North Pender Island Local Trust Committee community information meeting, May 27, 2021

[0:00:12] Trustee Patrick: if you're just joining us just hold a minute we'll start the meeting momentarily how's the system is

[0:00:38] Trustee Patrick: it not quite yet live

[0:00:41] Voice 4: stream is still connecting and it is um up in live now okay

[0:00:49] Trustee Patrick: trustees should

[0:00:51] Trustee Patrick: we kick off the meeting some thumbs up excellent well good morning everyone i'd like to call this

[0:01:01] Trustee Patrick: meeting of the north pender island local trust committee to order this meeting is being recorded

[0:01:06] Trustee Patrick: and also live streamed.

[0:01:08] Trustee Patrick: I always begin with acknowledging how fortunate we are

[0:01:10] Trustee Patrick: to be gathering today in the traditional territories

[0:01:13] Trustee Patrick: all across the Coast Salish people.

[0:01:17] Trustee Patrick: I had the honor of being able to participate

[0:01:22] Trustee Patrick: in a indigenous knowledge learning a couple of weeks ago

[0:01:25] Trustee Patrick: about water.

[0:01:26] Trustee Patrick: And I was deeply moved of how they shared stories

[0:01:34] Trustee Patrick: of the place and water.

[0:01:36] Trustee Patrick: They never exclusively only spoke about water but how it played into the into everything and I spoke asked Harold Joe about the integration of it and he talked about being human and how being human is that responsibility of we have for in the place where we are, and I'm just so fortunate to be able to be part of, of having these stories hearing these stories.

[0:02:05] Trustee Patrick: I'm Laura Patrick. I'm elected on Salt Spring Island and chair of this local trust committee.

[0:02:10] Trustee Patrick: I'm joined today by Trustee Deb Morrison. Good morning, Deb. And Trustee Ben McConkie.

[0:02:15] Trustee Patrick: Good morning, Ben. Together, we make up your North Pender Island Local Trust Committee.

[0:02:20] Trustee Patrick: This meeting is an official forum for your local trust committee to make decisions about land use planning matters and discuss relevant business.

[0:02:27] Trustee Patrick: I also want to add that this is a place of employment, despite the fact that some of our staff are coming from their own homes, they have the right to a safe and respectful workplace.

[0:02:36] Trustee Patrick: We're grateful for the ability to have this electronic meeting. Trustees, staff, and the public don't have to travel. We're honoring provincial health orders and guidelines during the pandemic.

[0:02:44] Trustee Patrick: We appreciate your understanding and assistance. As we may have technical difficulties, we will do our best to overcome them as quickly as we can.

[0:02:53] Trustee Patrick: and everyone's mics have been muted

[0:02:55] Trustee Patrick: so that we don't have any audio disruptions

[0:02:57] Trustee Patrick: and I'll review in a few moments

[0:02:58] Trustee Patrick: when we get to the town hall,

[0:03:00] Trustee Patrick: how you can communicate with us.

[0:03:04] Trustee Patrick: We have a number of staff members joining us today.

[0:03:07] Trustee Patrick: We have Maple Hung, our office administrator

[0:03:09] Trustee Patrick: who is making this meeting run smoothly.

[0:03:10] Trustee Patrick: Thank you, Maple, for being here.

[0:03:13] Trustee Patrick: Shannon Braford, our minute taker.

[0:03:15] Trustee Patrick: Thank you, Shannon.

[0:03:17] Trustee Patrick: Robert Kojima is our regional planning manager.

[0:03:19] Trustee Patrick: Robert and Kim Stockville, our planner.

[0:03:21] Trustee Patrick: Well, Kim, I understand we'll have a couple more staff joining us later in the meeting,

[0:03:25] Trustee Patrick: Phil Testamal and Nerissa Chadwick.

[0:03:28] Trustee Patrick: We have an agenda before us, trustees.

[0:03:32] Trustee Patrick: Is there any additions or changes that need to be made to the agenda?

[0:03:36] Trustee Patrick: Not for me.

[0:03:37] Trustee Patrick: Yeah.

[0:03:38] Trustee Patrick: So we can approve the agenda through general consent?

[0:03:42] Trustee Patrick: Excellent.

[0:03:43] Trustee Patrick: I'm going to apologize.

[0:03:45] Trustee Patrick: I had a technical difficulty, so I've reversed on my computers and so my notes are on the

[0:03:49] Trustee Patrick: computer.

[0:03:50] Trustee Patrick: I'm also visually doing and I have an agenda on the other.

[0:03:53] Trustee Patrick: so I apologize I might be awkward a couple of times as I'm finding my place and of course my

[0:03:59] Trustee Patrick: printer's out of ink so I don't have a paper copy of the agenda it's one of those days

[0:04:03] Trustee Patrick: um so um we have reports uh trustee reports and who'd like to go first do

[0:04:12] Trustee McConchie: you want to go ahead

[0:04:12] Trustee McConchie: you want me to go first okay good morning everyone good morning to everyone that's listening to the

[0:04:16] Trustee McConchie: meeting thanks very much for that introduction chair Patrick and thanks for your comments about

[0:04:20] Trustee McConchie: about your Indigenous knowledge.

[0:04:22] Trustee McConchie: That's super hip.

[0:04:23] Trustee McConchie: On that note, I just had a couple of issues

[0:04:25] Trustee McConchie: I wanted to let the public know about

[0:04:26] Trustee McConchie: as my role as trustee

[0:04:27] Trustee McConchie: and chair of the Parks and Recreation Commission.

[0:04:29] Trustee McConchie: First of all, it was nice to see in the Driftwood newspaper

[0:04:32] Trustee McConchie: our recent decision on James Island

[0:04:34] Trustee McConchie: was covered by Elizabeth Nolan,

[0:04:36] Trustee McConchie: showing our solidarity with the Wissanik Leadership Council

[0:04:39] Trustee McConchie: in regards to that particular issue.

[0:04:41] Trustee McConchie: I encourage folks to go to driftwood.com

[0:04:43] Trustee McConchie: and read that article.

[0:04:45] Trustee McConchie: It was very well done by Elizabeth.

[0:04:47] Trustee McConchie: The next point I wanted to bring up

[0:04:48] Trustee McConchie: was issues surrounding our use of helicopters and helipads.

[0:04:52] Trustee McConchie: I spent considerable time as a trustee talking to people.

[0:04:56] Trustee McConchie: This was the number one issue that I would say

[0:04:58] Trustee McConchie: people kept talking to me about wherever I went.

[0:05:00] Trustee McConchie: And we are going to discuss that issue

[0:05:03] Trustee McConchie: in an in-camera meeting today.

[0:05:06] Trustee McConchie: And I'd be interested to hear your thoughts as well

[0:05:08] Trustee McConchie: for those people listening.

[0:05:10] Trustee McConchie: Just from a perspective of just some community issues

[0:05:14] Trustee McConchie: right now that I'd like to point out.

[0:05:16] Trustee McConchie: from my position as Parks and Recreation Chair with the CRD.

[0:05:20] Trustee McConchie: I just wanted to notify folks that the Mortimer Spit will not be graded this year

[0:05:23] Trustee McConchie: and the found road trail will not be fixed.

[0:05:28] Trustee McConchie: It will be closed to the public.

[0:05:29] Trustee McConchie: And the reasons for this is because the Parks and Recreation Commission

[0:05:33] Trustee McConchie: has begun a very serious engagement with First Nations with regards to reconciliation.

[0:05:41] Trustee McConchie: Part of the issue is that these are archaeological sites

[0:05:44] Trustee McConchie: and there's ground disturbance taking place.

[0:05:46] Trustee McConchie: And that we, as a commission, need to ask the WSANIC Leadership Council for and inform them about the land disturbance that's taking place.

[0:05:55] Trustee McConchie: That area around the spit is a major archaeological site.

[0:05:58] Trustee McConchie: So this will be a change in our human behaviors on the island.

[0:06:01] Trustee McConchie: And this will impact day-to-day life.

[0:06:03] Trustee McConchie: But it is for efforts and reconciliation that I think are extremely worthwhile cause.

[0:06:08] Trustee McConchie: Next, three more points, if that's okay, Chair Patrick.

[0:06:11] Trustee McConchie: Our healthcare society needs money.

[0:06:13] Trustee McConchie: And it needs money to function.

[0:06:15] Trustee McConchie: I encourage folks to consider donating and to also pay attention to the campaign ahead to make sure our healthcare society can withstand the pressures and the population pressures that are going to take place as a result of the massive shift that's taking place as a result of the real estate market, new folks coming and relocating as a result of this pandemic.

[0:06:34] Trustee McConchie: pandemic. I would like to express my solidarity with, of course, the Fairy Creek protesters and

[0:06:40] Trustee McConchie: their efforts to protect old-growth logging in the province of British Columbia. It's a tragedy

[0:06:46] Trustee McConchie: what's taking place right now in that area, and I certainly hope the NDP government wakes up

[0:06:51] Trustee McConchie: and prevents any sort of old-growth logging from continuing to take place. There are a number of

[0:06:56] Trustee McConchie: islanders I know that are taking supplies to the protesters, and I really appreciate the efforts

[0:07:00] Trustee McConchie: for people to protect the planet and the last comment i want to make is a political point

[0:07:05] Trustee McConchie: that the islands trust governance model requires restructuring the islands trust act

[0:07:08] Trustee McConchie: requires amendments and you'll see today if you watch the entire meeting today you'll realize

[0:07:14] Trustee McConchie: some of the ineptitudes of the trust that will be on place today with that i would like to express

[0:07:19] Trustee McConchie: my express my express my uh thanks for staff and uh of course my fellow trustees for working so

[0:07:24] Trustee McConchie: so hard on these issues.

[0:07:25] Trustee McConchie: Thanks, that's it.

[0:07:26] Trustee Morrison: Thank you, Trustee McAuley.

[0:07:28] Trustee Morrison: Trustee Morrison.

[0:07:29] Trustee Morrison: Thank you.

[0:07:31] Trustee Morrison: I want to express first my condolences

[0:07:34] Trustee Morrison: to the Masonic nations for the loss of Lou Claxton

[0:07:40] Trustee Morrison: who passed away and other elders

[0:07:44] Trustee Morrison: who have also passed away this spring.

[0:07:48] Trustee Morrison: I know a very hard year,

[0:07:49] Trustee Morrison: so my condolences go out to everyone there.

[0:07:53] Trustee Morrison: I want to thank the numerous volunteers who have gotten us to this point in the work on the agricultural APC and the regular APC and just the review by community members and the feedback we've gotten.

[0:08:10] Trustee Morrison: There's been enormous feedback.

[0:08:14] Trustee Morrison: It's really an interesting situation, being a trustee on the island.

[0:08:18] Trustee Morrison: island we've learned a lot in the last um two and a half years or so um a lot of the things that go

[0:08:26] Trustee Morrison: on seem like you know any one issue like the helicopter like the logging like the gravel like

[0:08:31] Trustee Morrison: whatever it is often seem to be the most pressing issue to any one person who's dealing with

[0:08:37] Trustee Morrison: something but i just do want to acknowledge that ben and laura and i and all the staff have to deal

[0:08:43] Trustee Morrison: with the entire constellation of all those decisions and all that is related to that as

[0:08:50] Trustee Morrison: we process and hear that all the phone calls that we process in here and the site visits and

[0:08:56] Trustee Morrison: everything else so while any one issue may seem like it's not moving fast enough do know that

[0:09:02] Trustee Morrison: it's getting intended it's just there are so many different things right now as we make a lot of

[0:09:07] Trustee Morrison: different changes and hear the different opinions of people so patience is helpful

[0:09:14] Trustee Morrison: and so yeah often I think then I start to feel even though we are paid it's so marginal compared

[0:09:23] Trustee Morrison: to what the actual amount of work is done so I just want to acknowledge that okay so in terms

[0:09:31] Trustee Morrison: In terms of other things, Ben's updates on the major things, we are also, from the Trust Council perspective, coming into the June Trust Council in a few weeks here, a couple weeks.

[0:09:43] Trustee Morrison: And at that Trust Council, there'll be a number of different things that would be helpful if folks had a look at the Trust Council packages.

[0:09:52] Trustee Morrison: There's a special meeting of the Trust Council, and Laura can perhaps say that more specifically, but it looked like it landed on July 8th.

[0:09:59] Trustee Morrison: and that will be for the trust programs the new policy statement the initial review of it so i do

[0:10:06] Trustee Morrison: encourage people to also pay attention and attend to that that'll impact many things across the

[0:10:11] Trustee Morrison: whole of the trust area all right thank you thank

[0:10:15] Trustee Patrick: you both of you and i do i greatly appreciate the

[0:10:19] Trustee Patrick: work that you're doing as i'm sure your your fellow islanders do as well um yes we do have

[0:10:26] Trustee Patrick: of a number of meetings that um that are coming up so the trust council meeting the regular quarterly

[0:10:31] Trustee Patrick: trust council meeting will be june 8th through 10th and on the evening of june 8th is delegations

[0:10:37] Trustee Patrick: and town hall so that'll be beginning at seven o'clock the detailed agenda package for that i

[0:10:44] Trustee Patrick: think comes out like friday night or saturday so that'll be out very very soon yeah um the trust

[0:10:52] Trustee Patrick: Council through a resolution without meeting. Sorry, I was having a, what does an RWM stand for?

[0:11:02] Trustee Patrick: Just last evening passed holding a meeting on July 8th for the first intended for first reading for

[0:11:12] Trustee Patrick: the draft policy statement. Just so people understand, when we go through these series

[0:11:19] Trustee Patrick: of readings on bylaws a first reading of bylaw is basically a signal of the elected saying

[0:11:25] Trustee Patrick: this is a version we now want out for public comment so that's what first reading means so

[0:11:33] Trustee Patrick: if you're if you're i just want to have people call you know that you don't have to have input

[0:11:38] Trustee Patrick: by this first this is this is really sort of like an internal process if you think of it that the

[0:11:43] Trustee Patrick: The trustees need to put a draft out there that we do purposely solicit feedback on.

[0:11:49] Trustee Patrick: And that engagement is going to refer as will happen over the summer.

[0:11:53] Trustee Patrick: And then there will be a public engagement process in September.

[0:11:56] Trustee Patrick: So lots of opportunity coming for your input into the policy statement, which is, as Deb mentioned, very important to how we operate.

[0:12:06] Trustee Patrick: Great. The Association of Vancouver Island Coastal Communities is having its conference this weekend,

[0:12:16] Trustee Patrick: or Friday. It's the group of communities and local governments throughout the Vancouver Island

[0:12:24] Trustee Patrick: and the coast here. And we vote on a number of resolutions that then go to the UBCM,

[0:12:31] Trustee Patrick: which is the Union of BC Municipalities in the fall.

[0:12:34] Trustee Patrick: I was at, we have to vote on,

[0:12:40] Trustee Patrick: organizations put forward resolutions.

[0:12:44] Trustee Patrick: Islands Trust put forward a resolution

[0:12:46] Trustee Patrick: saying that the Local Government Act's restrictions

[0:12:48] Trustee Patrick: on how we notify people of public hearings is silly.

[0:12:51] Trustee Patrick: You know, you have to put an article in the driftwood.

[0:12:53] Trustee Patrick: We're not allowed to put articles that are meaningful

[0:12:56] Trustee Patrick: or we're to publish them that are meaningful

[0:12:58] Trustee Patrick: to our small rural communities.

[0:12:59] Trustee Patrick: So we put a resolution forward, but I was amazed by the number of resolutions that were related to climate change in the environment coming from communities in the Vancouver Island and coastal communities.

[0:13:09] Trustee Patrick: So really seeing a shift in people's thinking. So I just wanted to report that to the trustees.

[0:13:16] Trustee Patrick: Okay. So with that.

[0:13:18] Trustee McConchie: Can I just add, Chair Patrick, sorry, I

[0:13:19] Trustee McConchie: just realized one quick, very quick point.

[0:13:22] Trustee McConchie: I really want to thank the Pender Island Conservancy for their broom bash.

[0:13:25] Trustee McConchie: I got to mention that because I saw some people here that are you know the conservancy is really

[0:13:30] Trustee McConchie: taking the lead on a lot of environmental issues so congrats to the broom bash organizers

[0:13:35] Trustee McConchie: and everyone there sorry thanks Laura and I'm realizing

[0:13:38] Trustee McConchie: we need to we skip number item number

[0:13:40] Trustee McConchie: two on our agenda which is rise and report ah

[0:13:43] Trustee Patrick: thank you sorry I don't have the notes

[0:13:48] Trustee Patrick: I can

[0:13:50] Voice 4: send oh chair Patrick I can send them to you right now by email just one moment okay thank

[0:13:54] Trustee Patrick: Thank you. Sorry, there were too many. Like I said, I'm operating on opposite of my normal

[0:13:59] Trustee Patrick: computers. So

[0:14:00] Voice 4: I apologize.

[0:14:03] Trustee Patrick: Thank you for pointing that out. All right. Oh, so all we are is rising

[0:14:14] Trustee Patrick: and reporting that we had adopted the minutes. Is that correct? Am I missing? I'm sorry. I'm

[0:14:29] Trustee Patrick: had to rise and report from

[0:14:35] Trustee McConchie: our in-camera meeting from april 29th

[0:14:38] Trustee Patrick: oh resolutions would be included

[0:14:43] Trustee Patrick: um okay so am i to report i'm just looking to staff um make sure am i reporting these two

[0:14:55] Trustee Patrick: resolutions that were passed the

[0:15:00] Voice 6: james island related resolutions yes yes i think that was

[0:15:06] Voice 6: was the intent at the in-camera meeting

[0:15:07] Voice 6: that the subsequent regular meeting,

[0:15:11] Voice 6: you would rather the local trust committee

[0:15:12] Voice 6: would just report on those resolutions.

[0:15:14] Trustee Patrick: Okay.

[0:15:15] Trustee Patrick: So I'm just, I'm sorry.

[0:15:17] Trustee Patrick: Whenever we have in-camera meetings, I'm sorry.

[0:15:19] Trustee Patrick: So we had passed three.

[0:15:24] Trustee Patrick: So we had the appointments.

[0:15:26] Trustee Patrick: We had, we appointed to the advisory planning commission,

[0:15:31] Trustee Patrick: Amanda Griesbach and Stephenson.

[0:15:36] Trustee Patrick: or Stevenson, Carol Bell, Vicki Dutton, and we appointed Michael Simmons and Dennis Agar to the

[0:15:45] Trustee Patrick: North Pender Island Advisory Planning Commission commencing immediately for a term until March 1,

[0:15:51] Trustee Patrick: 2022. So we always appreciate and congratulate people for coming forward to work with us. It's

[0:16:06] Trustee Patrick: to James Island, that the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee will not accept any

[0:16:14] Trustee Patrick: appraisal until written confirmation from the Say Out First Nation is received that

[0:16:18] Trustee Patrick: the Say Out leadership approved subdivision North Pender SUV 2008.9.

[0:16:26] Trustee Patrick: And it was also a resolution we passed was that North Pender Island Local Trust Committee

[0:16:31] Trustee Patrick: amend resolution North Pender 2021-027

[0:16:37] Trustee Patrick: by modifying that the grant of authority

[0:16:39] Trustee Patrick: by requiring the chair was also obtained

[0:16:43] Trustee Patrick: written confirmation from the SAO First Nation

[0:16:46] Trustee Patrick: that they consider the consultation

[0:16:47] Trustee Patrick: by the Ministry of Transportation Infrastructure

[0:16:49] Trustee Patrick: to be sufficient and will not be seeking

[0:16:51] Trustee Patrick: further consultation.

[0:16:55] Trustee Patrick: Thank you, Mabel, for forwarding those to me.

[0:16:59] Trustee Patrick: Okay. So with that, thank you, Ben, for reminding me. And I apologize for being backwards. I like

[0:17:08] Trustee Patrick: to have everything organized, and today is not going to be one of those days. I apologize.

[0:17:12] Trustee Patrick: So today is the town hall. We do have a very full agenda, so we do ask that you be brief.

[0:17:18] Trustee Patrick: We do want to hear your questions and comments. Later in the agenda, we're going to be reviewing

[0:17:22] Trustee Patrick: a number of applications. Applicants can speak at that time. So if you have comments regarding

[0:17:28] Trustee Patrick: applications. This is your time to speak. Only the applicants will be given an opportunity to

[0:17:33] Trustee Patrick: speak when we're considering their applications. Your questions and comments are important and

[0:17:39] Trustee Patrick: valued to us, and they help us make good decisions. We always want to hear from you. So if you don't

[0:17:46] Trustee Patrick: have a chance to speak today or you're coming to us through the live stream, please email us at

[0:17:51] Trustee Patrick: southinfo at islandstrust.bc.ca. And today, if you're speaking to us, direct your comments to

[0:17:57] Trustee Patrick: the local trust committee not the audience or staff speak about issues not people be clear

[0:18:02] Trustee Patrick: concise and respectful so with that i'm going to have to sorry change so i can see who's talking

[0:18:13] Trustee Patrick: to us so um you need to raise your hand um if you're on the phone it's star six i believe

[0:18:21] Trustee Patrick: to raise your hand so if you wish to address us today please raise your hand and maple will help

[0:18:26] Trustee Patrick: me with activating your microphone. Is there anyone that wishes to address us today? I'm not

[0:18:39] Trustee Patrick: seeing any hands go up. Very unlike North Pendra. I think everyone's anxious. Oops, I talked somebody

[0:18:53] Trustee Patrick: into it. Rhonda Porter. Rhonda, if you take yourself off mute. Good morning, Rhonda.

[0:19:01] Voice 21: Morning, everybody. I'm glad I managed to get in. I don't know whether people realize it, but the

[0:19:07] Voice 21: the link that came in my email

[0:19:10] Voice 21: connected to an expired webinar

[0:19:13] Voice 21: and I had to go online

[0:19:17] Voice 21: and log in with the number that was included.

[0:19:20] Voice 21: So it may be if there's not many people here,

[0:19:23] Voice 21: it's because they tried to click on the link

[0:19:25] Voice 21: and it came up expired

[0:19:27] Voice 21: with an entirely different number

[0:19:29] Voice 21: from what was in the email I received.

[0:19:31] Trustee Patrick: Thank you for that information.

[0:19:36] Trustee Patrick: Is there anything else that you'd like to say?

[0:19:41] Voice 21: that's okay well

[0:19:42] Trustee Patrick: thank you for letting us know that and appreciate it there are a number of

[0:19:45] Trustee Patrick: people that did manage to find it and if you are following us through live stream there is the link

[0:19:50] Trustee Patrick: should be available through the website it is a little different than when you log into the

[0:19:53] Trustee Patrick: website if you the landing page if you let it kind of scroll down you'll find the active meetings at

[0:19:59] Trustee Patrick: the at the bottom all right well that i think people are anxious to to have us get on with

[0:20:07] Trustee Patrick: with the meeting.

[0:20:08] Trustee Patrick: So trustees, should we carry on?

[0:20:11] Trustee Patrick: Excellent.

[0:20:12] Trustee Patrick: All right.

[0:20:13] Trustee Patrick: So we are moving on to,

[0:20:19] Trustee Patrick: we have the minutes from April 29th.

[0:20:23] Trustee Patrick: Are there any additions or changes

[0:20:26] Trustee Patrick: that need to be made to those minutes?

[0:20:30] Trustee Patrick: Not seeing any,

[0:20:31] Trustee Patrick: can we approve those minutes through general consent?

[0:20:33] Trustee Patrick: Excellent.

[0:20:35] Trustee Patrick: There was also the special minutes,

[0:20:37] Trustee Patrick: meeting minutes from May the 12th.

[0:20:39] Trustee Patrick: Are there any additions or changes to those?

[0:20:42] Trustee Patrick: Can we approve those through general consent?

[0:20:44] Trustee Patrick: Excellent.

[0:20:44] Trustee Patrick: Thank you very much.

[0:20:46] Trustee Patrick: We have going on, we have the follow-up action list that's on page 17.

[0:20:54] Trustee Patrick: Are there any questions you have of staff or is there anything on this list that staff wish to bring to our attention?

[0:21:04] Trustee Patrick: Not seeing any.

[0:21:05] Trustee Patrick: We will keep moving on.

[0:21:07] Trustee Patrick: Please slow me down.

[0:21:08] Trustee Patrick: I'm going to try to power through as fast as I can.

[0:21:10] Trustee Patrick: If I'm going too fast, please point that out, trustees.

[0:21:13] Trustee Patrick: So we have we have a delegation today. Very happy that we have Justine Stark from the

[0:21:20] Trustee Patrick: Capital Regional District here to talk to us about the Southern Gulf Island Transportation

[0:21:25] Trustee Patrick: Integration Plan. Maple, can we get Justine? Yes. I

[0:21:33] Voice 4: moved over there. Yep, moved over there,

[0:21:35] Voice 4: Patrick. There

[0:21:41] Trustee Patrick: she is. Well, welcome, Justine. And the floor is yours.

[0:21:46] Voice 22: Okay, thank you. I'm

[0:21:48] Voice 22: I'm here today to present to the North Pender community

[0:21:50] Voice 22: and the local trust committee,

[0:21:52] Voice 22: the CRD's Transportation Integration Planning Project.

[0:21:56] Voice 22: So we've engaged Watt Consulting

[0:21:59] Voice 22: to develop service model recommendations

[0:22:03] Voice 22: for an integrated transportation service

[0:22:05] Voice 22: that would link the Southern Gulf Islands

[0:22:07] Voice 22: through passenger ferries, active transportation networks

[0:22:12] Voice 22: and public transportation services.

[0:22:13] Voice 22: This is a project that evolved out of a request from the Southern Gulf Islands Community Economic Sustainability Commission,

[0:22:23] Voice 22: which is a regional commission for a transportation commission.

[0:22:29] Voice 22: So they requested that the CRD establish a transportation commission.

[0:22:33] Voice 22: And the way services, the way regional districts work

[0:22:39] Voice 22: is you have commissions to guide services

[0:22:41] Voice 22: and to create services, you need to establish the service

[0:22:48] Voice 22: through voter assent, like a referendum.

[0:22:51] Voice 22: So we've engaged what consulting to work with our team

[0:22:56] Voice 22: of local liaisons and we're in the beginning stages

[0:23:02] Voice 22: of the process.

[0:23:03] Voice 22: So we've struck three technical advisory groups or transportation advisory groups with a focus on each transportation mode.

[0:23:10] Voice 22: And on Pender, we're working with them moving around Pender Society and other transportation advocates so that there's local knowledge and context to the work.

[0:23:19] Voice 22: And the goal, as I mentioned, is to cost out and scope out this integrated service to a level of detail that would enable service establishment,

[0:23:28] Voice 22: establishment, which takes approval of the CRD board. And as I mentioned, voter assent. So we

[0:23:34] Voice 22: are gearing towards a referendum to be on the ballot of the 2022 general election. And so we're

[0:23:45] Voice 22: sort of we're at this point, we've been gathering all the information and interviewing key stakeholders

[0:23:49] Voice 22: like Ministry of Transportation and BC Transit and BC Ferries, School District 64, First Nations,

[0:23:58] Voice 22: the Southern Gulf Islands Harbors Commission who manages the dock system throughout the

[0:24:02] Voice 22: Southern Gulf Islands, water taxi providers, the community parks commissions, community bus

[0:24:07] Voice 22: societies, all the people who have a role in transportation in the islands. And so we're

[0:24:13] Voice 22: getting and what's working now to get all that information together in order to support a more

[0:24:19] Voice 22: broad and in-depth community engagement, like broader community engagement process, which is

[0:24:24] Voice 22: targeted for the fall so um the uh service model recommendations will be made by the end of 2021

[0:24:31] Voice 22: and then decisions um depending on the recommendations and more community

[0:24:37] Voice 22: consultation will continue through 2022 2022 in the lead up to the referendum

[0:24:43] Voice 22: um it's it's a pretty uh pretty broad um service that we're looking to establish

[0:24:50] Voice 22: And the idea would be to enable folks to travel through the islands and across the islands without a single occupancy vehicle.

[0:25:00] Voice 22: So we know that the community bus systems, for example, like on Pender, the bus is just barely viable.

[0:25:09] Voice 22: They had to discontinue last year because of COVID.

[0:25:11] Voice 22: But also there's just not quite enough operating funding to make it a viable bus service.

[0:25:16] Voice 22: What we learned from the Salt Spring Transportation Service is when they did establish the bus ridership just grew exponentially and far exceeded anyone's expectations.

[0:25:27] Voice 22: So we know that the islands, when there is a reliable service, will support a public transit service.

[0:25:34] Voice 22: So that one, I think, is really an important component of this work.

[0:25:40] Voice 22: And the active transportation networks would be kind of more longer term.

[0:25:45] Voice 22: The reason the CRD needs to get involved in this or some level of government is because trail societies and other folks like Moving Around Pender have mapped out an active transportation plan for the islands, but the Ministry of Transportation won't issue them licenses of occupation, for example, on the roadside.

[0:26:06] Voice 22: They need a government organization to hold those licenses.

[0:26:09] Voice 22: And so certainly don't want to insert the CRD in a way that's going to be more cumbersome than necessary into the island mobility network.

[0:26:20] Voice 22: But part of our work is to understand what that role of the CRD should be at minimum in order to support and enable a more integrated transportation network on the islands.

[0:26:31] Voice 22: so um i think with that i'll i'll just i'll turn to trustees for questions and um and i'm sure

[0:26:39] Voice 22: there'll there'll be more detail kind of that comes out of that trustees questions

[0:26:44] Trustee Patrick: yeah do you

[0:26:47] Trustee McConchie: want to go ahead or yeah

[0:26:48] Trustee Morrison: i i have a few questions about this so in terms of of and i maybe this is

[0:26:55] Trustee Morrison: just something that has to unfold as as the commission goes forward but um in terms of the

[0:27:02] Trustee Morrison: sort of requirements of what gets done in trails or other forms of transportation

[0:27:08] Trustee Morrison: will it really be island developed or will it have to abide by particular criteria so i'm like

[0:27:15] Trustee Morrison: thinking of these like highly engineered trails in victoria and i'm wondering like that doesn't

[0:27:20] Trustee Morrison: really seem appropriate here but like what is the sort of island version of that that we'd want to

[0:27:26] Trustee Morrison: to have here. And how we go about establishing where those trails are is also somewhat contentious

[0:27:33] Trustee Morrison: because it interweaves with other things. So things like the helipad. And so we want to be

[0:27:42] Trustee Morrison: careful that we don't do a single issue transportation thing and then mess up something

[0:27:48] Trustee Morrison: else. So I'm just wondering how you're thinking about that.

[0:27:53] Voice 22: Yeah, excellent question. And thank

[0:27:55] Voice 22: Thank you. That's a major goal of this is to establish some standards for the trails that will be acceptable to the Ministry of Transportation.

[0:28:06] Voice 22: So they will issue the license of occupation.

[0:28:08] Voice 22: And we're really looking actually to Salt Spring, which is developing that kind of middle road, pardon the pun, side of the road, like an example.

[0:28:19] Voice 22: So there's some new trail developments on Salt Spring.

[0:28:21] Voice 22: They're still not cheap, but they are not galloping gooses.

[0:28:25] Voice 22: um you know and and also the main so you know you might know about the regional parks developing the

[0:28:31] Voice 22: um spine trail over the southern gulf islands um and starting with the leg on main island which

[0:28:36] Voice 22: is being proposed um at i think a higher and more skookum standard than we would want to um have

[0:28:44] Voice 22: you know that would it would be viable to actually see the development of the active transportation

[0:28:48] Voice 22: network we need to build it to a lesser standard and yeah so that's that's key we've heard that

[0:28:53] Voice 22: strongly we knew that going in that Islanders can do it you know and and

[0:28:58] Voice 22: just let us do it and so we just that's the idea is to understand like how how

[0:29:03] Voice 22: minimum the involvement of the CRD can be and and to support that you had

[0:29:10] Voice 22: another piece there oh yeah so the and then the existing trail networks and all

[0:29:14] Voice 22: the complicated each island is different but we are part of our community

[0:29:17] Voice 22: engagement in the fall is a community mapping process so we'll be showing what

[0:29:22] Voice 22: we know about where the existing trails are and who operates and manages them and then having

[0:29:27] Voice 22: people through um hope maybe in maybe live uh workshops but also we'll have an online interactive

[0:29:33] Voice 22: um application platform like an interactive platform so people can draw their roots and

[0:29:38] Voice 22: connections and and wishes for where connections should be and and just get all that information

[0:29:44] Voice 22: together thank you

[0:29:48] Voice 21: justin okay um

[0:29:52] Trustee McConchie: so thanks justine it's great to have you back in your old

[0:29:54] Trustee McConchie: alma mater here and thanks for giving the presentation um if you don't mind i'm going to

[0:29:59] Trustee McConchie: ask you some

[0:30:00] Trustee McConchie: challenging questions mainly because i mean i feel like the crd director should be here explaining

[0:30:04] Trustee McConchie: this and selling this uh so i'm going to ask those questions which i because i've been a part of this

[0:30:10] Trustee McConchie: type of um transportation initiative since before you joined the crd back when i think it was june

[0:30:15] Trustee McConchie: or june wasn't you're in your position and so it went like this so i was chair of the economic

[0:30:21] Trustee McConchie: sustainability commission one of the main factors i really wanted to get happening was environmental

[0:30:25] Trustee McConchie: transportation so bike paths you know what what could it be like if we connected all the islands

[0:30:30] Trustee McConchie: and we studied ferries going between islands we worked we talked about working with bc ferries

[0:30:36] Trustee McConchie: we tried to figure out what's why the bus aren't properly funded and it came down to you sort of

[0:30:42] Trustee McConchie: have to like work with what you got because we're asking a lot of taxpayers you know to pay for

[0:30:48] Trustee McConchie: stuff and our health care society uh really needs money right now and folks in the magic lake sewer

[0:30:55] Trustee McConchie: sewer and water system have already got thousands of dollars of bills that they have to pay for

[0:31:00] Trustee McConchie: upgrades for the sewer, right? So my question is, is why will this service do something that's

[0:31:06] Trustee McConchie: different than what has been done before? And let me just also just state that in the Parks

[0:31:13] Trustee McConchie: and Recreation Commission, which you know I'm chair of, we applied for a bike path. We did it

[0:31:19] Trustee McConchie: through that commission. We didn't need another commission to do it. We just needed an entity to

[0:31:24] Trustee McConchie: funnel the money right because map is not actually a society at all even though you called it a

[0:31:29] Trustee McConchie: society it's a it's a group of dudes right and they can apply for and girls some some women but

[0:31:34] Trustee McConchie: it's male centric um and it's it's a it's they can apply for their own grant money that way uh

[0:31:40] Trustee McConchie: sorry through the parks and recreation commission so um when i'm what i'm wondering is why now like

[0:31:47] Trustee McConchie: like we're asking a lot of taxpayers right now and this has been studied to death village bay

[0:31:54] Trustee McConchie: can't, sorry, the trail from Village Bay on Main Island to town can't be built. I walked on Main

[0:32:00] Trustee McConchie: Island the other day, and there's still stakes in the ground, right? We already have a trail

[0:32:04] Trustee McConchie: plan. We already have studies into what the costs of ferries are. We've already banged on the door

[0:32:10] Trustee McConchie: to the BC transit for, you know, money. You know, what's different this time? And I appreciate you

[0:32:17] Trustee McConchie: taking on the challenging question.

[0:32:19] Voice 22: Yeah, of course. Well, what's different is nobody ever

[0:32:22] Voice 22: took all that information and applied it like this is implementing all that years all those

[0:32:27] Voice 22: years of work because they're the regional district is positioned to to bring all those

[0:32:33] Voice 22: disparate parts together under an umbrella that can enable implementation so um the parks uh i'm

[0:32:42] Voice 22: so glad that the penders parks commission is advancing the honors bypass trail but that

[0:32:47] Voice 22: is particular to this commission's composition and your leadership as chair of that commission

[0:32:52] Voice 22: to find it acceptable to develop a recreational trail

[0:32:57] Voice 22: because of course the commissions

[0:32:59] Voice 22: are responsible for recreation.

[0:33:01] Voice 22: So it's gonna be a stretch

[0:33:03] Voice 22: if you wanna actually integrate transportation.

[0:33:06] Voice 22: The commission wouldn't, for example,

[0:33:09] Voice 22: be able to fund shortfalls for operating expenses

[0:33:12] Voice 22: of the community bus.

[0:33:14] Voice 22: And the BC transit study that was done

[0:33:16] Voice 22: found that the islands are on the border of viability

[0:33:21] Voice 22: and and there is a community contribution that's required to be able to you know if we were to go

[0:33:27] Voice 22: with a bc transit model so there's different models there's the community bus model and the

[0:33:31] Voice 22: bc transit model and we're costing them both out for the community to decide but if we were to go

[0:33:36] Voice 22: with the bc transit model they'll provide 60 however you know the community needs to cough

[0:33:42] Voice 22: up some money and the only um instrument to be able to gather that community contribution is

[0:33:48] Voice 22: through a service establishment or like a tax requisition and so of course we want to make it

[0:33:54] Voice 22: affordable we don't want to overburden the community with all the the taxes but there's

[0:34:00] Voice 22: also high needs in an unincorporated electoral area you have service needs and you know it's

[0:34:07] Voice 22: it's up to the community to pay for them so yeah

[0:34:10] Trustee McConchie: I guess thanks for that explanation I guess I mean

[0:34:13] Trustee McConchie: I mean, we can't even fix the dip on self-pander.

[0:34:16] Trustee McConchie: We can't even get the Ministry of Transportation on the phone to tell us if a road's going to fall into the ocean.

[0:34:22] Trustee McConchie: So I'm curious to know why the CRD thinks it can work with MOTI if we apply this service and actually make stuff work.

[0:34:31] Trustee McConchie: Because I've been banging the drum thinking of various ways to happen.

[0:34:34] Trustee McConchie: And I'm just wondering what another level of bureaucracy will do on top of the bureaucracy we have to deal with.

[0:34:41] Trustee McConchie: Anyways, I know it's a political statement, but I look forward to the CRD with public consultation, and I think the intent of it is good.

[0:34:48] Trustee McConchie: I'm just wondering if we are asking too much of taxpayers on this island already when we have crumbling infrastructure.

[0:34:59] Trustee Patrick: Okay, well, I really want to thank you, Justine, for taking that integrated approach.

[0:35:06] Trustee Patrick: I think that was the right not to look at one mode of transportation, but look at it in an integrated way.

[0:35:11] Trustee Patrick: I didn't get a chance I should have had my notes here for, you know, the trustees asked me to bring up relationships with the CRD and infrastructure projects through the executive which I did yesterday, and they first step was they strongly

[0:35:29] Trustee Patrick: really recommended we bring it to the southern gulf island forum because main island and others

[0:35:34] Trustee Patrick: are also saying that you know for coordinating with the crd on infrastructure projects that you

[0:35:39] Trustee Patrick: know whether we need to change some of the standards with modi or there's you know it starts

[0:35:44] Trustee Patrick: to get complex of all these people that are involved that maybe the southern gulf island

[0:35:47] Trustee Patrick: forum if we should see if we could raise that as an issue to bring the players together through

[0:35:52] Trustee Patrick: that forum too yeah

[0:35:54] Voice 22: absolutely at the political level um i find i'm disengaged with this forum

[0:35:59] Voice 22: i'm not aware of what happens when it is or what's discussed and so um you know like in in my

[0:36:06] Voice 22: role as staff it would be um good to make sure to keep us in the loop too like we need communication

[0:36:12] Voice 22: there because you know we're the busy bees well

[0:36:15] Trustee Patrick: thank you we're well we're just trying to figure

[0:36:17] Trustee Patrick: out what what they're going to do but you're i think that's the key is to have the right once

[0:36:22] Trustee Patrick: we figure it out what what we'd like to focus on is to have the right people at the table so we can

[0:36:26] Trustee Patrick: and make those conversations and move things forward.

[0:36:29] Trustee Morrison: Can I

[0:36:30] Trustee Patrick: ask one further question?

[0:36:31] Trustee Morrison: Yes, please.

[0:36:32] Trustee Morrison: So I take Ben's questions to heart,

[0:36:36] Trustee Morrison: like in the context of we pay a certain amount to the CRD

[0:36:42] Trustee Morrison: for particular things already,

[0:36:43] Trustee Morrison: and it's not an insignificant amount

[0:36:46] Trustee Morrison: as taxpayers on tender.

[0:36:47] Trustee Morrison: And so if we were to choose a particular service,

[0:36:53] Trustee Morrison: service, I can understand having an additional tax requisition if as a community we decide that

[0:36:59] Trustee Morrison: we want a busing service or we want whatever it is specifically. So my understanding of what you're

[0:37:05] Trustee Morrison: doing right now is not that this particular moment is going to cost anybody any additional money,

[0:37:11] Trustee Morrison: but that you're going to synthesize all the work that has been done to date and tell us what our

[0:37:16] Trustee Morrison: options are going forward um and that potentially because map has cannot hold land that or cannot

[0:37:23] Trustee Morrison: hold these special licenses or whatever it is from the ministry of transportation that that would be

[0:37:28] Trustee Morrison: something the crd actually has the capacity to be able to do um and so i guess the question i have

[0:37:35] Trustee Morrison: is like holding the licenses for the ministry of transportation versus running a bus service or a

[0:37:44] Trustee Morrison: larger set of active transportation efforts seem to be like two different scales of work

[0:37:51] Trustee Morrison: which may require sort of a tax service the other which i don't know that it does so can you talk

[0:37:58] Trustee Morrison: to about like if it was just at a minimum holding the ability for us to have the trail network here

[0:38:03] Trustee Morrison: on pender of some kind it's done locally um would that require some kind of tax service so

[0:38:13] Voice 22: it's kind

[0:38:15] Voice 22: Your question is getting to the nugget of defining what the service model would be.

[0:38:21] Voice 22: And yeah, you're right.

[0:38:22] Voice 22: We're not there yet.

[0:38:23] Voice 22: That's what this is all about is trying to scope it and understand the cost between the

[0:38:29] Voice 22: water-based proposal, public transit proposal, the active transportation proposal.

[0:38:35] Voice 22: So each mode will have different costs and have, I think, require a different role for

[0:38:42] Voice 22: the CRD.

[0:38:42] Voice 22: And I think like from now, like where I'm sitting right now, imagining how it's going to be without having all the information in is for the water base, probably the CRD would be contracting with service providers like water taxi service providers on a route and collecting the tax money to make up the difference between what the water taxis need to operate and make a living.

[0:39:12] Voice 22: little bit of money and what's an acceptable fare for a passenger so to support that's the

[0:39:18] Voice 22: community benefit is making it affordable enough that people use it and if it were you know there

[0:39:25] Voice 22: you know if it were viable if it were affordable enough and it were viable it would already be

[0:39:30] Voice 22: happening the private sector would be delivering it so there is um in for the water-based you know

[0:39:36] Voice 22: there seems to be you know demand people are asking us for this um but there needs to be some

[0:39:42] Voice 22: kind of public funding to lift it off the ground. And the water one is really interesting because I

[0:39:47] Voice 22: get excited about the idea of people living on one island and working on another and being able to

[0:39:51] Voice 22: travel back and forth in a work day without relying on BC ferries, which it doesn't make

[0:39:56] Voice 22: it viable to have the islands function as a broader community, but that's kind of a bit of

[0:40:01] Voice 22: a tangent. And sorry, I just, oh yeah, so the different service models. Did I answer your

[0:40:11] Voice 22: question at all I feel like I lost the second half of it but yeah

[0:40:16] Trustee Morrison: just that if we were having

[0:40:17] Trustee Morrison: a minimum of say a trail network being something that the CRD could potentially hold licenses from

[0:40:25] Trustee Morrison: MOTI but not necessarily offer other services and we could do it internally for the remainder

[0:40:30] Voice 22: yeah like so for the trails that's that's a really key one that we want to develop a workable model

[0:40:36] Voice 22: right so CRD holds the licenses of occupations and then the way it works on Salt Spring is the

[0:40:42] Voice 22: The Transportation Commission works with Partners Creating Pathways, which is the nonprofit society, or I think I got that name right, that's actually planning the trails and building the trails and bringing the volunteers on.

[0:40:55] Voice 22: And there's, you know, like, I'm not going to sugarcoat it, right?

[0:41:00] Voice 22: CRD is difficult to work with.

[0:41:02] Voice 22: We have insurance requirements.

[0:41:03] Voice 22: We have standards.

[0:41:04] Voice 22: And government in general is difficult to work with.

[0:41:06] Voice 22: Like, MOTI requires engineered designs.

[0:41:08] Voice 22: And so you're

[0:41:09] Voice 22: not going to get around this, whether it's MAP, you know, if MAP magically was permitted to have licenses for the roadsides, they would still need to meet those engineering standards.

[0:41:20] Voice 22: So there's a cost to it, and it's going to come down to whether the community wants this or not.

[0:41:26] Voice 22: And we've been requested to provide it.

[0:41:29] Voice 22: So then we'll cost it out and give it back to the community to decide.

[0:41:39] Trustee Patrick: All right.

[0:41:40] Trustee Patrick: Any other questions?

[0:41:43] Trustee Patrick: I really appreciate the work that you're doing and, and Justine and to bring this forward and

[0:41:49] Trustee Patrick: understand that it would be, it's going to be a lot more conversations with the community to come

[0:41:54] Trustee Patrick: and then potentially a referendum in 22. I just

[0:42:01] Trustee McConchie: have one quick question. So if the,

[0:42:02] Trustee McConchie: so is this the only CRD referendum question to your knowledge right now that Islanders may face,

[0:42:12] Voice 22: um hopefully you know requests come from the community like the pender island health society

[0:42:18] Voice 22: has has asked the crd to hold a referendum so that to to fund that as a service and so that's

[0:42:26] Voice 22: one there's things that are beyond our control yeah i'd like to only have one referendum question

[0:42:30] Voice 22: on that ballot because you know it's too much there's

[0:42:34] Trustee McConchie: other other things like connectivity

[0:42:36] Voice 22: which we're working on and maybe we're hoping to do without going to

[0:42:40] Voice 22: referendum.

[0:42:41] Trustee McConchie: So you're suggesting there's potentially two referendum questions.

[0:42:44] Trustee McConchie: One is to fund the healthcare society and one is to fund the transportation

[0:42:50] Trustee McConchie: service commission.

[0:42:51] Trustee McConchie: I

[0:42:51] Voice 22: think their goal is to run a referendum for the healthcare society this

[0:42:56] Voice 22: year.

[0:42:58] Trustee McConchie: This year in 2021. Okay.

[0:43:03] Trustee McConchie: Well, it'd be great to let us know if you have any reports on that,

[0:43:06] Trustee McConchie: so we can let the community know about that.

[0:43:08] Voice 22: yeah so that that's one where the pender health care society will be in charge of doing

[0:43:13] Voice 22: communications around that because it's a it's a contribution society so crd isn't going to promote

[0:43:18] Voice 22: it because we need to stay neutral on that i

[0:43:20] Trustee McConchie: see okay yeah

[0:43:21] Voice 22: all

[0:43:23] Trustee Patrick: right any other questions for justine

[0:43:25] Trustee Patrick: thank you thank you justine for coming today and uh have a great rest of your day okay thanks

[0:43:32] Voice 22: everyone have a good meeting all

[0:43:33] Trustee Patrick: right thanks trustees are you ready to go right into the

[0:43:37] Trustee Patrick: applications and please wave me down if you need a break at some point i'll just keep processing

[0:43:42] Trustee Patrick: away so we have our first application here on page 21 of the agenda package it's a temporary

[0:43:50] Trustee Patrick: use permit 2021.3 wilmot and i see we have planner stockville here to give the staff report thank you

[0:43:56] Trustee Patrick: chair patrick

[0:43:57] Planner Stockdill (probable): thank you so the purpose of this report is to consider a renewal of a temporary

[0:44:02] Planner Stockdill (probable): a use permit for industrial use on a rural property. If the renewal is approved, this

[0:44:10] Planner Stockdill (probable): would allow the continuation of the use of a portable sawmill and also a firewood splitting

[0:44:15] Planner Stockdill (probable): operation. The applicant applied for a TUP back in 2017 to legalize this industrial use.

[0:44:25] Planner Stockdill (probable): The application was a result of bylaw enforcement that was initially started, the illegal use was initially started in 2012.

[0:44:38] Planner Stockdill (probable): So for the first TUP application, the LTC did approve it back in 2018.

[0:44:46] Planner Stockdill (probable): 2018. There was a LTC resolution that states that a note should be placed on file indicating

[0:44:55] Planner Stockdill (probable): that the LTC recommends that any application for renewal of this temporary use permit be

[0:45:02] Planner Stockdill (probable): denied and that any application for rezoning for industrial use also be denied.

[0:45:07] Planner Stockdill (probable): The first TUP, that's TUP 2017.2 that was approved in 2018, actually expired this year on May 1.

[0:45:21] Planner Stockdill (probable): So the applicants are now applying to renew their TUP application for an additional three years.

[0:45:28] Planner Stockdill (probable): The applicants state that they do plan to build a suite in their barn that's located on their property.

[0:45:36] Planner Stockdill (probable): although in order to afford the construction of this suite they need to create further income

[0:45:43] Planner Stockdill (probable): from their wood splitting and sawmill business as they spent a considerable amount on the

[0:45:50] Planner Stockdill (probable): construction of the sound abatement structure that was a requirement of that first TUP.

[0:45:56] Planner Stockdill (probable): The applicants have provided a number of letters outlining their TUP renewal. Also they've

[0:46:04] Planner Stockdill (probable): confirmed that they complied with all the tup conditions in terms of ocp designations and

[0:46:13] Planner Stockdill (probable): the lub the subject property is designated rule in the ocp and it is zoned rule comprehensive one

[0:46:21] Planner Stockdill (probable): and the principal use of that zone is dwellings agriculture and cottages the north pender lub

[0:46:28] Planner Stockdill (probable): does have a section for that permits home industrial regulations. But the purpose of

[0:46:36] Planner Stockdill (probable): that is there must be a primary residential use on that property first. In this case,

[0:46:42] Planner Stockdill (probable): the subject property does not have that dwelling unit. Home industry use is permitted on lots

[0:46:51] Planner Stockdill (probable): greater than two hectares and the subject property is 3.2 hectares in size. The applicant is aware

[0:46:58] Planner Stockdill (probable): that if they construct a residential use that their use could be then in compliance with the

[0:47:07] Planner Stockdill (probable): home industry regulations in the LUB although there are a number of regulations that they may

[0:47:12] Planner Stockdill (probable): have difficulty actually complying with and that's the 50 meter setback requirement and there's also

[0:47:18] Planner Stockdill (probable): regulation stating that no noise is permitted at any lot line from the industrial or the home

[0:47:26] Planner Stockdill (probable): industry use in terms of economic benefit the use certainly does provide a service to the community

[0:47:34] Planner Stockdill (probable): by processing timber on the island and the economic benefit in terms of supporting a local

[0:47:39] Planner Stockdill (probable): business and employment and the applicants have provided a number of letters of support from

[0:47:47] Planner Stockdill (probable): community members and neighbors we also have received a number of letters that are opposed to

[0:47:54] Planner Stockdill (probable): this application so in terms of bylaw enforcement the bylaw enforcement officer did make a site

[0:48:02] Planner Stockdill (probable): visit last week and noted a number of discrepancies with the tup conditions and that's the storage of

[0:48:08] Planner Stockdill (probable): wood outside of the tup area a fire extinguisher is not remaining within the tup area at all times

[0:48:17] Planner Stockdill (probable): the applicant stated that they do actually get a fire permit so that they seem to have satisfied

[0:48:23] Planner Stockdill (probable): So, in terms of the rationale, the staff have put forward a recommendation to not approve the TUP renewal based on the fact of the previous LTC's resolution.

[0:48:36] Planner Stockdill (probable): And staff also believe that the potential impacts on the local neighbourhood and concerns raised by noise and so forth.

[0:48:44] Planner Stockdill (probable): Although there have been a number of letters of support received as well.

[0:48:48] Planner Stockdill (probable): So if the LTC does decide to approve the TUP renewal, the LTC should indicate how many years

[0:48:54] Planner Stockdill (probable): the permit should be issued for. And again, that's not greater than three years. And because this is

[0:49:00] Planner Stockdill (probable): a TUP renewal, the LTC cannot make any type of changes to the TUP. So as I mentioned, there's

[0:49:09] Planner Stockdill (probable): two alternatives for the LTC to consider. The first one is to request further information.

[0:49:13] Planner Stockdill (probable): The second one is to approve the application and staff have made the recommendation to deny the TUP renewal.

[0:49:23] Planner Stockdill (probable): And I believe the applicant is also here to answer any questions the LTC may have.

[0:49:28] Trustee Patrick: Thank you very much, Planner Stockdale. Maple, can we get the applicant moved over?

[0:49:35] Voice 4: Yes, I've just moved Alan Wilmot over here to the panelist side.

[0:49:45] Trustee Patrick: mr wilmot if you can turn yours you can turn your video and your audio on if you can find

[0:49:54] Trustee Patrick: that it's at the bottom of your screen on the left hand side unmute hello hello there you are

[0:50:01] Voice 1: do you see us yes

[0:50:03] Trustee Patrick: we can we can can you hear us yes very very very clearly thank you all right

[0:50:08] Trustee Patrick: thank you is there anything you'd like to add to the planners report uh

[0:50:13] Voice 13: yes so we'd like to thank

[0:50:15] Voice 13: you for the opportunity to address the local trust council reason renewal over tup at winter

[0:50:23] Voice 13: creek farm our acreage on houston road we have a strong commitment to maintaining a healthy

[0:50:29] Voice 13: environment we have captured runoff water from an artesian spring on our property to create a

[0:50:36] Voice 13: beautiful pond that also serves to protect an upper wetland area and is a source of water for

[0:50:42] Voice 13: fire protection we have maintained the forest curtain around our property by not removing

[0:50:48] Voice 13: any trees from our boundaries our business operation takes place in a valley that was

[0:50:55] Voice 13: once filled with invasive broom this has now been totally eradicated the neighboring ridge

[0:51:05] Voice 13: that's on our property has been maintained and blocked sound to hoosen road

[0:51:10] Voice 13: road. The sound blockage was confirmed in 2017 by a professional sound engineer's report.

[0:51:21] Voice 13: The engineer we hired to give credence to our point of view that no sound was heard

[0:51:30] Voice 13: from down in the valley where the tup is uh up on uh houston road

[0:51:39] Voice 13: we have not altered the original valley drainage ditch that feeds a dpa wetland some 200 feet from

[0:51:50] Voice 13: our sawmilling firewood business we have a siltation fence in place should any runoff

[0:51:55] Voice 13: from our operation occur we remove sparse scrubby forest from the lower slope of our ridge and

[0:52:02] Voice 13: replaced it with 265 trellis apple trees that provide organic apples for the local community

[0:52:09] Voice 13: and to supply twin island cider our business itself presents a sustainable model we purchase

[0:52:17] Voice 13: local logs that clients no longer need or want use a local trucking firm to transport them to

[0:52:23] Voice 13: our property and and then repurpose those logs into lumber firewood off cuts and kindling therefore

[0:52:32] Voice 13: or thereby creating very minimal waste these products then return to the community less

[0:52:38] Voice 13: thus reducing our carbon footprint and avoiding bringing invasive species to the island

[0:52:44] Voice 13: many university uh uh faculties of forestry recommend that fire would not be brought on

[0:52:54] Voice 13: to an island because of the invasives that can be carried on the load many pender island families

[0:53:01] Voice 13: and local contractors depend on our services.

[0:53:05] Voice 13: Our firewood list consists of 75% of senior citizens

[0:53:09] Voice 13: who cannot source their own firewood.

[0:53:12] Voice 13: We have worked hard since we bought our property in 2004

[0:53:15] Voice 13: to be a good community neighbor

[0:53:17] Voice 13: and to preserve our land in a park-like setting.

[0:53:20] Voice 13: We wish to continue our business efforts

[0:53:23] Voice 13: in order to satisfy local needs

[0:53:26] Voice 13: and to be able to afford to build a suite

[0:53:29] Voice 13: in our 3,000-square-foot barn

[0:53:32] Voice 13: to house and employ a local person in our business.

[0:53:35] Voice 13: To that end, we have had the suite plans professionally drawn

[0:53:40] Voice 13: which are ready to go to permitting

[0:53:43] Voice 13: once we have the funding in place.

[0:53:45] Voice 13: To the best of our ability,

[0:53:47] Voice 13: we have set aside the numerous conditions of our current TUP.

[0:53:51] Voice 13: When we received the TUP in 2017,

[0:53:55] Voice 13: we estimated the sound abatement structure required

[0:53:58] Voice 13: required, we would cost $10,000. To this end, the cost was over $46,000, and we had to buy a new

[0:54:08] Voice 13: wood truck with four-wheel drive to be able to use our firewood processor inside the fenced area.

[0:54:14] Voice 13: This cost an additional $26,000. Therefore, we could not afford to build a barn suite in the

[0:54:21] Voice 13: last three-year period. We have been very serious about fire suppression, should it ever be needed.

[0:54:28] Voice 13: We have established a clear 15-meter firebreak around our sound abatement structure, mill, and shed.

[0:54:37] Voice 13: We have 13,000 gallons of water stored in two tanks.

[0:54:40] Voice 13: They are plumbed with hoses that reach to the TUP area and a pump should they be needed.

[0:54:48] Voice 13: We also have a water source inside the mill shed charged and ready to go.

[0:54:56] Voice 13: along with two industrial fire extinguish in the tup area and a and three more in the barn

[0:55:04] Voice 13: additional water sources include a 2500 gallon orchard water tank our 13 foot deep pond and

[0:55:11] Voice 13: our neighbor's 25 foot deep pond in fact our local fire chief had no problem granting us a special

[0:55:17] Voice 13: permit to work during extreme fire conditions last year due to our fire safety efforts we feel

[0:55:23] Voice 13: there are some clarifications needed in the Islands Trust staff report. We have

[0:55:30] Voice 13: had no complaints lodged against us during the three-year period of our TUP.

[0:55:36] Voice 13: The report averages lot sizes but in fact on the valley side of Hoosin where

[0:55:42] Voice 13: we are located there are only seven lots versus 19 lots on the ocean side. The lots

[0:55:49] Voice 13: So joining our eight acre lot are 8.5 and five acres.

[0:55:52] Voice 13: Our adjacent excuse me, neighbors are supportive of our operation.

[0:55:57] Voice 13: The average lot size

[0:56:02] Voice 13: on our site of on our side of the road

[0:56:05] Voice 13: is six acres versus 3.37 on the other side.

[0:56:10] Voice 13: The report character

[0:56:12] Voice 13: characterizes us as being knowing compliant when in fact

[0:56:16] Voice 13: we've been very compliant, moving our firewood operation

[0:56:18] Voice 13: from near Hoosin Road in 2016

[0:56:23] Voice 13: at the request of Warren Dingman, the bylaw officer.

[0:56:27] Voice 13: We had plans drawn for a 600-foot square-foot cottage

[0:56:33] Voice 13: near our pond and received a permit for that in 2017.

[0:56:37] Voice 13: However, three weeks after the permit was issued,

[0:56:40] Voice 13: the building inspector informed us

[0:56:42] Voice 13: that he had changed his mind

[0:56:43] Voice 13: and withdrew permission to proceed

[0:56:46] Voice 13: until we had a geotech survey which would likely require a needed retainer wall built against the

[0:56:55] Voice 13: ridge adding to the building site hence our affordable cottage doubled in price thus we

[0:57:01] Voice 13: could not afford it so we canceled our permit with the intention to build the suite in our barn

[0:57:06] Voice 13: instead the building inspector agreed that was feasible and we have complied with the many

[0:57:13] Voice 13: conditions of our tup including not operating on weekends and and working uh on weekdays

[0:57:21] Voice 13: between 10 and 4. as to um as to noise from our business being heard on the adjacent national park

[0:57:30] Voice 13: it should be noted there is currently no public access to the area the one complaint received

[0:57:36] Voice 13: received in 2017 with regard was with regard to our planer. Since that complaint, we have not used the machine in the last three years. And should we need it, we would use it inside our barn as the TUP allows or allowed. Since we have an hour meter on our mills, we are able to definitely state that the mill operates about 16 hours a

[0:58:05] Voice 13: month that's an average cutting time of five hours per month as two-thirds of the time the mill

[0:58:14] Voice 13: operates involves moving positioning off looting logs and lumber and it when it's when the mill

[0:58:25] Voice 13: is idling do this two-thirds of the time the sound is very low um it it should be noted that

[0:58:34] Voice 13: other business on houston road create both noise and traffic if we had an issue in these business

[0:58:41] Voice 13: if we had an issue with these business we would approach the owners and try to resolve our

[0:58:46] Voice 13: concerns unfortunately the two neighbors who have complained have not approached us additional

[0:58:52] Voice 13: traffic and noise is generated by current lot development on the ocean side of the road

[0:58:59] Voice 13: courier deliveries, construction activities, as well as visitors to Mount Menzies Park

[0:59:05] Voice 13: at the end of Hoosen Road. We feel the benefits of our business to the local community

[0:59:10] Voice 13: and the sustainable nature of our venture outweigh opposition voiced by two Hoosen

[0:59:17] Voice 13: residents. Our letters of support include two from Hoosen residents, one immediately across the

[0:59:23] Voice 13: street and one directly or directly adjacent to our property we also have several letters of support

[0:59:32] Voice 13: from the wider pender island community one final note our son alistair who is a co-owner of the

[0:59:41] Voice 13: property with us holds an msc in environmental management from the university of london

[0:59:47] Voice 13: He has operated a global consulting business in renewable light and power for the past 14 years.

[1:00:00] Voice 13: sustainability and the environmental aspect of our operations very seriously thank you for

[1:00:07] Voice 13: considering our request thank

[1:00:10] Trustee Patrick: you very much uh mr wolat and the trustees may have questions for you

[1:00:14] Trustee Patrick: or staff so uh trustees who'd like to go first trustee mcconkie all

[1:00:23] Trustee McConchie: right thanks very much

[1:00:25] Trustee McConchie: al and julie for coming uh i mean it's pretty thorough there al i i was like wow what else

[1:00:30] Trustee McConchie: could we do is other than a cavity search or something on this situation this is very detailed

[1:00:35] Trustee McConchie: information on a sawmill um you know one of the realities of living on this island is that we do

[1:00:41] Trustee McConchie: have trees that fall and we have trees that require clearing uh we have uh you know to make way for

[1:00:48] Trustee McConchie: people's cabins or whatever and it makes sense not to ship it off island and and have it operating

[1:00:54] Trustee McConchie: on island that that's logical to me and so uh i'm definitely in support of the the uh this uh permit

[1:01:01] Trustee McConchie: uh for another three years um especially considering all the efforts that they have gone

[1:01:06] Trustee McConchie: and the cost they've undertaken to uh make this uh business um work and uh support islanders of

[1:01:14] Trustee McConchie: course the the main concern i have i've already spoken to julie and al about this is where they

[1:01:20] Trustee McConchie: they get their logs from and that it is not a hands-off approach to logging on pender and that's

[1:01:29] Trustee McConchie: something I don't believe I can put in this TUP but other than to to rationalize with our

[1:01:35] Trustee McConchie: contractors our arborists and the people that process the wood that there's a healthy way of

[1:01:41] Trustee McConchie: managing forests on this island and that that's key a key component to this so my hope is that

[1:01:48] Trustee McConchie: that with the approval of this permit the Wilmots will continue to consider this

[1:01:54] Trustee McConchie: in any logs that they take from anything in the future because I certainly don't want to see some

[1:02:00] Trustee McConchie: of the forestry practices that have been taking place on this island I believe it is a bad

[1:02:05] Trustee McConchie: precedent and I believe it is not healthy for our forests considering you know as we talked about

[1:02:11] Trustee McConchie: the climate change is impacting our forests in a major way the cedar trees are dying the arbutus

[1:02:18] Trustee McConchie: are undergoing a major blight and we will need to deal with that wood that falls and dies and

[1:02:24] Voice 11: but

[1:02:25] Trustee McConchie: but i certainly don't think clear cuts are the best way to go about that

[1:02:30] Trustee McConchie: so like i said to you julian l i think if my decision here is to talk about how land use

[1:02:37] Trustee McConchie: and uh the huson valley has a long history of logging uh and forestry processing um so it is

[1:02:45] Trustee McConchie: is within land use history, I would say. But just my final plea is to make this business a healthy

[1:02:56] Trustee McConchie: one by encouraging our local contractors to practice in environmentally sustainable and

[1:03:04] Trustee McConchie: healthy ways with our forests. And that's basically those are my only comments as I've

[1:03:09] Trustee McConchie: asked numerous questions of Alan and Julie already, and I thank them for presenting today.

[1:03:15] Trustee Patrick: Thank you, Trustee McConkie. Trustee Morrison.

[1:03:18] Trustee Morrison: Yeah, so I, first of all, thanks to staff report, I completely understand why the recommendation

[1:03:28] Trustee Morrison: is the way it is from staff, given that there isn't a residence, that's the place where

[1:03:33] Trustee Morrison: it really breaks our bylaw, because there is no residence on board. But having talked

[1:03:41] Trustee Morrison: through the situation and looked at all the documentation around this there is intent to

[1:03:46] Trustee Morrison: put a residence on the site and there there has been like this exactly what alan just said around

[1:03:53] Trustee Morrison: like having this original site for the house and then a shift because the geotechnical survey and

[1:03:59] Trustee Morrison: now it going into the barn and that is underway so my expectation would be that if we renew the

[1:04:06] Trustee Morrison: permit that three years from now there would be illegal or illegal residents on the property

[1:04:12] Trustee Morrison: and that would change the nature of this request and just a clarification from staff at that point

[1:04:18] Trustee Morrison: I want to understand exactly where the sort of resistance is for this because I want to make

[1:04:23] Trustee Morrison: sure that we're compliant with our own bylaws so if there is a residence on the site what would be

[1:04:31] Trustee Morrison: the remaining um issues that you'd say fire i heard fire suppression equipment which i saw in

[1:04:39] Trustee Morrison: place when i did the site um and what was the other one so

[1:04:44] Planner Stockdill (probable): in terms of the applicant meeting

[1:04:47] Planner Stockdill (probable): the home uh home industry regulations uh the two issues number one would be um the setback of 50

[1:04:55] Planner Stockdill (probable): meters from any lot line. From my understanding they currently do not meet the 50 meter setback

[1:05:02] Planner Stockdill (probable): so that would potentially result in a requirement for a variance to vary that and also there's a

[1:05:11] Planner Stockdill (probable): regulation that states that there must be not or there must not generate any noise in the course

[1:05:18] Planner Stockdill (probable): of the operation that can be heard from any lot line and so a consideration towards the the noise

[1:05:26] Planner Stockdill (probable): we've heard from some neighbors that there has been some noise issues in the past but perhaps

[1:05:32] Planner Stockdill (probable): that sound abatement structure has certainly assisted with the reduction to noise.

[1:05:37] Trustee Morrison: Okay so

[1:05:39] Trustee Morrison: really helpful to understand where that is and I did have a look at the hour meter on the mill

[1:05:46] Trustee Morrison: as well and confirmed that the amount the mill is operating and the structure of it so I feel

[1:05:54] Trustee Morrison: I feel confident in going ahead with this understanding that we're working towards compliance and I'll sort of like trajectory of work.

[1:06:03] Trustee Morrison: And so I would, if it's okay I would like to put a motion on the table around the acceptance of this permit for three years with it so the renewal of this permit for three years.

[1:06:15] Trustee Morrison: But before I do that just want to ensure there's no like other big questions or comments for folks.

[1:06:23] Trustee Patrick: Just two nights ago here on Salt Spring, they had an ecoforestry panel including the community

[1:06:30] Trustee Patrick: forest from Tortoise Island and really talked about the importance to that we're still going

[1:06:38] Trustee Patrick: to have to manage our forests through thinning and other things for fire and so forth as

[1:06:43] Trustee Patrick: we keep to keep our forests healthy and get them to mature and being able to create product

[1:06:51] Trustee Patrick: value-added product on the on the island directly close to that is very important for

[1:06:58] Trustee Patrick: these practices to be to happen so all

[1:07:01] Trustee Morrison: right so i'd like to go ahead and make a motion that the

[1:07:05] Trustee Morrison: north pender local trust committee yep can i yep before

[1:07:09] Trustee McConchie: you start this before you go ahead with a

[1:07:11] Trustee McConchie: emotion we're relying what my my point is that i was trying to make there was that i'm wondering

[1:07:18] Trustee McConchie: if there's we're relying on the goodwill of the applicant to manage for us appropriately right

[1:07:25] Trustee McConchie: so like for example the clear cut that happened i don't want to see happen again that's my point

[1:07:32] Trustee McConchie: that was really bad

[1:07:34] Voice 11: awful

[1:07:37] Trustee McConchie: for our island and here we are on the times colonist right uh and there's

[1:07:42] Trustee McConchie: a clear cut and an advertisement says welcome to pander island i don't want to see that again

[1:07:47] Voice 11: is

[1:07:47] Trustee McConchie: my point is there something so question the staff is there something in a tup we can put

[1:07:52] Trustee McConchie: where it says and the sawmill can't take clear cut logs yeah

[1:07:56] Trustee Morrison: we can't change this one we can't

[1:07:58] Trustee Patrick: change it

[1:07:58] Trustee Morrison: we can't oh

[1:08:00] Trustee Morrison: yeah i think

[1:08:01] Trustee McConchie: my i think my point is made i'm just trying

[1:08:04] Trustee McConchie: to make a public

[1:08:04] Trustee McConchie: point here because i support the application that that man it sure sure upsets me to see that take

[1:08:11] Trustee McConchie: And I know that this is not the responsibility of applicants, but that the applicants do play a role in how we manage our forests.

[1:08:20] Trustee McConchie: And they are very respected in our community and have a lot of influence over our young contractors that certainly need a stern talking to.

[1:08:28] Trustee McConchie: And I know Mr. Wilmot is death capable of that.

[1:08:32] Trustee McConchie: So I just wanted to make that really clear.

[1:08:34] Trustee McConchie: yeah

[1:08:34] Trustee Patrick: and i think conversations like we're we're trying to get started on salt spring like having

[1:08:39] Trustee Patrick: these panel conversations bringing these these eco foresters and examples to prove that it can

[1:08:45] Trustee Patrick: be done and and and how it can be done is part of the education process that we all have to start

[1:08:51] Trustee Patrick: doing yeah and

[1:08:52] Trustee Morrison: one last thought on that and then i can see phil also wants to throw something in i

[1:08:56] Trustee Morrison: I think. So one last thought on that. So I agree completely, Ben, that like we need to just

[1:09:04] Trustee Morrison: constantly be restating that forest management is different than like clear cutting and having

[1:09:12] Trustee Morrison: logs being coming in from that. As a community, we need to kind of stand together against broader

[1:09:19] Trustee Morrison: broader clear cuts and just refuse to service people that are doing that. And I know it were

[1:09:25] Trustee Morrison: difficult. So just as a stance, though, I would encourage people in that vein. Of course, like

[1:09:33] Trustee Morrison: this doesn't mean that like, if you have, you can never cut a tree. I've heard that recently,

[1:09:37] Trustee Morrison: too, from various folks I've been talking to. But people are like, Oh, well, can I never cut

[1:09:42] Trustee Morrison: a tree? I'm like, come on. No, not at all. I have one over on the corner of my house here that I'm

[1:09:46] Trustee Morrison: like hmm that's sketchy i've had bear out to look at it and he actually suggested that we don't

[1:09:51] Trustee Morrison: necessarily cut the tree because it's not necessary at this moment so it's it's wise

[1:09:55] Trustee Morrison: of the trees we have making sure that when they fall we use local sources of processing and this

[1:10:01] Trustee Morrison: is exactly what the willamette mill is doing so i really support the work that they're doing and

[1:10:06] Trustee Morrison: how they're doing it i do encourage them not to take clear cut wood as well like so if we can

[1:10:11] Trustee Morrison: avoid that in the future um and uh there was one last point i had about that um yeah

[1:10:21] Trustee McConchie: can i just add

[1:10:22] Trustee McConchie: the point that there's before we move ahead was that there there's lots of portable sawmills on

[1:10:27] Trustee McConchie: the island and the and the wilmots are have been what's happened to them is it's the part of the

[1:10:33] Trustee McConchie: the complaint process right so there's a bunch of sawmills around the island i know for a fact

[1:10:38] Trustee McConchie: but people don't complain and so now the wilmots had to spend like tens of thousands of dollars

[1:10:42] Trustee McConchie: to try and make their portable sawmill function uh to come up with the current logistics of you

[1:10:47] Trustee McConchie: know how to make that happen which i think is is a real drag for them you know that's a lot of money

[1:10:51] Trustee McConchie: uh especially when they're trying to build an orchard and a farm and uh help support islanders

[1:10:56] Trustee McConchie: so i want to also recognize the stress you know and the and the challenging times that alan julie

[1:11:01] Trustee McConchie: have had to go through as a result of this experience so um i'd be happy if it's okay

[1:11:06] Trustee McConchie: trustee Morrison to make a motion that sorry yeah

[1:11:09] Trustee Morrison: there's there was one comment I think I think that

[1:11:12] Trustee Morrison: Phil had he's been waving this

[1:11:13] Planner: thing I don't want to muddy the waters and this isn't my file so I

[1:11:17] Planner: don't want to step on Kim but do you depending on how how strongly you feel about trustee

[1:11:26] Planner: McConaughey about chain of custody like the sourcing of

[1:11:29] Planner: wood I mean you do have the alternative

[1:11:31] Planner: to deny this application and have them make a new application where you could put those

[1:11:35] Planner: conditions and so if you're it depends on your comfort level so i just wanted to interject that

[1:11:41] Trustee McConchie: i think uh the going through this meeting is is enough and i i think i just made a political point

[1:11:47] Trustee McConchie: that i've already made to julie and al privately and and it's not really to do julie and al alan

[1:11:52] Trustee McConchie: julie are just before the island's trust and we have no other ability to complain about this type

[1:11:56] Trustee McConchie: of thing so alan julie have to sit there and listen to some know-it-all talk about it like me

[1:12:01] Trustee McConchie: so um but i do i do respect what you guys are doing alan julie so i appreciate that uh plan

[1:12:07] Trustee McConchie: to test them all but i'm comfortable moving ahead uh and relying on the goodwill of the

[1:12:11] Trustee McConchie: applicants in this particular circumstance although

[1:12:14] Trustee Morrison: i think in the future um i would

[1:12:17] Trustee Morrison: like to see that on any tups or applications just as a like initial text on it i'd like to

[1:12:24] Trustee Morrison: to see chain of custody of logs because I want to really try to kibosh the issue of like clear

[1:12:31] Trustee Morrison: cuts happening in this location so yeah

[1:12:35] Trustee McConchie: I'd like to make a motion that the north pender island

[1:12:37] Trustee McConchie: local trust committee approve issuance of temporary use permit mptup 2021.3 will not for three years

[1:12:44] Trustee McConchie: my

[1:12:45] Trustee Morrison: second yes

[1:12:45] Trustee Patrick: all right second is there any discussion on this motion no

[1:12:49] Trustee Morrison: it's great to have

[1:12:50] Trustee Morrison: have local business being able to process this stuff and I know there's a lot of artists who

[1:12:55] Trustee Morrison: are using wood in this area too so it's great thank you all

[1:12:59] Trustee Patrick: right then I'll call the vote all

[1:13:01] Trustee Patrick: those in favor and that's carried all right well thank you very much Alan and Julie for being here

[1:13:08] Trustee Patrick: today thank you trustee trustee Stockdale I just elevated you for your report thank you very much

[1:13:16] Voice 13: for hearing us thank you thank

[1:13:18] Trustee Morrison: you for being here and for being so well prepared and all the time

[1:13:22] Trustee Morrison: just to talk this through too thank

[1:13:25] Voice 1: you thank you and thank you both for visiting our property

[1:13:27] Voice 1: most appreciated and uh and trustee patrick i realize your situation is different but thank

[1:13:33] Voice 1: you very much for listening to our situation all

[1:13:37] Trustee Patrick: right well thank you okay uh we're gonna move on

[1:13:40] Trustee Patrick: to the next application uh it is a temporary use permit 2020.1 uh four sorry um grimmer and it's on

[1:13:49] Trustee Patrick: page 63 of the agenda package and i see uh bill testamal is here thank

[1:13:56] Planner: you chair patrick um so

[1:13:58] Planner: this is a renewal application for a temporary use permit uh the original temporary use permit was uh

[1:14:05] Planner: 2018.5 and it's at 4415 bedwell harbour road um and the initial permit was

[1:14:14] Planner: sorry issued for one year and expired on may 12th of 2021 and the permit is for a concrete

[1:14:22] Planner: batch plant and associated uses on a portion uh actually a reduced portion of the subject property

[1:14:28] Planner: property. The intent of the renewal would maintain the subject property in compliance

[1:14:34] Planner: with the land use bylaw. One of the main conditions of renewal that was placed in the TUP was

[1:14:45] Planner: that the applicant provide an environmental monitoring inspection report as part of their

[1:14:53] Planner: renewal application so the applicant had or has hired island engineering which was the initial

[1:15:00] Planner: qep for the environmental management plans that were created for the property and that were

[1:15:06] Planner: integrated into the initial tup they did a site inspection on may 10th of this year and they've

[1:15:16] Planner: submitted a monitoring inspection report and that was is attached to the staff report

[1:15:23] Planner: and includes a completed site inspection checklist and has the following conclusion.

[1:15:31] Planner: It states that it is clear that GEL, which is the, sorry, I forget the name of the, oh, sorry,

[1:15:41] Planner: Gulf Excavation Limited, sorry, has made efforts to comply with the EMP, which is the Environmental

[1:15:47] Planner: Management Plan, but there are several non-conformances noted within the attached

[1:15:51] Planner: attached inspection report that should be addressed prior to the rainy season of 2021.

[1:15:57] Planner: So, just for clarification, staff and myself spoke to Sean Bulvec, who is the QEP, and

[1:16:06] Planner: he indicated that October 1st would be an appropriate onset of the rainy season, if

[1:16:12] Planner: if we can put it that way um so within the tup itself condition 3ff requires that

[1:16:22] Planner: the permitted usage shall conform to all operational methods and environmental mitigation

[1:16:29] Planner: measures best management practices and environmental monitoring monitoring requirements

[1:16:33] Planner: contained in the emp therefore so any deficiency which was has been cited makes the

[1:16:42] Planner: the use is non-compliant.

[1:16:45] Planner: So going back to the report, which,

[1:16:50] Planner: sorry, back to the report and the deficiencies,

[1:16:54] Planner: there's a table that's been created

[1:16:55] Planner: on page 65 of the agenda

[1:16:58] Planner: that lists basically four deficiencies

[1:17:03] Planner: that Island Engineer identified.

[1:17:07] Planner: Just summarizing them,

[1:17:08] Planner: there some construction of berms to direct stormwater away or from the from

[1:17:15] Planner: the area there's there they noted some of the equipment that was not fully

[1:17:22] Planner: contained within within the actual TEP area they weren't retained to do a

[1:17:28] Planner: follow-up monitoring event in 2020 which was one of their recommendations and

[1:17:34] Planner: and there was no documented weekly inspection reports um they did come up they also had some

[1:17:42] Planner: comments on page 11 of that report um i'm not going to summarize those those have been presented

[1:17:48] Planner: to you in the table um in addition to uh the inspection report um bylaw inspector enforcement

[1:17:58] Planner: staff did a site inspection on May 18th just on the basis of that we've noted

[1:18:05] Planner: some other non-conformities and that's on table two and essentially those are

[1:18:10] Planner: that the site access has not been completed so the initial application

[1:18:16] Planner: allowed for the use of for looking at the figure two which is on page 67 and

[1:18:22] Planner: allowed for the use of both site access a and B and at this point in time site

[1:18:28] Planner: access A was to be fully completed and the access on for B which is higher up in the property was

[1:18:37] Planner: to be for emergencies only. Staff understands that that is being undertaken and the pictures

[1:18:45] Planner: indicate or the site inspection indicated that that's being fully underway. It's unclear

[1:18:52] Planner: clear how the public is limited from access to the TUP area. There doesn't seem to be

[1:19:02] Planner: any signage or gating. Also, there's a requirement for non-mountable and locked fencing around

[1:19:13] Planner: the wastewater and retention facility. They have put up snow fencing. It seems to be to

[1:19:19] Planner: the appropriate height but I wouldn't classify snow fencing as lockable nor non-mountable I

[1:19:26] Planner: think you could easily get over that if you wanted to although I understand that this is

[1:19:31] Planner: from basically from the safety of children and wildlife and lastly the required planting

[1:19:39] Planner: that's part of the landscaping plan has does not appear to be completed so that included

[1:19:45] Planner: included the planting of Douglas fir and spirea on the screening berms, and that was supposed

[1:19:53] Planner: to be done within six months of the issuance of the original permit.

[1:19:56] Planner: So at this point, bylaw enforcement is ongoing, and what we've determined is that any compliance

[1:20:05] Planner: agreement that the enforcement would undertake to complete all of the conditions of the TUP,

[1:20:13] Planner: If it's renewed, it would be dovetailed or coordinated to that October 1st deadline, which I indicated with the inspection report.

[1:20:27] Planner: important. There's also notes here about the timing of staff's recommendation is for a two-year

[1:20:33] Planner: renewal and the reason for that is to allow for the land use bylaw review project to complete

[1:20:43] Planner: for industrial particularly for industrial properties and at that point either the property

[1:20:50] Planner: could be pre-zoned or if not it gives the applicant the ability to transition

[1:20:56] Planner: to appropriately zoned property on Pender Island. So with that staff's

[1:21:02] Planner: recommendation as I said is for the renewal of the permit for a two-year

[1:21:06] Planner: period and that recommendation is supported because the applicant has

[1:21:11] Planner: supplied the required professional reported. The use is substantively

[1:21:18] Planner: complying with the TUP and the Environmental Management Plan. Non-compliance will be addressed

[1:21:25] Planner: by continuing bylaw enforcement. There have been no complaints since the issuance of the original

[1:21:32] Planner: permit a year ago. And as I said, the two-year time frame would allow for the LUB project to

[1:21:39] Planner: complete. And alternatives were given. And that's my summary.

[1:21:45] Trustee Patrick: Thank you very much. Is the applicant here, Maple?

[1:21:50] Trustee Patrick: I

[1:21:52] Voice 4: will just move them over one moment, please.

[1:21:56] Voice 4: Just moving Barbara Grimmer over to the panelist side.

[1:22:05] Trustee Patrick: Okay, Barbara, if you can take yourself off of mute and turn your video on, you're welcome to. Down in the lower, yes, can get your audio on. You're welcome to join us on video if you wish as well.

[1:22:18] Voice 10: Is Erin here?

[1:22:22] Trustee Patrick: Maple is...

[1:22:24] Voice 4: I don't think I see Aaron, Barbara. Did you say he was coming or?

[1:22:32] Voice 4: He

[1:22:32] Voice 10: was going to, yeah.

[1:22:33] Voice 10: Okay.

[1:22:34] Voice 4: I don't see him on the list. Did you want me to just forward him an email

[1:22:39] Voice 4: with the link once again right now? Are

[1:22:42] Voice 4: you able to contact him as well?

[1:22:44] Voice 10: I can text him.

[1:22:45] Voice 4: Yes, please. And I'll also send him an email.

[1:22:59] Trustee Patrick: Give him a moment and I'll look to trustees.

[1:23:02] Trustee Patrick: we could

[1:23:07] Trustee Morrison: go ahead and start chatting on when they get in we can all right

[1:23:12] Trustee Morrison: they have additional

[1:23:12] Trustee Morrison: things to say barbara

[1:23:16] Trustee Patrick: if you did you want to speak first or are you confirming no no just

[1:23:20] Trustee Patrick: answering the questions okay

[1:23:22] Trustee McConchie: i've got i've got a couple questions if that's okay sure

[1:23:24] Trustee Patrick: yes no please

[1:23:25] Trustee Patrick: proceed uh

[1:23:27] Trustee McConchie: in on page 65 of the staff report and page 67 sorry 66 65 and 66 of the staff report

[1:23:35] Trustee McConchie: there are two tables table one and table two these are tup non-conformities and emp non-conformities

[1:23:41] Trustee McConchie: and recommendations i'm curious to know why these uh are not haven't been addressed why are these

[1:23:47] Trustee McConchie: still non-conforming which

[1:23:49] Voice 10: ones are you talking about on page 65

[1:23:53] Trustee McConchie: yeah so on page 65 um okay so

[1:23:58] Trustee McConchie: there's four of them there there and the one in particular i was concerned about was there were

[1:24:04] Trustee McConchie: no documented weekly inspection reports on file. The IR recommends that GEL begin weekly inspections

[1:24:11] Trustee McConchie: with proper documentation. There's also, there's noted that several pieces of equipment possibly

[1:24:19] Trustee McConchie: related to the operations noted within the TUP area currently stored outside of the designated

[1:24:23] Trustee McConchie: temporary use area list and schedule B of the TUP. Then on the page 66, site access has not

[1:24:31] Trustee McConchie: been completed and site access b continues to be used it's unclear it's unclear if and how public

[1:24:37] Trustee McConchie: access to and from the concrete back plant batch plant area of the temporary use area site is

[1:24:41] Trustee McConchie: prohibited uh and you know uh the required planting of landscaping plan has not been completed i'm

[1:24:48] Trustee McConchie: just curious to know why those non-conformities um like how come we have there must be a reason

[1:24:53] Voice 10: yeah um it'd be good if aaron could answer but um i do know that some of the one of the problems

[1:24:59] Voice 10: with moving some of that equipment was there wasn't enough room at the site it hadn't been

[1:25:04] Voice 10: prepared because they had to start from scratch with you know with the ground and all so they

[1:25:10] Voice 10: and they were slammed because of covid everybody was doing you know home construction jobs so they

[1:25:16] Voice 10: were pretty busy but he's uh moved um at least one truck i saw one truck moved over they were

[1:25:23] Voice 10: were preparing a site and they had made enough room for one truck to be

[1:25:27] Voice 10: moved. And they're probably working on that today as well.

[1:25:33] Voice 10: Yeah. I'd like to see it moved as well.

[1:25:38] Planner: Just sorry, just interrupt there too.

[1:25:40] Planner: So I did through email conversation,

[1:25:42] Planner: apparently there is some confusion because some of the equipment that may

[1:25:46] Planner: have been cited by the QEP,

[1:25:49] Planner: we're not certain that it's actually associated with the use because there

[1:25:54] Planner: there is a lot of, or there has been in the past,

[1:25:56] Planner: a lot of derelict equipment and vehicles on that property.

[1:26:00] Planner: Yeah,

[1:26:00] Voice 10: I think some of them aren't golf.

[1:26:03] Voice 10: And he did move the one that was a gravel truck,

[1:26:08] Voice 10: was moved.

[1:26:09] Voice 10: That's definitely golf.

[1:26:13] Voice 10: The paperwork, you'd have to ask Aaron about that.

[1:26:18] Voice 10: The not bringing them to the wet season,

[1:26:25] Voice 10: And I don't even think anybody was thinking of it because of COVID.

[1:26:29] Voice 10: So that just got missed.

[1:26:32] Voice 10: And they wanted, yeah, they wanted the constructed cement berms and curbs.

[1:26:42] Voice 10: But with gravel, like, all they had there was really shale.

[1:26:46] Voice 10: Like, it's a temporary site.

[1:26:49] Voice 10: So it hadn't been really constructed.

[1:26:52] Voice 10: It would have had, like, paving or cement.

[1:26:55] Voice 10: Like, I looked at those technical diagrams.

[1:26:57] Voice 10: So I think, again, that was, they were working, constantly working on how the water was working.

[1:27:03] Voice 10: The stormwater runoff goes into a particular area where it's held with the rubber, you know, and so they were having water go that way from the Batch area.

[1:27:19] Voice 10: There, oh, the planting of the berms that was talked about, I don't think the berms were all even completed.

[1:27:24] Voice 10: I had the area surveyed so they knew exactly how far they could go and couldn't go.

[1:27:30] Voice 10: And because they hadn't prepared some of the areas they hadn't finished, some of those berms are new, kind of still being constructed.

[1:27:40] Voice 10: And some had naturally vegetated, weren't planted because it started to get dry.

[1:27:48] Voice 10: We'd have to water them.

[1:27:49] Voice 10: So we had to, you know, figure out how they were going to do that.

[1:27:53] Voice 10: so um but and a lot of the area that's marked for um berm or for plantings actually have natural

[1:28:02] Voice 10: trees there there was a uh quite a substantial setback from the southern side and the bedwell

[1:28:11] Voice 10: harbor side and all the natural vegetation was left um so it's actually the only part that

[1:28:18] Voice 10: wasn't planted is the part that faces on to the rest of the property i don't know if that answers

[1:28:27] Voice 10: all your questions yeah

[1:28:30] Trustee Morrison: i think the other berms that are not yet constructed that would need to

[1:28:35] Trustee Morrison: be planted are where that new site access a comes out and my understanding is that that's like

[1:28:43] Trustee Morrison: in they're in the middle of pushing that through i was up there on the weekend i saw the movement

[1:28:47] Trustee Morrison: that they're starting to push it through um so as they reorganize the interior a bit more to get it

[1:28:54] Trustee Morrison: in there yeah

[1:28:55] Voice 10: and then that will once they're finished with that that site yeah that road

[1:29:00] Voice 10: access then it would be planted and it's almost finished they have the culverts down down there

[1:29:09] Voice 10: i think they're working on width of the access so it's wide enough i don't know if they were

[1:29:14] Voice 10: going to make it wide enough for two trucks it looks like it's the same it looks like it's the

[1:29:19] Voice 10: same or a bit wider than the access they were using to prevent uh access they were putting

[1:29:27] Voice 10: putting gates up. He had asked me a couple weeks ago where we got our gates from. I have

[1:29:34] Voice 10: a gate at the farm he was going to use that's wide enough. And then we would fully gate

[1:29:41] Voice 10: off the other part, the other driveway that's closest to the house so nobody could go drive

[1:29:46] Voice 10: in. Are there any more questions?

[1:30:01] Voice 10: Any question slots?

[1:30:03] Voice 10: Aaron just put this out that his phone screen's broken.

[1:30:06] Voice 10: He can't use the top half of his phone.

[1:30:10] Voice 4: So Barbara, what I did is I talked to Aaron

[1:30:13] Voice 4: and I've given him the toll-free number to call in

[1:30:15] Voice 4: and he's going to try, he said,

[1:30:17] Voice 4: but I'm not sure how long the local trust committee

[1:30:19] Voice 4: wants to wait, but he's trying to call in right now.

[1:30:24] Trustee Patrick: Thank you, Maple.

[1:30:25] Trustee Patrick: If you get him on board, then switch him over.

[1:30:29] Trustee Morrison: So maybe just a couple comments and thoughts about this.

[1:30:33] Trustee Morrison: because I know this is a contentious permit for us as LTC.

[1:30:40] Trustee Morrison: So I think I'll name a couple of things

[1:30:41] Trustee Morrison: and just we can have that conversation

[1:30:43] Trustee Morrison: because I think it'll happen at some point.

[1:30:45] Trustee Morrison: So as a temporary use permit,

[1:30:49] Trustee Morrison: one of the things that we asked last year

[1:30:52] Trustee Morrison: was that environmental monitoring would be done.

[1:30:57] Trustee Morrison: I'm not happy to see that there's not weekly reports.

[1:30:59] Trustee Morrison: courts. I do understand it's been a very unusual year for everyone. So I'm willing to sort of,

[1:31:06] Trustee Morrison: you know, accept that. I am happy to see that there's been a lot of the pieces of the permit

[1:31:14] Trustee Morrison: complied with. I've been up on the site a couple times just to look at it and see as things have

[1:31:20] Trustee Morrison: developed. And I mean, it is a heavy industry site. You know, there's nothing getting around

[1:31:24] Trustee Morrison: around that but the way that they're managing water in particular and the attention to like

[1:31:30] Trustee Morrison: redesigning and and managing it so that it is doing what it's supposed to do i've been very

[1:31:35] Trustee Morrison: appreciative of that and the report does show that the ph of the um containment ponds like the

[1:31:45] Trustee Morrison: sort of step down ponds is an appropriate level so that's really good to see um i i agree with

[1:31:53] Trustee Morrison: bill i would much prefer to see more skookum fencing i'm glad there is any kind of fence

[1:31:57] Trustee Morrison: thing at this point but as all sort of configuration happens with the driveway it

[1:32:03] Trustee Morrison: would be nice to get that final fencing in there and i think that's been a little bit of the

[1:32:07] Trustee Morrison: challenge is my understanding is just that like as things have shifted around they've just wanted

[1:32:12] Trustee Morrison: to make you know put the fencing up where the where the uh site pond will be but i think erin

[1:32:20] Trustee Morrison: can speak to that

[1:32:21] Voice 10: we're going we bought posts and fence fencing to fence it off from the rest

[1:32:27] Voice 10: of the property we haven't done

[1:32:29] Voice 10: that yet because we wanted to we were waiting for them to finish

[1:32:32] Voice 10: with the birming and also i took my own water samples i sent them to phil um so i took samples

[1:32:39] Voice 10: from the ponds and from the well and complete with total extractable hydrocarbons all heavy

[1:32:48] Voice 10: metals minerals ph and the ph kind of matched to what the consultant did because i think that's

[1:32:55] Voice 10: all they did was ph but i did a complete water analysis i do periodic water testing on our farms

[1:33:02] Voice 10: anyway but especially there because i know that's one of the concerns people have so i just did a

[1:33:11] Voice 10: full test and phil could send that to you all right sorry

[1:33:16] Planner: i don't believe i received that barbara i

[1:33:19] Planner: Yeah,

[1:33:19] Voice 10: it was attached to the thing you told me I didn't have to worry about because you got the report, because I put in a bunch of what they had complied with and not so attached to that is the water testing.

[1:33:31] Planner: Okay, I'll have another look.

[1:33:37] Trustee Patrick: I just want this has been an interesting.

[1:33:40] Trustee Patrick: I think, as far as I'm aware, this first time and for islands trust that we used an environmental management plan approach with an inspection through a temporary use permit for an industrial use.

[1:33:51] Trustee Patrick: and it's so one we're learning as we go go forward and it's it's it's very informative to

[1:34:00] Trustee Patrick: be able to have this this report from the QEP the check checklist beginning on page 70 and the

[1:34:07] Trustee Patrick: inspection so it's I've been watching this very closely and very interested in and how how it

[1:34:13] Trustee Patrick: works they

[1:34:14] Voice 10: also subscribe to the code of practice for cement they're registered with the province

[1:34:21] Voice 10: and it covers a lot of the environmental acts like so it makes it into a one document that

[1:34:29] Voice 10: makes it easier for the industry to follow instead of referring to all these acts and

[1:34:33] Voice 10: trying to interpret it themselves the code of practice has already put that interpretation in

[1:34:38] Voice 10: for them so and because it's not like a city operation where they're very large scale

[1:34:45] Voice 10: scale they have these big mixing like automated mixing areas like they do a lot of this by hand

[1:34:52] Voice 10: with bags and it's a lot very much more laborious and not the same as an operation in town because

[1:34:59] Voice 10: it's smaller scale all

[1:35:06] Trustee Morrison: right um i to laura to your point i actually um this type of industry i'm

[1:35:14] Trustee Morrison: way more happier about it being on a tup even though the tps aren't necessarily meant for this

[1:35:21] Trustee Morrison: um because of the environmental monitoring because as soon as you get stuff rezoned

[1:35:25] Trustee Morrison: then we lose local control of environmental monitoring so

[1:35:29] Voice 10: all of the code of practice

[1:35:31] Voice 10: and the ministry the ministries involved can come and do spot checks

[1:35:37] Voice 10: yeah

[1:35:39] Trustee Morrison: it's interesting i've had mixed um feedback on how how frequent the ministry does that or not

[1:35:47] Trustee Morrison: lot um and on like how to do that but anyway um okay i don't necessarily want to hang out for a

[1:35:56] Trustee Morrison: long period of time he's calling into meeting right now oh no that's his computer okay just

[1:36:02] Trustee Morrison: in a second all right see we do have two there he is so

[1:36:20] Trustee Patrick: has he called in oh

[1:36:21] Voice 4: yeah is that his

[1:36:22] Voice 4: number bar brother nine six

[1:36:24] Voice 4: zero zero okay i'm just gonna enable him to speak hi aaron is that

[1:36:29] Voice 4: to you can you start

[1:36:30] Trustee Patrick: star

[1:36:32] Voice 4: six or

[1:36:33] Trustee Patrick: nine star six

[1:36:34] Voice 4: you got it we're

[1:36:47] Trustee Patrick: not getting the microphone is

[1:36:48] Trustee Patrick: it star six star nine star you can't overpower that huh we have him here we're just not getting

[1:37:04] Trustee Patrick: him off of mute ah all right aaron can you hear us

[1:37:15] Voice 16: yeah hi sorry this is uh malcolm cowley calling

[1:37:18] Voice 16: from crd i think i just was on mute accidentally or by mistake instead of mr grimmer i think so

[1:37:26] Trustee Patrick: sorry about that that

[1:37:28] Voice 16: that's okay i'll just uh mute myself again all

[1:37:31] Trustee Patrick: right thank you so i guess

[1:37:33] Trustee Patrick: we don't have him here then so

[1:37:35] Trustee Morrison: i think we either need to proceed or move his permit because i think

[1:37:39] Trustee Morrison: we need to move on what

[1:37:40] Trustee Patrick: would you guys

[1:37:40] Trustee Morrison: i think his phone screen is broken yeah but we're we're

[1:37:44] Trustee Morrison: on unlimited time today so um

[1:37:46] Trustee Patrick: what would you like to do trustees do you want to proceed with

[1:37:49] Trustee Patrick: considering this to tup or to defer it to later in the agenda or order of applicants can we confirm

[1:37:57] Trustee Patrick: that aaron's going to

[1:37:58] Trustee McConchie: yeah it's just disappointing like this is your application i mean there's

[1:38:02] Trustee McConchie: computers and stuff it's too bad that aaron's not here to answer our questions and to take the time

[1:38:06] Trustee McConchie: to do that

[1:38:08] Trustee Morrison: yeah so i'm i feel like i've had multiple conversations over the year around

[1:38:14] Trustee Morrison: around this permit and I'm happy with what I see.

[1:38:18] Trustee Morrison: I see other things moving along on this permit.

[1:38:21] Trustee Morrison: So I guess, Bill, I would like to see,

[1:38:26] Trustee Morrison: and maybe this is a question for you as staff,

[1:38:28] Trustee Morrison: like if the permit conditions,

[1:38:31] Trustee Morrison: like the additional things that need to be finished

[1:38:32] Trustee Morrison: are not met by October, what's the recourse?

[1:38:36] Planner: So the recourse all around here is enforcement.

[1:38:39] Planner: So even if you deny the renewal,

[1:38:43] Planner: we move that would be enforcement to cease to use so as that as I reported by law enforcement

[1:38:53] Planner: is ongoing there is an open file on this on this application so and with the renewal basically by

[1:39:04] Planner: law enforcement staff would come to a compliance agreement and as I said that we as staff we would

[1:39:10] Planner: work to make sure that all of those non-compliances are wrapped up by October 1st so um and the

[1:39:17] Planner: recourse there is for non-non-compliance is ticketing so yeah

[1:39:21] Trustee Morrison: okay so I'm going to go ahead

[1:39:23] Trustee Morrison: and make the motion that the North Pender Local Island Trust Committee approve issuance of the

[1:39:27] Trustee Morrison: renewal application temporary use permit NPTUP 2021.4 Grimmer shown as attachment one for a

[1:39:34] Trustee Morrison: period of two years.

[1:39:36] Trustee Patrick: Is there a second? I'll second the motion for discussion purposes.

[1:39:41] Trustee Patrick: Is there discussion on this motion? I'm

[1:39:46] Trustee McConchie: happy to discuss this. I don't know. I don't see this as

[1:39:49] Trustee McConchie: a really contentious issue amongst my fellow trustees, like Trustee Morrison, what you just

[1:39:54] Trustee McConchie: indicated. It's just, I think the bigger picture is really important in this particular application.

[1:40:00] Trustee McConchie: And the bigger picture is this, that the trust committee has been forced to resolve a business

[1:40:07] Trustee McConchie: landowner dispute. And what's happened is the business operator operated for years on industrial

[1:40:15] Trustee McConchie: land. Then there was a disagreement. I'm not sure what happened, but the business was forced to move

[1:40:21] Trustee McConchie: then without asking permission of the local trust committee, which is the proper process.

[1:40:28] Trustee McConchie: and barring the fact that there was a previous trust committee that stated maybe this location

[1:40:36] Trustee McConchie: would be suitable that does not give permission to do that they went ahead therefore and opened

[1:40:42] Trustee McConchie: up shop and then they went into a bylaw enforcement thing which is why we have an

[1:40:47] Trustee McConchie: bylaw enforcement file opened on them right on this particular application so now as a result

[1:40:52] Trustee McConchie: result of basically property owners and business disputes, we have an industrial park right in the

[1:41:00] Trustee McConchie: center of North Pender Island. So I have yet to hear logical rationale that supports this type

[1:41:09] Trustee McConchie: of planning. It feels as though the trust has been forced to resolve issues due to public pressure,

[1:41:16] Trustee McConchie: due to um you know sympathy for the business owner and operator uh when it's not appropriate

[1:41:24] Trustee McConchie: planning and it and it goes against the heart of the preserve and protect mandate business owners

[1:41:29] Trustee McConchie: should not be in charge of determining land usage which is why i believe it's now appropriate now

[1:41:36] Trustee McConchie: at this time to i will i will vote against the motion because i i believe that it's now's the

[1:41:42] Trustee McConchie: the time for the the applicant to find a more suitable location and go through the proper

[1:41:47] Trustee McConchie: process and begin that again so the the perhaps the lessons learned from this experience can be

[1:41:53] Trustee McConchie: translated uh to future trust committees so that's why i'm going to vote against the motion but i do

[1:41:59] Trustee McConchie: respect trustee morrison and chair patrick's views on this of course

[1:42:03] Trustee Patrick: any further discussion on this

[1:42:07] Trustee Patrick: motion yeah

[1:42:09] Trustee Morrison: i i think many of the things that have just been named are things we have talked about

[1:42:13] Trustee Morrison: pretty extensively before so i don't need to go into um too long of a discussion about this i

[1:42:19] Trustee Morrison: feel like frustrated too about the idea that we can't have more sort of active planning um but i

[1:42:26] Trustee Morrison: actually like after the uh land use bylaw conversations on industrial land um in the

[1:42:32] Trustee Morrison: a special meeting this spring I had it sparked conversations with a lot of people on the island

[1:42:37] Trustee Morrison: around like how we go about um doing industrial land and how we um like think about the use and

[1:42:48] Trustee Morrison: the work relative to different locations on the island um and there wasn't universal agreement and

[1:42:54] Trustee Morrison: in fact I don't know if there was any agreement at all about putting all industrial land in one

[1:42:58] Trustee Morrison: one area so like it just makes me think we need to we need to just have some deeper discussions

[1:43:06] Trustee Morrison: on the industrial component of our land use review so in in the as we still have that

[1:43:11] Trustee Morrison: undergoing and we're trying to resolve that i feel like this has to continue until we

[1:43:16] Trustee Morrison: have some resolution of like what strategy we're going forward on the land use bylaw so i'm in

[1:43:21] Trustee Morrison: favor of this can

[1:43:24] Trustee McConchie: i share patrick yes i just i feel it's important like i really wish and would

[1:43:29] Trustee McConchie: would hope if you're going to vote in favor of this motion that you're you're explaining it to

[1:43:34] Trustee McConchie: the public and justifying that that you're you're what i'm trying to ask is why are why are we

[1:43:43] Trustee McConchie: rewarding this type of planning why are we agreeing to a temporary use permit this is and what is your

[1:43:51] Trustee McConchie: reasoning for agreeing to the temporary use permit based on the fact that it forced the local trust

[1:43:57] Trustee McConchie: committee into this position as a dispute between

[1:44:00] Trustee McConchie: landowner and property i'm

[1:44:02] Trustee Morrison: not going to answer

[1:44:02] Trustee Morrison: that question i'm not going to answer that question because that question is a question

[1:44:06] Trustee Morrison: i dealt with on the first temporary use permit but we're discussing the

[1:44:09] Trustee McConchie: permit right now yeah

[1:44:10] Trustee Morrison: and

[1:44:11] Trustee McConchie: it's a renewal

[1:44:12] Trustee Morrison: it's a renewal to try and get us and then part of the agreement on uh doing the

[1:44:17] Trustee Morrison: first one was the idea that we would try and get our land use bylaw um house in order to be able

[1:44:23] Trustee Morrison: able to see where to put industrial land like this and so I don't see an alternative right now

[1:44:30] Trustee Morrison: I agree with you that it's not good to get pressed to get pushed into this but at the same time

[1:44:34] Trustee Morrison: I don't see a clear solution for where it goes in a different location and I have asked that

[1:44:42] Trustee Morrison: question a lot of people on this island just so just a second and so I've asked a lot of people

[1:44:48] Trustee Morrison: on this island about where we would put this instead and that's attention and if we need it

[1:44:54] Trustee Morrison: at all they I'm almost getting a universal answer that yes we should keep it which is actually

[1:44:58] Trustee Morrison: really surprising to me honestly and from a preserve and protect mandate what what I put

[1:45:05] Trustee Morrison: and I think the rules were quite stringent of what we asked to have in this permit I feel they

[1:45:10] Trustee Morrison: are working hard to meet those and the ones they've met are the critical ones around water

[1:45:15] Trustee Morrison: and like concerns about environmental contaminating and the ones that are left to be

[1:45:20] Trustee Morrison: met are more about the aesthetics and the reporting issues that like the paperwork

[1:45:24] Trustee Morrison: aspects which given the last year I understand how that can be challenging for anybody so please

[1:45:31] Trustee Morrison: don't question that I would have the preserve and protect mandate like forefront in in the way that

[1:45:38] Trustee Morrison: I'm thinking about this permit because I do actually think that the environmental criteria

[1:45:42] Trustee Morrison: we put on the environmental management is actually really critical and if we just zone land and like

[1:45:48] Trustee Morrison: drill use in other areas I think we have much less control than we have in this particular

[1:45:54] Trustee Morrison: situation so my rationale for being able to have this permit approved is that they are meeting

[1:46:04] Trustee Morrison: but they are in the requirements of environmental monitoring to keep and protect and preserve the

[1:46:10] Trustee Morrison: quality of water in the area and to at the same time have a sustainable industry in this space

[1:46:17] Trustee Morrison: to be able to work there so it's a balancing act they didn't have to cut down a bunch of trees to

[1:46:24] Trustee Morrison: be able to build this because they didn't do it in a completely forested area it was an open area

[1:46:28] Trustee Morrison: where it was moved i don't think it's necessarily the ideal spot i actually think the ideal spot

[1:46:34] Trustee Morrison: is coronable given politics which is the part we're trying to work through with the land use

[1:46:38] Trustee Morrison: use bylaw. So yeah, so that's how I'm thinking about it.

[1:46:44] Trustee McConchie: Well, what is the point of the land

[1:46:46] Trustee McConchie: use bylaw if industrial businesses can just set up shop wherever they want and ask for permission

[1:46:52] Trustee McConchie: later? I

[1:46:54] Trustee Patrick: think it was important. I think Miles Drew, the former head of bylaw enforcement,

[1:46:59] Trustee Patrick: was in a North Pender meeting. We had a debate on another application of this nature that

[1:47:05] Trustee Patrick: bylaw enforcement is a process and the process leads you to a resolution and the temporary use

[1:47:11] Trustee Patrick: permit or how how we go is the process to resolve and and we're in a process that we're trying to

[1:47:22] Trustee Patrick: resolve and the applicant is is working through it and and we're taking a very unique and innovative

[1:47:28] Trustee Patrick: approach that hasn't been done anywhere else to put the environmental controls on it so i agree

[1:47:33] Trustee Patrick: Agree, Ben?

[1:47:34] Trustee McConchie: It's not

[1:47:34] Trustee Patrick: ideal and would prefer.

[1:47:38] Trustee McConchie: Fair enough.

[1:47:38] Trustee McConchie: Chair Patrick, how,

[1:47:42] Trustee McConchie: do you feel approval of this temporary use permit

[1:47:47] Trustee McConchie: will undermine the land use bylaw review,

[1:47:50] Trustee McConchie: mainly because industrial people

[1:47:53] Trustee McConchie: who are running industrial activity

[1:47:55] Trustee McConchie: are basically given a green light

[1:47:57] Trustee McConchie: to operate without permission?

[1:48:02] Trustee Patrick: I'm sort of with Ben, with Deb on the answer here,

[1:48:08] Trustee Patrick: that you're going through a process of the land use bylaw review and it's a long game we're trying

[1:48:15] Trustee Patrick: to make long-term decisions to have proper proper land land use for as long as we can on on the

[1:48:24] Trustee Patrick: island to deal with what the needs are um so this is a temporary use permit allowing the time for

[1:48:30] Trustee Patrick: that process to complete and

[1:48:34] Trustee Morrison: i know i go ahead sorry sorry i didn't i thought you're finished

[1:48:38] Trustee Morrison: I was

[1:48:39] Trustee Patrick: just going to say, I don't see this as a green light, and again, I think Miles's question

[1:48:46] Trustee Patrick: at that time was to a different applicant was, are you enjoying this? Has this been easy?

[1:48:53] Trustee Patrick: And I don't think we've made this easy.

[1:48:58] Trustee Morrison: And I also, I think to that question, is that

[1:49:02] Trustee Morrison: there is no guarantee that a temporary use permit will be given. There's no guarantee.

[1:49:11] Trustee Morrison: And so each application we're looking at

[1:49:14] Trustee Morrison: and we're seeing if their criteria that we put in place

[1:49:17] Trustee Morrison: are going to be met, we could say no.

[1:49:21] Trustee Morrison: But in these cases, the majority of the votes

[1:49:24] Trustee Morrison: have been for proceeding.

[1:49:26] Trustee Morrison: There are things that we have said no about

[1:49:29] Trustee Morrison: and that we will continue to say no about

[1:49:31] Trustee Morrison: around industrial land use or around rezoning applications

[1:49:36] Trustee Morrison: that seem in some way harmful in ways that can't be controlled.

[1:49:41] Trustee Morrison: And so I understand that the process is not what I would love to see necessarily and can work toward a better process as things are moving along.

[1:49:53] Trustee Morrison: But I also think that it's just because there's a TUP process and that bylaw enforcement drives us into a TUP process doesn't mean we will give the TUPs.

[1:50:03] Trustee Morrison: So it's an insecure space, as we've seen for the last eight years of waste management efforts.

[1:50:09] Trustee Morrison: Like, it's a very insecure space for businesses to have to operate on TUPs.

[1:50:14] Trustee Morrison: And so I don't agree that it's a green light issue.

[1:50:20] Trustee McConchie: All right.

[1:50:21] Trustee McConchie: Well, maybe before the vote, I just want to say I'd be disappointed if this motion passed, mainly because it's not the job of the Islands Trust to preserve and protect cement plants.

[1:50:34] Trustee McConchie: I mean, the right thing to do, in my opinion as a trustee, is to limit this type of activity on the island.

[1:50:41] Trustee McConchie: that's i think that's the original intent of the mandate so uh but i respect your guys's rationale

[1:50:47] Trustee McConchie: and opinions i appreciate the conversation and

[1:50:51] Trustee Patrick: i and i understand

[1:50:52] Trustee Patrick: i think when uh back when we

[1:50:54] Trustee Patrick: could travel and i traveled regularly on the early ferries off the islands concrete trucks very large

[1:51:00] Trustee Patrick: ones lined up on our ferries coming and moving and the transportation is is extreme so they're

[1:51:08] Trustee Patrick: going to come yeah

[1:51:12] Trustee Morrison: and i guess that's that's my sort of issue i you know and this may not

[1:51:17] Trustee Morrison: you know the applicant may not love to hear this but i could take or leave a concrete plant

[1:51:22] Trustee Morrison: um because heavy industry is not something that i'm particularly fond of but in thinking about

[1:51:29] Trustee Morrison: in and asking broadly in the community about keep it or or get rid of it as an actual just

[1:51:37] Trustee Morrison: just basic question, we have a concrete batch plant or not on the island. I can't even think

[1:51:43] Trustee Morrison: of a single person who said no. And so then the second question that comes up is, okay, if yes,

[1:51:50] Trustee Morrison: then where and how will it to infer that we're protecting and preserving in terms of water

[1:51:56] Trustee Morrison: quality and environment. And so the conditions that we put in in this permit, I actually feel

[1:52:01] Trustee Morrison: are pretty awesome for being able to try to get to that level and you know as we go forward maybe

[1:52:08] Trustee Morrison: could even be more stringent depending where things end up with this so yeah and we are as

[1:52:16] Trustee Morrison: a local government charged with land use and while I push back against the idea that you know

[1:52:24] Trustee Morrison: we are trying to we're not an urban planning area we're not uh like for communities that's our

[1:52:34] Trustee Morrison: primary um goal our primary goal is actually to preserve and protect the environment but that

[1:52:40] Trustee Morrison: doesn't mean given the way we've been set up that we exclude people or excluding use and if we're

[1:52:45] Trustee Morrison: going to require in the building code that we build with concrete i'd much rather that we have

[1:52:50] Trustee Morrison: some very safe environment to ensure it's controlled and managed and I agree with Laura

[1:52:56] Trustee Morrison: I think like putting concrete trucks on the ferry might not be the right move either

[1:52:59] Trustee Morrison: so I don't know

[1:53:01] Trustee McConchie: I'm a little bit more benevolent bring that up Christy Morrison you're talking

[1:53:04] Trustee McConchie: you're talking about the string engine you know environmental plan but there's a lots of

[1:53:08] Trustee McConchie: non-compliance taking place yeah the non

[1:53:11] Trustee Morrison: -compliant oh

[1:53:12] Trustee McConchie: sorry and the bylaw enforcement is stating that

[1:53:15] Trustee McConchie: they're going to be busy dealing with this

[1:53:17] Voice 11: like

[1:53:19] Trustee McConchie: that's concerning so i mean that's why i can't

[1:53:23] Trustee McConchie: support this motion but i believe we've discussed this uh i think

[1:53:26] Trustee McConchie: chair patrick so uh yeah and i

[1:53:29] Trustee Morrison: understand that i understand that ben understand the the pieces that are non-compliant but when i

[1:53:34] Trustee Morrison: look at what's non-compliant it's not the parts that i most can vote the preserve and protect

[1:53:38] Trustee Morrison: mandate those are the water like the issues around water and i feel that they've done a really good

[1:53:44] Trustee Morrison: a job around that so i feel okay supporting this i really need to see those other things complied

[1:53:48] Trustee Morrison: and i really want to see fines handed out if they're not complied by october so because that

[1:53:53] Trustee Morrison: seems yeah the

[1:53:54] Trustee McConchie: only uh concern also i just wanted to raise is your concern over berms

[1:53:59] Trustee McConchie: and nobody can see anything going on taking place in that property it's uh it's all hidden right

[1:54:05] Trustee McConchie: yeah

[1:54:06] Trustee Morrison: the condition of the original permit to moderate the impact of noise and and site for

[1:54:13] Trustee Morrison: for the community.

[1:54:14] Trustee Morrison: I'm sure that Erin would welcome anybody

[1:54:16] Trustee Morrison: to have a tour of it if they wanted to know

[1:54:18] Trustee Morrison: what's going on there.

[1:54:19] Trustee Morrison: All

[1:54:23] Trustee Patrick: right, is there any further discussion?

[1:54:25] Trustee Patrick: I'll call the vote then.

[1:54:30] Trustee Patrick: All those in favor?

[1:54:35] Trustee Patrick: All those against?

[1:54:38] Trustee Patrick: And that motion carries.

[1:54:44] Trustee Patrick: Any other business on this application?

[1:54:49] Trustee McConchie: We need a break.

[1:54:49] Trustee McConchie: Thanks, Chair Patrick.

[1:54:50] Trustee Patrick: Would you like a break?

[1:54:51] Trustee Patrick: How much time?

[1:54:54] Trustee Patrick: Five minutes?

[1:54:55] Trustee Patrick: Okay, I'll take a five-minute break.

[2:01:34] Trustee Patrick: all right is everybody back can you hear me yep there we go yes you're good yes

[2:01:44] Voice 4: i've returned as

[2:01:46] Voice 4: well

[2:01:46] Trustee Patrick: talking to the world i was like oh no all right

[2:01:49] Trustee Patrick: i'm going technical issues today all right

[2:01:52] Trustee Patrick: we're going to move on to the next um uh permit which is a temporary use permit 2021.6 banjil

[2:02:01] Trustee Patrick: and I see is that going to up fill test well so Bill over to you thank

[2:02:07] Planner: you chair Patrick so this

[2:02:09] Planner: is a temporary use permit application for 5706 canal road and the purpose of the TUP is for

[2:02:18] Planner: gravel storage on a limited area of the subject property the application is proceeding as the

[2:02:26] Planner: The storage is required for the CRD project to construct 3.2 kilometers of a sewer main replacement in Magic Lake Estates.

[2:02:36] Planner: And the sole purpose, or beg your pardon, the sole use proposed is for the gravel storage,

[2:02:43] Planner: and that will cease upon completion of the project, which is scheduled to be approximately six months in length.

[2:02:50] Planner: So Malcolm Cowley from the CRD who actually made a guest appearance just a few minutes ago

[2:03:00] Planner: unscheduled is here to answer questions on the project in general and we can do so after I

[2:03:07] Planner: finished this but just to carry on with the actual use on this property it was initiated on May 3rd

[2:03:15] Planner: without the obtaining a tup in advance the reason it proceeded without a permit seems to be a

[2:03:25] Planner: communication breakdown the original applicant was aaron grimmer who arranged the lease on the

[2:03:30] Planner: property and the applicant who is kyle van giel hopefully i'm saying that right

[2:03:39] Planner: was under the understanding and he can speak to this that the permits were in place or or and he

[2:03:48] Planner: at the time when it was brought to his attention that he did not have or a TUP there was a loaded

[2:03:55] Planner: barge basically on the way to the island so the applicant has also applied for an industrial

[2:04:04] Planner: access permit from the Ministry of Transportation and Infrastructure. So all

[2:04:08] Planner: of the gravel that is required for the project is actually on site now and that

[2:04:11] Planner: was shown in the pictures that were attached to the report and essentially

[2:04:18] Planner: the use entails the loading and transporting of gravel from the property

[2:04:22] Planner: on demand for the CRD project. Just a note, clean fill from the excavation of

[2:04:31] Planner: With the project in Magic Lake is being redistributed to individual property owners on Pender Island and any contaminated fill and or road spoils will be stockpiled and will be removed from the island for appropriate processing.

[2:04:47] Planner: So the location of the use area is 2,000 square meter flat area, and that's shown on Figure 2, which is page 126 of the agenda, and that's close to Canal Road, and the TUP area includes obviously an access driveway to and from, which is the sole egress and ingress area.

[2:05:17] Planner: So, again, the rationale is in support of the TUP is to provide a temporary storage area.

[2:05:27] Planner: And that project has obviously a community benefit where they're replacing old and failing infrastructure in Magic Lake with obviously benefit to the natural environment and improved infrastructure on the island.

[2:05:44] Planner: on. So the TUP policies or the use of a TUP in this case is unlike some of the previous

[2:05:58] Planner: ones which we've been exploring which are to a TUP can be used to essentially trial

[2:06:04] Planner: run a use on a property with a view to rezoning in the future. This is truly an ephemeral

[2:06:11] Planner: or a temporary use on the property, which is an appropriate use for a TUP application.

[2:06:20] Planner: And the policies are quite thin on TUPs outside of STVRs, which we are also familiar with.

[2:06:29] Planner: And in this case, the actual application is supported by OCP policies.

[2:06:36] Planner: So the draft TUP placed conditions, which essentially can summarize them as specifying a restricted area, the driveway, the times of day and the days of the week that this use can operate, maximum number of loads per day, maximum volume of aggregate that can be stored,

[2:07:00] Planner: and the type of number of, sorry, type and number of vehicles and machines that can be used in the

[2:07:05] Planner: area. And there is a condition that the use cannot result in the contamination or degradation

[2:07:14] Planner: of groundwater aquifers in the vicinity or downstream aquatic areas. So all of those

[2:07:22] Planner: limits were set in consultation with the applicant. There's basically a bit higher

[2:07:27] Planner: then was was actually required and that was to ensure that there's some

[2:07:35] Planner: flexibility and also if the LTC chooses they could make it more restrictive the

[2:07:42] Planner: reverse is obviously not true with a TUP once the notification has gone out and

[2:07:49] Planner: again or the the local trust committee also has the ability in this case to add

[2:07:55] Planner: more restrictions or more conditions to the TEP as it's been drafted. A brief

[2:08:00] Planner: summary of potential impacts. There was some analysis in the staff report about

[2:08:05] Planner: ground and surface water vulnerability, noting that there's two ponds on the

[2:08:11] Planner: property. The closest is approximately 15 meters from the use downslope. That pond

[2:08:18] Planner: is known to be or thought to be man-made it's burned it's not designated as

[2:08:25] Planner: wetland sensitive in our mapping and it's currently only used basically and

[2:08:32] Planner: it's thought to have ever been used just for drainage retention or storm water

[2:08:37] Planner: management yeah there's a second pond further down downslope which is used

[2:08:44] Planner: only for garden irrigation. I included intrinsic groundwater vulnerability mapping which would

[2:08:52] Planner: indicate vulnerability to contamination of groundwater resources from industrial uses

[2:08:57] Planner: and that was on page 134 of the report. It indicates that the area is moderately high

[2:09:03] Planner: vulnerability but just noting that the only use is for the storage of gravel and as part of the

[2:09:13] Planner: contract with the CRD the gravel is has been all tested for leachable metals and there was

[2:09:23] Planner: this shown on figure two there was some analysis of the location of known wells and that was based

[2:09:31] Planner: on the known well on the actual subject property and then ones in the vicinity that are provided by

[2:09:37] Planner: by data from the provincial well site.

[2:09:43] Planner: Other potential impacts are obviously traffic volumes

[2:09:47] Planner: and safety, noise and dust.

[2:09:51] Planner: So as part of their requirements,

[2:09:55] Planner: the TUP notices were circulated

[2:09:57] Planner: to surrounding property owners

[2:09:58] Planner: and the notice was published in the May 19th driftwood.

[2:10:03] Planner: We have not received any correspondence at this time

[2:10:06] Planner: and our recommendation at this point is for the LTC to approve issuance of the

[2:10:14] Planner: temporary use permit for a period of one year and the rationale for the

[2:10:19] Planner: recommendation is the use supports the CRD project for the sewer main

[2:10:24] Planner: replacement for a portion of Magic Lake sewer system and the proposed use is

[2:10:29] Planner: consistent with uh ocp guidelines for tup and the one-year time frame is um obviously structured to

[2:10:39] Planner: take into account that if the project does go over the six-month estimated time that they wouldn't

[2:10:45] Planner: have to come back for a renewal uh and there's alternatives provided and that's my summary

[2:10:53] Trustee Patrick: thank you very much um you said that we had the crd and do we have the applicant as well i believe

[2:10:59] Planner: I believe Kyle was going to attend as well.

[2:11:02] Planner: So hopefully he had more success.

[2:11:03] Trustee Patrick: Maple, I guess Malcolm will just be on the phone.

[2:11:07] Trustee Patrick: So we just need to, he's had practice

[2:11:09] Trustee Patrick: and being

[2:11:11] Voice 4: able

[2:11:12] Trustee Patrick: to interact with us.

[2:11:13] Trustee Patrick: And then.

[2:11:14] Voice 4: So I'll move Kyle over as a panelist.

[2:11:17] Voice 4: I did see Malcolm earlier,

[2:11:18] Voice 4: but his phone has disappeared now.

[2:11:20] Voice 4: Maybe.

[2:11:20] Voice 4: I

[2:11:20] Trustee Patrick: still see, I think it was the 9600.

[2:11:22] Trustee Patrick: I still see it there.

[2:11:23] Voice 4: Oh, it is there.

[2:11:24] Voice 4: Okay.

[2:11:24] Voice 4: Yes.

[2:11:25] Voice 4: It just popped up there.

[2:11:26] Voice 4: Okay.

[2:11:27] Voice 4: I'll just enable that as well.

[2:11:30] Trustee Patrick: so malcolm if you're listening to us whatever you did before do it again

[2:11:33] Trustee Patrick: there we go yeah

[2:11:36] Voice 16: thank you chair it's malcolm cowley here and sorry for interrupting in your

[2:11:40] Voice 16: earlier report there but i i am here to

[2:11:42] Voice 16: answer questions regarding the crd project okay

[2:11:46] Trustee Patrick: and i

[2:11:48] Trustee Patrick: see uh kyle has been moved over hello kyle so um so trustees so do you kyle do you have anything

[2:11:55] Trustee Patrick: you wish to add before the trustees fire away um

[2:11:58] Voice 2: no uh it sounds like you guys nailed uh uh nailed

[2:12:02] Voice 2: the conditions at the beginning um i do uh i apologize i got her something from it wasn't

[2:12:07] Voice 2: in place i i thought it was um we are uh we are trying to do everything here at tryon uh to be

[2:12:14] Voice 2: compliant with the uh local jurisdictions and uh um have the least amount of negative impact and

[2:12:20] Voice 2: positive impact with the local community all

[2:12:24] Trustee Patrick: right uh thank you kyle i'm gonna the trustees

[2:12:26] Trustee Patrick: may have questions for you or the planner or for malcolm so trustees uh trustee mcconkey

[2:12:32] Trustee Patrick: i

[2:12:33] Trustee McConchie: had a question for i've got a lot of comments and questions here um so i just want to start

[2:12:37] Trustee McConchie: with a question for uh planner test them all planner test them all on page if you look at

[2:12:42] Trustee McConchie: at our staff report right now, on page 166, can we all go to page 166? Because it's important to

[2:12:51] Trustee McConchie: my point here. On page 166, there's a map in the next application. It's not related to this

[2:12:58] Trustee McConchie: application. However, it should be, in my opinion. And there's a DPA intertidal area along Hamilton

[2:13:05] Trustee McConchie: beach why was that dpa6 not part of this application as part of transporting gravel

[2:13:14] Trustee McConchie: meant that a giant barge went and basically crushed a beach and the trust didn't give

[2:13:23] Trustee McConchie: approval for that so i'm wondering why that's not part of the application so

[2:13:26] Planner: that's something

[2:13:30] Planner: that wasn't brought to my attention before but um i uh just off the top of my head i don't think

[2:13:35] Planner: that would be a use or something that would actually require a DP unless they altered the

[2:13:46] Planner: beach in some way. They drove a

[2:13:48] Planner: giant barge onto the beach. I don't understand. Kyle?

[2:13:55] Voice 2: If I may, it's trustee Ben I believe. The barge facility that we used didn't actually land on

[2:14:03] Voice 2: the beach but i used uh be a 70 foot ramp system that works on cabers so it actually landed us into

[2:14:10] Voice 2: the driving uh driving section and then i did have my crews do a hand cleanup so no uh no mechanical

[2:14:17] Voice 2: equipment of the of the existing beach and we tried to get it restored right back to where

[2:14:22] Voice 2: and probably improve the uh existing ramp for uh where people use as a boat launch i just want to

[2:14:29] Voice 2: put that in there that the barge didn't actually beach it was always buoyant in the water and that

[2:14:35] Voice 2: ramp system was used i just wanted to just want to put that in for clear

[2:14:39] Trustee Patrick: thank you sure

[2:14:41] Trustee McConchie: so but i

[2:14:42] Trustee McConchie: mean that dpa is pretty huge is the only point yeah

[2:14:46] Planner: but trustee mcconaughey it's like um sorry

[2:14:50] Planner: i don't have i don't have my ocp open here but um perhaps uh planner stock dollar planner kajima

[2:14:57] Planner: or sorry regional planning manager kojima could help but uh i don't believe that uh

[2:15:04] Planner: this common activity which is landing a barge there which has been going on from my understanding

[2:15:09] Planner: that's where things are or barges are typically brought in is included in the uh uh the marine

[2:15:18] Planner: sensitive uh dpa so is that

[2:15:21] Voice 6: vessel is not the vessel is not something that would a landing of

[2:15:24] Voice 6: a vessel is not something that would require a dp what

[2:15:27] Trustee McConchie: governmental okay what environmental

[2:15:29] Trustee McConchie: monitoring takes place when someone brings a barge to a hamilton beach what government

[2:15:35] Trustee McConchie: jurisdiction they

[2:15:37] Planner: have to comply with best management practices for dfo and that's with

[2:15:41] Planner: respect to fish habitat and um again it's like it it's a prevent it would be provincial or federal

[2:15:48] Planner: jurisdiction if you're damaging habitat i mean and that that would be enforcement by those

[2:15:54] Planner: authorities and they you know getting DFO there to enforce on somebody landing

[2:16:00] Planner: a barge again maybe Kyle could speak to this from the industry point of view but

[2:16:05] Planner: they have best management practices that they're required to comply with from DFO

[2:16:10] Planner: and again there's there's like provincial legislation for damage to to

[2:16:18] Planner: critical habitat so so

[2:16:20] Trustee McConchie: there's no environmental monitoring taking place

[2:16:23] Trustee McConchie: unless damage happens is what i'm understanding pretty

[2:16:27] Planner: much okay again i'm sorry that's the best

[2:16:30] Planner: i can report right now yeah no

[2:16:32] Planner: i appreciate that

[2:16:32] Trustee Morrison: trustee morrison um so i wasn't present with the

[2:16:37] Trustee Morrison: gravel barges but i don't want to enter the unloading of equipment um because i heard that

[2:16:44] Trustee Morrison: the equipment was coming in and i was curious to understand how the barges docked um and the barge

[2:16:49] Trustee Morrison: was buoyant in the water and the ramp came right out to where the paved surface was so but I didn't

[2:16:56] Trustee Morrison: see the unloading of the gravel so it is interesting to me in the islands that barges come and go like

[2:17:03] Trustee Morrison: that and there we did get a couple emails I that day or the during that week gravel came in we got

[2:17:12] Trustee Morrison: a couple emails during that week that were questioning that issue of like how do we

[2:17:15] Trustee Morrison: understand barges coming into the beach with fish habitat so it would be really helpful to

[2:17:21] Trustee Morrison: understand that and know what those types of monitoring permissions are or if that whole

[2:17:28] Trustee Morrison: area going out of the boat ram is like excluded from the dpa somehow like i just i i had questions

[2:17:34] Trustee Morrison: about it too so it's a little unclear i

[2:17:36] Planner: think as as uh robert just indicated it's it's not excluded

[2:17:41] Planner: from the dp area but it's the use that we're talking about here the landing of a vessel or

[2:17:46] Planner: the the mooring of a vessel offshore is not an activity that requires a dp yeah

[2:17:56] Trustee Morrison: and i think

[2:17:57] Trustee Morrison: to to ben's point we had a so the other one that we had like this not related to this permit but

[2:18:03] Trustee Morrison: a similar issue is like a house was brought on on medicine beach um a year ago or two years and

[2:18:09] Trustee Morrison: And like, I don't understand how that was allowed either.

[2:18:13] Trustee Morrison: So, cause that was like right in a protected area.

[2:18:16] Trustee Morrison: Like that's the, yeah, that's not a boat launch.

[2:18:18] Trustee Morrison: So,

[2:18:19] Planner: so Kyle indicated this, sorry, I don't mean to interrupt,

[2:18:22] Trustee Morrison: and

[2:18:22] Planner: we've actually had some inquiries about a similar situation that may or

[2:18:26] Planner: may not, it's looking like it won't come to you on Sydney Island.

[2:18:29] Planner: So this is Nickel Brothers and they do,

[2:18:32] Planner: Kyle has matched what they said exactly.

[2:18:35] Planner: They have a 70 foot ramp, which can span the foreshore.

[2:18:39] Planner: and they come in on tides

[2:18:43] Planner: and they are able to actually do it

[2:18:47] Planner: with minimal or no damage to sensitive ecosystems.

[2:18:55] Planner: So again, we don't have Nickel Brothers here

[2:18:58] Planner: and we rely here on Kyle to report

[2:19:02] Planner: on how this was accomplished,

[2:19:04] Planner: but I understand that this can be done.

[2:19:07] Planner: so um and that's just a bit of a background okay

[2:19:14] Trustee McConchie: my next question if it's okay maybe um

[2:19:17] Trustee McConchie: malcolm can clarify this i'm not sure who wants to clarify this but like like what what's up guys

[2:19:24] Trustee McConchie: like why didn't you apply for a permit and get it done on time this is embarrassing you're asking

[2:19:29] Trustee McConchie: the local trust committee to approve something that's already been done right and it puts us in

[2:19:36] Trustee McConchie: an awful position as trustees because first of all you bypass the whole process right uh and then

[2:19:43] Trustee McConchie: all i see is passing the buck like malcolm why is the contractor responsible for solely for this

[2:19:49] Trustee McConchie: because this throws it all on the contractor and the crd goes well whoops you know i'm curious to

[2:19:55] Trustee McConchie: know what what logic is that in the crd policy can you perhaps explain that to us sure

[2:20:02] Voice 16: i can try uh

[2:20:03] Voice 16: Trustee McConaghy, this is pretty typical standard contractual policy that the CUD

[2:20:10] Voice 16: follows with any contractor, whether it's in the municipality of Lankford,

[2:20:15] Voice 16: Saanich, or any area where we're doing work. It's always the responsibility of the contractor

[2:20:20] Voice 16: to obtain any and all permits to be able to do their work. We don't know the means and methods

[2:20:28] Voice 16: of how they do their work or plan to do their work.

[2:20:31] Voice 16: So we can't guess where they might want to store

[2:20:36] Voice 16: and use lay down areas for materials.

[2:20:42] Voice 16: We just simply can't guess where they might want to do that.

[2:20:46] Voice 16: So that's always the contractor's responsibility

[2:20:48] Voice 16: because they all have different ideas on how they want to do the work.

[2:20:54] Voice 16: Certainly a contractor could have chosen to have gravel trucks

[2:20:57] Voice 16: come along the ferry every single day such as Big Digum and Gulf Excavating

[2:21:05] Voice 16: do to bring gravel to the site every single day. That's certainly a

[2:21:10] Voice 16: legal option. Trine has come up with a different option and that option again

[2:21:18] Voice 16: is their responsibility to get whatever permits are required for their

[2:21:23] Voice 16: their option uh so that that's their responsibility that's not not the crds if

[2:21:29] Trustee Morrison: i can follow up on that

[2:21:30] Trustee Morrison: um so that's businesses has been done um but but whittling islands in a way and we're not victoria

[2:21:41] Trustee Morrison: and we're not sydney um we're part of the islands trust area and we know we have ferries to get on

[2:21:46] Trustee Morrison: we know there might be barges necessary all those things um we're not we're not a unique area

[2:21:54] Trustee Morrison: like the islands trust is a unique area and as such I really think that the CRD practices related

[2:22:01] Trustee Morrison: to activities in the trust area need to be reconsidered and revised and I think that what

[2:22:07] Trustee Morrison: should have happened here and I know Malcolm we've had this conversation on Sunday and I think I made

[2:22:12] Trustee Morrison: my position abundantly clear about this but we really need to have practices with regard to big

[2:22:19] Trustee Morrison: projects like this or any project really with the CRD where you're engaged with the community in a

[2:22:25] Trustee Morrison: meaningful conversation and I know that you've been engaged with staff for months but it was

[2:22:30] Trustee Morrison: quite a surprise to me when I went down to like see the unloading of equipment and heard that

[2:22:36] Trustee Morrison: gravel was coming the next day so it was really surprising and it's not good that a local

[2:22:45] Trustee Morrison: government official in the islands doesn't know that gravels like arriving in the barges um and

[2:22:52] Trustee Morrison: that they're like that's just not good and i know that internally and i feel i'd like to understand

[2:22:58] Trustee Morrison: this from our staff's perspective too like i know that there's been this like months of conversations

[2:23:04] Trustee Morrison: um internally that i heard about when i talked to malcolm the first time um and i just there's

[2:23:12] Trustee Morrison: a point at which like Ben and I know some of the dynamics here to be able to say like this might

[2:23:19] Trustee Morrison: work or this might not work or like let's go around and ask a bunch of questions to people

[2:23:24] Trustee Morrison: and figure out what's the best solution given the transportation and everything else and the ferries

[2:23:28] Trustee Morrison: and the storage and that kind of conversation just would have been much better to have at the very

[2:23:34] Trustee Morrison: beginning of the project so I'm frustrated about the process that went on and this again I'm this

[2:23:43] Trustee Morrison: is pre-contractor like the conditions of the contract could have been set that it had to come

[2:23:48] Trustee Morrison: by barge or it had to come this way and then we would have known that a barge was coming we could

[2:23:52] Trustee Morrison: have gone down and monitored there's a whole bunch of stuff that could have happened it would have

[2:23:56] Trustee Morrison: been really there okay I don't even know if that was a question that was just a statement but I

[2:24:00] Trustee Morrison: I think I got that off my chest, but I'm good.

[2:24:03] Trustee McConchie: Yeah.

[2:24:03] Trustee McConchie: So can I just offer maybe we can look at the application as if the gravel is not there.

[2:24:09] Trustee McConchie: That's how I'm looking at this right now.

[2:24:10] Voice 21: Yeah.

[2:24:11] Voice 21: Because

[2:24:11] Trustee McConchie: I wrote, I'm looking at my old emails back in February of 2021, contacted Dave Howe, contacted and then Dave CC, you know, folks that are involved in this project from the CRD.

[2:24:24] Trustee McConchie: because i said what's up guys i'm hearing rumors that a property in magic lake estates might be

[2:24:30] Trustee McConchie: used to dump off gravel that's that's that's not a probably a good idea that's not something i would

[2:24:35] Trustee McConchie: support and i heard nothing back from that concern then then the next thing i know all of a sudden

[2:24:42] Trustee McConchie: gravels there and i was like well that's that's weird right speak and the reason being is because

[2:24:48] Trustee McConchie: from from the crd missed the boat on this because we've been debating for years where to put

[2:24:54] Trustee McConchie: industrial stuff and i know this is temporary right and i know it's for a greater good of the

[2:25:00] Trustee McConchie: sewer system but we've been asking the crd for a service for industrial land for like years i had

[2:25:06] Trustee McConchie: a meeting with the cfo and here you guys finally the crd finally needs industrial land and use of

[2:25:12] Trustee McConchie: industrial land and what happens they just go ahead and bypass the island's trust and then

[2:25:16] Trustee McConchie: blame the contractor i mean this is a pretty pretty significant screw up as far as i'm concerned

[2:25:22] Trustee McConchie: from the CRD and it's really disappointing. And as I work more with the CRD, I'm realizing more

[2:25:27] Trustee McConchie: and more reform is needed in that level of governance than could even be imagined. And

[2:25:32] Trustee McConchie: this situation personifies that all. It's all mismanaged. It's a really, really sad scene and

[2:25:39] Trustee McConchie: it's an insult to the Islands Trust what's taking place. So if I was to look at it from that

[2:25:43] Trustee McConchie: perspective of would I approve this location? Absolutely not. It is a very busy road on one

[2:25:50] Trustee McConchie: one of the humps that goes down people build speed there uh on in cars i'm lucky i'm happy

[2:25:57] Trustee McConchie: that no one's been injured so far it's in the middle of rural land um it goes the trucks now

[2:26:04] Trustee McConchie: have to go all the way down and around and you know it's it's it's not ideal right um and also

[2:26:10] Trustee McConchie: i feel as though uh the uh the the gravel and the way that this is handled is just abundantly

[2:26:18] Trustee McConchie: leave disappointing. But then we're in this position, and Kyle, this is the thing. There's

[2:26:28] Trustee McConchie: a human thing involved in this. You're a contractor, right? And that would punish you

[2:26:34] Trustee McConchie: if we denied this application. But we're in this position now where we didn't even get asked

[2:26:41] Trustee McConchie: to do it. So it's like, what the heck's going on here? Something is broken in the system,

[2:26:46] Trustee McConchie: right so um okay

[2:26:50] Trustee Morrison: that's that's

[2:26:52] Trustee McConchie: that's so well just a sec i i just want this to be really clear

[2:26:55] Trustee McConchie: right because

[2:26:56] Trustee McConchie: this is about respect of our local government's process i understand you're probably

[2:27:01] Trustee McConchie: tired of me ranting but i feel like this message needs to be really heard okay i i don't know um

[2:27:07] Trustee McConchie: i would have trouble moving forward to approve the temporary use permit but it's as usual the

[2:27:12] Trustee McConchie: The trust has been forced into this position by business owners, just like the previous situation.

[2:27:18] Trustee McConchie: So here we are. So I'll leave it to you, my fellow trustees, if you'd like to move this forward.

[2:27:23] Trustee McConchie: But I'm not going to.

[2:27:25] Trustee Morrison: So a couple of things on this, if I can, to Patrick, or if you want to jump in.

[2:27:30] Trustee Morrison: OK, so so I had been asked, I guess it must have been when Aaron Grimmer originally started talking with Chris and Sandra on that property to come and look at it as a potential site,

[2:27:43] Trustee Morrison: knowing that there was going to be a project coming up. I had no idea the project was as

[2:27:47] Trustee Morrison: far along as it apparently was. So I had gone down and looked at that site and thought about

[2:27:53] Trustee Morrison: all of the dynamic we do, other places we can store gravel on the island, the one that's

[2:28:00] Trustee Morrison: actually licensed for it right now. But in thinking about, and at that point I guess it

[2:28:07] Trustee Morrison: it was clear that the barging would be the way that gravel was brought in.

[2:28:14] Trustee Morrison: And so from my perspective, if you bring gravel in on a barge down at Browning

[2:28:21] Trustee Morrison: and then take it all the way up past the driftwood

[2:28:24] Trustee Morrison: and store it up on the only site that was actually zoned for it

[2:28:28] Trustee Morrison: and then bring it all the way back down,

[2:28:31] Trustee Morrison: and we're not talking about a couple loads,

[2:28:33] Trustee Morrison: and Kyle can clarify this in a second,

[2:28:35] Trustee Morrison: but my understanding is it's a significant amount of trucks of gravel so I didn't want that going

[2:28:41] Trustee Morrison: through the middle of the community all summer so from my perspective this site is better for

[2:28:46] Trustee Morrison: servicing the Magic Lake area on a temporary use if it was gravel only so no road waste at all that

[2:28:53] Trustee Morrison: that would go to some other industrial site for storage and then full removal from the island

[2:29:00] Trustee Morrison: um because it's more about like the the amount of wear and tear on the roads on pender and the

[2:29:07] Trustee Morrison: amount of traffic through the community um and the yeah so and there's very few places on in that

[2:29:16] Trustee Morrison: part of the island that are big enough to be able to store that they wouldn't require tree removal

[2:29:20] Trustee Morrison: and this was one of them so it didn't require tree removal to be able to do that um so i am

[2:29:28] Trustee Morrison: actually in support of where it's sitting right now because I feel given that the gravel came in

[2:29:35] Trustee Morrison: by barge that this was the most appropriate place to put it. Clarify Kyle about how many trucks,

[2:29:43] Trustee Morrison: how many truckloads of gravel this is and the safety issues that been raised and like a couple

[2:29:50] Trustee Morrison: things around that.

[2:29:51] Voice 2: So it'll be around 650 dump truckloads of gravel. I agree with what you said

[2:29:59] Voice 2: there are

[2:30:00] Voice 2: trustee Morrison it's when we're deciding where to put it was where would be the least impact

[2:30:07] Voice 2: to the community and to roll over it would be over 1200 dump trucks going through and by the

[2:30:15] Voice 2: driftwood center to utilize the currently industrial land you gotta imagine the trucks

[2:30:21] Voice 2: go one way and and past the other so that was a part of our decided factors I believe Aaron's

[2:30:28] Voice 2: original application was March 27th or 26th,

[2:30:34] Voice 2: whatever the date was there that he had put onto it.

[2:30:38] Voice 2: So in our opinion here, or in our thoughts here anyways,

[2:30:43] Voice 2: I try on is that the paperwork was in process

[2:30:48] Voice 2: and we were in compliance,

[2:30:51] Voice 2: obviously not since we're having this meeting today,

[2:30:54] Voice 2: but no, that's what it definitely was in our thought process

[2:30:58] Voice 2: of where we're deciding to put it um is how how to have the least impact to the uh to the community

[2:31:04] Voice 2: center or to the local residents um we are uh uh facility there we do have trucks turning signs

[2:31:12] Voice 2: and we are at the high point of the corner i do know i don't understand what uh ben was

[2:31:17] Voice 2: mentioning there but uh my drivers do have a clear line of sight for over 300 feet or so 200 feet to

[2:31:23] Voice 2: the towards the driftwood and over 300 feet towards the magic lake area so my trucks do have a full

[2:31:29] Voice 2: visible uh on uh to either side for oncoming traffic and we do have trucks turn signs in place

[2:31:36] Voice 2: to notify any of the uh ongoing motorists as well as coinage to notify that there is something

[2:31:43] Voice 2: forthcoming thank

[2:31:45] Trustee Patrick: you trustees any other questions here um i do ben like i said i concur with you

[2:31:54] Trustee Patrick: about process and when i brought that up yesterday at the executive as as requested about you know

[2:32:00] Trustee Patrick: crd infrastructure projects on islands um uh vice chair rogers said that there were issues on main

[2:32:07] Trustee Patrick: island as well and that's why he encouraged we got feedback back to bring this up at the southern

[2:32:12] Trustee Patrick: gulf island forum where we have crd at the table um and and talk about this because it's it's not

[2:32:19] Trustee Patrick: this project it's the next one and the next one in which islands they're on so that we have a

[2:32:23] Trustee Patrick: process that works going forward and that we don't have surprises um so

[2:32:28] Trustee McConchie: well well chair patrick the

[2:32:30] Trustee McConchie: process works when folks have respect for the authority involved and what i mean by that is

[2:32:36] Trustee McConchie: when folks continually ask for permission after the fact you know like imagine if they set up shop

[2:32:43] Trustee McConchie: on the agricultural land reserve and just dump the gravel on the alr well no one knows not to

[2:32:47] Trustee McConchie: mess with the alr because you go to jail and you get fined like a million dollars right the reason

[2:32:53] Trustee McConchie: why people just ask for forgiveness is because the trust is ineffective at governing and and

[2:32:58] Trustee McConchie: enforcing its bylaws and so here's an example so here we are right and it's really disappointing

[2:33:05] Trustee McConchie: really disappointing just ask for forgiveness is is is the is the modus operandi for most people

[2:33:13] Trustee McConchie: and it makes sense you know that's why why not there's no real repercussion other than to you

[2:33:19] Trustee McConchie: have to sit here and listen to a know-it-all trustee you know on zoom right that's the only

[2:33:24] Trustee McConchie: repercussion yeah

[2:33:25] Trustee Morrison: so the repercussion could be we can deny the permit the gravel has to be moved to

[2:33:29] Trustee Morrison: another site and it's incredibly costly um and that's that's not something that we make a decision

[2:33:35] Trustee Morrison: on so we have that decision to require the gravel to be moved i'm going to go make the motion um

[2:33:42] Trustee Morrison: that the north pender island local trust committee approve issuance of the temporary use permit

[2:33:47] Trustee Morrison: application NP 2021.6 Vangeal for a period of one year.

[2:33:53] Trustee Patrick: Is there a second to the motion?

[2:33:56] Trustee Patrick: I'll second the motion for discussion purposes.

[2:33:59] Trustee Morrison: So, and in discussing that,

[2:34:02] Trustee Morrison: I wanna say that thinking about this, not,

[2:34:05] Trustee Morrison: and I hear everything that's been said about process

[2:34:07] Trustee Morrison: and agree with it,

[2:34:09] Trustee Morrison: but thinking about this as if the gravel wasn't there,

[2:34:12] Trustee Morrison: I actually think it's the right site given that the,

[2:34:16] Trustee Morrison: and I actually think that it was the right move to bring that gravel in by

[2:34:20] Trustee Morrison: barge.

[2:34:22] Trustee Morrison: I think that the way we are managing the foreshore is a lot of question

[2:34:26] Trustee Morrison: because there's a lot of confusion about that. And we,

[2:34:29] Trustee Morrison: we got a lot of emails and but, and, and in particular,

[2:34:34] Trustee Morrison: I would like to ensure that the CRD it makes sure that the road surface at

[2:34:39] Trustee Morrison: the ramp in prime condition, like it was before

[2:34:43] Trustee Morrison: given the heavy weight of truck traffic on it coming off the barge so that that's one of my

[2:34:50] Trustee Morrison: concerns but generally speaking about this permit I actually have the right space to store gravel

[2:34:58] Trustee Morrison: the gravel's not like like Phil mentioned it's not like contaminated it's a relatively benign

[2:35:06] Trustee Morrison: use for that spot where it is I think it's low impact on the community from truck traffic I'm

[2:35:14] Trustee Morrison: I'm giving the rationale here for why I'm thinking about this permit the way I am.

[2:35:18] Trustee Morrison: And I think that it's servicing a major community need.

[2:35:25] Trustee Morrison: If we want roads, if we want sewers, we understand we sometimes have to have temporary industrial use around this.

[2:35:31] Trustee Morrison: And this to me is the right site just to minimize the amount of heavy truck traffic back and forth in the community.

[2:35:39] Trustee McConchie: well i i think that um i don't know which site was the appropriate site because this is the only

[2:35:44] Trustee McConchie: application i've been given right there it should have been part of the process for the contractor

[2:35:49] Trustee McConchie: to present hey here's the possible sites as the islands trust is in charge of land use decisions

[2:35:53] Trustee McConchie: right so right now there's gravel sitting on the site already so we don't actually have the

[2:35:58] Trustee McConchie: the benefit of knowing all the different possible locations that could have been used and then

[2:36:02] Trustee McConchie: brought that into our discussions because the decision's already been made for us

[2:36:05] Trustee McConchie: so that's that's disappointing yeah

[2:36:09] Trustee Morrison: and that's not the way our temporary use permit system really

[2:36:11] Trustee Morrison: works and it would be better i agree if we had more conversations up front at the very beginning

[2:36:16] Trustee Morrison: about where possibilities are um from my

[2:36:20] Trustee McConchie: i did is my point that's why i'm hoping not

[2:36:22] Trustee Morrison: i have an

[2:36:23] Trustee McConchie: email record trying to ask them

[2:36:25] Trustee McConchie: what's going on yeah

[2:36:27] Trustee Morrison: i'm with you on that so

[2:36:28] Trustee McConchie: we're not

[2:36:29] Trustee McConchie: in this position if

[2:36:31] Voice 16: i could maybe reply to that seeing how you brought my name up uh

[2:36:34] Voice 16: Trustee McConkie I did reply to your February 17th email indicating that we

[2:36:42] Voice 16: we hadn't contacted any homeowners about using property for staging areas I

[2:36:46] Voice 16: understood that somebody had approached the the trust at that point again we

[2:36:52] Voice 16: didn't have a contract in place with a contractor so we had no idea whether the

[2:36:56] Voice 16: contractor would even want to use that particular piece of property and I

[2:37:00] Voice 16: communicated you know to to uh the the people on the email it was director howe

[2:37:07] Voice 16: robert kojima deb morrison ian jesney matthew mccrank paul brent north pender island local

[2:37:13] Voice 16: trust committee and phil testamal indicating that we have made the contractor responsible for

[2:37:20] Voice 16: obtaining any permits required for him to complete his work once the contract is awarded we will

[2:37:26] Voice 16: remind him again that that is his responsibility to obtain permits so i think we we had communicated

[2:37:31] Voice 16: to the trust the process that we follow um and that's the process that kyle has endeavored to

[2:37:38] Voice 16: follow sounds like there was a miscommunication maybe and where the application was submitted on

[2:37:44] Voice 16: march 27th and maybe the paperwork wasn't done properly or correctly and uh kyle's kind of get

[2:37:51] Voice 16: left holding the bag with what he thought, you know,

[2:37:54] Voice 16: the previous applicant had taken care of.

[2:37:59] Voice 16: So I apologize on behalf of our contractor for that,

[2:38:03] Voice 16: but we certainly made every effort to inform the trust of the project

[2:38:08] Voice 16: and that it's the requirement for the contractor to obtain any permits

[2:38:13] Voice 16: for any lay down areas that he requires to do his work.

[2:38:16] Trustee McConchie: If I can, yeah, great. Thanks, Malcolm.

[2:38:18] Trustee McConchie: Malcolm, I've noticed that Dave Howe did write you guys, Malcolm and Ian.

[2:38:23] Trustee McConchie: Trustee Ben has some suggestions for staging locations.

[2:38:26] Trustee McConchie: This might add value if needed, and I didn't hear anything.

[2:38:29] Trustee McConchie: I was just trying to involve the Island's Trust on some level.

[2:38:33] Trustee McConchie: Now, you didn't have to, I guess, and yeah, there's a TUP process.

[2:38:38] Trustee McConchie: We're in a weird governance situation.

[2:38:40] Trustee McConchie: So anytime CRD encounters SGI projects in the future,

[2:38:44] Trustee McConchie: I hope we learn our lesson from this particular experience.

[2:38:47] Trustee McConchie: This is really disappointing and does not shed lightly upon good governance cooperation.

[2:38:54] Voice 16: Yeah, again, my apologies if you feel that way.

[2:38:57] Voice 16: We certainly have communicated with staff as early as December 3rd, 2020, of this project, Islands Trust staff.

[2:39:04] Voice 16: We've sent drawings to them on December 3rd, as well as on January 8th.

[2:39:09] Voice 16: There's been certainly lots of, we have monthly meetings with our local sewer committee,

[2:39:16] Voice 16: and they report out to the larger community through the Pender Post and otherwise

[2:39:23] Voice 16: that the project was advancing.

[2:39:27] Voice 16: We certainly look forward to trying to improve things to make a more formal submission

[2:39:32] Voice 16: if that's what the trustee would like to see.

[2:39:36] Voice 16: But we take the steps of communicating with Islands Trust staff

[2:39:40] Voice 16: staffed and islands you know we we trust that island trust staff are informing the islands

[2:39:46] Voice 16: trust committee so

[2:39:48] Trustee Morrison: a couple things on the communications so i i echo what ben says

[2:39:52] Trustee Morrison: actually and looking back through my email somehow i don't have that email that you're referencing

[2:39:56] Trustee Morrison: um malcolm i don't know if my email got in there wrong but anyway i i actually sent an email on

[2:40:03] Trustee Morrison: february 16th to dave so ben and i were both on this earlier about just like so what's going on

[2:40:09] Trustee Morrison: with this happening we're hearing about it internally but we're not really getting informed

[2:40:14] Trustee Morrison: about the steps and where everything's going to go so um and and i specifically said there is no

[2:40:23] Trustee Morrison: place on the island that there's a staging area so and i do not want to have a retroactive permit

[2:40:29] Trustee Morrison: like we did on the sewer work around the lake because the rules weren't followed so this is

[2:40:33] Trustee Morrison: a little bit frustrating that we're in this situation and and again malcolm i think it's

[2:40:38] Trustee Morrison: It's not about the, you know, even the paperwork, like, issue that went on with this particular

[2:40:46] Trustee Morrison: permit getting filed when it did.

[2:40:48] Trustee Morrison: I actually think it's a totally different issue than that.

[2:40:51] Trustee Morrison: It's more about, like, how the CRD and the Islands Trust are engaging in conversations

[2:40:58] Trustee Morrison: super early on and how the CRD is changing its process so you actually are taking suggestions

[2:41:03] Trustee Morrison: on where sites like this might be and, like, potentially thinking differently.

[2:41:08] Trustee Morrison: about how you're working in the islands because the ways that your contracts are running for

[2:41:14] Trustee Morrison: other places they just are not working here so we need to be in deeper conversation about how to fix

[2:41:20] Trustee Morrison: that happy to look

[2:41:26] Voice 16: at trying to improve things certainly trustee morrison for sure again we

[2:41:32] Voice 16: have no idea how this particular contractor wanted to execute his work he could have chosen

[2:41:37] Voice 16: to bring gravel trucks on the ferry every single day. He could have chosen to stockpile gravel

[2:41:44] Voice 16: at the already zoned industrial storage property. He had those options available to him.

[2:41:54] Voice 16: It's his decision to make as to what he ultimately ended up doing, which was

[2:41:59] Voice 16: making an application for a temporary use permit.

[2:42:02] Trustee Morrison: Yeah, but I guess that's my point,

[2:42:04] Trustee Morrison: is it shouldn't actually be the contractor's decision to make it should be the community's

[2:42:08] Trustee Morrison: decision to make and we should bound the in such a way that it works for the community

[2:42:13] Trustee Morrison: and that's where we're coming into a problem it's actually i have nothing to argue about i think the

[2:42:18] Trustee Morrison: contractor is doing a decent job of what's going on on the island my argument is with the crd about

[2:42:23] Trustee Morrison: the fact that um the that you're doing a sort of business decides model and that's just bs in the

[2:42:32] Trustee Morrison: the trust okay the community decides and we decide for the and the trust decides for the

[2:42:38] Trustee Morrison: protection and preservation of the trust and so like we need to bound your contracts in different

[2:42:43] Trustee Morrison: ways in this area yeah

[2:42:46] Voice 16: that would be we certainly can look at options i think it's difficult to bind

[2:42:50] Voice 16: contractors into specific methods and means of how they go about doing their work well i mean

[2:42:58] Trustee McConchie: certainly if i was in a crd office i would put if there was a project in the sgi i'd be like

[2:43:04] Trustee McConchie: Like, warning, Garden Pond warning.

[2:43:07] Trustee McConchie: Like, didn't we learn anything from that?

[2:43:09] Trustee McConchie: Like, this is a different place.

[2:43:11] Trustee McConchie: Like, Lankford is probably a CRD engineered dream

[2:43:14] Trustee McConchie: because you just go in and nuke a mountain

[2:43:16] Trustee McConchie: and don't worry about it, right?

[2:43:18] Trustee McConchie: This is the Southern Gulf Islands.

[2:43:19] Trustee McConchie: This is a fragile ecosystem

[2:43:20] Trustee McConchie: that the province is deemed to protect.

[2:43:23] Trustee McConchie: So certainly the CRD, maybe I'm wondering

[2:43:26] Trustee McConchie: once we vote on this motion,

[2:43:27] Trustee McConchie: if we could also pass a motion

[2:43:28] Trustee McConchie: to write a stern letter to the CRD,

[2:43:30] Trustee McConchie: just letting them, like, I believe Trustee Morrison,

[2:43:32] Trustee McConchie: And I know that's something you probably support just to let know that we're, you know, like we got to improve methods of communication on this.

[2:43:39] Trustee McConchie: But I believe we're discussing a motion right now that's on the table.

[2:43:43] Trustee Patrick: We have a motion on the table to approve this temporary use permit for one year.

[2:43:50] Trustee Patrick: Is there any further discussion on this motion?

[2:43:54] Trustee Patrick: If not, I'll call the vote.

[2:43:56] Trustee Patrick: All those in favor?

[2:43:58] Trustee Patrick: And all those opposed?

[2:44:02] Trustee Patrick: Trustee McConkie voted against.

[2:44:04] Trustee Patrick: and is that carries uh did you want to

[2:44:10] Trustee McConchie: i'd like to make a motion that staff or that staff draft

[2:44:13] Trustee McConchie: a report um indicating a need for future uh infrastructure projects or any projects related

[2:44:19] Trustee McConchie: to the crd um that there be an improved method of communication between contractors engineers

[2:44:26] Trustee McConchie: and staff and trustees so

[2:44:29] Trustee Patrick: that would be a chair letter yeah does that

[2:44:32] Voice 6: be a letter you said report

[2:44:33] Trustee McConchie: Yeah,

[2:44:33] Trustee Patrick: letter, excuse

[2:44:34] Trustee McConchie: me, a letter, I don't need a before

[2:44:37] Trustee Patrick: that, before that is seconded, can we give Shannon a chance to for sure, Shannon

[2:44:46] Voice 12: when you're ready you can read that back, and

[2:44:52] Trustee Morrison: I would encourage strong wording.

[2:45:04] Voice 8: so um trustee mcconkie if i can give you the start of your motion and you can give me what

[2:45:10] Voice 8: you're hoping for at the end so that the north pender island local trust committee requests staff

[2:45:15] Voice 8: to draft a letter from the chair to the capital regional district indicating a need for um uh

[2:45:26] Trustee McConchie: improved communication regarding any future CRD Islands Trust-related project,

[2:45:41] Trustee McConchie: particularly between the contractor, CRD, trustees, and staff of the Islands Trust.

[2:46:15] Trustee Patrick: Okay.

[2:46:16] Trustee Patrick: Shannon typing.

[2:46:17] Trustee Patrick: That

[2:46:17] Voice 8: the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee request staff to draft a letter

[2:46:22] Voice 8: from the chair of the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee to the Capital Regional District

[2:46:25] Voice 8: indicating a need for improved communication

[2:46:28] Voice 8: regarding any future Capital Regional District

[2:46:30] Voice 8: dash Islands Trust related projects,

[2:46:32] Voice 8: particularly among contractors,

[2:46:34] Voice 8: Capital Regional District staff,

[2:46:36] Voice 8: trustees and Islands Trust staff.

[2:46:38] Trustee Morrison: Thank you.

[2:46:39] Trustee Morrison: Does

[2:46:39] Trustee Patrick: that sound good?

[2:46:40] Trustee Patrick: Is there a second to that motion?

[2:46:42] Trustee Patrick: Seconded by Trustee Morrison.

[2:46:45] Trustee Patrick: I was gonna say,

[2:46:46] Trustee Patrick: we don't need to amend it,

[2:46:49] Trustee Patrick: but to make sure we copy,

[2:46:51] Trustee Patrick: Southern Gulf Island Forum is sort of an entity,

[2:46:54] Trustee Patrick: either we bring it forward as well I know tomorrow

[2:46:57] Trustee Patrick: yeah and it

[2:46:59] Trustee Morrison: should be cc'd to everybody

[2:47:00] Trustee Morrison: and their dog who's related to this yeah

[2:47:03] Trustee Patrick: staff is that we don't need to specify that in the

[2:47:07] Trustee Patrick: motion I would hope no good all right is there any further discussion on this motion

[2:47:15] Trustee Patrick: I'll call the vote then all those in favor and that's carried all right well thank you thank

[2:47:22] Trustee Patrick: you kyle thank you malcolm and i think i think we all want to have improved communications as we as

[2:47:28] Trustee Patrick: we go forward and and on these islands so thank you all right thanks

[2:47:32] Trustee Morrison: for taking time i know you're

[2:47:35] Trustee Morrison: you're working on the island so thanks for taking time to be here today that's appreciated

[2:47:40] Voice 2: take care guys thanks

[2:47:41] Trustee Morrison: all

[2:47:43] Trustee Patrick: right trustees how are we doing so our next um application is another

[2:47:48] Trustee Patrick: Another temporary use permit 2020 21.2 Pettifer

[2:47:54] Trustee Patrick: on page 142 of the agenda package.

[2:47:57] Trustee Patrick: And again, it looks like we have planner testimonial.

[2:47:59] Trustee Patrick: Sure,

[2:48:00] Planner: thanks Chair Patrick.

[2:48:04] Planner: So this is, there's a memo here for 1601 Storm Crescent

[2:48:09] Planner: and this is a renewal of TUP 2018.1.

[2:48:14] Planner: and purpose of the memo is to provide information from the applicant on a visitor information

[2:48:21] Planner: package provided to all guests and letters of support from adjacent neighbors as was requested

[2:48:27] Planner: by the LTC so the staff report for this application was originally reported on April 29th and at the

[2:48:39] Planner: regular meeting and at that time unfortunately Robin Pettifer who is with us today and he's

[2:48:46] Planner: tested his systems I think hopefully all as well wasn't able to communicate so there was

[2:48:52] Planner: some confusion about what was being provided to the guests but notwithstanding so the local trust

[2:48:59] Planner: committee passed a motion requesting that further information be provided before they consider this

[2:49:07] Planner: application um and particularly that the guest information was improved uh to reflect uh the

[2:49:17] Planner: i guess you call it the community and the environmental outlook of uh of north pender

[2:49:24] Planner: um so subsequent to that we've provided the applicant with some examples and he has provided

[2:49:31] Planner: provided and revised his guest information to include more information and prioritize

[2:49:40] Planner: some of those issues. And he has also provided two letters of support from his adjacent neighbors,

[2:49:46] Planner: north and south of the directly adjacent neighbors. So staff's recommendation is from the previous

[2:49:55] Planner: that the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee

[2:49:59] Planner: approved issuance of the renewal permit

[2:50:02] Planner: for a period of three years.

[2:50:04] Planner: And the rationale for that is that the three-year period

[2:50:07] Planner: is consistent with more recent applications

[2:50:09] Planner: for STVR uses for renewal,

[2:50:12] Planner: that there have been no complaints about the STVR

[2:50:15] Planner: since the original permit was issued.

[2:50:18] Planner: The guest capacity is modest at seven people by the permit,

[2:50:24] Planner: although it's noted that the applicant on their own accord limited to a maximum

[2:50:31] Planner: of five people. The applicant meets the current TEP guidelines in the OCP and

[2:50:38] Planner: that the permit provides the conditions to ensure that use does not have an

[2:50:42] Planner: unreasonable impact and there's enforcement ability if it does. That's

[2:50:48] Planner: my summary of the memo. And as I said, Robin is available for questions.

[2:50:54] Trustee Patrick: Thank you. I see Robin here. Is there anything you wish to add, Robin?

[2:51:00] Voice 18: No, I don't think so, unless there's any questions. But of course, thank you for your time.

[2:51:06] Voice 18: Sorry that we couldn't hear each other last time. But of

[2:51:10] Voice 18: course, if you have any questions,

[2:51:12] Voice 18: please feel free.

[2:51:14] Trustee Patrick: All right. Well, thank you. Just stand by. There might be

[2:51:16] Trustee Patrick: trustees questions a

[2:51:17] Trustee Morrison: couple comments um i i really appreciate the additional um and the

[2:51:25] Trustee Morrison: revisions to the materials and to see the materials provided um particularly the water

[2:51:31] Trustee Morrison: scarcity in common language um and the fire prevention um i think generally speaking and

[2:51:39] Trustee Morrison: this is more for staff as we go forward with stvrs like having a pool of like the stvr

[2:51:45] Trustee Morrison: sort of documentation that people who are applying for a permit can look at um to kind of pick the

[2:51:51] Trustee Morrison: you know the best hits of um kind of things and and as planners look at those if they have things

[2:51:57] Trustee Morrison: that you know really stick out well because i know we've seen some stellar examples over the

[2:52:01] Trustee Morrison: years that that would be super helpful i think against going forward so um but this looks much

[2:52:07] Trustee Morrison: much better. And I feel much more confident about this. Okay, so Ben, did you have other specific

[2:52:15] Trustee Morrison: questions?

[2:52:16] Trustee McConchie: I just had a question. Thanks, Robin, for providing this information for us. The reason

[2:52:20] Trustee McConchie: why we sent it back to you, mainly was because we want to make sure there's a consistency with

[2:52:24] Trustee McConchie: every SCVR owner, that your job is as an education, right? Because, you know, a lot of people come

[2:52:31] Trustee McConchie: here, and the first thing you always say, oh, yeah, don't flush if the toilets, whatever the

[2:52:35] Trustee McConchie: the color you know like it's been part of my childhood so we want to make sure that you're

[2:52:39] Trustee McConchie: doing that and because we're trying to implement kind of a standardized you know way of communicating

[2:52:43] Trustee McConchie: to folks the only

[2:52:44] Trustee McConchie: question i had was do you have an ability to monitor your water usage um relative

[2:52:49] Trustee McConchie: to um because you're on the magic lake water and sewer if i recall in this area um so the reason

[2:52:56] Trustee McConchie: being is a lot of the arguments made is that people over consume water um when they come and

[2:53:02] Trustee McConchie: stay in stvrs but we've been finding that actually those that monitor their wells or sorry their

[2:53:07] Trustee McConchie: water usage it's actually lower than the canadian standard um so i'm wondering if um you have an

[2:53:14] Trustee McConchie: ability to monitor that the water usage in your in your house um

[2:53:18] Voice 18: that's a good question free and

[2:53:20] Voice 18: forgive me i'm not as you may be getting to sense all of you i'm not very technical um i can i can

[2:53:25] Voice 18: call my brother right now and ask him that question

[2:53:27] Trustee McConchie: i don't need it right now okay

[2:53:28] Trustee McConchie: i can

[2:53:29] Trustee McConchie: I'm just wondering if you have an ability to, on your water bill, I think.

[2:53:34] Trustee McConchie: Yeah, Morrison, yeah.

[2:53:36] Planner: Sorry, yeah, CRD can provide you with an analysis, like a usage analysis.

[2:53:43] Planner: But one thing I'm going to point out here, and there's a difficulty here because we don't want to create staff work,

[2:53:50] Planner: but there's no point in doing that for a single household unless we have a relative measure of average use in Magic Lake Estate.

[2:53:58] Planner: So, and I don't know if that would fall to a project, but we can report, and we have reported in the past on STVRs, about what people's consumption is, but that's a, you know, there's nothing, there's no relative measure.

[2:54:15] Planner: Well,

[2:54:15] Trustee Morrison: we have at least

[2:54:16] Planner: a measuring point, though. We have a number.

[2:54:18] Trustee Morrison: Yeah, but there is actually, because the CRD bills have on them, um, water usage and, and

[2:54:24] Trustee Morrison: relative to the region

[2:54:26] Voice 11: or the BC.

[2:54:27] Trustee Morrison: So like the, just a copy of your water, like usage part, not the like financial part of

[2:54:33] Trustee Morrison: it, but the usage part that has the graphs on it.

[2:54:35] Trustee Morrison: That's really what you want to see.

[2:54:37] Trustee Morrison: Um, and those graphs actually show like your usage relative to the BC averages.

[2:54:42] Trustee Morrison: And I'm not sure if they do the regional averages here, but at least they, and you can look

[2:54:46] Trustee Morrison: at them year after year have them multiple years then we can start to see that and build that up

[2:54:50] Trustee Morrison: so for

[2:54:51] Planner: my point i think i would do that

[2:54:53] Trustee Morrison: sorry go ahead my

[2:54:54] Planner: point was that that's fine too but i think

[2:54:57] Planner: the number you need is the magic lake average if you're going to be looking at this so i don't know

[2:55:03] Planner: how we obtain that but i mean obviously staff can look into that but

[2:55:06] Planner: again we're not we're not

[2:55:08] Planner: flush with time to to for projects right now or extra work but yeah

[2:55:12] Trustee Morrison: the other thing phil related

[2:55:14] Trustee Morrison: to that sorry ben but the other

[2:55:17] Trustee Morrison: related to that is um i would say because we're water scarce on

[2:55:22] Trustee Morrison: pender people generally know fairly well what people what they use for water especially if

[2:55:28] Trustee Morrison: they're on a well um people have like reasonably good understanding and more and more so i think

[2:55:34] Trustee Morrison: that's starting to come because people are storing water so we have an understanding of how many

[2:55:39] Trustee Morrison: gallons you need to store for summer season use and so I think even if we have those amounts

[2:55:46] Trustee Morrison: we'll start to be able to use them in different ways so even if they might not be super comparable

[2:55:51] Trustee Morrison: yet they will start to make more and more sense to us as we go forward sorry just

[2:55:55] Planner: as a suggestion

[2:55:56] Planner: I think staff probably could look into just communicating with the CRD although we've just

[2:56:02] Planner: been talking about that about finding the average number for Magic Lake and giving

[2:56:08] Voice 11: that as a

[2:56:08] Planner: a relative measure and just one other point and this is my omission I did send some photographs

[2:56:14] Planner: that Robin provided that were left off the report but they did just showing a water conservation

[2:56:21] Planner: signage throughout the house so I forgot to report that with my initial report sorry sorry I didn't

[2:56:27] Trustee McConchie: mean to turn this into a big project I didn't realize it was that big a deal to call Kathy

[2:56:30] Trustee McConchie: Heslop and ask for that she's the chair of the water and sewer I'm sure she'd have a simple answer

[2:56:34] Trustee McConchie: the point is is that we're creating a new bylaw right with this bylaw based on the way the process

[2:56:41] Trustee McConchie: the way i've interpreted it and we're eliminating a certain amount of stvrs we're but part of that

[2:56:46] Trustee McConchie: requirement is just like would you mind robin monitoring how much water you guys use so we

[2:56:51] Trustee McConchie: have an idea so then in like 10 years from now it's like well we're finding that all these stvrs

[2:56:57] Trustee McConchie: are actually producing consuming tons and tons of water maybe we should limit them based on the

[2:57:02] Trustee McConchie: environmental concerns we have so it's mainly a data collection thing from from the stvr owner

[2:57:07] Trustee McConchie: and i think that's really beneficial i don't see how this is a big project or adding to staff time

[2:57:11] Trustee McConchie: but you know uh i i so i was people uh for you at average um

[2:57:20] Voice 18: so if yeah i'll do uh whatever

[2:57:23] Voice 18: whatever you guys recommend um or of course very happy to to do what i can i'm again i'm maybe i

[2:57:29] Voice 18: could ask phil for his advice on how i go about doing that um and i don't know whether this helps

[2:57:36] Voice 18: or not um my mother is not well so she's not living there right now so i would think realistically

[2:57:44] Voice 18: there's much less water use because you know the house is often empty um and of course of course

[2:57:53] Voice 18: she's not there anymore so it's obviously only when the gas is there and of course with covid

[2:57:57] Voice 18: but everything's empty anyway um yeah okay yeah septic we're on septic i don't know also we're

[2:58:04] Voice 18: um yeah and and thanks to to phil he had some good recommendations on the uh the label so

[2:58:12] Voice 18: uh water scarcity being a problem my mother is very big on that um now we have again thanks to

[2:58:18] Voice 18: your recommendations we have put on all the toilets the in the laundry by the sinks throughout

[2:58:23] Voice 18: throughout the kitchen, uh, labels and all the water using, uh, pieces of equipment reminding

[2:58:29] Voice 18: guests. The last thing I, um, and you know, you never know, sure. There's always, uh, not good

[2:58:36] Voice 18: people who, who might come, but just on the bright side, the people who come are very, um,

[2:58:44] Voice 18: appreciative of Pender, the guests, and they're for lack of a better word, they're,

[2:58:49] Voice 18: they're generally a very good lot of people.

[2:58:52] Voice 18: Even, you know, coming in from,

[2:58:54] Voice 18: even from Toronto on one occasion,

[2:58:55] Voice 18: they're generally really pro-environment

[2:59:00] Voice 18: and green people, which is a nice thing.

[2:59:06] Trustee McConchie: Yeah.

[2:59:08] Trustee McConchie: Okay, great.

[2:59:08] Trustee McConchie: Thanks, Rob.

[2:59:09] Trustee McConchie: I mean, Chair, if it's okay,

[2:59:10] Trustee McConchie: I'd like to make a motion that the North Bender Island

[2:59:13] Trustee McConchie: will trust community member use permit MPTUP 2021.2

[2:59:18] Trustee McConchie: pedifer is there

[2:59:23] Trustee Patrick: a second second by trustee morrison any discussion on this motion no thanks

[2:59:28] Trustee Morrison: very much for for providing the additional information and

[2:59:33] Trustee McConchie: i want to wish your mother uh

[2:59:34] Trustee McConchie: good health and good vibes robin well

[2:59:38] Voice 18: thanks very much she had covid but she's uh she's okay oh my

[2:59:41] Trustee Morrison: gosh yeah i'm sorry yeah

[2:59:42] Voice 18: and uh thanks to each of you and uh hopefully maybe i'll meet you guys on

[2:59:46] Voice 18: pender at some point my mother uh got the place in the 70s so i've been going ever since i was a baby

[2:59:54] Voice 18: so yeah awesome thank you

[2:59:57] Voice 18: anyway thank you okay i'm

[2:59:58] Trustee Patrick: gonna call the vote then

[3:00:00] Trustee Patrick: All those in favor?

[3:00:01] Trustee Patrick: And that is carried.

[3:00:03] Trustee Patrick: So thank you, Robin, for coming today.

[3:00:05] Trustee Patrick: Thank you, the Planner Test Mall.

[3:00:07] Voice 18: Yeah, thank you very much to all of you.

[3:00:08] Voice 18: And thanks, Phil, also, and Maple, for your assistance.

[3:00:12] Voice 18: Thank you.

[3:00:13] Voice 18: Okay, Carla.

[3:00:14] Trustee Patrick: All right, our next application

[3:00:16] Trustee Patrick: is a development permit 2021.2, loss.

[3:00:20] Trustee Patrick: And I see Phil's still with us for the staff report,

[3:00:23] Trustee Patrick: which is on page 164 of the report.

[3:00:26] Trustee Patrick: report this

[3:00:28] Planner: is the last one and it's it's not a tup so we can all rest is

[3:00:33] Voice 21: that yeah um

[3:00:35] Planner: sorry um

[3:00:37] Planner: so this is for uh 4606 oak road and 4602 oak road uh and the report is to consider a development

[3:00:45] Planner: permit uh which is required for a boundary adjustment subdivision between the two

[3:00:49] Planner: properties, within which development permit areas two, which is herbaceous, and four wetland

[3:00:58] Planner: ecosystems are designated. So there's no development associated with this application.

[3:01:03] Planner: However, there is a requirement to obtain a development permit to finalize the boundary

[3:01:07] Planner: adjustment subdivision. The type of subdivision does not create any new loss, but rather it moves

[3:01:15] Planner: the interior shared boundary and the current configurations are shown on page 166 and figure 2

[3:01:22] Planner: as well as the proposed which is essentially increasing well is increasing a lot for by adding

[3:01:28] Planner: a 0.08 hectare triangle to the southeast corner and the intent of doing that is to pursue sorry

[3:01:39] Planner: sorry, preserve a view corridor with Port Browning

[3:01:42] Planner: to ensure that it otherwise wouldn't be built upon.

[3:01:45] Planner: So the understanding is that the property 4602 will be sold

[3:01:51] Planner: or it will be on the market soon if it's not already.

[3:01:54] Planner: And so the owner of, sorry, the applicant, Stephen Lofts,

[3:01:59] Planner: has an agreement to obtain a piece of that to preserve that view corridor.

[3:02:04] Planner: are um as you know uh lot three uh was the subject of a rezoning application and we had a similar

[3:02:12] Planner: application for dp which was required for the subdivision for that so this is very similar

[3:02:18] Planner: um and that was approved in november of 26 2020. um so the two i've indicated which two

[3:02:27] Planner: two development permit areas are designated and the overall objective for those two is

[3:02:33] Planner: to preserve and protect remaining ecosystems.

[3:02:37] Planner: So there's a DPA checklist that was included on page 202 of the agenda for relevant guidelines,

[3:02:43] Planner: which are not a lot in this case.

[3:02:46] Planner: And in summary, the proposal meets those DPA guidelines and as required, the owners retained

[3:02:55] Planner: Sarah Bonner, who's a registered biologist, to undertake an assessment and make recommendations

[3:03:01] Planner: in accordance with the DPA guidelines. And her report is on page 175 to 200 of the agenda.

[3:03:07] Planner: And that provides a baseline environmental assessment, reviewing sensitive ecosystem

[3:03:12] Planner: mapping, raptor and harem nesting mapping, and conservation data and a field survey.

[3:03:18] Planner: survey, and it concluded that no new land alteration is planned, therefore no species

[3:03:23] Planner: are expected to be impacted by this lot line adjustment. Site observations confirmed the

[3:03:29] Planner: presence of the wetland, terrestrial herbaceous, and intertidal ecosystems within lot 3, and

[3:03:35] Planner: that no impact will result from the proposed boundary line adjustment. There were no recommendations

[3:03:41] Planner: recommendations made by the biologist report. However, by copy of this report, we are encouraging

[3:03:49] Planner: the applicant to remove invasive species and ensure that any new plantings would include

[3:03:54] Planner: native species. Staff's recommendation is that the LTC approve issuance of DP-NP-DP-2021.2

[3:04:07] Planner: loss and the rationale being that it's supported by the objectives and guidelines of the dpa which

[3:04:12] Planner: have been met and the boundary adjustment would not sorry would result in significant

[3:04:20] Planner: would not result in sorry in a sufficient area of each lot for the permitted uses without

[3:04:26] Planner: encroaching into the so it would let me restate that it would result in a sufficient area on each

[3:04:32] Planner: lot for the permitted uses without encroaching into the sensitive ecosystems which points back

[3:04:37] Planner: back to the need for this type of application.

[3:04:41] Planner: So there's alternatives included and that's the summary.

[3:04:44] Trustee Patrick: Thank you, Planner Testimale.

[3:04:46] Trustee Patrick: Maple, can we get the applicant moved over?

[3:04:51] Voice 4: Yes, one moment here.

[3:04:54] Voice 4: Just moving Steven Lofts over.

[3:04:59] Voice 4: Steven, you may unmute yourself now if you wish

[3:05:01] Voice 4: and turn on your camera too.

[3:05:04] Okay,

[3:05:05] Voice 19: can you hear me?

[3:05:07] Trustee Patrick: Yes, we can, hello.

[3:05:08] Trustee Patrick: I'm

[3:05:09] Voice 19: not sure why it's not. I was watching. I don't know why I'm not being seen. Anyway, it doesn't really matter. Just briefly, I think what Phil said, there's no development going on here. I'm just buying a quarter of an acre to protect my view in the event that the new buyer downstream from me decides they want to do something.

[3:05:34] Voice 19: something. There's no wells or septic fields and we are quite some distance from the DP

[3:05:42] Voice 19: areas on my neighbor's property. So there's no concerns there either. So it's pretty

[3:05:49] Voice 19: straightforward, I think.

[3:05:51] Trustee Patrick: All right. Thank you. The trustees might have questions for you.

[3:05:54] Trustee Patrick: Trustees. Now we can see you, Stephen. Yeah, I

[3:05:57] Voice 19: found the button.

[3:05:59] Trustee Patrick: Any questions for the applicant or staff? Yes.

[3:06:04] Trustee McConchie: I got a question. What's the point of

[3:06:06] Trustee McConchie: of the islands trust in this

[3:06:07] Trustee Patrick: bill okay

[3:06:09] Planner: so so we honey we've had this question before on these

[3:06:15] Planner: type of applications so uh and essentially what's going on here is is that there is a requirement

[3:06:22] Planner: when these with a development permit area when it's designated subdivision is one of the types

[3:06:27] Planner: of uh one of the activities that requires a dp and the reason for that is my last statements

[3:06:35] Planner: which i fumbled upon which is that in a subdivision there needs to be an assurance

[3:06:41] Planner: that if there's dpas involved that there's sufficient area for development on each of

[3:06:47] Planner: the properties without essentially putting everything into one basket so you create a

[3:06:52] Planner: property that has only dpas on it or very limited developmental areas without impacting the dpas so

[3:06:59] Planner: that's the that's the lens that this has to be looked through again it's we can't we don't have

[3:07:06] Planner: the uh as staff we don't have the ability to even though we're not delegated to have discretion to

[3:07:14] Planner: say this doesn't require a dp because it doesn't make any sense like they've as steven's pointed

[3:07:20] Planner: out the the ecosystems are distance and things like that we we have you have the guidelines or

[3:07:25] Planner: you have the requirements that are part of the DP

[3:07:26] Planner: and that's where this gets caught.

[3:07:29] Planner: So it's hollow, I understand that,

[3:07:33] Planner: but there is intent there which is we've spoken to before

[3:07:36] Planner: in previous meetings on similar applications.

[3:07:39] Planner: So maybe that's not a good answer.

[3:07:42] Voice 6: I'll just add that the intent is to avoid a subdivision

[3:07:47] Voice 6: where development is forced into development permit areas.

[3:07:51] Voice 6: So this is a mechanism that allows the local trust committee

[3:07:53] Voice 6: we need to actually control the layout of subdivisions.

[3:07:56] Voice 6: Where there's not a development permit area,

[3:07:57] Voice 6: you don't really have control

[3:07:58] Voice 6: over the layout of subdivisions.

[3:08:00] Voice 6: So this gives you some

[3:08:00] Voice 6: discretion over that.

[3:08:02] Voice 6: This case, it's not affecting.

[3:08:05] Voice 6: There's plenty of area on both lots to develop

[3:08:08] Voice 6: without needing a further DP in the future.

[3:08:10] Voice 6: So this is an example

[3:08:12] Voice 6: of how the development permit process can work.

[3:08:16] Voice 11: Well,

[3:08:17] Trustee McConchie: it's just interesting

[3:08:18] Trustee McConchie: because like this, you know,

[3:08:19] Trustee McConchie: just hearing from planner testimonial

[3:08:21] Trustee McConchie: just about how busy you guys are.

[3:08:22] Trustee McConchie: and this is a deficiency in a way because you guys spent a whole bunch of time on well i don't know

[3:08:27] Trustee McConchie: how much time you spent on it because i never no one ever answers the question how you guys spend

[3:08:31] Trustee McConchie: time so it's it that's what i'm just wondering if there's maybe an improvement needed in the process

[3:08:36] Trustee McConchie: where in a particular giant lot like this where the dpa is a way on the other side

[3:08:40] Trustee McConchie: i mean i wonder if there's a way to improve this so it's more efficient use of time and

[3:08:45] Trustee McConchie: because i there's the way the package comes to me as a trustee it's like there's nothing i can do

[3:08:52] Trustee McConchie: what what what am i going to do here the even the alternatives are like beg get a lawyer anyways

[3:08:58] Trustee McConchie: we've

[3:08:58] Planner: well so just so this is typical with the dp though like if somebody is meeting all the

[3:09:04] Planner: conditions of the dp you're bound

[3:09:06] Planner: to issue the dp well

[3:09:07] Trustee Morrison: that's the point yeah

[3:09:08] Planner: and it's it's so

[3:09:09] Planner: it's a mechanism but we've said we've stated this before there's there's no delegation we don't have

[3:09:15] Planner: the islands trust doesn't have the ability for you as the trustees to delegate to staff for

[3:09:21] Planner: certain types of dps which other other authority land you know regional districts and municipalities

[3:09:28] Planner: have the islands trust doesn't have that and that's again we've i think this we had this

[3:09:33] Planner: conversation last time that's the the wish list that's gone to the minister so or it's part of it

[3:09:38] Planner: yeah so

[3:09:40] Planner: where you

[3:09:41] Planner: wouldn't see these so yeah if that was the case so

[3:09:45] Trustee Morrison: one other question related

[3:09:47] Trustee Morrison: to the cost of kind of permit because um so like is it required that they have a biology report

[3:09:54] Trustee Morrison: in this case like is that a requirement of the dp it's

[3:09:58] Planner: not absolute in this case what we

[3:10:00] Planner: recommended was um that they because they were we had just done the same gone through the same

[3:10:08] Planner: process for the other property or that one of the properties that they quote unquote it doesn't for

[3:10:14] Planner: lack of better terms piggyback on that and just have that biologist do the same here um yeah

[3:10:21] Planner: and that's what

[3:10:22] Planner: happened so i unfortunately i think the cost was probably a bit higher than

[3:10:27] Planner: i would have thought it would have been but that's not yeah i probably shouldn't make that comment

[3:10:31] Planner: Yeah,

[3:10:32] Trustee Morrison: no, but just to clarify my question, like, like, is, is it, is it, do you as staff have discretion about whether at any particular stage to ask for any particular kind of report?

[3:10:45] Planner: Yeah, we do.

[3:10:48] Planner: It's

[3:10:49] Voice 6: the development approval information bylaw that, that that's where you can delegate to staff through that bylaw,

[3:10:54] Voice 6: which you've done to establish the requirements for reporting.

[3:11:00] Voice 6: reporting

[3:11:01] Trustee Morrison: okay because like in this case for instance where the dp that we're concerned about

[3:11:05] Trustee Morrison: is far away like i wouldn't have asked necessarily for a biologist report and and i know it was a lot

[3:11:12] Trustee Morrison: more expensive than you anticipated bill but maybe that's more of an iterative conversation

[3:11:16] Trustee Morrison: um because it just seems like it's a huge cost for essentially just a boundary adjustment related

[3:11:22] Trustee Morrison: and you know it is what it is but i just feel like it's putting a lot on on applicants this

[3:11:28] Trustee Morrison: kind of thing so okay um yeah i i understand even it was expensive is that accurate to say

[3:11:37] Voice 19: well it was yeah i was close it was almost a thousand dollars plus there's the application

[3:11:42] Voice 19: fee for the development permit itself

[3:11:44] Voice 11: and

[3:11:45] Voice 19: you know everyone has their handout whether it's um

[3:11:48] Voice 19: uh even vha for goodness sakes i mean you know it's just uh it blew me away when i was looking

[3:11:57] Voice 19: looking at buying this property, just how much it costs to actually buy it, let alone the cost

[3:12:01] Voice 19: of the property, if you know what I'm saying. Yeah. Yeah. It is surprising. It's a wonder

[3:12:06] Voice 19: anything ever gets achieved. And what I'm doing, I think is pretty straightforward and it's not

[3:12:12] Voice 19: hurting anyone,

[3:12:13] Voice 1: you

[3:12:14] Voice 19: know? So what's, why does it cost so much? Okay.

[3:12:19] Voice 19: That's my peeve for today.

[3:12:21] Voice 19: yeah that's

[3:12:22] Trustee Morrison: okay we all have our daily one um all right so any other thoughts on this any other

[3:12:29] Trustee Morrison: questions comments

[3:12:30] Trustee McConchie: we we uh yeah we can't um we can't i can't see anything in the guideline that

[3:12:37] Trustee McConchie: could oppose the application in the dpa checklist or sorry in the dp checklist so i from a trustee

[3:12:45] Trustee McConchie: perspective if i understand the role it would be if it's to deny it would be to you know point

[3:12:50] Trustee McConchie: which guideline is not being utilized.

[3:12:52] Trustee McConchie: So I don't have one.

[3:12:53] Trustee McConchie: So I don't see any other alternative

[3:12:55] Trustee McConchie: other than to approve the motion

[3:12:59] Trustee McConchie: to improve Mr. Loft's view.

[3:13:02] Trustee Morrison: Right.

[3:13:04] Trustee McConchie: So I'd like to make a motion

[3:13:06] Trustee McConchie: that the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee

[3:13:07] Trustee McConchie: approve issuance of bill in the permit MPDP 20202.1.2 Lofts.

[3:13:13] Trustee Patrick: Is there a second?

[3:13:14] Trustee Patrick: Seconded by Trustee Morrison.

[3:13:15] Trustee Patrick: Any discussion?

[3:13:17] Trustee Patrick: I'll call the vote.

[3:13:18] Trustee Patrick: All those in favor?

[3:13:19] Trustee Patrick: and that's carried.

[3:13:23] Trustee Patrick: Thanks, Stephen.

[3:13:24] Trustee Patrick: I know. Thank you.

[3:13:26] Trustee Patrick: Thank you very much, Stephen Loss for being here.

[3:13:28] Trustee Patrick: And I think I'm hopeful that we'll have the authority

[3:13:31] Trustee Patrick: to delegate this, delegate development permits

[3:13:34] Trustee Patrick: to staff in the future.

[3:13:37] Voice 19: Well, I wish you luck with that.

[3:13:39] Trustee Patrick: Thank you.

[3:13:42] Trustee Patrick: All right, moving on.

[3:13:44] Trustee Patrick: We have rezoning 2021.1 sketch on page 204

[3:13:50] Trustee Patrick: of the agenda package.

[3:13:51] Trustee Patrick: and i see that the planner test mall is done and we have planner stockville staff report so over

[3:13:56] Trustee Patrick: to you planner stockville thank

[3:13:57] Planner Stockdill (probable): you chair patrick we'll give phil a break here uh so i am introducing

[3:14:03] Planner Stockdill (probable): an application to amend the north pender land use bylaw to rezone the subject property from

[3:14:09] Planner Stockdill (probable): rural residential to a site-specific rural residential zone the ltc is familiar with this

[3:14:16] Planner Stockdill (probable): property and with this rezoning application. The applicant did apply back in 2019 with

[3:14:25] Planner Stockdill (probable): a similar application and that was denied. The proposal is in result of a bylaw enforcement

[3:14:34] Planner Stockdill (probable): action in 2018. That is for the placement of six storage containers on the subject property

[3:14:43] Planner Stockdill (probable): property without the establishment of a principal dwelling unit at that time the applicant was

[3:14:50] Planner Stockdill (probable): giving a number of alternatives in order to comply with the land use bylaw and those are stated in

[3:14:56] Planner Stockdill (probable): the in the staff report the applicant is now reapplying with the same proposal that was

[3:15:04] Planner Stockdill (probable): included or introduced to the LTC back in 2019 although the applicant has now made some

[3:15:12] Planner Stockdill (probable): improvements to the land and those are the planting are a number of cedar trees to help

[3:15:17] Planner Stockdill (probable): screen the shipping containers from the road and also the construction of a pretty significant

[3:15:23] Planner Stockdill (probable): cedar wood fence which does screen the shipping containers from neighboring properties

[3:15:31] Planner Stockdill (probable): as mentioned the property is zoned rural residential and the current use is currently

[3:15:40] Planner Stockdill (probable): currently illegal as there is no principal residential use established on the property

[3:15:44] Planner Stockdill (probable): um the there was an indication that a principal residential use will be initiated at some point

[3:15:54] Planner Stockdill (probable): on the subject property but the applicant has mentioned that there are tech or geotechnical

[3:15:59] Planner Stockdill (probable): issues with slope and Rockfall but there is no clear evidence that a building permit wouldn't

[3:16:06] Planner Stockdill (probable): be issued for residents on that property so staff have made the recommendation to not move forward

[3:16:18] Planner Stockdill (probable): with this rezoning application that's based on the surrounding rural residential land use context is

[3:16:25] Planner Stockdill (probable): not suitable for the storage of six shipping containers which could be which is essentially

[3:16:31] Planner Stockdill (probable): a light industrial use also the proposed use is contrary to the official community plan

[3:16:37] Planner Stockdill (probable): as the property is designated rural residential.

[3:16:42] Planner Stockdill (probable): The applicant is aware that an application for a TUP

[3:16:46] Planner Stockdill (probable): may be the better course of action

[3:16:48] Planner Stockdill (probable): because it would provide the property owner

[3:16:51] Planner Stockdill (probable): potentially up to six years to save up

[3:16:55] Planner Stockdill (probable): and plan for the construction of a dwelling unit

[3:16:58] Planner Stockdill (probable): on the property,

[3:17:00] Planner Stockdill (probable): which then would bring the structures,

[3:17:02] Planner Stockdill (probable): the accessory buildings into compliance

[3:17:04] Planner Stockdill (probable): with the land use bylaw.

[3:17:06] Planner Stockdill (probable): The LTC also has another option which is to proceed with the application but at a reduced

[3:17:13] Planner Stockdill (probable): scale so the LTC could move forward with a rezoning application but request the applicant

[3:17:19] Planner Stockdill (probable): to reduce the number of accessory buildings on the property and so I've included that as a

[3:17:25] Planner Stockdill (probable): alternative for the LTC to consider and that is alternative number three.

[3:17:32] Planner Stockdill (probable): I know the applicant is here, and I'm sure Mr. Sketch will like to speak to support his application.

[3:17:42] Planner Stockdill (probable): He has also provided a number of pictures of the steeder screening and also the fence that he installed.

[3:17:51] Planner Stockdill (probable): So, as mentioned, the recommendation on page 204 of the agenda is that the North Pender LTC deny the application.

[3:18:01] Planner Stockdill (probable): If the LTC makes this, if this is the motion is supported, then bylaw enforcement will continue for the property.

[3:18:11] Planner Stockdill (probable): Thank you.

[3:18:12] Trustee Patrick: Thank you, Clarence.

[3:18:14] Trustee Patrick: Dr. Lowe, can we have the applicant moved over?

[3:18:23] Voice 4: Okay, Michael

[3:18:24] Voice 12: Sketch has been moved over.

[3:18:25] Voice 4: over Michael you can unmute yourself and turn on your camera if you wish and start

[3:18:32] Voice 14: video yep we

[3:18:35] Trustee Patrick: can hear you Michael is yes would you like to add anything um

[3:18:39] Voice 14: I submitted yesterday um my response

[3:18:44] Voice 14: to the staff report and uh if you've received it and had a chance to look at it um that's what I

[3:18:51] Voice 14: have to say or what i can add if i have any if there are any questions on on that um i i think a

[3:18:59] Voice 14: a principal concern of mine is that the use because of form and character of the structures

[3:19:06] Voice 14: i use to store my domestic goods has de facto being described as an industrial use and i

[3:19:15] Voice 14: I do not believe it is.

[3:19:17] Voice 14: And I really made an effort to adequately screen

[3:19:25] Voice 14: so that, and I've had numerous unsolicited compliments

[3:19:31] Voice 14: on the fence and how it looks.

[3:19:34] Voice 14: And of course, one would like to see nothing there at all,

[3:19:40] Voice 14: all, but I had absolutely no choice in 2018 and no time to do anything, and there was

[3:19:48] Voice 14: no place zoned to accommodate these goods. I did look at the land use by-law and the

[3:19:55] Voice 14: industrial zones, and I had two months to move. I hope you will look on this favorably.

[3:20:03] Voice 14: um i hope thank you oh and my my use is ongoing i i there's no realistic improvement

[3:20:14] Voice 14: in the uh property availability for rentals uh i have a small uh spot now for which we are

[3:20:22] Voice 14: very grateful but most of the ones that i am hearing about uh that that come up are quite small

[3:20:30] Voice 14: all um and to be able to find 1500 square feet um at a reasonable price um in the next 25 years is

[3:20:40] Voice 14: is unlikely um i i really don't believe that i have um created a a monster on my property

[3:20:50] Voice 14: this is less than one percent of of my five and a quarter acres largely treed

[3:20:58] Voice 14: and by the by there there although it's not directly relevant but there is an easement

[3:21:05] Voice 14: along the edge of the north edge of my property which my father wanted for walking use by

[3:21:13] Voice 14: stanley point residents and i've maintained that easement and it was an awful mess when i

[3:21:20] Voice 14: inherited it the easement began with a ditch and then a large shale extraction

[3:21:28] Voice 14: pit for the building of that road it was ugly and really unusable and when I did

[3:21:36] Voice 14: the placement of the containers the excavator operator was kind enough to

[3:21:42] Voice 14: use his skills to really sculpt that into a very handsome entrance for the

[3:21:48] Voice 14: easement path that is not of course directly related to the containers but it makes

[3:21:56] Voice 14: that path usable and attractive for local residents the caveat is that the next door

[3:22:03] Voice 14: neighbors have said they will not have any passage of the public or sadly point residents

[3:22:10] Voice 14: onto that next property.

[3:22:13] Voice 14: So it's a short, short walk, but it is an improvement.

[3:22:17] Voice 14: And overall, when you drive into that cul-de-sac,

[3:22:20] Voice 14: I think it looks fine now.

[3:22:25] Voice 14: And I hope you will consider this application favorably.

[3:22:30] Voice 14: Thank you.

[3:22:30] Voice 14: Thank

[3:22:31] Trustee Patrick: you very much.

[3:22:32] Trustee Patrick: Trustees, questions, comments for staff or the applicant?

[3:22:35] Trustee McConchie: I've got a quick question.

[3:22:36] Trustee McConchie: There's talking about geotechnical issues.

[3:22:39] Trustee McConchie: what I've never seen a geotechnical report is there a geotechnical report

[3:22:43] Trustee McConchie: available yes

[3:22:45] Voice 14: as I said at a previous application I think it was you who asked

[3:22:50] Voice 14: about this the rockfall hazard was identified at the time of settling of my

[3:22:57] Voice 14: father's estate I every indication I've had an eye this isn't absolutely

[3:23:04] Voice 14: definite there are similar situations on Pender Island and yes the rockfall

[3:23:09] Voice 14: hazard can be mitigated but it's but it's expensive it really is expensive and i um

[3:23:16] Voice 14: yeah to be blunt i can't afford to put a house uh a well uh a sewage disposal field and mitigate

[3:23:23] Voice 14: rockfall hazard uh i i just you know my capital and my income are insufficient and i would be

[3:23:34] Voice 14: folly at my age to go into debt to to afford a house on that property it can be built yes i'm

[3:23:41] Voice 14: i'm i'm an engineer and i believe it can be but you have to pay for it um and i i can't i

[3:23:49] Voice 14: but i um i i said in my my report to you that i'd been in touch with uh on galliano island

[3:23:58] Voice 14: trustee of two terms and a current trustee and on Galliano it's simply put

[3:24:06] Voice 14: structures are allowed on unbuilt residentially zoned land and I asked had

[3:24:13] Voice 14: there been trouble do people abuse that privilege do they cover the place with

[3:24:18] Voice 14: all sorts of debris and just wreck it and the answer was no not at all the the

[3:24:25] Voice 14: the real environmental impact comes when a house is put on that on the property so those property

[3:24:31] Voice 14: owners with unbuilt land like mine have modest use of it and they're not sort of automatically

[3:24:38] Voice 14: drawn to make any use of the property to put a house on it um so i there are two sides to the

[3:24:45] Voice 14: coin of the of the absolute rigorous prohibition of structures or even allowing one building on an

[3:24:53] Voice 14: an unbuilt lot um there's an incentive to put a house on it and um i think it's an unnecessary

[3:25:00] Voice 14: incentive myself and i will lobby the local trust committee uh regarding the land use bylaw

[3:25:08] Voice 14: improvements um in that regard okay so

[3:25:11] Trustee McConchie: just covered a lot of topics there just getting back

[3:25:15] Trustee McConchie: to the original point that i was making in question so there you're suggesting there has

[3:25:20] Trustee McConchie: been the geotechnical survey done of this because part of the rationale given by from correspondence

[3:25:25] Trustee McConchie: from folks that are in support of your application is uh that the property is not usable and can you

[3:25:31] Trustee McConchie: cannot build a structure or a house on it therefore allow this particular type of use

[3:25:37] Trustee McConchie: because what other use can you use for the property but now i'm hearing that you can

[3:25:40] Trustee McConchie: actually build a house on this

[3:25:42] Voice 14: potentially for a price i believe so but it's expensive

[3:25:46] Voice 14: the the the rockfall mitigation is is very expensive but

[3:25:50] Trustee McConchie: the land itself can be done

[3:25:51] Voice 14: sorry land sorry potential

[3:25:56] Trustee McConchie: oh sorry so

[3:25:58] Trustee Patrick: the land is blocking out

[3:26:00] Trustee McConchie: sorry sorry but my question was

[3:26:03] Trustee McConchie: just shoot the internet spit my question was but the land you can build a structure on the house

[3:26:11] Trustee McConchie: just or on the property is is can

[3:26:13] Voice 14: be built on i believe expensive and that's the an educated

[3:26:17] Voice 14: engineering opinion but i have been warned that it is very expensive and i don't mean 10 or 20

[3:26:24] Voice 14: thousand dollars but there is

[3:26:26] Trustee McConchie: so there is no geotechnical report from what i understand even

[3:26:31] Trustee McConchie: though people keep saying geotechnical concerns there's no geotechnical report uh

[3:26:35] Voice 14: i i believe

[3:26:37] Voice 14: there was, I've answered this once, but I believe there was one done at the time I acquired the

[3:26:43] Voice 14: property from the estate. And the reason for that report was assessing the value that I would

[3:26:52] Voice 14: buy it for. And I think I remember from 1993 that that report was left with the CRD. I didn't see it.

[3:27:04] Voice 14: Okay.

[3:27:05] Trustee McConchie: So then my next question is, you know, I was a renter on Pender for four or five years, and, you know, it was unstable. But I had to downsize my possessions. So I'm wondering, you know, why do you feel that the Islands Trust should take into account your storage of personal possessions as part of land usage? Why should that be part of our decision?

[3:27:34] Voice 14: because part of the island's trust is to be compassionate about the needs of individual residents on the island.

[3:27:42] Voice 14: I have, for instance, 20 years of my own work, research work, for which I did not file a PhD,

[3:27:50] Voice 14: but there's worth in the work.

[3:27:54] Voice 14: Something happened in my life and I had to move suddenly.

[3:27:58] Voice 14: And I'd like to get back to that work.

[3:28:00] Voice 14: Half a container is full of that work.

[3:28:04] Voice 14: And yes, I could burn it, throw it out.

[3:28:07] Voice 14: I have family items.

[3:28:12] Voice 14: I

[3:28:12] Trustee Patrick: don't think, I was going to say,

[3:28:13] Trustee Patrick: I don't think we have to get into the detail of what you...

[3:28:16] Trustee Patrick: No,

[3:28:16] Trustee McConchie: nor do I.

[3:28:16] Trustee McConchie: I'm going to, Chair Patrick, just for clarification,

[3:28:20] Trustee McConchie: there's rationale provided by correspondence

[3:28:23] Trustee McConchie: and by the applicant.

[3:28:24] Trustee McConchie: I'm just asking about the rationale.

[3:28:26] Trustee McConchie: One of the rationales was,

[3:28:27] Trustee McConchie: I

[3:28:27] Voice 11: need some money to store my possessions.

[3:28:29] Trustee McConchie: Why should,

[3:28:30] Trustee McConchie: just a second,

[3:28:31] Trustee McConchie: I just want to clarify my point, please.

[3:28:32] Trustee McConchie: why should the local trust committee be in the business of making land use decisions based on

[3:28:39] Trustee McConchie: people's personal possessions is my question um

[3:28:43] Voice 14: i i am asking uh a compassionate consideration

[3:28:48] Voice 14: of my needs as a resident and my needs are as a resident are for uh some place to live and

[3:28:57] Voice 14: someplace to put my possessions the possessions are to me valuable they may not be commercially

[3:29:04] Voice 14: valuable but they are very valuable to me and they're valuable to my estate the people I wish

[3:29:10] Voice 14: to pass them on to I've hit I had two 12-year rental situations that worked fine then suddenly

[3:29:19] Voice 14: a one year and now um a very small place and uh i i the circumstance in part because of island's

[3:29:29] Voice 14: trust permission of of commercial use of residential areas there are an awful lot of

[3:29:34] Voice 14: houses that are empty and prior to about tooth the mid 2000 and about 2007 i started hearing of

[3:29:44] Voice 14: people not being able to find a house to rent, there was a shift for these people with houses

[3:29:50] Voice 14: to cash in on them on an STVR basis for one month of the year and leave them empty the rest.

[3:30:00] Voice 14: accelerating downward spiral of availability and um you can say that's not my problem is not your

[3:30:08] Voice 14: problem but i i have to live with it and as a consequence i am with humility asking for permission

[3:30:16] Voice 14: for a very modest use of land i've paid taxes on for 25 years and not had the use of well thank you

[3:30:27] Trustee Patrick: Any further questions or comments or staff for the applicant?

[3:30:33] Trustee Morrison: So a couple quick comments. So it seems to me that the the problem we're hitting is really about

[3:30:44] Trustee Morrison: properly zoned land for storage of for storage capability on the island.

[3:30:51] Trustee Morrison: If there isn't a zoned land for storage use, which I don't think there is,

[3:30:58] Trustee Morrison: then where do we think that that needs to be in the in our land use bylaw to review so that we

[3:31:05] Trustee Morrison: have appropriate storage so there are a number of existing industrial zone lands or potentially

[3:31:11] Trustee Morrison: industrial zonable lands that would be appropriate for storage and i guess my question around this

[3:31:17] Trustee Morrison: is um like if there was one a an alternative location for like an actual zone place for

[3:31:27] Trustee Morrison: storage of those type of containers somewhere else on the island would that be something that's

[3:31:32] Trustee Morrison: available or possible for you because our concern here is like we're countering our ocp

[3:31:39] Trustee Morrison: if we went forward with this by putting in essentially industrial use in the middle of

[3:31:46] Trustee Morrison: a residential neighborhood and so you know putting industrial adding an industrial use to the

[3:31:53] Trustee Morrison: industrial piece of land is a different issue um so i you know i know there is like a small

[3:32:01] Trustee Morrison: uh mini storage kind of thing in one place it's a home business um kind of issue but

[3:32:08] Trustee Morrison: thoughts about and maybe this is a more general question for everybody but thoughts about like

[3:32:14] Trustee Morrison: having other industrial land having storage added to that does that resolve

[3:32:21] Trustee Morrison: this issue it

[3:32:23] Voice 14: would not for me personally and I there are others in my

[3:32:28] Voice 14: situation people who have unbuilt land and they've had to in some cases just go

[3:32:37] Voice 14: ahead and use it and they're not likely to write to you on the subject because

[3:32:42] Voice 14: because they don't want by law enforcement.

[3:32:44] Voice 14: But one of the six containers,

[3:32:49] Voice 14: I'm able to put an aisle down the middle

[3:32:52] Voice 14: so I can get at it or in it at the moment

[3:32:55] Voice 14: because I'm in such a small place.

[3:32:58] Voice 14: The rest are fairly well packed.

[3:33:00] Voice 14: So every now and then,

[3:33:01] Voice 14: we need something at the back of the container.

[3:33:04] Voice 14: This is two or three times a week we access the containers.

[3:33:08] Voice 14: And it means taking things out,

[3:33:10] Voice 14: putting them on the ground,

[3:33:12] Voice 14: And that really is very awkward in a public storage area.

[3:33:16] Voice 14: And the other area, the other concern of my own is I have a limited pension money and rents are screaming up and nobody is going to give me use of their land to put my possessions on.

[3:33:37] Voice 14: on. But I do have, and I'm very blessed and lucky to have it, five acres of land that I'm

[3:33:47] Voice 14: asking you for permission to use a tiny portion of. And I dispute that this is an industrial use.

[3:33:54] Voice 14: And I question the logic of claiming it's industrial because of the container shape.

[3:34:00] Voice 14: If they were wooden structures, would one say that it was industrial?

[3:34:05] Voice 14: And the day I put a house on it, if I could afford it, suddenly it would become accessory to a residential use, no longer industrial.

[3:34:17] Voice 14: I mean, how can that happen if it's intrinsically an industrial use?

[3:34:22] Voice 14: I can't fathom that, and I don't agree with it.

[3:34:26] Voice 14: and nor do i want either a commercial or an industrial use on my property

[3:34:35] Voice 14: this i think is a legitimate personal goods um they are as i've said they are cupboards

[3:34:45] Voice 14: for my own house the house here hasn't got any cupboard space but i do have um uh on my property

[3:34:56] Voice 14: and I'm using them as cupboards. And I understand that property owners in Stanley Point were upset,

[3:35:08] Voice 14: particularly when the storage containers first went in and there was kind of a scar

[3:35:15] Voice 14: of fresh excavation and the storage containers looking very different from the forest. And

[3:35:24] Voice 14: And that situation and why I'm giving this, we're making this application now, is that the surrounding vegetation has reverted a bit.

[3:35:36] Voice 14: And the alder trees give a really substantial screen.

[3:35:40] Voice 14: And it is very difficult to see even the fence now in the summer.

[3:35:45] Voice 14: In the winter, you can see the alder trees bare and then the fence, which I believe is an attractive one.

[3:35:52] Voice 14: and you cannot see the storage containers so I and I have use of my own land very modest

[3:35:59] Voice 14: and I envisage this as a permitted use such and such a percentage of my land with necessary

[3:36:10] Voice 14: screening I don't envisage this as a rezoning to accommodate an industrial use with respect

[3:36:18] Voice 14: respect

[3:36:20] Trustee Morrison: so and if

[3:36:21] Trustee McConchie: i can ask yeah

[3:36:22] Trustee McConchie: sorry sorry trustee i

[3:36:24] Trustee Morrison: can ask just a couple quick questions

[3:36:25] Trustee Morrison: of staff on this just to remind me because we've had a lot of different paperwork um in front of

[3:36:31] Trustee Morrison: us in the last couple years um one of the recommendations kim is to deny the application

[3:36:37] Trustee Morrison: and recommend the applicant applies for a temporary use permit and part of the denied

[3:36:42] Trustee Morrison: application issue is that we're permanently rezoning something um against our current ocp

[3:36:48] Trustee Morrison: in our current bylaws.

[3:36:50] Trustee Morrison: So in terms of the temporary use,

[3:36:54] Trustee Morrison: I thought that's how we started this whole train

[3:36:56] Trustee Morrison: was with the temporary use permit.

[3:36:59] Trustee Morrison: Was that not true?

[3:37:01] Trustee Morrison: Because with bylaw enforcement,

[3:37:03] Trustee Morrison: I thought we went into a TUP originally.

[3:37:06] Planner Stockdill (probable): From my understanding,

[3:37:07] Planner Stockdill (probable): there was not a TUP issued for this property.

[3:37:11] Planner Stockdill (probable): Robert may have a little bit more of a history.

[3:37:13] Planner Stockdill (probable): From my understanding,

[3:37:14] Planner Stockdill (probable): it was an application for a rezoning in 2019.

[3:37:18] Voice 6: There were actually

[3:37:19] Voice 6: two previous rezoning applications

[3:37:21] Voice 6: that the LTCs turned down.

[3:37:23] Voice 6: Okay, and

[3:37:24] Voice 6: none of them were TUP?

[3:37:25] Voice 6: No, there was no TUP application.

[3:37:28] Voice 6: No.

[3:37:30] Trustee Morrison: Okay, because to me,

[3:37:33] Trustee Morrison: I'm hearing the personal challenge that Mr. Sketching,

[3:37:39] Trustee Morrison: I'm also not really wanting to rezone land

[3:37:43] Trustee Morrison: away from the current OCP and current bylaws that we have.

[3:37:49] Trustee Morrison: Um, so, and some islands have gone and we, and we are sort of in conversations right

[3:37:56] Trustee Morrison: now about thinking about like, does, um, rural land or rural residential land, does

[3:38:02] Trustee Morrison: it have to have a house on it or not to be, to have other buildings?

[3:38:06] Trustee Morrison: Cause this is coming up in the agricultural APC right now with, um, the possibility of

[3:38:12] Trustee Morrison: having two lots next to each other and having a non-residential structure on one and a

[3:38:17] Trustee Morrison: residential structure on another.

[3:38:18] Trustee Morrison: other um so it is coming up in other contexts right now um and so i feel like we haven't quite

[3:38:26] Trustee Morrison: resolved those changes um as part of the land use bylaw um and and where that fits in with this

[3:38:34] Trustee Morrison: whole thing the biggest issue is that um you know having six storage containers in a residential

[3:38:41] Trustee Morrison: neighborhood that are i you know we can't control form and function you're very right if they were

[3:38:47] Trustee Morrison: wood would i care maybe i don't know um but the fact that they're field storage containers you

[3:38:55] Trustee Morrison: know it just and there's that many of them is is what is triggering the reaction in the community

[3:39:02] Trustee Morrison: i think and and my personal sort of sense of neighborhood and and rural feel um i don't know

[3:39:12] Trustee Morrison: No. Options for going to number four, where we would deny the rezoning, but consider a temporary use permit. I wouldn't want to have the applicant go down if we consider it a temporary use permit. So anyway, thoughts on that?

[3:39:32] Trustee McConchie: Well, I guess we can discuss now we have any questions for staff or for Mr. Sketch. We can discuss this. I guess we're discussing this with our trustees now.

[3:39:40] Trustee Morrison: Yeah, I think so.

[3:39:40] Trustee Morrison: So

[3:39:40] Trustee McConchie: I, well, I mean, I would move to deny

[3:39:44] Trustee McConchie: that the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee

[3:39:46] Trustee McConchie: deny application NPRZ 2021.1.

[3:39:51] Trustee Morrison: Okay.

[3:39:51] Trustee Morrison: So we're not having a discussion to put on the table.

[3:39:54] Trustee Morrison: You're just putting one on the table.

[3:39:55] Trustee Morrison: I

[3:39:55] Trustee McConchie: didn't hear a motion.

[3:39:56] Trustee McConchie: So I just decided to make a motion from Trustee Morrison.

[3:39:59] Trustee McConchie: Is there

[3:39:59] Trustee Patrick: a second to that motion?

[3:40:02] Trustee Patrick: I'm going to second that motion for discussion

[3:40:05] Trustee Patrick: because it could be amended to,

[3:40:06] Trustee Patrick: if you choose to add the temporary use permit.

[3:40:12] Trustee McConchie: Okay, the reason for my motion is the rationale provided is not sufficient for a land use decision.

[3:40:19] Trustee McConchie: The other reasoning is that a zoning amendment, as stated in the staff report, a zoning amendment is a permanent change to the legal use of the property and should not be used to resolve a temporary situation of the applicant.

[3:40:29] Trustee McConchie: The other point, the application presents procedural issues.

[3:40:31] Trustee McConchie: That's the third application associated with use on this property.

[3:40:34] Trustee McConchie: The use is contrary to the official community plan objectives and policy, and the input from neighbors from two previous applications indicates a lack of support for use. That's the rationale for me.

[3:40:47] Trustee Morrison: Yeah, and I agree with that. I think that the denying, I don't think we could approve an application like this particular rezoning application given all of those things that Ben's just said and the staff that's named.

[3:40:59] Trustee Morrison: I think the question that I have that's still outstanding, and I think it's up to Mr. Sketch if he wants to do that, is, is there any suggestion around a temporary use permit? I still don't know that I see that inside.

[3:41:17] Trustee Morrison: inside, still don't know if I see a temporary use permit as meeting any of the, it still

[3:41:26] Trustee Morrison: contravenes the OCP, it still contravenes some other things. So I'm not sure that there is any

[3:41:30] Trustee Morrison: way forward on a TUP either. I just don't want to suggest that as another pathway and it

[3:41:37] Trustee Morrison: might not be productive. So I kind of want us to clarify whether that is or not a pathway.

[3:41:44] Trustee Morrison: Any

[3:41:50] Trustee Patrick: comments from staff on a TUP as a pathway?

[3:41:55] Voice 6: It's certainly possible to make the application. That was one of the recommendations.

[3:41:59] Voice 6: I think that, you know, if someone approached me with the question about, you know,

[3:42:03] Voice 6: should I be applying for a TUP for the situation like this, if someone else approached me,

[3:42:07] Voice 6: my advice to them would be to, if you want to come forward with that application,

[3:42:13] Voice 6: come forward with a plan that this is a truly temporary circumstance,

[3:42:17] Voice 6: circumstance that you need time to find another location to resolve an issue to get a building

[3:42:24] Voice 6: permit for the house sell the property whatever

[3:42:27] Trustee Morrison: yeah i agree no

[3:42:30] Voice 6: it's not a substitute for a reason

[3:42:31] Trustee Morrison: no i agree it would have to show that it was temporary use because even if you like even when

[3:42:39] Trustee Morrison: it did there was some sense that you know it would be temporary and the housing situation

[3:42:44] Trustee Morrison: as mr sketch has talked about is part of the like things trying to be working out um but if it

[3:42:50] Trustee Morrison: doesn't resolve in you know another three years then it it's not resolvable um and there's like

[3:42:56] Trustee Morrison: a need to downsize or to to shift somehow um so yeah okay yeah i can't application in this area

[3:43:10] Trustee Morrison: So, because of, I do think it contravenes our OCP and our, for all the reasons stated.

[3:43:20] Trustee McConchie: The other point I'd like to make, Trustee Morrison, is that we're also, from what I understand, just discussions about shipping containers is that there's limits that need to be put on these.

[3:43:30] Trustee McConchie: It's getting

[3:43:31] Trustee McConchie: out of control.

[3:43:33] Trustee McConchie: And it's sort of a free-for-all right now.

[3:43:36] Trustee McConchie: And I certainly think that denying this application will keep within the consistency of what I believe to be the momentum in which this committee is moving.

[3:43:47] Trustee Morrison: Yeah, I think the one question we're going to have to resolve, though, as part of the land use bylaw work is like our situations and how do we specify it in land use bylaws of situations where buildings can be built that are not residence buildings on a property before there's a residence or maybe if there was never to be a residence.

[3:44:07] Trustee Morrison: because of a variety of reasons that have been named to us in various reports this spring um

[3:44:13] Trustee Morrison: and like what would that look like and and can we and this is i guess a question for the planners

[3:44:19] Trustee Morrison: can we specify that buildings can't be shipping containers or um that they have to be particular

[3:44:26] Trustee Morrison: kinds of structures i know we have constraints on that you

[3:44:30] Planner Stockdill (probable): could add a regulation that would

[3:44:32] Planner Stockdill (probable): permit accessory buildings before the primary residential use but ex specifically exclude

[3:44:39] Planner Stockdill (probable): shipping containers is that if that's something the ltc recognizes that's something yeah

[3:44:45] Voice 6: so most

[3:44:46] Voice 6: of the other bylaws that address the most where local trust communities have turned their mind

[3:44:51] Voice 6: to the issue of accessory structures before construction most of them have limited it in

[3:44:56] Voice 6: some way floor area maximum floor area before the principal dwelling one structure something like

[3:45:01] Voice 6: that and yes

[3:45:03] Voice 1: you can you can

[3:45:03] Voice 6: distinguish shipping containers from other types of buildings and say

[3:45:07] Voice 6: prohibited or just one something like that

[3:45:09] Voice 11: okay i'd

[3:45:11] Trustee McConchie: also like to point out that this is

[3:45:13] Trustee McConchie: now the third application today that sort of asked for forgiveness after the fact

[3:45:17] Trustee McConchie: um application and that the proper channels were not started and i realized there was a time frame

[3:45:24] Trustee McConchie: concerns however this is another process question for me as well as a trustee that's

[3:45:31] Trustee McConchie: So hence the reasoning for my motion.

[3:45:33] Trustee Patrick: Any further discussion on this motion?

[3:45:36] Trustee Patrick: That then I'll call the vote.

[3:45:38] Trustee Patrick: All those in favor?

[3:45:41] Trustee Patrick: And that's carried.

[3:45:43] Trustee Patrick: So Michael, I know this is an ongoing stress for you

[3:45:47] Trustee Patrick: and I hope we can find a solution

[3:45:49] Trustee Patrick: and consider a temporary use permit

[3:45:52] Trustee Patrick: as a viable step forward.

[3:45:57] Trustee Patrick: Okay, any other comments on this matter?

[3:46:03] Trustee Patrick: matter. Otherwise, we are moving on. So thank you, Michael. So the next item of business is the

[3:46:15] Trustee Patrick: ground. Everyone's okay. We don't need to see nurses here. So checking in. So

[3:46:20] Trustee Patrick: we have the

[3:46:21] Trustee Patrick: groundwater sustainability implementation staff report on page 222 of the agenda package and

[3:46:28] Trustee Patrick: and welcome Narissa Chadwick, and it's over to you.

[3:46:31] Voice 7: Hi there, thanks Chair Patrick.

[3:46:35] Voice 7: Yeah, I unfortunately haven't been able to join

[3:46:37] Voice 7: the other meetings where the groundwater sustainability

[3:46:43] Voice 7: project was introduced, but today I am fortunately,

[3:46:46] Voice 7: and hopefully I'll be able to continue to present

[3:46:49] Voice 7: as the project moves forward.

[3:46:53] Voice 7: So what you have before you today

[3:46:56] Voice 7: day is sort of a preliminary identification of some options for OCP and LUB amendments

[3:47:10] Voice 7: related to this project. I think the decision was made at your previous meeting to focus

[3:47:18] Voice 7: focus on the groundwater sustainability.

[3:47:20] Voice 7: And you'll see, you may have seen in the report

[3:47:26] Voice 7: that we have found a way to connect it

[3:47:30] Voice 7: to the CDF mapping as well.

[3:47:32] Voice 7: So I can describe that a little bit as we move forward.

[3:47:36] Voice 7: So what we're looking for today

[3:47:40] Voice 7: is to support the movement forward of this project,

[3:47:44] Voice 7: which would basically, there's sort of two next steps,

[3:47:48] Voice 7: one being the public engagement piece that we plan to as I've indicated the

[3:47:56] Voice 7: recommendation is to hold that in July and that'll be William Shoba who will be

[3:48:02] Voice 7: presenting on the the phase one and two the first phases of this groundwater

[3:48:09] Voice 7: project which is essentially presenting the mapping and identifying what that

[3:48:14] Voice 7: means to the public so it'll be fairly high level and then what we're what

[3:48:20] Voice 7: we're recommending is that we schedule a special meeting in September because it

[3:48:26] Voice 7: looks like your agenda packages get very very thick with applications so so we're

[3:48:32] Voice 7: thinking that it may be maybe a good idea to have a separate meeting where we

[3:48:36] Voice 7: can discuss in detail what some of the proposed amendments are so the staff

[3:48:43] Voice 7: report today identifies just some of the background, preliminary list of proposed

[3:48:52] Voice 7: amendments for the OCP and the LEB and then identifying some sort of steps, next steps.

[3:49:03] Voice 7: So you've seen the maps a few times and I thought in the staff report I just sort of

[3:49:12] Voice 7: of identify specifically what what you're seeing in those maps so there are two main things I mean

[3:49:21] Voice 7: well three really like one is the delineation of of groundwater areas and then the identification

[3:49:29] Voice 7: of groundwater potential and so the the potential recharge of those groundwater areas is

[3:49:41] Voice 7: is sort of measured with the identified use.

[3:49:47] Voice 7: And that's what gives us the water budget essentially,

[3:49:51] Voice 7: which is what you see in figure three,

[3:49:56] Voice 7: which is the colorful map with big draft on it.

[3:50:00] Voice 7: So what you see there is,

[3:50:02] Voice 7: so that's the groundwater recharge,

[3:50:04] Voice 7: recharge, which is the ability for the groundwater area to recharge itself for the water to come

[3:50:12] Voice 7: back into it. And then you're seeing estimated usage. So the estimated usage is based on

[3:50:21] Voice 7: looking at how those areas are zoned and what the sort of allowable amount for those zones are.

[3:50:28] Voice 7: So there's a little bit of uncertainty related to the absolute accuracy, for example, agricultural uses, the allowable use is quite high.

[3:50:41] Voice 7: So that's what the usage is based upon.

[3:50:46] Voice 7: pond so we do need to do some work to kind of break that down a little bit because not you know

[3:50:55] Voice 7: not all of the agricultural areas have for example cattle farms which is a high water use

[3:51:02] Voice 7: although they're allowed to have that extent of water so we're still trying to figure out

[3:51:06] Voice 7: how we will address some of those kind of questions and so this is why we're looking at

[3:51:16] Voice 7: at moving forward with how we look at this mapping from a tiered perspective so there are areas that

[3:51:25] Voice 7: are very very clearly critical and those are the areas and I think in the last staff report

[3:51:31] Voice 7: these classes were introduced to you.

[3:51:34] Voice 7: So in class one, there are areas that are critical

[3:51:38] Voice 7: and there's a higher confidence,

[3:51:41] Voice 7: a high confidence in the data.

[3:51:42] Voice 7: So again, there isn't, for example,

[3:51:46] Voice 7: like a identified allowable use

[3:51:49] Voice 7: that isn't necessarily being used to its extent.

[3:51:53] Voice 7: There are areas that are identified as critical.

[3:51:57] Voice 7: What we're referring to class two,

[3:51:59] Voice 7: those are the ones where they're red on the map but they might not actually be red if we kind of

[3:52:04] Voice 7: do a little bit more analysis um then there's there's areas that could be become critical

[3:52:10] Voice 7: um if we look at what build out potential is and so part of this process we'll be looking at what

[3:52:17] Voice 7: that build-up potential is and layering it on there and identifying where we may want to reduce

[3:52:22] Voice 7: the allowable amount of density to be below what is currently allowed and then there's the class

[3:52:29] Voice 7: four which is is areas that have low low vulnerability those are areas that have

[3:52:37] Voice 7: you know plentiful water and are a lot of you know a number of them are are protected

[3:52:45] Voice 7: so there isn't a whole lot that we need to be doing about those areas so that's kind of how

[3:52:51] Voice 7: we're looking at um at moving forward and kind of focusing our work um i did point out in the um

[3:52:59] Voice 7: the staff report that uh we're we're we're at a bit of an exciting period in time i think um

[3:53:06] Voice 7: from a trust council perspective where we've got two initiatives moving uh that are moving forward

[3:53:10] Voice 7: the policy statement review and the development of the freshwater sustainability strategy that

[3:53:15] Voice 7: directly connect to this work and to a certain extent can you know we'll be

[3:53:21] Voice 7: informing some of the recommendations that staff put forward so I did identify

[3:53:26] Voice 7: in the staff report some of the the key proposed policies that are coming out of

[3:53:33] Voice 7: those processes and again you know these are all these are drafts so we'll have

[3:53:36] Voice 7: to see where the process goes but but it gives you a sense of of where things are

[3:53:43] Voice 7: are moving and how staff are thinking in relationship

[3:53:48] Voice 7: to those higher level policy discussions

[3:53:52] Voice 7: that are happening.

[3:53:56] Voice 7: So sort of digging into the amendments,

[3:53:59] Voice 7: I did a pretty thorough look through the OCP

[3:54:04] Voice 7: and the land use bylaw.

[3:54:06] Voice 7: And there are some in the OCP,

[3:54:09] Voice 7: there are some, more in the OCP, not much in the land use bylaw, but the OCP does have a section

[3:54:18] Voice 7: on groundwater resources, which is the primary place where groundwater sustainability is

[3:54:23] Voice 7: considered. So there's a number of policies in that section that address watershed health and

[3:54:29] Voice 7: protecting groundwater supply. And there's policies in other parts of the OCP that encourage water

[3:54:35] Voice 7: collection and water storage and water conservation and acknowledge the need to consider a quality

[3:54:40] Voice 7: and quantity of uh water and the impacts on screen streams and uh with rezonings and subdivision

[3:54:47] Voice 7: um so there is a bit of a framework there um and uh but there's a there's a lot of update that can

[3:54:55] Voice 7: um that can be can be made um now that we've got this data so specifically including the maps of

[3:55:02] Voice 7: the groundwater regions and highlighting the critical areas so those are the class one

[3:55:07] Voice 7: definitely the class two um probably and the class and you know some of the class three the class

[3:55:13] Voice 7: three again being the ones that we'll understand a little bit more when we do our build out mapping

[3:55:18] Voice 7: on top and the class two being the ones where there's sort of some uncertainty around the data

[3:55:23] Voice 7: um there like i said there's opportunity to incorporate some of the information related to

[3:55:31] Voice 7: CDF mapping. We have been talking to, I've been talking to William and we can look at where

[3:55:40] Voice 7: the critical areas of the CDF mapping intersect with the critical areas related to the groundwater

[3:55:49] Voice 7: mapping. And so that will indicate to us areas that we, you know, really a primary focus, I guess.

[3:55:58] Voice 7: And so, you know, some of our work will involve doing some of that overlay work.

[3:56:06] Voice 7: You know, there's a lot of little things that need to be done, updates to some of the language and introduction, principles, objectives related to sustainable communities.

[3:56:18] Voice 7: Like, we're learning a lot with respect to groundwater and, you know, there's a lot of language that isn't in the OCP that could be in there.

[3:56:29] Voice 7: And another thing that I'll point out is that through our freshwater sustainability

[3:56:37] Voice 7: strategy development process, we've had a very inspiring process related to understanding

[3:56:47] Voice 7: Indigenous knowledge and the cultural and spiritual values of water. And so that's one

[3:56:53] Voice 7: of the things that um um you know staff are recommending to have that kind of an acknowledgement

[3:57:00] Voice 7: um when we're now that we bringing some of what we've learned um and acknowledging and using the

[3:57:07] Voice 7: appropriate language um when it comes to um recognizing those those values in water um so

[3:57:14] Voice 7: the ocp provides an opportunity for that um and and so i guess you know when you when we start

[3:57:21] Voice 7: looking at the land use bylaw amendments um there isn't a whole lot uh right now so we'd be looking

[3:57:29] Voice 7: at creating uh groundwater protection zones for those critical areas changing zoning in some of

[3:57:35] Voice 7: the critical areas to reduce or transfer current density or development potential um zoning

[3:57:42] Voice 7: regulations that would limit use uh place restrictions on size and sighting potentially um

[3:57:49] Voice 7: And again, we still need to sort of dive down and kind of get a clear idea of what that

[3:57:55] Voice 7: would look like, considering potable water requirements as a condition of certain uses

[3:58:02] Voice 7: or increases in density, limiting permeable surfaces, developing rainwater capture and

[3:58:10] Voice 7: cistern regulations.

[3:58:11] Voice 7: And that's also something that as part of the freshwater sustainability strategy. That's something that that is going to be recommended as something sort of trust wide we dig into a little bit more and understanding what the opportunities are with with rainwater capture.

[3:58:30] Voice 7: Looking at subdivision servicing regulations and updating those based on what we what we now understand

[3:58:35] Voice 7: end, requiring non-potable rainwater catchment for building permits for new constructions in

[3:58:42] Voice 7: critical areas specifically, and requiring non-potable rainwater capture and storage

[3:58:51] Voice 7: as a condition of building permit if a building is going to contain a secondary suite. So there's

[3:58:58] Voice 7: some things that are sort of low-hanging fruit, and then there's like that one, and then there's

[3:59:04] Voice 7: some that are going to require a bit more um work research uh and um and thinking on our part

[3:59:10] Voice 7: um there's a number of other considerations and and they include you know potential updates to

[3:59:16] Voice 7: bylaw enforcement policies um updates to uh development approval information bylaws

[3:59:24] Voice 7: um terms of record reference for um professionals professional reports related to water um other

[3:59:33] Voice 7: administrative requirements possible monitoring and so the because we're sort of

[3:59:41] Voice 7: working in tandem with with Galliano there's the opportunity to achieve some some efficiencies

[3:59:49] Voice 7: there with some of those those other considerations so that's sort of the path that we've

[4:00:00] Voice 7: we're sort of thinking of of of pursuing the next steps related to that um include finalizing the

[4:00:09] Voice 7: the groundwater mapping um incorporating the build out analysis and integrating that information into

[4:00:17] Voice 7: our tapas mapping system i'm looking at the overlaps in critical areas that need critical

[4:00:23] Voice 7: attention, the overlaps with the Coastal Douglas fir preservation mapping.

[4:00:31] Voice 7: I mentioned the outreach that would be happening in July, potentially, and as I've mentioned

[4:00:45] Voice 7: as well, we'd be focusing on the critical or the class one areas first, and then moving

[4:00:52] Voice 7: on from there as we learn more about um how to address the other areas uh and again uh as as

[4:01:00] Voice 7: identified in my recommended resolutions we are encouraging the ltc to uh to schedule a special

[4:01:11] Voice 7: meeting so that um that some focus can be given to what we propose the like a more detailed proposal

[4:01:19] Voice 7: proposal of um amendments well

[4:01:25] Trustee Morrison: thank you very much yes um i have a couple quick questions it's okay

[4:01:31] Trustee Morrison: yep proceed um so one was about the cdf and groundwater um overview

[4:01:39] Trustee Morrison: in thinking about that do you have any indication whether you think the that having groundwater

[4:01:50] Trustee Morrison: water as a primary sort of protection of groundwater as a primary circle in whatever

[4:01:55] Trustee Morrison: might be proposed as amendments or dps or whatever the um tree cutting in the cdf would be or tree

[4:02:03] Trustee Morrison: cutting more broadly in areas that are groundwater recharge would be something that can be kind of

[4:02:09] Trustee Morrison: together or is that not as clear or known yet yeah

[4:02:14] Voice 7: i mean that's definitely outside my um area of

[4:02:17] Voice 7: of expertise. And so it would certainly be something that, I mean, you know, we definitely

[4:02:25] Voice 7: need to look into more. And, you know, William, and, you know, Kate, for example, they would have

[4:02:32] Voice 7: a much better sense of how we begin to look at that sort of thing.

[4:02:36] Trustee Morrison: Okay. And then the other,

[4:02:37] Trustee Morrison: the proposed amendments that are like in the list of amendments that you had, they all sound great.

[4:02:44] Trustee Morrison: Right. One of the ones I was thinking about to be really intersectional and how we're thinking about issues in the islands is like, you know, non-potable drinking water or, sorry, non-potable water catchment.

[4:02:57] Trustee Morrison: Thinking about how we're working with the fire departments to identify what that might look like so that it can be drawn on as a source of water.

[4:03:05] Trustee Morrison: So we have more distributed water systems across the island for firefighting, too, for summer firefighting.

[4:03:12] Trustee Morrison: and then the last question I had was about the adjusted timeline here does squeeze it in before

[4:03:19] Trustee Morrison: the end of this term but it gets tight and so I just wanted to make sure that all this good work

[4:03:24] Trustee Morrison: can become reality and so how confident maybe is the question are you that we can because we've

[4:03:33] Trustee Morrison: been hearing for you know a year or more that we're coming down with amendments but we haven't

[4:03:38] Trustee Morrison: seen them yet and so um the special meeting you're suggesting would be like a working meeting for

[4:03:44] Trustee Morrison: actual amendments and what they might look like i'm assuming yeah

[4:03:47] Voice 7: yeah that's the plan is that

[4:03:49] Voice 7: it'll be it'll be a like um you know i've already worked on some fairly um specific ocp identifying

[4:03:57] Voice 7: areas in the ocp and i plan to do the same thing for the land use bylaw so essentially i'll be able

[4:04:03] Voice 7: to come forward with you know section whatever it is we can look at this we can look at this

[4:04:09] Voice 7: and and maybe even advance it a little bit further than that i'll have to see

[4:04:13] Voice 7: um in terms of timing um and i think in terms of general timing and project completion

[4:04:18] Voice 7: the fact that we're working um you know in tandem with the galliano process like i said it does it

[4:04:24] Voice 7: It does provide some efficiencies with respect to timing.

[4:04:29] Voice 7: So we're fairly optimistic that we can work

[4:04:35] Voice 7: it through within the next year.

[4:04:41] Trustee McConchie: I got a quick question.

[4:04:43] Voice 21: Please go.

[4:04:44] Trustee McConchie: Thanks, Nerissa, for the report.

[4:04:46] Trustee McConchie: Appreciate you coming to the, taking the time to talk to us today.

[4:04:49] Trustee McConchie: So on page, well, figure three of the staff report, which is on page 225, there's like a draft and it says North,

[4:04:58] Trustee McConchie: And there's a picture, a color-coded picture of North Pender.

[4:05:00] Trustee McConchie: Well, I mean, that's the gold.

[4:05:02] Trustee McConchie: That was like a tease.

[4:05:03] Trustee McConchie: I mean, like, is that accurate?

[4:05:05] Trustee McConchie: Because that's a pretty, I'm like, oh, my gosh, we need to do something now.

[4:05:10] Trustee McConchie: And did the people on North Pender in the Armidale Road area, are they aware of this?

[4:05:14] Trustee McConchie: Or is this just a draft in that actually those colors will flip?

[4:05:19] Voice 7: So one of the things that's happening is that the, so what William tells me,

[4:05:27] Voice 7: because because now i know i'm not like i'm not the hydrogeologist

[4:05:31] Trustee McConchie: i can just

[4:05:32] Voice 7: tell you what i know

[4:05:33] Voice 7: based on my conversations with william um so um i know that he's going to be receiving uh sort of

[4:05:40] Voice 7: like he the the final um analysis version of of this that's why it's got it's got slap draft on

[4:05:47] Voice 7: it um that process is just coming to completion um he doesn't expect that there'll be a whole lot

[4:05:55] Voice 7: lot of change. The one thing that is sort of critical to point out, which I pointed out

[4:06:03] Voice 7: when I was going through the report, but is easier to, you know, understand when you actually look

[4:06:09] Voice 7: at the map, is that those areas that you see in red, those are the areas where, like I said,

[4:06:18] Voice 7: the way that that's measured is that it looks at the groundwater recharge, so the ability

[4:06:23] Voice 7: for the aquifers to the water to come into the groundwater regions from wherever it all comes

[4:06:29] Voice 7: from right i'm not the hydrogen geologist on the rain yeah exactly yeah that's where it ultimately

[4:06:35] Voice 7: comes from um um you know in the structure of those and everything that all influences how much

[4:06:41] Voice 7: goes in there um so it's that balanced with um with with use but use is determined based on

[4:06:50] Voice 7: on allowed allowable use so what what what is or deemed right essentially right so in the case of

[4:06:58] Voice 7: agriculture like i identified um a lot of the red areas sometimes they come up because there's

[4:07:04] Voice 7: agricultural area um because the allowable use with respect to that particular land use is high

[4:07:12] Voice 7: so it's not necessarily reflective of um what the reality is and so that's where i was saying so

[4:07:19] Voice 7: So those, those kinds of areas. So some of them are critical, critical.

[4:07:22] Voice 7: And, and once we do our overlay of like zoning onto this,

[4:07:28] Voice 7: we'll be able to get a sense of that. But those areas, for example,

[4:07:31] Voice 7: that would fall into that we're not confident with the data is areas like

[4:07:38] Voice 7: agricultural where, you know, maybe it's not being farmed or maybe it's like,

[4:07:43] Voice 7: you know, it's a, it's a light,

[4:07:45] Voice 7: it's a light agricultural use as opposed to a heavier use that would use um a lot of water

[4:07:51] Voice 7: and that and and the the measurement of that measurement that you see of the water balance

[4:07:58] Voice 7: is based on the um the groundwater region as a whole so in some cases the region um

[4:08:06] Voice 7: you know part of it may may be um agricultural part of it may be residential but the the the

[4:08:14] Voice 7: the average or the um the the amount of water that is identified to be uh potential use is a

[4:08:24] Voice 7: whole amount so it will affect that whole reason okay

[4:08:30] Trustee McConchie: sorry chair pat uh so just just to clarify

[4:08:33] Trustee McConchie: my question just one more time i've just because i'm not quite maybe i didn't understand um that

[4:08:39] Trustee McConchie: that map that's figure three is accurate information.

[4:08:44] Voice 7: Yeah. So like I said,

[4:08:45] Trustee McConchie: it's

[4:08:45] Voice 7: accurate based on the data that we have available to us.

[4:08:49] Voice 7: Gotcha. Okay.

[4:08:50] Trustee McConchie: So in Armadale road where it says the groundwater usage is above 50,

[4:08:55] Trustee McConchie: between 50 and 75% and the available groundwater is low.

[4:09:00] Trustee McConchie: Like that's, that's probably, that's, that's accurate information.

[4:09:04] Voice 7: So again, it's based on, on the,

[4:09:08] Voice 7: the allowable use of water,

[4:09:12] Voice 7: the amount that whatever the use of that area is allowed.

[4:09:18] Voice 7: So it's based on the maximum essentially.

[4:09:20] Voice 7: If you

[4:09:20] Voice 6: know that some users are required

[4:09:24] Voice 6: to get licenses now, right?

[4:09:25] Voice 6: Like farms, commercial and industrial,

[4:09:27] Voice 6: but individual residential users aren't required

[4:09:31] Voice 6: to be licensed provincially.

[4:09:35] Voice 6: So there's an estimate,

[4:09:37] Voice 6: There's a number for these sort of a typical residential usage that's applied in each of these regions.

[4:09:43] Voice 6: And then if I'm understanding what William's saying correctly and identifying as the issue is that then the licensed amount for the non-residential users is applied.

[4:09:52] Voice 6: And farms can be licensed for significant amounts of water.

[4:09:56] Voice 6: They can have huge deemed right, but they may not be using it.

[4:10:00] Voice 6: They may not be irrigating very much at all, or they may be just using water from a pond, like a stormwater pond.

[4:10:07] Voice 6: and so that that could be and this is showing up not just here but on other islands as well

[4:10:11] Voice 6: the red areas have a have a there's intense to be a correlation between the red areas and alr land

[4:10:19] okay

[4:10:20] Voice 6: so that's one of the uncertainties okay thanks thanks for clarifying yeah

[4:10:24] Trustee Patrick: and i think

[4:10:25] Trustee Patrick: that raises and thanks thank you so much for the staff reports is the meeting with the public what

[4:10:32] Trustee Patrick: What are we telling them?

[4:10:33] Trustee Patrick: And I'm on the round table that has been informing the overall strategic plan for the

[4:10:41] Trustee Patrick: Islands Trust area.

[4:10:43] Trustee Patrick: And last week was our kind of final meeting and talking about what's the most important

[4:10:47] Trustee Patrick: thing.

[4:10:48] Trustee Patrick: And it was pretty much consensus on education and communication was so important.

[4:10:53] Trustee Patrick: And you think of how complex all this stuff is.

[4:10:57] Trustee Patrick: And my only concern is when we show a map like this, what does this mean?

[4:11:02] Trustee Patrick: What does it drive?

[4:11:03] Trustee Patrick: What's the unintended consequences?

[4:11:05] Trustee Patrick: Do you frighten people who are actually in an area

[4:11:08] Trustee Patrick: that their well is working okay

[4:11:09] Trustee Patrick: and there are sustainable users?

[4:11:14] Trustee Patrick: Or some person goes, oh, I got to sell my product.

[4:11:16] Trustee Patrick: I'm going to buy over here because that looks good,

[4:11:18] Trustee Patrick: but that's where the coastal Douglas fir trees

[4:11:20] Trustee Patrick: are the healthiest.

[4:11:22] Trustee Patrick: So we have to really think about what are we communicating

[4:11:27] Trustee Patrick: with this material and what is the messages

[4:11:29] Trustee Patrick: is you want people to leave those that meeting with um when when we share that that information

[4:11:35] Trustee Patrick: so that's my concern is if we just take these raw maps and put them up there that you know

[4:11:41] Trustee Patrick: we haven't even gotten to where where we are making some decisions of where we're going do we

[4:11:47] Trustee Patrick: create more anxiety and fear at a time when it just seems to be out of control

[4:11:53] Trustee Patrick: on salt spring i can say the fears and anxieties are at an extremely high level right now

[4:11:59] Trustee Patrick: And, you know, I just don't want an unintended consequences of creating more concern when it, you know, may or may not be necessary.

[4:12:10] Voice 12: Yeah.

[4:12:11] Voice 12: Go ahead.

[4:12:13] Trustee Patrick: Chair Patrick?

[4:12:14] Trustee Patrick: Oh, yes, go ahead.

[4:12:15] Trustee Patrick: I

[4:12:15] Voice 7: would actually turn those questions over to the LTC related to what you think we need to be presenting to the public.

[4:12:31] Trustee McConchie: Well, totally. Thanks, Planner Chadwick.

[4:12:35] Trustee McConchie: Like I would say, we need to scare. Well, I mean, scare is the wrong word.

[4:12:39] Trustee McConchie: but we need to let people know that groundwater is an extraordinarily um limited and valuable

[4:12:46] Trustee McConchie: resource on the island and we need to get people hip to this and i mean i don't know planner

[4:12:51] Trustee McConchie: chadwick have you noticed in your research of this like going over data or i'm not even quite

[4:12:56] Trustee McConchie: sure exactly what your role is maybe from a legislative bylaw reading perspective and

[4:13:02] Trustee McConchie: williams the science but like how is climate change is impacting these islands in a major way

[4:13:07] Trustee McConchie: right and the evidence is is tremendous i think we should come at this from a from a holy cow

[4:13:13] Trustee McConchie: i perspective community we need to get our act together start storing water we uh start making

[4:13:20] Trustee McConchie: a concerted effort at more conservation methods maybe discuss with our farming community um what

[4:13:26] Trustee McConchie: their plans are for farming use uh use of water in the future i mean this is this needs to be a huge

[4:13:31] Trustee McConchie: a huge issue that Islanders need to take on.

[4:13:35] Trustee McConchie: And so I'd certainly support communicating

[4:13:38] Trustee McConchie: on as many meetings as we need to make this really connect

[4:13:42] Trustee McConchie: with Islanders the importance of this.

[4:13:44] Trustee McConchie: So I'm in favor of scaring, I guess, Chair Patrick.

[4:13:48] Trustee McConchie: Well,

[4:13:48] Trustee Patrick: I'm okay with scaring, but you're directing,

[4:13:51] Trustee Patrick: you also said, let's tell them what we can do.

[4:13:54] Trustee Patrick: You know, you can start storing your water.

[4:13:56] Trustee Patrick: So it's giving, not just leaving them in a state of fright,

[4:14:02] Trustee Patrick: but to give them some direction, you know, that if you,

[4:14:06] Trustee Patrick: if you've got a garden and you don't have rain,

[4:14:09] Trustee Patrick: your rainwater catching system, duh, easy, you know,

[4:14:12] Trustee Patrick: and here's where you can go get that information.

[4:14:15] Trustee Patrick: SWPA's got a whole page on how to set that up. So send them over,

[4:14:18] Trustee Patrick: go see that, you know? So I think it's just, you want to drive behavior,

[4:14:24] Trustee Patrick: you know, and I, is that what I mean?

[4:14:25] Trustee Patrick: You want to drive awareness and behavior.

[4:14:28] Trustee Patrick: behavior so we we can't just drive the fright because they'll go do something that you didn't

[4:14:35] Trustee Patrick: expect them to do like i said they'll go move into an area that the coastal douglas fir is

[4:14:39] Trustee Patrick: is is critical and healthy and suddenly that you know it has water that's an area that's green on

[4:14:47] Trustee Patrick: the map or whatever so it's just

[4:14:49] Trustee McConchie: fair enough i was thinking fright more of like hey there's a

[4:14:53] Trustee McConchie: giant resort that needs to be built in a particular area of the island that we've discussed

[4:14:57] Trustee McConchie: hey we should be concerned about that i agree

[4:15:00] Trustee Patrick: but this is about public meeting that you're

[4:15:03] Trustee Patrick: you're planning a public meeting so what do you expect the public to to do with the information

[4:15:09] Trustee Patrick: that you're going to give them that was my question yeah

[4:15:13] Trustee Morrison: so um i'd like to actually put

[4:15:16] Trustee Morrison: the two motions on the table because i think it is helpful to have the public meetings and

[4:15:20] Trustee Morrison: and then add a little bit more to the conversation about what might be at

[4:15:25] Trustee Morrison: those public meetings

[4:15:26] Trustee Morrison: and it sounds to me like there's two being requested so i'll do the first one the the

[4:15:32] Trustee Morrison: north pender island local trust committee request staff to organize a committee information

[4:15:38] Trustee Morrison: i mean there's community

[4:15:39] Voice 10: information right there's

[4:15:41] Trustee Morrison: a meeting yeah it's okay just let me

[4:15:43] Trustee Morrison: read it again staff to organize a community information meeting so there's a word missing

[4:15:48] Trustee Morrison: there in july 2021 to share the results of the 2020 southern gulf islands groundwater recharge

[4:15:54] Trustee Morrison: charge potential mapping around regional groundwater availability assessments i

[4:16:00] Trustee McConchie: second the most is

[4:16:01] Trustee Morrison: there a second second and

[4:16:03] Trustee Morrison: so maybe yeah discussion yeah so the the one other thing i would add to

[4:16:07] Trustee Morrison: what's been said already is um when we're sharing like any meeting that's organized to share i

[4:16:14] Trustee Morrison: really want to make sure that we have time to explain in really like everyday language um what

[4:16:20] Trustee Morrison: it is that these maps show because i think ben's totally right what's going to happen is people are

[4:16:26] Trustee Morrison: going to be like what and so um but that's a good thing i think that's actually a needed thing um

[4:16:33] Trustee Morrison: and then we need to be able to respond like not in an abstract way but in a very concrete way

[4:16:40] Trustee Morrison: these are the types of things that we're starting to build out into land use planning bylaw you can

[4:16:46] Trustee Morrison: can do them voluntarily right now but these are the kind of things that like your list here and

[4:16:50] Trustee Morrison: like that we're we want people to start considering and you're you know this is what the islands trust

[4:16:55] Trustee Morrison: is actually building into the requirements now for future building so that people understand

[4:17:00] Trustee Morrison: this is the scientific information that's informing this kind of action and you can go

[4:17:05] Trustee Morrison: ahead and do this kind of action right now like you don't have to wait for bylaws to come into

[4:17:09] Trustee Morrison: place so that would be great yeah

[4:17:12] Trustee Patrick: i think one of the the things we're gonna we're trying to get

[4:17:16] Trustee Patrick: launched here on salt spring is a know your own watershed thing of what might because a lot of the

[4:17:22] Trustee Patrick: regulations land use bylaw things that we'll be creating are about future buildings that don't

[4:17:27] Trustee Patrick: exist yet and the main the impact is here today so what can we do that you know the biggest bang

[4:17:33] Trustee Patrick: bang for our buck or influence is to influence the behavior of the people who are already here

[4:17:39] Trustee Patrick: and so i think it's giving them some of those tools you know or pointing them in the direction

[4:17:44] Trustee Patrick: so that they have, they leave with some resources

[4:17:46] Trustee Patrick: of where to go find how to put a rainwater collection system

[4:17:50] Trustee Patrick: and how to, you know, that they could license their well,

[4:17:55] Trustee Patrick: that that option's here,

[4:17:56] Trustee Patrick: that they could put meters on their own wells.

[4:17:58] Trustee Patrick: You know, this is, there's things they can do

[4:18:00] Trustee Patrick: to get themselves educated and understand their own use.

[4:18:06] Trustee McConchie: As this is a North Pender Trust Committee initiative,

[4:18:11] Trustee McConchie: it would be helpful before the meeting

[4:18:13] Trustee McConchie: if we do approve this motion to get hit some of the info

[4:18:16] Voice 11: and

[4:18:17] Trustee McConchie: not have it six days before the

[4:18:19] Trustee McConchie: meeting and then here we are as trustees at the in front of the public on whatever zoom platform

[4:18:25] Trustee McConchie: and then we get hit by

[4:18:27] Trustee McConchie: information we didn't think about or we didn't even get a chance to

[4:18:30] Trustee McConchie: talk to people you know a lot of this kind of research has been sort of in the dark for me

[4:18:35] Trustee McConchie: as a trustee

[4:18:36] Trustee Morrison: and it's been

[4:18:36] Trustee McConchie: great to have william and have you narissa here today so just just if

[4:18:40] Trustee McConchie: if we're going to do this, it'd be great to have some information so we can prepare ourselves.

[4:18:43] Trustee Morrison: Okay. And often before meetings like this, like we need it before the weekend of the meeting before

[4:18:49] Trustee Morrison: this, because often on the weekend, there's a lot of conversations going on in the community.

[4:18:53] Trustee Morrison: And it would be really helpful that we process commission before the weekend, before the meeting,

[4:18:59] Trustee Morrison: so that we can kind of field some of those conversations a little bit.

[4:19:05] Trustee McConchie: We want this to be successful for sure.

[4:19:08] Trustee Patrick: Robert, if you're saying,

[4:19:13] Voice 6: would it be useful to have a, I think to have another meeting

[4:19:15] Voice 6: in advance, just to receive the, receive the data, maybe ask him questions of William.

[4:19:21] Trustee Morrison: I don't know. I feel like we can just,

[4:19:22] Trustee McConchie: I mean, I

[4:19:23] Trustee Morrison: guess what

[4:19:25] Trustee McConchie: I'm saying, just set,

[4:19:26] Trustee McConchie: send us some info to read more than five days

[4:19:30] Trustee McConchie: before the meeting,

[4:19:30] Trustee Morrison: a little time on it. Like

[4:19:32] Trustee McConchie: I love reading this stuff, but I often am, am constricted on time. Uh, especially if it gets

[4:19:37] Trustee McConchie: really technical, right? So maybe if we're going to schedule something in July 2021, we have

[4:19:43] Trustee McConchie: something by the end of June, or at least middle or first week of July, or, you know, depending on

[4:19:48] Trustee McConchie: when we schedule it, it would just be really helpful for the trustees.

[4:19:52] Trustee Morrison: Yeah, push the meeting

[4:19:53] Trustee Morrison: a week if you think you need an additional week, like push the meeting a little later so that we

[4:19:58] Trustee Morrison: can make sure we get the materials early enough to process.

[4:20:02] Voice 7: So you're interested in having the

[4:20:05] Voice 7: the materials that we would be presenting to the public

[4:20:08] Voice 7: before they go to the public.

[4:20:10] Voice 7: Yeah.

[4:20:11] Trustee Patrick: Well in advance is

[4:20:12] Voice 7: what I'm hearing, well in advance.

[4:20:15] Voice 7: Okay, so we may have to think about

[4:20:18] Voice 7: the timing of that meeting.

[4:20:20] Trustee Morrison: Yeah, that's okay.

[4:20:22] Voice 7: On time, workload and holiday time.

[4:20:26] Trustee Patrick: Yeah, and plain language.

[4:20:29] Trustee Patrick: We don't wanna be talking to hydro geologists here.

[4:20:33] Trustee Patrick: We've had it, we're talking to Joe Public

[4:20:35] Trustee Patrick: that needs to understand what we're saying.

[4:20:39] Trustee Patrick: Critical.

[4:20:40] Trustee Patrick: All right, trustees, any other discussion on this motion?

[4:20:44] Trustee Patrick: I'll call the vote.

[4:20:45] Trustee Patrick: All those in favor?

[4:20:46] Trustee Patrick: And that's carried.

[4:20:49] Trustee Morrison: I'll go ahead and put the other one on the table too,

[4:20:51] Trustee Morrison: that the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee

[4:20:53] Trustee Morrison: request staff to organize special meeting

[4:20:55] Trustee Morrison: of the Local Trust Committee in September, 2021

[4:20:57] Trustee Morrison: to review in detail proposed amendments to the OCP and LUB.

[4:21:01] Trustee Patrick: Is there a second?

[4:21:03] Trustee Patrick: I'll second that.

[4:21:03] Trustee Patrick: any discussion i'll call the vote all those in favor and that's carried thank you for the work

[4:21:14] Trustee Patrick: all

[4:21:15] Trustee McConchie: right yeah thanks marissa great just great to have you here today at our trust committee meeting

[4:21:19] Trustee McConchie: all

[4:21:22] Trustee Patrick: right um just sort of catching up where we are okay we got our work program reports here i

[4:21:30] Trustee Patrick: don't think we want to add anything else to our top priorities list um your your full full up

[4:21:36] Trustee Patrick: projects list is there mostly as a capture um applications list here on page 233 is there any

[4:21:45] Trustee Patrick: questions on any of the applications that are on the list seeing

[4:21:50] Trustee McConchie: we got a lot of applications

[4:21:52] Trustee McConchie: finished i'm realizing a

[4:21:54] Trustee Patrick: staff of uh if you're wondering what staff are doing with their time

[4:21:58] Trustee Patrick: they are very very very busy working on these projects and these applications and um um yeah

[4:22:06] Trustee Patrick: And they're actually doing an amazing job

[4:22:08] Trustee Patrick: keeping up with the huge influx of applications.

[4:22:14] Trustee Patrick: Okay, so we have our adopted policy standing resolutions

[4:22:18] Trustee Patrick: that are here and on we go to.

[4:22:21] Trustee Patrick: So first, next item of new business

[4:22:23] Trustee Patrick: is the business license staff memo there on page 247.

[4:22:31] Voice 6: So this is just the update the local trust committee

[4:22:34] Voice 6: on the resolution that was adopted by South Pender

[4:22:38] Voice 6: a couple of weeks ago now,

[4:22:43] Voice 6: requesting that the Capital Regional District

[4:22:46] Voice 6: explore the implementation of business licensing

[4:22:48] Voice 6: specifically for tourist accommodation

[4:22:50] Voice 6: and short-term vacation rentals.

[4:22:52] Voice 6: And the opportunity for the North Pender Local Trust Committee

[4:22:55] Voice 6: to adopt a similar or virtually identical resolution.

[4:23:00] Trustee Patrick: I could talk about it.

[4:23:01] Trustee Patrick: I think Ben wasn't able to be at that meeting.

[4:23:03] Trustee Patrick: Right.

[4:23:05] Trustee Patrick: So quickly, I'm the instigator.

[4:23:08] Trustee Patrick: I was asking that we had a representative

[4:23:10] Trustee Patrick: from every one of our local trust committees

[4:23:12] Trustee Patrick: because we were all struggling

[4:23:13] Trustee Patrick: with the ongoing management

[4:23:15] Trustee Patrick: of the short-term vacation rentals

[4:23:17] Trustee Patrick: and especially the impact on bylaw enforcement.

[4:23:19] Trustee Patrick: That's been kind of like whack-a-mole,

[4:23:21] Trustee Patrick: you know, that bylaw enforcement's

[4:23:23] Trustee Patrick: putting a lot of resources

[4:23:24] Trustee Patrick: into chasing short-term vacation rentals.

[4:23:26] Trustee Patrick: And so we wanted to look at

[4:23:27] Trustee Patrick: were there regional things

[4:23:29] Trustee Patrick: that we could do to support one another

[4:23:31] Trustee Patrick: and help maybe through,

[4:23:32] Trustee Patrick: you know, bulk of activity

[4:23:33] Trustee Patrick: activity and very quickly it was the business you know that the most areas that have high level of

[4:23:40] Trustee Patrick: short-term vacation rentals use business licenses as a tool to limit the number and also it's a very

[4:23:47] Trustee Patrick: powerful tool where the temporary use permits that we have are we can't just pull them back

[4:23:52] Trustee Patrick: where a business license it can be removed immediately and that the capital regional

[4:24:01] Trustee Patrick: the regional district could have that service

[4:24:03] Trustee Patrick: through more of a simplistic route, an order of council,

[4:24:08] Trustee Patrick: rather than Islands Trust would need an amendment

[4:24:12] Trustee Patrick: of the act to have a business licensing service.

[4:24:17] Trustee Patrick: So the motion was just basically encouraging the CRD

[4:24:24] Trustee Patrick: to at least think about or start to think about

[4:24:26] Trustee Patrick: the implementation of it.

[4:24:27] Trustee Patrick: it um i've i've heard from uh trustee brent that um he's already starting working with david how

[4:24:35] Trustee Patrick: and that they're you know they're they're starting to think about it because it's going to it's going

[4:24:38] Trustee Patrick: to take some time this isn't something that just happens over overnight um but the power of having

[4:24:43] Trustee Patrick: business licenses also would be you know you can as a region we could tell arab b and b they can't

[4:24:50] Trustee Patrick: put their business license in the ad they can't have an ad from this region so it

[4:24:54] Trustee Patrick: does give us

[4:24:54] Trustee Patrick: more power. So that was the idea is another tool in the box. So Salt Spring passed the motion this

[4:24:59] Trustee Patrick: week as well. And we just thought we're just leaning on CRD to think about this tool while

[4:25:08] Trustee Patrick: we all carry on doing what we can do with our tools. So if you want

[4:25:14] Trustee Morrison: to pass

[4:25:15] Trustee Patrick: that motion and

[4:25:16] Trustee Patrick: it gets added to the pile of motions.

[4:25:19] Trustee Morrison: I mean, I think it's a good idea to have business license

[4:25:22] Trustee Morrison: because I feel like we're constantly naming that as a challenge. I don't know. Ben's not.

[4:25:31] Trustee Patrick: Ben?

[4:25:35] Trustee McConchie: Yeah.

[4:25:39] Trustee McConchie: I don't know.

[4:25:40] Trustee McConchie: I missed the meeting.

[4:25:41] Trustee McConchie: I'm not informed appropriately to really understand the implications of having a business license, whether it's good policy or not.

[4:25:47] Trustee McConchie: It is a tool.

[4:25:48] Trustee McConchie: I understand your point.

[4:25:50] Trustee McConchie: I mean, is it another layer of bureaucracy for people to go through?

[4:25:55] Trustee McConchie: And how much will the community buy in is my concern.

[4:25:59] Voice 11: Will

[4:25:59] Trustee McConchie: it seem like an impediment?

[4:26:00] Trustee McConchie: and the more impediments you put in front of the community the more less buy-in they have to the

[4:26:05] Trustee McConchie: structure of the government and then more calls come

[4:26:07] Trustee McConchie: to reform the government so that's the concern

[4:26:09] Trustee McConchie: i have

[4:26:09] Trustee Patrick: well i think it's it's it's not an either one it's a there's a process involved it's it's

[4:26:14] Trustee Patrick: not a simple crd decides to put it in place there have they sort of like what you heard justine

[4:26:18] Trustee Patrick: doing there has to be a you know they have to study it they have to look at it they have to

[4:26:21] Trustee Patrick: consult the community so there's that whole process that would have to happen um but i think

[4:26:26] Trustee Patrick: if you can easily look at you know go look at tofino and see how they use business licenses

[4:26:31] Trustee Patrick: to manage short-term vacation rentals it's a powerful tool far more powerful than our temporary

[4:26:36] Trustee Patrick: use permits and other systems that we have maybe

[4:26:41] Trustee McConchie: maybe uh chair patrick you just caught me on a

[4:26:43] Trustee McConchie: bad day my faith in the crd is very yeah

[4:26:46] Trustee Morrison: it's pretty low for me to do it yeah i i'm not sure

[4:26:51] Trustee Morrison: i feel like we need to recommend that the crd do this i think they need to do it if they see a

[4:26:55] Trustee Morrison: a community problem it's their their pot to like figure it out i don't

[4:27:00] Trustee Patrick: know well they at the moment

[4:27:02] Trustee Patrick: they weren't they had they were making they were let out no they wouldn't even think about it and

[4:27:07] Trustee Patrick: it's and

[4:27:08] Trustee Patrick: so what we're doing is nudging them to think about it uh using our power to nudge them

[4:27:13] Trustee Patrick: um because now at least they're starting to think move you know at least david is moving from a

[4:27:20] Trustee Patrick: absolute no to hmm he's thinking about it um so that's better um so there's this is nowhere near

[4:27:29] Trustee Patrick: implementing it it's simply signaling that a tool that could be worth having if they wanted to so

[4:27:36] Trustee Patrick: it's up to you yeah

[4:27:37] Trustee Morrison: i don't think i'm not pressuring you i

[4:27:39] Trustee Morrison: don't think i'm well enough

[4:27:40] Trustee Morrison: informed either honestly like i mean it seems like a good idea on the surface but i agree like

[4:27:46] Trustee Morrison: more layers of of bureaucracy i'm not sure if that is or not the right move no

[4:27:52] Trustee Patrick: more into the

[4:27:54] Trustee Patrick: future if if there was a business license tool then we would just be doing land use

[4:28:01] Trustee Patrick: where is this type of use allowed is it a home-based business is it got to be within a

[4:28:08] Trustee Patrick: commercial development zone or whatever we would do pure zone pure land use planning and

[4:28:15] Trustee Patrick: And the business permit becomes the tool to make it legal.

[4:28:20] Trustee Morrison: Yeah.

[4:28:21] Trustee Patrick: They work together.

[4:28:23] Trustee Morrison: Yeah, it just

[4:28:24] Trustee Morrison: seems like it's really like the CARD's business to get that in place

[4:28:28] Trustee Morrison: if they think it's the right move for the community.

[4:28:30] Trustee Morrison: I just feel like it's, I don't know.

[4:28:34] Trustee Morrison: So I'm not convinced about it yet.

[4:28:36] Trustee Patrick: You can think

[4:28:38] Trustee Morrison: about it some more.

[4:28:38] Trustee Patrick: We

[4:28:39] Trustee McConchie: defer on a decision for this for the next meeting.

[4:28:41] Trustee Patrick: We can.

[4:28:42] Voice 6: Great.

[4:28:43] Voice 6: Do you want it back on the agenda for next meeting?

[4:28:45] Trustee Patrick: Yeah, I think it's probably worthwhile to bring,

[4:28:47] Trustee Patrick: can we can talk about it with a few people.

[4:28:49] Trustee Patrick: That's all right.

[4:28:49] Trustee Patrick: Please consider talking to some of the other trustees.

[4:28:55] Trustee Patrick: Yep.

[4:28:55] Trustee Patrick: Trustee Maude was at the meeting too.

[4:28:57] Trustee Patrick: And then Trustee Wright.

[4:28:59] Trustee Patrick: Okay.

[4:29:01] Trustee Patrick: And Brent.

[4:29:04] Trustee Patrick: Okay.

[4:29:05] Trustee Patrick: So we have a draft annual report wording on page 248.

[4:29:13] Trustee Patrick: Yeah.

[4:29:20] Trustee Patrick: If you're okay with that wording,

[4:29:22] Trustee Patrick: then we just need the motion.

[4:29:24] Trustee Patrick: Which

[4:29:24] Voice 6: is in the agenda cover.

[4:29:26] Trustee Patrick: Yep.

[4:29:26] Voice 6: 16.2.

[4:29:28] Trustee Patrick: Yeah.

[4:29:29] Trustee Patrick: Pretty straightforward.

[4:29:31] Trustee Patrick: On page.

[4:29:33] Trustee Patrick: I'd

[4:29:33] Trustee McConchie: like to move that the North Panoramical Trust Committee approves the

[4:29:36] Trustee McConchie: format and outline of contents of the, for the 2020-2021 annual report.

[4:29:41] Trustee Patrick: Is there a second?

[4:29:42] Trustee Patrick: Seconded by Trustee Morrison.

[4:29:45] Trustee Patrick: All those in favor?

[4:29:47] Trustee Patrick: Pass.

[4:29:48] Trustee Patrick: I actually had a thought this morning.

[4:29:51] Trustee Patrick: Just, I didn't want to say it before the motion.

[4:29:53] Trustee Patrick: Because we can't do anything now.

[4:29:54] Trustee Patrick: it's too late that it's this is a the gears are in motion but for next year's annual report because

[4:30:00] Trustee Patrick: this is our chance to get in front of the minister that all we do is kind of say what we did we don't

[4:30:05] Trustee Patrick: we don't leave some of those bigger challenges out there that that should be part of to me part

[4:30:10] Trustee Patrick: of the annual report for each of the local trust areas could be to say let the minister know where

[4:30:14] Trustee Patrick: where our challenges lie too you're suggesting

[4:30:18] Trustee McConchie: the ministers listen to the island's trust that's

[4:30:21] Trustee McConchie: i think

[4:30:21] Trustee Patrick: the minister reads the report okay i do think

[4:30:25] Trustee Patrick: they read the report so so that is our

[4:30:27] Trustee Patrick: our chance to communicate too not just say everything's rosy and happy so fair enough

[4:30:33] Trustee McConchie: then we should we should we write uh would the ministry please listen and improve giving powers

[4:30:40] Trustee McConchie: to the honest trust to do its job effectively yeah right say

[4:30:43] Trustee Patrick: how it's showing up how does it

[4:30:45] Trustee McConchie: showing up

[4:30:45] Trustee Patrick: okay on your community what does it look like on your community i mean to me that's

[4:30:49] Trustee Patrick: a chance to really educate the minister on you know how is it showing up anyway okay just a

[4:30:56] Trustee Patrick: thought that i had hit me this morning as i was thinking um okay i think we're at the end of our

[4:31:02] Trustee Patrick: agenda our

[4:31:03] Trustee McConchie: next meeting tonight sorry just sorry chair patrick there was a legal opinion uh

[4:31:09] Trustee McConchie: circulated in an email and i'm wondering

[4:31:11] Trustee McConchie: when when are we going to discuss that

[4:31:15] Trustee Patrick: how can we well

[4:31:18] Voice 6: if you wanted to discuss it as an ltc i guess you could add as a edit right now to

[4:31:23] Voice 6: was a closed meeting item if

[4:31:25] Trustee McConchie: you've got it

[4:31:26] Voice 6: in front of you

[4:31:27] Trustee McConchie: yeah that's what i'm that's why i'm

[4:31:29] Trustee McConchie: bringing this up right now but i i'm aware trustee morrison is probably limited by what i'm not sure

[4:31:34] Trustee McConchie: what do you what

[4:31:35] Trustee Patrick: morrison do you have time today

[4:31:37] Trustee Patrick: or well

[4:31:38] Trustee Morrison: i'm put in a position where i'm having to

[4:31:41] Trustee Morrison: say yes or no on time when i thought the meeting would end in half an hour so i i want to discuss

[4:31:50] Trustee Morrison: the motion um and i don't really want to wait to discuss the motion but the

[4:31:55] Trustee Patrick: the legal opinion the

[4:31:56] Trustee Patrick: legal

[4:31:56] Trustee Morrison: opinion sorry there's two things still remaining like the legal opinion i'd like to

[4:32:00] Trustee Morrison: discuss it and we still have to discuss the date issue because the next thing is a little

[4:32:04] Trustee Morrison: challenging so i'm already

[4:32:06] Trustee Morrison: late for where i'm supposed to be um and it does cause me conflict

[4:32:10] Trustee Morrison: but i want to discuss this so let's proceed and if we can proceed in a timely manner that would be

[4:32:16] Trustee McConchie: for sure absolutely yeah because i have really specific questions as far as

[4:32:21] Trustee McConchie: as far as they will

[4:32:23] Trustee Morrison: we also

[4:32:23] Trustee McConchie: have the town hall section of the i

[4:32:25] Trustee Morrison: know i know and the meeting was supposed to end at one

[4:32:27] Trustee Morrison: and i know we had a lot of things on the agenda but i unfortunately schedule my life around all

[4:32:33] Trustee Patrick: right um should we go

[4:32:34] Trustee Morrison: to the town

[4:32:35] Trustee Patrick: hall and see how long it takes and then yeah

[4:32:38] Trustee Morrison: can i make a

[4:32:39] Trustee Morrison: suggestion um that because we a closed meeting we would have to do what would we do we would do

[4:32:45] Trustee Patrick: We have to do a motion and we just lock up the Zoom call.

[4:32:49] Trustee Morrison: And then we, so we would do the town hall first

[4:32:51] Trustee Morrison: and then do it after the town hall.

[4:32:52] Trustee Morrison: Do the

[4:32:52] Trustee Patrick: town hall first.

[4:32:53] Trustee Patrick: Okay.

[4:32:55] Trustee Morrison: Okay.

[4:32:59] Trustee Morrison: You know what?

[4:33:00] Trustee Morrison: I'm basically blowing up my afternoon anyway.

[4:33:03] Trustee Morrison: Can we take a break?

[4:33:04] Trustee Morrison: Because I need to reorganize several things.

[4:33:06] Trustee McConchie: So yes, of course.

[4:33:08] Trustee McConchie: That'd be great.

[4:33:09] Trustee McConchie: Take

[4:33:09] Trustee Patrick: a break now and then do the town hall.

[4:33:13] Trustee Patrick: Okay.

[4:33:13] Trustee Patrick: How much time do you need?

[4:33:16] Trustee Patrick: Five minutes.

[4:33:17] Voice 4: Five minutes.

[4:33:18] Trustee Patrick: Okay.

[4:33:18] Trustee Patrick: Five minute break.

[4:33:20] Trustee Patrick: thank you guys i'll

[4:33:21] Voice 4: put the break slide up thanks

[4:33:23] Voice 12: maple go

[4:36:34] Trustee Morrison: whenever everything else is back

[4:36:36] Voice 12: everybody's here except for staff or do we have shannon

[4:36:44] Voice 12: here shannon's here

[4:37:00] Trustee Patrick: okay thank you just

[4:37:02] Trustee Patrick: want to make sure our minute taker is here so should we go on with the town hall and then

[4:37:06] Trustee Patrick: come back and or do you want to do oh the next meeting i guess next

[4:37:10] Trustee Morrison: meeting i think let's have

[4:37:11] Trustee Patrick: of that

[4:37:11] Trustee Patrick: discussion so what's the

[4:37:12] Trustee Patrick: what's the conflict of the next meeting so

[4:37:15] Trustee Morrison: um the next

[4:37:17] Trustee Morrison: meeting uh maple tech just before we started this meeting um i don't know what the agenda

[4:37:23] Trustee Morrison: is starting to stack up like robert you might have a better idea yeah so because one of one

[4:37:30] Trustee Morrison: of the things i'm wondering is if we can start the meeting at oh no ben you were saying anytime

[4:37:36] Trustee Morrison: time after three is better if we do it if we shuffle yeah

[4:37:39] Trustee McConchie: wait maple can you take us off the

[4:37:42] Trustee McConchie: thing so i can see people the uh there we go yeah oh there you guys are um yeah it's like 3 30 i can

[4:37:48] Trustee McConchie: be at a computer at 3 30 uh if we switch the schedule around no problem yeah

[4:37:53] Trustee Morrison: and that's way

[4:37:53] Trustee Morrison: better for me so and i know it's a staff challenge too because that starts to get outside the workday

[4:37:59] Trustee Morrison: for folks but um it's just it's become a really big conflict for me the

[4:38:04] Voice 6: other option is look for

[4:38:05] Voice 6: a different date but that's probably equally challenging yeah

[4:38:08] Trustee Morrison: that's pretty challenging

[4:38:09] Trustee Morrison: too i think

[4:38:11] Trustee McConchie: it's great to have an afternoon and into evening session and i don't think

[4:38:14] Trustee McConchie: we've eaten too much into overtime have we for staff for our ltc but

[4:38:20] Voice 6: yeah i don't know

[4:38:22] Voice 6: um i had a few saturday meetings in the fall i remember that but uh okay so is that possible

[4:38:29] Trustee McConchie: Yeah,

[4:38:30] Trustee Patrick: it's possible I'm available. I'm always available.

[4:38:35] Trustee Patrick: That's

[4:38:35] Trustee Morrison: definitely the simplest fix for all of the conflict is to just move it to start at 330.

[4:38:43] Trustee Patrick: So do we need a motion to change the time.

[4:38:46] Voice 6: Yeah, I should pass a motion. Good.

[4:38:50] Trustee Patrick: I'd

[4:38:51] Trustee McConchie: like to make a motion

[4:38:53] Trustee McConchie: to change the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee meeting of June the 24th from 9am to

[4:38:59] Trustee McConchie: to a start time of 3.30 p.m.

[4:39:02] Trustee Patrick: Is there a second?

[4:39:04] Trustee Patrick: Second by Trustee Morrison.

[4:39:05] Trustee Patrick: Shannon, I think that was pretty easy.

[4:39:08] Trustee Patrick: I hope you got that one.

[4:39:10] Trustee Patrick: All right, I'll call a vote.

[4:39:12] Trustee Patrick: Can

[4:39:12] Trustee McConchie: I just actually, can I discuss?

[4:39:13] Trustee McConchie: I want to discuss something briefly

[4:39:15] Trustee McConchie: because we can discuss stuff.

[4:39:16] Trustee McConchie: We're not super, super pressed.

[4:39:19] Trustee McConchie: I understand that staff have, you know,

[4:39:23] Trustee McConchie: families and lives.

[4:39:25] Trustee McConchie: I just really want to reiterate this point

[4:39:27] Trustee McConchie: that man it's hard it's very very challenging to be a trustee and not be retired so we either have

[4:39:34] Trustee McConchie: retired trustees or or people that are involved in working in the community and that those two

[4:39:40] Trustee McConchie: issues seem to not be able to reconcile themselves right now and it's it's frustrating because i want

[4:39:46] Trustee McConchie: to attend every single meeting and be convenient for staff but i'm you know we're we we are not

[4:39:52] Trustee McConchie: paid a full-time salary to do this job and that's okay it's public service but I do recognize staff

[4:39:59] Trustee McConchie: are going to have to this will impact impact their lives as well when we make the decision

[4:40:04] Trustee McConchie: yeah

[4:40:05] Trustee Morrison: and I totally I agree and I echo that you know it is a challenge for us because there's

[4:40:11] Trustee Morrison: been a lot of additional meetings with the trust programs committee too and the select committee

[4:40:15] Trustee Morrison: so like I'm on several committees and so it's been around a different thing and both work full time

[4:40:21] Trustee Morrison: so it is super challenging for us to fit all these other meetings into our schedule and still keep

[4:40:26] Trustee Morrison: our flow of north tender things working so it's amazing we don't have more conflicts so i'm like

[4:40:33] Trustee Morrison: really appreciative of trying to work around that yeah

[4:40:35] Trustee McConchie: for sure all

[4:40:37] Trustee Patrick: right then i'll call the vote

[4:40:38] Trustee Patrick: all those in favor that's carried so great so this is um

[4:40:44] Trustee Patrick: our second town hall um again we don't

[4:40:47] Trustee Patrick: rework the decisions we made today. And please talk to us, not the staff, and please talk about

[4:41:00] Trustee Patrick: issues, not people. I see we have a couple of people who have already raised their hands. We

[4:41:04] Trustee Patrick: have Chris Roper. Chris, there you go. Hello. Hi, Chris.

[4:41:13] Voice 5: Hello. Good afternoon. Hello, all. Good

[4:41:15] Voice 5: Good afternoon.

[4:41:16] Voice 5: I must say this is the first trust meeting that I've sat through pretty much its entirety.

[4:41:22] Voice 5: I had a technical glitch this morning, but I've been with you for the last four hours, I believe, and my hat's off to you all.

[4:41:32] Voice 5: Thank you.

[4:41:33] Voice 5: I reiterate staff should be more willing to work other hours to accommodate.

[4:41:41] Voice 5: I reiterate that.

[4:41:43] Voice 5: that. I just want to mention a couple of things. You know who I am, North Pender Island resident

[4:41:50] Voice 5: neighbor to the helicopter, and I just want to get a timeline here, if you don't mind, real quickly.

[4:41:56] Voice 5: The landing installation occurred February the 26th. February the 26th, the landing installation

[4:42:07] Voice 5: occurred which puts us at a 92 93 day count kind of today and when we look at the June 24th meeting

[4:42:22] Voice 5: at 15 30 that puts from installation time so I just wanted to bring that timeline up

[4:42:32] Voice 5: up. The other thing I really wanted to ask is, do we know what it is that is next door to me?

[4:42:45] Voice 5: Is it a personal helicopter landing location, or is it an aerodrome? An aerodrome

[4:42:58] Voice 5: falls under regulations by Transport Canada, which excludes any local involvement,

[4:43:10] Voice 5: a personal helicopter landing location does not and opens up a wide door for groups involved in

[4:43:23] Voice 5: land use i'll also say that a a helidrome needs to be registered into the best of my knowledge there

[4:43:30] Voice 5: is no registration in place so i think that's a pretty big door that you should investigate um

[4:43:43] Voice 5: so that that that you know that's kind of about the start of it i'm just hoping that uh

[4:43:50] Voice 5: some of the legal that has been discussed can come forth.

[4:43:57] Voice 5: I would also mention that in all my efforts,

[4:44:01] Voice 5: I've been deferred to noise complaint at Transport Canada,

[4:44:06] Voice 5: which I rang well over a dozen times and it answers at an answering machine

[4:44:13] Voice 5: that takes a recording at the Canadian Aviation Museum noise complaint line.

[4:44:20] Voice 5: So that's my only, sorry, that's my only outlet for noise, complaint, and irritation.

[4:44:34] Voice 5: And I've requested a return call from the Ottawa number, which was given to me by CRD,

[4:44:45] Voice 5: and never have had a return call or acknowledgement of lodging of complaint

[4:44:53] Voice 5: uh so federal government at its best um and and it's excluded you guys and your ability

[4:45:03] Voice 5: and and i'm sorry to say but nobody answers the phone there so um that's it for me

[4:45:10] Voice 5: update and i'll i'll i'll put into it oh other uh there was no one allowed to talk at this meeting

[4:45:18] Voice 5: a number of us were were requested such and were refused and that was a bit of a slap thank you

[4:45:26] Voice 5: somebody and i've got her name but we've been we were refused and so

[4:45:30] Trustee Patrick: we will line up for the

[4:45:32] Voice 5: the meeting on the 24th.

[4:45:35] Voice 5: So over to you, thank you.

[4:45:37] Voice 5: That's fine.

[4:45:38] Trustee Patrick: Sorry, Chris, I'm the one that was,

[4:45:41] Trustee Patrick: there were two delegation requests

[4:45:43] Trustee Patrick: and I had just asked that

[4:45:46] Trustee Patrick: because we had this legal opinion coming

[4:45:48] Trustee Patrick: that we'd be just given the opportunity to review that

[4:45:51] Trustee Patrick: and that we invited you to speak in the town hall.

[4:45:57] Trustee Patrick: So I was not refusing you in a way to silence.

[4:45:59] Trustee Patrick: It was the timing of one of the trustees

[4:46:02] Trustee Patrick: to have the opportunity to be armed with the information

[4:46:07] Trustee Patrick: in this legal opinion.

[4:46:10] Voice 5: I understand and I appreciate that.

[4:46:12] Voice 5: Thank you.

[4:46:13] Voice 5: It's just back to the timing, you know,

[4:46:15] Voice 5: clock is ticking time.

[4:46:16] Voice 5: I

[4:46:16] Trustee Patrick: hear you.

[4:46:18] Trustee Patrick: Thank

[4:46:19] Voice 5: you. Thank you.

[4:46:19] Voice 5: Thank you.

[4:46:22] Trustee Patrick: Michael Sketch.

[4:46:26] Trustee Patrick: Michael, take yourself off mute.

[4:46:28] Trustee Patrick: Can you hear me?

[4:46:29] Trustee Patrick: Yes, yes we can.

[4:46:30] Voice 14: video anyway um i have something very um in my view important to add to your discussion about

[4:46:39] Voice 14: crd contract work um it yes of course it's very important to be able to uh liaise with

[4:46:47] Voice 14: the contractor and find out things are done properly but the crux of the matter i dealt

[4:46:53] Voice 14: with at length and spent an awful lot of money on freedom of information uh request regarding

[4:46:59] Voice 14: regarding a 2012 CRD contract.

[4:47:02] Voice 14: And the heart of the matter is failure of the CRD board to observe Section 35 of the

[4:47:10] Voice 14: Islands Trust Act.

[4:47:11] Voice 14: I'll explain that.

[4:47:14] Voice 14: But that is the crux of the failure.

[4:47:17] Voice 14: When the contract is decided on by the board, does it or does it not respect the bylaws

[4:47:24] Voice 14: of the local government?

[4:47:25] Voice 14: and in the case of dumping fill which is arguably a landfill they do not they didn't do so in 2012

[4:47:31] Voice 14: and they were absolutely unaccountable i'll explain that when i first heard of fill being

[4:47:39] Voice 14: dumped on both mckinnon road in a steep ravine and then on agricultural land reserve land i got

[4:47:46] Voice 14: a hold of the regional director who referred me to gave me a telephone number in a person he turned

[4:47:51] Voice 14: out to be the senior contract lawyer for the CRD and I explained my freedom of information request

[4:47:59] Voice 14: regarding the contract because I knew that that from off the record from somebody who had looked

[4:48:06] Voice 14: at the contract that it was specified in the contract that the excavated roadworks

[4:48:12] Voice 14: spoils be taken from the island that was in 2012. um and something happened and they weren't they

[4:48:19] Voice 14: were dumped and the senior contract lawyer for the crd said to me thank you for explaining your

[4:48:28] Voice 14: foi request i will not disclose the details of the contract despite potential for litigation from the

[4:48:37] Voice 14: public and that was my answer i passed that on to david howe and nothing happened nor was there any

[4:48:44] Voice 14: action. And I'm really pleased and thank you from the public perspective that this local trust

[4:48:50] Voice 14: committee has tackled the issue straight on. But I suggest that you amend your motion of action

[4:48:58] Voice 14: with the CRD to focus on the time, the writing of the contract. Now, the contract, because of

[4:49:05] Voice 14: liability issues, is not public. Anybody who reads it, if they want to apply for contractor position,

[4:49:13] Voice 14: opposition, has to sign a nondisclosure agreement.

[4:49:19] Voice 14: And so that would have to be dealt with at a high level in advance, such that the local

[4:49:24] Voice 14: government, the LTC, can see and make damn sure when the contract is let for Islands

[4:49:32] Voice 14: Trust issues, the contract covers, is not at variance with the OCP or land use by-law.

[4:49:42] Voice 14: And it's at that stage you have some muscle when that contract is awarded.

[4:49:48] Voice 14: It's all very well for the CRD contract lawyer to defer to the CRD engineers, they to a contracting firm of engineers, and they to the contractor, and him to the subcontractor.

[4:50:00] Voice 14: That's how it happened in 2012.

[4:50:02] Voice 14: Nobody was accountable.

[4:50:04] Voice 14: The only way you can get accountability is under Section 35 of the Act at the time of awarding of the contract.

[4:50:11] Voice 14: and you must be able to read the contract in advance

[4:50:15] Voice 14: before it goes to the CRD board.

[4:50:18] Voice 14: Please.

[4:50:20] Voice 14: Thank you.

[4:50:21] Trustee Patrick: Thank you very much.

[4:50:23] Trustee Patrick: Is there anyone else

[4:50:25] Voice 12: that wishes to address us today?

[4:50:33] Voice 12: Barbara.

[4:50:35] Voice 12: Hi,

[4:50:39] Voice 10: I just wanted to say that I'm glad to see

[4:50:41] Voice 10: that the groundwater sustainability is moving forward.

[4:50:44] Voice 10: forward. Currently, all farmers, all non-domestic users like agriculture, industrial, commercial

[4:50:53] Voice 10: have to license their wells. And this is supposed to be done by March 1st of next year. And

[4:51:01] Voice 10: this also includes domestic wells if people are using their domestic well for a market

[4:51:06] Voice 10: garden, watering livestock or chickens, that type of thing. And using an agriculture water

[4:51:13] Voice 10: water calculator that's online there's a tool available for people to calculate how much

[4:51:18] Voice 10: water they will be needing by because they have to pay for this water once they license it

[4:51:23] Voice 10: that it's by soil type crop type type of irrigation or animals so um will the trust be having access

[4:51:32] Voice 10: to all this data because it could help them know how much water is actually being used because

[4:51:36] Voice 10: currently it sounds like that red area is using ALR land probably making assumptions that we're

[4:51:43] Voice 10: all pumping groundwater like they do in California but we don't we tend to use wells so it'd be nice

[4:51:50] Voice 10: to see more water storage like or we don't use wells we use ponds so like it'd be nice to see

[4:51:56] Voice 10: more encouragement of ponds and yeah that's I'm just glad to see that and will this also be

[4:52:05] Voice 10: be triggering some kind of OCP review on density

[4:52:08] Voice 10: once you do get better numbers?

[4:52:10] Voice 10: That's all I had to say.

[4:52:11] Trustee Patrick: Very much possibly.

[4:52:13] Trustee Patrick: That's what this could lead to.

[4:52:15] Trustee Patrick: And yeah, thank you.

[4:52:16] Trustee Patrick: We do have very good cooperation

[4:52:17] Trustee Patrick: with Flynnrow and licensed data.

[4:52:20] Voice 10: Okay, thanks.

[4:52:22] Trustee Patrick: All right, thank you very much.

[4:52:26] Trustee Patrick: Are there anyone else that wishes to address us today?

[4:52:30] Trustee Patrick: If not, we always wanna hear from you.

[4:52:34] Trustee Patrick: Please email your trustees or southinfo

[4:52:37] Trustee Patrick: at islandstrust.bc.ca,

[4:52:39] Trustee Patrick: because what you have to say is very important to us all right with that I think we're going to go

[4:52:46] Trustee Patrick: into an in-camera meeting but we need um we'll need a motion here to do that uh is um uh chair

[4:52:56] Voice 4: Patrick I we I got um Jazz um the legislative clerk to send you the motion in an email okay good

[4:53:02] Trustee Patrick: sorry my

[4:53:03] Trustee Patrick: um maybe

[4:53:04] Voice 4: you could check there for a second if

[4:53:05] Trustee Patrick: that helps it's updating here it comes

[4:53:08] Trustee Patrick: Okay. Jazz. All right. I guess I'll read the motion then. I moved that the North Pender

[4:53:17] Trustee Patrick: local trust committee closed the meeting to the public in accordance with the community charter

[4:53:23] Trustee Patrick: part four division three section 91I for the purpose of considering legal advice. Is there a

[4:53:34] Trustee Patrick: second second

[4:53:36] Trustee McConchie: for any

[4:53:38] Trustee Patrick: discussion otherwise i will call the vote all those in favor

[4:53:43] Trustee Patrick: and that's carried so um are you just going to close the um looks

[4:53:50] Trustee McConchie: like maple sent us another

[4:53:51] Trustee McConchie: link for a encounter that's

[4:53:53] Trustee Patrick: no she sent a link of the um yes i did send another

[4:54:00] Voice 4: yes but if you choose to want

[4:54:02] Trustee Patrick: to come back

[4:54:03] Voice 4: this meeting will be opened you can do that if you'd

[4:54:06] Voice 4: like to report

[4:54:07] Voice 4: or you could do it at the next ltc meeting how

[4:54:11] Trustee Patrick: do you want to do that trustees probably

[4:54:13] Trustee Patrick: next people are

[4:54:15] Trustee McConchie: asking what they want the information from this legal opinion in the

[4:54:19] Trustee McConchie: public so should we rise and report it right after like i don't even understand how that

[4:54:25] Trustee McConchie: well

[4:54:25] Trustee Patrick: we have to have a discussion so we i can't we can't leave

[4:54:28] Trustee Morrison: this one open

[4:54:28] Trustee Patrick: yeah leave this

[4:54:30] Trustee Patrick: meeting open

[4:54:30] Trustee Morrison: and then we can rise and report here right okay

[4:54:33] Trustee Morrison: yeah thank you so we'll leave

[4:54:36] Trustee Patrick: this meeting open but we will leave this meeting and we

[4:54:39] Trustee McConchie: can always come back to it all right yes

[4:54:41] Voice 4: okay thank you

[4:54:42] Trustee Patrick: we're uh reopen this uh regular meeting of the north pender local trust committee

[4:54:51] Trustee Patrick: um is there any further business today no

[4:54:57] Trustee Morrison: um i actually yes

[4:55:01] Trustee Patrick: there is yeah

[4:55:01] Trustee Morrison: i had um two things

[4:55:04] Trustee Morrison: I realized that came and I didn't know so I just want to name them and then just figure out

[4:55:11] Trustee Morrison: what where they land probably on next meeting's agenda so I noticed that there

[4:55:19] Trustee Morrison: there are some challenges around the food truck on pender and I don't know how that's

[4:55:27] Trustee Morrison: like if we need to just clarify that inside our own land use bylaws around food trucks being

[4:55:34] Trustee Morrison: agricultural use so I just noted agricultural sort of the land use work and did the date

[4:55:43] Trustee Morrison: there was one other thing I've forgotten it okay well that's it other than that just the

[4:55:49] Trustee Morrison: rise and report well

[4:55:51] Trustee Patrick: there is no there was nothing to rise

[4:55:53] Trustee Patrick: and report but there may be some motions

[4:55:57] Trustee Morrison: yes all right so let's see if I can do these on the fly we're

[4:56:04] Trustee Patrick: just recording so you're going to

[4:56:05] Trustee Patrick: have to yeah so

[4:56:07] Trustee Morrison: the first one would be that the north pender local trust committee um request a

[4:56:16] Trustee Morrison: public release of the legal decision regarding helicopter use on yeah okay is that how it would

[4:56:26] Trustee Morrison: be awarded request

[4:56:27] Voice 6: uh executive committee release the legal opinion dated may 19 2021

[4:56:40] Voice 6: on recreational helipads thank you okay

[4:56:46] Trustee McConchie: is there a second to that motion second that motion yes

[4:56:48] Trustee McConchie: any

[4:56:49] Trustee Morrison: discussion it's important for the public to know what what we're getting is legal advice

[4:56:56] Trustee McConchie: public pays for the legal opinions

[4:56:58] Trustee Patrick: i'll call the vote all those in favor and that's carried

[4:57:04] Trustee Patrick: okay

[4:57:06] Trustee Morrison: the second one would be that the north pender local trust committee um add a helicopter

[4:57:20] Trustee Morrison: a

[4:57:20] Voice 6: prohibition on helicopters yeah

[4:57:23] Trustee Morrison: a prohibition on helicopters is part of the land use bylaw review

[4:57:26] Trustee Morrison: you is

[4:57:29] Trustee McConchie: there a second I second the motion

[4:57:30] Trustee Patrick: any discussion we're

[4:57:36] Trustee Morrison: not sure how active it will be

[4:57:37] Trustee Morrison: but we need to do it anyway call the vote self

[4:57:40] Trustee McConchie: -explanatory yep all

[4:57:42] Trustee Morrison: those in favor and that's

[4:57:44] Trustee Morrison: carried all right last one that the north pender island local trust committee take advocacy

[4:57:53] Trustee Morrison: to prohibit recreational helicopter use in the trust area is

[4:57:59] Trustee Patrick: there a second to that motion

[4:58:00] Trustee Patrick: second is there any discussion call the vote all those in favor and that's carried is there

[4:58:11] Trustee Patrick: any further business today um

[4:58:13] Voice 6: just one more thing about the the legal opinion like you can put into

[4:58:17] Voice 6: your own words what the opinion says when you're talking to people right um if you if you while

[4:58:24] Voice 6: you're waiting for the decision to be released right you can tell people you know i've received

[4:58:29] Voice 6: received a legal opinion this is this is how I interpret it this is how I understand it

[4:58:34] Trustee Morrison: okay that's good particularly

[4:58:35] Voice 6: on some aspect of it like the um the well it's not an aerodrome

[4:58:39] Voice 6: therefore you guys can enforce aspect of it

[4:58:42] Trustee Morrison: right right okay okay that's helpful um I probably will

[4:58:47] Trustee Morrison: try to do that in the next tender poster on the forum because I need to kind of think it through

[4:58:52] Trustee Morrison: a little bit

[4:58:52] Trustee Morrison: more of how I'd frame that

[4:58:54] Trustee McConchie: yeah so Robert I can memorize lines from the report from

[4:58:58] Trustee McConchie: you're

[4:58:58] Voice 6: supposed to put it into your own words

[4:59:00] Trustee McConchie: you're

[4:59:01] Voice 6: supposed to read it understand it yeah

[4:59:04] Voice 6: and put it into your own words i

[4:59:06] Trustee McConchie: just want to i i yeah okay good to know i just want to

[4:59:08] Trustee McConchie: the principle

[4:59:09] Voice 6: is um disclosure right you're not supposed to disclose

[4:59:12] Voice 6: solicitor client privilege fair enough okay

[4:59:14] Trustee Patrick: all right any further business

[4:59:19] Trustee Patrick: motion to adjourn make

[4:59:21] Trustee McConchie: to make a motion to adjourn

[4:59:22] Trustee Patrick: is there a second all those in favor

[4:59:28] Trustee Patrick: okay thank

[4:59:29] Trustee McConchie: you staff thank you robert thank you thank you

[4:59:32] Trustee Patrick: thank you

[4:59:33] Trustee McConchie: narissa all right bye