North Pender Island Local Trust Committee community information meeting, June 24, 2021

[0:00:12] Trustee Patrick: Good afternoon. If you're just joining us, we'll start the meeting in just a moment.

[0:00:29] Trustee Patrick: Okay, trustees, it's 3.30. Everybody ready?

[0:00:32] Trustee Patrick: I see. Great. Well, good afternoon. I'd really like to, I really like to, I will call this

[0:00:40] Trustee Patrick: meeting of the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee to order. This meeting is being recorded

[0:00:45] Trustee Patrick: and also live streamed. I begin with acknowledging how fortunate we are to be able to gather today

[0:00:52] Trustee Patrick: day all across the locations of the traditional of the traditional territory of the Coast Salish

[0:00:57] Trustee Patrick: people. Also, I know it's hard that we have more news today coming from a residential school in

[0:01:05] Trustee Patrick: Saskatoon about more graves being discovered. And the Truth and Reconciliation calls for action

[0:01:17] Trustee Patrick: did have a mandate that we learn about the truth about what happened at residential schools

[0:01:23] Trustee Patrick: and to inform all Canadians about what happened at the schools and this is what's happening we're

[0:01:30] Trustee Patrick: getting informed we're learning and that is part of our journey on reconciliation is for each of us

[0:01:37] Trustee Patrick: to have have this learning but also I do understand the trauma that this brings to

[0:01:45] Trustee Patrick: Indigenous people of this residential school, and my thoughts and prayers are out to them.

[0:01:55] Trustee Patrick: I'm Laura Patrick. I'm elected on Salt Spring Island and chair of this local trust committee.

[0:02:01] Trustee Patrick: I'm joined today by Trustee Deb Morrison. Good afternoon, Deb, and Trustee Ben McConkie. Good

[0:02:06] Trustee Patrick: afternoon, Ben. Together, we make up your North Pender Local Trust Committee. This meeting is an

[0:02:11] Trustee Patrick: official forum for your local trust committee to make decisions about land use planning matters

[0:02:15] Trustee Patrick: and discuss relevant business. Also want to add that despite the fact that some of our staff may

[0:02:23] Trustee Patrick: be coming from their homes, they have the right to a safe and respectful workplace. We're grateful

[0:02:30] Trustee Patrick: for the ability to have electronic meetings. Trustee staff and the public don't have to travel

[0:02:34] Trustee Patrick: and we're honoring the provincial health orders and guidelines during the pandemic. We appreciate

[0:02:38] Trustee Patrick: your understanding and assistance as this is a virtual meeting. There could be technical

[0:02:44] Trustee Patrick: difficulties and we'll work quickly to overcome them. Everyone's mics have been muted so that

[0:02:49] Trustee Patrick: there are no audio disruptions and I'll review in a few moments how the town hall will work.

[0:02:55] Trustee Patrick: We have several staff joining us today. I'd like to introduce them. Maple Hung, our office

[0:02:59] Trustee Patrick: administrator who's making this meeting run smoothly. Thank you very much, Maple. Shannon

[0:03:05] Trustee Patrick: Shannon Brayford is joining us via audio today. She's our minute taker. Good afternoon, Shannon.

[0:03:10] Trustee Patrick: And we have Robert Kojima, our regional planning manager. Afternoon, Robert. And we have planners

[0:03:17] Trustee Patrick: Kim Stockville and Phil Testamal here as well. Good afternoon. Thanks for being here.

[0:03:23] Trustee Patrick: So, trustees, we have an agenda before us. We have one additional request to bring to your

[0:03:28] Trustee Patrick: attention. John Roper has asked for five minutes during the town hall to discuss helicopters. I

[0:03:34] Trustee Patrick: I told him to be prepared to speak, but would ask whether you would concur to that five minute request.

[0:03:40] Trustee Patrick: So I'm seeing. Yes,

[0:03:41] Trustee Morrison: I believe it's Chris Roper, though.

[0:03:43] Trustee Morrison: Oh,

[0:03:43] Trustee Patrick: Chris, sorry. You're right. My notes. I can't even read my own writing.

[0:03:46] Trustee Patrick: Thank you for pointing that out. So. All right.

[0:03:50] Trustee Patrick: So we'll add that acknowledge that Chris will have five minutes in the town hall.

[0:03:55] Trustee Patrick: Are there any other additions or changes that need to be made to the agenda?

[0:04:00] Trustee Patrick: Yes. Deb, Trustee Morrison. Yes.

[0:04:03] Trustee Morrison: Yes, there was one that came in by email to us. It was on page seven, under 13.2.

[0:04:12] Trustee Morrison: Barb.

[0:04:13] Trustee Morrison: Oh,

[0:04:13] Trustee Patrick: for a change to the minutes.

[0:04:15] Trustee Patrick: Yeah.

[0:04:15] Trustee Morrison: Yeah.

[0:04:16] Trustee Morrison: Oh, sorry, not the agenda.

[0:04:17] Trustee Patrick: Sorry, I'm jumping straight to minutes.

[0:04:19] Trustee Patrick: Sorry, we're trying

[0:04:20] Trustee Patrick: to move this meeting along at high speed. Thank you.

[0:04:22] Trustee Morrison: Yeah, no, you're good.

[0:04:23] Trustee Patrick: All right. So can we approve the agenda through general consent?

[0:04:27] Trustee Patrick: Yeah.

[0:04:28] Trustee Patrick: Excellent. So that moves us on to reports. Which trustee would like to go first?

[0:04:34] Trustee Morrison: I can go.

[0:04:35] Trustee Morrison: Do you want?

[0:04:36] Trustee McConchie: Yeah, go ahead. Okay.

[0:04:38] Trustee Morrison: A couple things to report. As many of the islands

[0:04:43] Trustee Morrison: have realized, and if you haven't found it, there's a Facebook page to this effect. The

[0:04:48] Trustee Morrison: trust policy statement is progressing as it has for the last two years, and it's getting to the

[0:04:56] Trustee Morrison: point where there's a broader public consultation again. It's had a couple different cycles of it,

[0:05:01] Trustee Morrison: But there is information on the programs page and actually wanted to potentially advise the trust to actually shift how this is on the web page because it's a bit buried.

[0:05:16] Trustee Morrison: It's on the programs page under Islands 2050 for people to get information on and to send comments to make sure that comments are also cc'd, even if you're cc'd them to trustees.

[0:05:27] Trustee Morrison: that is also cc'd to Islands 2050 at islandstrust.bc.ca, and if we can post that in our

[0:05:36] Trustee Morrison: minutes specifically, because I'm worried that people are emailing trustees or putting things

[0:05:42] Trustee Morrison: on Facebook, but those comments are not getting into the actual public record, and we need to

[0:05:47] Trustee Morrison: make sure that all public comment right now is getting into public record so that all trustees

[0:05:51] Trustee Morrison: are seeing it. So there is a July 8th meeting for the trust policy statement, and I do encourage

[0:05:58] Trustee Morrison: everybody to submit comments before that, and to be as specific as possible. If there is edits,

[0:06:06] Trustee Morrison: I know there's a lot of folks that just don't even want the first reading, that's fine to say

[0:06:10] Trustee Morrison: too, but if you have specific edits, it's really helpful to suggest those. Next thing, I really

[0:06:18] Trustee Morrison: really wanted to thank the agricultural APC for all of the minutes. It was really interesting to

[0:06:24] Trustee Morrison: read through them. And so thanks very much for that. It's really helpful to understand your

[0:06:29] Trustee Morrison: thinking when we can see the minutes like they are. So thanks for the minute taker and thanks

[0:06:33] Trustee Morrison: for the APC for the work you're doing. And then maybe on a personal note, I did have my other

[0:06:41] Trustee Morrison: vaccine, my second vaccine yesterday. So I apologize if I'm a little bit like loopy today,

[0:06:45] Trustee Morrison: day but hopefully I can handle it um and I'm glad we're having this meeting in the evening anyway

[0:06:50] Trustee Morrison: um last thing I actually think that um I I will speak for myself on this issue but I think um

[0:06:58] Trustee Morrison: that I need to apologize for not considering a deferral of the um the what is it called the

[0:07:07] Trustee Morrison: TUP for Grimmer um last meeting because as a committee we should have probably done a deferral

[0:07:15] Trustee Morrison: of that instead of approve it but it just hadn't come out like I just didn't think about it

[0:07:20] Trustee Morrison: in that moment that a deferral was an option because the applicant wasn't there and so and

[0:07:27] Trustee Morrison: we might want to have that more as a standing policy for us that if an applicant isn't present

[0:07:33] Trustee Morrison: that we defer because we really need applicants present and it was like a really awkward and

[0:07:39] Trustee Morrison: confusing situation I wanted to do so sorry that we just didn't think of that in the moment

[0:07:45] Trustee Morrison: something to consider all right so I think that's everything for now thank

[0:07:49] Trustee Patrick: you Trustee Morrison

[0:07:50] Trustee Patrick: Trustee McConkie I

[0:07:52] Trustee McConchie: want to echo what Trustee Morrison just said but I'm not sure Chair

[0:07:57] Trustee McConchie: Patrick if if it's all right I'm pretty moved by the the news of the day I wanted to talk about

[0:08:04] Trustee McConchie: personal things but I'm not sure if I could just have this trustee report as a moment of silence

[0:08:10] Trustee McConchie: for um uh the 751 unmarked graves near former residential school um uh the indian residential

[0:08:20] Trustee McConchie: school operated from 1899 to 1997 and uh i'm wondering if we could just have a moment just to

[0:08:27] Trustee McConchie: pause on that and i'll i'll move on okay

[0:08:30] Trustee Patrick: absolutely i'm

[0:09:21] Trustee McConchie: not sure how to stop like i could sit and

[0:09:24] Trustee McConchie: think about it all day but i we do have a business item but i wanted to recognize that

[0:09:27] Trustee McConchie: and uh bring us back center us after all this chaos has been going on into the work that we

[0:09:33] Trustee McConchie: have ahead of us right now thank you all

[0:09:40] Trustee Patrick: right um any further you wish you weren't going to report

[0:09:43] Trustee Patrick: anything else than at this moment uh

[0:09:46] Trustee McConchie: other than um i i'm going to announce that i'm not running

[0:09:51] Trustee McConchie: for re-election for trustee of north pender my focus will be on in the coming year and a half

[0:09:59] Trustee McConchie: ahead will be on educating and working with folks that would like to take this position on and

[0:10:05] Trustee McConchie: continue the work and I'm concerned that the public will be perceived as us pushing through

[0:10:11] Trustee McConchie: quickly what is important policy work so therefore the person that attains this office is someone

[0:10:19] Trustee McConchie: that is well educated and we have the benefit of having zoom meetings and application papers to

[0:10:26] Trustee McConchie: to get folks up to speed on this.

[0:10:29] Trustee McConchie: I would love to have seen Gary Steeves

[0:10:33] Trustee McConchie: and Ken Hancock discuss some issues

[0:10:34] Trustee McConchie: and learn about the details of the debate.

[0:10:37] Trustee McConchie: I think this is a great opportunity.

[0:10:39] Trustee McConchie: So rather than focus on the individual,

[0:10:42] Trustee McConchie: I will complete the work at hand

[0:10:44] Trustee McConchie: to preserve and protect the year and a half I have,

[0:10:46] Trustee McConchie: but I wanted to let folks know so we can start planning

[0:10:49] Trustee McConchie: and proceed appropriately

[0:10:51] Trustee McConchie: to the next democratic election.

[0:10:53] Trustee McConchie: So I did want to mention that personal information

[0:10:56] Trustee McConchie: despite the news of today,

[0:10:58] Trustee McConchie: as I feel that it's pertinent

[0:10:59] Trustee McConchie: to the benefit of the community.

[0:11:01] Trustee McConchie: So thanks for listening.

[0:11:03] Trustee Patrick: Thank you, Ben.

[0:11:06] Trustee Patrick: For the chair report,

[0:11:08] Trustee Patrick: as Deb mentioned that there is a meeting scheduled

[0:11:11] Trustee Patrick: for the trust council on July 8th,

[0:11:14] Trustee Patrick: the evening before on July 7th,

[0:11:17] Trustee Patrick: there is a town hall scheduled from seven till nine.

[0:11:21] Trustee Patrick: The executive committee yesterday

[0:11:22] Trustee Patrick: yesterday approved a half hour before that starting at 6 30 to have an information session

[0:11:29] Trustee Patrick: to just sort of explain what what's going on the trust policy statement and the process and

[0:11:35] Trustee Patrick: so forth so I hope that's news to the trustees but we thought that we didn't want to take time

[0:11:41] Trustee Patrick: out of the town hall so we added it as an additional space before the town hall for

[0:11:47] Trustee Patrick: for anyone that's interested.

[0:11:49] Trustee Patrick: So I think that's important.

[0:11:52] Trustee Patrick: And yes, while there's a meeting coming up on July 8th,

[0:11:56] Trustee Patrick: it's important for the trustees to receive the draft

[0:11:59] Trustee Patrick: that's coming and to make some decisions

[0:12:01] Trustee Patrick: on what to do for next steps.

[0:12:05] Trustee Patrick: And I think that's the vision of the meeting.

[0:12:08] Trustee Patrick: And I think regardless of the outcome,

[0:12:10] Trustee Patrick: there'll be a far more community engagement

[0:12:13] Trustee Patrick: that's uh just just beginning on uh on on inputting input to to the policy statement

[0:12:21] Trustee Patrick: the directions that are very important so um looking forward to the the next next phase and

[0:12:27] Trustee Patrick: the conversations that we have to have with our um our island islanders okay so with that

[0:12:34] Trustee Patrick: oops jumping back uh back to our agenda sorry i'm looking on alternative space myself today so

[0:12:42] Trustee Patrick: So here we go.

[0:12:45] Trustee Patrick: So this is your chance to speak, the town hall.

[0:12:51] Trustee Patrick: We want to hear your questions and comments.

[0:12:54] Trustee Patrick: Later in the agenda, we'll be discussing various topics and some applications and applicants.

[0:12:59] Trustee Patrick: You will have an opportunity to speak when we consider your application.

[0:13:02] Trustee Patrick: So applicants don't need to speak at this time, but we do want to hear any questions

[0:13:06] Trustee Patrick: or comments that people have that will help us make good decisions.

[0:13:10] Trustee Patrick: when addressing the local trust committee please address your comments to us the trustees not

[0:13:16] Trustee Patrick: the audience or staff and speak about the issues not individuals be clear concise and respectful

[0:13:25] Trustee Patrick: we do have a full agenda today so i will be cognizant of time and i really am appreciative

[0:13:30] Trustee Patrick: of chris for making a request for some additional time for his conversation we're going to start

[0:13:36] Trustee Patrick: with chris so uh maple will um promote you chris to uh uh panelists so that we can see you if you

[0:13:44] Trustee Patrick: choose or and your audio so yes chris

[0:13:48] Voice 6: has been promoted now so

[0:13:49] Trustee Patrick: chris you can turn on your video

[0:13:50] Trustee Patrick: and audio if you wish it's in the lower left hand side of your screen oh let's hope we can find chris

[0:14:15] Voice 4: yeah ah

[0:14:16] Trustee Patrick: there we go have

[0:14:17] Voice 4: you got we

[0:14:18] Trustee Patrick: can hear you

[0:14:19] Voice 4: chris top right hand corner top right hand

[0:14:22] Trustee Patrick: hello

[0:14:22] Voice 4: thank you top right hand corner you know or maybe my ipad upside down oh

[0:14:29] Trustee Patrick: you have an ipad

[0:14:31] Voice 4: all

[0:14:32] Trustee Patrick: right the floor is yours

[0:14:33] Voice 4: chris well well well thank you thank you for allowing me a few minutes

[0:14:39] Voice 4: to speak about the helicopter lake located next door to our property at 6935 pirates road

[0:14:46] Voice 4: on north pander island

[0:14:57] Trustee Patrick: chris are you there um

[0:14:59] Voice 4: yeah i'm having just a slight technical

[0:15:03] Voice 4: difficulty at the moment i

[0:15:08] Trustee Patrick: can hear you there's

[0:15:22] Trustee McConchie: some time here to sort it out sort it out we

[0:15:25] Trustee McConchie: will give chris the floor at any perhaps if that's

[0:15:29] Trustee Patrick: can we can we give you a moment to if

[0:15:31] Trustee Patrick: you want to work on your technical we can move on for a minute are

[0:15:36] Voice 4: you hearing this i can hear you

[0:15:39] Trustee Patrick: you know okay

[0:15:42] Voice 4: well um i am running an audio that i guess is not being picked up but i'm running an

[0:15:49] Voice 4: audio right now of a helicopter departing next door um that puts my db meter into the red zone

[0:16:00] Voice 4: and puts my db around 191 to 193 the helicopter is about 50 uh 50 meters away

[0:16:10] Voice 4: ways from where i'm standing on my property line here i i realized that wasn't working very well

[0:16:17] Voice 4: i thought i could impact everyone with the noise which is much greater to me than it was to you uh

[0:16:25] Voice 4: but i i just would have played a minute and a half's worth of a helicopter exiting uh the

[0:16:32] Voice 4: helicopter pad uh that my neighbor mr quinn has constructed and and i'd like to just point out a

[0:16:40] Voice 4: a couple of things that it does put my DB meter into the red line when I stand at my property

[0:16:45] Voice 4: line, runs up into the 191, 193, which is red zone danger. That recording was done a couple

[0:16:53] Voice 4: of weeks ago. There's been some 20 flights have occurred since the end of March. And we all got

[0:16:59] Voice 4: together and wrote a nice neighborhood letter to Mr. Quinn saying, welcome to the neighborhood.

[0:17:03] Voice 4: enjoy we're here for a specific reason please don't fly your helicopter and he rebuked the

[0:17:10] Voice 4: letter now I'd like to change reference the whale research lab at Friday Harbor just last week

[0:17:18] Voice 4: announced that there'd been no sightings of the southern resident orca whales in the San Juans

[0:17:24] Voice 4: for two years two years that's like 700 days we used to see orcas three to four times here right

[0:17:33] Voice 4: off the bluffs right off oak bluffs three to four times a week the the residents would show up

[0:17:39] Voice 4: i'm really partial to this because i host the dfo hydrophone at my property and the hydrophone

[0:17:47] Voice 4: is there to listen to noise and whales and to send that information to vancouver to the central

[0:17:54] Voice 4: collection facility so i'm very involved with dfo on a personal level um so we used to see him three

[0:18:01] Voice 4: to four times a week right now they should be off the bluffs enjoying the chinook salmon run

[0:18:08] Voice 4: it should be happening right now well the resident whales are no longer resident

[0:18:14] Voice 4: because we took their fish they didn't come here because it's a nice place to be they came here

[0:18:22] Voice 4: because there was fish and now we've taken the fish and and and and they're off foraging somewhere

[0:18:29] Voice 4: somewhere else. Environmental impact is really hard to measure when it's happening. You know,

[0:18:34] Voice 4: we're mostly unaware of the impact and small change occurs. Well, in this case, the orca just

[0:18:41] Voice 4: left. They're gone. Now we're altering the environment by a private helicopter. Now we

[0:18:50] Voice 4: are altering the environment and small change is happening. And won't it be a real shame in

[0:18:57] Voice 4: two years if we're having the same conversation again about the great reduction of wildlife on

[0:19:04] Voice 4: oak bluffs on north pender island because of the helicopter because we have the conversation about

[0:19:11] Voice 4: the orca and the no fish and i'm really concerned and i can only use that as a reference but

[0:19:17] Voice 4: we have to observe change and we have to be aware that we impact the environment and environment

[0:19:24] Voice 4: doesn't wait for us it it it does its own thing and and and so i i put out a plea that you know

[0:19:32] Voice 4: we're we're in a very critical time you guys are looking at the gulf islands in the bigger picture

[0:19:38] Voice 4: and and the picture is changing quickly dramatically so maybe we should hit a pause

[0:19:44] Voice 4: button for a bit and just do a reassess before we get too far that all of a sudden we go well

[0:19:51] Voice 4: well, what happened to that eagle that was there?

[0:19:54] Voice 4: Or where are all the vultures that used to just nest,

[0:19:59] Voice 4: like literally between me and where the hydrophone is in the ocean?

[0:20:04] Voice 4: There's numbers of them.

[0:20:06] Voice 4: So I'm sorry, I'm getting back on my soapbox.

[0:20:09] Voice 4: So I'll get off and I'll close.

[0:20:10] Voice 4: And thank you for considering and allowing me the time.

[0:20:14] Voice 4: It's greatly appreciated.

[0:20:15] Voice 4: Thank you very much.

[0:20:16] Voice 4: Ben, I appreciate you taking that time.

[0:20:19] Voice 4: and that yeah that's where we are thank you ben thank you all

[0:20:24] Trustee Patrick: thank you chris so we're going to

[0:20:28] Trustee Patrick: move on with the with the others in the town hall and i see people have already raised your hand and

[0:20:32] Trustee Patrick: that's how you can get our attention so again i ask that you be clear concise and respectful

[0:20:40] Trustee Patrick: and i see that doug um i don't know how to say your last name doug doug regar doug if you take

[0:20:49] Trustee Patrick: yourself off mute, we should be able to hear you.

[0:20:53] Voice 2: It's Doug Regehr, no problem there on the

[0:20:55] Voice 2: pronunciation, everybody

[0:20:56] Voice 2: gets it wrong, including my mom.

[0:21:00] Trustee Patrick: Please proceed. So can

[0:21:03] Voice 2: you hear me okay?

[0:21:04] Trustee Patrick: Yes. Can

[0:21:05] Voice 2: you hear me okay?

[0:21:06] Trustee Patrick: Yes, can you hear us? Okay, great.

[0:21:09] Trustee Patrick: So yes,

[0:21:10] Voice 2: everything's really good on

[0:21:12] Voice 2: my end. So again, my name is Doug Regehr. I live at 427 Buccaneers Road, next to, directly next to

[0:21:21] Voice 2: a STVR that's got a permit that's up for renewal, just so we're clear, right?

[0:21:28] Voice 2: I appreciate the time that you've given me as well to talk today.

[0:21:31] Voice 2: I'm going to be very brief because I can see that you guys want to be quick here, and I

[0:21:36] Voice 2: totally get it.

[0:21:37] Voice 2: So anyway, to start, I would just like to say that I would like to support the staff

[0:21:43] Voice 2: alternative number three in the staff recommendations regarding this TUP.

[0:21:49] Voice 2: that is basically saying to deny the application um and the reason i'd like to do that is because

[0:21:56] Voice 2: um firstly um i i saw the review by the staff and apparently nobody uh understandably has

[0:22:05] Voice 2: actually done a site visit here uh at our address due to covet 19 restrictions um so i think for

[0:22:13] Voice 2: For this, for my reasoning, I think it really would require somebody to be here on site to actually experience the noise issues that I experience and my family experience that transmit to our house.

[0:22:26] Voice 2: So that's one of the reasons why. Also, you'll get a good understanding of the parking issue. There are parking issues here. I get people that are parking their vehicle on my property.

[0:22:38] Voice 2: um you if somebody comes and has a look they'll really get the perspective

[0:22:42] Voice 2: doing a topographical map really doesn't do it right um i also would like to also comment on

[0:22:50] Voice 2: the supporting letters that um are in the package today and i would like to just um

[0:22:57] Voice 2: uh let you know that i i really feel that my concerns being the the person is living where

[0:23:05] Voice 2: where I am living in proximity to this short-term rental

[0:23:11] Voice 2: should carry more weight.

[0:23:12] Voice 2: I really feel that my position should carry more weight

[0:23:16] Voice 2: than neighbors and 200 meters down the road or whatever.

[0:23:22] Voice 2: I really think that it's important to look at my situation

[0:23:29] Voice 2: and go from there.

[0:23:33] Voice 2: Excuse me.

[0:23:33] Voice 2: I also want to just make a note here that I received a letter with the on-line or the on-island emergency contact name and number.

[0:23:46] Voice 2: And I tried to contact that number just to make sure that that person is actually is the on-line contact, on-island contact.

[0:23:55] Voice 2: contact. And for several days now, numerous times a day, I've been calling and the person who picks

[0:24:01] Voice 2: it up either picks it up and hangs up or they don't take my message. So I'm really concerned

[0:24:07] Voice 2: about that. In the event there was an emergency or something, there's nobody there. I know that's

[0:24:13] Voice 2: not the issue about my noise and such, but I just thought it would be really important that I brought

[0:24:17] Voice 2: um lastly um i would just like to say that um this is not a personal issue between myself

[0:24:28] Voice 2: and the owner of this business next door to me this is really not pleased this is this is about

[0:24:34] Voice 2: trans sound transfer from vacation rental into my house throughout my house all day long but

[0:24:43] Voice 2: more particularly after 11 o'clock at night it resonates through my bedroom window when we're

[0:24:48] Voice 2: trying to sleep i understand the people that come up on vacation and they're they should have a good

[0:24:54] Voice 2: time they should be chatting and talking when they when they get out of their vehicles and they should

[0:24:58] Voice 2: be going in the hot tub and enjoying themselves and talking i would i do that myself i'm sure many

[0:25:03] Voice 2: of you have right but the problem is that this resonates throughout our whole house and the ferry

[0:25:11] Voice 2: schedule is such that the towasin ferry i think it leaves seven o'clock at night each each night so

[0:25:18] Voice 2: So just, you get it, right?

[0:25:20] Voice 2: It's like every night.

[0:25:22] Voice 2: That's all I'm trying to say.

[0:25:24] Voice 2: Hopefully you hear what I'm saying.

[0:25:26] Voice 2: You have another look at this

[0:25:28] Voice 2: when you're making your decision here.

[0:25:30] Voice 2: I really think there's a little bit more to this

[0:25:32] Voice 2: than what meets the eye in terms of the sound.

[0:25:36] Voice 2: It's really bad.

[0:25:39] Voice 2: I also want to take this time to thank the three of you.

[0:25:41] Voice 2: I've never met you.

[0:25:42] Voice 2: I've never talked to you.

[0:25:44] Voice 2: I'm not the type of person that works the scenes,

[0:25:46] Voice 2: behind the scenes.

[0:25:48] Voice 2: I just want to say thank you for all your work, and I understand that you're leaving us now, Ben. I don't know you, never met you, but I was a government official myself. I know what you guys do, so thank you for your good work. I do appreciate it.

[0:26:01] Trustee Patrick: Thank you very much, Doug. I see there's a Neil Parker, or Niall. Niall?

[0:26:10] Voice 11: Hello, everyone. Is my audio okay?

[0:26:13] Trustee Patrick: Yes.

[0:26:14] Voice 11: okay um i just had a short uh more of a question i don't know if it if you've got people on there

[0:26:22] Voice 11: are going to answer it much but uh i did send it on through uh dev and ben and they passed it on

[0:26:27] Voice 11: to the islands 2050 uh thanks for that um but it essentially came down to the recommendation about

[0:26:34] Voice 11: uh the uh to to prohibit desalination and i just really didn't see the rationale for that

[0:26:42] Voice 11: as panning out. The only notes that I could see in the draft two referred to energy and impact

[0:26:53] Voice 11: on the marine environment, both of which I figure are going to be pretty small, but if somebody's

[0:27:00] Voice 11: got some numbers on that, whether the planners have worked on that, I would love to see references

[0:27:05] Voice 11: to that.

[0:27:08] Trustee Patrick: All right well is that your only question at this time?

[0:27:13] Voice 11: It is indeed and thanks for everything

[0:27:15] Voice 11: you guys do. I expect you may if you don't have that sort of answer now just something that should

[0:27:20] Voice 11: be dug into before you guys commit to such a fairly restrictive requirement.

[0:27:27] Trustee Morrison: Oh no thank you

[0:27:28] Trustee Morrison: oh go ahead. Yeah I did make a note of that I'm keeping a log now of all the different things

[0:27:36] Trustee Morrison: that people are suggesting and like questions they're asking so i can kind of get all those

[0:27:41] Trustee Morrison: answers as we move forward um but i would encourage and i hopefully that will come back at us too

[0:27:48] Trustee Morrison: just because we forwarded that to staff so um yeah it would be good to know that because i

[0:27:52] Trustee Morrison: actually am curious about that too now that you pointed it out so that'd be great okay great yeah

[0:27:57] Trustee McConchie: and i i just want to i just want to recognize uh trustee morrison as chair of the trust programs

[0:28:02] Trustee McConchie: committee and i know trustee morrison has worked extraordinarily hard on this and you luckily

[0:28:08] Trustee McConchie: islanders are in good hands because she's going to be the trust programs committee now that we have

[0:28:14] Trustee McConchie: this massive online thing going on which is islanders are engaged and they want to meet and

[0:28:21] Trustee McConchie: they're excited about talking about this fair enough they're mad because of some misinformation

[0:28:26] Trustee McConchie: information uh but they're engaged and you know we've got a good chair here to help guide us uh

[0:28:32] Trustee McConchie: forward in the in the coming months so i just wanted to recognize that

[0:28:35] Trustee Morrison: thanks for that

[0:28:37] Trustee Morrison: um having

[0:28:38] Trustee Morrison: said that i also want folks to know that i actually don't necessarily have skin in the game in terms

[0:28:43] Trustee Morrison: of what comes out as the policy statement it is a process for us to try and figure out collectively

[0:28:48] Trustee Morrison: what lands and what works for both the mandate us implementing the mandate and like what works

[0:28:54] Trustee Morrison: for us as his community oh

[0:28:56] Trustee Patrick: yeah thanks

[0:28:57] Trustee Morrison: for that all

[0:28:59] Trustee Patrick: right thank you uh leslie uh kerfoot i have

[0:29:05] Trustee Patrick: to get her there we go leslie if you take yourself off mute hello yes we can hi can

[0:29:13] Trustee Patrick: you see me or

[0:29:14] Trustee Patrick: you just hear me

[0:29:15] Trustee Patrick: we can just hear you okay

[0:29:17] Voice 7: thank you and thank you for the opportunity to speak to

[0:29:21] Voice 7: all three of you and i as well thank you for your your courageous work lots of stuff on the table

[0:29:26] Voice 7: I am the new property owner of the old Arcadia by the Sea, 1329 McKinnon Road.

[0:29:34] Voice 7: It's now called the Tides Cottages.

[0:29:37] Voice 7: We, as a family, purchased that property on April 4th.

[0:29:42] Voice 7: We did not have a realtor.

[0:29:44] Voice 7: We dealt directly with the property owners, the Ennings family.

[0:29:48] Voice 7: And I did do my due diligence, mainly with Kim Stockdell, who was super helpful to me.

[0:29:54] Voice 7: and i discovered as we were making an agreement with the endings i discovered

[0:30:00] Voice 7: the review that is going on by Islands Trust

[0:30:02] Voice 7: on the C2 commercial tourist zoning.

[0:30:07] Voice 7: I probably don't have that wording correct, I apologize.

[0:30:10] Voice 7: And in my initial discussions and research

[0:30:13] Voice 7: and due diligence that I did do on the property,

[0:30:17] Voice 7: I learned the zoning density was 26 units

[0:30:21] Voice 7: and there were multiple uses.

[0:30:23] Voice 7: We negotiated a price based on that zoning.

[0:30:26] Voice 7: We had targeted the C2 zoning

[0:30:28] Voice 7: because we felt it was very solid.

[0:30:31] Voice 7: We looked at Airbnbs, B&Bs, and we were worried about them

[0:30:34] Voice 7: because we learned there was a housing shortage on the island.

[0:30:37] Voice 7: So we specifically targeted C2.

[0:30:40] Voice 7: We negotiated a price, a very high price,

[0:30:44] Voice 7: based on the future potential of that property.

[0:30:47] Voice 7: The current owners were doing approximately $30,000

[0:30:51] Voice 7: out of five units, tourist units, $30,000 a year,

[0:30:57] Voice 7: mostly in the summer. We were coming out of COVID, et cetera, et cetera. So the price was negotiated.

[0:31:04] Voice 7: In my discussions, mainly with Kim Stockdell, I knew there was a review. I knew that density

[0:31:11] Voice 7: may reduce, but it seemed it was very early stages and the reduction would be slim. I have looked at

[0:31:21] Voice 7: all the c2 zoning i know about brownings and and um the others that have it port brownings

[0:31:27] Voice 7: the woods um currents and it seemed that they were set up for that if it's only to make it

[0:31:34] Voice 7: financially viable so to make a long story short we took over the property on the fourth myself

[0:31:40] Voice 7: and my son uh we renovated it for two and a half months just about killed myself and um i finally

[0:31:47] Voice 7: it came up for air when we opened June 15th when COVID restrictions were lifted. I received the May

[0:31:55] Voice 7: 25th letter from Kim Stockdale and in it were three options. One was to go from 26 to four

[0:32:04] Voice 7: tourist units. We already had six. The other was to become a rural residential if there was just a

[0:32:13] Voice 7: home. And it was also a huge reduction in use. And to be honest, we were devastated. I actually

[0:32:19] Voice 7: cried. I haven't slept for weeks. We have invested millions. We've renovated it. It is the initial

[0:32:25] Voice 7: end of the Gulf Islands. It's an absolutely fantastic property. And we're going to fight

[0:32:31] Voice 7: hard to hold on to what we thought we purchased. It was a very quick process, a very harsh

[0:32:39] Voice 7: harsh recommendation in my view and I really just want to represent that we are a family

[0:32:45] Voice 7: and our goal is to have an eco resort family run and family focused it's on three acres that is

[0:32:53] Voice 7: a complete green space very private to the rest of the neighborhood all of the activity is on the

[0:32:59] Voice 7: front of the property on the water we are completely dialed in to solar to managing

[0:33:06] Voice 7: Managing water responsibly, managing power responsibly, handling our green space, maintaining privacy for the neighborhood, managing vehicles.

[0:33:15] Voice 7: We are responsible property and business owners with a lot of success, and we are a family.

[0:33:22] Voice 7: We have not had time to do a feasibility study.

[0:33:25] Voice 7: We need to look at water.

[0:33:26] Voice 7: We need to understand it.

[0:33:28] Voice 7: We need to look at the sector.

[0:33:30] Voice 7: We need to look at the building restrictions.

[0:33:32] Voice 7: We've only had the property, I don't know, what is it now, every three months.

[0:33:36] Voice 7: We will be doing that feasibility study, but we would like, we think we can develop 20 to 26 units responsibly there, and we would like to hang on to the uses.

[0:33:48] Voice 7: The uses will be for our guests only, not for the public, but to remain competitive, we need to offer some food, you know, some limited amenities.

[0:33:58] Voice 7: So I really just wanted the chance to speak and let you know a little bit about me.

[0:34:03] Voice 7: I also live on South Pender Island.

[0:34:06] Voice 7: We have a home, a family home here.

[0:34:08] Voice 7: And we were so excited about the purchase of this resort.

[0:34:12] Voice 7: And our dreams have just been smashed by that letter.

[0:34:16] Voice 7: And I hope we have time.

[0:34:19] Voice 7: I know Deb is going to come out and see me on Saturday.

[0:34:21] Voice 7: Thank you so much for that.

[0:34:23] Voice 7: And I have had a conversation with Ben.

[0:34:25] Voice 7: And you were very supportive as well.

[0:34:27] Voice 7: So I thank you for that.

[0:34:28] Voice 7: Just wanted the chance to say hi, let you know who we are.

[0:34:32] Voice 7: and I hope he'll treat us fairly and responsibly. Thank you.

[0:34:37] Trustee Patrick: Thank you Leslie for coming today.

[0:34:40] Voice 7: Thank you.

[0:34:43] Trustee Patrick: All right I see a Michael sketch. Michael disappeared. Oh there he is. No Michael

[0:34:56] Trustee Patrick: you're there. Sorry I just bounced off my screen. Can you hear me? Yes.

[0:34:59] Voice 13: Thank you.

[0:35:02] Voice 13: Trustees I have comments on staff advice for both a proposed soil deposit and removal by law

[0:35:10] Voice 13: and on the i1b zone component of the land use bylaw review the soil deposit and removal bylaw

[0:35:19] Voice 13: first staff recommend exemption from soil deposit and removal regulation for public works

[0:35:26] Voice 13: one such public work would be regional district water and sewer provision whereas there may be

[0:35:33] Voice 13: an argument to exempt public service soil removal subsequent discard of excavated roadwork spoils

[0:35:41] Voice 13: under CRD contract was at best cavalier in 2012-2013. Soil described as clay muck was

[0:35:52] Voice 13: deposited on both a steep ocean side ravine in part on a herbaceous DPA. Bylaw enforcement

[0:36:00] Voice 13: ceased the deposit operation but did not require remediation despite impact on the neighbor's

[0:36:07] Voice 13: property. Then the excavated roadwork spoils were deposited on land in the ALR, which had been

[0:36:14] Voice 13: prime agricultural soil. At the time, staff responded to complaint from the public

[0:36:19] Voice 13: that there was no bylaw to prevent waste soil deposit on the ALR. A soil deposit bylaw must

[0:36:27] Voice 13: give local trust area protection for valuable agricultural soils, particularly given failure

[0:36:34] Voice 13: of trust area policy to do so.

[0:36:39] Voice 13: Deferring to the ALC should not be an option.

[0:36:44] Voice 13: Unauthorized soil deposit from and soil deposit on the ALR

[0:36:50] Voice 13: is first and foremost a local trust area problem.

[0:36:55] Voice 13: My second topic is the industrial zone I-1B.

[0:37:00] Voice 13: Staff advise rezoning the I-1B zone,

[0:37:03] Voice 13: zone for a site-specific boat storage use only.

[0:37:10] Voice 13: As of the ALC decision of 17 March this year, the ALC gave conditional approval for exclusion

[0:37:20] Voice 13: of the ALR portion of the I-1B zone.

[0:37:25] Voice 13: However, until all conditions of approval are met, the subject land remains in the ALR.

[0:37:33] Voice 13: Rezoning for land use not consistent with an order of the ALC should not be considered.

[0:37:40] Voice 13: Further, under present ALC law, there is a one-year period when the ALC will consider requests for reconsideration of the conditional exclusion approval.

[0:37:52] Voice 13: approval. Given that the 29th of October 2020, trustee reasons for decision to forward the

[0:38:02] Voice 13: inclusion and exclusion applications to the ALC were not informed, respecting crucial evidence

[0:38:09] Voice 13: previously published by the local planning service, then from the public perspective,

[0:38:15] Voice 13: there are grounds for the LTC to ask the Land Commission to reconsider.

[0:38:22] Voice 13: I hope the LTC will do so.

[0:38:26] Voice 13: And my last point is Islands Trust mapping of ALR land adjacent the I-1B zone

[0:38:33] Voice 13: and the effect on the exclusion-inclusion applications.

[0:38:38] Voice 13: In late 2020, the Islands Trust MapIt tool

[0:38:42] Voice 13: tool, showed the eastern ALR boundary for the 4606 Razor Point Road parcel, which includes

[0:38:50] Voice 13: the I-1B zone, to be about 30 feet west of the ALR's own published mapping boundary.

[0:38:59] Voice 13: The error caused staff and applicant to underestimate the area for inclusion-exclusion by about

[0:39:07] Voice 13: 10%.

[0:39:07] Voice 13: That mapping error was corrected after the LTC referred the exclusion-inclusion applications to the ALC.

[0:39:17] Voice 13: However, there was and remains a second mapping error.

[0:39:22] Voice 13: The ALR rural zone boundary is displaced to the west, so apparently conferring Islands Trust rural zone use permissions for a strip of the ALR.

[0:39:34] Voice 13: That error should be corrected.

[0:39:36] Voice 13: I asked the senior mapping staff member and he said the change required a resolution

[0:39:42] Voice 13: from the LTC. Thank you for considering my comments.

[0:39:47] Trustee Patrick: Thank you, Michael. Is there anyone

[0:39:50] Trustee Patrick: else that wishes to address us today? Your comments are always important. Oops, I see

[0:39:59] Trustee Patrick: Jeremy Lewis. Hello? Can

[0:40:05] Voice 10: you hear me? Yes.

[0:40:07] Voice 10: Excellent. I wanted to make a comment. I'd

[0:40:10] Voice 10: I'd written my trustees regarding housing availability on Pender and I feel like a lot

[0:40:17] Voice 10: of our housing is eaten up by Airbnbs and rentals that will obtain more income by renting out

[0:40:26] Voice 10: short-term rather than to long-term and I'm wondering if maybe we could address this with

[0:40:33] Voice 10: some sort of a tax on Airbnbs.

[0:40:40] Trustee Patrick: No good a good question I mean currently they just have a small

[0:40:44] Trustee Patrick: all the, what's it called, MRDT tax.

[0:40:49] Trustee McConchie: Yeah, if I can add something,

[0:40:51] Trustee McConchie: we've been debating bylaw 222

[0:40:53] Trustee McConchie: for about two and a half years now.

[0:40:56] Trustee McConchie: And Jeremy, we have been discussing this every month

[0:41:00] Trustee McConchie: at our meetings,

[0:41:01] Trustee McConchie: and certainly it's an interesting point to bring up.

[0:41:04] Trustee McConchie: Thank you.

[0:41:08] Trustee Patrick: Any other comments, Jeremy?

[0:41:12] Voice 10: No, just, I mean, really, I'm fairly new to Pender

[0:41:15] Voice 10: and I want to stay here,

[0:41:17] Voice 10: but I'm also in a rental situation and as a providing a service that's in high demand

[0:41:24] Voice 10: and talking to other people it's it's going to be difficult for me to stay here long term I just

[0:41:29] Voice 10: want to throw that out there if we need if we if people on Pender want to maintain services and I

[0:41:36] Voice 10: am considered a fairly well compensated I'm not like the people who are earning minimum wage at

[0:41:42] Voice 10: many of the jobs uh we need to really address this because i'm i mean i'm sure you all see how

[0:41:48] Voice 10: many people are looking for housing that have been here far longer than me and probably far

[0:41:52] Voice 10: better tenants than me even uh it makes me very nervous and uh yeah we just really need to address

[0:41:58] Voice 10: this well

[0:41:59] Trustee Patrick: thank you for speaking about this jeremy thanks

[0:42:02] Voice 10: for hearing me is

[0:42:06] Trustee Patrick: there anyone else that

[0:42:07] Trustee Patrick: wishes to address us today let's say your comments are always important your trustees want to hear

[0:42:13] Trustee Patrick: from you and as Trustee Morrison pointed out if you have comments regarding the policy statement

[0:42:20] Trustee Patrick: it's the islands 2050 at islandstrust.bc.ca and or you can like I said contact your trustees

[0:42:30] Trustee Patrick: or send information to southinfo at islandstrust.bc.ca and like I said we always

[0:42:38] Trustee Patrick: always, always want to hear from you.

[0:42:41] Trustee Patrick: Okay, I believe Jeremy, I think your hand's still up,

[0:42:45] Trustee Patrick: but I think your hand just came up again.

[0:42:47] Trustee Patrick: Oh, thank you Trustee Morrison,

[0:42:48] Trustee Patrick: put the Iowans 2050 email address in the chat

[0:42:53] Trustee Patrick: that I hope attendees can see.

[0:42:56] Trustee Patrick: Okay, with that, I'm going to move on with our agenda.

[0:43:00] Trustee Patrick: So thank you everyone for your comments today.

[0:43:03] Trustee Patrick: We have next, we have the minutes from our May 27th,

[0:43:08] Trustee Patrick: 21 and I do note that yes we received a comment staff have already made that correction from

[0:43:16] Trustee Patrick: Barbara Johnson regarding her as being not not being the applicant so that correction has been

[0:43:24] Trustee Patrick: caught are there any other additions and corrections that need to be made can we approve the amended

[0:43:30] Trustee Patrick: minutes through general consent great thank you we do have a number of minutes here from May 10th

[0:43:36] Trustee Patrick: May 14 and May 20 and June 8 from the agricultural advisory planning Commission again, as I echo I think we all are so appreciative of the work that that you're you're doing to.

[0:43:49] Trustee Patrick: inform this the agricultural part of the land use by law review and really appreciate the effort and time you're putting into that.

[0:43:57] Trustee Patrick: that um

[0:43:58] Trustee Morrison: patrick yes ask a quick question about those um so i saw there was a number of motions

[0:44:04] Trustee Morrison: in among those were those pulled out specifically those motions into the lub reporting because i'm

[0:44:12] Trustee Morrison: not sure i saw them all um like get translated into the lub thing so i just wondered um plan

[0:44:19] Trustee Morrison: if you can just make sure how are we processing all the motions that the um a pc put forward

[0:44:25] Trustee Morrison: yeah

[0:44:26] Planner Stockdill (probable): so when when i provide a staff report based on the recommendations from the aapc then i will

[0:44:33] Planner Stockdill (probable): list all those resolutions from all their for their minutes so i'll make a point of including

[0:44:38] Planner Stockdill (probable): that in a staff report so they're all together in one document thank you

[0:44:42] Trustee Patrick: thank you okay so moving

[0:44:45] Trustee Patrick: on we have the follow-up action list for june on page 29 of the agenda package are there any

[0:44:53] Trustee Patrick: questions of staff or any that staff wish to discuss i'm not seeing any i'll give you a moment

[0:45:03] Trustee Patrick: sure no all right we'll just keep moving on then so we're going to be in the applications

[0:45:11] Trustee Patrick: and referrals now at 12.1 we have a rezoning 2016.1 main road for consideration for adoption

[0:45:19] Trustee Patrick: it's on page 33 of our agenda package and i see planner test them all here oh

[0:45:24] Planner: thank you

[0:45:25] Planner: Chair Patrick. So yeah rezoning 2016.1 which is main road and this is with regards to bylaw 202

[0:45:33] Planner: and the purpose of the report is for consideration of final adoption of the bylaw. So the objective

[0:45:41] Planner: of that bylaw is to rezone portions of lot 8 and 9 on Port Washington Road 3323 Port Washington

[0:45:51] Planner: Road from rural to industrial 2A and to correspondingly to amend the official community

[0:46:01] Planner: plan designation, sorry, to correspond to it. Further, the bylaw would limit the use in the

[0:46:11] Planner: I2A zone to the current and historical uses of the two lots. This proposal will legalize the

[0:46:19] Planner: uses on the lots and is compatible with other uses in the area and is supported by the policies of

[0:46:25] Planner: the OCP. So this application has been reviewed by the local trust committee on five occasions

[0:46:32] Planner: and a public hearing was held for bylaw 202 on October 26, 2017. It was last reported to

[0:46:40] Planner: this local trust committee on January 28th. At that point the trustee or the trust committee

[0:46:47] Planner: passed four resolutions the first designating the chair of the LTC to sign the covenant

[0:46:55] Planner: for a restriction on tree removal on the upland area of the zoned

[0:47:00] Planner: the newly zoned areas of the two properties

[0:47:06] Planner: that the bylaw 202 would be read a third time or was read a third time and that it be forwarded to

[0:47:14] Planner: to the executive committee for their approval and they also finally directed staff to report

[0:47:22] Planner: back for final adoption upon written confirmation of both executive committee approval and confirmation

[0:47:32] Planner: of completion of fire suppression upgrades that were a concern of from

[0:47:41] Planner: sorry from previously with the through the public hearing and consultation

[0:47:47] Planner: process so on February 24th of 2021 the Executive Committee approved by law 202

[0:47:57] Planner: and on May 11th 2021 we received confirmation that the section 219 covenant has been registered with

[0:48:06] Planner: the land titles office and as I said previously that protects the upslope area in the industrial

[0:48:12] Planner: zone portions by restricting tree removal on those portions of the property. One other request

[0:48:20] Planner: that was made in that meeting was that there be confirmation that the landscaping screening that

[0:48:26] Planner: was required as part of the temporary use permit had been completed and the applicant has also

[0:48:31] Planner: provided that and that was attached to this report indicating that they had planted approximately 25

[0:48:39] Planner: cypress trees in the two unplanted gaps along port washington road and the eastern boundary of

[0:48:46] Planner: lot 8 which is the easternmost of the two properties and finally an email also attached

[0:48:54] Planner: from Mike Dine who's the chief of the Pender Island fire rescue confirming

[0:48:59] Planner: that the water supply for fire suppression had been installed to their

[0:49:04] Planner: satisfaction so our recommendation is that the LTC sorry LTC bylaw number 202

[0:49:16] Planner: be adopted and the rationale for that recommendation is that it has received

[0:49:22] Planner: The required 219 covenant has been registered with the land title office and all the other conditions, sorry, LTC conditions have been satisfied and I'll note that I believe Rick Gill is here representing Main Road, he emailed me just before the meeting saying that he was attending, if you had any questions and that's my report.

[0:49:46] Trustee Patrick: All right, thank you. So trustees, so what would you like to do, or do you have any questions for Rick, or?

[0:49:52] Trustee Patrick: i

[0:49:53] Trustee Morrison: have one question um actually for the planner first and then there may be other things for the

[0:49:57] Trustee Morrison: um for rick um can you tell us what is the and just tell the community generally what are the

[0:50:05] Trustee Morrison: repercussions for cutting in a covenant area like it's nice that there's a covenant what does that

[0:50:11] Trustee Morrison: mean in terms of if somebody cuts trees now that those are like specifically for tree protection

[0:50:17] Planner: So basically, it's like any other covenant. You're contractually obliged to the other party, the local trust committee.

[0:50:29] Planner: So the penalty that's in there, sorry, I don't know off the top of my head what the penalty would be.

[0:50:36] Planner: Robert may be able to, I can look it up quickly if you had other questions.

[0:50:43] Trustee Morrison: We'll come back to that one if it's not easily available.

[0:50:46] Planner: I I'll just quickly look here so yeah I

[0:50:59] Trustee McConchie: don't have any questions I just wanted to move move forward

[0:51:04] Voice 8: just to

[0:51:05] Trustee McConchie: just let me know while we're waiting sorry about this

[0:51:09] Voice 4: and

[0:51:18] Trustee Morrison: I and this question is

[0:51:20] Trustee Morrison: really just based on like the question that we get asked all the time of you know okay so what

[0:51:25] Trustee Morrison: you know like what what happens if people do go ahead and do it anyway well

[0:51:31] Planner: I mean to be honest

[0:51:34] Planner: I mean, so again, Robert may want to weigh into this, but they'd be in breach of contract, which is something that could be enforced through the courts.

[0:51:42] Planner: So what the remedy would be, it doesn't appear, sorry, I'm just quickly scanning it.

[0:51:49] Planner: There's a actual dollar figure.

[0:51:51] Planner: I mean, some I have seen or we have drafted covenants with where there's a financial penalty written in.

[0:52:00] Planner: in. But I'm not seeing that in this one. So some,

[0:52:07] Voice 16: some conservation covenants have what's

[0:52:08] Voice 16: called a rent charge. And that's kind of a way of putting in a monetary penalty. But those are

[0:52:15] Voice 16: specific to conservation covenants. This covenant is like Phil says, it's a contractual obligation,

[0:52:21] Voice 16: if it's breached, if there's a breach of the covenant, it's actually easier to enforce that

[0:52:25] Voice 16: than something like a

[0:52:26] Voice 16: development permit area that's

[0:52:28] Trustee Patrick: great all right shall we move it right

[0:52:31] Trustee Patrick: who'd like to proceed motions on page 33.

[0:52:37] Trustee McConchie: yeah i'd be happy to move the motion uh for discussion

[0:52:41] Trustee McConchie: uh i'd like to move that the north pender island local trust committee bylaw number 202

[0:52:45] Trustee McConchie: set it as north pender island land use bylaw 103 1996 amendment number one 2016 be adopted

[0:52:51] Trustee Patrick: is there a second second by trustee morrison is there a discussion yeah

[0:52:56] Trustee McConchie: just a brief discussion

[0:52:57] Trustee McConchie: I think it's important to recognize what's going on like in history here.

[0:53:01] Trustee McConchie: So this, from what I understand, and please correct me if I'm wrong, planner Testamal or head planner Kojima, this was Crownland at one point.

[0:53:12] Trustee McConchie: And highways maintenance used to be operated with like the province being in charge of it.

[0:53:17] Trustee McConchie: Then Gordon Campbell and the Liberals come into power in 20, you know, after the NDP government and privatize everything or lots of stuff rather in the province.

[0:53:27] Trustee McConchie: And one of those things is highway maintenance. So now we're kind of dealing with the fallout from the privatization era of the 2000s because this zoning was sort of ambiguous.

[0:53:37] Trustee McConchie: ambiguous and now we have uh basically an essential service that's been privatized on the

[0:53:43] Trustee McConchie: islands and we need to approve zoning for them to continue to operate because the only alternative

[0:53:47] Trustee McConchie: is to not have a place for our essential service to operate on the island right so if i'm

[0:53:52] Trustee McConchie: understanding that correctly that's how i see this kind of application so so the

[0:53:58] Planner: as you pointed out

[0:54:00] Planner: the the property used to be owned by the ministry of well it used to be called the ministry of

[0:54:05] Planner: highways and they used to you know undertake all the road maintenance services on the islands

[0:54:11] Planner: throughout the province and yes you're right it was privatized and it and through that process

[0:54:16] Planner: the property was sold to main road um and they have since and they're i'm not sure what the cycle

[0:54:24] Planner: is rick may be able to talk to this like the lease cycle but um on the previous go around uh i think

[0:54:30] Planner: a year two years ago they lost the contract or they weren't successful i should say so um but

[0:54:37] Planner: they have i mean they came to an agreement with mcon who's the current one uh to to carry on using

[0:54:43] Planner: this pro this property so yeah you're you're correct i'm not sure what has been put upon

[0:54:50] Planner: like i'm not sure how to answer the question what's been put upon the community though like

[0:54:55] Planner: uh it it remains a service that that that is being is through is is essentially a contract

[0:55:02] Planner: with the government so and that i would presume it you know wouldn't be deficient from any from

[0:55:10] Planner: the the government itself running it so i'm not sure what that what the issue you're pointing at

[0:55:15] Planner: is i'm

[0:55:16] Trustee McConchie: pointing at the fact that like say we want to fix something on the roads we don't contact the

[0:55:21] Trustee McConchie: people here that work here we have to go to a separate ministry and that separate ministry

[0:55:27] Trustee McConchie: privatized the maintenance division creating other levels of governance and now we need a

[0:55:31] Trustee McConchie: place for them to operate so it's like what else can i do is the question i'm asking really

[0:55:35] Trustee McConchie: no

[0:55:36] Planner: but where what you would still need to play if it was the government they would still need

[0:55:40] Planner: a place to operate yeah exactly

[0:55:43] Planner: yeah yeah

[0:55:44] Trustee McConchie: that's what i'm saying yeah and it doesn't sound like

[0:55:47] Planner: Like they're, I mean, again, I'm not, I'm not in a position to defend what either the

[0:55:52] Planner: government or, or main road or MCON, but it doesn't,

[0:55:55] Voice 8: I'm

[0:55:56] Trustee McConchie: not asking you to do that.

[0:55:57] Trustee McConchie: No, no, no.

[0:55:58] Planner: But I'm

[0:55:58] Trustee McConchie: just trying to identify the issue.

[0:56:01] Trustee McConchie: Yeah, no, I'm pointing out the history in which we're at this position now, right?

[0:56:05] Trustee McConchie: It's all I'm trying to say.

[0:56:06] Trustee McConchie: And if I'm, I was asking you to correct if my historical record was wrong, you know what

[0:56:11] Trustee McConchie: I'm saying?

[0:56:12] Trustee McConchie: Planner testable.

[0:56:12] Trustee McConchie: and that's why i'm i'm like okay well we need a highways yard it sounds to me like these private

[0:56:19] Trustee McConchie: companies sort of randomly shift right now depending on who wins the contract so but

[0:56:24] Trustee McConchie: regardless we got a place on the island for this service to operate which provides a service to

[0:56:28] Trustee McConchie: so therefore i should vote in favor of the motion sorry

[0:56:33] Planner: i misunderstood yeah well

[0:56:34] Trustee McConchie: i maybe i misspoke

[0:56:35] Trustee McConchie: poke i'm not english is a as a weak language of mine so that's

[0:56:41] Trustee Morrison: why i have to say

[0:56:42] Trustee Morrison: and maybe if i could add to that the the the challenge that the privatization i think

[0:56:50] Trustee Morrison: proposes for us is essentially that um what happens if there is a shift and who is who is

[0:56:57] Trustee Morrison: owning this like does the whole yard get sold with the zoning we could potentially like make

[0:57:02] Trustee Morrison: his statement here in this moment of doing this that this is the yard like that's it this is the

[0:57:07] Trustee Morrison: yard so like going forward in the future as this shifts potentially in in any kind of ownership

[0:57:14] Trustee Morrison: that this is where it's going to be um yeah

[0:57:17] Trustee McConchie: like that's my understanding is is from what i asked

[0:57:20] Trustee McConchie: that the last time we discussed this this is basically it there's no other place that can

[0:57:23] Trustee McConchie: operate this type of zoning so you're and it's a quite an arduous process to go through this

[0:57:28] Trustee McConchie: to like it's it's we're essentially kind of turning it again into a crown land in a weird

[0:57:34] Trustee McConchie: way like it's we're limiting that this one place can operate kind of thing and there's not going

[0:57:39] Trustee McConchie: to be competitors necessarily yeah it's interesting anyways all

[0:57:44] Trustee Patrick: right well thank you for that

[0:57:45] Trustee Patrick: discussion uh if there's no further discussion i'll call the vote all those in favor and that's

[0:57:52] Trustee Patrick: carried so thank you very much and we'll go on to the next item then so the next application is a

[0:58:01] Trustee Patrick: development permit 2021.3 very on sydney island in a staff report and i see a filled testimony

[0:58:10] Trustee Patrick: we'll continue on page 54 thanks

[0:58:16] Planner: chair patrick so um this is for 337 evergreen lane on sydney

[0:58:23] Planner: island which is lot 91 and the purpose of is to consider a dp application as you've said

[0:58:30] Planner: so that development permit is for land alteration within the sydney island geotechnical

[0:58:35] Planner: development permit area that is designated on the property so the application has been made

[0:58:41] Planner: in advance of a building permit application and what is being requested is that the dwelling

[0:58:46] Planner: the proposed dwelling be located further southwest to a building site with better views,

[0:58:54] Planner: improved exposure for their solar system than would otherwise be permitted with the current DPA setback.

[0:59:05] Planner: Additionally, complying with the current setback would require more tree removal further back on the property

[0:59:12] Planner: or northeast portion of the property.

[0:59:15] Planner: So referring to Figure 2, which is on page 57 of the agenda, the development is to include, as I stated, a portion of the dwelling. It's also going to include a cistern for fire suppression and a greenhouse that will be located.

[0:59:30] Planner: So all of these are to be located in what is now area, a portion of area B and by, sorry, area B.

[0:59:39] Planner: and that the boundary or the boundary doesn't effectively change but it allows that development

[0:59:46] Planner: to occur within 50 meters of the southwest property line so it will include minimal

[0:59:53] Planner: tree removal under the supervision of an arborist and I did request an arborist report

[1:00:00] Planner: did receive an email which I forwarded to the local trust committee yesterday I believe

[1:00:07] Planner: which gives details some details on the tree removal require as required a geotechnical

[1:00:15] Planner: hazard assessment was submitted to the trust by risic geotechnical and that's attachment three

[1:00:22] Planner: and it also includes a guidelines checklist

[1:00:25] Planner: and a detailed site plan.

[1:00:30] Planner: Sorry, let's move on here.

[1:00:33] Planner: So just briefly, so the geotechnical DPA is designated

[1:00:37] Planner: for the protection of development from hazardous conditions.

[1:00:41] Planner: And that coincides with a covenant

[1:00:45] Planner: that is on the entire island,

[1:00:48] Planner: which was registered at the time of subdivision.

[1:00:51] Planner: That DPA has two components.

[1:00:53] Planner: The first is the shoreline banks or area A,

[1:00:57] Planner: which are the steep sand cliffs that we all know

[1:01:00] Planner: and a relatively upland area B,

[1:01:04] Planner: above and beyond the crest of those banks.

[1:01:08] Planner: The boundary between the two areas is two meters

[1:01:12] Planner: or was located two meters from the crest of the bank.

[1:01:16] Planner: And the geotechnical report essentially ground truths

[1:01:19] Planner: and does excuse me a subject property analysis of the geotechnical conditions on the property

[1:01:29] Planner: including the tree removal and that report concluded that the offset proposed above for

[1:01:36] Planner: the for the single family residence is considered to be sufficient to mitigate the geotechnical

[1:01:41] Planner: hazard from the erosion-based slope and seismically induced slope regression so as I said there's a

[1:01:48] Planner: checklist that is uh basically signs off on each of the guidelines and it's a sealed engineer's

[1:01:57] Planner: checklist so it the report itself provided recommendations for the tree removal and

[1:02:04] Planner: specifically for that requirement for a certified arborist for stump retention of when the when

[1:02:10] Planner: there's tree removal where feasible as well as for minimizing disruption of existing vegetation

[1:02:16] Planner: and for storm management conditions so all of those recommendations have been put into the dp

[1:02:24] Planner: as conditions so staff's recommendation is that the north pender island ltc approve issuance of dp

[1:02:32] Planner: 2021.3 ferry and the rationale for the recommendation is that the application is

[1:02:40] Planner: based on a professional geotechnical assessment an addendum sorry which meets all of the relevant

[1:02:45] Planner: the relevant objectives and guidelines of the DPA and all the recommendations of that assessment have been incorporated into the proposed DP.

[1:02:54] Trustee Patrick: All right, thank you. I see the applicant is here. I believe that's Kevin Ferry. If we can have him promoted to panelist.

[1:03:03] Trustee Patrick: Kevin

[1:03:03] Voice 8: has been promoted.

[1:03:05] Trustee Patrick: Kevin, if you can turn your audio and you can turn your video on if you wish.

[1:03:15] Voice 9: Good evening.

[1:03:17] Voice 9: Hello.

[1:03:18] Voice 8: Hi,

[1:03:20] Trustee Patrick: do you have anything you'd like to add?

[1:03:22] Trustee Patrick: um

[1:03:23] Voice 9: well my wife and i are this is going to be our permanent home it's not something that we

[1:03:33] Voice 9: took lightly in the process we we spent a lot of time thinking about the process and how we would

[1:03:39] Voice 9: accomplish this um and i'm just turning on a camera again there

[1:03:46] Voice 9: we are

[1:03:49] Voice 9: And I think the thing that we most loved about the lot and this particular piece of real estate was

[1:03:56] Voice 9: the trees that are on it and the look of it and the feel of it. We were actually quite

[1:04:04] Voice 9: concerned with the number of standing dead that were on the property,

[1:04:09] Voice 9: which was our biggest concern with the arborist is getting that down. So there wasn't any risk

[1:04:15] Voice 9: moving forward but um the uh position of the house and where it sits on the property i think

[1:04:25] Voice 9: it lends itself very nicely to the property in its new location all

[1:04:30] Trustee Patrick: right thank you we're gonna

[1:04:31] Trustee Patrick: have some discussion we may have some questions for you trustees perfect go

[1:04:40] Trustee McConchie: ahead trustee morrison

[1:04:41] Voice 8: oh she's letting

[1:04:42] Trustee McConchie: you go first go ahead wonderful okay um yeah so thanks for coming to the meeting

[1:04:46] Trustee McConchie: guys i appreciate your taking the time to go through the process to um to ensure what it

[1:04:52] Trustee McConchie: seems like this like the purpose of this dpa or sorry dp um this this area that's a geotechnical

[1:04:59] Trustee McConchie: thing so the scientists said hey anytime you're going to build something make sure there's an

[1:05:04] Trustee McConchie: engineer that comes in and makes sure that they build a house that's not going to fall into the

[1:05:09] Trustee McConchie: ocean because it's such a sensitive area and so the

[1:05:11] Trustee McConchie: geo yeah so the geotechs come back and said

[1:05:14] Trustee McConchie: yeah it's a great thing so it's sort of a check and balance right kind of thing uh now that's

[1:05:19] Trustee McConchie: that's great i noticed that most of those lots along the way are actually in that same area and

[1:05:24] Trustee McConchie: they're undeveloped as well uh your neighbors yeah yeah so they're they're also gonna potentially

[1:05:29] Trustee McConchie: have to go through this process of proving that their house won't fall into the ocean okay kind

[1:05:33] Trustee McConchie: of thing that's probably reassuring to know that you're building something that's not going to fall

[1:05:36] Trustee McConchie: into the ocean so um i'm not sure what i can like argue against this as a trustee like this makes

[1:05:42] Trustee McConchie: perfect sense to me uh and uh as long as it sounds to me like you guys are very interested

[1:05:48] Trustee McConchie: in preserving the the trees uh i've been to sydney along with trustee uh our trust fellow trustees we

[1:05:54] Trustee McConchie: visited about pre-covid uh we met with um some of your folks from the strata council and some folks

[1:06:00] Trustee McConchie: were surprised to hear that we had governed the islands there uh and it's a great community and

[1:06:05] Trustee McConchie: it's a it's a got a great forestry plan so to hear that you guys are interested in preserving

[1:06:09] Trustee McConchie: uh you know whatever and making for a healthy forest along that area and care enough about

[1:06:13] Trustee McConchie: this and to go through the process i appreciate that so those are my comments thank you thank

[1:06:17] Trustee Morrison: Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[1:06:19] Trustee Morrison: Trustee Morrison?

[1:06:21] Trustee Morrison: I have a couple of technical questions.

[1:06:23] Trustee Morrison: So the, and this is more for the planner, I think.

[1:06:27] Trustee Morrison: So

[1:06:27] Voice 8: the

[1:06:29] Trustee Morrison: septic fields, do they have to be within the,

[1:06:33] Trustee Morrison: like, or outside the offset areas?

[1:06:36] Planner: The sept, if you look at the, did you see on page,

[1:06:41] Planner: okay, so the

[1:06:41] Planner: septic field is actually located outside of.

[1:06:44] Trustee Morrison: No, I know that.

[1:06:45] Trustee Morrison: My question

[1:06:45] Trustee Morrison: is, does it have to be?

[1:06:48] Planner: I mean, it would have been up to the geotechnical.

[1:06:50] Planner: It wasn't part of the assessment.

[1:06:52] Planner: So I just want to clarify something that Trustee, oh my gosh, sorry, I was going to say Ben, but McConnachie said, which is that the reason that this is in front of you is because they want to build their house closer and within the geotechnical area.

[1:07:11] Planner: if they had put, if we're again referencing the site plan,

[1:07:16] Planner: if they were behind the line,

[1:07:18] Planner: there's no need for a geotechnical assessment,

[1:07:21] Planner: unless otherwise is required by the building permit

[1:07:24] Planner: or building inspector.

[1:07:25] Planner: But just to answer your question, Trustee Morrison,

[1:07:29] Planner: is that if the septic field,

[1:07:31] Planner: if they wanted to put it in this area,

[1:07:33] Planner: they could have made that part of their application.

[1:07:35] Planner: And again, it's a completely a professional reliance.

[1:07:38] Planner: So it's up to the geotechnical engineer

[1:07:40] Planner: to determine whether or not that would be suitable and whether or not that would be impactful so

[1:07:44] Planner: you'll

[1:07:44] Trustee Morrison: pause for a second that wasn't my question my question is it was about um the setbacks from

[1:07:49] Trustee Morrison: the back property line so i see where it is on the map but i also see that it's not within the

[1:07:55] Trustee Morrison: setbacks right and i'm wondering if it has to be outside that oh

[1:08:01] Planner: i'm sorry yeah um so a septic field

[1:08:04] Planner: and I'm going to, I don't believe a septic field is a structure in this bylaw. So I don't believe

[1:08:11] Planner: it has to meet the setbacks. Septic fields though, do have to meet, I mean, primarily they have to

[1:08:16] Planner: meet minimum setbacks from well heads and it's, it's Island Health's jurisdiction. So. Okay. No,

[1:08:23] Trustee Morrison: that was good because one of the claims for this adjustment is also around like tree cutting on

[1:08:28] Trustee Morrison: the back of the property. So I wanted to understand how far back given the septic field, everything

[1:08:32] Trustee Morrison: could move so that's why i'm

[1:08:34] Planner: asking oh i understand yeah okay

[1:08:35] Trustee Morrison: um and then then the other question i

[1:08:38] Trustee Morrison: have is related to um what was it here you you said that stump retention were feasible can can

[1:08:48] Trustee Morrison: i have that unpacked a little bit

[1:08:49] Planner: i was only so so obviously some trees are going to be removed

[1:08:53] Planner: where the house is going to be

[1:08:54] Trustee Morrison: built so

[1:08:55] Planner: that's sorry that would probably not a very good way

[1:08:57] Planner: way of saying it but that was that's the understanding so okay

[1:09:00] Trustee Morrison: so that's great because

[1:09:02] Trustee Morrison: i know that sometimes like you know cutting a stump especially you know cutting it right down

[1:09:07] Trustee Morrison: to the ground which is fine in this case um sometimes it's like not an aesthetic that people

[1:09:11] Trustee Morrison: like in their front yard but it is actually a really good geotechnical solution in this particular

[1:09:16] Trustee Morrison: situation so if they're retainable with the root structures intact and cutable you know cut down

[1:09:22] Trustee Morrison: to the ground i would definitely want to see that happening because it's so good just long term

[1:09:28] Planner: that just to just to echo that that is a condition and that's conditions that are

[1:09:33] Planner: put on by the geotechnical engineers that retaining of of root systems and and stumps so

[1:09:42] Planner: where possible so

[1:09:44] Trustee McConchie: can i ask a question like what this is a what's the point of the geotech

[1:09:50] Trustee McConchie: assessment like why would someone want to build something where they're gonna their house is gonna

[1:09:53] Trustee McConchie: fall into the ocean like what is the what is the real objective of this government thing like just

[1:09:58] Trustee McConchie: to check in because shouldn't there be just a

[1:10:00] Trustee McConchie: government government

[1:10:01] Trustee McConchie: is beg your pardon i think

[1:10:03] Trustee Morrison: it's to flag it as an issue so that it's the home buyers know that it's an issue and like that it's

[1:10:08] Trustee Morrison: actually because like somebody who builds and flips could do something like that and like not

[1:10:13] Trustee Morrison: care put it out in a good view never have a geotechnical survey and then the new home buyer

[1:10:17] Trustee Morrison: is at risk. So, but with this, we're basically protecting buyers and protecting builders like

[1:10:23] Trustee Morrison: long-term.

[1:10:24] Trustee McConchie: Interesting. Would you interpret that as well, Planner? So,

[1:10:28] Planner: the development permit area

[1:10:31] Planner: is in place for the protection of development from hazardous conditions. And so, essentially,

[1:10:38] Planner: it relies on a higher scale or geotechnical analysis, or higher level, I should say,

[1:10:47] Planner: And if somebody wants to move into that area, which is the case here, then it needs to be, it needs further analysis and ground truthing to ensure that safety is maintained.

[1:11:00] Planner: And it's completely, so that's the exercise here.

[1:11:04] Planner: And they have obligations through the covenant on the property as well.

[1:11:09] Planner: And so the development permit area actually kind of mirrors the covenant.

[1:11:15] Planner: So it's like an extra layer of protection, I guess you'd say.

[1:11:17] Planner: so but that's the exercise that's being undertaken here is that they're wanting to move into an area

[1:11:23] Planner: that at a higher level was identified as being a dangerous place to go and what they've got is a

[1:11:29] Planner: geotechnical report that says okay it's dangerous but it's not as dangerous as they said before

[1:11:33] Planner: and you can go this far does that yeah

[1:11:36] Voice 16: that's that's correct and sort of a bit of bit of the

[1:11:39] Voice 16: history is so about over 20 years ago when the subdivision was done um a geotechnical report

[1:11:46] Voice 16: was done on the whole island like uh that kind of scale and identified these areas these two areas a

[1:11:52] Voice 16: and b as areas that should be um investigated at the time of development um they're kind of it's

[1:11:58] Voice 16: kind of flagging them for future investigation um like no building in there unless you have a site

[1:12:04] Voice 16: scale analysis done and what we found about 10 years ago is the covenant wasn't being enforced

[1:12:10] Voice 16: by the ministry of transportation um and so um yeah as part of one of the amendments about 10

[1:12:17] Voice 16: years ago to the ocp and land use bylaw for sydney island the associated islands but specifically for

[1:12:23] Voice 16: sydney island was to establish the development permit area so basically the ltc takes on that

[1:12:28] Voice 16: that role of ensuring that the the building is safe it's

[1:12:33] Trustee McConchie: i'm just i'm wondering like what

[1:12:34] Trustee McConchie: doesn't the building department do this like i mean why are we in charge of this is my question

[1:12:39] Trustee McConchie: yeah

[1:12:40] Voice 16: building inspectors do have the authority to ask for geotechnical reports as well okay um so

[1:12:46] Trustee McConchie: yeah okay cool thank you so i'd like to move if it's okay chair patrick yes proceed uh that the

[1:12:52] Trustee McConchie: north pander island local trust committee approve issuance of development permit mpdp 2021.3 ferry

[1:12:57] Trustee McConchie: is

[1:12:58] Trustee Patrick: there a second second by trustee morrison any discussion one more thing

[1:13:02] Trustee Patrick: yeah go ahead

[1:13:03] Trustee Patrick: oh

[1:13:04] Trustee McConchie: i was just going to say quickly uh i appreciate the the kind of master class and what this policy

[1:13:09] Trustee McConchie: policy is and what to do because it's interesting

[1:13:10] Trustee Morrison: um yeah a couple quick last comments one um i

[1:13:17] Trustee Morrison: really appreciate that the homeowner is doing their due diligence and getting all this paperwork done

[1:13:20] Trustee Morrison: before building um so that's really awesome and that this is a check on like that idea of future

[1:13:27] Trustee Morrison: building just to make sure that things are safe in that area not only for this site but for like

[1:13:32] Trustee Morrison: the surrounding property owners because as soon as you get erosion on a site it sort of exacerbates

[1:13:37] Trustee Morrison: surrounding properties too

[1:13:37] Voice 9: so

[1:13:38] Trustee Morrison: yeah so thanks for that um one note too on files like this because

[1:13:43] Trustee Morrison: we did get an email from related to the arborist afterwards i just want to make a note and i can't

[1:13:48] Trustee Morrison: remember phil if you do this automatically but i really want to make sure that emails like that

[1:13:53] Trustee Morrison: get appended to the public package because i want to make sure that the whole of the record is

[1:13:57] Trustee Morrison: complete so if we go back to it and i don't know how we do that exactly but i just want to make

[1:14:02] Trustee Morrison: sure that email that came in does go with this report somehow okay

[1:14:07] Planner: um yeah that was sorry an

[1:14:09] Planner: oversight and an afterthought on my behalf but yeah

[1:14:12] Trustee Morrison: no worries i just want to make sure later

[1:14:14] Trustee Morrison: on if we come back to it

[1:14:15] Trustee Morrison: we can find

[1:14:15] Planner: the package i'm not sure how we do it but i'll make a note

[1:14:19] Trustee Patrick: thank you your challenge for the day i'll

[1:14:21] Planner: figure it out so thank

[1:14:22] Trustee Patrick: you is there any further discussion

[1:14:26] Trustee Patrick: if not i'll call the vote then all those in favor and that's carried so thank you

[1:14:31] Trustee Patrick: for coming and welcome to sydney and uh very

[1:14:34] Voice 9: much and thank you for your service

[1:14:36] Voice 9: thank

[1:14:37] Trustee Patrick: you okay so we're gonna move on to one more for a small bio break that's a good idea thank you

[1:14:44] Trustee Patrick: and so we'll take a five minute break then all right so maple we're gonna take a five minute

[1:14:50] Trustee Patrick: break okay you're back still

[1:19:32] Voice 7: waiting to stop hello

[1:19:46] Trustee Patrick: kim all right if we're all back and ready to go

[1:19:53] Trustee Patrick: So that's super. Okay, so our next application is a temporary use permit 2021.5 for PGROM. And we have a staff report beginning on page 81. And, oh, it's like that's going to be Planner Testamal again.

[1:20:12] Planner: There may be a message to all of that. Thanks, Chair Patrick.

[1:20:14] Planner: Patrick. So, TUP 2021.5 is for 4729 Buccaneers Road, and the purpose of the report is to consider

[1:20:27] Planner: a renewal temporary use permit for short-term vacation and rental within a dwelling unit.

[1:20:36] Planner: The original permit was issued in 2018 for three years, and the renewal will allow for the STPR

[1:20:43] Planner: are used to continue in compliance with the land use bylaw so the dwelling is smaller in size 612

[1:20:50] Planner: square feet or 56 square meters three bedroom home on the north side of magic lake and the maximum

[1:20:56] Planner: guest capacity is six guests and the driveway is able to facilitate four cars for parking

[1:21:03] Planner: since the original application was issued staff have received complaints

[1:21:07] Planner: complaints from one neighbor, and a bylaw complaint for the S2VR use was received in

[1:21:13] Planner: February 2021. So an investigation of that complaint concluded that the applicant had

[1:21:19] Planner: not fully complied with the issued permit, particularly that all of the neighbors within

[1:21:24] Planner: 200 meters had not been provided with a copy of the permit and an up-to-date on-island contact

[1:21:29] Planner: numbers. And also it's noted that the information on sensitive ecosystems had not been provided to

[1:21:36] Planner: guests particularly that the development permit area 10 which is the riparian and aquatic

[1:21:44] Planner: development permit area so the applicant has since cooperated cooperated I beg your pardon

[1:21:51] Planner: and has now met those conditions in addition the applicant has provided as part of this renewal

[1:21:58] Planner: application an attachment which is on page 87 of the agenda and that indicates that he has taken

[1:22:04] Planner: can further measures to minimize the impacts of the use on neighboring properties. Just briefly,

[1:22:11] Planner: that includes installing two new privacy fences in 2020, raising an existing privacy fence on the

[1:22:19] Planner: deck, and installing and monitoring outside motion and noise sensors, which will alert

[1:22:27] Planner: the owners when sound decibels reach a certain threshold on the property and presumably enable

[1:22:34] Planner: them to contact the renters and indicate an issue so he's also revised his guest

[1:22:41] Planner: information package and that was submitted and that's attachment to the

[1:22:45] Planner: staff report and that includes as I said the addition of excuse me the

[1:22:50] Planner: information on the development permit area in addition to water conservation

[1:22:55] Planner: information and signage it's all fixtures so although notification is not

[1:23:04] Planner: required as part of a renewal application based on previous applications and direction from the

[1:23:12] Planner: local trust committee we recommended that the applicant consult with his surrounding neighbors

[1:23:16] Planner: and if possible submit letters of support. He did submit four letters of support and those have

[1:23:22] Planner: of course been forwarded to the LTC and were attached to the staff report.

[1:23:27] Planner: One email has also been received separately that opposes the renewal application, and further email was sent yesterday by the same neighbor, Mr. Regier, who we heard from earlier, and that was also forwarded to the LTC and the applicant.

[1:23:46] Planner: So the one email from that, or sorry, the concerns from Mr. Regier, which you have heard, are numerous, but they're primarily focused on the noise, noise penetration into the house, a nuisance, given the proximity of the two houses, and the situation of overlook, which magnifies that noise issue, and also issues with parking.

[1:24:12] Planner: parking. The four letters of support, though, all indicate that they have not had any of

[1:24:19] Planner: the same noise or parking issues since the permit was issued. So staff's recommendation

[1:24:25] Planner: is to the Local Trust Committee to approve the temporary use permit for a period of three

[1:24:30] Planner: years, the three-year period being consistent with most recent renewal applications for

[1:24:36] Planner: STVR uses. Also based on the fact that the applicant has made efforts to minimize impacts

[1:24:42] Planner: to neighbours in response to informal and informal complaints, that the guest capacity is modest at

[1:24:49] Planner: six and the applicant provided letters of support. We do have one letter of opposition and one

[1:24:56] Planner: further email from the same neighbour. The application meets the current TUP guidelines

[1:25:05] Planner: lines of the OCP and the permit does can provide conditions for further enforcement if necessary.

[1:25:12] Planner: So that's my report.

[1:25:13] Trustee Patrick: Thank you. I see the applicant is here, Neil. Can we have him

[1:25:19] Trustee Patrick: moved over? Yes,

[1:25:23] Voice 7: Neil has been promoted.

[1:25:25] Trustee Patrick: Thank you, Maple. So Neil, if you can turn your video

[1:25:28] Trustee Patrick: and audio on, we can see and hear you. Oh yeah,

[1:25:33] Voice 15: there we go.

[1:25:34] Trustee Patrick: Thank you. Do you have anything

[1:25:35] Trustee Patrick: you'd like to add um

[1:25:37] Voice 15: yeah i i mean i understand so so thank you phil and and thank you to the

[1:25:42] Voice 15: trustees for taking the time for this um i think the applicant it's a pretty big renewal application

[1:25:47] Voice 15: and phil you've done a great job of outlining the things um i mean yeah i have a couple comments

[1:25:55] Voice 15: that i think i should make just to highlight these issues because they're really it comes

[1:25:58] Voice 15: down to a couple key things um if i i may for a few minutes is that all right uh yes yeah awesome

[1:26:05] Voice 15: Great. So, I mean, at a bigger picture, we've loved having this opportunity for the last three years, you know, we're the only permit on Magic Lake, we take that very seriously. And we love having guests there.

[1:26:21] Voice 15: and of course as you can tell by the letters and stuff we have other neighbors who are equally as

[1:26:27] Voice 15: close to this one neighbor situation who have no complaints and have put in letters of support

[1:26:34] Voice 15: and in fact they sometimes have had their family members come and stay at our place

[1:26:37] Voice 15: and rent it and things so it's a really tricky situation because we've run into a classic kind

[1:26:43] Voice 15: of neighbor issue and fundamentally while I appreciate the neighbor suggesting it's not

[1:26:50] Voice 15: not a personal thing. We've had neighbor issues for many, many years before I ever tried to have

[1:26:56] Voice 15: this permit situation. And they're classic neighbor things, you know, property lines,

[1:27:02] Voice 15: trees, setbacks, other things that all happened many years ago. And now, while we thought we'd

[1:27:09] Voice 15: rectified those things and we thought we could all move forward, we're dealing with an issue on

[1:27:14] Voice 15: this and we really want to make sure that um we're not a disturbance to any of our neighbors of

[1:27:20] Voice 15: course and as phil noted we've we feel like we've gone like way beyond an extra mile to try to make

[1:27:26] Voice 15: as much privacy and reduce noise and all these other things on there um so i think there's there's

[1:27:34] Voice 15: a couple things i just wanted to highlight which is a bit unique and hasn't come up um just to give

[1:27:39] Voice 15: you a little understanding of like how much we rent it is our family cottage you know it's not

[1:27:43] Voice 15: something that if we lost this permit it would go back into rental stock because it's used what we

[1:27:48] Voice 15: would say is well less than a quarter of the time by renters and most the time it's about 10 percent

[1:27:52] Voice 15: so i i pulled up a couple numbers from the just to kind of give you an idea in 2020 we only rented

[1:27:59] Voice 15: it to 12 sets of guests last year the average rental time was four days and no rentals were

[1:28:05] Voice 15: longer than a week um and so that was the pandemic so it's a bit unusual in 2029 we only had a total

[1:28:13] Voice 15: total of 15 sets of guests for the entire calendar year there. And so you can understand that while

[1:28:20] Voice 15: we're getting all these complaints about just constant noise or something like that, we don't

[1:28:25] Voice 15: understand where it's coming from because A, there's very rarely actual paying renters there.

[1:28:30] Voice 15: There is our families there and maybe we're being too noisy. And if that's an issue, then we can,

[1:28:36] Voice 15: you know, we can deal with that with the neighbor or if we're breaking a bylaw, then we're happy to

[1:28:40] Voice 15: to deal with that then. But I think that's where the blur comes a little bit. It's very difficult

[1:28:44] Voice 15: for neighbors to know whether or not there's a renter there or whether or not it's us and our

[1:28:48] Voice 15: family, you know, enjoying our own property. And then, of course, in 2021, because of the travel

[1:28:54] Voice 15: restrictions, I think we've only rented it about two or three times. And then we shut down the

[1:29:00] Voice 15: rental as soon as there was the non-essential travel ban. So the property is actually being

[1:29:04] Voice 15: completely empty now for four months and so again this stress of this constant noise thing

[1:29:10] Voice 15: it seems very unfounded to us because we we don't understand how that's happening

[1:29:15] Voice 15: um but of course like like our neighbor suggested we have a hot tub they have a hot tub on their

[1:29:21] Voice 15: deck also they're right across the fence from each other um interestingly our hot tub is actually on

[1:29:25] Voice 15: the other side of the properties so it's actually closer to our other neighbor so you would think

[1:29:30] Voice 15: that our other neighbor would have more of a concern than this one but um yeah and and of

[1:29:35] Voice 15: course we like to use our hot tub in the evening and and so to so to our guests and stuff um but

[1:29:39] Voice 15: we've never had any complaints of amplified sound the police have never been called there's never

[1:29:45] Voice 15: been a party we've never had any type of concern about that and even in the complaint letters from

[1:29:50] Voice 15: our neighbor it specifies just it's it's people talking um too late into the evening and at the

[1:29:56] Voice 15: the end of the day, we feel that, you know, it's our property. And when

[1:30:00] Voice 15: whether it's us or a guest wants to enjoy our deck or something like that in the evening,

[1:30:05] Voice 15: then it's really difficult to control that. So just to kind of talk a little bit about what Phil

[1:30:11] Voice 15: said, we took this kind of extreme action and said, you know what, if they're really concerned

[1:30:15] Voice 15: about this, we had a complaint from them about two years ago, where at 10 o'clock at night,

[1:30:21] Voice 15: they sent us a complaint, there was too much noise. It was a family with two children in the

[1:30:25] Voice 15: the hot tub at 10pm. That was the concern. And since then, because there was all this other

[1:30:31] Voice 15: stress, we said, you know what, we're going to install a security camera on the side of the

[1:30:34] Voice 15: house, which points like it's on their side of the house. And it has a decimeter in it. And it

[1:30:39] Voice 15: also records all the sound outside. And it gives us the security of knowing when a car comes up

[1:30:44] Voice 15: the driveway, which is a guest, we can tell whether there's too many people coming. So if

[1:30:48] Voice 15: there ever was like a party or something like that, we would immediately be able to know whether

[1:30:52] Voice 15: there was more than six guests or something like that too and the decimeter is really great because

[1:30:57] Voice 15: it has an app in my phone so it has a threshold for what is like no sound outside and then it

[1:31:02] Voice 15: shows thresholds for whether there's talking level outside and then if there ever was a length of

[1:31:08] Voice 15: time where it goes over a threshold for more than five minutes it texts me and I have it set past

[1:31:13] Voice 15: 10 o'clock even so if there ever was a guest there where there was noise over a certain decibel we

[1:31:20] Voice 15: We also have full recording of all sound on that side of the house for years now.

[1:31:24] Voice 15: And we don't have any correlation between this serious noise issue and any recording of that.

[1:31:33] Voice 15: So it's really challenging.

[1:31:34] Voice 15: And also, our neighbor has a security system, as you can tell by their letter, on their side of the house seeing us.

[1:31:40] Voice 15: So we feel like if there really was ever a big noise issue, then they would have had an opportunity to send us a recording.

[1:31:47] Voice 15: recording so you can understand that the challenge of that and i guess the solution from our section

[1:31:52] Voice 15: is that we've done the best we can we put up fences we put in this thing to record it we put

[1:31:56] Voice 15: in an alarm system for this noise and at the end of the day you know if if it's loud after 11 and

[1:32:03] Voice 15: we don't respond and you're concerned about it call the police we'd love you to do that because

[1:32:07] Voice 15: that's what they're there for that's why we have the rcmp on the island if there's a party we'd

[1:32:10] Voice 15: love to make sure that gets stopped so please do that um and uh but you know give us a try first

[1:32:16] Voice 15: and that's usually the more neighborly way to deal with it and that's kind of our solution to this

[1:32:20] Voice 15: noise thing so i hope you'll take that all in consideration um i'd love to do one more minute

[1:32:25] Voice 15: and just address the other two concerns that were just brought up one is around the on island

[1:32:29] Voice 15: contact but i which i just heard from uh during this call and the other one is about kind of

[1:32:34] Voice 15: parking can i uh is there any questions about the noise from any trustees because i because i'd

[1:32:39] Voice 15: really like to help clarify that trustees

[1:32:42] Trustee Patrick: any questions on the noise issue or let him just

[1:32:45] Trustee Patrick: continue?

[1:32:45] Trustee McConchie: Noise is a CRD bylaw issue and an RCMP issue, if I'm not mistaken, right? The Islands

[1:32:53] Trustee McConchie: Trust has no jurisdiction over noise, correct? Okay, that's just all I needed a point of

[1:32:58] Trustee McConchie: clarification there. You're welcome to continue. It's up to my fellow trustees

[1:33:03] Trustee McConchie: if you want to

[1:33:03] Trustee McConchie: continue. It's your application, right? Yeah,

[1:33:06] Voice 15: great. Awesome. Okay, well, thank you so much.

[1:33:08] Voice 15: Well, then I'll just do quickly on the other two concerns. One is parking. As you can see

[1:33:12] Voice 15: by the photographs, our driveway is a big dirt driveway. There's an embankment that goes down

[1:33:18] Voice 15: to their property. The top of that embankment appears to a common person to be part of our

[1:33:25] Voice 15: property, but the property line actually cuts at the top of the embankment. So it appears based on

[1:33:30] Voice 15: the letter they just sent that at some point a guest has actually pulled onto the top of that

[1:33:35] Voice 15: embankment, which would technically mean that part of their car would have crossed the property line.

[1:33:40] Voice 15: The solution for this, if they're really concerned about that, I'm more than happy to put up a marker or a small fence post or something like that to delineate where the edge of the parking is so they don't cross over onto that dirt part of the embankment.

[1:33:54] Voice 15: And that's an easy solution for us.

[1:33:56] Voice 15: And in regards to the on-island contact, which it appears that the neighbor's been trying to contact, well, we haven't been renting it for four months, so our on-island contact is not available if it's not rented.

[1:34:07] Voice 15: that's just there we don't expect that anybody can just call them 24 7 when when the place isn't

[1:34:14] Voice 15: rented so we we inform them when the place is rented the on-island emergency contact knows

[1:34:18] Voice 15: that we're not there and it's and somebody else and so um i it's understandable that maybe they

[1:34:23] Voice 15: haven't got back to them because it's currently not rented so anyways i really i do hope you take

[1:34:28] Voice 15: those things into consideration i appreciate all the work i know that these these permits

[1:34:32] Voice 15: are a challenging thing right now

[1:34:34] Voice 15: and with the bylaw 222 going in,

[1:34:36] Voice 15: we've been in the community for 30 years,

[1:34:38] Voice 15: our family has,

[1:34:39] Voice 15: and we support the idea

[1:34:40] Voice 15: that there's the availability of these permits

[1:34:42] Voice 15: and we'd really appreciate, you know,

[1:34:45] Voice 15: representing being a permit on the lake again

[1:34:47] Voice 15: for three more years.

[1:34:48] Voice 15: So please take that into consideration

[1:34:50] Voice 15: and thanks for all your time.

[1:34:51] Trustee Patrick: All right, thank you very much.

[1:34:53] Trustee Patrick: So trustees, questions for the planner or the applicant?

[1:34:58] Trustee Morrison: This is a renewal,

[1:35:00] Trustee Morrison: so my understanding is we cannot add additions

[1:35:02] Trustee Morrison: to the required permit.

[1:35:04] Trustee Morrison: That's

[1:35:04] Planner: right. The only changes that you can make are to the timeframe. So you could make it for one year, two years, three years. So, but no added conditions.

[1:35:12] Planner: okay

[1:35:14] Trustee Morrison: so to neil to your um point about the driveway issue um from my perspective that

[1:35:22] Trustee Morrison: would be something that you do based on sort of neighborly interactions um and just to ensure

[1:35:29] Trustee Morrison: that your that guests on your property would be fully on your property um so you're

[1:35:36] Voice 15: happy to do

[1:35:36] Voice 15: that

[1:35:37] Trustee Morrison: yeah um ben do you have questions or other comments the

[1:35:43] Trustee McConchie: initial comment is um i really don't

[1:35:46] Trustee McConchie: like being put in the position as a trustee to that in between a neighbor dispute right um because

[1:35:52] Trustee McConchie: that's how this is being framed this is the first time we've ever had a stvr where we've had a very

[1:35:57] Trustee McConchie: serious complaint where the neighbor is clearly quite upset and that we haven't encountered this

[1:36:01] Trustee McConchie: yet which is the issue and i'm like well okay is everyone worked up because of covid i mean there's

[1:36:07] Trustee McConchie: valid points on both sides and ultimately what am i like i haven't i don't know your family history

[1:36:13] Trustee McConchie: or whatever is going on and that's what's happening here it seems so um but our decision is to

[1:36:18] Trustee McConchie: determine land use right so kind of like that's how i want to direct the conversation a couple

[1:36:23] Trustee McConchie: things didn't get pointed out so this is in a highly densified area of magic lake right

[1:36:27] Trustee McConchie: so the the question that the future trust committee should think about is well how many

[1:36:34] Trustee McConchie: short-term vacation rentals are we going to permit in this highly densified part of the lake right

[1:36:39] Trustee McConchie: and this is the first one uh as far as what i'm understanding so that's kind of where i wanted

[1:36:45] Trustee McConchie: the conversation to direct like i i'm i would almost want to defer from and send you guys to

[1:36:50] Trustee McConchie: like a community justice mediation program or something do you know what i mean because i you're

[1:36:55] Trustee McConchie: having like what is this you have a decibel meter thing that connects to your phone to to to make

[1:37:01] Trustee McConchie: sure people aren't making too much noise like you know it's a lot of process right uh to kind of

[1:37:08] Voice 15: exhausting

[1:37:08] Trustee McConchie: yeah

[1:37:09] Voice 15: and it's been hard on our family for years and i appreciate that because it's um

[1:37:13] Voice 15: yeah it's it's unnecessary because as as you're saying it's it's really a civil issue that's

[1:37:17] Voice 15: being gone for years before any of this permit and it's being it's bleeding into this thing and

[1:37:22] Voice 15: fundamentally uh they should be kept separately so i appreciate that yeah

[1:37:26] Trustee McConchie: and but at the same time

[1:37:28] Trustee McConchie: you know i want to respect that the your neighbors have a point of view and and they're a part of

[1:37:32] Trustee McConchie: this conversation their lives are impacted by this i did i have lived beside an stvr and i do know

[1:37:38] Trustee McConchie: that there's random people that show up and you're sort of like the flow of the neighborhood kind of

[1:37:42] Trustee McConchie: changes and like that is a real thing right um when when you're kind of used to a particular

[1:37:48] Trustee McConchie: sound in the neighborhood and that's kind of what i feel that is a very strong point they're making

[1:37:53] Trustee McConchie: however that said like this is about land use um and the use of it on magic lake and this highly

[1:38:00] Trustee McConchie: densified area so that's kind of where i wanted to know what my trustees thought um in particular

[1:38:05] Trustee McConchie: about that particular issue um i i wish you guys could talk it out though is that possible are you

[1:38:11] Trustee McConchie: guys able to i would love to

[1:38:13] Trustee McConchie: yeah

[1:38:14] Voice 15: i wish we could too but we you know we had got a there's years ago

[1:38:19] Voice 15: go there's incidents that have involved in police and lawyers and other things and now we've got to

[1:38:24] Voice 15: this situation where like you know I thought we got a fence and fence makes good neighbors usually

[1:38:29] Voice 15: you know that kind of theory and we said hey let's be bygones be bygones years ago but

[1:38:33] Voice 15: and I haven't heard anything from them for so long and then as soon as a month before this

[1:38:38] Voice 15: renewal permit comes up this large laundry list of complaints which the bylaw officer walked through

[1:38:43] Voice 15: with them and us and said that the most of them are just civil issues and I agree it's it's a sad

[1:38:48] Voice 15: situation because we don't want to have conflict with our neighbors we want to be there to enjoy

[1:38:53] Voice 15: the lake and enjoy our cottage and they're part-timers also so they want to be there to

[1:38:56] Voice 15: enjoy peace and quiet in their thing um and uh we'd love to you know continue to try to rectify

[1:39:02] Voice 15: this um but uh yeah but at the same time we'd love to renew and and be able to uh continue doing the

[1:39:09] Voice 15: good work we are there so sure trustee

[1:39:13] Trustee McConchie: morrison uh i give you space here yeah

[1:39:16] Trustee Morrison: so um if if meal

[1:39:19] Trustee Morrison: if you can just pause for a minute i i think i do want to just talk back and forth with benefit a

[1:39:23] Trustee Morrison: little bit um so i think one of the questions i have in this situation because stvr is permitting

[1:39:29] Trustee Morrison: of stvrs is a land use decision but it is actually also sort of a social land use decision about like

[1:39:36] Trustee Morrison: how people are getting on in areas around that and part of the idea of having it on TUP

[1:39:43] Trustee Morrison: is that neighbors influence the renewals and so in this situation it's a bit of a question

[1:39:53] Trustee Morrison: like what do we do about that where there is like clearly folks who are being naming that

[1:39:59] Trustee Morrison: they're being impacted and like you know it's not been or my job to be the judge and jury

[1:40:05] Trustee Morrison: in that situation and so I think one of the questions I have for staff in this situation

[1:40:11] Trustee Morrison: is like what are the options for deferral of a permit like this where we would um ask both

[1:40:22] Trustee Morrison: neighbors in good faith to talk to each other before and like you know have a conversation

[1:40:28] Trustee Morrison: about what would be something to move this forward and you know bring that back to the

[1:40:33] Trustee Morrison: the next meeting like is that something that's useful for us to do and I guess Ben I think the

[1:40:38] Trustee Morrison: question for you too like because I don't particularly want to be the one who decides

[1:40:43] Trustee Morrison: who's like you know and and I also think that there are it's not just about who's accurately

[1:40:50] Trustee Morrison: reflecting all the details it's also like there are perceptions of people that are just different

[1:40:55] Trustee Morrison: like based on where you're living and what your circumstances are and everything else

[1:40:59] Trustee Morrison: so i don't know um phil or ben or robert like thoughts on what

[1:41:05] Trustee Morrison: can be done uh

[1:41:06] Planner: well probably

[1:41:08] Planner: weigh in as well but definitely you can defer and you can make the request that they come back with

[1:41:13] Planner: more information on how they're getting along i would presume yeah so yeah

[1:41:19] Voice 16: you can defer it i just

[1:41:21] Voice 16: one caution is that it is a renewal right and so if you defer it for too long is it is it really

[1:41:26] Voice 16: the renewal anymore or is it a new application but uh i mean yeah i mean if you're going to

[1:41:33] Voice 16: defer it for a month you should probably ask the applicant something to come back with something

[1:41:35] Voice 16: specific so yeah

[1:41:38] Trustee McConchie: so i've argued kind of the human approach to this discussion but let's talk

[1:41:43] Trustee McConchie: logically about jurisdictional control and and the policy here so crd is in charge of bylaw noise

[1:41:49] Trustee McConchie: the rcmp is in charge of if parties get out of control technically a property owner could come

[1:41:55] Trustee McConchie: from Vancouver every weekend, unload their van, make a bunch of noise and sit and chill. And if

[1:42:00] Trustee McConchie: that's a problem for a neighbour in the Magic Lake area, they call the RCMP if it's continually like

[1:42:04] Trustee McConchie: they're playing Metallica or whatever super loud past 11 o'clock. So our job, that's why I was

[1:42:09] Trustee McConchie: trying to ask the policy question, is the densification of STVRs on Magic Lake is really

[1:42:14] Trustee McConchie: kind of the crux of the issue. It's our only jurisdictional approach. And so I'm just wondering

[1:42:19] Trustee McConchie: from the planners maybe like phil um or plan to test them all rather excuse me um is you know what

[1:42:26] Trustee McConchie: um what do you think is is uh should we maybe propose a a limit on the amount in magic lake

[1:42:33] Trustee McConchie: considering that there are

[1:42:34] Trustee McConchie: some impacts is that part of bylaw 222 yeah

[1:42:38] Planner: i would say so and also

[1:42:39] Planner: as neil's pointed out this is the only one on magic lake so um so i'm not sure if this is a

[1:42:46] Planner: density issue or as we've all been you know basically witnessing here it's it's an issue

[1:42:51] Planner: between two neighbors which you know it it may be just a the the fluke of of circumstance of

[1:42:59] Planner: of the two neighbors not getting along so i don't know if that's by saying you know capping let's

[1:43:05] Planner: say you're going to say five around magic lake that's not going to remedy this particular

[1:43:10] Planner: situation so

[1:43:12] Trustee McConchie: then i guess the kind of random question i have which is kind of hippy dippy

[1:43:15] Trustee McConchie: people whatever should the islands trust get into the policy of like solving neighbor disputes like

[1:43:21] Trustee McConchie: through the community justice there's a there's a group of folks that try to mediate things is

[1:43:27] Trustee McConchie: there a mechanism that all of a sudden we need to like create this one meeting and we ask them to go

[1:43:33] Trustee McConchie: to this one meeting for two hours and talk it out and they like you know what i mean like we can't

[1:43:38] Trustee McConchie: really enforce people to talk to each other right or can we right i

[1:43:43] Planner: don't want to get involved in

[1:43:45] Planner: this too much but i mean it sounds like there's a long history here and um and yeah i think the

[1:43:52] Planner: the point has been made quite accurately that this is a land use decision it's not you trying to

[1:43:58] Planner: mediate between two neighbors i

[1:44:00] Voice 16: think as as a local trust committee if you were satisfied that

[1:44:04] Voice 16: it was the land use causing the issue then then you know that's clearly within in the you know

[1:44:10] Voice 16: know the area that you control but i'm not sure that that's the case and yeah

[1:44:15] Trustee McConchie: well i i just i'm

[1:44:16] Trustee McConchie: aware that you're probably the neighbors are listening so i just want them to understand my

[1:44:19] Trustee McConchie: rationale then for approving this uh this motion for i would like to make a motion that the north

[1:44:25] Trustee McConchie: pender island local trust committee approve issuance of renewal temporary use permit nptup

[1:44:30] Trustee McConchie: 2021.5 p gram for a period of three years is

[1:44:37] Trustee Patrick: there a second to this motion seconded by trustee

[1:44:40] Trustee Patrick: Morrison is there a discussion yeah yeah

[1:44:43] Voice 7: go ahead

[1:44:43] Trustee McConchie: I've talked a lot here so

[1:44:47] Trustee Morrison: yeah I'm of two minds

[1:44:50] Trustee Morrison: on this honestly I'm of the mind that there is like that civil disturbances and things like that

[1:44:59] Trustee Morrison: need to be resolved neighbor to neighbor and it does seem like you have done several things to

[1:45:06] Trustee Morrison: try and address that so from that perspective it seems good from from another perspective it

[1:45:14] Trustee Morrison: concerns me that's that something that we have designated land use on is

[1:45:21] Trustee Morrison: resulting in somebody informing us that they're very unhappy and so that that is a problem for

[1:45:28] Trustee Morrison: us too because like where do we draw the line between allowing renewal of tups based on a

[1:45:35] Trustee Morrison: to complain or not. And so I guess my advice here would be that from the perspective of STVRs

[1:45:44] Trustee Morrison: to the general sort of public is complaints are not just complaints to the property owner that

[1:45:52] Trustee Morrison: like, I actually think that, that if you have a complaint, you need to phone the police or,

[1:45:57] Trustee Morrison: you know, phone the folks that are in charge of enforcing those noise bylaws, those other things,

[1:46:03] Trustee Morrison: so that there is a documentation history of that because what I don't see here right now is I don't

[1:46:08] Trustee Morrison: see a documented history of complaints on the property that we can say that there is a documented

[1:46:15] Trustee Morrison: history and deny the permit because like five times police visited the property and like that's

[1:46:20] Trustee Morrison: not okay right so I guess that's what and I guess Phil that's the question that I would like to

[1:46:26] Trustee Morrison: answer too is like is would we have that record of like visits if it existed in terms of like

[1:46:33] Trustee Morrison: complaints police complaints to the property that

[1:46:37] Planner: could have been part of the bylaw investigation

[1:46:39] Planner: if i mean i don't think they would necessarily go there and i think again neil has pointed out that

[1:46:46] Planner: maybe there and maybe this is a better question for neil is that there has been police visits but

[1:46:51] Planner: we're not certain a staff at least how much how many of those have been for his family not renters

[1:46:58] Planner: so you know can i

[1:47:01] Voice 15: try to address that yeah because

[1:47:03] Voice 15: so so many great comments here and i totally

[1:47:06] Voice 15: understand this and i'm sorry this is dragging out because it hits on a touch button point of

[1:47:10] Voice 15: this whole thing for sure so i understand that i'm like this case that's causing a little challenge

[1:47:15] Voice 15: for sure um the the police issues we've never had a police issue for noise in in the decades

[1:47:22] Voice 15: that's never been a thing it's for uh it's for completely other civil issues between the two of

[1:47:27] Voice 15: us uh that happened years ago um so we've never had a noise complaint the bylaws office has never

[1:47:33] Voice 15: received a noise complaint at a time we've never had a police visit for a thing i have years of

[1:47:39] Voice 15: recorded video and audio of that side of the house and don't have a single time where there's noise

[1:47:44] Voice 15: after 11 p.m on record and and so the the it's this is the big challenge here is we also have

[1:47:51] Voice 15: a neighbor right on the other side who's just as close and closer to the hot tub who has has never

[1:47:56] Voice 15: had a problem with any of our guests or noise and the ones across the street also submitted letters

[1:48:01] Voice 15: and they all seem to be quite fine with it and i think that's what you're running into is you feel

[1:48:05] Voice 15: like you're trying to adjudicate between something that actually you can't do with a a land use issue

[1:48:11] Voice 15: issue because if you just said okay well we can have one every three feet or something it's just

[1:48:16] Voice 15: that just you just got a challenge here where two neighbors are uh kind of having troubles i'd love

[1:48:21] Voice 15: to you know go to some adjudication situation with our neighbor and try to work out some of

[1:48:25] Voice 15: our other issues that are more civil um but what's happening is it's bubbling up into this renewal

[1:48:30] Voice 15: thing and the reality is is we only have renters on the property like 10 maybe maybe 20 of the year

[1:48:37] Voice 15: year in total and so the problems aren't really half the time or most of the time aren't really

[1:48:44] Voice 15: our neighbors except for I guess one of them parked on the on the road off the driveway so

[1:48:50] Voice 15: yeah I'll pause there and I appreciate all the comments and I appreciate so much that this is

[1:48:54] Voice 15: really a a touch point especially while the other bylaw thing has been going on and and and I and I

[1:49:00] Voice 15: definitely don't want to put the trustees in a situation to try to resolve neighbor issues over

[1:49:04] Voice 15: over a land use situation, so thank you.

[1:49:06] Trustee Patrick: The trustees, any further discussion?

[1:49:10] Trustee McConchie: I know, other than I just,

[1:49:13] Trustee McConchie: I hope you guys are able to talk things through

[1:49:15] Trustee McConchie: and as far as land use is considered,

[1:49:19] Trustee McConchie: this follows and is consistent within the by-law 222

[1:49:22] Trustee McConchie: and the work that the trust committee has been doing

[1:49:25] Trustee McConchie: to set up a process in which we know

[1:49:28] Trustee McConchie: how many short-term vacation rentals there are

[1:49:31] Trustee McConchie: and start a database for future trustees

[1:49:33] Trustee McConchie: to be able to make appropriate decisions

[1:49:35] Trustee McConchie: because before it was wild west and a free for all.

[1:49:38] Trustee McConchie: And now the trust has worked hard to make a process

[1:49:41] Trustee McConchie: in which we are able to regulate, monitor it

[1:49:43] Trustee McConchie: and then know what's healthy or not for the community.

[1:49:45] Trustee McConchie: So that's how I'm basing my decision today.

[1:49:48] Trustee Patrick: Thank you.

[1:49:49] Trustee Patrick: Then I'll call the vote.

[1:49:50] Trustee Patrick: All those in favor, that is carried.

[1:49:54] Trustee Patrick: All right, so thank you very much and best of luck.

[1:50:00] Trustee Patrick: Thank

[1:50:00] Voice 15: you so much for all your time

[1:50:01] Voice 15: because I know this took a lot longer

[1:50:03] Voice 15: than a normal renewal should be.

[1:50:04] Voice 15: so have a great evening thank you thank

[1:50:06] Trustee Patrick: you my trustees everyone's okay to proceed

[1:50:10] Trustee Patrick: go on to uh the next item is 13.1 the land use bylaw review project and we have a staff report

[1:50:16] Trustee Patrick: on page 108 and i see planner stuck bill here so thank

[1:50:21] Planner Stockdill (probable): you thank you chair patrick um yes so this

[1:50:25] Planner Stockdill (probable): is a staff report with regards to the land use bylaw review project and it's to provide the ltc

[1:50:31] Planner Stockdill (probable): with a little bit more information on the topic areas and to seek direction on three items with

[1:50:37] Planner Stockdill (probable): regards to the maximum floor area discussion the industrial regulations and also the project

[1:50:43] Planner Stockdill (probable): charter so I'm actually just going to touch on those items that need further clarification

[1:50:49] Planner Stockdill (probable): so on page five of the staff report I've listed some options for the LTC's consideration

[1:50:56] Planner Stockdill (probable): consideration, and where staff is looking for direction from the LTC.

[1:51:01] Planner Stockdill (probable): In regard to the maximum floor area there is direction to provide further information

[1:51:07] Planner Stockdill (probable): based on a gradual scale approach, and that's on page four of the staff report.

[1:51:14] Planner Stockdill (probable): There's one column called example A and these numbers are based on the maximum floor area

[1:51:19] Planner Stockdill (probable): that South Pender has in their land use bylaw.

[1:51:23] Planner Stockdill (probable): Example B is actually just a reduction of that amount, a reduction of the amount in the South

[1:51:31] Planner Stockdill (probable): Pender bylaw and again another option for the LTC to consider is to actually reduce that even more.

[1:51:40] Planner Stockdill (probable): Again it's important to have the discussion of exactly why the LTC would like to regulate

[1:51:46] Planner Stockdill (probable): late maximum floor area is it to reduce the situations where these mega homes are being built

[1:51:56] Planner Stockdill (probable): or is does the LTC believe that there's certainly a proliferation of larger homes

[1:52:02] Planner Stockdill (probable): on lots that are less than 0.4 hectares or one acre so the first option for the LTC to consider

[1:52:12] Planner Stockdill (probable): is the example A in table two,

[1:52:16] Planner Stockdill (probable): and there's a recommendation there for the LTC.

[1:52:20] Planner Stockdill (probable): Option two is example B in the table.

[1:52:26] Planner Stockdill (probable): Again, and I didn't include this,

[1:52:28] Planner Stockdill (probable): but I should have is that the LTC

[1:52:30] Planner Stockdill (probable): can also provide direction to staff

[1:52:32] Planner Stockdill (probable): to even reduce those numbers further.

[1:52:34] Planner Stockdill (probable): So that is another option for your consideration.

[1:52:37] Planner Stockdill (probable): And option three is to amend the definition

[1:52:40] Planner Stockdill (probable): of lot coverage and on floor area um and there is a recommend or a recommendation there if the ltc

[1:52:49] Planner Stockdill (probable): would like to um adopt those new um definitions as i've described in the staff report just touching

[1:52:58] Planner Stockdill (probable): on some of the industrial amendments uh so staff have provided

[1:53:03] Trustee Patrick: i was gonna say planner stockdale

[1:53:04] Trustee Patrick: look to the trustees did you want to work through these by group conversation so just stay on the

[1:53:09] Trustee Patrick: the floor here for a moment. So that would be great. So did you have anything else on the floor

[1:53:15] Trustee Patrick: area or can we open up questions from trustees there?

[1:53:18] Planner Stockdill (probable): I'm happy to take any questions from the

[1:53:20] Planner Stockdill (probable): trustees. All right, trustees.

[1:53:25] Trustee McConchie: Go ahead, Trustee Morrison, if you're ready.

[1:53:28] Trustee Morrison: Sure. Yeah. So thank

[1:53:31] Trustee Morrison: you very much for providing these examples. I know floor air has been very stressful for many folks

[1:53:36] Trustee Morrison: in the community and we've had lots of comments. So just to be clear before we get into the

[1:53:41] Trustee Morrison: conversation of floor area we we do have proposed language already that will be included around um

[1:53:50] Trustee Morrison: grandparenting existing buildings um even if they burn to the ground that they like more than 75

[1:53:56] Trustee Morrison: that they will still be able to rebuild on that site is that accurate yes

[1:54:02] Planner Stockdill (probable): so if the ltc does um

[1:54:04] Planner Stockdill (probable): give direction to establish a maximum floor area we will add that provision in um that just wasn't

[1:54:11] Planner Stockdill (probable): included in the staff report so that provision

[1:54:12] Planner Stockdill (probable): will be included in the draft bylaw yeah okay

[1:54:15] Trustee Morrison: because we got like 10 000 emails related to that one little issue so okay so that's good to know

[1:54:20] Trustee Morrison: um and then in terms of the floor area to your questions so about reasons why we would want to

[1:54:28] Trustee Morrison: have a maximum floor area so from my perspective there's a couple reasons so uh and it's a little

[1:54:36] Trustee Morrison: little bit about floor area and footprint so like we can either do footprint on the land

[1:54:43] Trustee Morrison: or floor area but doing combinations of them it's just hard for people to understand

[1:54:48] Trustee Morrison: so it's easier in some ways to go with floor area and people can understand that more easily

[1:54:55] Trustee Morrison: like how to because it's part of your building requirement personally I like footprint just

[1:55:01] Trustee Morrison: because that's the ecological stamp on the ground of how much trees get cut, how much land is taken

[1:55:07] Trustee Morrison: up, that kind of issue. But I do understand that floor is easier for people to think through. So

[1:55:16] Trustee Morrison: my rationale for why we are trying to even go for a maximum floor area is about having less impact

[1:55:22] Trustee Morrison: on lots where we're cutting lots of trees or where buildings are in jeopardy of being hit by trees

[1:55:28] Trustee Morrison: because they're close or whatever um so that's one part of it the other part of it is um how much land

[1:55:35] Trustee Morrison: is um well let me just pause there that's the biggest part of it um there is a little bit of

[1:55:44] Trustee Morrison: an issue too for getting away from the rural nature of the island i think that i'm concerned

[1:55:51] Trustee Morrison: about so if we have for instance in the magic lake area or in other places where you have small

[1:55:57] Trustee Morrison: lot sizes, like less than 0.4 of a hectare, then bigger houses are actually going to have a much

[1:56:04] Trustee Morrison: bigger impact accumulatively across the region because you just get a lot more vegetation. And

[1:56:11] Trustee Morrison: because the lots are small, it just is amplified. Um, so that's a bit of a concern for me. Um,

[1:56:18] Trustee Morrison: so I, I think example A is too high on table two. I think example B is, it's probably a good

[1:56:27] Trustee Morrison: first step from the perspective of like community being able to tolerate that amount of change

[1:56:33] Trustee Morrison: um but i think i would like to see it like across the board 500 square feet reduced

[1:56:41] Trustee Morrison: um and again just making sure that this is interior square footage not exterior so that

[1:56:48] Trustee Morrison: we're not prioritized we're not um privileging different building methods over others um that's

[1:56:55] Trustee Morrison: bit of an issue for me so like cob buildings are much thicker walls so if we're doing internal

[1:56:59] Trustee Morrison: measurements then we're we're not preferencing building options um and then last thing maybe

[1:57:05] Trustee Morrison: um related to square footage we don't have anything in here related to overall footprint of

[1:57:13] Trustee Morrison: all buildings on the property and i thought we'd requested that so that might have just maybe that's

[1:57:19] Trustee Morrison: in a different area that i might just that might be so the other thing i want to put on the table

[1:57:25] Trustee Morrison: but I'm curious what Ben and Laura think about this is, you know, from an affordable housing

[1:57:31] Trustee Morrison: perspective, we, we're not affordable housing managers. Like that's not necessarily the thing

[1:57:36] Trustee Morrison: that the trust is doing, but there is an affordable housing shortage. So like what

[1:57:42] Trustee Morrison: land use mechanisms do we have that could help that situation? And the one thing that I think

[1:57:48] Trustee Morrison: that we do have the potential to do, whether people take us up on it as their own issue, but

[1:57:52] Trustee Morrison: But we do have the potential in areas where there's secure water to split the square footage

[1:57:59] Trustee Morrison: so that people, like if you had 2,500 square foot on a lot, say you're allowed, that you

[1:58:04] Trustee Morrison: could split the square footage into two occupate, occupy, what do you call it?

[1:58:11] Trustee Morrison: Dwellings.

[1:58:12] Trustee Morrison: Thank you.

[1:58:13] Trustee Morrison: Two dwellings.

[1:58:14] Trustee Morrison: And right now that's only allowed on three acres or more, but we have the potential if

[1:58:18] Trustee Morrison: we wanted to, to change that here.

[1:58:19] Trustee Morrison: So I'd be interested to know what other folks think about that.

[1:58:26] Trustee Morrison: Trustee McConkie.

[1:58:28] Trustee McConchie: I'd like a more, maybe a, you're, you're more detail oriented in this issue

[1:58:32] Trustee McConchie: than I am trustee Morrison. I'm, I'm more like the current bylaw is ridiculous, right? If I'm

[1:58:39] Trustee McConchie: correct me, if I'm wrong, it's 25% lot coverage. So it makes for good governance to establish

[1:58:44] Trustee McConchie: something that's reasonable, right? We need the community to buy into it because, and, and as far

[1:58:51] Trustee McConchie: far as our justification is it's just it's like i mean look at table uh on page one one one of the

[1:58:58] Trustee McConchie: of the agenda package you know under example a on 10 acres or greater if we were to take that

[1:59:05] Trustee McConchie: option if i'm not correct me if i'm wrong here you still can build a 6 000 square foot house

[1:59:11] Trustee McConchie: it's not like we're the government is oppressing you even on option b or example b is 4 500 square

[1:59:19] Trustee McConchie: feet and then yeah and then only then if let's say we adopt this and and on 10 acres or greater

[1:59:26] Trustee McConchie: it's 4,500 square feet so you want to build a bigger home than 4,500 square feet you then go

[1:59:32] Trustee McConchie: to this thing called the check and balance called the trustees that the island elects and they say

[1:59:38] Trustee McConchie: well what are you doing what's your plan you want to build a 7,000 square foot house okay cool can

[1:59:44] Trustee McConchie: Can you show me where like you have your own like water system that funnels the water slide or whatever you've got going on in that house?

[1:59:52] Trustee McConchie: And it's a check and balance in the community.

[1:59:55] Trustee McConchie: So that means the trustees could still say at the end of the day, you know what?

[1:59:59] Trustee McConchie: You're set.

[2:00:00] Trustee McConchie: thousand square foot house it sounds like an awesome idea go for it right however this bylaw

[2:00:07] Trustee McConchie: the way i'm looking at it i'm kind of going towards example b in table uh two of page 111

[2:00:14] Trustee McConchie: it's it's at least a a strong starting point for the discussion going forward and because we need

[2:00:20] Trustee McConchie: to have meetings uh in the community so that's kind of where i i was hoping uh this conversation

[2:00:27] Trustee McConchie: would lead to is planning for like in-person meetings to really feel like we're connecting

[2:00:32] Trustee McConchie: with folks um about this issue because it's just been all virtual for the most part right now uh

[2:00:38] Trustee McConchie: but that's those were my initial comments and uh that's all i have to say about floor area ratio

[2:00:43] Trustee McConchie: and all that stuff

[2:00:43] Trustee Patrick: oh thank well thank you i'll give you my my two cents um i kind of like where

[2:00:50] Trustee Patrick: what you were going to Deb is, um, flexibility, but flexibility for reasons. Um, and, you know,

[2:01:03] Trustee Patrick: one would be either creating that, um, you know, you're creating a rental unit or something,

[2:01:08] Trustee Patrick: then there, you know, you, you're, you're given flexibility or you're creating a home that's,

[2:01:14] Trustee Patrick: you know, super, you know, you're, you're taking on the, the living challenge or something, you

[2:01:20] Trustee Patrick: know um that um or you're coveting you know you got more than 10 acres and you're coveting

[2:01:25] Trustee Patrick: you know you're going to protect uh a certain amount of your land so that there's that that

[2:01:31] Trustee Patrick: were you could direct future trustees so to speak as you're saying ben that yes a trustee could

[2:01:37] Trustee Patrick: decide to bury something but you would be telling them why you would bury it um on what are and but

[2:01:44] Trustee Patrick: but we use incentives that are, you know, that are to a benefit for the future.

[2:01:50] Trustee Patrick: You know, those are, to me, that helps people see that there's a way beyond that.

[2:01:54] Trustee Patrick: The ones that, you know, oh my goodness, I'm like, I'm getting limited on my house size,

[2:01:58] Trustee Patrick: but there's a path and we've given you some ideas of what you would need to do to get that

[2:02:06] Trustee Patrick: very large house, if that's what you wanted.

[2:02:09] Trustee Morrison: I think I would want to see a little bit of difference in what I see in the staff report.

[2:02:14] Trustee Morrison: i i think to get that kind of you know innovative energy use innovative kind of technology and play

[2:02:23] Trustee Morrison: in housing which i think a lot of people are doing already people are starting to really think about

[2:02:27] Trustee Morrison: that but like for instance if you had a 4500 square foot house and you're on a well and you're

[2:02:36] Trustee Morrison: drawing off the well you are likely drawing uh like on more water sources in the house than a

[2:02:43] Trustee Morrison: a house that's much smaller. And so you are actually impacting the community because your

[2:02:48] Trustee Morrison: aquifer is a shared aquifer. So, but if we say that the house limit is like 4,000 square foot

[2:02:55] Trustee Morrison: or something like whatever, just drop it a little bit lower even, then you could come back and say

[2:03:00] Trustee Morrison: you still want your 4,500 square foot house, but now you're going to do rain catchment or you're

[2:03:04] Trustee Morrison: going to do a bunch of other things, right? So I would like to see on example B, I would like to

[2:03:11] Trustee Morrison: to see the square footage dropped by 500 for all of those examples, because we can always increase

[2:03:16] Trustee Morrison: it in a second reading or third reading, but we can't decrease it because that's a significant

[2:03:21] Trustee Morrison: change. So I think it will foster a lot of discussion in the community to Ben's point.

[2:03:26] Trustee Morrison: And I, and I think it would be helpful to know what that is because I have had emails that even

[2:03:32] Trustee Morrison: 2,500 is too high, right? So it would be good to get, just get that kind of, you know, conversation

[2:03:38] Trustee Morrison: going. So that would be one thing I would like to see like 2,500, 3,000, 3,500 and 4,000. And then

[2:03:47] Trustee Morrison: I, I'm not clear about the last one. I have to ask some questions about that. Um, and then I would

[2:03:52] Trustee Morrison: also, I think if trustees are interested in trying that say that one consideration for a variance

[2:04:00] Trustee Morrison: would be to split square footage, but then that would have to be brought back in a plan.

[2:04:05] Trustee Morrison: plan like somebody would have to come with a variance to show us what they would want to do

[2:04:09] Trustee Morrison: with a split so it's not a universal that you can do it but there is an option for a variance to do

[2:04:13] Trustee Morrison: it yeah

[2:04:15] Trustee Patrick: it's home plating there's other words that are used to indicate that you know you're not

[2:04:20] Trustee Patrick: separating the dwellings across the property they're being built

[2:04:23] Voice 8: yeah whatever each other

[2:04:24] Trustee Patrick: yeah um well i thought we had that really interesting data we had the data on the size

[2:04:30] Trustee Patrick: of the current but what was it the last three four years of building permits and um i was

[2:04:36] Trustee Patrick: pleasantly surprised to see the sizes of the houses oh

[2:04:42] Trustee McConchie: you're so if i'm understanding correctly

[2:04:44] Trustee McConchie: trustee morrison you're kind of wanting to provoke the conversation so then we so that's that's cool

[2:04:50] Trustee McConchie: the only ramification that might happen is that with sort of the undertones of like the islands

[2:04:56] Trustee McConchie: trust is controlling your life and they're coming for your you know family and your home or whatever

[2:05:02] Trustee McConchie: ever and i just want to be cognizant of the fact that we're um that there's rationale behind those

[2:05:08] Trustee McConchie: particular numbers you know

[2:05:09] Trustee Patrick: um

[2:05:11] Trustee McConchie: i mean it

[2:05:13] Trustee McConchie: would make for a good for conversation that's that's

[2:05:15] Trustee McConchie: what maybe we need to do well the conversation would

[2:05:18] Trustee McConchie: be good but

[2:05:19] Trustee Patrick: it was also it'd be nice to

[2:05:20] Trustee Patrick: hear what people would like to see for what would be incentives or reasons that to get something

[2:05:24] Trustee Patrick: bigger what would be reasonable requests is it you know protecting a piece of your land or

[2:05:33] Trustee Patrick: making an affordable

[2:05:34] Trustee Patrick: housing unit uh yeah energy

[2:05:36] Trustee Morrison: efficient design yeah

[2:05:37] Trustee Patrick: siding

[2:05:39] Trustee Morrison: like uh you know a

[2:05:41] Trustee Morrison: shifting in siding so that we know you're not cutting down the only arbutus tree on the lot

[2:05:46] Trustee Morrison: you know like that kind of stuff

[2:05:47] Trustee McConchie: yeah yeah are you able to put a let folks know if they if they

[2:05:51] Trustee McConchie: want to build a 7 000 square foot house they have to put part of their land as part of a covenant

[2:05:55] Trustee McConchie: is that is that something that is in the toolbox of the ltc yeah

[2:06:00] Planner Stockdill (probable): potentially what you could do is

[2:06:02] Planner Stockdill (probable): add a policy to your ocp that states that the ltc would or turn their mind to supporting a

[2:06:09] Planner Stockdill (probable): variance to increase maximum floor area if the applicant has addressed a number of these things

[2:06:16] Planner Stockdill (probable): and some of them could be yeah rainwater catchment tree tree retention on the property or so forth so

[2:06:23] Planner Stockdill (probable): we can there could be a list of of these items in the ocp yeah

[2:06:28] Trustee Morrison: storage for fire water because if you

[2:06:30] Trustee Morrison: have a big house you better have some serious fire fighting water stored on on site so basically

[2:06:38] Trustee McConchie: what this is that we're establishing the project charter the direction that we're going to present

[2:06:42] Trustee McConchie: to the community as a draft bylaw right now is that understanding the process so if that's the

[2:06:48] Trustee McConchie: case then we just basically need to agree so trustee morrison you're saying take all the

[2:06:52] Trustee McConchie: numbers in example b on page 111 of the agenda package and drop them by 500 each then we're also

[2:07:00] Trustee McConchie: saying hey community what do you think about the idea that if you apply for a giant a bigger home

[2:07:04] Trustee McConchie: well that means giant i don't know i have no problem saying that you apply for a large home

[2:07:08] Trustee McConchie: you you also uh have to give something back to the environment which you know is sort of like um

[2:07:15] Trustee McConchie: making a deal in a way um and we want to hear what people think about that so we're not forcing it on

[2:07:21] Trustee McConchie: them we're just drafting the bylaw to hear the feedback and hopefully in person is am i understand

[2:07:25] Trustee McConchie: the process correctly. I agree. Yeah, I think that's correct.

[2:07:29] Trustee Morrison: And Ben, to your point about

[2:07:30] Trustee Morrison: the rationale of like, why go that low is really, it's, it's literally to do what you just said,

[2:07:36] Trustee Morrison: like, we're trying to incentivize people to do environmentally sound building if they start to

[2:07:41] Trustee Morrison: get bigger. Because there's energy impacts, there's water impacts, there's like, all of

[2:07:46] Trustee Morrison: these things are in play now. And so we're not saying you can't do it. We're just saying if you

[2:07:50] Trustee Morrison: you do it you need to actually really show the community how you're doing it and honestly that

[2:07:56] Trustee Morrison: would be amazing if more people did that on the island because then we would be like a great place

[2:07:59] Trustee Morrison: to come and explore how technologies like that work you know okay

[2:08:06] Trustee Patrick: so is that sounds like it's

[2:08:08] Trustee Patrick: option two with a revision does do option b are yeah it's option is it option two though table

[2:08:19] Trustee Morrison: able to

[2:08:19] Trustee Patrick: example but but you're also wanting to reduce the um oh

[2:08:24] Trustee Morrison: i see what you mean yeah

[2:08:26] Trustee McConchie: so in normal circumstances if we move forward with this there'd be a local newspaper that

[2:08:30] Trustee McConchie: would cover this issue and say hey the north pender ltc is interested in hearing what you

[2:08:35] Trustee McConchie: think about they've got these numbers and uh you know are you going to come to the meeting so what

[2:08:40] Trustee McConchie: mechanism do we have in place right now to let islanders know that we want to have this conversation

[2:08:44] Trustee McConchie: with them and we're looking forward to talking to them yeah

[2:08:47] Planner Stockdill (probable): so that's the discussion that we need to

[2:08:49] Planner Stockdill (probable): have in amending the project charter and the plan is to have a good sound draft bylaw in place and

[2:08:56] Planner Stockdill (probable): then have those community information meetings sometime in early fall hopefully in person and

[2:09:02] Planner Stockdill (probable): that's before first reading is even given just so there's a discussion with community members

[2:09:07] Planner Stockdill (probable): sounds

[2:09:08] Trustee McConchie: great and

[2:09:09] Trustee Morrison: for something like this it would be good if the community information meeting was

[2:09:13] Trustee Morrison: not part of a regular meeting that it was actually hosted in the hall where people can walk around

[2:09:18] Trustee Morrison: and look at like charts and things and under really get into conversation about it oh yeah

[2:09:25] Voice 16: absolutely i wouldn't recommend this as part of a regular yeah

[2:09:28] Trustee Morrison: yeah yeah so okay all

[2:09:36] Trustee Patrick: right so that's

[2:09:37] Trustee Patrick: your she you'd be looking for we have to have a motion to amend uh column b or can she we include

[2:09:46] Trustee Patrick: that in the motion that's drafted on under option 2 on page 112 i

[2:09:51] Planner Stockdill (probable): would just include that in the

[2:09:52] Planner Stockdill (probable): the motion the motions or resolutions are helpful because it is helpful to track all these decisions

[2:09:57] Planner Stockdill (probable): made by the ltc and then you could actually add to that that staff provide examples of incentives

[2:10:05] Planner Stockdill (probable): for environmentally sound building practices in the ocp well

[2:10:10] Trustee Patrick: i think it's more than practices

[2:10:12] Trustee Patrick: it's options for incentive you know other other aren't you know because it could be covenants to

[2:10:19] Trustee Patrick: protect the land it could be other things that benefit the environment options

[2:10:25] Planner Stockdill (probable): for incentives

[2:10:26] Planner Stockdill (probable): yeah but that with i

[2:10:29] Trustee Patrick: think so does that make sense yeah who wants to try a

[2:10:32] Trustee Morrison: motion yeah i'll go ahead

[2:10:35] Trustee Morrison: and try one um so i think the one that we're looking at here is that the north pender island

[2:10:42] Trustee Morrison: local trust committee directed direct to staff to draft bylaw amendments for establishing a gradual

[2:10:48] Trustee Morrison: scale maximum flora floor area as outlined in table two example b for property zoned rural

[2:10:59] Trustee Morrison: residential rural rural comprehensive one and rural comprehensive two two and to amend the

[2:11:03] Trustee Morrison: definitions of lot coverage employer in the north pender land use by lot as outlined in the staff

[2:11:08] Trustee Morrison: report dated june 24th 2021 with the amendment to reduce each of the floor areas by 500 square feet

[2:11:17] Trustee Morrison: did

[2:11:21] Trustee Patrick: you get the incentive language in there yeah

[2:11:24] Trustee Morrison: that's too many things i think

[2:11:25] Trustee Morrison: okay did you catch the last bit there shannon

[2:11:33] Trustee Patrick: are you great thank you all right is there a second

[2:11:39] Trustee Patrick: to that motion for

[2:11:40] Trustee McConchie: a second yeah any

[2:11:42] Trustee Patrick: discussion on this motion uh

[2:11:44] Trustee McConchie: i just want to point out like

[2:11:45] Trustee McConchie: the everyone's going to come back and make sure like go as my house legal non-conforming and how

[2:11:50] Trustee McConchie: How does that affect my property value?

[2:11:52] Trustee McConchie: And I'm wondering how we address that in an effective way

[2:11:55] Trustee McConchie: so we don't have misinformation spread.

[2:12:00] Trustee Morrison: Yeah, we need to get out in front of that

[2:12:01] Trustee Morrison: because it really was a problem last year.

[2:12:04] Trustee McConchie: Yeah, what this motion proposes, right,

[2:12:08] Trustee McConchie: could create confusion that all houses,

[2:12:12] Trustee McConchie: because what happens is on one acre,

[2:12:15] Trustee McConchie: the maximum square foot would be 2,500 on one acre,

[2:12:20] Trustee McConchie: according to this proposal

[2:12:22] Voice 7: no it might

[2:12:23] Voice 7: be a misunderstanding

[2:12:24] Trustee McConchie: example on one on less than

[2:12:27] Trustee McConchie: one acre excuse me less than one yeah now the the people are all going to come back and they're

[2:12:33] Trustee McConchie: going to say well is that going to make my home legal non-conforming right so what what are we

[2:12:40] Trustee McConchie: how are we going to get ahead of that conversation so

[2:12:44] Planner Stockdill (probable): i put together an faq document uh gosh about

[2:12:49] Planner Stockdill (probable): about four or five months ago i'll make sure that it's on the um the project website what i could do

[2:12:54] Planner Stockdill (probable): is amend that to just include more language around this and that could be a useful document

[2:13:00] Planner Stockdill (probable): to circulate the

[2:13:02] Trustee McConchie: planner stock deal if i could get a pdf or what maybe you've sent this to me

[2:13:05] Trustee McConchie: i'm not sure but if you could send it again this is the pdf i can post legal non-conforming

[2:13:11] Trustee McConchie: questions asked yeah absolutely

[2:13:13] Trustee McConchie: that's that's

[2:13:14] Trustee Morrison: what i said yeah this is one of the issues that

[2:13:17] Trustee Morrison: It absolutely just flies around the community

[2:13:19] Trustee Morrison: and misinformation like you would believe.

[2:13:21] Trustee Patrick: And that this is the initiation of a conversation

[2:13:24] Trustee Patrick: that a drafting of just a draft.

[2:13:29] Trustee Patrick: Those subtleties are lost.

[2:13:31] Trustee Patrick: Yeah.

[2:13:31] Trustee McConchie: I guess with government though,

[2:13:34] Trustee McConchie: right now everyone's been in virtual land

[2:13:36] Trustee McConchie: and now they're emerging.

[2:13:38] Trustee McConchie: And so we have to be cognizant

[2:13:40] Trustee McConchie: and be really aware that we're doing our best

[2:13:42] Trustee McConchie: to communicate about the process and how it works.

[2:13:47] Trustee McConchie: and uh that we care about what islanders think it's just all like the point i'm just trying yeah

[2:13:52] Trustee McConchie: okay anyway so i'd be willing to vote

[2:13:54] Trustee Patrick: you're ready to call the vote then um all those in favor

[2:14:00] Trustee Patrick: and that's carried so we're going to do a second motion regarding

[2:14:05] Trustee Patrick: incentives

[2:14:07] Trustee Morrison: okay it'll be something like the the north pender island local trust committee

[2:14:13] Trustee Morrison: direct to staff to provide a list of incentives

[2:14:18] Trustee Morrison: in the OCP for addressing house size variance.

[2:14:28] Trustee Patrick: Shannon, let me know if you got that.

[2:14:35] Trustee Patrick: I

[2:14:35] Voice 6: can read that back.

[2:14:36] Voice 6: That the

[2:14:37] Voice 6: North Shore Island Local Trust Committee

[2:14:39] Voice 6: direct staff to provide a list of incentives

[2:14:41] Voice 6: in the official community plan

[2:14:43] Voice 6: for addressing house size variance.

[2:14:46] Trustee Morrison: Thank you.

[2:14:46] Trustee Morrison: all right um

[2:14:48] Trustee Patrick: is there a second to that motion seconded by trustee mcconkey any discussion

[2:14:53] Trustee Patrick: all right i'll call the vote all those in favor and that's carrying so is there any other input

[2:15:03] Trustee Patrick: coverage

[2:15:04] Trustee McConchie: yeah

[2:15:06] Trustee Patrick: that's what i was multiple buildings that you were talking about how do we deal with

[2:15:10] Trustee Patrick: yeah option

[2:15:11] Trustee McConchie: three which is on page uh 112 of the staff report uh if the ltc wishes to amend the

[2:15:19] Trustee McConchie: the definition of lot coverage and floor area,

[2:15:20] Trustee McConchie: this is an option if the LTC believes

[2:15:23] Trustee McConchie: that by including impervious services

[2:15:25] Trustee McConchie: to lot coverage calculation

[2:15:26] Trustee McConchie: will lessen the mass of the built form,

[2:15:29] Trustee McConchie: therefore contributing to the preservation

[2:15:30] Trustee McConchie: of rural character.

[2:15:32] Trustee McConchie: So your recommendation, if I understand Planner Stockdale,

[2:15:35] Trustee McConchie: is that the North Penn or Island direct staff

[2:15:37] Trustee McConchie: to draft a bylaw amendment to amend the definitions

[2:15:39] Trustee McConchie: of lot coverage and floor area in the land use bylaw, right?

[2:15:44] Trustee McConchie: I'm just-

[2:15:45] Trustee McConchie: Yes.

[2:15:46] Planner Stockdill (probable): Actually, you did that in your last motion.

[2:15:48] Planner Stockdill (probable): Yeah, that's what

[2:15:49] Trustee McConchie: I was wondering.

[2:15:50] Trustee McConchie: Just want to make sure.

[2:15:51] Trustee McConchie: Yeah.

[2:15:52] Trustee McConchie: Great.

[2:15:52] Trustee McConchie: Thank you.

[2:15:56] Trustee Patrick: All right.

[2:15:56] Trustee Patrick: Any further questions?

[2:15:58] Trustee Morrison: So one of the things I didn't see here, and again, I'm sorry, Planner Stockdale, there's

[2:16:03] Trustee Morrison: a lot of paper here, but if I missed it, just direct me to it.

[2:16:07] Trustee Morrison: But in terms of impervious surfaces issues, so like right now, which way did the definitions

[2:16:17] Trustee Morrison: definitions land on that? Like, did the definitions land that it's a building, or it's a building in

[2:16:22] Trustee Morrison: a porch in a driveway, or it's a building, you know, so because driveways are also an issue that

[2:16:27] Trustee Morrison: I had a really interesting conversation yesterday around that, like, what if we actually gave a

[2:16:34] Trustee Morrison: driveway permit to people, because often what happens is by the time people get into their

[2:16:40] Trustee Morrison: building site and realize that they're in the Islands Trust area, and they're new to the island,

[2:16:44] Trustee Morrison: and they should have all these other things they've already done a bunch of damage but if if

[2:16:48] Trustee Morrison: they actually had to get a permit to get their driveway put in it would in and it could be like

[2:16:54] Trustee Morrison: a 50 permit just to instigate the idea that you're in the trust area as you start to develop here

[2:17:00] Trustee Morrison: like here's the packet of stuff you need to consider um so i don't know there's just something

[2:17:05] Trustee Morrison: there about it's two different issues one is like what does that look like if it's a thing

[2:17:13] Trustee Morrison: and two what do we do about like paved driveways and the ecological impact that those may have

[2:17:19] Trustee Morrison: yeah

[2:17:21] Planner Stockdill (probable): so by amending the lot coverage definition which you've provided that motion to do it at

[2:17:27] Planner Stockdill (probable): the lot coverage is now going to include impermeable services and for example those

[2:17:33] Planner Stockdill (probable): are the driveways you know the cement patios and so forth but like you mentioned what's difficult

[2:17:39] Planner Stockdill (probable): about that is, you know, you don't necessarily need a permit or like a building permit for a

[2:17:46] Planner Stockdill (probable): driveway. So it's difficult for the Islands Trust to regulate now this amended definition of law

[2:17:53] Planner Stockdill (probable): coverage. So that's one of the difficulties. Really, we, staff, we'd be notified when we

[2:18:00] Planner Stockdill (probable): receive a building permit referral or for review, and that's when we would do the law coverage

[2:18:07] Planner Stockdill (probable): coverage calculation but then again the driveways don't necessarily from my understanding you don't

[2:18:13] Planner Stockdill (probable): need a permit and that's not necessarily something from my belief that islands trust can do unless

[2:18:17] Planner Stockdill (probable): you establish a development permit area but that would be a larger yeah okay all

[2:18:28] Trustee Morrison: right any further

[2:18:28] Trustee Morrison: questions so as it stands right now 25 of lot coverage is available to be covered by impervious

[2:18:37] Trustee Morrison: surfaces including the house that is that still exist because what's covering the impermeable

[2:18:44] Trustee Morrison: surfaces so

[2:18:46] Voice 16: you mean in the current bylaw

[2:18:48] Trustee Morrison: no like even in this amendment like we're talking house

[2:18:51] Trustee Morrison: size here today what we haven't really necessarily talked is like shed coverage driveway coverage

[2:18:57] Trustee Morrison: porch coverage like all of that so

[2:19:01] Planner Stockdill (probable): that's in your definition of lot coverage so when you're looking

[2:19:05] Planner Stockdill (probable): So lot coverage, the way I see it, is when you're from a bird's-eye view, when you're looking down, what percentage of the land is covered?

[2:19:13] Planner Stockdill (probable): And the current definition in the Land Use By-law only includes buildings and structures, but structures do not include impermeable services.

[2:19:24] Trustee Morrison: No, I understand the definition. Sorry, I'm not being very clear.

[2:19:27] Trustee Morrison: So I understand the definition of what we're changing. What I don't

[2:19:30] Trustee Morrison: understand is the percentage.

[2:19:32] Trustee Morrison: Is the percentage

[2:19:32] Trustee Morrison: still staying the same?

[2:19:34] Planner Stockdill (probable): Yeah. They're still saying the same, unless the LTC gives direction to reduce that amount.

[2:19:39] Planner Stockdill (probable): So 25 is the number.

[2:19:41] Trustee Morrison: Yeah. Okay. So that, that is the question. I'm not sure how to address that,

[2:19:45] Trustee Morrison: but so at the moment, 25% of a lot could be covered in impervious surfaces. Um, and that

[2:19:52] Trustee Morrison: has an impact on water. I don't know that I'm prepared to deal with that on a rational level

[2:19:57] Trustee Morrison: right now, because I don't know what the, um, impacts of our water study are. So like, until

[2:20:03] Trustee Morrison: we know what the impacts of our water study are i don't know that we can make a clear decision on

[2:20:07] Trustee Morrison: that yeah

[2:20:12] Trustee McConchie: i think there's a lot in this bylaw already and let's deal with that like the motion

[2:20:16] Trustee McConchie: that was just passed yeah but i i don't want this to go off the rails yeah does

[2:20:22] Trustee McConchie: that make sense

[2:20:23] Trustee Patrick: we're hearing you okay so then have kim proceed with the next section yeah

[2:20:30] Planner Stockdill (probable): so i'm just going to

[2:20:31] Planner Stockdill (probable): highlight the items where further direction is required unless the LTC has questions about other

[2:20:38] Planner Stockdill (probable): points that I haven't raised. So in terms of the industrial regulation amendments staff have

[2:20:46] Planner Stockdill (probable): prepared a very draft version a black line version of the LUB amendment bylaw and because this bylaw

[2:20:53] Planner Stockdill (probable): is so large it's going to actually it won't be attached to a staff report because the agenda

[2:20:58] Planner Stockdill (probable): would then be four or five hundred pages so unfortunately with these amendments the map

[2:21:06] Planner Stockdill (probable): amendments weren't complete so we couldn't actually include that so that's something that

[2:21:10] Planner Stockdill (probable): will come so one point that staff wanted clarity from the LTC is in regards to the property located

[2:21:20] Planner Stockdill (probable): It's located at 3418 South Otter Bay Road, and this is the portion of the lot that's between the recycling depot and McDonald Farm.

[2:21:31] Planner Stockdill (probable): The LTC gave direction to rezone this property to allow for waste transfer, composting, and a recycling or reuse facility.

[2:21:42] Planner Stockdill (probable): But staff are proposing that that property would actually be rezoned to a general industrial use. So it would, all uses permitted in the general industrial use zone would be permitted, in addition to the waste transfer composting and recycling.

[2:22:03] Planner Stockdill (probable): recycling and that's on page eight of the staff report it's in that table it's the current zoning

[2:22:11] Planner Stockdill (probable): is I2C and staff are proposing to rezone that to that new general industrial zone with a site

[2:22:20] Planner Stockdill (probable): specific additional uses for the waste transfer composting and also recycling there's also a map

[2:22:29] Planner Stockdill (probable): on page nine of the staff report which is on page 116 of the agenda it's the property with the

[2:22:37] Planner Stockdill (probable): number two there so that's the that's the property um in question if the ltc wanted the um that to

[2:22:44] Planner Stockdill (probable): be zoned the general industrial zone to include those additional uses okay

[2:22:52] Trustee Patrick: so looking for feedback

[2:22:54] Trustee Patrick: back

[2:22:58] Voice 8: thoughts trustee

[2:23:04] Trustee McConchie: morrison do you want to go first or do you want me to go oh go

[2:23:07] Trustee Morrison: ahead okay

[2:23:08] Trustee McConchie: like i mean uh the crux of the issue for me as a trustee comes down to am i telling people how to

[2:23:16] Trustee McConchie: run their land or am i getting any feedback from them on how they want their land to operate

[2:23:22] Trustee McConchie: so this particular issue we're kind of telling the people you know what what in a fantasy world

[2:23:30] Trustee McConchie: old we would love to make the island run great because we've been thinking about it and we've

[2:23:33] Trustee McConchie: been talking to people and why don't you get it together and use your land for what the community

[2:23:38] Trustee McConchie: needs right and so i'm just like at this point i'm sort of wanting to back away from this industrial

[2:23:45] Trustee McConchie: review uh mainly because a lot of this a lot of these issues are like businesses versus with

[2:23:53] Trustee McConchie: with landowners and there's TUPs all that it's kind of driven by the

[2:23:58] Trustee McConchie: industrial folks right now.

[2:24:00] Trustee McConchie: So I don't know what positive feedback we're going to get at all.

[2:24:05] Trustee McConchie: If we start telling them how to zone their land.

[2:24:07] Trustee McConchie: Well, I agree with what the staff are saying.

[2:24:09] Trustee McConchie: Like it makes perfect logical sense.

[2:24:12] Trustee McConchie: I'm like hearing crickets from anybody that, that owns industrial land.

[2:24:18] Trustee McConchie: You know, I don't know what they think about this.

[2:24:20] Trustee McConchie: I don't know what happens if I zone the land and then there's some sort of a challenge to it, which I don't know if that's correct, that we can be legally challenged by just changing the zoning.

[2:24:32] Trustee McConchie: Maybe, Robert, you can clarify that. But those are my thoughts at this point.

[2:24:39] Trustee McConchie: I'm sort of wanting to back away from this whole thing altogether, to be honest, at this point, especially until we get a chance to hear from people, because I've heard nothing.

[2:24:49] Trustee McConchie: think so those are my thoughts it's hard to be a drag but

[2:24:54] Trustee Morrison: that's okay robert uh

[2:24:57] Voice 16: so the question

[2:24:59] Voice 16: about being legally challenged yeah i mean someone can challenge you legally whether they'd be

[2:25:03] Voice 16: successful or not is a whole different story but uh yeah you can change zoning on properties um i

[2:25:08] Voice 16: think the the thought with the uh the property by the recycling center is to continue to include

[2:25:15] Voice 16: the contractor yard business there because you know there's there's one or two there there have

[2:25:19] Voice 16: been one or two operating there historically so rather than render them non-conforming keep that

[2:25:24] Voice 16: as an option for the contractor businesses and

[2:25:28] Trustee Morrison: so that but that one by the recycling center is

[2:25:31] Trustee Morrison: currently zoned for storage is that right oh

[2:25:34] Voice 16: i think so yeah uh manufacturing processing repair

[2:25:38] Voice 16: of goods and materials yeah okay

[2:25:40] Trustee Morrison: yeah it's interesting i've um since we originally talked

[2:25:46] Trustee Morrison: talked about this i i haven't hit everybody but i've gone around and talked to most of the

[2:25:52] Trustee Morrison: industrial owners and operators especially up in the port wash area and some of the commercial

[2:25:57] Trustee Morrison: operators up there and um have just been asking sort of other random people which is limited right

[2:26:05] Trustee Morrison: now because of you know covid we're not mixing um about sort of different industrial uses on on the

[2:26:13] Trustee Morrison: the land and then like we had a couple people come here and talk um at different times or emails from

[2:26:18] Trustee Morrison: various people and and i don't think that there's clear consensus or opinion on like where everything

[2:26:25] Trustee Morrison: goes and where it should go and like um you know how property might shift use in the next little

[2:26:34] Trustee Morrison: while or why it would shift to use that that's being held in tension with the issue of you know

[2:26:42] Trustee Morrison: no plan is not necessarily the way that we have the island develop right so and we do have an

[2:26:50] Trustee Morrison: official community plan but you know there's just it's just a complicated terrain because of the

[2:26:58] Trustee Morrison: land just exactly what ben said like because of who owns what land and the dynamics of what it's

[2:27:03] Trustee Morrison: being used for at any one time so i think the only thing that i'm more worried about than

[2:27:09] Trustee Morrison: And I kind of am okay to back away from some of this and like have it as a, you know, one

[2:27:15] Trustee Morrison: off for a while, just to try and figure out maybe the next time we do an OCP, we like

[2:27:19] Trustee Morrison: get really deep into the industrial land use planning with everybody on the island about

[2:27:23] Trustee Morrison: industrial and like really get clear, you know, where things should be or shouldn't

[2:27:29] Trustee Morrison: be and why.

[2:27:31] Trustee Morrison: But the only thing I think that we need to find some site for is waste transfer, because

[2:27:38] Trustee Morrison: because like we're supposed to have somewhere that is waste transfer and that's a problem

[2:27:45] Trustee Morrison: not to have something like that so i i'm open to suggestions about that and maybe we just do a

[2:27:52] Trustee Morrison: bunch of different places waste transfer and people work it out among them like you know

[2:27:57] Trustee Morrison: on existing industrial property we just add waste transfer to a bunch of existing industrial

[2:28:03] Trustee Morrison: property and people sort it out um yeah

[2:28:06] Voice 16: so so in the current draft it would be those those two

[2:28:09] Voice 16: industrial sites on otter bay road the old gulf excavating site and the one by the recycling

[2:28:15] Voice 16: center but as you know it's the same property same owner but

[2:28:18] Trustee Morrison: it could also be oh no that one's

[2:28:20] Trustee Morrison: non-industrial zone right now it's on a tup were

[2:28:23] Planner Stockdill (probable): there any others kim that were no those were the

[2:28:26] Planner Stockdill (probable): only two those were the

[2:28:26] Voice 16: only two right but

[2:28:27] Planner Stockdill (probable): the subdivision regulations would change as such that

[2:28:30] Planner Stockdill (probable): that it would lend itself to actually subdivide

[2:28:34] Planner Stockdill (probable): those two portions off.

[2:28:36] Voice 16: Yeah.

[2:28:38] Planner Stockdill (probable): But that

[2:28:39] Trustee Morrison: would have to-

[2:28:39] Planner Stockdill (probable): Can you

[2:28:39] Trustee Morrison: say that again, Kim?

[2:28:41] Planner Stockdill (probable): The lot, the subdivision regulation would be changed.

[2:28:46] Planner Stockdill (probable): So the minimum lot size would actually be reduced

[2:28:50] Planner Stockdill (probable): to allow for those two properties

[2:28:53] Planner Stockdill (probable): to be actually subdivided off the parent parcel

[2:28:55] Planner Stockdill (probable): in order for the property owner to actually sell

[2:28:59] Voice 8: those lots

[2:29:00] Planner Stockdill (probable): if they wanted to so then um those community members who would like to own and operate

[2:29:09] Voice 8: the

[2:29:10] Planner Stockdill (probable): waste transfer could potentially do so so

[2:29:13] Trustee Morrison: that to

[2:29:14] Trustee Morrison: me seems actually like a good move i

[2:29:16] Trustee Morrison: don't know that i necessarily think we should add additional um like uh additional uses to a site

[2:29:24] Trustee Morrison: without the community approving that um as a use by use but i actually do see what you're saying

[2:29:30] Trustee Morrison: like having those two pieces on honor bay actually pulled into separate um title means they could be

[2:29:39] Trustee Morrison: sold and they could be sold into community use or different people because yeah i get what you're

[2:29:43] Trustee Morrison: saying especially that one where the old gulf excavating was because that's a huge piece

[2:29:47] Trustee Morrison: property yeah yeah the

[2:29:50] Voice 16: ltc had a bit of discussion about that probably about six months ago now it

[2:29:53] Voice 16: was in the discussion paper and yeah and there's obviously obstacles or costs associated with

[2:29:59] Voice 16: of the vision.

[2:30:00] Voice 16: but it gives the opportunity to do that, to create separate title for those industrial pieces.

[2:30:05] Trustee Morrison: Yeah. So from my perspective, I think that would be one thing I'd want to hang on to,

[2:30:09] Trustee Morrison: because that's potentially a solution to the waste management project that's plagued us for

[2:30:13] Trustee Morrison: like eight years. So, and we don't necessarily add new uses to that right now, but we do allow

[2:30:21] Trustee Morrison: those to be sub-developed and then allow opportunity if people want to sell the property

[2:30:29] Trustee Morrison: and somebody else wants to buy it and apply for a new use to it then that would be dealt with as

[2:30:35] Trustee Morrison: the applications come up

[2:30:43] Voice 8: whoops um

[2:30:44] Trustee McConchie: okay those are interesting points trustee morrison um

[2:30:48] Trustee McConchie: i guess uh like i don't know if i belong as part of the conversation because of like my

[2:30:55] Trustee McConchie: belief in how things should go and i'm not trying to revisit a decision the trust committee made

[2:31:01] Trustee McConchie: But this conversation will continue to happen in the future years to come. Because at some point, a trust committee has to be like, no, we stop industrial land to force the business owners and the landowners to figure out how to get along, right?

[2:31:17] Trustee McConchie: Right. So we can we can continue to juggle these areas of land.

[2:31:23] Trustee McConchie: Right. But because there's no like hard sticking point or incentive for the land landowners and the business operators to really cooperate.

[2:31:32] Trustee McConchie: Right. It might be a continual T.U.P. thing or or or maybe like I don't know how it's going to unfold right now.

[2:31:41] Trustee McConchie: And like I mean that with respect, I'm not trying to like rehash a decision.

[2:31:46] Trustee McConchie: I'm just saying, like, that's why I feel uncomfortable, because I could, I'm a hardliner with regards to this, that they should have sorted it out on their own, right? And then if not, apply for rezoning. So, because it's a serious use of land, right? So, yeah, like, that's why I say, I don't know if I have anything positive to contribute, but I want to contribute positively to this.

[2:32:11] Trustee McConchie: but that's kind of where my beliefs stand if that makes sense I yeah

[2:32:16] Trustee Morrison: yeah the

[2:32:18] Trustee McConchie: question

[2:32:19] Trustee Morrison: that I have

[2:32:20] Trustee Morrison: been like do you think that do you think that having the old gulf excavating site and the site

[2:32:27] Trustee Morrison: beside the recycling center as actual properties that could be individually sold like separate from

[2:32:32] Trustee Morrison: any of the surrounding lands that they're in do you think that would help solve that issue so that

[2:32:37] Trustee Morrison: that people like that, you know, person X doesn't actually necessarily need to get along with person

[2:32:42] Trustee Morrison: Y. They can just sell the property to person Y. Right. And then, you know, then they're not,

[2:32:48] Trustee Morrison: you're not creating more industrial land. You're literally just saying here, you, it's your problem.

[2:32:53] Trustee Morrison: You take it, you know, and that, that's the sort of, that's the only question I think that I would

[2:33:01] Trustee Morrison: really want to consider. Cause I'm happy to just shelve the rest of it right now. And just to

[2:33:06] Trustee Morrison: to think a little bit longer, like, you know, I just don't want to push the issue of that

[2:33:11] Trustee Morrison: industrial land getting clipped from the surrounding giant rural lands, because it's

[2:33:16] Trustee Morrison: already been used industrially. And it has the potential to shift ownership now in a way that

[2:33:22] Trustee Morrison: could actually resolve several other problems in the community.

[2:33:28] Trustee McConchie: Yeah, I mean, that could be part

[2:33:30] Trustee McConchie: of it then. Because if sounds to me like you're wanting to work with these folks. And that's like

[2:33:37] Trustee McConchie: a different strategy for dealing with what is like an impossible solution like this is every

[2:33:43] Trustee McConchie: trustee since whatever 1980 has been dealing with this right and so that's why i was like i was kind

[2:33:50] Trustee McConchie: of trying to be a hardliner here but if we're going to have to if you want to if we're going

[2:33:54] Trustee McConchie: to go forward and the trust committee has voted to go with a particular direction then perhaps

[2:33:59] Trustee McConchie: that's the right way to go about it you know i i can't argue against it but so i'd be happy to

[2:34:06] Trustee McConchie: support that if that's something you think

[2:34:08] Trustee Patrick: would

[2:34:09] Trustee McConchie: help resolve this you know

[2:34:10] Trustee Patrick: so do we need for you

[2:34:11] Trustee Patrick: already have taken that direction to allow for the subdivision of the smallest parcel yeah that's

[2:34:17] Trustee Patrick: correct yeah

[2:34:18] Voice 16: yeah yeah i think yeah so the question i guess we're seeking is is do you

[2:34:22] Voice 16: does the trust committee want to go forward with a draft bylaw that allows the um the waste uh

[2:34:28] Voice 16: transfer uses on the gulf excavating site the site by the recycling center um as you give direction

[2:34:36] Voice 16: previously or pull that back yeah

[2:34:38] Trustee McConchie: that that makes sense to me like i don't know what

[2:34:41] Trustee McConchie: what mr allen

[2:34:42] Trustee McConchie: is doing with the property or the one or mr mr and mrs wine are doing but it's an empty industrial

[2:34:47] Trustee McConchie: land sort of sitting there

[2:34:49] Trustee Morrison: yeah i think so

[2:34:50] Trustee Morrison: i think so and

[2:34:52] Trustee McConchie: and okay and yeah we've been we've

[2:34:54] Trustee McConchie: been trying really hard to work uh to support this type of thing i i i have we heard any feedback i

[2:35:01] Trustee McConchie: i don't know yeah

[2:35:04] Trustee Morrison: i mean nothing but but i think what that does is it does do it's a it's a bit of

[2:35:09] Trustee Morrison: a middle ground in the short term uh basically telescoping is it telescoping that's what it's

[2:35:14] Trustee Morrison: called telegraphing telegraphing are um it's late i'm vaccinated um so it telegraphs our intent

[2:35:23] Trustee Morrison: tent to be like you know these are the spots now we've zoned um for this yeah

[2:35:31] Voice 16: how

[2:35:32] Trustee Patrick: we get a conversation going okay

[2:35:36] Voice 16: kim you got what you need do

[2:35:38] Trustee Patrick: you need a resolution on that

[2:35:40] Trustee Patrick: nope no okay is there so that's good for now is there another any other feedback you need

[2:35:48] Trustee Patrick: the

[2:35:48] Planner Stockdill (probable): last comment actually it just leads into the discussion of community engagement and shifting

[2:35:54] Planner Stockdill (probable): the timeline and the project charter just shifting the timeline as the draft bylaw we need a few more

[2:36:02] Planner Stockdill (probable): months to get that completed and also shifting the community information meetings we were supposed

[2:36:10] Planner Stockdill (probable): to schedule those over the summer months but shifting those back to to early late fall

[2:36:15] Planner Stockdill (probable): hopefully so we can have them in person and again these are we'd be presenting the draft bylaw and

[2:36:21] Planner Stockdill (probable): that's where this discussion which it sounds like the ltc really wants to have with community members

[2:36:26] Planner Stockdill (probable): that's when you're going to have that there great

[2:36:29] Trustee Morrison: so

[2:36:30] Planner Stockdill (probable): there is a recommendation on page

[2:36:34] Planner Stockdill (probable): 108. thank you 108 of the stuff or of the agenda and that's to

[2:36:41] Planner Stockdill (probable): approve the updated project charter to reflect the new timeline trustees what would you like

[2:36:49] Planner Stockdill (probable): to

[2:36:49] Voice 7: do this

[2:36:50] Trustee McConchie: this covers everything the commercial regulation review so so

[2:36:56] Planner Stockdill (probable): um no because staff did

[2:36:59] Planner Stockdill (probable): not need any clarity right

[2:37:01] Voice 8: now so

[2:37:02] Planner Stockdill (probable): that it that does prompt me to state that again we're i'm

[2:37:07] Planner Stockdill (probable): hoping to have a draft bylaw presented to the ltc for the july meeting and those will incorporate

[2:37:12] Planner Stockdill (probable): the comments that we've heard today and also from the letters of the c2 that mckinnon wrote

[2:37:17] Planner Stockdill (probable): properties yeah sorry

[2:37:19] Trustee Morrison: there's one one other thing that i wanted to just highlight because it's come

[2:37:23] Trustee Morrison: up it's in the staff report but we haven't talked about it and i feel the need to state it

[2:37:30] Trustee Morrison: helicopter prohibition is in here so a recreational helicopter prohibition is in here

[2:37:37] Trustee Morrison: um and that was something that we asked for different options did you need to have any

[2:37:43] Trustee Morrison: other clarification from us it didn't look like it from what i saw in here but i did want to name

[2:37:49] Trustee Morrison: that it was in there not

[2:37:51] Planner Stockdill (probable): at this time but if the ltc feels like something should be added we can do

[2:37:55] Planner Stockdill (probable): that um and again this is all in draft form so this can be amended over the next few months but

[2:38:01] Planner Stockdill (probable): i wanted to put that in there because i know it was a high priority and it is in the blackline

[2:38:06] Planner Stockdill (probable): version of the draft bylaw as well which is on the project website no

[2:38:10] Trustee Morrison: that's great because i

[2:38:11] Trustee Morrison: I just wanted

[2:38:12] Trustee Morrison: to have Kimmy be able to comment, yeah.

[2:38:16] Voice 16: Kim, is your

[2:38:16] Voice 16: hope that at the July meeting

[2:38:19] Voice 16: discussion focusing on the C2 properties

[2:38:23] Voice 16: and the agricultural zoning?

[2:38:25] Planner Stockdill (probable): That's correct, yes.

[2:38:27] Voice 16: And I'm glad to say at this point,

[2:38:30] Voice 16: we seem to have gotten past this huge flurry of applications

[2:38:33] Voice 16: we had at the first half of the year.

[2:38:35] Voice 16: So at this point, the agenda for July

[2:38:37] Voice 16: looks like we can largely just focus

[2:38:40] Voice 16: on the land use bylaw review.

[2:38:42] Trustee Morrison: Okay. And so for the C2 related properties, I know that I saw from your emails, Kim, that there was a number of different folks that we still had to reach out to, right? Or one, at least, that we're still reaching out to and hadn't got in contact with. And I wanted to just thank the

[2:39:01] Trustee Morrison: Leslie.

[2:39:02] Trustee Morrison: Leslie yeah today for coming and talking to us about that that and I'm a little worried that

[2:39:08] Trustee Morrison: the communication letter wasn't uh I don't know I'm just a little worried about how that

[2:39:14] Trustee Morrison: communication came across because one of the things that we want to make sure is just that

[2:39:17] Trustee Morrison: commercial property owners who have land are really just informing us of what their plans

[2:39:21] Trustee Morrison: are so that we can think about that when the commercial comes so yeah

[2:39:25] Trustee McConchie: so so I'd like to make

[2:39:27] Trustee McConchie: Sorry to interrupt, Planner Stockdale.

[2:39:29] Trustee McConchie: I'm happy to move forward if that's cool.

[2:39:31] Trustee McConchie: I think that's where

[2:39:32] Trustee McConchie: you were kind of hoping to direct the LTC, because it's 6 o'clock.

[2:39:36] Voice 8: Yeah.

[2:39:37] Trustee McConchie: But this is good.

[2:39:38] Trustee McConchie: I love this time.

[2:39:38] Trustee McConchie: This is really, my mind is fresh.

[2:39:41] Trustee McConchie: I'd like to make a motion that the North Banner Island Local Trust Committee approve the updated

[2:39:45] Trustee McConchie: project charter for the land use bylaw review project dated June 24th, 2021.

[2:39:50] Trustee Patrick: Is there a second?

[2:39:51] Trustee Patrick: Seconded by Trustee Moore.

[2:39:52] Trustee Patrick: Is there any discussion?

[2:39:53] Trustee Patrick: I'll call the vote.

[2:39:54] Trustee Patrick: All those in favor?

[2:39:56] Trustee Patrick: And that's carried.

[2:39:57] Trustee Patrick: So, more to come on the land use bylaw in the next meeting. So thank you very much, Kim. And thanks trustees for progressing your way through this many tentacled activity.

[2:40:12] Trustee McConchie: There's not too much left though.

[2:40:14] Trustee Patrick: No, you're getting you're starting to make some serious progress. That's good.

[2:40:20] Trustee Patrick: um okay so the next thing on our agenda is the soil bylaw project and that's 13.2 and it's on

[2:40:27] Trustee Patrick: page 124 of the agenda package thank

[2:40:30] Voice 16: you so really this is a bit of an update for the local trust

[2:40:33] Voice 16: committee and seeking formal direction to prepare a draft bylaw but it's also an opportunity well

[2:40:40] Voice 16: i took an opportunity to kind of highlight for the local trust committee some of the issues that

[2:40:44] Voice 16: that I've seen in looking at other soil bylaws

[2:40:46] Voice 16: and just doing some research in general.

[2:40:48] Voice 16: And those are mainly on the second page of the staff report,

[2:40:52] Voice 16: but also to propose or put forward some objectives

[2:40:58] Voice 16: that would inform the drafting of the bylaws

[2:41:01] Voice 16: so the LTC can have a look and look at that,

[2:41:04] Voice 16: add to them, delete any, et cetera.

[2:41:07] Voice 16: And this kind of comes out of the fact that soil bylaws,

[2:41:13] Voice 16: there's no real rationale or context for them in the local government act it just says that

[2:41:19] Voice 16: local governments can adopt soil deposit and removal bylaws and most of the bylaws don't

[2:41:24] Voice 16: really have any explanation as part of the part of the bylaw it's a piece of legislation or an

[2:41:29] Voice 16: enactment so um that sort of helped guide the the drafting of the bylaw i've got these these um

[2:41:37] Voice 16: objectives proposed and they're starting on page 125 at the bottom of the agenda package

[2:41:42] Voice 16: And the first one is protecting environmentally sensitive areas from disturbance, protect surface water flows, protect drinking water quality, archaeological and cultural heritage sites, protect geologically hazardous areas, address potentially contaminated soil and fill,

[2:42:06] Voice 16: regulate large-scale soil excavation and deposits to ensure it doesn't impose a hazard or impacts

[2:42:13] Voice 16: minimize impacts on agricultural lands and address climate change mitigation

[2:42:18] Voice 16: essentially that element is by allowing soil deposit in a regulated manner and soil removal

[2:42:26] Voice 16: as well in a regulated manner you can potentially do it on the island rather than importing soil

[2:42:32] Voice 16: from off island and exporting soil to some somewhere else as phil this is the opportunity

[2:42:38] Voice 16: for the local trust committee to kind of have a bit of a bit of a review and discussion of that

[2:42:42] Voice 16: and the recommendation is to give direction to proceed with preparing a draft bylaw

[2:42:46] Voice 16: based on these objectives all

[2:42:49] Trustee Patrick: right so feedback on the objectives so

[2:42:52] Trustee Morrison: most of those objectives

[2:42:54] Trustee Morrison: look fine to me um the one thing that i really am not super fan of is the public works being

[2:43:00] Trustee Morrison: and excluded because there's two different instances that I know of where I felt there

[2:43:06] Trustee Morrison: was probably problematic issues around that. And I just, I, I just don't want it. So I think

[2:43:15] Trustee Morrison: public works needs to be included in this. They have to apply for the permit.

[2:43:19] Trustee Morrison: Okay.

[2:43:21] Trustee Morrison: Trustee McConkie, any comments?

[2:43:23] Trustee McConchie: So the question is, what is the objective? The response, the reason why that I, you know,

[2:43:29] Trustee McConchie: we kind of started discussing this is because i've seen some really significant um suburban

[2:43:37] Trustee McConchie: style excavating taking place um meaning like people will move there's companies that are

[2:43:44] Trustee McConchie: taking land flattening it out and the soil disrupting their neighbor or i've seen some

[2:43:50] Trustee McConchie: uh clear cuts where you know the the they're basically the lot was clear-cutted and then

[2:43:57] Trustee McConchie: And the property was totally just scarred going up and down the land.

[2:44:02] Trustee McConchie: And then I've been driven in Magic Lake and there's just people that are taking giant chunks out of the side of a mountain and there's no geotechnical DPA on there or whatever.

[2:44:12] Trustee McConchie: So that concerns me that there doesn't seem to be any thought as to like what happens when I just destroy a whole part of the side of a cliff side, you know, in Magic Lake, right?

[2:44:24] Trustee McConchie: so um i don't want to create a whole bunch of needless bureaucracy i wanted to specifically

[2:44:30] Trustee McConchie: target um the major ground disturbance i guess would be and what how yeah sorry do you think

[2:44:41] Voice 16: objective four is speaking do you

[2:44:44] Voice 16: think objective sorry seven is speaking to that objective seven

[2:44:47] Voice 16: to

[2:44:48] Trustee McConchie: regulate large-scale excavation and soil deposit to ensure it does not pose hazard both

[2:44:52] Trustee McConchie: both on-site to adjacent properties and that?

[2:44:54] Trustee McConchie: Yes.

[2:44:54] Voice 8: Yeah.

[2:44:55] Trustee McConchie: Yeah.

[2:44:56] Trustee McConchie: So you can't have someone come on with an excavator beside you

[2:44:59] Trustee McConchie: and significantly disrupt the environment that's around you

[2:45:03] Trustee McConchie: with an excavator, essentially.

[2:45:05] Trustee McConchie: Now, the concern I have is that this will needlessly impede some work

[2:45:11] Trustee McConchie: that is obviously not that disruptive and it's minor

[2:45:15] Trustee McConchie: and then they have to go through the permitting process

[2:45:17] Trustee McConchie: and staff get bogged down with work.

[2:45:20] Trustee McConchie: and that's that's the worry i have so like a typical contractor like i don't think braden

[2:45:25] Trustee McConchie: minds if i point out his name but big dig i'm contracting if he goes and he he has to pay

[2:45:31] Trustee McConchie: another thousand bucks for something you know like where we get community buy-in is kind of

[2:45:37] Trustee McConchie: one of the concerns i have with this um and now we become an overarching uh you know domineering

[2:45:44] Trustee McConchie: government local government but really it's trying to prevent you know major works from

[2:45:50] Trustee McConchie: happening and disrupting people's quality of life and their property so those

[2:45:55] Voice 16: are kind of the

[2:45:55] Trustee McConchie: concern am i i'm not sure i'm rambling on but i'm i hope i'm articulating some of the concerns and

[2:46:01] Voice 16: that's where the volumes come in and the exemptions and those are some of the issues i saw i'm looking

[2:46:06] Voice 16: at other bylaws and some of the experiences the volumes are set too low and think certain things

[2:46:11] Voice 16: weren't exempted on one hand um but yeah it's a it's a regulatory regime and so there's going to

[2:46:17] Voice 16: be there's going to be process associated with it and some people aren't going to like it right one

[2:46:24] Trustee Patrick: of the things is just to maybe sit down and talk with some of the uh some of the major excavating

[2:46:31] Trustee Patrick: companies on north fender uh you know maybe before pen goes to paper just because it might help avoid

[2:46:39] Trustee Patrick: some of that if they can you know where's that threshold

[2:46:42] Trustee McConchie: if i can interrupt chair patrick just

[2:46:45] Trustee McConchie: because i want to follow that train of thought i have been trying to talk to these guys and say

[2:46:50] Trustee McConchie: and girls and say hey what are you doing and they go well i'm listening to the client that's that's

[2:46:57] Trustee McConchie: why that that's the impetus for bringing it towards a government regulation i agree with

[2:47:02] Trustee Patrick: moving but i'm just saying if they are they could give us some input that might help the exemptions

[2:47:08] Trustee Patrick: and the volumes. And if they felt that they were consulted, it might prevent some of the kickback

[2:47:14] Trustee Patrick: because that would be the crowd that would have the largest concerns. And I think if they felt

[2:47:22] Trustee Patrick: they were reached out to, that might just help.

[2:47:26] Voice 16: Yeah. So we could do some sort of targeted

[2:47:29] Voice 16: consultation with the key, you know, we know who the key excavators are on the island. We can ask

[2:47:33] Voice 16: them for their input in a sort of preliminary way and then the project charter it's scheduled for

[2:47:39] Voice 16: the fall to to have more more consultation with stakeholders particularly if there's a draft that

[2:47:45] Voice 16: they can look at yeah

[2:47:46] Trustee McConchie: like like i will say this like it's it's hard to regulate but it's almost

[2:47:50] Trustee McConchie: like we need to set a a set of values or something with excavators and and these folks because there

[2:47:56] Trustee McConchie: There are some excavator folks that are like artists, right?

[2:48:00] Trustee McConchie: And they're known as environmentalists.

[2:48:04] Trustee McConchie: And there are some other excavator companies that are like,

[2:48:07] Trustee McConchie: I'll do the job for whatever you pay me, right?

[2:48:10] Trustee McConchie: And so I want to ensure that those folks are consulted.

[2:48:13] Trustee McConchie: So I agree, Robert, makes sense.

[2:48:17] Trustee McConchie: Are we able to reach out to them?

[2:48:18] Trustee McConchie: Like you just email?

[2:48:20] Voice 16: Yeah, if you want to send me an email with who you think you should be contacting,

[2:48:25] Trustee McConchie: And it's probably

[2:48:26] Voice 16: the same list that Phil and I would come up with.

[2:48:29] Trustee McConchie: Okay, cool.

[2:48:31] Trustee McConchie: It'd be a good party to have them all together.

[2:48:36] Trustee McConchie: I'd be happy to move this forward.

[2:48:39] Trustee McConchie: I don't know if that's okay, Chair Patrick.

[2:48:42] Trustee McConchie: I'd like to make a motion that the North Panorama Local Trust Committee

[2:48:45] Trustee McConchie: request staff to prepare a draft soil deposit and removal byline

[2:48:49] Trustee McConchie: in accordance with the objectives identified in the staff report.

[2:48:52] Trustee McConchie: Prepared for June 24th, 2021 regular meeting.

[2:48:54] Trustee McConchie: is

[2:48:55] Trustee Patrick: there a second second right trustee morrison any discussion then i'll call the vote all those

[2:49:02] Trustee Patrick: in favor and that's carried i'd

[2:49:05] Trustee McConchie: like to make a motion that north pen around the local trust

[2:49:07] Trustee McConchie: committee request staff to request that staff report back with a draft bylaw for the ltc review

[2:49:12] Trustee McConchie: at a subsequent meeting is

[2:49:15] Trustee Patrick: there a second second by trusting based

[2:49:17] Trustee McConchie: on the conversation we had i

[2:49:19] Trustee McConchie: I guess, right?

[2:49:20] Trustee McConchie: Yeah, okay.

[2:49:21] Trustee McConchie: Yeah, I second, or sorry, I vote.

[2:49:24] Trustee Patrick: Okay, we're

[2:49:25] Trustee McConchie: doing fine. Good move.

[2:49:26] Trustee Patrick: It's getting late.

[2:49:28] Trustee Patrick: I thought you said you were doing well.

[2:49:29] Trustee Patrick: I

[2:49:30] Trustee McConchie: thought I was, yeah.

[2:49:31] Trustee Patrick: Is there any further discussion?

[2:49:34] Trustee Patrick: I'll call the vote then, all those in favor?

[2:49:37] Trustee Patrick: And that's carried.

[2:49:38] Trustee Patrick: That's fine, so thanks.

[2:49:42] Trustee Patrick: And I guess staff got the feedback they needed.

[2:49:45] Trustee Patrick: So moving on, we've got the top priorities.

[2:49:48] Voice 6: I'm sorry, Chair.

[2:49:49] Trustee Patrick: Oh, sorry.

[2:49:51] Voice 6: I just wanted to clarify that the motion was as in the staff report with the addition at the end of based on the discussion held at the meeting.

[2:50:02] Trustee Patrick: Sure, if you caught that and put that in there, that's fine.

[2:50:05] Trustee Patrick: Yep.

[2:50:06] Trustee Patrick: I think it was kind of more of a clarification.

[2:50:08] Trustee Patrick: We wanted to see staff's head nodding, and they did.

[2:50:12] Trustee Patrick: But putting that in the motion is sufficient, too.

[2:50:14] Trustee Patrick: I think that would be, trustees, would you feel comfortable that that was what we had just voted on?

[2:50:19] Trustee Patrick: Yes.

[2:50:19] Trustee Patrick: Yes. Thanks, Shannon. You've got great ears.

[2:50:25] Trustee Patrick: Okay. So moving on, like I said, we have our top priorities and projects list here.

[2:50:32] Trustee Patrick: Any discussion work that you probably don't want to add more today?

[2:50:38] Trustee Patrick: Okay. You have the applications here on page 131. Are there any questions about any of the

[2:50:43] Trustee Patrick: applications? Not seeing any. Trustee local, it's been, nope, nope, nope. We have the policies and

[2:50:51] Trustee Patrick: and standing resolutions.

[2:50:53] Trustee Patrick: And there is the Islands Trust Conservancy report

[2:50:56] Trustee Patrick: that's here for May.

[2:50:58] Trustee Patrick: I think it's always important to read the work

[2:51:00] Trustee Patrick: that our Trust Conservancy is doing.

[2:51:03] Trustee Patrick: And I do, I guess we should have said

[2:51:05] Trustee Patrick: there was the NAPTEC covenant that was agreed to here

[2:51:09] Trustee Patrick: on North Pender, more land put under that program

[2:51:12] Trustee Patrick: at our last trust council and, oh, go ahead.

[2:51:16] Trustee McConchie: Yeah, Chair Patrick, I just wanted to add

[2:51:18] Trustee McConchie: like for Kate Emmings sake you know if there's anybody listening and they're

[2:51:24] Trustee McConchie: looking for a donation or a cause you know the Island Trust Conservancy is an

[2:51:28] Trustee McConchie: excellent organization and Kate was really well eloquently spoke at the last

[2:51:36] Trustee McConchie: Trust Council trying to encourage folks to get involved in preserving what land

[2:51:41] Trustee McConchie: land we have left in our uh violence trust area

[2:51:44] Trustee Patrick: oh thank you for that um so going on a new business

[2:51:50] Trustee Patrick: we have 15.1 which is a revisit of the business license uh memo that uh we talked about uh last

[2:51:56] Trustee Patrick: time um i do want to report that just having this action and having this conversation we have

[2:52:04] Trustee Patrick: had progress. There was a notice of motion brought to the CRD board for the electoral

[2:52:11] Trustee Patrick: area directors. And in July, they'll be discussing their interest in at least starting down the path

[2:52:22] Trustee Patrick: of just the feasibility work that needs to be looked at on short-term vacation rentals related

[2:52:27] Trustee Patrick: related to short business licenses related to short-term vacation rentals so you know we

[2:52:34] Trustee Patrick: that was one of the purposes of this was to get the conversation moving as another tool to look

[2:52:40] Trustee Patrick: at and examine and for understanding how that could work and so this is here if i understand

[2:52:48] Trustee Patrick: main island has passed this did galliano pass this as well yet i don't remember

[2:52:54] Trustee Patrick: um salt spring has passed it south pender

[2:52:58] Trustee Patrick: has passed it so it's just adding your voice of uh

[2:53:02] Trustee Patrick: of interest but like i said we we have started the movement has started and uh so

[2:53:15] Trustee McConchie: like is there

[2:53:16] Trustee McConchie: an action item on this because this is a south pender initiative right it

[2:53:21] Trustee Patrick: started on south we

[2:53:22] Trustee Patrick: had a joint meeting yeah yeah

[2:53:24] Trustee Patrick: yeah south pender happened to be the first local trust committee to

[2:53:28] Trustee Patrick: go so the motion was drafted for them and then uh salt spring and maine passed essentially the same

[2:53:34] Trustee Patrick: the same motion was just putting their you know the island uh local trust committee name in there

[2:53:40] Trustee Patrick: so it's just a series of uh uh islands that are local trust committees that are just adding their

[2:53:46] Trustee Patrick: voice by passing this resolution so

[2:53:48] Trustee McConchie: we're essentially like super regulating short-term

[2:53:51] Trustee McConchie: vacation rentals like you know we already have the tup process and now we're asking them to also get

[2:53:57] Trustee McConchie: a business license correct this

[2:54:00] Trustee Patrick: is this isn't about super regulating this is about exploring

[2:54:05] Trustee Patrick: a potential other tool and this tool could either replace the temporary use permit perhaps in the

[2:54:12] Trustee Patrick: future um um so it's it's it's another tool uh we still have to do the land use planning where

[2:54:19] Trustee Patrick: our short-term vacation where's that use allowed that is an island specific question and a regulatory

[2:54:25] Trustee Patrick: regulatory authority within the Islands Trust. Where would this type of use be allowed? Under

[2:54:29] Trustee Patrick: what circumstances? Is it home-based? Is it this? Is it that? Those are, or is it this zone? You

[2:54:34] Trustee Patrick: know, those are the questions that we would have. If a short, if a business license existed, it

[2:54:39] Trustee Patrick: would be, that's one of the things it would look at. Looking at how it's used in like Penticton,

[2:54:47] Trustee Patrick: I looked at Penticton and Tofino, for example. The business license not only looks at land use,

[2:54:53] Trustee Patrick: that's one of the questions is it permitted in this location but it's also do they have life

[2:54:58] Trustee Patrick: safety do they fire you know there's there's that whole life safety question that comes to play

[2:55:04] Trustee Patrick: um and then like uh there's some uh the the number question comes into play how many in the

[2:55:12] Trustee Patrick: in so that one have you been grappling with how many should there be in those type of things

[2:55:16] Trustee Patrick: so there's a series of issues there's we're a long ways the crd has a lot of work to do

[2:55:23] Trustee Patrick: if it were to implement a business license service and they're just starting that question

[2:55:30] Trustee Patrick: so they're going to have lots of questions for islands trust to understand you know what we

[2:55:36] Trustee Patrick: would want or what how we how we dovetail together they don't exist independently right can i try to

[2:55:46] Trustee Morrison: to synthesize that just because i want to make sure i understand what what we'd be doing because

[2:55:51] Trustee Morrison: i i have worries too that this would be a double issue so my understanding is if we had a vote on

[2:55:58] Trustee Morrison: our if we put forward a similar motion for north pender what we're asking the crd to do basically

[2:56:03] Trustee Morrison: is do the thing they're supposed to do which is to regulate just just one sec to regulate

[2:56:10] Trustee Morrison: business-like activity on the island, given that these are places where people, it's not a home

[2:56:16] Trustee Morrison: based business because this is, this is actually about people who are renting when they're not

[2:56:21] Trustee Morrison: there. That's what the STVRs is. So it would just be a, well, there's only one or two that are like

[2:56:29] Trustee Morrison: that anyway. So yeah, it seems like it's a good move from my perspective. And then we wouldn't

[2:56:35] Trustee Morrison: actually have stvrs in tups necessarily we just make a rule this is the rule you can put so many

[2:56:41] Trustee Morrison: there and so many here and that's it and we're hands off so that'd

[2:56:46] Voice 16: be great not necessarily so

[2:56:48] Trustee Morrison: think

[2:56:48] Voice 16: of a business license as it's like an administrative tool right like to operate your

[2:56:53] Voice 16: business you have to get a business license um so if it was implemented and the crd had this

[2:57:00] Voice 16: business licensing program anyone's and they could draft their bylaws so it's limited to vacation

[2:57:04] Voice 16: rentals and someone with a vacation rental or wanting to operate a vacation rental will have

[2:57:10] Voice 16: to apply for a business license. The CRD would receive the application. They would send a copy

[2:57:15] Voice 16: to Island Trust Planning Department to check zoning. They would send it to their own building

[2:57:20] Voice 16: inspection department and they would send it to the fire chief of each of the particular island

[2:57:27] Voice 16: and maybe others. And we would check it to make sure it complied with zoning. Now, if it was

[2:57:33] Voice 16: operating as a home business then yacht complies with zoning um if it was a standalone vacation

[2:57:40] Voice 16: rental they would still need a temporary use permit so they would have they would be applying

[2:57:45] Voice 16: for the temporary use permit first just like they do now and then if they get the temporary use

[2:57:49] Voice 16: permit they would go to the crd to apply for their business license or

[2:57:53] Trustee Patrick: not i mean that that those are

[2:57:54] Trustee Patrick: things that could still be decided i mean because your temporary use permit exists today yeah if it

[2:57:59] Voice 16: Because it was everything and everything else was the same as today.

[2:58:03] Trustee Patrick: Oh, sorry.

[2:58:04] Trustee Patrick: I said there could be a re-examining of how to best use the tools.

[2:58:09] Trustee Morrison: So the advantage from what I can see here is that all STVRs, home-based and not home-based, would suddenly be in a system that we would actually know how many STVRs there would be.

[2:58:20] Trustee Morrison: And they would assumably pay some kind of tax based on their business.

[2:58:24] Voice 16: They'd pay a fee for the business license.

[2:58:26] Voice 16: and then uh usually they're set up so the first time you apply it's a you know a more significant

[2:58:32] Voice 16: fee a couple hundred dollars and then it's less to renew um and business licenses can be revoked

[2:58:38] Voice 16: if you're no if you're not complying with something all

[2:58:42] Trustee Patrick: right there's still like so

[2:58:45] Trustee Patrick: there's a whole feasibility yeah exploration phase that crd would have to go through if the

[2:58:51] Trustee Patrick: three electoral area directors decide to proceed okay but we're just deciding oh

[2:58:56] Trustee McConchie: and the other

[2:58:57] Trustee Patrick: The other advantage, sorry, I'm tired too, so my brain's working at, you know, slow speed here, is that we took a regional approach, that this tool would be available over the region.

[2:59:08] Trustee Patrick: That was the concept behind this, because as a regional, right now we have no leverage with like Airbnb.

[2:59:18] Trustee Patrick: um whereas if business licenses existed in our region the gulf island region we could say well

[2:59:25] Trustee Patrick: sorry airbnb to advertise an airbnb you must post your your business license

[2:59:29] Trustee Patrick: in it so it gives us

[2:59:31] Trustee Patrick: more clout as a region because now airbnb is going to care gulf island region is an important region

[2:59:38] Trustee Patrick: um and so now we have some clout i

[2:59:44] Trustee McConchie: think it's worthy of conversation i

[2:59:46] Trustee Patrick: think so moving forward

[2:59:47] Trustee McConchie: i'm not going to shut something down right now that seems to be a good idea

[2:59:51] Trustee Patrick: there's lots of hurdles but

[2:59:53] Trustee McConchie: obviously we're expressing some concerns that can be brought

[2:59:55] Trustee McConchie: a bit further so there's not really much we need to do i guess eh no

[2:59:58] Trustee Patrick: so other so if you're

[3:00:00] Trustee Patrick: interested you can modify this motion that's on page 145 and um okay

[3:00:06] Trustee McConchie: i'd like to modify the motion

[3:00:08] Trustee McConchie: i don't know you

[3:00:10] Trustee Patrick: just put north instead of south yeah

[3:00:11] Trustee McConchie: that's what i was going to say

[3:00:12] Trustee McConchie: as per in page whatever 145 uh replace the word south pender with north pender

[3:00:19] Trustee McConchie: so

[3:00:20] Trustee Patrick: are you willing to make that motion i

[3:00:22] Trustee McConchie: i make that motion do i need to read it out

[3:00:24] Trustee McConchie: i

[3:00:24] Trustee Patrick: guess we should yes okay here

[3:00:26] Trustee Patrick: we

[3:00:28] Trustee McConchie: go whereas the north pender island local trust committee

[3:00:30] Trustee McConchie: is implementing additional policies and zoning to regulate and manage short-term vacation rentals on

[3:00:35] Trustee McConchie: north pender island the local trust committee lacks the full range of tools and enforcement

[3:00:39] Trustee McConchie: of vacation rentals therefore the north pender island local trust committee requests that the

[3:00:45] Trustee McConchie: capital regional district explore the implementation of business licensing for

[3:00:49] Trustee McConchie: for tourist accommodation and specifically

[3:00:50] Trustee McConchie: for short-term vacation rentals.

[3:00:52] Trustee Patrick: Okay.

[3:00:53] Trustee Patrick: Is there a second?

[3:00:53] Trustee Patrick: Seconded by Tristan Morrison.

[3:00:54] Trustee Patrick: Any discussion?

[3:00:56] Trustee Patrick: Call the vote.

[3:00:57] Trustee Patrick: All those in favor?

[3:00:58] Trustee Patrick: The

[3:00:58] Trustee McConchie: only discussion is,

[3:00:59] Trustee McConchie: I just want to make a really brief point, sorry,

[3:01:03] Trustee McConchie: that this continues what we've been working on,

[3:01:06] Trustee McConchie: which is to create a process that we can understand

[3:01:09] Trustee McConchie: how many are, what's taking place.

[3:01:11] Trustee McConchie: That's how I

[3:01:12] Trustee McConchie: look at this.

[3:01:13] Trustee Patrick: I

[3:01:13] Trustee McConchie: just wanted to mention that.

[3:01:14] Trustee McConchie: So that's why I support the motion.

[3:01:15] Trustee McConchie: Thank you.

[3:01:15] Trustee McConchie: All

[3:01:16] Trustee Patrick: right, I'll call the vote then all those in favor.

[3:01:17] Trustee Patrick: and that's carried now thanks guys for your support and like i said just it really showed

[3:01:23] Trustee Patrick: the power of working as a region we crd before was a hard no they're now moving forward by at

[3:01:29] Trustee Patrick: least looking at this because we as a group of trustees did ask so i was i was glad to see that

[3:01:35] Trustee Patrick: all right uh going on here we don't uh it looks like um we have uh our next meeting will be july

[3:01:47] Trustee Patrick: 29th. Oh, sorry. I didn't need to jump over this. I'm sorry. Trustee McConkie, 15.2 was your new

[3:01:55] Trustee Patrick: business item that you

[3:01:56] Trustee McConchie: brought. This can be shelled for the next meeting. I just wanted to

[3:02:00] Trustee McConchie: have a public conversation with you guys about what your positions are regarding the current

[3:02:06] Trustee McConchie: state of the Islands Trust Act and how it fits into society in a 2021 climate change, First

[3:02:14] Trustee McConchie: nation's reconciliation perspective and i i would like to make space for that in our ltc meeting

[3:02:19] Trustee McConchie: uh to let voters know and uh constituents know as we head into the next election cycle you know

[3:02:25] Trustee McConchie: where you where where you currently see things and how you what your vision is for kind of the future

[3:02:31] Trustee McConchie: so i'm not sure at 6 30 if that's the best time to have that conversation but i wanted to just

[3:02:36] Trustee McConchie: kind of let you know and and give you a heads up that i would like to make that a part of our

[3:02:40] Trustee McConchie: our local trust committee uh even if it's 15 minutes uh just put that in your guys's brain

[3:02:46] Trustee McConchie: if everything's fine and you think the honest trust act is perfect and wonderful fantastic

[3:02:51] Trustee McConchie: you think that nothing should be uh moved forward that's that's a great perspective but i don't know

[3:02:58] Trustee McConchie: i don't get the opportunity to talk to you guys anymore so that's why i wanted to put that on

[3:03:01] Trustee McConchie: the agenda that's the main reason okay thank you all right trustee

[3:03:04] Trustee Patrick: morrison oh sorry bad echo

[3:03:06] Trustee Patrick: trustee morrison do you want to proceed today or put that to the next meeting

[3:03:10] Trustee Patrick: um

[3:03:10] Trustee Morrison: i'm on meetings until 8 30 tonight so i don't care if we talk about it now or later

[3:03:15] Trustee Morrison: i'm happy to talk about it now um i i think there it's a big topic so is there any particular

[3:03:23] Trustee Morrison: spot that you are interested in starting that conversation then like in terms of

[3:03:28] Trustee Morrison: well

[3:03:29] Trustee McConchie: i'll tell you i'll tell you i i'm worried about the uh the there's an undercurrent in our

[3:03:34] Trustee McConchie: local politics that wants to disband and and get rid of the of the islands trust um i feel

[3:03:41] Trustee McConchie: government is always a work in motion and um there's no perfect governance structure but

[3:03:47] Trustee McConchie: certainly now that we're seeing consultation with first nations um we should start having a

[3:03:52] Trustee McConchie: conversation about how that's going to look when we're asking questions about what they think about

[3:03:57] Trustee McConchie: these islands again finally because our colonial government structure was like no we don't care

[3:04:02] Trustee McConchie: care necessarily about your opinion we're going to tell you what to do so that's a new point that

[3:04:06] Trustee McConchie: we need to address also the community needs to have a really serious conversation about whether

[3:04:11] Trustee McConchie: or not we're really going to protect these islands or whether or not we're going to cultivate

[3:04:18] Trustee McConchie: communities right and i felt like we sort of dabbled in it with trust council and it would

[3:04:24] Trustee McConchie: it proved to be a very divisive issue right so i i want to make this conversation um i want to i

[3:04:34] Trustee McConchie: want to make this a long-term conversation where where our government should always be open to

[3:04:40] Trustee McConchie: improving and um if if that is the case is this leading to something which would include an

[3:04:47] Trustee McConchie: amendment to the islands trust act

[3:04:49] Voice 8: right

[3:04:50] Trustee McConchie: now there is no space for that it's i might it's

[3:04:53] Trustee McConchie: sort of shot down in trust council and and there's a sort of defensiveness from the organization

[3:04:59] Trustee McConchie: like well we are doing a good job and what are you talking about whereas it's like we should

[3:05:03] Trustee McConchie: like cultivate a conversation where we're always improving this institution because it's a great

[3:05:09] Trustee McConchie: idea right well that's kind of what why i wanted to make space for it i don't know if the local

[3:05:14] Trustee McConchie: trust committee is the appropriate place for that um i like

[3:05:18] Voice 8: i don't want to know okay

[3:05:19] Trustee McConchie: great um so

[3:05:22] Trustee Morrison: yeah so

[3:05:22] Trustee McConchie: that's why I put this on the agenda today yeah

[3:05:26] Trustee Morrison: so a couple things related to that so

[3:05:28] Trustee Morrison: yeah I agree with you that I think I I think too the government is never perfect I am not a big

[3:05:36] Trustee Morrison: fan of many things about um how we're organized in terms of process ironically considering getting

[3:05:46] Trustee Morrison: getting nailed on process in the facebook today um but i'm not a big fan of the process that we

[3:05:52] Trustee Morrison: have for many things um because it doesn't seem very adaptive and flexible it doesn't seem like

[3:05:58] Trustee Morrison: it's in the modern world um versus you know how things have gone 30 years ago so i think there's

[3:06:06] Trustee Morrison: a lot of improvements in terms of the act itself um i think the act is like the idea is good i

[3:06:15] Trustee Morrison: I think the way that it's organized is not really working,

[3:06:19] Trustee Morrison: but it's why I voted for the land use,

[3:06:22] Trustee Morrison: or not the land use, sorry, the governance review.

[3:06:26] Trustee Morrison: And, you know, the governance review

[3:06:29] Trustee Morrison: is not a reflection on staff per se,

[3:06:32] Trustee Morrison: it's a reflection on the organization,

[3:06:34] Trustee Morrison: the structure of government,

[3:06:35] Trustee Morrison: because it just seems very archaic,

[3:06:39] Trustee Morrison: some of the things that are going on structurally for us.

[3:06:42] Trustee Morrison: And so I would like to see some changes in that. But it's good to know what those changes might look like going forward based on the best feedback. And so I'm happy that that review is going forward. And, you know, it is taking a bit longer than expected. So it's, you know, we'll see what we can do with that.

[3:07:01] Trustee Morrison: But I'm hoping that it actually suggests some ways forward that might be more streamlined and potentially much more, you know, appropriate for UNDRIP or for DRIPA, like with First Nations involvement in the trust.

[3:07:15] Trustee Morrison: trust um i i also i guess the one thing i was really interested in in our discussions at trust

[3:07:21] Trustee Morrison: council is just like wow is it ever hard to get people to commit to what a unique community is

[3:07:27] Trustee Morrison: or what the environment is and like how where that should sit in the hierarchy of like conflicts

[3:07:33] Trustee Morrison: and that just blew me away because i was like i don't understand why that's a complicated thing

[3:07:39] Trustee Morrison: it seems like it's pretty straightforward to me but i guess there's some pretty big differences

[3:07:44] Trustee Morrison: is and I would love to understand what what's in that and I think it gets at what you were just

[3:07:48] Trustee Morrison: talking about with like what do what do communities what are what are private rights in the trust area

[3:07:54] Trustee Morrison: versus community rights and how can we clearly explain that and collectively understand that

[3:08:01] Trustee Morrison: in the trust area that those are all things that you make me think of I

[3:08:07] Trustee Patrick: know I'm there's

[3:08:09] Trustee Patrick: there's two things I absolutely agree that you know review and looking at yourselves is is a is

[3:08:15] Trustee Patrick: is correct very important well that regulation should be you know and if you look at most modern

[3:08:20] Trustee Patrick: regulations build performance review right into the regulation so it's it's you know stand it

[3:08:28] Trustee Patrick: must occur you know at a every so many years and it'll even lay out part of the act is what's

[3:08:35] Trustee Patrick: involved in what you know a performance review of an act and i'm a strong believer of of that

[3:08:41] Trustee Patrick: And that's how I even look at our own bylaws now in Salt Spring. It's like, if we're going to create a bylaw, what was it intended to do? And that we measure that, because if it's not doing what we've set it out to do, then did we just add needless administration for no purpose? So performance and monitoring is critical.

[3:09:02] Trustee Patrick: critical um the other you know so going back and you know the province should be asking that

[3:09:08] Trustee Patrick: question this is a 45 year old piece of legislation you know did did it set out to do as intended and

[3:09:15] Trustee Patrick: does it need to be reviewed and asked from the province from from you know mom and dad should

[3:09:20] Trustee Patrick: come down and uh and and revisit and i would absolutely welcome that you know it's probably

[3:09:25] Trustee Patrick: good good time to do we're in you know in the world but the act itself i've been spending a

[3:09:31] Trustee Patrick: A lot of time, you know, sometimes going back and rereading things and reminding things and thinking of them and go, wow, there's actually a lot of stuff in here that we don't use well.

[3:09:38] Trustee Patrick: When we talk about, it's not that the act is silent on the voice of reconciliation.

[3:09:45] Trustee Patrick: There's a lot of tools in there that are useful.

[3:09:49] Trustee Patrick: One is we have the power to tell the province where their regulations aren't working for us on the islands.

[3:09:54] Trustee Patrick: We've never used it.

[3:09:57] Trustee Patrick: We've never gone to the province and say, you know that regulation you have?

[3:10:00] Trustee Patrick: it's really messing up here or it's adding other layers that are making things complicated

[3:10:05] Trustee Patrick: we also have coordinating more coordinating powers where we can coordinate harmonization

[3:10:11] Trustee Patrick: of things rather than you know and that's one of the positives that's coming out of this water

[3:10:16] Trustee Patrick: strategy thing with that round table everyone's sitting around there they're going if i'm doing

[3:10:20] Trustee Patrick: if i need to get approval for water i've got to go to the islands trust i have to go to the island

[3:10:25] Trustee Patrick: health. I have to go to Flynn Row. I have to go to five different people. Why can't it be harmonized

[3:10:31] Trustee Patrick: into a simpler process? And that we have the power of coordination to develop those processes.

[3:10:37] Trustee Patrick: And then there's the delegation powers. And under the delegation powers, you know,

[3:10:42] Trustee Patrick: Trust Council could delegate to like North Pender to enter into agreements with First Nations. So

[3:10:49] Trustee Patrick: So co-management and these other things that all exists within the structure of

[3:10:54] Trustee Patrick: the act, we just haven't used it. So I think some of this is mindset.

[3:10:58] Trustee Patrick: We have to open our mind and say, how can we use the tools we have?

[3:11:02] Trustee Patrick: And then there's the review part of it are, you know, does our,

[3:11:05] Trustee Patrick: do we have everything that we need? But so I I'm just, to me,

[3:11:10] Trustee Patrick: it's time to, you know, you can, what am I trying to do?

[3:11:14] Trustee Patrick: Do I have the tool to get me to what, what I need to do?

[3:11:17] Trustee Patrick: i

[3:11:19] Trustee McConchie: appreciate your thoughts chair patrick and trustee morrison on this well

[3:11:24] Trustee Patrick: i think it's good

[3:11:24] Trustee Patrick: to check in and talk about this from time to time because we have to end up

[3:11:27] Trustee Patrick: with trust table and

[3:11:29] Trustee Patrick: it's uh you know the more we can talk to each other and help each other and it it helps

[3:11:37] Trustee McConchie: dramatically yeah that's that's all i wanted to just put time aside for that i appreciate you

[3:11:41] Trustee McConchie: you guys diving into the act thank you

[3:11:44] Trustee Patrick: it's fun to go back and read things again okay so that

[3:11:52] Trustee Patrick: brings us we're going to have a second town hall and then we go into a closed meeting so for those

[3:11:59] Trustee Patrick: of us that wish to speak to us again we will not rework decisions that we just made today and i

[3:12:05] Trustee Patrick: I ask that you not, not go there. So this is a second town hall again,

[3:12:10] Trustee Patrick: focused to us and be respectful and,

[3:12:14] Trustee Patrick: and cognizant of time because we still have a closed meeting that we need to

[3:12:18] Trustee Patrick: go into. So is there anyone that wishes to speak to us

[3:12:25] Trustee Patrick: today or this evening, wherever we are?

[3:12:31] Trustee Patrick: I'm not seeing anyone pop their hands up. So Michael sketch.

[3:12:35] Trustee Patrick: church hello michael can

[3:12:40] Voice 13: you hello can you hear me yes

[3:12:42] Trustee Patrick: um

[3:12:42] Voice 13: i'm i i'm not um i'd like to mention

[3:12:47] Voice 13: a point of view which simply wasn't discussed not with an eye to changing a decision i don't

[3:12:53] Voice 13: think there was one but um regarding the two industrial zones owned by the allen family

[3:13:00] Voice 13: it makes uh i think good sense although it's unfortunate that the recycling society and the

[3:13:08] Voice 13: and the Allen owner weren't in on this conversation, but we must recall that the reason

[3:13:14] Voice 13: the I2C zone has been vacated is that an adjacent property owner was really upset about industrial

[3:13:23] Voice 13: use. And that property owner's point of view was paid attention to, a temporary use permit was

[3:13:30] Voice 13: was refused and the industrial operation moved to the other area, which had processing, crushing

[3:13:40] Voice 13: and storage of gravel permission, which is being done.

[3:13:44] Voice 13: The other perspective is that obviously the recycling society is really pushed for space

[3:13:53] Voice 13: and the logical place for a community service site is right beside recycling, adjacent land.

[3:13:59] Voice 13: So if you were to reverse the two recommendations for I2B and I2C, I think it would make a lot more sense to enable the community service stroke recycling society to expand across the adjacent property line or the common property line.

[3:14:20] Voice 13: and for the industrial site which is is now going on to be on the um on the other side of the road

[3:14:27] Voice 13: uh and and um i i can't help but thinking that that it should be possible to bring the

[3:14:35] Voice 13: different parties together and at least have a discussion about this stuff

[3:14:38] Voice 13: but at the at the at the minimum exchanging those those two uh permitted uses would be i think

[3:14:46] Voice 13: useful and i have one other comment if i may and i'm not trying to be in any way um contentious

[3:14:53] Voice 13: but we have been reminded there's an election coming up in 18 months whatever it is um and it

[3:15:01] Voice 13: really did sound to me as though there was an uh a definite political plug for a particular

[3:15:07] Voice 13: particular candidate and I wonder if the local trust committee to could refrain from

[3:15:16] Voice 13: plugging somebody or something.

[3:15:18] Trustee Patrick: Michael there was no there was that

[3:15:20] Trustee Patrick: wasn't done Michael so

[3:15:22] Trustee Patrick: and I think

[3:15:25] Voice 13: it was my impression.

[3:15:26] Trustee Patrick: Okay well I we just we disagree so thank you

[3:15:31] Trustee Patrick: didn't happen.

[3:15:32] Trustee Patrick: Well,

[3:15:32] Trustee McConchie: let me explain. I'll happily explain myself. I want to take the time, if anyone is interested, whether I agree with them or not, politically, to offer myself to educate them, just like previous trustees have done for me from both sides of the political spectrum.

[3:15:50] Trustee McConchie: Gary Steeves gave me his thoughts. Ken Hancock gave me his thoughts. Derek Masselin gave me his thoughts. Diane Barber gave me their thoughts. I mean, that's what I said. I'm not plugging any candidates. So please don't spread that or have that impression. Thank you.

[3:16:05] Trustee Patrick: All right. Thank you. Is there anyone else that wishes to speak to us today? Again, remember, your comments are important to the trustees, so please reach out and communicate your ideas, your comments, your suggestions, because they're always welcome.

[3:16:21] Trustee Patrick: Okay, with that, I need a motion read to go in-camera.

[3:16:25] Trustee Patrick: That's on the agenda package on page three.

[3:16:29] Trustee McConchie: Okay, on page three.

[3:16:31] Trustee McConchie: That

[3:16:31] Trustee Morrison: the meeting be closed to the public

[3:16:33] Trustee Morrison: in accordance with the community charter part four

[3:16:36] Trustee Morrison: division 3S91DI for the purpose of considering

[3:16:41] Trustee Morrison: adoption of in-camera meeting minutes

[3:16:43] Trustee Morrison: dated April 29th, 2021, legal advice,

[3:16:47] Trustee Morrison: and that the recorder and staff attend the meeting.

[3:16:51] Trustee Patrick: Is there a second?

[3:16:53] Trustee Patrick: Yeah, of course.

[3:16:53] Trustee Patrick: Seconded by Trustee McConkie.

[3:16:54] Trustee Patrick: I'll call the vote.

[3:16:55] Trustee Patrick: All those in favor?

[3:16:56] Trustee Patrick: And that's carried.

[3:16:57] Trustee Patrick: So thank you, everyone, for joining us today.

[3:17:00] Trustee Patrick: And we'll rise and report in the next meeting.

[3:17:04] Trustee Patrick: So with that, have a great evening.

[3:17:07] Trustee Patrick: Go out and enjoy the sun.

[3:17:09] Trustee Patrick: Are

[3:17:09] Trustee McConchie: we meeting on a separate link?

[3:17:12] Trustee McConchie: Yeah, Maple sent you the link.

[3:17:14] Trustee Patrick: Okay.

[3:17:15] Trustee McConchie: Okay, bye.

[3:17:16] Trustee McConchie: See you in a sec.

[3:17:16] Trustee Patrick: All right.

[3:17:17] Trustee Patrick: Bye, guys.

North Pender Local Trust Committee   
Regular Business Meeting Minutes 
June 24, 2021 ADOPTED Page 1 of 8 
 
North Pender Island Local Trust Committee 
Minutes of Regular Meeting 
 
Date: 
Location: 
June 24, 2021 
Electronic Meeting (Zoom Webinar) 
 
Members Present: Laura Patrick, Chair  
Benjamin McConchie, Local Trustee 
 Deb Morrison, Local Trustee 
  
Staff Present: Robert Kojima, Regional Planning Manager 
 Phil Testemale, Planner 2 
 Kim Stockdill, Planner 
 Maple Hung, Planning Assistant (Host) 
 Shannon Brayford, Recorder 
  
Public:         There were approximately (15) attendees in the webinar. 
 
1. CALL TO ORDER 
Chair Patrick called the meeting to order at 3:00 p.m.  She acknowledged that the meeting was 
being held in traditional territory of the Coast Salish First Nations. 
2. APPROVAL OF AGENDA 
It was recommended and agreed that Chris Roper will be granted 5 minutes for a presentation 
regarding helicopters during the Town Hall.  
By general consent, the agenda was approved as presented.  
3. TRUSTEE REPORT 
Trustee Morrison reported that the Trust Policy Statement review is moving forward and broad 
public consultation is underway.  She encouraged the public to visit the Programs Page under 
Islands 2050 and to send comments to the Islands 2050 email address before July 8, 2021 
meeting.   
Trustee Morrison also thanked the North Pender Island Agricultural Advisory Planning 
Commission (AAPC) for their comprehensive reports and minutes.  
Trustee Morrison noted that, at a past meeting, a Temporary Use Permit (TUP) was considered 
in the absence of the applicant. She recommended that the Local Trust Committee (LTC) 
consider adopting a practice of deferring applications when the applicant wishes to, but is 
unable to attend.  
A D O P T E D 

 
 
 
North Pender Local Trust Committee   
Regular Business Meeting Minutes 
June 24, 2021 ADOPTED Page 2 of 8 
Trustee McConchie requested a moment of silence for the 751 unmarked graves uncovered at a 
former Residential School in Saskatchewan.  
Trustee McConchie reported that he will not be running for a second term as a Trustee.  
4. CHAIR'S REPORT 
Chair Patrick provided a report on the upcoming Trust Council Meeting.  She noted that the 
meeting starts July 8, 2021, but that a Town Hall will be held on July 7, 2021 with an education 
session preceding it.  
5. TOWN HALL AND QUESTIONS 
Chris Roper noted that a helicopter is operating on the residential property next to his.  He 
outlined the negative impact that the helicopter has on him as a neighbour and also expressed 
concern for it causing harm to the area’s ecosystem.  
Doug Regehr addressed a TUP application for a Short Term Vacation Rental (STVR).  He 
encouraged the LTC to refuse the permit application citing noise, parking issues, and a lack of 
on-island contact.  
Niall Parker requested further information on why the the Islands 2050 recommendations 
include prohibiting de-salination as a source of water.  
It was noted that the question had been forwarded to staff and is awaiting further information.  
Leslie Kerfoot noted that she had recently purchased a property with a Commercial 2 zoning and 
the intent to operate the resort.  She reported receiving a letter implying that the zoning would 
be amended and outlined her concerns with the process and the impact it would have on her 
family’s investment.  
Michael Sketch addressed a proposed soil deposit and removal bylaw, noting staff 
recommendations for exemptions.  He encouraged the LTC to carefully consider these 
exemptions and provided rationale, including past incidences in which stronger bylaws could 
have prevented ecological damage.  
Michael Sketch recommended that the LTC not accept the staff recommendation for changing 
the Industrial I1b zone.  He provided a rationale to support his recommendation.  
Jeremy Lewis addressed the impact of vacation rentals on housing stock.  He noted that the 
island will face a crisis of not having service providers due to a lack of housing.  
6. COMMUNITY INFORMATION MEETING 
None 
7. PUBLIC HEARING 
None 
8. MINUTES 
8.1 Local Trust Committee Minutes Dated May 27, 2021 (for Adoption) 
The following amendments to the minutes were presented for consideration: 

 
 
 
North Pender Local Trust Committee   
Regular Business Meeting Minutes 
June 24, 2021 ADOPTED Page 3 of 8 
 Under item 13.2 amend to identify Barbara Johnstone as “Property Owner”, not 
“Applicant”  
By general consent, the minutes were adopted as amended. 
8.2 Section 26 Resolutions-without-meeting Report - None 
8.3 Advisory Planning Commission Minutes - None 
8.4 Agricultural Advisory Planning Commission Minutes Dated May 10, May 14, May 20 
and June 8, 2021 
Received for information.  
9. BUSINESS ARISING FROM THE MINUTES 
9.1 Follow-up Action List Dated June 2021 
Received for information.  
10. DELEGATIONS 
None 
11. CORRESPONDENCE 
Correspondence received concerning current applications or projects is posted to the LTC 
webpage 
12. APPLICATIONS AND REFERRALS 
12.1 NP-RZ-2016.1 (Mainroad) - Consideration of Adoption of Land Use Bylaw No. 202 - 
Staff Report  
Planner Testemale provided an overview of the application and associated staff report.  
He summarized the rationale for the staff recommendation, the history of the 
application, and the manners by which the applicant has satisfied all LTC conditions. 
A discussion was held regarding the consequences should the covenant be breached.  
NP-2021-070 
It was Moved and Seconded, 
that the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee Bylaw No. 202, cited as 
“North Pender Island Land Use Bylaw 103, 1996, Amendment No.1, 2016,” be 
adopted. 
 CARRIED 
12.2 NP-DP-2021.3 (Ferry) – Staff Report  
Planner Testemale provided an overview of the application and associated staff report.  
He highlighted the applicant’s rationale for requesting the Development Permit (DP) and 
the recommendations of the professional reports received.  
Chair Patrick invited the applicants to address the LTC.  

 
 
 
North Pender Local Trust Committee   
Regular Business Meeting Minutes 
June 24, 2021 ADOPTED Page 4 of 8 
Kevin Ferry provided an overview of their plans for the property and their intended 
stewardship of the treed property.  
The LTC requested and received information on the following points:  
 The rationale for siting of the septic field; and 
 Historical rationale for creation of this development permit area.  
NP-2021-071 
It was Moved and Seconded, 
that the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee approve issuance of 
Development Permit NP-DP-2021.3 (Ferry). 
 CARRIED 
Note:  A break was held from 4:44 p.m. – 4:50 p.m.  
12.3 NP-TUP-2021.5 (Pegram) – Staff Report 
Planner Testemale provided an overview of the application, the history of bylaw 
complaints against the property, and the steps taken by the applicant to minimize the 
impact of the use on neighbouring properties.  
Chair Patrick acknowledged the applicant and invited him to speak. 
Neil Pegram addressed the LTC.  He highlighted the letters of support received for his 
application, the number of rentals that have been booked for the past 5 years, and data 
tracked by the installed decimeter with an automatic alert for excessive sound. 
The LTC discussed the application and recommended that the applicant install a marker 
to delineate the property line and prevent guests from parking on the neighbour’s 
property.  
It was noted that there is an interpersonal issue between the applicant and a neighbour.  
The impact of the neighbour issues on the application were discussed and the LTC 
encouraged the neighbours to work collaboratively to reconcile the matter.  
NP-2021-072 
It was Moved and Seconded, 
that the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee approve issuance of 
renewal Temporary Use Permit NP-TUP-2021.5 (Pegram) for a period of three 
(3) years. 
 CARRIED 
13. LOCAL TRUST COMMITTEE PROJECTS 
13.1 Land Use Bylaw Review Project - Staff Report 
Planner Stockdill provided an overview of the staff report.  She highlighted the areas in 
which additional guidance is being sought by staff including: maximum floor area, 
industrial regulations, and the project charter. 
A discussion was held regarding maximum floor area including the following points:  

 
 
 
North Pender Local Trust Committee   
Regular Business Meeting Minutes 
June 24, 2021 ADOPTED Page 5 of 8 
 Importance of limiting maximum floor area in reducing tree removal and 
protecting natural character; 
 Importance of the limit reflecting interior square footage as opposed to exterior 
to ensure that different building options are not being privileged; 
 Consideration of imposing an overall floor area for all buildings on a property; 
 Consideration of allowing property owners to split the total square footage into 
two dwellings to provide additional housing stock; and 
 Consideration of incentivizing energy efficient home building and covenants by 
allowing applications for larger homes should certain conditions be met. 
NP-2021-073 
It was Moved and Seconded, 
that the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee direct to staff to draft bylaw 
amendments for establishing a gradual scale maximum floor area, as outlined in 
Table 2 Example B, for properties zoned Rural Residential, Rural, Rural 
Comprehensive 1 and Rural Comprehensive 2 and to amend the definitions of 
lot coverage and floor area in the North Pender Land Use Bylaw as outlined in 
the Staff Report dated June 24, 2021 with the amendment to reduce each of the 
floor areas by 500 square feet. 
 CARRIED 
NP-2021-074 
It was Moved and Seconded, 
that the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee direct staff to provide a list 
of incentives in the Official Community Plan for addressing house size variance.  
 CARRIED 
A discussion of additional lot coverage and impervious surfaces was held.  The LTC 
requested and received information on the regulations already proposed and the 
definitions included in the OCP.  
Planner Stockdill provided an overview of the proposed industrial regulation 
amendments.  She noted that staff is seeking direction from the LTC regarding 3418 
South Otter Bay Road and provided an overview of staff recommendations.   
A discussion of the challenges of the industrial regulation amendments was held and the 
LTC considered options for the project moving forward.  The following points were 
discussed:  
 Potential sites and opportunities for creating a property with waste transfer as a 
use, including potentials for subdivision  
 Waste transfer uses on the Gulf Excavating site.  
Planner Stockdill provided an overview of the project plan moving forward.  
NP-2021-075 
It was Moved and Seconded, 
that the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee approve the updated 
Project Charter for the Land Use Bylaw Review Project dated June 24, 2021.  
 CARRIED 

 
 
 
North Pender Local Trust Committee   
Regular Business Meeting Minutes 
June 24, 2021 ADOPTED Page 6 of 8 
13.2 Soil Bylaw Project – Staff Report  
Regional Planning Manager (RPM) Kojima provided an overview of the staff report.  He 
highlighted the recommended objectives for the project and encouraged the LTC to 
carefully consider that list.  
A discussion was held regarding the objectives of the project.  The following points were 
noted:  
 Activities by Public Works should be included in the bylaw; and 
 Stakeholder consultation, including service providers, should be undertaken 
early. 
NP-2021-076 
It was Moved and Seconded, 
That the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee request staff to prepare a 
draft soil deposit and removal bylaw in accordance with the objectives 
identified in the staff reported prepared for the June 24, 2021 regular meeting. 
 CARRIED 
NP-2021-077 
It was Moved and Seconded, 
That the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee request that staff report 
back with a draft bylaw for LTC review at a subsequent meeting, based on the 
discussion held at this meeting.  
 CARRIED 
14. REPORTS 
14.1 Work Program Report  
14.1.1 Top Priorities Report Dated June 2021 
Received for information. 
14.1.2 Projects List Report Dated June 2021 
Received for information. 
14.2 Applications Report Dated June 2021  
Received for information. 
14.3 Trustee and Local Expense Report – None 
None 
14.4 Adopted Policies and Standing Resolutions  
Received for information. 
14.5 Local Trust Committee Webpage 
No comments heard.  

 
 
 
North Pender Local Trust Committee   
Regular Business Meeting Minutes 
June 24, 2021 ADOPTED Page 7 of 8 
14.6 Islands Trust Conservancy Report Dated May 25, 2021 
Received for information. 
15. NEW BUSINESS 
15.1 Business Licenses – Memo  
Chair Patrick provided an overview of the project and update on the progress to date.  
A discussion was held regarding the role and limitations of the licences in regulating 
STVRs.  Further discussion was held regarding the benefits and concerns of adopting the 
proposed resolution. 
NP-2021-078 
It was Moved and Seconded, 
WHEREAS the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee is implementing 
additional policies and zoning to regulate and manage short term vacation 
rentals on North Pender island, the Local Trust Committee lacks the full range of 
tools for enforcement and administration of vacation rentals;  
THEREFORE the North Pender Island Local Trust Committee requests that the 
Capital Regional District explore the implementation of business licensing for 
tourist accommodation and specifically for short term vacation rentals.  
 CARRIED 
 
15.2 Amending the Islands Trust Act to change the structure of the Islands Trust 
Government 
A discussion was held including the following points:  
 Importance for reconciliation moving forward 
 Consideration of building community  
 Importance of self reflection and growth in an organization 
 
16. UPCOMING MEETINGS 
16.1 Next Regular Meeting Scheduled for July 29, 2021, Location:  TBD 
17. TOWN HALL  
Michael Sketch encouraged the LTC to consider the history and social reasons why the industrial 
zoning owned by the Allen family hasn’t been exercised.  
18. CLOSED MEETING (Distributed Under Separate Cover) 
18.1 Motion to Close Meeting 
At 6:46 p.m. Chair Patrick noted that there was a recommendation for a motion to close 
the public meeting.  She further noted that the Rise and Report will be included at the 
next Regular Business Meeting.  

 
 
 
North Pender Local Trust Committee   
Regular Business Meeting Minutes 
June 24, 2021 ADOPTED Page 8 of 8 
NP-2021-079 
It was Moved and Seconded, 
that the meeting be closed to the public in accordance with the Community 
Charter, Part 4, Division 3 s. 90(1)(d)(i) for the purpose of considering: 
• Adoption of In-Camera Meeting Minutes Dated April 29, 2021 
• Legal Advice 
AND that the recorder and staff attend the meeting.  
 CARRIED 
18.2 Recall to Order 
The meeting was recalled to order at 7:10 p.m. 
18.3 Rise and Report 
Rise and report will be deferred to the next business meeting.   
19. ADJOURNMENT 
By general consent, the meeting was adjourned at 7:11 p.m. 
 
 
 
 
 
_________________________ 
Laura Patrick, Chair 
 
 
 
Certified Correct: 
 
 
 
 
_________________________ 
Shannon Brayford, Recorder