Denman Island Local Trust Committee regular meeting, December 12, 2024

[0:00:00] Voice 10: we're being live streamed. All right everybody, good evening. Another beautiful evening on the

[0:00:05] Voice 10: west coast and we didn't get the storm they were talking about so smiles all around.

[0:00:10] Voice 10: I just wanted to begin the meeting today by acknowledging that we're fortunate enough to

[0:00:15] Voice 10: be able to gather today in locations across the territory of the Coastalos people. It's

[0:00:20] Voice 10: a broad and vast and spectacular um so before us uh we have an agenda um and i will uh if anybody

[0:00:30] Voice 10: has any comments or concerns otherwise by general consent we'll adopt that agenda um i don't see

[0:00:37] Voice 10: any hands coming up so we will take it that the agenda is adopted um moving down we have

[0:00:45] Voice 10: adoptions of minutes of the draft committee of the whole meeting um of november 6th for a review

[0:00:51] Voice 10: and adoption does anybody have any comments or concerns about the minutes of november the 6th

[0:00:56] Voice 15: a point point of order

[0:00:58] Voice 10: excellent do

[0:01:00] Voice 15: we have a quorum we

[0:01:02] Voice 10: do have a quorum that was established

[0:01:05] Voice 15: okay i only count 12.

[0:01:08] Voice 10: okay well i was told there was a quorum so

[0:01:10] Voice 10: So, and Trustee Borthwick?

[0:01:14] Voice 22: Yeah, I was just going to ask a similar thing.

[0:01:17] Voice 22: I think we have 13, but I think quorum, we have to have 14.

[0:01:21] Voice 22: Am I right?

[0:01:25] Voice 10: I'm assuming somebody is counting all the little numbers there.

[0:01:30] Voice 22: Oh, I think we have, Trustee Evans has just joined us.

[0:01:33] Voice 22: So I think we might be over the line now.

[0:01:36] Voice 10: All right, Trustee Hunter, what do you?

[0:01:41] Voice 3: Yes, I was worried about the quorum thing.

[0:01:43] Voice 3: And I have to leave because I've got another issue going on.

[0:01:49] Voice 3: So you can count me out for the rest of the evening.

[0:01:52] Voice 3: I'm sorry.

[0:01:52] Voice 3: I would love to participate, but I have to leave.

[0:01:56] Voice 3: Thank you.

[0:01:56] Voice 10: Well, thank you for letting us know.

[0:02:00] Voice 22: Back

[0:02:01] Voice 10: to Trustee Borthwick.

[0:02:04] Voice 22: No, I think we're over the line now.

[0:02:06] Voice 22: I think Trustee Evans and Trustee Larone have just joined us.

[0:02:09] Voice 22: I think we're in good shape now.

[0:02:10] Voice 22: I'm sorry, I meant to lower my hand.

[0:02:12] Voice 22: Fair enough.

[0:02:13] Voice 22: Trustee Fass.

[0:02:15] Trustee Fast: yeah my question is just who is watching quorum when we're so close i

[0:02:24] Voice 27: was sorry chairman i'm

[0:02:26] Voice 27: counting and have quorum okay

[0:02:29] Voice 10: and you'll be monitoring that yes sir

[0:02:32] Voice 10: i'll say so trustee

[0:02:33] Voice 10: fast that is your answer alex will be will be the police officer for quorum so hopefully we

[0:02:41] Voice 10: keep going okay trustee getty i

[0:02:43] Voice 21: had a couple of small typos in the minutes and i've sent that

[0:02:46] Voice 21: a message to the staff i don't think it changes any of the um significant content

[0:02:53] Voice 21: all right two tiny amendments all

[0:02:57] Voice 10: right do you want to sort of uh verbalize or are they just

[0:03:00] Voice 10: so minor we just shouldn't have to worry about them at this point i

[0:03:04] Voice 21: think they're minor there's

[0:03:05] Voice 21: a spelling mistake on page eight and the um motion that was made uh number 26 uh referred to 3.4.8

[0:03:16] Voice 21: and it should have been 3.4.9

[0:03:19] I

[0:03:22] Voice 21: sent a message to Lori

[0:03:24] Voice 21: so those can be amended

[0:03:28] Voice 21: okay

[0:03:29] Voice 10: thank you very much

[0:03:30] Voice 10: so does anybody else have anything else with these minutes

[0:03:35] Voice 10: if not by consent we will be adopting

[0:03:38] Voice 10: those minutes of November the 6th

[0:03:43] Voice 10: and thank you Trustee Getty for the attention to details

[0:03:47] Voice 10: very much appreciated by everybody

[0:03:49] Voice 10: everybody. All right, so we'll move on to the follow-up action list and updates. So

[0:04:00] Voice 10: who is, is that Jason taking care of that, or is that you, Claire?

[0:04:06] Voice 19: I'm happy to take questions on

[0:04:07] Voice 19: this. I don't believe there's a need to walk you through it, so I'd be happy just to take questions

[0:04:12] Voice 19: if there are any.

[0:04:13] Voice 10: All right, anybody have any questions about the follow-up action report?

[0:04:15] Voice 10: report. No hands. So I think that makes sense to everybody. It's very, it's long, but it

[0:04:27] Voice 10: is detailed. We very much appreciate that. All right. So we moved down to definition

[0:04:34] Voice 10: of prioritize in the draft new policy statement. There's a briefing there. I think is that

[0:04:44] Voice 10: that clear is that jason on that i'd

[0:04:48] Voice 1: be happy to introduce this item uh chairman go ahead thank you

[0:04:52] Voice 1: all right thank you sir uh so first of all apologies for this like somewhat esoteric

[0:04:58] Voice 1: contribution to your discussion um committee of the whole had asked for a definition of the word

[0:05:03] Voice 1: prioritize as that term is used in the draft new policy statement uh those of you who've read the

[0:05:08] Voice 1: report will note that we did not provide such a definition though we did give you some dictionary

[0:05:12] Voice 1: dictionary definitions that that sort of help guide you in a in a direction um the gist of the

[0:05:17] Voice 1: report is really this that you know there is there are benefits and drawbacks of defining things or

[0:05:23] Voice 1: not defining things uh in leaving things undefined you create some flexibility for yourself in terms

[0:05:30] Voice 1: of how you uh apply the term or how you interpret the application of the term

[0:05:35] Voice 3: I'm fucking bucked up.

[0:05:39] Voice 12: Sorry.

[0:05:44] Voice 1: Surely he couldn't have been talking to me.

[0:05:48] Voice 7: He's muted now.

[0:05:50] Voice 9: I muted myself.

[0:05:52] Voice 9: I'm sorry.

[0:05:54] Voice 9: You made us smile, which is a good thing.

[0:05:58] Voice 9: Go ahead, Plenty Owens.

[0:06:00] Voice 1: Okay.

[0:06:00] Voice 1: So flexibility in leading terms, undefined.

[0:06:04] Voice 1: And then the more narrowly you define a term, the more expectation that that creates that you're going to behave in a certain way in your actions or decisions in keeping with the definition that you create for that term.

[0:06:15] Voice 1: So if that is this body's intention to create some certainty around a term, how a term is used, we can certainly create a definition for you.

[0:06:24] Voice 1: But it's been my experience, I think, in observing elected officials that, you know, they and or you don't necessarily want to fetter your decision making abilities some of the time beyond, you know, the other policies that guide the decisions that you do make.

[0:06:42] Voice 1: in asking for a definition of prioritize it also struck us that if there are specific ways that you

[0:06:50] Voice 1: want to operationalize the prioritization of certain things in this document then rather in

[0:06:58] Voice 1: the definitions section or the glossary of this document it would make more sense that that be

[0:07:04] Voice 1: part of the implementation section of the document for example like if there are specific

[0:07:08] Voice 1: specific um decisions or tasks or or processes that you think should be undertaken to prioritize

[0:07:16] Voice 1: the protection of the ecosystems that are identified in the document for example

[0:07:20] Voice 1: we can help create that for you and and share that with you and you can ponder whether it

[0:07:27] Voice 1: gets to your intention and uh i think i'll just leave it there unless claire has anything she'd

[0:07:34] Voice 1: like to to add beyond that okay

[0:07:36] Voice 10: thank you very much so director fader anything further or

[0:07:41] Voice 19: nothing

[0:07:42] Voice 19: to

[0:07:42] Voice 10: add thank you excellent operate so trustees any questions or comments on this okay trustee graham

[0:07:53] Voice 6: thank you chair um i really appreciate the fact that uh priority has been given a definition

[0:07:59] Voice 6: uh considering uh that it is to designate or treat as more important than other things it's been

[0:08:06] Voice 6: my understanding from the very first time I was a trustee that the difference, the fundamental

[0:08:11] Voice 6: difference of being a trustee as opposed to a commissioner is that we have this overarching

[0:08:15] Voice 6: responsibility to the natural environment. Municipalities and regional districts don't

[0:08:20] Voice 6: really follow that philosophy. They're more about growth and looking at the benefits of their

[0:08:28] Voice 6: constituents. But we have a unique perspective on prioritizing the protection of the environment,

[0:08:35] Voice 6: environment, which actually serves the constituents better than any economic perspective.

[0:08:40] Voice 6: I know that there's a concern that if we prioritize the environment, we don't take as much concern

[0:08:48] Voice 6: and consideration in our communities, but that's just not true.

[0:08:51] Voice 6: I think both can happen concurrently.

[0:08:54] Voice 6: So I like the fact that the Trust has the protection of the natural environment as its

[0:09:00] Voice 6: number one priority.

[0:09:03] Voice 10: Excellent.

[0:09:03] Voice 10: Thank you.

[0:09:04] Voice 10: Trustee Patrick?

[0:09:06] Voice 15: No, I have no worries at all about the way it's stated, number one priorities.

[0:09:13] Voice 15: And I agree with Planner Yeomans that leaving it flexible.

[0:09:18] Voice 15: I'm looking forward to the implementation phase conversations that we're going to have.

[0:09:22] Voice 15: And I think that's a really good place to have that conversation.

[0:09:26] Voice 15: So no definition necessary.

[0:09:29] Voice 15: Excellent.

[0:09:30] Voice 15: Trustee Yates?

[0:09:32] Voice 26: Oh, thank you, David.

[0:09:33] Voice 26: David, I just wanted to echo what Trustee Graham said about prioritizing the environment in our job.

[0:09:43] Voice 26: I would not be a trustee if we were not prioritizing the environment.

[0:09:49] Voice 26: So thank you very much for saying that.

[0:09:52] Voice 10: Excellent. Well, thank you.

[0:09:55] Voice 10: All right. If nobody else has any of the comments, thank you very much, Planner Yeomans.

[0:10:01] Voice 10: It seems that this has landed very, very well

[0:10:04] Voice 10: and well written and well laid out

[0:10:06] Voice 10: and very much appreciated.

[0:10:10] Voice 10: And Trustee H, oh, you got your hand.

[0:10:12] Voice 10: Thank you.

[0:10:14] Voice 10: All right.

[0:10:15] Voice 10: So I guess we can move down

[0:10:19] Voice 10: to our Policy Statement Amendment Project.

[0:10:22] Voice 10: Tourism, Hazard, Forest, Ecosystem Policies

[0:10:25] Voice 10: Request for Decision.

[0:10:27] Voice 10: And I take it that's back to Planner Yeomans again.

[0:10:30] Voice 1: Indeed it is.

[0:10:31] Voice 1: Thank you, Chair Maude.

[0:10:33] Voice 1: So this is a bit of an omnibus request for decision that bundles together several requests that were made of staff over a number of Committee of the Whole meetings of the past months.

[0:10:45] Voice 1: Those being the specific requests that were made were a request for staff to develop and return to Committee of the Whole a policy to manage tourism in a sustainable manner.

[0:10:56] Voice 1: a request to staff to consider editing item 3.4.6 to maintain the original intention but

[0:11:03] Voice 1: improve the grammar fair point and a direction to staff to seek a qualified biologist to review

[0:11:12] Voice 1: draft policy 3.3.3 to assess if the phrase and associated ecosystems is required and so this

[0:11:18] Voice 1: RFD brings together all three of those requests from from committee of the whole would you like

[0:11:25] Voice 1: to move through each of those in turn and speak to give a little bit of background on on the

[0:11:29] Voice 1: recommendation being made and why it's being made i think that's a wise way to proceed yes please

[0:11:35] Voice 1: okay on the recommendation that we uh develop and include a tourism policy

[0:11:42] Voice 1: the reality was we we didn't really have much to go on here um it's um in asking claire

[0:11:48] Voice 1: and and learning a little bit about the previous community engagement that had been done

[0:11:52] Voice 1: done in the earlier phases of the policy statement, it didn't seem as though tourism had sort of risen

[0:11:57] Voice 1: to the fore as a priority issue. And therefore, not a lot of thought had been given necessarily

[0:12:03] Voice 1: to developing any policies related there too. So we did return to the last time that the Islands

[0:12:09] Voice 1: Trust undertook sort of a comprehensive tourism planning initiative, which was way back in 2006.

[0:12:15] Voice 1: And we simply drew on some language that the consultant who was hired at that time and worked

[0:12:20] Voice 1: with the local community around what tourism policy in the policy statement might look like

[0:12:26] Voice 1: and just sort of cribbed from the good work that they had done at that time.

[0:12:30] Voice 1: And so all you really wind up with then as a result is that the existing policy 3.4.7

[0:12:38] Voice 1: in the draft new policy statement has the word tourism added to it. So instead of it saying

[0:12:44] Voice 1: support economic activities that are compatible with the preservation and protection of the trust

[0:12:48] Voice 1: trust area and its unique amenities, environment, and community character.

[0:12:51] Voice 1: It now says support economic and tourism activities that are compatible with the preservation

[0:12:56] Voice 1: and protection of the trust area and its unique amenities, environment, and character.

[0:13:02] Voice 1: Now, if you feel as though that's sort of insufficient to capture the issues that need

[0:13:10] Voice 1: to be addressed in this higher level policy, I think we're certainly, well, you know, up

[0:13:15] Voice 1: for a more fulsome discussion here at this table to sort of learn if there are specific concerns

[0:13:20] Voice 1: that do need to be addressed in the policy, either to encourage certain types of tourism

[0:13:25] Voice 1: or discourage other certain types of tourism. So I will leave that with you. Do you want to,

[0:13:32] Voice 1: sorry, Chair Maude, do you want to move to a discussion now on that topic before we move to

[0:13:36] Voice 1: the next?

[0:13:37] Voice 10: I think this is wise, is that if we tackle these one at a time, and then we won't

[0:13:42] Voice 10: get lost as we go down uh so trustees do you any sort of um cause for concern or questions about

[0:13:49] Voice 10: um this statement trustee

[0:13:54] Voice 21: getty i think that tourism is a huge topic and i think that um

[0:14:00] Voice 21: you know it might in terms of um whether or not a whole study goes into the policy statement

[0:14:07] Voice 21: statement, I think if we leave it as suggested, that it might get us through this stage. But I

[0:14:17] Voice 21: think at some point we have to have a fairly, I think it would be helpful if we had some sort of

[0:14:24] Voice 21: a more detailed discussion about it. You know, maybe we could add sustainable in the beginning

[0:14:31] Voice 21: of this phrase to point us in a certain direction um but it is it's a huge topic and it's very

[0:14:38] Voice 21: different for people that are you know on a very busy ferry line and as opposed to people that are

[0:14:44] Voice 21: more remote and um just you know what whatever the attractions are so and i think we've got all

[0:14:51] Voice 21: got different um issues in terms of whether or not there's any kind of accommodation and whether

[0:14:56] Voice 21: people get stranded and they just sleep in the fields and you know you end up in somebody in

[0:15:01] Voice 21: your driveway but um you know i think that the general policy statement as suggested um will

[0:15:11] Voice 21: get us by but i think it's a much bigger issue so i wouldn't mind maybe thinking about putting

[0:15:17] Voice 21: sustainable in there but again that's one of those undefined difficult to sort out

[0:15:26] Voice 21: but at least we're pointing in the right direction excellent

[0:15:29] Voice 10: thank you for that feedback trustee

[0:15:31] Voice 10: Harris hi

[0:15:34] Voice 8: yes sorry for the confusion um I swear the legal opinion that we heard not that long ago

[0:15:40] Voice 8: said that um a balanced approach was a point

[0:15:45] Trustee Fast: of order was

[0:15:46] Voice 8: something that um was mandated

[0:15:49] Voice 8: mandated to do

[0:15:53] Trustee Fast: this is closed not needing

[0:15:56] Trustee Fast: information not

[0:15:57] Voice 8: um I'm sorry I'm

[0:15:58] Trustee Fast: speaking until I get

[0:16:00] Trustee Fast: get acknowledged for my point of order.

[0:16:02] Voice 8: Okay, Trustee Fass.

[0:16:04] Voice 8: I don't, I can't hear what

[0:16:06] Trustee Fast: you're saying, sorry.

[0:16:06] Voice 8: Thank you very much.

[0:16:08] Trustee Fast: I'm wondering if the language could be adjusted

[0:16:09] Trustee Fast: to not speak of privileged information

[0:16:13] Trustee Fast: from closed meetings, closed to the public.

[0:16:20] Voice 10: Okay, so Trustee Harris, do you want to sort of.

[0:16:25] Voice 8: I don't think I was doing that, but,

[0:16:26] Voice 8: and I'm

[0:16:28] Trustee Fast: very concerned actually with what I'm seeing here.

[0:16:30] Trustee Fast: There's

[0:16:30] Voice 8: stuff about forest ecosystems

[0:16:31] Trustee Fast: and unfrequented.

[0:16:32] Trustee Fast: from the chair of the meeting yes

[0:16:35] Voice 10: i have a great trustee fast i've agreed with

[0:16:38] Voice 8: you i just did hear

[0:16:39] Voice 10: from the chair so trustee harris if you could sort of rephrase it not referring yeah i'm i'm

[0:16:46] Voice 8: actually feeling i'm feeling kind of unsafe at this moment um okay so

[0:16:53] Voice 8: happy to see people are

[0:16:54] Voice 8: taking glee with their uh interruptions um yeah i'm really concerned with the language i'm hearing

[0:17:02] Voice 8: hearing here. You know, we've heard other things that are contrary to what's being said. This

[0:17:09] Voice 8: thing about forest ecosystems is quite alarming. Yeah, I'm not surprised, but I'll just keep

[0:17:18] Voice 8: paying attention.

[0:17:24] Voice 10: Okay, thank you, Trustee Harris. Trustee Fast.

[0:17:28] Trustee Fast: Thank you, Chair. I'm wondering

[0:17:32] Trustee Fast: about the word tourism as well um i like having it included here as staff have suggested um

[0:17:41] Trustee Fast: and it says and as compatible with compatible with sorry uh unique amenities environment and

[0:17:47] Trustee Fast: community character um i'm wondering if that's enough uh is q by in saying compatible with

[0:17:56] Trustee Fast: with community character, does that get at the issue

[0:18:00] Trustee Fast: of congestion at the ferries?

[0:18:04] Trustee Fast: I don't know if that's a community character issue

[0:18:08] Trustee Fast: or whether there needs to be something in there

[0:18:12] Trustee Fast: about transportation capacity or something

[0:18:18] Trustee Fast: because what we've experienced on Bowen

[0:18:21] Trustee Fast: and maybe it's different for other islands,

[0:18:23] Trustee Fast: But just in the past few years, we've had a very sudden increase in tourism and including walk-on tourism.

[0:18:35] Trustee Fast: And it's made a big difference to how residents can access the ferry.

[0:18:41] Trustee Fast: And so I'm wondering if ferry capacity, ferry accessibility, something, transportation accessibility, what do people think?

[0:18:51] Trustee Fast: I'm interested. Thank you.

[0:18:53] Voice 10: Okay, thank you. Maybe just pass it back to Planner Yeomans, just maybe if he could give a little bit of guidance there.

[0:19:01] Voice 1: Yeah, I think some of the language that Trustee Fast has proposed would slot in quite nicely. I think transportation and infrastructure capacity, transportation capacity, if you want to just call it infrastructure capacity. I'm not sure what the best terminology necessarily is. We can go away and workshop that a little bit.

[0:19:20] Voice 1: it um bearing in mind i i think i made one quick note in my in my briefing or the background to it

[0:19:27] Voice 1: that um you guys you can't necessarily control who comes to the island like you control the zoning

[0:19:37] Voice 1: that um creates the activities or lack thereof that people might want to engage in or their

[0:19:42] Voice 1: ability to stay on the island if you permit commercial accommodation there's not a whole

[0:19:47] Voice 1: whole lot you can do short of your advocacy work directly with bc ferries to try and encourage them

[0:19:53] Voice 1: to change their practices or change their policies and i you know welcome to be corrected here if i'm

[0:19:59] Voice 1: wrong but it's hard to stop people from hopping on the boat and coming to your beautiful islands

[0:20:03] Voice 1: no

[0:20:04] Voice 10: fair enough fair enough okay so if you're so noted um you've got something that you can

[0:20:09] Voice 10: perhaps work with trustee peterson uh

[0:20:15] Voice 5: thank you chair um i'm just uh looking at this and uh

[0:20:21] Voice 5: i think this is actually quite quite suitable um as mentioned with the definition

[0:20:31] Voice 5: discussion a moment ago i think that um community character is something that is uh

[0:20:40] Voice 5: It's perfectly reasonable to be defined by the local trust committee and that concerns around, for example, transportation and infrastructure and how that impacts the community character can be captured within that interpretive role of trustees.

[0:21:02] Voice 5: trustees. And other than that, I think this is a balanced statement here. And I agree with it as

[0:21:11] Voice 5: yes, I'm fine with that. Thank you.

[0:21:13] Voice 10: Thank you. Trustee Borthwick.

[0:21:17] Voice 22: Yeah, definitely a little bit of what Trustee Peterson in there is saying. This has been one

[0:21:22] Voice 22: of the, this is obviously a very interesting topic for those of us on Denman and Hornby where

[0:21:29] Voice 22: where, you know, in order to get to Ormby, you must pass through Denman.

[0:21:33] Voice 22: And so their different definition of what tourism means in their community,

[0:21:38] Voice 22: which is fine, it's their right to define that, has a direct impact on us.

[0:21:44] Voice 22: One of the things that I found really fascinating,

[0:21:46] Voice 22: going back to the oft-mentioned 1986 definition of unique amenities, etc.,

[0:21:57] Voice 22: talks about um you know self-sufficiency um and and um developing like compatible and

[0:22:07] Voice 22: sustainable economic development um which in in small part for many islands is a tour is a factor

[0:22:15] Voice 22: of tourism that is a the the nature of these places and the fact that we are you know by the

[0:22:19] Voice 22: mandate you know doing this on behalf of the of the province means that we are going to have people

[0:22:24] Voice 22: who come here and that's that's a good thing they they enrich our communities in lots of ways

[0:22:28] Voice 22: um and i would agree with trustee peterson in that um you know i like the language that's that's kind

[0:22:34] Voice 22: of showing up here and i would agree um oh i forget who was talking about the inclusion of

[0:22:40] Voice 22: sustainable i think it was judy getty was talking about the the yeah um that inclusion of that

[0:22:45] Voice 22: language and and yeah i would i would like i think each island is going to have a very different

[0:22:49] Voice 22: definition of what sustaining their rural character means and what's appropriate for tourism um you

[0:22:55] Voice 22: know a a form of tourism that may be appropriate on uh you know on salt spring may not be possible

[0:23:02] Voice 22: or appropriate on liskiti um and that's fine that's that's good um and also this policy

[0:23:09] Voice 22: statement is hopefully going to be a document that helps um helps us harmonize when those

[0:23:16] Voice 22: impacts may impact other islands. So for example, I would hope that the policy statement would

[0:23:21] Voice 22: bring us to a place where we're able to negotiate some of how those impacts of, say, Hornby's

[0:23:27] Voice 22: tourism hits Denman. And I, yeah, I mean, I would agree with Jason Yeomans about there's a lot of

[0:23:34] Voice 22: factors to this whole conversation that are completely out of our control and are just not

[0:23:39] Voice 22: ours to define but you know what what sorts of tourism we we encourage and and um support uh

[0:23:47] Voice 22: do have impacts on our islands but i think that the people who are best placed to to define that

[0:23:52] Voice 22: are going to be the local trust committees thank

[0:23:55] Voice 10: you very much trustee patrick oh

[0:23:58] Voice 15: i'm the one that

[0:23:59] Voice 15: pushed requesting this and you all agreed um the levels of uh visitors i think compounded

[0:24:09] Voice 15: with the growth that we're seeing is really reaching higher frustration levels. I think

[0:24:14] Voice 15: we've all seen that. The ferries are busier, everything's busier, and it's always hard

[0:24:18] Voice 15: to say, well, who done it? But I think it's an international or world trend that there's

[0:24:28] Voice 15: a lot more attention being put to tourism. So I'm not sure if this is going to do it

[0:24:35] Voice 15: enough. I know in our OCP, we say the growth of tourism is managed in a way that does not

[0:24:43] Voice 15: displace or detract from our community's important function as a home for its residents.

[0:24:47] Voice 15: And then we go on and have policies about economic and growth and tourism. So we haven't really

[0:24:53] Voice 15: dealt with that one issue. How do we manage tourism and what tools and things do we have

[0:24:59] Voice 15: have available to ensure that we do stay as a primary residential-based group of violence.

[0:25:06] Voice 15: So that, I don't have an answer, and I don't know if this is, maybe this is going to have to do for

[0:25:11] Voice 15: now, and it goes on the implementation list of more to do, but I think it's an area we're going

[0:25:16] Voice 15: to only see more pressure as trustees.

[0:25:20] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Patrick. Trustee Elliott.

[0:25:23] Voice 24: Thank you, Chair. Great discussion. Would the word responsible tourism be an option

[0:25:31] Voice 24: sustainable tourism um i think unless you're having sort of a certifying system like what

[0:25:38] Voice 24: is sustainable tourism um responsible tourism i don't know i i've seen this uh for instance on

[0:25:45] Voice 24: iceland's um tourism website and they talk a lot about sustainability they have a lot of fragile

[0:25:51] Voice 24: unique ecosystems um so that could be one option and then how do we that support sorry what was

[0:26:00] Voice 24: the wording again uh maintains community character and health um healthy communities this is some of

[0:26:07] Voice 24: the wording we're starting to hear what is a healthy well-balanced community and that's different

[0:26:13] Voice 24: everywhere um character doesn't do it and do quite enough for me character is

[0:26:22] Voice 24: um it kind of speaks to the look and the feel of a place uh but to me health speaks to more

[0:26:29] Voice 24: or being responsive to the residents who live there and the balance that they feel is needed to protect their community's interests and well-being.

[0:26:40] Voice 24: So just throwing those words out there, responsible tourism and potentially community character and health. Thanks.

[0:26:48] Voice 10: Thank you. Staff, did you want to weigh in at all as to the good or bad of the adjusting of the wording?

[0:26:59] Voice 1: No, I don't think I have anything to add. At least not anything based on professional expertise, personal opinion, perhaps.

[0:27:08] Voice 1: All

[0:27:09] Voice 10: right. So you've got it noted. So it's something flagged for review. Okay, Trustee Yates.

[0:27:19] Voice 26: Thank you, Chair Mouad. Firstly, I support Trustee Getty's idea of putting in the word sustainable. I know it's nebulous, but we all know what it means. So it doesn't hurt to put it in there.

[0:27:31] Voice 26: there. Secondly, I like Trustee Elliott's idea of adding, you know, the health of a community

[0:27:38] Voice 26: along with community character. And I also support Trustee Fast's idea of dealing with

[0:27:48] Voice 26: transportation capacity or transportation limitations. I totally agree with other

[0:27:53] Voice 26: trustees that we don't have any control, really, of who wants to come over and visit us. But

[0:27:58] Voice 26: But when we work with our local chambers of commerce, which we certainly do here on Gabriola, we talk about ferry capacity.

[0:28:07] Voice 26: We also talk about whether we have a bus to get them around, whether people should be cycling.

[0:28:13] Voice 26: We talk about when we approve, for example, a temporary use permit for a short-term vacation rental.

[0:28:19] Voice 26: We talk about how close they are to the village, to the ferry, whether people can walk, cycle, that kind of thing.

[0:28:27] Voice 26: So I think in the policy statement, it really doesn't hurt to say something about transportation capacity slash limitations.

[0:28:39] Voice 26: And then, of course, the local trust committees have that as their backing when they want to talk about active transportation and transportation limitations.

[0:28:49] Voice 26: And also, as a member of the Ferry Advisory Committee, for now anyway, it doesn't hurt to have something in the Trust Policy Statement that does talk about limitations to our access to the island.

[0:29:05] Voice 26: Thank you.

[0:29:06] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Yates.

[0:29:08] Voice 10: Trustee Graham.

[0:29:09] Voice 6: Thank you, Chair.

[0:29:12] Voice 6: This is such an interesting conversation.

[0:29:14] Voice 6: conversation I'm trying to think of how the policy statement would be used by a local trust committee

[0:29:19] Voice 6: because that really is its function how does it work how do we use it so each island is looking

[0:29:25] Voice 6: at this particular policy and they're trying to see if it speaks to their particular situation

[0:29:29] Voice 6: and the word that crops up on them and frequently is the word scale is is our local situation

[0:29:37] Voice 6: in scale with our island values and so it would be helpful I think if the policy statement addressed

[0:29:42] Voice 6: address the fact that that particular economic activity should be in scale with island values.

[0:29:48] Voice 6: Thank you.

[0:29:50] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Graham. Trustee Fast.

[0:29:56] Trustee Fast: Thank you, Chair. Sorry about that.

[0:30:00] Trustee Fast: This is a great conversation.

[0:30:01] Trustee Fast: I like what I'm hearing about using the word sustainable

[0:30:06] Trustee Fast: in front of tourism, health in front of community.

[0:30:10] Trustee Fast: The InScale idea is great.

[0:30:13] Trustee Fast: Thank you for people picking up on the transportation capacity

[0:30:18] Trustee Fast: kind of issues we all have.

[0:30:22] Trustee Fast: We need to use boats to get to our islands.

[0:30:25] Trustee Fast: I wonder, just a word to follow up on community character.

[0:30:33] Trustee Fast: I've heard, just bringing out more of my concern with the words community character, is that I hear them being so close to Metro Vancouver.

[0:30:44] Trustee Fast: I hear them being used to prevent or oppose affordable housing, changes that would any kind of changes to establish neighborhoods that have large houses on large lots, very large trees anyway.

[0:31:03] Trustee Fast: anyway, and they don't want changes. And this is just an example. But I wonder if we include

[0:31:12] Trustee Fast: the word community character, would that change, would that stop us from doing some of the

[0:31:22] Trustee Fast: reconciliation actions that some of us might be hoping for, wanting to lay a path towards?

[0:31:32] Trustee Fast: um uh would it be i i don't know maybe staff could tell me has the the words community character

[0:31:41] Trustee Fast: uh been used yet to uh oppose changes to housing or some of the changes that we might be working

[0:31:50] Trustee Fast: towards it just seems to me to be kind of uh uh make uh baking in the community character of now

[0:32:01] Trustee Fast: now. And I'm not sure that's what we're intending. So I'd be interested in what other trustees

[0:32:07] Trustee Fast: think about this. Thank you.

[0:32:11] Voice 10: Okay. Did you want to get some feedback from

[0:32:13] Voice 10: Mount Plano Yeomanis on that or just? Yes, please.

[0:32:19] Voice 1: I'm certainly aware. My

[0:32:21] Trustee Fast: question was, yeah, just has it been used that way before? I don't expect

[0:32:25] Trustee Fast: you to weigh in on the whole thing.

[0:32:27] Voice 1: I mean, I think I'm probably anecdotally familiar with

[0:32:30] Voice 1: some of the situations you're talking about trustee fast in places like shaughnessy or

[0:32:34] Voice 1: for example where heaven forbid their community character be destroyed right um

[0:32:40] Voice 1: i i am not familiar with any particular examples of it being used here in the islands but my my

[0:32:47] Voice 1: experience in the islands really is is limited to my time on salt spring um i think there's a

[0:32:53] Voice 1: conversation taking place in the community right now about island character but when i when i hear

[0:33:00] Voice 1: community character i think about like the actual like almost the aesthetics of the community like

[0:33:06] Voice 1: if you lived in like a little gingerbread bavarian town and somebody wanted to propose something that

[0:33:11] Voice 1: was not of the gingerbread bavarian architecture style but you know i'm sure you've all visited

[0:33:17] Voice 1: ganges on your visits to trust council like i don't know how you describe that community

[0:33:22] Voice 1: character it's eclectic and so and so um that's so i'm not i haven't heard that term used very

[0:33:30] Voice 1: very limited view from my part.

[0:33:33] Voice 10: Okay, thank you, Planner Yeomans.

[0:33:36] Voice 10: Trustee Luckham.

[0:33:39] Voice 7: So I might be a lone voice here,

[0:33:44] Voice 7: but there's a certain element of humor in this

[0:33:47] Voice 7: and that I'm totally satisfied

[0:33:49] Voice 7: with what's contained in the report

[0:33:54] Voice 7: that we, by general consent,

[0:33:57] Voice 7: adopt adding the word tourism.

[0:33:59] Voice 7: although um i can't see it here i have to look over there because that's where it is but um

[0:34:06] Voice 7: i i wonder about trying to expand or define the word tourism any further than it is of its essence

[0:34:16] Voice 7: as tourism because if you want to expand on tourism do you also want to expand on economic

[0:34:22] Voice 7: because clearly that would need to meet all the same criteria for which you've articulated for

[0:34:29] Voice 7: for tourism. And in fact, compatible with Preservation, Protect, Trust Area, Unique

[0:34:36] Voice 7: Amenities, etc., actually captures everything that I think each of you has said. The humor in this

[0:34:45] Voice 7: is, as much as I love tourism on Cedars Island, it's great. It's been a significant benefit. I'm

[0:34:54] Voice 7: is not tourism an economic activity?

[0:34:57] Voice 7: And so do we actually need to place the word in there?

[0:35:01] Voice 7: I'm happy to place the word in there,

[0:35:02] Voice 7: but I'm just asking the question

[0:35:05] Voice 7: whether we need to expand on the word tourism

[0:35:09] Voice 7: more so than anything else.

[0:35:12] Voice 10: That's it.

[0:35:13] Voice 10: Thank you, Christy.

[0:35:13] Voice 10: Luck and food for thought.

[0:35:17] Voice 10: Christy Evans.

[0:35:19] Voice 17: Thanks.

[0:35:20] Voice 17: I've really enjoyed this conversation this far

[0:35:22] Voice 17: and in agreeance with most of what's been brought up,

[0:35:26] Voice 17: On South Panda, we have had issues with defining the community character.

[0:35:34] Voice 17: So I would be reluctant to include that wording in here just because of how it's been used.

[0:35:40] Voice 17: It has been a problem.

[0:35:43] Voice 17: Rural character and community character have both been problematic with our bylaws.

[0:35:48] Voice 17: But I'm happy to have the sustainable and the healthy.

[0:35:54] Voice 17: Those were great.

[0:35:56] Voice 17: So I'd definitely throw my support behind those.

[0:35:59] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Evans.

[0:36:01] Voice 10: Trustee Peterson.

[0:36:04] Voice 5: Yeah, thank you.

[0:36:05] Voice 5: And thank you, Trustee Evans, because it's good to know that that's problematic in some places, the community character.

[0:36:19] Voice 5: Because I was just about to say that the fact that it's, just reiterate my earlier point that the interpretation of a term like that is essentially up to the local trust committee of the day.

[0:36:36] Voice 5: But hearing that it's problematic in some communities, I'm more open to finding another way to address it.

[0:36:50] Voice 5: I think what I'm kind of sticking to, though, is I don't want to get too detailed, in a sense, on how we define this policy so that it does fit the varying islands.

[0:37:10] Voice 5: It's important that this is applicable from all the way up the scale from Luskete through Saturna, Pender, and to Salt Spring.

[0:37:19] Voice 5: I mean, if we're not making statements that are especially directive policies that are suitable through the whole scale, then that's really problematic.

[0:37:32] Voice 5: So, again, thank you, Trustee Evans.

[0:37:36] Voice 5: That's food for thought.

[0:37:37] Voice 5: And I'm going to be rethinking on how I approach this.

[0:37:43] Voice 5: I was just going to say, hey, let's stick with this because we can all somewhat define it to our own areas.

[0:37:51] Voice 5: But if it's problematic in some communities, I take that seriously.

[0:37:54] Voice 5: Thank you.

[0:37:55] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Peters.

[0:37:58] Voice 10: Does anybody else have any sort of comments on this section, or can we move on?

[0:38:05] Voice 20: I have a question, but I can't figure out how to get my hand up.

[0:38:09] Voice 10: Okay.

[0:38:10] Voice 10: Well, we all have that problem.

[0:38:13] Voice 10: It's under reaction.

[0:38:14] Voice 10: So you have to hit the little smiley face, and the hand comes up.

[0:38:18] Voice 10: It's well hidden.

[0:38:19] Voice 10: But, Trustee Morrison, go ahead.

[0:38:20] Voice 10: it so

[0:38:24] Voice 20: um i have to just note that i'm not that excited about tourism being in here at all

[0:38:31] Voice 20: um and of course i'm coming into this conversation after we have you know you have had multiple

[0:38:39] Voice 20: meetings that i was not or just didn't appear on my calendar so i wasn't aware that they were there

[0:38:45] Voice 20: so i'm probably throwing a wrench in that but i'm not really understanding why tourism gets a

[0:38:55] Voice 20: specific sort of policy note in the trust policy statement so i'm just having trouble that so i

[0:39:05] Voice 20: just want to make sure that whatever kind of summation we have of this it's certainly not

[0:39:09] Voice 20: by general consent because i am not consenting to a tourism policy

[0:39:13] Voice 10: maybe director fader could

[0:39:17] Voice 10: could fill in the blank I think this is a legacy definition that's been there in the past or

[0:39:24] Voice 10: it's something like that Director Frater?

[0:39:27] Voice 19: No this well certainly this recommendation is a legacy

[0:39:30] Voice 19: idea that came about from an early 2000s tourism forum that Islands Trust held and then did some

[0:39:36] Voice 19: policy work on and as is the Islands Trust way subsequently had an election and moved off to

[0:39:41] Voice 19: something new so it never got implemented but certainly this request to include the concept

[0:39:47] Voice 19: of tourism came from committee of the whole you asked us the staff to go back and then bring

[0:39:51] Voice 19: forward some recommendations to you to call this out as a you know again it states economic

[0:39:56] Voice 19: opportunities but you're choosing this sector of the economy as something you want to name I guess

[0:40:01] Voice 19: more specifically rather than any other economic sector so we're bringing this back at your request

[0:40:06] Voice 19: yeah and I just I just want it to be clear

[0:40:10] Voice 20: in the like public sign and the meeting minutes

[0:40:12] Voice 20: that the conversation around Section 3

[0:40:15] Voice 20: that named tourism as a highlighted area

[0:40:18] Voice 20: was something I disagreed with.

[0:40:21] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Morrison.

[0:40:23] Voice 10: Hey, Trustee Yates.

[0:40:26] Voice 26: Thank you, Chair Mott.

[0:40:27] Voice 26: I certainly appreciate Trustee Morrison

[0:40:30] Voice 26: and Trustee Luckham's comments

[0:40:32] Voice 26: about having tourism listed separately.

[0:40:35] Voice 26: But the reason we do is because that is such a huge part

[0:40:40] Voice 26: part of of not just our economy on these you know trust islands but if it's not a part of

[0:40:48] Voice 26: your economy it's certainly a part of your seasonal transportation woes and you know i mean

[0:40:56] Voice 26: i just had a conversation today with uh the ed of our chamber of commerce and it always comes down

[0:41:02] Voice 26: to tourism and so it it probably because it is so important for most of the islands it probably

[0:41:10] Voice 26: does need to have special mention.

[0:41:13] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Yeggs. Trustee Boland.

[0:41:18] Voice 16: Yeah, I take the other points and I wonder if we, but both sides, tourism has a huge impact

[0:41:25] Voice 16: like really disproportionate to other economic activities because of the nature of the,

[0:41:34] Voice 16: you know, the islands. So what about support economic activities, including tourism,

[0:41:41] Voice 16: that are compatible with preservation and protection,

[0:41:45] Voice 16: et cetera, et cetera.

[0:41:46] Voice 16: And I do like the idea of the health of the community

[0:41:49] Voice 16: as opposed to the community character,

[0:41:52] Voice 16: which is a kind of a baked in moment in time.

[0:41:56] Voice 16: I'd love to put in something like evolving community character,

[0:42:00] Voice 16: but that might be a step too far.

[0:42:03] Voice 16: Okay, thanks.

[0:42:04] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Bowen.

[0:42:06] Voice 10: Trustee Patrick.

[0:42:07] Voice 15: I just, for the benefit of Trustee Morrison,

[0:42:10] Voice 15: where this conversation came from,

[0:42:11] Voice 15: we were in the section of managing growth and development. We were talking about density and

[0:42:15] Voice 15: housing density and all of these things. And tourism came up as, well, we're not managing

[0:42:20] Voice 15: tourism in that way either. And that we needed to have a section of tourism to talk about actually

[0:42:25] Voice 15: limiting or managing or dealing with tourism in a responsible way. So that's how the conversation

[0:42:30] Voice 15: came about. It wasn't about promoting tourism. It was about addressing it and recognizing it.

[0:42:37] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Patrick, for clarifying that. Trustee Elliott.

[0:42:40] Voice 10: Yeah,

[0:42:41] Voice 24: I don't want to belabor the point. We've been mostly speaking about the negative impacts of tourism, but most tourism done responsibly is an educational opportunity. And that's why I was advocating for the word responsible tourism.

[0:42:57] Voice 24: education is part of what the conservancies are strongly trying to do and what we are

[0:43:07] Voice 24: positioned to do with these very unique and ecosystems and communities that have developed

[0:43:14] Voice 24: is to promote certain ideals and I don't think typical market tourism where people come in and

[0:43:25] Voice 24: and buy from a big box store is what we're looking for.

[0:43:29] Voice 24: We are looking for a responsible avenue

[0:43:33] Voice 24: that supports our communities,

[0:43:36] Voice 24: but also promotes the ideals of conservation

[0:43:40] Voice 24: and the beauty and spectacular nature of this place.

[0:43:44] Voice 24: So I think there's pluses on both sides

[0:43:47] Voice 24: for having tourism in there.

[0:43:49] Voice 24: I think tourism is happening regardless

[0:43:51] Voice 24: And to not have a policy on it would be, I think, irresponsible.

[0:43:57] Voice 24: Thank you.

[0:43:59] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Elliott.

[0:44:00] Voice 10: Trustee Yates.

[0:44:01] Voice 26: And just to riff on what Trustee Elliott just said, you know, thinking about our provincial mandate, not just for the benefit of the residents, but for the benefit of British Columbia, I know they're thinking about tourists.

[0:44:17] Voice 10: Okay.

[0:44:18] Voice 10: Hey, probably should wrap it up and move on to the next section.

[0:44:22] Voice 10: Unless anybody else has anything else to add in?

[0:44:26] Voice 1: Sure, Maude.

[0:44:28] Voice 1: I heard a number of different ideas.

[0:44:32] Voice 1: You know, I understand the general direction of those.

[0:44:35] Voice 1: It would be helpful, I think, if this body were to make a resolution to direct some specific changes to do the things that have been raised here.

[0:44:45] Voice 1: and i'd like to share my screen right now um and just share a version of the policy which i think

[0:44:51] Voice 1: oh someone else is sharing i guess alex would you mind uh all right sweet all right is everybody

[0:45:09] Voice 1: seeing uh policy 3.4.7 in front of them most definitely a sea of red okay so this is some of

[0:45:17] Voice 1: the ideas that i've heard here uh i there are some things that are not in here the word responsible

[0:45:21] Voice 1: is not in here but it certainly could be um adding in transportation and infrastructure at the end

[0:45:28] Voice 1: capacity at the end makes it kind of long and unwieldy so i'm not sure if everything should

[0:45:32] Voice 1: necessarily be crammed into one policy but i i will leave it at you guys to sort of discuss if

[0:45:39] Voice 1: and whether this um captures the conversation you've had or if there's other ways you would

[0:45:45] Voice 1: would like to arrange this all

[0:45:47] Voice 10: right trustee morrison thank

[0:45:53] Voice 20: you sorry multitasking here it's

[0:45:56] Voice 20: kind of complex um all right so that statement that's in there right now jason just for

[0:46:04] Voice 20: clarification was is the suggested phrasing or is the current phrasing the

[0:46:11] Voice 1: the black text

[0:46:13] Voice 1: is the way that it currently appears in the draft new policy statement and the red text

[0:46:19] Voice 1: is just me slotting in some of the things that i've heard in the course of this conversation

[0:46:24] Voice 1: the only recommendation that staff had made up to this point was to add the and tourism part after

[0:46:30] Voice 1: um economic okay this

[0:46:34] Voice 1: other stuff is just sort of some of the some of the other ideas that have

[0:46:37] Voice 1: burbled up here in the course of the discussion okay

[0:46:41] Voice 20: that's super helpful thank you um so i don't

[0:46:45] Voice 20: know what emotion looks like because i'm new to the whole sort of fact you know fall effort um but

[0:46:51] Voice 20: i'm happy to make emotion around this i don't support the and tourism ad because i think it

[0:46:59] Voice 20: is actually from everything that's been said so far under the economic activity and i do understand

[0:47:05] Voice 20: that but i think it doesn't need to be elevated above other things because i think we need to

[0:47:10] Voice 20: deciding community what that looks like as opposed to across the whole area and elevate it so how do

[0:47:17] Voice 20: i make a motion to do the support the rest of it on

[0:47:25] Voice 10: your moments you have some guidance as to how

[0:47:27] Voice 10: you would like to see a motion crafted that modifies your direction or your suggestion oh

[0:47:33] Voice 1: well i mean the the typically despite the fact that we went ahead and did all of this work

[0:47:39] Voice 1: anyways the um the recommendation or the resolutions from this body typically go that

[0:47:45] Voice 1: committee of the whole recommends that trust council revise um or i mean in this case

[0:47:52] Voice 1: no in this case no change has been made to the original text so um in making that resolution

[0:48:00] Voice 1: trustee morrison you're i'm sorry i would have to think about maybe clara i see clara's come

[0:48:08] Voice 1: I'm off mute. Claire, help me out here.

[0:48:10] Voice 10: Planner for graders.

[0:48:13] Voice 10: Planner, director, I'm sorry.

[0:48:15] Voice 19: Happy to try and be a planner.

[0:48:17] Voice 19: Trustee Morrison, essentially, there would be no need for a motion from you

[0:48:21] Voice 19: because the current proposal is, it currently reads,

[0:48:26] Voice 19: support economic opportunities, support economic activities.

[0:48:30] Voice 19: So if you were content with that, then there would be no motion needed.

[0:48:33] Voice 19: It would simply be to change that language to include the notion of tourism,

[0:48:36] Voice 19: then someone would need to move that motion.

[0:48:38] Voice 20: Right, but Jason has a bunch of other suggested text in here like sustainable or end health that considers transportation infrastructure. And I agree with other things that Trustee Yates and others have said about the impacts of that. I just don't think that we should highlight tourism above other economic activities. That's all.

[0:48:55] Voice 19: So if you were looking to move a motion to have it read the way you wish to have it read, you could pass a motion that said that Committee of the Whole recommend that Trust Council revise the policy to read as follows. And then you could include the language that you want.

[0:49:07] Voice 19: Great. Thank you very much. Can I do that on the fly or do we need to send that by email?

[0:49:13] Voice 19: I think for the sake of the minute take, I will turn to our minute taker to ask their preference

[0:49:18] Voice 19: at this point and also would defer to the chair as to if you'd like to take motions at the end

[0:49:22] Voice 19: or do them as we go through.

[0:49:24] Voice 10: Well, I think the wisdom is so we don't lose anything we do it as

[0:49:27] Voice 10: we go through. So I think we're waiting for guidance from the minute taker as to how she'd

[0:49:33] Voice 10: like to receive the minutes thank

[0:49:37] Voice 25: you through the chair i'm happy for the emotion on the fly

[0:49:41] Voice 25: um i just might need you to repeat if it's substantially different than what is there

[0:49:46] Voice 10: thank you very much

[0:49:47] Voice 25: okay

[0:49:50] Voice 20: i'm gonna go for it and i'm gonna type it while i do it to help you out

[0:49:53] Voice 20: there okay that uh committee whole of the whole recommended trust council policy 3.4.7 read support

[0:50:03] Voice 20: Support sustainable economic activities that are compatible, tell me if I need to slow down, with preservation and protection of the trust area and its unique amenities, environment, community character, there's another Oxford comma in there, and health.

[0:50:37] Voice 20: and that consider transportation and infrastructure capacity.

[0:50:43] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Morrison.

[0:50:45] Voice 10: Is there a seconder for the motion?

[0:50:50] Voice 10: Trustee Dodd, seconding?

[0:50:52] Voice 10: All right.

[0:50:57] Voice 10: Okay, so seconded by Trustee Dodd.

[0:51:00] Voice 10: So discussion on the motion, please.

[0:51:02] Voice 10: Trustee Evans?

[0:51:06] Voice 17: Yeah, I'd like to make an amendment to the motion.

[0:51:10] Voice 17: Okay.

[0:51:12] Voice 17: I would like to have the words character and removed

[0:51:17] Voice 17: moved so that it reads community health rather than community character and health because

[0:51:24] Voice 17: community character has been problematic for some of our communities all

[0:51:30] Voice 10: right so you want

[0:51:31] Voice 10: to make a motion to that effect

[0:51:32] Voice 1: uh

[0:51:34] Trustee Fast: see them all yeah

[0:51:35] Voice 1: let me i'll stop sharing here and perhaps

[0:51:38] Voice 1: lisa can uh share thank you i'll

[0:51:47] Voice 25: have that up in one i

[0:51:56] Voice 20: think i got it in the chat i think

[0:51:59] Voice 20: and

[0:53:00] Voice 10: there we are now

[0:53:15] Voice 17: we're missing some words in there from the original motion do you see

[0:53:25] Voice 20: the chat i think most of the original motion i think i added a community at the very end by

[0:53:29] Voice 20: accident the

[0:53:34] Voice 9: whole beginning of the motion's missing how's

[0:54:06] Voice 10: that reading yeah that looks

[0:54:34] Voice 20: right to me i

[0:54:36] Voice 17: was just going to say for my amendment i was not suggesting removing

[0:54:39] Voice 17: community character i was suggesting removing character and so that it reads community health

[0:54:46] Voice 17: that is my amended my amendment all

[0:55:02] Voice 10: right does somebody wish to second that we have hands up so

[0:55:10] Voice 10: maybe if somebody says i do would help i'll

[0:55:14] Voice 24: second that trustee elliott here trustee elliott

[0:55:18] Voice 10: has seconded it so discussion on the amendment trustee dodds um

[0:55:28] Voice 4: i i actually think that's a

[0:55:31] Voice 4: a good idea. I think character is a difficult concept to put in place. Definitely, I prefer

[0:55:39] Voice 4: this amended motion.

[0:55:41] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Dodds. Trustee Graham.

[0:55:44] Voice 6: Thank you. Yes, I agree with the

[0:55:47] Voice 6: amendment, but I'm looking at the original motion made by Trustee Morrison, and I thought

[0:55:52] Voice 6: she did not want the word tourism in there, and yet I see that in that motion.

[0:55:57] Voice 6: motion? No.

[0:56:02] Voice 26: No. No. No. It's in the heading.

[0:56:07] Voice 6: My mistake. I thought you didn't like it in the

[0:56:10] Voice 6: heading. I'm sorry. Oh,

[0:56:13] Voice 20: you're right. It shouldn't be in the heading. You're right. It shouldn't be

[0:56:16] Voice 20: in the heading.

[0:56:19] Voice 28: I still apologize, but thank you. Okay. All right. Trustee Yates.

[0:56:26] Voice 26: That was me that

[0:56:27] Voice 26: said it's in the heading thanks all

[0:56:29] Voice 10: right trustee peterson yeah

[0:56:33] Voice 5: um well given that what we've heard

[0:56:35] Voice 5: about the problematic nature of um of the word character uh i'm i'm gonna support um this

[0:56:44] Voice 5: amendment thank you peterson trustee harris thank

[0:56:52] Voice 8: you um yeah i don't see what the difficulty is

[0:56:56] Voice 8: with character that's been part of the thing that was we've been trying to protect as the

[0:57:00] Voice 8: rural character and community character for years um and i also would like to say that um

[0:57:06] Voice 8: it doesn't seem like a balanced approach as does the legal opinion that the trust council agreed

[0:57:13] Voice 8: to release at the last trust council so i don't know how there can be a point of order on talking

[0:57:19] Voice 8: about that um i'm so i'd like to understand you know better if somebody could explain what the

[0:57:27] Voice 8: a problem with character.

[0:57:31] Voice 10: Trustee Evans, did you maybe want to expand a little bit on your thoughts?

[0:57:35] Voice 17: Sure. In our community, and if it's happening in our community, then there's a potential for it

[0:57:41] Voice 17: to happen in others. If not now, then in the future. The word community character has caused

[0:57:48] Voice 17: dissension in how it's being used. And when it comes to some of how the bylaws are being written,

[0:57:56] Voice 17: um there we've been struggling with what it is and therefore how it affects our bylaws so for

[0:58:06] Voice 17: simplistic um measures i would prefer that it's just not in here because i don't know what it's

[0:58:16] Voice 17: adding right now apart from uh some problems that we've been experiencing down at our end

[0:58:22] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Evans.

[0:58:26] Voice 10: All right.

[0:58:29] Voice 10: So any other discussion on the amendment?

[0:58:34] Voice 10: I

[0:58:35] Voice 20: still can't figure out how to get my hand up.

[0:58:37] Voice 20: Sorry.

[0:58:37] Voice 10: Okay.

[0:58:38] Voice 10: So if you look at the bottom, the last part, there's a heading with a smiling face saying reactions.

[0:58:44] Voice 20: Yeah.

[0:58:45] Voice 20: Mine doesn't seem to have a hand right now.

[0:58:47] Voice 20: It did before, but it doesn't now.

[0:58:51] Voice 24: It's a heart.

[0:58:53] Voice 24: Thank you for that.

[0:58:55] Voice 20: Okay.

[0:58:56] Voice 20: Yeah.

[0:58:56] Voice 20: Yeah, so when I click on it, okay, I got it now.

[0:58:58] Voice 20: When I click on the carrot, it doesn't give it,

[0:59:00] Voice 20: but when I click on the heart, it does.

[0:59:01] Voice 20: Okay, got it.

[0:59:02] Voice 20: Okay.

[0:59:03] Voice 9: All right, trusty boy.

[0:59:05] Voice 20: Sorry.

[0:59:06] Voice 20: Usually technical stuff's not my problem, but anyway.

[0:59:10] Voice 20: So I went back and forth about this too

[0:59:13] Voice 20: because I know that character can be vague,

[0:59:16] Voice 20: but I do like the idea of character in there

[0:59:19] Voice 20: because the idea of the rural nature of the islands

[0:59:22] Voice 20: is actually really important to me

[0:59:25] Voice 20: and to our communities generally.

[0:59:27] Voice 20: I think so I would like to have it even though it's a bit vague in the policy because it is a

[0:59:33] Voice 20: big word I like to have it in here and then in the local communities we actually you know define that

[0:59:39] Voice 20: in our LTCs as we work out our OCPs and we work out our bylaws so I feel like there is a move for

[0:59:45] Voice 20: us to be able to ground that in our own communities but still make it relevant and that we have to

[0:59:50] Voice 20: kind of address it and community health is slightly different because community health could be argued

[0:59:54] Voice 20: you there's more and more people who have lived urban lives come into the islands you know community

[1:00:00] Voice 20: health could be argued to have all sorts of services associated with it which you know

[1:00:04] Voice 20: isn't always in keeping with the rural or you know self-reliant nature of the island

[1:00:11] Voice 10: thank you trustee morrison trustee getty so

[1:00:14] Voice 21: in that discussion uh between the last two or three

[1:00:18] Voice 21: trustees um we don't have it written here in front of us but what you've been talking about

[1:00:22] Voice 21: is rural character so does that need to be spelled out

[1:00:27] Voice 10: question trustee elliott

[1:00:32] Voice 10: um

[1:00:35] Voice 24: so the reason i have a problem with the word character is because it describes community as

[1:00:41] Voice 24: if it's a monolith a character a community with a certain character brings to my mind

[1:00:46] Voice 24: a sort of strata you know the before mentioned you know sort of bavarian um whatever some kind

[1:00:54] Voice 24: of architecture it doesn't tell me that this is a community uh with diversity and that is

[1:01:01] Voice 24: bent on achieving healthy outcomes for many different levels of people. So I do support

[1:01:08] Voice 24: health over character. I think it's got more longevity as a term. And secondly, I'd like to

[1:01:17] Voice 24: see the word tourism added back in. Because originally, this was part of the mandate of the

[1:01:23] Voice 24: trust is to promote the special area to for the benefit of the province of BC. And I think it

[1:01:30] Voice 24: it would be remiss to not have a policy on tourism.

[1:01:33] Voice 24: Thank you.

[1:01:34] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Elliott.

[1:01:35] Voice 10: Trustee Harris.

[1:01:37] Voice 8: The way it reads now to me has changed the intent greatly.

[1:01:43] Voice 8: Community health, that's, you know,

[1:01:46] Voice 8: maybe if it said something along the lines of the trust area,

[1:01:50] Voice 8: its unique amenities, environment, community,

[1:01:54] Voice 8: and the community's health, something along those lines.

[1:01:58] Voice 8: But community health, that seems to, I think that could be contrived into so many different problematic areas, possibly more so than the word character.

[1:02:09] Voice 8: Thank

[1:02:11] Voice 10: you, Trustee Harris.

[1:02:13] Voice 10: Anybody else have anything to add to the discussion?

[1:02:19] Voice 10: If not, we will have called a vote on the amendment to remove character and weird place to end.

[1:02:30] Voice 10: So the motion is to remove the words character and the word end.

[1:02:38] Voice 10: So all those in favor, raise your hands, please.

[1:02:50] Voice 9: Slowly click in.

[1:02:51] Voice 9: all right

[1:02:57] Voice 10: so we have 11 in favor or 10 in favor okay let's the high number i saw was 11 so we'll

[1:03:05] Voice 10: call it 11 in favor so hands down please so

[1:03:10] Voice 20: point of order chair yes when

[1:03:12] Voice 20: you actually started like

[1:03:14] Voice 20: asking for stability it was nine could we do a recall on the count please all

[1:03:18] Voice 10: right we will do

[1:03:18] Voice 10: that we'll so once again raise your hands please in favor and then pause so we have stabilized at

[1:03:33] Voice 10: had 11 hands in the air in favor.

[1:03:35] Voice 10: So hands down, please.

[1:03:41] Voice 10: And those opposed, please.

[1:03:48] Voice 10: So at this point, I'm seeing two opposed, 11 in favor.

[1:03:52] Voice 10: So the motion carries.

[1:03:54] Voice 10: So now we'll go back to the amended motion.

[1:04:00] Voice 10: Is there any further discussion on the amended motion?

[1:04:02] Voice 10: Trustee Graham.

[1:04:04] Voice 6: Thank you, Chair.

[1:04:05] Voice 6: Sorry for being a stickler,

[1:04:07] Voice 6: but I see the word tourism still is in the motion

[1:04:11] Voice 6: under discussion in the title activities I think it should read yeah so the

[1:04:19] Voice 10: intent is to remove and tourism from the from that bolded heading so don't strike

[1:04:29] Voice 20: it out just remove it at the moment because the current motion was not

[1:04:33] Voice 20: intended to thank you all

[1:04:38] Voice 10: right so any further discussion on the motion okay

[1:04:44] Voice 10: seeing no hands I will okay what trustee Evans sorry

[1:04:49] Voice 17: I'm confused now is there a

[1:04:50] Voice 17: motion because Deb Morrison said the original motion wasn't supposed to have it in there and

[1:04:55] Voice 17: it's been deleted now so I'm not sure if there's an amendment motion or if we're back to the original

[1:04:59] Voice 17: motion as

[1:05:03] Voice 10: far as I understand the intent of the mover originally was the word tourism was not

[1:05:08] Voice 10: supposed to be emboldened at the top okay so it's not an amendment

[1:05:11] Voice 10: in person so that's not an

[1:05:13] Voice 10: amendment so we're sorry thank

[1:05:14] Voice 17: you so

[1:05:16] Voice 10: what we're doing if we're voting on what is before you right

[1:05:18] Voice 10: right now. Trustee Bowen.

[1:05:24] Voice 16: I'm a little confused. I think there is an amendment because we've

[1:05:28] Voice 16: added in health and consider transportation and infrastructure capacity. I think those are new.

[1:05:38] Voice 16: So yeah, thanks.

[1:05:41] Voice 10: Is that true? Trustee Morrison, can you clarify what you originally moved?

[1:05:46] Voice 10: Have we strayed off of what your original motion was?

[1:05:50] Voice 20: So the motion as is there is correct.

[1:05:53] Voice 20: I never said anything about the title.

[1:05:55] Voice 20: So because it wasn't in the original text that Jason put before us.

[1:05:59] Voice 20: So when he put the title back in there, it confused me.

[1:06:02] Voice 20: So thanks for catching that.

[1:06:03] Voice 20: The title should be as it is right here in front of us.

[1:06:07] Voice 20: So this is a motion that we made to modify the text that is in the current version of the policy statement.

[1:06:16] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Morrison.

[1:06:17] Voice 10: Trustee Dodds?

[1:06:18] Voice 4: And for clarification, this is now an amended motion because we took the word character out.

[1:06:24] Voice 4: So

[1:06:24] Voice 10: it is an

[1:06:24] Voice 4: amended motion, but it is a motion.

[1:06:27] Voice 10: It is a motion.

[1:06:27] Voice 10: It's the amended motion.

[1:06:29] Voice 10: Thank you.

[1:06:31] Voice 10: All right.

[1:06:31] Voice 10: So is there any further discussion on the amended motion?

[1:06:37] Voice 10: Trustee Dodds, hands down.

[1:06:38] Voice 10: Trustee Harris?

[1:06:41] Voice 8: Is it just me or does the grammar seem wrong?

[1:06:45] Voice 8: Because the

[1:06:45] Voice 8: word that is not supposed to be in there.

[1:06:48] Voice 8: you know i don't even know why i care but um is the grammar wrong to me or my

[1:06:53] Voice 8: i

[1:06:57] Voice 24: think you're actually right trustee harris there needs to be a

[1:07:02] Voice 24: the preservation and protection of the trust area which would be more consistent with the

[1:07:07] Voice 24: other policies that are compatible with the preservation and protection that's what i was

[1:07:14] Voice 24: noticing earlier so

[1:07:17] Voice 10: but uh so for clarification trustee harrison you're talking about the first

[1:07:21] Voice 10: instance of that or the second instance of that fact

[1:07:24] Voice 8: looking at I was actually I

[1:07:27] Voice 8: was looking at the second instance some support sustainable economic activities

[1:07:32] Voice 8: that are compatible with preservation it should be of that shouldn't it that are

[1:07:37] Voice 8: that are compatible with the preservation and protection of the trust

[1:07:42] Voice 8: area and its unique amenities environment community health and consider

[1:07:46] Voice 8: transportation and infrastructure capacity is that that wrong like i said i could be wrong

[1:07:52] Voice 8: about that but the second that grammar didn't seem right i could again i'm not a uh a linguist

[1:07:59] Voice 10: here i don't agree with you on that trustee borthwick um

[1:08:03] Voice 22: i i would actually say it's that's

[1:08:06] Voice 22: not the i think that is still appropriate because it's the the subject is uh the sustainable

[1:08:13] Voice 22: economic activities right so we are supporting sustainable economic activities that consider

[1:08:20] Voice 22: transportation infrastructure capacity you can take out that center part because it's it's a

[1:08:25] Voice 22: separate clause um that said i would make the change that um you could actually remove the

[1:08:33] Voice 22: and after trust area uh and because uh its unique amenities environment community uh and community

[1:08:41] Voice 22: community health should have a,

[1:08:46] Voice 22: I think that and should be transposed after environment and before community

[1:08:53] Voice 22: health. If I, if I'm reading that as a list correctly, but

[1:08:56] Voice 22: I might be,

[1:08:57] Voice 22: I might be incorrect, but that's my.

[1:09:00] Voice 10: So we are really wordsmithing here. Trustee Getty.

[1:09:06] Voice 21: The last time we asked staff to have a look at some of the grammar and to

[1:09:10] Voice 21: polish something up. So perhaps we can do that here.

[1:09:13] Voice 21: I believe the intention is to support sustainable economic activities, that blah, blah, blah, and that blah, blah, blah.

[1:09:23] Voice 21: So I think there's two separate entities here.

[1:09:26] Voice 21: I'm not sure how many that's we need to have in the system and where ands need to be.

[1:09:30] Voice 21: And it would be rather than go through the time that we've got tonight on the rest of the stuff, it'd be really nice if we could hand this off to staff to polish it for us.

[1:09:38] Voice 10: All right.

[1:09:38] Voice 10: With everybody's consent, is that acceptable?

[1:09:40] Voice 10: acceptable um if we adopt this motion and then staff can sort of clean up where it was needed

[1:09:48] Voice 10: um trustee dodds oh sorry i would

[1:09:54] Voice 20: support that move because i'm actually building like i built

[1:09:57] Voice 20: this motion off of what the staff recommended so i would prefer to go back to staff with the

[1:10:02] Voice 20: grammar question

[1:10:03] Voice 10: excellent thank you very much jesse dodds i

[1:10:06] Voice 4: don't think we should be wordsmithing

[1:10:07] Voice 4: I think that all of the motions that we do should be with a provision that obviously at some point staff will clean up the actual language that's used.

[1:10:15] Voice 4: As long as the intent is there, that's what's important because you're going to spend hours wordsmithing and we should not be doing that.

[1:10:23] Voice 10: I totally agree.

[1:10:24] Voice 10: So with everybody's consent, going forward tonight, that's sort of the intent is that we get things on the table.

[1:10:32] Voice 10: if there if there's something that's just a little bit wrong we will trust staff to clean

[1:10:37] Voice 10: up the grammar because it's not intent it's basically cleaning things up so let's if everybody

[1:10:42] Voice 10: can agree with that let's move with that trustee morrison not trust me okay so if nobody else says

[1:10:54] Voice 10: anything more um i'd like to call the vote on the amended motion all of us in favor please

[1:11:00] Voice 10: please. Okay. We appear to have stabilized at nine in favor. Hands down, please. And those

[1:11:22] Voice 10: opposed? I'm seeing two opposed. So may

[1:11:37] Voice 16: I just ask, are we counting abstentions? Because there

[1:11:42] Voice 16: are a few people who haven't. Yeah.

[1:11:44] Voice 10: Well, and yes, that is my next question. So at this point,

[1:11:48] Voice 10: the vote is nine to two and i'll just ask of staff to clarify how many trustees are in the room

[1:11:57] Voice 10: just for quorum in particular we

[1:11:59] Voice 27: have 16 trustees in the room so

[1:12:02] Voice 10: we have um so we we had it's nine

[1:12:04] Voice 10: to two so there were 11 people voted there were five extension of abstentions um so the motion

[1:12:10] Voice 10: carries all right so is there anything else on this topic or can we move on to the second one

[1:12:18] Voice 10: sounds like we're moving on to the second one over to you planner yeomans

[1:12:33] Voice 1: it's just having a difficult time locating my mouse cursor

[1:12:38] Voice 1: um we'll see now whether there was some irony in you recommending to staff that we help

[1:12:45] Voice 1: uh workshop your grammar or workshop our own grammar i guess and come back with a better

[1:12:51] Voice 1: version. You had asked us to go away and look at the grammar in proposed policy 3.4.6. And this

[1:13:02] Voice 1: is a policy that deals with hazard areas, climate change related hazard areas. And the current

[1:13:09] Voice 1: language in the policy says identify with consideration of climate change, areas hazardous

[1:13:15] Voice 1: to development activities, including but not limited to areas subject to flooding, erosion,

[1:13:21] Voice 1: wildfire or slope stability and direct development away from such hazards we have come back to you

[1:13:27] Voice 1: with and it's you know at your discretion whether this is better or worse or neutral identify areas

[1:13:34] Voice 1: at risk of environmental and climate change related hazards and direct development away

[1:13:39] Voice 1: from them including but not limited to areas subject to flooding erosion wildfire and slope

[1:13:45] Voice 1: instability thank

[1:13:48] Voice 10: you so trustees any commentary on this suggested change we

[1:13:57] Voice 10: said trustee Pearson has in the chat said that he likes it anybody else have

[1:14:02] Voice 10: any cause for concern or can we move on sorry

[1:14:06] Voice 17: I can't get my hand up okay

[1:14:08] Voice 10: okay

[1:14:10] Voice 17: so I'm sorry can I go to Anna can I speak

[1:14:12] Voice 10: absolutely

[1:14:13] Voice 17: I'd like to remove the

[1:14:15] Voice 17: word wildfire from that because all of the islands are subject to wildfire and

[1:14:19] Voice 17: And if we're going to direct development away from them, then we're effectively directing development away from all of our islands.

[1:14:26] Voice 17: And I don't think that's the intent.

[1:14:30] Voice 17: So I would like to remove the wildfire.

[1:14:33] Voice 17: Everything else is fine.

[1:14:35] Voice 17: But we live in a forested area.

[1:14:38] Voice 17: The islands are all contiguous forests, which are subject to direct wildfire hazards.

[1:14:48] Voice 10: OK, thank you, Trustee Evans.

[1:14:49] Voice 10: So maybe we'll put a placeholder on that.

[1:14:52] Voice 10: We'll hear from a couple more trustees and see if a motion is merited there.

[1:14:55] Voice 10: Trustee Patrick.

[1:14:57] Voice 15: As we're talking about future development, I think it's absolutely prudent.

[1:15:01] Voice 15: And I think Salt Spring Fire would be there to say that there are ways of directing development away or reducing the potential of impact as a result of wildfires.

[1:15:13] Voice 15: So I think keeping wildfire is absolutely appropriate, especially with our climate change reference in this policy.

[1:15:20] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Patrick. Trustee Harris.

[1:15:25] Voice 8: A little bit confused at this conversation, because currently the policy reads wildfires in there.

[1:15:34] Voice 8: But the second part, oh, I see it's in there as well.

[1:15:40] Voice 8: I do agree with Trustee Evans on this one.

[1:15:44] Voice 8: That can be quite nefarious, I think.

[1:15:47] Voice 8: Yes, wildfires are a concern, and clearly the islands are concerned about it, and that's not going to go away, but the way this is worded could direct development away from the islands, period, because all 100% of the islands are at risk of wildfire.

[1:16:07] Voice 8: Trustee Evans made a very valid and clear point there.

[1:16:10] Voice 8: So I'm in agreement with that word wildfire needing to be removed from this portion of this policy statement.

[1:16:20] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Harris.

[1:16:22] Voice 10: Trustee Lockham.

[1:16:24] Voice 7: Well, thank you.

[1:16:25] Voice 7: I'd like to know why that particular word was chosen to be in there.

[1:16:32] Voice 7: And so is there any historical context or rationale for why that was placed in originally in 3.4.6?

[1:16:41] Voice 7: Because it may

[1:16:42] Voice 7: not, it may simply be not the best choice of word to describe a hazardous fire location.

[1:16:52] Voice 10: Perhaps Director Frater might have some history on that.

[1:16:57] Voice 19: I'm afraid I'm losing my encyclopedic memory about this policy statement and how each word came to be added.

[1:17:04] Voice 19: likely at a result of climate change i knew i know that there are air wildfire hazard maps available

[1:17:09] Voice 19: um for particularly for the southern gulf islands that could be used um to consider areas that are

[1:17:15] Voice 19: more hazardous in terms of fire in terms of keeping infrastructure away from high risk areas

[1:17:19] Voice 19: but um would need a planner you know planner to speak to that in specific if you give me a few

[1:17:25] Voice 19: minutes i may be able to dig back and source out the where you know where and how that the concept

[1:17:30] Voice 19: of wildfire got added, but I don't have it at hand right at the minute.

[1:17:33] Voice 10: Thank you, Director Frey.

[1:17:35] Voice 7: Might I have a follow-up notion there?

[1:17:39] Voice 10: Absolutely.

[1:17:42] Voice 7: Just reflecting on it, it strikes me that it's to do with fuel loads

[1:17:49] Voice 7: in any particular area that might be hazardous fuel loads in forested areas or something along

[1:17:59] Voice 7: long that rather than a simply a single word wildfire which could imply a number of things

[1:18:07] Voice 7: including fire in a hayfield yeah yeah anyway uh struggling with the choice of word there the

[1:18:15] Voice 7: the idea of directing housing because of course that's the the urban interface they call it right

[1:18:23] Voice 7: Right. The proximity to the forest is getting less and less.

[1:18:28] Voice 7: And it's the structures within the urban interface that are at risk.

[1:18:35] Voice 7: So, yeah.

[1:18:38] Voice 10: Thank you. Trustee Fast.

[1:18:42] Trustee Fast: Thank you, Chair.

[1:18:43] Trustee Fast: Chair, I'm wondering if we could consider adding the word

[1:18:51] Trustee Fast: or inserting the word elevated before the word risk

[1:18:56] Trustee Fast: in the first few words so that it would read

[1:19:01] Trustee Fast: identify areas at elevated risk of environmental.

[1:19:05] Trustee Fast: Because later on, hopefully that would qualify later on

[1:19:11] Trustee Fast: when it says areas subject to flooding, erosion, wildfire, sloping, instability. Subject to is very

[1:19:20] Trustee Fast: subjective. It refers to risk, I think. Bowen has a community wildfire protection plan, and it

[1:19:33] Trustee Fast: It includes many things, not just fuel loads, but also wind direction and many other factors.

[1:19:41] Trustee Fast: And so I don't want to go into all of the things.

[1:19:48] Trustee Fast: I'm sure Trustee Luckham and others have much to say about wildfire and wildfire prevention.

[1:19:55] Trustee Fast: I just think the point in this hazardous areas part is about, can we look at which are the high elevated risk, not just general risk?

[1:20:07] Trustee Fast: So later, maybe I'll propose a word to add the word elevated after the word, just right in front of the word risk. Over.

[1:20:18] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Fath. I see Director Cermak has his hand up, so he might aid our conversation here.

[1:20:27] Voice 2: i wish i had jason yeoman's charm to to tell you maybe not i just thought i would tell you that

[1:20:33] Voice 2: the local government act helps guide local trust committees when they're amending official community

[1:20:40] Voice 2: plans that they may designate development permit areas or protect development from hazardous

[1:20:47] Voice 2: conditions so this is actually meant to protect your development not the island per se of its

[1:20:52] Voice 2: own natural right so when we talk about hazard areas and planning it's actually protecting

[1:20:56] Voice 2: development from hazardous conditions so these areas are subject to uh you know the conditions

[1:21:03] Voice 2: there are wildfire and the conditions are subject to flooding and stuff like that so i don't know if

[1:21:09] Voice 2: that aids or subtracts but that's what the local government act allows you to one of the reasons

[1:21:14] Voice 2: for creating a development permit area is to protect development from hazardous conditions

[1:21:19] Voice 2: conditions. That's the way the Local Government Act is worded.

[1:21:23] Voice 10: Thank you for that insight, Director Cermak. Trustee Patrick?

[1:21:28] Voice 15: Yeah, well, for at least Salt Spring and the Southern Gulf Islands, we both have maps that

[1:21:33] Voice 15: have been produced with wildfire exposure that are fresh and new right off the press

[1:21:39] Voice 15: this year, or I guess 2023, sorry, 23, but we got them this year. You know, so I think

[1:21:47] Voice 15: we could we could add lots of words about exposure or highest exposure those things i i think it's

[1:21:53] Voice 15: enough the way the policy is written here and i think the intent is is correct so i'd i'd like

[1:22:00] Voice 15: to retain wildfire thank

[1:22:03] Voice 10: you trustee morrison thank

[1:22:06] Voice 20: you um i have a slightly different tangent

[1:22:09] Voice 20: on this so i i actually think that it's fire not wildfire um for some of the things that uh trustee

[1:22:17] Voice 20: Luckum said um and also like when we think about the compounding factors of you know adjacency to

[1:22:24] Voice 20: water adjacency to um you know road access for being able to get fire trucks out to you know

[1:22:32] Voice 20: places like that so there's like a bunch of different compounding factors that we have

[1:22:36] Voice 20: on North Bender for sure that aren't necessarily about wildfire per se they can include wildfire

[1:22:43] Voice 20: but the broader term is actually about fire and so I would reckon I have a motion at any point

[1:22:51] Voice 20: if we think that's helpful to go from wildfire to fire I would keep fire in the risk because we

[1:22:56] Voice 20: definitely have that problem in the development context with access to services in different

[1:23:01] Voice 20: areas or no access to services in different areas and that should be considered into any development

[1:23:08] Voice 10: thank you trustee Morrison okay we have a couple more speakers and maybe we'll we can go to a

[1:23:13] Voice 10: motion trustee getty sorry

[1:23:19] Voice 21: i'll pass i don't remember it

[1:23:21] Voice 10: happens trustee pass thank you chair

[1:23:25] Trustee Fast: um i'm just uh going to agree with a few of the previous speakers in that i think fire needs to

[1:23:31] Trustee Fast: be in there call it wildfire or fire i uh i think it needs to be in there specifically because i'm

[1:23:39] Trustee Fast: not only keen to protect development but i'm keen to protect watersheds and our ecosystems

[1:23:45] Trustee Fast: systems and uh wildfire human uh cultural fire might be fine um but i guess i'm more interested

[1:23:56] Trustee Fast: in the wildfire aspects of uh the chemistry changes that happen after fire to um affect

[1:24:04] Trustee Fast: uh surface water anyway and uh and of course the ecological uh impacts uh i think we might

[1:24:12] Trustee Fast: be talking about wildfire not cultural fire or um controlled burning and i think we might be

[1:24:20] Trustee Fast: considering uh broader than just um uh development or certainly that would be my inclination so

[1:24:27] Trustee Fast: at this point i'd sooner leave it like it is or just add the word elevated uh but i'll uh

[1:24:34] Trustee Fast: hear from other trustees hey

[1:24:37] Voice 11: director freighter thank

[1:24:41] Voice 19: you i've been quickly sleuthing as you've

[1:24:43] Voice 19: been talking um i can't find where it was originally added but imagine it was in the june

[1:24:47] Voice 19: or 2021 version and i've also found that the public engagement that happened in the last round

[1:24:55] Voice 19: phase three public engagement the concept of prevention of wildfire impacts was certainly

[1:25:00] Voice 19: a theme that emerged through the community engagement work that you did um i found a

[1:25:05] Voice 19: comment from bowen island municipality saying that any they would hope that any policies relating to

[1:25:10] Voice 19: wildfire prevention for example such as this one would take into account unique island needs such

[1:25:15] Voice 19: as biogeochematic zone which I believe this policy does because it allows you to define

[1:25:19] Voice 19: each island can define for itself what an area hazardous to fire would be so I'll leave it there

[1:25:25] Voice 19: but I can't find the initial impetus to add the concept but imagine it came out of the working

[1:25:30] Voice 19: group that we had last term that was looking at you know responding to climate threats

[1:25:36] Voice 19: so that's what I found in a few minutes I've just been sleuthing for you

[1:25:39] Voice 10: Thank you, Director Frey. Trustee Lockham?

[1:25:42] Voice 7: Well, I would just like to really endorse Deb Morrison's suggestion. I think she hit the

[1:25:48] Voice 7: nail on the head there. And I do like the idea of elevated as a descriptor. And so let's move along.

[1:25:57] Voice 10: Okay, thank you. Trustee Evans?

[1:25:59] Voice 17: I was just going to concur and say I like the usage of the word elevated as well. Thank you.

[1:26:04] Voice 10: Thank you. Trustee Harris?

[1:26:09] Voice 8: Thank you.

[1:26:12] Voice 8: um i i still see it as um you know i guess you're saying elevated that changes it to a degree

[1:26:22] Voice 8: but again this policy area is hazard areas policy so hazard areas saying that you know

[1:26:33] Voice 8: wildfire that basically that means everywhere is a hazardous area like plain and simple so i don't

[1:26:42] Voice 8: I don't think it should be in there. And I'm sure other people in the community

[1:26:47] Voice 8: will say, what's going on here? This looks like everywhere you guys are claiming is a

[1:26:51] Voice 8: hazardous area now. So, thank you.

[1:26:54] Voice 10: So, just, Trustee Harris,

[1:26:55] Voice 10: just for clarification, if wildfire changed to fire,

[1:26:59] Voice 10: would that work a little bit better in your mind?

[1:27:05] Voice 8: It's saying that, thank you for the question, it's saying here that

[1:27:08] Voice 8: you know, I'm trying to read right from the beginning here,

[1:27:13] Voice 8: the hazardous areas identify areas at risk environmental and climate change of the direct

[1:27:19] Voice 8: development away from them um including but not limited to areas subject to flooding erosion

[1:27:24] Voice 8: and you're saying just fire well again

[1:27:27] Voice 10: everywhere yeah

[1:27:29] Voice 8: everywhere is just like just like chair

[1:27:33] Voice 8: well chair of trust council uh locum mentioned that it could be a hate field and the islands

[1:27:40] Voice 8: are forested and in actual fact we do need to address wildfire it's a giant um you know a huge

[1:27:46] Voice 8: huge issue especially as trustee fast was saying in watersheds and some of the problems we have

[1:27:52] Voice 8: i'm not sure about all the other islands at all but salt spring is that we have these watershed

[1:27:57] Voice 8: areas where there's major fuel and a huge cleanup that needs to be done and it isn't being done

[1:28:00] Voice 8: so yes we need to address wildfire and wildfire experts are saying we actually need to cut swaths

[1:28:07] Voice 8: in this contiguous um you know fire or forest area um as they do all up and down the west

[1:28:14] Voice 8: coast of north america um to try and alleviate the wildfire risk but this to me just is sort of

[1:28:21] Voice 8: ignoring the risk and saying we don't want to develop anywhere that you could possibly have

[1:28:27] Voice 8: some fire so again you know if you if that's going to be put in there fine i'm gonna i'm not

[1:28:32] Voice 8: agree with it, but I'll guarantee that we'll be getting kicked back from the committee.

[1:28:38] Voice 10: Okay, thank you, Trustee Harris. Trustee Faust?

[1:28:41] Trustee Fast: Thank you, Chair. I would like to move that, oops, where did it go? Oh, sorry. I move that

[1:28:52] Trustee Fast: committee the whole request, trust council or staff, to come back with, oh, direct trust council

[1:29:03] Trustee Fast: to insert the word elevated before the word risk,

[1:29:11] Trustee Fast: just to do one thing at a time.

[1:29:12] Voice 10: Okay, so one thing at a time.

[1:29:15] Voice 10: All right, so we'll ask the recording secretary

[1:29:20] Voice 10: to get that on the screen.

[1:29:26] Voice 21: Don't we have to have a motion before it's amended?

[1:29:30] Voice 10: Well, no, because we're not amending.

[1:29:34] Voice 10: This is now, this is, I believe.

[1:29:39] Voice 10: So we have the wording before.

[1:29:41] Voice 10: us

[1:29:42] Voice 7: right but it's not yet

[1:29:44] Voice 7: it's

[1:29:45] Voice 10: not a motion yet we

[1:29:48] Voice 7: need to move the original motion so we need

[1:29:50] Voice 10: to move the original motion so okay so

[1:29:52] Voice 7: however it is that anybody wants to move it yeah it's

[1:29:55] Voice 7: included different wording can

[1:29:56] Voice 21: i suggest that we recommend to trust council that they

[1:30:00] Voice 21: identify areas of elevated risk of environmental and climate change related hazards and direct

[1:30:05] Voice 21: development away from them including but not limited to areas subject to flooding erosion

[1:30:11] Voice 21: wildfire and slope instability all

[1:30:13] Voice 10: right so that's the motion trustee says trustee fast is seconded

[1:30:19] Voice 10: the motion so now we're now we're on our way so um discussion on the motion before you trustee bond

[1:30:28] Voice 10: um

[1:30:30] Voice 16: i support the idea of elevated risk um i support the idea of removing the word wildfire

[1:30:37] Voice 16: i've um you know looked at the crd risk assessment maps and it's focused on fire smart and

[1:30:46] Voice 16: um making your home more robust and it identifies areas with indeed fuel loads that need to be

[1:30:55] Voice 16: mitigated. So I don't think it's appropriate that we would consider directing development away from

[1:31:04] Voice 16: because it's all encompassing and it may change also as areas are mitigated and fuel loads are

[1:31:13] Voice 16: reduced in Parks Canada land. We can only dream. So it would be an impossible task even to attempt

[1:31:24] Voice 16: And also many of the risk maps, we're at risk of sort of closing a circle because some of the risks are, you know, some other maps I've seen focus on the interface with existing infrastructure, which are homes.

[1:31:38] Voice 16: So it's like direct, you know, development away from existing homes because the interface is high risk.

[1:31:45] Voice 16: So I don't think FIRE will work in this context.

[1:31:50] Voice 16: The others will and elevated risk is a good addition.

[1:31:53] Voice 16: Thanks.

[1:31:54] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Bolton.

[1:31:55] Voice 10: Trustee Morrison.

[1:31:57] Voice 20: Yeah, I'm generally in support of this motion.

[1:31:59] Voice 20: I would love to see an amendment for fire versus wildfire, and I'm happy to speak to that at the time.

[1:32:05] Voice 10: Okay, thank you.

[1:32:06] Voice 10: Trustee Evans.

[1:32:10] Voice 17: I would like to make an amendment to remove the word wildfire.

[1:32:16] Voice 10: All right.

[1:32:17] Voice 10: So you want to totally remove the word, or do you want to change it to fire?

[1:32:21] Voice 17: Remove the word wildfire.

[1:32:23] Voice 10: Okay, so totally remove the word wildfire.

[1:32:25] Voice 10: and

[1:32:27] Voice 17: so

[1:32:29] Voice 10: so we'll see if there's a seconder for that motion i seconded okay so trustee

[1:32:35] Voice 10: bowen has seconded that so discussion on the amendment can

[1:32:39] Voice 17: i speak to my amendment first

[1:32:40] Voice 10: certainly um

[1:32:42] Voice 17: so the reason why i'm requesting that it be removed in its entirety is because

[1:32:47] Voice 17: its subject is including but not limited to so it doesn't have to be explicitly brought out here

[1:32:56] Voice 17: But in our bylaws and our OCP, we can address it more appropriately rather than having a blanket wildfire exclusion for any development across all of the islands that will have any areas that are subject to any change-related hazards of wildfire.

[1:33:19] Voice 17: because with our parks and with our OCPs

[1:33:25] Voice 17: requesting that we have contiguous forest with houses.

[1:33:31] Voice 17: So if somebody needs to build an accessory building,

[1:33:34] Voice 17: you're not allowed because it's within a wildfire zone

[1:33:36] Voice 17: or you're not allowed because it's too close

[1:33:40] Voice 17: to the wildfire area.

[1:33:43] Voice 17: I see issues.

[1:33:45] Voice 17: So that's why I would really just like

[1:33:48] Voice 17: to see that word removed.

[1:33:49] Voice 17: But it doesn't preclude us from putting other things in our in our islands, OCPs and in our bylaws to address it more, more specifically.

[1:33:59] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Evans. Trustee Patrick.

[1:34:02] Voice 15: Wow. I don't know what islands you guys are on, but I spend a lot of time talking about wildfires and attending meetings about wildfire.

[1:34:09] Voice 15: I cannot see this reduced. Let's look at this policy.

[1:34:12] Voice 15: The original words, it says an elevated risk of flooding, erosion, wildfire.

[1:34:19] Voice 15: It's making reference to climate change and things change and elevated risk of.

[1:34:24] Voice 15: It's where things are changing.

[1:34:26] Voice 15: There are parts of our island that are drying out faster and becoming more prone to wildfire.

[1:34:31] Voice 15: That's what this is referencing.

[1:34:33] Voice 15: So I cannot support removing wildfire.

[1:34:37] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Patrick.

[1:34:39] Voice 10: Trustee Luckham.

[1:34:40] Voice 7: Yeah, I don't support removing the entire word.

[1:34:44] Voice 7: I would be happy just to see it changed to fire.

[1:34:47] Voice 7: And remind everybody that we have hazardous slope mapping and we have flood zone mapping.

[1:34:56] Voice 7: And if that's the criteria for not including something in a policy, then we may as well just eliminate the whole thing.

[1:35:02] Voice 7: But I support the hazardous area policy here.

[1:35:07] Voice 7: I think it just should be the word fire.

[1:35:09] Voice 10: Thank you.

[1:35:10] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Lackham.

[1:35:11] Voice 10: Trustee Morrison.

[1:35:16] Voice 20: Thank you.

[1:35:16] Voice 20: I don't support the removal of wildfire.

[1:35:19] Voice 20: And the conversation that we're having is about the idea that wildfire is pervasive everywhere. There certainly is elevated risks in different areas related to fire. And a lot of it has to do with how we build out infrastructure, how we limit infrastructure related to fire, how we understand fuel loads.

[1:35:39] Voice 20: i agree with all those things those things we can manage in our ocps we can advocate for with

[1:35:45] Voice 20: the conservancy to like get control of the forest managed with the national parks and we're doing

[1:35:50] Voice 20: those things right so we can shift what those risk maps look like and again it's not that we were

[1:35:57] Voice 20: we're saying that we don't do it we don't develop at all in those areas that's not what we're saying

[1:36:02] Voice 20: that we develop while we're thinking about the elevated risk of fire.

[1:36:08] Voice 20: And, you know, be careful.

[1:36:10] Voice 20: I lived in Colorado when entire neighborhoods burnt to the ground

[1:36:15] Voice 20: because people built in areas that were high risk with limited infrastructure.

[1:36:20] Voice 20: So, and I know many people who have lost their homes in different places all across North America.

[1:36:26] Voice 20: And I just don't want that for our communities.

[1:36:30] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Morrison. Trustee Harris.

[1:36:34] Voice 8: Yes, that, you know, danger is real, and it encompasses all of the, definitely all of Salt Spring.

[1:36:43] Voice 8: When it's dry, it's dry. There's an elevated fire risk. The fire hall posts it. It can be extreme and very, very extreme.

[1:36:50] Voice 8: And that basically covers the whole of the island.

[1:36:53] Voice 8: So this word wildfire being in there does have the danger of people interpreting it as development anywhere.

[1:37:03] Voice 8: Again, wildfire is something that we are addressing.

[1:37:06] Voice 8: There's all kinds of talk and, you know, committees about it and studies and consultants, which, you know, we still we can't even come to an agreement on that.

[1:37:15] Voice 8: um the you know one of the main authorities on the west coast of north america states clearly

[1:37:21] Voice 8: that in order to mitigate wildfire risk you need to use heavy equipment and loggers and create

[1:37:28] Voice 8: swaths so you know we can't even agree to do that like this is a reality so again the whole of the

[1:37:34] Voice 8: island can be encompassed by this this term here and i think it's it's it would be troublesome to

[1:37:39] Voice 8: many people in the community it doesn't belong in this area um i do 100 agree that we need to deal

[1:37:46] Voice 8: with the wildfire risk nobody nobody is saying that we don't need to do that but in this context

[1:37:54] Voice 8: it's again we're going to have some kickback from the community thank

[1:37:57] Voice 10: you trustee harris trustee

[1:37:59] Voice 10: evans thanks

[1:38:02] Voice 17: um i'm not sure about the other islands uh maybe staff can help me out here

[1:38:06] Voice 17: But I do see, like, on the schedules, I do see steep slope hazards and other items that are listed in here.

[1:38:15] Voice 17: The one that I do not see are wildfire maps for South Panda.

[1:38:21] Voice 17: I don't know how many other islands have that.

[1:38:23] Voice 17: So if I can just ask that question quickly of staff before I continue on with my thought.

[1:38:28] Voice 10: Okay, thank you.

[1:38:29] Voice 10: So, Director Frater?

[1:38:34] Voice 19: I think this one might be better suited to Director of Planning or Planner Humans.

[1:38:40] Voice 10: Great. Who wants to jump in on this?

[1:38:46] Voice 16: Hi.

[1:38:47] Voice 16: I

[1:38:48] Voice 10: see Trustee Boland may.

[1:38:50] Voice 10: Okay. Trustee Boland might be able to enlighten us.

[1:38:53] Voice 16: Well, not that much, but there are wildfire hazard risk maps prepared by the

[1:38:59] Voice 16: CRD for the Southern Gulf Islands. And I've put in the chat a link and there's one for each island

[1:39:07] Voice 16: and it describes how the hazard assessment is carried out and most of the suggestion around

[1:39:15] Voice 16: mitigation for householders is about fire smart in your home and anyway there's a link in the chat

[1:39:23] Voice 16: which is um let me see crd i've got it in the chat i can repeat it in the chat but

[1:39:32] Voice 10: there are maps.

[1:39:33] Voice 10: Thanks Trustee Bowen. Okay Trustee Evans back to you.

[1:39:37] Voice 17: Okay so if the

[1:39:38] Voice 17: islands don't have maps for wildfire or fire regarding development and land use

[1:39:49] Voice 17: I find that problematic I would suggest that we get some of those maps in place

[1:39:55] Voice 17: rather than just the CRD ones we should have them at our own island level as well.

[1:40:03] Voice 17: And, yeah, like I said, I'm not comfortable voting to include the word wildfire until I understand the impact that it has on my island.

[1:40:15] Voice 17: Like I said, because with this, and this is a directive, correct?

[1:40:22] Voice 17: Is this a directive?

[1:40:24] Voice 1: It is a directive. That is correct.

[1:40:27] Voice 1: Okay,

[1:40:28] Voice 17: so if it's a directive, then we are saying that we have to direct development away from anywhere that falls within the wildfire. So that means anyone that comes to us with a variance or a building permit, we can't do it. Or am I misunderstanding that?

[1:40:47] Voice 17: That

[1:40:48] Voice 24: is not what that level of policy would direct. Can somebody explain that?

[1:40:53] Voice 10: Yeah, just one at a time, please.

[1:40:55] Voice 10: Director Freyder, I see, has her hand up.

[1:40:57] Voice 10: She might be able to clarify here.

[1:40:59] Voice 19: I will leave the planners to speak to the implementation piece,

[1:41:03] Voice 19: but I'll just note it's a two-part directive.

[1:41:05] Voice 19: The first part is to identify it.

[1:41:07] Voice 19: So that would be the procurement of the maps you need

[1:41:10] Voice 19: to then do the policy work, which is the directing away from.

[1:41:13] Voice 19: So where there is an absence of information,

[1:41:15] Voice 19: this policy would direct the local trust committee

[1:41:17] Voice 19: to go get the information it needs to make good decisions

[1:41:20] Voice 19: about then avoiding the hazards that have been identified.

[1:41:23] Voice 19: So that speaks to the comment made by Trustee Evans,

[1:41:26] Voice 19: but I'll let a planner with some more expertise

[1:41:28] Voice 19: speak to the implementation side.

[1:41:32] Voice 1: Go ahead.

[1:41:33] Voice 1: Oh, I was only gonna say that it would be up

[1:41:37] Voice 1: to the local trust committee who is abiding

[1:41:40] Voice 1: by this directive policy to direct development

[1:41:44] Voice 1: away from that area in accordance

[1:41:46] Voice 1: with whatever it thinks that means.

[1:41:47] Voice 1: If you think that means that there is existing development potential in the wildfire interface zone that you think should no longer be there, you can consider ways to remove that development potential.

[1:41:57] Voice 1: If you do not want to make a change to people's existing development rights that they may have under current zoning, then you could consider that this will apply only to potential new development.

[1:42:08] Voice 1: Like if people were to come forward with rezoning applications to create more dense subdivisions, for example, than your zoning bylaw currently allows, and you determined that that proposal was located in an area of elevated wildfire exposure risk, or whatever the other hazard happens to be, you could not approve that proposal and suggest that they move it elsewhere to a less risky zone.

[1:42:34] Voice 17: Can I ask a follow-up question?

[1:42:36] Voice 1: Certainly, go ahead.

[1:42:38] Voice 17: So does that mean if somebody has owned their piece of property, which is already subdivided for, say, 20 years, and they've decided, OK, now I'm going to build, but they fall within that wildfire area.

[1:42:49] Voice 17: Does this directive and the follow on bylaws and OCP stuff, does that impact their ability to get their building permit at all?

[1:43:01] Voice 1: Only if you as a local trust committee were to change their zoning in such a way that they could no longer do that thing. But I mean, if you are zoned to build a house, you can build a house regardless of what this higher level policy might say.

[1:43:21] Voice 1: The expectation here is that over time, local trust committees are going to amend their bylaws in such a way that they are going to reduce development opportunities within that wildfire interface zone.

[1:43:31] Voice 1: But for the person you are talking about today, if they have a piece of property and they're zoned to build a house and this policy statement passes with this policy in it, that has no impact on them until such time as your local trust committee amends its own policies and regulations to come into line with this in such a way that it thinks is appropriate and that EC may or may not approve when the bylaw gets to their table.

[1:43:59] Voice 1: And

[1:44:00] Voice 17: this is a directive. So we have to. Yeah.

[1:44:04] Voice 17: And that's my problem. We have to do this. Whether now or in the future, we have to.

[1:44:12] Voice 9: Yes, but trustee, how are you?

[1:44:17] Voice 24: Well, I guess I'm having a problem with trustee Evans question. Do any trust areas currently have these protected areas?

[1:44:27] Voice 24: Well, we don't have any areas generally, I think, that protect against flooding either or, you know, sea level rise. And yet mapping is coming up at an accelerated rate because we're aware that climate change is changing the lands and waters in which we live.

[1:44:46] Voice 24: I would say it's taken us so long to conclude or redraft a policy statement.

[1:44:54] Voice 24: This is going to have to stand for perhaps 20, 30 years.

[1:44:58] Voice 24: Let's do some proactive policies that put in place the directives to consider the potential changes that will impact our communities.

[1:45:12] Voice 24: This is, it's about responsible planning and directing development away from what is potentially known to be a hazardous area in the future. Maybe it isn't known now, but having a policy in place to say you should not put more development there in that what, say, a community is identified as a high wildfire interface is a responsible local government planning tool.

[1:45:40] Voice 24: So I'm not in support of removing the word wildfire out of precaution and just knowing it's taking us so long to land this policy statement.

[1:45:49] Voice 24: We better be planning for the future, not for the past.

[1:45:53] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Elliott.

[1:45:55] Voice 10: Trustee Harris.

[1:45:57] Voice 8: Thank you.

[1:45:57] Voice 8: you um in recent fairly recent conversations with the fire chief on salt spring island there was

[1:46:03] Voice 8: you know there had been talk um by some in the fire hall and in the local trust committee staff

[1:46:12] Voice 8: about um creating developmental welfare developmental permit areas and many in the

[1:46:18] Voice 8: community were quite alarmed by that kind of talk um the fire chief reiterated to me that um

[1:46:24] Voice 8: that isn't what he was looking for.

[1:46:26] Voice 8: If there was going to be a development in a forested area,

[1:46:30] Voice 8: then they would want to make sure that the development took the precautions needed

[1:46:38] Voice 8: to make sure there was going to be enough water for them to fight the fire,

[1:46:42] Voice 8: i.e. ponds, holding tanks, that kind of deal.

[1:46:47] Voice 8: The way this is worded now, this is the type of language that got the island's trust into big trouble

[1:46:51] Voice 8: with the last policy statement.

[1:46:53] Voice 8: This is very overreaching and really can be interpreted as a very nefarious, you know, way of gaining, you know, getting this sort of eco-radical type of grip on people's private property, including local First Nations who own large tracts of forested land who want to develop them.

[1:47:13] Voice 8: um this now you know this doesn't mean that we can't address wildfire like i said but to me it

[1:47:19] Voice 8: doesn't belong here it's going to get us in trouble and um we'll you know see what happens

[1:47:25] Voice 8: but i'm in support of the motion to amend this and take the word wildfire out thank you thank

[1:47:30] Voice 8: you trustee harris trustee fast um

[1:47:33] Trustee Fast: thank you chair i just want to uh point people to page 64

[1:47:38] Trustee Fast: of our Community Wildfire Resiliency Plan

[1:47:42] Trustee Fast: that I put in the chat.

[1:47:44] Trustee Fast: My initials in there are TF for anybody looking for it.

[1:47:49] Trustee Fast: It was delightful to see that over the change in renewing,

[1:47:57] Trustee Fast: because this was renewing a 20-year-old plan,

[1:48:01] Trustee Fast: that we only on Bowen have very small areas

[1:48:07] Trustee Fast: that are listed as extreme wildfire threat

[1:48:11] Trustee Fast: in their detailed rating system

[1:48:14] Trustee Fast: or high, very small areas.

[1:48:18] Trustee Fast: So I don't think we should be alarmed by this

[1:48:20] Trustee Fast: because we've got the word elevated in there.

[1:48:24] Trustee Fast: It's not a blanket halt on development.

[1:48:29] Trustee Fast: It's very specific areas if the mapping is done.

[1:48:32] Trustee Fast: And that's what this motion seems to me to be speaking to.

[1:48:35] Trustee Fast: So I'm in support of the motion without the amendment.

[1:48:40] Trustee Fast: I want to leave wildfire in.

[1:48:42] Trustee Fast: Thank you.

[1:48:42] Voice 10: So, Trustee Fast, just to be clear, we're only speaking on the amendment, please.

[1:48:47] Voice 10: Trustee Lockham.

[1:48:49] Voice 7: Yeah, thank you, Chair.

[1:48:50] Voice 7: And if I might, I actually have a remark that I'd like to make, and then I have a point

[1:48:55] Voice 7: that I would like to make, if that's okay.

[1:48:57] Voice 11: Absolutely.

[1:48:58] Voice 7: And so my remark is that I think it would be better to not characterize individuals

[1:49:05] Voice 7: individuals or people as eco-radicals. I feel offended.

[1:49:12] Voice 8: Chair, point of order. Point of order, Chair. Point of order. I was not characterizing people.

[1:49:19] Voice 8: I was characterizing the policy.

[1:49:23] Voice 7: Well, or behavior, or if I misinterpreted it,

[1:49:26] Voice 7: I'm free to misinterpret it in that way. I think we should just not use eco-radical,

[1:49:32] Voice 7: call, no matter who it is or what it is that it's directed at.

[1:49:38] Voice 7: And I'm interfering with the chair's decision on the point of order.

[1:49:43] Voice 10: No, we'll just, we've heard Trustee Harris's comments.

[1:49:50] Voice 10: We've heard Trustee Laughlin's reply.

[1:49:53] Voice 10: I think we can just carry forward with that advice.

[1:49:56] Voice 7: Right.

[1:49:56] Voice 7: So then my comment on the amendment is, there is a significant point there that Trustee

[1:50:03] Voice 7: Evans raised, is that if a piece of property is zoned for any number of dwellings currently,

[1:50:11] Voice 7: and there's been no changes to the land use bylaws in that particular region, that they would be free

[1:50:17] Voice 7: to do as they do today, even after the policy statement is amended. It may be that regardless

[1:50:24] Voice 7: of whether this language is in the policy statement or not, it may be that a local trust

[1:50:29] Voice 7: trust committee, might choose to amend its setbacks within a property that might possibly

[1:50:37] Voice 7: in a development permit area include setback from the forest because of fire risk.

[1:50:44] Voice 7: And of course, if that's on private property, if the fire risk was the forest close to where

[1:50:50] Voice 7: they wanted to build, they would be free to clear that area.

[1:50:54] Voice 7: Not that I would necessarily support doing that, but they would be free to clear that

[1:50:58] Voice 7: forest area in order to do wildfire mitigation so that they could build or construct a home

[1:51:04] Voice 7: where it is that they wanted. I would presume that any alterations to the land use bylaw would be

[1:51:10] Voice 7: in some form of setback from the edge of the forest or the urban interface area. And perhaps

[1:51:19] Voice 7: we might seek clarity on that from staff if you think that's appropriate, Chair.

[1:51:25] Voice 7: Yeah,

[1:51:26] Voice 10: you can certainly seek that clarity. But are you in favor or opposed to the-

[1:51:31] Voice 7: I am in favor of removing the word or not removing the word. I'm not in favor of the

[1:51:36] Voice 7: motion to remove the word wildfire. I want it to be changed to fire.

[1:51:41] Voice 10: Okay. Thank you for that clarity. So,

[1:51:47] Voice 10: Yomans, did you want to address Chair Luckham's question?

[1:51:51] Voice 10: I

[1:51:55] Voice 1: can take a first crack at it, but then may defer to the Director of Planning Services.

[1:52:00] Voice 1: I mean, when we think about the tools that we have at our disposal under the Local Government Act to protect against the kind of hazards that are being described here today, there are the regulatory tools that zoning offers, which is to say, if the land at risk of wildfire is currently zoned for four dwelling units,

[1:52:21] Voice 1: then perhaps you shouldn't allow for dwelling units there because of the risk that more of

[1:52:26] Voice 1: those dwelling units may ignite at some point in the future right so you've got that tool

[1:52:29] Voice 1: a setback as a regulatory setback might be a little bit challenging because we only really

[1:52:36] Voice 1: set back from the lot line not from the tree line but there is potential there to use

[1:52:43] Voice 1: that tool and then there are development permit areas which most of your islands currently have

[1:52:48] Voice 1: have in place, if not for hazards, than for environmental protection. And the way that the

[1:52:57] Voice 1: hazard or take a steep slope hazard protection development permit area, for example, which I

[1:53:03] Voice 1: know Salt Spring has and likely a number of your other islands have, typically you bring in an

[1:53:08] Voice 1: expert to undertake an analysis and provide a professional report as to their recommendations

[1:53:15] Voice 1: for how the development can be made safe.

[1:53:18] Voice 1: And so in a wildfire interface area,

[1:53:21] Voice 1: you can perhaps imagine that you would bring in somebody

[1:53:24] Voice 1: with the expertise in wildfire risk assessment

[1:53:26] Voice 1: on that given parcel who will make

[1:53:29] Voice 1: the appropriate recommendations for how risk can be reduced

[1:53:32] Voice 1: or risk can be mitigated.

[1:53:36] Voice 1: Sorry, that's a quick summary of some of the tools,

[1:53:39] Voice 1: but Director of Planning Services,

[1:53:41] Voice 1: any other methods of mitigation?

[1:53:47] Voice 2: I just would like to highlight,

[1:53:48] Voice 2: Right. Thank you. And through the chair, just the two key ones you've mentioned, and that is you can regulate use in certain areas and it doesn't have to be per law to give me a certain areas.

[1:53:59] Voice 2: And so if you have wildfire mapping that shows high or extreme areas of danger, you can say, don't put a house there, but then you would direct it somewhere else.

[1:54:09] Voice 2: It wouldn't take away your density, necessarily your potential there, but it would just remove it from the hazardous area.

[1:54:15] Voice 2: So, that's not the purpose of it. So, you can change the use location specifically. And as you mentioned, the more common tool for hazards are via the development permit area, which again does not take away development potential. It only provides guidelines to avoid the hazard. So, those are the two key ways to do it.

[1:54:33] Voice 10: Thank you, Dr. Surmatt. So, Trustee Luck, is that answer to things? Good. Thank you. So, Trustee Getty.

[1:54:41] Voice 10: um

[1:54:43] Voice 21: it's my motion and we're speaking to the amendment um but i'm wondering if we can

[1:54:50] Voice 21: basically get through this part of this somehow and um we're making recommendations to trust

[1:54:58] Voice 21: council there's going to be more discussion and it's going to be agreement in principle so

[1:55:03] Voice 21: um i'm also wondering if um a later motion could be to direct staff to consider an advisory

[1:55:10] Voice 21: policy so that it isn't quite, and that might take care of

[1:55:14] Voice 21: Trustee Evans' concern, so that it's

[1:55:18] Voice 21: you know, we're more aware and we're better educated and we're more

[1:55:25] Voice 21: cognizant in terms of the

[1:55:26] Voice 21: both the increased climate change threats

[1:55:30] Voice 21: and individually where all the services are on each island.

[1:55:35] Voice 21: But it was weird. I have to agree with

[1:55:39] Voice 21: With Trustee Luckham's comments, I was almost at a point of agreeing with Trustee Harris,

[1:55:45] Voice 21: and then we got into nefarious and eco-warriors, and it's like that language is a little bit

[1:55:51] Voice 21: difficult.

[1:55:54] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Giddey.

[1:55:56] Voice 10: If I may,

[1:55:56] Voice 8: I'd love to respond.

[1:55:58] Voice 8: I missed.

[1:55:58] Voice 10: I mean, I would love to

[1:55:59] Voice 8: respond just kindly to Chair Giddey.

[1:56:02] Voice 10: No, but Trustee Harris, we just wait.

[1:56:05] Voice 10: We just have two more speakers, and if you put your hands up, you can address.

[1:56:10] Voice 10: at that time please okay

[1:56:12] Voice 8: yeah because i had

[1:56:13] Voice 8: a nice comment it was nothing bad but um yes i'd

[1:56:16] Voice 8: like to respond um thank

[1:56:17] Voice 10: you we're trying to discuss an amendment and and and not further

[1:56:22] Voice 10: debate but we will allow you to address that in just two more speakers trusty speak peterson

[1:56:29] Voice 5: thank you chair you're doing a great job um uh i want to thank um director cermak

[1:56:36] Voice 5: for his comments on the regulatory tools.

[1:56:40] Voice 5: I think that's useful information.

[1:56:46] Voice 5: I read this policy, it starts out with identify

[1:56:51] Voice 5: and then direct development away from these areas.

[1:56:58] Voice 5: I don't see this existential threat here.

[1:57:04] Voice 5: Honestly, I don't.

[1:57:05] Voice 5: This is about identifying hazardous areas,

[1:57:09] Voice 5: is directing the development away from them.

[1:57:14] Voice 5: I just want to push back a little bit against a comment I heard earlier

[1:57:20] Voice 5: that the trust policy, we better get it darn right this time

[1:57:24] Voice 5: because it'll never be updated again.

[1:57:27] Voice 5: It has to last for 20 or 30 years.

[1:57:29] Voice 5: That is not what our policy says.

[1:57:31] Voice 5: We are massively overdue.

[1:57:35] Voice 5: I am a strong advocate for the moment this work is done.

[1:57:40] Voice 5: I'm going to demand that we get to work on our policy statement amendment policy.

[1:57:45] Voice 5: This work needs to be ongoing.

[1:57:47] Voice 5: The policy statement is intended to be iterative.

[1:57:50] Voice 5: It's not meant to be fixed in stone.

[1:57:52] Voice 5: So I really disagree with that comment.

[1:57:57] Voice 5: So finally, I'll just say I'm opposed to this amendment.

[1:58:01] Voice 5: Thank you.

[1:58:01] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Peterson.

[1:58:03] Voice 10: Trustee Evans?

[1:58:03] Voice 10: okay

[1:58:05] Voice 17: so i did just have a look at that crd map and i'm horrified to see the entire islands of

[1:58:11] Voice 17: pandas are at the extreme level as in the bright red to about the 50 chance of fire over the entire

[1:58:20] Voice 17: island so i'm again and i i could be misunderstanding um how this would be applied

[1:58:29] Voice 17: so i i am i am fully open to that i just have discomfort um especially where we're being

[1:58:36] Voice 17: directed to direct development away from these areas we're being mandated to direct development

[1:58:42] Voice 17: away from them that just um makes me a little uncomfortable because while we're saying that

[1:58:49] Voice 17: we shouldn't fetter the decisions of um future trustees or ourself i feel like that's exactly

[1:58:56] Voice 17: what we're doing here we're telling you you have to you are mandated and you have to and i'm just

[1:59:02] Voice 17: uncomfortable with that thanks yeah

[1:59:05] Voice 10: thank you trustee evan trustee morrison oh i thought

[1:59:10] Voice 20: trustee harris had his hand up before me oh

[1:59:12] Voice 10: he went it went down and went back up and he's going

[1:59:14] Voice 10: to make a nice comment at the end yeah i did have it up but

[1:59:18] Voice 8: i put it down because i was going to

[1:59:20] Voice 8: to speak so yeah

[1:59:22] Voice 20: go ahead trustee harris go ahead trustee harrison thank

[1:59:25] Voice 8: you um thank you yeah you

[1:59:28] Voice 8: know i just want to address some of the comments i'm hearing about you know this isn't aimed when

[1:59:33] Voice 8: i say this policy will seem nefarious and it will people in the community will completely take this

[1:59:39] Voice 8: the wrong way and there isn't any need for it i'm not aiming this the word nefarious at somebody

[1:59:45] Voice 8: And as with the word eco-radical, because some things do come across as eco-radical. Like, I'm sorry, but that's a reality. Many people in the community see some of these policies as eco-radical, and this very well could be one of them.

[2:00:00] Voice 8: not aimed at anybody i'm not attacking anyone um these are real concerns okay

[2:00:09] Voice 10: thank you trustee

[2:00:10] Voice 10: harris for that clarification trustee morrison did you have a yeah so

[2:00:16] Voice 20: i a couple quick um additions

[2:00:18] Voice 20: to things that have been said so far so uh first is that the crd maps don't dictate what our maps

[2:00:24] Voice 20: will be um so and and i would really support uh an amendment after this if we get through this

[2:00:31] Voice 20: here with wildfire in place just to reduce it or not reduce it but just shift it to fire

[2:00:36] Voice 20: because my concern and i think this was something the planner said earlier is these policies are

[2:00:43] Voice 20: directed at what we understand fire or what we understand development risk to be and um so just

[2:00:52] Voice 20: to ground this in really straightforward understanding when razor point was built on

[2:00:56] Voice 20: north pender um you're going down a historic narrow road with multiple bends that fire trucks

[2:01:03] Voice 20: have to navigate to out to a place where there's no where the water is coming out from a pump

[2:01:08] Voice 20: like a pump system so pressure could be challenging lines are challenging and there's a it was a

[2:01:15] Voice 20: cottages and now it's all these bigger houses um and that kind of development is fire risk that's

[2:01:22] Voice 20: an elevated fire risk situation so i totally hear what trustee evans is saying around and trustee

[2:01:30] Voice 20: harris too i think said that around like the entire island is that we get to dictate as local

[2:01:35] Voice 20: government officials what those maps look like on our islands and to think about what what the

[2:01:41] Voice 20: variables are that we want to consider so i think moving it from wildfire to fire is going to help

[2:01:47] Voice 20: us with that and it's going to protect properties and protect peoples okay

[2:01:53] Voice 10: um hopefully we're going

[2:01:55] Voice 10: to wind this up reasonably soon trustee dodge so

[2:01:59] Voice 4: i think that wildfire should not be in here

[2:02:01] Voice 4: i liked what i heard judy getty saying about an advisory policy um to me our entire island is

[2:02:10] Voice 4: open to wildfire so in terms of new development what are we in about old development i i think

[2:02:17] Voice 4: by removing that and switching that particular topic to an advisory policy, we will have

[2:02:23] Voice 4: accomplished what most people are concerned about, which is protecting any new development

[2:02:27] Voice 4: from the fire, increased fire risk. But at the moment, I would agree with what actually

[2:02:32] Voice 4: Trustee Harris says, that putting that in there is going to be a red flag for people

[2:02:37] Voice 4: who will see that as just another way to completely shut down all development. We already have

[2:02:43] Voice 4: existing zoning in place new development is uh is going to be going to areas at the time of

[2:02:49] Voice 4: rezoning that are appropriate that in most cases certainly where i am will have nothing to do with

[2:02:55] Voice 4: hazardous areas thank

[2:02:59] Voice 10: you thank you okay are you done thank you very much trustee harris on the

[2:03:05] Voice 10: amendment thank

[2:03:07] Voice 8: you um i still support it um you know if this is going to be um left up to the um

[2:03:15] Voice 8: ltcs and and their ocps and and and local um development bottles and why is it in here in

[2:03:22] Voice 8: the first place um so i'm still in favor of the removal of the world

[2:03:27] Voice 10: thank you trustee harris

[2:03:28] Voice 10: trustee gabriel hi

[2:03:31] Voice 18: good evening everyone um in 2006 galliano had a wildfire and we lost 126

[2:03:39] Voice 18: hectares um we know through climate change that uh is making wildfire seasons longer uh and more

[2:03:48] Voice 18: intense um i think that the um water flower risk is central to land use planning we have to plan

[2:03:57] Voice 18: for the future and i think that if we were to uh take out wildfire or fire um that exclusion could

[2:04:06] Voice 18: be interpreted as an oversight um i i'm not of which uh wildfire or fire i'm not to um prefer

[2:04:16] Voice 18: one or the other but i do think that needs to be in there why don't we just put both in thank you

[2:04:22] Voice 18: thank

[2:04:23] Voice 10: you trustee gabbro trustee harris will put you as the last speaker because we'd like to put

[2:04:28] Voice 10: this to a vote please thank

[2:04:31] Voice 8: you um nobody is as asking for the word wildfire to be removed from

[2:04:36] Voice 8: the vocabulary of the islands trust or from the local trust committees um this is you know high

[2:04:40] Voice 8: and center on on everybody's um radar and um this just removes an issue um from the communities

[2:04:50] Voice 8: getting behind and supporting this policy statement?

[2:04:55] Voice 10: Thank you, Trustee Harris.

[2:04:56] Voice 10: Okay, if everybody's okay, we'll go to the vote, please,

[2:05:00] Voice 10: on the amendment, which is to remove the word wildfire.

[2:05:05] Voice 10: So all those in favor, please put your hands up.

[2:05:17] Voice 10: So I'm seeing six in favor.

[2:05:20] Voice 10: So please put your hands down.

[2:05:24] Voice 10: I'll ask for those opposed to put your hands up,

[2:05:29] Voice 10: and then i'll have um somebody from staff tell me how many trustees are in the room please

[2:05:37] Voice 10: so at this point we have 10 opposed six in favor how many trustees do we have now we have okay so

[2:05:45] Voice 10: how many so hands down please and how many trustees do we have team

[2:05:53] Voice 27: attendees chair so

[2:05:55] Voice 10: so that is

[2:05:56] Voice 10: defeated all right so now back to the original motion we will if no if there's no amendments

[2:06:11] Voice 10: Any amendments proposed?

[2:06:12] Voice 7: I have an amendment, sir.

[2:06:14] Voice 10: All right.

[2:06:15] Voice 10: Trustee Luckham.

[2:06:18] Voice 7: There were other hands up,

[2:06:19] Voice 7: but I didn't want you to move on before.

[2:06:21] Voice 10: Well, yeah.

[2:06:22] Voice 10: So basically I don't want to move on, so.

[2:06:25] Voice 7: So I would move that the word-

[2:06:29] Voice 20: Point of order, sorry, point of order.

[2:06:32] Voice 20: Chair, there is, Trustee Luckham is correct.

[2:06:35] Voice 20: There are other hands up

[2:06:36] Voice 20: and there may be other motions before Trustee Luckham.

[2:06:38] Voice 10: All right, fair enough.

[2:06:40] Voice 10: Trustee Boland, go ahead.

[2:06:40] Voice 10: head uh

[2:06:47] Voice 16: apologies that was a mistake okay

[2:06:51] Voice 10: thank you all right um i only see one hand up that it

[2:06:56] Voice 10: would be trustee luckham so back to you trustee luckham i

[2:06:59] Voice 7: think trustee morrison's hand was up

[2:07:01] Voice 7: and it accidentally went down

[2:07:03] Voice 10: okay so trustee morrison still is that what yeah we're probably

[2:07:07] Voice 20: going to make the same motion anyway so i put it in the chat if we if you want to move it i'm fine

[2:07:14] Voice 20: with that but i'm also happy to move it well

[2:07:16] Voice 7: you make it all seconded okay

[2:07:18] Voice 20: the the um committee of

[2:07:20] Voice 20: the whole recommends that trust council revised proposed directive policy 3.4.6 to replace wildfire

[2:07:26] Voice 20: with fire

[2:07:26] Voice 7: seconded okay

[2:07:28] Voice 10: moved and seconded so discussion on the amendment please can i speak

[2:07:36] Voice 20: to the motion

[2:07:37] Voice 10: absolutely so

[2:07:39] Voice 20: really the motion is just to allow a broader understanding of fire

[2:07:44] Voice 20: so that committed communities can actually tailor what they are concerned

[2:07:48] Voice 20: about and consider wildfire infrastructure whatever they need to for

[2:07:55] Voice 20: their own communities to tailor this work down to their communities Thank You

[2:08:02] Voice 10: trustee Morrison I see trustee Harris says his hand up trustee Harris all

[2:08:17] Voice 10: encompassing

[2:08:18] Voice 8: okay

[2:08:19] Voice 10: we missed all of that because you seem to have been muted so

[2:08:22] Voice 10: So if you want to try again, I'll hear.

[2:08:31] Voice 10: Trustee Lockham.

[2:08:33] Voice 7: Yeah, I'm in support of this motion.

[2:08:35] Voice 7: I think this is a good solution to the wildfire conversation that we've had.

[2:08:41] Voice 7: I can fully understand the desire not to go that far.

[2:08:45] Voice 7: But I think it's important for us to note that this fire and fire hazard rating and

[2:08:51] Voice 7: And wildfire and forest fires are a science and a specialty probably understood by, fully understood by few.

[2:09:01] Voice 7: But a fire hazard, the red zones on a map, is actually used by industry, fire departments and others to provide permissions for various levels of fire that people might do.

[2:09:20] Voice 7: too, like weenie roasts or stump burning, isn't necessarily related to a wildfire condition.

[2:09:27] Voice 7: So those hazard ratings are different than a fuel load, which is what a wildfire risk is,

[2:09:35] Voice 7: is fuel loads. So I just feel that's worthwhile considering when you contemplate how you're going

[2:09:41] Voice 7: to vote thank

[2:09:43] Voice 10: you trustee welcome trustee harris

[2:09:46] Voice 8: having worked um in logging for over 30 years

[2:09:52] Voice 8: and um and been a certified tree faller in the west coast of canada for about just as long um

[2:09:59] Voice 8: it's my experience that the area that for instance salt spring island is in um

[2:10:05] Voice 8: the whole island is covered when we were in an extreme fire rating as in vancouver island

[2:10:11] Voice 8: in different areas a whole a whole the areas are are put into that area and that what this policy

[2:10:18] Voice 8: does with this type of wording again people are going to think that this is problematic and we're

[2:10:25] Voice 8: going to be hearing about it um it's to me a very overreaching type of wording not aiming this at

[2:10:31] Voice 8: any person in particular so um i'm i'm not in favor of of of the amendment or the motion thank

[2:10:42] Voice 8: you thank

[2:10:43] Voice 10: you trustee harris so seeing no other hands up i'd like to call the vote please all

[2:10:48] Voice 10: those in favor of amending the motion by replacing the word wildfire with fire please put your hands

[2:10:55] Voice 10: up so we seem to have stabilized at eight in favor please put your hands

[2:11:17] Voice 10: down those opposed please we have six opposed so that motion carries so we're

[2:11:37] Voice 10: now so we will be replacing the word wildfire with fire in the original

[2:11:41] Voice 10: motion are there any further amendments to the motion trustee Evans I don't have

[2:11:50] Voice 17: a motion ready uh but i do just want to have a quick um chat about the phrasing direct development

[2:11:56] Voice 17: away is there a different way that we can capture that um that isn't as directive i don't have any

[2:12:08] Voice 17: suggestions but i am struggling with with that piece um surrounding the fire so um i just find

[2:12:17] Voice 17: that that's very this is this is a directive policy and that is a very directive statement

[2:12:25] Voice 17: within the directive policy that's very binding um and i'm a little uncomfortable with it so i'm

[2:12:31] Voice 17: i'm opening it up for discussion here um if if anyone has any ideas thanks

[2:12:36] Voice 10: thank you trustee

[2:12:37] Voice 10: evans just see the recording secretary's just asking second and why that was seconded by trustee

[2:12:42] Voice 10: Luckum. So for Trustee Evans' question, does staff have any sort of advice? Not seeing any

[2:12:56] Voice 10: staff advice, we'll move on to Trustee Yates.

[2:12:59] Voice 26: Thank you, Chairman. I was just going to ask

[2:13:01] Voice 26: if we can have a five-minute break when this motion is finished.

[2:13:05] Voice 10: We might be adjourning by

[2:13:07] Voice 10: then, but yes. So let's move on. Trustee Morrison?

[2:13:16] Voice 20: Yeah, interesting enough, I didn't like those

[2:13:18] Voice 20: words either so um which is yeah um i am trying to think of what an alternative would be and

[2:13:27] Voice 20: i feel like what we what we've all been talking about related to some of the things trustee

[2:13:33] Voice 20: harris is even mentioning around um like you know fuel reduction or like it's management

[2:13:40] Voice 20: management it's about management of these risks right so i think it's something like um when we're

[2:13:50] Voice 20: talking okay so sorry i'm things are jumping around screen here identify areas elevated risk

[2:13:55] Voice 20: environment of climate change and hazards and manage development around them and i think that's

[2:14:04] Voice 20: something it's something like that but if we can talk that through a little bit more that might be

[2:14:08] Voice 20: helpful okay

[2:14:10] Voice 10: thank you trustee morrison trustee harris the

[2:14:15] Voice 8: wording is definitely problematic um

[2:14:17] Voice 8: i know just personally for myself um it this gives me a great feeling of of um of not feeling safe

[2:14:26] Voice 8: for my family who still lives on salt spring for my friends who still live on salt spring

[2:14:30] Voice 8: who um you know gain their livelihoods for themselves and their families by working in

[2:14:37] Voice 8: in the forest and in development um this is a very unsafe feeling and people are going to um

[2:14:43] Voice 8: you know come back with those types of remarks if we bring this forward

[2:14:47] Voice 8: in this worded um version what trustee evans was saying about changing the words um you know from

[2:14:54] Voice 8: directing development away to something else i think is a move in the right direction now what

[2:15:00] Voice 8: that wording is i would really love to hear some um something okay

[2:15:05] Voice 10: um i see trustee morrison has

[2:15:07] Voice 10: put something in the chat as a suggestion so you can look at that and we'll move on trustee bowen

[2:15:14] Voice 16: what about identify risks blah blah blah manage that risk while managing development

[2:15:27] Voice 16: so it's balancing the risk with the development not setting up the black and white rule direct

[2:15:35] Voice 16: direct development away from so manage the elevated risk and while considering bylaws

[2:15:42] Voice 16: that direct development okay

[2:15:46] Voice 10: so well have a look at what trustee um Morrison's put in the chat and

[2:15:50] Voice 10: we'll we'll we'll see how people like that thank you trustee Peterson yeah

[2:15:56] Voice 5: thank you chair um I I

[2:15:59] Voice 5: I think we're getting a little over, well, okay, I think we're getting a little bit overly concerned about how directive policies, how directive directive policies are.

[2:16:15] Voice 5: You know, this comes into play when a bylaw hits the executive committee and seeing how it works with the policy statement.

[2:16:29] Voice 5: I don't see anything in here that sets off the alarm bells for me.

[2:16:39] Voice 5: Local trust committees are being asked to identify areas at elevated risk,

[2:16:48] Voice 5: not to identify the entire island at elevated risk,

[2:16:54] Voice 5: risk um uh and and to do you know to direct development away from the areas of elevated risk

[2:17:02] Voice 5: not the entire island that's that's not what's being said here and when your bylaw goes before

[2:17:10] Voice 5: the executive committee i would expect that the executive committee wouldn't be interpreting

[2:17:19] Voice 5: interpreting um a policy like this as the entire island and i would also expect that if if your

[2:17:27] Voice 5: local trust committee disagreed with the decision of the executive committee you could be able to

[2:17:31] Voice 5: make this case at trust council um so i think we're getting i i'm sensing a bit of um fear that

[2:17:42] Voice 5: that directive policies are this incredibly binding situation

[2:17:46] Voice 5: that's going to completely hamstring the ability of local trust committees

[2:17:54] Voice 5: to make decisions.

[2:17:56] Voice 5: It's the local trust committee that's to identify.

[2:17:59] Voice 5: It's the local trust committee that's to direct.

[2:18:03] Voice 5: And then when your bylaw comes to the executive committee,

[2:18:07] Voice 5: committee um I I you know you're being asked to to make a reasonable assessment of that

[2:18:15] Voice 5: and and you can make your case for the executive committee I I just think we're we're getting a

[2:18:20] Voice 5: little bit um uh overly concerned that this is somehow extremely prescriptive in a way that's

[2:18:31] Voice 5: that there's no argument with and I just don't think that that's the case I I support it as it

[2:18:36] Voice 5: is thank you thank

[2:18:38] Voice 10: you trustee peterson trustee fast thank

[2:18:43] Trustee Fast: you chair i'm um uh i withdraw okay

[2:18:47] Voice 10: thank you trustee fast trustee harris um

[2:18:51] Voice 8: you know i have a contrary version of of um what chair

[2:18:55] Voice 8: peterson um surmised of this um you know because you know it does go to the executive committee

[2:19:01] Voice 8: and then executive committee would be looking at this um i know there's been talk on salt spring

[2:19:06] Voice 8: anyhow of developmental permit areas for wildfire and they would encompass large large portions of

[2:19:13] Voice 8: the island and if not all of the island or practically all of it at some point um with

[2:19:19] Voice 8: this type of wording and if it's the case if it's up to the uh ltc's and why do we have to

[2:19:24] Voice 8: have such strong wording i do like what was written in the chat about um um well that's

[2:19:30] Voice 8: moved up to manage development related to them that's that sounds great like that makes sense

[2:19:36] Voice 8: people community will like that like this isn't just what we're coming up with here this is what

[2:19:41] Voice 8: you know what i'm trying to envision is what is the community going to say and something that's

[2:19:47] Voice 8: worded more along the lines of managed development related to these then you know that's workable

[2:19:52] Voice 8: that's that makes sense that's that seems like a you know a common sense type of approach and

[2:19:57] Voice 8: we're going to look at it we're not just going to say or seemingly say no development um in this

[2:20:02] Voice 8: area we're directing it away from here um so i'm all for changing it and i do like what i've seen

[2:20:08] Voice 8: in the chat there i'd love to hear more thank

[2:20:10] Voice 10: you trustee harris so we're we're straying away from

[2:20:14] Voice 10: the motion i but i've asked for any more future stuff we're discussing it but we need to wrap

[2:20:19] Voice 10: it up a little bit i see um director freighter's got her hands up she might be able to add some

[2:20:24] Voice 10: clarity to what we're discussing right now and whether or not we're going to need further

[2:20:28] Voice 10: further amendments thank you director freighter um

[2:20:32] Voice 19: thank you chair i've put my hand up thinking

[2:20:34] Voice 19: you you seem to be bogging down on this concept and i wonder when the circumstances arises if

[2:20:39] Voice 19: you might choose to ask for more staff advice on this on a topic or a topic like this where you're

[2:20:44] Voice 19: having a challenge and we could come you know if you request more staff reporting we can come back

[2:20:48] Voice 19: to you with what it might mean in practice to direct development away or ask us for alternate

[2:20:52] Voice 19: wording so perhaps we're not taking all your time here you could ask us to bring you back a report

[2:20:56] Voice 19: report on this topic. There are 48 communities in BC that have already implemented wildfire DPAs.

[2:21:01] Voice 19: We could give you some examples of how they've worked to reduce the interface zone. It doesn't

[2:21:05] Voice 19: mean no development. It just means shifting it away and protecting infrastructure. So perhaps

[2:21:10] Voice 19: if you ask us for advice, we could prepare that for you and bring it back at a future meeting.

[2:21:15] Voice 10: Thank you, Director Frater, for that suggestion. Trustee Boland.

[2:21:21] Voice 16: I'd just like to suggest that anybody who's considering, you know, the impact of this,

[2:21:29] Voice 16: you should look at the CRD maps and look at the Bone Island map. The Bone Island map is quite

[2:21:34] Voice 16: moderate and would raise no alarm bells. The Southern Gulf Island maps, and we would be going

[2:21:40] Voice 16: to experts who create similar to the people who created those maps. So it would be very hard to

[2:21:46] Voice 16: say no no no we don't agree that the uh the risk is not as you've described it anyway look at the

[2:21:53] Voice 16: two maps and compare them and consider what we might be saying and i support the uh suggestion

[2:22:01] Voice 16: that we mitigate or manage the risk making

[2:22:05] Voice 10: this before and trustee evans i

[2:22:10] Voice 17: like the suggestion

[2:22:11] Voice 17: of asking staff to come back with uh clarification on what it means that to direct development away

[2:22:18] Voice 17: way, and perhaps also come back with a few other wording alternates. There have been two that have

[2:22:25] Voice 17: been specified in here as ones to consider. One is changing direct development away with to manage

[2:22:33] Voice 17: development related to them. And the other one is along the lines of create bylaws to mitigate

[2:22:40] Voice 17: development issues related to. So those might be, and I see that there is another one that

[2:22:48] Voice 17: that's popped up, address vulnerabilities, mitigate hazards and prepare responding to

[2:22:54] Voice 17: and recovering from hazard events. So there are some different ways of saying this without it

[2:23:01] Voice 17: being quite the potential impact of those choice of words is I think what I'm getting at. But I do

[2:23:12] Voice 17: like the idea of turning this back over to staff and letting them come back with some suggestions.

[2:23:16] Voice 17: questions. So that is what I'll propose.

[2:23:20] Voice 10: Okay, so we have some logistical stuff. I'll

[2:23:23] Voice 10: go to Trustee Morrison in a second. But so we have a motion on the floor. So we assumably

[2:23:30] Voice 10: would have to deal with that motion. And then subsequently, so I would suggest we might

[2:23:37] Voice 10: approve the motion that's there. But then a subsequent motion would be to refer it to

[2:23:42] Voice 10: of staff for for further comment whatever figure something out and what was trustee morrison

[2:23:49] Voice 10: you're muted trustee morris yeah

[2:23:56] Voice 20: i got it um thank you for reminding me that we are

[2:23:59] Voice 20: reminding us that we have an active motion on the floor um i i am i am somewhat moved i don't i don't

[2:24:07] Voice 20: to to change the wording because i don't particularly want to leave the wording in this

[2:24:11] Voice 20: sway um even between these these meetings i just don't want community to get steam shall we say

[2:24:20] Voice 20: so i move that the committee of the whole direct trust council to change the words

[2:24:27] Voice 20: direct development away from them to manage development related to them and then we can

[2:24:37] Voice 20: talk about the next step potentially if staff can come back and recommend other language for us but

[2:24:42] Voice 20: but I just would rather leave it in a little bit more friendly community language at this point.

[2:24:48] Voice 10: Okay, so you can see on the screen there that the Secretary is trying to capture your words.

[2:24:53] Voice 10: So if you can sort of...

[2:24:55] Voice 20: It's in the chat. I'll put it in the chat again.

[2:24:57] Voice 20: I

[2:24:57] Voice 16: support that motion, the amendment.

[2:25:05] Voice 21: If I may, I'm having trouble toggling back and forth with the chat.

[2:25:09] Voice 21: So if we can get it up on the screen, that would help.

[2:25:12] Voice 10: Absolutely. The chat's not really a good place to be conducting business.

[2:25:15] Voice 20: No, I'm just trying to put text in the chat for the staff.

[2:25:19] Voice 20: I

[2:25:19] Voice 10: appreciate that, yes.

[2:25:22] Voice 17: Can I ask a point of privilege?

[2:25:25] Voice 11: Certainly.

[2:25:27] Voice 17: If we vote on this motion now, are we able to come back and vote on a similar motion again in the future?

[2:25:37] Voice 17: I think there's something that has to be done in the same meeting.

[2:25:42] Voice 17: So I just wanted to get some clarity on that.

[2:25:44] Voice 17: all

[2:25:45] Voice 10: right we have a fantastic stuff staff monitoring this meeting who would like to weigh

[2:25:51] Voice 10: in on the procedural issue there please uh

[2:25:55] Voice 23: chair i could it's uh david here okay

[2:25:57] Voice 10: director marler

[2:25:59] Voice 10: will seek your advice yeah

[2:26:02] Voice 23: um yeah you're not supposed to um beg the question like go back and

[2:26:10] Voice 23: and revisit a decision they've already made.

[2:26:13] Voice 23: But if you're looking to tweak something,

[2:26:15] Voice 23: and this is Committee of the Whole,

[2:26:17] Voice 23: so you're not actually making a decision,

[2:26:19] Voice 23: you're making a recommendation.

[2:26:21] Voice 23: So I think you can loosen those rules a little bit

[2:26:24] Voice 23: and allow for that if it helps the meeting to move along.

[2:26:29] Voice 10: Thank you for that clarity.

[2:26:32] Voice 10: So we're on safe ground.

[2:26:34] Voice 10: All right, so we have that amendment to your satisfaction.

[2:26:42] Voice 10: Oh, Trustee Morrison.

[2:26:44] Voice 10: and no

[2:26:48] Voice 20: sorry my recommendation is in the chat like at the that's not what's there okay

[2:26:53] Voice 11: direct

[2:26:55] Voice 20: development away from them should be in the first quote david without your hand emotion submission i

[2:27:11] Voice 20: don't want to do with myself okay from them and then an end quote to manage development related

[2:27:29] Voice 20: related to them and I think trustee Borthwick I've managed to get the the syntax correct and

[2:27:39] Voice 17: I'll second that trustee Evans okay

[2:27:41] Voice 10: so we have this move by trustee Morrison seconded by trustee

[2:27:47] Voice 10: Evans so discussion on the amendment please I

[2:27:57] Voice 20: think I've said everything I need to say on it

[2:27:58] Voice 20: okay

[2:27:59] Voice 10: um any further discussion on this I've seen no hands go up so I will call the question all

[2:28:07] Voice 10: All those in favor of the amendment?

[2:28:23] Voice 10: So we appear to have stabilized at eight in favor.

[2:28:27] Voice 10: So if you put your hands down, please.

[2:28:36] Voice 10: Just waiting on Trustee Luckham.

[2:28:38] Voice 10: All right, so those opposed?

[2:28:53] Voice 10: So we had eight in favor, four opposed.

[2:28:59] Voice 10: And staff, how many trustees do we have in the room?

[2:29:02] Voice 10: I'm just checking.

[2:29:04] Voice 10: 14, so we still have quorum.

[2:29:05] Voice 10: So that passes.

[2:29:09] Voice 10: so we'll get we'll have staff amend um the motion and then hopefully we can go to a vote on the

[2:29:16] Voice 10: motion trustee fast you're muted now you're gone okay so all right so we have the amended motion

[2:29:52] Voice 10: Just

[2:29:58] Voice 20: one technical issue.

[2:30:00] Voice 20: issue chair go

[2:30:01] Voice 10: ahead looks

[2:30:02] Voice 20: like there's a random comma that's still that needed to be uh removed

[2:30:07] Voice 20: as well just after them them

[2:30:13] Voice 10: so um

[2:30:18] Voice 11: oh

[2:30:23] Voice 17: it's in the motion yeah yeah

[2:30:26] Voice 10: okay so it's clear what the

[2:30:32] Voice 10: motion is on the table all right so any discussion on the motion seeing no hands up we'll call the

[2:30:50] Voice 10: question on the motion as amended all those in favor okay so we seem to have stabilized at seven

[2:31:09] Voice 10: in favor so those of hands down please and those opposed so we're seven in favor four opposed

[2:31:35] Voice 10: um we have a couple of sessions so that carries all right um there was a request um for a five

[2:31:46] Voice 10: minute break is everybody in agreement with that so i don't see anybody waving their hands in

[2:31:55] Voice 10: opposition so we'll take a five minute break and we'll come back and we'll conclude the rest of

[2:32:01] Voice 10: this stuff

[2:32:01] Voice 17: sorry my hand was up so can i speak when we come back yes

[2:32:05] Voice 10: absolutely thanks so so

[2:32:07] Voice 10: we'll we'll take a five minute pause we'll get we'll come back let's call it 8 40 we'll come back

[2:32:12] Voice 10: and and we will conclude our business at 8 40 thank you very much okay everybody we will come

[2:38:48] Voice 10: back from our break here um now watching the clock we're at 8 40 we're to adjourn at um nine

[2:38:57] Voice 10: o'clock um staff are requested about five minutes to discuss um next meeting dates and such so

[2:39:05] Voice 10: So we're literally at the point where you have 15 minutes to accomplish something.

[2:39:11] Voice 10: And based on the pace of the meeting so far, it doesn't look like we're going to get through anything else.

[2:39:19] Voice 10: So I'll turn it over to Trustee Evans.

[2:39:21] Voice 10: And this just might be a Q&A session because I just don't see we're going to accomplish any more business tonight.

[2:39:28] Voice 10: But Trustee Evans, over to you.

[2:39:30] Voice 17: So I just want to ask, do I need to make a motion to ask staff to come back with suggestions for us?

[2:39:40] Voice 17: But I think we can't do that because we're a committee of the whole.

[2:39:43] Voice 17: So is that just an automatic assumption that that's going to happen or how is that going to be tracked?

[2:39:49] Voice 10: I believe we can request. Please, staff, can somebody give me some clarification of how we can ask questions of staff?

[2:39:57] Voice 10: I

[2:40:01] Voice 19: can speak to that, and Director Marler can correct me as needed. Yes, you can request items of staff. By the letter of the law, we should be taking it to Executive Committee and getting Executive to direct us. We have been acting a little loose and fast with that one, so we'll take Director Marler's guidance on this one, but please do direct staff, and we'll seek the direction from Executive Committee as required.

[2:40:22] Voice 19: Okay, Director Marler?

[2:40:23] Voice 10: Yeah,

[2:40:24] Voice 23: I concur with Director Fletcher. The Committee of the Hall is relatively new. We're still working out how it can best work. So I think to keep things moving, if you need information, we can certainly provide it back and you can request it by resolution.

[2:40:41] Voice 23: solution.

[2:40:42] Voice 10: Excellent. Thank you very much. So, oh, and I just, just before we go to trustee

[2:40:48] Voice 10: evidence, I see the boardroom's got their hand up. So I just want to make sure I'm not saying

[2:40:51] Voice 10: or doing anything wrong here. So over to you. I just

[2:40:55] Voice 27: wanted to let you know, we have 13 trustees.

[2:40:59] Voice 10: Okay. So we're, so the way we're sitting, we're still at quorum with 13?

[2:41:05] Voice 23: Yes, you are. So if you lose one, you lose quorum.

[2:41:08] Voice 23: Okay,

[2:41:09] Voice 10: so just for clarity, if anybody needs to leave in the next 18 minutes, please put your hand up and let us know that you're leaving because that's going to bring a conclusion to the meeting.

[2:41:21] Voice 10: So please don't leave.

[2:41:24] Voice 10: But if you have to, you have to.

[2:41:25] Voice 10: So just please advise us.

[2:41:27] Voice 10: Trustee Evans.

[2:41:29] Voice 17: So I do apologize.

[2:41:30] Voice 17: My computer froze during the entirety of Steph Marlowe's answer.

[2:41:36] Voice 17: so I don't know what the answer is the

[2:41:38] Voice 10: answer is yes okay you

[2:41:40] Voice 10: could you it's

[2:41:42] Voice 10: it's it may not be 110% but you know we can do this because we're doing it

[2:41:48] Voice 17: okay

[2:41:49] Voice 17: so I move that committee of the whole request staff to come back with alternate

[2:42:00] Voice 17: wording suggestions and I can't see the section that it's in now because it's

[2:42:04] Voice 17: off screen okay

[2:42:11] Voice 10: so um also so so with what we were just working on so that so that's 5.22 hazardous

[2:42:23] Voice 10: areas so

[2:42:25] Voice 17: sorry i froze again okay

[2:42:27] Voice 10: so what it appears that what you're trying to do is it's

[2:42:31] Voice 10: 5.22 hazardous areas of what we were just discussing on

[2:42:35] Voice 12: yes okay

[2:42:37] Voice 10: um and and alternate

[2:42:44] Voice 10: wording suggestions to is there a particular area you'd like them to focus there yes it was

[2:42:50] Voice 17: um it was where where we used to have the words uh direct development away yeah

[2:42:55] Voice 10: um

[2:42:58] Voice 17: so now it's

[2:42:58] Voice 17: managed managed development related to them so

[2:43:04] Voice 10: you would just like them to review that wording

[2:43:07] Voice 10: to see if there's something better

[2:43:09] Voice 17: exactly that's it okay

[2:43:29] Voice 10: you've seen what's on the screen there

[2:43:30] Voice 10: does that sort of reflect what you? Sure.

[2:43:35] Voice 10: Sure. That sounds like an endorsement. Is there a

[2:43:38] Voice 10: seconder for that motion?

[2:43:45] Voice 17: See, Trustee Peterson's waving his fingers.

[2:43:47] Voice 10: Oh, okay. Well, of course,

[2:43:48] Voice 10: I don't see it. I don't have that enlightenment. So, Trustee Peterson seconds that motion.

[2:43:56] Voice 10: Okay. So, any discussion? Do you want to speak to your motion?

[2:44:03] Voice 17: I just want to take advantage of

[2:44:05] Voice 17: of the suggestion from staff to turn this back over to them for some

[2:44:08] Voice 17: for their review and suggestions rather than us

[2:44:12] Voice 17: trying to hash it out.

[2:44:14] Voice 10: Okay, thank you very much.

[2:44:17] Voice 10: Alright, so Trustee Harris.

[2:44:21] Voice 8: I kind of

[2:44:22] Voice 8: like how we ended up with a pretty good version there.

[2:44:28] Voice 8: You know, I don't

[2:44:31] Voice 8: know if I'm in support of the motion. I think the wording

[2:44:35] Voice 8: and looks pretty good as is.

[2:44:37] Voice 8: Thank you.

[2:44:39] Voice 10: Yeah, so just to be clear,

[2:44:41] Voice 10: what the Committee of the Whole is asking

[2:44:42] Voice 10: is just some suggestions.

[2:44:45] Voice 10: So if we were to make any changes

[2:44:47] Voice 10: that would happen to this body,

[2:44:49] Voice 10: so we're not firm,

[2:44:51] Voice 10: we're just asking for some suggestions.

[2:44:53] Voice 10: So Trustee Evans, or so Trustee Paston.

[2:44:58] Trustee Fast: Thank you, Chair.

[2:45:00] Trustee Fast: Because this section is called hazardous areas,

[2:45:04] Trustee Fast: not where should development be,

[2:45:07] Trustee Fast: One of the suggestions I had put in the chat was, rather than, I guess it would be, rather than managed development related to now, it would be address vulnerabilities, mitigate hazards, and prepare for responding to and recovering from hazard events, because it kind of takes in, this is language from some of the Bowen plans.

[2:45:33] Trustee Fast: And it relates to all hazards, and it doesn't just relate to directing development where it can and cannot be.

[2:45:46] Trustee Fast: It's more about the future, preparing for responding to and recovering from hazard events of all kinds.

[2:45:52] Trustee Fast: And so I want to propose this for consideration by staff.

[2:45:58] Trustee Fast: So if the words could be, I'm just going to leave it there. Thank you.

[2:46:02] Trustee Fast: Okay.

[2:46:03] Voice 10: Well, I trust that staff are monitoring the chat and your comments. So in their review,

[2:46:10] Voice 10: hopefully they'll be incorporating those thoughts. Does anybody else have any comments

[2:46:16] Voice 10: or concerns with this motion? If not, I'll be calling the question. So all those in favor,

[2:46:25] Voice 10: please put your hands up.

[2:46:34] Voice 20: Sorry, Chair, my hands up. I just can't figure out how to get the button

[2:46:38] Voice 20: here the

[2:46:38] Voice 10: whole problem so we're we seem to stabilize now at 12 or now 13 with with trustee

[2:46:45] Voice 10: morrison so we're almost unanimous there so please put your hands down is there anybody opposed to

[2:46:56] Voice 10: this we have one opposed so that carries all right is there any other business all right so

[2:47:15] Voice 10: where we're landed right now i don't feel comfortable entering into any further discussion

[2:47:23] Voice 10: on this section because like literally in 10 minutes,

[2:47:30] Voice 10: I don't think we're going to get anywhere

[2:47:31] Voice 10: and then we're going to lose the train of thought.

[2:47:36] Voice 10: So what I'm suggesting is if we move down,

[2:47:43] Voice 10: well, see 5.4 is draft new policy statement,

[2:47:46] Voice 10: red line version.

[2:47:47] Voice 10: I really don't think we're going to get through that in eight minutes.

[2:47:50] Voice 10: Director Frater, you have your hands out.

[2:47:51] Voice 10: I'm sure you have a suggestion to skid put some grease on the skids here so uh

[2:47:58] Voice 19: before I grease

[2:47:59] Voice 19: the skids I just want to go back to the motion you just passed because I believe the policy you

[2:48:04] Voice 19: were trying to amend is the one that's on screen right now 3.4.6 but it just occurred to me there

[2:48:09] Voice 19: was a different number in the policy in the resolution you just passed yeah

[2:48:13] Voice 19: necessary but

[2:48:14] Voice 19: I just want to have you double check your intentions there okay

[2:48:18] Voice 10: thank you because I'm

[2:48:18] Voice 10: going off the agenda and the agenda is 5.22 um we're in in the body of of on page two so

[2:48:31] Voice 19: i'm sorry i might this might be an unnecessary interruption

[2:48:34] Voice 10: no it's not because i i see where

[2:48:36] Voice 10: you're coming from you're you're you're pointing to what's in the the actual document

[2:48:41] Voice 19: yes and

[2:48:42] Voice 10: and i'm pointing to what's sitting on the agenda so sheriff with

[2:48:47] Voice 19: the indulgence of the group

[2:48:48] Voice 19: i think it would be much this resolution will be much more understandable over time if you were to

[2:48:53] Voice 19: have referenced 3.4.6 of the draft policy statement rather than the agenda number all right so

[2:49:02] Voice 10: let's lean on director marler how do we correct this can we just have a note at the bottom of

[2:49:09] Voice 10: the motion um clarifying what was being referred to or how do we fix this little error so it's a

[2:49:18] Voice 23: a wrong reference in the

[2:49:21] Voice 23: resolution.

[2:49:22] Voice 10: Well, just for clarity, what we were referencing was what the agenda

[2:49:26] Voice 10: is, not what the policy is.

[2:49:30] Voice 23: Okay, yeah. One of two ways. I think you could make a note

[2:49:36] Voice 23: in the minutes that the reference at 522 there is

[2:49:41] Voice 23: to what it's referring to, and just

[2:49:44] Voice 23: clarify which policy it is. The correct way would be just to

[2:49:49] Voice 23: to have another resolution to clarify it,

[2:49:51] Voice 23: but I think if it's okay with the Director Frater,

[2:49:56] Voice 23: you could just go by the note in the minutes.

[2:49:59] Voice 10: Yeah, as Committee of the Whole,

[2:50:00] Voice 10: I think that we're a little bit more flexible.

[2:50:04] Voice 10: So I think if the minute taker could just note

[2:50:07] Voice 10: the correct policy.

[2:50:11] Voice 21: David, I'm prepared to make another motion quickly

[2:50:13] Voice 21: so that it's on the record.

[2:50:14] Voice 21: Okay.

[2:50:15] Voice 21: For the

[2:50:15] Voice 21: authority is the correct.

[2:50:16] Voice 21: Correct. So I would move that Committee of the Whole request staff to come back with alternative wording suggestions to 3.4.6 in the policy statement.

[2:50:30] Voice 10: Okay, so...

[2:50:31] Voice 16: I second that.

[2:50:36] Voice 10: So the way the minute taker has put it, does that work for you?

[2:50:42] Voice 21: Yeah, yes.

[2:50:43] Voice 10: Okay. So it's...

[2:50:46] Voice 21: Okay, wait a sec. To correct, 5.2.2 to 3.4.6.

[2:50:51] Voice 21: Yeah. Yeah. So

[2:50:57] Voice 10: moved by Trustee Getty, seconded by Trustee Boland. I'm assuming there's no further discussion on this motion. So we'll call all in favor, please. So we seem to have stabilized at 11. All right, so hands down, please. And those opposed? We have none opposed. So that carries. And this is how we all work together.

[2:51:39] Voice 10: other. Thank you very much, Claire, for catching that. And we're back on the straight and narrow.

[2:51:49] Voice 10: So at 8.53, we've been asked for five minutes to discuss the next meeting. So I think we're there.

[2:51:58] Voice 10: So I'm assuming, Alex, you want to take the lead on this?

[2:52:03] Voice 19: Sure. I think it's me, if I might.

[2:52:05] Voice 11: Okay. It's the Director Fraser.

[2:52:06] Voice 11: Thank

[2:52:06] Voice 19: you. So we're proposing, we've looked at calendars and the next executive committee meeting to approve the agenda that moves to committee of the whole. So we'd like to propose January 30th from 1 to 4 p.m. And if that is suitable to all, we'd love to have a resolution at this body to avoid having to run an RWM.

[2:52:25] Voice 19: all

[2:52:27] Voice 10: right so in that you assume that you've got you have to start to everybody's calendar so

[2:52:32] Voice 10: for trust count for island's trust it seems to be clear to trustee evans um

[2:52:39] Voice 17: yeah so i'm just

[2:52:44] Trustee Fast: motion at you're

[2:52:46] Voice 17: freezing these meetings um so that can you turn the video off

[2:52:53] Voice 10: trustee evans we're not quite seeing us so maybe if you could turn your video off we might get to

[2:52:57] Voice 10: what you're saying okay

[2:52:59] Voice 17: is that any better that's

[2:53:01] Voice 10: way better um

[2:53:03] Voice 17: i was just going to say at trust

[2:53:04] Voice 17: council we did pass a motion that we were going to have these committee of the whole meetings every

[2:53:07] Voice 17: two weeks and uh the suggestion of uh january 30th as the next one is almost two months away

[2:53:16] Voice 17: not two weeks away so i was just wondering if there's any way that we could have this sooner

[2:53:23] Voice 19: understood um we were looking at available dates and we have that of course we have the winter

[2:53:28] Voice 19: or holidays coming, which I think was an unusual time of year where we have often people away for

[2:53:32] Voice 19: up to two weeks. And then the next executive committee is not till January 15th. We could

[2:53:36] Voice 19: certainly look at options, but there was nothing easily achievable in that timeframe. So at this

[2:53:42] Voice 19: point, we'd like to recommend that we start January 30th. And after that, we would then

[2:53:46] Voice 19: have you on a bi-weekly meeting cycle as best as we can.

[2:53:49] Voice 17: So I just had a quick question. Why do we

[2:53:52] Voice 17: have to have the meeting after the executive committee meeting the

[2:53:55] Voice 19: agenda by policy the

[2:53:57] Voice 19: agenda for committee of the whole goes through the executive committee for approval as they do

[2:54:02] Voice 19: with the trust council agendas so in order to accelerate the schedule we would need to

[2:54:06] Voice 19: schedule a special executive committee meeting for this approval it could be done it just adds

[2:54:13] Voice 19: pieces so certainly it could be done but certainly we would need to schedule that special meeting in

[2:54:18] Voice 19: very early january and then have committee of the whole okay

[2:54:21] Voice 17: because i would have thought we

[2:54:22] Voice 17: would just continue on with this agenda because we didn't get through it but okay thanks okay

[2:54:27] Voice 10: trustee morland um

[2:54:29] Voice 17: perhaps

[2:54:30] Voice 16: uh director marler could advise um is it possible that these could

[2:54:36] Voice 16: be scheduled as um since they have to go through executive committee or it appears they do that

[2:54:42] Voice 16: they could be scheduled as trust council meetings which dissolve into committee of the whole and

[2:54:48] Voice 16: And therefore, we could do some approval of some of the things because we're creating this sort of logjam.

[2:54:56] Voice 16: I'll accept, you know, that maybe the logistics don't work out, but I'd appreciate somebody applying themselves to that and considering whether it would help us, you know, with, you know, actually getting some things cleared away.

[2:55:09] Voice 16: Thank you.

[2:55:11] Voice 23: I could answer that through the chair.

[2:55:13] Voice 16: Go ahead, please.

[2:55:14] Voice 23: yeah so yeah of course council can schedule its own meetings and your meeting procedure

[2:55:21] Voice 23: by law allows trust council to dissolve or resolve sorry itself as a committee of the whole

[2:55:28] Voice 23: but that would be a council's decision not the committee of the whole decision so

[2:55:33] Voice 23: you would need to have that discussion as council so

[2:55:37] Voice 16: we we couldn't have the discussion because

[2:55:40] Voice 16: because we're not just council because we're committee of the whole and we want to be just

[2:55:43] Voice 16: council okay thank you

[2:55:45] Voice 23: yeah i know it's weird but yeah you are committee the whole you can make

[2:55:50] Voice 23: recommendations to trust council uh unfortunately you know so council doesn't meet again now until

[2:55:55] Voice 23: march uh you could make a recommendation to executive committee to consider calling a special

[2:56:02] Voice 23: meeting of trust council for the purpose of having that discussion um not going to recommend it i

[2:56:08] Voice 23: I think it might complicate things if you, you know, try and do too much.

[2:56:14] Voice 23: The, you know, the direction that you've given staff so far is to allow committee of the whole to keep focusing on it.

[2:56:23] Voice 23: So keeping it clean that way and just keep going with the plan might be better than trying to shift gears and doing something different.

[2:56:33] Voice 23: But that's just my thinking around that.

[2:56:36] Voice 10: OK, thanks, Director Merrill.

[2:56:37] Voice 10: I see the director of freighters kind of hand up for maybe some more

[2:56:40] Voice 10: verification.

[2:56:42] Voice 19: Yes. Thank you. Echoing everything director Marler said possible,

[2:56:46] Voice 19: but one of the things I'd like you to consider is we have in a way made a

[2:56:49] Voice 19: promise to the public that you'll work in committee of the whole and not

[2:56:53] Voice 19: make any swift decisions on the policy statement.

[2:56:56] Voice 19: And so that's one way of sort of sustaining public trust in the process is

[2:56:59] Voice 19: to ensure that, you know, you're, you're in the recommendation stage.

[2:57:02] Voice 19: And then when we really move to like a approval and principle,

[2:57:05] Voice 19: there'll be lots of notice to the public.

[2:57:06] Voice 19: they'll have an opportunity to share their views so we've sort of defined the structured process

[2:57:10] Voice 19: that sort of enables public trust and confidence that nothing swift will happen in an unpredictable

[2:57:15] Voice 19: way okay

[2:57:17] Voice 10: thank you director frader trustee fast um

[2:57:21] Trustee Fast: thank you chair i move that the next meeting

[2:57:24] Trustee Fast: of the trust uh council committee of the whole be scheduled for january 30th at 6 p.m

[2:57:31] Voice 10: okay i just i

[2:57:33] Voice 10: I see, before we second that,

[2:57:35] Voice 10: I just see a pained look on Trustee Morrison's face.

[2:57:38] Voice 10: So maybe just defer over to Trustee Morrison for...

[2:57:42] Voice 20: Sorry, I just would, I highly suggest

[2:57:46] Voice 20: that one of the things we could do is we could recess

[2:57:48] Voice 20: instead of adjourn the meeting.

[2:57:52] Voice 20: There's some procedural thing

[2:57:54] Voice 20: that David Marler could probably help us with.

[2:57:57] Voice 20: Because we haven't finished this agenda,

[2:57:59] Voice 20: we could just recess this meeting

[2:58:01] Voice 20: and pick it up in early March.

[2:58:03] Voice 20: and then we don't need to worry about the executive committee meeting uh creating another

[2:58:07] Voice 20: agenda so if we want to keep going on this this pace i suggest we do that

[2:58:13] Voice 23: and

[2:58:14] Voice 23: go ahead

[2:58:16] Voice 10: early january yeah director marla go ahead yeah

[2:58:21] Voice 23: thank you unfortunately that's not

[2:58:22] Voice 23: an option under rubbish rules for meetings that is only an option to um in public hearings uh

[2:58:30] Voice 23: The legislation clearly allows you to recess a public hearing if you don't finish it.

[2:58:35] Voice 23: But for meetings, there's no legislation that allows you to do that.

[2:58:39] Voice 23: And rubbish rules doesn't either.

[2:58:41] Voice 23: So if you're going to continue, if you want to continue the meeting another day, you have to adjourn and then reschedule and continue the agenda on the date that you've picked.

[2:58:53] Voice 20: So, sorry, clarification, we can continue the meeting, the same meeting on a different day?

[2:59:00] Voice 20: No,

[2:59:01] Voice 23: you'd be adjourning this meeting and then you would continue the agenda items on at a future meeting. So you would just say we haven't finished the agenda. We need to schedule a meeting to continue that.

[2:59:13] Voice 20: Okay, but

[2:59:14] Voice 20: that wouldn't have to go through the executive because it's the same agenda. I'm not clear on what I'm trying to get across.

[2:59:19] Voice 23: Yeah. Well, again, Trust Council's policy doesn't anticipate this kind of thing.

[2:59:25] Voice 23: So it just says that executive is responsible for the establishment of Trust Council's agenda.

[2:59:32] Voice 23: It may be something we need to look at as policy amendments to try and clean this up and make it easier for committee of the whole to do this kind of thing.

[2:59:42] Voice 23: But right now, we don't have any means to do that other than the way we're doing it.

[2:59:52] Voice 10: Okay, thank you very much. So, Trustee Yates, I believe you wanted a second motion?

[2:59:56] Voice 26: Well, I wanted to ask, it was originally from 1 to

[3:00:00] Voice 26: four on the 30th i'm happy to second that um i'll second a later one too i was hoping it would be

[3:00:07] Voice 26: one to four okay

[3:00:09] Voice 27: that's

[3:00:10] Voice 26: fine with me all

[3:00:14] Voice 10: right uh trustee peterson yeah

[3:00:19] Voice 5: i was going to bring up the

[3:00:20] Voice 5: the earlier time because i was happy when i heard that time rather

[3:00:26] Voice 5: than rather than an evening time

[3:00:29] Voice 5: i was happy to hear the earlier time um and then uh we do have an executive committee um next week

[3:00:40] Voice 5: and i wonder if we might be able to uh expedite the potential meeting date in january if this

[3:00:50] Voice 5: committee made a recommendation to executive committee um that we that our next committee

[3:00:56] Voice 5: The whole meeting be a continuation of the items on this agenda we didn't complete.

[3:01:02] Voice 5: I

[3:01:05] Voice 10: see Director Freitas put her hand up, so go ahead.

[3:01:12] Voice 19: I have not had a chance to confer with my colleagues, but I'm going to turn to Ruben and see if he concurs.

[3:01:19] Voice 19: Alex has advised we potentially could, if it doesn't flow through Executive Committee, we could potentially do the afternoon of the 8th based on calendars here.

[3:01:28] Voice 19: And she's been doing some frantic quick work to find an alternate date.

[3:01:32] Voice 19: um so that would if that is possible but I will have uh CAO Broney weigh in if he feels that's

[3:01:40] Voice 19: too soon in the new year for staff.

[3:01:43] Voice 10: CAO Broney you're on the table.

[3:01:46] Voice 13: Thank you I think we can

[3:01:49] Voice 13: probably manage to accommodate to do that we have to get this on the agenda for next week's executive

[3:01:53] Voice 13: which of course has to go out tomorrow um so that'll require a bit of fancy footwork for us

[3:01:57] Voice 13: tomorrow to firm up the agenda for that executive for next week um but we can if it's just a

[3:02:03] Voice 13: continuation of this agenda um and if the key staff who would be needed to support that discussion

[3:02:11] Voice 13: are don't have holidays books still at that time then we can look at that for for tomorrow morning

[3:02:18] Voice 13: and see if we can bring that to exec next week okay

[3:02:21] Voice 10: so if we did two motions so we have a motion

[3:02:23] Voice 10: on the floor right now for the for the the one meeting so if we had a second motion requesting

[3:02:29] Voice 10: that ec consider this um earlier january date with would that be the proper way to proceed

[3:02:38] Voice 7: i'll just draw the attention of the chair to the chat oh

[3:02:41] Voice 10: my god we have to see i because i as chair

[3:02:44] Voice 10: not unlike you as chair try not to pay attention to the chat

[3:02:48] Voice 7: so so

[3:02:49] Voice 10: we have um um uh trustee elliott

[3:02:53] Voice 10: saying that she's not available and

[3:02:56] Voice 7: she would be the chair and

[3:02:58] Voice 10: she would be the chair however

[3:03:00] Voice 24: if i may chair i'd be happy to swap with um if trustee peterson's available and i could do the

[3:03:07] Voice 24: 30th um i was planning um a slightly different segment uh with uh um policy advisor yeomans on

[3:03:17] Voice 24: on presenting some options on limits to growth.

[3:03:22] Voice 24: And so if another chair wanted to step in

[3:03:26] Voice 24: and continue this agenda on January 8th,

[3:03:28] Voice 24: I could certainly do a January 30th chairing, thank you.

[3:03:33] Voice 24: Yeah,

[3:03:34] Voice 10: I think amongst all of us,

[3:03:36] Voice 10: we can figure out those ones.

[3:03:41] Voice 7: Okay,

[3:03:42] Voice 10: so let's just go through the hands up, please.

[3:03:45] Voice 10: so trustee boland so so so i'm

[3:03:51] Voice 16: okay

[3:03:52] Voice 10: actually i was

[3:03:53] Voice 16: going to bring up the fact that there was a

[3:03:56] Voice 16: an ec which tim already brought up so that's fine thank you okay

[3:04:01] Voice 10: thank you so and just to be clear

[3:04:03] Voice 10: we have a motion on the on the table on the floor right now for for the 30th so we're supposed to

[3:04:08] Voice 10: be speaking to the motion but let's just wrap this up because we're going to start losing people

[3:04:13] Voice 10: we're gonna then we can't do anything so trustee fourth uh

[3:04:16] Voice 22: yeah i just want to say i i hear people

[3:04:19] Voice 22: asking for for earlier meetings um for those of us who are working uh that can be a struggle um i

[3:04:27] Voice 22: mean later evenings also extends my day in another way but just just bear that in mind whatever

[3:04:31] Voice 22: whatever it is i'll you know i'll make it work but thank you trustee bortha trustee fast um just

[3:04:37] Trustee Fast: that i'm not available january the 8th i didn't have anything penciled in on my calendar so i

[3:04:42] Trustee Fast: book something else and i'm making a presentation i can't get out of it uh but i did have something

[3:04:47] Trustee Fast: on the 30th penciled in not enough with the time but anyway that's i won't be there and i see other

[3:04:53] Trustee Fast: people can't be there either in the chat okay

[3:04:56] Voice 10: trustee peterson um

[3:05:00] Voice 5: thank you uh i'm hoping we

[3:05:04] Voice 5: can get uh at least the motion that's on the floor pass and uh and and explore uh other options um

[3:05:11] Voice 5: If there are any before then.

[3:05:13] Voice 5: And so, and to Trustee, sorry, it's getting late.

[3:05:18] Voice 5: Trustee Elliott's question, if the 8th is a go or another early January date, I don't mind swapping.

[3:05:27] Voice 10: Okay, so I want to go to the vote, but that's Trustee Evans' last comments.

[3:05:31] Voice 17: I was just going to say, for those that are saying that they are or are not available for certain dates, just remember there's only half of us here.

[3:05:38] Voice 17: so there may be other people we just need to have quorum we don't need to have everybody

[3:05:43] Voice 10: fair enough all right so let's go back to the motion that's on the floor

[3:05:47] Voice 10: um so that is for the january i believe 30th meeting

[3:05:53] Voice 12: that's right

[3:05:55] Voice 12: okay

[3:05:56] Voice 10: so all those in favor

[3:05:58] Voice 10: of the motion to the next meeting please raise your hands i see 11 in favor hands down please

[3:06:12] Voice 10: and

[3:06:15] Trustee Fast: Peter was waving his hand and

[3:06:17] Voice 10: Peter is saying okay so there we go those opposed one opposed

[3:06:25] Voice 10: so that carries so does somebody want to make a motion requesting EC schedule a meeting for the

[3:06:32] Voice 10: 8th trustee Evans I

[3:06:37] Voice 17: move that committee of the whole requests executive committee to schedule a

[3:06:46] Voice 17: meeting on january 8th for a for the continuance of this agenda or of what's the date today

[3:06:55] Voice 17: december 12th agenda thank

[3:06:57] Voice 10: you trustee evans trustee getty can

[3:07:00] Voice 21: i amend that to make it subject

[3:07:01] Voice 21: to availability of staff and if staff could ask for whether or not we've got a quorum

[3:07:07] Voice 21: from the rest of the trustees that would help that's

[3:07:12] Voice 10: a i believe it's a friendly enough amendment

[3:07:14] Voice 10: any further discussion on this motion trustee packard

[3:07:21] Voice 15: is this for evening or for the one

[3:07:23] Voice 15: o'clock start on the 8th because that wasn't made clear okay

[3:07:27] Voice 10: we have the boardroom hand up so let's

[3:07:30] Voice 27: sorry that was exactly my question as well i'd like to check with the recorder if the motion

[3:07:35] Voice 27: was for the evening time on the 30th or the afternoon time

[3:07:40] Voice 10: okay let's figure this one out

[3:07:43] Voice 10: justy morrison sorry

[3:07:47] Voice 20: i can't speak to that comment my comment was just if we're going to schedule it

[3:07:51] Voice 20: i i assumed it was an afternoon thing on the 30th from what the conversation was yeah um

[3:07:57] Voice 20: but if we're

[3:07:58] Voice 20: going to do an eighth meeting having two afternoon meetings because it's killing me i don't need

[3:08:03] Voice 20: meetings on workday so i need i need to have at least one of them be an evening so

[3:08:07] Voice 10: you would you

[3:08:08] Voice 10: would prefer the eighth so is anybody is everybody comfortable with the if we do a meeting on the

[3:08:13] Voice 10: the 8th for the evening does that work for everybody within reason okay so staff will

[3:08:21] Voice 10: understand let's not burden ourselves with motions that it will be in the evening so the the motion

[3:08:28] Voice 10: on the floor right now is to schedule a meeting for the 8th and the and the and the and the

[3:08:35] Voice 10: understanding it would be an evening meeting any further discussion on this not seeing any

[3:08:41] Voice 10: will call the question. All in favour? I'm seeing 12

[3:08:49] Voice 10: in favour. Hands down, please. Okay, there we go.

[3:09:01] Voice 10: Anybody opposed? That carries. So we have

[3:09:07] Voice 10: some direction here. Thank you very much. It has been

[3:09:11] Voice 10: a very entertaining evening. And I

[3:09:15] Voice 10: guess at this point we'll call for adjournment. So all those in

[3:09:19] Voice 10: favour? Aye.

[3:09:21] Voice 10: I see lots of hands in favour. I don't see any hands down.

[3:09:26] Voice 16: Thanks for sharing.

[3:09:28] Voice 10: Well, thank you very much, everybody. I will call us adjourned. If there's no other business, we will see you guys perhaps on the 8th. And thank you, everybody, for being very patient with me. It has been an evening. So go to bed, sleep well, and wake up in the morning, please.

[3:09:47] Voice 10: please. Thank

[3:09:48] Voice 10: you. Thank

[3:09:49] Voice 20: you, Chair Maude. And I'm on the Eastern time zone. So it's now 10 after

[3:09:55] Voice 20: midnight. So I'm really tired.

[3:09:59] Voice 5: Okay, thank you, everybody. Well done, David. Thanks. Good night.

[3:10:04] Voice 20: Good night. Good night.