Islands Trust Regional Planning Committee special meeting, May 9, 2025

[0:00:03] Voice 16: And there's one member of the public that I'll let in as well.

[0:00:08] Voice 16: And we are live streaming.

[0:00:11] Voice 4: All right.

[0:00:13] Voice 4: Good morning, everyone.

[0:00:14] Voice 4: And welcome to this meeting of the Regional Planning Committee.

[0:00:18] Voice 4: I am your, well, vice chair, acting chair.

[0:00:26] Voice 4: And, yeah, we're going to call this meeting to order.

[0:00:30] Voice 4: I'm going to do a brief land acknowledgement,

[0:00:34] Voice 4: And then we're going to move directly into an election for chair as trustee Patrick, who was or ex officio Patrick currently, who was our chair, has has moved on to being into an even bigger chair.

[0:00:49] Voice 4: So we need a new chair.

[0:00:54] Voice 4: We are, I'm doing this a little off the cuff,

[0:00:57] Voice 4: but I know that certainly I feel very privileged

[0:01:02] Voice 4: to get to serve in this capacity.

[0:01:05] Voice 4: And I think we all feel very honored

[0:01:09] Voice 4: to get to serve in our various varying capacities

[0:01:12] Voice 4: in this land that since time immemorial

[0:01:17] Voice 4: has been the home of First Nations peoples,

[0:01:20] Voice 4: Salish peoples and others,

[0:01:23] Voice 4: depending on where you are around the Salish Sea.

[0:01:27] Voice 4: And yeah, it is a great honor

[0:01:30] Voice 4: to sort of contribute in that way.

[0:01:32] Voice 4: And I hope that we continue to carry out those duties

[0:01:37] Voice 4: with that spirit in mind.

[0:01:40] Voice 4: Yeah.

[0:01:42] Voice 4: So we're going to move directly into an election for chair.

[0:01:48] Voice 4: And I will probably hand us over to Stefan Cermak, I believe, is going to run you through the plan here.

[0:01:56] Voice 4: We're going to plan to, so we've got a very busy agenda here today, as I think everybody knows.

[0:02:02] Voice 4: We've got a whole bunch to get through.

[0:02:05] Voice 4: My suggestion is if we don't get through all the things we might consider a special meeting at another time, we'll see.

[0:02:12] Voice 4: Hopefully we can steam through some things.

[0:02:15] Voice 4: and yes we're going to keep this election relatively brief is the plan and then we'll

[0:02:21] Voice 4: get on and then we'll see what the chair wishes to do with the rest of the meeting thank you sam

[0:02:30] Voice 12: i'll take that as my uh pardon me trustee borthwick acting chair borthwick i'll take that

[0:02:34] Voice 12: as my cue um so good morning everybody uh i'm grateful to be coming to you from salt spring

[0:02:40] Voice 12: island the unceded territory of many co-sailors first nations i'm going to help you with the

[0:02:46] Voice 12: election of a chair. You've been through this a few times. The process goes such that one of you

[0:02:51] Voice 12: has to nominate someone else. That nomination must be seconded and then that nominee must be

[0:02:58] Voice 12: accepted by the nominee. So let's start there. Are there any nominations for chair? Trustee Graham.

[0:03:06] Voice 13: Thank you, Chair. I'd like to nominate Trustee Boland as chair. Do we have a seconder? I will

[0:03:14] Voice 12: We'll second that at least.

[0:03:16] Voice 12: Okay.

[0:03:17] Voice 12: So we'll take that.

[0:03:19] Voice 12: Sam seconds the nominee.

[0:03:21] Voice 12: And Trustee Boland, do you accept that nomination?

[0:03:24] Voice 9: I do.

[0:03:25] Voice 9: Thank you.

[0:03:26] Voice 12: Wonderful.

[0:03:28] Voice 12: Thank you.

[0:03:31] Voice 12: I just realized I should be taking my notes.

[0:03:36] Voice 12: Anybody else like to nominate anybody else for chair?

[0:03:49] Voice 12: There we go.

[0:03:50] Voice 8: I heard that.

[0:03:51] Voice 12: That was very sharp.

[0:03:53] Voice 12: I

[0:03:53] Voice 16: think that was the call.

[0:03:55] Voice 12: Okay.

[0:03:56] Voice 12: So I'm going to ask a second time.

[0:03:57] Voice 12: All right. Is there any nominations for Chair of the Regional Planning Committee?

[0:04:09] Voice 12: Okay. Last call.

[0:04:13] Voice 12: Anybody else for the third and final time would like to nominate anybody else for Chair of the Regional Planning Committee?

[0:04:26] Voice 12: Okay. Well, by the power invested in me, I now appoint you Chair.

[0:04:31] Voice 12: I don't know if that's quite true, but congratulations, Trustee Bullen.

[0:04:34] Voice 12: You are the Chair of the Regional Planning Committee.

[0:04:37] Voice 12: I turn it over to you.

[0:04:39] Voice 12: by acclamation thank you very much thank

[0:04:42] Voice 10: you i feel like there should have been a sword involved

[0:04:45] Voice 10: but nonetheless um thank you um i didn't check beforehand does that mean i now have to chair

[0:04:54] Voice 10: this this meeting okay um

[0:05:00] Voice 4: marie just for what it's worth i'm happy to help uh stephan and i did run

[0:05:05] Voice 4: through a bunch of bits and pieces with this before so if there's bits where you're struggling

[0:05:10] Voice 4: I'm I'm here to help well

[0:05:12] Voice 10: I don't mind but would you like to just carry on for some of it and then

[0:05:16] Voice 10: I'll swap over at some stage what about that yeah

[0:05:20] Voice 4: I mean I think we probably both know about as much

[0:05:23] Voice 4: about this process as one another but um but yeah no absolutely well

[0:05:29] Voice 10: why don't we go through to uh

[0:05:32] Voice 10: let's say just arbitrarily 8.4 and then consider a break and a handover how about that well we do

[0:05:39] Voice 4: Do you? Sure. Yeah, yeah, that's, that's fine by me. I know we've got a proven agenda as well.

[0:05:45] Voice 9: Yeah. Okay. I'll leave that with you.

[0:05:47] Voice 4: Sure. Yeah.

[0:05:55] Voice 4: All right, then. Well, I will continue to do the thing then. All right. So the first step is, yeah, we need to, I trust everybody has had a chance to look through this agenda.

[0:06:09] Voice 4: Obviously, this agenda had a very daunting number of pages, but it was mostly housing report, housing needs reports.

[0:06:19] Voice 4: So hopefully everyone's had a chance to have a look through the agenda.

[0:06:23] Voice 4: Does anybody have any late items that they would like to bring forward?

[0:06:30] Voice 4: Trustee Elliott.

[0:06:31] Voice 4: Thank

[0:06:34] Voice 6: you, Chair. It is a two-page report that could be appended to item 8.1. What was that? 843, the Tiny Homes on Wheels Enablement Project AVICC presentation. So in this agenda is the actual presentation, and this is my report out of what was said in that wonderful meeting.

[0:07:03] Voice 4: Yeah, I certainly don't see any particular problem. I had assumed we were going to hear about that anyways, knowing that that meeting had already passed. But unless there's any opposition, I'll figure out how to make all of you, make sure I've got all the trustees in my view.

[0:07:25] Voice 4: um yes unless there's any issues though i think we can add that by by a cent uh all right are there

[0:07:33] Voice 4: any other things that wanted to be added in i feel like i remember getting another email about

[0:07:38] Voice 4: something but

[0:07:43] Voice 6: trustee boland were you not going to do well

[0:07:47] Voice 10: i just i i do have a short uh report

[0:07:51] Voice 10: i'll present verbally uh on the back of what you've mentioned it's the tiny homes on wheels

[0:07:57] Voice 10: and i think it might come up again in the housing um uh toolkit updates so i think we're covered

[0:08:06] Voice 10: off in terms it's not really new it's just i will say something at that time thank you

[0:08:14] Voice 4: okay well that seems grand then let's uh adopt the agenda as uh as amended and move into the meeting

[0:08:25] Voice 4: uh so we've got a thing here for public comment period uh i don't know i know rob said we did

[0:08:34] Voice 4: have some attendees yes

[0:08:37] Voice 16: trustee borthwick there's a member of the public who raised their hand

[0:08:40] Voice 16: yeah speak

[0:08:41] Voice 4: uh i think we should do that um i can't remember what the time frame we normally

[0:08:46] Voice 4: do for these is i am aware that we have a very busy schedule but i'm happy for us to hear from

[0:08:51] Voice 4: the public as well um perhaps someone can remind me of giving some sort of framework for how much

[0:09:02] Voice 4: time we want to give to public comment i

[0:09:06] Voice 10: think it's usually about two minutes yeah

[0:09:08] Voice 4: somewhere in

[0:09:09] Voice 4: that somewhere in that realm um so yeah rob if you want to let them speak great maxine you can

[0:09:17] Voice 4: go ahead please

[0:09:18] Voice 16: okay

[0:09:18] Voice 2: um i'm representing friends of the gulf island society and we want to express

[0:09:24] Voice 2: our concern about the Freshwater Sustainability Project. First of all, we're concerned that the

[0:09:31] Voice 2: data don't consider community reports on slow and dry wells, wells that fail all or part of the year.

[0:09:40] Voice 2: Second, we are concerned that the project produce visible, practical-for-use work products.

[0:09:49] Voice 2: We haven't seen that. And I know that you're considering hiring a consultant to do a review of the project. And I was just going to suggest that it's not the science that's in question for us anyway. It's the usability and practicality for the stated use.

[0:10:10] Voice 2: and specifically also a website has been suggested.

[0:10:16] Voice 2: I saw the presentation at your last meeting

[0:10:18] Voice 2: and perhaps the consultant could review the cost

[0:10:22] Voice 2: and practicality of that website

[0:10:25] Voice 2: in addition to the rest of the project.

[0:10:29] Voice 2: That's all I was going to say.

[0:10:30] Voice 2: Thank you.

[0:10:33] Voice 4: Thank you very much.

[0:10:34] Voice 4: No, we appreciate that input.

[0:10:36] Voice 4: And we'll talk to that probably a little later

[0:10:38] Voice 4: in the agenda, but thanks for your contribution.

[0:10:42] Voice 4: All right. So I think there's nobody else in here with us at the moment. So, and we have no delegations. So we will move on to correspondence. So we've got two pieces of correspondence. We got one from Stuart Brands at 6.1, which is page four of the agenda for anybody who needs that.

[0:11:09] Voice 4: And this is a sort of a back and forth between our staff and Mr. Brands.

[0:11:17] Voice 4: I don't know if we have any particular, if anybody has any particular discussion that

[0:11:21] Voice 4: they want to have on this, or if we want to just receive it for correspondence.

[0:11:26] Voice 4: Not seeing any hands jumping up, although I don't, again, I don't have everybody, all

[0:11:36] Voice 4: the trustees in the same spots, but that's fine.

[0:11:41] Voice 4: All right.

[0:11:42] Voice 4: right if we don't have any specific responses to this uh i'm gonna i'm gonna assume we've all

[0:11:49] Voice 4: had a good read and that we can receive it all right so our next piece of correspondence then

[0:12:01] Voice 4: uh it's from alex degan and similarly here i don't know if anybody has any particular

[0:12:10] Voice 4: uh response that they want to give at this time or any discussion if it warrants any particular

[0:12:15] Voice 4: discussion Oh trustee Elliott thank

[0:12:26] Voice 6: you struggling to find the buttons so miss

[0:12:30] Voice 6: Dagan is a resident of Gabriela Island as is involved in our water budget study

[0:12:37] Voice 6: community group and they are following the the work of the consultants which

[0:12:44] Voice 6: council allocated $50,000 for this water budget study on Gabriela and so I think

[0:12:51] Voice 6: I think the questions asked are, you know, will the information gained be integrated into land use planning and lead to the drafting of new directive policies in that policy statement?

[0:13:04] Voice 6: I think that's up to everybody here who's working on the policy statement and then when it goes out to community to ensure that there are directive policies that match the work that we're doing on groundwater supply and mapping.

[0:13:17] Voice 6: and will it inform and direct trust council staff-led decision on limiting density increases?

[0:13:25] Voice 6: I think the response to that is we're developing a suitable land analysis

[0:13:30] Voice 6: in order to direct density away from groundwater recharge areas.

[0:13:35] Voice 6: So it asks a few questions that I think are in, you know,

[0:13:40] Voice 6: absolutely top of mind and why we're doing this work.

[0:13:43] Voice 6: I'm not sure what further there is, but it's just good information that we should maybe have in the back of our minds as we work on all of these projects. So thank you.

[0:13:58] Voice 6: Yeah,

[0:13:58] Voice 4: it's definitely I think I think definitely the comments are, you know, good focusing and reminder for us to as we sort of try to direction and support the work that our staff are doing to keep our eye on these things.

[0:14:14] Voice 4: And obviously, we always want to see all the studies that we're commissioning and having being used to their their fullest.

[0:14:22] Voice 4: And obviously, that doesn't always happen. So it is good to have that sort of focus honed, I think.

[0:14:29] Voice 4: Yeah. But yes. All right. Well, thank you to those who have correspondence. We will receive those. And let's get into some spicy administrative coordination. So we've got draft minutes of our January 20th special meeting. Does anybody have any comments on the minutes?

[0:14:53] Voice 4: other

[0:14:58] Voice 10: than to say they're great minutes i think um the minutes of the islands trust are

[0:15:03] Voice 10: generally really pretty good and thank you yeah

[0:15:09] Voice 4: absolutely all right so uh then i think we can

[0:15:14] Voice 4: uh we can uh we approve those minutes uh we also have the minutes of our february 7th

[0:15:25] Voice 4: meeting i don't know if anybody has any comments on those

[0:15:33] Voice 4: hearing none i'm gonna say we'll accept those minutes as well

[0:15:39] Voice 4: um let's see so i believe that takes us uh so we have uh our follow-up action list for review

[0:15:53] Voice 4: uh so and i know that i had a couple of things um but i think i answered them both for myself

[0:16:12] Voice 4: later as I read through the agenda the other day yeah I mean and certainly as

[0:16:25] Voice 4: as was just being cited by our public comment yeah I mean the review of the of

[0:16:34] Voice 4: the freshwater sustainability strategy oh this is one of the ones that I had a

[0:16:41] Voice 4: question about so I was curious and perhaps director Cermak can help me out

[0:16:47] Voice 4: here so there's um or william chova um so i see that since uh august of 2022 we've there's been

[0:16:58] Voice 4: this request to create a faq for the uh freshwater sustainability strategy um and i noted in some

[0:17:07] Voice 4: past uh agendas that the the target date has shifted a few times and i assume that that's

[0:17:15] Voice 4: the regular, there's just lack of resources and whatever else, but I did want to just sort of

[0:17:20] Voice 4: question it and see if it is continuing to get kicked down the road, do we need to, you know,

[0:17:27] Voice 4: re-emphasize that, or do we need to, you know, see about taking it off the list? I don't, I think it

[0:17:33] Voice 4: would be a good thing to have, but I wanted to have that discussion just briefly at RPC.

[0:17:45] Voice 12: Thank you, Trustee Borthwick. I'll start with the answers, recognize that this is long outstanding,

[0:17:50] Voice 12: ending it almost you know the fuels but to be what's happening in the next few months as opposed

[0:17:55] Voice 12: to what hasn't happened in the last couple years i think what happened here to some degree is the

[0:18:01] Voice 12: freshwater sustainability strategy and specific programs it was working on and the faq what didn't

[0:18:08] Voice 12: materialize i don't have the whole story why but looking forward with the creation of freshwater

[0:18:13] Voice 12: Water Atlas webpage that's coming. I know that Mr. Sholba and myself have talked about that,

[0:18:20] Voice 12: and part of the introduction of that would involve, I don't know if specifically an FAQ,

[0:18:26] Voice 12: but certainly an education session and information session informing people about the Atlas and the

[0:18:31] Voice 12: strategy in a larger global sense. But that's my big picture. Maybe I can turn it over to

[0:18:36] Voice 12: William for any further guidance on this particular deliverable.

[0:18:41] Voice 12: Thank

[0:18:46] Voice 3: you. Yeah, I don't have really a comment on it. It's part of an outreach or education

[0:19:02] Voice 3: surrounded by the delivery of the strategy. And with the process of the strategy has been

[0:19:13] Voice 3: in on projects not on the implementation of the strategy itself so um we we have we have no

[0:19:20] Voice 3: shortage of of um questions being asked on on the strategy so it would be um a part of the

[0:19:30] Voice 3: implementation um communications piece which um yeah i mean i i don't really want to revisit the

[0:19:40] Voice 3: the history right now, but there's been several opportunities of, um, of, of business cases,

[0:19:47] Voice 3: uh, being part of the freshwater sustainability strategy just wasn't supported by, um,

[0:19:54] Voice 3: politically. So, um, that's part of that. Um, so yeah, I, I imagine, um, part of the review

[0:20:02] Voice 3: would, um, would provide, um, some questions and answers about the strategy itself. Um,

[0:20:10] Voice 3: sure

[0:20:11] Voice 4: yeah and really um i'm not i'm not trying to uh sort of beat anyone over the head with this

[0:20:16] Voice 4: this is really just that i noticed that it was still there after a period of time and i thought

[0:20:21] Voice 4: might be worth sort of revisiting and and seeing um and i see that uh morgana's also listed on on

[0:20:29] Voice 4: this in terms of communication so potentially there's there's some some room to communicate

[0:20:32] Voice 4: or collaborate there uh trustee or chair borland um

[0:20:38] Voice 10: hi uh yeah we did approve a business case for

[0:20:43] Voice 10: money and for a student as far as i know and that was to work on the freshwater atlas and i think

[0:20:51] Voice 10: there was deemed to be just resources available as well so um i don't know where that is now but

[0:20:58] Voice 10: but perhaps this can be taken out and bundled with that

[0:21:02] Voice 10: and we can get an update on when that is likely to go live.

[0:21:08] Voice 10: So it doesn't exist in isolation.

[0:21:10] Voice 10: It's actually bundled in with the delivery of the Freshwater Atlas

[0:21:18] Voice 10: and we could be given some sort of date for that.

[0:21:22] Voice 10: Thank you.

[0:21:25] Voice 3: Yeah, through the chair?

[0:21:29] Voice 3: who's chairing right now to

[0:21:30] Voice 10: the chair

[0:21:32] Voice 3: through the chair um yeah uh first of all our um okay so

[0:21:37] Voice 3: we do have uh this is borderline jumping into my update but we we do have

[0:21:43] Voice 3: um uh a consultant

[0:21:46] Voice 3: not a student a consultant working on this project this consultant is a phd student at

[0:21:53] Voice 3: at UBC but it's not a co-op or anything and developing a frequently asked questions out

[0:21:58] Voice 3: of the scope of of that project he's a spatial analyst and we're lucky to have Landon and

[0:22:05] Voice 3: we have zero time to to do a frequently asked question before the end of his contract at the

[0:22:11] Voice 3: end of June for

[0:22:13] Voice 4: sure yeah and and I guess I guess the thing that I would say is I mean

[0:22:18] Voice 4: one obviously these are always more complicated to build than one thinks um but perhaps if you

[0:22:24] Voice 4: have had a you know a series of questions um that might be something that morgana is able to sort of

[0:22:31] Voice 4: have a look over and and sort of help direct a little bit and anyways i'm not going to get it

[0:22:36] Voice 3: yeah no no no no i appreciate that vice chair because it's not just you're right it's it is

[0:22:43] Voice 3: is complicated to build because just slapping a frequently asked question on

[0:22:47] Voice 3: our already complicated single webpage, Freshwater, it's,

[0:22:52] Voice 3: it's, it's too much already.

[0:22:54] Voice 3: And so the communications advice is like, it's too much already.

[0:22:59] Voice 3: So the whole,

[0:23:00] Voice 3: like the website for Freshwater needs to be revisited and rethought of

[0:23:06] Voice 3: because it's, it's, it's already too much information.

[0:23:10] Voice 3: And we know that already. Right.

[0:23:12] Voice 3: Yeah.

[0:23:13] Voice 4: Okay. Well, let's not belabor this too much more. I know Director Cermak did have his hand up there briefly, but he did take it down, so I don't know.

[0:23:22] Voice 12: Well, through the vice chair, if the RPC would like us to remove that from the follow-up action list, it's fine. I think you rest assured that the Atlas itself is going to require communications.

[0:23:34] Voice 12: You have a report coming to you as per small action list that should be in your summer that we're reporting next RPC meeting in July about that.

[0:23:43] Voice 12: So we can fold that in there.

[0:23:45] Voice 12: We could also fold it into, as William said, into the review process in terms of when we're reviewing the freshwater sustainability strategy and reporting back.

[0:23:57] Voice 12: That by nature of itself will also create a need for communication and what it is and where it's going and stuff.

[0:24:04] Voice 12: So if you feel comfortable that those two products will answer questions, I believe

[0:24:09] Voice 12: as this resolution was requiring, you could ask us to remove it from there and we'll fold

[0:24:14] Voice 12: it into other items.

[0:24:16] Voice 4: I mean, certainly my immediate sort of instinct here is that this is still a specific form

[0:24:25] Voice 4: of communication that might be valid and it may well come to be through those other processes

[0:24:30] Voice 4: in which case that's great.

[0:24:32] Voice 4: I mean, we're not in the business of telling you specifically how to deliver those things,

[0:24:37] Voice 4: just that that is a thing that we've identified as a need or actually previous trust council

[0:24:41] Voice 4: identified as a need, previous RPC.

[0:24:44] Voice 4: And yeah, I really just wanted to note that I had seen it sort of bumping along from a

[0:24:49] Voice 4: couple of agendas and wanted to just check in.

[0:24:51] Voice 4: Anyways, that's taken far more time than it should have.

[0:24:54] Voice 4: Does anybody else have any things on the follow-up action list?

[0:25:02] Voice 4: Okay.

[0:25:03] Voice 4: Okay. Well, then I think we can accept that and get into some meat.

[0:25:11] Voice 4: So at 8.1, we have Monitor Progress of Protection of Ecosystem Health

[0:25:24] Voice 4: in All Land Use Planning Decisions, a presentation.

[0:25:30] Voice 12: Mr. Chair, I'll take the lead on that for now.

[0:25:32] Voice 12: It's my pleasure to introduce you to Patricia Woodruff.

[0:25:37] Voice 12: patricia is uh she has a phd in biology extensive experience she has decades of experience working

[0:25:46] Voice 12: in british columbia as a professional biologist within various provincial ministries as well as

[0:25:51] Voice 12: the federal department of fisheries and oceans and numerous non-profit organizations patricia's

[0:25:56] Voice 12: most recent experience that you can tell i had to write this down to make sure i i didn't say

[0:26:00] Voice 12: anything wrong uh patricia's most recent experiences are working with the ministry of water land and

[0:26:05] Voice 12: resources stewardship reviewing repairing area protection regulation assessment reports for

[0:26:10] Voice 12: compliance with standards and related work that might have sounded like a word a lot of words

[0:26:15] Voice 12: but in language you might understand better is raw reports or as they're now called wrapper reports

[0:26:21] Voice 12: patricia reviewed them from the provincial side of things uh for so she has a lot of experience

[0:26:26] Voice 12: with development permit areas with local regulations with how the ministry perceives

[0:26:31] Voice 12: things as a major asset. The opportunity to hire Patricia came via the federal grant from the ECCC,

[0:26:40] Voice 12: the Department of Climate Change Canada, and the contribution agreement that we signed with ECC

[0:26:47] Voice 12: directs the work of Patricia to enhance integration of biological information into land use decisions

[0:26:52] Voice 12: in the Islands Trust area. And Patricia started up with us in late February. She'll be with us

[0:26:57] Voice 12: to the end of next march and her focus is uh and her speciality i would say to some degree maybe

[0:27:03] Voice 12: she wouldn't say this is species at risk and that's the focus of the program and so she's not

[0:27:08] Voice 12: just looking at species at risk she's looking at the habitat that they're in and she's done

[0:27:12] Voice 12: well i don't want to give it all away but an exhaustive assessment of everything island stress

[0:27:16] Voice 12: related in this field but before i go into it i'm i've been very excited to work with patricia she's

[0:27:22] Voice 12: been going she's been a dynamo to work with i'm going to turn over patricia to tell you more about

[0:27:27] Voice 12: program what she's doing and what to expect in the fiscal year. Trisha.

[0:27:33] Voice 11: Thanks very much Director

[0:27:34] Voice 11: Cermak and thank you trustees for fitting me into your schedule today. I have a quick three-minute

[0:27:40] Voice 11: presentation. Okay hold on let me make sure I can do this. I practiced so hopefully this works

[0:27:49] Voice 11: from beginning. Okay I'm hoping everyone can see the slides. So just to follow up with what

[0:28:02] Voice 11: what Director Cermak was telling you.

[0:28:05] Voice 11: I have a background with Species at Risk,

[0:28:08] Voice 11: both with the federal government

[0:28:09] Voice 11: under the Species at Risk Act

[0:28:10] Voice 11: and with the Provincial Conservation Data Center.

[0:28:14] Voice 11: I've built ecosystem models

[0:28:16] Voice 11: of both local freshwater and marine environments,

[0:28:19] Voice 11: focusing mainly on food web interactions.

[0:28:22] Voice 11: My base position is with the Aquatic Ecosystem Branch

[0:28:24] Voice 11: and Ministry of Water, Land and Resource Stewardship,

[0:28:26] Voice 11: where I review those wrapper reports

[0:28:28] Voice 11: to make sure they meet standards.

[0:28:29] Voice 11: And doing that in that role,

[0:28:31] Voice 11: I've worked quite a bit with the planning departments of local governments.

[0:28:34] Voice 11: I've also worked with different First Nations throughout Vancouver Island and the Lower

[0:28:39] Voice 11: Mainland on a variety of projects, including the state of salmon, shellfish, and the local

[0:28:43] Voice 11: environment in their traditional territories.

[0:28:47] Voice 11: So for my current tasks, I am meeting with the full planning team next week to present

[0:28:53] Voice 11: on the different species at risk and sensitive ecosystems in Islands Trust, and as well as

[0:28:58] Voice 11: to discuss potential webinar topics or any other manuals or documentation which could help them

[0:29:04] Voice 11: better integrate biological information into their land use planning decisions for the biological

[0:29:09] Voice 11: indicators and data gaps. I'm currently compiling a list of species at risk which includes culturally

[0:29:15] Voice 11: significant and regionally important species for each island and this list includes their habitat

[0:29:21] Voice 11: requirements, the threats, available protections already in place and the basic population trends.

[0:29:28] Voice 11: I've been, in collaboration with the province, I've been reviewing the official community plans and development permit area guidelines from other local governments to see what wording and protections are in place elsewhere in the province.

[0:29:42] Voice 11: And I will be working with the ITC to engage with First Nations on any culturally significant species that could use additional protections.

[0:29:49] Voice 11: And I am currently assisting planners in their review of professional reports for various projects.

[0:29:55] Voice 11: projects so by the end of next march

[0:30:00] Voice 11: I'm hoping to have a report that assesses the current status of species at

[0:30:03] Voice 11: risk in Islands Trust with their existing protections and any gaps that

[0:30:07] Voice 11: could be gaps in habitat protection or just gaps in knowledge of, you know,

[0:30:11] Voice 11: population trends and current conditions.

[0:30:15] Voice 11: The planning team has already identified potential areas where manuals or

[0:30:19] Voice 11: recorded webinars would be useful for them,

[0:30:21] Voice 11: especially in the onboarding process to better understand the data that's

[0:30:26] Voice 11: available in the mapping process. I'll be producing those and anything else that gets

[0:30:30] Voice 11: fleshed out next week. I'll have a potential toolkit of wording available that specifically

[0:30:36] Voice 11: identifies species at risk and their habitats that's been used by other local governments,

[0:30:41] Voice 11: and it could be available just as sort of templates for any upcoming OCP and bylaw reviews.

[0:30:46] Voice 11: And I will also be investigating any other potential options for protection, such as

[0:30:52] Voice 11: potentially conservation agreements with the federal government. In those cases, funding is

[0:30:57] Voice 11: available for activities such as monitoring species at risk and identifying protecting any

[0:31:02] Voice 11: critical habitat. And that is my three-minute overview of me. We might have a couple minutes

[0:31:09] Voice 11: for any questions, and thank you again for your time.

[0:31:13] Voice 4: Yeah, well, I mean, I'll say right off the

[0:31:15] Voice 4: bat that I am extremely interested to see that report, and that your work sounds absolutely

[0:31:20] Voice 4: fascinating and super helpful. But I'm going to let ex-officio trustee Patrick speak.

[0:31:29] Trustee Patrick: Well, thank you. It's a pleasure to meet you. Patricia, in your digging and uncovering of

[0:31:35] Trustee Patrick: understones here at the Islands Trust, there's one project I really hope you take a close look at,

[0:31:40] Trustee Patrick: and that was here on Salt Spring. A group of scientists, we pulled together a group last term

[0:31:46] Trustee Patrick: that had more doctors than I ever saw in one working group

[0:31:50] Trustee Patrick: and under Dr. Tara Martin's leadership

[0:31:53] Trustee Patrick: from the conservation lab over in UBC

[0:31:56] Trustee Patrick: produced an incredible GIS database

[0:31:59] Trustee Patrick: that helped inform decisions in particular

[0:32:03] Trustee Patrick: about like what portion of a property

[0:32:06] Trustee Patrick: had the highest value.

[0:32:09] Trustee Patrick: Often when we get faced decisions

[0:32:11] Trustee Patrick: of an applicant offering a piece of property to protect,

[0:32:17] Trustee Patrick: it's typically the piece that's least attractive to develop,

[0:32:21] Trustee Patrick: which could be also the least important

[0:32:24] Trustee Patrick: to biological diversity or ecosystem health.

[0:32:28] Trustee Patrick: This tool that was created was really cool

[0:32:30] Trustee Patrick: because it was all the layers,

[0:32:32] Trustee Patrick: our layers plus additional layers

[0:32:34] Trustee Patrick: from the conservation lab that really informed

[0:32:37] Trustee Patrick: where was the highest value of that property.

[0:32:40] Trustee Patrick: So I'd really encourage you to take a look and dig. I know staff here in Salt Spring did do some digging to find it because it seems to have gotten well under a rock.

[0:32:49] Trustee Patrick: But I think it was an important tool to take a look at. Is that something we need in the future as well?

[0:32:55] Trustee Patrick: Okay,

[0:32:56] Voice 11: thank you. I will follow up with that.

[0:32:59] Voice 4: And Trustee Graham.

[0:33:02] Voice 13: Thank you very much for that presentation.

[0:33:04] Voice 13: I'm very curious about the infestation of the European wall lizard, and how it's impacting the poor little lizard that should be here. And I'm curious to know if you'll be addressing what we can do, or if we can do anything to support the indigenous species with this onslaught of this introduced species.

[0:33:28] Voice 13: species?

[0:33:29] Voice 11: I have done some work with Gavin Hanke at the Royal BC Museum, and I know he's been

[0:33:34] Voice 11: involved in a lot of the invasive lizards that have shown up in the last number of years in BC.

[0:33:41] Voice 11: So I can definitely follow up with him. I know his particular technique involves elastic bands and

[0:33:47] Voice 11: sort of knocking them out. But I've also heard that American kestrels have figured out how to

[0:33:54] Voice 11: catch them so hopefully we can get some native species preying on them too but yeah i can

[0:33:59] Voice 11: definitely follow up with him good

[0:34:03] Voice 4: and trustee boland patricia you're very popular today

[0:34:08] Voice 10: um thanks for that introduction it sounds really exciting um it's just a couple of

[0:34:14] Voice 10: relatively boring questions so how will you interact with the islands trust conservancy

[0:34:20] Voice 10: see species at risk program and i note that they have a species at risk program coordinator email

[0:34:29] Voice 10: and i'm just wondering will you have a generic email will you use the same one i'm really

[0:34:34] Voice 10: thinking about how you know because i imagine there'll be quite a few people who would like

[0:34:39] Voice 10: to actually give you a heads up on things much as laura has done for um soul spring so it would

[0:34:45] Voice 10: be handy to maybe advertise um a generic email like that thank you okay

[0:34:52] Voice 11: i don't know of any

[0:34:53] Voice 11: generic email director sermac and he's shaking his head no so i i assume it will just be to me i am

[0:35:00] Voice 11: i do tend to meet at least once a week sometimes more often with some of the members of the

[0:35:07] Voice 11: conservancy i like sit right behind them and i do have scheduled meetings with them so we are

[0:35:13] Voice 11: are sort of in the loop of what I'm working on

[0:35:16] Voice 11: and any way I can help them or they can, you know, assist me.

[0:35:19] Voice 11: And then I believe one of the members of the Conservancy

[0:35:22] Voice 11: will be coming to the planning meeting next week as well,

[0:35:24] Voice 11: just as a general introduction and, you know,

[0:35:26] Voice 11: meeting the planners face-to-face.

[0:35:28] Voice 11: So we are trying to get a little bit more,

[0:35:31] Voice 11: or a little bit less siloing, I guess,

[0:35:34] Voice 11: and a little bit more integration, if that helps.

[0:35:39] Voice 11: Thank you, Trustee Chair Boland.

[0:35:42] Voice 4: And Trustee Elliott.

[0:35:47] Voice 6: Thank you.

[0:35:47] Voice 6: Thank you. This question may be for Director Cermak. What will it look like for something like Gabriela's OCP review where we're at right now with developing DPAs? The planners collected all the information about potential DPAs across the trust area, but how would Tricia's biologist position inform that work?

[0:36:13] Voice 12: I actually think Patricia can answer that, but perhaps I will do so for her because you asked me directly.

[0:36:20] Voice 12: Well,

[0:36:20] Voice 6: no, I mean, over to you. I just didn't know who was setting the work plan.

[0:36:23] Voice 6: Sure.

[0:36:24] Voice 12: Well, we set

[0:36:25] Voice 12: up the work plan to start. It was quite broad and with many chapters to it and very sequential with great hopes.

[0:36:32] Voice 12: Patricia is being quicker than the work plan we developed.

[0:36:35] Voice 12: So she's been able to get into more detail than, you know, we always give a little bit of bandwidth.

[0:36:41] Voice 12: with and I believe and she can correct me if I'm wrong she's contact she's talked to people about

[0:36:46] Voice 12: their projects and certainly made herself available to them and so we were slow in the first month and

[0:36:53] Voice 12: a half to let her loose to the planners because you know some planners will just couple her up

[0:36:57] Voice 12: and take all her time so we want to make sure she has her own work plan established before she starts

[0:37:02] Voice 12: being embedded into others but she is being and this is part of the meeting we're doing next week

[0:37:07] Voice 12: is is to show her it's uh now broadly to the whole team to allow her to uh to to say yes you may pull

[0:37:15] Voice 12: on patricia to you know review recommend advise those types of things in the project but she is

[0:37:21] Voice 12: not um she has no direction and it's not in her work plan to like do any sort of scientific work

[0:37:27] Voice 12: or anything like that or any drafting specific drafting it's more of an advisory role to the

[0:37:31] Voice 12: planners and for that the planners do know that already but they all get that formal sort of

[0:37:35] Voice 12: interaction um and so yeah i i suspect that the planner for uh gabriola will be not shy to pull

[0:37:42] Voice 12: whatever resources she can from patricia i

[0:37:46] Voice 6: suspect you're right sorry

[0:37:48] Voice 7: stefan

[0:37:50] Voice 6: uh sorry you're you're

[0:37:51] Voice 6: is anyone else having trouble hearing um director sir mac you're very very quiet um

[0:37:58] Voice 6: I

[0:37:58] Voice 4: can hear you, but...

[0:37:59] Voice 4: He does have very dulcet tones, so...

[0:38:01] Voice 4: Dulcet tones.

[0:38:11] Voice 4: You're currently muted if you're...

[0:38:14] Voice 12: There we go.

[0:38:15] Voice 12: Sorry, I was testing my microphone while we...

[0:38:18] Voice 4: Better or worse, Toby? Any different?

[0:38:21] Voice 4: Okay, well...

[0:38:23] Voice 4: Maybe I can speak more directly into the device.

[0:38:26] Voice 4: It'll be the Director Cermak ASMR meeting today.

[0:38:35] Voice 12: How's this?

[0:38:39] Voice 12: still quiet i've just cranked my microphone now huh well i'm good at yelling so how about i do

[0:38:47] Voice 12: that that's

[0:38:47] Voice 6: better there we go all

[0:38:49] Voice 12: right

[0:38:52] Voice 4: chair boland yeah

[0:38:54] Voice 10: just a couple of quick things i'm

[0:38:56] Voice 10: always interested in indicators and i'm wondering if you can as part of your work propose some

[0:39:04] Voice 10: because I believe we're going to try and refresh the Trust Indicators report.

[0:39:12] Voice 10: So, for instance, I know Parks Canada once did a presentation where they said that the count of songbirds was a key indicator of overgrazing.

[0:39:23] Voice 10: And I really thought, oh, you know, revelatory Saturna is way down on the bottom in terms of that indicator.

[0:39:31] Voice 10: indicator and the other thing is there are two reports that always that I really like and that

[0:39:38] Voice 10: don't get a lot of airtime in my view is one is the disturbed area and the other is a report

[0:39:49] Voice 10: on contiguous forests and those are both reports which personally I feel are quite positive about

[0:39:57] Voice 10: the islands trust um in that they indicate that there isn't a lot of disturbance and that you know

[0:40:04] Voice 10: we have a lot of ridiculous forest but um i'd be interested in your take on that and i think there

[0:40:10] Voice 10: are two key reports that could do with being um you know reviewed or looked at better and sorry

[0:40:19] Voice 10: sorry, one issue I have with those reports is that they don't normalize their areas and they give

[0:40:29] Voice 10: tables with the areas for islands and they're not, they don't line up very accurately. So

[0:40:35] Voice 10: as a heads up going forward. Anyway, thank you very much. I look forward to hearing more from you.

[0:40:42] Voice 10: Yeah. Thank you, Chair.

[0:40:45] Voice 4: All right. Well, thank you very much, Patricia. I know we're all very

[0:40:50] Voice 4: excited to see what you are doing uh and it sounds like you are off to a roaring start so

[0:40:55] Voice 4: thank you and yeah keep up the good work thank

[0:40:59] Voice 11: you vice chair thanks

[0:41:01] Voice 12: patricia all right

[0:41:04] Voice 4: uh so then at 8.2 we have uh an update from mr shulba i assume uh on the freshwater

[0:41:12] Voice 4: sustainability strategy hi

[0:41:24] Voice 3: everyone thanks thanks face chair um always a pleasure to

[0:41:29] Voice 3: to be in front of the RPC.

[0:41:31] Voice 3: So yeah, this is an update on the current work

[0:41:39] Voice 3: that is being undertaken now

[0:41:41] Voice 3: by the Freshwater Sustainability Strategy.

[0:41:45] Voice 3: And I have a few updates regarding the grant application.

[0:41:53] Voice 3: There is also later on in the agenda

[0:41:55] Voice 3: And as part of Director Cermak's report, speaking to a review.

[0:42:04] Voice 3: And so if you'd like to ask questions, it's probably best that we talk about that there.

[0:42:08] Voice 3: But if there's something relating to the projects I'm working on now, I think that would be fine.

[0:42:15] Voice 3: So we can do, I think I'll want to start with the Atlas because it's more of a brief and straightforward update.

[0:42:24] Voice 3: So I've been working on the Freshwater Atlas now for, yeah, for quite some time.

[0:42:31] Voice 3: I would say like two and a half years.

[0:42:35] Voice 3: We had some technical challenges with our GIS system because, not to bore you on it, but the GIS system has gone through a significant evolution on the back end.

[0:42:51] Voice 3: uh uh we we did have online servers with with uh esri which is our um mapping um

[0:42:59] Voice 3: like i guess platform and um and and and since then we have brought our uh we're hosting all

[0:43:08] Voice 3: of our information on on-site servers in in victoria and backed up elsewhere but but uh

[0:43:14] Voice 3: the island's trust now controls um the servers rather than just posting our information on on

[0:43:20] Voice 3: on Esri's cloud-based form.

[0:43:24] Voice 3: So that's great.

[0:43:25] Voice 3: We have more control on that.

[0:43:27] Voice 3: And when the Freshwater Atlas started,

[0:43:30] Voice 3: it was the cloud-based thing and it didn't work out.

[0:43:34] Voice 3: We just had too much information

[0:43:36] Voice 3: and it was costing the organization too much.

[0:43:38] Voice 3: And so they just basically deleted it.

[0:43:41] Voice 3: So we had to rebuild it from scratch,

[0:43:43] Voice 3: which is fine because it's on a new platform.

[0:43:45] Voice 3: And that's the same platform that MapIt is being developed on.

[0:43:48] Voice 3: And I'm sure for those of you in other committees, you're aware of the MAP-IT process.

[0:43:55] Voice 3: So that's really great.

[0:43:57] Voice 3: So some updates, we have worked with Kendra, our GIS coordinator, and now have the data

[0:44:06] Voice 3: in our hosted server, which was a huge milestone.

[0:44:11] Voice 3: And to do that was no small feat.

[0:44:13] Voice 3: We had to, well, we, my consultant Landon had to do a lot of spatial analysts and data

[0:44:22] Voice 3: management.

[0:44:22] Voice 3: It was, I'm glad it wasn't me doing that work.

[0:44:25] Voice 3: And I'm really happy that he did it.

[0:44:26] Voice 3: So, so technical hurdle hurdles accomplished.

[0:44:30] Voice 3: And, and so we have six weeks left on ish on his contract.

[0:44:34] Voice 3: And we already have a, um, uh, Landon was also the architect of, of the methodology

[0:44:41] Voice 3: for watershed resiliency uh which we have on several islands of um that were associated with

[0:44:48] Voice 3: the suitable land analysis and we have created now a educational experience where the the several

[0:44:56] Voice 3: methods in that mapping product have been um you can explore them there's a little write-up of what

[0:45:04] Voice 3: they are and and so that's part of it so the fresh water atlas is going to be like map it

[0:45:11] Voice 3: where there's going to be one page with with a map and and all like all the layers um from the

[0:45:17] Voice 3: projects of the fresh water sustainability strategy some from um planning services like

[0:45:23] Voice 3: zoning and cadastral and things like that and then we're also importing um kind of just like a

[0:45:31] Voice 3: digital cable to, to licensing information from the province, the wells database. And so I'm

[0:45:39] Voice 3: hoping that it could be like a one-stop shop for everything. Freshwater. And so, so that's going to

[0:45:47] Voice 3: be the map it. And then there's going to be these experiences that can communicate and step through

[0:45:52] Voice 3: and educate about the, the, the types of projects we're undertaking. So that's really exciting. I

[0:46:01] Voice 3: So, on track. No big technical challenges now. We're meeting again with GIS to make sure that what we're doing is copacetic. And so, really excited for that.

[0:46:15] Voice 3: So, I can, I'm not sure if I should stop for questions or just keep moving to the next topic. I see Trustee Elliott, I'm not here to chair the meeting, but I

[0:46:26] Voice 4: do see a question.

[0:46:27] Voice 4: Yeah, I mean, I see Trustee Elliott has a question. My inclination is for let's, I mean, if we're going to talk about this later on, let's maybe try and keep things quick, but I...

[0:46:35] Voice 3: Well, we won't be talking about the freshwater isles later on.

[0:46:38] Voice 4: Okay, fair enough.

[0:46:39] Voice 4: Trustee Elliott.

[0:46:42] Voice 6: Thanks. So thinking about the longevity of the project, what kind of software licenses or platforms are we going to need to support it?

[0:46:54] Voice 6: you talked about porting in provincial data is there um is that sort of a one stage process or

[0:47:04] Voice 6: is there going to be a legacy and a continuing need to upgrade and keep that up yeah

[0:47:10] Voice 3: so thanks

[0:47:11] Voice 3: for that so our servers are obviously supported right our information so there's um we've been

[0:47:18] Voice 3: been trying really hard to not have this sideshow of freshwater and all of our other databases.

[0:47:25] Voice 3: So the reason why this is the process behind the scenes, not the exciting stuff, is to

[0:47:31] Voice 3: ensure that the freshwater information and mapping that we have is now supported inside

[0:47:40] Voice 3: our GIS server.

[0:47:41] Voice 3: So that's kind of like the recharge mapping.

[0:47:44] Voice 3: We may revisit that with a new methodology in the future, but for right now, that is a kind of a static product.

[0:47:53] Voice 3: Same with watershed resiliency.

[0:47:55] Voice 3: Things like water licensing and license works and the wells, those can be updated at any time the province wants to.

[0:48:05] Voice 3: So it's basically just a URL connection to bring it in.

[0:48:08] Voice 3: So there's nothing needed there.

[0:48:12] Voice 3: It's just part of mapping.

[0:48:13] Voice 3: and and i'm i imagine there's other layers within map it that they do that with it's called wms

[0:48:20] Voice 3: world mapping service so that's no problem that they're so and and then that's all the esri so

[0:48:25] Voice 3: that's that's operational cost that there's another cost where we have the aquifer conceptualization

[0:48:31] Voice 3: models the 3d models and so there's two costs associated with that one is to take the existing

[0:48:38] Voice 3: maps that we've developed and paid for over multi-year project and and then host those

[0:48:45] Voice 3: or basic sorry transfer those to a hosting service and that's a cost and that's a like

[0:48:52] Voice 3: one-time one-time cost and and so we we have now um we have that there's a business case for that

[0:48:59] Voice 3: and then that's happening this year so the models will be put on to a hosting service that will be

[0:49:05] Voice 3: served up in the freshwater atlas and then the maintenance of those models is also an operating

[0:49:13] Voice 3: cost of is so they have assumed that that will be just part of their software budget so um yeah

[0:49:20] Voice 3: like for for project costs to to carry on the freshwater atlas um following this year there

[0:49:28] Voice 3: unless it's related to a specific project there isn't one it's operational costs through through

[0:49:34] Voice 3: information services to facilitate and maintain and support those licenses.

[0:49:47] Voice 3: And the license cost for the 3D model is like a drop in the bucket to what the cost for Esri is.

[0:49:52] Voice 3: It's our mapping service. I'm interested to see the budget. The operating cost is not cheap for

[0:49:58] Voice 3: for sure good

[0:50:00] Voice 4: uh trustee boland chair boland hi

[0:50:04] Voice 10: um what is you talked about

[0:50:07] Voice 10: the method for watershed resiliency i think that's what you said which has been adopted or used in

[0:50:16] Voice 10: several islands could you is that something that we should be familiar with um

[0:50:25] Voice 3: okay yeah

[0:50:26] Voice 3: Yeah, that does relate to the grant application.

[0:50:29] Voice 3: So Watershed Resiliency was developed on Denman, Hornby, and Laskedia as part of the Healthy Watersheds Initiative,

[0:50:39] Voice 3: which was coupled with the development of the Freshwater Sustainability Strategy back in 2020, so last term.

[0:50:46] Voice 3: And so as part of the suitable land analysis, it just so happened that we contracted Landon,

[0:50:54] Voice 3: who's a spatial analyst, to help with that work in the absence of our on-site GIS staff.

[0:51:01] Voice 3: And part of that contract, we included the five islands that the suitable land analysis

[0:51:10] Voice 3: was being processed on to have the watershed resiliency mapping for those islands.

[0:51:18] Voice 3: And so that's where that work is.

[0:51:23] Voice 3: So it has been presented previous term, and then it's wrapped up with the suitable land

[0:51:30] Voice 3: analysis, which I think I'll have to kind of ask either Regional Planning Manager Kojima

[0:51:37] Voice 3: or maybe Director Cermak, I'm having a meeting with Regional Planning Manager Kojima next

[0:51:44] Voice 3: week regarding the suitable land analysis, but I don't think there hasn't really been

[0:51:48] Voice 3: a formal presentation back to RPC on that, I'm not sure.

[0:51:52] Voice 3: but but it has been presented on um briefly when we presented to the local trust committees

[0:51:59] Voice 3: whose um whose islands had the the suitable land analysis which

[0:52:04] Voice 10: five islands are we talking about

[0:52:06] Voice 10: uh

[0:52:07] Voice 3: it was denman hornby gabriola maine and then north pender was the um was the the pilot but we

[0:52:16] Voice 3: didn't present back to the that ltc so i guess it was four four islands that we presented on

[0:52:22] Voice 3: and and but north pender was the um was the

[0:52:26] Voice 10: thing so is there a standard presentation that we can

[0:52:29] Voice 10: see yeah

[0:52:30] Voice 3: yeah there's there's the recordings and again um not

[0:52:34] Voice 10: a recording i mean was there a

[0:52:36] Voice 10: was there a powerpoint presentation of some kind yes

[0:52:40] Voice 3: there was there was a recording and the

[0:52:43] Voice 3: powerpoint presentation and you know to express my beef on how we do that you have to go diving

[0:52:49] Voice 3: it to the events pages to find that which is i i i want to reserve myself but it's not a good way

[0:52:56] Voice 3: to present these things i so i i imagine that there will be either a way an easier way to see

[0:53:04] Voice 3: those presentations either on the individual ltc um pages as part of their projects um or you know

[0:53:11] Voice 3: i i'm hoping that if the suitable line analysis gets traction that they'll have its own space that

[0:53:15] Voice 3: okay thank you thank you

[0:53:18] Voice 3: very much available yeah and and and then also with that um it's it and

[0:53:22] Voice 3: this is exactly the reason why i wanted lennon to to to start with the watershed resiliency um

[0:53:30] Voice 3: it like educational experience within the freshwater alice because it's only on a few

[0:53:35] Voice 3: islands and and it's such a powerful tool so the where it came from is landon um as part of his

[0:53:41] Voice 3: His undergrad thesis got hired by the Capital Regional District to do watershed resiliency of the Souk watershed.

[0:53:52] Voice 3: So to understand the resiliency of a water supply for half a million people.

[0:53:58] Voice 3: And they use it.

[0:54:01] Voice 3: It's a very powerful and interesting data set.

[0:54:03] Voice 3: And it's embedded in the Souk land.

[0:54:06] Voice 3: this is okay uh um vice chair i don't see any more questions on the uh freshwater alice so again um i

[0:54:18] Voice 3: think that we have a a resolution to to to report back on in in july so there there will be um

[0:54:27] Voice 3: you know a report and and perhaps i'm not sure i'll have to work with with uh with director

[0:54:33] Voice 3: cermak there might be some sort of business case or request for decision regarding the

[0:54:38] Voice 3: the rollout of the fresh water

[0:54:39] Voice 3: we'll have to work on that

[0:54:42] Voice 3: of a more

[0:54:43] Voice 3: we can even do a little demo I'm not sure

[0:54:46] Voice 3: because demos may not work

[0:54:48] Voice 3: because these meetings are so heavy

[0:54:49] Voice 3: and to that I will stop

[0:54:52] Voice 3: I mean that's

[0:54:53] Voice 4: and I'll leave this to the pleasure of our

[0:54:56] Voice 4: new chair but

[0:54:58] Voice 4: you know that may well be something that

[0:55:00] Voice 4: we're interested in you know holding a special

[0:55:02] Voice 4: meeting and taking up some of your

[0:55:04] Voice 4: precious evening time or something like that

[0:55:06] Voice 4: no worries

[0:55:07] Voice 4: I know is always a wonderful prospect.

[0:55:11] Voice 4: I think we'd love to, I certainly, I know I would love to see, you know,

[0:55:15] Voice 4: what's, what's been going on there and take a peek under the hood as it were.

[0:55:19] Voice 3: Yeah. And I think director Cermak tried to get in front of that and,

[0:55:23] Voice 3: and pose it as a, as a stewardship work webinar for TPC,

[0:55:30] Voice 3: but they decided to not take that on.

[0:55:32] Voice 3: so it would be up to the rpc to to choose to publicly educate um on on the freshwater

[0:55:39] Voice 3: so they just thought it was a little bit too specific and technical for their stewardship

[0:55:44] Voice 3: program which is fine i i understand that so um that that will rest in the hands of the rpc

[0:55:51] Voice 3: if you choose to yeah

[0:55:53] Voice 4: um the cool kids over there we've got the nerds over here so

[0:55:56] Voice 4: so.

[0:56:00] Voice 3: Great. So moving on to a topic, which is, Trustee Elliott is familiar with,

[0:56:09] Voice 3: happening as a case study in Huron in the Island Trust Freshwater Footprint Project, which

[0:56:15] Voice 3: is also closing on the same day as the closing of the contract for the Freshwater Atlas at the end

[0:56:21] Voice 3: of june and so we had a our first of three uh public um meetings um uh the the first one was on

[0:56:34] Voice 3: uh community monitoring and mapping and so this was a uh online webinar and we had uh um our our

[0:56:44] Voice 3: consultant part of their of that fifty thousand dollars was was community coordination so this uh

[0:56:51] Voice 3: webinar was coordinated by by that consultant and uh we had a speaker from the regional district of

[0:56:58] Voice 3: Nanaimo speaking to their watershed um drinking water watershed protection program we had uh

[0:57:04] Voice 3: someone from um from the province and speaking to um uh like surface water monitoring and and then

[0:57:13] Voice 3: Then we had our consultant speaking to the hazards and risks of freshwater and how to

[0:57:21] Voice 3: observe that and monitor it, and a really involved question and answer period after

[0:57:26] Voice 3: that.

[0:57:26] Voice 3: It was really great.

[0:57:28] Voice 3: My first idea was to have these workshops be more broad to the Islands Trust area, but

[0:57:38] Voice 3: then specifically speaking to Gabriela.

[0:57:40] Voice 3: of but as we started to to develop the the methodology for the workshop we really wanted

[0:57:45] Voice 3: to focus on gabriel and and because it's part of their major project right now so um it was

[0:57:52] Voice 3: gabriel specific there was i think um there's like a half a dozen groups there um that were

[0:58:00] Voice 3: relating to water or monitoring watershed ecosystem monitoring on gabriel and and then

[0:58:06] Voice 3: um i think we had like 30 attendees which was pretty good um and then later on in this month

[0:58:12] Voice 3: um yeah the end of the month we're going to have a um in-person meeting which is going to be

[0:58:18] Voice 3: exciting it's going to be hybrid we're going to be recording it um and and that will be more on

[0:58:24] Voice 3: defining freshwater footprint and and it will be uh you know gabriela specific so we'll be talking

[0:58:31] Voice 3: talking about policy and regulation and next steps

[0:58:37] Voice 3: and the holistic vision of freshwater sustainability.

[0:58:41] Voice 3: So really looking forward to that.

[0:58:44] Voice 3: And so those are, and then also in,

[0:58:48] Voice 3: and the third meeting is gonna be

[0:58:50] Voice 3: a community information meeting following.

[0:58:53] Voice 3: And to kind of round off the social aspect of that,

[0:58:56] Voice 3: the consultants are taking on some social science

[0:58:59] Voice 3: to to try to understand uh water demand um you know that's what we heard from from the previous

[0:59:07] Voice 3: attempts at groundwater availability provinces heard the same thing you can use estimates but

[0:59:13] Voice 3: we don't really know how much people use so there's there's attempts to through survey and

[0:59:18] Voice 3: and then through other methods to try to harness some of that data to then be

[0:59:26] Voice 3: imported into the more technical aspects of the work, which is a gridded water balance and

[0:59:32] Voice 3: trying to identify areas of the island that has increased groundwater vulnerability and

[0:59:39] Voice 3: opportunity for groundwater development. And I think overall, the intention would be to

[0:59:48] Voice 3: use the gridded water balance as a replacement for the groundwater wells density map in the

[0:59:57] Voice 3: suitable land analysis. That's kind of like the...

[1:00:00] Voice 3: updated version that the the well density is a proxy to to water use and a gridded water balance

[1:00:05] Voice 3: takes in um not only the technical aspects of it but again like i said the the social um like

[1:00:13] Voice 3: framework of that and and so yeah any maps um that are associated with that will be embedded

[1:00:19] Voice 3: into the freshwater atlas and and then of course we'll get consultant reports and and um i'm not

[1:00:26] Voice 3: Not too sure how many people read the RFP, and then we have a really great proposal from GW Solutions, who's the contractor.

[1:00:34] Voice 3: And they're very aware that the final report is not just a technical report to staff.

[1:00:41] Voice 3: It should be something that we can share publicly that is digestible by trustees and staff and the residents and other researchers, people who care.

[1:00:52] Voice 3: um so i think that um yeah i think that's good for now on on the update for from the freshwater

[1:01:01] Voice 3: footprint um yeah i i i i don't think it's really in my place to speak to the correspondence letter

[1:01:09] Voice 3: but um you know there's always a challenge with with these projects where you know water is part

[1:01:16] Voice 3: part of all of us and especially people who live on the island uh islands of of whatever

[1:01:23] Voice 3: projects or science is being implemented um or or being done on the islands like how is this going

[1:01:31] Voice 3: to to work how are we going to use it and um that's why it's so exciting to have this project

[1:01:38] Voice 3: uh being done as part of an ocp project where we have island planners and we have this

[1:01:44] Voice 3: this other process so the the freshwater footprint is part of that ocp process what what can be kind

[1:01:52] Voice 3: of difficult to do is like have these parallel processes of trying to address um you know the

[1:02:00] Voice 3: like the the correspondence and i appreciate trustee elliot speaking to it earlier because

[1:02:06] Voice 3: um i think she said it better than i did like we're we are trying to integrate this with the

[1:02:11] Voice 3: the ocp process and there is a planner that that is addressing this and there already has been a

[1:02:16] Voice 3: water policies like workshop just as part of the ocp and then our process and then it was really

[1:02:23] Voice 3: great because a lot of those people that sat on that water policies kind of working group and i

[1:02:28] Voice 3: trusty elliott was in the room um that that they are now integrated into our project so it's great

[1:02:34] Voice 3: I think that there's some excitement about our workshop at the in-person workshop at the end of

[1:02:41] Voice 3: the month. And I think that that will really be the tipping point to start answering those

[1:02:46] Voice 3: questions and the correspondence and start really getting some traction on this project. So yeah,

[1:02:52] Voice 3: I think I'll leave it at that.

[1:02:55] Voice 4: Great. Yeah, no, thank you for that,

[1:02:58] Voice 4: William. And yeah, Trustee Elliott.

[1:03:02] Voice 6: So just a quick comment. It was an excellent

[1:03:05] Voice 6: webinar. I had a lot of positive feedback from community members, and I just wanted to highlight

[1:03:10] Voice 6: that one thing that the Gabriela OCP project is doing is that there's a water focus group that

[1:03:15] Voice 6: is following along the work of these consultants, and what I'm hoping this turns into is sort of a

[1:03:21] Voice 6: community water stewards group. So Gabriela has, you know, the densest amount of wells. We have no

[1:03:28] Voice 6: community water systems so residents are quite rightly so anxious about where's the groundwater

[1:03:35] Voice 6: are we going to run out we can't handle more housing and so involving folks that are

[1:03:42] Voice 6: you know they see everything from the outside or they see calls for more

[1:03:47] Voice 6: housing or different forms of housing or just like can we sustain the community that we have

[1:03:52] Voice 6: But bringing them into the conversation and actually having them part of the water work and to do outreach to our community, I think is going to be a really successful marriage of science and citizen science.

[1:04:08] Voice 6: So I'm very appreciative of the approach taken.

[1:04:10] Voice 6: And it's really good to involve community members who are honestly anxious about water.

[1:04:18] Voice 6: That's what it comes down to.

[1:04:20] Voice 6: They really want to make sure that groundwater is protected, especially as we talk about housing.

[1:04:26] Voice 6: So thanks for your work on this, William.

[1:04:29] Voice 3: Yeah, thanks.

[1:04:30] Voice 3: And I really enjoyed the webinar format.

[1:04:34] Voice 3: Like, I believe I saw Chair Patrick there.

[1:04:36] Voice 3: I think I saw RPC Chair Boland attending the meeting.

[1:04:41] Voice 3: and and you know um in you know in my personal and professional opinion the RDN is just plowing

[1:04:52] Voice 3: the way for how to do this and how to step up as a regional district and the capital regional

[1:04:58] Voice 3: district has to take a note and and same same with the Cowichan Valley even more so because

[1:05:05] Voice 3: they're taking the money in because they have a referendum they have a program and there has been

[1:05:11] Voice 3: zero work done on thetis uh local trust area so um that you know that that that's

[1:05:18] Voice 3: it's it's a perfect storm of why gabriola was chosen as a case study um because what you just

[1:05:24] Voice 3: said densest amount of

[1:05:26] Voice 3: wells those well density maps are startling you know way way more dense

[1:05:31] Voice 3: than areas of like overall than salt spring um and and then there's the most amount of data it's

[1:05:38] Voice 3: It's the most data-rich island we have in the Islands Trust area.

[1:05:42] Voice 3: And then there's this kind of commitment from three, like, all levels of government to do what they can in that jurisdiction.

[1:05:54] Voice 3: And it was great to have them all there.

[1:05:56] Voice 3: You know, we had every single representative, every single government level representative at that meeting.

[1:06:01] Voice 3: So, yeah, I'm appreciative just to be, you know, I'm largely helping coordinate.

[1:06:09] Voice 3: And it's just, I think when I was talking to Director Cermak, he said, because he was at the meeting too, he said, it's nice to see you amongst your peers, you know, because like, that's, that's my network. And it's, it's, it's great to work with those people and have the opportunity. Yep.

[1:06:22] Voice 4: So thanks. Yep.

[1:06:24] Voice 4: Absolutely. All right. Chair Boland.

[1:06:27] Voice 4: um

[1:06:28] Voice 10: yeah it was a great webinar i think bringing in people from other local governments and

[1:06:35] Voice 10: different levels of expertise on any of the topics we tackle is a good way to go and it was very very

[1:06:42] Voice 10: good um i just have one quick question could we uh in the regional planning uh committee see

[1:06:50] Voice 10: see the results of the gabriola water survey as soon as it's available i'd like to see it like

[1:06:58] Voice 10: number one i'd like to see what the answers are but number two i'd like to get a flavor of

[1:07:02] Voice 10: how people are willing to participate in that kind of survey because um you know one of the strategic

[1:07:12] Voice 10: plans and feedback in many of the reports i've read was about engagement and figuring out

[1:07:18] Voice 10: how much water is actually being used because some of the estimates that are applied are more

[1:07:25] Voice 10: i think than um like the cake is over egged a bit so i really really love to see that um

[1:07:32] Voice 10: that survey for a number of reasons so when is the deadline and when would you have those results

[1:07:39] Voice 10: uh

[1:07:40] Voice 3: so the contract closes um at at the end of june and um yeah it's it's like when contracts

[1:07:50] Voice 3: close at at at on march 31st any year and you know everyone wants to see it april 1st it just

[1:07:56] Voice 3: doesn't work that way right because the staff needs time to digest it we also need to have a

[1:08:01] Voice 3: community information meeting back to the owners of the project which is the local trust yeah right

[1:08:06] Voice 3: yeah so um excuse

[1:08:08] Voice 10: me william i'm not talking about the whole piece of work and i'm well

[1:08:12] Voice 3: you're doing the

[1:08:13] Voice 10: survey you

[1:08:14] Voice 3: won't piecemeal it out no so it's going to be part of the project

[1:08:18] Voice 3: and so there'll be a community information meeting to the local trust committee and then

[1:08:22] Voice 3: following that i can give an update to the regional planning committee so that would likely

[1:08:28] Voice 3: be in september and then if there's any uh resolutions of the regional planning committee

[1:08:33] Voice 3: to dive deeper into something then you can make those resolutions well

[1:08:38] Voice 4: and yeah i mean i want to

[1:08:40] Voice 4: be clear i don't think trustee boland was uh hoping you'd have it july 1st but uh but yeah

[1:08:47] Voice 4: i think there's there's definitely interest in seeing work yeah

[1:08:50] Voice 3: no i get

[1:08:50] Voice 4: that i just

[1:08:51] Voice 3: i'm just

[1:08:52] Voice 3: not parsing out one piece of the puzzle you know but

[1:08:55] Voice 3: if we do like but i i want to agree with

[1:08:57] Voice 3: trustee boland and actually to to be honest um it it's been a lot of feedback from trustee boland

[1:09:04] Voice 3: and the Saturna local trust committee,

[1:09:09] Voice 3: the various trustees that I've been associated with

[1:09:11] Voice 3: on like how, you know, like how much assumption

[1:09:17] Voice 3: or how much error is there in water demand,

[1:09:22] Voice 3: especially coming from the, like we learned a lot

[1:09:25] Voice 3: from back in the day

[1:09:26] Voice 3: from the groundwater availability assessments.

[1:09:28] Voice 3: And we did a review process on that.

[1:09:30] Voice 3: And all that work was given to GW Solutions.

[1:09:34] Voice 3: like be concerned with this you know and and and even before that i wrote the proposal to

[1:09:41] Voice 3: undertake social science like how else are we going to do it right we can't knock on everybody's

[1:09:46] Voice 3: door and meter everybody so how else are we going to do it so the survey was a great tool

[1:09:50] Voice 3: and and they've they've already done the actually trustee boldness uh i don't want to speak for the

[1:09:56] Voice 3: consultants but they've been working on savory island and doing a similar uh um outreach like

[1:10:02] Voice 3: like survey program. And I'm thinking that that pro project might finish before this one. I'm not

[1:10:08] Voice 3: sure, but, but there, but there has been other, you know, attempts of, of undertaking this work

[1:10:14] Voice 3: and savory is, you know, it's an Island it's, it's similar. And so we'll, we'll see how successful

[1:10:20] Voice 3: it has been in various places. I think Quadra is doing it as well. So yeah. Hopefully it works out

[1:10:28] Voice 3: it will um yeah so fresh water footprint anybody that's good yeah no absolutely

[1:10:37] Voice 4: thank you okay

[1:10:38] Voice 4: and

[1:10:38] Voice 3: um yeah so you know not to get into the minutiae of of all of the current planning

[1:10:45] Voice 3: that i'm doing because i don't think i want to waste your ear on that but that you know i i work

[1:10:51] Voice 3: on current planning with the planners and bylaw officers and there's some real problematic

[1:10:57] Voice 3: problematic development permit areas out there that i don't know how we undertake that i know

[1:11:02] Voice 3: that's on under the ltc level but like um you know on chair patrick's island like development

[1:11:08] Voice 3: permit area five community well capture zones is very problematic it's the science is not it's just

[1:11:14] Voice 3: the logic of it is missing and and you know when you have applicants that want to like do an

[1:11:20] Voice 3: emergency uh repair on a septic field and they have to go through this challenge of of a

[1:11:27] Voice 3: development permit area that's that I think staff we agree that needs to be updated it's

[1:11:33] Voice 3: I'm faced with it a lot when I work especially when I work with bylaw and we just go out

[1:11:37] Voice 3: on a site visit and there is a dpa of a stream dpa and we're standing in the middle of the field

[1:11:44] Voice 3: and we were like well what is this you know I'll leave that out there but um I think my last uh

[1:11:52] Voice 3: you know I gave you all the good and I'm going to give you the unfortunate so um we applied um to

[1:11:57] Voice 3: the watershed security fund and we have just been informed that we haven't been successful

[1:12:05] Voice 3: and really not to my surprise because if you do take a cursory view of the freshwater

[1:12:13] Voice 3: sustainability strategy we're in year five and there's significant organizational structures

[1:12:17] Voice 3: that are missing that we asked them to fulfill for the island stress so coordinator role we

[1:12:24] Voice 3: We asked for that, you know, that an interdepartmental team, we don't have a technical advisory committee.

[1:12:35] Voice 3: Well, I don't, I don't want to call it a technical advisory committee because there should be, it should be broad ranging with perhaps indigenous knowledge holders or First Nations staffer on there.

[1:12:47] Voice 3: So an advisory group we don't have.

[1:12:49] Voice 3: have um so and and those things are listed as early priorities of the of the um freshwater

[1:12:55] Voice 3: sustainability strategy so i i'm not actually too surprised i would like to get a debrief

[1:13:00] Voice 3: from them but um we just learned about that now so knocking on

[1:13:04] Voice 3: the door asking for a debrief within

[1:13:05] Voice 3: days is not probably gonna facilitate anything i think we might have to wait till we're getting

[1:13:11] Voice 3: closer to the next call to then say hey can we can we look at what we had what we have now

[1:13:17] Voice 3: Now, especially if it's following a review, because I think with the review, we will say,

[1:13:23] Voice 3: hey, we were not successful in the Watershed Security Strategy Fund application.

[1:13:30] Voice 3: Here's all that information.

[1:13:32] Voice 3: And so I think from that, depending on who the consultant, or depending if it goes forward

[1:13:39] Voice 3: at the Regional Planning Committee, but if it does, who that consultant will be and how

[1:13:45] Voice 3: how aware are they of these programs and, and,

[1:13:48] Voice 3: and perhaps they'll give us a, you know, a better go. I mean,

[1:13:51] Voice 3: we could have asked for, for 50 bucks, you know, and done something,

[1:13:55] Voice 3: but we asked for the maximum amount they had to really engage a multi-year

[1:14:00] Voice 3: program. And we just weren't successful. So yeah,

[1:14:05] Voice 3: I think I'll,

[1:14:07] Voice 3: I'll leave it at that because that might tie into the conversation we'll have

[1:14:10] Voice 3: later on in the day about the review and the RFD for that.

[1:14:14] Voice 3: for sure yeah so

[1:14:16] Voice 3: appreciate the time I hope I didn't take up too much time

[1:14:18] Voice 3: I didn't know how much time I had allotted but

[1:14:19] Voice 3: there it is

[1:14:22] Voice 3: we're

[1:14:23] Voice 4: all good we will

[1:14:24] Voice 4: carry on and I think

[1:14:27] Voice 4: there was some good questions and some good

[1:14:29] Voice 4: discussions so it is not

[1:14:31] Voice 4: there's never time wasted

[1:14:32] Voice 4: all right

[1:14:35] Voice 4: so

[1:14:37] Voice 4: yeah of course

[1:14:40] Voice 4: so the next

[1:14:41] Voice 4: big thing

[1:14:43] Voice 4: is we are getting into 8.3 which is pages 30 to 78 in the agenda now this is one of the bigger

[1:14:51] Voice 4: pieces of meat uh this is the bylaw compliance and enforcement policy review

[1:14:57] Voice 4: um and the best practices manual uh and we have an rfd um this was i think the number that

[1:15:05] Voice 4: chair boland said that she might want to take over from but i leave that up to her actually it was

[1:15:15] Voice 10: after eight after this 8.4 if you're happy to go on and thank you sam i really appreciate it

[1:15:23] Voice 10: which allows me to ask questions thank you um

[1:15:27] Voice 4: yeah no that's absolutely fine i will suggest

[1:15:30] Voice 4: because this is going to be a a fairly meaty chunk i don't know if anybody needs to i know

[1:15:35] Voice 4: we're still relatively early in but if anybody needs like a five minute bio break i feel like

[1:15:41] Voice 4: like it might be worth it to do that before we get into leaping into this.

[1:15:45] Voice 4: So does anybody in, does anybody, anybody hate that idea?

[1:15:50] Voice 4: Maybe that's the best way to ask them.

[1:15:56] Voice 4: I could use a bio break.

[1:15:57] Voice 4: Perfect. So I know we've, we've got a lot of stuff to get through,

[1:16:01] Voice 4: but I think it's worth it. We'll all,

[1:16:03] Voice 4: we'll all do that better with emptier bladders. So I will,

[1:16:06] Voice 4: we'll be back in five minutes. So call it 1125.

[1:16:11] Voice 4: all right and

[1:16:19] Voice 8: yeah see you in a few moments all right rpc so

[1:21:07] Voice 4: it was a quick break hopefully we

[1:21:10] Voice 4: have all made good use of it i'm gonna wait until i see a few more faces back trusty bullet also

[1:21:29] Voice 4: we'll say a verbal welcome to trusty laroni who's joined us although she may be still on break

[1:21:38] Voice 4: i'm

[1:21:46] Voice 6: here just um couldn't find the program that's

[1:21:49] Voice 4: all good all right and it looks like

[1:21:53] Voice 4: Chair Boland has rejoined us as well. So let's get back into it. So 8.3. Now, when we did our

[1:22:11] Voice 4: sort of pre-planning for this, we had budgeted roughly an hour and a half for this section.

[1:22:17] Voice 4: We'll see how we do. But definitely there's some stuff to get into here.

[1:22:22] Voice 4: here um so i don't know i assume director sermac are you going to kick us off um

[1:22:29] Voice 4: uh

[1:22:30] Voice 14: vice chair i'm going to do it oh perfect

[1:22:32] Voice 14: summarize the report thank you

[1:22:34] Voice 4: members of

[1:22:37] Voice 14: the committee so the purpose of the report is is kind of twofold it's to bring back

[1:22:43] Voice 14: uh the trust council policy policy 5.5.1 um for our pc's consideration and to get direction

[1:22:51] Voice 14: on revising the manual. So policy 5.5.1 to start with as you know this provides

[1:23:01] Voice 14: direction to staff on bylaw enforcement processes and procedures. RPC has been

[1:23:09] Voice 14: reviewing it for the last several meetings and at the last meeting worked

[1:23:14] Voice 14: through the final sections and directed the revisions be made. So staff have made

[1:23:20] Voice 14: the changes and attached your two versions uh a clean copy and what's called a black line version

[1:23:27] Voice 14: shows all the changes that have been made to uh the policy over the last several meetings

[1:23:33] Voice 14: uh just to summarize some of the major significant changes um you've added guiding principles

[1:23:41] Voice 14: to the policy you've added a roles and responsibilities you've expanded the definitions

[1:23:50] Voice 14: We've expanded and revised key policy sections for commencing investigations, conducting investigations, site inspections, and closing investigations.

[1:24:04] Voice 14: Also expanded and clarified how to prioritize resources, added a review of officer conduct, made a reference to LTC enforcement policies,

[1:24:22] Voice 14: and policies for dealing with frivolous or vexatious complaints so overall our pc is

[1:24:31] Voice 14: requested to review the changes it's made and if the committee satisfied you endorse the current

[1:24:37] Voice 14: draft then the next if you do so the next step would be for us to send it send it to the ombudsperson's

[1:24:42] Voice 14: office for comment now with the best practices manual it's also attached this is the version

[1:24:50] Voice 14: that RPC reviewed several meetings ago and RPC hasn't reviewed or provided any

[1:25:01] Voice 14: direction on the manual for the last couple of meetings. Some changes were

[1:25:07] Voice 14: previously made and there's a summary of those in the report but for this

[1:25:11] Voice 14: meeting RPC has requested to give direction on making any specific changes

[1:25:17] Voice 14: and then generally to provide direction to staff to harmonize the manual with the policy draft

[1:25:26] Voice 14: policy 5.5.1 to make sure that the changes that have

[1:25:30] Voice 14: been made to policy 5.1 5.1 are accurately

[1:25:32] Voice 14: reflected in the manual and then if you accomplish that finish that next step would be again to send

[1:25:42] Voice 14: and manual to the ombudsperson's office for comment.

[1:25:45] Voice 14: And then we would bring back the policy

[1:25:47] Voice 14: and the manual together for a future RPC meeting

[1:25:51] Voice 14: for referral to trust council.

[1:25:53] Voice 14: So with that, back to you, Vice Chair.

[1:25:56] Voice 4: All right, thank you very much.

[1:25:58] Voice 4: And I see we've already got a short queue

[1:26:01] Voice 4: of people to speak to this.

[1:26:03] Voice 4: So I'm gonna ask Trustee Graham.

[1:26:06] Voice 13: Thank you, Vice Chair.

[1:26:08] Voice 13: Robert, you are also hard to hear.

[1:26:11] Voice 13: And it may just be that your mouth needs to be closer to the microphone.

[1:26:18] Voice 14: I'll turn up my volume.

[1:26:20] Voice 14: How's that?

[1:26:21] Voice 14: Is that better?

[1:26:21] Voice 13: That's better.

[1:26:22] Voice 13: Thank you.

[1:26:23] Voice 14: All right.

[1:26:27] Voice 4: And Trustee Patrick.

[1:26:32] Trustee Patrick: Thank you.

[1:26:33] Trustee Patrick: It seems like we've been working on this a very long time.

[1:26:36] Trustee Patrick: I know back very early in the process, I believe it was Trustee Elliott that brought forward the best practice checklist from the ombudsman.

[1:26:45] Trustee Patrick: And I know that was one of the questions that we were going to ask is, or I thought staff had identified kind of a review of that checklist against the policy.

[1:26:55] Trustee Patrick: And I'm just asking, has that occurred?

[1:26:59] Trustee Patrick: And if not, before it goes to the ombudsman, were we planning to just check our policy against this best practices checklist?

[1:27:07] Trustee Patrick: To

[1:27:10] Voice 14: the chair or vice chair? Yes. I can't recall if it was attached to a package at one of the earlier meetings, but I know we had a table where we reviewed that checklist. And yes, we'll review it again before it gets sent to the ombudsperson's office.

[1:27:34] Voice 4: Okay. Trustee Chair Boland?

[1:27:40] Voice 10: Yeah, thanks. I have a couple of things. Number one, just to prove that I did read it,

[1:27:48] Voice 10: although it doesn't really help, on line one, section 1.1, I think you're missing an

[1:27:54] Voice 10: S in that line, on the first line. But I'm talking now about section, I think it's 5.1,

[1:28:05] Voice 10: site inspections so it doesn't actually you know the saturn issue which is uh about the notice

[1:28:14] Voice 10: period and um it doesn't uh talk about that there and i accept that you may not want to put it in

[1:28:25] Voice 10: there exactly explicitly but i think if i was reading that i would get no sense of the fact

[1:28:31] Voice 10: that there was or could be somewhere else a notice period that was specific so I noted that

[1:28:41] Voice 10: later on there was something or other about the LTCs would adopt and should address and there

[1:28:48] Voice 10: was a checklist and I wonder if in their entry with notice you could reference that so reference

[1:28:57] Voice 10: Section X, the LTCs will themselves define what the notice period will be. Does that make sense,

[1:29:06] Voice 10: Robert?

[1:29:07] Voice 14: It makes sense, yep. We can certainly add cross-references throughout the policy.

[1:29:14] Voice 14: It would also be something that would be articulated in the manual, which is more of

[1:29:21] Voice 14: of the public facing communication yeah

[1:29:22] Voice 10: no i accept that and i just would like it noted there

[1:29:27] Voice 10: that even if it's just to say the exact period will be elsewhere otherwise it's kind of just

[1:29:35] Voice 10: hanging in the air like it could be anything or people might even know that that was um you know

[1:29:41] Voice 10: an option that would be defined elsewhere thank you very much yeah

[1:29:47] Voice 4: that was that was actually

[1:29:48] Voice 4: something that I had on my list of notes as well. I think

[1:29:54] Voice 10: 12.1.2 is where the LTC is. Okay.

[1:30:00] Voice 10: you thanks um

[1:30:03] Voice 4: and i've got a couple of notes as well but i'll go to trustee elliot thank you um

[1:30:10] Voice 5: this is uh this is a great policy i think it should advance to trust council um i just wanted

[1:30:17] Voice 5: to have a brief conversation about the closing

[1:30:21] Voice 6: investigation section six um and how does this

[1:30:27] Voice 6: fit with the non-involvement of

[1:30:31] Voice 5: trustees, or were not supposed to be involved with the

[1:30:35] Voice 5: bylaw enforcement process.

[1:30:36] Voice 6: So, goals and investigations could be done 6.1.3 on direction of a local trust committee,

[1:30:44] Voice 6: or if the director of planning services concurred with the manager, that the contraventions

[1:30:49] Voice 6: of a minor nature.

[1:30:50] Voice 6: And this, well, you've heard many times our experience on Mudge has been a real challenge because bylaw investigation is continuing on a slew of files that is, yeah, we don't know what those contraventions are.

[1:31:15] Voice 6: Are they maybe minor or major?

[1:31:17] Voice 6: Is this policy allowing the local trust committee to give direction where it would consider

[1:31:27] Voice 6: that investigation is not in the public interest or there's a political reason or there's a

[1:31:34] Voice 6: community reason for not investigating?

[1:31:37] Voice 6: And how does that play out for staff?

[1:31:43] Voice 4: I'll perhaps ask staff to speak to that directly.

[1:31:50] Voice 14: thank you vice chair so yes um as you pointed out um christy elliott uh 6.1.3 says on the direction

[1:32:01] Voice 14: of the local trust committee so yes files can be closed at the by by the local trust committee

[1:32:06] Voice 14: obviously acting as a as a body um and those um is the processes around that could be fleshed out

[1:32:18] Voice 14: out in the local trust committee's policy regular reports from bylaw officers review of files on a

[1:32:29] Voice 14: regular basis something like that could add more specifics to how and when files are closed

[1:32:40] Voice 14: but definitely an LTC can by resolution close files yeah

[1:32:45] Voice 4: and I can speak a little bit to this

[1:32:47] Voice 4: uh trustee elliott so just from from my experience um trustee uh trustees graham and mod and i have

[1:32:55] Voice 4: closed uh bylaw files generally you know with with some guidance from staff around around what's

[1:33:03] Voice 4: what's happening there but you know i think and i think there probably is some value in

[1:33:08] Voice 4: ltc's developing some methodology around when that's appropriate um i think the the the key

[1:33:14] Voice 4: key part about involvement is that trustees shouldn't be um uh it's about you know obviously

[1:33:23] Voice 4: making sure that things are transparent and it's an avoidance of of improper action and trustees

[1:33:29] Voice 4: shouldn't be involved in the investigation itself um you know there there should be a degree of

[1:33:35] Voice 4: staying to arm's length um again i think the hope and the part of the reason why there's multiple

[1:33:41] Voice 4: local trustees is so that there is some insulation from, you know, someone, a trustee taking undue

[1:33:50] Voice 4: action. But I think there are instances when there is value in being able to, you know,

[1:33:57] Voice 4: see that, you know, yes, this is a contravention, but it is minor in nature. And I think, again,

[1:34:04] Voice 4: I think the caveats that are in that 6.1.4 should apply in this policy. I would copy a lot of those

[1:34:12] Voice 4: to 6.1.3 as well so it's it's really got to be you know with that and perhaps perhaps that's

[1:34:19] Voice 4: something that happened you know we flesh that out further i don't know if that's something

[1:34:22] Voice 4: that's necessary i but there is there is definitely that mechanism is available i don't think i've

[1:34:28] Voice 4: said anything that is untrue but robert kojima can correct me

[1:34:33] Voice 14: that's true uh just uh remind

[1:34:37] Voice 14: bind committee members that you know a policy can't bind the action of a local trust committee

[1:34:44] Voice 14: it just provides guidance does

[1:34:49] Voice 4: that make sense trustee elliott i know you've got a mouthful so

[1:34:55] Voice 6: i'm so sorry i'm i'm really having trouble hearing you robert you said policy can't bind

[1:35:00] Voice 6: the can't fetter the discretion of the local trust committee correct

[1:35:04] Voice 14: so

[1:35:07] Voice 6: how does that play out

[1:35:08] Voice 6: um

[1:35:10] Voice 14: so a local trust committee the policy will provide guidance to the local trust committee

[1:35:17] Voice 14: but as long as the local trust committee is acting lawfully within its jurisdiction

[1:35:22] Voice 14: can't be bound by a policy same way that this is this is giving direction primarily to staff

[1:35:31] Voice 6: okay thank you um if i chair can i make one more comment please and

[1:35:37] Voice 6: then i'll stop um there's been

[1:35:39] Voice 6: been a lot of debate in our current policy about staff's interpretation of opening or

[1:35:46] Voice 6: commencing investigations that I think the wording is investigations may be, or a file

[1:35:55] Voice 6: may be opened, you know, in these cases. And I noticed that the language is more directive

[1:36:03] Voice 6: here so 3.6 investigation and progressive enforcement after the review if it doesn't

[1:36:12] Voice 6: fall you know it's going to happen if there's potential impacts cultural heritage

[1:36:17] Voice 6: but the officer will investigate the potential violation including

[1:36:24] Voice 6: so I just wanted to raise this I don't have a concern with it because I think there's lots of

[1:36:30] Voice 6: other avenues or determining that, okay, this, you know, maybe there's a contravention, but

[1:36:39] Voice 6: it's not worth pursuing or the bylaw

[1:36:44] Voice 5: enforcement team has other priorities or the LTC has other

[1:36:47] Voice 5: priorities. But I just wanted to highlight that, that we seem to have given discretion

[1:36:55] Voice 5: discretion through the may not a must investigation um of uh parent contraventions and here it's

[1:37:05] Voice 5: it's just structured in different ways so exercising discretion comes in at 4.3.4 i

[1:37:15] Voice 5: believe when determining the scope and approach to investigation providing flexibility such as

[1:37:19] Voice 5: extended timelines. But, you know, we've really been in the situation on Mudge where

[1:37:26] Voice 5: there's a bunch of files opened and the community's really been asking, you know,

[1:37:33] Voice 5: why Islands Trust did not exercise discretion and sort of the full range of files that are

[1:37:41] Voice 5: investigated and the impacts on community. So we're dealing with that right now. The discretion

[1:37:45] Voice 5: piece is huge for us and uh we're going to need to see that um defined and upheld um by our staff

[1:37:55] Voice 5: and so i i do want to see this advance to trust council because it's a far it's a huge improvement

[1:38:02] Voice 5: over what we have um and i'd like to see it go to the june trust council meeting because i think we

[1:38:08] Voice 5: need this in place even if the other pieces are not quite finished thanks no

[1:38:14] Voice 4: absolutely thank you

[1:38:15] Voice 4: trustee elliot and yeah i would agree and i want to say just very quickly that i you know i think

[1:38:20] Voice 4: this is a tremendous advancement it's been a huge piece of work and i want to congratulate all the

[1:38:24] Voice 4: staff who've been involved um on their work on this uh trustee patrick all

[1:38:33] Trustee Patrick: right you should

[1:38:34] Trustee Patrick: probably let director sir mac speak before me sure

[1:38:37] Voice 12: director sir mac sure thank you chair or sorry

[1:38:41] Voice 12: vice chair um i just want to say about trust council so you know we're following the project

[1:38:46] Voice 12: project charter i think it might be premature to send it we've sort of learned the lesson about

[1:38:50] Voice 12: sending things that are not ready however we have the chair of trust council's ex-officio and she

[1:38:55] Voice 12: will be constructing that agenda and cooperation but that's just i just would like to put that

[1:39:00] Voice 12: out there because as we said it still needs to go back to the ombudsperson and still needs to

[1:39:03] Voice 12: come back and we won't have time for it to return to the june trust council however we're fully

[1:39:08] Voice 12: prepared for september um

[1:39:14] Voice 4: yeah yeah no i i think that's that's absolutely correct um and yeah i

[1:39:18] Voice 4: I mean, I'm as keen to see it come to trust counsel as you are, Trustee Elliott, believe me.

[1:39:23] Voice 4: Trustee Patrick.

[1:39:25] Trustee Patrick: Yeah, I've been trying to draw trustees' attention to reading drafts.

[1:39:30] Trustee Patrick: And I think when we have a draft at some certain points, I think for information purposes, I think other trustees should be taking a look at it so that we're hearing from them sooner than later.

[1:39:39] Trustee Patrick: But, yes, I think it should go when we really think it's ready and having the ombudsman's comments back.

[1:39:47] Trustee Patrick: I just wanted to follow on Toby's, Trustee Elliott's questions on sort of the implementing discretion. And when we look at like other municipal ones, they can do it a bit more simply by establishing the priorities within the one bylaw because they have only one bylaw.

[1:40:08] Trustee Patrick: And I do understand we get more complicated in that we've got, well, additional groups that really set the priority.

[1:40:18] Trustee Patrick: Because I think I agree that I don't know if the discretion is as clear as it could or should be in this policy.

[1:40:29] Trustee Patrick: And if it is a combination of this policy plus local trust committee policies that establish discretion, then we should really say that clearly in this policy, that it's how it happens.

[1:40:47] Trustee Patrick: how it happens because I think that's the intent is to be as clear as possible if we say oh if you

[1:40:54] Trustee Patrick: read this and if you read that if you read this and the combination of all those things is how

[1:40:57] Trustee Patrick: we do it that's not providing clarity to the people who are trying to find it as well as

[1:41:03] Trustee Patrick: trustees so I would be interested in hearing how we can make that discretion piece very clear

[1:41:11] Trustee Patrick: if it's intended to also be combined with the local trust committees policies for establishing

[1:41:17] Trustee Patrick: priorities yeah

[1:41:23] Voice 4: absolutely um i would have second that uh chair boland i'm

[1:41:31] Voice 10: sorry i think i raised

[1:41:32] Voice 10: my hand by mistake i have nothing i think it's from the last question okay

[1:41:37] Voice 8: oh

[1:41:38] Voice 10: i'm sorry i've

[1:41:39] Voice 10: just remembered oh

[1:41:40] Voice 8: go ahead uh

[1:41:42] Voice 10: so with respect to the manual um it wasn't clear to me are you

[1:41:50] Voice 10: proposing that you will update the manual and then take both to the ombudsperson without coming back

[1:41:57] Voice 10: to anybody if we approve the policy right now with amendments it wasn't clear it was then we will

[1:42:07] Voice 10: you know update the manual to align it with the policy so

[1:42:14] Voice 14: through the vice chair so it's kind of

[1:42:17] Voice 14: up to our pc um at this meeting um you could finalize and endorse the policy 5.5.1 and the

[1:42:26] Voice 14: next step would be to send it to the ombudsperson's office you could with the man with respect to the

[1:42:31] Voice 14: manual um you could just give us direction to the high level direction to harmonize it with the

[1:42:38] Voice 14: policy or you could get into reviewing it kind of section by section which you may not complete

[1:42:44] Voice 14: today we wouldn't send the manual to the ombudsperson's office until our pc has gone

[1:42:51] Voice 14: through and reviewed it and given us direction okay i can

[1:42:56] Voice 10: barely hear you

[1:42:57] Voice 14: robert sorry i'm sorry

[1:42:58] Voice 14: i've got my my volumes turned up and yeah

[1:43:02] Voice 10: are you using headphones yeah yeah yeah okay

[1:43:06] Voice 10: Okay. And that's fine. So, I noticed in the manual that there are some highlights with review this. And what was, where did those come from?

[1:43:21] Voice 14: That came from Biola Enforcement Manager and Morgana, the communications person.

[1:43:30] Voice 10: Okay.

[1:43:32] Voice 14: Trying to provide some pointers to RPC.

[1:43:37] Voice 10: okay and i'm thinking about so if you go so could we work back from september

[1:43:43] Voice 10: and figure out how to put some uh sort of a timeline in place like is it possible

[1:43:52] Voice 10: i think we have another rpc meeting in july correct and then between july and before

[1:44:02] Voice 10: before September, do you think the ombudsperson could come back?

[1:44:10] Voice 4: I see Director Sir Max got his hand up here.

[1:44:15] Voice 12: Thank you. I'll just say, Chair. Thank you, Chair. I have been in regular contact with the

[1:44:22] Voice 12: ombudsperson. They've been monitoring our progress through this. We keep telling them it's coming,

[1:44:27] Voice 12: and it's not. So they are now keenly interested, when's it coming? And so they're waiting. They're

[1:44:34] Voice 12: to review this because they are like i said they recently contacted me uh they were at a i don't

[1:44:40] Voice 12: know an ombudsperson's conference of some sort and they actually said that the work this committee

[1:44:47] Voice 12: is doing is now being modeled by other communities and so uh you're actually leading the way for

[1:44:54] Voice 12: others to do better work so that's that was very exciting um so but their turnaround time they

[1:44:58] Voice 12: indicated wouldn't be long of course the closer we get into summer um the more we run into um

[1:45:03] Voice 12: yeah time off and stuff like that but if we can get the sooner we can get things to them i'm pretty

[1:45:08] Voice 12: confident that we could get a reasonably quick turnaround and so my guess is just a guess it

[1:45:14] Voice 12: would be a three to four week turnaround because they're anticipating it but

[1:45:18] Voice 10: in general like from

[1:45:20] Voice 10: this meeting forward so now we're in may and what are the key steps and what are the review

[1:45:28] Voice 10: review um options and which committees should those reviews take place so i'm thinking about

[1:45:36] Voice 10: you know we we have these two documents and one is pretty close and the other we haven't looked

[1:45:43] Voice 10: seriously at for some time and how do we actually get it into a state to send the ombudsperson and

[1:45:51] Voice 10: and get it back in time for September.

[1:46:01] Voice 4: Robert Kojima.

[1:46:03] Voice 14: Vice Chair, so yes,

[1:46:06] Voice 14: if you were to give us direction

[1:46:09] Voice 14: on the policy 5.5.1 today, that's ideal.

[1:46:12] Voice 14: Then we would send that directly

[1:46:14] Voice 14: to the Ombudsperson's office.

[1:46:15] Voice 14: The manual, like I said, it's up to RPC.

[1:46:19] Voice 14: It's up to you as a committee

[1:46:21] Voice 14: how much detail you want to get into

[1:46:23] Voice 14: or do you want to go through it over multiple meetings

[1:46:27] Voice 14: Or do you want to give sort of high level direction to harmonize the manual with the policy we make those changes we send that also to ombudsperson's office when we bring them back at hopefully the July meeting.

[1:46:46] Voice 14: Hopefully we would get something back from the ombudsperson's office on both documents for the July RPC meeting.

[1:46:53] Voice 14: meeting, unless RPC wants to spend more time with the manual.

[1:46:59] Voice 10: I hesitate to suggest this, but the special meeting to look at 5.5.1 was really, really

[1:47:08] Voice 10: useful.

[1:47:09] Voice 10: I don't think the manual would take such a long time because we have looked at it before

[1:47:14] Voice 10: and much of the content comes from 5.5.1.

[1:47:19] Voice 10: so do you think we should or could have a short-ish special meeting to go through the manual

[1:47:26] Voice 10: and get it to the ombudsperson um earlier but would both of yeah do you think that's possible

[1:47:36] Voice 10: before july um

[1:47:43] Voice 4: so i'm gonna i'm gonna yeah request yeah see that direct that towards

[1:47:48] Voice 4: our director and then i think we should also check in with with other members of the committee as

[1:47:53] Voice 4: well just to make sure that there's willingness i think i assume they're probably but uh sure

[1:48:00] Voice 12: through the chair i think this is one of those opportunities so i i would encourage that if you

[1:48:04] Voice 12: have some feedback right now to give us as much as you can i think rpm kojima has been clear you

[1:48:10] Voice 12: can be high level or detailed whichever you prefer and then when it's the comfort of the rpc to

[1:48:17] Voice 12: proceed you could very well make that decision today uh you can hear staff signaling uh the

[1:48:22] Voice 12: One of the clear things we know we have to do is to harmonize the documents 551 with the manual.

[1:48:28] Voice 12: That clear direction, you could just tell us to do it and we could forward it.

[1:48:31] Voice 12: You don't need to see the harmonization.

[1:48:33] Voice 12: I think you get it.

[1:48:35] Voice 12: So you could just give us that direction and that'll allow us to proceed in a more expedient manner.

[1:48:41] Voice 12: But if you want to do as you've done with policy 551 and you want to go line by line type thing,

[1:48:46] Voice 12: which is absolutely your chosen method,

[1:48:50] Voice 12: then we have to find a date that works for this meeting.

[1:48:53] Voice 12: And of course, I'm just cracking open the calendar

[1:48:55] Voice 12: to see if there's time available.

[1:48:58] Voice 12: I know I'm going to be away for some of that time.

[1:49:00] Voice 12: I suspect Robert is too.

[1:49:01] Voice 12: He gets a lot more time off than I do.

[1:49:04] Voice 12: He's earned it and others.

[1:49:06] Voice 12: So it gets a little trickier

[1:49:07] Voice 12: if we start trying to squeeze a new special business meeting

[1:49:10] Voice 12: in between now and July.

[1:49:12] Voice 12: But we'll look if that's what the RPC would like to do.

[1:49:15] Voice 12: Sure.

[1:49:16] Voice 4: Um, yeah, I think that sounds good. I have an idea as well, potentially, but I'm going to turn

[1:49:21] Voice 4: over to Trustee Graham first.

[1:49:24] Voice 13: Thank you, Chair. Well, I appreciate staff's suggestion that we

[1:49:30] Voice 13: direct them to harmonize the documents and pass them on to the ombudsperson's office. I read the

[1:49:36] Voice 13: document, both actually. I'm very happy with how they read. I have no suggestions, no words to

[1:49:43] Voice 13: change, no ordering to reorder. It's a big improvement from what was, and I'm really

[1:49:49] Voice 13: happy with it. So I'm ready to go. That's just me.

[1:49:55] Voice 4: Yeah. And I'm pretty similar. I do have

[1:49:59] Voice 4: two of my own little things. And the first thing I guess I'll say is that I wonder if

[1:50:06] Voice 4: possibly, so obviously we generally see these documents come back to us when we get an agenda

[1:50:11] Voice 4: for, for another meeting. I wonder if that harmonization for the, like, I'd like us to get

[1:50:17] Voice 4: to a place, you know, if we're, if we're endorsing the policies today, I'd, you know, I want to make

[1:50:21] Voice 4: sure that we've got that to a good place. Um, but then if we're then harmonizing a best practices

[1:50:27] Voice 4: manual, and I think we can absolutely hand that to staff and, and I think they've done a great job.

[1:50:32] Voice 4: I think that the best practices manual, even, you know, allowing for the things that we wanted to

[1:50:37] Voice 4: have changed, they have a pretty good handle on where things are going. And I think the new

[1:50:43] Voice 4: policies that we're looking at right now are a really good indication of that. What might be

[1:50:50] Voice 4: possible is if that harmonization happens in advance of when the agenda would otherwise be

[1:50:54] Voice 4: published, if that maybe gets sent out to the RPC beforehand, so that we have a little bit of a

[1:51:00] Voice 4: longer window to sort of like go through it and look at it, that might give us a little bit of a

[1:51:05] Voice 4: leg up in terms of pushing that further down the road for July. I don't know if that works

[1:51:12] Voice 4: for you, Chair? Okay. So, I will go on to, I just have two little things that I wanted

[1:51:20] Voice 4: to just dig into. One is in the definition. So, A8, which is on page 35, the very top

[1:51:30] Voice 4: of page 35. um so this is the definition of a vexatious complaint um which i think is a really

[1:51:38] Voice 4: good thing for us to have in here i know that this is you know keenly tied to uh to the much island

[1:51:43] Voice 4: things and but also has you know been a problem elsewhere as well um and i'm glad to see it in

[1:51:48] Voice 4: here i did want to just and i'm being picky here so this is i i'm pretty happy just i am i am i

[1:51:55] Voice 4: i want to acknowledge i'm drilling down to an obnoxious level um my the my suggestion would be

[1:52:04] Voice 4: that uh we strike the word uh solely um so when it's made solely for retaliatory or in bad faith

[1:52:11] Voice 4: and the only reason i say that and i'm i'm i'm totally open to hearing if there's a technical

[1:52:16] Voice 4: reason why it's better to have that in there um the only reason and the only reason it just sort

[1:52:21] Voice 4: rang for me was um i think there are moments when a complaint might be a legitimate bylaw complaint

[1:52:29] Voice 4: but is uh is being hammered at uh uh you know is is could be 90 percent vexatious but might have a

[1:52:40] Voice 4: small sliver of like there's a potential thing here and it could be and again it's the issue

[1:52:46] Voice 4: is like really when those come in a big barrage obviously if there's a legitimate bylaw violation

[1:52:50] Voice 4: that has to be investigated um but i just and this is i'm not i'm this is not a i'm not prepared to

[1:52:57] Voice 4: die on this hill i'm just wanting to sort of like question that i guess thanks

[1:53:02] Voice 14: vice chair yeah i

[1:53:03] Voice 14: don't i don't see a problem with striking it i don't know if um stefan or warren have any concerns

[1:53:10] Voice 14: sure

[1:53:11] Voice 4: and i'm open to hearing from the rest of the committee too if they have if they're seeing

[1:53:14] Voice 4: hearing a similar thing it might just be me um i would

[1:53:19] Voice 12: like to hear from uh manager dingman if

[1:53:22] Voice 12: if he's got any thoughts or concerns.

[1:53:24] Voice 12: Yeah, absolutely.

[1:53:26] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: Go through the chair.

[1:53:27] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: I'd have no concerns about the removal of that word.

[1:53:30] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: Yeah,

[1:53:32] Voice 4: I just want to make sure we're not limiting ourselves

[1:53:36] Voice 4: from determining something as vexatious,

[1:53:38] Voice 4: even when there is a grain of truth, potentially.

[1:53:42] Voice 4: And obviously, if it's a serious grain,

[1:53:44] Voice 4: I would hope we would deal with it.

[1:53:45] Voice 4: But that just, and again, that's me being very picky.

[1:53:49] Voice 4: The one, the other one that I had in my head is in section three, uh, 3.3.

[1:53:57] Voice 4: Uh, and I think, um, and this was just, again, this is more of a grammar thing.

[1:54:05] Voice 4: Uh, if a complaint that involves potential impacts, um, I think we could probably strike

[1:54:10] Voice 4: the word that, uh, if a complaint involves potential impacts to cultural heritage, to

[1:54:14] Voice 4: me scans better, but.

[1:54:16] Voice 14: Yep.

[1:54:17] Voice 14: I agree with that.

[1:54:18] Voice 14: uh

[1:54:19] Voice 4: and i think those are all of my otherwise i think uh somebody caught one of the other ones

[1:54:24] Voice 4: that i had but uh yeah i think that's that's everything and i'm otherwise pretty happy but

[1:54:30] Voice 4: do any other trustees have anything that they want to add trustee elliot um

[1:54:37] Voice 6: so i'm i'm actually

[1:54:39] Voice 6: supportive of how of staff um doing the um the work and then sending both products to the

[1:54:47] Voice 6: ombudsperson's office in the interest of advancing this this has been a very long and involved

[1:54:53] Voice 6: project and i think you know to the this committee's credit we've we've been really engaged

[1:54:59] Voice 6: with it and um and trying to serve our communities and make sure everything is clear but at a certain

[1:55:06] Voice 6: point we need to i think sort of take our hands off the wheel and let the professionals um do the

[1:55:13] Voice 6: writing in in and and i have confidence and staff to do that um so some high level feedback on the

[1:55:24] Voice 6: plain language no what are we calling it now best practices manual oh sorry things keep

[1:55:33] Voice 6: computers just spinning out um the guiding principles could be made into a list there's

[1:55:39] Voice 6: some important principles in there. So page 57. I'm not sure

[1:55:47] Voice 6: if it needs to be right up at the top. Or if the purpose might

[1:55:53] Voice 6: be better placed up at the top because it refers to the

[1:55:57] Voice 6: documents. I would like to see a section on discretion and how

[1:56:07] Voice 6: that shows up in the policy um discretion meaning from the

[1:56:13] Voice 6: enforcement officers up to the director to

[1:56:19] Voice 6: decisions to close files that's it is a little bit

[1:56:23] Voice 6: everywhere but it's not um i think it's not totally clear

[1:56:30] Voice 6: and yeah the the way the information structured i think definitely needs to

[1:56:36] Voice 6: be looked at there's quite a bit this great information here is just a bit all over the place

[1:56:44] Voice 6: um process new file sorry i'm just looking for my oh it was the communication to trustees

[1:56:57] Voice 5: so page 65 um i think that needs work because

[1:57:16] Voice 6: generally it's pretty good yeah we just need to

[1:57:20] Voice 6: highlight a few things and maybe reorder and make lists where there's large paragraphs. I know it's

[1:57:25] Voice 6: a very long document. There's a lot in here. But this is a very complicated area. And you've asked

[1:57:33] Voice 6: for reviews of certain parts. Do you want that

[1:57:37] Voice 5: now? Should we discuss that? And then I'm all for

[1:57:41] Voice 5: just sending staff to do the work and moving it forward.

[1:57:47] Voice 4: Well, I mean, I think we should definitely

[1:57:49] Voice 4: go through if you've got specific areas that you want to kind of go through and review i think we

[1:57:53] Voice 4: should do that work now and i think the decision of how we send it on um perhaps can be something

[1:57:58] Voice 4: we discuss you know when we're getting to making motions does that make sense yeah

[1:58:06] Voice 5: so the first

[1:58:08] Voice 5: page

[1:58:08] Voice 6: that i see has please review is page 67 of the um what initiates a case file so what's what's

[1:58:20] Voice 6: necessary to review here are we being asked do we not want to direct by law enforcement officers to

[1:58:29] Voice 6: inspect violations in these areas or

[1:58:35] Voice 5: is there questions about this yeah uh

[1:58:39] Voice 4: yeah i see director

[1:58:40] Voice 4: dingman so

[1:58:43] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: chair the in this section here the review is um do we want to use these words do

[1:58:50] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: Do we want to use the word violation?

[1:58:52] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: I would say we should not use these words.

[1:58:55] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: And we should just use contravention or some other, well,

[1:58:58] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: contravention is the best word.

[1:59:00] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: I think as much as possible,

[1:59:02] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: we should try to eliminate the word violation from all of the documents that

[1:59:07] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: we use, whether it's a policy, this manual,

[1:59:10] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: we can just use the word contravention.

[1:59:12] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: We're kind of stuck with using the word bylaw violation notice for our

[1:59:15] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: tickets.

[1:59:16] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: But in this section, I think we can use,

[1:59:20] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: we can have better language yeah

[1:59:23] Voice 4: i think that that's uh that's a very good point uh trustee

[1:59:27] Voice 4: boland chair boland uh

[1:59:31] Voice 10: yeah the word violation i i don't believe it's in the policy anymore 5.5.1

[1:59:37] Voice 10: yeah i agree it should be gone and the first one implementation bylaw and i'm just thinking

[1:59:45] Voice 10: you know if i looked at that i would just want to know in this manual that one was needed i

[1:59:51] Voice 10: I wouldn't necessarily need to know all the details of the bylaw.

[1:59:56] Voice 10: That's somewhere else around the policy.

[2:00:00] Voice 10: So in that section, I would just say Section 3 allows local governments

[2:00:06] Voice 10: to have this system, and, you know, to do that,

[2:00:11] Voice 10: they have to have it enabled,

[2:00:14] Voice 10: and then I wouldn't have the rest of it at all.

[2:00:16] Voice 10: But maybe that's what they're asking.

[2:00:23] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: Manager, do you have that?

[2:00:24] Voice 16: Yeah,

[2:00:24] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: so I don't know that we need any of that information in there

[2:00:29] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: regarding implementing a bylaw notice bylaw uh that's uh it's another process it's not part of

[2:00:37] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: the bylaw investigation enforcement process it's it's just a matter of fact uh here's the law and

[2:00:44] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: how you would enact a bend bylaw so i don't see its its usefulness within the manual itself and

[2:00:52] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: perhaps it should be deleted from it

[2:00:56] Voice 4: yeah does anybody else have any thoughts on that particular

[2:00:59] Voice 4: I mean, I'm perhaps the thing to do here is go from review to review and quickly just sort of hear staff's input on those.

[2:01:08] Voice 4: And then assuming we're happy with their their guidance, you know, give them a give them a check and move on.

[2:01:17] Voice 4: Does that work as a process for the committee? Lovely. All right.

[2:01:21] Voice 4: So is this then our next implementation point or review point? Perfect.

[2:01:29] Voice 4: uh so yeah i mean perhaps uh director dingman or manager dingman sorry pulling a chair pulling a

[2:01:37] Voice 4: chair patrick promoting people uh manager dingman or or uh or or rpm kojima whomever whomever is the

[2:01:47] Voice 4: the best person to speak to it go

[2:01:50] Voice 14: ahead warren so

[2:01:52] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: on page 67 here that i'm seeing now just as

[2:01:55] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: As discussed, I don't believe that this is required within the manual itself.

[2:01:59] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: This is an administrative bylaw process that I don't see the benefit here, and I believe it should just be removed.

[2:02:06] Voice 4: Yeah, this is a

[2:02:06] Voice 4: public-facing document.

[2:02:09] Voice 4: We don't need to tell the public how to do your job or our job.

[2:02:17] Voice 4: All right.

[2:02:20] Voice 4: Seeing no major opposition, nobody's raised their hand about this, so I think that's great.

[2:02:26] Voice 4: we would i think we'll we'll take your lead there uh manager dingman uh so our next

[2:02:32] Voice 4: it's our next review point i think i see page 70.

[2:02:43] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: so for this section chair uh vice chair what we

[2:02:46] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: did is uh change some of the language just to make sure more it is more accurate um but again um

[2:02:54] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: I guess there is some benefit.

[2:02:56] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: I don't know that it's really necessary,

[2:02:59] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: but we did change, we did correct some of the time periods

[2:03:03] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: so that it's more accurate.

[2:03:06] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: And we're just asking the RPC to review

[2:03:08] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: to see if they have any further questions

[2:03:11] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: about the content of this section.

[2:03:15] Voice 4: RPC, do we have any further questions?

[2:03:19] Voice 4: And we can take a second if we need to.

[2:03:22] Voice 4: Chair, you are muted, right?

[2:03:28] Voice 10: thank you uh is this content in the letter that's sent um what i mean is like i'm reading this and

[2:03:38] Voice 10: i'm thinking uh do i need to know this in the abstract or do i just need to know that the

[2:03:45] Voice 10: conditions around what happens next are described in the letter or described in the policy it seems

[2:03:53] Voice 10: seems very kind of weighty and in an abstract way it doesn't really communicate very well

[2:04:02] Voice 10: if you've had a uh a notice then i assume you would understand this content do you see what i

[2:04:12] Voice 10: mean like does it need to be here as a kind of in a general guideline that's user-friendly

[2:04:18] Voice 10: would be my question so

[2:04:21] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: chair i believe it does provide some benefit to be here to reinforce how

[2:04:25] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: how the process works when someone receives a letter a violation notice letter within the

[2:04:32] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: letter itself some of this information is going to be communicated and the rest of the information

[2:04:37] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: is going to be communicated on the bylaw violation notice itself or the ticket so this is a

[2:04:43] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: comprehensive listing of all the information that they're going to receive as say one part whereas

[2:04:50] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: Whereas if you're a respondent in a bylaw contravention,

[2:04:54] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: you're going to receive that information partly in the letter

[2:04:57] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: on when you need to respond, what's going to happen if you don't respond,

[2:05:01] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: and it's on the ticket itself.

[2:05:04] Voice 10: Would a cartoon of this work better as sort of a little workflow?

[2:05:10] Voice 10: You know, one of those yes, no, go back to the beginning,

[2:05:14] Voice 10: and it would communicate it possibly faster, but just an idea.

[2:05:23] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: I don't believe it would, but, you know, I prefer the written word.

[2:05:28] Voice 4: Yeah. I

[2:05:29] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: mean, I think

[2:05:29] Voice 4: someone who's coming to this, you know, who's coming to this for reference, probably, you know, presumably has part of this information and this is supposed to be a place that they can come to.

[2:05:37] Voice 4: I think it works. But, Trustee Graham?

[2:05:42] Voice 13: This works for me.

[2:05:46] Voice 10: Yeah.

[2:05:47] Voice 10: Okay. One last suggestion.

[2:05:50] Voice 10: What about instead of there are four possible scenarios, you just turn it into friendly language and say, if the respondent does not respond, if the respondent does not respond, if the respondent claims, blah, blah, blah.

[2:06:08] Voice 10: The four possible scenarios, it's quite formal. It's straight out of the policy and it hasn't been transmogrified into more friendly language.

[2:06:18] Voice 10: and maybe if we did that it would be a little bit nicer thanks i'll leave it at that i think

[2:06:27] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: we could do that chair yes make it softer more reader friendly sure

[2:06:33] Voice 4: all right and i think that

[2:06:35] Voice 4: is our last please review section in the best practices manual so unless anybody else has

[2:06:43] Voice 4: anything that they want to add does staff feel like they have uh the input that they need do

[2:06:47] Voice 4: Do they have anything that we've missed?

[2:06:53] Voice 14: No.

[2:06:54] Voice 14: Thanks, Vice Chair.

[2:06:55] Voice 14: I think it's clear.

[2:06:56] Voice 4: No, that sounds great.

[2:06:58] Voice 4: All right.

[2:06:58] Voice 4: So we've got 19 minutes now until 1230, and I don't know what we want to do in terms of lunch or breaks.

[2:07:06] Voice 4: I will leave that perhaps to the discretion of our chair, who's got her hand up, but is muted.

[2:07:13] Voice 4: There you go.

[2:07:13] Voice 4: I

[2:07:14] Voice 10: was just thinking, do we need a motion to make it clear what we have decided with respect to these two documents and what will happen to them next?

[2:07:28] Voice 4: RPM, Kojima, do you need any specific direction from us?

[2:07:32] Voice 14: It might be advisable to pass a resolution like you had at previous meetings to make the changes identified during the meeting and then move on to the next recommended resolution.

[2:07:46] Voice 10: are they going straight to the ombudsperson before the july no they're not they're coming

[2:07:53] Voice 10: to us in july and then to the ombudsperson well

[2:07:56] Voice 4: i think that's the discussion we're going to have

[2:07:57] Voice 4: next so i think that's that's the next thing and yeah no no no that's that's a good question and

[2:08:03] Voice 4: that's i think what we'll move into um so shall we make a motion uh to uh enact the the amendments

[2:08:14] Voice 4: amendments as discussed.

[2:08:17] Voice 4: And would somebody like to make that trustee Elliot?

[2:08:21] Voice 6: Well, actually I have a question about the wording.

[2:08:24] Voice 6: The first one

[2:08:25] Voice 6: that regional planning committee review and endorse.

[2:08:30] Voice 6: We're not directing ourselves to review it. We have reviewed it. Yes. Yeah.

[2:08:35] Voice 6: So do we want to endorse the draft bylaw compliance and enforcement policy

[2:08:39] Voice 6: 5.5.1?

[2:08:42] Voice 4: and possibly I guess we add a line of as amended

[2:08:46] Voice 6: as discussed or as amended

[2:08:49] Voice 4: does that work for you RPM Kojima? Yep that's great

[2:08:54] Voice 4: alright well would somebody like to make a motion?

[2:08:58] Voice 6: I'm happy to do that. Take it away.

[2:09:01] Voice 6: The Regional Planning Committee endorse draft

[2:09:04] Voice 6: bylaw compliance and enforcement policy 5.5.1

[2:09:08] Voice 6: as amended all

[2:09:10] Voice 4: right and do we have a seconder

[2:09:12] Voice 10: yes a second all

[2:09:15] Voice 4: right uh yeah uh chair boland

[2:09:18] Voice 4: uh any further discussion on the motion all right i will call the vote uh all in favor please raise

[2:09:26] Voice 4: your hand okay and please lower your hands uh any opposed lovely that carries and i think that's my

[2:09:50] Voice 4: my first chaired motion. It's very exciting. All right. Well, for Trust Council, for Trust

[2:10:00] Voice 4: anyways. Okay. So now we're looking at revising the best practices manual. I think this is

[2:10:15] Voice 4: fairly straightforward. This doesn't, and this actually, I mean, I know in the RFD,

[2:10:21] Voice 4: The discussion is basically later on that having endorsed it or having completed its review, staff will automatically submit documents.

[2:10:30] Voice 4: I don't know if we want to have a bit more of a directive conversation around that, perhaps Director Cermak, because I know that we do have a bit of a discussion to have about the order of operations there.

[2:10:45] Voice 14: so vice chair yeah that sounds like um the rpc wants to should have a discussion about

[2:10:51] Voice 14: whether you want us to send it to the ombudsperson's office make that basically make

[2:10:57] Voice 14: the changes and send it to the ombudsperson's office and hopefully get it back in time for

[2:11:01] Voice 14: the july meeting or if you want to see it with the changes before it goes to the person yeah

[2:11:07] Voice 4: which possibly involves a special meeting or getting uh getting a version of the best

[2:11:12] Voice 4: practices manual in between um this i think doesn't necessarily interfere with this second

[2:11:18] Voice 4: motion um so i was going to suggest that we maybe move on to that second motion directly

[2:11:23] Voice 4: uh which is harmonizing the the best practices manual and then and then let's have a third motion

[2:11:30] Voice 4: which we'll be discussing how we want to dispose dispense with things but i will hear from the rest

[2:11:34] Voice 4: of the committee uh trustee elliott oh

[2:11:38] Voice 6: if you're going to separate them that's fine i'll hold my

[2:11:40] Voice 6: comments but happy to make the recommended motion yeah

[2:11:43] Voice 4: i mean i feel like they're slightly different

[2:11:45] Voice 4: directives so um uh chair boland yeah

[2:11:52] Voice 10: i think the second one can just go as is with as amended

[2:11:55] Voice 10: and then we can do a third and having listened to the conversation i'm happy to go with um

[2:12:04] Voice 10: send it to the ombudsperson try and get it back for july and then we have a chance to

[2:12:10] Voice 10: go kill horror before we go forward with it but i think that would be um that would be the most

[2:12:19] Voice 10: expeditious way to deal with it i think thank you all

[2:12:24] Voice 4: right uh well let's let's move on to the

[2:12:26] Voice 4: second motion then or uh sorry trustee elliott go ahead that's

[2:12:31] Voice 6: what i was gonna do um but i was

[2:12:33] Voice 6: gonna ask do we want to add with feedback uh from rpcs discussed at my ninth meeting

[2:12:39] Voice 6: or is that sort of implied?

[2:12:42] Voice 4: Do

[2:12:43] Voice 6: we have those notes?

[2:12:46] Voice 4: Would you

[2:12:46] Voice 6: like an extra

[2:12:47] Voice 4: seasoning on that?

[2:12:49] Voice 14: Yeah, a little bit of spice.

[2:12:50] Voice 14: You can add a bit of spice to it.

[2:12:52] Voice 14: All right.

[2:12:52] Voice 6: Okay.

[2:12:54] Voice 6: With amendments as discussed at the May 9th meeting

[2:12:57] Voice 6: would be amendments.

[2:13:01] Voice 6: Okay.

[2:13:01] Voice 6: So I move that the Regional Planning Committee

[2:13:03] Voice 6: request staff revise the draft bylaw compliance

[2:13:06] Voice 6: and enforcement best practices manual

[2:13:08] Voice 6: to harmonize it with draft bylaw compliance and enforcement policy 5.5.1 comma with amendments

[2:13:17] Voice 6: as discussed at rpc may 9th meeting period all

[2:13:29] Voice 4: right let's call for a seconder i'll second that

[2:13:35] Voice 4: trustee boland and let's move any further discussion cool it seems fairly straightforward

[2:13:46] Voice 4: forward uh all in favor please raise your hands all right uh please lower your hands any opposed

[2:13:58] Voice 4: lovely there we go so that is carried okay so let's talk about how we want to

[2:14:10] Voice 4: get this over the finish line or get this over the next line um so as i see it we have the option to

[2:14:19] Voice 4: to, you know, staff will make the amendments we've discussed, forward it to the ombudsperson's

[2:14:26] Voice 4: office, and then we would potentially receive it back in July, at which point we could decide

[2:14:32] Voice 4: whether we want to forward it on to Trust Council in September. Alternatively, we would ask staff

[2:14:39] Voice 4: to make those amendments and then return it to us before sending it on to the ombudsperson's

[2:14:45] Voice 4: office which definitely will push us further along and knowing that we've got breaks over

[2:14:49] Voice 4: summer that may slow the process down but i mean as as uh chair patrick is always saying it is

[2:14:55] Voice 4: worth it to well linger in the project definition phase so uh i'm i'm open to to hearing discussion

[2:15:02] Voice 4: about this i know that there are some uh some feelings one way or another i would love to hear

[2:15:08] Voice 4: from people who have not necessarily spoken directly to this already because i think we've

[2:15:12] Voice 4: got some idea of where people are standing. And I'd love to hear if our ex officio chair has

[2:15:21] Voice 4: anything she wants to add as well. But Trustee Graham.

[2:15:25] Voice 13: Thank you, Acting Chair. So I liked your

[2:15:29] Voice 13: first suggestion of letting staff make the changes and send it off to the ombudsperson's office. I

[2:15:36] Voice 13: wouldn't add to the motion the opportunity to bring it back. Once the ombudsperson's office

[2:15:42] Voice 13: has it it's in their control and when we get it is when we get it at which point we can decide

[2:15:47] Voice 13: which trust council meeting is appropriate yeah

[2:15:51] Voice 4: absolutely and i i would say you know we'll also

[2:15:54] Voice 4: have the benefit of their review at that point uh and we can still make changes to it at that

[2:15:59] Voice 4: point it's not being graven in stone at that at that juncture um but uh yeah and and i sorry i

[2:16:06] Voice 4: don't mean to silence people who have spoken to it who would like to speak to it further so

[2:16:10] Voice 4: So, Mairead, I know you had your hand up.

[2:16:13] Voice 4: Okay.

[2:16:15] Voice 4: Well, does anybody want to propose a motion?

[2:16:19] Voice 4: Or I guess, perhaps, does staff have a sense of which feels like it works best for their flow?

[2:16:29] Voice 4: Because I also want to be respectful of our capacity as well.

[2:16:36] Voice 14: Vice-Chair, whether or not a motion is needed, is that the question?

[2:16:40] Voice 14: No,

[2:16:40] Voice 4: just in terms of, you know, if there is an option between send it to the ombudsperson directly after review or whether, obviously, circling it back to us creates a degree of work.

[2:16:53] Voice 4: So, yeah.

[2:16:54] Voice 4: Okay.

[2:16:55] Voice 4: Yeah,

[2:16:57] Voice 14: most expeditious is to send it to the ombudsperson's office and we'll, you know, we'll try and draft the changes in such a way that, you know, these are changes to the manual that we made at the direction of RPC.

[2:17:10] Voice 14: Here's a different color, any changes suggested by the ombudsperson's office, and then you can dig into that as a committee in the July meeting, hopefully.

[2:17:20] Voice 14: Oh,

[2:17:21] Voice 4: well, that. Yeah. So I guess at that juncture, I will ask, does anybody have a motion that they would like to to cobble together here?

[2:17:35] Voice 9: I

[2:17:36] Voice 10: can give it a go. Absolutely.

[2:17:39] Voice 10: I move that RPC requests staff to make amendments, as discussed, to the policy 5.5.1.

[2:17:54] Voice 10: and the user guide or whatever it's called.

[2:18:00] Voice 10: I can't remember now.

[2:18:01] Voice 10: What is it called?

[2:18:01] Voice 10: The best practices manual

[2:18:04] Voice 10: and to send it to the ombudsperson for review.

[2:18:10] Voice 4: And I'm going to check in with Mr. Croker

[2:18:13] Voice 4: and see if he captured that.

[2:18:18] Voice 4: Fantastic.

[2:18:18] Voice 4: I have a feeling he probably did.

[2:18:21] Voice 4: Thank you, Rob.

[2:18:23] Voice 4: All right.

[2:18:24] Voice 4: Marid, just have a second to look over that.

[2:18:27] Voice 4: Are you happy?

[2:18:28] Voice 10: uh yeah should we should we put as as as agreed at may blah blah meeting instead of as discussed

[2:18:37] Voice 10: it's

[2:18:38] Voice 4: uh it's not yet been by expose it's not been seconded so you're i think that's absolutely fine

[2:18:43] Voice 4: so

[2:18:43] Voice 10: so what about as instead of as discussed put in as agreed at the may 9th regional planning

[2:18:51] Voice 10: meeting, comma, and then, or no, not there, sorry, no comma there, I think it's later,

[2:19:04] Voice 10: yeah, perfect.

[2:19:06] Voice 4: All right, so if you are happy with that, I'm happy to not make you read that out

[2:19:12] Voice 4: again.

[2:19:13] Voice 10: Okay, and I

[2:19:14] Voice 10: did have one thought, which was, you know, if it came back after the July

[2:19:21] Voice 10: july rpc meeting and we felt we needed a quick glance over it before it went to trust council

[2:19:29] Voice 10: we could have a special meeting you know we could do it ad hoc as needed if if it turned up and it

[2:19:35] Voice 10: couldn't go to trust council unless we saw it first or something well i think

[2:19:39] Voice 4: we we would have

[2:19:40] Voice 4: to make a motion to forward it to trust council regardless yeah if it

[2:19:44] Voice 4: doesn't come back in time

[2:19:45] Voice 4: for our july meeting we won't have had a chance to make that motion uh trustee graham or yeah

[2:19:50] Voice 4: Yeah. Trustee Graham.

[2:19:51] Voice 13: Yeah. I just wanted to make, I think it's coming back to the RPC. Is it not?

[2:19:57] Voice 13: Because the ombudsperson's office may make some changes and we would have to endorse those changes

[2:20:03] Voice 13: and then it would go to trust counsel. I believe. Yeah, absolutely.

[2:20:07] Voice 4: Yeah. Yeah. All right. Perfect.

[2:20:10] Voice 4: So I will take that as moved if that doesn't offend anybody's sensibilities and call for a

[2:20:15] Voice 4: seconder trustee graham thank you all right uh so do we have any discussion on the motion

[2:20:27] Voice 4: trustee elliott

[2:20:32] Voice 6: there's just a comma missing i'm sorry to make amendments as agreed at the rpc

[2:20:40] Voice 6: meeting comma to trust council policy actually comma after amendments and comma there that would

[2:20:48] Voice 6: be great after to make amendments comma yes that's it thank you now it reads correctly

[2:20:54] Voice 6: very

[2:20:56] Voice 4: good funnily enough that is exactly where trustee boland removed a comma so

[2:21:01] Voice 4: we've got all our hanging clauses it's good uh i think staff get our get our drift here

[2:21:08] Voice 4: uh all right so i am if unless there's any further discussion i'm going to call the question

[2:21:13] Voice 4: all right uh all in favor please raise your hands very good please lower your hands

[2:21:23] Voice 4: and any opposed

[2:21:25] Voice 4: alright seeing none that is

[2:21:29] Voice 4: carried thank you

[2:21:31] Voice 4: RPC and there

[2:21:35] Voice 4: we go and we're at

[2:21:36] Voice 4: 1226 which is

[2:21:38] Voice 4: pretty great we did that in

[2:21:41] Voice 4: 14 minutes

[2:21:44] Voice 4: do we have anything further

[2:21:47] Voice 4: that you'd like us to touch on

[2:21:49] Voice 4: here

[2:21:51] Voice 4: RPM Kojima have we

[2:21:52] Voice 4: satisfied your

[2:21:54] Voice 4: your bloodlust for bylaw enforcement review.

[2:22:02] Voice 4: Wonderful.

[2:22:03] Voice 4: All right.

[2:22:04] Voice 4: Well, in that case,

[2:22:07] Voice 4: I'm going to suggest

[2:22:10] Voice 4: this might be a good place to take lunch,

[2:22:13] Voice 4: but I will perhaps ask our chair

[2:22:15] Voice 4: to make that final determination.

[2:22:19] Voice 10: I think that's a great idea

[2:22:21] Voice 10: and we've made really good progress

[2:22:23] Voice 10: And thank you for carrying on and giving me a chance to kind of take a breath.

[2:22:28] Voice 10: So I'm happy to pick up after the lunch break.

[2:22:32] Voice 10: So should we meet at one o'clock?

[2:22:35] Voice 4: I think that sounds very good.

[2:22:37] Voice 4: Is that amenable to everybody else?

[2:22:39] Voice 4: All right.

[2:22:42] Voice 4: That sounds good.

[2:22:43] Voice 8: And

[2:22:43] Voice 4: yeah, it's been my pleasure.

[2:22:47] Voice 10: Thank you.

[2:22:47] Voice 10: I hope I can do half as well on my first outing.

[2:22:53] Voice 10: Thank you very much.

[2:22:55] Voice 4: All right.

[2:22:56] Voice 4: right. See everybody at one o'clock.

[2:55:56] Voice 12: I'm just going to, I assume we're passing the chair to the chair.

[2:56:02] Voice 4: I believe that's the plan. And there she is, the woman of the hour.

[2:56:07] Voice 12: All right, Chair Boland, if you don't mind, I'm just going to,

[2:56:10] Voice 12: I don't know how much you've studied the rest of the agenda.

[2:56:13] Voice 12: We did talk about it with Sam beforehand.

[2:56:17] Voice 12: You know, we've got the Housing Strategic Action Plan.

[2:56:19] Voice 12: It's quite, it's got multiple components, three of them,

[2:56:22] Voice 12: plus a few other things about the annual contribution,

[2:56:25] Voice 12: contribution, crown lease referrals, and an update to the work program.

[2:56:29] Voice 12: So I think the annual report contribution is presumably going to be quite quick, crown

[2:56:34] Voice 12: lease referrals could be quick.

[2:56:37] Voice 12: I will need a little bit of time with the update to the work program, if you know it's

[2:56:41] Voice 12: a bit of a wholesale change.

[2:56:43] Voice 12: So the two key items, just from a staff's perspective, of course, do as you wish, is

[2:56:48] Voice 12: the Housing Strategic Action Plan and the last item to update the work program to reflect

[2:56:54] Voice 12: strategic plan so and the bulk

[2:56:57] Voice 10: of that of course

[2:56:57] Voice 12: would go to housing so just thought i'd give you

[2:57:00] Voice 12: a heads up what staff are saying sure

[2:57:02] Voice 10: um do you think that we should move the crown tenure

[2:57:07] Voice 10: application to last on the agenda then i i to be honest that kind of left me in a state of um

[2:57:17] Voice 10: and you know i need somebody to explain to me more about this but but we could put that at the end

[2:57:23] Voice 10: and move to the other items first, at least.

[2:57:27] Voice 10: If

[2:57:27] Voice 12: that was deferred,

[2:57:28] Voice 10: would that be a big problem?

[2:57:30] Voice 12: No, and I'll get to the punchline too.

[2:57:32] Voice 12: I have a request, or I will be reporting back to the RPC in the future

[2:57:38] Voice 12: about policies for amendment.

[2:57:40] Voice 12: I think there's an interesting movement afoot as per strategic plan

[2:57:44] Voice 12: to amend, rescind, merge policies.

[2:57:51] Voice 12: And I've sort of asked for a resolution in my work program to do that.

[2:57:56] Voice 12: So that would just naturally fall in there anyways.

[2:57:58] Voice 12: So I don't want to say superfluous because it's important, but it'll be moved along regardless.

[2:58:05] Voice 12: So yeah, deferring it would be probably the best one to defer of all these.

[2:58:11] Voice 12: And the annual

[2:58:12] Voice 12: report cannot be deferred.

[2:58:14] Voice 12: I will be shocked and

[2:58:15] Voice 12: quartered if that happens.

[2:58:17] Voice 10: Yeah, no problem.

[2:58:18] Voice 10: them. I do have one comment on that, but not about the substance, more about the order and

[2:58:22] Voice 10: the items, okay? I see that Trustee Borthwick, Vice Chair Borthwick, has his hand up.

[2:58:30] Voice 4: Yeah, and just very briefly, and I realized, and thank you for saying it, I realized it during the

[2:58:35] Voice 4: break, but yeah, the 11.1, the work program updates had been, when we were talking about

[2:58:43] Voice 4: the agenda at the beginning i had meant to suggest that uh we maybe bumped that up uh earlier um just

[2:58:50] Voice 4: because i think there is some stuff that's worth kind of digging into and it would be too bad i

[2:58:55] Voice 4: think to leave that to when our brains have all turned to mush um but i forgot to do it because

[2:59:01] Voice 4: i was chairing instead uh but i'm i think i think if we're deferring something else i think it'd be

[2:59:05] Voice 4: fine i just want to make sure it doesn't drop off the end because i think there's some important

[2:59:10] Voice 10: Thanks. I think we have so we have two hours to go scheduled. And we'll have a maybe a comfort break in the middle of it. But everybody's good to go. Yeah. Okay. And, and trustee Borthwick, Vice Chair Borthwick, I would appreciate it if you jumped in and kept an eye on things. If I miss hands up or whatever. Just give me an alert. I'd appreciate that. Thank you.

[2:59:39] Voice 10: no

[2:59:40] Voice 4: problem okay

[2:59:42] Voice 10: so the next item on our agenda is the housing strategic action plan uh 8.4

[2:59:49] Voice 10: uh the first item is 8.41 housing strategic action plan and housing toolkit and and there is

[3:00:00] Voice 10: request for a decision with some uh suggested um motions um so uh who would like to um first of all

[3:00:13] Voice 10: let me say that i think the housing toolkit is a great piece of work and the fact that you're

[3:00:18] Voice 10: already looking at amending it incorporating feedback from experience at ltcs the tiny homes

[3:00:27] Voice 10: things etc etc i mean i think that's terrific and i hope that that process of amending it will

[3:00:34] Voice 10: happen frequently or as needed and that it doesn't become dusty and molder away on a shelf someplace

[3:00:43] Voice 10: so um i really appreciate that and as i went through it i thought yeah this is this is it's

[3:00:51] Voice 10: sort of one of those things that in the abstract it's not easy to dig into but i've had a couple

[3:00:57] Voice 10: of recent experiences through the tiny homes thing and something else and then you read it with

[3:01:03] Voice 10: uh that kind of experience lens and suddenly a host of things jump out and so um i probably read

[3:01:12] Voice 10: it this time um it made meant more to me this time anyway i appreciate it and i appreciate

[3:01:20] Voice 10: the updates coming. Okay, go everybody else. So,

[3:01:32] Voice 8: Chair, did you want me

[3:01:33] Voice 14: to just briefly introduce

[3:01:35] Voice 14: the report? You did a great introduction, Chair, but you'd like me to summarize it?

[3:01:40] Voice 10: Sure, please do, Robert.

[3:01:42] Voice 14: I'll be brief. So, yeah, the purpose, as you said, is to provide our PC

[3:01:46] Voice 14: with updates on the Housing Options Toolkit and the Housing Strategic Action Plan. So,

[3:01:53] Voice 14: So with the toolkit, it was completed well over a year ago now and is intended to be regularly reviewed and updated.

[3:02:00] Voice 14: So in reviewing it in the last month or so, we've identified a number of relatively minor updates and changes that can be completed without allocating any additional resources.

[3:02:12] Voice 14: Those are summarized in the report.

[3:02:14] Voice 14: The two sort of other updates that we don't think we could do unless there is dedicated staff time.

[3:02:23] Voice 14: is updating the housing profiles to incorporate the data from the housing needs reports

[3:02:31] Voice 14: and updating the baseline report in the toolkit, which is the baseline report was that

[3:02:37] Voice 14: probably the largest single item in the toolkit, which basically goes through every OCP and LUB

[3:02:45] Voice 14: and summarizes everything housing related to that. Then I'd suggest that there's a number

[3:02:50] Voice 14: of ongoing housing projects that LTCs are doing and then once those are completed would be a good

[3:02:57] Voice 14: time to update the baseline report anyway so in summary staff are proposing to complete the minor

[3:03:04] Voice 14: initiatives and others things as resources permit uh so that's the toolkit the second item in the

[3:03:15] Voice 14: rfd is about the presentation there's a quest request to come back with options for a presentation

[3:03:19] Voice 14: to trustees so wasn't it actually explicit in the resolution but we're

[3:03:26] Voice 14: presuming it's about the toolkit specifically so a few options are

[3:03:32] Voice 14: presented a zoom session for all trustees noted that those attendance of

[3:03:39] Voice 14: those is it's hit and miss in the past the recommended option is that staff

[3:03:47] Voice 14: Staff target LTCs that have ongoing or pending major projects, specifically related to housing,

[3:03:53] Voice 14: those that are interested, and just do presentations as part of their regular or special meeting agendas.

[3:04:01] Voice 14: Other options add a memo to all LTC agendas with a link.

[3:04:06] Voice 14: And the fourth is a presentation at Trust Council.

[3:04:11] Voice 14: And, of course, the fifth unstated option is we don't do anything.

[3:04:15] Voice 14: the direction of our pc and then the third is the housing strategic action plan so did some

[3:04:24] Voice 14: updates to the actions list table so actions that have been completed were noted of the remaining

[3:04:31] Voice 14: actions sort of what we sort of came up with was that we could be more specific about the status

[3:04:41] Voice 14: of those actions and suggested a number of additional descriptions

[3:04:47] Voice 14: of where things are.

[3:04:51] Voice 14: So targeted for completion this fiscal year is a couple of actions there,

[3:04:56] Voice 14: the suitable land analysis and a couple of templates,

[3:05:00] Voice 14: water-related templates.

[3:05:02] Voice 14: Next fiscal year update the housing profiles, which I mentioned earlier,

[3:05:06] Voice 14: and then upon adoption of the policy statement,

[3:05:09] Voice 14: look at some of the implementing some of that uh others are on would be classified as ongoing this

[3:05:18] Voice 14: is working with first nations and working with regional districts which are just ongoing

[3:05:22] Voice 14: through every um initiative uh summer advocacy actions specifically provincial and um the

[3:05:31] Voice 14: suggestion is that those be labeled as advocacy actions and potentially incorporated into trust

[3:05:37] Voice 14: area services advocacy program and then there's a number that we're suggesting or recommending

[3:05:44] Voice 14: the status be deferred and those would be creating any new data for the suitable land analysis

[3:05:52] Voice 14: if new data becomes available and that it was met the technical requirements for mapping so

[3:06:01] Voice 14: me those that new data be incorporated into the suitable land analysis but not creating

[3:06:08] Voice 14: we don't have the funding to create any new data layers part two of the housing toolkit

[3:06:13] Voice 14: which was never commenced and would require resources to do that

[3:06:19] Voice 14: working with rds to administer housing agreements doesn't seem to be much initiative

[3:06:26] Voice 14: from most regional districts to take something like that on requesting trust

[3:06:31] Voice 14: council to hold land and establishing roundtables so in summary the

[3:06:38] Voice 14: recommendations are to make them direct staff or support staff to make the minor

[3:06:43] Voice 14: updates to the housing toolkit schedule presentation give direction about

[3:06:48] Voice 14: scheduling presentations to LTCs and to revise the housing strategic action

[3:06:54] Voice 14: plan action list as recommended and essentially forward that to trust

[3:07:01] Voice 14: council I'm not sure if we would need to or not that might be a bit of a

[3:07:04] Voice 14: discussion thank you back to you chair um

[3:07:13] Voice 10: trustee patrick or chair patrick

[3:07:17] Voice 10: should I say go ahead uh

[3:07:19] Trustee Patrick: just a trustee I think

[3:07:22] Trustee Patrick: um I yes to me these documents are all live

[3:07:27] Trustee Patrick: they must be maintained and kept current because we are learning and we're

[3:07:31] Trustee Patrick: learning a lots from other jurisdictions and so forth.

[3:07:36] Trustee Patrick: So for example, in the toolkit, I, to me,

[3:07:39] Trustee Patrick: I think we need to start working to change some of the narrative.

[3:07:44] Trustee Patrick: So often,

[3:07:46] Trustee Patrick: anytime we have conversations in our islands about affordable housing,

[3:07:49] Trustee Patrick: it's, it's treated like it's new, it's above, it's increased density.

[3:07:53] Trustee Patrick: It's, it's, you know, it's all this stuff is pounded onto it.

[3:07:57] Trustee Patrick: while we carry on building single family homes on all the existing density that allows those

[3:08:06] Trustee Patrick: structures to be built so i think under zoning like review of existing we need to to you know

[3:08:13] Trustee Patrick: always be planting that seed you can make corrections to the underlying zoning on your

[3:08:19] Trustee Patrick: islands and and i think as we look at housing needs assessments and things and you know we

[3:08:25] Trustee Patrick: We should be horrified by the number of houses that are indicated that we should be building to supply some demand and growth when our very own hardworking people are living in tents.

[3:08:37] Trustee Patrick: So we've got to take that on.

[3:08:40] Trustee Patrick: The other is the forms of housing as we learn more and expand.

[3:08:45] Trustee Patrick: And I think a form that's missing is community land trusts and the reuse of existing homes.

[3:08:53] Trustee Patrick: So where there's a large single family home, that might be a good candidate for a community land trust to restructure that into a multi-unit house without changing the footprint of the house.

[3:09:06] Trustee Patrick: So I think we've got to be planting those seeds that those are also, you know, really, I would hope, very accommodating to our mandate that if we're reusing existing houses and the footprints that they already have created, that that would be a real beneficial thing.

[3:09:27] Trustee Patrick: So that's, like I said, as we look at our comments on the zoning and options there that we really start, what is the word, you know, pushing some innovation as well.

[3:09:44] Voice 10: Thank you. Trustee Elliot?

[3:09:48] Voice 6: Agree with everything I've heard.

[3:09:50] Voice 6: So in reviewing the notes from our last meeting, they do say that regarding the presentation, and I think this might be a good approach, is that a trustee expressed the desire for a workshop connecting policy options from tool three with the policy statement.

[3:10:06] Voice 6: statement and so what's been really interesting to for me as a trustee is working through the

[3:10:15] Voice 6: policy statement which is kind of very abstract work if you haven't worked in policy before which

[3:10:23] Voice 6: I haven't but then working through a Gabriel OCP process and having worked on on the tiny house

[3:10:31] Voice 6: and sort of smaller dwellings, the conversation about clustering smaller or low impact forms of

[3:10:39] Voice 6: housing is echoing through all of those processes. So what I'd like to see in terms of a presentation,

[3:10:48] Voice 6: what I think would be really useful and timely is a working demonstration of the links between

[3:10:57] Voice 6: between the policy statement options that we're considering with clustering small units under a

[3:11:04] Voice 6: certain size, how those could show up in an OCP. You could use, you know, Maine's got a housing

[3:11:11] Voice 6: project with the Flex Housing Initiative. Gabriel is developing policy options. And we'll soon find

[3:11:18] Voice 6: out if the community does want to see clustering of small homes. And then what other, North Pender.

[3:11:25] Voice 6: So we could see how that could show up in different OCPs to illustrate how different configurations would test that top-level policy in a policy statement.

[3:11:38] Voice 6: Because to me, this is a practical way to demonstrate how the conversation about density must change.

[3:11:49] Voice 6: And we've seen this from calls from the Salt Spring Island Housing Task Force.

[3:11:53] Voice 6: there's a few recommendations that they made. And I think the language, people are starting

[3:11:59] Voice 6: to understand the language better now that just as Trustee Patrick said, moving away from

[3:12:04] Voice 6: the market-driven single-family dwellings, what are those other forms that could be less impactful

[3:12:13] Voice 6: on the environment? What are the qualifiers or the criteria for those forms? And what are the

[3:12:20] Voice 6: environmental considerations or offsets that might be needed. So I could pick seven or eight

[3:12:26] Voice 6: policy tools from that toolkit, um, from the, the clustering or the alternative dwellings or the,

[3:12:35] Voice 6: um, uh, what do you call it? The, I keep wanting to call it the horseshoe,

[3:12:40] Voice 6: but it's when you cluster everything together, home plates, home plate zoning, uh, the eco

[3:12:45] Voice 6: ecovillage model, the environmental density trade-off kind of thing, we could pull together

[3:12:52] Voice 6: a lot of those different policy options and play with them to see, well, how could they work out?

[3:12:58] Voice 6: And that would get community members thinking about, oh, I have a piece of land that, you know,

[3:13:05] Voice 6: this house is no longer suitable for me and my children. If we could apply to rezone it for,

[3:13:11] Voice 6: Or, you know, three units, what would be, what are the things that I need to think about?

[3:13:16] Voice 6: So I think a practical workshop that would invite, that would connect the policy statement, work on the clustering small homes through our OCP policies in different areas and, you know, sort of illustrate how that could play out in real communities would be really useful.

[3:13:36] Voice 6: And I'll stop there.

[3:13:37] Voice 6: And

[3:13:39] Voice 10: Vice Chair Borthwick, and my hand is up for next.

[3:13:48] Voice 4: Yeah, so I have a bit of a heel turn moment here to make, I'm afraid. And I want to preface this

[3:13:56] Voice 4: just by saying that I, yeah, I talked briefly about the suitable land analysis tool. And I

[3:14:03] Voice 4: want to just preface this by saying, like, I think that the theory of the tool is brilliant.

[3:14:09] Voice 4: um and it you know has tremendous potential um and i have noticed we are we are one of the islands

[3:14:16] Voice 4: for which it has been partially developed we've had a a demonstration and i want to thank staff

[3:14:21] Voice 4: for for walking us through those things and again i want to be really clear i'm not trying to

[3:14:27] Voice 4: um disparage anybody's uh any anyone in particular um one of the things and i think the my major

[3:14:35] Voice 4: major, I suppose, concerns that came out of the meeting that the orientation that we had

[3:14:42] Voice 4: are sort of encapsulated in the fact that one of our things at this point is we're talking

[3:14:51] Voice 4: about drafting methodology for how that is going to be deployed.

[3:14:56] Voice 4: And there's an element to which that feels quite backwards to sort of be now determining

[3:15:05] Voice 4: how we want to use this thing, having developed a thing.

[3:15:09] Voice 4: And a lot of the questions that I had during our orientation,

[3:15:16] Voice 4: for which David Graham was also there,

[3:15:21] Voice 4: is, you know, are around like, well, how are we, you know,

[3:15:24] Voice 4: I mean, so there's some issue and we've, you know,

[3:15:26] Voice 4: we've had some very fruitful conversations with the Dem and Conservancy

[3:15:30] Voice 4: who have a lot of really valuable data and, you know, how can we,

[3:15:33] Voice 4: And, you know, there's talk about how to integrate that and use that. And I think that's really good. And I really appreciate staff's, you know, willingness to engage with that stuff.

[3:15:42] Voice 4: um the uh the part that i was concerned about was was this sort of lack of method methodology in

[3:15:51] Voice 4: terms of um you know how are we making sure that this data stays accurate how you know what is the

[3:15:59] Voice 4: political process by which we're going to be updating this how frequently is that going to

[3:16:03] Voice 4: be done um you know uh and and a lot of those were big question marks in terms of like well

[3:16:09] Voice 4: well, we've created this basically multilayered mapping tool,

[3:16:13] Voice 4: which absolutely can see the utility.

[3:16:16] Voice 4: I'm super excited about it.

[3:16:17] Voice 4: I am a big nerd for maps.

[3:16:19] Voice 4: Very excited about that.

[3:16:20] Voice 4: The concern that I have then is,

[3:16:23] Voice 4: okay, well, we're talking about weighting

[3:16:26] Voice 4: the importance of various factors to create these composites.

[3:16:30] Voice 4: And what I realized as we sort of started to interface with that question was,

[3:16:36] Voice 4: is we haven't given a good idea to the process

[3:16:40] Voice 4: of how we're having those discussions,

[3:16:43] Voice 4: how we're deciding those weightings

[3:16:48] Voice 4: and like at what intervals are they getting updated?

[3:16:52] Voice 4: And yeah, anyways, I don't mean to beat a dead horse here.

[3:16:55] Voice 4: I think I've kind of made that point per se,

[3:16:57] Voice 4: but it feels a little bit like we've created a tool

[3:17:08] Voice 4: for the sake of creating a tool, and now we're trying to figure out what it's useful for.

[3:17:12] Voice 4: And I think we understand what it's useful for, but I guess we're not quite sure which end to

[3:17:16] Voice 4: hold. And maybe is that a better analogy? I don't know if I'm explaining myself very well.

[3:17:21] Voice 4: But how we are going to interface with it operationally is the part that I feel like

[3:17:28] Voice 4: has been you know a bit foggy um and yeah i and and yeah i mean i do have there are some some

[3:17:38] Voice 4: serious concerns certainly where where we are um it's not a tool that i can currently say that i'm

[3:17:44] Voice 4: really excited to use because i know that there's just pretty obvious errors in the data um which

[3:17:51] Voice 4: and like obviously and i think as uh william was talking about earlier like there's some

[3:17:56] Voice 4: some layers of that data, which have more veracity than others, and some that we have

[3:17:59] Voice 4: more control over and update stuff that we've generated ourselves. And, you know, I hear

[3:18:04] Voice 4: Robert Kojima and that, like, we're not necessarily in a position to be, you know,

[3:18:07] Voice 4: creating more data for that. It's more about how we're interfacing with it. But

[3:18:13] Voice 4: when there are obvious errors in data that we're presenting, it undercuts the work. And I really

[3:18:20] Voice 4: really want to support this thing. I want it to be a useful and helpful tool. But when it has

[3:18:26] Voice 4: obvious problems, it undermines the confidence of constituents who've seen it so far. And that

[3:18:33] Voice 4: calls into question if decisions are being made based on that tool, which just, it undermines

[3:18:38] Voice 4: the position that I, you know,

[3:18:40] Voice 4: really want to hold, which is, you know, supporting it and being

[3:18:42] Voice 4: excited about it. And yeah, anyways, that's sort of, those are really sort of broad scattershot

[3:18:49] Voice 4: concerns. And I don't know if necessarily we need to get into all the nitty gritty of that right

[3:18:54] Voice 4: now. But I feel like as the RPC, we are the body that most directly interfaces. As an LTC, I don't

[3:19:03] Voice 4: really feel like it's our place to try and direct the work of the regional planning teams. But as

[3:19:09] Voice 4: RPC, I feel like this is where it falls into our jurisdiction. And I just want to make sure that

[3:19:14] Voice 4: those concerns are sort of coming back up and and you know i think this is something we need to talk

[3:19:19] Voice 4: about because again i think it could be really exciting i could it could be a tremendous tool

[3:19:24] Voice 4: and i don't want to see it fumble um and yeah i've got more bits and pieces but i won't i won't

[3:19:30] Voice 4: sort of belabor the point right now um mostly just sort of wanting to get it in the atmosphere

[3:19:35] Voice 4: Thank

[3:19:38] Voice 10: you. Okay, I have my own hand up. I'll just do round one of my items. So one of the things I'm, so okay, to follow on from what Trustee Elliott said about clustering and follow on what Trustee Patrick said.

[3:20:03] Voice 10: There is a confusion, I think, about density and the impact of clustering and the impact of affordability.

[3:20:13] Voice 10: Like these are all different things that play off each other.

[3:20:17] Voice 10: But I think people automatically the headline for them is, oh, we're going to increase density.

[3:20:24] Voice 10: Oh, we don't have enough water alarm bells. And how you achieve that.

[3:20:30] Voice 10: So I'll just give an example. On Saterna at the moment, because a giant piece of forested land has been taken over by the BC Parks Foundation, not BC Parks, Parks Foundation, there are a significant number of densities which are going to be transferred to the community amenity density bank, which is for the benefit of the community.

[3:20:56] Voice 10: But also the reason they said that they would transfer those densities is because Ceterna has a notion of cap on, you know, they have a view on the end point for population and lots.

[3:21:11] Voice 10: So, you know, that that was interesting to me that they would not have considered it if those densities would be just thrown over the fence into a, I don't know, open market.

[3:21:25] Voice 10: So they wanted to be sure that they would kind of benefit the community.

[3:21:32] Voice 10: And so I do think that people get confused because then they become alarmed about these densities and they don't realize that the densities are being moved.

[3:21:41] Voice 10: They are not being created. And in fact, the benefit arguably is that that forested lot will remain intact and they will be used elsewhere where maybe there are already amenities and infrastructure.

[3:21:55] Voice 10: And so I just wonder if we shouldn't have some sort of introduction or discussion around, you know, affordable housing options like clustering and, you know, not building, you know, not forcing people to have, you know, five acre subdivisions with a single house.

[3:22:17] Voice 10: like bring that all into one picture that sort of says this is not going to have a negative impact

[3:22:25] Voice 10: it may have a positive impact because um you share resources and infrastructure you leave

[3:22:34] Voice 10: areas unchanged like really bring those different levers together and something coherent so that

[3:22:41] Voice 10: that people aren't making up their own narrative on it, because it can be quite negative.

[3:22:47] Voice 10: And there are a lot of people who think that all of these things together are coming to increase density.

[3:22:55] Voice 10: And we're not really increasing density if you put five people together on one lot instead of each of them on five separate lots or whatever.

[3:23:03] Voice 10: So it's like population versus lot densities and development lots.

[3:23:08] Voice 10: thoughts another thing so I'll leave that at the moment because indeed I'm kind of beating it to

[3:23:13] Voice 10: get death but I feel quite strongly about it and if we do come up with clustering opportunities

[3:23:18] Voice 10: or ways to cluster and reasons then we should also consider services and shared services and

[3:23:27] Voice 10: how that can and be accommodated you know do you say if we have you know it's a bit like the main

[3:23:34] Voice 10: option where you can have 10 homes if they're all you know combined the same size as can we

[3:23:40] Voice 10: apply that to septic systems and to water systems and i'll move quickly on and what i found about

[3:23:49] Voice 10: the profiles is um that we should have better information i think about as on saturn you know

[3:24:00] Voice 10: know notionally there were 850 densities and you know 150 disappeared to parks canada

[3:24:09] Voice 10: i don't know 500 450 have been developed so have some notional kind of scorecard of where we are

[3:24:18] Voice 10: and i know it's difficult and to be very very accurate about that because you know it changes

[3:24:24] Voice 10: and it's hard to get all the data but we could make a start on that because it would give people

[3:24:30] Voice 10: a clearer picture you know for instance you know saltwater intrusion is a huge problem

[3:24:37] Voice 10: um or could be a huge problem or is a huge risk but on most of the islands um the

[3:24:46] Voice 10: um coastal properties and lots have already been developed on saturn i don't believe there

[3:24:52] Voice 10: as a location with undeveloped coastal property.

[3:24:56] Voice 10: So, you know, there is a risk, but on the other hand,

[3:25:00] Voice 10: if we knew the degree to which those areas were already developed

[3:25:06] Voice 10: and it would help us.

[3:25:12] Voice 10: The last thing I want to talk about, I have a huge list here,

[3:25:17] Voice 10: but I'm not going to go through it all.

[3:25:18] Voice 10: um one thing is so in the census data because i was involved in the tiny homes thing i dug around

[3:25:27] Voice 10: to see okay can we have some idea of how many people are living in tiny homes or different

[3:25:34] Voice 10: housing options and in fact it's terribly um lacking in granularity they basically bundle

[3:25:42] Voice 10: everything into single family detached which includes mobile homes that have been fixed to

[3:25:53] Voice 10: the ground in some way temporarily or otherwise and then they have something called movable or

[3:25:59] Voice 10: mobile which is trailers tents or these boats and and I suspect all of that data is terribly

[3:26:07] Voice 10: inaccurate and you know i wonder if we shouldn't try to collect ourselves better information and

[3:26:16] Voice 10: if in running some kind of survey like that it's a way also of advertising and communicating

[3:26:24] Voice 10: this toolkit you know it's a way of launching it and saying this toolkit exists and we'd really

[3:26:31] Voice 10: really like to see what kind of options we should use.

[3:26:36] Voice 10: Here's a description.

[3:26:37] Voice 10: And by the way, tell us about your situation,

[3:26:41] Voice 10: you know, what kind of house, et cetera, et cetera,

[3:26:43] Voice 10: more than is in the census data,

[3:26:45] Voice 10: because it's not very granular

[3:26:47] Voice 10: and we're bundled up with, you know,

[3:26:50] Voice 10: everybody else in Canada.

[3:26:51] Voice 10: So it's very hard to really see a picture

[3:26:55] Voice 10: of how people live in the islands in that census data.

[3:26:59] Voice 10: Okay, I'll leave it at that.

[3:27:01] Voice 10: Thank you.

[3:27:08] Voice 8: I think you've got to invite your next speaker, Chair.

[3:27:13] Voice 10: I'm sorry.

[3:27:14] Voice 10: I actually said, I think I'm using myself first.

[3:27:16] Voice 10: Okay.

[3:27:16] Voice 10: Trustee Patrick, please.

[3:27:18] Voice 10: Thanks.

[3:27:18] Voice 10: Thanks, Sam.

[3:27:19] Voice 10: Thank you.

[3:27:22] Trustee Patrick: I did want to follow up on Trustee Borthwick's comments.

[3:27:26] Trustee Patrick: And I think as the suitable, you know, this is a new tool for the Island Trust, the suitable

[3:27:30] Trustee Patrick: land analysis.

[3:27:31] Trustee Patrick: And I think on Salt Spring, we tried to act proactively, and in our terms of reference for our upcoming project, we said that the data and mapping inputs into the suitable land analysis will be customized to Salt Spring and developed in a transparent and engaged manner.

[3:27:49] Trustee Patrick: Because we could see what was going to come. And I think it's important that, you know, suitable land analysis could have different layers to different islands because of the issues and concerns on those islands. There could even be social layers, not all environmental or, you know, but it needs, I think if the analysis was built from the beginning in a transparent manner, engaging your community along the way, then the results are going to be more acceptable.

[3:28:19] Trustee Patrick: So I think that's something we should be building into it. And I wanted to, I think, Mayraid, I think you, I think this is one of the big holes that are in our toolkit, and that's data. And that is a very interesting data point.

[3:28:38] Trustee Patrick: Again, like I said, we always emphasize, oh, affordable housing, another unit, and the whole island just goes to it. But we celebrate when we fundraise and secure a beautiful property to protect it into the future.

[3:28:57] Trustee Patrick: we don't mention how many densities were taken off the map as well and I think those are important

[3:29:05] Trustee Patrick: pieces of data to help show that you know this is a bit of an accounting exercise to some degree

[3:29:11] Trustee Patrick: and you know we shouldn't be losing that data that is important data which I think goes to

[3:29:18] Trustee Patrick: an entire data tool or maybe it's a data program it should be funded as well that you know we're

[3:29:24] Trustee Patrick: We're going to be talking about the housing needs assessments in a minute.

[3:29:27] Trustee Patrick: Man, it would have been better if we had some better data that was applicable to our islands.

[3:29:32] Trustee Patrick: So we know that we're missing data.

[3:29:35] Trustee Patrick: We know we don't have accurate.

[3:29:37] Trustee Patrick: So shouldn't we be building a tool to make sure we're collecting the data that we need to demonstrate the housing, and I'm talking full spectrum, concerns that we have in these islands?

[3:29:52] Trustee Patrick: instead of speculating, I think it would help us a whole lot if we had real data.

[3:30:00] Voice 10: Thank you. I agree wholeheartedly. I wish we had spent that hundred and thirty thousand on something like that.

[3:30:08] Voice 10: Anyway, with respect to the suitable tool analysis, I actually am going in next week to sit with Brad and have a look at the mapping options and that.

[3:30:20] Voice 10: But I actually wonder if we haven't shot ourselves in the foot a bit by advertising it as something that delivers a kind of a, you know, semi-automated product and whether it shouldn't be relaunched as like exploring just data for the islands.

[3:30:43] Voice 10: Like I see it as a way to explore things that I can't see, you know, via I go on Google Earth, I drag out paper maps, I try and count, you know, where the different, you know, developments are.

[3:30:59] Voice 10: but if we had you know if we use that tool you could just say well i don't have any particular

[3:31:05] Voice 10: questions but let's just sort of zoom around and talk it's a way to talk about the island and become

[3:31:13] Voice 10: familiar with it in a way that as a trustee i should be familiar like for instance at the moment

[3:31:19] Voice 10: i would love to find a suitable location to relocate the pickleball court and i don't know

[3:31:25] Voice 10: if i can launch that at the two suitable land analysis um and of course you know where could we

[3:31:31] Voice 10: uh increase um i hate to use the word density but where could we have clusters

[3:31:39] Voice 10: um so but but really we should just be exploring it and talking while we're looking at the data

[3:31:48] Voice 10: rather than waiting things and then going zip give me the answer i know i'm exaggerating but

[3:31:54] Voice 10: But perhaps we could relaunch it.

[3:31:57] Voice 10: I mean, we don't even say what the suitable, suitable for what, you know.

[3:32:02] Voice 10: So it's become a bit of a tag, but maybe we should rename it and relaunch it.

[3:32:09] Voice 10: Thanks.

[3:32:09] Voice 10: OK, Trustee Brothwick.

[3:32:13] Voice 4: Yeah, and I think I just I mean, I want to, you know, be fair here and say that I think like I think that is the dream of what that tool is for.

[3:32:22] Voice 4: And I think that's what we, I mean, certainly as a trustee, that's exactly what I'd love to see from the suitable land analysis tool.

[3:32:30] Voice 4: And currently how it's formatted, we have to sort of request specific sets of data.

[3:32:39] Voice 4: It's not a terribly user-friendly tool at this point, just in terms of the software that it currently exists within.

[3:32:46] Voice 4: in um and i think i think there are probably off there's like and part of that is it's been built

[3:32:52] Voice 4: as a in the way that it's been built and and uh and i and again like i want to like hats off to

[3:32:57] Voice 4: the work that's gone into to creating it the way that it is and currently it doesn't uh doesn't

[3:33:04] Voice 4: perform in that particular function um but that would be i mean being able to sort of compare and

[3:33:09] Voice 4: contrast layers and and and modify those those weightings to you know account for different

[3:33:14] Voice 4: different questions, you know, and I think extrapolating from that data, you should be

[3:33:19] Voice 4: able to answer that question of, Hey, where's a great place to put a pickleball court? You know,

[3:33:23] Voice 4: where do we already have a bunch of noise pollution that we're not super worried about

[3:33:26] Voice 4: a bunch of rackets, uh, you know, or, you know, and that's the sort of stuff that would be

[3:33:31] Voice 4: tremendously useful. Um, and it just, it currently doesn't exist in that format. And I,

[3:33:36] Voice 4: I guess my point was, um, I wonder if we didn't, uh, and, and this is partly on,

[3:33:42] Voice 4: This is on us as trustees, and this was a staff-led initiative, but I think part of the problem that we're having is that this methodology about how it's going to be deployed has been one of the later considerations, as opposed to something that was like, okay, well, we agree that it's a good tool, totally, 100%.

[3:34:05] Voice 4: It's a useful thing.

[3:34:07] Voice 4: We should figure out exactly how it's going to be useful and how it comes together.

[3:34:14] Voice 4: how we're how we're effective how we are actually going to use it is going to inform how we ought

[3:34:20] Voice 4: to build it i guess is my very cobbled together sentence there but anyway that that's all and i

[3:34:27] Voice 4: want to and again like i want to be really clear like i am am glad for the work that's gone into

[3:34:33] Voice 4: it and i i appreciate the the the um the goal um and i want to make sure that we get there

[3:34:40] Voice 4: as best we can thank

[3:34:43] Voice 10: you okay um anybody else we're still on the topic of the toolkit and

[3:34:51] Voice 10: updating the toolkit um any any further discussion uh trustee graham yeah

[3:35:01] Voice 13: interesting whoops what

[3:35:03] Voice 13: happened interesting conversation i just want to say i mean demin is deep into our housing review

[3:35:09] Voice 13: you. And so many of the tools in the toolkit are ones that we're exploring with our community.

[3:35:17] Voice 13: And, you know, your concerns about the reaction that some of your residents have about, oh my

[3:35:24] Voice 13: God, more density and the desecration of the natural environment is one that we continue to

[3:35:29] Voice 13: hear. And we'll always hear that from a certain group of people. It's part of the challenge for

[3:35:36] Voice 13: for the work that we do with those these two opposing ideas one of housing people and one

[3:35:43] Voice 13: to protect the environment and it's it's one of the toughest parts of the work that we do

[3:35:48] Voice 13: one thing I've tried to share with my community is that we're certainly not looking at putting

[3:35:55] Voice 13: housing in parks or conservation lands we're looking at we're looking we're exploring the

[3:36:01] Voice 13: idea of adding a second dwelling, an ADU, on land that's already been pretty seriously

[3:36:08] Voice 13: modified by human habitation.

[3:36:11] Voice 13: And one of the trade-offs we might look at is reducing the percentage of the land that

[3:36:18] Voice 13: can be covered by impervious surfaces.

[3:36:21] Voice 13: So it's a bit of a trade-off.

[3:36:22] Voice 13: So if we reduce the percentage of your private lot that you can cover with buildings, including

[3:36:29] Voice 13: including your residences, by, say, 5%.

[3:36:32] Voice 13: Right now, most of their lot coverage percentages, I think, are pretty high.

[3:36:36] Voice 13: I think they're, on mine, on a 10-acre lot, I can cover 25% with buildings, which is insane.

[3:36:42] Voice 13: I could quite happily look at 15%.

[3:36:45] Voice 13: That would be a huge advantage to the nature, which has a chance then, at least there isn't

[3:36:52] Voice 13: the building that it has to uh combat with uh in it as a trade for meat perhaps to have a

[3:36:58] Voice 13: secondary dwelling this is a tough pill for people to to look at um and the discussions that we've

[3:37:05] Voice 13: had with our community about the sustainability of our community and the resilience of our

[3:37:09] Voice 13: community as climate change puts more and more pressures on us how we need a full

[3:37:16] Voice 13: range of you know we need working-class people on these islands it's fairly important that makes

[3:37:21] Voice 13: makes a really i mean we all know this right and yet at the same time we have people saying well

[3:37:26] Voice 13: i'm okay and i think we should just leave everything the way it is and i struggle with

[3:37:32] Voice 13: these conversations i i lay awake at night and i just struggle uh trying to find the right approach

[3:37:39] Voice 13: i've used a number of opportunities in our flagstone to to write about yeah the the supposed

[3:37:48] Voice 13: threat that if you allow everybody in a certain zone to have a second dwelling they will all have

[3:37:53] Voice 13: one and and that's just silly you know that's just not real and yet that's where a lot of people go

[3:37:58] Voice 13: i don't know if there's any easy answers i'm just sharing with you some of my my thoughts

[3:38:03] Voice 13: and as i said i love the toolkit i love the options that it presents from a local trust

[3:38:09] Voice 13: committee's perspective when you start diving into your your housing regulations yeah thank you

[3:38:18] Trustee Patrick: uh

[3:38:18] Voice 10: trustee patrick i

[3:38:20] Trustee Patrick: just want uh when i say track the the densities that are that are being removed

[3:38:24] Trustee Patrick: moved from parklands. I think we all agree. We're not saying putting housing in the parklands.

[3:38:29] Trustee Patrick: It's a good news story. It's data that we could share, and it helps have those narratives when

[3:38:34] Trustee Patrick: we have to talk with our community. And this is where having the data helps. Like on Salt Spring,

[3:38:41] Trustee Patrick: there's 2,500 lots that you can have a secondary suite, but only 10 have been built in 14 years.

[3:38:49] Trustee Patrick: So that data is so important. And if we have that correct and we're collecting it and sharing it, that helps dispel that fear that everybody's going to do this. And so that's all I'm encouraging is that the data helps us tell those stories and hopefully helps us not have to stay up at night worrying like we all do about keeping the precious families that we need on these islands here.

[3:39:16] Trustee Patrick: year.

[3:39:20] Voice 6: Thanks. Okay, thank you. So I'd like to get specific. Staff asked for feedback on

[3:39:30] Voice 6: tool three. Are there any things that we want them to look into? Just let me know if I have

[3:39:39] Voice 6: the question right. Are you looking for direction into, you know, expand these areas or do some

[3:39:45] Voice 6: research if resources you know are available or or is the the menu full for for tool three it's just

[3:39:54] Voice 6: going to be updated with the information that we have e

[3:39:57] Voice 14: through the chair to trustee elliott

[3:40:01] Voice 14: um yep so we've identified what we think we could do without additional resources and that's a

[3:40:08] Voice 14: euphemism for doing it off the side of my desk i guess um and then there's things we'd like to do

[3:40:13] Voice 14: but you know don't have the resources this year to do it um so yeah we're asking for your

[3:40:21] Voice 14: endorsement of that or you know maybe don't do this do this instead oh

[3:40:27] Voice 6: thank you um well if i

[3:40:30] Voice 6: could i guess highlight one thing that i think is going to be needed maybe not at this maybe we

[3:40:38] Voice 6: We can't flesh it out at this point.

[3:40:40] Voice 6: But how to allow, what is the regulatory structure to allow small-scale, multi-unit, affordable housing that is not built by a housing society?

[3:40:58] Voice 6: But are there any examples of options of securing an affordable housing agreement with, you know, the Land Trust Society, as Trustee Patrick was saying, or even a landowner that's perhaps a cooperative that's coming together for the sake of building affordable housing?

[3:41:19] Voice 6: So we've got, if you look on page 85, small scale multi-unit housing for market, and then down multi-family dwelling units affordable. But the definition there is quite limiting, only if undertaken by a government or nonprofit organization.

[3:41:38] Voice 6: But I think if we're going to talk about construction of multi-dwelling units or clustering units on a lot that maybe previously only had one single family dwelling, but the LTC wants to make sure that it's used for rent or low, you know, workforce housing or whatever that is.

[3:42:00] Voice 6: So what would be the tool to secure that? Does it have to be a housing agreement? That would be

[3:42:06] Voice 6: something I'd want explored, as well as a little bit more on the zoning for unit numbers, not

[3:42:13] Voice 6: housing type. And this is something that I've wished RPC could have tackled from the beginning

[3:42:18] Voice 6: of this term, defining, like redefining density. There has to be other ways defining density than

[3:42:25] Voice 6: then one single family dwelling equals a density equals a unit. So this is the closest that I've

[3:42:31] Voice 6: seen that we come zone for unit numbers. I've never seen that show up in an OCP or

[3:42:38] Voice 6: as a zoning option. So what might that look like? And so if we're going back to the question of

[3:42:49] Voice 6: of what to address in the toolkit sorry there's a lot here you're saying you're going to do all

[3:43:02] Voice 6: those bullet points and then review and expand definitions of tiny homes on wheels

[3:43:06] Voice 6: could we include alternative dwellings or zoning for units rather than like it's it's about the

[3:43:16] Voice 6: housing form. Everywhere we're talking about housing form, we're trying to like, you know,

[3:43:22] Voice 6: what's another definition? What's another way of defining it than this market-driven single-family

[3:43:27] Voice 6: dwelling? And there's all those other, you know, market considerations as well. But that's the

[3:43:33] Voice 6: thing that I'm interested in. If we're going to create policy options for clustering, what would

[3:43:38] Voice 6: would that what would that look like in terms of securing it for affordable housing

[3:43:49] Voice 6: I'm not sure if that's in the scope of what you'd what you listed

[3:43:52] Voice 6: here it could be okay

[3:43:54] Voice 14: what would

[3:43:54] Voice 6: we need to take out well

[3:43:58] Voice 14: I mean it's it's if it's it's sort of in you adding another

[3:44:00] Voice 14: row or expanding on particular rows that's certainly certainly something that can be done

[3:44:06] Voice 14: pretty pretty easily so what I'm hearing is more about small scale multi-unit in particular

[3:44:18] Voice 14: something that's maybe kind of between the market and non-markets where there's some sort of

[3:44:27] Voice 14: restrictions whether it's tenure or restrictions on on rents or prices something like that

[3:44:37] Voice 14: at a small scale yeah

[3:44:41] Voice 6: it's a tricky one definitely has to have some market analysis there like it

[3:44:49] Voice 6: it can't just be for affordable housing but i think i think you're right that what's that middle

[3:44:55] Voice 6: so using the language of the clustering that we're trying small i think it's it's just clustering

[3:45:01] Voice 6: small dwellings is that what we landed on so i don't want to get stuck with multi-unit housing

[3:45:08] Voice 6: it's more multiple housing types and forms allowed because they're going to

[3:45:15] Voice 6: be used for an affordable or less than market rates okay

[3:45:25] Voice 14: yeah they're adding

[3:45:30] Voice 14: another row or expanding upon something that's already there to kind of flush

[3:45:34] Voice 14: that a bit you're

[3:45:39] Voice 10: fading away again robert a bit yeah how's

[3:45:44] Voice 14: that a

[3:45:46] Voice 10: little better okay a little

[3:45:47] Voice 10: better i think i think uh your laptops need some is support with the volume of your audio you and

[3:45:56] Voice 10: stephan but anyway right

[3:45:57] Voice 14: well i did a high-tech uh over lunch i did a high-tech uh maneuver i

[3:46:01] Voice 14: unplugged my headset plugged it back in but maybe that didn't work

[3:46:07] Voice 14: all right yep no i it's uh trustee elliot uh i think i've got what you're looking for

[3:46:14] Voice 14: and can look at adding either adding additional um item to the toolkit or expanding upon one or

[3:46:25] Voice 14: more of the existing options yeah

[3:46:31] Voice 10: i had a kind of a mad thought i just throw it out there and

[3:46:38] Voice 10: And, you know, we can think about it is in terms of densities.

[3:46:44] Voice 10: I'm thinking on Saturna Island, they came up with this notional, I don't know, 2,000 or 2,500 people and 800 lots.

[3:46:55] Voice 10: So, you know, 2.4 people per lot or 2.5.

[3:46:59] Voice 10: But really, when you talk about the impact, you're talking about, you know, when people add a bathroom, suddenly, OK, you need to add water collection or you must expand your septic or, you know, you don't have enough water, whatever.

[3:47:16] Voice 10: I just wondered if we could turn everything into numbers of bedrooms and bathroom units in terms of, you know, describing what the kind of total density picture would begin to look like.

[3:47:33] Voice 10: And then you could configure them, you know, like a tiny home would have one bedroom, one bathroom and some, you know, that that would be OK.

[3:47:40] Voice 10: OK, you can have four on this lot, therefore, just an idea to to kind of quantify it,

[3:47:46] Voice 10: because truly it's the, you know, the use of water and the septic system that, you know, kind of creates the impact.

[3:47:59] Voice 10: And if you could quantify that and, you know, add it all up and then divide it up differently,

[3:48:04] Voice 10: maybe you could distribute it in a better way.

[3:48:08] Voice 10: anyway just an idea okay next anybody else want to talk more about these the toolkit

[3:48:15] Voice 10: okay are we ready to uh look at the recommended um um decisions that were requested could you

[3:48:30] Voice 10: scroll back up to i can't remember what page you're at page 106 please i think we're on

[3:48:48] Voice 6: 70 79

[3:48:49] Voice 6: sure oh yes 79

[3:48:53] Voice 10: great pardon yeah thanks so um are we ready to move ahead with these recommendations

[3:49:04] Voice 10: and sure i

[3:49:11] Voice 6: can move them first what if you like chair yeah

[3:49:14] Voice 10: and do we have uh one of them should

[3:49:16] Voice 10: have with uh as amended or as discussed what you what you requested

[3:49:21] Voice 6: discussed yeah i'm pretty

[3:49:25] Voice 6: Pretty confident staff will update what they're able to with the time they have.

[3:49:30] Voice 6: Okay.

[3:49:32] Voice 6: Okay.

[3:49:34] Voice 6: I move that Regional Planning Committee request staff make minor amendments to the Housing Options Toolkit identified in the request for decision of May 9th, 2025 and as discussed.

[3:49:49] Voice 10: Okay.

[3:49:49] Voice 10: That's seconded by Trustee Borthwick.

[3:49:52] Voice 10: Any discussion?

[3:50:02] Voice 10: Okay.

[3:50:03] Voice 10: All those in favor, raise your hand.

[3:50:04] Voice 10: we are a select few now aren't we do we do yeah we still have um yeah okay and those

[3:50:18] Voice 10: lower your hands anybody in opposition not in favor nope okay thank you that passes that's

[3:50:33] Voice 10: carried and the second one would somebody like to move the second motion okay

[3:50:41] Voice 4: i'll give trustee

[3:50:42] Voice 4: Elliott a break from being a mover and shaker. I move that the Regional Planning Committee

[3:50:50] Voice 4: request staff to schedule a future presentation for local trust committees initiating major

[3:50:55] Voice 4: projects or housing projects for presentations at regular or special LTC meetings.

[3:51:04] Voice 10: That's seconded by Trustee Graham. Thank you. All those in favor? Sorry, Trustee Elliott,

[3:51:14] Voice 10: it go ahead can

[3:51:15] Voice 6: we can we discuss first um so i actually i was hoping we wouldn't second this

[3:51:22] Voice 6: because um to me this is quite limited a future presentation for local trust committees that

[3:51:28] Voice 6: have housing projects it's going to be about four or five um it doesn't look like that would be a

[3:51:35] Voice 6: public webinar for the public to attend and view or would it through

[3:51:45] Voice 14: the chair so yeah as proposed

[3:51:47] Voice 14: it would be for the LTCs, but of course there would be public meetings.

[3:51:51] Voice 14: The LTC could, in

[3:51:55] Voice 14: just thinking about it, sure, an LTC could structure it in such a way that there's

[3:51:59] Voice 14: public engagement and public participation

[3:52:03] Voice 14: in those sessions.

[3:52:07] Voice 6: And I had been hoping that

[3:52:09] Voice 6: we could come back to that discussion of tying it to the policy statement

[3:52:13] Voice 6: work and doing sort of a constructive

[3:52:18] Voice 6: workshop demonstrating what small homes and clustering and offset, density offsets might

[3:52:27] Voice 6: look like. But does this, do you imagine that this presentation would be sort of

[3:52:33] Voice 6: hand and repeated? Of course, because that would be easiest. And is this open enough that you'd be

[3:52:43] Voice 6: be able to consider linking it with the policy statement work

[3:52:47] Voice 6: and tailoring it to some policy

[3:52:51] Voice 6: options that are being considered by local trust committees with those

[3:52:55] Voice 6: housing projects?

[3:52:57] Voice 14: Yes, I think given the

[3:52:59] Voice 14: smaller number of LTCs that would be targeted,

[3:53:05] Voice 14: I think it would be feasible to

[3:53:07] Voice 14: tailor each presentation to the specific project the local trust committee

[3:53:12] Voice 14: he's doing and it makes sense to bring in um draft policy statement uh directive policies at that

[3:53:20] Voice 14: point that are available at that point or have been um supported at that point yeah okay thanks

[3:53:32] Voice 6: those were my questions so

[3:53:35] Voice 10: um i'm thinking that uh this kind of limits it i can understand that

[3:53:40] Voice 10: if you're initiating a major project but to some degree it's kind of the cart before the horse i

[3:53:45] Voice 10: I thought about this earlier in that you might initiate a major project if you knew what options were available.

[3:53:53] Voice 10: And, you know, maybe that's not quite true.

[3:53:56] Voice 10: But I wonder if we shouldn't say for local trust committees, especially those initiating major projects.

[3:54:04] Voice 10: So it could be for other local trust committees by request.

[3:54:08] Voice 10: and even say you're not initiating,

[3:54:12] Voice 10: there could be a group of local trust committees

[3:54:14] Voice 10: who could have a more general presentation on this

[3:54:17] Voice 10: or should that then just go to trust council, I suppose?

[3:54:22] Voice 14: That was

[3:54:23] Voice 10: one of the

[3:54:23] Voice 14: options, chairs, to go

[3:54:25] Voice 14: to trust council.

[3:54:27] Voice 14: Time tends to be limited at trust council.

[3:54:31] Voice 14: Trustees are focused on whatever the business of trust council is.

[3:54:36] Voice 14: It could be a while before it can be scheduled

[3:54:38] Voice 14: for trust council as well so yeah there's no real ideal approach you know we have limited

[3:54:46] Voice 14: you know it's like i

[3:54:47] Voice 14: keep saying there's limited resources the options or it's not like we can

[3:54:51] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: hire

[3:54:51] Voice 14: a consultant to come in and do like a whole road show and so on so unless unless rpc wants to

[3:54:58] Voice 14: maybe defer this and put in a business case for the subsequent year like for next fiscal year

[3:55:03] Voice 14: and expand this into a more comprehensive approach

[3:55:08] Voice 10: no i want to do something like practical and short

[3:55:11] Voice 10: and just kind of considering this so i suppose really what you're saying is that you would make

[3:55:17] Voice 10: a tailored presentation if you knew what the project was you would you know tailor your

[3:55:24] Voice 10: presentation to suggestions that they might want to consider and i suppose that's good enough and

[3:55:32] Voice 10: we should just carry on with this particular motion is that your intention yes

[3:55:37] Voice 14: and just sort of for

[3:55:38] Voice 14: the just um the focus would be on the housing toolkit sort of bringing the housing toolkit

[3:55:45] Voice 14: options back to the forefront of local trust committees and communities where they are

[3:55:53] Voice 14: initiating or in the early stages of a major project whether it's specifically a housing

[3:55:58] Voice 14: project because it doesn't have to be a major project it could be a smaller housing project

[3:56:03] Voice 14: um or are doing or contemplating an ocp review okay

[3:56:10] Voice 10: thank you um so this has been moved and

[3:56:15] Voice 10: seconded i believe is and does anybody want to discuss this further or make a different

[3:56:23] Voice 10: suggestion oh okay so um so let's vote on the motion so all those in favor raise your hands

[3:56:36] Voice 10: thank you lower your hands anybody not in favor raise your hand that's carried thank you and the

[3:56:57] Voice 10: The third, so, okay, did we actually discuss the plan?

[3:57:14] Voice 10: We discussed the content of the toolkit a lot and the updates.

[3:57:21] Voice 10: I'm not sure we discussed the plan.

[3:57:25] Voice 10: What page is the plan on again?

[3:57:28] Voice 10: I've lost it now.

[3:57:34] Voice 14: So, Chair, what's called the actions list or the table is on page 103.

[3:57:44] Voice 14: Page, pardon?

[3:57:45] Voice 14: 103 103

[3:57:48] Voice 10: oh yeah okay so does anybody want to um raise anything in that explicitly

[3:58:01] Voice 10: go

[3:58:15] Voice 6: ahead trustee elliott so there's a raft of good ideas in here um yeah and i just want to

[3:58:25] Voice 6: recognize what staff highlighted that um we effectively neglected to include affordable

[3:58:34] Voice 6: affordable housing strategies in our strategic plan for trust council and so i wonder if

[3:58:42] Voice 6: if any of these can really be advanced in particular the advocacy pieces you know

[3:58:51] Voice 6: delivering that to trust programs committee i just don't think is is going to turn into anything

[3:59:01] Voice 6: thing frankly they've got a lot on their plates um the advocate sorry number 26 advocated the

[3:59:10] Voice 6: province for changes the provincial and regional level to support tiny homes on wheels um i

[3:59:18] Voice 6: wouldn't see turning that over to um just programs committee um i think what'll come out of the tiny

[3:59:26] Voice 6: house working group is sort of a path forward some of it which may be advocacy

[3:59:35] Voice 6: but i think it could be removed from the strat plan

[3:59:42] Voice 6: so i'm i know we want to keep this alive and keep it moving and thank you to staff for identifying

[3:59:51] Voice 6: what's been done and what could be done but seeing as we don't have housing in our strat plan

[4:00:00] Voice 6: Are we going to have to go back to council in June and say, hello, we left off a pretty significant piece and maybe there's some other things that need to drop off the list?

[4:00:15] Voice 6: And if so, what would be the key actions from this strat plan that we'd want to advance?

[4:00:24] Voice 6: because it's only by focusing on something that we actually get it done if we just have a bunch of

[4:00:31] Voice 6: orphan actions that uh really aren't going to get any resourcing or attention what do we do with

[4:00:39] Voice 6: that um

[4:00:43] Voice 10: i'm looking at all of this and this is all um you know i can see the dates some of the

[4:00:53] Voice 10: dates are a little bit iffy like quarter 4 23 24 um on item 11 um i think that was you you said you

[4:01:04] Voice 10: would um apply for insecure funding pilot approach um do we have to decide on this right now or could

[4:01:14] Voice 10: we um review it again in july what what would happen if we didn't actually um put this through

[4:01:23] Voice 10: right now and if we went through it really rigorously at the end of July after the

[4:01:31] Voice 10: trust council meeting uh trustee Patrick sorry I'm just jumping over to trustee Patrick now

[4:01:37] Voice 10: oh uh sorry

[4:01:39] Trustee Patrick: I was trying to catch everything here uh yes our strategic plan it's interesting

[4:01:46] Trustee Patrick: because I just was like gosh last night I know for the budget webinar I read out that a focus

[4:01:50] Trustee Patrick: area is growth management and community resiliency but we do have that growth

[4:01:57] Trustee Patrick: area but our our strategic direction is we're kind of missing that you're right

[4:02:07] Trustee Patrick: the affordable housing piece or diverse housing or resilience so we call it

[4:02:12] Trustee Patrick: community resiliency and we have no strategic direction that matches the

[4:02:18] Trustee Patrick: resiliency piece so that is a gaping hole that this committee should identify as a oops and um

[4:02:26] Trustee Patrick: and that that does look a bit i won't use other words of what that might look like

[4:02:31] Trustee Patrick: to our general public by not having that there um as well for objective c which is the suitable

[4:02:38] Trustee Patrick: land analysis like i said salt spring is going to require that we proceed with the community

[4:02:43] Trustee Patrick: engagement to develop those layers, is that a good practice that we should be catching and

[4:02:48] Trustee Patrick: developing overall for this committee in that tool development that's in Objective C? And

[4:02:56] Trustee Patrick: are we okay with not, you know, it's kind of in the strategic plan when you look at it,

[4:03:08] Trustee Patrick: it says we're going to work with other agencies to facilitate data gathering and share in the

[4:03:13] Trustee Patrick: the development of environmental indicators but we're missing all the housing indicator piece

[4:03:19] Trustee Patrick: of you know that we just talked about how many units have been built what kind of been built

[4:03:24] Trustee Patrick: where they've been built and um those type of things so um should we not have an objective to

[4:03:31] Trustee Patrick: fill out what kind of data we are gathering that's related to um housing and i'm saying

[4:03:39] Trustee Patrick: full-spectrum housing?

[4:03:50] Voice 10: Director Cermak, would you like to attempt to answer any of that?

[4:03:56] Voice 12: Sure. Thank you, Chair. I do believe that the Trust Council's approved strategic plan

[4:04:03] Voice 12: has one of the probably the biggest actions for RPC consideration in the near future.

[4:04:11] Voice 12: And I'm trying to find the exact developer growth management planning framework that includes data

[4:04:16] Voice 12: data on growth trends and projections, geological and hydrological capacities, infrastructure and

[4:04:22] Voice 12: development rates. So you'll see that in my proposed work plan. What does that mean? I've

[4:04:27] Voice 12: actually spent time trying to dissect that. I realized I can't do it all, but I do, not

[4:04:33] Voice 12: surprisingly, perhaps see it's a very similar request of the contractor currently, or that's

[4:04:40] Voice 12: about to be officially contracted on Salt Spring Island on their project. So there's some harmony

[4:04:45] Voice 12: many there. Long story short, I think that might address some of the questions that ex-officio

[4:04:49] Voice 12: Patrick has brought up here in terms of housing data going forward. It's just, unfortunately,

[4:04:57] Voice 12: the strategic plan kind of spread apart some of these things. And I think it's just not the

[4:05:02] Voice 12: strategic plan as a whole or the housing strategic action plan that you have. I hope that made sense.

[4:05:08] Voice 12: My point was to say, you do have a strategic action.

[4:05:11] Voice 12: The key initiative is to capture more data for decision-making in the form of housing and infrastructure.

[4:05:20] Voice 10: Okay.

[4:05:20] Voice 10: Trustee Elliott, thank you.

[4:05:22] Voice 10: Thank you.

[4:05:23] Voice 10: Trustee Elliott, go ahead.

[4:05:25] Voice 6: Yes, I do recognize that the growth management framework is one that we're moving towards.

[4:05:34] Voice 6: And that feels to me like a whole big project.

[4:05:37] Voice 6: It's going to marry science and social science and community profiles, and I think there's a lot to unpack there.

[4:05:46] Voice 6: I guess what I'm wondering, following on Trustee Patrick's comment about did we miss something in our, you know, as a response to supporting resilient communities is do we need to add a strategic objective that would specifically deal with supporting housing diversity to increase the number of housing or affordable housing options?

[4:06:19] Voice 6: and the islands um and i'm struggling with this because it's we've been told our strategic plan

[4:06:33] Voice 6: is you know it's got to be limited so that we can accomplish what's in it um i just don't want

[4:06:39] Voice 6: work that's underway to not be supported so if you think that that that's captured in the growth

[4:06:52] Voice 6: growth management. Sorry, I've got to skip over to your work plan there because your work program

[4:07:00] Voice 6: there, what was it called again? So yeah, the growth management planning framework. So it's

[4:07:05] Voice 6: all about data. But where do we go with these policy options for multiple forms or diverse

[4:07:13] Voice 6: forms of housing to alleviate the supply that's just not happening for a diverse community?

[4:07:24] Voice 12: If I may, through the chair?

[4:07:26] Voice 10: Yes, go ahead.

[4:07:27] Voice 12: You know, I have the strategic plan open, and I believe, what page is it of your agenda there?

[4:07:32] Voice 12: It's way at the bottom at 560.

[4:07:33] Voice 12: I have a snapshot of it.

[4:07:35] Voice 12: And so when we were talking, when, thank you, Rob, the, you know, the community growth management and community resiliency is a focus area of the strategic plan, within which is, you know, you have explore innovative approaches to supporting diverse housing options and tenures.

[4:07:54] Voice 12: So you have that as a strategic direction, but within that, you have only two key initiatives.

[4:08:00] Voice 12: One is to consider community benefit land trust concept for Islands Trust.

[4:08:04] Voice 12: We've heard that discussed today, but that has no specific target date.

[4:08:08] Voice 12: And then the other one is design a plan to advocate to enhance community access to funding for housing in the trust area.

[4:08:17] Voice 12: So I think to answer your question, Trustee Elliott, we're looking for an amendment or the RPC was recommending an amendment to trust counsel for a new initiative.

[4:08:25] Voice 12: I think that you would say, you know, 2.3.3, whatever that may be.

[4:08:31] Voice 12: So if that's the will of this RPC, more than welcome to make that resolution to trust counsel to add another key initiative.

[4:08:40] Voice 12: And that could, you know, harmonize with your tiny homes and wheels type thing.

[4:08:44] Voice 12: And perhaps

[4:08:45] Voice 6: you wish to

[4:08:45] Voice 12: just want to stew on that.

[4:08:47] Voice 12: We can talk about next meeting or.

[4:08:49] Voice 6: That's helpful. Thanks. Let me, let me think about that.

[4:08:53] Voice 10: Yeah, that's really helpful. But if we go back to the,

[4:08:57] Voice 10: I think that's really helpful.

[4:08:59] Voice 10: If we go back to the strategic action plan action list,

[4:09:05] Voice 10: I just find this bit like, Oh, sorry, trustee Graham, go ahead.

[4:09:10] Voice 13: Yeah. Thank you, chair.

[4:09:11] Voice 13: I want to talk about this idea of community resiliency and,

[4:09:16] Voice 13: the word growth. Why are they tied together? I know that there are municipalities, one is

[4:09:21] Voice 13: what used to be Qualicum, that decided that they weren't going to tolerate any more growth.

[4:09:27] Voice 13: They basically stopped any new subdivisions, any new developments, and they

[4:09:35] Voice 13: essentially put the walls up. And I mean, we're on a finite island with finite resources.

[4:09:40] Voice 13: Why are we even entertaining growth? When I talk about resiliency and a full spectrum of age and work, and I don't want to use the word class, but that's the one we use, a work class, a retired class.

[4:09:54] Voice 13: um so it's not like we want it's it's we want a balance of who's on these islands and i mean i'd

[4:10:03] Voice 13: be quite happy to cap denman's population at around 1500 what i want to see is that when we lose an

[4:10:10] Voice 13: old person like me they're replaced by a young person that has that is a working class and they

[4:10:17] Voice 13: can't do that if if the only property available is a million dollars so i i mean we hear all the

[4:10:24] Voice 13: the time, anytime you talk about density increases on this island, people want to talk about carrying

[4:10:30] Voice 13: capacity and how many more people can we have here. And it just gives people comfort to know

[4:10:38] Voice 13: that if we had a cap, this is it. This island can't take any more people. But we have to address

[4:10:46] Voice 13: the fact that our average age is much higher than the provincial one. We're missing a key

[4:10:53] Voice 13: key demographic element to maintain the success and resiliency of our

[4:10:59] Voice 13: community. So every time I see growth, my cringe,

[4:11:04] Voice 13: I don't want to see growth anymore. I don't want to see growth.

[4:11:06] Voice 13: I want to see something that reflects a better distribution of ages and

[4:11:14] Voice 13: classes on my island.

[4:11:18] Voice 10: Thank you. Justy Patrick.

[4:11:22] Trustee Patrick: Oh yes. I mean, change management,

[4:11:26] Trustee Patrick: growth management, management. I couldn't agree with you more, Trustee Graham. I think that's

[4:11:34] Trustee Patrick: one of our challenges is things change. Demographics change. Conditions change.

[4:11:41] Trustee Patrick: The way people are living are changing because houses got too expensive. So we've got to find

[4:11:46] Trustee Patrick: a word that we can all live with. I mean, this is not about, and it can't be, about

[4:11:55] Trustee Patrick: creating unlimited growth on these islands. However, some of our islands have far more

[4:12:00] Trustee Patrick: development potential existing in the 1971 vintage zoning that was established long before the

[4:12:08] Trustee Patrick: islands dressed was. So that's why I wanted to see some sort of housing toolkit of how do we

[4:12:13] Trustee Patrick: address some of this unbuilt capacity that may or may not be appropriate with what we know today.

[4:12:20] Trustee Patrick: day. So it is complex. And I think we need to find some words that we can live with that. It's

[4:12:25] Trustee Patrick: not about accommodating growth, but it's about recognizing conditions change. We need to be

[4:12:30] Trustee Patrick: proactive. We need to be making sure our communities remain resilient, healthy, and hopefully

[4:12:38] Trustee Patrick: lots of young children, which by the way, trustee Elliot and I saw all over Bowen Island. It was

[4:12:43] Trustee Patrick: very interesting, but they're exploding with families and children. Well, South Springs

[4:12:49] Trustee Patrick: is getting very gray and just

[4:12:55] Voice 10: hear it sorry

[4:13:01] Voice 6: okay i'm gonna send in a motion to rob right now and

[4:13:06] Voice 6: i'll put it in the chat so you can all see it and it's about replacing one of those items in our

[4:13:14] Voice 6: strat plan chat chat chat where are you okay so please don't second it but sheriff do you want

[4:13:26] Voice 6: me to read it out so we can consider it? Or do you want to do other things first? I'm just going

[4:13:39] Voice 6: to read it out. I move that RPC recommend to trust council that strategic plan action 2.3.2

[4:13:45] Voice 6: design a plan to advocate to enhance community access to funding for housing in the trust area.

[4:13:52] Voice 6: Sorry, it should read be replaced with this action. Ensure all official community plans

[4:13:58] Voice 6: under review include supportive policies for diverse types and forms of housing and policy

[4:14:03] Voice 6: options that increase the diversity of housing stock that's probably saying the same thing twice

[4:14:08] Voice 6: but let's debate something like this a concrete action with work that's already underway official

[4:14:17] Voice 6: community plans are under review and we have the toolkit with a lot of supportive policies

[4:14:24] Voice 6: we're saying that those should be used and that we would i mean it's not a new piece of work

[4:14:32] Voice 6: it's just that our PC wants to ensure that official community plans allow for

[4:14:43] Voice 6: those diverse types and forms of housing in order to increase the diversity of

[4:14:48] Voice 6: housing stock.

[4:14:49] Voice 9: Does this

[4:14:50] Voice 6: make sense? I

[4:14:51] Voice 8: sent it to

[4:14:52] Voice 6: Rob but it needs to be

[4:14:56] Voice 6: worked it's kind of a mess thanks.

[4:14:59] Voice 10: So I plan to advocate to announce

[4:15:01] Voice 10: asking you should access to funding i'm not sure what the first one was there some anything

[4:15:24] Voice 10: specific about the first one i.e um should we leave it like does somebody have something in

[4:15:31] Voice 10: mind that's specific to that and should we just add 233 or should we just say please

[4:15:38] Voice 10: you know insert this under

[4:15:40] Voice 10: 2.3 we've

[4:15:42] Voice 6: been told rather strictly oh and this is in the bucket for

[4:15:46] Voice 6: For EC, that's probably what Director Cermak is going to say.

[4:15:49] Voice 6: It's been assigned to EC.

[4:15:51] Voice 6: Oh, interesting.

[4:15:53] Voice 6: Okay.

[4:15:54] Voice 6: What do we do about that?

[4:15:59] Voice 10: I'm sure Director Cermak can advise us.

[4:16:04] Voice 12: Thank you, Chair.

[4:16:05] Voice 12: My advice is this is kind of coming out the blue.

[4:16:10] Voice 12: And, you know, I think this is where a lot of sometimes we stub our toes

[4:16:13] Voice 12: and make mistakes or take pivots that maybe we're not prepared to make.

[4:16:19] Voice 12: I see this as a perhaps a better notice of motion for next meeting to discuss

[4:16:23] Voice 12: give you all time to think about it and come back and staff can also come back

[4:16:27] Voice 12: with some advice if this notice of motion is made I recognize that's slow

[4:16:31] Voice 12: but sometimes slow is good and that way we can also advise which committee how

[4:16:36] Voice 12: this affects the committee structure etc etc so if this is made of a notice of

[4:16:40] Voice 12: motion for next July we can respond better that I think all trustees can do

[4:16:45] Voice 12: so as well as staff but if it goes this way it's kind of off the cuff and my advice will be um i

[4:16:51] Voice 12: don't know how easy he's going to do it i don't know how easy will respond i don't know how trust

[4:16:55] Voice 12: council will respond so it's kind of start going up the chain and i would like time to be able to

[4:16:59] Voice 12: form a better sort of

[4:17:02] Voice 12: chain of events i

[4:17:04] Voice 10: think that's good advice but in terms of timing it

[4:17:06] Voice 10: effectively means that it won't show up at trust council on the strategic plan and capital letters

[4:17:13] Voice 10: until next september is there a way to make it to short-circuit it by changing this language to say

[4:17:21] Voice 10: please consider or you know to ec to consider it and consider recommending it to trust council

[4:17:30] Voice 10: is there a way to kind of nurse it along without making it too specific and therefore

[4:17:36] Voice 10: for, run the risk of it being incorrect in some way.

[4:17:42] Voice 12: No, staff can certainly, you know, if this is the will of the RPC, staff will certainly

[4:17:45] Voice 12: do their best to afford and, you know, to the proper, you know, go to EC, it has to

[4:17:49] Voice 12: get to the executive committee by the end of July or July 18th, I think is when they

[4:17:54] Voice 12: meet or somewhere thereabouts, right after regional planning committee's next meeting.

[4:18:00] Voice 12: So whatever comes out of the next meeting will feed into, you know, executive committee's

[4:18:05] Voice 12: consideration of the agenda but if you wanted to go to the june one then it's just going to go in

[4:18:10] Voice 12: a memo format staff would just say rpc passes resolution well

[4:18:15] Voice 10: i'm really saying instead of

[4:18:18] Voice 10: insure i'm thinking like please consider this as part of the strategic plan and but anyway i'm

[4:18:27] Voice 10: what does anybody else think about this i always i the timeline and the trust is like some you've

[4:18:34] Voice 10: You've gone through the back of a wardrobe into some other parallel universe.

[4:18:38] Voice 10: And sometimes I think I try and think ahead to the to the meeting schedule and see, you know, what the impact is of of not kind of considering those steps and how you could navigate them.

[4:18:53] Voice 10: OK, open the floor. What does anybody else think?

[4:19:00] Voice 10: Trustee

[4:19:00] Trustee Patrick: Patrick, wouldn't it be housing options rather than housing stock?

[4:19:04] Trustee Patrick: back so that's all is

[4:19:22] Voice 10: it housing types in this case it's forms of housing you know i'm just

[4:19:30] Voice 10: asking i'm not yeah options is better for sure um so do you want to go ahead with this as is

[4:19:45] Voice 10: tracy elliott well

[4:19:46] Voice 6: one thing we could do because the action that i'm because the action that i'm

[4:19:52] Voice 6: proposing is in executive committee's bucket we could request executive committee to

[4:20:03] Voice 6: give some feedback on what is that plan to advocate to enhance community access to funding

[4:20:12] Voice 6: because i agree with you director cermak unders you know making a wholesale you know change in

[4:20:19] Voice 6: the train track that is but i suspect this design a plan to advocate to enhance community access to

[4:20:27] Voice 6: funding is like a long-term project that has not been scoped out yet just just a guess um

[4:20:34] Voice 6: and if there's value in that executive committee could come back and say no that's still

[4:20:39] Voice 6: something we really need to do um and no we won't be taking this to trust council to amend

[4:20:46] Voice 6: the strategic plan. What I'm looking for is councils, you know, some support from council

[4:20:53] Voice 6: that they still want to work on this housing options toolkit. This is not, there's nothing

[4:21:03] Voice 6: wrong with this designing a plan to advocate for community access. It's just, it has no project

[4:21:08] Voice 6: budget or charter. I've never seen, you know, any indication of what it's going to be. So could this

[4:21:15] Voice 6: be a request executive committee see how this is going to fit with their work plan if it's not a

[4:21:21] Voice 6: fit this action could then be considered advanced to trust council to in its place so

[4:21:29] Voice 10: i'll go to

[4:21:29] Voice 10: trustee patrick after i said this so are we considering putting in a recent planning committee

[4:21:36] Voice 10: request executive committee to consider recommending to trust council blah blah blah

[4:21:42] Voice 10: and over to you trustee patrick

[4:21:44] Voice 7: yeah

[4:21:46] Trustee Patrick: i think this is when we have these high level phrases

[4:21:49] Trustee Patrick: what is it we really need um part of it is you know we need to be paying attention to housing

[4:21:55] Trustee Patrick: funding of housing what's going on at housing and having that expertise and availability

[4:22:01] Trustee Patrick: locally somehow within our our own ranks my understanding is that the the funding that's

[4:22:09] Trustee Patrick: available for housing anywhere is uh you know becoming harder and harder and harder and harder

[4:22:14] Trustee Patrick: to obtain and that more programs are going to be mimicking more like bc builds where the buildings

[4:22:21] Trustee Patrick: are being designed more to um you know not be for profit but they should be striving to break even

[4:22:29] Trustee Patrick: in their cost of operations so um you know that those are the trends that are that are occurring

[4:22:35] Trustee Patrick: out there and i think you know we by the time we get around to making a project charter and

[4:22:39] Trustee Patrick: deciding to go out there and help you know help communities secure funding the funds are gone

[4:22:44] Trustee Patrick: so i think we need to be find a way to get out ahead of what's going on that's right

[4:22:50] Trustee Patrick: so nope i'm sure stephan has some information on that uh

[4:22:56] Voice 10: go ahead can i just uh say something

[4:22:58] Voice 10: thing uh time check we are at 2 27 i think um the crown application tenure thing is definitely

[4:23:07] Voice 10: deferred but i'm concerned about getting through the rest of this um work so any suggestions

[4:23:15] Voice 10: director sermac do you have any suggestions about how we can do this and could we um how would

[4:23:23] Voice 10: anybody feel about running for an extra half an hour is there anybody who cannot do that

[4:23:33] Voice 10: trust you both vick um

[4:23:34] Voice 4: i can do an extra half hour i can't do a whole bunch more than that

[4:23:38] Voice 4: because i have uh the second of three jobs to go to today okay

[4:23:42] Voice 10: that gives us an hour so we need to

[4:23:46] Voice 10: um and i'll try and bustle things along but we do need to focus and really um try and get through

[4:23:53] Voice 10: as much as we can because i think there are a few key items here okay so are we going to um

[4:24:00] Voice 10: so director cermak do you want to respond to trustee patrick on this please

[4:24:06] Voice 12: sorry i've lost

[4:24:07] Voice 12: the question my apologies um yeah i mean my recommendation at the moment is there's some

[4:24:12] Voice 12: uncertainty what to do with the strategic plan the housing strategic action plan um and based

[4:24:17] Voice 12: Based on timing, we could defer until next meeting.

[4:24:19] Voice 12: But I hear a desire to move quickly to amend the strategic, make recommendations to change the Trust Council strategic plan.

[4:24:27] Voice 12: So I'm at a loss of how to advise you.

[4:24:29] Voice 12: My recommendation is, due to the uncertainty and the ongoing discussion, is to defer to next meeting to continue this discussion.

[4:24:36] Voice 12: Again, I feel like that's the back.

[4:24:38] Voice 12: We're going to Narnia, as you suggested, Chair Blunt.

[4:24:43] Voice 10: Okay. So the reason I often push is I feel like we're going to miss something if we don't. But

[4:24:53] Voice 10: if you think that it's reasonable to discuss it in July and we won't have missed the boat with

[4:24:58] Voice 10: respect to something, whatever the something is, then that's fine by me.

[4:25:03] Voice 12: And if I may, Chair, I would like to emphasize that all the LTCs doing major projects,

[4:25:10] Voice 12: as far as I can tell are doing this very thing and a lot of minor projects as well and they are

[4:25:16] Voice 12: looking at supportive policies by diverse types and forms of housing I don't I think it's the

[4:25:22] Voice 12: the vast bulk of what's going on so in a sense it's a nice to have but it's it's happening because

[4:25:29] Voice 12: that's what trustees want on their local trust areas so I think trying to figure out I'm going

[4:25:35] Voice 12: to call it sausage making you know how we go through all the processes and all that

[4:25:38] Voice 12: the Narnia closet there, is we can figure that process out in July, if you like, to have a good

[4:25:46] Voice 12: conversation. But this really is happening.

[4:25:50] Voice 10: Okay, Trustee Elliott, do you want to

[4:25:55] Voice 10: respond to that?

[4:25:56] Voice 6: Yeah, I think you're right, Director Cermak. It is happening.

[4:26:02] Voice 6: But what I'm looking for is where in our strategic plan is it going to continue to support

[4:26:08] Voice 6: work on um increasing community resiliency it's just there isn't a project other than

[4:26:15] Voice 6: if we skip to your work plan sort of a another data gathering exercise that to me is

[4:26:26] Voice 6: there's going to be no focus on housing if if if so jumping to our work plan that's what i'm

[4:26:32] Voice 6: looking ahead to and i don't know how to solve that right now so and i think the conversation

[4:26:38] Voice 6: Probably run its course. So I'll withdraw the half-baked motion. Maybe let's return to the strategic plan. My sense is there's just, there's no capacity to do anything on the housing strategic plan, which is why this report recommends that these actions go off into different committees or are delayed.

[4:27:02] Voice 6: aid we don't have any money or budget or staff resources for this work so what are we going to do

[4:27:11] Voice 6: um

[4:27:13] Voice 10: so i actually think unless it is going to handicap you in some way director cermak

[4:27:22] Voice 10: and your colleagues that i don't want to vote uh i don't want to go with that motion the third motion

[4:27:32] Voice 10: that your revised their housing strategic action plan is recommended and can we just defer that to

[4:27:39] Voice 10: the next meeting together with the discussion of the and and then we're going to move on later

[4:27:45] Voice 10: after we've done these 8.4.2 etc the housing needs report will deal with your work plan updates and

[4:27:53] Voice 10: that might help us reflect on on this because i find it just a sort of a mixed bag of actions

[4:28:01] Voice 10: and i i start to read it and i get kind of angsty about about the whole thing so um there's nothing

[4:28:09] Voice 10: in particular i want to change but i feel like it's it's kind of hard to just go oh yeah fine

[4:28:15] Voice 10: that that that's fine what does anybody else think about that okay so we're going to park

[4:28:23] Voice 10: number three for the moment we're going to move on to tiny homes on wheels enablement project

[4:28:28] Voice 10: final report and the AVICC presentation and I think we can assume that you've seen those both

[4:28:40] Voice 10: and I'll ask Toby to speak to the AVICC her report her feedback report and then I'll give

[4:28:48] Voice 10: you a brief update on the steering committee activities so go ahead Toby if that's okay with

[4:28:55] Voice 10: Sure,

[4:28:56] Voice 6: thanks. Yep, so we had a great couple of weeks, which is why I think we're all so exhausted after this project just squeaked in under the deadline, or rather, maybe a week past.

[4:29:10] Voice 6: But the final report is excellent. I've heard great feedback from those who've received it. There's a lot of information in there.

[4:29:19] Voice 6: I'm confident enough to put it on the website and thank you to staff that it's already up there

[4:29:23] Voice 6: in the housing affordability project section the key findings and this was what I

[4:29:33] Voice 6: my late item the AVICC report if you go to page oops it's rather large

[4:29:44] Voice 6: so the new construction compliance pathway slide 173 of our agenda and this I just want

[4:29:55] Voice 6: to share it was such a bright aha moment for the RDN building inspection staff they've been

[4:30:00] Voice 6: looking for solutions for so long like what do we do about tiny homes they're on wheels we just

[4:30:06] Voice 6: can't permit them sorry the next page uh new construction that's it um and so this aha moment

[4:30:13] Voice 6: thanks to the islands trust bringing everybody together in the room industry um these two

[4:30:19] Voice 6: manufacturers were able to demonstrate that their mh built manufactured home built tiny homes

[4:30:26] Voice 6: are as close to bc building code as they can get and industry has demonstrated they can innovate

[4:30:34] Voice 6: and are willing to make whatever changes are necessary to get there and so that building

[4:30:41] Voice 6: inspection or permitting professionals can issue a permit for it so this has changed the conversation

[4:30:48] Voice 6: for tiny homes on wheels previously building inspection industry was like nope it's got

[4:30:54] Voice 6: got wheels, can't permit it, it's not a dwelling. And now what we could potentially see is in our

[4:31:00] Voice 6: OCPs, funny homes on wheels with this standard could be categorized as a dwelling and issued

[4:31:08] Voice 6: a building permit. Now this is just the RDN. They're quite excited about sharing this information

[4:31:14] Voice 6: with, you know, other building permitting inspectors across BC. So they'll do their

[4:31:19] Voice 6: your own advocacy on that. What I'd like to request from this group is whether there's an

[4:31:26] Voice 6: interest, well, actually, I think this may be your role, Director Cermak. Rob, could you flip

[4:31:34] Voice 6: to my late submission, just to have that on screen and apologies for everybody who didn't see this.

[4:31:41] Voice 6: So yeah, we made a presentation. Those are the two lovely RDN staff people and Director Vanessa

[4:31:47] Voice 6: If you go to the last page down there, Rob, please, down below next steps.

[4:31:55] Voice 6: And yeah, so this next step, I think, is sort of an easy one for us.

[4:31:59] Voice 6: There's an ongoing process to harmonize construction codes.

[4:32:04] Voice 6: The cycle runs on five years.

[4:32:06] Voice 6: The current five-year plan for 2025 scopes in housing supply.

[4:32:12] Voice 6: And the definition, just right down at the end there, is to support efforts to increase housing supply by considering innovative construction methodologies, dot, dot, dot, includes requirements for tiny homes, building relocation, modular construction.

[4:32:26] Voice 6: construction so because the ministry has been given or sorry the um the code board has been

[4:32:35] Voice 6: has scoped in housing supply and specifically tiny homes they're quite interested in our work here

[4:32:42] Voice 6: and would probably like to see the final report so um just wanted to check in with this group

[4:32:48] Voice 6: and whether our staff agree with forwarding the report to the director of building safety and

[4:32:54] Voice 6: standards. I know that there is a tiny house working group of professionals, one of which is

[4:33:02] Voice 6: I heard from Trustee Patrick Forrest-Bortolo from Salt Spring, who was really helpful for us in

[4:33:09] Voice 6: writing that really dense report that Mairead Boland and I dug into last summer,

[4:33:16] Voice 6: and which kind of kicked off this whole project. So there's a lot of next steps that could be

[4:33:20] Voice 6: taken the tiny house working group has um well you're going to give that verbal report um but

[4:33:27] Voice 6: it was a very positive presentation really well received people were very excited that uh there

[4:33:32] Voice 6: was some progress and that we did our job as the islands trust to convene all the different

[4:33:38] Voice 6: partners in the room to create um or to generate the conversation that created some good outcomes

[4:33:44] Voice 6: So, you know, Robert Kojima was there, and I don't know if you want to add anything to that, but that's it for my report, and sorry it was late. Thanks.

[4:33:59] Voice 10: Yeah, Robert, did you want to add to that? Thanks, Toby.

[4:34:06] Voice 14: Thanks, Chair. No, nothing to add. I thought the technical working group session was a great session.

[4:34:11] Voice 14: It was well facilitated, and like Trustee Elliott said, we were able to narrow focus in on the CSA standard

[4:34:23] Voice 14: that would allow a path for people with tiny homes, or at least people with manufactured tiny homes.

[4:34:32] Voice 10: Thank you.

[4:34:34] Voice 10: Okay, thanks, Toby. That was great.

[4:34:36] Voice 10: Right. So all I have to add really is I'd like to thank, sorry, I'm just trying to find my notes

[4:34:46] Voice 10: here. Yeah. First of all, I would like to thank Director Cermak in particular for his assistance,

[4:34:57] Voice 10: you know, hands-on assistance, organising contracts and this, that and the other and

[4:35:01] Voice 10: advising us and providing the able assistance of Rob Kroger to keep us on track and for

[4:35:12] Voice 10: agreeing that, you know, our steering committee will continue for a number of months at least

[4:35:18] Voice 10: just to keep things going while we sort out next steps and get support from other agencies,

[4:35:26] Voice 10: agencies organizations so again we have the assistance of Robert and Rob Kroger in doing

[4:35:33] Voice 10: that so thank you very much and thank you for putting all the information on the website we

[4:35:42] Voice 10: can share it easily I did write a very short report which I'll send to you afterwards I think

[4:35:47] Voice 10: it's a page and a half but there are two things that you know is really the steering committee

[4:35:53] Voice 10: has met once two weeks ago since the completion of the report and the AVICC, just the AVICC

[4:36:05] Voice 10: presentations work. So there was a lot of discussion about how to promote the information,

[4:36:13] Voice 10: how to spread the information, how to build networks. You know, one of the things actually,

[4:36:19] Voice 10: Actually, Toby, I don't think you mentioned this, was to look into the province's methods that they applied when legalising secondary suites to see if it could be repurposed and applied to existing tiny homes to try and help people become legal.

[4:36:42] Voice 10: So extracting next steps from the report and also kind of brainstorming how to do it was terrific.

[4:36:51] Voice 10: We don't have a lot of resources at the moment until we reach out to the different local governments and ask them.

[4:37:01] Voice 10: so with that in mind there are two things that we would like to do next well there are several but

[4:37:09] Voice 10: two that's that i want to put on the table here one is um planning for the union of bc

[4:37:15] Voice 10: municipalities convention and so that'll take place over the next um six weeks and uh since

[4:37:23] Voice 10: toby is on the executive committee i think she and uh together with others will really hold our

[4:37:30] Voice 10: of each the fire with respect to that so I'm going to park that for the moment unless Toby

[4:37:35] Voice 10: says there's something specific needed for that but it's how to communicate this at that convention

[4:37:42] Voice 10: in September and the one thing that I am going to ask Director Cermak for some help with is

[4:37:54] Voice 10: basically helping to distribute the report

[4:37:57] Voice 10: and maybe one of the things that came from the steering committee

[4:38:03] Voice 10: was the possibility of creating a survey for residents

[4:38:08] Voice 10: and separately perhaps for local governments.

[4:38:11] Voice 10: The residents would be to promote the information

[4:38:15] Voice 10: but also to gather better information about the current situation and, you know, what the appetite is, what the capacity,

[4:38:26] Voice 10: what the ground truthing of the census data that is lacking could be.

[4:38:35] Voice 10: And the second one, which would be possibly a survey for local governments,

[4:38:42] Voice 10: would be to ask them specifically um you know give them the information and then say okay

[4:38:48] Voice 10: can you assign resources do you want to participate in you know keeping this initiative

[4:38:56] Voice 10: going so those are the two that those are the two primary things that i wanted to cover

[4:39:03] Voice 10: and and and i think i'm hoping we can discuss it informally with you director sermac if that's okay

[4:39:14] Voice 10: if we can dip into your communications and staff expertise uh rather than make it a very formal

[4:39:23] Voice 10: thing what do you think i

[4:39:27] Voice 12: suggest we have that conversation um you and i you know chairing

[4:39:30] Voice 12: myself and if you want to pull somebody else into that meeting that's fine um you know

[4:39:35] Voice 12: So generally we try not to assign resources on us to it's to a specific

[4:39:39] Voice 12: project. Um, so if we can sort of keep focused on, you know,

[4:39:43] Voice 12: what this is for,

[4:39:44] Voice 12: what the expected results are and what we're going to do with them,

[4:39:46] Voice 12: I would hate to think that we're just doing ad hoc, um, work without,

[4:39:52] Voice 12: um, you know, sort of support behind us assigning it. So, um,

[4:39:56] Voice 12: we can have that discussion

[4:39:58] Voice 12: further another time.

[4:39:59] Voice 12: I know you're yourself are very keen on tracking how we spend our time into

[4:40:03] Voice 12: where it comes from and what direction. So.

[4:40:06] Voice 9: this is where it comes back to bite me yes

[4:40:11] Voice 9: yeah i know be careful what you wish for there are always those things where you think well

[4:40:16] Voice 9: that's not exactly what i mean or

[4:40:18] Voice 10: i'm but i'm the exception yeah i'll try not to make myself

[4:40:22] Voice 10: too much of an exception and to toe the line i fully agree that we should really um i don't

[4:40:28] Voice 10: want to do something and something that's potentially quite public that isn't really

[4:40:32] Voice 10: really well thought through and that doesn't really deliver um you know a really good outcome

[4:40:41] Voice 10: so i'm with you on that in that we should really think it out very clearly it's not like you can

[4:40:46] Voice 10: just try it out and then go that didn't work it'll have had you know created a public impression so

[4:40:53] Voice 10: it's really important that we do it very carefully and

[4:40:58] Voice 12: if i may just jump in there before trustee

[4:40:59] Voice 12: Elliot, sorry to use your MO. And that is, you know, you have, I'd like to just kind of track

[4:41:06] Voice 12: the resolutions pretty clearly with the RPC and Trust Council. Trust Council supported you taking

[4:41:10] Voice 12: this direction. And this may be just sort of the wrapping up of some of that direction, or at least,

[4:41:16] Voice 12: you know, may be able to be captured in that. I just want to make sure that we're doing

[4:41:19] Voice 12: work that's been properly allocated, but I don't want to be too much of a bean counter either.

[4:41:24] Voice 12: there so

[4:41:24] Voice 10: that's terrific and um i'll be in victoria next week and maybe we can sit down to

[4:41:30] Voice 10: face or you you're not you you may not be there but we'll figure out something anyway thank you

[4:41:34] Voice 10: very much i appreciate that director cermak i just yeah yeah go ahead yeah

[4:41:40] Voice 6: so i think this is why i

[4:41:41] Voice 6: was struggling with the housing strategic plan is because we we have this project that actually did

[4:41:48] Voice 6: something new, and out of it came a potential discussion for policy options for existing

[4:41:57] Voice 6: builds, which we may or may not want to go into. So I think the working group needs to do some more

[4:42:06] Voice 6: work identifying what are the next steps that we want to see taken. I can definitely see a request

[4:42:14] Voice 6: coming forward for support for a survey to identify the people currently living in unsecure,

[4:42:22] Voice 6: non-conforming housing in the Islands Trust as a corollary to the housing needs reports.

[4:42:30] Voice 6: So housing needs reports, which we'll get into, typically they wouldn't gather a lot

[4:42:38] Voice 6: of data, and I don't really trust the data on the number of people living in RVs or non-conforming

[4:42:43] Voice 6: dwellings. And many of our communities have policies about non-enforcement. This is an

[4:42:49] Voice 6: untenable situation. We cannot keep not enforcing on these structures. We need to find a path

[4:42:55] Voice 6: forward to either bring them into a formal permitting process and compliance or allow

[4:43:06] Voice 6: them to be dwellings with certain health and safety standards checked off. So that to me is

[4:43:13] Voice 6: is is a good outcome of both this project and the gaps in the housing needs reports i think we need

[4:43:20] Voice 6: to do more work and perhaps we can bring that back for the july meeting um with a request for

[4:43:25] Voice 6: you know either strike everything from the strategic plan housing strategic plan and this

[4:43:31] Voice 6: is the area we focus on or or what have you but i think there's a number of actions that come from

[4:43:36] Voice 6: both the tiny house project and the gaps in the housing needs reports that we could uh we could

[4:43:42] Voice 6: do some work on so let's work on that for july perhaps yeah

[4:43:46] Voice 10: i think that's a good strategy we

[4:43:48] Voice 10: we seem to have um a whole lot of sort of threads coming together and um if we take a little time

[4:43:56] Voice 10: to kind of digest them uh then we can put something really good into the strategic plan

[4:44:03] Voice 10: um at the moment i read those two and they were probably made sense at the time but they mean

[4:44:09] Voice 10: very little to me at the moment i just think okay but anyway yeah that's terrific and thanks

[4:44:16] Voice 10: director summit for your steer on this i think we've had a good outcome overall you've slowed

[4:44:22] Voice 10: us down to speed us up okay um so uh the housing needs reports so again we are at 249 so uh housing

[4:44:37] Voice 10: needs reports request for decision i will open the floor direct to sermac you need to introduce it

[4:44:46] Voice 10: and then we will discuss it thank

[4:44:49] Voice 12: you chair you have attached to this report

[4:44:54] Voice 12: the housing needs reports for all local chess committees they were commissioned as per trust

[4:45:01] Voice 12: Council's you know approved business case the the requirement is that the legislation changed

[4:45:07] Voice 12: requiring all local governments including local trust areas to have housing needs reports they

[4:45:13] Voice 12: had to have an interim housing report done as of December 31st of last year 2024 we were a bit

[4:45:21] Voice 12: delayed in that and the province said that was okay just there was a bit we had some staffing

[4:45:26] Voice 12: staffing issues, and then we had some consultant issues because everybody was doing housing

[4:45:32] Voice 12: needs reports.

[4:45:33] Voice 12: So it was kind of all at once.

[4:45:35] Voice 12: So once we got them done, or once we got the quote in, we realized we had a little bit

[4:45:40] Voice 12: of extra money from what the government gave as a grant requiring this work to be done.

[4:45:46] Voice 12: And so we requested them to do a questionnaire and some engagement, developed a terms of

[4:45:53] Voice 12: reference with some staff and and ask them to go forth and do that so that the legislation requires

[4:46:00] Voice 12: that the housing needs reports as most of you have already spoken about today or at least a few of

[4:46:04] Voice 12: you have spoken about is uh it's you have to follow legislation's uh process to calculate

[4:46:10] Voice 12: the numbers you're not allowed to deviate from that that's the legislative requirement

[4:46:13] Voice 12: so that was done um the bonus was supposed to be or the extra was supposed to be the engagement

[4:46:21] Voice 12: in the survey and you have that included in there and that's you know that's where we felt a bit

[4:46:26] Voice 12: short the although we got 893 responses I think on the survey which is a great response rate

[4:46:33] Voice 12: you know the questions were perhaps not as targeted as they could have been and it was

[4:46:38] Voice 12: never really designed to be you know policy specific to us to an individual local trust area

[4:46:46] Voice 12: and then the the actual engagement component of it the number of people that were engaged was

[4:46:51] Voice 12: significantly less than we had given contact information for to the consultants and what have

[4:46:56] Voice 12: you. That is all to say that we, you know, we did learn a lot of in, in during the process about

[4:47:01] Voice 12: sort of you know, the surveys and the engagement and how to make better use of it. We have to do

[4:47:07] Voice 12: this exercise again in 2028. So we'll certainly apply the lessons learned how to, how to update

[4:47:14] Voice 12: the housing needs reports in a much more um do when we do it all at once and how to maybe tailor

[4:47:20] Voice 12: make that per um local trust area in a better way certainly i think my the lessons i've learned

[4:47:26] Voice 12: right off the hop is to more actively engage um especially key um you know planners and community

[4:47:33] Voice 12: members and active um who are doing the work and do it more often i think we all got very busy

[4:47:42] Voice 12: and we ran out of time so anyway so the the long and short of it is uh you've got the reports

[4:47:48] Voice 12: um they meet provincial legislation um i have already posted them online in the link

[4:47:55] Voice 12: uh in the same housing affordability spot that the tiny homes and wheels information is and after

[4:48:01] Voice 12: this uh as per the charter the project charter the trust council approved or the business case

[4:48:06] Voice 12: rather that's going to afford a memo to them with a link online so they don't all get this

[4:48:11] Voice 12: for a Genshin report to find that location.

[4:48:15] Voice 12: So in the meantime, because of that awkward scenario

[4:48:17] Voice 12: whereby you're considering LTC's housing needs reports,

[4:48:21] Voice 12: I, of course, sent an email to all the trustees

[4:48:23] Voice 12: informing them that this is available today

[4:48:26] Voice 12: and that they will get a memo from me in the future

[4:48:29] Voice 12: advising them that they may review the work

[4:48:32] Voice 12: at their respective LTCs.

[4:48:36] Voice 12: Thank you, Chair.

[4:48:36] Voice 10: Thank you.

[4:48:37] Voice 10: Thank you, Director Cermak.

[4:48:40] Voice 10: Trustee Patrick, go ahead.

[4:48:43] Voice 10: Oh,

[4:48:43] Trustee Patrick: boy. We met yesterday, our Salt Spring Local Trust Committee, and I had the great pleasure of announcing that in the written part of our report there, it says, if we just build two units over the next 20 years, our rental housing on Salt Spring will be at healthy levels.

[4:48:59] Trustee Patrick: levels, one, that was an error. Oh, no, well, it's actually 15 or 16, 16, 16.09 over 20 years. And so

[4:49:12] Trustee Patrick: whether it's two or 16.09 over 20 years, both those numbers are chronically wrong. So yes,

[4:49:20] Trustee Patrick: Stephan, there's an error underneath the table on the salt spring. It was cut and copied from

[4:49:24] Trustee Patrick: another island. One of the problems when they do multiple reports. And then the growth number

[4:49:33] Trustee Patrick: is 1,900 units of more single-family homes over the next 20 years, and we can meet our

[4:49:40] Trustee Patrick: growth scenario there. David, isn't that good to know? Build, baby, build. So, the data's

[4:49:46] Trustee Patrick: not good um it matches the uh the free heart uh model that is available um on bc housing's

[4:49:56] Trustee Patrick: website which i ran last september so um the how i understand bc housing is that

[4:50:05] Trustee Patrick: the their their methodology is a starting point um many communities augmented and customized the data

[4:50:14] Trustee Patrick: to get to more correct numbers.

[4:50:18] Trustee Patrick: And so there's two things.

[4:50:20] Trustee Patrick: One, we have data that just doesn't match at all

[4:50:23] Trustee Patrick: our intentions on our islands.

[4:50:26] Trustee Patrick: And two, I mean, the Islands Trust Act,

[4:50:29] Trustee Patrick: we have that section, what is it?

[4:50:31] Trustee Patrick: Eight, two, E or F.

[4:50:33] Trustee Patrick: We can tell lieutenant governor and council

[4:50:37] Trustee Patrick: when we need something different.

[4:50:40] Trustee Patrick: They can tell us what to do,

[4:50:42] Trustee Patrick: But we have that one little clause in our act that we get to tell them what to do.

[4:50:46] Trustee Patrick: And if this methodology is so wrong and doesn't work for the Islands Trust, we should consider either creating a methodology that does work for the Islands Trust so that we can predict the housing that we do need more appropriately, or we ask to work with the province to create a model that would work with us.

[4:51:05] Trustee Patrick: But I don't know what to do because basically we have nothing that will help us on Salt. This just doesn't even begin to help us on Salt Spring, what we've got now. And I'm sure it's similar on other islands. I totaled them up 33 units in the next 20 years over the entire trust area, I guess, minus Bowen. And we're at healthy rental levels. I just know that's not true.

[4:51:35] Trustee Patrick: I guess thoughts from staff, how can we communicate with the province if this methodology is so bad?

[4:51:41] Trustee Patrick: Should we find a way to communicate with the province on finding a methodology that works for the islands?

[4:51:51] Voice 10: I suppose just before I go to Trustee Graham, my question would be, has it worked well anywhere?

[4:52:00] Voice 10: Like, is it a question of the size of the sample, the different profile on the islands?

[4:52:06] Voice 10: but anyway trustee graham go ahead yeah

[4:52:10] Voice 13: thank you thank you um ex officio patrick um i guess i

[4:52:17] Voice 13: wasn't surprised i think uh when the consultant spoke to us he alluded to the fact that the

[4:52:23] Voice 13: methodology was being um was a provincial method that we probably wouldn't be too impressed with

[4:52:30] Voice 13: the results um thank goodness we are exempt from adopting the results there it's a complete

[4:52:37] Voice 13: think they used an AI program to derive this report. It just doesn't feel human to me. It

[4:52:44] Voice 13: feels very mechanical and the numbers don't make sense. And it's so sad that we spend taxpayer

[4:52:51] Voice 13: dollars in an exercise that provides absolutely no benefit to us. We should be exempt. I think

[4:52:58] Voice 13: that would be a way if the executive or the new chair wants to have a chat with the minister,

[4:53:03] Voice 13: Minister, you know, just leave us alone. Give us the money. We'll do with it what we want.

[4:53:08] Voice 13: I mean, our community group on Demo is more than happy to share the hard work that they've done,

[4:53:13] Voice 13: the numbers that they have, which are fantastic. They never even talked to them, which was very sad.

[4:53:18] Voice 13: Anyway, I don't think there's, I don't want to belabor my comments on here.

[4:53:24] Voice 13: Demo and I, our local trust committee, in my perspective, won't be using any of this data,

[4:53:27] Voice 13: and we'll just wait for the province to dictate another one in 2028.

[4:53:35] Voice 10: Thank you, Dr. Graham. I'll just put my own hand up for a moment.

[4:53:40] Voice 10: Yeah, I looked at the Saturna data and it is completely mystifying.

[4:53:44] Voice 10: You know, I look at it and it just intuitively doesn't make sense.

[4:53:50] Voice 10: And one that particularly didn't make sense, and it's probably a function of, you know, the size of the sample or something.

[4:53:59] Voice 10: thing but they talk about extreme core housing need renters and in 2016 it was 22.2 percent

[4:54:10] Voice 10: um i'd have to go back and read like 2022.2 percent of what i don't know by 2021 that was zero

[4:54:20] Voice 10: and i i look at it and i think and then i'd have to go back like were there four people in extreme

[4:54:27] Voice 10: in rent and one of them was an extreme and now he isn't i don't know but i i just can't see how we

[4:54:35] Voice 10: can use this i went through it and i thought i couldn't find i accept that it's done based on

[4:54:44] Voice 10: census data and population predictions but um it just doesn't generate something that's useful

[4:54:53] Voice 10: The other thing I wanted to ask was, so they compare it with BC as a whole all the time, and I just wonder if you actually take the Islands Trust out of the data before you compare it with the rest of BC, or is it the Islands Trust versus the whole of BC including the Islands Trust?

[4:55:14] Voice 10: because that probably skews the data a bit

[4:55:18] Voice 10: or flattens the variation.

[4:55:24] Voice 10: I had some other specific questions.

[4:55:28] Voice 10: Let me see.

[4:55:32] Voice 10: I found that the,

[4:55:34] Voice 10: do you think that the population projections make sense

[4:55:37] Voice 10: because they're based on, you know,

[4:55:40] Voice 10: BC, which has huge conurbations.

[4:55:43] Voice 10: And I don't think that the population projections for the trust could be the same.

[4:55:48] Voice 10: They must be different. And if you look back over what's happened, it can be quite flat.

[4:55:59] Voice 10: Between 2016 and 2021, there seemed to have been a bit of an uptick.

[4:56:06] Voice 10: and i think that that was down to partially covet and partially i think better internet

[4:56:13] Voice 10: connections across the islands but i think there's no there's there's no granularity in the data that

[4:56:20] Voice 10: we can use um uh what else i actually think we should take the hundred thousand the next time

[4:56:30] Voice 10: and just decide what we're going to do with it i know my key question was can we reject this report

[4:56:35] Voice 10: court like formally actually say this is of no value to us thank you very much thank you

[4:56:42] Voice 10: go ahead trustee elliot you

[4:56:48] Voice 6: had a valid question in there and i'm wondering what the answer might

[4:56:52] Voice 6: be because i don't want to forward this to say okay because here's the flip side people who say

[4:57:02] Voice 6: that we do not have a housing problem in our communities may use this report to say,

[4:57:10] Voice 6: look, there's hardly anybody in core housing need. And that's just wrong. And I will tell you why.

[4:57:18] Voice 6: And this has me so fired up. I've stayed up late at night. I can have well-to-do people in my

[4:57:25] Voice 6: community write in all the time about the need to prioritize the environment. Can I get a single

[4:57:31] Voice 6: person who's living in a trailer, not hooked up to emergency services, hoarding in water,

[4:57:39] Voice 6: who's living and doing a trade or they work as a paramedic or a nurse or a carpenter,

[4:57:45] Voice 6: and there are many of them, they can't write in to say, we need housing options because

[4:57:51] Voice 6: they might become a target for bylaw enforcement.

[4:57:55] Voice 6: We can't have a public conversation with the vulnerable people in our community of which

[4:58:00] Voice 6: there, far more than these reports indicate, because they are vulnerable. And putting this

[4:58:06] Voice 6: kind of report out there just is going to further drive them into hiding. So I do not support if we,

[4:58:17] Voice 6: I know we have to legislatively put this report out there, but it should go with a coda that says

[4:58:22] Voice 6: none of this has been ground-truthed, and the data does not indicate the story on the ground,

[4:58:28] Voice 6: because it does not i

[4:58:35] Voice 10: am okay uh director cermak would you like to respond to that can we

[4:58:42] Voice 12: this

[4:58:43] Voice 10: report um

[4:58:45] Voice 12: you can reject the findings and disagree with them for sure

[4:58:49] Voice 12: and i'm hearing you know broad statements to that effect i don't think you can reject the

[4:58:55] Voice 12: fact that submitted based on the model and it produced the results that it did

[4:58:59] Voice 12: that makes sense like it is what it is but i do fully think that um you know that you know just

[4:59:06] Voice 12: for example i don't want you to make the resolution yet you know the and this is why i made this uh

[4:59:11] Voice 12: an rfd and not a memo is for you to actually infuse your your assessment of it otherwise i

[4:59:18] Voice 12: would have just said i'm forwarding it um the rpc request staff to forward the the these report

[4:59:24] Voice 12: board with the following comments and and say what you think of it and tell the LTC what you

[4:59:30] Voice 12: think of it and I'm hearing broad things about you know it's it's we know that it's produced on

[4:59:36] Voice 12: stats and even in the report itself it says the statistics during this era there if you recall

[4:59:44] Voice 12: the statistics were skewed by the province doing funny business pulling long forms inserting long

[4:59:50] Voice 12: long forms, or I don't remember quite the story. And then COVID really skewed the data further.

[4:59:55] Voice 12: So they acknowledged that the next housing needs report will be much

[5:00:00] Voice 12: closer to the next census data and should be a little bit more accurate so that they know we're

[5:00:04] Voice 12: in this anomaly and so this part partially reflects that but then secondly of course

[5:00:10] Voice 12: it's based on stats and so much reality on the islands I'll call it a black housing market and

[5:00:17] Voice 12: I hope people don't quote me on that but so much of the housing is under the radar and those people

[5:00:24] Voice 12: never get captured and a lot of the resolutions that LTCs have made have I wouldn't say encouraged

[5:00:29] Voice 12: that but um have i've seen just in my time on salt spring it's a really mushroom such that you see

[5:00:35] Voice 12: lack no enforcement so therefore people feeling more permissive to increase so kind of daylighting

[5:00:40] Voice 12: an issue that was already there um so it's gonna be really hard for stats to ever capture that

[5:00:46] Voice 12: information so you need ground truthing to some effect so if you want to pass a resolution that

[5:00:51] Voice 12: says you know afford the um forward the report to ltcs uh with the following statements you know

[5:00:58] Voice 12: that um you know whatever whatever statement you want to make i don't want to put words in your

[5:01:03] Voice 12: mouth but you can certainly sort of reject the findings in that matter and

[5:01:08] Voice 10: thank you trustee

[5:01:10] Voice 10: berthwick yeah

[5:01:12] Voice 4: um i mean i think similar to uh trustee graham i was not surprised uh by the the

[5:01:19] Voice 4: sort of findings and i yeah you're

[5:01:21] Voice 10: a little quiet trustee berthwick you've caught whatever it is

[5:01:26] Voice 10: sorry

[5:01:26] Voice 4: hang on one second i'll uh give me one second i'll uh change things around here

[5:01:30] Voice 4: I was hoping this would be better.

[5:01:37] Voice 8: Good.

[5:01:38] Voice 8: That's better.

[5:01:39] Voice 8: Yeah.

[5:01:39] Voice 8: Okay.

[5:01:39] Voice 8: Wonderful.

[5:01:40] Voice 8: Thank you.

[5:01:42] Voice 4: Yeah, I think, like, Trustee Graham, I was not terribly surprised by the findings or

[5:01:47] Voice 4: the sort of quality of this.

[5:01:49] Voice 4: And I think, Ben, I think, you know, Director Sir Mike was kind of speaking to that, too.

[5:01:53] Voice 4: This was not unexpected.

[5:01:56] Voice 4: And, you know, future ones will hopefully be much better.

[5:01:59] Voice 4: But I really feel Trustee Elliott's concern in terms of, you know, how this may be weaponized

[5:02:06] Voice 4: uh and and yeah and as you're talking about tractor cermak like there's there is a whole

[5:02:13] Voice 4: you know subsection of population who who will never report you know accurately and we you know

[5:02:18] Voice 4: we are going to be a place that is particularly prone to that um for lots of reasons um you know

[5:02:24] Voice 4: i don't think it's just down to any one thing but um yeah i mean i i certainly and obviously

[5:02:31] Voice 4: Obviously, we have the benefit of having 50% of the executive here, but I would definitely

[5:02:36] Voice 4: support a resolution that, you know, we have to, to some degree, accept these reports such

[5:02:43] Voice 4: as they are, and, you know, we are compelled to do that by the province.

[5:02:48] Voice 4: I would strongly support us putting out some sort of statement saying that these reports

[5:02:55] Voice 4: courts do not reflect uh the um perspective of of certainly this body but i would i would

[5:03:04] Voice 4: i would want to forward that to the executive to to make that statement um because i think that

[5:03:11] Voice 4: comes with a little bit more force and comes a little more broadly

[5:03:13] Manager of Bylaw Compliance and Enforcement: it also brings

[5:03:14] Voice 4: in a wider

[5:03:15] Voice 4: spectrum of trustees potentially but um yeah i mean i feel like we're a little bit we're stuck

[5:03:21] Voice 4: in that we must accept them and so i you know there's no there's only so much we can do about

[5:03:25] Voice 4: that but i do think it would be valuable for us to to put a statement out to you know talk about

[5:03:31] Voice 4: what we see as the value or lack thereof of the of the findings thank

[5:03:39] Voice 10: you um i'll just throw this in

[5:03:41] Voice 10: and then i'll move quickly to trustee patrick um should we consider a news release as a means to

[5:03:47] Voice 10: put it out and make a statement rather than just forward it to every ltc and then leave it at that

[5:03:55] Voice 10: but okay trustee Patrick oh

[5:04:00] Trustee Patrick: I'd like to go further sorry I know I'm the chair

[5:04:02] Trustee Patrick: now but you know we've received a message from our minister that says we

[5:04:07] Trustee Patrick: have been given the tools that we need to do the job so I think this is a

[5:04:13] Trustee Patrick: perfect example to respond where perhaps we have not and here's an example of

[5:04:18] Trustee Patrick: where it is not you know so I'm I'm I'm fired up like all of you it's so far

[5:04:25] Trustee Patrick: off the mark. I don't think it's just what we tell local trust committees to take this with

[5:04:31] Trustee Patrick: a deep grain of salt. It's how do we respond to the province? How is this report handed? You know,

[5:04:38] Trustee Patrick: it's a legislative obligation that we handed into the province. You know, how, what we say

[5:04:46] Trustee Patrick: and who says it, I agree, Trustee Borthwick, it should be higher up the executive committee or

[5:04:52] Trustee Patrick: or even Trust Council that goes on the record of saying, you know, the tool you provided us

[5:04:58] Trustee Patrick: is useless. Or is it do you want us to build 1900 more single family homes? You know, they might

[5:05:06] Trustee Patrick: because they get all the, you know, transfer tax for building them all. But, you know, let's hope

[5:05:12] Trustee Patrick: that's not what the province intended by this tool in the islands, but they need to know this tool

[5:05:17] Trustee Patrick: doesn't work yeah

[5:05:20] Voice 10: i think the fact that we're excluded from complying with any of the outcomes

[5:05:24] Voice 10: is telling in itself um and i think that's a great idea trustee patrick i i would go with a full rest

[5:05:33] Voice 10: press release a news release you know a normal islands trust news release but also um a letter

[5:05:42] Voice 10: to the ministry that directed us to do this and it would be helpful if we could all pull out

[5:05:50] Voice 10: some of the stats that make no sense as examples and I'm sure we can all do that and I also think

[5:05:58] Voice 10: it would be helpful if we got any sense like do our other places completely content with it do

[5:06:06] Voice 10: Do they think like, oh, this is terrific, I can really use this,

[5:06:10] Voice 10: or are they all actually questioning the validity of it?

[5:06:13] Voice 10: Trustee Elliott, and then I'll come to you, Director Cermak.

[5:06:17] Voice 10: Go ahead.

[5:06:17] Voice 6: Sorry, just very briefly, we had a report.

[5:06:19] Voice 6: The RDN got an interim report similar to this about three or four months ago,

[5:06:25] Voice 6: and Director Craig said it was just ridiculous and in no way useful

[5:06:34] Voice 6: useful and did not count the actual housing need. So it is just a pro forma. We've got to

[5:06:40] Voice 6: get this done legislatively, but I do think we should issue a statement that in no way this

[5:06:47] Voice 6: constitutes actual data on the ground experiences in the Gulf Islands.

[5:06:52] Voice 6: Okay. Director Cermak?

[5:06:58] Voice 12: I'm going to be personal. Love it. So I think that is the direction for

[5:07:03] Voice 12: for RPC to request executive committee to do

[5:07:05] Voice 12: in terms of creating news releases

[5:07:07] Voice 12: and that sort of positional statement.

[5:07:10] Voice 12: So if you want to make a resolution as such

[5:07:13] Voice 12: that you forward the report to the executive committee

[5:07:17] Voice 12: and ask them to take the following actions,

[5:07:20] Voice 12: such as making a news release

[5:07:24] Voice 12: and or communicating with the minister, X, Y, Z.

[5:07:29] Voice 12: So I just think that's,

[5:07:30] Voice 12: you push that to the EC to make that decision.

[5:07:32] Voice 12: I think that that's the body that makes those type of decisions.

[5:07:35] Voice 12: Meanwhile, I can push it the other way to the LTC, if you wish, again, with a covering statement on behalf of RPC saying that, you know, this report's come through RPC, RPC's seen it.

[5:07:49] Voice 12: It's of poor quality.

[5:07:51] Voice 12: It's been referred to the EC.

[5:07:52] Voice 12: In the meantime, here it is for you.

[5:07:54] Voice 12: Or maybe not.

[5:07:56] Voice 12: Actually, I take that back.

[5:07:57] Voice 12: maybe you don't like the recommendation there and you just send it to EC first for them to

[5:08:02] Voice 12: make that decision I

[5:08:04] Voice 10: think it should go to EC first personally and I think it's not even about

[5:08:09] Voice 10: the quality it's more about the in the fundamentals of the methodology as much as anything else but

[5:08:17] Voice 10: anyway okay so we need a motion and I'm going to nominate trustee Patrick to make the motion

[5:08:24] Voice 10: uh to forward it to executive committee and to come up with a response trustee bothwick you want

[5:08:32] Voice 10: to say something well

[5:08:34] Voice 4: i just don't know maybe trustee patrick might be about to open their

[5:08:37] Voice 4: mouth to say this but i don't know that they can make that motion on our behalf as ex officio so

[5:08:42] Voice 4: oh

[5:08:43] Voice 10: okay yeah good job we kept you around

[5:08:48] Voice 10: to keep me on my toes thank you okay so i will make i'm

[5:08:56] Voice 4: happy to sort of start

[5:08:58] Voice 10: did

[5:08:58] Voice 4: have a quick question that perhaps um that perhaps our chair can can answer or or

[5:09:05] Voice 4: or trustee elliott um so i mean i'm starting out basically we'll forward it to um to ec um

[5:09:16] Voice 4: Um, uh, can we, is it, is it inappropriate for us to request that you, uh, prepare a

[5:09:25] Voice 4: public statement?

[5:09:26] Voice 4: Uh, I don't think we should be leading in, in what we, I don't think we can demand you

[5:09:32] Voice 4: say a certain thing.

[5:09:33] Voice 4: That's my understanding of what's, and it doesn't seem quite proper, but, um, uh, you

[5:09:41] Voice 4: know, I would love to say, um, you know, RPC request staff to forward the housing needs

[5:09:47] Voice 4: reports uh to the executive committee and request that they release a public statement disavowing it

[5:09:55] Voice 4: on the strongest possible terms but i don't feel like that's very cricket um so yeah if i can maybe

[5:10:05] Voice 4: get some guidance on what's better decorum thirsty

[5:10:12] Voice 10: perfect go ahead yeah

[5:10:15] Trustee Patrick: my suggestion is i think use

[5:10:17] Trustee Patrick: some of the words that uh that will resonate and that is that it's a tool that uh is that you know

[5:10:22] Trustee Patrick: we found inappropriate um and resulted in data that that may do more harm than good or you know

[5:10:31] Trustee Patrick: something of that nature but i'd use the word tool um so that that kind of directs the executive

[5:10:35] Trustee Patrick: committee to think how they could use that to provide that response in a meaningful way

[5:10:41] Trustee Patrick: so

[5:10:42] Voice 10: may have negative consequences and the results the results don't represent our islands

[5:10:51] Voice 10: and could have negative consequences something like that we believe i'll

[5:11:00] Voice 4: just uh friend

[5:11:01] Voice 4: beg something out here give me a second

[5:11:03] Voice 10: okay well why don't we move

[5:11:05] Voice 4: someone else can get a go-to

[5:11:08] Voice 10: sure okay fair enough i'm looking at the time so um and i don't want to do that oh rush rush rush

[5:11:18] Voice 10: here quick make a couple of decisions okay chat among yourselves i do um i i did i did wonder

[5:11:57] Voice 10: whether uh like who came up with the methodology and of course they were limited by using data that

[5:12:05] Voice 10: that existed the census data so it's really some of it is a reflection on the fact that the census

[5:12:13] Voice 10: data doesn't gather the information they need to do this kind of work perhaps i did note in looking

[5:12:28] Voice 10: at the census data that they said that in for instance the one i took issue with i just dug

[5:12:34] Voice 10: into was the structures what type of structures a structural type or something for the housing

[5:12:41] Voice 10: or dwellings and they said they used to have people go around and actually check so you know

[5:12:49] Voice 10: when the census people go around and will you be at home etc prior to delivering the forms

[5:12:55] Voice 10: and that they used to actually do some sort of categorization go ahead trustee brothwick

[5:13:01] Voice 10: yeah

[5:13:02] Voice 4: all right so we'll see if this this works a little less spicy

[5:13:07] Voice 4: I move that the Regional Planning Committee request staff to forward the housing needs reports to the Executive Committee, but also wish to express our profound dissatisfaction with the results of this tool and concerns about the potential harms of its findings.

[5:13:30] Voice 4: I don't know.

[5:13:37] Voice 8: So anybody

[5:13:38] Voice 10: want to change this in any way before it gets seconded?

[5:13:44] Voice 10: Go ahead, Trustee Elliott.

[5:13:47] Voice 6: Yeah, I don't know if expressing words like disappointment or dissatisfaction,

[5:13:52] Voice 6: it's maybe that we request Executive Committee prepare public communications

[5:13:57] Voice 6: on the insufficiency of the housing needs reports.

[5:14:02] Voice 6: courts and my wording was more that the ungrounded data results do not accurately

[5:14:08] Voice 6: reflect or represent the true housing needs in our communities um like it's ungrounded and that

[5:14:16] Voice 6: was the word like not ground truth yeah but it could just be that the data results do not so

[5:14:25] Voice 6: a couple of different options up there yeah 20 after i have to go very soon

[5:14:31] Voice 6: this is terrible

[5:14:32] Voice 6: terrible and we need to get to the work plan yeah yeah

[5:14:36] Voice 6: so

[5:14:39] Voice 10: um well why don't we leave the

[5:14:44] Voice 10: communications thing out though because i'm assuming that you will be there and you will

[5:14:49] Voice 10: know that that will be required how about i prepare communications to that effect and not

[5:14:55] Voice 10: actually flesh out the last sentence you know what i mean that request executive committee

[5:15:04] Voice 10: we should prepare communications.

[5:15:06] Voice 10: I

[5:15:07] Voice 6: don't know about the profound dissatisfaction.

[5:15:09] Voice 6: That's like, it's that the reports are insufficient,

[5:15:13] Voice 6: that they don't match our community's experience.

[5:15:21] Trustee Patrick: And express our...

[5:15:24] Trustee Patrick: Yeah, nor assist our land use planning needs or something.

[5:15:31] Voice 6: God.

[5:15:33] Voice 6: Winking motions at this hour sucks.

[5:15:36] Voice 10: yeah sorry i'm i'm completely my eyes are gone i can't even read it now

[5:15:46] Voice 10: i

[5:15:46] Voice 4: mean and yeah i mean i i wonder because i think partly what i'm i'm trying to convey is that the

[5:15:52] Voice 4: the opinion of this body um so i'm profound is obviously a a modifying tone so that totally

[5:15:59] Voice 4: could be struck i think without but i think we are dissatisfied with the result of this tool

[5:16:04] Voice 4: We

[5:16:05] Voice 10: also wish to convey our unease. Would that be a good word? There's a word for it. Our lack of confidence in the data and its ability and its usefulness and belief that it could cause harm.

[5:16:30] Voice 4: Sure. And then I said, yeah, and I think probably strike everything that I've got there. I think that is, yeah, yeah. Does that, is that better?

[5:16:43] Voice 4: Okay.

[5:16:44] Voice 4: Sounds good.

[5:16:46] Voice 4: And I, my

[5:16:47] Voice 4: feeling would be that we wouldn't request EC to make a publication, like as a motion, but I mean, I certainly hope you guys will add, but I don't think we need to make that as a, I don't think that's appropriate in resolution, per se.

[5:16:59] Voice 4: day.

[5:17:00] Voice 10: Okay. Sam, would you like to move this then? I will.

[5:17:05] Voice 4: Yeah, I can read it out if that's

[5:17:07] Voice 4: preferable. I move that the Regional Planning Committee request staff to forward the housing

[5:17:12] Voice 4: needs reports to the Executive Committee, but also wish to convey our lack of confidence in

[5:17:18] Voice 4: the data, its usefulness, and believe that it could cause harm. So I'm going to strike that

[5:17:24] Voice 4: that and between data and its,

[5:17:27] Voice 4: because I think this is a list.

[5:17:29] Voice 4: So there's a comma there.

[5:17:31] Voice 4: There we go.

[5:17:32] Voice 10: Okay.

[5:17:35] Voice 10: Is it, should that be believed that,

[5:17:37] Voice 10: should that be belief that it could convey our belief?

[5:17:41] Voice 10: It could believe-

[5:17:42] Voice 8: Yes, correct, yes.

[5:17:44] Voice 8: Okay. Thank you.

[5:17:45] Voice 8: Oh

[5:17:46] Voice 10: no, yeah, great.

[5:17:48] Voice 10: Okay, anybody want to discuss this or second it?

[5:17:52] Voice 10: Second.

[5:17:59] Voice 10: Okay, thanks trustee Elliot, so that's seconded.

[5:18:01] Voice 10: um okay let's have a vote all is in favor raise your hands hey lower your hand anybody who is

[5:18:19] Voice 10: a not in favor raise your hands okay that carries thank you okie dokes right um so

[5:18:31] Voice 10: if we have to think about ending in seven minutes uh trustee cermak what do you think

[5:18:41] Voice 10: you would absolutely like to cover off in this what what have what's the absolute must do in

[5:18:48] Voice 10: the next seven minutes to help you with your work thank

[5:18:52] Voice 12: you chair uh the annual report will be

[5:18:54] Voice 12: critical uh to uh not put a cog in that and at least a cursory uh glance at the future projects

[5:19:01] Voice 12: or the uh the work program i'd like to at least tell you what i've done

[5:19:04] Voice 10: okay fair enough um the

[5:19:07] Voice 10: The annual report, my only comment, and I'll just put it in there quickly, is to swap the two items that are the big ticket items.

[5:19:17] Voice 10: So move the funding request below the achievements.

[5:19:22] Voice 10: It just seems like we just immediately went to the funding.

[5:19:26] Voice 10: And actually, after that, there's a kind of a description of some achievements.

[5:19:30] Voice 10: So would that make sense?

[5:19:34] Voice 10: Anybody else want to comment on that?

[5:19:37] Voice 10: that

[5:19:41] Voice 8: seems fine other

[5:19:43] Voice 10: than that i'm good anybody else got some thoughts okay ducks and so we uh

[5:20:00] Voice 10: so we have a um request for decision i'll take the action of moving that motion

[5:20:08] Voice 10: um okay um i think i can do that yeah that the regional planning so i moved the regional planning

[5:20:14] Voice 10: and committee approves the attached text for inclusion in the 2024-25 annual report for

[5:20:22] Voice 10: approval by trust council and submission to the minister of housing and municipal affairs

[5:20:27] Voice 10: i would say the sorry the attached text um as amended would that be correct

[5:20:35] Voice 10: trustee sermac as i suggested or do

[5:20:38] Voice 12: i need no that would be fine i would uh i know what you

[5:20:41] Voice 10: I'm

[5:20:41] Voice 12: not

[5:20:43] Voice 10: changing the text

[5:20:44] Voice 10: I'm just changing the order

[5:20:46] Voice 10: Okay, Tristie Borthwick

[5:20:49] Voice 10: Okay, seconded

[5:20:51] Voice 10: Right

[5:20:52] Voice 10: Let's vote on that

[5:20:54] Voice 10: All those in favour, raise your hands

[5:20:58] Voice 10: I can't find my own

[5:21:01] Voice 10: There

[5:21:04] Voice 10: And blow your hands please

[5:21:09] Voice 10: Okay

[5:21:09] Voice 10: Anybody not in favour, raise your hand

[5:21:13] Voice 10: Okay, that carries

[5:21:18] Voice 10: Great, okay

[5:21:19] Voice 10: Okay, onwards. So the work plan updates. Go ahead, Director Cermak.

[5:21:26] Voice 12: Thank you. Just so you know, the active projects list that came just before this item 11 and the

[5:21:33] Voice 12: future projects list, I've amended.

[5:21:36] Voice 12: That's okay. This is all relevant. So I'm just going to put

[5:21:38] Voice 12: them all together. You'll see that I've changed the active projects list to reflect what I've

[5:21:44] Voice 12: I've talked about in the work program update.

[5:21:45] Voice 12: So I just wanted you to see that,

[5:21:47] Voice 12: that I changed your active projects report one, two, and three

[5:21:50] Voice 12: to mirror what Trust Council's strategic plan has assigned to you.

[5:21:56] Voice 12: So they've already said what your priorities are,

[5:21:58] Voice 12: so I've made that match.

[5:22:00] Voice 12: But I just wanted to make sure that you see those changes.

[5:22:04] Voice 12: And I've also taken the opportunity to clean it up

[5:22:07] Voice 12: because I was kind of hanging on to my LTC tendencies.

[5:22:11] Voice 12: dependencies, and that was to sort of record actions that were taking place. And so now I see

[5:22:17] Voice 12: a little more consistency with the actual key actions that are happening. So hopefully that's

[5:22:23] Voice 12: cleaner, easier, and more consistent for you to understand. So that's in terms of the active

[5:22:27] Voice 12: projects. In the future projects, again, I've extracted those items from the strategic plan

[5:22:33] Voice 12: that Trust Council endorsed, and I've assigned a name to them. If you look at all the history

[5:22:39] Voice 12: since i've been with you as director i didn't have any names assigned to it too much chagrin

[5:22:42] Voice 12: of other directors and so now i have finally harmonized we are all one so you can see all

[5:22:48] Voice 12: those things so this active project list and the future projects list should match with the work

[5:22:54] Voice 12: program and i have to work hold on suddenly my trusty button's not working there so i have

[5:23:02] Voice 12: attached on page 555 of your agenda package a work program it explains to you i made those

[5:23:08] Voice 12: those changes, explains how they came about through the strategic plan adopted by Trust

[5:23:12] Voice 12: Council, and thereby making recommendations to you.

[5:23:16] Voice 12: And those are, one, to recommend to Trust Council via the EC that your top three priorities

[5:23:23] Voice 12: are improved by-law enforcement policies and procedures as you are doing, update and

[5:23:31] Voice 12: implement the freshwater sustainability strategy.

[5:23:33] Voice 12: Those two remain consistent.

[5:23:34] Voice 12: And the third one is monitor progress and protection of ecosystem health and all land

[5:23:38] Voice 12: use planning decisions if you remember way back earlier today we met Patricia and the work she's

[5:23:43] Voice 12: doing so having those be your top three priorities we did talk about the fact that housing is not on

[5:23:50] Voice 12: here you know the housing strategic action plan that's something that has fallen off

[5:23:54] Voice 12: mainly because of the way the strategic plan was drafted however you have already heard from Robert

[5:23:59] Voice 12: Kojima and other staff that we'll continue work on that this term as discussed earlier today I don't

[5:24:06] Voice 12: really have time to open that up too much more, but I'll leave it at that. Recommendations number

[5:24:11] Voice 12: two and three are to sort of, one is that the RPC requests staff to report back on policies held by

[5:24:19] Voice 12: under my name, my title, pardon me. And the other one is to request staff to draft business cases

[5:24:25] Voice 12: as listed there, map eelgrass and kelp forests. And I have to emphasize with that, if we don't

[5:24:30] Voice 12: do it now, we've lost the value of the previous mapping. There's only so long that the previous

[5:24:34] Voice 12: mapping sort of is valid. We kind of got like a less than a five-year window before we have to

[5:24:38] Voice 12: start from scratch. And then the other one is, as we talked about growth management and independent

[5:24:44] Voice 12: review of the freshwater sustainability strategy. That's a very fast review and almost uncomfortable

[5:24:49] Voice 12: going that fast. The last thing I have to tell you is if for those who didn't attend trust programs

[5:24:54] Voice 12: committee, they had a different interpretation of the trust council strategic plan and what it means

[5:25:00] Voice 12: to initiate something next fiscal.

[5:25:03] Voice 12: And they said, in their opinion,

[5:25:06] Voice 12: that drafting business cases is initiating a project.

[5:25:12] Voice 12: So therefore, these resolutions I have

[5:25:14] Voice 12: that speak to next fiscal's potential projects,

[5:25:18] Voice 12: I shouldn't even be recommending this.

[5:25:20] Voice 12: Does that make sense?

[5:25:21] Voice 12: Except for perhaps the freshwater sustainability strategy.

[5:25:25] Voice 12: So I hope that's clear.

[5:25:28] Voice 12: Maybe it's not,

[5:25:29] Voice 12: but it takes some time to unravel, and I'm watching the clock.

[5:25:32] Voice 12: It's 3.30, so I'm going to stop, Chair, and hopefully you can help me.

[5:25:37] Voice 10: Thank you.

[5:25:38] Voice 10: I didn't understand the last three sentences, but let's go to Trustee Patrick.

[5:25:45] Trustee Patrick: Yeah, I mean, listening to the conversation earlier with William

[5:25:50] Trustee Patrick: on the freshwater strategy, I started jotting down notes.

[5:25:55] Trustee Patrick: And we're not going to be able to discuss it with any meat now,

[5:25:58] Trustee Patrick: now, so I'm looking more at direction of whether I'm happy to work with Director Cermak and

[5:26:02] Trustee Patrick: William Shulbaugh maybe between now and our next meeting, which is going to be not, it's

[5:26:09] Trustee Patrick: for a long time from now, is we really actually need to deal with the funding questions as

[5:26:15] Trustee Patrick: well as what the program is.

[5:26:17] Trustee Patrick: Because if we only talk about where are we and how the program is doing, we're going

[5:26:21] Trustee Patrick: to be back in the same place that we are now.

[5:26:23] Trustee Patrick: Now, you know, our appetite to do things and the ability to fund it is very different.

[5:26:29] Trustee Patrick: As William referred to the CVRD, you know, they've got up to a million dollars a year that they're able to requisition to put toward this work.

[5:26:38] Trustee Patrick: And, you know, so I think we need to really have some serious conversations of how do we fund a program sustainably of this nature over this large geographic region and complication as it is.

[5:26:53] Trustee Patrick: so that we can actually do the work we want to do in these islands.

[5:26:58] Trustee Patrick: And so I think that's a big piece of the conversation.

[5:27:01] Trustee Patrick: I don't think we have to change the strategic, I think, you know,

[5:27:03] Trustee Patrick: part of the implementation and coming up with a plan

[5:27:05] Trustee Patrick: and the scope of what we're trying to do.

[5:27:07] Trustee Patrick: I think it can all fit in there,

[5:27:08] Trustee Patrick: but I think we've got to talk about those hard questions.

[5:27:21] Voice 10: Anybody else want to jump in?

[5:27:23] Voice 10: Tracey, go ahead.

[5:27:24] Voice 6: So we need to make some decisions.

[5:27:26] Voice 6: um are we ready to request that trust council tell us these are our top three priorities

[5:27:38] Voice 6: i guess we don't have any option with that my question with the eelgrass and kelp forests

[5:27:44] Voice 6: action um so going back to your comment about projects that were to be initiated 2026-27

[5:27:53] Voice 6: that wasn't my understanding from trust programs um yeah i'm i still i i kind of agree with you

[5:28:10] Voice 6: that if we're if the action is to be initiated in 26 27 we need business plans to start being

[5:28:16] Voice 6: drafted this year for next fiscal so

[5:28:20] Voice 12: certainly staff's interpretation but the response we got

[5:28:24] Voice 12: I heard from Trust Programs Committee was a bit different.

[5:28:26] Voice 12: But it could be because the volume of their work is a bit different

[5:28:29] Voice 12: or, you know, it's their interpretation.

[5:28:32] Voice 10: So, Director Summer, can you explain to me?

[5:28:35] Voice 10: I'm missing something.

[5:28:37] Voice 10: So they're saying if you

[5:28:39] Voice 10: prepare a business case,

[5:28:41] Voice 10: you have initiated a project.

[5:28:43] Voice 10: And is the discussion that you first of all have to agree

[5:28:47] Voice 10: that a project is going forward

[5:28:51] Voice 10: before you make the business case and initiate it.

[5:28:54] Voice 10: I'm not quite clear on what you're telling us.

[5:28:58] Voice 12: Okay, perhaps I can get Rob to go to page 559

[5:29:01] Voice 12: of the agenda package.

[5:29:02] Voice 10: And zoom a little bit, please, Rob.

[5:29:04] Voice 12: Yeah, and zoom into the color code key initiatives, right?

[5:29:09] Voice 12: So if you could zoom in just...

[5:29:13] Voice 12: Woo, now that is a zoom.

[5:29:17] Voice 12: Get in there a little higher.

[5:29:19] Voice 12: There you go.

[5:29:20] Voice 12: Yeah.

[5:29:20] Voice 12: Yeah. So we can interpret what the color codes mean. There you go. Excellent, Rob. Always

[5:29:25] Voice 12: amazing. So as you know, Trust Council prioritized, they kind of had four ranks. I don't know

[5:29:33] Voice 12: what color green that is. We'll call it a light green. I know some of you colored people

[5:29:38] Voice 12: have a good name for that, but top priority for current council terms. So these are the

[5:29:41] Voice 12: top priorities of Trust Council. Only one that's relevant to a regional planning committee

[5:29:47] Voice 12: right now you can actually see there's 1.2.3 and that's relevant that's the bylaw enforcement

[5:29:52] Voice 12: policies and procedures so we've got that following that is the priority for current council term

[5:30:00] Voice 12: arcagreen. There's a bunch of those in there. I don't want you to scroll to see them, but

[5:30:04] Voice 12: we've captured that in our discussions today. But it's this blue column that myself and other

[5:30:11] Voice 12: directors said, okay, well, since we're going to start it next year, we need to get business cases

[5:30:15] Voice 12: rolling. And that's what I'm recommending to you. But when I attended Trust Programs Committee,

[5:30:22] Voice 12: there was a discussion about asking them the same question I'm asking you is to request staff to

[5:30:28] Voice 12: come forward with business cases when they talked about it their understanding as they discussed as

[5:30:33] Voice 12: a group was that this doesn't mean coming forward with a business case this actually means next year

[5:30:37] Voice 12: we start talking about it next year we start it so um in other words they asked not to have

[5:30:43] Voice 12: business cases that are related to blue items and i am asking you to ask me to come back with

[5:30:49] Voice 12: business cases and and i and i can be quite quick about it is and that is because i'm hoping that

[5:30:55] Voice 12: that by-law enforcement will come to a conclusion.

[5:30:58] Voice 12: At least, you know, we'll be implementing it,

[5:31:00] Voice 12: but we won't be discussing the policies and the best practices.

[5:31:03] Voice 12: I think freshwater sustainability will continue.

[5:31:05] Voice 12: And I know that from the Regional Planning Committee perspective,

[5:31:10] Voice 12: we also lose Patricia at the end of this fiscal term.

[5:31:13] Voice 12: And so she won't be carrying on any more work.

[5:31:15] Voice 12: Now, she could be implementing,

[5:31:16] Voice 12: but I know the Trust Programs Committee and others

[5:31:18] Voice 12: have also similar work going on in there.

[5:31:22] Voice 12: So I see an opportunity for you to do more next fiscal.

[5:31:27] Voice 12: And so I'm asking you to ask me to do that.

[5:31:29] Voice 12: I think it's relatively easy for me to ask for a business case for eelgrass mapping.

[5:31:33] Voice 12: That's a relatively straightforward process.

[5:31:36] Voice 12: I think the hardest thing is this growth management framework.

[5:31:39] Voice 12: I don't know what that means.

[5:31:40] Voice 12: And I certainly think you need some solid action as Trustee Patrick or Ex-Officer Patrick was mentioning about the freshwater sustainability strategy.

[5:31:49] Voice 12: strategy um you know we've heard how great it is to have committees of people coming together to

[5:31:54] Voice 12: make this work go forward what does it mean has it worked we need to staff it up we need to we

[5:31:59] Voice 12: need to focus on the strategic item it is the number one pivot point of all the work we do

[5:32:04] Voice 12: from a land use planning perspective and we have done it a disservice of um resourcing so and i

[5:32:11] Voice 12: think we need to get that evaluated what to do and how to do it next so anyhow my whole point was to

[5:32:16] Voice 12: say i put before you something i thought we could do tpcs kind of throw a bit of a hey we thought

[5:32:22] Voice 12: to be initiated me don't do that yet so that's i'm sorry if i've been confusing but it confused

[5:32:27] Voice 12: me when i heard it so yeah i'm a

[5:32:31] Voice 10: bit sort of silenced by this as well i i would have looked

[5:32:36] Voice 10: at that and believed that we had this was planning now we needed to plan for 26 27.

[5:32:44] Voice 10: so and that's a bit of a curveball uh so

[5:32:51] Voice 12: may you may disregard that advice okay

[5:32:55] Voice 10: so okay so uh by our policy uh we're doing um update and implement the fresh water

[5:33:02] Voice 10: sustainability strategy are we we can or can't do either part of that or none of it or whatever

[5:33:11] Voice 10: based on not getting this grant funding?

[5:33:15] Voice 10: What's the status of that?

[5:33:17] Voice 12: If I may, through the chair,

[5:33:20] Voice 12: the RPC has asked for an independent review

[5:33:22] Voice 12: as well as an implementation plan.

[5:33:25] Voice 12: Now that we have this sort of idea

[5:33:27] Voice 12: for an independent review,

[5:33:29] Voice 12: we need the resources for that

[5:33:31] Voice 12: and it didn't make too much sense

[5:33:32] Voice 12: to do more of an implementation plan

[5:33:34] Voice 12: until we get the review.

[5:33:35] Voice 12: It's kind of chicken and egg now.

[5:33:37] Voice 12: So we're asking for that independent review

[5:33:39] Voice 12: view and out of that will come um you know formation of a implementation plan okay and then

[5:33:47] Voice 10: so that's one two three you've just spoken

[5:33:50] Voice 12: to yeah i

[5:33:52] Voice 12: just want to say you were sort of asking

[5:33:54] Voice 12: what's happening in the meantime and i think uh mr shova identified many things he's working on

[5:33:59] Voice 12: um in relation to the freshwater sustainability strategy and many of those things are actually

[5:34:04] Voice 12: putting the science into the planning right um you know we see that that that especially like

[5:34:10] Voice 7: that

[5:34:11] Voice 12: freshwater footprint happening on gabriola or uh he doesn't call that freshwater footprint

[5:34:15] Voice 12: or no he does call footprint it used to be the balance now it's footprint um

[5:34:20] Voice 10: okay and then um

[5:34:22] Voice 10: so uh the policies um is that kind of ongoing work anyway no

[5:34:29] Voice 12: this is work that uh you know

[5:34:32] Voice 12: we've kind of been letting poor director marla do all the work behind the scenes on um and when i

[5:34:37] Voice 12: read strategic pardon me when i read the strategic plan of trust council it was directed to all

[5:34:42] Voice 12: committees so that was my opportunity to say oh what are all the policies that regional planning

[5:34:47] Voice 12: committee may be interested in so what i've done in your future work projects you'll see i listed

[5:34:51] Voice 12: all the policies that are under the director of planning um purview to monitor and update

[5:34:56] Voice 12: update so you'll see that in your work your I think your future projects and I that's kind of

[5:35:03] Voice 12: I've got that as an extra as I have time like an operational review and I'll just I kind of have

[5:35:09] Voice 12: in my head I'd like to categorize things that have been updated recently things that you're working

[5:35:14] Voice 12: on and so on and so forth I'll come back with a slow step-by-step process to to assess those I

[5:35:20] Voice 12: don't think I have a massive comprehensive work program for you but this is you directing me to

[5:35:26] Voice 12: to add this to my work plate and I'll report it as feasible.

[5:35:30] Voice 12: Sorry to interrupt you.

[5:35:31] Voice 2: Trustee

[5:35:31] Voice 4: Elliott's got to take off.

[5:35:35] Voice 4: Do we know if there's a, are we on the cusp, I guess?

[5:35:39] Voice 10: Of a vote.

[5:35:40] Voice 10: I don't think we are, but, you know,

[5:35:44] Voice 10: you're asking for a decision,

[5:35:46] Voice 10: but we seem to have a whole lot of kind of balls in the air

[5:35:49] Voice 10: at the same time.

[5:35:51] Voice 10: You know, there's lack of clarity about, you know,

[5:35:54] Voice 10: Are we going to do business cases?

[5:35:56] Voice 10: Does that constitute initiating a project?

[5:36:03] Voice 10: Do we need to vote on this or narrow it down or part of this right now, Director Cermak?

[5:36:12] Voice 12: Thank you, Chair.

[5:36:14] Voice 12: I think you have your top priorities, and I've already sort of placed them in your work

[5:36:18] Voice 12: program, assuming that because that's what Trust Council told you, this was just a sort

[5:36:21] Voice 12: of formality to put into place.

[5:36:23] Voice 12: So if you don't want

[5:36:24] Voice 12: to pass that resolution, I don't think there's anything lost, but it'll just be dangling there.

[5:36:31] Voice 12: But I will report back to Trust Council as per the work program because that's automatically generated.

[5:36:36] Voice 12: So be aware of that.

[5:36:38] Voice 12: The not reporting back on policies, I don't mind if you don't tell me not to do something.

[5:36:42] Voice 12: I'm pretty good.

[5:36:43] Voice 12: but the last one the business cases i would like direction on that because it has to come back to

[5:36:50] Voice 12: you in july in order then to get to the september trust council and and or pardon me and to get get

[5:36:55] Voice 12: the ball rolling with you know how these

[5:36:56] Voice 10: things work so the eelgrass and the kelp forest you have

[5:37:00] Voice 10: prepared business cases for those in the past so correct in my view that's not a huge amount of

[5:37:06] Voice 10: work then i don't want to commit you to something that's like a blank sheet of paper and it's going

[5:37:11] Voice 10: going to take like three weeks each but i'm assuming that that is not the case uh that is

[5:37:17] Voice 12: correct i think each i i put down a manageable uh list of things to do i have uh mr schoble to help

[5:37:23] Voice 12: me with a freshwater sustainability strategy i have a a robust planning team to help me with

[5:37:29] Voice 12: the growth management planning framework i also see that the um contractor working or about to

[5:37:35] Voice 12: work for salt spring islands ocp project is doing the same thing and i would just touch base with

[5:37:39] Voice 12: but then saying, ah, you're doing this thing.

[5:37:40] Voice 12: So I think

[5:37:41] Voice 12: all these are very manageable

[5:37:42] Voice 12: for me to come back in July.

[5:37:44] Voice 12: At

[5:37:44] Voice 10: least I hope

[5:37:45] Voice 12: so, despite the fact

[5:37:46] Voice 10: I'm going

[5:37:46] Voice 12: to be on a holiday during that time too.

[5:37:48] Voice 12: Yeah.

[5:37:49] Voice 10: Okay, so we are going to vote

[5:37:53] Voice 10: on the request to draft business cases.

[5:37:57] Voice 10: I don't want to lose quorum if we can avoid it.

[5:38:01] Voice 10: Does anybody object to voting

[5:38:04] Voice 10: that we go ahead with those draft business cases?

[5:38:07] Voice 10: Do it, Mairead.

[5:38:08] Voice 6: go go

[5:38:09] Voice 6: go i'm leaving the meeting literally right now okay

[5:38:13] Voice 10: i move that we request staff to draft

[5:38:17] Voice 10: business cases to address the following trust council key initiatives map your grass and kelp

[5:38:22] Voice 10: forests develop a growth management planning framework and conduct an independent review

[5:38:28] Voice 10: of the freshwater sustainability strategy seconder okay two seconders okay trustee

[5:38:37] Voice 10: I'm literally

[5:38:44] Voice 6: walking out of the meeting I'm so sorry

[5:38:47] Voice 6: okay just

[5:38:48] Trustee Patrick: have a vote

[5:38:48] Voice 6: please okay thank you

[5:38:51] Voice 6: I have to go can

[5:38:54] Voice 10: you okay we'll have a vote and then I'll we can talk it through because

[5:39:01] Voice 10: I have a commentary okay let's vote in all those in favor raise your hands

[5:39:09] Voice 10: okay and those uh lower your hands anybody not in favor raise your hand so that carries okay

[5:39:21] Voice 10: trustee elliot away you go trustee patrick go ahead yeah

[5:39:26] Trustee Patrick: no i'd like to to work with stephan

[5:39:28] Trustee Patrick: and william as at least to the options as they pulled you know because i think this review could

[5:39:33] Trustee Patrick: i think we've got to seriously consider some of the tougher questions and so that needs to be one

[5:39:39] Trustee Patrick: of the options that we look at in developing the business case is the long-term funding of this.

[5:39:45] Voice 10: I think that's a good idea. I was going to say that I would like to

[5:39:51] Voice 10: be involved in that as well. And of course, Jose Patrick, you have a lot of historical knowledge

[5:39:56] Voice 10: and I need to gain that knowledge going forward. So, Director Cermak, I'd really appreciate it if

[5:40:03] Voice 10: if you and both of us at least can come together to talk through some of the

[5:40:10] Voice 10: business case options, maybe we can schedule that offline. Yeah.

[5:40:15] Voice 12: Well, I, I, I must, I, I'm a little bit nervous about that. Of course,

[5:40:19] Voice 12: it's supposed to be an independent staff exercise to create a business case

[5:40:22] Voice 12: with your inputs for sure. You know, but as I want to make sure that what we

[5:40:27] Voice 12: present, I mean,

[5:40:28] Voice 12: I'd certainly welcome your input without any doubt and I'll work together with

[5:40:31] Voice 12: with you. But when it comes back to RPC, I just want to make sure that RPC gets a full chance at

[5:40:38] Voice 12: it. Does that make sense? Yeah. Okay.

[5:40:41] Voice 12: So yeah, we'll book something to have a chat about it.

[5:40:43] Voice 12: I think the funding formula is critical. So I appreciate it.

[5:40:46] Voice 10: Yeah. And I think I was going to

[5:40:48] Voice 10: circle back to Trustee Patrick's initial point, which is that we really have to look at how these

[5:40:55] Voice 10: are funded so that they're sustainable. There are some that I don't agree with, but that doesn't

[5:41:00] Voice 10: mean that that we shouldn't look at the funding because part of my disagreement is how do we fund

[5:41:05] Voice 10: it so um you know that's working through that would um would help okay um so uh william i can't

[5:41:17] Voice 10: imagine your title at this stage i'm too tired no

[5:41:20] Voice 3: no that's fine um yeah thanks for this uh late

[5:41:24] Voice 3: comment yeah it's it's like

[5:41:26] Voice 3: the the challenge of like what's a business case what's a project

[5:41:29] Voice 3: charter what's the terms of reference right and and like we want to present i think the business

[5:41:33] Voice 3: case is like presenting the idea and and the support generally um but i do agree with you

[5:41:39] Voice 3: like the funding i'm not sure do you mean like the long-term funding of the sustainability strategy

[5:41:43] Voice 3: just the funding of the review i don't know that's where i don't understand that question but

[5:41:47] Voice 3: like the funding of the review yeah probably in the business case section but the funding

[5:41:52] Voice 3: long-term funding and i i think that comes you know like what's in scope what's out of scope

[5:41:57] Voice 3: for the project and then we lay that out in a project charter and then we can really get into

[5:42:02] Voice 3: that when we have and i i think the business case just to support how much this is going to cost the

[5:42:08] Voice 3: review and then we can get into the content and then like this is going to be really closely

[5:42:12] Voice 3: aligned with the rpc so the project charter will lay out all that and then we go to procurement

[5:42:17] Voice 3: for that consultant with the terms of reference stems from those discussions like that's part of

[5:42:23] Voice 3: the project right so um i don't see this as going like business case and then we're just hiring

[5:42:28] Voice 3: somebody next day i don't like i think the business case is just to identify the project

[5:42:34] Voice 3: generally and then budget for the review yeah thanks

[5:42:38] Voice 10: yeah no no that's uh i take the point

[5:42:41] Voice 10: um okay i think we have um drawn to a conclusion uh director sermac is there anything any last

[5:42:52] Voice 10: me a thing that you want to force us to consider give us homework i

[5:42:59] Voice 12: anything you haven't got to up

[5:43:01] Voice 12: will carry forward i last last comment i'd like to make is um shoot i have my notes here let me

[5:43:09] Voice 12: just find them for a sec future meeting topics uh uh chair boland you mentioned the desire to

[5:43:15] Voice 12: talk about proof of water at a future meeting i forward you a um a report from executive committee

[5:43:21] Voice 12: and response. I don't know if you still want that, but I have it on my radar for future meeting

[5:43:26] Voice 12: topics. So don't have

[5:43:27] Voice 12: to answer now, but that's my poke to you. Are you satisfied? There's also

[5:43:32] Voice 12: this secondary matter is there are a lot of things that the RPC is sort of oversees that are worthy

[5:43:37] Voice 12: of trust council-esque training sessions. We talked about that in regards to housing options

[5:43:43] Voice 12: toolkit. And I heard Trustee Borthwick, he wanted me to carry forward the idea of the suitable land

[5:43:48] Voice 12: analysis there's other things the applications portal we haven't we need to go to trust wide

[5:43:54] Voice 12: sort of training sessions we freshwater atlas when it comes online map it when it is fixed

[5:44:00] Voice 12: so on and so forth so these i'm just flagging them that we have this i have a list of future

[5:44:05] Voice 12: business future meeting topics so i haven't lost them so this is my oh and then last one i just

[5:44:11] Voice 12: made a note of today was the tiny homes and wheel steering committee next directions so just and

[5:44:17] Voice 12: And anything we didn't capture today, I'll put on the list.

[5:44:18] Voice 12: So Chair Boland, I'll make sure I share that list with you.

[5:44:22] Voice 12: And save Trustee Borthwick.

[5:44:25] Voice 12: Is there anything?

[5:44:27] Voice 12: That's it.

[5:44:27] Voice 12: Everybody should go home.

[5:44:28] Voice 12: You should applaud

[5:44:28] Voice 10: yourselves for the long day.

[5:44:31] Voice 10: I really appreciate you hanging in here.

[5:44:33] Voice 10: I know that this was a bit of a monster meeting.

[5:44:37] Voice 10: I think we had some good discussions.

[5:44:40] Voice 10: And I think we ticked off a few big items.

[5:44:45] Voice 10: So, you know, thank you all.

[5:44:48] Voice 10: And I'll be in touch afterwards, Stefan, to kind of flesh out next steps.

[5:44:54] Voice 10: And thank you all for your patience. And I hope I didn't slow things down, rush things too much.

[5:45:00] Voice 10: And thanks, Rob.

[5:45:03] Voice 4: Congratulations, Chair Boland.

[5:45:09] Voice 9: Okay, thanks. Okay, bye-bye.