18] Trustee Borthwick: rest of the the adjustments that are going to have to happen

[0:40:21] Voice 9: yeah yeah we have that consideration in

[0:40:25] Voice 9: mind so that's taken care of so do you require the motions to move forward or i

[0:40:33] Voice 3: don't think so

[0:40:34] Voice 3: So no, because if you're not going to be passing the motion as staff, if you would like to

[0:40:42] Voice 3: just look at this as a part of the larger public project.

[0:40:48] Trustee Borthwick: I mean, we have carved this off into a minor project.

[0:40:51] Trustee Borthwick: That's the only issue.

[0:40:52] Trustee Borthwick: So there's the funding question that I think, because there's a significant question of

[0:40:57] Trustee Borthwick: how this is organized and arranged, I would think that it makes sense for us to at least

[0:41:03] Trustee Borthwick: of a motion so that doesn't fall off i know you guys obviously are not going to forget it but just

[0:41:08] Trustee Borthwick: in terms of like good process to me it seems like we probably ought to make a motion to defer for

[0:41:15] Trustee Borthwick: now um is that

[0:41:17] Voice 9: it's

[0:41:19] Trustee Borthwick: as

[0:41:20] Voice 9: long as the planner's not here yeah there's

[0:41:23] Trustee Borthwick: no harm feels like that might

[0:41:26] Trustee Borthwick: be a thing well just that i don't want to i don't want to get caught off guard because we have

[0:41:30] Trustee Borthwick: separated 727 right if you're just getting a component done sooner of the housing project

[0:41:34] Trustee Borthwick: could be a different question but because this is become separate so what's the wording that

[0:41:39] Trustee Borthwick: would be appropriate for you this um

[0:41:43] Voice 11: see things because this

[0:41:54] Trustee Borthwick: is these are amendments to 249 and

[0:41:58] Trustee Borthwick: Yeah, the amendments to 2.9, if I'm right.

[0:42:04] Voice 11: Yes.

[0:42:04] Voice 11: Yeah.

[0:42:06] Voice 11: So

[0:42:11] Trustee Borthwick: I move that the Demo and Local Trust Committee

[0:42:17] Trustee Borthwick: request staff to return the considerations

[0:42:27] Trustee Borthwick: of the Demo and Local Trust Committee's

[0:42:31] Trustee Borthwick: permit review project and amendments

[0:42:34] Trustee Borthwick: to Biolog 249

[0:42:39] Voice 11: to at a later meeting

[0:42:44] Voice 11: following considerations

[0:42:55] Voice 11: timeline.

[0:42:56] Voice 11: I don't know if Lisa got that.

[0:43:02] Voice 11: I

[0:43:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): think that more or less captures it.

[0:43:05] Planner Chadwick (probable): The one thing I will also add that actually

[0:43:07] Planner Chadwick (probable): I think supports this direction is

[0:43:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): that we received

[0:43:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): a note from the Comox

[0:43:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): um just yesterday um their their feedback um their referral feedback um indicated that they

[0:43:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): are waiting for the suitable land analysis before they feel that they could adequately

[0:43:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): provide um uh their their review so yeah that's that that's also an additional piece that sort

[0:43:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): of supports this direction i

[0:43:42] Trustee Borthwick: just want to check that uh lisa has has the motion yes trustee

[0:43:50] Voice 4: yeah thank

[0:43:52] Trustee Borthwick: you uh

[0:43:54] Voice 4: that the denman island local trust committee requests staff to return

[0:43:57] Voice 4: the consideration of denman island temporary use permit release review project and amendments to

[0:44:04] Voice 4: bylaw 249 to a later meeting following considerations of the broader housing project

[0:44:09] Voice 4: project timelines.

[0:44:12] Trustee Borthwick: It's clunky as hell, but it'll do.

[0:44:16] Voice 9: I will second that motion.

[0:44:18] Voice 9: All right.

[0:44:18] Voice 9: Is there further discussion?

[0:44:20] Voice 9: We'll call the question.

[0:44:21] Voice 9: All in favor?

[0:44:21] Voice 9: That carries.

[0:44:23] Voice 9: Thank you very much.

[0:44:24] Voice 9: Do you want

[0:44:25] Voice 10: David back in?

[0:44:26] Voice 9: Well, not really.

[0:44:30] Voice 9: I want David back in here.

[0:44:32] Voice 9: This is recording, too, so he's going to hear that comment.

[0:44:35] Voice 9: Yeah.

[0:44:37] Voice 9: All right.

[0:44:38] Voice 9: So we'll just wait for Trustee Brangham to respond.

[0:44:40] Voice 9: Do you want to rejoin us?

[0:44:50] Voice 11: All right.

[0:44:55] Voice 9: So just to summarize, what we've done is deferred it to the future and into the housing project.

[0:45:02] Voice 9: So in a separate format.

[0:45:04] Voice 9: So, well, was I correct in that statement?

[0:45:09] Voice 1: Sorry, I didn't hear you.

[0:45:11] Voice 9: Okay, that's good.

[0:45:13] Voice 9: So we're just telling you.

[0:45:15] Voice 1: Did it have to do with the pickleball score?

[0:45:18] Voice 9: They

[0:45:18] Trustee Graham: were doing Tai Chi.

[0:45:22] Voice 9: So it's just informing Trustee Graham that it's decided to defer it

[0:45:26] Voice 9: and wrapped into the Greater Housing Project as a separate element.

[0:45:32] Voice 9: All right.

[0:45:34] Voice 9: So moving forward, we are not having a community information meeting.

[0:45:39] Voice 9: We're not having a public hearing.

[0:45:43] Voice 9: So going forward, we have trustee reports.

[0:45:46] Voice 9: Right now.

[0:45:46] Voice 9: which

[0:45:50] who wants to point you in a way

[0:45:51] you could

[0:45:52] well I did

[0:45:56] we had our

[0:45:58] quarterly meeting of trust council

[0:46:00] Trustee Graham: in December

[0:46:01] Trustee Graham: a sub-Victoria meeting and I wasn't

[0:46:04] Trustee Graham: feeling up to it physically so I

[0:46:05] Trustee Graham: attended by Zoom

[0:46:08] Trustee Graham: and I always miss

[0:46:09] Trustee Graham: hanging out with my fellow trustees

[0:46:12] Trustee Graham: and staff that's always a good time

[0:46:15] Trustee Graham: and it was a

[0:46:16] Trustee Graham: fairly productive meeting I think

[0:46:17] Trustee Graham: I got a chance to meet our new CAO, Ruben.

[0:46:21] Trustee Graham: I can't remember his last name.

[0:46:25] Trustee Graham: So hopefully he enjoyed the meeting

[0:46:27] Trustee Graham: and got a taste of the flavor of Trust Council

[0:46:30] and met all of you and had chats with them.

[0:46:33] And who knows what the pitch will bring.

[0:46:35] As far as Demna, we continue to wait for funding

[0:46:40] for

[0:46:41] Trustee Graham: our affordable housing project, Demna Green.

[0:46:43] Trustee Graham: I think they got turned down again.

[0:46:44] Trustee Graham: That's unfortunate.

[0:46:45] Trustee Graham: origin. And other than that, it's been quiet from my perspective. Yeah, thank you.

[0:46:55] Yeah,

[0:46:56] Trustee Borthwick: I mean, Devon is anything but quiet from my perspective, but I have lots of hats at the moment.

[0:47:03] Trustee Borthwick: Yeah, it was really good to meet our new CAO. I managed to have a short chat with him a couple

[0:47:10] Trustee Borthwick: a couple of times throughout the meeting and then yeah,

[0:47:13] Trustee Borthwick: harmed by the direction that he's taking on things.

[0:47:16] Trustee Borthwick: And I'm glad that our director of financial planning

[0:47:22] Trustee Borthwick: will have hopefully a few fewer rocks to carry

[0:47:27] Trustee Borthwick: in that not too distant future.

[0:47:29] Trustee Borthwick: She's done a really wonderful job as our interim CAO.

[0:47:33] Trustee Borthwick: Last month, I got to go to all sorts of things,

[0:47:37] Trustee Borthwick: um but sort of chief among them in terms of islands trust stuff i was at a meeting

[0:47:42] Trustee Borthwick: where i was at the the semi-annual meeting of the bane sound marine ecosystem forum

[0:47:49] Trustee Borthwick: um and the main topic of discussion was dwrs uh deep water recoveries shipwrecking exercises

[0:47:57] Trustee Borthwick: and made sound which are pretty horrific um and definitely something that i

[0:48:04] Trustee Borthwick: I would like to sort of address at some point, probably through this LTCC, I'd like to, you know, maybe explore ways for us to sort of weigh in on that a little bit.

[0:48:15] Trustee Borthwick: Not least as a component of reconciliation, because both Qualicum, our Flamman and Comox nations were physically represented, but we also have Qualicum chief on that steering committee.

[0:48:28] Trustee Borthwick: he was not able to attempt but there's a strong uh interest in the wellness of the sound from

[0:48:34] Trustee Borthwick: the first nations perspective and supporting uh supporting their opposition to that is an

[0:48:39] Trustee Borthwick: important part of like co-stewarding these lands and waters uh three days after i went to that

[0:48:48] Trustee Borthwick: meeting i went to uh government government meeting with comox first nations the third one they've

[0:48:53] Trustee Borthwick: held, the first one being, I think, in 2011. And yeah, lots of really good people from all around

[0:49:03] Trustee Borthwick: the valley there, probably about 100 or so staff and elected persons in response to that, including

[0:49:11] Trustee Borthwick: people from the Department of National Defense, the RCMP, CVRD, Strathcona Regional District.

[0:49:19] Trustee Borthwick: we had some folks from

[0:49:21] Trustee Borthwick: Powell River, we had people from Sayward

[0:49:25] Trustee Borthwick: yeah

[0:49:25] Trustee Borthwick: lots of different levels

[0:49:27] Trustee Borthwick: towns of Cumberland

[0:49:29] Trustee Borthwick: village of Cumberland, town according

[0:49:31] Trustee Borthwick: to Comox

[0:49:32] Trustee Borthwick: lots of really good people, really nice to sort of get

[0:49:35] Trustee Borthwick: an overview of their process and their structure

[0:49:38] Trustee Borthwick: and get to

[0:49:40] Trustee Borthwick: speak with them

[0:49:41] Trustee Borthwick: about what's coming on the road forward

[0:49:43] Trustee Borthwick: and get

[0:49:44] Trustee Borthwick: some more

[0:49:47] Trustee Borthwick: context on some cool history

[0:49:48] Trustee Borthwick: and sad history

[0:49:51] Trustee Borthwick: but also some really interesting and wonderful

[0:49:53] Trustee Borthwick: stuff too

[0:49:55] Trustee Borthwick: and yeah I'm going to be looking for ways

[0:49:57] Trustee Borthwick: to

[0:49:59] Trustee Borthwick: propagate that experience and sort of share

[0:50:01] Trustee Borthwick: those things

[0:50:03] Trustee Borthwick: with the community here because I think it's

[0:50:05] Trustee Borthwick: they're valuable opportunities

[0:50:07] Trustee Borthwick: to sort of understand

[0:50:08] Trustee Borthwick: the history and culture of the land

[0:50:11] Trustee Borthwick: on which we live currently

[0:50:13] Trustee Borthwick: and be in partnership with

[0:50:15] Trustee Borthwick: people who live there work so it was it was a huge honor i was really glad to do it there's lots of

[0:50:19] Trustee Borthwick: work to do um and i'm glad to be doing it thank you thank you all right well my ending is i'm

[0:50:30] plow along with the um welcome to

[0:50:32] Voice 9: ceo brony to alice trust um he's certainly today his he only

[0:50:40] Voice 9: started at the end of november so he's only two weeks a week and a half yeah two weeks maybe

[0:50:45] Voice 9: yeah probably two weeks and um he really has been quite enlightening um he's he brings a lot of

[0:50:54] Voice 9: perspective to the trust um he's enthusiastic he's i think he's going to make a lot of positive

[0:51:03] Voice 9: change for the organization um so um i will join you and welcome to the trust um and there's an

[0:51:10] Voice 9: all staff meeting tomorrow um or those trust staff members who haven't had an opportunity to meet him

[0:51:17] Voice 9: yet we'll get that opportunity as we did last week at trust council um i hope we'll be just as

[0:51:23] Voice 9: impressed as we are so that is that is wonderful um the trust policy statement um is uh meandering

[0:51:31] Voice 9: forward we have another meeting on thursday of the committee of the whole to discuss it

[0:51:36] Voice 9: um there's a stated goal um to get this over the finish line as soon as possible

[0:51:43] Voice 9: um respecting that we have a process um the feeling is it would be nice to go to first reading

[0:51:51] Voice 9: um in june it would have been nice to in march but june seems to be the goal to go to first reading

[0:51:58] Voice 9: and first reading is not it is the beginning of the end it's not the end um that is putting it

[0:52:05] Voice 9: out saying okay we're comfortable with the document putting it out for further feedback

[0:52:11] Voice 9: from the public and the first nations um and whatever necessary changes will be made i i will

[0:52:21] Voice 9: my commentary has been the last draft the press policy statement a couple of years ago

[0:52:27] Voice 9: i couldn't go anywhere for months without people sort of pigeonholing me going this is wrong this

[0:52:36] Voice 9: This is bad.

[0:52:36] Voice 9: This is like a lot of negativity and a lot of public commentary.

[0:52:42] Voice 9: This latest iteration, which has been out, I think, since May,

[0:52:46] Voice 9: I haven't had one person make one comment,

[0:52:50] Voice 9: which says to me that we got the feedback from the last draft

[0:52:54] Voice 9: and we've incorporated enough into the new draft

[0:52:59] Voice 9: that people are comfortable with it now.

[0:53:00] Voice 9: So we've gone from the point of discomfort to somewhat comfort,

[0:53:04] Voice 9: for which is why it would be nice to get it to first reading so that we can get it to the point

[0:53:11] Voice 9: where you know hopefully can be adopted it's never going to be 100 these documents never are but you

[0:53:17] Voice 9: know if we can get it to the point where we're 90 95 and get it done it will help us as an

[0:53:25] Voice 9: organization it will take a tremendous workload off of staff financially the implications like

[0:53:32] Voice 9: um ec took the budget oh my goodness i can't remember how high it was it was sort of

[0:53:38] in the over

[0:53:39] Voice 9: 100 000 reach down to 20 000 trust council that's now bumping up a little bit more

[0:53:45] Voice 9: for communications yeah but we've sent the message we want to get it finished uh we didn't

[0:53:51] Voice 9: want the two-year consultation so and that is in a respectful manner because as i said because we

[0:53:57] Voice 9: haven't had feedback. I think we've achieved our goals. So that's for that sitting. So

[0:54:04] if I get my

[0:54:05] Voice 9: new modem, I will be chairing that meeting on Thursday night. If not,

[0:54:10] Voice 9: I don't know what I'm going to be doing. So I may have to take the trip over to Victoria

[0:54:15] Voice 9: to chair the meeting. I think it's just we've been busy. There's been a lot going on.

[0:54:24] Voice 9: it's a matter of sort of keeping on the balls and they are certainly appreciate all the staff

[0:54:29] Voice 9: support that we get um because you know we spend five minutes in a meeting making a suggestion

[0:54:38] Voice 9: and it means five weeks of work for staff and you know is we i think that we need to respect that

[0:54:46] Voice 9: we need to honor that and you know and that's why we took you weren't here just you graham but

[0:54:52] We took an eminent break

[0:54:55] Voice 9: during this last discussion to allow staff to sort of discuss what is the best step forward.

[0:55:00] Voice 9: So rather than dictating, we got the feedback, okay, this is a path we should take, and that's the path that we will take.

[0:55:07] Voice 9: So we're all in this together.

[0:55:08] Voice 9: We all work together.

[0:55:09] Voice 9: We work together well, which is very much appreciated.

[0:55:12] Voice 9: And we achieve things.

[0:55:15] Voice 9: So now that I've waved the flag and said, rah, rah, we're doing a good job, we will move on.

[0:55:23] Voice 9: So we don't have the electoral director with us today.

[0:55:27] So now we have merged out at a point where we have public comments.

[0:55:32] So if any member of the public wants

[0:55:35] Voice 9: to make a comment or a statement or anything, this is your opportunity.

[0:55:41] Voice 7: Sure. I'll just to reaffirm, portal housing is an emergency here.

[0:55:49] Voice 7: or we need safe housing for many people as soon as possible so i hope you treat the project with

[0:55:58] Voice 7: the urgency you deserve thank you very much i

[0:56:01] Voice 9: believe the local trust committee is on a parallel

[0:56:06] Voice 9: path with you is like to get this done as soon as possible this is what we want thank you all right

[0:56:18] Voice 9: so we flip over the page and we have local crest beginning minutes dated october 8th 2024.

[0:56:27] Voice 9: um if there's nothing to add to that we can adopt those by consent

[0:56:34] Voice 9: we have a resolution that we report to december 3rd for receipt um we don't have any

[0:56:48] Voice 9: advisory planning commission meeting minutes so we move down to the follow-up action list

[0:56:54] Voice 9: which takes 20. just just to say excellent

[0:56:57] Trustee Graham: excellent minutes appreciate your uh care and

[0:57:00] Trustee Graham: attention and yeah

[0:57:02] Voice 5: very very good thank you

[0:57:03] Voice 9: it's the caliber and minutes are excellent

[0:57:07] Voice 9: very much appreciated so we move on the involved action list uh december 3rd um or you

[0:57:17] Voice 9: I

[0:57:18] Voice 3: don't have anything to add, but if there's any questions, I'd be glad to take those.

[0:57:23] Voice 9: Anybody have any questions or concerns or conditions or relations or?

[0:57:27] Trustee Borthwick: Yeah, I mean, I think my, I think Planner Chadwick has already sort of answered the

[0:57:32] Trustee Borthwick: question that I had to come up from this, but yeah, item eight under the

[0:57:40] housing

[0:57:40] Trustee Borthwick: project is to schedule a meeting about the following receipt of the October report from

[0:57:47] Trustee Borthwick: h apc uh what's up i was looking at uh i don't know this is this is the suitable analysis

[0:57:59] Trustee Borthwick: it is the page break uh it's grouping up a little bit here um so yeah suitable analysis

[0:58:12] obviously we've been waiting for a while to get that report um and yeah sounds like they're you

[0:58:19] know staffing issues that

[0:58:20] Trustee Borthwick: have held that stuff up um i have to say there's a little frustration for

[0:58:25] Trustee Borthwick: me in terms of uh you know this is something that was highlighted many times by the ehpc as being

[0:58:32] Trustee Borthwick: something that they were concerned about now there's lots of reasons for that and i i understand

[0:58:37] Trustee Borthwick: the you know i've heard the arguments many times about the value that this has down the line um

[0:58:44] Um,

[0:58:44] Trustee Borthwick: and if this is holding up the project and if certainly if like currently I'm hearing

[0:58:49] Trustee Borthwick: that, uh, the Comox, you know, are waiting to see that super land analysis before they

[0:58:54] Trustee Borthwick: want to weigh in on things.

[0:58:56] Trustee Borthwick: And if that's pushing us back to April, you know, the, like, I understand its value as

[0:59:03] Trustee Borthwick: a planning tool.

[0:59:04] Trustee Borthwick: And also if it's, you know, there is a real danger at this point that we don't see conclusion

[0:59:09] of this by the end of term.

[0:59:11] and uh yeah

[0:59:15] Trustee Borthwick: i have some concerns about that um this this and i think i understand that

[0:59:21] Trustee Borthwick: i understand the comments i understand that they did the pushback to that but i just want to sort

[0:59:27] Trustee Borthwick: of express that a little bit um and and yeah i mean in terms of like when are we actually so i

[0:59:36] Trustee Borthwick: So, I mean, Planner Chadwick, you're talking about hopefully seeing draft bylaws towards the end of spring, early summer was sort of, I think, I can't remember exactly when you said that, but I remember that being vaguely a sort of thing in terms of the conversation around the TMP review.

[1:00:00] Trustee Borthwick: When are we going to, and obviously I know this is a huge thing, I know there's been staffing issues, this is why I want to make sure that this goes forward in a way that's sufficient and is respectfully used in your time.

[1:00:11] Trustee Borthwick: I know we only get so much of it, and I understand when it is, and you're very valuable in lots of places, and we're very glad to have you.

[1:00:19] Trustee Borthwick: And also, you know, it would be good for us, I think, to get a sense of what we are looking at in terms of timelines and what are the things that are holding us back from those things.

[1:00:32] Trustee Borthwick: Yeah, that's my sort of, my impressions from that, like I say, some of that's going to be addressed, but.

[1:00:42] Voice 1: Did you want a response there, Sam?

[1:00:45] Trustee Borthwick: I'm sure if you want to.

[1:00:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): So we have been working consistently on this project.

[1:00:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): It's very complex.

[1:01:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): um and it requires a lot of time and effort and we have been putting that in we would not be able

[1:01:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): to be moving any faster than we are now even if we had the suitable land analysis right now

[1:01:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): um as i'll be explaining a little bit further um when we get into the report um the suitable

[1:01:17] Planner Chadwick (probable): analysis land analysis is really about um providing that information that allows us to

[1:01:23] Planner Chadwick (probable): understand impact um of of increasing density um it's an that is a particular interest of the

[1:01:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): comox and without the suitable land analysis they i mean they've hired their own biologist

[1:01:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): to start to explore this without us doing our work uh we may be waiting longer for them to do

[1:01:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): their work so in that respect it's actually um it's actually much more uh creating more efficiency

[1:01:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): all around um and also um um i mean we're just waiting right now uh for we have all the data

[1:01:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): together we're just waiting for uh the front-facing um interface to be created so that it can actually

[1:02:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): be effectively understood by the public um and so if it happens that we don't get there we can

[1:02:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): can still use the data it's just going to be not as easy to use so um um we're doing our best that's

[1:02:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): and and

[1:02:21] Voice 1: and it isn't

[1:02:21] Planner Chadwick (probable): and i'll also just point out again the the critical importance of using this

[1:02:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): type of analysis is that ultimately you you don't like that the um salt spring island ltc ran into

[1:02:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): challenges with first nations because they did not indicate that they had used there was any

[1:02:40] Planner Chadwick (probable): analysis used in in um in supporting um uh accessory dwelling unit an increase everywhere

[1:02:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): so um again they have not been able to move with that at all at this point so it's been a couple

[1:02:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): of years so in this case i do anticipate that you are going to have your bylaws by the end of term

[1:03:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): like we're working hard to do that marlis and i will be working together to to do our best

[1:03:07] Trustee Borthwick: yeah

[1:03:08] Trustee Borthwick: Yeah, no, and to be really clear, at no point do I want to disparage the work that you guys

[1:03:12] Trustee Borthwick: are doing, and even give the appearance of that, I have no question, I know who I'm talking

[1:03:19] Trustee Borthwick: to, and I really, you have my complete confidence and respect, and it's just, I also, I have

[1:03:29] Trustee Borthwick: to be there on the receiving end of the external perception too, and so this is part of what

[1:03:35] Trustee Borthwick: what I feel is my, my role is to sort of feed them back to you,

[1:03:39] Trustee Borthwick: just, just as a awareness piece. And again,

[1:03:42] Trustee Borthwick: I know you guys know a lot of this stuff too, but this is my part of that,

[1:03:47] Trustee Borthwick: that role is, is being part of that communication process as I see it.

[1:03:51] Trustee Borthwick: But no, I, I, and I appreciate your feedback and I, that's,

[1:03:54] Trustee Borthwick: that's what I want to hear. You know, I want to,

[1:03:56] Trustee Borthwick: I want to know what the realities are on the ground.

[1:03:58] Trustee Borthwick: And I'm glad that this is creating efficiencies for us. You know,

[1:04:03] Trustee Borthwick: know for many many reasons i don't want this to become salt spring uh but um but yeah no really

[1:04:11] Trustee Borthwick: for the work and that's fine uh and just just gotta it's if it's if it's something that was

[1:04:18] Trustee Borthwick: it was stopping us from moving forward on other parts of it and getting into those analysis of

[1:04:23] Trustee Borthwick: future amendments to the bylaws that would be if it was completely precluding that work

[1:04:28] Trustee Borthwick: that I would feel like we have a serious problem.

[1:04:31] Trustee Borthwick: If it's not, fantastic, great.

[1:04:33] Planner Chadwick (probable): Yeah, and I would add as staff,

[1:04:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): we're trying to be as strategic as possible

[1:04:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): with the use of our time and moving forward

[1:04:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): with the TEP amendment project,

[1:04:44] Planner Chadwick (probable): that was all about having very focused, concentrated time

[1:04:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): on a really important thing.

[1:04:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): So we're doing our best to be as strategic

[1:04:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): and efficient with our time as we can,

[1:04:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): while balancing the work for Denman

[1:04:56] Planner Chadwick (probable): with the work for other other uh ltcs totally

[1:05:00] Trustee Borthwick: and i i really appreciate it i think all of us do

[1:05:04] Trustee Borthwick: uh in this ltc so

[1:05:06] Voice 11: yeah um yeah i think that's all mine okay and you're happy i'm happy all

[1:05:18] Voice 11: right so we'll move

[1:05:20] Voice 9: on um we're supposed to be great yet uh locations so applications referrals

[1:05:32] Voice 9: PL, I hate this new

[1:05:34] Voice 9: non-reg system. I really do.

[1:05:36] Voice 9: It needs commas

[1:05:38] Voice 9: or brackets or something.

[1:05:41] Voice 9: PL, PL

[1:05:42] Voice 9: RZ 2024

[1:05:45] Voice 9: 0055

[1:05:45] Voice 9: Denman Conservancy Plenary Staff Report.

[1:05:49] Voice 3: So we're ahead

[1:05:51] Voice 3: of schedule, so the applicants aren't here.

[1:05:54] Voice 9: Sure.

[1:05:55] Voice 9: Are you expecting the applicants?

[1:05:56] Voice 3: I let them know the approximate time,

[1:05:59] Voice 3: but I do always have the caveat that the agenda

[1:06:01] Voice 3: gets moved around.

[1:06:03] Voice 3: schedule so i so

[1:06:05] Voice 9: we're anticipating them to be here at 12 30.

[1:06:07] Voice 3: they didn't confirm

[1:06:08] Voice 3: yes or no but i just

[1:06:10] Voice 9: encourage

[1:06:11] Voice 3: applicants to be here

[1:06:13] Voice 9: um so not understanding this is a straightforward decision it is to me yeah seems pretty simple

[1:06:21] Trustee Graham: um yeah so we're comfortable proceeding without the advocate i think they would be thrilled to

[1:06:27] Trustee Graham: to hear our decision if it goes the way it's suggested to by the staff, which is what they

[1:06:34] Trustee Graham: want.

[1:06:34] Trustee Graham: I'm sorry.

[1:06:35] Voice 9: It's your choice.

[1:06:35] Voice 9: It's basically LTC's choice.

[1:06:37] Trustee Borthwick: We can defer.

[1:06:38] Trustee Borthwick: I wonder if we would.

[1:06:39] Trustee Borthwick: And the only reason I wonder is if we've got other business that doesn't involve them that

[1:06:45] Trustee Borthwick: we can get to and give them a better chance of seeing things.

[1:06:49] Trustee Borthwick: We could do that.

[1:06:50] Trustee Borthwick: I don't think that, I don't want to pull up a meeting on this thing either, but I think

[1:06:55] Trustee Borthwick: if that's a good idea.

[1:06:57] Trustee Borthwick: if we've got other stuff we can do and knock that off and then you know maybe they'll be here maybe

[1:07:02] Trustee Borthwick: they won't all

[1:07:02] Voice 9: right so so we'll defer this till the 12 30 until later in the agenda until we run

[1:07:10] Voice 9: out of other stuff to do yeah well we have a scheduled break from 12 to 12 30 which is an

[1:07:16] Voice 9: hour away so you think we're going to be able to get to the agenda there's not a lot there's not a

[1:07:24] Voice 9: a

[1:07:24] Trustee Borthwick: bunch of we were we

[1:07:25] Trustee Borthwick: had a lot of us we were going to do today

[1:07:27] Voice 10: so

[1:07:29] Voice 9: okay so let's just move

[1:07:31] Voice 9: this down to the bottom we'll go through everything and then we'll deal with it last on

[1:07:35] Voice 9: the agenda as long as everyone remembers to do that because i've actually been in a meeting where

[1:07:39] Voice 9: we did that we forgot i was not sharing by the way but i was also did not remember so we actually

[1:07:46] Voice 9: adjourned and went home and then it was like crap so we didn't do the most important thing

[1:07:51] Voice 9: Oh dear, we're still here, so we were trying to be accommodating, it didn't actually work out very well at all.

[1:07:57] Voice 9: So we'll move on to section 13, page 51, minor project, housing related temporary use pilot project review, post public care.

[1:08:06] Voice 9: Can't do that.

[1:08:09] Voice 9: I really tried.

[1:08:12] Voice 9: I apologize.

[1:08:14] Voice 9: So 13.2, major project, Denman housing review project update staff report.

[1:08:20] Voice 9: report. Are we over with Tyner Chadwick on this one?

[1:08:23] Voice 9: That works for her. It's earlier than what she was expecting.

[1:08:26] Voice 9: There she is.

[1:08:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): Oh, this is great. Get it over with before lunch.

[1:08:35] Voice 9: All right, Tyner Chadwick, over to you.

[1:08:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): Okay. Yeah. So this is the continuation of

[1:08:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): our project here. And there's some decisions for LTC to make that'll

[1:08:45] Planner Chadwick (probable): help support staff in moving

[1:08:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): moving forward. I've provided a little overview of where we were last time, and so there's

[1:09:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): still work that's being done on the decisions that were made with Phase 2a, and as I've

[1:09:08] Planner Chadwick (probable): indicated and we talked about before, we've created three different phases here for the

[1:09:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): project just to make make it easier to focus on um on on of on the the the easier ones first

[1:09:25] Planner Chadwick (probable): just the things requiring lub um amendments and then also circling back to our conversation about

[1:09:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): the the tup um you know the l the uh the actually there was there was ocp amendments there too sorry

[1:09:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): it wasn't just land use bylaw but the idea is that we could potentially move forward just the

[1:09:45] Planner Chadwick (probable): the land use bylaw so phase 2a amendments if if it makes sense to move them forward ahead and again

[1:09:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): when we come into spring we'll have a better sense because we'll um um we'll have a sense of of of

[1:09:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): whether we we've been able to have a look at that suitable land analysis and whether we can move

[1:10:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): forward with with um everything or uh in good time um so i did provide you with a uh an update

[1:10:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): on where things are at with the um the actions that we looked at last time and i will also just

[1:10:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): remind everyone that um these actions are all coming off of the um the denman island housing

[1:10:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): action plan implementation table which uh which has been i very very useful uh in being able to

[1:10:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): just sort of track the work on this um and i can bring that back for you at any time to you know

[1:10:40] Planner Chadwick (probable): I'll show you where the ticks are and such, but I've laid it out in terms of each phase here.

[1:10:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): So in terms of phase 2A, a number of decisions were made.

[1:10:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): Some direction was provided by the LTC, and it's all summarized in the chart there on the second page of the report.

[1:11:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): Are there any questions related to phase 2A before I sort of dig down into the phase 2B actions?

[1:11:11] Trustee Graham: HAB-Jacques Juilland- No, thank you.

[1:11:13] Trustee Graham: HAB-Jacques Juilland- Looking at number seven expand secondary sweet permissions and water services area. Just a question.

[1:11:23] Trustee Graham: And I'm starting to think about another minor project, I'm kind of assuming that the work on the previous minor project is now kind of like there's a gap until we have the community information meeting and the public hearing.

[1:11:39] Trustee Graham: is it fair to start another minor project without the actual conclusion of the original minor

[1:11:49] Trustee Graham: project and if it's possible to direct our local planner to a second minor project i'm wondering if

[1:11:57] Trustee Graham: the number seven would be an ideal project to take on and i don't want to make that decision

[1:12:06] Trustee Graham: I actually would probably ask staff to review the projects and come back to the local trust

[1:12:12] Trustee Graham: committee with their recommendation as to what the next minor project could be, but

[1:12:17] just a deep understanding of what that project is, that seems to me like it might be one

[1:12:23] to come off your plate, as a traveler can put on my car, but anyway,

[1:12:30] Trustee Graham: that's just a suggestion.

[1:12:31] Trustee Graham: I do have a question on number eight.

[1:12:34] Trustee Graham: You've got there, this is the cisterns required for new bills

[1:12:38] Trustee Graham: and clarity required on cistern-only subsets.

[1:12:41] Trustee Graham: What clarity are you looking for and who are you looking for?

[1:12:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): So that's just connecting with Island Health

[1:12:52] Planner Chadwick (probable): and just getting a good sense of where they're at.

[1:12:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): Things sort of shifted a little.

[1:12:57] Planner Chadwick (probable): We did have a good conversation with them recently

[1:12:59] Planner Chadwick (probable): and there's a few things I just want to follow up with on that.

[1:13:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): So that's really where that's coming.

[1:13:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): This is also,

[1:13:07] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah, it's sort of really doing our best

[1:13:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): to kind of document what our process is so that you know where we're at.

[1:13:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): And just to speak to your proposal there,

[1:13:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): the intention at this point is that Marlis and I

[1:13:23] Planner Chadwick (probable): will work together through these things.

[1:13:25] Planner Chadwick (probable): So I don't think that it's necessary to carve it off, but it could certainly be something that we delegate, you know, Marlis's time.

[1:13:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): Like there are, this project is many, many different projects within one project.

[1:13:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): so um it's where um some additional like so the the value of um of identifying something as a

[1:13:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): minor project is that if it's something that doesn't fall it is slightly outside of the um

[1:13:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): um the purpose and objectives of the existing project um then you sort of put it into the

[1:14:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): the minor project there are projects that are um that um are complementary like uh and one of the

[1:14:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): the projects that um we are interested in bringing up for discussion um to you at some point uh

[1:14:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): at the next ltc meeting hopefully is um or earlier um is the because we're we're working with the the

[1:14:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): The Comox very strongly right now.

[1:14:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): And there's a lot of referral.

[1:14:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): The referral to First Nations in the OCP is fairly outdated.

[1:14:39] Planner Chadwick (probable): So that's something that could also be.

[1:14:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): Again, we can certainly go back and we can provide you with some options for minor projects.

[1:14:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): So that that there, but they would, in the interest of efficiency, they need to be directly connected to the work that we're currently doing. Otherwise, you know, we're really not, we're not spending our time efficiently.

[1:15:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): I, I've found I've been working with, um, with the Island Planner on, um, on, on Gabriola, uh, through their OCP review. And that has been a really, really great experience because we're able to really support each other through the whole thing and go back and forth.

[1:15:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): So I think that that will be the intention moving forward with with Marlis.

[1:15:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): And like I say, like we can certainly like those carve carve off those those pieces so that the bits of research can be done and then be brought back into the major project.

[1:15:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): So I really appreciate your observation there, Trustee Graham.

[1:15:44] Voice 3: Yeah, I just had one addition. So I actually have a report ready to go.

[1:15:49] Voice 3: and waiting, just sitting with our RPM

[1:15:51] Voice 3: on recommendations for

[1:15:53] Voice 3: next minor projects.

[1:15:55] Voice 3: But if I can get a resolution

[1:15:57] Voice 3: from the LTC just requesting

[1:15:59] Voice 3: that staff come back at the next meeting

[1:16:01] Voice 3: with a report such

[1:16:03] Voice 3: as that, I think that would help to speed

[1:16:05] Voice 3: things along.

[1:16:07] Trustee Graham: I was going to make that

[1:16:09] Trustee Graham: motion, but I will wait until we have our official

[1:16:12] Trustee Graham: minutes.

[1:16:12] Trustee Graham: Well, she

[1:16:13] Trustee Graham: is actually doing

[1:16:15] Trustee Graham: a meeting.

[1:16:17] Trustee Graham: amazing um so i'm happy i i perhaps now's a good time to do it absolutely i know that the

[1:16:23] Trustee Graham: devon trust committee requests that to uh come back with options for a minor project

[1:16:33] Trustee Graham: uh to the local trust committee at their convenience

[1:16:43] Trustee Graham: at the next meeting sure you want that pressure or

[1:16:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): just if you just yeah if you just like yeah i

[1:16:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): I, you could say, if you just say, you request staff to come back with that, then the timing

[1:16:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): will be, will happen whenever it happens.

[1:16:58] Trustee Borthwick: Marlis, give us the report that you've already written.

[1:17:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): Marlis could just hand it to you right now.

[1:17:04] Trustee Borthwick: Well, Marlis doesn't have to worry about the deadline, because she's already done the work.

[1:17:08] Planner Chadwick (probable): Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1:17:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): And again, you know, where we're at as staff is that we want to be able to, like, the efficiency

[1:17:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): of this project is really dependent on being able to have Marlis' time engaged with it.

[1:17:25] Voice 9: Okay, so Lisa, you've got that

[1:17:27] Voice 9: good?

[1:17:28] Voice 4: Yes, Chairman, I have that. Excellent.

[1:17:31] Voice 9: Seconded by Trustee Berthouet. Any further discussion, call the question on paper.

[1:17:35] Voice 9: That's carried. All right.

[1:17:40] Voice 9: Okay,

[1:17:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): anything else on 2A before I start moving into

[1:17:44] Planner Chadwick (probable): 2B?

[1:17:45] Voice 9: No, I think we're off to B.

[1:17:48] Voice 9: Okay,

[1:17:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): off to be. So, in the chart there I've listed the actions and the status and next steps,

[1:17:56] Planner Chadwick (probable): and what I will do, what I'm going to do is I'm going to go through each one of these

[1:18:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): because there's a number of questions related to them that I need in order to be able to

[1:18:07] Planner Chadwick (probable): move forward. So, action number one is to include policies related to ALC exclusion for affordable

[1:18:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): affordable housing, and that would be in the OCP.

[1:18:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): So currently the Agricultural Land Commission requires

[1:18:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): that the local governments apply for exclusion applications

[1:18:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): on behalf of private landowners so that there's congruency

[1:18:39] Planner Chadwick (probable): with local government policy.

[1:18:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): A large portion of land on Denman Island

[1:18:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): is in the agricultural, almost half actually.

[1:18:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): It's quite remarkable.

[1:18:57] Planner Chadwick (probable): So the suggestion here is,

[1:19:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): and this has sort of come up in discussion before,

[1:19:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): is to put a policy into the OCP that allows exclusion

[1:19:08] Planner Chadwick (probable): from the ALC, from the Agricultural Land Reserve for affordable housing.

[1:19:18] Planner Chadwick (probable): And I've indicated that there already are policies related to exclusion

[1:19:25] Planner Chadwick (probable): from the Agricultural Land Reserve for where there's significant benefit

[1:19:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): benefit for the greater community of Denman Island, which is sort of, you know, to be kind of defined. You could be explicit in these policies if you'd like to be, to emphasize an interest in exclusion for, and I've indicated affordable rental and special needs housing, just expanding it.

[1:20:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): That's just based on the local government act refers to affordable rental and special needs.

[1:20:07] Planner Chadwick (probable): You don't necessarily have to specify all of those three things.

[1:20:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): Special needs encompasses things like seniors housing, etc.

[1:20:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): So the questions here really for you are, are you interested in being sort of explicit

[1:20:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): complicit where you already have policies related to the exclusion from agricultural

[1:20:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): land reserve? Are you interested in being explicit about housing being something that is of

[1:20:44] Planner Chadwick (probable): significant benefit or significant benefit for the greater community? Because it generally could

[1:20:52] Planner Chadwick (probable): fall under that. But again, if you want to be more explicit, it's much clearer when decisions

[1:20:59] Planner Chadwick (probable): are being made. The other question for you is that if you do decide that you want to be explicit

[1:21:07] Planner Chadwick (probable): and identify that affordable housing is specifically something that would be of

[1:21:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): significant benefit then um do you want to leave it with at affordable housing or are you interested

[1:21:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): in adding rental and special needs or just special needs housing and again this is really just to get

[1:21:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): some direction from you for the draft bylaw there'll be there'll be further opportunity to

[1:21:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): discuss and debate the the the specificities uh later on in the process just

[1:21:42] Trustee Graham: these sure i'll go

[1:21:44] Trustee Graham: go for an answer. Thank you for noticing that that particular policy is rather vague as

[1:21:50] Trustee Graham: far as what community benefit. I think it would be useful to say including or such as

[1:21:58] Trustee Graham: and include those words that you quoted, rental and special needs affordable. Especially

[1:22:04] Trustee Graham: affordable rental and special needs housing. That makes sense to me. And just looking at

[1:22:08] Trustee Graham: the 2018 housing needs assessment for denman um there was a conclusion that we needed 80 units

[1:22:15] Trustee Graham: we're we're now sitting zoned only not built but zoned we're at 56. so we're still missing 24. so

[1:22:24] Trustee Graham: i anticipate at least one more application coming from a non-profit group to fill in the missing 24

[1:22:31] Trustee Graham: so we're at the 80 and that's an old needs assessment it's like probably closer to 100

[1:22:37] Trustee Graham: But anyway, that's the data that we've got right now.

[1:22:39] Trustee Graham: And we have way too much agricultural land in the ALR for such a tiny island.

[1:22:45] Trustee Graham: And it's more than likely that that's where that property would come.

[1:22:48] Trustee Graham: So, yes, I think that's a really good idea to make it specific as well as being undefined.

[1:22:57] Trustee Borthwick: Yeah, I'm happy with making that specificity.

[1:23:00] Trustee Borthwick: i would like just so that i'm sort of fully grasping things because i know that there there

[1:23:07] Trustee Borthwick: are uh technical definitions that like vary from uh layman definitions so um

[1:23:17] Trustee Borthwick: yeah the only the only part really like uh i you know i guess i'd like to know

[1:23:21] Trustee Borthwick: sort of what the just very broad uh sort of definition of of in this instance

[1:23:28] Trustee Borthwick: it's quite affordable affordable i assume means that it's compliant with the i forget what the

[1:23:34] Trustee Borthwick: name of the standard is but there is an affordable there is an affordability uh metric that is that

[1:23:40] Trustee Borthwick: is provincial as is my would be my understanding uh in terms of rental now the only thing that i

[1:23:46] Trustee Borthwick: wonder is like is that encompassing market rents which obviously do not fall necessarily within the

[1:23:51] Trustee Borthwick: affordability matrix for the province um and then special needs housing just can mean a lot of

[1:23:57] Trustee Borthwick: things generally speaking i'm you know i'm in favor of making sure that if it's an accessibility

[1:24:02] Trustee Borthwick: question then yes obviously those things are things that i think are really important but i

[1:24:06] Trustee Borthwick: yeah just curious just to get like even a broad definition of those things but i'm

[1:24:10] Trustee Borthwick: i think i'm very much in favor i just want to check um

[1:24:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah so one of the things that i would

[1:24:18] Planner Chadwick (probable): note is that um so i'm also working on um uh the housing project for main island and the

[1:24:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): The Gabriel OCP, which the section of housing, which I've prioritized and has been prioritized by the Gabriel OCP, it's basically a rewrite, or I mean, at least the proposed draft will be very much, there's some significant potential changes in that.

[1:24:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): And the value of all of that is that there's opportunity for consistency in terms of definition. And so I'm looking to the provincial definitions, etc. And so we will have very strong definitions supporting these words.

[1:25:13] Planner Chadwick (probable): And I mean, like affordable is not the easiest to define. And so, I mean, it's likely that your LTC, as well as the other three will have some opportunity to have some discussion about how you want to define affordable because in some cases, like, you know, affordability can only be maintained over time, if you've got a housing agreement in place.

[1:25:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): so that's why in some cases you might want to keep some of your words open because you won't

[1:25:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): necessarily have a housing agreement but it may be considered affordable um and and i may come

[1:25:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): back to you so all of these things are evolving at different speeds in different ways but will

[1:25:57] Planner Chadwick (probable): influence um each other um because as i'm doing the work on gabriola i'm getting into the definition

[1:26:03] Planner Chadwick (probable): of attainable housing so

[1:26:06] Voice 5: there may be

[1:26:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): some other words that i that i start to kind of throw your

[1:26:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): way um as we

[1:26:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): move through this so that's what i'm saying like this is it's good to get that

[1:26:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): your general to understand where your general interest is um but there'll be opportunity to

[1:26:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): to further sort of nuance the words we use how we define them and all of that sort of stuff which is

[1:26:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): very very important

[1:26:28] Trustee Borthwick: yeah no

[1:26:30] Voice 5: that's good if this is

[1:26:30] Trustee Borthwick: helping hone that down and and and is you know

[1:26:33] Trustee Borthwick: bearing down on those concepts then that i'm happy yeah yeah i just want to make sure i wasn't

[1:26:40] Trustee Borthwick: you know i want to make sure i understand what oh

[1:26:43] Planner Chadwick (probable): totally yeah and like i

[1:26:45] Planner Chadwick (probable): said it's it's it's not

[1:26:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): it's it's complicated and it's complex and you know we're trying to get into we're trying to

[1:26:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): make it as easy as possible by diving deep and bringing it back up to the surface

[1:26:57] Planner Chadwick (probable): so

[1:26:58] Trustee Borthwick: in terms of this item do do you need specific direction or is it enough for us to just say yes

[1:27:05] Trustee Borthwick: please do yeah

[1:27:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): that's what i'm that's all i need yeah yes because

[1:27:09] Trustee Borthwick: i'm

[1:27:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): not going to move forward on

[1:27:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): things that you say no thank you keep

[1:27:15] Trustee Borthwick: it keep it nice and specific yeah

[1:27:18] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah do just do it yeah

[1:27:21] Planner Chadwick (probable): okay so moving on to action two so this is about permitting a reduction of minimum parcel size to

[1:27:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): facilitate land for donation to non-profit organization so looking through your um

[1:27:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): your subdivision bylaw you already identify um exceptions in so this is all about so sorry let

[1:27:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): me just back up a couple so in your subdivision bylaws each and in your zoning bylaw um each

[1:27:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): Each zone has a sort of maximum or minimum parcel size for a subdivision.

[1:28:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): Your subdivision bylaw does make exceptions for multifamily affordable housing.

[1:28:08] Planner Chadwick (probable): So what's being suggested here is that that be expanded not just for multifamily affordable housing, but affordable housing in general.

[1:28:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): um in the instance for example where a land owner wants is interested in subdividing their land

[1:28:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): to donate a parcel of land to the land conservancy who might be able to be interested in building one

[1:28:37] Planner Chadwick (probable): unit so you've got a um and this is something that we're we're looking at in in detail um on

[1:28:45] Planner Chadwick (probable): on main island because that's where a number of landowners have kind of said oh you know if i

[1:28:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): could i would i would you know i give i give you you know i look i look at at at subdividing a

[1:28:57] Planner Chadwick (probable): piece of property but i can't sort of thing to to donate um all of that to say this we know the

[1:29:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): subdivision process is not an easy one so it would be it would take a real um altruistic person to

[1:29:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): to, you know, want to go through the process, but why not provide the opportunity for them to do

[1:29:18] Planner Chadwick (probable): that if they'd like to? And in the case, for example, on Main Island, there was a housing

[1:29:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): association that did take on the, they had to rezone, they had to rezone the land to allow for

[1:29:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): the subdivision, and then they took on the subdivision. So this is really an opportunity

[1:29:39] Planner Chadwick (probable): potentially to fast-track the ability of a nonprofit organization to acquire a

[1:29:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): smaller piece of land without having to go through a rezoning process and like I

[1:29:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): say it you've already kind of a previous LTC already thought about this because

[1:29:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): you've already made the

[1:30:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): exception for multi-family housing so it would just be expanding that um to however you'd like

[1:30:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): to you know um it could be specifically you could be just very be specific about um it being

[1:30:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): multi-family housing or land to be donated to a non-profit uh government organization or first

[1:30:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): nation um to build affordable housing for example so there's a few questions here for you one is

[1:30:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): is do you support the approach of kind of expanding that ability

[1:30:33] Planner Chadwick (probable): to reduce minimum lot size for the donation of a piece of land

[1:30:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): that may not be multifamily, but it would be affordable housing?

[1:30:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): And if you choose to go that route,

[1:30:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): would you like it to be secured by a housing agreement,

[1:30:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): which is where it would be beneficial to identify very specifically

[1:31:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): that it would be a non-profit government organization or First Nations.

[1:31:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): Yeah, yeah.

[1:31:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): So those are your choices, really.

[1:31:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): So this is the direction I'm looking for.

[1:31:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): Do you like the approach to expand that?

[1:31:21] Planner Chadwick (probable): Do you want it to specify who could have the land,

[1:31:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): which helps to secure that it would be an organization that would look over it over time and ensure that affordability.

[1:31:37] Planner Chadwick (probable): And the other question here is that would you be interested in seeing that minimum lot size be reduced for the other land designations where it doesn't currently exist for multifamily?

[1:31:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): So that would be rural and village.

[1:32:04] Trustee Graham: Steve, okay.

[1:32:05] Trustee Graham: You thought this would be easy, didn't you?

[1:32:09] No, no, no.

[1:32:09] This is all good work.

[1:32:11] So to your first question, yes.

[1:32:16] I like anything that we can do to make a piece of property donated to a nonprofit

[1:32:25] and not worry about getting hung up with a lot size is a plus.

[1:32:29] So yes, I like the first question.

[1:32:32] The second one, my only

[1:32:34] Trustee Graham: concern is the total that we don't have the trust staff available

[1:32:40] Trustee Graham: to monitor single residence housing agreements, multiple housing agreements.

[1:32:47] Trustee Graham: So as much as I love the idea, I don't understand how we would actually be able to put a housing

[1:32:54] Trustee Graham: agreement on a single residence that is uh being developed as an affordable house you know more

[1:33:00] Trustee Graham: than i do yeah

[1:33:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): so in the case where um in the case where it's donated to a established organization

[1:33:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): it's a lot easier to monitor um so that's that's that's why you might want to specify

[1:33:17] Planner Chadwick (probable): the other thing is that um we're we can still put it into we can still put it into the

[1:33:25] Planner Chadwick (probable): bylaws under the understanding that it may be challenging to oversee multiple over time.

[1:33:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): And that is something that we as an organization would have to start to look into in more detail,

[1:33:40] Planner Chadwick (probable): how we could support that.

[1:33:43] Planner Chadwick (probable): If we saw multiple units being secured, affordability being secured by housing agreements.

[1:33:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): It

[1:33:56] Trustee Graham: is, in fact, the number one recommendation from the Housing Advisory Planning Commission.

[1:34:00] Trustee Graham: We tie the availability of combining that, even a single unit of the Portable Housing, with a housing unit.

[1:34:07] Trustee Graham: So I absolutely agree, but at the time we were told, well, the trust doesn't have the person power to monitor a full budget.

[1:34:17] Can you

[1:34:18] Trustee Graham: imagine how many housing agreements that might come up for review on a regular basis?

[1:34:21] Trustee Graham: cases. But as you say, a non-profit organization on the island wants to take that on, and we

[1:34:27] Trustee Graham: can do that. So I say yes to the second one, and I say yes to the third one. So I'm like,

[1:34:33] yes, yes, yes. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[1:34:36] Yeah, I mean, I agree. And I mean, I had also heard

[1:34:42] Trustee Borthwick: those issues, but I was going to ask

[1:34:46] ask uh if andrew said not preempted me uh which was basically that yeah well if currently we don't

[1:34:55] have a lot of housing agreements and we're not uh you know we're and we're finding it as challenging

[1:35:00] to

[1:35:01] Trustee Borthwick: administrate um but it's that that analogy of um you know uh the the pottery exam where you get

[1:35:08] Trustee Borthwick: one student and tell them all their marks are on one pot i have to make a perfect pot and you tell

[1:35:13] Trustee Borthwick: the other student they've got to make 100 pots the people making 100 pots will probably make

[1:35:17] Trustee Borthwick: better pots by the end of it so we if we start having to administrate lots of housing agreements

[1:35:22] Trustee Borthwick: it'll indicate to us as a as a body that this is something we need to streamline that process and

[1:35:27] Trustee Borthwick: we'll get better at it uh you know uh so i yeah i'm keen to see that the other thing forward that

[1:35:32] Trustee Borthwick: moves forward obviously want to make sure that we're supporting staff and getting that work done

[1:35:37] Trustee Borthwick: you know well and efficiently and that they're not getting so done because that's no good either but

[1:35:42] Trustee Borthwick: But yeah, that's the first trend.

[1:35:46] Voice 11: Yeah,

[1:35:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): and I'll just add on that topic that I know that the CRD is looking at it in detail to support the Southern Gulf Islands affordable housing strategy.

[1:36:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): So there is a potential opportunity to understand through the research that they're doing what the implications are.

[1:36:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): And in this specific instance, we're looking, we're not looking at sort of writ large kind of housing agreements per secondary dwellings.

[1:36:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): This is about actual lots being donated with housing agreements.

[1:36:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): So it's a much smaller number and it would

[1:36:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): be a much more manageable number.

[1:36:34] Voice 5: Yeah.

[1:36:36] Voice 5: All

[1:36:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): right. Moving right along.

[1:36:39] Planner Chadwick (probable): on so um adding policies to support development variants for proof of water for cooperatives so

[1:36:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): this is something that um requires a lot of um um our freshwater specialist time um and so we need

[1:36:57] Planner Chadwick (probable): to um we we haven't been able to get that time um to really dive into it enough but he's familiar

[1:37:07] Planner Chadwick (probable): with the he's aware of the of the interest and um and we'll be exploring it a little bit more

[1:37:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): in the new year it may be if if we can't get to this piece it may be that we we might need to

[1:37:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): take this out depending on um on whether um on on how much time i can have of of his to to really

[1:37:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): help me um figure it out and um and iron it out but he's keen so like i said we'll we'll kind of

[1:37:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): reevaluate, I think, in the new year, the opportunity to have this as part of the greater

[1:37:43] Planner Chadwick (probable): project, in the interest of not holding up the whole thing. But again, there could be opportunity

[1:37:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): to move it forward. And he is keen. So I'll provide an update later with the next report

[1:37:57] Planner Chadwick (probable): where we're at with that. Okay, so

[1:38:01] Trustee Graham: certainly, yeah, why, why was it specific to cooperatives?

[1:38:08] Trustee Graham: Just curious.

[1:38:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): Because when you've got an organization that has their own,

[1:38:18] Planner Chadwick (probable): essentially, bylaws related to how to oversee communal various communal things,

[1:38:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): including water, like from a professional perspective,

[1:38:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): perspective, that's the kind of arrangement where it feels like we should really support

[1:38:40] Planner Chadwick (probable): because you've got a whole body of people agreeing to look after a system. It's not as,

[1:38:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): it becomes more challenging if you've just got a single person out somewhere to know whether or

[1:38:57] Planner Chadwick (probable): or not the system would be able to be looked after.

[1:39:03] Planner Chadwick (probable): And we can have a further discussion about that

[1:39:05] Planner Chadwick (probable): when we get into kind of that topic.

[1:39:09] Trustee Graham: Thank you, just curious.

[1:39:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): Yeah, okay, any more, any other questions

[1:39:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): moving into home occupation?

[1:39:18] Voice 11: No.

[1:39:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): Or I mean,

[1:39:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): home-based assisted living

[1:39:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): permitted as a home occupation, that's very,

[1:39:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): so that was something coming out of the,

[1:39:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): Well, I mean, majority of this is coming out of the recommendations of the HAPC.

[1:39:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): So this one is fairly easy.

[1:39:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): It's just a matter of including it.

[1:39:39] Planner Chadwick (probable): It can be included as a home occupation.

[1:39:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): And, you know, the question there,

[1:39:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): And, you know, we can provide some draft considerations at this point.

[1:39:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): These can also be added to or amended as we move forward.

[1:40:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): And I've just indicated some that you may want to have as consideration for home-based businesses, potentially.

[1:40:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): And these are sort of mirrored a little bit after the guest accommodation.

[1:40:17] Planner Chadwick (probable): accommodation, um, there's an opportunity for you to, to, to, to identify, uh, you know, if you want

[1:40:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): to restrict number of bedrooms or beds or what have you, you don't need to, but you, you can,

[1:40:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): if you want to, this is your, this is, this is your opportunity to do that. Um, so the first

[1:40:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): question is, do you want to add home-based business as a assist, home-based assisted living as a,

[1:40:40] Planner Chadwick (probable): as a home occupation? And, and then the second one is, um, you know, how would you like it to

[1:40:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): be regulated um and are there are there any specific specifics you'd like to kind of put

[1:40:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): out there right now again like i say there's there's opportunity to think about and um

[1:41:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): add to amend any anything that that we discussed today

[1:41:05] Voice 9: okay

[1:41:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): uh okay i'll go yeah it's a great idea adding it to the list of home-based permitted home-based

[1:41:17] business

[1:41:19] Trustee Graham: opportunities it's a great one and i think that's smart to uh pattern the

[1:41:24] restrictions on the current b&b restrictions

[1:41:27] Trustee Graham: because the environmental impact is kind of

[1:41:30] Trustee Graham: similar if someone's running a b&b full-time they would have the same amount of environmental

[1:41:36] Trustee Graham: environmental impact of someone running a long-term care facility full-time um i guess the

[1:41:41] Trustee Graham: only question i would have is if you had a large enough property uh if you restrict it to the

[1:41:46] Trustee Graham: principal dwelling i mean what would be required if somebody said well yeah but i've got you know

[1:41:53] Trustee Graham: 50 acres and i i have this great outbuilding that i would like to equip as a as a home-based

[1:41:58] business so a lot of home-based businesses if you have a large enough property you can you can

[1:42:02] to conduct the business in an outbuilding.

[1:42:07] Trustee Graham: So I'm wondering, yeah, I don't know how it would build in that.

[1:42:14] Trustee Graham: Annalisa, how would you do that?

[1:42:17] Planner Chadwick (probable): Well, that's a good question.

[1:42:18] Planner Chadwick (probable): You know, I think I thought exactly what you thought.

[1:42:21] Planner Chadwick (probable): I mean, what I provided here is from the B&B regulations,

[1:42:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): but that's certainly

[1:42:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): something I can think about and come back with.

[1:42:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): proposal

[1:42:34] Trustee Borthwick: yeah i definitely know at least one place where i know there are a number of other buildings

[1:42:41] already on the property they've been there for forever that i know that that person may well

[1:42:47] be looking to do uh

[1:42:48] Trustee Borthwick: some end-of-life care and long-term care uh and i think to restrict that

[1:42:54] Trustee Borthwick: to the primary residence would possibly be overly prohibitive um you know lots of properties that

[1:43:00] Trustee Borthwick: a really nice little side cabinet would work really well for that and also allow that that

[1:43:05] Trustee Borthwick: person some autonomy uh and privacy so i don't know that that restriction is necessarily uh as

[1:43:12] Trustee Borthwick: if like it makes sense for bnb but it or for bb but not not necessarily for this use yeah so with

[1:43:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): that consideration you may want to consider um like like number of um of of of of clients potentially

[1:43:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): right so then you're not necessarily restricting where they are right

[1:43:40] i

[1:43:41] Voice 11: think we need a little more yeah i

[1:43:43] Trustee Graham: don't know enough more thought

[1:43:44] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah

[1:43:44] Trustee Graham: you

[1:43:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): can go back and think about it for sure adding

[1:43:49] Trustee Graham: it to the list is the first step for sure

[1:43:52] Planner Chadwick (probable): possibly

[1:43:52] Trustee Graham: press details can come yeah it's our community feedback perhaps

[1:43:57] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah yeah well and this is it too right like is there may be things that pop up

[1:44:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): pop out to you as things that you really want some feedback on um and i'm going to make note of that

[1:44:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): too um and then you can make you know you can really focus the feedback in a way that uh

[1:44:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): like helps fulfill your own gaps in in in sort of understanding of what would be best

[1:44:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): okay so should we move on okay okay so tiny home villages so this is one that's come up it's

[1:44:31] Planner Chadwick (probable): interesting this this term tiny home village comes up all over the place so it's come up on

[1:44:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): maine it's come up on gabriola and you know it's really like what are we talking about when we're

[1:44:40] Planner Chadwick (probable): talking about tiny home village and i think the concept is really about like a bunch of small

[1:44:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): units in a concentrated area um and they don't necessarily need to be you know the word tiny

[1:44:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): homes kind of been like what is a tiny home we have the tiny home on wheels they could be tiny

[1:45:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): homes on wheels they could be they could be yurts they could be i mean on denman they can be all

[1:45:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): kinds of things right um but i the concept is you got a bunch of little little houses in a in a

[1:45:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): concentrated area and um and what's been restrictive in in in most ltc's bylaws is that they only allow

[1:45:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): allow you know a principal unit and an additional unit potentially or a secondary suite so there

[1:45:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): the ability to have a number of small units is not supported generally by by the majority of

[1:45:43] Planner Chadwick (probable): of LCC bylaws and that's what we're starting to look at is like how can we because it's because

[1:45:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): It's becoming, you know, acknowledged to be a more affordable way to live

[1:45:56] Planner Chadwick (probable): and creating that opportunity for community building as well.

[1:46:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): So as I've indicated in my little discussion here, there is an opportunity,

[1:46:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): you know, the flex housing does provide an opportunity for some additional units.

[1:46:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): Um, um, and, and I can, I can provide you with a, you know, I've given you an example of the, you know, the flex housing information from, from main Island, um, that identifies, you know, what that looks like for main Island in the, the, their pilot area right now.

[1:46:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): So in that case, you know, what flex housing does is it allows for multiple units within a maximum floor area, maximum combined floor area of all of the buildings.

[1:46:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): So on smaller lots, you're looking at, you know, being able to have an additional one additional lot on lots that would be lots under 1.5 acres on lots greater than or 0.6 hectares on lots greater than 0.6 hectares up to 1.2.

[1:47:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): it's three um and then it goes up to to five uh and main island only looked at um at lots up to

[1:47:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): five hectares so that's why that's the case so the flex housing will um allow for some

[1:47:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): some um ability to have a a smaller amount of clustered housing um and and outright right so

[1:47:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): if and i think you have indicated that you're interested in the flex housing model

[1:47:45] Planner Chadwick (probable): and i can um i can develop some um um you know we we can we can have a more specific

[1:47:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): discussion around maximum floor areas, I think, at a later date. And I can also draft some options

[1:48:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): for larger lots. So again, that idea of having a more cluster of smaller units could be addressed

[1:48:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): in that way. But to support the potential of even more units, and again, like people talk about

[1:48:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): about rv park or like all of these things i mean really what we're talking again about is we're

[1:48:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): talking about just allowing a bunch of small units and it could end up you know you could end up it

[1:48:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): could be pads that people bring their their tiny homes or their rvs onto but it could be a mixture

[1:48:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): of that and it could be a mixture of things with foundations but all of those all of those dwellings

[1:48:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): are all of those that type of all of those types of housings are considered a dwelling

[1:48:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): So, what's being suggested here is that if you would like to support the ability for somebody to rezone their land so they could have, say, more than what could potentially be allowed by flex housing, then your OCP would have to identify the ability to have that kind of rezoning.

[1:49:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): And it would be very similar to multifamily affordable housing in terms of how it would be evaluated.

[1:49:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): So what I've suggested here, again, is if this is the direction you want to go, then it's and I've called it this arrangement.

[1:49:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): I've called it clustered small unit affordable housing, which may also change.

[1:49:33] Planner Chadwick (probable): But, you know, you get what I mean, right?

[1:49:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): I was actually playing around with acronyms last week when I was looking at the Gabriela stuff.

[1:49:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): stuff um so who knows you could end up with a really funky acronym but that's that's the gist

[1:49:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): of it um and it would be easy enough to add that to um your policy 8 which already which already

[1:49:56] Planner Chadwick (probable): allows for rezoning for multi-family units so it would be a matter of just adding clustered

[1:50:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): small unit housing there um and then um and then potentially using the same kind of um

[1:50:13] Planner Chadwick (probable): review requirements as you would for multi-unit, adding a few additional ones to consider the fact

[1:50:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): that they are independent units. So that's about having them clustered, you know, restricting the

[1:50:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): size, et cetera. So questions are, do you support rezoning for clustered small unit affordable

[1:50:33] Planner Chadwick (probable): affordable housing. Would you like staff to provide options for flexible housing on larger

[1:50:39] Planner Chadwick (probable): lots? And are there specific interests, things that you'd like to consider in the list of things?

[1:50:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): And again, that also may be something that you want some further thought and engagement on.

[1:50:57] Trustee Borthwick: I mean, yeah, for me, yes. I think that's a really good thing. Yes, on larger lots.

[1:51:04] Trustee Borthwick: uh and i will uh my you know my enthusiasm is already very high but it will be uh you know

[1:51:11] Trustee Borthwick: multiplied by a factor if you can't get a fun acronym sorry

[1:51:15] Voice 1: what was that last piece i didn't

[1:51:17] Trustee Borthwick: if you are able to to come up with a fun acronym oh

[1:51:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah yeah yeah oh yeah for sure for sure

[1:51:28] Voice 9: i'm not t-shirt potential yeah absolutely oh

[1:51:31] Trustee Graham: yeah totally there's value in humor for sure

[1:51:35] Trustee Graham: Yeah, that's great. I know that tiny homes is a very popular term right now. It's got a cool vibe to it, but it's good to have a term that covers all of the potential things that people choose to live in.

[1:51:52] So thank you for the small unit

[1:51:54] Trustee Graham: of affordable housing.

[1:51:55] Trustee Graham: That works for me.

[1:51:57] Trustee Graham: And for anyone that's like the plus, what's it called on main?

[1:52:05] Trustee Graham: Flexible housing.

[1:52:06] Trustee Graham: Flexible housing.

[1:52:06] Trustee Graham: So that doesn't have any affordability tied to the policy, as I understand it.

[1:52:11] Trustee Graham: It's simply a way for some property owners to divide their maximum floor area in combinations based on their size.

[1:52:18] Trustee Graham: So I understand that.

[1:52:19] Trustee Graham: and and so if somebody as you say wants to offer an affordable like a restricted with a housing

[1:52:27] Trustee Graham: agreement opportunity for people to park their whatevers on their on their property that makes

[1:52:32] Trustee Graham: great sense absolutely that's very much what coho is in a way they've provided a place to plunk

[1:52:38] whatever you choose to live in and it's clustered and it's affordable

[1:52:42] Trustee Graham: so you pretty much identified

[1:52:44] Trustee Graham: on exactly what we've got and people seem really comfortable with that so let's let's build on our

[1:52:51] Trustee Graham: successes and other specific interests you know i think keeping it vague it's a unit yep we've

[1:53:06] already defined what that unit can be on emmett so we've taken care of all the potentials and

[1:53:12] And we do have policies.

[1:53:15] There are actually, I think, policy 29 and 30.

[1:53:17] One talks about affordable housing,

[1:53:19] the other talks about

[1:53:20] Trustee Graham: special needs housing.

[1:53:22] That, I always assumed, would kind of be another co-op,

[1:53:27] though no group

[1:53:28] Trustee Graham: has been brave enough to do the work

[1:53:30] Trustee Graham: and reap the rewards.

[1:53:31] Trustee Graham: But maybe that'll happen one day.

[1:53:33] Trustee Graham: So I think I've answered your questions.

[1:53:37] Planner Chadwick (probable): Great.

[1:53:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): I have check marks by them all.

[1:53:43] Planner Chadwick (probable): Excellent. Okay. Moving right along. Okay. So there was this interest in variations in housing that support shared facilities. And so basically that's just a variation on the clustered small unit and affordable housing. So that would be an easy thing to sort of support under that.

[1:54:07] Planner Chadwick (probable): that, it's just not, again, it has to do with definitions, et cetera, right? Like, so not

[1:54:13] Planner Chadwick (probable): restricting the fact that the housing unit you're living in has a toilet and a kitchen in it,

[1:54:18] Planner Chadwick (probable): right? It may be that, so that's where you can add statements like I've indicated here,

[1:54:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): that clustered small unit affordable housing could include all of these shared things. We can

[1:54:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): add more shared things too, or we can say, you know, other shared amenities or something like

[1:54:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): like that but um it's just indicating you know providing an indication to future communities

[1:54:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): and ltcs that uh that there's there's support for this this kind of arrangement my

[1:54:50] Trustee Graham: question is

[1:54:51] Trustee Graham: i always assumed but because we we've talked about pod housing over the years in social groups and

[1:54:58] Trustee Graham: and opportunities to talk to people about that.

[1:55:02] Trustee Graham: And reviewing our definitions and our land use bylaw,

[1:55:07] Trustee Graham: I don't think we would be able to stop a group of people doing that today.

[1:55:12] Trustee Graham: We don't define family.

[1:55:14] Trustee Graham: We define a dwelling as a single kitchen.

[1:55:17] Trustee Graham: So if somebody was so moved to build a big kitchen

[1:55:23] Trustee Graham: and then attach to that kitchen a bunch of living pods,

[1:55:26] Trustee Graham: pods I don't believe we have anything in our bylaws that would prevent

[1:55:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): that's correct if you

[1:55:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): if it's all within one unit there's nothing that prevents that but this is speaking to

[1:55:39] Planner Chadwick (probable): separate units oh

[1:55:42] Trustee Graham: not attached so the pod that we always talked about they were always attached

[1:55:46] Trustee Graham: so you're saying it wouldn't be attached yeah well

[1:55:50] Trustee Borthwick: I mean we already have people sort of moving

[1:55:51] Trustee Borthwick: around that stuff with with breezeways right like as long as there's a continuous seal that's

[1:55:56] Trustee Borthwick: attached as

[1:55:58] Trustee Graham: far as our bylaws are concerned so you're saying no breezeway not actually attached

[1:56:02] Trustee Graham: so a common service building and then a group of uh sleeping and sitting pods

[1:56:10] yeah and i guess the key thing and this is i think already accustomed

[1:56:15] Trustee Borthwick: accounted for but

[1:56:16] Trustee Borthwick: just making sure that those don't inadvertently become airbnb uh you know oh yeah yeah yeah

[1:56:23] Trustee Borthwick: which i think we've already covered but just that's that's something that we want to make

[1:56:26] Trustee Borthwick: sure is baked into that yeah

[1:56:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): for sure yeah yeah yeah and

[1:56:31] Trustee Graham: we would probably want to restrict that

[1:56:33] Trustee Graham: to an affordable yeah and

[1:56:35] Voice 1: affordable yep also

[1:56:37] Trustee Graham: going to have a housing agreement attached to it

[1:56:39] Voice 1: yep okay

[1:56:43] Trustee Graham: cool yeah no that's good um

[1:56:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): okay yeah and so then this was another

[1:56:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): Another observation that I made as I was moving through it is that if some of these changes are to be made, then there'll need to be an amendment to housing objectives.

[1:57:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): Your housing objectives are pretty good, I have to say.

[1:57:03] Planner Chadwick (probable): So I've just identified your guiding objective.

[1:57:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): It fits within what's being discussed and the elements of this project.

[1:57:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): So there isn't really like any major tweaks to most of the objectives except for this objective three, the setting of a maximum for overall residential density so that, you know, I think the TUP project is suggesting the removal of the density bank.

[1:57:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): bank. And if that all moves forward, then this objective would need to be removed. So

[1:57:44] Planner Chadwick (probable): it may be that you want to think about this in a different way. But that's something that

[1:57:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): I observed. The other thing is that objective three, it sort of adds this, especially for

[1:58:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): For seniors, to support the establishment of affordable housing, rental options, and special needs housing to provide the opportunity for island seniors to remain in the community, especially in their own or family homes.

[1:58:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): I don't know if you necessarily need to have that if you just, I mean, because really you're looking for any flexibility there, I would assume.

[1:58:26] Trustee Graham: Now, that Objective 3 that stands, that's a really important statement that this island has lived with for decades.

[1:58:35] Trustee Graham: And I really actually expected a pretty big pushback from our removal of the temporary use permit and the density bank.

[1:58:45] Trustee Graham: And for the community to say, well, what about unrestricted growth?

[1:58:50] Trustee Graham: We don't want unrestricted growth on it.

[1:58:52] Trustee Graham: And I say, well, of course we don't.

[1:58:54] Trustee Graham: So what are we going to replace that particular stage, which talks about density and uses dwellings as the measuring tool?

[1:59:05] Trustee Graham: Can we look at something more nuanced, like environmental impact or lot or something to at least address the fact that we are not interested in going beyond what we feel comfortable with, whatever that is.

[1:59:23] Trustee Graham: And I know people come to the table and they want to talk about, well, what's the carrying capacity of Demenon?

[1:59:29] Trustee Graham: That's where we should set our limits.

[1:59:31] Trustee Graham: But that's against you.

[1:59:33] Trustee Graham: You've

[1:59:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): expanded that.

[1:59:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): I've said this to other LTCs.

[1:59:39] Planner Chadwick (probable): You're beyond it.

[1:59:40] Planner Chadwick (probable): Most

[1:59:41] Trustee Graham: of the islands are beyond it.

[1:59:42] Trustee Graham: And your carrying capacity is totally dependent on how you live.

[1:59:46] Trustee Graham: like if you're a one gold buddhist you could probably have 10 000 people here because there

[1:59:53] Trustee Graham: would be almost no impact or if you have a hundred billionaires each of which has a 150 000

[2:00:00] Trustee Graham: square foot mansion with the airport i mean so impact is a relative term lifestyle is more

[2:00:07] Trustee Graham: important so we need to put our thoughts to replacing this particular policy which is

[2:00:13] Trustee Graham: a hard-fought policy back in the day i remember the conversations to ensure that our island has

[2:00:19] Trustee Graham: not exploded and i don't know what the answer is but that's your expertise bring something back to

[2:00:26] Trustee Graham: the world to address that yeah

[2:00:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): i totally appreciate that and i actually i actually see i'm actually

[2:00:31] Planner Chadwick (probable): seeing two um potential objectives that i could kind of i could bring some wording forward to

[2:00:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): and one would be around that sort of you know um the the low environmental impact um idea

[2:00:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): And then the other one is also like supporting density that is focused on providing affordable, you know, I don't know how attainable, affordable and special needs.

[2:01:13] Trustee Graham: One thought I've had over the years is a restriction in lot coverage, percentage lot coverage.

[2:01:21] Trustee Graham: So, we said, yes, you can do more on your lot, which has already been severely affected

[2:01:27] Trustee Graham: by your lifestyle.

[2:01:28] Trustee Graham: So, it's not the natural environment, it's paved and built on, et cetera, but we've restricted

[2:01:34] Trustee Graham: the amount of lot that you can cover with those non-pervious services.

[2:01:39] Trustee Graham: So that's kind of like a, it's a bit of a trade-off.

[2:01:43] Trustee Graham: You need to leave more of your lot in a natural state, but you can take a smaller portion

[2:01:48] Trustee Graham: and you can over develop it than a single family one that's just a thought i'll just leave it there

[2:01:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah and i i you brought that thought up a few times through this project um and we can sort

[2:02:03] Planner Chadwick (probable): of go back to that again uh because i think the the last place we we left it was let's look at

[2:02:07] Planner Chadwick (probable): what the flex housing looks like um the ne the next step is actually to think through

[2:02:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): um lot coverage maximums which is a another discussion which we can um have another look at

[2:02:23] Planner Chadwick (probable): um just need to have some direction to staff to do so right is

[2:02:30] Trustee Graham: it do you know do you know

[2:02:31] Trustee Graham: of any other island that's that's done that but look at their lot of coverage uh yeah actually

[2:02:36] Voice 1: i

[2:02:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): did provide in one of the reports i provided to you i i did provide an indication of of some

[2:02:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): some examples and north pender did that fairly recently so we can certainly look to to north

[2:02:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): pender as the most recent okay

[2:02:56] Voice 11: yeah and

[2:02:59] Trustee Borthwick: with david on all that stuff i'm keen to and i understand

[2:03:03] Trustee Borthwick: the the consternation for people worried about uh you know that obviously the the density cap

[2:03:11] Trustee Borthwick: uh the density bank as it exists is not entirely serving its purpose nor is it is it going to be

[2:03:18] Trustee Borthwick: you know uh it's not capturing things in a nuanced way but i think the um i think that

[2:03:26] that recognition that lifestyle uh is is relative and so and so impact is relative

[2:03:33] uh is really significant and i think that's a good place to sort of build

[2:03:37] our strategizing and also our communication uh around uh and yeah i mean i think when

[2:03:47] When the density bank was formed, there was a different assumption of how people lived

[2:03:51] on the island.

[2:03:52] That's changed quite a lot.

[2:03:55] Trustee Borthwick: And it's changed quite a lot.

[2:03:58] Trustee Borthwick: You know, I think 30 years ago, you know, people were living on the islands in a very

[2:04:02] Trustee Borthwick: different way.

[2:04:03] Trustee Borthwick: So I think there are some assumptions built into the density bank which aren't necessarily

[2:04:07] Trustee Borthwick: unilaterally the case anymore.

[2:04:09] Trustee Borthwick: And we risk, you know, making this a place where only those billionaires are able to

[2:04:15] Trustee Borthwick: to live you know within the regulation and that actually we're excluding the people who actually

[2:04:20] Trustee Borthwick: live here in a way that's that's more harmonious so uh yeah we're finding ways to capture that

[2:04:25] Trustee Borthwick: and sort of advocate for that in our in our land use

[2:04:30] Voice 11: plan i guess i think really a good

[2:04:31] Voice 11: a good objective

[2:04:32] Voice 1: okay yeah so

[2:04:35] Voice 11: the message is not exploding

[2:04:38] all

[2:04:41] Voice 9: right is does that conclude

[2:04:46] Voice 9: yeah

[2:04:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): i just put three more check marks so that's great thank you

[2:04:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): moving right along it feels really good yeah so that that kind of concludes the discussion of

[2:04:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): phase 2b um and i've just identified kind of the update there faced to just remind you what phase

[2:05:03] Planner Chadwick (probable): Phase 2C looks like.

[2:05:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): And again, so Phase 2C bylaws can be drafted.

[2:05:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): It's just where they apply or, you know, the permissions can be drafted.

[2:05:18] Planner Chadwick (probable): It's just where you want to apply the ability to have multiple dwellings.

[2:05:25] Planner Chadwick (probable): Because if there are areas that come out as like, you know, really, no, you really don't want to do that because it's going to be particularly impactful in this particular area, then, you know, having the, we need to, you can't make those decisions until you have that information and we have the analysis around it.

[2:05:45] Planner Chadwick (probable): So, and like I said, Comox is very keen on seeing the suitable land analysis. We are, you know, we will have this consultant moving by the, before we break for the winter break. And so I would see in January, hopefully having the ability to engage you in a conversation around the suitable land analysis.

[2:06:10] Trustee Borthwick: one of the key things with that is that's also what's really bearing in mind is the

[2:06:15] Trustee Borthwick: covox are going to have an election in january as well so their chief and council are changing

[2:06:19] Trustee Borthwick: potentially in january um so that i think might also be part of where those timelines are are

[2:06:25] Trustee Borthwick: sort of going to come up against um knowing knowing that there's going to be a variety of

[2:06:32] Trustee Borthwick: kind of zones of varying permissibility um

[2:06:36] Voice 11: just not necessarily knowing where those zones are

[2:06:41] going to

[2:06:41] Trustee Borthwick: be um is it possible is it is it putting the cart too much before the horse to sort of

[2:06:47] Trustee Borthwick: start planning those those drafts knowing that okay well we're going to have you know say five

[2:06:53] Trustee Borthwick: levels of yes or no um is it is it putting it too much before the the cart to uh to sort of start

[2:07:04] Trustee Borthwick: building those frameworks before you know exactly where they're going to go or is or is it just

[2:07:09] Trustee Borthwick: better to wait until you know where those things are going to be yeah

[2:07:12] Voice 1: well yeah yeah

[2:07:14] Trustee Borthwick: lots of stuff

[2:07:16] Voice 11: i just yeah was that sorry

[2:07:18] Voice 11: lots

[2:07:19] Voice 1: of stuff did

[2:07:22] Voice 11: you

[2:07:23] Voice 1: want me to say something

[2:07:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah yeah no certainly we like we we are um working on that stuff in fact like i mean some

[2:07:33] Planner Chadwick (probable): some of it's plug and play like we have the the the main island um regulation flex housing

[2:07:40] Planner Chadwick (probable): regulation to work with there's what i'm finding is actually quite interesting and a bit frustrating

[2:07:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): is that um all these all these bylaws are written differently so it's like you're kind of

[2:07:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): jerry-rigging them a little bit like so what we have for maine will have to be slightly adjusted

[2:08:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): for the denman context because in maine they talk about cottages uh they don't talk about so we had

[2:08:08] Planner Chadwick (probable): you know so so anyways so there that's why you read cottage plus another accessory dwelling unit

[2:08:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): so we're sort of trying to clean things up so that we can get some consistency here um and so

[2:08:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): those how those policies will read and for denman will already be kind of ready to go um um the

[2:08:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): The expansion of the secondary suite.

[2:08:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): Yeah, like all of this stuff we'll know,

[2:08:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): like it'll all be kind of, you know,

[2:08:33] Planner Chadwick (probable): once we know whether you want to expand it,

[2:08:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): like it's really just about understanding

[2:08:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): how far you want to expand it,

[2:08:40] Planner Chadwick (probable): but the actual policy language will be ready.

[2:08:46] Trustee Borthwick: You're saying it's David Mott's fault

[2:08:48] Trustee Borthwick: that the definitions are all a mess coming up from Maine

[2:08:50] Trustee Borthwick: and you're having to do a ton of work to adapt them.

[2:08:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): well fortunate for for fortunately for dave he he

[2:08:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): was not on the ltc back in the day

[2:09:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): i i would

[2:09:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): say like i looking at the i've been looking to the denman ocp quite a bit um to

[2:09:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): actually help to provide some guidance on on um on uh structure it's really well structured so

[2:09:17] Planner Chadwick (probable): So kudos to whoever did that.

[2:09:23] Voice 9: A huge community effort, to be quite honest.

[2:09:28] Voice 5: I

[2:09:29] Voice 9: will go back to me now with my tail

[2:09:30] Trustee Graham: between my legs.

[2:09:33] Trustee Graham: So here's my question.

[2:09:35] Trustee Graham: The way I envision the feedback that we get from our community,

[2:09:40] Trustee Graham: do we want to suggest to our community

[2:09:44] that we have

[2:09:45] Trustee Graham: a large expansion of the rights to build

[2:09:51] Trustee Graham: in secondary dwellings and suites,

[2:09:53] Trustee Graham: or do we want to have a minimum perspective

[2:09:56] Trustee Graham: and have our community add?

[2:09:58] Trustee Graham: So in other words, if we kind of show the map

[2:10:01] Trustee Graham: with the suitable land analysis areas blocked off

[2:10:04] Trustee Graham: and the COVAX First Nation areas blocked off,

[2:10:07] Trustee Graham: but everything else, it's a go,

[2:10:10] that's obviously going to scare the community, which is fine.

[2:10:13] Trustee Graham: and then they go well not here well not here but i like that or do we do we show a very small

[2:10:21] Trustee Graham: opportunity the way main island has really kind of picked one area as a pilot and have the

[2:10:27] Trustee Graham: community say well what about this area what about that area so i don't know which is more useful

[2:10:32] Trustee Graham: yeah

[2:10:33] Planner Chadwick (probable): so i mean it's interesting that you should say that because um with main we came up with

[2:10:40] Planner Chadwick (probable): what we came up with first and put out there the community came in and said what about this what

[2:10:45] Planner Chadwick (probable): about that what about this and then we did further analysis and then the the pilot area kind of

[2:10:52] Planner Chadwick (probable): shifted a bit so there's so there's a lot of value in in having that that public input at that point

[2:10:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): which you want to identify the area which way you want to go I think will be dependent on on seeing

[2:11:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): what the information looks like right like it it um and

[2:11:09] Voice 1: it may be

[2:11:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): that you know again there may be

[2:11:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): like little um you know as as as david model tell you little oases of of of difference where there's

[2:11:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): a there's a fantastic well that somehow hasn't been captured by uh the analysis right so i mean

[2:11:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): a lot of this stuff yeah we've got the data but a lot of it needs to be ground truths

[2:11:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): it's uh within the community so um and this is what the beauty of maps right because without

[2:11:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): the map we have no starting point so

[2:11:42] Trustee Graham: we'll cross that bridge as we get closer to the cim

[2:11:50] Trustee Graham: all right

[2:11:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): any other questions um related to this work

[2:11:57] Trustee Graham: one of the areas that we put on our list of things that should be easy is renaming the village

[2:12:05] Trustee Graham: to downtown and and i going through our bylaws and our and the copies and the ocp and the lub

[2:12:15] Trustee Graham: the word village is everything and i'm wondering are we really asking too much for this we are

[2:12:22] Voice 1: actually it's going to be i'm

[2:12:25] Trustee Graham: actually going to remove my interest in it we'll we'll continue to

[2:12:30] Trustee Graham: to call it downtown that's the what's the right word but the vernacular that's that's the community

[2:12:35] Trustee Graham: word but maybe the document just leave it i don't want to make more

[2:12:40] Trustee Graham: so

[2:12:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): what i will also add to that is that it is it makes it it's it's easier to maintain the

[2:12:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): consistency as well across bylaws and the the reason that village is used is that it is a very

[2:12:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): specific uh planning term like it it really does indicate the the core uh economic area of the

[2:13:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): of the small town right so um so i i think that's a good i mean i was going to suggest

[2:13:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): when we got to that part that um we just put downtown diamond in brackets in certain places

[2:13:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): of the ocp but uh i i think that what you're suggesting makes perfect sense and so i have

[2:13:23] Planner Chadwick (probable): If I may, I will put

[2:13:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): an X. I have check marks. I can put

[2:13:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): an X.

[2:13:30] Trustee Borthwick: That can be good, too.

[2:13:33] Trustee Graham: He's warming up on the

[2:13:35] idea, but it's not

[2:13:36] clear. I'm simply

[2:13:38] just trying to bring this

[2:13:40] project to the end

[2:13:42] in my term. We have less than two years

[2:13:44] to go. Just so everybody

[2:13:46] knows, we've got a year and

[2:13:48] if we're lucky, two-thirds

[2:13:50] left. So thank you for

[2:13:52] your diligence

[2:13:53] Trustee Graham: and your focus

[2:13:54] Trustee Graham: and I'm excited. I mean, even more excited when I can retire and say, we did it. We've reviewed the

[2:14:00] Trustee Graham: housing policy center and regulations.

[2:14:05] Planner Chadwick (probable): We'll have a little party.

[2:14:08] Trustee Graham: Your main island flexible housing has a rather delirium error.

[2:14:14] Trustee Graham: 15,640 liters is not 300 gallons. It's 3000 gallons.

[2:14:18] Trustee Graham: Oh, oops. Yeah.

[2:14:19] Trustee Graham: If you're distributing that, you need to change that, right?

[2:14:22] Trustee Graham: Yeah,

[2:14:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah, yeah. Thank you.

[2:14:23] Planner Chadwick (probable): all

[2:14:24] Trustee Graham: right

[2:14:25] Voice 9: so you do you need any supporting motions or yeah i

[2:14:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): just have the one it's very

[2:14:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): straightforward it's just that the the denman island local trust committee approved the next

[2:14:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): steps for completing the denman island housing review project yes

[2:14:38] Trustee Borthwick: i'm happy to make that

[2:14:39] Trustee Borthwick: you're looking at it uh i move that the denman island local trust committee

[2:14:44] Trustee Borthwick: approved the next steps for completing the denman island housing review project brackets

[2:14:51] Trustee Borthwick: it's stage two on the phase to be close

[2:14:55] Voice 9: friends i'll say exactly for the discussion

[2:14:58] Voice 9: oh a question all the favor that

[2:15:01] Voice 11: carries all right so we

[2:15:11] Voice 9: will take a 30-minute break

[2:15:13] Voice 9: now as for the schedule and we will return at 12 45. thank you

[2:15:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): all right i'm out thank you

[2:15:21] Voice 9: Remember, comparison for pottery, not exploding.

[2:15:28] Voice 10: Pottery explodes every now and then.

[2:45:30] Voice 10: So do you guys want to roll back to the, yeah, obviously,

[2:45:34] Voice 11: no, I see it

[2:45:36] Trustee Graham: is not, let's do there.

[2:45:41] Voice 9: All right, so we'll come back to order. We're going to go back to item 12.1c.

[2:45:53] We have a trustee paying attention, who's not the chair, which is, I had to read this to you.

[2:45:59] I think

[2:45:59] Voice 9: PLR Z202-240055, Denman Conservancy application, so we will hand it over to Clare.

[2:46:14] Voice 3: So this rezoning proposal involves amendments to the Denman Island OCP and the land use bylaw to

[2:46:21] Voice 3: rezone four parcels of land from forestry to conservation. These are owned and managed by

[2:46:27] Voice 3: by Denman Conservancy Association, which is the applicant for the proposal.

[2:46:32] Voice 3: One of these parcels is split-zone, with a portion located within the Agricultural Land

[2:46:37] Voice 3: Resort .

[2:46:38] Voice 3: The intent of the proposed amendments is to enhance conservation efforts on Denman Island

[2:46:43] Voice 3: by transitioning land use away from forestry and resource extraction, and towards protection

[2:46:48] Voice 3: and preservation.

[2:46:51] Voice 3: Denman Conservancy Association has been actively involved in environmental stewardship since

[2:46:55] Voice 3: its incorporation in 1991 and the rezoning reflects their commitment to preserving ecosystems.

[2:47:02] Voice 3: Some of the

[2:47:03] Voice 3: details, the two of the parcels are already protected by a conservation covenant

[2:47:07] Voice 3: and are used for passive recreation including walking path with no permanent structures planned

[2:47:13] Voice 3: the future of these properties will remain focused on conservation and recreation.

[2:47:18] Voice 3: The rezoning will prohibit residential development and allow only passive recreational activities.

[2:47:25] The

[2:47:27] Voice 3: staff are recommending in this preliminary staff report that the LTC move forward with

[2:47:33] Voice 3: an early referral of this application to the ALC, just given that a portion is in the ALR.

[2:47:38] Voice 3: And additionally, the staff report suggests preparing draft bylaws for future consideration

[2:47:43] Voice 3: to facilitate the rebuilding process.

[2:47:46] Voice 3: I'll just highlight a couple key considerations.

[2:47:50] Voice 3: The parcel in the agricultural land reserve, one parcel has a portion of land in the ALR

[2:47:58] Voice 3: and conservation is allowed within the ALR.

[2:48:01] Voice 3: However, the rezoning may impact the ability to continue farming activities.

[2:48:06] Voice 3: Staff recommend referring the application to the ALC for their review.

[2:48:12] Voice 3: So there's a conservation covenant on two of the parcels ensuring long-term protection

[2:48:18] Voice 3: protection. Staff recommend potentially extending this protection to the remaining parcels,

[2:48:25] Voice 3: so another two, which currently lack such covenants. Conservation covalent could provide

[2:48:31] Voice 3: stronger protection than zoning alone, safeguarding ecological values like habitat preservation

[2:48:37] Voice 3: and preventing vegetation removal. Because even with the conservation, just with the

[2:48:43] Voice 3: conservation zoning, not that the conservation, not that the

[2:48:48] Voice 3: DPA would do this, but they could potentially clear up the

[2:48:51] Voice 3: land with the conservation loan. It doesn't, our conservation

[2:48:54] Voice 3: zoning alone unfortunately doesn't prohibit vegetation removal.

[2:48:59] Voice 3: It just prohibits residential use of structures being built on

[2:49:02] Voice 3: the parcel. So that is a consideration and staff would

[2:49:07] Voice 3: look to the Islands Trust Conservancy for a little bit

[2:49:11] Voice 3: more guidance on looking at conservation covenants on those other two parcels. So the proposal to

[2:49:19] Voice 3: rezone to conservation does support Denman Island's environmental protection goals and

[2:49:24] Voice 3: aligns with the community's commitment to sustainable land use. Staff recommend referring

[2:49:29] Voice 3: the application early to gather input and ensure that the proposal progresses smoothly.

[2:49:34] Voice 3: Justin, any questions or just if any of those,

[2:49:40] Trustee Borthwick: like in terms of extending that conservation

[2:49:44] Trustee Borthwick: covenant to the other side, that's not captured in the recommended motions here?

[2:49:51] Voice 3: No, I did capture it in, so I talked about it in the body report and

[2:49:59] Voice 13: then I believe

[2:50:02] Voice 3: I believe it was in one of the checklists that was provided as an

[2:50:06] Voice 3: attachment, the

[2:50:07] Voice 13: Attachment

[2:50:08] Voice 3: 5.

[2:50:12] Voice 3: It talks about referral to the Violence Trust Conservancy.

[2:50:16] Voice 3: So I didn't know if the LTC would be interested in doing that at this stage, or I'll be able

[2:50:23] Voice 3: to confirm it a lot.

[2:50:24] Voice 3: Wouldn't

[2:50:26] Trustee Graham: it be the Divot Conservancy Association making that application for a...

[2:50:31] Voice 3: Yeah, sorry.

[2:50:32] Voice 3: Sorry, but whether the LTC would like me to forward this to the Islands Trust Conservancy

[2:50:38] Voice 3: now to begin the discussion.

[2:50:43] Trustee Graham: I think that's premature.

[2:50:45] Trustee Graham: We should wait for direction from the ACA.

[2:50:51] Voice 3: Yeah, the LTC can, so that could be something that they recommend to go along with this

[2:50:58] Voice 3: rezoning.

[2:50:59] Voice 3: If the LTC really would like to see those conservation covenants placed on the land,

[2:51:02] Voice 3: And that's, you know, could make it a condition that we donate.

[2:51:06] Voice 3: Oh, I see.

[2:51:07] Voice 9: Have you spoken to Trust Conservancy about capacity?

[2:51:12] Voice 9: No.

[2:51:13] Voice 9: Because they know that they have mentioned that they've got capacity issues.

[2:51:20] Voice 11: Well,

[2:51:21] Trustee Graham: I mean, I'm going to move to motion.

[2:51:22] Trustee Graham: This is kind of the question for me.

[2:51:24] Trustee Graham: Do any of these parcels have residential densities?

[2:51:28] Trustee Graham: Yes.

[2:51:28] Trustee Graham: So they'll, because we still have a density bank, they'll slip into the bank.

[2:51:33] Voice 3: So they would, yeah.

[2:51:35] Voice 3: I did write in the report that

[2:51:37] Trustee Borthwick: their intention was to donate it back to the bank.

[2:51:43] Trustee Borthwick: So we had a letter about that.

[2:51:44] Trustee Borthwick: There's four densities.

[2:51:45] Voice 3: Yeah.

[2:51:46] Voice 3: So the intention was to donate it to the bank.

[2:51:48] Voice 3: And I did write in the report that likely these densities would be lost if the bank is removed.

[2:51:55] Voice 3: Yeah.

[2:51:57] Voice 3: Timing wise, we'll have to see how this all works out.

[2:51:59] Voice 3: But if this is just forging ahead as is, yes, they would get donated into the bank.

[2:52:04] Voice 3: and I would have to do an OCP amendment to do

[2:52:07] Voice 3: that. So

[2:52:08] Voice 9: crazy question. If the bank, if the

[2:52:12] OTC decides

[2:52:12] Voice 9: to extinguish the bank, what happens with those densities? Does the bank sort of sit

[2:52:19] Voice 9: until it's extinguished? No.

[2:52:21] Voice 3: Or does it just

[2:52:22] Voice 3: automatically disappear? Yeah, so this is a bit

[2:52:25] Voice 3: of an aside, but the bank isn't accurate as of now anyways. There is still the option to do a

[2:52:33] Voice 3: density transfer and that would remain but that's with two simultaneous rezoning basically would

[2:52:39] Voice 3: transfer one to the other um we wouldn't potentially have the ability to bank if the

[2:52:45] Voice 3: the

[2:52:46] Voice 11: biopic gets through to it so stephen might be a little bit too for because if they all she's

[2:52:53] Voice 11: considering experiencing the bank well

[2:52:55] Trustee Borthwick: i think that's been the assumption but i'm now wondering

[2:52:58] Trustee Borthwick: are we potentially

[2:53:00] missing a step given that we're deferring

[2:53:02] Trustee Borthwick: that discussion to later

[2:53:04] Trustee Borthwick: are we getting it to a place

[2:53:06] Trustee Borthwick: where we're

[2:53:08] Trustee Borthwick: not directing that transfer

[2:53:10] Trustee Borthwick: that work to happen

[2:53:12] Trustee Borthwick: you know

[2:53:13] Trustee Borthwick: without wanting to assume anything about

[2:53:16] Trustee Borthwick: that future choice

[2:53:17] Trustee Borthwick: are we

[2:53:19] Trustee Borthwick: missing a step if we don't

[2:53:22] Trustee Borthwick: make those transfers otherwise

[2:53:24] Trustee Borthwick: well

[2:53:25] Voice 3: I would forge ahead

[2:53:26] Voice 3: with the bylaws

[2:53:28] Trustee Borthwick: that's my sentence anyways but

[2:53:29] Voice 3: transfers would have to happen and we'll just have to see how

[2:53:33] Voice 3: the timing works out because yeah i'm not these might these bylaws might be coming forward maybe

[2:53:39] Voice 3: in march yeah so

[2:53:42] Voice 11: it

[2:53:43] Voice 3: creates it creates a little bit of clunkiness with this rezoning and also with

[2:53:47] Voice 3: the cobalt rezoning yeah um because we were obviously thought that those would go they would

[2:53:53] Voice 3: removing densities from the they're rezoning but i wasn't going forward with that because i thought

[2:53:59] Voice 3: yeah

[2:54:00] Voice 11: yeah so

[2:54:01] Voice 3: it's a little bit clunky just with this housing project and having these applications

[2:54:06] Voice 3: going forward at this time but um i know

[2:54:09] Voice 3: there's not a

[2:54:10] Trustee Borthwick: reason to stop doing it i'm just making

[2:54:11] Trustee Borthwick: sure we're not like leaving ourselves open to a to a thing that we forgot to do at some point

[2:54:16] Voice 3: it wouldn't be a forgotten thing it would be maybe an unnecessary in the end

[2:54:23] Voice 3: work and we have to do it if the violence are what the violence are right now and

[2:54:28] Trustee Graham: sure just a final question if i'm curious that the agricultural land commission

[2:54:33] Trustee Graham: is okay with land in the alr having a conservation covenant placed on it

[2:54:39] Voice 3: that's what yes so there is

[2:54:43] Voice 3: uh well i haven't spoken exact i haven't spoken about this particular parcel that

[2:54:48] Voice 3: but there is a portion in the ALR right now with a conservation covenant on it, but some very

[2:54:56] Voice 3: specific wording around agricultural uses are still permitted. So that's where a bit of my

[2:55:03] Voice 3: hesitation is with this whole application, whether they, if they would like to remove

[2:55:09] Voice 3: move the portion from the ALR or, yeah, there might be an exclusion application coming forward.

[2:55:18] Voice 3: You'll

[2:55:19] Trustee Graham: wait until you hear from the ALC on that. No more questions. I'm going to make the first

[2:55:26] Trustee Graham: motion. I move that the Deming Island Trust Committee request staff to prepare a draft

[2:55:31] Trustee Graham: draft by-law to amend the Denman Island Community Plan to enable application PLRZ20240055

[2:55:40] Trustee Graham: Denman Conservation Association, Conservancy Association.

[2:55:44] Second. Further discussion? All questions, all in favor? That carries. Your turn.

[2:55:50] I move that

[2:55:52] Trustee Borthwick: the Denman Island Local Trust Committee request staff to prepare a draft

[2:55:55] Trustee Borthwick: draft bylaw to amend demini land use bylaw 2008 to enable application p l r z two zero two four

[2:56:03] Trustee Borthwick: zero zero five five demo conservancy association so the discussion called question all favor

[2:56:09] gary and

[2:56:10] Trustee Graham: finally i move that the demini local trust committee requests staff who sent an early

[2:56:14] Trustee Graham: referral of prs as a two or two four to the law five five the conservancy association of the

[2:56:20] Trustee Graham: the Honest Dress Conservancy and the Agriculture Land Commission for a comment.

[2:56:24] Trustee Graham: That's it.

[2:56:25] Trustee Graham: Discussion.

[2:56:25] Trustee Graham: Question.

[2:56:26] Trustee Graham: There.

[2:56:27] Trustee Graham: It can't be.

[2:56:29] Voice 9: But in all seriousness, where did the new numbering come from?

[2:56:33] Voice 9: Is that a...

[2:56:35] Voice 9: It came

[2:56:35] Voice 3: from, I don't know if you're aware of the transition to CityView.

[2:56:39] Voice 3: Yeah.

[2:56:39] Voice 9: It came from

[2:56:40] Voice 9: CityView.

[2:56:41] Voice 9: Evil CityView.

[2:56:43] Voice 9: So you can certainly provide feedback from this LPC, you know.

[2:56:48] Voice 9: There's been a lot of feedback regarding the numbering system.

[2:56:50] Voice 9: yeah it just in the moment it makes it hard to read because like even if there were a couple

[2:56:55] Voice 9: of dashes in there because when you're trying to read through like when you have like a zen

[2:56:59] Voice 9: the two side by side yes it makes it typical for the bunch so and

[2:57:08] Voice 11: i am funky so

[2:57:10] Voice 9: all righty

[2:57:11] Voice 9: so where have we now we were staggering back onto our um i believe we're section 14 correspondence

[2:57:21] Voice 9: Yeah, so page 64.69 from the Demonomic Distributory. It's on point, I guess, a little bit to her

[2:57:32] Voice 9: previous discussion about the land bank,

[2:57:35] Trustee Graham: this one, or there's another one, yeah, yeah, this

[2:57:39] Trustee Graham: is, we're just copying on this one, yes, this letter went to the adjunct, yeah, this isn't

[2:57:44] Voice 3: related to the application yeah this

[2:57:46] Voice 9: is i get some police plans yes

[2:57:50] Voice 9: so that's just basically for receipt for information yeah

[2:57:54] Voice 9: to let you know that they've reached out yeah all right so we moved out to section 16 on page 74

[2:58:04] Voice 9: um base for community engagement auditions also stated the method of the project oh and we have

[2:58:11] that has joined

[2:58:12] Voice 9: us from afar.

[2:58:15] Voice 6: Good afternoon, trustees from a land far, far away.

[2:58:19] Voice 6: Welcome.

[2:58:21] Voice 6: Thank you. Happy to be here.

[2:58:22] Voice 6: Things are looking festive there on Denman Island.

[2:58:25] Voice 6: Well, it

[2:58:27] Voice 9: is a festive place.

[2:58:30] Voice 6: That is my recollection as well, at all times of year.

[2:58:34] Voice 9: All righty, so over to you.

[2:58:38] Voice 9: We have some options.

[2:58:46] Voice 9: So if you want to walk through those, Jason.

[2:58:50] Voice 6: Sure. Thank you. Thank you, Chair.

[2:58:52] Voice 6: Coming to you today on behalf of Trust Area Services

[2:58:56] Voice 6: concerning the Islands Trust Policy Statement Amendment Project.

[2:59:00] Voice 6: The current project charter for the Policy Statement Amendment Project

[2:59:02] Voice 6: envisions a modest amount of on-island engagement

[2:59:06] Voice 6: to take place around the draft policy statement.

[2:59:09] Voice 6: At such time, well, the current project charter

[2:59:12] Voice 6: says at approval in principle,

[2:59:14] Voice 6: but following a decision of Trust Council,

[2:59:17] Voice 6: Just last week, I believe that the approval in principle is now going to be foregone and the body will move to first reading.

[2:59:24] Voice 6: So let's say some modest amount of on-island engagement following first reading of the draft policy statement.

[2:59:30] Voice 6: And I'm happy to be able to say that.

[2:59:34] Voice 6: Really for the purpose of informing each local trust committee's response when you receive the document on referral from trust counsel.

[2:59:43] Voice 6: So the question before you is essentially, what do you need to know from your constituents in order to make an informed response to Trust Council about the policy statement when it lands here at this table?

[2:59:55] Voice 6: You'll see that there's a number of different options on page two and three of the staff.

[3:00:00] Voice 6: report that's in your agenda package, ranging from no engagement whatsoever, to TAS staff coming to

[3:00:06] Voice 6: your island and both providing information and receiving feedback on the document. These all

[3:00:13] Voice 6: have different costs associated and different levels of effort required. So it's sort of up

[3:00:19] Voice 6: to you to determine what might work best for you and for your constituents. I will say that

[3:00:26] Voice 6: regardless of what local engagement option you choose, your constituents will still be able to

[3:00:32] Voice 6: share their opinions about the document directly with Trust Council through a survey, both in

[3:00:38] Voice 6: paper copy and that'll be available online. So they'll have a direct line for feedback.

[3:00:43] Voice 6: And this is more just, what do you need as local representatives in order to make an informed

[3:00:49] Voice 6: decision happy to answer any questions that may arise um yeah i'll just leave it there thank you

[3:00:57] Voice 6: yeah thank

[3:00:59] Trustee Graham: you for uh uh giving us all those options um i don't have any questions so i

[3:01:04] Trustee Graham: certainly have a recommendation but i'll wait until i hear from my

[3:01:06] Voice 11: trustees i

[3:01:07] Trustee Borthwick: was gonna ask

[3:01:09] Trustee Borthwick: if you had any i had a couple that sort of stood out to me but i was interested to hear you over

[3:01:14] Trustee Borthwick: what you you you've been asked a little longer than i have so you know a little bit more about

[3:01:18] Trustee Borthwick: what people are gonna well

[3:01:19] Trustee Graham: i'm not sorry that i missed the previous uh iteration of the policy

[3:01:23] Trustee Graham: statement and the and the uproar that it caused many communities and i think justifiably there

[3:01:28] Trustee Graham: were a couple of uh directives in there that really hit uh at a personal level i won't i

[3:01:34] Trustee Graham: won't go further um as your report says there this will be this would be the fourth time that

[3:01:40] Trustee Graham: communities and asked for their feedback i'm pretty sure we've exhausted their patience on

[3:01:46] Trustee Graham: this particular one um we're elected to do the job i think we've done a great job on this particular

[3:01:51] Trustee Graham: time i don't need personally any formal online on island engagement my culture state and i maintain

[3:01:59] Trustee Graham: a monthly newsletter of about 750 words that we share with our community that's a great opportunity

[3:02:05] Trustee Graham: to take those words and do a thumbnail presentation of the policy statement and direct people to the

[3:02:12] Trustee Graham: survey which is on the website for any uh further comments that's my opinion so

[3:02:18] Voice 9: you are down to

[3:02:20] Voice 9: option one number one okay yeah

[3:02:23] Trustee Borthwick: i mean i i want to make sure and i think that you know we obviously

[3:02:28] Trustee Borthwick: have to i feel like we've got to be mindful of like that impression that the impression that

[3:02:35] Trustee Borthwick: the trust is not uh accessible um but also you know i mean i talk with people

[3:02:43] Trustee Borthwick: pretty frequently and i think that the key word there is is formal um and you know holding a

[3:02:51] holding public meeting i haven't had a lot of public uh information meetings uh yet this term

[3:02:58] but we haven't done a lot of that i did it in the previous term and um you know i've certainly seen

[3:03:03] them done in other organizations and whatever else um but i'm i'm happy to to sort of have

[3:03:09] that informal engagement and if people have questions you know obviously encourage them to

[3:03:14] come and talk to us but

[3:03:14] Trustee Borthwick: you know yeah i would agree uh i don't necessarily think we need to

[3:03:19] Trustee Borthwick: host a specific meeting um and i certainly wouldn't want to spend a lot of money or staff

[3:03:25] Trustee Borthwick: time on sort of conducting that i think uh yeah we have a relatively small population uh i think

[3:03:32] Trustee Borthwick: we're we're capable of having that engagement

[3:03:34] Trustee Borthwick: okay

[3:03:35] Trustee Graham: well just further to that we do have a small

[3:03:39] Trustee Graham: population but we have a very very small number who are intimately involved in trust and they

[3:03:46] Trustee Graham: follow everything we do and good for them and they they will take full advantage of the online

[3:03:51] Trustee Graham: opportunity to and the vast majority of developers don't know what a policy statement is don't care

[3:03:57] Trustee Graham: what the policy statement is and they're quite happy to get on with their lives with any of

[3:04:01] Trustee Graham: these stuff that's just the reality it's not a criticism it's just how it works on these islands

[3:04:06] Trustee Graham: yeah um so you know anyway that's are we we're we're two to be on the same page

[3:04:11] Trustee Graham: so page

[3:04:12] Voice 9: 70 there is a recommended motion

[3:04:18] so i move that devon island select engagement option one for phase four committee engagement

[3:04:26] Trustee Graham: about the new draft islands trust policy statement second second for the discussion

[3:04:31] Voice 9: All questions? All in favor? Awesome. We have made category opens quite a little easier.

[3:04:40] Voice 6: Thank you very much, sirs.

[3:04:42] Voice 6: Thank you

[3:04:42] Voice 6: very much for your time.

[3:04:44] Voice 6: Happy holidays if I don't see you again before then.

[3:04:47] Voice 9: See you later. Thank you.

[3:04:49] Voice 9: All right. So moving down to 16.2, draft 2526, Demand Island Local Trust meeting, committee meeting schedule.

[3:04:57] Voice 9: schedule. I'm very pleased to know there's not an August meeting, which sent many people

[3:05:06] Voice 9: into masses. So does that schedule work for everybody?

[3:05:15] Voice 9: No, that works. It works. Okay. So top of page 75, there is a motion.

[3:05:21] Voice 9: I think it should be fine. My

[3:05:23] Trustee Borthwick: sister is having a baby sometime next year, but it is on the other

[3:05:27] Trustee Borthwick: side of the planet can

[3:05:28] Trustee Graham: you give her that schedule i'll

[3:05:30] Trustee Borthwick: try to get her down well it's about when i

[3:05:32] Trustee Borthwick: go to see the baby but i don't know what that means

[3:05:35] Voice 7: she

[3:05:37] Trustee Borthwick: lives in england so i guess that's true

[3:05:39] Trustee Borthwick: but well no actually last time you know they're there last year they didn't let me see them

[3:05:43] Trustee Borthwick: because the security deal started i was going to get flow to the country they wouldn't let me

[3:05:48] Trustee Borthwick: no well

[3:05:49] Voice 9: anyways august is a very good month in england so we have to lock it up for you

[3:05:56] Voice 9: yeah but yeah there's so much

[3:05:59] Trustee Borthwick: going on so much work i tried i appreciate it uh i will uh when

[3:06:06] Trustee Borthwick: i local trust committee approved their their january 2025 to march 2026 meeting schedule

[3:06:12] Trustee Borthwick: discussion call the question what favor we

[3:06:16] Voice 11: have a calendar it's

[3:06:21] Voice 9: wonderful can

[3:06:22] Voice 3: we just ask the

[3:06:23] Voice 3: question if you'd like to proceed with all the meetings in person

[3:06:27] Voice 9: I think that's the theme, and I will do my very best to attend.

[3:06:34] Voice 9: Thank you.

[3:06:36] Voice 9: All right.

[3:06:38] Voice 9: How is the Trust and Service Committee meeting for information?

[3:06:46] Voice 9: Trust and Service Committee for information.

[3:06:48] Voice 9: Applications report.

[3:06:50] Voice 9: Anything

[3:06:51] Trustee Graham: to be highlighted on that?

[3:06:53] Trustee Graham: Curious to know the first couple are in advance.

[3:06:57] Trustee Graham: what does that mean exactly?

[3:07:00] If

[3:07:01] Trustee Graham: an application is in abeyance,

[3:07:03] Trustee Graham: I mean, we haven't heard from these people

[3:07:04] Trustee Graham: since 2018, the very first one,

[3:07:07] Trustee Graham: about six years ago.

[3:07:09] Voice 13: Yeah, sometimes with

[3:07:10] Voice 3: subdivisions especially,

[3:07:11] Voice 3: we see that it can take a significant amount of time

[3:07:15] Voice 3: for a new applicant.

[3:07:17] Voice 3: So they

[3:07:18] Voice 3: would have submitted their application to Moody.

[3:07:21] Voice 3: We get the referral.

[3:07:22] Voice 3: We respond with a number of conditions

[3:07:25] Voice 3: that they would need to meet in order to meet the land use bylaw and it can take a lot of time.

[3:07:31] Voice 3: Sometimes it could be they need a rezoning in order to qualify for subdivision so these can

[3:07:38] Voice 3: stay in advance for quite some time. We do check in with the applicant trying to do it at a you

[3:07:44] Voice 3: know regular interval but sometimes it's just they're still working on meeting the conditions.

[3:07:50] Voice 9: It is complicated, I know. First experience, I'm in year eight to assemble a subdivision application.

[3:07:57] Wow.

[3:07:57] And it's, a little bit of this voting changes the requirements quite a bit, but also the approving officers change.

[3:08:07] And when they change, you go back to zero.

[3:08:09] Oh my goodness.

[3:08:10] So it's, if you

[3:08:13] Voice 9: told me before I started, I'm fine. I know you're kidding, it should take you a year.

[3:08:17] Voice 11: Right.

[3:08:17] Voice 11: year

[3:08:18] Voice 9: 8, I'm almost

[3:08:20] Voice 9: the same stage I was 6 months in the process

[3:08:23] Voice 9: and I've

[3:08:24] virtually, I think it's a good word

[3:08:26] but I've pretty much given up

[3:08:27] Voice 9: and that's a very very simple subdivision

[3:08:31] Voice 9: so I understand if anybody's getting

[3:08:32] Voice 9: complexity, it does take a lot of

[3:08:34] Voice 9: energy and a lot of money

[3:08:37] we're

[3:08:37] Voice 9: probably $35,000

[3:08:39] Voice 9: into it so far

[3:08:40] and

[3:08:40] Voice 9: not making progress

[3:08:42] Voice 9: so

[3:08:44] Voice 9: the only other one is

[3:08:46] Voice 9: the second one

[3:08:48] Voice 9: one doesn't have a name that can attach to it. So that was a little confusing to me.

[3:08:56] Voice 9: So I see.

[3:08:59] Voice 11: Yes. So I don't say the essential name. Yeah. So maybe it could

[3:09:04] Voice 3: just be when

[3:09:04] Voice 11: it was transferred over. It must be. Yeah. So I noticed that force setting and use permit

[3:09:17] Voice 11: also has no

[3:09:18] Voice 11: description. Optional enter comments is required. So I mean, it is really for safe,

[3:09:25] Voice 11: but just i must i must say i'm very very impressed with how quickly setting the experiments get

[3:09:33] Voice 9: processed it's either i was just does a very good job with that yeah you know when you're

[3:09:39] Voice 9: down in my area i think we're just gonna be up to 24 months yeah and the the goal with

[3:09:46] that is just eight days i don't think it's very very very

[3:09:50] Trustee Graham: interesting less detail in

[3:09:52] Trustee Graham: setting the experiment really just looking at the setbacks and a lot of coverage i think that you

[3:09:58] Trustee Graham: know what it is it is it's a simpler instrument to maintain uh insurances that they're building

[3:10:05] Trustee Graham: on their own property i

[3:10:08] Voice 9: think it's important all righty um so that was basically just for

[3:10:14] Voice 9: our information yeah um that's that's important yeah so it's just of course

[3:10:26] Voice 9: policies for information, so 16.8 First Nations Relationship Building Update. Is that just

[3:10:37] Voice 9: a placeholder?

[3:10:38] Voice 13: That's just a bit of a placeholder, the

[3:10:39] Voice 13: requirements are in whichever app we're at.

[3:10:43] Voice 13: I

[3:10:44] Trustee Borthwick: was going to ask, given that the, it took us a while to kind of get off the ground in

[3:10:51] in terms of an elected-to-elected relationship

[3:10:54] when the previous chief and council were elected.

[3:10:58] Trustee Borthwick: And I wonder, you know, knowing that we do know,

[3:11:01] Trustee Borthwick: as we do, that they have an election in January,

[3:11:03] Trustee Borthwick: if there's some pre-planning that we might do

[3:11:06] Trustee Borthwick: to, like, be prepared as the LTC to send a letter

[3:11:09] Trustee Borthwick: congratulating the new chief and council

[3:11:12] Trustee Borthwick: and scheduling, you know, reaching out

[3:11:14] Trustee Borthwick: to schedule some engagement.

[3:11:17] Trustee Borthwick: You know, we know that they're going to be doing that.

[3:11:19] Trustee Borthwick: and this year is going to be a big year for them because they're voting on ratifying their treaty

[3:11:24] Trustee Borthwick: in March. So I think it would be good for us to sort of be a little bit more on the ball in terms

[3:11:29] Trustee Borthwick: of being like, hey congratulations on your election, re-election, and you know we look

[3:11:33] Trustee Borthwick: forward to supporting you in whatever ways we can and you know going forward into the treaty stuff.

[3:11:39] Trustee Borthwick: There's a lot of stuff happening in the Clomox First Nation right now and it would be good for

[3:11:42] Trustee Borthwick: us to be a little more proactive than we were maybe last time around. Sounds like a motion.

[3:11:48] Trustee Borthwick: Yeah.

[3:11:51] Voice 9: Take your time.

[3:11:53] Voice 9: Yeah.

[3:12:06] Voice 11: Just take a second.

[3:12:07] Voice 11: No problem.

[3:12:08] Voice 11: You're in a rush today.

[3:12:10] Voice 11: I think this Chris Derout on Hinton Road, he's building a pool.

[3:13:05] Voice 11: I haven't seen one of those ever.

[3:13:19] Voice 11: Most people don't want any more.

[3:13:22] The pools and hot tubs have seemed to be pulled out earlier.

[3:13:25] Yeah.

[3:13:26] It's a lot of money that could be in there.

[3:13:28] All right, I think I'm there, and I'll go slow.

[3:13:32] Lisa, let me know if you have any issues.

[3:13:36] So I move that the Dem and I Owned Local Trust Committee request staff

[3:13:42] to

[3:13:43] Trustee Borthwick: be ready to draft a letter of congratulations and introduction

[3:13:47] Trustee Borthwick: from the Dem and I Owned Local Trust Committee to Comox First Nation

[3:13:52] Comox First Nation following their January 2025 election and

[3:13:59] Trustee Borthwick: reach out to

[3:14:02] Trustee Borthwick: schedule a meeting between the LTC and Chief of Council

[3:14:07] Voice 11: at their convenience.

[3:14:10] Voice 11: Lisa,

[3:14:11] Voice 9: you captured that?

[3:14:14] Voice 4: Yes, Chairman, I've got that. Thank you.

[3:14:17] Voice 9: Thank you very much.

[3:14:18] Voice 9: Sorry, I was a little wordy. A little wordy, Lisa.

[3:14:20] Voice 9: So, Secretary-General Graham, any third discussion?

[3:14:25] Voice 9: That's great, thank you.

[3:14:26] Voice 9: All questions, all in favor?

[3:14:28] Voice 11: It's really important for that group, so, yeah.

[3:14:33] Voice 11: All right.

[3:14:39] Voice 9: So, we moved down to future projects, there's something highlighted there.

[3:14:50] Literally, we're coming to upcoming meetings.

[3:14:54] Voice 9: next regular meeting scheduled to be decided i believe we did decide on january something

[3:15:00] right first so that is our next meeting so we'll go to adjournment if there's no other business

[3:15:08] all right

[3:15:09] Voice 9: i think we're done yeah we are adjourned the meeting thank you thank you

[3:15:13] Voice 11: lisa

[3:15:13] Voice 9: for all your help

[3:15:19] Voice 4: thanks everyone thank you

ADOPTED 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 1 of 8 
Local Trust Committee Minutes 
December 10, 2024 
                        Denman Island Local Trust Committee 
Minutes of Regular Meeting 
 
Date:  
Location:  
December 10, 2024 
Denman Activity Centre 
1111 Northwest Rd, Denman Island, BC 
 
Members Present: David Maude, Chair 
 David Graham, Trustee 
 Sam Borthwick, Trustee 
  
Staff Present: Marlis McCargar, Island Planner 
 Narissa Chadwick, Island Planner (electronic) 
 Nadine Mourao, Legislative Clerk  
 Jason Youmans, Senior Policy Advisor (electronic) 
 Lisa Millard, Meeting Administrator/Recorder (electronic) 
  
Others Present: There were approximately five members of the public in attendance. 
 
1. CALL TO ORDER 
Chair Maude called the meeting to order at 10:00 am.   
2. TERRITORIAL ACKNOWLEDGEMENT 
Chair Maude acknowledged that the meeting was held on the territory of the Coast Salish First 
Nations. 
3. APPROVAL OF AGENDA 
Trustees noted that legislative public notification requirements regarding the Public Hearing had 
been met; however, many community members were not aware that it was to take place today 
because the local newspaper, in which the hearing was advertised, had not been delivered to 
homes due to the postal strike. 
The following amendments to the agenda were presented for consideration: 
 Defer Item No. 5 “Community Information Meeting,” No. 6 “Public Hearing,” and No. 13.1 
“Minor Project Post Public Hearing Staff Report” to a future meeting. 
By general consent, the agenda was approved as amended.  
DE-2024-073 
It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee request staff to postpone the 
Community Information Meeting and Public Hearing regarding proposed Bylaw Nos. 248 
and 249. 
CARRIED 

ADOPTED 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 2 of 8 
Local Trust Committee Minutes 
December 10, 2024 
4. PROJECTS 
Trustee Graham declared a conflict of interest and left the meeting at 10:08 a.m. 
4.1 Denman Island Temporary Use Permit Review Project- Staff Report 
  The Planner summarized the staff report and highlighted the following: 
 Proposed amendments to Bylaw No. 249 are for the purpose of clarifying whether 
secondary dwellings are permitted per lot or per primary dwelling; 
 Intention is to permit secondary dwelling units on a per lot basis; 
 Limiting number of units to one per lot ensures density remains manageable and 
avoids risk of overdevelopment on larger lots; and 
 There are fourteen properties with more than one civic address and these 
properties could potentially be impacted by the bylaw. 
A member of the public stated they live on one of the fourteen properties identified and 
if the proposal goes forward it will result in only one of the three homes located within 
the R2 zone being eligible to have a secondary dwelling. They stated a preference that 
one secondary dwelling unit be allowed per primary dwelling versus per lot. 
Discussion ensued and the following comments were noted: 
 The Planner clarified that site-specific regulations could be looked at within the 
context of the larger Housing Review Project.  
 
The meeting was recessed for a break at 10:22 a.m. reconvened at 10:34 a.m. 
 
DE-2024-074 
It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee request staff to return the 
consideration of the Denman Island Temporary Use Permit Release Review 
Project and amendments to Bylaw No. 249 to a later meeting following 
considerations of the broader housing project timelines. 
CARRIED 
Trustee Graham returned to the meeting at 10:45 a.m. 
5. COMMUNITY INFORMATION MEETING - Proposed Bylaw Nos. 248 and 249 - Housing-Related 
Temporary Use Permit Review Project – deferred   
6. PUBLIC HEARING - deferred 
7. REPORTS 
7.1 Trustee Reports 
Trustee Graham reported electronic attendance at Trust Council and noted the arrival of 
new Chief Administrative Officer Rueben Bronee. 
 
Trustee Borthwick reported the following: 
 Attended Trust Council and met the new Chief Administrative Officer; 
 Acknowledged the work of Interim Chief Administrative Officer Mobbs; 

ADOPTED 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 3 of 8 
Local Trust Committee Minutes 
December 10, 2024 
 Attended semi-annual meeting of the Baynes Sound Marine Ecosystem Forum and 
highlighted discussion on ship breaking activity; and 
 Attended government to government meeting with K’omoks First Nation. 
7.2 Chair's Report 
Chair Maude reported the following: 
 Welcomed Chief Administrative Officer Rueben Bronee to Islands Trust; and 
 Continued attendance at Committee of the Whole meetings to move draft Trust 
Policy Statement work forward to First Reading in anticipation of commencing the 
public engagement process. 
7.3 Electoral Area Director's Report - none 
8. PUBLIC COMMENTS 
A member of the public stated affordable housing is an emergency, safe housing is needed, and 
they hope the Local Trust Committee treats the project with urgency. 
9. MINUTES 
9.1 Local Trust Committee Minutes dated October 8, 2024 - for adoption 
By general consent, the Local Trust Committee meeting minutes of October 8, 
2024 were adopted. 
9.2 Section 26 Resolutions-Without-Meeting Report dated December 3, 2024 
  Received for information. 
9.3 Advisory Planning Commission Minutes - none 
10. BUSINESS ARISING FROM MINUTES 
10.1 Follow-up Action List dated December 3, 2024 
The Planner noted the affordable housing project is complex but remains on track to 
complete before the end of the Trustee’s term.  
11. DELEGATIONS – none  
Item 12 was re-ordered and heard after Item 13.2. 
12. APPLICATIONS AND REFERRALS 
12.1 PLRZ20240055 (Denman Conservancy) - Preliminary Staff Report 
The Planner summarized the staff report and highlighted the following: 
 Application to rezone four parcels of land from forestry to conservation; 
 The parcels of land are owned and managed by the Denman Conservancy 
Association; 
 One of the parcels is split-zoned between forestry and agriculture and located 
within the Agricultural Land Reserve; and 
 Suggestion to amend bylaws to facilitate the rezoning process to enhance 
conservation efforts and support protection and preservation of the parcels. 

ADOPTED 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 4 of 8 
Local Trust Committee Minutes 
December 10, 2024 
Discussion ensued and the following comments and clarifications were noted: 
 There is opportunity for extending the existing conservation covenant to all of the 
parcels or placing a new conservation covenant on the parcels without; 
 Owner had intention to donate residential densities to the density bank and this 
should proceed regardless of the status of the TUP Review Project which is seeking 
to remove the density bank; and 
 The Agricultural Land Commission in the past has permitted land in the Agricultural 
Land Reserve to have a conservation covenant placed on it. 
DE-2024-075 
   It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee request staff to prepare a draft 
bylaw to amend the Denman Island Official Community Plan, 2008, to enable 
application PLRZ20240055 (Denman Conservancy Association).  
CARRIED 
DE-2024-76 
   It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee request staff to prepare a draft 
bylaw to amend Denman Island Land Use Bylaw, 2008, to enable application 
PLRZ20240055 (Denman Conservancy Association).  
CARRIED 
DE-2024-077 
   It was MOVED and SECONDED  
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee request staff to send an early 
referral of PLRZ20240055 (Denman Conservancy Association) to the Islands 
Trust Conservancy and Agricultural Land Commission for comment. 
CARRIED 
13. LOCAL TRUST COMMITTEE PROJECTS 
13.1 Minor Project: Housing-Related Temporary Use Permit Review - Post Public Hearing 
Staff Report - deferred 
13.2 Major Project: Denman Housing Review Project Update - Staff Report 
The Planner summarized the staff report. 
Discussion ensued on Phase 2A and the following comments were noted: 
 A Trustee asked if Action 7 “Expand Secondary Suites Permissions in water service 
areas” should be undertaken as a minor project. The Planner clarified the intention 
is for planners to work through the major project items together and it would not be 
necessary to separate this item from the major project; however, there is 
opportunity for a new minor project to be undertaken. 
DE-2024-078 
It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee request staff to come back with 
options for a minor project to the Local Trust Committee. 
CARRIED 

ADOPTED 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 5 of 8 
Local Trust Committee Minutes 
December 10, 2024 
Discussion ensued on Phase 2B and the following comments were noted: 
 Action 1  
o Agricultural Land Commission requires local governments to apply for 
exclusions; 
o Policy allowing exclusion from the Agricultural Land Reserve for affordable and 
special needs housing can be added to the Official Community Plan; 
o Definitions for terms such ‘affordable’, ‘rental’, and ‘market housing’ will be 
included; and 
o Affordability can only be maintained over time if there is a housing agreement. 
 
 Action 2 
o Subdivision bylaw already identifies exceptions to minimum parcel sizes for 
multifamily affordable housing and there is agreement to expand this exception 
to affordable housing in general; and 
o Suggestion to tie availability of providing single unit affordable housing to a 
housing agreement. 
 
 Action 3 
o Adding policies to support development variance for proof of water for 
cooperatives requires input from a freshwater specialist. 
 
 Action 4 
o Agreement to add policies to support home-based assisted living as a permitted 
home occupation; 
o Only allowing assisted living in a primary residence might be too restrictive; and 
o Consider specifying number of clients versus where the occupation occurs. 
 
 Action 5 
o Tiny home village is a number of small units located within a concentrated area; 
o Flexible housing provides an opportunity for units in addition to a principle and 
secondary dwellings; and 
o Support for rezoning for clustered small unit affordable housing on larger lots. 
 
 Action 6 
o Trustees expressed interest in allowing variations in housing that support 
shared facilities provided they are not vacation units; 
o This type of housing should be restricted to an affordable housing development 
operating with a housing agreement. 
 
Discussion ensued on Phase 2B “Additional Actions” and the following comments were 
noted: 
 Address affordable housing options in a way that indicates there is not interest in 
unrestricted growth; 
 Planner can provide language focussed on low environmental impact and 
supporting density that is focussed on providing affordable, special needs housing;  
 Community input will help identify areas for zoning to allow increased housing; and 
 Changing the reference for “the Village” to “Downtown Denman” in the Official 
Community Plan is problematic due to the number of times the term “the Village” is 
used and the need for consistency across bylaws. 

ADOPTED 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 6 of 8 
Local Trust Committee Minutes 
December 10, 2024 
DE-2024-079 
   It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee approve the next steps for 
completing Denman Island Housing Review Project (Stage 2, Phase 2B). 
CARRIED 
The meeting was recessed for a break at 12:15 p.m. and reconvened at 12:45 p.m. 
14. CORRESPONDENCE 
(Correspondence received concerning current applications or projects is posted to the LTC 
webpage) 
14.1 Letter dated November 26, 2024 from Denman Conservancy Association regarding ALR 
Land Development on Denman Island 
  Received for information.  
15. NEW BUSINESS - none 
16. STAFF REPORTS 
16.1 Phase 4 Community Engagement Options - Policy Statement Amendment Project - 
Staff Report 
The Senior Policy Advisor summarized the staff report and outlined the options for 
community engagement following First Reading of the draft Policy Statement. 
DE-2024-080 
It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that Denman Island Local Trust Committee select Engagement Option No. 1 for 
Phase 4 community engagement about the new draft Islands Trust Policy 
Statement. 
CARRIED 
16.2 Draft 2025/2026 Denman Island Local Trust Committee Meeting Schedule - Request 
for Decision 
The Local Trust Committee would like all of their regular meetings to be scheduled to be 
held in-person. 
   DE-2024-081 
   It was MOVED and SECONDED 
that Denman Island Local Trust Committee approve their January, 2025 to 
March, 2025 Meeting Schedule. 
CARRIED 
16.3 Highlights of the Trust Conservancy November 19th, 2024 Board Meeting 
  Received for information. 
16.4 Trust Conservancy - The Heron - Fall Edition 
  Received for information. 
16.5 Applications Report dated December 5, 2024 
Received for information. 

ADOPTED 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 7 of 8 
Local Trust Committee Minutes 
December 10, 2024 
16.6 Trustee and Local Expense Report - October, 2024 
  Received for information. 
16.7 Adopted Policies and Standing Resolutions 
  Received for information. 
16.8 First Nations Relationship Building Update  
DE-2024-082 
It was MOVED and SECONDED  
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee request staff to be ready to draft 
a letter of congratulations and introduction from the Denman Island Local Trust 
Committee to K’omoks First Nation following their January, 2025 election and 
reach out to schedule a meeting between the Local Trust Committee and the 
Chief and Council at their convenience.   
CARRIED 
16.9 Local Trust Committee Webpage 
  No updates are required at this time. 
17. WORK PROGRAM 
17.1 Active Projects Report dated December 3, 2024 
  Received for information. 
17.2 Future Projects Report dated December 3, 2024 
  Received for information. 
18. UPCOMING MEETINGS 
18.1 Next Regular Meeting Scheduled  
The next regular meeting will be held January 21, 2025 at 10:00 a.m. at the Denman 
Activity Centre, 1111 Northwest Road, Denman BC. 
19. ADJOURNMENT 
By general consent, the meeting was adjourned 1:15 p.m. 
 
_________________________ 
David Maude, Chair 
 
Certified Correct: 
 
_________________________ 
Lisa Millard, Meeting Administrator/Recorder