Salt Spring Island Local Trust Committee regular meeting, August 9, 2022

[0:00:00] Voice 29: the door.

[0:00:08] Voice 21: I'm just going to adjust the camera here. There we go.

[0:00:23] Voice 12: So the audio and everything

[0:00:26] Voice 12: is good? Yes.

[0:00:30] Trustee Luckham: So good morning, trustees. Good morning, staff. Good morning, members of the

[0:00:35] Trustee Luckham: public that joined us for today's Salt Spring Island Local Trust Committee meeting of August

[0:00:42] Trustee Luckham: It's a beautiful pending, developing into probably another hot day in the Southern Gulf Islands here in the Coast Salish Territory.

[0:00:54] Trustee Luckham: It's an honor and privilege, an opportunity for me to be able to live and work here,

[0:01:02] Trustee Luckham: surrounded by the rich history of the Coast Salish people for which there's ample opportunity

[0:01:10] Trustee Luckham: for everyone to learn more about the history and culture of this place and more and more

[0:01:16] Trustee Luckham: literature coming to help us understand what has transpired over the last 150 years

[0:01:25] Trustee Luckham: years and recommend everybody to engage in that. It's a wonderful place to be. My name

[0:01:35] Trustee Luckham: is Peter Luckham. I'm elected on Theta Sound, which is in Wiaxin and Penelope Territory.

[0:01:40] Trustee Luckham: And it's a wonderful place to be. And today I find myself here as the chair of the Salt

[0:01:45] Trustee Luckham: Spring Island Local Trust Committee, appointed by Executive Committee and Council. And joining

[0:01:51] Trustee Luckham: Joining me today is your locally elected trustees, Peter Groh and Laura Patrick.

[0:01:57] Trustee Luckham: And we have a couple of staff members here at the moment.

[0:02:00] Trustee Luckham: We have Jason Yeomans.

[0:02:02] Trustee Luckham: Thank you, Jason, for being here.

[0:02:03] Trustee Luckham: And Rob Pringle, looking after our technology at minute taking.

[0:02:08] Trustee Luckham: Louisa Garbo, our regional planning manager, acting regional planning manager, will be joining us at 10 o'clock today.

[0:02:15] Trustee Luckham: We have various schedules.

[0:02:16] Voice 12: schedules.

[0:02:18] Trustee Luckham: And we have an in-camera session scheduled before the break today. We'll be

[0:02:24] Trustee Luckham: breaking at noon and then going into applications. Just want to note for those that are viewing

[0:02:31] Trustee Luckham: the meeting and have been planning to attend because of the Vortex application on our agenda

[0:02:39] Trustee Luckham: today there is a late amendment to the application and you will find that on the website it's going

[0:02:47] Trustee Luckham: to be item 16.2.1 and it's essentially a revised development permit that moves the septic field

[0:02:57] Trustee Luckham: outside of the 30 meter setback so for those of you that are paying close attention to that and

[0:03:02] Trustee Luckham: we're interested in that please try and review that material before we get to that application

[0:03:09] Trustee Luckham: as one of the early applications we're going to deal with today.

[0:03:16] Trustee Luckham: So as I move into opening the meeting, calling the meeting to order, improving the agenda,

[0:03:22] Trustee Luckham: there has been a suggestion, I'm not sure if you both saw that or not, that we might want to rejig the agenda.

[0:03:29] Trustee Luckham: There's a simpler, fairly straightforward application on our agenda at 16.3.

[0:03:46] Trustee Luckham: 13.3.

[0:03:48] Voice 17: 15.3.

[0:03:49] Voice 17: 16.3?

[0:03:50] Trustee Luckham: 15.

[0:03:51] Trustee Luckham: Because of the...

[0:03:52] Trustee Luckham: Oh, sorry.

[0:03:54] Trustee Luckham: There's an agenda that I'm working on,

[0:03:59] Trustee Luckham: but indeed it would be 15.3 on the old agenda 16.3 on the new agenda so that's good thank you

[0:04:06] Trustee Luckham: for sorting that out clarifying that um that we might want to consider bumping that to the top as

[0:04:12] Trustee Luckham: the vortex application uh the discussion and debate presentations may take a little longer

[0:04:17] Trustee Luckham: and um it might it would

[0:04:19] Voice 15: be helpful to the applicant if we could read that that's all

[0:04:23] Voice 15: right with the lpc yes sure okay great

[0:04:26] Trustee Luckham: and uh i've also been advised that the application uh

[0:04:30] Trustee Luckham: chapman at uh ss at 16.4 or 15.4 depending on the gender you're looking at um the applicant has asked

[0:04:38] Trustee Luckham: to uh defer that um

[0:04:40] Voice 15: for personal reasons and um i think we're happy to also uh respect that request

[0:04:47] Voice 15: so we won't re-address that one today so

[0:04:51] Trustee Luckham: if that's all right i'll ask if there's any further

[0:04:53] Trustee Luckham: or amendments to the agenda

[0:04:54] Trustee Grove (probable): i'm so sorry but can i just can i confirm then that vortex is

[0:05:02] Trustee Grove (probable): going down what is the what is the new we're going to bump

[0:05:05] Trustee Luckham: up uh the chapman no sorry we're going to

[0:05:10] Trustee Grove (probable): bump

[0:05:10] Trustee Luckham: up saw chuck 22.4 to

[0:05:13] Trustee Grove (probable): a head of road

[0:05:13] Trustee Luckham: ahead of vortex thank you and then just for the record

[0:05:17] Trustee Luckham: we're going to have an in camera also which was not on the original agenda at the end of the

[0:05:21] Trustee Luckham: session okay so

[0:05:25] Voice 15: if there's nothing further than

[0:05:27] Voice 15: oh another

[0:05:27] Voice 17: item i wanted to add i think 8.3 just a

[0:05:32] Voice 17: discussion on bylaw 530 8

[0:05:36] Trustee Luckham: .3 what do you want to put in there

[0:05:38] Voice 17: um bylaw 530 oh actually okay

[0:05:42] Trustee Luckham: um okay 8.3 bylaw 530 is there anything further

[0:06:02] Trustee Luckham: so if there's nothing further then i'll move that we adopt the agenda by general consent

[0:06:09] Trustee Luckham: as amended agreed and that brings us to uh previous minutes we have draft minutes of the july

[0:06:20] Trustee Luckham: backwards july 12th salt spring island ltc regular meeting for adoption yeah and is there any changes

[0:06:26] Trustee Luckham: none all right so then we'll adopt those by general consent as presented the next one is

[0:06:33] Trustee Luckham: the draft minutes july the 7th that's a special ltc meeting um is there any changes no so then

[0:06:39] Trustee Luckham: we will also adopt those uh by general consent as presented we don't have any resolution without

[0:06:46] Trustee Luckham: out meetings today we have advisory planning commission section is next the only minutes we

[0:06:52] Trustee Luckham: have are the draft minutes of the july 7th meeting of the housing action program task force i don't

[0:07:00] Trustee Luckham: see members of that task force here today but nonetheless want to receive that information

[0:07:06] Trustee Luckham: that's all right and thank the members of the housing action program task force for the work

[0:07:12] Trustee Luckham: that they do in assisting us in that important housing work that we're undertaking here on the

[0:07:17] Trustee Luckham: island okay local trust committee public hearing nothing today but certainly there's a couple

[0:07:25] Trustee Luckham: that are potentially coming up and um we'll discuss that when we get to the next meeting

[0:07:32] Voice 12: uh schedule

[0:07:34] Trustee Luckham: so business of rising from the minutes proceed with that at the moment

[0:07:42] Trustee Luckham: and i'll just ask um and if there's questions that the regional planning manager needs to ask

[0:07:47] Trustee Luckham: we can defer that um to when she returns when she arrives and i'll just ask if there's any

[0:07:55] Trustee Luckham: questions or remarks on the follow-up action list laura patrick over to you

[0:07:59] Voice 17: i can't i can't find it on the projects list i can't find it in the follow-up action list

[0:08:04] Voice 17: i had raised the issue about signage on rezoning and large development projects and i

[0:08:10] Voice 17: know i asked

[0:08:11] Voice 17: I asked Stefan about it

[0:08:12] Voice 1: a long time ago, and I remember

[0:08:14] Voice 17: having a conversation.

[0:08:15] Voice 17: I can't remember what it was, but it doesn't exist on any list.

[0:08:20] Voice 17: And so I'm curious as to, it's never

[0:08:23] Voice 1: going to happen if it doesn't exist on a list.

[0:08:25] Voice 17: And whether we need, I can't even remember if we had a resolution or what we did to embrace that.

[0:08:33] Voice 17: What was your memory?

[0:08:34] Voice 17: My

[0:08:35] Trustee Grove (probable): memory is dreadful, but it's by nature.

[0:08:37] Trustee Grove (probable): So your point being the inadequacy of the science.

[0:08:41] Trustee Grove (probable): Well,

[0:08:41] Voice 17: we had general agreement from staff that it was a good idea, and so I remember that conversation.

[0:08:48] Voice 17: Maybe Rob remembers.

[0:08:49] Voice 17: You found it?

[0:08:51] Voice 4: So on the fuel, the follow-up action list, we only go back six months.

[0:08:57] Voice 4: So what we share within your package is six months.

[0:09:00] Voice 4: So that resolution

[0:09:01] Voice 4: was made more than six months ago.

[0:09:04] Voice 4: It's still on the fuel, and it will be for – it's more of a technical amendment.

[0:09:08] Voice 1: And

[0:09:08] Voice 4: I would turn to Jason to speak about how that would be addressed in a bylaw.

[0:09:13] Voice 3: Yeah, I'm trying to think that because I seem to recall that the previous regional planning manager was holding off on it until he could do it in tandem with something that's happening either federation-wide or some other administrative bylaw of the local trust committee.

[0:09:34] Voice 3: And so it was going to batch them together, essentially, but I'm afraid I can't recall.

[0:09:38] Voice 3: Okay,

[0:09:38] Voice 17: I just want to make sure it wasn't lost. Because I, you know, people keep, it keeps

[0:09:44] Voice 20: coming up in letters, and

[0:09:45] Voice 17: I, and I wanted to be able to respond to the person who raised it, but I couldn't find the reference. Okay.

[0:09:55] Voice 12: that's a that's a really good question especially I didn't really

[0:09:59] Trustee Luckham: consciously know that

[0:10:01] Trustee Luckham: we didn't publish the list if it was more than six months old items but presumably when we get

[0:10:09] Trustee Luckham: a new uh appointed uh regional planning manager there will be a conversation about all of the

[0:10:16] Trustee Luckham: work in stream as we do regularly anyway and hopefully we can get that placed somewhere

[0:10:23] Trustee Luckham: well that's a really great great question thanks for that um anything else

[0:10:27] Voice 20: okay

[0:10:29] Trustee Luckham: and nothing for

[0:10:30] Trustee Luckham: lorisa later on the follow-up action okay uh

[0:10:38] Voice 3: community oh i was just going to make one note

[0:10:42] Voice 3: on the follow-up action that service which went unchecked as a publication of the staff report

[0:10:47] Voice 3: about which is now in the street which was regarding land use contracts and making contact

[0:10:52] Voice 3: tap the two property owners so we've had a meeting with one of those property owners

[0:10:57] Voice 3: thank you check that office well

[0:11:04] Voice 17: there's still work to come but at least that's

[0:11:06] Voice 17: kicking it off thank you okay

[0:11:08] Trustee Luckham: thank you so no committee information meeting no public hearing

[0:11:12] Trustee Luckham: today our policy and standing resolutions list is there for information and so i'll just receive

[0:11:20] Trustee Luckham: that that's all right our work program top priorities reported of july 2022 um is there

[0:11:29] Trustee Luckham: any comments or any questions you need to have answered so we'll receive that for information

[0:11:36] Trustee Luckham: then also our projects list those items that are not immediately active um is there anything

[0:11:45] Trustee Luckham: any remarks there no so then we'll receive those for information so our applications

[0:11:52] Trustee Luckham: log status report dated july 20th 2022 um are there any questions about any of the applications

[0:12:02] Trustee Luckham: that are on there and laura patrick over to you

[0:12:04] Voice 17: it's not on there but it was the

[0:12:08] Voice 17: the ALC application for expanding uses

[0:12:14] Voice 17: for the property that the old park in my garage,

[0:12:17] Voice 17: that's the Scotts plumbing location.

[0:12:21] Voice 17: I wondered if there was any update

[0:12:23] Voice 17: or any communications from the ALC

[0:12:25] Voice 17: in regard to that application.

[0:12:31] Voice 21: It's been a long time.

[0:12:34] Voice 21: No response.

[0:12:36] Voice 21: I have no information to provide.

[0:12:38] Voice 17: Okay.

[0:12:38] Voice 17: And then the other one,

[0:12:41] Voice 17: well it's it's it's the application's been done which is just i'm just asking here

[0:12:46] Voice 17: is i'm getting calls and you may be getting calls as well peter from people at somerside

[0:12:51] Voice 17: on the new phase of somerside there's that lock block wall that's really

[0:12:57] Voice 17: gotten a lot of attention from people i know i went back and read the re-read and re-read

[0:13:03] Voice 17: and it does kind of show up on the plan but there's no details to it there's any

[0:13:11] Voice 17: you know it's pretty it's upsetting some

[0:13:13] Voice 21: of the people there and i can see why

[0:13:21] Voice 3: yeah i i don't know if there's a a question in there or this you're interested in

[0:13:25] Voice 3: yeah

[0:13:26] Voice 17: i guess if it's is it in conformance with the permit i guess is the first question

[0:13:31] Voice 3: so we've had a number of inquiries about this and what have you been saying

[0:13:39] Voice 3: um i mean yeah i i know that the the wall was reflected in some way in the development permit

[0:13:44] Voice 3: but i think it was kind of from plan view yeah so you get you

[0:13:48] Voice 17: can

[0:13:49] Voice 3: see it see it from the top

[0:13:50] Voice 3: not necessarily

[0:13:51] Voice 17: like feathered several times and you know my impression of what feathered is in a

[0:13:56] Voice 17: lock block wall is not bad yeah

[0:14:00] Voice 3: um rob do you know have have we advised or is is it assigned to any

[0:14:06] Voice 3: of the planners to look at the permit and see whether it's still looking for that for the right

[0:14:13] Voice 4: person too like since it's come to our attention there's been snap holidays and so it's on our

[0:14:20] Voice 4: to-do list for this week all

[0:14:21] Voice 17: right so staff will be looking into seeing if it is in conformance with

[0:14:24] Voice 17: the permit okay that's i think the key thing is thank you so

[0:14:29] Trustee Luckham: does that mean to be on a follow-up

[0:14:31] Trustee Luckham: action list well i

[0:14:32] Voice 17: think it's a step responding to inquiries so i don't it's just now we i've

[0:14:38] Voice 17: made an inquiry and i assume you can get

[0:14:40] Voice 3: those who are concerned those who are concerned about

[0:14:42] Voice 3: it will ensure that it remains at our attention okay

[0:14:46] Trustee Luckham: then that's that's good then um anything else

[0:14:51] Trustee Luckham: on the applications log that's

[0:14:54] Voice 17: all i have no

[0:14:55] Trustee Grove (probable): i do oh

[0:14:57] Voice 17: sorry i have just some news i guess you

[0:15:00] Voice 17: always ask about dragonfly um i heard from fernando dos santos on the drake road dragonfly

[0:15:08] Voice 17: HAB-Masyn Moyer- My project, the CRD has agreed to operate the water service for that.

[0:15:12] Voice 17: HAB

[0:15:13] Voice 21: -Masyn Moyer-

[0:15:13] Voice 17: Yes, well.

[0:15:15] Voice 21: HAB

[0:15:15] Voice 17: -Masyn Moyer-

[0:15:15] Voice 21: That is incredible

[0:15:16] Voice 17: good news.

[0:15:18] Voice 17: HAB

[0:15:18] Voice 21: -Masyn Moyer-

[0:15:18] Voice 17: we'll expect to see that application moving forward.

[0:15:22] Voice 17: HAB-Terry Palmos-

[0:15:23] Voice 15: Where we go, I would call it collaboration.

[0:15:27] Voice 15: HAB-Terry Palmos-

[0:15:27] Trustee Luckham: sex on it's good.

[0:15:29] Trustee Luckham: HAB-Terry Palmos- Okay um nothing else.

[0:15:32] Trustee Luckham: HAB-Terry Palmos- So expense report we don't have a current expense report.

[0:15:37] Voice 17: HAB-Masyn Moyer- We were emailed it.

[0:15:39] Trustee Luckham: we were which we

[0:15:40] Voice 17: received an email of it

[0:15:42] Trustee Luckham: yeah but it's not on this agenda yeah and so if you

[0:15:46] Trustee Luckham: have any questions you can direct them to nancy rogers uh unstressed conservancy board report

[0:15:52] Trustee Luckham: um also nothing there i think probably we had our ec stress conservancy board meeting

[0:16:03] Trustee Luckham: in between our last meeting and now and um just talked about common goals and the work that

[0:16:11] Trustee Luckham: they're doing um and it's an amazing uh legacy that the honest trust conservancy leaves

[0:16:21] Trustee Luckham: the honest trust for all the work that it does and continues to do

[0:16:26] Trustee Luckham: i'm grateful for that next item is the salt spring island watershed protection line so

[0:16:32] Trustee Luckham: nothing uh to report today unless you have any verbal update for us

[0:16:39] Voice 17: unless jason has any no no i don't know if this nothing's really moving

[0:16:44] Voice 3: to not have to switch the table uh some work has been on going on developing

[0:16:48] Voice 3: to the watershed stewardship and protections contingent plan which is swip up adjacent and

[0:16:53] Voice 3: we'll come back okay

[0:16:56] Trustee Luckham: the housing action program task force um scheduled for 10 o'clock um i

[0:17:04] Trustee Luckham: believe

[0:17:04] Voice 17: you submitted an email report i

[0:17:08] Voice 21: didn't see that i have not seen that did

[0:17:17] Voice 20: you see your email

[0:17:24] Voice 21: I

[0:17:36] Voice 4: did make him aware of 10am. So that was at their meeting. As

[0:17:46] Voice 4: we are ahead of schedule, I think

[0:17:48] Trustee Grove (probable): you might be showing up in the next.

[0:17:50] Trustee Grove (probable): Excuse me, if I made the meeting of last week, that didn't actually go ahead of it.

[0:17:55] Trustee Grove (probable): Housing Action Program meeting did go ahead.

[0:17:58] Voice 4: okay

[0:18:00] Trustee Luckham: all right um so i look for the pleasure of the ltc at this time um whether or not all of

[0:18:11] Trustee Luckham: these items in the local trust committee projects require um the regional planning manager to be

[0:18:17] Trustee Luckham: with us or not i suspect we might want to have her important and then bylaw 530 at 8.3 which

[0:18:26] Trustee Luckham: was added as a new item um is

[0:18:28] Trustee Luckham: that something that uh she'll

[0:18:30] Voice 17: probably want to participate

[0:18:31] Voice 17: in that conversation too second she'll

[0:18:34] Voice 17: probably want to participate in that conversation so do

[0:18:37] Trustee Luckham: you want to reach us for 10 minutes and or we could have the closed meeting we might want the

[0:18:42] Trustee Luckham: rp and yeah here as

[0:18:44] Trustee Luckham: well for that okay sounds

[0:18:45] Trustee Grove (probable): good okay

[0:18:47] Trustee Luckham: so let's just recess for 10 minutes

[0:18:50] Trustee Luckham: i'm sorry for the disruption those of you that are watching our live streaming session but we

[0:18:56] Trustee Luckham: will return at 10 o'clock as shortly as we can and either continue with the housing action program

[0:19:02] Trustee Luckham: task force or move directly into local trust committee projects so um that you can just put

[0:28:18] Trustee Luckham: order here now um we have the regional plan arriving shortly um you said we would uh

[0:28:27] Trustee Luckham: reconvene at

[0:28:28] Voice 12: 10 o'clock there's

[0:28:31] Voice 5: someone that i met when we were doing that

[0:28:35] Trustee Luckham: we'll just wait another moment to uh start morning lorisa

[0:28:43] Trustee Luckham: we are at 10 o'clock so let us go to item 7.8 housing action program task force chairs update

[0:28:51] Trustee Luckham: thank you for joining us and what you have to report to us today great

[0:28:56] Voice 5: thank you for for hearing

[0:28:58] Voice 5: me um at this time um so yeah so quick update on where we're at with the task force um the cao

[0:29:06] Voice 5: Joe has asked us to suspend our meetings for the election period for September and October.

[0:29:14] Voice 5: So, you know, the task force was disappointed about that but we recognize that and the shortage

[0:29:20] Voice 5: of staff, you know, that we're giving, you know, we're agreeing to that suspension, where

[0:29:28] Voice 5: we were working on updating which updated our matrix it's not complete, but it's more

[0:29:33] Voice 5: updated now um and one of the members that the vice chair carrie who does work in uh

[0:29:40] Voice 5: in research professionally has offered to write a summary report just like a like a four or five

[0:29:46] Voice 5: page easier to read version of our top items so that um so that it can be shared with the public

[0:29:52] Voice 5: and just generally inform the community about the kinds of things we're thinking about beyond

[0:29:58] Voice 5: on the recommendations that have been made so far.

[0:30:00] Voice 5: And we thought that would be a nice way to kind of bookend this first, basically the first part of the task force work until we resume, presumably, I suppose, after the election.

[0:30:11] Voice 5: I would imagine that to me.

[0:30:13] Voice 15: Yeah, that seems likely.

[0:30:16] Voice 15: Yeah.

[0:30:17] Voice 5: So that's, so in order to do that, though, we need, we had previously planned to, we were asked to, instead of meeting twice a month, we were asked to meet once a month.

[0:30:28] Voice 5: so our set meetings was was the first thursday of last thursday and then the next one was supposed

[0:30:35] Voice 5: to be september 1st but that's when we've been asked to suspend so we would like to maybe we

[0:30:41] Voice 5: could even keep that date if possible but we'd like to meet one more time just to be able to

[0:30:45] Voice 5: approve this this summary report that's being written so that's so we're gonna i've asked um

[0:30:51] Voice 5: kind of garbo if we could do that if we it doesn't necessarily have to be september 1st it could be

[0:30:55] Voice 5: another you know another day and it doesn't have to be for a full two-hour meeting it would just be

[0:30:59] Voice 5: an hour to just to simply be able to say yeah we we we approve of this summer report that carrie

[0:31:07] Voice 5: has done and and and so that it's so that that could be in public minutes and be able to be

[0:31:12] Voice 5: shared with the public um so so yeah i think that's but i think that's good stuff i think that

[0:31:18] Voice 5: you know that that you know we've made we've made some good ideas and it's you know it's it's um

[0:31:24] Voice 5: it kind of brings me up to the next thing about i want to talk to us about

[0:31:28] Voice 5: public public engagement and public education and um you know like this the

[0:31:35] Voice 5: we asked months ago and you probably remember but just before december we asked to to be able

[0:31:40] Voice 5: to the task force wanted to to write an article of rationale for why we're recommending accessory

[0:31:46] Voice 5: dwelling units in the way that we're recommending them we wanted to be able to spell spell out all

[0:31:51] Voice 5: our different reasons why it's an environmental solution um how you know how it fits in with the

[0:31:57] Voice 5: other things that we're thinking about as far as like you know people are concerned about buildup

[0:32:00] Voice 5: but we also have ideas about how to try to reduce the buildup by density transfers and other ways

[0:32:06] Voice 5: so that we stop so we don't have so many single family dwellings sprawled around the island so

[0:32:11] Voice 5: like it fits with a holistic uh picture that we're trying to articulate and so it's it's difficult to

[0:32:18] Voice 5: articulate that when we don't have a platform to be able to to express it and so so so now you know

[0:32:24] Voice 5: you know this there's a lot of um sort of debate in the media about bylaw 530 and there's a lot

[0:32:30] Voice 5: of confusion and misunderstanding about you know no one's ever had a chance to really explain

[0:32:35] Voice 5: you know from our point of view how this all fits how it fits into um the build out and carrying

[0:32:41] Voice 5: capacity and and there's this misunderstanding about that so i don't have any any solutions i

[0:32:46] Voice 5: know part of the problem was with staff resources and time um to be able to do that but i just

[0:32:51] Voice 5: wanted to raise the the point so that as we go forward you know that that we can think about

[0:32:56] Voice 5: how how we can communicate with the public so that we can educate the public about the things

[0:33:01] Voice 5: being done in a way that's not just you know meeting minutes that's that's not just um an

[0:33:08] Voice 5: article in the newspaper that's ephemeral it goes and it's gone people are paying attention might

[0:33:12] Voice 5: might see it but but like it's kind of thing like like for example you know a web page where you go

[0:33:16] Voice 5: yeah go to this web page and see the rationale and then then the community can be directed to

[0:33:21] Voice 5: that to have an understanding and that and that basically i've been trying to to um direct the

[0:33:28] Voice 5: public to the website and and as it is it's confusing i mean there's no one single link to

[0:33:33] Voice 5: even to the bylaw itself there's a link to the basically all of the ltc's projects and then the

[0:33:39] Voice 5: The public has to scroll through it and have to find the one,

[0:33:41] Voice 5: and then they have to open a certain folder.

[0:33:42] Voice 5: So for people who are used to public process and paying attention,

[0:33:46] Voice 5: they might be able to find that,

[0:33:46] Voice 5: but the average person, you know,

[0:33:48] Voice 5: who just wants to follow a link to find the information, it's confusing.

[0:33:52] Voice 5: And I think that as a really important, you know, public agency,

[0:33:56] Voice 5: it would be really important to recognize, you know,

[0:33:58] Voice 5: how the public gets its information and find a way to make it user-friendly

[0:34:03] Voice 5: and easy so that people aren't misinformed,

[0:34:06] Voice 5: they can be informed correctly and we don't have these disingenuous debates you know they're

[0:34:12] Voice 5: happening right now where basically you know people are arguing about things that aren't

[0:34:16] Voice 5: aren't really true and and it's it's difficult to carry a constant conversation because there's no

[0:34:20] Voice 5: constant reference point to be able to refer to so so I just wanted to bring that up and I just

[0:34:27] Voice 5: think it's really important to think about not only for this project but for everything that

[0:34:30] Voice 5: that the trust does an example of that is there was a survey done the survey card that went out

[0:34:37] Voice 5: and there was results of the survey it should be part of you know the project page somewhere

[0:34:41] Voice 5: in there we should be able to say the survey shows these respondents i can't find it anywhere

[0:34:46] Voice 5: so um i did ask um to have there's a couple of supporting documents asked to have included

[0:34:51] Voice 5: in there there's like a there's a file if you want to find the file and says other documents

[0:34:56] Voice 5: and asked for a couple of documents that floated

[0:34:58] Voice 5: and PlanetGuard just said that that is possible.

[0:35:01] Voice 5: So that will be done, but still, it's an awkward thing

[0:35:03] Voice 5: for the average person to be able to find that.

[0:35:05] Voice 5: It's really difficult.

[0:35:09] Voice 5: Yeah, that's the main thing.

[0:35:15] Voice 5: Yeah, I think that sums up.

[0:35:16] Voice 5: The task force has comments about the details

[0:35:20] Voice 5: of by-law 530, but I mean, it is what it is now.

[0:35:23] Voice 5: I guess the main thing that they're expressing,

[0:35:26] Voice 5: i just wanted to bring up is is um the there is the there is a clause in the bylaw that expressly

[0:35:32] Voice 5: prohibits uh tiny homes or or homes on wheels and um i just think it's unfortunate because it's

[0:35:40] Voice 5: really you know in the real world it's a really um important tool for people like the people are

[0:35:48] Voice 5: really using that right now and it's a low cost possibility like there are people right now for

[0:35:52] Voice 5: for example, providing a pad so they could rent a pad

[0:35:55] Voice 5: and someone could bring their tiny home to it.

[0:35:57] Voice 5: It's a solution that people are doing

[0:35:59] Voice 5: and it's unfortunate to expressly prohibit it.

[0:36:03] Voice 5: For example, so I was, but I understand why,

[0:36:05] Voice 5: and I know this is the CRD who has said,

[0:36:07] Voice 5: you know, you can't enable something

[0:36:09] Voice 5: that they can't enforce because of building code issues.

[0:36:13] Voice 5: So it becomes this inter-jurisdictional issue.

[0:36:16] Voice 5: And so I guess my comment on that was,

[0:36:18] Voice 5: why does it have to be expressly prohibited?

[0:36:21] Voice 5: Why could it not simply not mentioned, you know, and let, let that be a building code issue with the CRD in their reality and let the trust simply say, you know, don't have to say anything about it.

[0:36:32] Voice 5: It's you, you give it, you've articulated what access to building units are.

[0:36:36] Voice 5: And then, because then, then the pilot wouldn't, then that, that, that issue about, you know, giving permission to, to tiny homes can be solved with, with the building code, with the CRD.

[0:36:46] Voice 5: and there's lots all through the province there's lots of interest in doing that you know um

[0:36:51] Voice 5: the you

[0:36:52] Voice 5: know these these these time homes are being built are way more solid and way better than your typical

[0:36:58] Voice 5: rd and and it's and you know so it's not i think it's again it's an opportunity for this body to

[0:37:03] Voice 5: lead by example um and use your role of advocacy so anyway i just want to bring that up i know

[0:37:10] Voice 5: it's difficult because it's inter-jurisdictional um communications but i think it's important

[0:37:14] Voice 5: thank you any questions thank

[0:37:17] Trustee Luckham: you um did anybody have any comment no

[0:37:22] Trustee Grove (probable): i think that makes total

[0:37:24] Trustee Grove (probable): sense i mean we're we're leaning towards the crd to deal with um water issues and septic issues i

[0:37:31] Trustee Grove (probable): mean why not um building issues also so yeah

[0:37:35] Voice 5: it's it's kind of you know this in the in the work i've

[0:37:38] Voice 5: been doing it's been brought up a lot like we have enough there's enough roadblocks enough

[0:37:43] Voice 5: confusion yeah you know if if if the island's trust doesn't have to you be the you know if

[0:37:51] Voice 5: there's already other agencies they're responsible for for providing a certain hurdle or gate let

[0:37:57] Voice 5: those agencies be in that place you don't have to add another layer

[0:37:59] Voice 17: it's a bit redundant because

[0:38:02] Voice 17: the bylaw does say you must have a building permit so just then say they're not allowed it's

[0:38:08] Voice 17: that's a double a double negative right

[0:38:11] Voice 5: and another point another point just another point

[0:38:14] Voice 5: to articulate kind of the confusion out there there's a lot of people talking about oh this

[0:38:18] Voice 5: bylaw is going to enable uh vacationing rentals and it's not going to enable long-term loans but

[0:38:22] Voice 5: the bylaw expressly says you know that it cannot be rented long term but this is but it just it's

[0:38:28] Voice 5: just you know unless someone needs the bylaw and catches that point so there's just an example like

[0:38:33] Voice 5: that's the kind of thing that public institutions should fairly articulate at that point so there

[0:38:37] Voice 5: isn't this massive amount of confusion out there arguing against something that's just not true

[0:38:43] Voice 5: and and your solution to that is a permanent web page well i i i think that like yes i think that

[0:38:49] Voice 5: like for example our project would be ideal for project the web web page and it would have been

[0:38:54] Voice 5: ideal for example what we asked for was to be able to write a letter an article of explanation where

[0:38:58] Voice 5: it could be posted on a web page where people could refer to it in you know in a constant sort

[0:39:03] Voice 5: of way right um that's not kind of hidden in an obscure sort of folding folder system you know

[0:39:09] Voice 5: and then then that would be electric and they could be updated oh there's this issue so you

[0:39:12] Voice 5: would like to clarify this point the same thing with the with the buildup you know issue you know

[0:39:17] Voice 5: there's no hard traffic system has people that's the result of an interpretation and some assumptions

[0:39:23] Voice 5: that are made of another clause and so they can't be you know people are taking you know cherry

[0:39:28] Voice 5: picking one line out of a full paragraph and then using as argument against the thing it's just it's

[0:39:33] Voice 5: just it's just not true right because they're going to be part of your recommendations then

[0:39:37] Trustee Grove (probable): yes

[0:39:37] Voice 17: we asked for education and communication materials plus last um trust connect so

[0:39:44] Voice 17: yeah yeah no that's why i have it on the right i've embraced that issue

[0:39:51] Voice 21: okay thank you

[0:39:52] Trustee Luckham: thanks yeah um well so thank you certainly understand your concerns

[0:39:58] Trustee Luckham: terms and particularly what you just said that about cherry picking particular ideas and

[0:40:03] Trustee Luckham: interpreting them welcome to our world that's exactly what it's like um but we also have to

[0:40:11] Trustee Luckham: recognize and realize that people have the right to have their own interpretation and own point of

[0:40:17] Trustee Luckham: view and we we need to be open to hearing that um rather than uh always um carrying the the

[0:40:27] Trustee Luckham: hard lines so to speak so to do with all of these tiny traders or whatever you know we need to be

[0:40:32] Trustee Luckham: open to possibilities and hear from folks um i with respect to the reporting out at this point

[0:40:39] Trustee Luckham: you know uh the fact that the cao has called you and said you need to suspend the meetings

[0:40:43] Trustee Luckham: that's actually pretty serious because bc elections bc is very clear on any activity

[0:40:50] Trustee Luckham: that might be construed or perceived

[0:40:51] Trustee Luckham: as election campaigning activities

[0:40:55] Trustee Luckham: or setting candidates in a favorable light

[0:40:59] Trustee Luckham: or an unfavorable light have to be avoided.

[0:41:03] Trustee Luckham: Did you were indicating Louisa as

[0:41:05] Voice 20: I was going to say?

[0:41:05] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, I thought you

[0:41:05] Trustee Luckham: put your hand up.

[0:41:06] Trustee Luckham: So we have

[0:41:07] Trustee Luckham: to be very careful about that.

[0:41:09] Trustee Luckham: And that's important.

[0:41:11] Trustee Luckham: And then of course, if there's any reporting out

[0:41:13] Trustee Luckham: that comes from the committee, the task force,

[0:41:15] Trustee Luckham: it needs to come to the LTC to be published

[0:41:18] Trustee Luckham: because we need to be sure that it is also carrying the right message so right

[0:41:23] Voice 5: hence my

[0:41:24] Voice 5: request to have at least one more brief meeting to be able to yeah to identify that between a

[0:41:29] Voice 15: rock and a hard place why well because the elections have been called and campaigning

[0:41:34] Voice 15: has begun anyway i

[0:41:38] Voice 15: don't write the rules that's how it is right anyway

[0:41:43] Voice 12: luisa do you have any

[0:41:45] Voice 12: Any remarks on that?

[0:41:47] Voice 29: I just want to comment on, sorry, I have to wear my mask.

[0:41:52] Voice 29: That's fine.

[0:41:52] Voice 29: I met with someone who had COVID, and I didn't know that.

[0:41:55] Voice 29: So I just want to clarify that CAO did not put in a hard line saying it has to be suspended.

[0:42:05] Voice 29: It just recommended the task force not to meet because of what you're saying.

[0:42:11] Voice 29: and uh and i just want to reiterate the chair made a it was very accurate statement that we

[0:42:20] Voice 29: mentioned to the task force before that the media is not a channel for them to communicate so

[0:42:26] Voice 29: the only means is to submit a report through the staff report through this channel to ltc

[0:42:34] Voice 29: and also and i'm sorry a lot of good points been raised i totally appreciate that

[0:42:40] Voice 29: don't get me wrong but the uh we mentioned before that the this chair update is simply just for

[0:42:48] Voice 29: updates just as a reminder it's not for the chair to lobby any particular items so i just want to

[0:42:55] Voice 29: remind uh ltc that there's a point of order on that and uh so anything that you want to communicate

[0:43:03] Voice 29: yes we will be more than happy to when we have the right channel so i agree with you on the two

[0:43:10] Voice 29: documents we have no issue adding it to the website if you have no reports we have no issue to

[0:43:16] Voice 29: present it to ltc but it has to be through us to send it to ltc so it will be on the

[0:43:23] Voice 29: public record and it won't be accessible for the public because it's being posted so so

[0:43:29] Voice 5: so just a question about that so is it possible for us to send the report

[0:43:33] Voice 5: to the ltc without having a meeting amongst ourselves

[0:43:38] Voice 29: send it to us let me

[0:43:39] Voice 29: send it to ltc

[0:43:41] Voice 29: okay so then as

[0:43:42] Voice 5: long as it's

[0:43:43] Trustee Luckham: a report from the task force yeah right so if you need to have a

[0:43:47] Trustee Luckham: meeting to conclude that work then you need to do that as soon as possible i think the later you

[0:43:53] Trustee Luckham: leave it the more potential for compromise there is so as soon as that's done and then you submit

[0:43:58] Trustee Luckham: it to us and then you know i can't promise when we're going to get to it sure

[0:44:02] Voice 15: so our next meeting

[0:44:04] Voice 15: is in september right we'll see how that all plays out

[0:44:08] Voice 4: okay fair enough thank you we can communicate

[0:44:10] Voice 4: uh

[0:44:11] Voice 29: i'm going to have to look to staff because it requires staff support to take the minutes right

[0:44:18] Voice 29: yeah so

[0:44:21] Trustee Luckham: you need to work

[0:44:21] Trustee Luckham: with the staff in order to make that happen okay yeah okay

[0:44:27] Trustee Luckham: Okay, so can you live with that?

[0:44:28] Trustee Luckham: Yes.

[0:44:29] Trustee Luckham: Good, yeah.

[0:44:30] Trustee Luckham: So thanks for your remarks today.

[0:44:33] Trustee Luckham: I tend to be a little bit more liberal

[0:44:35] Trustee Luckham: than I might want to be,

[0:44:37] Trustee Luckham: but it is important to provide an update

[0:44:41] Trustee Luckham: and reporting out from the committee

[0:44:43] Trustee Luckham: is the appropriate channel

[0:44:45] Trustee Luckham: for substantiating the recommendations.

[0:44:49] Trustee Luckham: Thank you.

[0:44:49] Trustee Luckham: I appreciate that.

[0:44:50] Trustee Luckham: But thank you for the work that you do

[0:44:52] Trustee Luckham: and your team that supports you in that work.

[0:44:56] Trustee Luckham: so let us now um i'll just maybe ask we've gone through all of the morning's agendas um we didn't

[0:45:03] Trustee Luckham: have any questions that arose louisa uh or acting regional planning manager garbo um with respect

[0:45:09] Trustee Luckham: to work programs or projects at this time so we wanted to be sure we paused here uh until

[0:45:16] Trustee Luckham: your arrival to cover the budget uh uh business cases the super special property tax requisition

[0:45:22] Trustee Luckham: and there is a new item which we added in 8.3 on the new agenda would have been 7.3 before

[0:45:28] Trustee Luckham: which is bylaw 530 for just discussion and i know that you would want to participate in all of those

[0:45:35] Trustee Luckham: so what i'd like to do then is turn the floor over to you and uh and for 8.1 which is the budget oh

[0:45:44] Trustee Luckham: i should just say is there anything you wanted to share with us that was important on any of

[0:45:48] Trustee Luckham: the earlier items to the recording uh

[0:45:50] Voice 29: no i i'm just not prepared to talk about 5 30 so it depends

[0:45:55] Voice 29: on what's being yeah

[0:45:56] Trustee Luckham: so i think it came from patrick's

[0:45:59] Voice 29: hearing it's already open yeah i just

[0:46:02] Voice 29: have a question yeah

[0:46:04] Trustee Luckham: it's just okay we'll we'll address that as best we can i understand you

[0:46:09] Trustee Luckham: would wouldn't be prepared um so the first item then is a budget business case for the south

[0:46:15] Trustee Luckham: bring local trust committee projects um i'll turn that over to you uh

[0:46:19] Voice 29: yeah sure this is actually a

[0:46:20] Voice 29: quick item this is essentially our effort to anticipate uh the projects that is already

[0:46:28] Voice 29: ongoing we'll be able to carry over to the next term and by

[0:46:33] Voice 29: doing so we want to make sure that we

[0:46:35] Voice 29: submit as a placeholder so to speak for the finance committee to realize that we need to seek

[0:46:42] Voice 29: funding for these projects so it's a bit awkward because it's the election year we don't know what

[0:46:50] Voice 29: projects will be accepted or continue under the new terms of office so but in any case they want

[0:46:57] Voice 29: to just be more prepared than not and the way we see it we look at internally as you know there

[0:47:05] Voice 29: will be no staff and so we have to figure out recruiting the senior planners to continue the

[0:47:11] Voice 29: the projects but nevertheless what we anticipate is for me at least I have three projects here

[0:47:19] Voice 29: and the budget is to cover those three. The first one the business case is for the OCP amendment

[0:47:25] Voice 29: because we know that for both CDF and hosting action program it's getting to approaching the

[0:47:33] Voice 29: OCP amendment stage so we should get funding for the OCP and as we know even through the

[0:47:40] Voice 29: the policy statement through GANCHI is much more effective

[0:47:44] Voice 29: and we can have a third mutual party to come in

[0:47:47] Voice 29: and reach out to the community.

[0:47:49] Voice 29: So that's why we're proposing funding for that.

[0:47:51] Voice 29: And you will see that on Appendix A to the staff report,

[0:47:56] Voice 29: the business case.

[0:47:58] Voice 29: And again, it's not written in a way

[0:48:02] Voice 29: that with a lot of certainty.

[0:48:04] Voice 29: It's in some way we don't know,

[0:48:05] Voice 29: but at least we want to ask for those funding.

[0:48:08] Voice 29: But we do have the confidence that because of the work that's been put together already

[0:48:14] Voice 29: for all these projects, that will likely be able to continue.

[0:48:18] Voice 29: So all the more reason that we want to secure funding.

[0:48:22] Voice 29: So that is for the first business case for the OCP amendment.

[0:48:26] Voice 29: And the second one is for the Ganges Village.

[0:48:29] Voice 29: And again, we invested a lot in it already.

[0:48:32] Voice 29: The community input portion is done by the consultant.

[0:48:35] Voice 29: And as the consultant recommended, you don't want those information to sit for too long and go stale.

[0:48:42] Voice 29: You want to be able to incorporate those community input and start working on the area plan.

[0:48:48] Voice 29: So the funding is for the area plan so that we can put it together.

[0:48:54] Voice 29: So basically, it's the business case for three projects.

[0:48:58] Voice 29: projects. And I know plan A is going to cover another business case. And with that, I don't

[0:49:06] Voice 29: have to answer any questions.

[0:49:10] Voice 12: Okay. Trustee Patrick.

[0:49:12] Voice 17: I have quite a few. Thank you for

[0:49:17] Voice 17: trying to pull this together. But I think there's one, I think what's vitally important to me is

[0:49:23] Voice 17: that anytime we say OCP amendment, I want to absolutely in the name of the project tie

[0:49:29] Voice 17: land use bylaw review as well because we have a situation here we have a 2008 major amendment to

[0:49:36] Voice 17: an ocp and we never updated the land use bylaw and i don't want to ever see that happen again

[0:49:43] Voice 17: to me the projects are linked you do an ocp review you do an unread review that is part it's

[0:49:49] Voice 17: the implementation of the ocp update so it's i i will only agree to this if we we you know we call

[0:49:58] Voice 17: the project basically you know major amendments to the ocp and the review and update um

[0:50:07] Voice 17: i have some concerns and it sort of relates to the two together you know let's just let's just

[0:50:14] Voice 17: jump into the future and let's just assume we have a letter from the first nations asking to be

[0:50:18] Voice 17: partners in this planning and co-managing so we're right back to where we are today with

[0:50:24] Voice 17: gandhi's village we don't have an answer as to what that looks like going forward um i did speak

[0:50:31] Voice 17: with heather cower yesterday from a regional perspective because i'm i absolutely support

[0:50:37] Voice 17: what we're trying to do or we're i think we're we're in the beginning of a phase of trying to

[0:50:43] Voice 17: move to some federal approaches to how we do our ocps and those things um and i think you know we

[0:50:52] Voice 17: We are having difficulties, you know, understanding how to move forward with the First Nations

[0:50:59] Voice 17: and involved in this level of planning.

[0:51:02] Voice 17: We know that, you know, Keats Islands got caught up in it.

[0:51:06] Voice 17: We know that Mesquite Islands OCP update got caught up in it.

[0:51:10] Voice 17: And so I think we have a federal issue, and that is, you know, we don't have a process

[0:51:17] Voice 17: process that we feel comfortable about saying we've done a good job with the first nations

[0:51:24] Voice 17: yeah and we're we're in a we're not going to answer that question permanently yet we're not

[0:51:30] Voice 17: at the we're not at the end we're still at the beginning of building these relationships and

[0:51:34] Voice 17: changing and i think there's some benefit from a better ancient standpoint that we figured this

[0:51:39] Voice 17: out that we come up to sort of a standard of we feel good about it it's going to change each you

[0:51:46] Voice 17: You know, each area is going to have each nation.

[0:51:47] Voice 17: They have different opinions of what it looks like.

[0:51:50] Voice 17: But I think as an organization, we need to do that work.

[0:51:54] Voice 17: And I don't know if we can do that this year.

[0:51:57] Voice 17: I know our budget is extremely tight and we don't have that money.

[0:52:02] Voice 17: But I think that's kind of a first step to any of this is to sort this out.

[0:52:06] Voice 17: Because to carry on with what we call parallel processes isn't honoring, really building

[0:52:18] Voice 17: reconciliation.

[0:52:20] Voice 17: I absolutely understand why we need to give First Nations their own engagement, but we

[0:52:27] Voice 17: need to be bringing the community and First Nations together.

[0:52:31] Voice 17: And at the end of the day, we end up with an OCP that we all feel good about, not a

[0:52:37] Voice 17: surprise.

[0:52:37] Voice 17: surprise, look, this is what we negotiated with First Nations or engaged in First Nations,

[0:52:41] Voice 17: and now we try to bring it together at the end. It just isn't helping the community

[0:52:47] Voice 17: on that journey. And I also, you know, to me, the budget of doing an OCP for major amendment,

[0:52:55] Voice 17: because housing, the concept of the housing is really about everything, how, where, why we're

[0:53:02] Voice 17: building housing. It's a big amendment. It's about almost everything in the OCP relates to how,

[0:53:06] Voice 17: how, where, and why we build housing.

[0:53:08] Voice 17: And I think we need money in there

[0:53:10] Voice 17: for doing technical report.

[0:53:11] Voice 17: We need technical data.

[0:53:12] Voice 20: We

[0:53:13] Voice 17: need data, not just engagement.

[0:53:15] Voice 17: And we're not filing ourselves that budget.

[0:53:19] Voice 17: So I don't think, you know, I went and looked at,

[0:53:24] Voice 17: I've been watching some of our local communities,

[0:53:27] Voice 17: you know, Sanich is just doing,

[0:53:29] Voice 17: they're not even calling it an area plan.

[0:53:30] Voice 17: They're calling it just a work plan in three corridors.

[0:53:34] Voice 17: doors. $300,000 is their budget. And so I don't think we're budgeting enough to do an OCP major

[0:53:47] Voice 17: amendment on this island. That $127,000 is not going to get us there. And we can't even begin

[0:53:57] Voice 17: until we really deal with this issue. Let's just assume we're co-planning or moving toward

[0:54:03] Voice 17: co-planning with first nations um so i have some challenges just endorsing this number i like

[0:54:13] Voice 17: you know i say yeah i think the project of this nature is makes sense but i think we have more

[0:54:18] Voice 17: work to do along with the regional approach to figure out what the budget really is to do this

[0:54:27] Voice 17: right and it will be phased there's no question it's going to be you know it's not going to work

[0:54:33] Voice 17: We're

[0:54:33] Voice 21: not going to be able to do

[0:54:34] Voice 17: a major OCD amendment in a year on this island.

[0:54:39] Voice 12: In a year?

[0:54:41] Voice 17: Right now, it's assumed this is, I mean, it mentions that a year is tight, but this is just one phase.

[0:54:49] Voice 17: And I look at everyone else, and even our own drafted materials has multiple phases now of

[0:54:57] Voice 21: doing the work.

[0:55:03] Voice 21: So,

[0:55:03] Trustee Grove (probable): sorry, if I may, so what would you like to see?

[0:55:06] Trustee Grove (probable): I

[0:55:07] Voice 17: think we need to do any, I think staff needs to do more work on preparing the budget to be more extensive, to include costs of technical, technical reporting as well.

[0:55:23] Voice 17: You know, information needs, technical reporting, market analysis, there's going to be a whole bunch of things that may need to be done.

[0:55:28] Voice 17: And I look at the development permit areas.

[0:55:33] Voice 17: A lot of this has to do, our development permit areas

[0:55:36] Voice 17: haven't even been updated or looked at for 20 years.

[0:55:40] Voice 21: Mapping out a date, those are technical things

[0:55:43] Voice 21: that need to be looked at.

[0:55:48] Voice 21: So I think the money is too low.

[0:55:50] Voice 21: Lisa wishes to speak.

[0:55:53] Voice 14: Go ahead, Lisa or Louisa.

[0:55:57] Voice 29: Good point.

[0:55:57] Voice 29: I appreciate you understand this is a very conservative number.

[0:56:02] Voice 29: numbers and I've been doing that for a lot of years and I thought this was a very small number

[0:56:08] Voice 29: but I tried to be realistic as well when I come in and ask for 300,000 you probably just

[0:56:15] Voice 29: you know kick me out the room and say that's ridiculous so what I would suggest is

[0:56:23] Voice 29: we really don't have time I'm not kidding I cannot bring it back for the next meeting because

[0:56:29] Voice 29: because it's already time to submit it for the director

[0:56:31] Voice 29: to approve it and move it forward.

[0:56:35] Voice 29: So I would say if you want to make a resolution

[0:56:41] Voice 29: and say like right now, say add the technical aspect

[0:56:48] Voice 29: and it can be collaboration with agency and university

[0:56:52] Voice 29: and we can budget.

[0:56:54] Voice 29: I anticipate that will be about $50,000 to $80,000 that should be enough for the technical analysis.

[0:57:06] Voice 29: We already budget for First Nations. A couple of things I want to mention about First Nations.

[0:57:11] Voice 29: It's not at our level, through the project, to deal with First Nations.

[0:57:15] Voice 29: I already worked with the Director of Administrative Services, Claire, is working on the First Nations coordination.

[0:57:23] Voice 29: nations so at the island just level it's already dealing with more elected level and at staff level

[0:57:30] Voice 29: we already got the commitment from staff with first nations we already paid three checks so

[0:57:37] Voice 29: they are aware of the work that we are doing it's not news it's just that we are progressing

[0:57:43] Voice 29: maybe faster than they can anticipate but the funding is really just about conversation you

[0:57:50] Voice 29: know they can look at it they can guide us so we do have that built into the project at the

[0:57:57] Voice 29: protocol level at the coordination level all that is at the electric level so i would not

[0:58:04] Voice 29: slow down the project budget to figure it out it's not true south spring island ocp amendment

[0:58:12] Voice 29: uh and we do we are very sensitive because we have been working with first nations at the staff level

[0:58:19] Voice 29: that's our appropriate channel is we work with the staff at their level uh and i think they

[0:58:27] Voice 29: we already talked about through ocp amendment with housing that's why we talk about the first

[0:58:32] Voice 29: nations how do we address that we collaborate with them and they give us advice on how to you know

[0:58:42] Voice 29: So for today, I would suggest if LTC is willing to amend it and add an item and at the cost

[0:58:52] Voice 29: so that I can at least submit it.

[0:58:55] Voice 29: Again, this is a placeholder.

[0:58:57] Voice 29: This is not a project charter.

[0:58:59] Voice 29: So we don't want to keep tweaking it just to, you know, I don't even know what happened

[0:59:07] Voice 29: with the next term.

[0:59:07] Voice 29: But I just want to make sure we've got something for the project.

[0:59:14] Trustee Grove (probable): Thanks, Lisa. That's great. So can we be specific as to what we should be doing here?

[0:59:21] Voice 29: We can add under the budget item. Page.

[0:59:26] Voice 29: I cannot submit two years. Just so you know, I tried last year.

[0:59:30] Voice 29: I would assume you can only submit one year at a time.

[0:59:33] Voice 20: So

[0:59:33] Voice 29: we can add, I think it's page 72.

[0:59:38] Voice 21: There's

[0:59:38] Voice 29: a table there with the cost, and I had it before, I just didn't add it to this

[0:59:45] Voice 29: project.

[0:59:46] Voice 29: It's collaboration with agencies and universities.

[0:59:52] Trustee Grove (probable): So we've got a total of $127,000 there, so what should we be asking for?

[0:59:57] Trustee Grove (probable): Well,

[0:59:58] Voice 29: I'm going to say.

[1:00:00] Voice 29: 50,000 is pretty reasonable.

[1:00:02] Trustee Grove (probable): An additional 50,000?

[1:00:03] Voice 29: Yeah.

[1:00:03] Voice 29: And

[1:00:03] Trustee Grove (probable): can we put that in as a separate line item?

[1:00:05] Trustee Grove (probable): Yeah,

[1:00:06] Voice 29: that's what I'm saying.

[1:00:06] Trustee Grove (probable): The line item

[1:00:07] Voice 29: will be called collaboration with university and agencies.

[1:00:14] Trustee Grove (probable): Collaboration with university?

[1:00:16] Voice 29: Yeah, because it's a stipend, right?

[1:00:18] Trustee Grove (probable): University

[1:00:18] Voice 29: has all the data gathering abilities and they can help us.

[1:00:23] Voice 17: We may need other technical reports.

[1:00:25] Voice 17: I don't know what we need.

[1:00:28] Voice 17: Technical reports yet.

[1:00:29] Voice 17: you haven't done the scoping so

[1:00:31] Trustee Grove (probable): we can just say technical reports i

[1:00:33] Voice 17: think it's technical

[1:00:35] Voice 17: maybe

[1:00:36] Voice 29: kind of collaboration

[1:00:37] Voice 17: is collaboration is one thing which absolutely we must have could be

[1:00:42] Voice 17: agency all kinds of agencies you can't do the the the dpa for wildfire whatever it's called

[1:00:49] Voice 17: um without working with the fire department and the crds people so technical analysis it's you

[1:00:57] Voice 17: You know, technical technical whatever it's called technical

[1:01:02] Trustee Grove (probable): analysis analysis so try and make that motion.

[1:01:07] Trustee Grove (probable): i'm the business case for salt spring island ltc projects as presented by staff.

[1:01:17] Voice 21: We need to make the amendments first.

[1:01:24] Voice 21: This is

[1:01:24] Voice 21: an amendment i'm right.

[1:01:25] Voice 21: Right.

[1:01:28] Trustee Grove (probable): As presented by staff on today's date, be amended, be increased by an amount of $50,000 to cover technical analysis and

[1:01:41] Voice 29: collaboration with university and

[1:01:44] Trustee Grove (probable): collaboration, like

[1:01:47] Voice 29: working together, collaboration

[1:01:49] Trustee Grove (probable): with other agencies.

[1:01:50] Trustee Grove (probable): is that all right

[1:01:51] Voice 17: that's fine yeah the university of course seconded could we also amend the name

[1:01:57] Voice 17: so that it's major amendment to the ocd and

[1:02:01] Voice 20: lub yes

[1:02:02] Voice 12: i would be happy with that so i guess my

[1:02:09] Trustee Luckham: question before we get this motion second there's there's two elements to this and i want to thank

[1:02:14] Trustee Luckham: you laura for raising in my mind most significantly that the lub needs to be there needs to be a path

[1:02:21] Trustee Luckham: forward to facilitate LUB amendments at the conclusion of or somewhat simultaneously with

[1:02:30] Trustee Luckham: the OCP. And so my question is, in addition to the funding that you require for technical analysis,

[1:02:37] Trustee Luckham: of which no disrespect intended, but I think we need to understand what the scope of that data

[1:02:44] Trustee Luckham: analysis is 50 000 you said 50 to 80 000 i think 50 000 might do some data analysis but if you

[1:02:53] Trustee Luckham: start to embrace wildfire implications in as part of what the ocp amendments are going to contain

[1:03:00] Trustee Luckham: i can bet you that would be 50 000 by itself given the size and scope of the urban interface within

[1:03:08] Trustee Luckham: the salt spring community but what my leading question is is how much do we need to include in

[1:03:14] Trustee Luckham: that to facilitate the opportunity to do lub amendments because that's twice as many public

[1:03:20] Trustee Luckham: meetings as what we would have for an ocb amendment thank

[1:03:25] Voice 29: you for bringing that up that

[1:03:26] Voice 29: was one thing it's it's not that we don't know a professional planner we know you do the ocp

[1:03:32] Voice 29: has to change the language firewall to be reflective of the policies it's a two separate

[1:03:39] Voice 29: major project so but you always have to do the ocp first and that's why we propose one year

[1:03:49] Voice 29: we anticipate one year and then the following year then we can go and ask money for the land

[1:03:55] Voice 29: use bylaw amendment and it's a two major project now i have done lots of land use bylaw amendment

[1:04:03] Voice 29: in the past that i know is huge undertaking as you can see even 530 bylaw 530 amending

[1:04:11] Voice 29: one thing it's huge effort so i wouldn't want to bunk it up it makes it really hard for the

[1:04:19] Voice 29: consultant to even do the outreach when there are two major items to talk about so i appreciate

[1:04:26] Voice 29: chair luck when you brought that up it is a huge and it's okay and it certainly is something to

[1:04:31] Voice 29: think about the following year after the ocp is done okay

[1:04:35] Trustee Grove (probable): rob might receive the draft motion on

[1:04:39] Trustee Luckham: And maybe I'm going to have a conversation here with Laura, just a little bit of a follow-up, because I want to be sure that we understand the process.

[1:04:49] Trustee Luckham: I'm not putting words in your mouth, but I think what Laura is saying is that historically, systemically, in fact, we've often failed to do the LUB piece.

[1:05:01] Trustee Luckham: And absolutely, that's something we need to avoid.

[1:05:03] Trustee Luckham: void and so somehow we have to name it right even if we don't budget for it so that when we go into

[1:05:12] Trustee Luckham: this multi-year cycle of funding um the under it's explicit the understanding is that now we

[1:05:20] Trustee Luckham: will commence yeah

[1:05:21] Voice 17: no that's i think the title needs just it's also you know you mean it just

[1:05:25] Voice 17: we're committing you're committing to this project process that you know could take 30 years i don't

[1:05:30] Voice 17: know but um

[1:05:31] Voice 12: it's the same it's linked

[1:05:32] Voice 17: we need to link it and i think that's something from the

[1:05:35] Voice 17: regional planning committee we've made very strong that we've got to stop where you know it's not

[1:05:39] Voice 17: just on salt spring it's happened on other islands where we've done half a project and we don't

[1:05:44] Voice 17: implement the changes and kind of tie those back together again and know that when we're making

[1:05:51] Voice 17: those budget commitments that that it's a path i

[1:05:54] Trustee Grove (probable): think that's a good idea

[1:05:55] Trustee Luckham: and then if i just want

[1:05:55] Trustee Luckham: to kind of crystallize this thought and i want to provide you the opportunity to agree or not um

[1:06:02] Trustee Luckham: that that you're right the ocp is a huge project in itself which has certain parameters around it

[1:06:12] Trustee Luckham: and the lub has you know it's the vision versus the regulation right that's how you implement the

[1:06:18] Trustee Luckham: the ocp but there's a there's that collaborative crossover event time horizon where the ocp is

[1:06:27] Trustee Luckham: coming to a conclusion and ideally there's another contractor in the wings that is observing the tail

[1:06:34] Trustee Luckham: end of the ocp and there's some communication back and forth so that that can seamlessly go

[1:06:39] Trustee Luckham: from an ocp into an lub and then with an expectation that the community the community

[1:06:46] Trustee Luckham: will get the investment that they've made

[1:06:49] Trustee Luckham: in the OCP visioning exercise

[1:06:51] Trustee Luckham: in actual regulation on the ground.

[1:06:55] Trustee Luckham: So, and then, so my question is,

[1:06:58] Trustee Luckham: is how much do we need to allow for in that OCP budget

[1:07:01] Trustee Luckham: to facilitate that, not only the collaboration

[1:07:05] Trustee Luckham: with other agencies and First Nations,

[1:07:07] Trustee Luckham: but to ensure that that transitions over to an LUB

[1:07:12] Trustee Luckham: in a good way.

[1:07:16] Trustee Luckham: I had another thought, but let's maybe conclude that thought to ensure that we're providing funding.

[1:07:23] Trustee Luckham: So you've got a motion up there to add additional funding for technical work.

[1:07:27] Trustee Luckham: I think maybe my question back to Louisa is how much money should we be including to ensure that we set the stage properly for a transition to an LUB in year two or three?

[1:07:40] Trustee Luckham: And then just maybe my comment was, and I know that you're well aware of it,

[1:07:46] Trustee Luckham: that the island stress is a very different animal than other land use planning agencies

[1:07:51] Trustee Luckham: or other municipalities and regional districts that have land use planning function.

[1:07:57] Trustee Luckham: This budget, I'm really glad to see this year, right?

[1:08:00] Trustee Luckham: You're thinking about this early because this is what we need to be prepared.

[1:08:03] Trustee Luckham: We need to talk to our colleagues on council and at FPC and the incoming council trustees need to have that conversation and concur with whatever the conclusions are, because we have to ask council for that $300,000.

[1:08:18] Trustee Luckham: It's just not so much a matter of going to the taxpayer and asking for $300,000. It's going to council to say, Salt Spring wants $300,000 to do this. And quite

[1:08:28] Voice 15: honestly, in the last budget cycle, the $90,000 that was asked for.

[1:08:33] Voice 15: was a big goal sorry

[1:08:37] Trustee Grove (probable): but let's not get too bogged down as losers told us this is like a face holder

[1:08:40] Trustee Grove (probable): we just want to get it on the list it's going to change this is not how it's going to look at

[1:08:44] Trustee Grove (probable): the end and we just want to get it down in place so um can we focus on that so

[1:08:52] Trustee Luckham: i just wonder should

[1:08:54] Trustee Luckham: we so my question for both of you is should there be a another amount of consideration

[1:09:03] Voice 20: i

[1:09:04] Voice 17: don't think i don't think you need to because it would be next year's budget

[1:09:07] Voice 17: name the project such that it's very clear that we're heading down that path okay

[1:09:13] Trustee Luckham: um

[1:09:15] Trustee Luckham: so that's your motion peter i

[1:09:18] Voice 17: think there's a couple of

[1:09:19] Trustee Grove (probable): changes there's some changes we want

[1:09:20] Trustee Luckham: to the

[1:09:20] Trustee Grove (probable): official community plan and the nice land use bylaw right and

[1:09:25] Voice 17: well no and and include it and

[1:09:29] Voice 17: include the a review of the blah blah blah in the title of the project

[1:09:36] Voice 17: so let's let's just add in the title of the project at the end there yeah

[1:09:43] Voice 21: and then

[1:09:45] Voice 17: i think

[1:09:48] Voice 17: your technical analysis it should just be technical analysis

[1:09:51] Voice 17: and collaboration not necessarily through collaboration

[1:09:55] Voice 22: i think that's

[1:09:56] Voice 21: better anything

[1:10:02] Voice 21: anything else yeah and

[1:10:06] Trustee Grove (probable): I'll be okay with fifty thousand dollars I

[1:10:08] Voice 17: don't think it's enough I mean

[1:10:10] Voice 17: the development permit area and I would look to Jason I know the CRD is doing a major study

[1:10:16] Voice 17: right now that

[1:10:17] Voice 17: will somewhat inform that development permit area but we don't know

[1:10:22] Voice 17: you know there there may be additional mapping that will need to be done and I think there was

[1:10:28] Voice 17: some grant funding that may be available to help support that element as well but

[1:10:36] Trustee Grove (probable): family yeah if

[1:10:38] Trustee Grove (probable): it's a placeholder let's double it to a hundred thousand dollars yeah

[1:10:45] Voice 12: you know i can't help but

[1:10:47] Trustee Luckham: think that to some extent the ltc needs to set out what it wants to do right and the staff need to

[1:10:54] Trustee Luckham: come back and say this is how much it's going to cost yeah absolutely so even putting the numbers

[1:11:00] Trustee Luckham: I think

[1:11:01] Voice 17: there's a lot of technical work to be done to support.

[1:11:10] Trustee Luckham: So do you need a

[1:11:11] Trustee Luckham: firm number in there, or is it simply better that you come back to

[1:11:15] Trustee Luckham: us with the next draft?

[1:11:17] Voice 29: It can only be an estimate.

[1:11:19] Voice 29: At

[1:11:19] Trustee Luckham: this

[1:11:21] Voice 29: stage, we don't even know what happened after the election.

[1:11:24] Voice 29: So it's a placeholder for us to secure some funding.

[1:11:29] Trustee Grove (probable): so that's put in there what we think we need and fifty thousand is not enough but we don't

[1:11:34] Voice 17: want a short

[1:11:34] Trustee Grove (probable): change and support

[1:11:36] Voice 17: making it a hundred you haven't seconded it yet we're still

[1:11:38] Voice 17: yeah i think for

[1:11:39] Voice 29: one year that's pretty good what

[1:11:41] Trustee Luckham: how much for

[1:11:42] Voice 29: one year i think this is the 50.

[1:11:45] Voice 29: no there are 100 days

[1:11:47] Trustee Luckham: oh i see okay yeah i'd be happy with that i'll second that motion good

[1:11:52] Trustee Grove (probable): Okay,

[1:11:54] Trustee Luckham: so moved and seconded. Any further discussion? Any further remarks from staff? No? Okay. Then all those in favour? That carries. Okay, there

[1:12:07] Trustee Grove (probable): you go. There's a second.

[1:12:08] Trustee Grove (probable): So I just put my hand up and I didn't see anything happen.

[1:12:11] Trustee Grove (probable): Well,

[1:12:11] Trustee Luckham: I wouldn't count on what that...

[1:12:16] Trustee Luckham: How did you do that?

[1:12:18] Trustee Luckham: Well, and I just said those opposed and I just thought you raised your hand.

[1:12:22] Trustee Luckham: do

[1:12:22] Voice 17: we do we need to now don't

[1:12:25] Trustee Luckham: count on that that's that's why we aren't able to run the

[1:12:28] Trustee Luckham: zoom meetings to have them uh fully on because the internet is just not capable of supporting

[1:12:36] Trustee Luckham: it's

[1:12:36] Trustee Grove (probable): quite distracting having the video up there but

[1:12:39] Trustee Luckham: you have to watch now watch it

[1:12:41] Trustee Luckham: okay rob and i kind of need to keep an eye on it you still

[1:12:45] Voice 17: need that motion to endorse though

[1:12:46] Voice 17: that was just to amend correct um i

[1:12:50] Voice 17: think we yeah

[1:12:51] Trustee Luckham: so

[1:12:52] Voice 17: i move that the salt spring island local trust

[1:12:54] Voice 17: committee endorsed the business case for the major amendment to the salt spring island local trust

[1:13:01] Voice 17: committee official community plan and land use bylaws as um shown in the appendix one as amended

[1:13:10] Voice 20: of

[1:13:10] Voice 17: the staff report dated august 9 2022 and forward it to the island's trust financial

[1:13:15] Voice 17: financial planning committee for consideration of its inclusion in the 2023-24 Island's Trust

[1:13:19] Voice 17: budget.

[1:13:20] Voice 21: And I will second that. Did you get that, Rob? A couple of minor tweets.

[1:13:42] Voice 21: So that sounds like your motion, Laura. Oh, I think so.

[1:13:55] Voice 17: We just want to have an

[1:13:55] Voice 17: as amended. Yep.

[1:13:58] Trustee Luckham: Seconded by Peter Grove. Any further discussion? No. All those in favor?

[1:14:01] Trustee Luckham: So that carries. Okay.

[1:14:04] Trustee Grove (probable): And I'll move that social matter.

[1:14:05] Voice 17: Yes. No, we need to discuss the next

[1:14:07] Voice 17: business case this

[1:14:09] Voice 21: is the village business case okay yes so um

[1:14:20] Voice 17: i mean i just right i mean the same

[1:14:23] Voice 17: the issue regarding what does good look like working with first nations i you know i understand

[1:14:29] Voice 17: the comment that your staff are becoming a bit more comfortable with what the process is but

[1:14:35] Voice 17: we're still not dealing with that community interface of what that process is and that's

[1:14:40] Voice 17: critically important to me um so while while we can endorse trying to move forward the footprint

[1:14:46] Voice 17: i feel we're still stuck for that same issue we just talked about with the ocp that you know we've

[1:14:52] Voice 17: got to figure out um what what that looks like and and i do know that you know we were we met

[1:15:04] Voice 17: with minister cullen we talked about dandy's village plan and the and the need to do this

[1:15:09] Voice 17: and he was interested and we haven't followed up to say can we move that from interested to

[1:15:14] Voice 17: the province actually be more interested in actually participating in helping us do this new

[1:15:23] Voice 17: level of cooperation with these nations you

[1:15:27] Voice 20: are right so i mean

[1:15:31] Voice 17: i'm fine with we can either push

[1:15:32] Voice 17: this forward but we have to continue our work to follow up with the province and see if we can

[1:15:37] Voice 17: really turn this project into something really helpful and straightforward sure

[1:15:46] Voice 29: i do have a

[1:15:48] Voice 29: comment uh the the way we budgeted it for first nation it's pretty small i would definitely like

[1:15:55] Voice 29: to ask for more again i was really conservative in the

[1:16:00] Voice 29: approach in asking but 26 000 for 13 nations

[1:16:06] Voice 29: it's pretty small should

[1:16:10] Voice 21: we double that too to 50 well

[1:16:13] Voice 17: or we could add a note

[1:16:16] Voice 17: you know or make sure we put a note in the minutes that we need to follow up with minister

[1:16:22] Voice 17: cullen regarding the opportunities to use this project as a pilot for the province on

[1:16:31] Voice 17: cooperative planning i don't know peter if you know how what we can do to or we can make a

[1:16:38] Voice 17: resolution that we follow up with minister cullen maybe it needs

[1:16:42] Voice 21: to be stronger worded

[1:16:44] Voice 21: um that would make sense to me we need to be very directive so

[1:16:52] Voice 17: park maybe just endorse this as is

[1:16:54] Voice 17: and then maybe add a new resolution that we follow up with minister cullen on pursuing

[1:16:59] Voice 17: ganji's village as a pilot because i mean we're

[1:17:02] Trustee Luckham: going to bring

[1:17:02] Voice 17: we're going to have to bring money

[1:17:03] Voice 17: to the table we're hoping the province brings money to the table to help us bring this project

[1:17:08] Voice 17: that um

[1:17:11] Trustee Luckham: yeah so i think you know we need to demonstrate our commitment to advancing this

[1:17:16] Trustee Luckham: work and this is what this is um and indeed a follow-up conversation with the minister

[1:17:21] Trustee Luckham: on his expression of interest in this project is something that could be done and then we can

[1:17:29] Trustee Luckham: get a real sense of what the water is like

[1:17:31] Trustee Luckham: because that will also require quite a bit of

[1:17:35] Trustee Luckham: uh back and forth so

[1:17:39] Trustee Grove (probable): should we make this motion and get on with that should

[1:17:41] Voice 17: we make this motion

[1:17:41] Voice 17: trust

[1:17:42] Trustee Grove (probable): committee endorsed the business case for the ganges village area plan shown in appendix

[1:17:47] Trustee Grove (probable): two of the staff report dated august 9th 2022 went forward to the islands trust financial

[1:17:52] Trustee Grove (probable): planning committee for consideration of inclusion in the 2023-24 islands trust budget

[1:17:57] Trustee Grove (probable): second

[1:17:58] Trustee Luckham: okay so that's the motion as presented i'm not mistaken yeah um and so then i'll call

[1:18:05] Trustee Luckham: for the second that was laura patrick thank you any further discussion all those in favor that

[1:18:11] Trustee Luckham: carries you

[1:18:12] Voice 17: want me to wing a yeah

[1:18:13] Trustee Luckham: i'll wing a motion

[1:18:14] Voice 17: rob you ready i'll move that the south

[1:18:18] Voice 17: bay island local trust committee requests the executive committee to follow up with

[1:18:26] Voice 17: minister of municipal affairs minister minister cullen

[1:18:30] Voice 21: on his expressed interest yeah his

[1:18:39] Voice 17: his expressed interest in in uh considering the ganges village planning as a pilot

[1:18:48] Voice 17: for cooperative

[1:18:50] Voice 21: planning with first nations beautiful yeah and we may even want

[1:19:00] Trustee Luckham: to we can

[1:19:01] Voice 12: do

[1:19:02] Trustee Luckham: that at ec is to invite the minister of indigenous affairs to engage in that and bring

[1:19:07] Trustee Grove (probable): a checkbook rob can you see it on the board he's

[1:19:10] Voice 17: typing yeah

[1:19:11] Trustee Grove (probable): but

[1:19:12] Voice 21: anyway that's adequate for the

[1:19:14] Voice 21: moment definitely need to work oh yeah sure if we wanted that as the title or the individual type

[1:19:52] Voice 21: Oh, I see.

[1:19:55] Voice 21: That'd be fine.

[1:19:57] Voice 21: No, that's fine.

[1:20:02] Voice 21: Yeah.

[1:20:04] Voice 21: His expressed interest.

[1:20:06] Voice 21: His expressed interest

[1:20:07] Voice 21: for Kanji Village.

[1:20:10] Voice 17: Pilot for cooperative planning with First Nations at

[1:20:18] Voice 21: the very end.

[1:20:19] Voice 21: For cooperative planning with First Nations.

[1:20:31] Voice 21: Okay.

[1:20:32] Voice 21: Good with that?

[1:20:33] Trustee Luckham: And

[1:20:34] Trustee Grove (probable): I'll second that in that case.

[1:20:35] Trustee Luckham: I'll second it then.

[1:20:36] Trustee Luckham: Any other discussion?

[1:20:37] Trustee Luckham: No.

[1:20:38] Trustee Luckham: All those in favor?

[1:20:39] Trustee Luckham: Is that carried unanimously also?

[1:20:42] Trustee Luckham: all right so i think that concludes it with

[1:20:44] Voice 17: that i have one more oh

[1:20:46] Trustee Luckham: um

[1:20:48] Voice 17: i wanted to i was going to

[1:20:51] Voice 17: raise the result i'm bringing it up in the business case section it may require work at the

[1:20:58] Voice 17: regional planning committee but i'm we only have two protocol agreements with the crd one is park

[1:21:05] Voice 17: park dedications during subdivision the other

[1:21:07] Voice 17: is business is uh building permits

[1:21:12] Voice 17: and I think we're missing so many opportunities to be cooperating I know staff work generally

[1:21:20] Voice 17: well together but we're not taking the time to sit down during the budget process and say hey

[1:21:24] Voice 17: what are you doing you know Jason and I were surprised when we found out the CRD was doing

[1:21:29] Voice 17: this wildfire study last year you know and it was uh you know we shouldn't be finding out about that

[1:21:35] Voice 17: we'll be going out to tender we should be talking about it at the budget time and cooperating so

[1:21:40] Voice 17: what i'm i'm going to raise a motion that may uh let me put the motion on the floor and then

[1:21:46] Voice 17: we can decide to discuss it um but it could be it should probably be a regional uh because it's not

[1:21:53] Voice 17: just us it's the southern all violence um that need to be in involved i'll i'll be referencing

[1:21:59] Voice 17: seeing later today uh the crd did a complete housing strategic plan for the southern gulf

[1:22:06] Voice 17: islands last year including market analysis and feasibility studies on the cost of building

[1:22:12] Voice 17: accessory dwelling units why that was all done for the southern gulf islands and that's shared with

[1:22:18] Voice 17: the salt spring it's just i can't explain it and we've got to stop behaving like that i think that's

[1:22:24] Voice 17: we just have to work together so i'm going

[1:22:25] Voice 18: to throw this motion on the

[1:22:26] Voice 17: floor i moved that the

[1:22:27] Voice 17: salt spring and i sent it to you rob i thought i think

[1:22:32] Voice 21: i did um see if you got it i didn't send it

[1:22:36] Voice 21: to you i sent it to you that's okay you're right rob

[1:22:44] Voice 12: is brilliant okay

[1:22:45] Voice 17: i tried sending

[1:22:47] Voice 17: it to you

[1:22:47] Voice 17: and it didn't oh it's still sending it it mustn't be working yeah go slow i moved that the salt

[1:22:54] Voice 17: Gold Spring Island Local Trust Committee

[1:22:56] Voice 17: request staff to prepare a business case

[1:23:01] Voice 21: to facilitate the development

[1:23:03] Voice 21: of a new protocol agreement

[1:23:16] Voice 21: or a memo of understanding

[1:23:21] Voice 21: between the Local Trust Committee and the CRD

[1:23:27] Voice 21: to facilitate improved cooperation

[1:23:35] Voice 17: on local and

[1:23:38] Voice 21: regional planning

[1:23:39] Voice 17: issues.

[1:23:40] Voice 17: issues. Sounds good.

[1:23:49] Voice 17: Sorry, Rob, I did try something else. Some of the writing is different

[1:23:56] Voice 17: than what I just said. Do you

[1:24:00] Voice 4: want me to use that? Oh,

[1:24:02] Voice 17: no, I just, no, no, no, what you got.

[1:24:03] Voice 22: I'm just, okay.

[1:24:05] Voice 4: Just give me one more.

[1:24:16] Voice 17: Just examples would be like, you know, an annual,

[1:24:20] Voice 17: I just see this as formalizing some things, you know, an annual sit-down between staff and the

[1:24:25] Voice 17: elected during budget processing they're on a little different schedule but we should make it

[1:24:31] Voice 17: work meet early during their schedule meet again during our budget and just maximize our cooperation

[1:24:40] Voice 17: and this could potentially be dealt with as the region i think there could be one protocol

[1:24:45] Voice 17: agreement between the islands the local trust committees and the crd to cover these issues

[1:24:55] Voice 29: so chair i just have a question on this motion uh instead of business case should

[1:25:04] Voice 21: it be project

[1:25:04] Voice 21: charter it

[1:25:08] Voice 17: could be i was just taking advantage of the business case to raise the issue um

[1:25:12] Voice 17: it's or a memo of understanding not for um and

[1:25:18] Voice 21: um um i mean i'm i'm

[1:25:29] Voice 17: open to suggestions um if

[1:25:30] Voice 17: do you think of the business but i wanted to raise the conversation and

[1:25:35] Voice 22: i was using

[1:25:36] Voice 17: the business case

[1:25:37] Voice 17: as the conversation because uh it may require other local trust committees to be involved in this

[1:25:43] Voice 17: so

[1:25:44] Trustee Luckham: maybe um what you you sort of hinted about that at the beginning about asking the regional

[1:25:52] Trustee Luckham: planning committee to do that

[1:25:53] Trustee Luckham: so maybe that's where that the motion needs to be directed is

[1:25:57] Trustee Luckham: to to request regional planning committee to prepare

[1:26:03] Voice 12: a business case blah blah blah or

[1:26:05] Voice 12: possibly

[1:26:06] Trustee Luckham: ask council to ask you know like that's where it starts to get messy because

[1:26:10] Trustee Luckham: the committees work under the direction of council primarily let's

[1:26:16] Trustee Grove (probable): just do it for salt

[1:26:17] Trustee Grove (probable): spring and we can manage salt spring whereas everything else takes on a bigger well you're

[1:26:21] Voice 15: right except it gets on your project list and then you have to prioritize that on your project list

[1:26:26] Voice 15: true so

[1:26:30] Voice 15: i'm just juggling that worldview but you're right and that could be i guess if this

[1:26:36] Voice 15: is an action that's on our follow-up action list then we can develop it as or we could

[1:26:43] Voice 17: just request staff to report back on options options how about that yeah yeah

[1:26:48] Voice 17: report back

[1:26:50] Voice 17: on options to facilitate the development of a new protocol agreement how about that good idea

[1:26:54] Voice 20: yeah does that

[1:26:55] Voice 17: work better works

[1:26:56] Voice 29: better i definitely cannot do another business case

[1:26:59] Voice 29: and i

[1:26:59] Voice 29: don't see business you

[1:27:00] Voice 17: know it's more just a i took advantage of that section to have that

[1:27:05] Voice 17: that

[1:27:06] Trustee Grove (probable): makes sense

[1:27:07] Trustee Luckham: so that's a much more manageable yeah and

[1:27:10] Trustee Grove (probable): i will second that okay

[1:27:11] Trustee Luckham: so moved and

[1:27:14] Trustee Luckham: seconded then any further discussion all those in favor i carry thanks okay

[1:27:18] Trustee Luckham: thank you um so then

[1:27:23] Trustee Luckham: that concludes the business cases i think at this time we've

[1:27:26] Trustee Grove (probable): got 8.2 swipper say again

[1:27:29] Trustee Grove (probable): swiffer yeah

[1:27:30] Trustee Luckham: 8.2 there's not a business well okay you're right

[1:27:32] Trustee Luckham: it's a business case it's a separate thing

[1:27:36] Trustee Luckham: um i just wanted to make a remark actually uh regional acting regional planning manager um

[1:27:43] Trustee Luckham: when i had said that we don't ever get around to doing luv amendments i just want to recognize

[1:27:49] Trustee Luckham: i said we own that we're not saying that staff aren't doing that um we own that um because we

[1:27:55] Trustee Luckham: don't plan for it appropriately i

[1:27:58] Voice 29: didn't even catch that so thank you okay

[1:28:01] Trustee Luckham: so now we'll move

[1:28:02] Trustee Luckham: on to the 8.2 salt spring island water protection um association alliance special property tax

[1:28:13] Trustee Luckham: tax requisition business case.

[1:28:14] Trustee Luckham: So who, ah, Planner Yeomans, thank you, Chad.

[1:28:22] Voice 3: In a similar vein to what

[1:28:25] Voice 3: Active Regional Planning Manager Garbo

[1:28:27] Voice 3: was just discussing with you,

[1:28:30] Voice 3: this is an opportunity to put in an early budget request

[1:28:34] Voice 3: for a special property tax requisition

[1:28:36] Voice 3: to continue funding

[1:28:37] Voice 3: the Salt Spring Island Watershed Protection Alliance.

[1:28:40] Voice 3: We've been informed by the Director

[1:28:42] Voice 3: of Administrative Services

[1:28:43] Voice 3: that she would like this sort of thing in the budget as early as possible so it is

[1:28:48] Voice 20: in

[1:28:49] Voice 3: the vein of a placeholder really at this point recognizing that it's probably a little bit

[1:28:53] Voice 3: premature at this time to commit funds to SWPA in the same way as past years recognizing that

[1:29:01] Voice 3: we're in the middle of a strategic planning process that may yield some sort of change in

[1:29:07] Voice 3: orientation of what SWPA does who does it how or how it's done you know whether it continues

[1:29:13] Voice 3: to live with the Iowans Trust or goes elsewhere. I'm not sure the speed at which any changes will

[1:29:20] Voice 3: occur based on the results of this strategic planning exercise, so it's probably prudent to,

[1:29:28] Voice 3: if the LTC wishes to continue to fund SWIFT or see SWIFT operate in a manner similar to the way

[1:29:35] Voice 3: it has over the past years, it's probably prudent to include this in the budget at this time and

[1:29:40] Voice 3: and the LTC and Trust Council can revisit it

[1:29:43] Voice 3: further down the road if they want to see changes made.

[1:29:47] Voice 3: Staff are recommending a special property tax requisition

[1:29:50] Voice 3: request of $75,500, which reflects that

[1:29:54] Voice 3: which has been made over the past,

[1:29:56] Voice 3: I think we've been doing that for three years or so,

[1:29:58] Voice 3: though I will note.

[1:30:00] Voice 3: that last year trust council reduced the special property tax requisition amount down to six

[1:30:05] Voice 3: thousand dollars so um that was a decision i think that was made on the floor at the trust

[1:30:11] Voice 3: council meeting um we are able to top up that sixty thousand dollars to unspent special property

[1:30:21] Voice 3: tax requisition funds for previous fiscal years that are still in reserve and so could make up

[1:30:26] Voice 3: any difference um that was left by that reduced special property tax requisition

[1:30:32] Voice 3: however it's really at the ltc's leisure as to what size of special property tax requisition

[1:30:40] Voice 3: they would wish to see put in place in order to continue funding swifa it can fund swifa at

[1:30:46] Voice 3: any level that it so chooses um

[1:30:52] Voice 12: so that concludes your report so we'll go for questions or directions

[1:30:57] Voice 12: One

[1:30:57] Trustee Grove (probable): quick point in your report on page 82, say, but will be open in January 2022, you mean 2023, I think.

[1:31:13] Trustee Grove (probable): Let me just find that here.

[1:31:18] Voice 21: Yes, correct. Thank you for that.

[1:31:21] Trustee Grove (probable): And then...

[1:31:22] Trustee Grove (probable): The hazards of reusing.

[1:31:24] Trustee Grove (probable): yeah um and uh the other concern i have about this and i and i think i guess we have to have

[1:31:32] Trustee Grove (probable): a placeholder but this is coming without any discussion by this by the swipper committee

[1:31:39] Trustee Grove (probable): itself as to what they want if am

[1:31:45] Trustee Grove (probable): i correct that

[1:31:46] Voice 3: is correct at this time swipa has not

[1:31:48] Voice 3: had a discussion about its work program or or recommendations for itself which is kind of

[1:31:55] Voice 3: ironically um for the coming fiscal year and

[1:31:58] Trustee Grove (probable): then if i just met my third part is i i'm having every

[1:32:04] Trustee Grove (probable): year i have an increased concern about i think you know um so i mean i won't be around i'll still be

[1:32:13] Trustee Grove (probable): alive but i wouldn't be around i think for um decision making on this issue but um it it does

[1:32:23] Trustee Grove (probable): does not sit well with me of the whole sweep of budget at this point having said that since it's

[1:32:28] Trustee Grove (probable): a placeholder um i will support it if my federal

[1:32:33] Voice 21: trustee agrees yeah yeah i

[1:32:40] Voice 17: mean carts and horses

[1:32:44] Voice 17: really would like to have the watershed strategic planning done because that's an element of that

[1:32:49] Voice 17: um to have a more defined path going forward and um i know that julia um pardon her last

[1:33:03] Voice 17: mobs thank you um had said that not this budget but the previous year municipal affairs did

[1:33:13] Voice 17: red flag this budget item and asked when are we stopping the special tax requisition that

[1:33:22] Voice 17: um so i i'm i'm hopeful that the plan is going to bring some new structure to how we do things and

[1:33:32] Voice 17: what are you know what this looks like and it's putting more burden on the agencies themselves

[1:33:38] Voice 17: to be doing the work so that if what work we are committing to is project work or violence trust

[1:33:45] Voice 17: whole work that is being funded differently than having a coordinator necessarily that's being

[1:33:52] Voice 17: funded so um i'm hopeful that there could be significant

[1:34:00] Voice 21: changes if you know

[1:34:01] Voice 17: this is even

[1:34:02] Voice 17: potentially replaced you know so there may be a need for a business case and maybe maybe that's

[1:34:10] Voice 17: but it may not be a special tax reposition it may just be a business case for x dollars to support

[1:34:18] Voice 17: a function of coordinating agencies.

[1:34:24] Voice 17: So we can either leave this as a parked item for now,

[1:34:29] Voice 17: but it will need to change when we get the plan, which

[1:34:36] Voice 17: hopefully will be before March.

[1:34:37] Voice 17: Better be before March.

[1:34:39] Voice 17: It

[1:34:39] Voice 20: will have to be.

[1:34:40] Voice 17: Has to be before March.

[1:34:41] Voice 17: So there could be significant change.

[1:34:43] Voice 17: This could move from being a special tax

[1:34:45] Voice 17: tax record which will affect how financial financing budgets

[1:34:52] Voice 21: the item yeah i think you

[1:34:58] Voice 15: know you said

[1:34:59] Voice 15: carts and horses i think this is an attempt to get the horses in front of the cart

[1:35:03] Voice 15: with respect to the feedback we had in the last budget cycle about having information earlier

[1:35:09] Voice 15: because indeed this is quite early

[1:35:11] Trustee Luckham: and it's um hard to believe that we're just thinking about

[1:35:15] Trustee Luckham: a bunch of remarks already but here we are so the motion that's there are you satisfied to advance

[1:35:25] Trustee Luckham: that today well

[1:35:28] Voice 17: we either leave it as a maybe we could tweak the wording of the motion once it's

[1:35:34] Voice 17: like um and

[1:35:35] Voice 12: that's on page um or

[1:35:36] Voice 17: you know i think we should bring the financial i

[1:35:42] Voice 17: think we should

[1:35:43] Voice 17: bring to the financial planning committee's attention that ongoing funding this project

[1:35:51] Voice 17: you know there may there may there will be changes and it may not be special tax requisition funding

[1:35:56] Voice 17: that we'll be seeking so i think i think we do need to give a message to the financial planning

[1:36:00] Voice 17: committee that you know heads up um how the citizens dealt with

[1:36:13] Trustee Grove (probable): what you suggested

[1:36:14] Trustee Luckham: chair of fpc i think that you're likely to see some of them well i think

[1:36:20] Trustee Grove (probable): it's helpful to to have these things on paper but then what happens with them down the road is

[1:36:24] Trustee Grove (probable): another matter um well

[1:36:27] Voice 17: we're waiting maybe we can note that we're still waiting waiting um for the

[1:36:32] Voice 17: outcome of the planning exercise so maybe that's all we have to let them know there may be

[1:36:39] Voice 17: changes coming so

[1:36:41] Voice 21: from what exercise from the strategic planning

[1:36:50] Voice 21: so sorry what are you suggesting we say to the we say here and now we could just

[1:37:04] Voice 21: approve the business case and not the special property tax requisition

[1:37:08] Voice 21: does that make sense hello yeah

[1:37:22] Voice 21: no i'm thinking i

[1:37:23] Voice 21: would

[1:37:25] Trustee Grove (probable): just remove the wording special tax

[1:37:27] Trustee Grove (probable): requisition and just say business case i

[1:37:33] Voice 21: think that's probably a

[1:37:35] Voice 17: conservative approach but

[1:37:38] Voice 17: we still have to talk with fbc about it oh

[1:37:41] Trustee Grove (probable): of course we do and i think from fbc just want to

[1:37:44] Trustee Grove (probable): know that it's there in the in the woods but they're not making any decisions the sources of

[1:37:49] Trustee Grove (probable): of funding I

[1:37:50] Voice 20: believe

[1:37:53] Voice 3: the whole origin of the special property tax requisition was because

[1:37:59] Voice 3: this is an authority that typically rests with the trust council but was then delegated to the

[1:38:07] Voice 3: LTC through bylaw 154 and because it is a special power delegated the LTC there therefore needed to

[1:38:17] Voice 3: be some special funding mechanism for that and that special funding mechanism

[1:38:24] Voice 3: is the special property tax requisition rather than the general trust council budget

[1:38:32] Voice 3: trust council and this is going back to to subjects that transpired before

[1:38:39] Voice 3: my time here

[1:38:40] Voice 3: but i've looked through most of the paperwork just trying to get up to speed on on how this

[1:38:44] Voice 3: all happened i believe that trust council will only fund projects that are directly within

[1:38:50] Voice 3: the local trust committee's authorities as defined in the in the act in the islands trust act and

[1:38:56] Voice 3: because administering a coordinating body like swift falls outside of those regular

[1:39:03] Voice 3: responsibilities of the local trust committee the ltc at that time was told that it needs to fund it

[1:39:08] Voice 3: through a special property tax requisition that applies only to to taxpayers within the salt

[1:39:12] Voice 3: in our local trust area rather than spread across the federation more generally no

[1:39:20] Voice 17: i i yeah so i

[1:39:22] Voice 17: maybe just leave it as is and recognize that we're going to potentially have some changes once we get

[1:39:27] Voice 17: the strategic plan because it may we may need to go back it may become a trust council coordination

[1:39:33] Voice 17: feature again potentially i'm

[1:39:36] Trustee Grove (probable): happy to do that all

[1:39:37] Voice 17: right let me just i'll i'll move it to the

[1:39:41] Voice 17: me i love the trust committee endorsed with a special property tax requisition business case

[1:39:45] Voice 17: attached to the staff report of july 27 2022 imparted to the island stress financial planning

[1:39:50] Voice 17: committee for inclusion in the draft 2023-24 island's trust budget i'll

[1:39:55] Trustee Grove (probable): second that and i

[1:39:56] Trustee Grove (probable): have a comment

[1:39:57] Voice 17: okay

[1:39:58] Voice 12: so moved and seconded as peter you wish to speak yeah

[1:40:02] Trustee Grove (probable): i would just like to hear

[1:40:03] Trustee Grove (probable): from the super committee as to what they think oh

[1:40:06] Voice 12: i

[1:40:08] Trustee Grove (probable): mean they should be recommending to us what what

[1:40:11] Trustee Grove (probable): we should be doing yeah

[1:40:13] Voice 3: and and that that typically does happen annually that sometimes the

[1:40:18] Trustee Grove (probable): timing

[1:40:19] Voice 20: yeah we're

[1:40:22] Trustee Grove (probable): trying to get that should we request that in this emotional we just need it

[1:40:25] Trustee Grove (probable): well

[1:40:25] Voice 17: no it will happen but i mean it's also everyone's waiting for the outcome of the

[1:40:29] Voice 17: strategic plan which is going to affect some of these conversations but there there will

[1:40:37] Voice 17: If I expect what I'm expecting, the outcome of the plan will require Islands Trust itself to have some conversations about our relationship.

[1:40:51] Voice 17: Because it is going to be related to the, our work is going to be related to the Federation's water planning exercises.

[1:41:01] Voice 17: exercises so there may be new conversations that have to happen to understand how we move forward

[1:41:07] Voice 17: as an organization with committing this not you know even on salt spring because there may be

[1:41:13] Voice 17: other islands that need to do more of this type of work too and

[1:41:16] Trustee Grove (probable): we think we've got a lot to do

[1:41:17] Trustee Grove (probable): right well let's just go ahead with this yeah let's

[1:41:19] Trustee Luckham: get on to our next

[1:41:20] Trustee Luckham: portion of the agenda

[1:41:21] Trustee Luckham: so that's moved and seconded any further discussion all those in favor

[1:41:27] Trustee Luckham: that carries unanimously thank you very much so now if i'm not mistaken i would like to go into

[1:41:34] Trustee Luckham: it in

[1:41:34] Trustee Grove (probable): the camera from 5 30 8.3 oh

[1:41:39] Trustee Luckham: right sorry 8.3 not a report a query i think yeah

[1:41:44] Voice 17: and i have a

[1:41:45] Voice 17: quick question i see david marler has responded and i just wanted to raise this at this point

[1:41:49] Voice 17: there's been a lot of interest that have been written by law 530 i mean

[1:41:54] Voice 17: purposely we wanted it broad because we're looking for people willing to be landlords

[1:42:00] Voice 17: we're also intrigued by limiting the number of units that are out there and my question

[1:42:07] Voice 17: that i asked and i'm going to really get an answer

[1:42:10] Voice 17: from david maybe you can answer that clearly

[1:42:13] Voice 17: we can make amendments to a bylaw after public hearing but we cannot affect use for density is

[1:42:19] Voice 17: that correct um

[1:42:21] Voice 29: i can't say i know

[1:42:23] Voice 17: much about it okay

[1:42:24] Voice 6: so that would be generally true so my

[1:42:27] Voice 17: question was if we came up with if we asked if staff were able to come up with a mechanism

[1:42:34] Voice 17: to manage the number of permissions per year or something like that

[1:42:40] Voice 17: i'm just talking theoretically with that does that is that a use of density effect and i see

[1:42:49] Voice 17: See, David Marler has his hand up.

[1:42:51] Trustee Luckham: David Marler, welcome.

[1:42:54] Trustee Luckham: Thank you.

[1:42:55] Trustee Luckham: Can you hear me okay?

[1:42:57] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, so Acting Regional Planning Manager David Marler has joined us today.

[1:43:02] Trustee Luckham: We're in camera session, but conveniently we have a question for him.

[1:43:06] Trustee Luckham: Did you copy the question?

[1:43:08] Voice 13: I believe I did.

[1:43:09] Voice 13: So I think the question is, if you were to have some form of a cap or a maximum number of units per year, would that be considered use or density?

[1:43:24] Voice 13: Is that that's my understanding of the question.

[1:43:27] Voice 13: Yes,

[1:43:27] Voice 17: it's could we amend the bylaw after public hearing to add a cap without impacting the public hearing?

[1:43:37] Voice 17: yeah

[1:43:38] Voice 13: well the first um the first response is my reading of the local government act section 479

[1:43:47] Voice 13: is it doesn't include the ability to have a timing component to your use and density

[1:43:57] Voice 13: it allows citing and size and setbacks and heights and uses and density but there's no

[1:44:05] Voice 13: indication of timing in there and I'm not aware of any jurisdiction in BC that has that ability,

[1:44:12] Voice 13: that ability to say in this zone we allow say one dwelling per lot but we're only going to allow

[1:44:21] Voice 13: 10 per year or 20 per year to be developed. I can't think of a mechanism under the Local

[1:44:28] Voice 13: of Government Act that will allow us to do that. So I think off the bat we can't do that. There may

[1:44:35] Voice 13: be other ways to do it, but we'd need to do quite a bit of research to figure out what that would

[1:44:42] Voice 13: look like. But purely using Section 479, I don't believe we can.

[1:44:47] Voice 17: I understand the research,

[1:44:49] Voice 17: but I'm just saying, theoretically, would we impact the public hearing if we were to do that

[1:44:55] Voice 17: work?

[1:44:56] Voice 13: Yeah, so I think the answer there is yes. I think that the use in density is established by

[1:45:03] Voice 13: the number per lot, so you're not going to change the use or density, but the discussion around,

[1:45:13] Voice 13: the public discussion around having some form of annual cap I think could encroach on the use

[1:45:20] Voice 13: and density. So I think you would probably have to go back to public hearing just because I think

[1:45:25] Voice 13: I think the range of the discussion

[1:45:30] Voice 13: is going to fundamentally affect what the bylaw looks like.

[1:45:34] Voice 13: I don't think it's a simple amendment.

[1:45:36] Voice 17: So what we could still proceed with the public hearing

[1:45:39] Voice 17: and then if that's a message that comes out,

[1:45:41] Voice 17: that's just a risk we're taking.

[1:45:43] Voice 19: Absolutely.

[1:45:44] Voice 17: Okay, that's fine.

[1:45:47] Voice 19: Okay.

[1:45:50] Trustee Luckham: Okay, is that it for the time?

[1:45:52] Voice 17: I just wanted to get that clarity

[1:45:53] Voice 17: and have that as a public conversation, so thank you.

[1:45:55] Voice 17: Okay.

[1:45:56] Trustee Luckham: So then let us now then move to our in-camera portion of the meeting and thank

[1:46:01] Trustee Luckham: the members of the public for joining us this morning. And we will be returning at noon

[1:46:06] Trustee Luckham: to continue with the rest of the agenda. And so I'll turn to the trustee for a motion.

[1:46:10] Trustee Grove (probable): So I'll move that Salisbury County Local Trust Committee close this meeting to the public

[1:46:14] Trustee Grove (probable): subject to Community Charter Section 91, the receipt of advice that is subject to solicitor

[1:46:19] Trustee Grove (probable): client privilege, including communications necessary for that purpose.

[1:46:23] Trustee Grove (probable): I'll second.

[1:46:24] Trustee Grove (probable): and now stop the invasive ravine i'll second again

[1:46:26] Trustee Luckham: so moved and seconded all those in favor

[1:46:29] Trustee Luckham: so that carries so then we will

[1:46:32] Voice 21: recess the public meeting and open

[2:09:44] Voice 20: so good

[2:09:49] Voice 21: afternoon everybody thank

[2:09:58] Trustee Luckham: you for uh taking the time out of a beautiful summer day

[2:10:01] Trustee Luckham: here um to join us and uh and see what we're up to and share your points of view um this is

[2:10:09] Trustee Luckham: certainly our public facing a portion of the meeting today um my name is peter luckham i'm

[2:10:15] Trustee Luckham: elected on the on fetus island and i'm

[2:10:18] Trustee Luckham: appointed as the chair of the salt spring island local trust

[2:10:21] Trustee Luckham: committee and i'm the chair of island council in this place for me to be here in your community

[2:10:27] Trustee Luckham: i want to uh also welcome gary holman uh your regional director locally elected gary

[2:10:32] Trustee Luckham: nice to see you here thanks for joining us and of course your two trustees peter grove

[2:10:36] Trustee Luckham: and uh laura patrick um with us at the staff level we have acting regional planning manager

[2:10:42] Trustee Luckham: uh louisa garbo and uh planner uh jason yeomans over in the corner and rob pringle is our minute

[2:10:49] Trustee Luckham: taker and people counter at the moment thank you rob for supporting

[2:10:56] Voice 29: i'm sorry but i couldn't understand one word you said because it's the audio it's not very good

[2:11:03] Voice 29: i

[2:11:04] Trustee Luckham: will try to speak more clearly

[2:11:05] Voice 29: i

[2:11:06] Trustee Luckham: have just made introductions and i will uh

[2:11:11] Trustee Luckham: we'll all make an effort to speak as clearly as we can.

[2:11:19] Trustee Luckham: Grateful to be here in Coast Salish Territory.

[2:11:22] Trustee Luckham: As you know, I'm fond of living in this place

[2:11:28] Trustee Luckham: and having the opportunity to learn about this place,

[2:11:32] Trustee Luckham: the rich culture and history that is here.

[2:11:37] Trustee Luckham: And I'm honored to be able to be here

[2:11:40] Trustee Luckham: and also take on this land use planning work

[2:11:46] Trustee Luckham: on the traditional territories of the First Nations people

[2:11:49] Trustee Luckham: that have been here since time immemorial.

[2:11:52] Trustee Luckham: So thank you for that.

[2:11:54] Trustee Luckham: So we're going to move right into the agenda here.

[2:11:56] Trustee Luckham: So we're going to start off with the trustee reports.

[2:11:59] Trustee Luckham: Oh, I should just say, just a little heads up,

[2:12:03] Trustee Luckham: we're going to, I'm going to do rise and report.

[2:12:06] Trustee Luckham: I'm going, we want to just shift the applications

[2:12:12] Trustee Luckham: a tiny little bit because we're expecting

[2:12:15] Trustee Luckham: a fairly lengthy conversation regarding the vortex.

[2:12:19] Trustee Luckham: And we would like to address 16.3,

[2:12:23] Trustee Luckham: a development permit for Sawchuck ahead of that

[2:12:27] Trustee Luckham: for our staff and planning staff

[2:12:30] Trustee Luckham: and the applicant's convenience.

[2:12:33] Trustee Luckham: and so just apologize if that delays you any further

[2:12:36] Trustee Luckham: than you want to be delayed, but thank you for being here.

[2:12:40] Trustee Luckham: Just to rise and report, out of our in-camera session

[2:12:44] Trustee Luckham: that we just had prior to the break,

[2:12:45] Trustee Luckham: and we adopted minutes of those,

[2:12:47] Trustee Luckham: that previous in-camera meeting,

[2:12:49] Trustee Luckham: we also have received a legal opinion from our lawyers

[2:12:55] Trustee Luckham: with respect to the Channel Ridge and ISED correspondence.

[2:13:03] Trustee Luckham: And we have now requested our staff to create a public letter that captures the essence of the opinion.

[2:13:15] Trustee Luckham: And I think that it's not unreasonable for me to say that at this time that we've been advised by our lawyers that the LTC has.

[2:13:24] Trustee Luckham: And I'm just doing that piece of the moment as a reporting out, not anticipating any discussion on that at this time.

[2:13:31] Trustee Luckham: but we have been advised by our lawyers that the LTC has completed the tasks that it needs to and

[2:13:37] Trustee Luckham: should do and is responsible to do and that any further action with regards to that site needs

[2:13:43] Trustee Luckham: to be directed directly to ISED for satisfaction and so that's we're going to have an open letter

[2:13:52] Trustee Luckham: that we're going to draft and we're hoping to get that out as quickly as we can so that you can be

[2:13:57] Trustee Luckham: clear on what we have learned so that said i'm going to go to trustee reports now and who's

[2:14:04] Trustee Luckham: going to start us off today laura patrick

[2:14:06] Voice 17: sounds like it was me i'll try to speak as loud as i can

[2:14:13] Voice 17: uh as you know our official community plan was last updated in 2008 and i thought that at the

[2:14:21] Voice 17: time they tried hard to really show the balance that is in our community and if you you need to

[2:14:27] Voice 17: read the official community plan as an entire piece it's not about going in and finding the

[2:14:33] Voice 17: pieces that you want to read like the very first section the very first objective under our island

[2:14:39] Voice 17: environment is to recognize the intrinsic value of our ecosystems and that the health of our

[2:14:46] Voice 17: ecosystems is inexplicably linked to human health and i think if you read our entire

[2:14:52] Voice 17: ocp you get

[2:14:53] Voice 17: get that feeling about how the two link together.

[2:14:59] Voice 17: And I say this, and I repeat that over and over again,

[2:15:03] Voice 17: those of you that know me,

[2:15:04] Voice 17: that I repeat that over and over again

[2:15:06] Voice 17: about the health of human health

[2:15:09] Voice 17: in our two ecosystems being linked.

[2:15:13] Voice 17: I'm a big fan of Kate Raworth's,

[2:15:16] Voice 17: Donut Economics.

[2:15:17] Voice 17: If you haven't read it, I encourage you to read it.

[2:15:20] Voice 17: I think that she has the best representation

[2:15:24] Voice 17: representation of how we're striving for that ideal balance, and that it's based on a social

[2:15:33] Voice 17: foundation and an ecological ceiling. And over and over again, people like to say that I've

[2:15:43] Voice 17: forgotten, but that is truly how I've lived my life, is striking that balance. I am disappointed

[2:15:51] Voice 17: pointed that the conversation with the bylaw 530 is falling out the way it is and i i do feel that

[2:15:57] Voice 17: we haven't met standards for good communications and best practices for public engagement

[2:16:02] Voice 17: but that said housing solutions have been researched on this island for decades 15 reports

[2:16:12] Voice 17: as early as 1994 15 for this just for this local trust committee and many finding that cottages and

[2:16:22] Voice 17: and legalizing cottages and suites

[2:16:25] Voice 17: has been a consistent recommendation over those years.

[2:16:29] Voice 17: The Capital Regional District recently received

[2:16:33] Voice 17: the Southern Gulf Island Housing Strategy, 2022 documents.

[2:16:38] Voice 17: And it describes the shared responsibilities for housing.

[2:16:43] Voice 17: And it plays out the responsibilities

[2:16:46] Voice 17: for the Islands Trust, CRD, the province,

[2:16:48] Voice 17: the federal government, nonprofits, developers,

[2:16:51] Voice 17: and private residents.

[2:16:52] Voice 17: residence it says residents have a role in supporting affordable housing by welcoming

[2:16:58] Voice 17: affordable housing projects in their neighborhoods and offering accessory units for rent on their

[2:17:04] Voice 17: own properties accompanying that report was also a housing feasibility analysis

[2:17:11] Voice 17: they looked at the cost of building these accessory dwelling units and they found that

[2:17:15] Voice 17: a secondary suites or two bedroom secondary suite onto your house was the most financially viable

[2:17:21] Voice 17: I spoke with the staff, and they agreed that a suite in an accessory

[2:17:26] Voice 1: building like in

[2:17:26] Voice 17: your garage would have similar financial viability.

[2:17:31] Voice 17: They also did a report, updated housing market analysis, February 2022.

[2:17:37] Voice 17: They used regional data, so that data is very pertinent to Salt Spring.

[2:17:41] Voice 17: They found the gap between income and cost of housing is widening.

[2:17:46] Voice 17: We all know that.

[2:17:48] Voice 17: The rental situation is impacting the local economy.

[2:17:52] Voice 17: there's a lack of primary rental stock and there's a hidden homelessness as people live in their cars

[2:17:58] Voice 17: boats camp and couch serve and they found that our housing supply is limited and lacks diversity

[2:18:06] Voice 17: i think the southern gulf island housing strategy is a great example of a regional initiative

[2:18:11] Voice 17: to identify the actions that we can all take to work on the housing issue we're not selling bylaw

[2:18:19] Voice 17: law 530 as the solution. It is simply one step, one step that we can take to diversify housing

[2:18:27] Voice 17: options and help residents who want to help house their fellow residents. It's also a necessary step

[2:18:36] Voice 17: to legalize this type of housing for full-time rental before we can even begin to regulate

[2:18:41] Voice 17: short-term rentals. On the short, short-term rentals is also something that's been well

[2:18:49] Voice 17: research. The UBCM and a provincial advisory group, which Islands Trust did sit and was

[2:18:56] Voice 17: represented, worked on short-term rentals and a report 2021 priorities for action on short-term

[2:19:02] Voice 17: rentals. It includes a priority to request the local government to allow regional districts to

[2:19:09] Voice 17: implement business licensing simply by approval of the district board. It also encourages local

[2:19:14] Voice 17: local governments to develop and then implement policy options that address housing priorities

[2:19:19] Voice 17: and needs, including short-term rental regulation and enforcement. Also in 2021, a toolkit for

[2:19:26] Voice 17: Canadian local governments for regulating short-term rentals is out. It's a superb tool,

[2:19:31] Voice 17: step-by-step how to do it. The business licenses are recognized in this toolkit as an important

[2:19:37] Voice 17: tool. We

[2:19:40] Voice 23: don't need to look at a lot of research

[2:19:41] Voice 17: for managing short-term vacation rentals. We can

[2:19:44] Voice 17: look at just some of the local communities right here in bc that also impacted by tourism tofino

[2:19:48] Voice 17: penticton and they all use these tools to manage it so i just encourage people to see that you know

[2:19:56] Voice 17: while yes we could do better at communicating and we need to try we need to listen to each other

[2:20:02] Voice 17: but that these things are well researched and i encourage you to support it

[2:20:08] Voice 17: and I guess as far as other meetings

[2:20:12] Voice 17: it's been quiet

[2:20:15] Voice 17: which is nice

[2:20:16] Voice 17: and just

[2:20:18] Voice 17: basically had an executive meeting last week

[2:20:20] Voice 17: and that's my report

[2:20:22] Voice 17: thank you

[2:20:24] Trustee Grove (probable): thank you very much and thanks

[2:20:27] Trustee Grove (probable): Laura

[2:20:29] Trustee Grove (probable): my time in the last

[2:20:31] Trustee Grove (probable): month has been spent

[2:20:32] Trustee Grove (probable): I have to say primarily

[2:20:35] Trustee Grove (probable): handling the wave upon wave

[2:20:37] Trustee Grove (probable): of family visitors who

[2:20:39] Trustee Grove (probable): who now arrived at our doorstep, having been held back for at least two years, if not more.

[2:20:46] Trustee Grove (probable): Lovely to see them. It'll be nice when they're all gone.

[2:20:53] Trustee Grove (probable): In terms of my duties as a trustee, I've been quite involved with Bylaw 530,

[2:20:59] Trustee Grove (probable): discussing that matter with a lot of people, responding to a lot of correspondence,

[2:21:05] Trustee Grove (probable): and we will see how that develops.

[2:21:09] Trustee Grove (probable): And the vortex development application, and I think you're going to find that there's some good news that on that front with a new application, excuse me, which I think will meet some of the concerns that many of us have or have had.

[2:21:29] Trustee Grove (probable): and then then not last but not least the um channel ridge communications tower which um has

[2:21:36] Trustee Grove (probable): caused a great deal of discussion and their concerns um our chair has mentioned that uh

[2:21:42] Trustee Grove (probable): that was a matter for an in-camera meeting earlier today and there will be an official response from

[2:21:48] Trustee Grove (probable): the local trust committee um in the very near future i hope um and uh so that is my report

[2:21:56] Trustee Grove (probable): Chair. Thank you. All

[2:21:59] Trustee Luckham: right. Thank you very much. I'm going to be very brief. I've spoken enough

[2:22:05] Trustee Luckham: already, but most of my work federation-wide has encompassed the next phase of the policy

[2:22:15] Trustee Luckham: statement amendment work. TPC met and actually considered all of the input that we received and

[2:22:22] Trustee Luckham: have uh amended and removed a number of the things that were felt to be um should be reconsidered or

[2:22:31] Trustee Luckham: thought through more more in depth and so we're expecting a newer draft of that to come through

[2:22:38] Trustee Luckham: which i expect will please many um until that work continues um uh we prepare even today here at the

[2:22:48] Trustee Luckham: the salt spring ltc today we're starting to prepare for the 2023 budget um we're also preparing for

[2:22:56] Trustee Luckham: our next council meeting in september um and of course uh elections are uh have begun and uh those

[2:23:04] Trustee Luckham: that are going to plan to to run um are no doubt moving into a campaign mode through the summer

[2:23:10] Trustee Luckham: into October. And so that's underway as well. On a local note, I just want to mention,

[2:23:19] Trustee Luckham: and I don't think it's inappropriate, you will be pleased to know that your very own

[2:23:26] Trustee Luckham: Stefan Cervak, who was the regional planning manager for this LTC, was the successful

[2:23:32] Trustee Luckham: candidate out of a slate of 20 to step up to be the regional planning manager for the Islands

[2:23:39] Trustee Luckham: Alms Trust. And his exceptional skills that he brought to the Spring LTC all these years

[2:23:47] Trustee Luckham: has put him into a good place to lead that division of the Alms Trust. So I just thought

[2:23:53] Trustee Luckham: that's a little bit of local news is that Stefan Zermack was a successful candidate.

[2:23:58] Trustee Luckham: And he begins, I believe, August the 15th or something. And so looking very much forward

[2:24:04] Trustee Luckham: to that because it actually means we'll be able to get moving quite a bit quicker than

[2:24:09] Trustee Luckham: and bringing in a totally new person.

[2:24:11] Trustee Luckham: But Stefan managed to outpace the other candidates

[2:24:18] Trustee Luckham: that were also very significant applicants.

[2:24:23] Trustee Luckham: So that's it for me.

[2:24:24] Trustee Luckham: I'm going to go to the CRD director for his report.

[2:24:27] Voice 30: Thanks Peter.

[2:24:29] Voice 30: And thanks to the trust committee

[2:24:30] Voice 30: for allowing me to mention some CRD issues today.

[2:24:34] Voice 30: the the bylaw for the local community commission proposal which is intended to broaden CRD

[2:24:43] Voice 30: representation is on the CRD board agenda tomorrow it's going to be revised slightly

[2:24:49] Voice 30: not a consequential change but having to do with how if there happens to be a vacancy mid-term

[2:24:56] Voice 30: for the local community commission how that position is re-established through election

[2:25:02] Voice 30: or appointment and when the board finalized the bylaw tomorrow go up on the website as well as

[2:25:10] Voice 30: uh synopsis and uh and an faq uh to help people understand the uh the intent of the bylaw i really

[2:25:18] Voice 30: do hope uh people will support it uh because we do need to have more than just one person

[2:25:25] Voice 30: representing crd issues for 11 000 people um the hospital district uh there hasn't been a

[2:25:32] Voice 30: public announcement from all of the funding partners but it's it was discussed in a public

[2:25:37] Voice 30: meeting the capital regional hospital district is contributing another 738 000 to the emergency room

[2:25:46] Voice 30: at lady minto which uh has as with many projects in british columbia has been has incurred a

[2:25:53] Voice 30: significant cost overrun and uh the security will be contributing in addition to the three million

[2:25:59] Voice 30: It already has contributed another $738,000.

[2:26:03] Voice 30: We expect an announcement from the province as well about their contribution.

[2:26:08] Voice 30: Up to now, the province has not been a contributor.

[2:26:11] Voice 30: It's been local funders, the hospital foundation and the hospital district.

[2:26:18] Voice 30: I think I can publicly say now that CRD has received a grant from CleanBC of $168,000

[2:26:27] Voice 30: to support the composting facility that's being built at the

[2:26:31] Voice 30: community farm in Burgoyne.

[2:26:33] Voice 30: There were some regulatory and administrative issues that had to be cleared up.

[2:26:39] Voice 30: For example, who owns the facility?

[2:26:41] Voice 30: CRD will own the facility, the Abattoir Society will run it,

[2:26:45] Voice 30: and they are leasing land from the Farmland Trust.

[2:26:48] Voice 30: So that's moving ahead, and the Abattoir Society is moving ahead

[2:26:53] Voice 30: had with additional uh purchases to complete the facility so that's underway um wanted to mention

[2:27:01] Voice 30: i just had a brief discussion with a member of the ev group and there are 378 evs now

[2:27:09] Voice 30: on salt spring i think we do have the highest per capita in british columbia and in large part due

[2:27:16] Voice 30: to the efforts of that group because the the uncertainty and the information that people

[2:27:21] Voice 30: want to hear about switching to electric vehicles laura has one i uh purchased one as well because

[2:27:29] Voice 30: i did need another car that is a good investment but 378 um and the crd is also applied for

[2:27:37] Voice 30: funding for a number of level two chargers throughout the capital regional district and

[2:27:43] Voice 30: that will include salt spring and these chargers would be um located on public land and crd would

[2:27:49] Voice 30: assume responsibility for uh operating we've taken over three or four already the two at our spring

[2:27:55] Voice 30: and we've installed two new ones at portlock and rainbow road uh i did want to mention vortex

[2:28:03] Voice 30: i know people will be speaking to it today of course it's a land use decision

[2:28:08] Voice 30: but the proponent is applying for a um to be included in the fulford water district service

[2:28:15] Voice 30: area. The Fulford Water Commission has to approve that. The CRD board has to approve that. The

[2:28:24] Voice 30: proponent is required to provide a study on water supply and demand to demonstrate that there is

[2:28:30] Voice 30: sufficient water coming out of Weston Lake and also under the auspices of SWPA. And the trust

[2:28:37] Voice 30: is funding this study, a study of Weston Lake that's not looking just at the Fulford Water

[2:28:43] Voice 30: district licenses but all licenses on the lake and the sustainability over time taking into account

[2:28:49] Voice 30: climate change similar to the kinds of studies that north salt spring did for safe mary lake

[2:28:55] Voice 30: and for maxwell lake so we want to make sure we have all that information in place before

[2:29:01] Voice 30: the commission makes a decision about whether to accept vortex into the the service area uh

[2:29:08] Voice 30: uh the Dragonfly affordable housing uh project are discussing with CRD the possibility of

[2:29:15] Voice 30: establishing a CRD water utility uh because they've gone the ownership route they have to

[2:29:21] Voice 30: establish a utility they were talking to North Salt Spring uh about that North Salt Spring is

[2:29:27] Voice 30: declined and uh they've now entered into discussions with the series yeah participated

[2:29:32] Voice 30: participated in one meeting they seem to be uh proceeding uh pretty well uh wanted to mention

[2:29:39] Voice 30: the speculation tax there has been quite a bit of publicity about that recently Salt Spring requested

[2:29:45] Voice 30: to be included in the speculation and vacancy tax area the minister did announce uh half a dozen

[2:29:53] Voice 30: communities in southern Vancouver Island to be included but excluded Salt Spring uh

[2:30:00] Voice 30: We're not clear why.

[2:30:00] Voice 30: Our MLA, Olsen, will be discussing the matter

[2:30:03] Voice 30: with the minister to clarify what the obstacle is,

[2:30:07] Voice 30: what the issue is, and we'll revisit that request

[2:30:11] Voice 30: when we have a better understanding

[2:30:12] Voice 30: of the minister's rationale.

[2:30:17] Voice 30: And just a quick comment on business licenses

[2:30:21] Voice 30: that Laura mentioned.

[2:30:22] Voice 30: I do think business licenses can help enforce our bylaws

[2:30:27] Voice 30: odds regarding STVRs. The OCP currently bans them. I support that position. So we have to

[2:30:35] Voice 30: think that through about whether we're banning STVRs and using business licenses to enforce

[2:30:40] Voice 30: that ban. And I do think they will help. Although if you look at the Victoria situation, they have

[2:30:46] Voice 30: licenses for vacation rentals as well. They have 500 licenses, but 1000 operators, and they're

[2:30:53] Voice 1: are

[2:30:53] Voice 30: still having to take people to court. So it's not a panacea, but it would help. And then the

[2:30:57] Voice 30: question is, what's the most appropriate entity to get that authority? My understanding is the

[2:31:04] Voice 30: province has to confer that authority. It is true that one or two other electoral areas have taken

[2:31:10] Voice 30: that on. But I would note in those regional districts, they don't have the trust. They're

[2:31:15] Voice 30: also responsible for land use. And in my view, it probably would be from a whole number of different

[2:31:21] Voice 30: perspectives more appropriate for the trust to take on that authority it would be an extension

[2:31:26] Voice 30: of their their uh their land use authority and would help them enforce their own bylaws

[2:31:33] Voice 30: to be further discussed um that's my report thank you thank

[2:31:38] Trustee Luckham: you very much gary and um

[2:31:43] Trustee Luckham: thank you for your report on electric vehicles and just a little friendly competition that's

[2:31:48] Trustee Luckham: about four percent of the population which is easily four times the national average so that's

[2:31:54] Trustee Luckham: significant but i have to just note that fetus is at about two and a half percent and we're chasing

[2:32:00] Trustee Grove (probable): you've only got four cars

[2:32:09] Trustee Luckham: that's more than four

[2:32:10] Voice 20: that's

[2:32:11] Trustee Luckham: about 60. um off the cuff paperwork anyway um thank you for the laugh

[2:32:19] Trustee Luckham: So we now going to move on to correspondence, and we have a number of pieces of correspondence here.

[2:32:26] Trustee Luckham: I'm just going to list them. Farat, Steiner, McQuatt, I apologize for that, making a mess of that.

[2:32:34] Trustee Luckham: and Scholdhaus

[2:32:35] Trustee Luckham: and also a letter from myself

[2:32:38] Trustee Luckham: to

[2:32:40] Trustee Luckham: Rogers is included

[2:32:42] Trustee Luckham: as communication

[2:32:43] Trustee Luckham: with respect, correspondence with respect

[2:32:46] Trustee Luckham: to the ISED and the Rogers Crest

[2:32:48] Trustee Luckham: Tower at Channel Ridge

[2:32:49] Trustee Luckham: and there's a couple of them

[2:32:52] Trustee Luckham: are identified as for consideration

[2:32:53] Trustee Luckham: others for information so I just want to ask

[2:32:56] Trustee Luckham: the LTC what you would like

[2:32:58] Trustee Luckham: to do with any of those

[2:32:59] Trustee Luckham: receive them for information

[2:33:02] Trustee Luckham: but yes all right so thank you to those that have written to us we've certainly read these

[2:33:07] Trustee Luckham: and there are others um that may be filed or that we've received earlier and um thank you

[2:33:15] Trustee Luckham: um and uh just with respect to 13.5 uh there were some questions i did phone michael prince

[2:33:23] Trustee Luckham: the day after our last meeting i did write to him i initially thought that they might be

[2:33:29] Trustee Luckham: what's the word might be agreeable to delay but it became immediately apparent that that was not

[2:33:37] Trustee Luckham: the case i followed up with a question to ask him what his intent was and their intent is to proceed

[2:33:45] Trustee Luckham: so um there we are we know that um the next piece of correspondence at 13.6 is from

[2:33:53] Trustee Luckham: bailey the development manager bc housing that's concerning the temporary housing project

[2:33:59] Trustee Luckham: the 154 kings lane the province is exercising its authority to advance that work and that's just a

[2:34:06] Trustee Luckham: notice that they would do the temporary use permit that they had initially applied for

[2:34:11] Trustee Luckham: because timing is the essence for ensuring that this community is in good shape for the coming

[2:34:17] Trustee Luckham: winter for housing so that's for information so now we're going to move to delegations in town

[2:34:25] Trustee Luckham: town hall. And I'm just going to go through this list that I have. I have four speakers that

[2:34:33] Trustee Luckham: have applied for the 10-minute speaking opportunity. And the town hall, typically,

[2:34:39] Trustee Luckham: we manage around two minutes, depending on how many people want to speak, to try and manage

[2:34:45] Trustee Luckham: the amount of time and then move into our applications and our decision-making. And so

[2:34:51] Trustee Luckham: So if one of these is not participating today,

[2:34:55] Trustee Luckham: just let me know at the outset and we'll move on.

[2:34:58] Trustee Luckham: So the first one is Maxine Leichter

[2:35:00] Trustee Luckham: on behalf of ATORP,

[2:35:02] Trustee Luckham: concerning water pollution at 14.1.

[2:35:06] Voice 20: That's you.

[2:35:11] Trustee Luckham: And just to remind everybody to be respectful,

[2:35:13] Trustee Luckham: especially with everybody in the room here today,

[2:35:16] Trustee Luckham: be respectful of your friends and neighbors

[2:35:18] Trustee Luckham: and the LTC speak to the issue,

[2:35:21] Trustee Luckham: not the individuals and be kind.

[2:35:24] Trustee Luckham: is

[2:35:24] Voice 29: it five or ten i'm

[2:35:26] Trustee Luckham: giving you ten minutes

[2:35:27] Voice 29: uh this delegation was prepared to deal with

[2:35:31] Voice 29: issues that have to do with the septic systems and i just want to say the fact that the proponent

[2:35:37] Voice 29: has decided to move the septic fields a few feet further inland from the water bodies can't change

[2:35:44] Voice 29: any of these concerns okay

[2:35:48] Voice 18: can you hear me

[2:35:49] Voice 18: yeah it's hard

[2:35:52] Voice 29: what i said was that this this this presentation was prepared by franz ator by presenting it for

[2:36:00] Voice 29: him and he and it deals with septic system effluent going into the receiving waters

[2:36:08] Voice 29: and even though the proponent has now changed his proposal to move the septic fields a few feet

[2:36:15] Voice 29: further away from the water doesn't change any of these concerns okay i just want to make that clear

[2:36:21] Voice 29: okay so fran says rather than express my own ideas and concerns about water pollution resulting from

[2:36:31] Voice 29: the proposed vortex resort i am going to let the documents speak for themselves and these are all

[2:36:39] Voice 29: quotes from staff reports. Three items for the 2019 staff report. The sewage system plan does

[2:36:48] Voice 29: not include a groundwater hydrology detailed site investigation. The Iowa's Trust Freshwater

[2:36:57] Voice 29: Specialist indicates that the statements in the sewage plan regarding the receiving environment

[2:37:02] Voice 29: would require a groundwater hydrology detailed site investigation prepared by a licensed engineer

[2:37:11] Voice 29: or geoscientist with proficiency in hydrology, unquote. Next quote from staff report in 2019.

[2:37:20] Voice 29: The soils are at low elevation with risk of sea level rise and an elevated water table,

[2:37:27] Voice 29: That's water coming up from below, resulting in shallow vertical distance between the dispersal beds and the water table.

[2:37:35] Voice 29: He indicated this could impact to the foreshore.

[2:37:41] Voice 29: Next quote. The sewage plan states that it is a conceptual design only.

[2:37:46] Voice 29: A detailed design for sewage system is yet to be created.

[2:37:50] Voice 29: The honest fresh water special indicates that the opinion that the opinions of the project biologists do not satisfy hydrologic considerations with respect to risk assessment of the water body receiving environment.

[2:38:05] Voice 29: next from the 2022 staff report while the applicant has provided engineering and environmental

[2:38:13] Voice 29: assessment reports for the project staff are concerned that they may lack sufficient detail

[2:38:18] Voice 29: to confirm whether the above guidelines are met those are the development permit guidelines

[2:38:23] Voice 29: being referred to there while the applicant's qualified environmental professional has

[2:38:30] Voice 29: has confirmed that water-containing treated sewage system percolate that enters Soul Creek

[2:38:36] Voice 29: will not be detrimental to groundwater quality.

[2:38:39] Voice 29: And below provincial thresholds, the report does not address any potential cumulative impacts

[2:38:47] Voice 29: on the marine environment measured over the years.

[2:38:51] Voice 29: From the 2020 Hydrology Report by David Gooding.

[2:38:56] Voice 29: This was done for Sam & Hansen Society.

[2:38:58] Voice 29: Quote, the property at 2661 Coker Ganges Road, with only a small portion above the two meter sea level contour line, and with a relatively long fetch to allow wave formation in certain winds, must be considered as a coastal flood hazard land.

[2:39:19] Voice 29: land another quote from the 2017 septic system study published in the journal of environmental

[2:39:29] Voice 29: science and technology quote known as contaminants of emerging concerns these types of pollutants are

[2:39:38] Voice 29: frequently detected in u.s and canadian rivers lakes drinking water supply many emerging

[2:39:44] Voice 29: contaminants are hormone disruptors associated with feminization of male fish and reduced

[2:39:50] Voice 29: fertility in other wildlife. Studies in humans have leaked some of these emerging, called

[2:39:58] Voice 29: contaminants of emerging concern, with thyroid disease, developmental disorders, decreased

[2:40:05] Voice 29: fertility, and even cancer. These chemicals are found in the products used every day,

[2:40:11] Voice 29: and eventually they make their way down the drain and this is a quote from Laura Shader

[2:40:18] Voice 29: an environmental chemist with the Silent Spring Institute from our OCP E21 no E2123

[2:40:30] Voice 29: development should not result in a pollution of surface or groundwater supply particular

[2:40:37] Voice 29: particular care should be taken to ensure that there are no detrimental impacts on agriculture

[2:40:43] Voice 29: land or fish-bearing watercourses because of water pollution.

[2:40:49] Voice 29: The staff reports for this meeting, well, this changed because the variants, the proponents

[2:40:58] Voice 29: submitted a different request for variants.

[2:41:01] Voice 29: But what we're saying here is that the staff report that recommends reports, more reports,

[2:41:08] Voice 29: is essential to show if the project

[2:41:11] Voice 29: can meet development permit guidelines,

[2:41:14] Voice 29: protect the spring streams from stormwater

[2:41:17] Voice 29: and sewage system discharge over the short and long term.

[2:41:23] Voice 29: My message to trustees, please act to require these reports.

[2:41:28] Voice 29: And unless these reports say no harm will occur

[2:41:31] Voice 29: over the short and long term,

[2:41:33] Voice 29: please honor our OCP and preserve and protect mandate

[2:41:37] Voice 29: mandate by downsizing this project so the estuary can be restored to its natural function.

[2:41:54] Trustee Luckham: You know, I guess I'm sometimes the only person who remembers and many of you are new faces

[2:42:00] Trustee Luckham: in the room today and appreciate that you're here. But, you know, we try to create what

[2:42:06] Trustee Luckham: I refer to and consider a safe environment for everyone to speak their opinion. And not

[2:42:13] Trustee Luckham: Not everybody agrees with each other.

[2:42:15] Trustee Luckham: And applause or booing has the potential to deter somebody else's voice in the room.

[2:42:23] Trustee Luckham: I just want you to consider that.

[2:42:25] Trustee Luckham: It's so important to hear all the voices.

[2:42:29] Trustee Luckham: So let's not boo or applaud.

[2:42:31] Trustee Luckham: And I apologize for not saying that in the beginning.

[2:42:35] Trustee Luckham: My fault.

[2:42:36] Trustee Luckham: I'm going to go to Parkinson regarding the vortex as the next speaker today.

[2:42:42] thank

[2:42:44] Voice 29: you my name is ann parkinson i am a registered professional biologist

[2:42:48] Voice 29: retired so my comments aren't mine alone but i am um 40 years marine

[2:42:56] Voice 29: survey diver i have been alaska to bc border down to victoria i have been a researcher on an

[2:43:04] Voice 29: abalone first abalone farm in canada i have worked federally provincially the first aquaculture

[2:43:11] Voice 29: research assistant in the ministry of agriculture i have the ocean totally in my heart so everything

[2:43:20] Voice 29: i say here is for bullford bay so thank you for allowing me to speak and the islands trust as we

[2:43:29] Voice 29: know is tasked with the nuts and the bolts of building structure private property fence lines

[2:43:37] Voice 29: We name it septic, the rights of the individual, possibly the profit margin, who knows, but who looks after the stream, who looks after the marine, who speaks for fish, whose responsibility is that?

[2:43:55] Voice 29: so once we um start to look at this bay we have to realize who is going to give priority

[2:44:04] Voice 29: to the ecosystem that provides services to humans we are talking food oxygen we're talking about

[2:44:13] Voice 29: temperature regulation and of course nowadays we're talking preventing storm surge so and

[2:44:21] Voice 29: How are we going to deal with this? The ILO's trust seems to have a clear intention declaring climate change. Emergency, wonderful. Having a foreshore plan, excellent. But I would say personally, no T to implement any of this.

[2:44:41] Voice 29: So, for example, one thing I've seen on the Vortex plan, this is the roof and parking lot runoff, and one side is diverted through a pipe rate to the mouth of the Fulford Creek, like, am I interpreting this correctly?

[2:44:56] Voice 29: And why has there not been a marine impact assessment report?

[2:45:01] Voice 29: The Vortex property includes hundreds of meters of oceanfront, and in case you didn't look at the plans, owns the road.

[2:45:11] Voice 29: the road so past and current pollution around the bay does not mean it is possible to continue

[2:45:23] Voice 29: with more assaults into the future we don't operate on that regulation so my views first

[2:45:33] Voice 29: the impact of the development on the bay and then i'm going to take a quick look at the impact of

[2:45:38] Voice 29: the bay on the development. So the estuary in Fulford is dead, right? Nobody has actually

[2:45:48] Voice 29: studied that. I'd like to see the stats. But in my opinion, that estuary is bone dead. There's

[2:45:54] Voice 29: no eelgrass, no migratory birds. People in this room can remember huge swaths of migratory birds.

[2:46:01] Voice 29: there's nothing to feed them it's gone and this is the result of decades of illegal dumping of filth

[2:46:12] Voice 29: followed by building a very tight short bridge so for instance take a hose let it flow it's soft

[2:46:23] Voice 29: it's gentle out it comes put a nozzle on it the stream is now a jet a hard jet next time you go

[2:46:31] Voice 29: over Fulford Bridge, take a look towards the ocean. It's a trench. Everything else is scoured,

[2:46:36] Voice 29: dead. So normally, the wide, wide mouth of Fulford would deposit gently and slowly oxygen,

[2:46:47] Voice 29: fine silt from all the hillsides, which would create what's called a biomat in the bay,

[2:46:55] Voice 29: which would allow field grass to grow, which would then be the nursery for young fish,

[2:46:59] Voice 29: young crabs, everything. Estuaries are essential for marine life. Also, Soul Creek used to be a

[2:47:09] Voice 29: grand river. It has now been culverted twice. There's nothing left of Soul Creek. The vortex

[2:47:17] Voice 29: plan calls the mouth of the Soul Creek a ditch. Not. It's a river and it's a creek. It has great

[2:47:28] Voice 29: potential to do wonderful ecosystem services for us. So now we find that this impact may actually

[2:47:36] Voice 29: even have an effect on the entire bay. Why can we not harvest shellfish? Why does the First Nations

[2:47:43] Voice 29: clam gardens not function like they ought to? Where are the salmon? It was the largest salmon

[2:47:50] Voice 29: run in the entire Gulf Islands. They're not there unless a tiny bit of enhancement is done. Those

[2:47:58] Voice 29: Those are the only fish, really, that are left there.

[2:47:59] Voice 29: But this is my opinion.

[2:48:01] Voice 29: I think it needs to be proven.

[2:48:04] Voice 29: And again, past wrongs do not justify more assaults into the future.

[2:48:11] Voice 29: The gravel dumping that will occur, the compaction.

[2:48:15] Voice 29: Read these reports.

[2:48:17] Voice 29: Digging huge holes to be able to put these motel units on stilts to avoid flooding.

[2:48:24] Voice 29: flooding i i just don't see how this is something that we should be considering for the future of

[2:48:31] Voice 29: this estuary now the vice versa okay so no amount sorry no amount of hard armoring of the shore

[2:48:42] Voice 29: is going to hold back the rising sea level and the storm surges not going to happen you can read

[2:48:50] Voice 29: everywhere from our own boundary bay that is very concerned about white rock to pei they're losing

[2:48:57] Voice 29: ground all the way through to the mississippi i just read a huge article about how they're

[2:49:02] Voice 29: quickly first nations are and the black history trying to grab their artifacts before the

[2:49:08] Voice 29: mississippi's done and then there's the uk and they have a huge program to pull back atolls in

[2:49:16] Voice 29: In the Pacific Islands, no, people are just leaving,

[2:49:19] Voice 29: up and packing and leaving.

[2:49:22] Voice 29: And Hawaii, I saw a little YouTube clip.

[2:49:26] Voice 29: Giant condo that was built in the 50s,

[2:49:28] Voice 29: right by, you know, green grass, the shore.

[2:49:31] Voice 29: The basement is full of water.

[2:49:33] Voice 29: They're worrying about the foundations.

[2:49:36] Voice 29: Nothing they can do.

[2:49:37] Voice 29: A few sandbags, they've tried rock walls.

[2:49:39] Voice 29: Not happening.

[2:49:41] Voice 29: It's, there's no amount of engineering work

[2:49:43] Voice 29: that's going to hold this back.

[2:49:45] Voice 29: everyone is retracting around the world. It's called coastal realignment. Lovely term.

[2:49:53] Voice 29: So if the current bridge and road were to flood, cutting off all Isabella residences from the

[2:50:00] Voice 29: Holford Village and the ferry, increasing rainfall is going to cause the streams, both streams,

[2:50:07] Voice 29: streams to rise and they won't be able to drain because of narrow culverts and short little bridge

[2:50:18] Voice 29: so um especially when the tides get higher it's going to back up more and more and people already

[2:50:24] Voice 29: on Fulford Creek are saying to me that this is the highest they have ever seen in 50 years of

[2:50:30] Voice 29: living on that river. All right, what are we going to do? I have a vision. I have a dream. Sorry,

[2:50:40] Voice 29: I'm borrowing that phrase. So I would like to offer an alternative vision to a motel in a flood

[2:50:46] Voice 29: zone. Imagine a visitor coming down the ferry, down the harbour, and seeing this beautiful bridge,

[2:50:55] Voice 29: amazing bridge, with Mount Maxwell framed in the background. I saw that on the ferry when I came

[2:51:00] Voice 29: down the other day i'm like it's great and as well as being very attractive looking and so on

[2:51:10] Voice 29: this bridge would also have a bicycle path and pedestrian walkway and that would join us to the

[2:51:19] Voice 29: whole coastal salish sea route that is being planned marvelous this bridge would also assure

[2:51:26] Voice 29: sure residents of guaranteed transportation for many decades to come. Property owners up and down

[2:51:35] Voice 29: both streams, bordering those creeks, would not fear flooding and would be able to be covered by

[2:51:44] Voice 29: their insurance companies. Things are changing in the insurance world. So lastly, the estuary and

[2:51:53] Voice 29: the marine environment would thrive. We could say hello to salmon. We could actually stand on the

[2:51:58] Voice 29: bridge and watch salmon come back. We could see eagles fishing. We could have an estuary that

[2:52:04] Voice 29: gives the whole bay a tremendous amount of life. And lastly, but not least, the sea would simply

[2:52:14] Voice 29: take its course, right? There's no way. You can put your hand up and you can try. It's not going

[2:52:22] Voice 29: to stop. So even more importantly to me a longer bridge would be a gift to future

[2:52:32] Voice 29: generations showing that we cared, we thought ahead and we did not leave an

[2:52:40] Voice 29: expensive crisis for them. We have a window of opportunity that will

[2:52:47] Voice 29: otherwise be closed forever and many of us in the community would like to work

[2:52:54] Voice 29: with the developer, Mr. Fulbrook, wherever.

[2:52:59] Voice 29: And we would like to extend our hands to you

[2:53:05] Voice 29: and ask that together we build maybe a bridge,

[2:53:12] Voice 29: but at least build initiatives

[2:53:13] Voice 29: that directly benefit the environment

[2:53:16] Voice 29: and every citizen in BC,

[2:53:19] Voice 29: not just a few that can afford to stay in the motel,

[2:53:24] Voice 29: but for everyone.

[2:53:26] Voice 29: one. Settler, First Nations, all people of this generation, and the next, and the next.

[2:53:37] Voice 29: Whatever it takes, we can do it. Salt Spring is amazing doing this. You would not be walking

[2:53:43] Voice 29: in Burgoyne Park right now if it were not for the efforts that it took to continue to make that

[2:53:51] Voice 29: accessible to the public. This estuary is essential to the marine life of Fulford

[2:53:56] Voice 29: Bay, so let's together build a bridge. Thank

[2:54:03] Voice 21: you very much. If I

[2:54:15] Trustee Luckham: had a contrary

[2:54:16] Trustee Luckham: opinion, I would feel intimidated. Just want you to consider those that agree

[2:54:23] Trustee Luckham: with you next uh speaker um is uh a master and so on behalf of uh nature salt

[2:54:31] Voice 21: spring regarding

[2:54:32] Voice 21: the voice okay firstly upon

[2:54:45] Voice 28: arising following that inspiring note of ams that inspiration

[2:54:53] Voice 28: my name is kathleen macer and i'm representing nature salt spring peter mcallister is also a

[2:55:05] Voice 28: member of nature's offspring and he has composed and researched the letter that i am about to read

[2:55:13] Voice 28: this letter was submitted to the um was submitted on july 26 to the ltc it concerns the proposed

[2:55:24] Voice 28: vortex development unfortunately peter cannot be here he's off island with his family this time

[2:55:36] Voice 28: Over 120 years ago, the estuary of the most important salmon-bearing creek in the Gulf Islands

[2:55:44] Voice 28: was degraded by the construction of a tavern whose eventual replacement was the Fulford Inn.

[2:55:53] Voice 28: In those days there was little consideration for the exceptional ecological values of the estuary,

[2:55:59] Voice 28: one of the most productive natural habitats in the world, and these estuaries now around the world

[2:56:07] Voice 28: are being increasingly considered worth rehabilitation and saving around the world.

[2:56:16] Voice 28: Nor did anyone think to recognize and respect the Fulford Creek Estuary

[2:56:22] Voice 28: as the essential core of vibrant Coast Salish life.

[2:56:27] Voice 28: No one knew then that the accelerating effects of catastrophic global warming

[2:56:32] Voice 28: would render sea level development in the Fulford Estuary untenable.

[2:56:37] Voice 28: Here we are today. In consideration of reconciliation and environmental awareness, there is no justification for retaining commercial zoning status in this ecologically and culturally most vulnerable and sensitive of landscapes.

[2:56:57] Voice 28: Storm surge vulnerability is one of the key takeaways of the 2022 Sea Level Rise Technical Report,

[2:57:09] Voice 28: issued jointly by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, NASA, NOAA,

[2:57:18] Voice 28: which is the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, and others.

[2:57:23] Voice 28: it alone should preclude building a resort in the estuaries especially at the head of a bay

[2:57:31] Voice 28: where in the span of 50 years ever more powerful wind-driven storm surges associated with king

[2:57:38] Voice 28: tides are going to occur even more sobering is the statement just issued by three former directors

[2:57:47] Voice 28: of the un framework convention on climate change calling out the policies and measures

[2:57:54] Voice 28: passed and implemented by governments, including Canada,

[2:57:58] Voice 28: limiting temperatures to under 2 degrees centigrade.

[2:58:03] Voice 28: Those pledges would lead to far greater temperature rises

[2:58:06] Voice 28: of at least 2.7 degrees centigrade

[2:58:09] Voice 28: and potentially as much as 3.6 degrees centigrade.

[2:58:16] Voice 28: That means rising sea levels may be expected

[2:58:19] Voice 28: to override post-glacial rebound in our area

[2:58:22] Voice 28: over the next 30 years.

[2:58:23] Voice 28: As NASA reports, we can expect a profound shift in coastal flooding caused by tide and storm surge height to increase and reach further inland.

[2:58:39] Voice 28: land. To bring these projections to the local level here on

[2:58:47] Voice 28: Salt Spring, go no further than the data reported in the BC

[2:58:51] Voice 28: storm surge forecasting system document for Victoria, which was

[2:58:57] Voice 28: produced in 2021 and 2022. Cadborough Bay facing in the

[2:59:04] Voice 28: same direction as Fulford Harbor is singled out as especially at

[2:59:10] Voice 28: at risk of storm surge damage

[2:59:12] Voice 28: when peak tides exceed three meters.

[2:59:17] Voice 28: Consider the risk of storm surge damage

[2:59:19] Voice 28: at only very modestly higher water levels

[2:59:22] Voice 28: at the head of Fulford Harbor over the next 30 years.

[2:59:27] Voice 28: If aching tide approaching four meters,

[2:59:31] Voice 28: such as the one that will occur this year

[2:59:34] Voice 28: on December 27th, 2022 was confined

[2:59:39] Voice 28: with powerful winds funneling down the bay,

[2:59:44] Voice 28: There is a surefire risk of damaging flood.

[2:59:52] Voice 28: These concerns are further reinforced by the hydrology studied by the Island Stream and Salmon Enhancement Society.

[3:00:00] Voice 28: concluded the lower lot is coastal flood hazard land it is hoped that you the local trust committee

[3:00:14] Voice 28: have the courage and wisdom to honor the island's trust climate emergency declaration

[3:00:22] Voice 28: the prudent course of action is to deny the vortex application for a development permit

[3:00:29] Voice 28: scrap the outdated commercial zone and restore the estuary as close as possible to its natural state

[3:00:42] Voice 28: This was researched and written by Peter McAllister and fully endorsed by Nature Salisbury.

[3:00:49] Trustee Luckham: Thank you. Thank you very much.

[3:00:52] Trustee Luckham: The next speaker is Gooch on behalf of the pool, also regarding the vortex.

[3:01:02] Thank

[3:01:06] Voice 11: you for this hearing.

[3:01:08] Voice 11: You, the trustees, are able to do something tangible about the trust stand on climate emergency and reconciliation.

[3:01:17] Voice 11: reconciliation. The Fulford Estuary could be a living testimonial to what we achieve when we

[3:01:25] Voice 11: work together, depending on your decision. We can protect the estuary, have a green development,

[3:01:31] Voice 11: and defend the lands that are so important to our First Peoples. But first, let's talk about

[3:01:36] Voice 11: accountability. Who's accountable to whom? Where do our responsibilities lie? You, the trustees,

[3:01:44] Voice 11: may feel a certain obligation towards the developer.

[3:01:49] Voice 11: For 2019, he has been given enough encouragement

[3:01:52] Voice 11: to think that the Vortex development

[3:01:54] Voice 11: will eventually get the go ahead.

[3:01:56] Voice 11: I think we can all relate to your impulse

[3:01:58] Voice 11: to continue to support a project you initially liked.

[3:02:01] Voice 11: Fair enough.

[3:02:03] Voice 11: You assumed that most Islanders also supported it

[3:02:06] Voice 11: because lots of people thought it was a revival

[3:02:08] Voice 11: of the Fulford Pub.

[3:02:11] Voice 11: Well, now we know that was a red herring.

[3:02:13] Voice 11: What's changed since 2019?

[3:02:16] Voice 11: Heat domes, flooding, extremes in winter temperature, our strange, long, cold, wet spring, followed by sweltering heat in July.

[3:02:24] Voice 11: Our sense of urgency about the environment and climate change has escalated dramatically.

[3:02:30] Voice 11: The backlash against this development may have taken you by surprise, but the threat that the vortex poses to the two creeks and the estuary is much, much clearer now than it was then.

[3:02:46] Voice 11: What's also changed is that you, the trustees, have recognized that reconciliation with First Nations is essential.

[3:02:53] Voice 11: Restoring the estuary as a home for salmon and clams, working with the people who have knowledge that goes back eons, that's reconciliation in practice, not just a token dollar.

[3:03:07] Voice 11: So why are we still disputing this? Vortex must, and could at the very least, scale back this project so the estuary is not vulnerable.

[3:03:16] Voice 11: vulnerable. Is there not a compromise to be had? It is possible to eat the cake. A modest

[3:03:23] Voice 11: piece, mind you, and have it too. Vortex could build with a smaller footprint on the upper

[3:03:29] Voice 11: lot. Let the lower lot go back to nature with a little help and a tax break for the developer

[3:03:36] Voice 11: as well. It could be a beautiful, blissful place, shaded trails winding along the creek

[3:03:43] Voice 11: down to the bay and the view from the upper lot

[3:03:46] Voice 11: from whatever development might happen there

[3:03:49] Voice 11: would be a true salt spring view,

[3:03:51] Voice 11: a subtle vista graced with native vegetation,

[3:03:55] Voice 11: gently sloping down to the sea.

[3:03:58] Voice 11: Tourists rounding the corner from the ferry terminal

[3:04:00] Voice 11: on their first salt spring visit

[3:04:02] Voice 11: won't be seeing just another resort,

[3:04:04] Voice 11: a maze of driveways and parking lots

[3:04:07] Voice 11: with all night lighting and a meadow

[3:04:08] Voice 11: popped with accommodation units on stilts instead a lovingly restored estuary something that speaks

[3:04:18] Voice 11: far more profoundly about who we are and what we value that could be your legacy to the island

[3:04:27] Voice 11: mr fulbrook that could be this trust legacy salt spring voted overwhelmingly against incorporation

[3:04:35] Voice 11: why to forestall developments like this one one that's too big for the site and environmentally

[3:04:40] Voice 11: mentally vulnerable on multiple levels. And let's be frank here. Vortex is a very little benefit to

[3:04:45] Voice 11: the island. Once upon a time, the developer could have said, it will provide jobs, but we can't even

[3:04:50] Voice 11: fill the jobs that are already available. The island doesn't need the project. And dangling

[3:04:57] Voice 11: the idea of resurrecting the Fulford Inn is pure fantasy. The proposed restaurant and bar is far

[3:05:05] Voice 11: too tiny to act as a neighborhood gathering place. Yes, the developer points out the Fulford

[3:05:10] Voice 11: estuary is damaged by cumulative neglect. But that's not a reason to put it at a continuing

[3:05:17] Voice 11: and even greater risk. That ecosystem doesn't have the resources to the fact that there's more damage.

[3:05:23] Voice 11: Once it's gone, it's gone. So that's where our obligation lies. That's where your responsibility

[3:05:32] Voice 11: lies, you the trustees. It's why we voted for you. There could hardly be any clearer call for your

[3:05:39] Voice 11: action on behalf of the environment. What if you were seeing this application for the first time

[3:05:45] Voice 11: today, knowing all that you know now about estuaries, tidal surges, listed streams, septic

[3:05:52] Voice 11: leaching, rare mollusks, pricey water hookups, and baby salmon, and let's not forget what the

[3:05:57] Voice 11: climate has in store for us all in the next decade or two or five or ten. We've been whittling away

[3:06:05] Voice 11: at this island's forests, wetlands, and natural habitat for years. This is an incredible opportunity

[3:06:10] Voice 11: to make a decision that gives something back and honors the spirit of reconciliation. We want to

[3:06:18] Voice 11: see this headline in the Globe and Mail. In a move hailed by our First Nations and

[3:06:28] Voice 11: conservationists throughout Canada, Salt Spring Island trustees vote to protect

[3:06:33] Voice 11: protect salmon streams, and a valuable estuary threatened by development.

[3:06:38] Voice 11: Thank you, and thank you for listening.

[3:06:45] Trustee Luckham: So, thank you, everybody.

[3:06:47] Trustee Luckham: Viewed or a mistake of my own, I believe, we've gone into overtime here, having allocated

[3:06:53] Trustee Luckham: 10 minutes per speaker.

[3:06:55] Trustee Luckham: Not everybody was 10 minutes, but a few were certainly enjoying that opportunity.

[3:06:58] Trustee Luckham: That's great that we've got the opportunity to hear the passion and interest in this project.

[3:07:06] Voice 18: I'll

[3:07:08] Trustee Luckham: try to speak louder. We're going to go to town hall now. And I'd like to get a quick indication of who would like to speak in the town hall.

[3:07:19] Trustee Luckham: And I'm just going to mention that we've had lots of correspondence. We've certainly heard a lot of passion about the Vortex project.

[3:07:27] Trustee Luckham: project and i know there's interest in the cell power project as well um but let's try and not

[3:07:32] Trustee Luckham: repeat the same messages that we've heard because we've heard them but we certainly want to hear

[3:07:38] Trustee Luckham: more information from each and every one of you so i think i saw about a dozen hands up

[3:07:43] Trustee Luckham: and if i allocate uh there's a few less now maybe um so what i'm going to ask you to do just to help

[3:07:50] Trustee Luckham: me manage it is if you could maybe just kind of form a lineup social distancing all that kind of

[3:07:55] Trustee Luckham: stuff and we're going to try and stick with two minutes for everybody and really want to ask you

[3:08:01] Trustee Luckham: to keep two or two minutes and uh and uh and then we'll move through everybody and hear what

[3:08:07] Trustee Luckham: everybody has to say about the various topics so uh please your name and your address just for

[3:08:12] Trustee Luckham: reference and over to yourself your name thank

[3:08:15] Voice 31: you uh brian young 1172 beaver point road salt

[3:08:18] Voice 31: spring i'm brian young representing transition salt spring speaking against the vortex proposal

[3:08:24] Voice 31: as a whole. We'd like to acknowledge that it may be too late to reject the current application

[3:08:31] Voice 31: without the trust being exposed legally and financially. Perhaps so be it. I'd also like

[3:08:37] Voice 31: to thank the previous delegations for their eloquent statements as to why this is an

[3:08:41] Voice 31: inappropriate project for this location. However, the fact that this application is even before the

[3:08:47] Voice 31: trust is a symptom of a systemic failure shared by governments the world over, one we simply must

[3:08:52] Voice 31: address if we're to survive the disruptions of the coming decades we would not be here today if the

[3:08:58] Voice 31: trust had developed the land use bylaw to back up its ambitious official community plan adopted in

[3:09:05] Voice 31: 2008 instead we're relying on a land use bylaw developed in 1998 how did this even happen we

[3:09:13] Voice 31: wouldn't be here today if the trust was addressing the climate crisis sufficiently since its noble

[3:09:19] Voice 31: but unfortunately hollow declaration

[3:09:21] Voice 31: of a climate emergency years ago.

[3:09:23] Voice 31: Transition developed a quarter of a million dollar

[3:09:25] Voice 31: climate plan for $25,000 and a lot of community sweat,

[3:09:29] Voice 31: but we have yet to be given the courtesy

[3:09:31] Voice 31: of a formal response to this substantial community endeavor.

[3:09:35] Voice 31: Your former CAO Linda Adams wrote the chapter

[3:09:38] Voice 31: on the policy changes needed to address climate risks.

[3:09:41] Voice 31: They focus on guiding development away

[3:09:44] Voice 31: from areas where sea level rise is projected.

[3:09:46] Voice 31: that this proposal got this far shows that the trust has not taken climate change seriously.

[3:09:52] Voice 31: CRD's maps show this property will be inundated in the coming decades, if not earlier.

[3:09:58] Voice 31: Furthermore, the trust is giving development approval where the water district, quite likely,

[3:10:01] Voice 31: quite likely has insufficient capacity, creating potential technical and legal problems for rate

[3:10:07] Voice 31: payers, and the trust released the report, Gary. The climate action plan calls for intergovernmental

[3:10:14] Voice 31: protocols to coordinate climate action between the CRD and the Islands Trust, there are only two

[3:10:19] Voice 31: such protocols, one of them to help them dedicate new parks. Why aren't Moji, the Islands Trust and

[3:10:25] Voice 31: the CRD working together to relocate Fulford Ganges Road, which is on private land, in front

[3:10:31] Voice 31: of the proposed development? It's already being undermined by storms and king tides. We've all

[3:10:36] Voice 31: seen the bumps we've had to go over. Emergency, what emergency? Finally, to the many others in

[3:10:42] Voice 31: the room and elsewhere who wish this proposal wasn't happening we need to work together to

[3:10:47] Voice 31: ensure the trust has the tools it needs to meaningfully respond to the climate emergency

[3:10:53] Voice 31: instead of responding to one-offs like we are doing today let's focus on getting the trust

[3:10:58] Voice 31: of land use bylaw and a renewed mandate that we urgently need to address the climate crisis thank

[3:11:04] Voice 31: you thank you thank

[3:11:06] Trustee Luckham: you and i'll just note that um generous with my time but i can't afford to

[3:11:11] Trustee Luckham: be generous with everybody and that was two minutes 48 seconds just for reference and so

[3:11:16] Trustee Luckham: please let's try and stick to two minutes um i'm not setting a standard by going two minutes 48

[3:11:23] Trustee Luckham: um and thank you there was another thought i had but i'm just going to continue on

[3:11:28] Trustee Luckham: i'll just manage

[3:11:29] Trustee Luckham: your time if you can please go ahead two minutes um who

[3:11:32] Trustee Luckham: you are and where you

[3:11:33] Trustee Luckham: live my

[3:11:34] Voice 23: name is kristin tuttle and i'm on 231 meadow drive thank you

[3:11:37] Voice 23: and i'm talking about the

[3:11:39] Voice 23: Rogers Tower. And

[3:11:41] Voice 23: I just, many of you have heard me speak before, and so most of you know I have a

[3:11:46] Voice 23: severe reaction to electromagnetics, like what's in here, but what you may not know is that I

[3:11:53] Voice 23: didn't always have these severe reactions. When I was a kid, I hung out in power line cuts and

[3:12:01] Voice 23: place near the mount palm tower and my dad had a 1980s car phone so i spent a lot of time in a car

[3:12:09] Voice 23: that um the exposure causes a lot of issues so to put a tower like this into a neighborhood

[3:12:18] Voice 23: especially when they don't want it um it's not my neighborhood but it's someone's neighborhood

[3:12:23] Voice 23: and there's kids and there's yeah it it's not a good idea and i strongly oppose it and i hope you

[3:12:32] Voice 23: support them in that okay

[3:12:35] Trustee Luckham: thank you for coming today next speaker please my

[3:12:40] Voice 2: name is uh jennifer

[3:12:41] Voice 2: i'm connected to family property on 186 meadow drive i'm here to speak about the vortex proposal

[3:12:48] Voice 2: And definitely, with the type of storms we've had, Isabella Point Road has been very affected by the climate change because it was broken in three different places, which is now fixed, but we can't guarantee for the future.

[3:13:05] Voice 2: So I really related to what was being said here about that we're not necessarily looking at what's happening in 2022 with planning for the Fulford Estuary.

[3:13:16] Voice 2: We're looking at potential in the future with a lot of these really extreme events and relentlessly occurring.

[3:13:26] Voice 2: And also, really what comes to mind is that it's important.

[3:13:32] Voice 2: I know the island trustees already try hard to let people know who are coming to do developments on Salt Spring Island, that it is unique to develop on Salt Spring.

[3:13:41] Voice 2: it's different than how you would develop if you were on the lower mainland or in Victoria but I

[3:13:47] Voice 2: think that even more needs to be done to to really indicate um really what what's going on here on

[3:13:55] Voice 2: Salt Spring and a lot of times when people are on social media which is kind of like a word soup

[3:14:00] Voice 2: you feel that some project is heavily supported but you don't really understand that it's not

[3:14:05] Voice 2: not really supported until people can get a chance to do the research and

[3:14:10] Voice 2: come and I was I really

[3:14:12] Voice 2: respected what the people here said and with their scientific background and I did know Ganges as a

[3:14:19] Voice 2: place where you could get fresh shrimp and that was when I was a child and it's been a death by

[3:14:24] Voice 2: a thousand cuts with marine life and we can't continue supporting this big oil big gas trucking

[3:14:29] Voice 2: food all around the world even economists don't even believe that globalization is the right

[3:14:34] Voice 2: answer anymore so you know we really have to get back into having our healthy ecosystem

[3:14:38] Voice 2: shown salt spring thank you thank

[3:14:40] Trustee Luckham: you thank you very much thank you for keeping your time

[3:14:44] Voice 10: um next speaker sir my name is miles wilson live on mcgill road been an island resident since 1980

[3:14:49] Voice 10: i'm here to talk about something completely different housing i encourage gary holman

[3:14:58] Voice 10: to lobby the government to change the residential tenancy branch rules and regulations if you want

[3:15:04] Voice 10: affordable housing you have to change these rules currently as it stands you've got lots of

[3:15:12] Voice 10: ma and pa rentals out there that aren't being rented because they're tired of unruly tenants

[3:15:17] Voice 10: not all tenants are bad there's good ones same with landlords not all are bad there are some

[3:15:24] Voice 10: good ones i had a tenant and i'm not the only one took me almost six months to get them out for

[3:15:33] Voice 10: non-payment of rent six months i'm sorry mr wilson your hearing has been scheduled for three and a

[3:15:41] Voice 10: half months down the road and then the tenant applies for an extension of that you think mom

[3:15:50] Voice 10: and pa are going to put up with that they're not going to do it you want to know why you have

[3:15:55] Voice 10: vacation rentals because that act

[3:15:58] Voice 14: okay

[3:15:59] Voice 10: not all vacation rentals are bad we don't have enough

[3:16:02] Voice 10: hotels to support our tourists that are coming here that are supporting our little businesses

[3:16:06] Voice 10: you make the tourists go away they die okay you guys are on the right track you're trying

[3:16:15] Voice 10: and i commend you for that you're you're you're on the right track the 20 the vacant home tax

[3:16:23] Voice 10: it isn't going to work gary it's going to bring even richer people here okay and they're going

[3:16:30] Voice 10: to be able to rent for their houses out to multi-millionaires who will rent it for a year

[3:16:36] Voice 10: at six seven thousand dollars a month it isn't going to work just like the the um the cooling

[3:16:43] Voice 10: off period the government's doing it's not going to work okay if you want affordable housing on

[3:16:50] Voice 10: this island build mobile home parks they're everywhere lease the land from the conservancy's

[3:16:57] Voice 10: got lots of land probably lots of flat land at least 10 acres and let's dad will give you

[3:17:05] Voice 10: affordable housing they're everywhere in bc you can literally put a single wide mobile home on a

[3:17:12] Voice 10: pad for under 250 000 okay so thank

[3:17:17] Trustee Luckham: you your time's up gave

[3:17:19] Voice 10: everybody else longer

[3:17:21] Trustee Luckham: i'm just telling

[3:17:22] Trustee Luckham: you not everybody

[3:17:25] thank

[3:17:29] Voice 8: you for the opportunity to speak my name is rory reese i live on 22 south ridge

[3:17:35] Voice 8: Rich Colford, and I just want to add my voice against the VORTEX proposal.

[3:17:41] Voice 8: When I hear water, all kinds of alarm bells go off.

[3:17:46] Voice 8: I mean, the one thing that the last two years have taught us about climate, the climate

[3:17:50] Voice 8: crisis, is that even the most dire predictions have been hopelessly out of date and wildly

[3:17:57] Voice 8: optimistic.

[3:17:58] Voice 8: It's happening faster and more furiously than even the most accredited scientists have expected.

[3:18:07] Voice 8: So when you look at taking more water out of Weston Lake or building right next to the

[3:18:12] Voice 8: tidal zone, it just doesn't make any sense.

[3:18:16] Voice 8: It's just the next 30 years are going to be nothing like the 30 years before.

[3:18:22] Voice 8: And we have to get our heads around that.

[3:18:24] Voice 8: is everything changes with the climate crisis. Everything we've known up until now has depended

[3:18:31] Voice 8: on a stable climate. It's gone. So we talked about land use bylaws. Even the word use, it implies

[3:18:40] Voice 8: taking from the land, using the land, using it up. What I would like to see would be a land

[3:18:47] Voice 8: restoration by law and I think the Fulford estuary would be a perfect place

[3:18:52] Voice 8: to do a pilot project so rather than having that land dedicated devoted to

[3:18:59] Voice 8: private profit it would be dedicated to restoration to restoring the ecosystems

[3:19:05] Voice 8: that support us all we can see our way towards moving in that direction we may

[3:19:12] Voice 8: have a chance thank you thank you very much next

[3:19:16] Voice 33: speaker hello everybody my name is rodney polden

[3:19:22] Voice 33: um i live on sky valley road uh i'll speak as briefly as i can and as succinctly as possible

[3:19:30] Voice 33: i think something i'd like to leave with is a quote from

[3:19:37] Voice 33: Albert Einstein who said you cannot use the mode of thinking that took you into a crisis

[3:19:46] Voice 33: in order to get out of that crisis it requires a different state of mind and I echo what what

[3:19:55] Voice 33: Marie Rees has just said to us I want to just touch on very briefly a few changes that have

[3:20:04] Voice 33: happened around that estuary. Only a short number of years ago, I'm a photographer, I photograph a

[3:20:11] Voice 33: lot of wildlife, only a few years ago I was photographing the great blue heron, heronry,

[3:20:18] Voice 33: that what is just about a hundred yards from the mouth of the estuary. Many of those trees were

[3:20:27] Voice 33: lost, the herons have left, but what also led to them leaving was the deterioration in the estuary

[3:20:37] Voice 33: and in the surroundings of Falkland Bay, Falkland Harbour. And I think that if we can

[3:20:45] Voice 33: realise that we're at a cuspal point here, we either choose to make things that are

[3:20:54] Voice 33: are long-standing fundamental facts of our life,

[3:21:00] Voice 33: our water, our air, our climate, our land,

[3:21:04] Voice 33: the degree to which areas are polluted or not polluted.

[3:21:08] Voice 33: I think we have reached a point now

[3:21:10] Voice 33: where almost everybody on the planet realises we have to change.

[3:21:14] Voice 33: This is not going to be changes of a scale of simply,

[3:21:17] Voice 33: oh, well, we'll alter this thing.

[3:21:20] Voice 33: I mean, I love the idea of moving a septic field 30 feet to one side.

[3:21:24] Voice 33: that kind of sums up the kinds of solutions that are being presented to us.

[3:21:29] Voice 33: I think we need to understand that what we are looking at in a very short period of time

[3:21:34] Voice 33: is a change that is going to make even gatherings like this very difficult for us.

[3:21:42] Voice 33: So I would strongly ask that you either deny completely the permit for Vortex.

[3:21:51] Voice 33: I'm sorry to the developer, but that's the way it is.

[3:21:53] Voice 33: um or at least that we see all of the reports that were required that were suggested by staff

[3:22:02] Voice 33: be obtained and followed thank you thank

[3:22:07] Trustee Luckham: you very much i am trying just for the last to politely

[3:22:12] Trustee Luckham: signal you when you're very close to the edge and um would be great if you could just keep an eye on

[3:22:17] Trustee Luckham: your turn go ahead and

[3:22:19] Trustee Luckham: you have two minutes

[3:22:20] Voice 25: sharon bywater malibu drive um i would like to

[3:22:24] Voice 25: to think that the trustees will see

[3:22:26] Voice 25: with the wonderful information that's been presented to you

[3:22:30] Voice 25: by the delegation on Vortex today,

[3:22:33] Voice 25: that we really need to, in the words of Penelope Elder,

[3:22:39] Voice 25: August Sylvester, we need to give what is hard to give.

[3:22:42] Voice 25: This development is not a need for this community.

[3:22:47] Voice 25: We need to put the future first of these ecosystems.

[3:22:55] Voice 25: these special places you have the opportunity to say no to this development tournament

[3:23:02] Voice 25: and i truly hope that you will sit and you will consider everything said today and that's going

[3:23:09] Voice 25: to be your decision this is a real opportunity to show our younger people that this generation

[3:23:16] Voice 25: we do care and we are willing to give what's hard to give thank you thank

[3:23:21] Trustee Luckham: you thank you for bringing

[3:23:23] Trustee Luckham: Oggy's words to us today. Sir.

[3:23:28] Voice 7: Hi, I'm speaking about the vortex. My name is John Fitzgibbon. I

[3:23:32] Voice 7: live at 2321 Fulford Ganges Road. Our property straddles the Fulford Creek a few kilometers

[3:23:39] Voice 7: upstream from the proposed development. The size and scale of the project is inappropriate for this

[3:23:46] Voice 7: location. The proposal takes advantage of inclusion of the roadway in the permitted density,

[3:23:51] Voice 7: block coverage and setback calculations.

[3:23:55] Voice 7: Permitting the accommodation units

[3:23:57] Voice 7: to be designated part of a motel

[3:23:59] Voice 7: allows for large units, more guests

[3:24:02] Voice 7: and use of kitchens and laundry,

[3:24:04] Voice 7: dramatically increasing the impact

[3:24:06] Voice 7: of the development on the environment.

[3:24:09] Voice 7: As LTC staff noted in 2019,

[3:24:13] Voice 7: this interpretation veers from the intent

[3:24:15] Voice 7: of the land use bylaw and the OCP.

[3:24:18] Voice 7: The Islands Trust Council declared a climate change emergency in response to, among other things, more extreme storms, sea level rise, and storm surge flooding, and committed to taking urgent and fair climate action.

[3:24:34] Voice 7: One natural defense against storm surges in Fulford Bay is to restore the salt marsh and lagoon to their natural state as soon as possible, and as much as possible.

[3:24:47] Voice 7: Fulford Creek is the major salmon-bearing stream on the island, and these days we see only a few salmon coming up our stream.

[3:24:58] Voice 7: Renewal of the estuary is important for the success of this vital resource.

[3:25:04] Voice 7: After careful consideration over the past three years, I have to agree with the fourth alternative put forward by the staff.

[3:25:11] Voice 7: that is to rezone the subject property to alter the density or location of development on the

[3:25:18] Voice 7: property. I propose that the LTC engage with the developer in pursuing a vision that is more in

[3:25:26] Voice 7: keeping with the official community plan and the tenets of the declared climate emergency.

[3:25:33] Voice 7: This could include building a smaller project on the upper lot and restoring the lower lot as much

[3:25:38] Voice 7: as possible to its original state and purpose. The developer has the choice of enduring a prolonged

[3:25:46] Voice 7: and bitter fight over an inappropriate development or the possibility of a legacy that is on par with

[3:25:52] Voice 7: the saving of Burgoyne Valley from clear-cut logging and development. Thank you. Thank you

[3:25:57] Voice 7: very much sir. I noticed that the

[3:26:00] Trustee Luckham: line doesn't seem to be getting any shorter and I'm going to

[3:26:02] Trustee Luckham: have to constrict it a little bit here because we have quite a bit more business to do today

[3:26:07] Trustee Luckham: and I want to respect the time that the staff

[3:26:10] Trustee Luckham: and other members of the public have available

[3:26:12] Trustee Luckham: for this course.

[3:26:13] Trustee Luckham: So try to provide us some new stuff if you can.

[3:26:16] Trustee Luckham: So sir, over to you.

[3:26:18] Voice 32: My name is Ryder Bergerud.

[3:26:20] Voice 32: I live at 1233 Isabella.

[3:26:22] Voice 32: I'd like to stand in support of Ann Parkinson's vision

[3:26:26] Voice 32: for the Fulford SUA.

[3:26:29] Voice 32: I think that this project is an inappropriate scale

[3:26:32] Voice 32: and an inappropriate spot.

[3:26:34] Voice 32: And I think that if the Trust Council wants to be something for the community, they should

[3:26:42] Voice 32: instead ask that the estuary be restored and suggest to the developer that they move the

[3:26:50] Voice 32: development site to the height of land and leave the estuary to be restored.

[3:26:55] Voice 32: Thanks.

[3:26:56] Voice 32: Thank you very much.

[3:26:57] Voice 32: Thank you for keeping it brief.

[3:26:59] Trustee Luckham: Next person, please.

[3:27:00] Voice 4: Hi, my name is Ian Peace, 875 Rainbow Road. I'm here to speak in opposition to the position of

[3:27:10] Voice 4: the development of vortex within the property. I think that they can do a better job of locating

[3:27:15] Voice 4: outside of the estuary. And really, that's my concern here is the preservation of the estuary

[3:27:22] Voice 4: that across Puget Sound and the Salish Sea, it's been determined that in the last 100,

[3:27:28] Voice 4: 150 years or so, 75, pick a number, 75, 85% of the estuaries have been seriously degraded,

[3:27:36] Voice 4: most likely by fill deposits. On May 3rd, I happened to be at the site when Paul Iwanis,

[3:27:43] Voice 4: the archaeologist, was doing excavations. And I was there when he announced that there was nine

[3:27:48] Voice 4: feet of fill up on the uphill side of the road near the former Colford Inn's front door. And

[3:27:55] Voice 4: And this triggers the question of what do we call an estuary because the archaeologists identified beach gravel below the old Fulford Inn.

[3:28:04] Voice 4: Now, Swell Environmental Consulting published a report on the 1st of October 2021, 143 pages.

[3:28:10] Voice 4: The cover letter states that most of the proposed development would occur at least 15 meters away, like uphill from the Fulford Creek estuary.

[3:28:20] Voice 4: But at the top of the second page of the same report, they introduce a term that is key

[3:28:25] Voice 4: to understanding adverse impacts to the Fulbert Estuary.

[3:28:28] Voice 4: The term is present natural boundary.

[3:28:31] Voice 4: It only occurs twice in the cover letter and nowhere else in the rest of the report.

[3:28:35] Voice 4: Instead, this well report shows natural boundary of the estuary as about the same as the extent

[3:28:41] Voice 4: of the filled deposits.

[3:28:43] Voice 4: I find this a very misleading way to address the natural estuary area when it seriously

[3:28:48] Voice 4: obscures the fact that almost all of the proposed development would sit on film deposits that

[3:28:54] Voice 4: seriously degraded the Fulford Creek estuary. So I think that that's pretty clear and supports

[3:29:00] Voice 4: some of the other people that have made comments here.

[3:29:03] Trustee Luckham: Thank you for that information. I'm going

[3:29:06] Trustee Luckham: to suggest that the person with the mask be the last town hall speaker. And so just want to respect

[3:29:13] Trustee Luckham: that we've gotten up there so let's go with the next speaker i'm

[3:29:18] Voice 4: going to be very brief

[3:29:20] Voice 4: jim pickstone 1090 isabella point road um i just want to say a couple things about the vortex

[3:29:26] Voice 4: i'm not going to repeat everything that's come before me excellent points by the folks that

[3:29:31] Voice 4: have just been speaking i just like to express my strong disagreement with this project to consider

[3:29:38] Voice 4: issue the permits and the variances as they sit right now seem so wrong on so many levels so trust

[3:29:45] Voice 4: members please consider seriously the strong opposition that you're hearing today when you

[3:29:50] Voice 4: proceed with this plan thank you very much thank you for being brief

[3:30:00] Voice 20: i

[3:30:00] Voice 6: i can't hear you um

[3:30:01] Voice 20: um

[3:30:04] Voice 6: i don't need this this is an ad hoc thing because uh i'm um i've got a

[3:30:10] Voice 6: farm that's 136 acres right beside the um corporate creek that i've had it for 47 years

[3:30:20] Voice 6: and i've seen a lot of change a lot of change bob akerman when i the old bob akerman he sees now

[3:30:26] Voice 6: And when I was there for about a week,

[3:30:30] Voice 6: he invited me to come and have some blackberry wine

[3:30:34] Voice 6: and tell me, tell the story about the whole place,

[3:30:39] Voice 6: how it was.

[3:30:40] Voice 6: One of the people who built the Fulford Hall

[3:30:48] Voice 6: were the ones that did it, the Graham family, basically.

[3:30:52] Voice 6: They were pioneers.

[3:30:53] Voice 6: years and uh so it's been a beautiful time to be there the trees have come back you know

[3:30:59] Voice 6: and the

[3:31:01] Voice 6: water was going well you know on pulpit creek lots of fish lots of fish that has gone as we've heard

[3:31:09] Voice 6: and um last year um my uh when we had that huge surge that came over in the you know massive

[3:31:18] Voice 6: of amount of water blasting through. We have a bridge for the first time ever it was a foot

[3:31:24] Voice 6: underwater. I have a picture of my 21 year old son pulling a tree trunk out of it you know the

[3:31:30] Voice 6: following day and then it went back down again. So there's a lot of change and it's happening quickly

[3:31:37] Voice 6: and so yeah and I'm hoping that we'll all the positive things that are going to

[3:31:44] Voice 6: stop that from happening because it's going fast that that be considered thank you thank you very

[3:31:52] Voice 12: much for bringing that history to us hi

[3:31:56] Voice 25: i'm jean wilkinson i live at 1395 bettis road um i just

[3:32:00] Voice 28: wanted to bring a perspective i've seen uh restoration in

[3:32:04] Voice 29: action i used to live in squamish

[3:32:06] Voice 29: it's a really large estuary there were acres and acres of dredge spoils dumped on the land

[3:32:11] Voice 29: those have been removed and everything's coming back to life there was a huge log sort in that

[3:32:17] Voice 29: area estuary it's gone things are coming back to life channels have been reopened salmon fry are

[3:32:24] Voice 29: surviving to a much higher level and it's really inspiring just to see that it can be done this is

[3:32:32] Voice 29: just a little area that has some dumping some

[3:32:36] Voice 27: bad mistakes in the past that need to be rectified it

[3:32:39] Voice 27: would be easy we could make that a really special place to bring it back to life and i totally

[3:32:44] Voice 27: endorse um the other statements

[3:32:46] Voice 29: that were made today i totally oppose this development for

[3:32:51] Voice 29: tourist accommodation in a really precious sensitive productive ecosystem and i want to

[3:32:57] Voice 29: pass on um a word from brian append she had to leave unfortunately but um as you know she's

[3:33:03] Voice 29: He's a PhD and has worked in restoration at UVic.

[3:33:09] Voice 29: And maybe you're aware of the recent research saying estuaries

[3:33:14] Voice 29: and revived restored eelgrass spreads are the biggest drawdown of carbon

[3:33:21] Voice 29: that we have on the planet.

[3:33:24] Voice 29: So this is also an opportunity to mitigate climate change

[3:33:27] Voice 29: rather than face all the problems related to it.

[3:33:30] Voice 29: And I know there's probably a lot of other people here

[3:33:33] Voice 29: they aren't going to have the opportunity to speak and if you're posted vortex maybe um just indicate

[3:33:38] Voice 29: it to the trustees so they can see that there's a lot of us i know you've received a lot of letters

[3:33:45] Voice 29: as well so

[3:33:46] Voice 28: thank you thank

[3:33:47] Trustee Luckham: you and i have been to the swamish estuary and it's a fabulous place

[3:33:54] Trustee Luckham: thank you my

[3:33:56] Voice 24: name is bonnie reynolds i'm speaking on behalf of marlon personal i'll keep this really

[3:33:59] Voice 24: brief uh specifically the points that haven't yet been mentioned um the ability of the site to deal

[3:34:04] Voice 24: uh speaking in opposition to the vortex project um the ability of the site to deal with septic

[3:34:10] Voice 24: ethylene is unknown however we all know that flooded septic fields don't work there have been

[3:34:15] Voice 24: no objective comprehensive hydrological studies of the property um the trust planning staff have

[3:34:20] Voice 24: asked for such studies twice in 2019 and 2022 but the trustees have not required them why not

[3:34:26] Voice 24: How can you evaluate the project when you don't have complete information?

[3:34:30] Voice 24: How can any project anywhere be approved without the relevant data?

[3:34:34] Voice 24: This project should not proceed one step further unless and until a thorough objective examination has been completed by a qualified hydrologist.

[3:34:41] Voice 24: If you approve the proposal in its current state, you'll clearly be contravening your mandate to preserve and protect South Wing Island.

[3:34:48] Voice 24: Thank you.

[3:34:49] Voice 24: On behalf of Robert Bateman, my wife, Bridget, and I are strongly opposed to the Vortex proposal of such magnitude.

[3:34:55] Voice 24: If modest-sized community pub could be built to replace the old one, that would be more

[3:34:59] Voice 24: welcome, but more tourist units would be damaging to nature, with potential pollution of the

[3:35:03] Voice 24: streams, the estuary, and marine life in Fulford Harbour.

[3:35:06] Voice 24: Sincerely, Robert Bateman.

[3:35:08] Voice 24: And Joe and Thomas Williams, and myself, also express our lack of support for the project.

[3:35:14] Voice 24: Thank you.

[3:35:14] Voice 14: Thank you.

[3:35:19] Voice 34: Well, today is a tough day to talk about anything other than Vortex.

[3:35:22] Voice 34: Thank you, Julie.

[3:35:23] Voice 34: And I commend and congratulate this group for coming out and having a say and speaking your minds and letting our local trust committee know what you think.

[3:35:32] Voice 34: This is a path we've been on for about a year with the cell tower on Channel Ridge.

[3:35:37] Voice 34: My name is Julian Clark. I live on Canvastack.

[3:35:41] Voice 34: I'm here today representing a group of homeowners that you see before you, and each of them would gladly have taken two minutes.

[3:35:47] Voice 34: but i'm going to ask you please since we're on a new topic would you please grant me seven minutes

[3:35:52] Voice 34: because you are at a juncture right now where you are about to respond to isid as you said based on

[3:35:58] Voice 34: the legal opinion you are about to respond to isid and i would like very much to try to put all of

[3:36:04] Voice 34: this in perspective for you at

[3:36:06] Trustee Luckham: this point sure before you begin we are not responding to isid

[3:36:11] Trustee Luckham: you are not

[3:36:12] Trustee Luckham: responding what that's uh that's not what i said we're writing

[3:36:17] Voice 34: an open letter

[3:36:18] Voice 34: writing an open letter to everybody okay so i think it may even be more appropriate

[3:36:23] Voice 34: that you hear what we have so

[3:36:25] Trustee Luckham: let me ask the ltc um uh about time management uh

[3:36:29] Voice 15: do you want to

[3:36:29] Voice 15: grant uh julian seven minutes is what he says we're stuck for time

[3:36:38] Trustee Luckham: how about we compromise

[3:36:41] Trustee Luckham: and we give you a form okay i

[3:36:43] Voice 34: will try thank you this group you've known we've been here before

[3:36:47] Voice 34: you all you know throughout the year yeah we all came here we're all very different people we all

[3:36:52] Voice 34: came here because of the same thing we we are looking for and we have found you know a common

[3:36:57] Voice 34: love for this island an idyllic setting calm and peaceful way of life the sense of safety and

[3:37:02] Voice 34: security the community and quite frankly a closeness we can feel the nature in this county

[3:37:06] Voice 34: all of that changed though when rogers decided they wanted to build a 14-story tower less than

[3:37:14] Voice 34: a football field away from most of our homes and less than half that distance from some of them

[3:37:22] Voice 34: and it's not just a 14-story tower by the way if they build this after a year they can grow up by

[3:37:27] Voice 34: another three stories a 17-story tower less than half a football field from some of these people's

[3:37:32] Voice 34: homes now i want to put that in perspective because we've been out there picketing and

[3:37:37] Voice 34: we've met a rogers contractor this past couple of weeks who said to us and i'm going to quote

[3:37:43] Voice 34: Quote, I've been working for Rogers and other telecom companies for over 25 years.

[3:37:48] Voice 34: I've installed foundations for over 150 cell towers.

[3:37:52] Voice 34: And I'll admit, I've never seen a tower this size placed this close to a residential area.

[3:38:04] Voice 34: Rogers' plans have shattered our sense of security and safety, caused us significant anxiety and worry, and has harmed our peace of mind.

[3:38:13] Voice 34: And quite frankly, we ask, how can that be?

[3:38:15] Voice 34: It runs against all of the OCP.

[3:38:18] Voice 34: OCP says you're not going to allow people to build in environmentally sensitive places.

[3:38:23] Voice 34: This is environmentally sensitive.

[3:38:25] Voice 34: OCP says you're going to accommodate the community's need to be safe, secure, and healthy.

[3:38:32] Voice 34: This is not doing that.

[3:38:34] Voice 34: The OCP says that you're committed to a precautionary health principle,

[3:38:39] Voice 34: which your own advisory planning commission applied to antenna sighting

[3:38:44] Voice 34: by recommending, and again, I quote, to the maximum extent possible, the antenna should be

[3:38:50] Voice 34: sited as far away from facilities concerned with continuous human activity as is practically

[3:38:55] Voice 34: feasible. So what gives? This is a clear case of poor, perhaps I should say terrible, corporate

[3:39:05] Voice 34: citizenry, and quite frankly, corporate greed. There are acres and acres of open space on

[3:39:12] Voice 34: Ani land where a tower could be sited safely. However, as Rogers acknowledged during their

[3:39:16] Voice 34: July 7th zoom call this site is the least expensive option and Rogers a 26 billion dollar

[3:39:23] Voice 34: corporation appears to be putting their bottom line ahead of our safety our security and our

[3:39:29] Voice 34: peace of mind it's very clear here when you look at the application process and

[3:39:35] Voice 14: I don't know what

[3:39:35] Voice 34: your lawyers told you but Rogers understood LTC staff when they told Rogers you have to use the

[3:39:43] Voice 34: the Island Trust draft, we are asking you to use the Island Trust draft model protocol as a

[3:39:48] Voice 34: guideline. It is very clear that Rogers stated and equivocally in their application form that

[3:39:55] Voice 34: they had met that model protocol. And it's absolutely clear that you relied on that.

[3:40:02] Voice 34: That was the protocol in the faithful July 27th meeting agenda, not the ICED default protocol.

[3:40:08] Voice 34: But here's the thing. If Rogers, Rogers deceived you, that's the thing. If Rogers truly met that model protocol, they could not place this tower on that site.

[3:40:23] Voice 34: The model protocol discourages locations that are environmentally sensitive. This is defined as environmentally sensitive.

[3:40:28] Voice 34: today. The protocol states and discourages locations in and among medium density residential

[3:40:36] Voice 34: areas. There's 65 homes within 500 meters of that site. And most importantly, this particular tower

[3:40:44] Voice 34: can and will likely be elevated an additional 25% in height after one year without any further

[3:40:50] Voice 34: approvals necessary. The model protocol states that the LTC should consider a guideline of

[3:40:56] Voice 34: increasing the setback by 25%. The proposed site is currently set back 42 meters for a 40-meter

[3:41:04] Voice 34: tower. If you use that 25% setback, you're pushing that tower eight meters further back,

[3:41:10] Voice 34: which will push it right over the cliff and into our Water Preservation Society lands.

[3:41:16] Voice 34: They shoehorned this into that site, telling you they'd met the protocol when they had it.

[3:41:24] Voice 34: Other interesting thing that we found out this past couple of weeks.

[3:41:27] Voice 34: Were Rogers ever willing to consider an alternative site?

[3:41:32] Voice 34: Well, interestingly, we found in the last couple of weeks that Rogers negotiated a right-of-way agreement with Aune for the proposed site in January of 2020.

[3:41:44] Voice 34: Curious, given that Rogers didn't approach you until November of 2020, 11 months later.

[3:41:53] Voice 34: We're not aware of any other locations that Rogers negotiated a right-of-way on.

[3:41:59] Voice 34: So this is just another example of how Rogers ignored the model protocol, which requires pre-consultation discussions around site options and a willingness to consider the LTC preferences for and against alternative locations.

[3:42:12] Voice 34: They only had one location in mind.

[3:42:16] Voice 34: So Rogers has been caught in their lie.

[3:42:19] Voice 34: They didn't fulfill the requirements of the model protocol.

[3:42:22] Voice 34: So what did they do?

[3:42:23] Voice 34: They've been called out.

[3:42:24] Voice 34: What they did is they leaned on the contacts of the federal regulator.

[3:42:27] Voice 34: They stated the only requirement they needed to meet was the ISA default protocol.

[3:42:33] Voice 34: They avoided the proper dispute resolution process that's laid out in CPC-2003.

[3:42:39] Voice 34: And quite frankly, they'd have us all believe that this is a government-approved site, which we know it is not.

[3:42:47] Voice 34: And then, even worse, they ignored your request for them to not begin construction until you had an opportunity to do a legal review and respond to the regulator's letter.

[3:42:57] Voice 34: So this

[3:42:58] Voice 4: is why we've all

[3:42:58] Voice 34: taken up picket signs.

[3:43:00] Voice 34: This

[3:43:00] Voice 4: is why we've been hanging

[3:43:01] Voice 34: out in the hot sun for the last couple of weeks,

[3:43:03] Voice 34: because we're trying to stop Rogers from getting up there and getting far enough

[3:43:07] Voice 34: to this construction that they can say, oh, sorry, it's done.

[3:43:13] Voice 34: But here's the truth.

[3:43:16] Voice 34: The truth is we can't stop Rogers.

[3:43:20] Voice 34: Only you can stop Rogers.

[3:43:23] Voice 34: The federal regulator does not deal with individuals.

[3:43:26] Voice 34: individuals. It's stated exactly that in CPC-2003. They will only deal with telecoms and land

[3:43:35] Voice 34: use authorities. Yeah, the federal regulators have the ultimate authority on siting an antenna.

[3:43:40] Voice 34: However, they've written the regulations to be explicitly clear that the proponent, Rogers

[3:43:46] Voice 34: in this case, must fulfill the requirements you, the land use authority, established.

[3:43:50] Voice 34: established. Rogers didn't fulfill those requirements. Rogers misled you that they had met those

[3:43:58] Voice 34: requirements. So that is seven minutes. 30 seconds. Hold on to your rescindments. You did the right

[3:44:06] Voice 34: thing. It is a valid rescindment. It is unthinkable. Let ICE know why you rescinded. Two of you were

[3:44:15] Voice 34: present. Two of you voted for it. There's valid rationale for rescindment. Tell them what that is.

[3:44:21] Voice 34: There is no way in the world that ICED will overrule you and require that you accept a false application, that you accept a site that runs counter to your official community plan, and that you're going to accept the will of a corporate bullet, quite frankly, that has never, ever met with the community, even when you ask them to do so.

[3:44:41] Voice 34: only you can stop this madness please listen to your hearts do the right thing and stop rogers

[3:44:50] Voice 34: from putting a 14-story tower in our backyard two minutes maybe

[3:45:03] Voice 26: two minutes 20 seconds

[3:45:06] Voice 20: hello

[3:45:06] Voice 26: i'm here today to talk about the rogers tower i'm diana potterson i live 70 meters from

[3:45:12] Voice 26: the tower site i want to thank you all for rescinding the concurrence decision back in

[3:45:17] Voice 26: march of this year i can't tell you the relief i felt knowing that you agreed with us and agreed

[3:45:22] Voice 26: with us enough that you thought it called for a decision over the last couple of months as my

[3:45:27] Voice 26: neighbors and i become aware of rogers intentions to proceed regardless of your decision that

[3:45:32] Voice 26: relief quickly faded away and was replaced by tangible anxiety and stress the threat of rogers

[3:45:37] Voice 26: going ahead with construction despite your efforts to stop them and force them to abide by our

[3:45:43] Voice 26: community, provincial and federal standards has caused me a great personal amount of stress.

[3:45:48] Voice 26: How can a corporation be allowed to bully its way around our local authorities?

[3:45:53] Voice 26: It's not right, plain and simple. Rogers got their foot in the door with the original concurrence

[3:45:58] Voice 26: and now they are refusing to remove it. This is unacceptable and it's why I've spent the last 16

[3:46:04] Voice 26: days blocking the access road to the site and contacting news outlets and trying to relay

[3:46:08] Voice 26: accurate information to those who will listen. I'm not against cell towers. I'm against inappropriate

[3:46:14] Voice 26: locations for cell towers that go against the guidance of local governments and that were

[3:46:19] Voice 26: approved under false pretenses. Rogers lied in their application by providing false and misleading

[3:46:26] Voice 26: information. No one on Salt Spring or anywhere should have to tolerate a 14 to 17 story structure

[3:46:32] Voice 26: structure approved under false pretenses in their backyard. Flashing a giant red light 24 hours a

[3:46:39] Voice 26: day let alone on the biologically sensitive land they are proposing. Rogers is attempting to steam

[3:46:45] Voice 26: all this and it's happening 70 meters from my front door. Wouldn't you be angry? Wouldn't you

[3:46:51] Voice 26: also feel compelled to picket journey heat wave to prevent Rogers from breaking the wishes of

[3:46:56] Voice 26: your local government? We too are citizens of the community and we deserve a fair process of

[3:47:01] Voice 26: due diligence and consideration for the people who were close to the site just like the community of

[3:47:06] Voice 26: ganges received in 2019 when the monopole was turned down what really gets me angry is that

[3:47:13] Voice 26: i shouldn't be having to pick it or write emails or lose sleep over this i shouldn't be having to

[3:47:17] Voice 26: speak here today rogers should respect our local authority it's as simple as that i will continue

[3:47:24] Voice 26: trying every route i can think of to shine a light on roger's egregious behavior as much as we the

[3:47:29] Voice 26: concerned residents are trying to do we are so unlikely to be as effective as you can be

[3:47:34] Voice 26: as our local authorities i am begging you to please continue standing up to rogers and not

[3:47:40] Voice 26: let them get away with this please force rogers to put the tower further away on the undeveloped

[3:47:46] Voice 26: donny land they have all the money in the world to do so i invite you to my house to come see how

[3:47:52] Voice 26: close it will be it shouldn't be in my backyard and i wouldn't endorse it in yours thank you

[3:47:58] Voice 22: Thank you.

[3:48:03] Voice 27: My name is Lynne Baldwin, I live at the end of Isabella. One of the atmospheric changes

[3:48:10] Voice 27: that are taking place are cane tides and they're going to become a very much common part of our

[3:48:16] Voice 27: winter water system. Those cane tides forecast for this winter will be four and five feet.

[3:48:23] Voice 27: Those roll down the Fulford Bay and by the time they get to the end of the Fulford Bay

[3:48:28] Voice 27: we will recreate the estuary that is now dry and that is a phenomenon that we're going to have to

[3:48:37] Voice 27: take into account when you make this decision about the vortex thank

[3:48:41] Trustee Luckham: you very much um let us

[3:48:44] Trustee Luckham: move along um we're going to move on to applications and referrals now um as i mentioned

[3:48:50] Trustee Luckham: earlier we rejigged the applications a little tiny bit to facilitate getting a more less complex

[3:48:58] Trustee Luckham: complex application through so we can spend the time on the vortex application. And thank you all

[3:49:03] Trustee Luckham: for what you shared with us today. So we're going to go to item 16.3. Thank you, Gary, for joining

[3:49:08] Trustee Luckham: us. We're going to go to item 16.3, Salt Spring Development Permit 2022.4. I saw Chuck at Trip

[3:49:15] Trustee Luckham: Road. And who is the staff member? I think Dave is. Oh, it's Phil Testamount. He's coming to us

[3:49:22] Trustee Luckham: us online so thank you and just for um clarity just want to let you know that well that's been

[3:49:30] Trustee Luckham: removed from my agenda here i think okay so we're okay so phil testimony over to

[3:49:40] Trustee Luckham: you thank you

[3:49:45] Voice 17: we're

[3:49:45] Trustee Luckham: just going to pause for a minute phil to let the room empty out

[3:49:48] Trustee Luckham: of folks that are here for it they want to get outside probably

[3:50:23] Voice 12: Okay, so thank you for those of you that have chosen to stay.

[3:50:29] Trustee Luckham: I just want to, while we've got a moment, let the people leave.

[3:50:33] Trustee Luckham: I want to thank you for staying.

[3:50:34] Trustee Luckham: And I want to just let you know, I've got this fancy phone here, my own personal phone, by the way,

[3:50:41] Trustee Luckham: that has an air quality monitor that measures volatile organic compounds in the room,

[3:50:46] Trustee Luckham: which gives you an indication of the quality of the air circulation and throughout this entire

[3:50:51] Trustee Luckham: time I've been concerned that it might dip down a little bit because of everything up there but

[3:50:55] Trustee Luckham: the air quality has been very good in the rooms we're getting good air circulation and hope that

[3:51:00] Trustee Luckham: helps you stay a little longer that certainly concerns me I'm concerned for my health as well

[3:51:06] Trustee Luckham: as for the community at large we have to continue that vigilance until we get through to whatever

[3:51:12] Trustee Luckham: the future holds for us don't even pretend to know that so i think we'll now move on in our

[3:51:19] Trustee Luckham: applications and referrals and we're going to jump to

[3:51:23] Voice 21: additional information that you'd like to

[3:51:43] Voice 21: provide us and

[3:51:43] Trustee Luckham: then we'll have a conversation at this table we may ask a few questions as we might

[3:51:48] Trustee Luckham: ask staff questions okay all right thank you for being here bill thank

[3:51:54] Voice 1: you chair welcome i'm sorry

[3:51:56] Voice 1: Sorry, you just buffered out there, so I've kind of got my fingers crossed.

[3:52:00] Voice 1: But anyways, quickly, Salt Spring application SSDP 2022.4 for 243 Trip Road is a development permit application for retroactive vegetation removal and for proposed restoration measures to protect water quality, fish, and sensitive riparian habitat,

[3:52:22] Voice 1: all within development permit area 4, which is lakes, streams, and wetlands.

[3:52:27] Voice 1: So this application is for work undertaken without a permit and for the remediation work that's proposed.

[3:52:34] Voice 1: So the scope of the development itself is limited to, sorry, moving ahead is limited to restoration planting

[3:52:41] Voice 1: and for a future access to the foreshore of the lake with a maximum width of 1.5 meters, and that's for an earthen path.

[3:52:49] Voice 1: um the specific vegetation remover itself was actually for invasive non-native blackberries

[3:52:56] Voice 1: within 10 meters of the natural boundary of saint mary's lake

[3:53:00] Voice 1: and just a note on that is that um just the way that the development permit is written um that

[3:53:07] Voice 1: under normal circumstances would actually be a recommendation of a biologist or the wrapper

[3:53:12] Voice 1: process to remove invasive species, but unfortunately because of how the DP is written, it actually brought this application forward.

[3:53:24] Voice 1: So the property is within the St. Mary Lake watershed, which is also designated under the riparian areas protection regulations or wrapper, and there's therefore part of DPA 7, which is riparian areas.

[3:53:39] Voice 1: However, the proposed restoration work that was submitted, and as part of this application facilitates an exemption to that DP, and also, or the exemption to the need to obtain a DP under that development permit area and also from the requirement to submit to the

[3:53:56] Voice 1: provincial wrapper review.

[3:53:57] Voice 1: So all of their works undertaken to date and that are proposed as part of the building permit application do not require DP, and this includes the removal of garbage and accumulated debris, which the applicants have done, clearing site preparation and future construction of a dwelling, accessory buildings, and a septic disposal system.

[3:54:18] Voice 1: All of that development is located 10 meters above the natural boundary of the lake in DPA 4 and fully outside of DPA 7, which is designated 30 meters from the natural boundary.

[3:54:29] Voice 1: And just to note, the siting of the septic field is fully outside of the DPAs at approximately 80 meters from the natural boundary of the lake and closer to Trip Road.

[3:54:38] Voice 1: The applicants hired Kathy Reimer, RP Bio, and Dave Gooding, our PN, who submitted a restoration report that is attachment three to the staff report.

[3:54:49] Voice 1: That followed the wrapper methodology and a streamside protection and enhancement area was assigned at 15 meters perpendicular from the high watermark of the lake and provides measures for the specific protection and enhancement of this area.

[3:55:07] Voice 1: That SPIA corresponds to the prescribed restoration planting area, and there will be no further development permitted within the SPIA, with the exception of that earthen path to the foreshore which I mentioned.

[3:55:19] Voice 1: All recommendations and measures in the restoration plan have been incorporated into the proposed DP, as well as further conditions that have been added based on the specifics of the proposal and previous similar applications.

[3:55:32] Voice 1: applications. Adherence to those conditions and monitoring will mitigate impacts from development

[3:55:37] Voice 1: and enhance the riparian area. So staff's recommendation on page 396 is for the agenda

[3:55:46] Voice 1: is that the Salt Spring Island Local Trust Committee approves issuance of DP 2022.4 and

[3:55:53] Voice 1: that is supported as the objectives and specifics guidelines of the DPA have been met. All relevant

[3:55:59] Voice 1: recommendations of a restoration plan have been incorporated into the conditions of the proposed

[3:56:04] Voice 1: EP and lastly implementing and monitoring conditions in the proposed EP will ensure

[3:56:10] Voice 1: the protection of the drinking water quality fish habitat and riparian areas. Alternative

[3:56:17] Voice 1: resolutions have been provided and that's my summary. Thank

[3:56:22] Trustee Luckham: you very much Bill and thank you

[3:56:24] Trustee Luckham: for joining us electronically and assisting us from the Victoria office with the workload here

[3:56:29] Trustee Luckham: appreciate that you're welcome um

[3:56:31] Trustee Luckham: so let's turn to the applicant do you have anything additional

[3:56:34] Trustee Luckham: to add you concur with the recommendation or you

[3:56:36] Trustee Luckham: concur excellent that's good so uh trustees do

[3:56:40] Voice 15: you have any questions for staff or the applicant

[3:56:42] Voice 17: well i just have a comment you know it's uh

[3:56:47] Voice 17: we know as we heard lots of people our regulations are behind and we have a lake that is intending

[3:56:55] Voice 17: to someday increase the height of that lake where it's weird and things so we that's something we

[3:57:03] Voice 17: should be putting on our projects list uh that the boundaries you know we shouldn't be approving

[3:57:08] Voice 17: any new projects that put further strain on you know the potential of increasing that weird height

[3:57:15] Voice 17: so that's another add to the list of things that we are behind on doing um which we can't do

[3:57:22] Voice 17: anything about for this for this project i'm just mentioning um the only question i have

[3:57:28] Voice 17: um phil would be in the permit i the monitoring report i don't really get up it's 30 days within

[3:57:39] Voice 17: the permitted restoration planting occurring but and i can't find um there's no like backup that

[3:57:48] Voice 17: that the restoration planning succeeded or was successful?

[3:57:54] Voice 1: Sorry, just, I'm going to scroll to the actual, pardon me.

[3:58:02] Voice 17: 3.73.

[3:58:04] Voice 1: Yeah, I'm just trying to find the actual page, sorry.

[3:58:06] Voice 1: Make sure this is going to be- 418.

[3:58:10] Voice 17: Oh, that's the version I'm looking at.

[3:58:13] Voice 1: So there is, I'm sorry,

[3:58:16] Voice 1: I'm speaking off the top of my head,

[3:58:17] Voice 1: but there are provisions in the dp to ensure that um survival of um and replacement if if the

[3:58:26] Voice 1: plantings are unsuccessful so i'm just opening it here give me two seconds i apologize yeah

[3:58:32] Voice 17: now my just question is it just says that the report will come within 30 days of the permitted

[3:58:38] Voice 17: being completed right but

[3:58:41] Voice 17: there's no proof that it survived right

[3:58:46] Voice 1: well um so that's

[3:58:48] Voice 1: The job of the monitor, I mean, the question is, there's an administrative and there's a monitoring limit that we have to place on things.

[3:58:58] Voice 1: And the way that's structured, like other DPs, is that there comes a point in time where the QEP will have to sign off on this.

[3:59:07] Voice 1: and there are obligations theoretically or in the in the or sorry conditions in the permit itself

[3:59:14] Voice 1: to ensure that those there's survival over a period of time but it's difficult for our staff

[3:59:21] Voice 1: to put in any conditions that extend that you

[3:59:24] Voice 1: know ad infinitum i guess is a for lack of better terms

[3:59:29] Voice 1: so yeah no i didn't

[3:59:31] Voice 17: expect it forever anyway okay

[3:59:33] Voice 1: i mean i i have to say that it if if that's a

[3:59:36] Voice 1: concern of the trustee and if you wanted to place a condition which has a time frame attached to

[3:59:43] Voice 17: that

[3:59:43] Voice 1: we can certainly do that so okay

[3:59:51] Trustee Luckham: your signal is breaking up there a bit i'm hoping

[3:59:54] Trustee Luckham: the trustee's got the message and is there further questions or concerns

[4:00:00] Trustee Luckham: well

[4:00:00] Voice 17: it just isn't clear in this permit maybe if it was a raw report it would be in there just it

[4:00:05] Voice 17: isn't clear um you know i i'll look to the are you're committed i guess to the that your this

[4:00:12] Voice 17: planting survive is what i'm the key thing i'm concerned about yes okay here

[4:00:20] Trustee Grove (probable): you go uh no i'm uh

[4:00:21] Trustee Grove (probable): satisfied with um the report and uh with the recommendation so i have a move that

[4:00:26] Trustee Grove (probable): Solstice Manor Local Trust Committee approves issuance of Development Permit SSDP 2022.4.

[4:00:32] Trustee Luckham: Okay, do I have a seconder? Seconded Laura Patrick, thank you. Any further discussion?

[4:00:40] Trustee Luckham: Then I'll call for the vote. All those in favour? That carries unanimously. Thank you very much

[4:00:46] Trustee Luckham: trustees.

[4:00:47] Voice 17: Mr Chair, could I make a motion to have the lake levels added to the project list?

[4:00:54] Voice 14: absolutely

[4:00:54] Voice 17: i'm so sorry nothing to

[4:00:57] Voice 14: do with your application you're good don't just raise the land

[4:01:01] Voice 17: you have to do that um i know that the south spring island local trust committee

[4:01:07] Voice 17: had a review of future lake levels of st mary's lake on land use regulations to the purchase

[4:01:18] Voice 12: it's a reasonable consideration let's just see if phil got that

[4:01:24] Voice 12: HAB-Masyn Moyer- He says he got it

[4:01:25] Voice 4: just to add a review of future lake levels of St mary's like to.

[4:01:34] Voice 17: HAB-Masyn Moyer- Like levels.

[4:01:36] Voice 17: HAB-Masyn Moyer- Land use bylaws to the pro we

[4:01:49] Voice 21: don't forget it it's our memory keeping list.

[4:01:53] Voice 21: HAB-Masyn Moyer- Because the beaver will show up.

[4:01:55] Voice 17: HAB-Masyn Moyer- The beaver does his best.

[4:02:10] Voice 17: I think it's just a review of impacts of future lake levels on the land use bylaw to the projects

[4:02:20] Voice 17: list that's

[4:02:23] Voice 21: space impact

[4:02:28] Voice 17: of I

[4:02:35] Voice 4: had a review of impact impacts

[4:02:38] Voice 17: of review of impact I don't know

[4:02:41] Voice 17: We could read English.

[4:02:44] Voice 17: As long as we know roughly what we're saying.

[4:02:46] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, that's good.

[4:02:48] Trustee Luckham: That's good.

[4:02:48] Trustee Luckham: That's good.

[4:02:49] Trustee Luckham: We'll capture it.

[4:02:50] Trustee Luckham: So let's move.

[4:02:51] Trustee Luckham: Do I have a seconder?

[4:02:52] Trustee Luckham: Yes.

[4:02:52] Trustee Luckham: Peter Grove, thank you.

[4:02:53] Trustee Luckham: Any discussion?

[4:02:54] Trustee Luckham: All those in favor?

[4:02:55] Trustee Luckham: Thank you for bringing that forward, Laura.

[4:02:58] Trustee Luckham: Okay.

[4:02:58] Trustee Luckham: So I think that concludes that development permit and the additional item that you put in there.

[4:03:05] Trustee Luckham: I'm going to now go. Well, I would like to go to 16.1. So spring development learners permit 2021.24. Just want to ask the trustees you want to have a five minute break here, refresh your water.

[4:03:18] Voice 15: totally just a good

[4:03:19] Trustee Luckham: idea okay so let us uh provide staff the opportunity to tell themselves

[4:03:26] Trustee Luckham: and we'll jump to 16.1 well

[4:03:30] Voice 21: the action has a presentation stick here a moment

[4:03:39] Voice 21: i left

[4:03:56] Voice 3: for five minutes and i came back in the room and cleared

[4:03:58] Voice 21: out like after all

[4:03:59] Voice 21: after

[4:04:00] Voice 3: all the presentations

[4:04:10] Voice 3: I've been doing my best call out from that's why I send you emails at nine o'clock at night

[4:04:15] Voice 3: sometimes you're

[4:04:17] Voice 35: working at night

[4:04:18] Voice 3: well I yeah get out go to the beach

[4:04:21] Voice 3: I

[4:04:21] Voice 35: guess your kids are out of

[4:04:22] Voice 3: school right I always forget that yeah exactly

[4:04:26] Voice 3: trying to maximize the summer fun

[4:04:35] Voice 35: You have a date that

[4:04:36] Voice 20: you're...

[4:04:37] Voice 20: September

[4:04:38] Voice 35: 1 is my

[4:04:39] Voice 3: last day in the office.

[4:04:39] Voice 3: You have a date you're taking off?

[4:04:41] Voice 3: Oh yeah, September the 11th.

[4:04:42] Voice 3: And you're flying to San Jose?

[4:04:45] Voice 20: And you've

[4:04:45] Voice 3: got a place?

[4:04:47] Voice 3: Yeah, so we're going with another family.

[4:04:50] Voice 3: We finished a course.

[4:04:51] Voice 3: Somebody else in there.

[4:04:52] Voice 3: Somebody here?

[4:04:53] Voice 3: Yeah.

[4:04:53] Voice 3: They're taking off with us.

[4:04:55] Voice 3: And I think she's booked us a place in San Jose

[4:04:57] Voice 3: for at least a couple of days.

[4:04:59] Voice 3: Yeah, so

[4:04:59] Voice 35: you'll be in San...

[4:05:00] Voice 35: Where do

[4:05:00] Voice 3: you go after that?

[4:05:02] Voice 3: I'd have to ask whether

[4:05:02] Voice 35: she's done any...

[4:05:05] Voice 35: we kind

[4:05:06] Voice 18: of did that

[4:05:07] Voice 18: I don't

[4:05:10] Voice 35: know if it was a great idea

[4:05:11] Voice 18: for us

[4:05:12] Voice 18: we ended up in Christchurch which was

[4:05:14] Voice 35: not a good choice

[4:05:17] Voice 20: but

[4:05:17] Voice 35: couldn't you get out of Christchurch if you

[4:05:19] Voice 35: we could but it was sort of like

[4:05:21] Voice 35: that move versus like let's just

[4:05:23] Voice 35: go back

[4:05:27] Voice 35: we

[4:05:27] Voice 18: didn't know where we were going to land either

[4:05:29] Voice 18: where

[4:05:29] Voice 35: would you go in Costa Rica

[4:05:49] Voice 20: i think

[4:05:50] Voice 3: we're we're looking for a little bit of everything

[4:05:56] Voice 20: yeah you

[4:05:57] Voice 3: know like i don't think we're going to be stationary at least not unless we find

[4:06:00] Voice 3: somewhere i

[4:06:01] Voice 20: don't like monozuma all right

[4:06:05] Trustee Luckham: everybody sorry to keep you waiting

[4:06:10] Trustee Luckham: peter's going to be back momentarily

[4:06:18] Trustee Luckham: yeah i'm pretty excited one thing about like when a casket doesn't happen

[4:06:22] i mean it's got a lot of natural but it doesn't have

[4:06:25] Voice 35: a bird bite

[4:06:33] Voice 20: all right

[4:06:34] Trustee Luckham: everybody let's bring ourselves back to order

[4:06:36] Voice 20: and

[4:06:38] Trustee Luckham: planner jason yeoman um application uh

[4:06:42] Trustee Luckham: salt spring development permit 2021 excuse us please etc and i see the applicant here thank

[4:06:52] Trustee Luckham: you for joining us you've seen how it works and i'm going to go over to jason to provide us a

[4:06:57] Trustee Luckham: summary of his report quite a bit of detail and thank you for the last jason and the applicant

[4:07:05] Trustee Luckham: for the last minute changes to accommodate the uh septic field placement that certainly helps

[4:07:13] Trustee Luckham: um

[4:07:14] Voice 3: yeah making helpful if you bring up the agenda package

[4:07:18] Voice 3: is that yeah

[4:07:19] Voice 4: i can do that definitely you

[4:07:21] Voice 3: don't have to do that page

[4:07:22] Voice 4: 111. um

[4:07:30] Voice 3: um yeah i

[4:07:31] Voice 3: i don't know if i need any visuals but okay you asked i'm ready at any time okay

[4:07:37] Voice 3: and and you've got the the file from the applicant like

[4:07:41] Voice 4: making it as pretty as possible

[4:07:45] Voice 4: where do you where

[4:07:46] Voice 3: do you project

[4:07:46] Voice 4: that there okay yeah and that's visible to people that are viewed

[4:07:51] Voice 4: i'll make it visible to people okay

[4:07:56] Voice 3: thank you chair luckham uh so you have two application

[4:08:02] Voice 3: application files before you for consideration in relation to these it's two subject properties

[4:08:07] Voice 3: but we'll consider it the development site uh salt spring island development variance

[4:08:12] Voice 3: permit 2021.24 and salt spring island development permit 2018.14. um given uh the presentations that

[4:08:22] Voice 3: you heard today and given the fact you've read the agenda package now several times over over

[4:08:26] Voice 3: the course of several years um I'm not going to provide a preamble about the site characteristics

[4:08:31] Voice 3: or the proposed development, if that's all right.

[4:08:34] Voice 20: I mean,

[4:08:34] Voice 3: the viewing public at home might appreciate it,

[4:08:36] Voice 3: but I think you know what we're talking about.

[4:08:39] Trustee Luckham: We know what

[4:08:40] Voice 3: you're talking about.

[4:08:40] Trustee Luckham: Okay.

[4:08:42] Voice 3: The local trust committee last considered this file

[4:08:44] Voice 3: in February, 2022.

[4:08:46] Voice 3: And at that time, the LTC directed staff to refer the file

[4:08:50] Voice 3: to First Nations for review and comment.

[4:08:52] Voice 3: Staff have done so, and so I'll provide a little update

[4:08:54] Voice 3: to you in the course of my presentation today.

[4:08:58] Voice 3: I'm going to try and take things fairly slowly

[4:09:00] Voice 3: solely and methodically. It's a large, complex file. There's been a few moving pieces

[4:09:06] Voice 3: here towards the finish line of today's meeting. And so we'll just try and be methodical in how we

[4:09:13] Voice 3: discuss and address various things. Referral of the file to First Nations was made in March

[4:09:20] Voice 3: following your February meeting with a 60-day referral window. The LTC extended that by a

[4:09:26] Voice 3: further 60 days at your may meeting as we hadn't had much take up on it uh at that time so that

[4:09:31] Voice 3: referral window is now closed and from that um you'll see that appendix nine in your staff report

[4:09:41] Voice 3: is a conditional approval of the development from the sale lands department um i had a little bit

[4:09:47] Voice 3: of back and forth with say over the past few months trying to arrange a site visit

[4:09:50] Voice 3: it and sort of learn a little bit more about their interests and concerns or ideas for this

[4:09:57] Voice 3: particular project. We weren't able to facilitate that, but they did provide that letter from the

[4:10:02] Voice 3: Lands Department, which is in your agenda package. LIAC's impersonation submitted a letter in February

[4:10:08] Voice 3: indicating that their ability to comment on the file would largely be predicated on the submission

[4:10:15] Voice 3: of a final archeological impact assessment report.

[4:10:18] Voice 3: I gather that report is now done.

[4:10:22] Voice 3: I assume, what I know of the archeological impact

[4:10:27] Voice 3: assessment process is that once that report is submitted

[4:10:30] Voice 3: to the archeological branch, they then send it out

[4:10:32] Voice 3: to nations for review and comment.

[4:10:34] Voice 3: And so LIAXN will likely receive that final report

[4:10:37] Voice 3: from the arch branch when it is submitted.

[4:10:40] Voice 3: it um liacson did send me an email i think that was just yesterday sort of mid-morning

[4:10:48] Voice 3: indicating um i don't want to let's see essentially that they are not in support of the

[4:10:55] Voice 3: proposal in its current current form that's the way it looks today i don't know much more beyond

[4:11:02] Voice 3: that um cowichan tribes also submitted a brief email to indicate that they were in concurrence

[4:11:09] Voice 3: with LIAC's and First Nations perspective on the file and then Malahat First Nation indicated that

[4:11:14] Voice 3: the proposal is outside of their core area of interest but wanted to ensure that First Nations

[4:11:21] Voice 3: representatives were present for all archaeological impact assessment work and

[4:11:25] Voice 3: subsurface excavation work. It's my understanding that Clienza had site technicians from SAO,

[4:11:31] Voice 3: Danford Couch and Tribes I believe for all the work they were doing on site so I think

[4:11:36] Voice 3: malahat's concern would be satisfied through that um let's see is there anything more i want to say

[4:11:42] Voice 3: about first nations presently i don't think so that's that's basically the summary of what we

[4:11:47] Voice 3: received from the referrals that went out i think that the applicant has been in more detailed

[4:11:52] Voice 3: conversation with say first nation over the past couple of months we probably want to provide you

[4:11:57] Voice 3: an update there but if you can on the substance of some of those conversations and um as i noted

[4:12:04] Voice 3: the archaeological impact assessment report it's my understanding is is done and to be submitted

[4:12:09] Voice 3: to the art branch sometime very soon i've sort of received a summary of that report

[4:12:17] Voice 3: all right so that's the first nations component um you will have received at the very end of the

[4:12:24] Voice 3: workday yesterday a updated staff report that includes an amended sewage disposal field site

[4:12:31] Voice 3: plan that we received from the applicant late last week with the submission of this uh updated

[4:12:38] Voice 3: sewage disposal field site plan one of the i guess we call it the most contentious aspect

[4:12:44] Voice 3: of the variance permit that had been applied for to date is now no longer necessary so one element

[4:12:51] Voice 3: of the variance permit that was being requested was to reduce the setback of sewage disposal

[4:12:56] Voice 3: disposal fields from water bodies from and this was in relation to soul creek primarily but to

[4:13:02] Voice 3: reduce that setback from the 30 meters that the land use bylaw requires to 10 meters from soul

[4:13:07] Voice 3: creek and then from 30 meters from the natural boundary of the sea to 26 meters with the relocated

[4:13:13] Voice 3: septic field as proposed that part of the variance permit is no longer required two minor variances

[4:13:20] Voice 3: are still necessary and that were included in the variance permit that is in the agenda package

[4:13:26] Voice 3: and that's a variance permit to place two of the buildings closer to the

[4:13:30] Voice 3: interior side lot line than would ordinarily be permitted the applicant owns two adjacent

[4:13:35] Voice 3: properties and since it's being developed effectively as a single site staff have no

[4:13:41] Voice 3: objections to citing buildings closer to his own lot lines than would ordinarily be allowed

[4:13:46] Voice 3: and the other setback variance that is being requested is to place some underground septic

[4:13:52] Voice 3: tanks closer to the road right of way than the bylaw would ordinarily allow and again staff

[4:13:57] Voice 3: consider that to be a fairly uh minor ask and as such have no objections to carrying on with

[4:14:03] Voice 3: the variants in that way the so just returning to your staff reports as they appear in the agenda

[4:14:12] Voice 3: um staff's recommendation on the variance permit all along um over the applicant's

[4:14:17] Voice 3: objections had been to strike the parts of the variance permit that concern the reduced

[4:14:22] Voice 3: we've set back to the septic fields and so the ltc now can actually simply proceed with the

[4:14:28] Voice 3: resolution that is in your staff report the recommended resolution in your staff report for

[4:14:33] Voice 3: dvp 2021.24 and achieve the effect of no longer requiring those disposal field setbacks i know

[4:14:41] Voice 3: that's a bit convoluted but it seems that rather than um sort of put together and provide you with

[4:14:47] Voice 3: an updated development variance permit at the last minute yesterday it just made sense

[4:14:51] Voice 3: to strike clauses from the existing development variance permit that was in your agenda package

[4:14:56] Voice 3: that you previously received. Excuse me,

[4:15:00] Trustee Grove (probable): could we deal

[4:15:01] Voice 3: with that before going on to the next?

[4:15:04] Voice 3: Absolutely. I mean, there are two separate applications in the agenda package. And so

[4:15:10] Voice 3: if you want to deal with them in turn, maybe my only note on that is that the next step when we

[4:15:17] Voice 3: talk about the development permit overall, there's a couple, if the LTC is considering

[4:15:22] Voice 3: during issuing that permit we need to make sure this new sewage disposal field

[4:15:28] Voice 3: design is included in that development permit and in the alternative section of the staff report you

[4:15:33] Voice 3: received yesterday afternoon there's some language around around how we could do that in the right

[4:15:38] Voice 3: way so i'm open to suggestions so just

[4:15:40] Trustee Grove (probable): so device it to my mind just

[4:15:43] Trustee Luckham: for a process can i ask a

[4:15:44] Trustee Luckham: question that there's two parts to that motion one is to make the amendments and the other is

[4:15:50] Trustee Luckham: to issue the permit and possibly that may want to be settled it's

[4:15:55] Voice 17: in one it's already in one

[4:15:57] Voice 17: resolution

[4:15:58] Trustee Luckham: it's in the alternate no

[4:16:00] Trustee Luckham: it's

[4:16:01] Voice 17: number one in the staff report it

[4:16:05] Voice 15: says and issue the

[4:16:06] Voice 15: permit as amended

[4:16:07] Voice 15: so i'm saying that issuing the permit may be a different discussion than making

[4:16:12] Voice 15: human or not

[4:16:13] Voice 17: this is the

[4:16:15] Voice 15: variance and

[4:16:17] Voice 17: issuing the permanent

[4:16:19] Voice 20: variance okay

[4:16:20] Trustee Grove (probable): because personally i'm

[4:16:24] Trustee Grove (probable): satisfied with that and i would like to move on and get that under our belts but just the thought

[4:16:30] Trustee Grove (probable): i'm not attached to that my children would say either

[4:16:33] Voice 17: way okay

[4:16:35] Trustee Luckham: okay so um so i'm going to do

[4:16:38] Trustee Luckham: what you want to proceed with dealing with this because the applicant may want to make some

[4:16:43] Trustee Luckham: some specific remarks with respect to this section?

[4:16:47] Trustee Grove (probable): I expect the applicant's delighted to press it.

[4:16:51] Trustee Luckham: Let's ask the applicant then.

[4:16:53] Voice 35: I mean, I've got a dog's breakfast of remarks.

[4:16:56] Voice 35: So I mean, I've got just a short presentation

[4:16:59] Voice 35: just to try to identify the shifts.

[4:17:03] Voice 35: But you know.

[4:17:05] Voice 20: If

[4:17:05] Trustee Grove (probable): you feel like you're exposing your dog's breakfast,

[4:17:08] Trustee Grove (probable): please do.

[4:17:09] Trustee Grove (probable): Let you know I'm happy with that first PDP motion.

[4:17:12] Trustee Grove (probable): check it yeah whatever okay chair yeah

[4:17:18] Voice 12: so

[4:17:19] Trustee Grove (probable): i will move that the salt spring island local

[4:17:21] Trustee Grove (probable): sorry salt spring island local trust committee amended development variance permit ssdbp 2021.2

[4:17:27] Trustee Grove (probable): or to remove clause 3.3 clause 4 schedule number 3 and schedule number 4 make consequential

[4:17:34] Trustee Grove (probable): numbering alterations to affect this change and issue the permit as amended

[4:17:38] Trustee Grove (probable): it okay

[4:17:41] Trustee Luckham: moved and seconded to speak to your uh motion no

[4:17:46] Trustee Grove (probable): thank you except it would have been

[4:17:47] Trustee Grove (probable): so nice we could have done this months ago well there is a

[4:17:54] Voice 35: dog's breakfast but there's a there's a reason why we are where we are yeah yeah um laura patrick

[4:18:00] Voice 35: i

[4:18:01] Voice 17: just you know i think i want to be clear that we're right now talking about the variants

[4:18:07] Voice 17: experience. This makes a lot of sense. We first had approved it

[4:18:16] Voice 17: based on decisions made regarding the alternative at the

[4:18:26] Voice 25: time was

[4:18:26] Voice 17: believed to have caused more archaeological impact. And

[4:18:29] Voice 17: I made

[4:18:30] Voice 17: that decision that I'd go where it was rather than that.

[4:18:33] Voice 17: And we saw it again.

[4:18:35] Voice 17: That's when we asked for the nations to get

[4:18:37] Voice 17: their feedback on a decision of that nature so um

[4:18:41] Voice 21: you know i'm very comfortable with moving

[4:18:43] Voice 21: forward with the variances okay um all right so what's your pleasure so you've just been moved

[4:19:02] Trustee Grove (probable): and seconded oh

[4:19:03] Trustee Luckham: i see thank

[4:19:04] Trustee Grove (probable): you do you have concerns that you don't expect

[4:19:06] Trustee Luckham: i do have concerns

[4:19:08] Trustee Luckham: and um um this is uh and i have concerns for the applicant as well as um for the community um

[4:19:17] Trustee Luckham: because we've got another section here that has some fairly stringent requirements that's

[4:19:22] Trustee Luckham: the development permit that's the next step yeah no it is the next step um however the

[4:19:27] Trustee Luckham: issuing this permit allows that work to install that field to happen is that correct um

[4:19:38] Voice 3: yes and

[4:19:39] Voice 3: no yes it can't be both

[4:19:41] Voice 3: it requires a building you have to have a building

[4:19:44] Voice 3: well and

[4:19:45] Trustee Grove (probable): we don't control

[4:19:46] Voice 3: the building permit i the the work to install the septic field may be

[4:19:51] Voice 3: of a nature that would require a development permit you know like the the development permit

[4:19:56] Voice 3: is necessary to see this the development on the site go forward i mean there are there are types

[4:20:03] Voice 3: of developments you could do on site without triggering a development permit most likely

[4:20:06] Voice 3: we would have to go through the list of development permit triggers to see what can actually happen

[4:20:12] Voice 3: there without heating it up but most things that you do would require development um

[4:20:17] Voice 17: mr chair i was

[4:20:19] Voice 17: gonna say we can discuss effluent and issues and environmental impacts as part of the next permit

[4:20:27] Voice 17: um this is strictly about the wear um now that it's been removed outside the 30 meters we don't

[4:20:35] Voice 17: have it doesn't trigger a variance no i realize that yeah

[4:20:41] Trustee Luckham: so all right i'll um i'll support this

[4:20:44] Trustee Luckham: um and we'll have further discussion over the program absolutely so i'll call the vote then

[4:20:50] Trustee Luckham: all those in favor that carries okay

[4:20:54] Voice 21: i'll take the next part right

[4:21:06] Voice 3: so this uh second application

[4:21:08] Voice 3: uh salt spring island development permit 2018.14 relates essentially to the to the comprehensive

[4:21:15] Voice 3: nature of the development that is proposed for the site. The site falls within Development

[4:21:22] Voice 3: Permit Area 2 for the form and character of non-village commercial and industrial development.

[4:21:26] Voice 3: It falls within Development Permit Area 3 for shoreline protection, Development Permit Area 4

[4:21:32] Voice 3: for the protection of lake streams and wetlands, Development Permit Area 6 for slope hazards and

[4:21:37] Voice 3: soil instability, and Development Permit Area 7 for the riparian area protection regulation.

[4:21:44] Voice 3: So there's a whole host of regulations and policies that apply to development on this site, some of which relate to environmental protection, some of which relate simply to the form and character of the development that's proposed.

[4:22:00] Voice 3: on the whole um the proposed approach to development here puts the development outside

[4:22:10] Voice 3: of most of the environmental protection development permit areas and you know if we continue to have

[4:22:17] Voice 3: the audience that we did today i was going to just sort of speak briefly about the fact that the

[4:22:20] Voice 3: the framework for decision making as it relates to these properties is not wide open right it's

[4:22:27] Voice 3: It's constrained by the development permit areas that apply to it, the land use by-law

[4:22:32] Voice 3: regulations that apply to it.

[4:22:33] Voice 3: It's not a simple yes or no, it's more of a, with the development permit areas it's

[4:22:39] Voice 3: a yes, but how can you do it in a way that complies with the guidelines?

[4:22:43] Voice 3: I think the nature of many of the comments that the LTC heard today were about whether

[4:22:49] Voice 3: or not those guidelines that are in place for the property are sufficient given its

[4:22:55] Voice 3: given its location but that's

[4:22:56] Voice 13: not

[4:22:57] Voice 3: the not the lens through which staff are able to do this

[4:23:01] Voice 3: application right we evaluate it against the guidelines that are in the official community

[4:23:06] Voice 3: plan and against the regulations in the land use bylaw and it's not necessarily a question of what

[4:23:11] Voice 3: is a more appropriate use on the site or what density um what density might be more appropriate

[4:23:17] Voice 3: there the developer has proposed something that is generally consistent with the land use bylaw

[4:23:24] Voice 3: regulations and the development permit area guidelines that are in place on the property

[4:23:28] Voice 3: you'll note um from staff's guideline evaluation which um i can't even remember what appendix it

[4:23:35] Voice 3: is here appendix two in your staff report for the development permit there are a couple of

[4:23:41] Voice 3: guidelines where staff continue to have concerns about whether the guideline is adequately met

[4:23:46] Voice 3: you know a couple quibbles about uh architectural form and character maybe and the nature of some

[4:23:51] Voice 3: of the building siting but on the whole i would say that the applicant has met the uh the form

[4:23:57] Voice 3: and character guidelines of development permit area two where staff continue to hang on hat though is

[4:24:03] Voice 3: is on this issue of um whether or not sufficient study has been done of the potential polluting

[4:24:11] Voice 3: impacts of development on the site particularly as it relates to um the septic field and the

[4:24:17] Voice 3: impact on groundwater hydrology and ultimately on the nearby streams as well. So despite the

[4:24:26] Voice 3: fact that the applicant is proposing to relocate the septic field outside of the original variance

[4:24:31] Voice 3: permit request, it is now 30 meters from Soul Creek, it is 30 meters from the Fulford Creek

[4:24:36] Voice 3: estuary, and it's 30 meters from the natural boundary of the sea on the harbour side. Staff

[4:24:42] Voice 3: continue to advocate for the the studies that are identified in the recommendation um in the

[4:24:48] Voice 3: covering staff report from august 9th um as as we have done so since uh since 2019 so that hasn't

[4:24:55] Voice 3: changed um okay thank you

[4:25:00] Trustee Luckham: after that um so does the applicant want to make your presentation now

[4:25:06] Trustee Luckham: yes please okay thank you and uh does phil have that or are you just gonna yeah i think so okay

[4:25:21] Voice 20: yeah no bill's gone it's rob did i say bill i said phil oh phil

[4:25:30] Voice 21: but it's okay i got another cup of coffee

[4:25:32] Voice 21: thank you bro if

[4:25:49] Voice 35: i just ask you to advance

[4:25:53] Voice 35: maybe when i when i ask you to advance

[4:26:00] Voice 35: That's great. We can talk about a lot of subjects related to the application. It's got some

[4:26:06] Voice 35: complexity. There's a lot of elements that I would love to speak to today, but I think

[4:26:11] Voice 35: primarily we're attempting to speak to the substance of the prior meeting that we had

[4:26:16] Voice 35: in February, where we were tasked with a few elements. So let's talk a little bit about

[4:26:24] Voice 35: about First Nations, if you could advance.

[4:26:27] Voice 35: Oh, I think that was, that was a challenge to me,

[4:26:32] Voice 35: but I want to acknowledge that the property is located

[4:26:34] Voice 35: in say First Nations heritage land.

[4:26:38] Voice 35: And we here on Salt Spring are occupying lands

[4:26:44] Voice 35: that have not been fully ceded.

[4:26:46] Voice 35: And like to say, we have an obligation to care

[4:26:48] Voice 35: and respect for land for each other in future generations.

[4:26:51] Voice 35: And that's always been a vision for the project.

[4:26:54] Voice 35: advance, please. This is our second letter from SAILT in providing conditional support

[4:27:04] Voice 35: for the application. The first letter was received in, I believe, February of 2020.

[4:27:10] Voice 35: We actually didn't receive it until a few months later. I think what's important to

[4:27:16] Voice 35: recognize is that that was a different Council-in-Chief, so that's two separate Councils-in-Chiefs

[4:27:21] Voice 35: that have reviewed this application and the work that that has gone into those kinds of

[4:27:27] Voice 35: communications has taken place over five years and it's many uh you know i would i would say

[4:27:34] Voice 35: you know 50 60 hours of work um most recently i've met with chief and council on two separate

[4:27:41] Voice 35: occasions i've also met with their uh land use committee and also their economic development

[4:27:46] Voice 35: development committee uh those those conversations are are wide-ranging they're quite interesting and

[4:27:53] Voice 35: I would love to share more and I would be happy to to do so if you ask but in some respects I

[4:27:59] Voice 35: can't really speak for sale I wanted to point out um some of the language because this letter

[4:28:08] Voice 35: is is quite distinct from anything that we've received in the past and in particular I just

[4:28:14] Voice 35: wanted to draw attention to the third paragraph

[4:28:20] Voice 12: right yeah

[4:28:24] Voice 35: i'd just like to identify the the highlighted areas through critical review we have determined

[4:28:29] Voice 35: that the proponent meets and exceeds the environmental standards for the project

[4:28:34] Voice 35: the proponent has satisfied our initial request to have our cultural monitors present for

[4:28:38] Voice 35: archaeological work within the project areas and we no longer have concerns of the project impacts

[4:28:43] Voice 35: acts to archeological sites and local waterways.

[4:28:46] Voice 35: And I would just like to identify also the last,

[4:28:51] Voice 35: the first sentence of the second to last paragraph.

[4:28:53] Voice 35: In the wake of reconciliation,

[4:28:55] Voice 35: we expect our Aboriginal rights to make land use decisions

[4:28:57] Voice 35: regarding our traditional territories

[4:28:59] Voice 35: to be recognized and affirmed.

[4:29:03] Voice 35: I think this is a very powerful letter.

[4:29:05] Voice 35: It's far more than what we had expected.

[4:29:08] Voice 35: I think it identifies a key objective

[4:29:11] Voice 35: for Say Out First Nations,

[4:29:12] Voice 35: which is to embark on a vision to establish a relationship

[4:29:18] Voice 35: with the Islands Trust and with Salt Spring Island

[4:29:20] Voice 35: and to embed its ancestral claims

[4:29:24] Voice 35: in Fulford Harbour in particular.

[4:29:28] Voice 35: The Lyakson letter of February, 2022,

[4:29:32] Voice 35: nope, nope, just keep it there, thank you.

[4:29:34] Voice 35: The Lyakson letter, it identified two key elements

[4:29:37] Voice 35: that they sought, which is they wanted

[4:29:39] Voice 35: the full environmental impact assessment

[4:29:41] Voice 35: completed for the project.

[4:29:44] Voice 35: which has happened, and they also wanted meaningful engagement with First Nations,

[4:29:49] Voice 35: which has also happened. I would also point out that the Liakson letter, a significant

[4:29:54] Voice 35: portion of that letter is actually in reference to Grace Point and how Grace Point

[4:30:00] Voice 35: became what it was, and in particular calls attention to the Islands Trust, and I think

[4:30:06] Voice 35: points the finger at Islands Trust in terms of its failure to provide appropriate assurances.

[4:30:13] Voice 35: This is not Cray's Island. This is a well-known site, and it's an entirely

[4:30:20] Voice 35: different circumstance. As Jason pointed out with Malahat First Nations, Malahat Nation notes that

[4:30:27] Voice 35: that the proposed activity falls outside of the core Malahad territory.

[4:30:31] Voice 35: And as such, we acknowledge and respect the local First Nations

[4:30:34] Voice 35: to act as primary correspondents in this case.

[4:30:38] Voice 35: And I presume that that's Seau and Cowichan.

[4:30:40] Voice 35: I would point out, and it may not be common knowledge,

[4:30:43] Voice 35: but not all First Nations get along.

[4:30:46] Voice 35: You know, they're like families.

[4:30:47] Voice 35: Some members get along, some members don't.

[4:30:50] Voice 35: Cowichan is predominantly a river First Nations.

[4:30:54] Voice 35: That's their heritage, is inland.

[4:30:57] Voice 35: Say Out is an ocean-going First Nation Coast Salish, and there are ongoing concerns related to the establishment of claims on Salt Spring that exceed traditional territories.

[4:31:13] Voice 35: And so I would just point out that there are concerns with Say Out related to Lyakson and Couch that you might be aware of.

[4:31:23] Voice 35: Could we advance, please?

[4:31:25] Voice 35: From the outset, the project was designed with this concept of creating an homage to a First Nations village.

[4:31:35] Voice 35: The project objectives clearly identify design intent.

[4:31:43] Voice 35: The buildings themselves look, in some respects, like longhouses.

[4:31:47] Voice 35: the design intent of mitigating potential archaeological impacts through use of pilings

[4:31:55] Voice 35: so as to reduce subsurface interruption has been an objective from the project from the outset.

[4:32:04] Voice 35: The project is divided into two zones, and I'll get into the archaeological a little bit

[4:32:08] Voice 35: later, but really the forward site where the old Fulford Inn was located,

[4:32:14] Voice 35: That's predominantly where the archaeological impacts are related to DERU18 are located.

[4:32:21] Voice 35: The Opland site has no archaeological evidence that's been found through the Archaeological

[4:32:29] Voice 35: Impact Assessment, and this is important.

[4:32:32] Voice 35: The proposed development on pilings is intended to mitigate impacts to land.

[4:32:37] Voice 35: And where there are impacts, the proposed construction is slab on grade and repurposing the site of the original Fulford Inn.

[4:32:47] Voice 35: That's appropriate brownfield development.

[4:32:50] Voice 35: That's the way you're supposed to do it.

[4:32:54] Voice 35: And I think it's always worth pointing out that although many may see this as a large development,

[4:32:59] Voice 35: the actual site coverage available for the project is 30% of the site.

[4:33:03] Voice 35: And we're using approximately 11% of the site.

[4:33:07] Voice 35: the buildings are small in design and they they basically are spaciously configured throughout

[4:33:15] Voice 35: the site additionally there are two water licenses available to the site the fulford water

[4:33:20] Voice 35: license is actually a well that's built into fulford creek there's no limit to that water

[4:33:26] Voice 35: license so a property owner here could actually pull water from that creek we believe that would

[4:33:32] Voice 35: be a detrimental approach to water usage so our approach is actually a more fulsome sustainable

[4:33:39] Voice 35: use of water which is which is the expansion of the fulford water district area

[4:33:44] Voice 35: water service area peace advance um you're not going to be able to see this but maybe i could

[4:33:51] Voice 35: just walk through here and point out some elements of this this

[4:33:55] Voice 34: is the archaeological impact

[4:33:56] Voice 35: assessment this is the this document was uh this work was done in may there was there's 15

[4:34:02] Voice 35: 15 excavation hits that have occurred on site,

[4:34:05] Voice 35: nine were completed in May.

[4:34:08] Voice 35: That was in response to Lioxin

[4:34:11] Voice 35: to really provide that information.

[4:34:14] Voice 35: It's not required.

[4:34:16] Voice 35: These kinds of assessments are typically not required

[4:34:19] Voice 35: at a development permit stage,

[4:34:20] Voice 35: but in the interest of trying to make sure

[4:34:23] Voice 35: that we're doing everything correctly,

[4:34:24] Voice 35: we've done this work.

[4:34:26] Voice 35: The legend here identifies these black areas

[4:34:29] Voice 35: as being positive um varying degrees of positive positive uh through auger or excavation and then

[4:34:38] Voice 35: positive with mixed results and you can see through the multiple insight

[4:34:43] Voice 35: this this red line is actually the extension of the ru 18 which goes all the way down the

[4:34:51] Voice 35: road and over to drummond park and almost almost exactly at the property line these white areas

[4:34:58] Voice 35: here are all test pits that have come up negative for any materials.

[4:35:07] Voice 35: That's the new archaeological impact assessment.

[4:35:21] Voice 35: Probably the most significant element of the AIA is that what's identified on the site

[4:35:27] Voice 35: is a thin layer of subsurface, cultural material, midden material, and then it's capped with

[4:35:37] Voice 35: with fill and mixed mixed material from the establishment of the roadway is our presumption

[4:35:46] Voice 35: so from the perspective of construction what we have is is an archaeological layer that's capped

[4:35:55] Voice 35: by fills and you know from the archaeological impact assessment goes further to review

[4:36:02] Voice 35: view the construction of the site as a mitigating impact to archaeological impacts.

[4:36:09] Voice 35: And the approach to the site that I've just described, building on pilings, building concrete

[4:36:16] Voice 35: on the parade, that approach is sort of best in class in terms of dealing with the potential

[4:36:22] Voice 35: risks of exposing additional archaeological and cultural evidence on the site.

[4:36:29] Voice 35: To date, what has been found literally is one arrowhead, I think, for lack of a better description, and approximately 35 faunal bones or animal bones.

[4:36:41] Voice 35: And it looks like it dates back 700 years or so.

[4:36:47] Voice 35: And just events.

[4:36:50] Voice 4: Technical issues with my screen sharing for the public and for trustees.

[4:36:55] Voice 4: fees. Screen sharing to the live stream, it's just not possible at this time. I can't get

[4:37:02] Voice 4: a good connection. The document is shared with us and will be available for review by

[4:37:08] Voice 4: the public if needed as a document received at the meeting.

[4:37:13] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, we'll do the best we can. And apologies to the viewing public.

[4:37:20] Voice 35: But continue, please.

[4:37:21] Voice 35: What you're seeing here today is the original DP with variance site plan showing the septic field

[4:37:28] Voice 35: and showing that septic field located within the 30 meter setback to waterways and within

[4:37:36] Voice 35: the archaeological area, that lower section. And please advance, we've kind of talked about this

[4:37:42] Voice 35: a little bit. I think you might recall when we did that DP that we had all options of where we

[4:37:50] Voice 35: could locate the septic field we were we were looking for i think a signal from the island's

[4:37:56] Voice 35: trust of support preliminary support for the project to really allow us to continue to to do

[4:38:01] Voice 35: the work and we were obviously that dp was was approved um unfortunately it it ran out of time

[4:38:09] Voice 35: and you know we you know we've we've since kind of i think having that archaeological impact

[4:38:16] Voice 35: impact assessment has really removed one of the most consequential risks of expanding

[4:38:23] Voice 35: a septic field to be advanced to the second, the third, the next slide please.

[4:38:29] Voice 35: And so now I think we achieved two outcomes that are a net benefit to the project.

[4:38:34] Voice 35: The septic fields are located outside the setback to water bodies and also they're actually

[4:38:41] Voice 35: outside of this DERU 18.

[4:38:44] Voice 35: so they're located within areas that we've done test fits and we've determined that there's no

[4:38:49] Voice 35: archaeological materials in those areas not to say

[4:38:52] Voice 35: that they would at the depth that they're

[4:38:54] Voice 35: typically located that they would be impacted nonetheless but this is uh this is obviously

[4:38:59] Voice 35: um quite an improvement to the project from from you know both perspectives archaeological and

[4:39:06] Voice 35: and environmental.

[4:39:09] Voice 35: Next slide.

[4:39:13] Voice 35: So I just reiterate,

[4:39:16] Voice 35: you know, we've had this First Nations conversation

[4:39:20] Voice 35: going on for some time.

[4:39:22] Voice 35: It's ranged through two different administrations

[4:39:25] Voice 35: with SAO.

[4:39:27] Voice 35: In total honesty, we've reached out to Cowichan

[4:39:30] Voice 35: as a number of times we've not had any response

[4:39:33] Voice 35: from Cowichan or any interest to have a further conversation.

[4:39:37] Voice 35: We've completed the archaeological impact assessment, that material will be made available in due course, but should you want to see it, we have it.

[4:39:46] Voice 35: And obviously we've changed the location of the septic system.

[4:39:52] Voice 20: Next slide, please.

[4:39:55] Voice 35: So I think when I started this project and the wild ride that I put myself and Chris on,

[4:40:03] Voice 35: I'm sorry, honey, we, we were, you know,

[4:40:07] Voice 35: we were looking at Salt Spring and Fulford Harbor from a certain point of

[4:40:12] Voice 35: view, which is this deteriorating situation related to the loss of what we

[4:40:17] Voice 35: felt was a, was a place of connection.

[4:40:20] Voice 35: And in the period of time that I've been involved in this property,

[4:40:24] Voice 35: the, the impacts to the environment have just been constant.

[4:40:28] Voice 35: And so it's not just the murder of an individual that is homeless on the site that has remained unsolved, but it's arson that burned down the old farmhouse on the site.

[4:40:45] Voice 35: It's two pickup trucks full of garbage that will be removed from the site.

[4:40:50] Voice 35: Most recently, it's the tree cutting that goes on on site, the ongoing issues with squatters.

[4:40:56] Voice 35: And now what we have are cars that are parking along Fulford Ganges Road on the property that are for sale or the barge that is run up on.

[4:41:08] Voice 35: And so there's really no oversight.

[4:41:10] Voice 35: site. I mean, when people talk about stewardship, it is really a mammoth undertaking to consider

[4:41:16] Voice 35: that you're the steward of a site that is really being imposed upon by human beings in the most

[4:41:25] Voice 35: degrading way and not really having any mechanism to address it other than showing up and telling

[4:41:32] Voice 35: people to, you know, get off the site. When we bought the property, the upland site where that

[4:41:39] Voice 35: That bridge was installed over Fulford Creek two years ago or so.

[4:41:44] Voice 35: That property owner clear-cut the hillside.

[4:41:47] Voice 35: That was a DP zone, a slide zone.

[4:41:50] Voice 35: We contacted the CRD.

[4:41:53] Voice 35: We contacted Iowans Trust.

[4:41:54] Voice 35: And we reported that event.

[4:41:58] Voice 35: Somebody called him.

[4:41:59] Voice 35: Somebody told him to stop.

[4:42:01] Voice 35: And then a couple months later, he clear-cut it again.

[4:42:03] Voice 35: Iowans Trust showed up on site.

[4:42:05] Voice 35: we provided them the google doc showing the before and after to and and um there was there

[4:42:12] Voice 35: was no response and and i think that's that's the that's the situation while i while i appreciate

[4:42:19] Voice 35: so much of what um many of my local islanders believe this is a unsustainable environmental

[4:42:27] Voice 35: issue i i believe in my heart that the environmental impacts are happening daily

[4:42:31] Voice 35: and they're happening casually, and there's no way for us to actually monitor.

[4:42:38] Voice 35: So when I embarked on this site, I really thought about it in terms of triple bottom line value analysis,

[4:42:45] Voice 35: which is that there's a social capital, there's an environmental capital, and there's an economic capital.

[4:42:50] Voice 35: Next slide.

[4:42:52] Voice 35: This is a pretty rudimentary concept,

[4:43:00] Voice 35: but it's not we don't live in a world where it's yes or no it's the balance of values that we create

[4:43:07] Voice 35: where we achieve outcomes that have positives across the board and you know while I appreciate

[4:43:15] Voice 35: the idea that it would be wonderful to restore the estuary there's two creeks that run through

[4:43:22] Voice 35: this property but there's also a road and while we while the road has no statutory right-of-way

[4:43:29] Voice 35: to cross the property and there's no there it is there it's an existing thing but that road is not

[4:43:38] Voice 35: going away that bridge is not going away and nothing is going to deter that that that estuary

[4:43:46] Voice 35: from evolving without some consideration of the road and I look at the road less as a negative

[4:43:53] Voice 35: and more as a positive i look at what we face regarding climate change and the decisions that

[4:44:00] Voice 35: we make with regard to where we are going to uh direct our energy toward mitigating climate change

[4:44:06] Voice 35: and where we are where we are going to retire and proceed and i look at delta in the mainland and i

[4:44:12] Voice 35: go that's a place where you're going to have some very significant impacts that no no amount of

[4:44:18] Voice 35: engineering is going to deal with. But this location, this very short span of road,

[4:44:25] Voice 35: is an area where armoring that shoreline will be a discussion in the future. Let's not forget

[4:44:33] Voice 35: the topography of the site rises up significantly from the road. We've been at this for six years.

[4:44:44] Voice 35: this is our fourth LTC meeting we've had two advisory design panel meetings both of which

[4:44:51] Voice 35: resulted in support for the project going forward I don't you know I think I would have said this

[4:44:57] Voice 35: is ridiculous this is not a way that an entitlement process should take place but in some respects I

[4:45:04] Voice 35: look at the journey that we've traveled on and I and I kind of think you know it is a unique site

[4:45:11] Voice 35: it does merit an extraordinary amount of effort and I think we've put in that effort and you can

[4:45:16] Voice 35: see it today because we've we continually make adjustments to make the project better and and

[4:45:25] Voice 35: I think we're going to continue to do that next slide please I wanted to read just a brief just

[4:45:35] Voice 35: a letter that came in today that I was just as I was looking through the file um and this letter

[4:45:40] Voice 35: came in today and i think it just kind of captured a little bit of sort of um something to think

[4:45:46] Voice 35: about it's a long letter and i'm not going to read all of it but as a parent with elementary

[4:45:51] Voice 35: aged kids that's that's who i think about with this project that's the demographic that i'm

[4:45:57] Voice 35: the future as a parent with elementary aged kids i feel an overwhelming sense of powerlessness

[4:46:03] Voice 35: when it comes to the world around us and yet we're so slammed trying to make ends meet and

[4:46:08] Voice 35: keep our heads above water, that we don't have

[4:46:10] Voice 35: the wherewithal to fight the good fight.

[4:46:13] Voice 35: Change is inevitable, as is development, and although we would selfishly love to see the

[4:46:18] Voice 35: area turned into a reserve, we're not naive enough to think that's going to happen.

[4:46:22] Voice 35: However, we're earnest in our hope that this project will fulfill its projected endorsement

[4:46:27] Voice 35: to restore the natural landscape through ecologically sensitive and responsible

[4:46:31] Voice 35: development. There's a way to do this in order to check off a box, and there is a way to do this

[4:46:36] Voice 35: with genuine intent this is an incredible opportunity to show the island's residents

[4:46:41] Voice 35: and visitors how development and environmental stewardship can coexist

[4:46:47] if

[4:46:49] Voice 35: there is a possibility to involve local indigenous tribes in order to incorporate the

[4:46:54] Voice 35: history if there is a possibility to include the history and educate visitors on the area

[4:46:59] Voice 35: it is possible to work with local environmental groups i know this sounds like a headache waiting

[4:47:04] Voice 35: to happen but making proactive progressions instead of perpetually destructive cycles

[4:47:10] Voice 35: is a way to put salt spring at the forefront necessary change and i think that's what i i

[4:47:17] Voice 35: believe this project represents it represents a way to build on this island to retain its sensitive

[4:47:24] Voice 35: areas and to make active decisions about what we are going to preserve and protect and and what we

[4:47:32] Voice 35: are going to advance for the future thank you thank you so much thank you okay

[4:47:43] Voice 14: um jason do

[4:47:45] Voice 14: you have more to say or are we at this table i

[4:47:49] Voice 3: may have more to say as the discussion evolves

[4:47:53] Voice 14: over

[4:47:53] Voice 3: on your side if you've got any questions and if you do get into um consideration of permit

[4:48:00] Voice 3: make issuance, then then I may have quite a bit to say. Okay,

[4:48:04] Voice 3: some of the technical mechanics of that.

[4:48:07] Voice 15: Questions or want the trustees to go first? And if you don't

[4:48:10] Voice 15: ask the question?

[4:48:16] Voice 17: Questions or comments?

[4:48:19] Voice 17: Well, I

[4:48:20] Voice 17: think first, I think this is not a reason. Very

[4:48:26] Voice 17: clear. This is not a rezoning property has been zoned. I

[4:48:31] Voice 17: HAB-Masyn Moyer- didn't look up the history, I don't know how long it's been so our last OCP amendment review the whole process happened in 2008.

[4:48:39] Voice 17: HAB-Masyn Moyer- There was no change to the zoning name as a result of that process zoning exists and that we are now considering development permit.

[4:48:49] Voice 17: and development permits are such that the conditions of the development permit

[4:48:56] Voice 17: will not prevent a property from being used as the local zoning bylaw allows the boxes that we're in

[4:49:04] Voice 17: i know there's a great deal of desire to say well let's erase all this and go back to some other

[4:49:10] Voice 17: time i think we have integrity that we have to start with you know the rules that we have which

[4:49:17] Voice 17: is the zoning that's in place. I have gone and re-read, as Jason knows, this past week as I went

[4:49:32] Voice 17: and re-read it, the redevelopment permit area requirement, our development area, the development

[4:49:41] Voice 17: information bylaws everything trying to understand and um be able to be on you know

[4:49:51] Voice 17: like completely understand and i really tried to understand and dive into

[4:49:58] Voice 17: this recommendation regarding the hydrology

[4:50:06] Voice 17: and the requirements that that comes out of, which is sort of DP2, that's like the shoreline

[4:50:17] Voice 17: and the lakes and streams development permit area no longer apply to changes, so it's development

[4:50:25] Voice 17: permit area 2, and it's the D212 section that talks about guidelines regarding stormwater

[4:50:32] Voice 17: drainage and water pollution um and i looked more at um and i can i also sat down and went through

[4:50:42] Voice 17: with jason every discharge point that you have and so my understanding is the parking lot

[4:50:50] Voice 17: the drainage that comes off the parking lot is all being directed toward um uh the

[4:50:58] Voice 17: wetland treatment systems is that that's correct that's so that's that's what i found

[4:51:04] Voice 17: And technically,

[4:51:08] Voice 35: they go through bioswales, and the bioswales create another layer of that.

[4:51:15] Voice 35: It's

[4:51:15] Voice 17: like a man-made wetland treatment, which is the high standard for treatment.

[4:51:24] Voice 17: So we're also looking at a modern parking lot serving a facility, which is, what did we hear, how many electric cars are on this island?

[4:51:32] Voice 17: 300?

[4:51:33] Voice 17: 400.

[4:51:34] Voice 18: Plus,

[4:51:34] Voice 17: when you take in the visitor parking lot, parking lots are evolving from being oily cesspools to, you know, and that's not what we'd expect.

[4:51:48] Voice 17: So the pollution level coming off the parking lot, going through the bioswales, isn't sending alarm bells off in my mind is what I'm trying to say.

[4:51:56] Voice 17: it

[4:51:57] Voice 21: the

[4:51:58] Voice 17: other area is the so all the roof water does go into a vault first like a and then down

[4:52:10] Voice 17: off to a discharge point something like that there

[4:52:16] Voice 35: there's no water catchment for the roof

[4:52:18] Voice 35: if but they the roof uh the roof drainage system goes into the stormwater management

[4:52:26] Voice 35: management system same system and goes through the same kind of ditching and and swaling of

[4:52:33] Voice 35: throughout the project so

[4:52:34] Voice 17: it's run through swaling before it goes Jason so

[4:52:38] Voice 3: the the engineering plan

[4:52:40] Voice 3: here shows that the water that comes off of the restaurant roof and the units that are closest to

[4:52:49] Voice 3: the bridge the how many units are in the buildings the eight units that are in those two buildings

[4:52:53] Voice 3: closest to the bridge um first flows into a storm water infiltrator attenuation system

[4:53:00] Voice 3: size to be reviewed during the design

[4:53:02] Voice 35: phase that is a catcher

[4:53:03] Voice 3: and then uh yeah it's it's

[4:53:05] Voice 3: not a it doesn't it appears to be like a an engineered catchment as opposed to a

[4:53:08] Voice 3: it

[4:53:09] Voice 17: doesn't just run out

[4:53:10] Voice 3: no no it obviously gets slowed down and then yeah and then into the outlet

[4:53:14] Voice 3: by the bridge for airflow so

[4:53:18] Voice 17: again i'm not getting a pollution um necessarily so it's really that

[4:53:24] Voice 17: back to the septic effluent system is really the only potential source if we were to argue

[4:53:32] Voice 17: argue pollution

[4:53:33] Voice 21: person from that from that angle i'm to

[4:53:40] Voice 17: me it's i mean the questions are

[4:53:42] Voice 17: that are being raised by staff are basically the operation of the of the effluent system

[4:53:51] Voice 17: is there a way of combining um we had originally when we were when we had considered the variance

[4:54:00] Voice 17: we'd added a performance sampling program

[4:54:13] Voice 17: to accommodate that.

[4:54:16] Voice 17: And I'm wondering if we could add basic knowledge

[4:54:22] Voice 17: that goes into the design and then operation of it

[4:54:26] Voice 17: and then its ongoing operation is really the concern

[4:54:31] Voice 17: that I'm hearing.

[4:54:32] Voice 17: And could that not be taken care of by just adding a monitoring, you know, that you have

[4:54:40] Voice 17: a monitoring program, which I assume you're generally

[4:54:43] Voice 1: going to be doing anyway, is monitoring

[4:54:45] Voice 17: the system for its performance.

[4:54:51] Voice 17: And I know I'm a believer that monitoring programs aren't static.

[4:54:56] Voice 17: learn from them and you modify the programs as you know carry on because you start getting

[4:55:03] Voice 17: confidence in the system and you get data and you can make you know good suggestions

[4:55:10] Voice 17: I'm wondering if you'd be interested it could be you know would a monitor setting a program

[4:55:17] Voice 17: of performance for the septic system would that replace the need to do a hydrology study

[4:55:28] Voice 17: is there is the benefit the perform the long-term performance of the system i'm asking i'm afraid i

[4:55:41] Voice 3: don't have the expertise to answer that question from a from a technical standpoint i'd refer to

[4:55:45] Voice 3: our um senior freshwater specialist who was supposed to attend today but was unable to make

[4:55:50] Voice 3: it um i think staff's recommendation remains as it appears on on the first page of the staff report

[4:55:59] Voice 3: But it's monitoring a pretty thing to do, absolutely.

[4:56:04] Voice 35: A couple of comments on the hydrology report.

[4:56:07] Voice 35: One is we asked if we could speak to the senior freshwater advisor for the Islands Trust within our technical group to review.

[4:56:19] Voice 35: It's a fairly small field, so there's some fairly well-known people that are in it.

[4:56:23] Voice 35: one of those people is uh is is assigned to tracks development who've developed this sort of

[4:56:28] Voice 35: performance-based uh sanitary sewage management plan and so you know the intent was let's have

[4:56:34] Voice 35: a conversation about what specifically uh beyond the general it requires a hydrology report what's

[4:56:40] Voice 35: the specific concern around that um that that was denied which you know which i understand is

[4:56:47] Voice 35: sometimes it's not possible. The issues around, I mean, our view of the

[4:56:54] Voice 35: hydrology report is that it's a red herring. It's not a real thing. We know

[4:56:59] Voice 35: from what's going on with Weston Lake and the water catchment analysis

[4:57:04] Voice 35: that's going on now with Weston Lake that the data sampling to create an

[4:57:11] Voice 35: appropriate hydrological report is substantial. So it doesn't include the

[4:57:16] Voice 35: harbor it includes all you know fern creek uh soul creek all all those all those water bases

[4:57:24] Voice 35: around bullford harbor lead into that so you're talking about a really significant scientific

[4:57:30] Voice 35: undertaking that would take because of the data sets that are required would take an extensive

[4:57:36] Voice 35: amount of time far beyond what any development permit would ever typically require um and i

[4:57:44] Voice 35: don't believe that the outcome of that result based on discussions with our technical staff

[4:57:49] Voice 35: is is going to provide any any insight into your decision it's not going to provide you

[4:57:54] Voice 35: the information that's going to allow you to make a decision today and further the septic system you

[4:58:00] Voice 35: know it's a thread that can be pulled on people have a way of responding to they don't

[4:58:08] Voice 35: they don't want to be around it once it's out of their body and you know that that just has a

[4:58:13] Voice 35: a natural way of you know repulsing people and we all live on an island where the systems the

[4:58:22] Voice 35: sanitary sewer systems that we use are septic systems and by and large

[4:58:26] Voice 35: 80 to 85 percent of

[4:58:27] Voice 35: those systems are outdated not monitored and haven't been recently inspected those that live

[4:58:37] Voice 35: along you know fullford um creek they all use septic systems and those along soul creek they

[4:58:44] Voice 35: all use septic systems and you know those those impacts on those creeks is you know is unknown but

[4:58:52] Voice 35: i would i would assume that you know this is a performance-based septic system it is the state

[4:59:00] Voice 35: of the art it's designed to create an outcome it's not designed to meet the specifications

[4:59:05] Voice 35: specifications from the Ministry of Health. It's designed to create an effluent that is cleaned

[4:59:14] Voice 35: and ready to go back into the receiving environment. And that's the other thing,

[4:59:19] Voice 35: is this concept of sewage returning to the receiving environment. People seem to glom

[4:59:25] Voice 35: onto that as, well, that's always what happens with water. Water always goes back into the water

[4:59:32] Voice 35: system that's the only place it ever goes um so it goes without saying so yes uh the system is

[4:59:39] Voice 35: designed that it can create data it could even be expanded through an educational program around the

[4:59:47] Voice 35: creek and around the estuary around soul creek to begin to articulate what the water system is

[4:59:53] Voice 35: actually doing there because we're collecting data and that data can be collected over years

[4:59:58] Voice 35: and I'll

[5:00:00] Voice 35: could be the base of a way to create real stewardship for Fulford and Harper, which

[5:00:05] Voice 35: I think is clearly what we hope that this project will achieve.

[5:00:11] Voice 17: Thank you.

[5:00:12] Voice 17: And I guess that's my question then is, if the system is already designed for that, then

[5:00:22] Voice 17: it's basically just a permit condition of getting the reporting from that system

[5:00:27] Voice 21: provided

[5:00:29] Voice 21: to us.

[5:00:30] Voice 21: Any thoughts here?

[5:00:46] Voice 20: um

[5:00:47] Trustee Luckham: so there's a lot to consider here um i would say that i support the concept of doing something

[5:00:59] Trustee Luckham: on that site and i appreciate quite a lot the presentation you've just done in

[5:01:07] Trustee Luckham: characterizing it in a meaningful way for me to understand uh the significance of it

[5:01:16] Trustee Luckham: and have sort of, I'm less concerned about the overall fairly large impact, like we're talking

[5:01:25] Trustee Luckham: about fairly substantial development that is going to be placed on that. I've become less

[5:01:31] Trustee Luckham: concerned with that.

[5:01:32] Voice 21: So that's good. But also, it's critically

[5:01:41] Trustee Luckham: important for me that we do the

[5:01:43] Trustee Luckham: right thing. And if we need more information, we should just get the more information to be

[5:01:49] Trustee Luckham: a hundred percent certain that we're we really are doing the right thing and um i've heard

[5:01:56] Trustee Luckham: there's so many concerns about it i'm sure it's all through different kinds of lenses

[5:02:01] Trustee Luckham: some are yeah um so i have just a few questions that staff may or may not be able to answer

[5:02:09] Trustee Luckham: yourself might be able to answer just because these are things that are being said and sure

[5:02:15] Trustee Luckham: Sure. I've been doing this long enough to know that there are questions that come up that are distractions from the main purpose and aren't necessarily relevant.

[5:02:25] Trustee Luckham: But nonetheless, the questions that are out there that I think need to be answered so that we can move on from whatever that question is and that uncertainty exists.

[5:02:34] Trustee Luckham: So one of the things that came up was that there's a density boost associated with that property because of the road or the lack of the road right away.

[5:02:43] Trustee Luckham: and that's an interesting problem in itself that obviously somewhere along the way needs to be

[5:02:49] Trustee Luckham: resolved but is the density that's permitted on that property inclusive of the land area that's

[5:02:54] Trustee Luckham: associated with the roadway yes yes okay so that's fine i don't necessarily have a problem

[5:02:59] Trustee Luckham: that's just good to know that um and obviously what happens with that road is a whole nother

[5:03:06] Trustee Luckham: thing um there's also been noted that there are some middens that are on the riverbanks upstream

[5:03:13] Trustee Luckham: upstream and just wondering whether or not those areas were sampled in the archaeological

[5:03:19] Trustee Luckham: information because of course i haven't seen the report so is there an answer to that i don't know

[5:03:28] Voice 35: what specific middens you're referring to but there are middens uh the upstream property not

[5:03:33] Voice 35: the problem the subject property where the clear cut occurred that i referred to is all midden

[5:03:40] Voice 35: property is all middens okay and they i think they currently have like motorhomes parked there

[5:03:44] Voice 35: today. Right, so that comes down on the Fulford Creek side. Yes, but as far as other cultural

[5:03:52] Voice 35: sites or other cultural areas or middens, there's none that are within the testing area of the two

[5:03:59] Voice 35: properties. It's complete. The AIA is a comprehensive final and that heritage permit

[5:04:10] Voice 35: permit was started in 2018 so that initial work happened in 2018 and then was subsequently and

[5:04:19] Voice 35: I think our intent was actually that was going to be sufficient for the purposes of the development

[5:04:24] Voice 35: permit and then once

[5:04:25] Voice 35: we got to building permit stage that Heritage permit would actually be

[5:04:30] Voice 35: closed out and you know by doing the additional excavation pits but that work has now been

[5:04:36] Voice 35: completed right

[5:04:37] Trustee Luckham: okay and i am familiar with those that whole method of protecting

[5:04:42] Voice 35: but maybe one more

[5:04:44] Voice 35: this might respond to your specific question the issue with archaeological areas is not necessarily

[5:04:51] Voice 35: that they're present it's the degree to which they're going to be interfered with

[5:04:55] Voice 35: so anything that is sort of on the creek or within the riparian area would not really be considered

[5:05:02] Voice 35: because it wouldn't be affected as a result of development.

[5:05:08] Voice 35: Yeah,

[5:05:09] Voice 20: there

[5:05:09] Trustee Luckham: are maybe unanticipated impacts that might occur

[5:05:16] Trustee Luckham: just because something happens that maybe should or shouldn't happen.

[5:05:20] Trustee Luckham: But I totally get that, and I understand the concept of the methodology

[5:05:25] Trustee Luckham: that the ARC branch uses to protect the sites and further impacts.

[5:05:32] Trustee Luckham: what's interesting in that and this is a kind of a candid question really is that and again i

[5:05:39] Trustee Luckham: haven't seen the report and actually the leading question is is the test holes that are drilled

[5:05:44] Trustee Luckham: to excavate material how deep are they on

[5:05:47] Voice 35: general the um each one of the excavation pits identifies

[5:05:52] Voice 35: the depth but if you were to look at the excavation yourself it would be about uh

[5:05:57] Voice 35: two meters deep oh wow okay and and then i think um test pits have found uh cultural deposits

[5:06:05] Voice 35: you know uh ranging from sort of 75 to 150 centimeters okay

[5:06:12] Trustee Luckham: that's good then because the

[5:06:14] Trustee Luckham: one thing that's interesting and i'm just trying to understand all this to be able to get to that

[5:06:19] Trustee Luckham: place to make the right decision um that you you indicated that there were all negative tests so

[5:06:25] Trustee Luckham: So is there something surprising from the archaeologist's perspective?

[5:06:28] Trustee Luckham: And I know you can't speak for the archaeologists.

[5:06:30] Trustee Luckham: Is that a surprise?

[5:06:32] Trustee Luckham: Because being a significant village site in the past,

[5:06:36] Trustee Luckham: do you think that there should be?

[5:06:37] Voice 35: I don't think it's clear that it was a village site.

[5:06:39] Voice 35: So I think that's one misnomer.

[5:06:41] Voice 35: I don't think it's actual.

[5:06:43] Voice 35: The Seyaut believed that it was a hunting ground.

[5:06:45] Voice 35: That's where they would hunt ducks.

[5:06:47] Voice 35: And

[5:06:47] Voice 20: so that's how

[5:06:48] Voice 35: they viewed their use of it.

[5:06:49] Voice 35: say it's um say it's uh reserve territories is there reserve lands at menahenik um there's

[5:06:59] Voice 35: clearly a line as well the road there's quite a bit of archaeological information but that was

[5:07:05] Voice 35: the primary um settlement site for for salt spring island that settlement was in place until

[5:07:12] Voice 35: the 1920s. Pre-1858, which is sort of the date when these archaeological areas are identified,

[5:07:20] Voice 35: if it's pre-1857, that's the Douglas Treaty date, that's significant. But what's interesting about

[5:07:29] Voice 35: settlements throughout the Gulf Islands is that when contact occurred and there were subsequent

[5:07:34] Voice 35: waves of contact, there was a kind of musket war where

[5:07:38] Voice 21: a trip to in some way, I don't know why that

[5:09:20] Voice 21: that is but that's not in this conversation you

[5:09:22] Trustee Luckham: know i can't help but

[5:09:23] Trustee Luckham: be struck and that's sort

[5:09:25] Trustee Luckham: of where i end up thinking about this is that some of the visionary elements that have been

[5:09:29] Trustee Luckham: expressed by the community and also i recognize the visionary elements that you've expressed

[5:09:34] Trustee Luckham: um certainly that road and a bridge and you know what is the potential for actually restoring that

[5:09:43] Trustee Luckham: estuary because the road it could be changed it just costs a lot of money and partnering with

[5:09:49] Trustee Luckham: others to facilitate that and maybe that's where that whole road access gets resolved and whatever

[5:09:55] Trustee Luckham: but there is i wouldn't discount that i'm just sort of saying

[5:09:59] Voice 35: well i don't discount um i only

[5:10:01] Voice 35: discount what what is real uh

[5:10:04] Trustee Luckham: what is what

[5:10:04] Voice 35: is unreal and and if um you know it it's it's pretty

[5:10:10] Voice 35: easy to cast dispersions on a proposal oh and but let's be clear it's the only proposal that's ever

[5:10:18] Voice 35: existed for this site there's nobody has ever stepped forward with any other proposal yeah i

[5:10:24] Voice 35: totally agree and during the time that has taken place um you know we've had just ongoing uh

[5:10:33] Voice 35: vandalism and blight on the site and it's you know it's impactful to the entire south island

[5:10:40] Voice 35: and community. And so while there might be a great idea out there, it's all the same considerations

[5:10:48] Voice 35: that go into this proposal are going to be considered in a subsequent proposal. If anybody

[5:10:56] Voice 35: comes up with any kind of strategy on this site, they're going to have to meet very stringent

[5:11:01] Voice 35: requirements regarding septic around water around storm storm uh management

[5:11:08] Voice 35: archaeological first nations you know the work that we've done six years of work is you know

[5:11:17] Voice 35: to get to a point where 97 98 percent of the work has been completed and to sort of look at that

[5:11:25] Voice 35: and compare it to a concept that is in the infant stages of consideration without financial

[5:11:35] Voice 35: wherewithal or even an effort to contact the property owner and say, you know, I've reached

[5:11:43] Voice 35: out to the salmon enhancement group. My phone number is readily available and nobody's called

[5:11:51] Voice 35: me and said we want to talk about estuary restoration but

[5:11:55] Voice 12: if you're going to talk about

[5:11:56] Voice 35: estuary restoration there's one player in that party and that's the province yeah that's it

[5:12:03] Voice 35: yeah

[5:12:04] Voice 12: and so i'm not judging you or criticizing

[5:12:08] Trustee Luckham: you for that because you're absolutely right about

[5:12:10] Trustee Luckham: that it's

[5:12:10] Voice 35: just a vision it's the value of that vision it's it's like you've got your meal in

[5:12:15] Voice 35: front of you and somebody's told you they've got a mars borrowed by the woodshed um you know what

[5:12:21] Voice 35: you going to do yeah

[5:12:22] Trustee Luckham: because i would also say that doing nothing on that site isn't going to

[5:12:27] Trustee Luckham: fix the estuary and and we've seen what was necessary i don't even know what the cost was

[5:12:32] Trustee Luckham: but we have seen what was necessary in squamish i mean

[5:12:36] Voice 35: i i would look at pulper harbour i live

[5:12:37] Voice 35: on the harbour so i'm not i'm i'm aware of what goes on in the harbour and i i live at uh fern

[5:12:43] Voice 35: creek um so fern creek is two clicks up up isabella point road yeah fern creek is sloughing

[5:12:48] Voice 35: sloughing the whole hillside is sloughing soil sediment or deposited into Fern Creek

[5:12:54] Voice 35: and they are being pushed out onto Isabella Point Road and then some a local fellow is coming along

[5:13:01] Voice 35: he's taking all that sediment pulling it out of the ditch pulling it off the road and he's building

[5:13:06] Voice 35: a ramp so the cars can drive on is on what's commonly called Hamilton Beach if you go there

[5:13:13] Voice 35: there today um it is a vastly different than it was at any time there's now probably 10 7 to 10

[5:13:20] Voice 35: cars parked there every day typically they are pulling cars onto the beach driving their cars

[5:13:26] Voice 35: and dropping and i've tried to address this through crd through ministry of fisheries and

[5:13:33] Voice 35: through some other and each one of those phone calls is that's not our problem that's not our

[5:13:39] Voice 35: problem so i think it's i mean i i don't just i don't uh dismiss what what people's concerns are

[5:13:48] Voice 35: i share i share we all can we all share these concerns this woman who wrote this letter this

[5:13:53] Voice 35: morning shares these concerns right but it's what you can do what you can accomplish yourself and i

[5:14:00] Voice 35: would i would gratefully jump on board any organization that was going to take on cleaning

[5:14:06] Voice 35: up Fulford Harbour, cleaning up the crap boats that could park there, and that drift onto the

[5:14:13] Voice 35: styrofoam. There's so much, but this project, it's not a profit-making rich developer from Vancouver,

[5:14:21] Voice 35: it's a local guy who sees the problem and has come up with a solution. It may not be the best

[5:14:26] Voice 35: solution, but it is the only solution that is a viable solution.

[5:14:31] Trustee Luckham: Okay, thank you for all that.

[5:14:33] Trustee Luckham: My final question then, you talked about the hydrology being a red herring and it's going to take an awful long time.

[5:14:40] Trustee Luckham: What are we talking about for time? How long would it take to do that hydrology work?

[5:14:44] Voice 35: The comment that I took is a minimum of three years for an appropriate data set, but the longer the period, the better the data.

[5:14:52] Voice 35: So now I have that context in touch. Okay.

[5:14:55] Trustee Luckham: I don't have any more questions.

[5:15:01] Trustee Grove (probable): Sorry, I have one now as a consequence of your last comment.

[5:15:05] Trustee Grove (probable): So there's recommendation A, a groundwater hydrology detailed site investigation that's going to take three years?

[5:15:11] Trustee Grove (probable): Yes.

[5:15:13] Voice 35: And many, many tens of thousands of dollars.

[5:15:20] Trustee Grove (probable): But I must say something that, and for staff, Jason, I mean, what is the solution here?

[5:15:27] Trustee Grove (probable): Are we going to have to wait three years for this development permit because we're having to wait for a study?

[5:15:36] Trustee Grove (probable): if you were

[5:15:37] Voice 3: to request the study you would have to wait until it was complete sorry i'm just in

[5:15:40] Voice 3: and that's that's a three-year exercise and that is a three-year exercise i'm in correspondence

[5:15:45] Voice 3: with uh our senior freshwater specialist just asking if those timelines sound realistic

[5:15:52] Voice 20: so

[5:15:52] Voice 3: they do something no i'm asking william right now if that sounds like a realistic estimate

[5:15:58] Trustee Luckham: oh i see so you don't have the answer for that well i'm prepared to accept it at face value

[5:16:03] Trustee Luckham: and the applicant doesn't have any reason to distort the truth

[5:16:07] Trustee Grove (probable): so so when you say face that's

[5:16:09] Trustee Grove (probable): significant um when you say face value um peter you mean what we're being so

[5:16:17] Trustee Grove (probable): second when you say a face value

[5:16:20] Trustee Luckham: who's face value oh i've just been told by the applicant

[5:16:22] Trustee Luckham: that it's a three-year process in order to effectively do that hydrological assessment

[5:16:27] Trustee Luckham: and I can see that because you'd have to have multiple seasonal sets

[5:16:32] Voice 35: of data so yeah groundwater

[5:16:35] Voice 35: like if you've done I don't know if you're familiar with with with contaminated sites

[5:16:41] Voice 35: but when you're doing contaminated sites test wells you're going through multiple dry seasons

[5:16:47] Voice 35: wet seasons to pull the data and the longer effectively the longer you have that information

[5:16:52] Voice 35: the information, the better for information.

[5:16:54] Voice 35: Okay.

[5:16:55] Trustee Grove (probable): But my fellow trustee knows about contaminated sites.

[5:16:58] Voice 17: No, I'm still, like I said,

[5:17:00] Voice 17: I'm trying to understand the reasons for this,

[5:17:07] Voice 17: and I'm still trying to pull myself around that.

[5:17:10] Voice 17: In the development, I know this application was started

[5:17:15] Voice 17: before the Development Approval Information By-law

[5:17:18] Voice 17: was created, but I still think it's a relevant document.

[5:17:22] Voice 17: document and for development permit area two it does recognize it does identify that you may need

[5:17:29] to be a um a water course assessment and a water course assessment

[5:17:38] Voice 17: is defined in this development

[5:17:41] Voice 17: area bylaw means an identification and assessment of any proposed changes to the existing natural

[5:17:47] Voice 17: and human-made water forces, as well as potential drainage hazards to the surface and groundwater

[5:17:53] Voice 17: that may affect the subject site and neighboring properties, and includes a summary of the

[5:17:59] Voice 17: methodology and level of field work, statements demonstrating that pre- and post-development

[5:18:04] Voice 17: flows remain constant. Inclusion of any off-site drainage hazards, mitigation, and identification

[5:18:11] Voice 17: of maintenance requirements.

[5:18:14] Voice 17: To me, this says something.

[5:18:16] Voice 17: And I think this is really what he's saying

[5:18:20] Voice 17: is he's saying he's concerned,

[5:18:23] Voice 17: I'm not really, he's not here,

[5:18:25] Voice 17: but he's concerned was that the effects

[5:18:28] Voice 17: of potentially operating system,

[5:18:34] Voice 17: potentially the stormwater,

[5:18:36] Voice 17: because he refers to that as changing

[5:18:39] Voice 17: or having an impact on the water course,

[5:18:41] Voice 17: because that relates back to the development permit area um so i mean that description of a

[5:18:49] Voice 17: water sort of course assessment to me that's definable because now you know you're not in

[5:18:55] Voice 17: the stream so you're not changing the streams but but

[5:18:58] Voice 35: there is there is a storm water management

[5:19:00] Voice 35: plan that's been created for the site i

[5:19:03] Voice 17: understand that so i think it's more or less just a statement

[5:19:06] Voice 17: and that's why I was wondering can't this be just sort of reverse engineered into the permit

[5:19:23] Voice 21: the I

[5:19:24] Voice 3: don't want to speak too much on William's behalf here because it is

[5:19:27] Voice 3: beyond my realm of expertise but the primary concern that William has identified

[5:19:33] Voice 3: is the potential dewatering of the aquifer which as I understand it is the pumping of groundwater

[5:19:40] Voice 3: water away from the sewage disposal site in order to ensure that the the sewage disposal site does

[5:19:48] Voice 3: not get saturated and then that pumped groundwater then winds up having to be distributed somewhere

[5:19:53] Voice 3: else and how that changes the hydrology of the places to which that groundwater is then

[5:19:58] Voice 3: redistributed i

[5:20:00] Voice 21: understand

[5:20:02] Voice 17: that in this water course assessment it makes that nice and clear

[5:20:05] Voice 17: it just says statements demonstrating that pre and post development flows remain constant

[5:20:09] Voice 17: it um i just think that's clear i think this is i mean it's

[5:20:18] Voice 35: not clear the other the other point just

[5:20:20] Voice 35: to make is that the project um complies with the green shore for development in ecologically

[5:20:26] Voice 35: sensitive areas like the standards that we're meeting are exceedingly high beyond what would

[5:20:33] Voice 35: typically be required so this stormwater management plan was developed in coordination with

[5:20:39] Voice 35: the qualified environmental professional to ensure that you know this the site is not going to be

[5:20:44] Voice 35: substantially excavated with with substantial changes to the water course it's it's really

[5:20:50] Voice 35: about managing uh managing the storm water so as to not overwhelm the system and additionally

[5:20:57] Voice 35: this the septic system it includes attenuation to hold septic um in the event of uh you know

[5:21:06] Voice 35: in the event of the site flooding it's designed so that the site could flood and and the septic

[5:21:11] Voice 35: system could continue to operate um it it's uh it's really there to provide the best possible

[5:21:19] Voice 35: performance i'm

[5:21:21] Voice 17: not what i mean i feel i've read the reports i think the elements and pieces are

[5:21:26] Voice 17: there i'm just trying to address the staff's questions that they've raised and i'm trying

[5:21:34] Voice 17: and figure out how that could potentially be done and trying to use the wording that makes

[5:21:43] Voice 17: at least more sense to me and so what what's being

[5:21:46] Voice 21: asked here um so maybe i'll ask a question that

[5:21:57] Voice 12: we may

[5:21:58] Trustee Luckham: or may not help and maybe i just totally misunderstand that's entirely possible this is

[5:22:02] Trustee Luckham: also outside of my pay grade but um it strikes me that in that option a groundwater hydrology

[5:22:10] Trustee Luckham: detailed site investigation that had that that provides information with respect to the site

[5:22:15] Trustee Luckham: conditions and proposed sewerage system plan design and including water all this kind of thing

[5:22:23] Trustee Luckham: um is there not enough information about the topology and the makeup of the sediments and

[5:22:35] Trustee Luckham: oils and all that kind of stuff that

[5:22:37] Voice 12: this

[5:22:38] Trustee Luckham: could be or is a paper exercise as opposed to a seasonal

[5:22:43] Trustee Luckham: because i can just see that you know you could get into this whole seasonal thing of doing testing

[5:22:49] Trustee Luckham: and in year two you get another heat dome where you

[5:22:52] Trustee Luckham: get some major flooding and you end up starting

[5:22:55] Trustee Luckham: again because the data gets well but is there i would have thought that this science was refined

[5:23:02] Trustee Luckham: find enough that this could be a paper exercises

[5:23:04] Trustee Luckham: to give probabilities, not necessarily definitive.

[5:23:08] Trustee Luckham: Is that true or false or anybody know that?

[5:23:12] Trustee Luckham: Well,

[5:23:12] Voice 17: this is, he's using very specific language,

[5:23:14] Voice 17: groundwater hydrology, detailed site investigation.

[5:23:18] Voice 17: It's a mouthful.

[5:23:19] Voice 17: Yeah.

[5:23:20] Voice 22: Which is

[5:23:20] Voice 17: very different from a water course assessment,

[5:23:22] Voice 17: which is described here in our, which is,

[5:23:28] Voice 17: to me is clear language.

[5:23:30] Voice 17: And this is a requirement for DP2, which is relevant to the conversation that we're having.

[5:23:37] Voice 21: And

[5:23:39] Voice 17: I think the pieces are all there.

[5:23:41] Voice 17: I think they're in the different reports, have been touched and covered.

[5:23:49] Trustee Luckham: Is that

[5:23:49] Trustee Luckham: sort of general in context?

[5:23:52] Trustee Luckham: Because, of course, if we applied it

[5:23:53] Voice 17: to the year.

[5:23:54] Trustee Luckham: It could be field work.

[5:23:54] Voice 17: There could be other things related here.

[5:23:56] Voice 17: the thing is it says a statement demonstrating that pre and post development flows remain

[5:24:01] Voice 17: constant i think that to me i read that as being that okay if water is going over to soul creek

[5:24:07] Voice 17: today that the amount of water going to salt creek today will remain that amount of water tomorrow

[5:24:15] Voice 17: because that's what i'm trying to understand

[5:24:18] Voice 17: in this request versus that we're not redistributing all the water so that what

[5:24:26] Voice 17: is going into soul creek today goes over to full free creek that that's my understanding

[5:24:33] Voice 17: of what's being asked but

[5:24:37] Trustee Luckham: they're probably natural there's natural seepage that exists

[5:24:41] Trustee Luckham: on a site like that right from get-go

[5:24:43] Voice 17: i think it's it's you never science is never going to

[5:24:46] Voice 17: be 100 perfect i think it's generally saying that you know you're not cutting off right

[5:24:50] Voice 17: you're

[5:24:51] Voice 21: going to harm

[5:24:52] Voice 17: soul creek because of this project or harm because

[5:24:55] Voice 17: you're now taking whatever

[5:24:56] Voice 17: water is going this way and you're moving it that way peter girl

[5:25:01] Trustee Grove (probable): i'm sorry this conversation is

[5:25:02] Trustee Grove (probable): actually sending me back i mean i'm not a scientist um and uh i have no knowledge about

[5:25:08] Trustee Grove (probable): this subject at all um it seems on the one hand that this is a bit extreme what's being asked for

[5:25:14] Trustee Grove (probable): and I simply do not know, and I find it impossible to think that this is a thingy or exercise.

[5:25:24] Trustee Grove (probable): If you had to fulfill this, you presumably would not put a shovel in the ground for three years,

[5:25:29] Trustee Grove (probable): is that right?

[5:25:31] Voice 35: Well, as I said before, it's a red herring. This is a system that's been

[5:25:37] Voice 35: developed by the best sanitary technician that services the Gulf Islands, including the islands.

[5:25:44] Voice 35: the septic

[5:25:45] Voice 22: system yeah it's a stage and the

[5:25:47] Voice 35: stormwater management plant from McElhaney

[5:25:49] Voice 35: engineering which is the best engineering firm in D.C. and you know I think what we face as the

[5:25:55] Voice 35: applicant is that we're continually asked to do more to do more to deal with yeah yeah and and

[5:26:01] Voice 35: the system it's a it's a performance-based design the design has got to occur so so to our I mean

[5:26:09] Voice 35: I mean, if I could continue with it,

[5:26:10] Voice 35: this is a building permit question.

[5:26:13] Voice 17: I agree, I was

[5:26:15] Voice 17: trying to say,

[5:26:15] Voice 17: can we make this essence of this be part of the permit

[5:26:19] Voice 17: so that it's something that, you know,

[5:26:21] Voice 17: basically would before the building permits issue

[5:26:26] Voice 17: that there's just proof that, you know,

[5:26:29] Voice 17: this, the essence of the water assessment,

[5:26:32] Voice 17: water course assessment is met.

[5:26:38] Trustee Luckham: You're still designing.

[5:26:39] Trustee Luckham: But I think what you're saying is it's a red herring, and whether you do it now or later, it doesn't still red herring.

[5:26:46] Voice 35: Well, it's the really difficult challenge of an entitlement process where we show up, we are told this is the issue, we go and we solve that issue, and then we come back and we're like, now we've got another issue, we go

[5:27:01] Voice 35: solve that issue.

[5:27:02] Voice 35: and you know meanwhile you know we're all getting older and you know what what continues to happen

[5:27:10] Voice 35: happens on the property um you know i i think the whole conversation with seo was about there is no

[5:27:18] Voice 35: opportunity unless we get a development permit that is why that letter is so forceful they are

[5:27:25] Voice 35: really looking for this to advance so we can move on with the work but at this present stage we have

[5:27:31] Voice 35: got conceptual design conceptual design you everybody in the room admits that they don't

[5:27:37] Voice 35: have the technical expertise to review and comment but the technical expertise is there the

[5:27:43] Voice 35: professionals are there they've provided these reports at significant cost and to sort of

[5:27:48] Voice 35: encumber the project with the requirement of doing a report which i've just described as being

[5:27:55] Voice 35: unnecessary to the process it's just onerous and it's it's uh at a certain point it you know i just

[5:28:05] Voice 35: you can't keep going to the well and asking us to chase down you know fear because that's what

[5:28:14] Voice 35: you're responding to you're responding to um concerns that are you know existential

[5:28:21] Voice 35: I don't know how many times I've heard heat dome today.

[5:28:27] Trustee Grove (probable): Excuse me.

[5:28:28] Trustee Grove (probable): Are suggestions or requirements B and C reasonable,

[5:28:34] Voice 21: do we think?

[5:28:42] Voice 21: B and

[5:28:43] Trustee Grove (probable): C, at least I can understand the language and they make sense to me.

[5:28:53] Trustee Luckham: Well, I might say, you know, we actually heard a lot earlier, Laura asked a bunch of questions about the stormwater management, if I'm not mistaken.

[5:29:00] Trustee Luckham: bacon and that seems to be I'm

[5:29:05] Voice 17: less concerned I mean I said I'm not the storm water I could

[5:29:12] Voice 17: especially from a pollution standpoint I think you have brought the high standard so I'm not

[5:29:17] Voice 17: I'm not having alarm bells going off

[5:29:21] Voice 25: on

[5:29:22] Voice 17: what my understanding of the design

[5:29:27] Voice 17: all i'm trying to say is try to solve this issue could it i'm just a question could it not be a

[5:29:33] Voice 17: condition you know it's a condition of the permit we have a lot of things in the permit that says

[5:29:37] Voice 17: before building permits um because i think i think you've got this material the answers have

[5:29:44] Voice 17: been there there are these different reports so it's it's it's more or less pulling it together

[5:29:49] Voice 17: and calling it a water assessment which is definable in our bylaws so it's it's

[5:29:54] Voice 17: The

[5:29:55] Voice 35: three technical experts, McElhaney on stormwater.

[5:30:00] Voice 35: management, tracks on sanitary and swell on the environmental area.

[5:30:08] Voice 35: Those three groups have combined into a single, and I think the last meeting we had multiple

[5:30:14] Voice 35: documents that were drafted by all three addressing all these areas because they would be addressed

[5:30:19] Voice 35: in a single technical response.

[5:30:23] Voice 35: But

[5:30:23] Trustee Grove (probable): should they not be adequate for our purposes?

[5:30:26] Trustee Grove (probable): They're totally adequate for your purposes.

[5:30:27] Trustee Grove (probable): I'm asking, Jason, your question.

[5:30:30] Voice 3: I think that staff's perspective on this is that because the plans remain conceptual at the moment,

[5:30:40] Voice 3: they don't have the sufficient level of detail and monitoring and understanding of the specifics of the site.

[5:30:47] Voice 3: But you do have, sorry

[5:30:49] Voice 35: Jason, I don't mean to debate in this forum,

[5:30:51] Voice 35: but they do represent the work of technical experts that say they meet the standard by which we can show that.

[5:30:58] Voice 35: that they've already vetted the response and they're they're they we can design the system

[5:31:05] Voice 35: we can provide the detailed design drawings it's just not it's not typical at a development permit

[5:31:12] Voice 35: stage that uh the applicant provide that level of detailed design like the the conceptual design

[5:31:21] Voice 35: you know even in our even the architectural drawings that you've seen they're all conceptual

[5:31:25] Voice 35: conceptual. They don't have detailed construction drawings. So at building permit, you get a

[5:31:31] Voice 35: full set of construction drawings, you get all the detailed design, and it all is vetted

[5:31:35] Voice 35: by other third parties that fill this space with bylands trust, that respond to these

[5:31:43] Voice 35: and have the technical expertise to review them and to see that they're consistent. We've

[5:31:47] Voice 35: been asked to talk to fisheries, we've talked to fisheries. I mean, everything that we've

[5:31:52] Voice 35: been asked to do we've done and every every uh every single path that we've followed we've

[5:31:59] Voice 35: resolved those those concerns and you know it like if we have another

[5:32:08] Voice 35: meeting you're going to

[5:32:09] Voice 35: have another thing for us to do jason please um

[5:32:13] Trustee Grove (probable): tell us how to resolve this because this is

[5:32:16] Trustee Grove (probable): it's um this is crazy making

[5:32:18] Voice 3: absolutely crazy i'll say this right um the site is in a development

[5:32:24] Voice 3: permit area there are guidelines with respect to that development permit area at the end of

[5:32:29] Voice 3: the day it is up to the ltc to determine whether you are satisfied that those guidelines are being

[5:32:34] Voice 3: met okay and

[5:32:36] Trustee Grove (probable): and will we know at this point do we have can we have that confidence it's

[5:32:45] Voice 17: under stormwater it's already in the permit

[5:32:51] Voice 17: confirmation from a qualified environmental professional that the operation stormwater

[5:32:55] Voice 17: infrastructure will not pollute or

[5:32:57] Voice 17: otherwise impair fish habitat values or water quality

[5:33:00] Voice 17: so that's in this there so the sewage

[5:33:05] Voice 21: one so what are

[5:33:12] Voice 17: you saying laura

[5:33:12] Trustee Luckham: c has been met

[5:33:14] Trustee Luckham: well

[5:33:14] Voice 17: i'm just saying it's it's putting it they have to do this prior it's in the permit condition

[5:33:20] Voice 17: it would be either just adding like that same statement repeating it in uh 3.9 under sewage

[5:33:28] Voice 17: disposal system

[5:33:29] Trustee Grove (probable): i'd like to say that

[5:33:30] Voice 17: well i

[5:33:33] Trustee Grove (probable): mean okay because

[5:33:34] Voice 17: that's the bottom line is

[5:33:35] Voice 17: we're wanting it we want proof that it's not polluting um we're comparing the fish habitats

[5:33:42] Voice 17: and values of those creeks or you add that you want you know you've had the water assessment

[5:33:50] Voice 17: staff prepared

[5:33:53] Voice 3: this development permit on the assumption that

[5:33:56] Voice 3: on the day it was drafted or today or someday in the future that it might get issued

[5:34:00] Voice 3: right yeah so it contains a number of clauses that we included to help ensure us and ensure

[5:34:09] Voice 3: the local community ensure the community that the i guess commitment that the applicant has made and

[5:34:15] Voice 3: the professional reports that have been provided are being met right so there is there is some

[5:34:20] Voice 3: language around ongoing monitoring and and demonstrating to us that the system performs

[5:34:26] Voice 3: as as promised and

[5:34:32] Trustee Grove (probable): that's written into the development permit draft

[5:34:34] Voice 3: it is though i think um

[5:34:38] Voice 3: some tweaking to some of that language may be necessary but

[5:34:41] Trustee Grove (probable): but well what sort of tweaking

[5:34:45] Trustee Grove (probable): and when could we have a look at what it might look like i

[5:34:53] Voice 3: believe that um trustee patrick has

[5:34:56] Voice 3: has explored this idea of monitoring and metering of things.

[5:35:01] Voice 3: I don't know.

[5:35:03] Voice 17: Yeah, I mean, if that's, I mean, I think that's,

[5:35:07] Voice 17: we've heard the system does the metering.

[5:35:09] Voice 17: We've got the requirement in there to prove performance.

[5:35:11] Voice 17: What you're missing is that they give you the report,

[5:35:18] Voice 17: if I'm reading it right, or it needs to be

[5:35:21] Voice 21: specified,

[5:35:23] Voice 21: but it

[5:35:27] Voice 17: just says that they have to operate

[5:35:33] Voice 17: operate it and they have but it doesn't have any report given

[5:35:41] Voice 21: to me I'm looking at section 39

[5:35:47] Voice 21: and so

[5:35:57] Trustee Luckham: you know if we're some let's just say that if any of these bad things happen

[5:36:02] Trustee Luckham: presumably they'll be required remediation no not because

[5:36:14] Trustee Luckham: it may not be identical yeah and it

[5:36:18] Voice 3: it the i guess without the baseline knowledge and information that the type of hydrogeological

[5:36:27] Voice 3: assessment that the freshwater specialist is advocating for then we don't know what the

[5:36:33] Voice 3: starting point is from which we measure right

[5:36:36] Trustee Luckham: any

[5:36:38] Voice 3: negative impact that may follow there from

[5:36:39] Voice 3: and

[5:36:40] Trustee Luckham: we don't know

[5:36:41] Voice 21: that only i

[5:36:52] Voice 35: just would point out that unless i'm mistaken there's no other

[5:36:57] Voice 35: other hydrological requirements that stress is issued on any other project

[5:37:01] Voice 21: from

[5:37:03] Voice 17: a drinking water

[5:37:04] Voice 17: perspective drinking water we have yes

[5:37:12] Voice 17: not um that's why I said I think the language of the

[5:37:19] Voice 17: water course assessment is appropriate is really what's being said so

[5:37:28] Voice 12: what are you what are you

[5:37:29] Voice 12: suggesting trustee patrick well

[5:37:33] Voice 21: i i think you're

[5:37:36] Voice 17: looking for i mean i'm trying to understand what's

[5:37:42] Voice 17: being asked for by the statement to me like i just talked about i think i think the water

[5:37:51] Voice 17: course assessment which is in our own development information bylaw for dp2 it just wasn't this

[5:37:57] Voice 17: wasn't used because the permit was predated this bylaw

[5:38:01] Voice 20: but

[5:38:02] Voice 17: i think this makes sense to me

[5:38:08] Voice 17: getting at what i understand most concerns are which is change of flow

[5:38:17] Voice 17: um impacting you know any change of flow that would be occurring that would could potentially

[5:38:26] Voice 17: actually be negative in their mind.

[5:38:28] Voice 17: I think it's, not to use this word, the red herring,

[5:38:34] Voice 17: any dewatering is going to be happening in the winter time

[5:38:37] Voice 17: when water is already flowing out of everyone's ears

[5:38:42] Voice 17: as opposed to the summertime.

[5:38:45] Voice 17: So it's, but at least this makes sense

[5:38:52] Voice 17: and it ends in a statement.

[5:38:53] Voice 17: And I think they can, you know,

[5:38:56] Voice 17: generally it's pulled from what they have.

[5:38:58] Voice 17: out of

[5:38:58] Trustee Grove (probable): that's in lieu of a paragraph could it

[5:39:02] Voice 17: be inserted in the permit just like we have these

[5:39:05] Voice 17: other we need confirmation of a water or we need this water course assessment done prior to you

[5:39:12] Voice 17: know it's prior to the building permit or whatever it is so that it becomes a condition of the

[5:39:17] Voice 17: permit so

[5:39:19] Voice 12: what's required for the water assessment I

[5:39:23] Voice 17: would just put the definition that we have right

[5:39:25] Voice 17: in our bylaw that's our development information bylaw and

[5:39:31] Voice 3: jason what do you say about that i'm

[5:39:33] Voice 3: just looking up that language right now it's

[5:39:37] Voice 21: right in the definitions it's

[5:39:53] Voice 21: like so it's one of the conditions of the dp2 information we

[5:40:12] Voice 17: don't play with that

[5:40:12] Voice 17: it's good

[5:40:13] Voice 17: more fun everybody's

[5:40:17] Trustee Grove (probable): got some snacks

[5:40:22] Trustee Grove (probable): so

[5:40:22] Trustee Luckham: um hold

[5:40:24] Trustee Grove (probable): on that's chasing so fast okay

[5:40:26] Trustee Luckham: go ahead so

[5:40:27] Trustee Grove (probable): i

[5:40:28] Voice 3: i hesitate to say this but i do feel

[5:40:32] Voice 3: that the the technical nature of this conversation is out of my is out of my wheelhouse and so

[5:40:39] Voice 3: So I think that work back to the LTC with more information

[5:40:45] Voice 3: if you believe such as required sort of spelling out

[5:40:50] Voice 3: this request in a little more detail

[5:40:51] Voice 3: and some of the particulars around that

[5:40:57] Voice 3: if you believe it necessary.

[5:40:59] Voice 3: Then I know nobody wants to belabor this any longer than.

[5:41:06] Voice 17: The questions would be,

[5:41:08] Voice 17: could we not turn this into permit conditions

[5:41:10] Voice 17: So it's the right timing of the development, and if that's the appropriate, and I don't want to, we're going to lose you, can we have a special meeting?

[5:41:23] Voice 3: That might be difficult to arrange in the next three weeks or so.

[5:41:29] Voice 3: but i mean again like the ltc can include i don't want to say any condition in its in a proposed

[5:41:39] Voice 3: development permit that it sees appropriate um as long as you can tie it to a guideline that's

[5:41:45] Voice 3: within that specific development permit area well

[5:41:48] Voice 17: this is one of our development information

[5:41:51] Voice 17: bylaws so

[5:41:52] Voice 17: i think we can tie it to that sure um i think it says the same thing just makes it clear

[5:41:59] Voice 17: or um

[5:42:03] Trustee Luckham: you

[5:42:09] Voice 12: know this is an important decision

[5:42:11] Trustee Luckham: like let's not underestimate that important

[5:42:13] Trustee Luckham: for you as well as it is important for us in the community um and i guess i am implying that if

[5:42:22] Trustee Luckham: there's the potential for us to get more information on more options and i'm not saying

[5:42:27] Trustee Luckham: going out and doing the hydrology thing i'm waffling on that because i get in the picture

[5:42:33] Trustee Luckham: and it sounds like the other two items here are or will be addressed in some fashion so if there's

[5:42:40] Trustee Luckham: more information we need to be because i think what jason said right at the beginning it's up

[5:42:45] Trustee Luckham: to the ltc based on the guidelines to be confident that um this is the right thing so um i think if

[5:42:54] Trustee Luckham: we can potentially get some more clarity on what the direction that laura's going versus what this

[5:43:01] Trustee Luckham: is then we'll be in a better situation and um if that's you know in three weeks or a month or

[5:43:08] Trustee Luckham: whatever you know that's not a lot of time um but um because i

[5:43:14] Trustee Luckham: don't think it's been months

[5:43:14] Voice 35: and it's

[5:43:15] Trustee Luckham: well it has

[5:43:15] Voice 35: yeah but like we have requirements related to fire yes and you

[5:43:21] Voice 35: deferred those to let us design the fire right i i you keep i don't know you say you don't have

[5:43:27] Voice 35: the technical knowledge to just defer the decision to a later to serve to defer the the

[5:43:34] Voice 35: the specific design until building permit stage allow the process

[5:43:40] Voice 35: like you're kind of

[5:43:41] Voice 35: interceding yourself in an area that you clearly don't feel comfortable making a decision but

[5:43:47] Voice 35: that that that design has got to be completed like the work is continually interrupted to

[5:43:53] Voice 35: move this forward because we we can't get past a development permit stage right and and so if

[5:43:59] Voice 35: what you're looking for is more certainty around the specifics around the design then let the

[5:44:05] Voice 35: design occur right make the design happen so you can then review it and you can specifically take

[5:44:11] Voice 35: it up with the crd you you're there to cooperate with other areas of government they're there to

[5:44:17] Voice 35: back up what you decide and you're gonna you know you're gonna say hey we want special attention to

[5:44:23] Voice 35: this this is a performance that the applicant says it's a kick-ass system we want to ensure that

[5:44:28] Voice 35: that's the case um you know we i just i just cannot continue to come back and be and be sent

[5:44:36] Voice 35: in a direction and spend another 50 grand or and time continues to go and the world changes around

[5:44:43] Voice 35: us and when i come the next time it's you know it's there's rabbits all over the property we

[5:44:47] Voice 35: need to protect them i

[5:44:50] Trustee Grove (probable): i have to say that's making sense we should be able to issue a development

[5:44:54] Trustee Grove (probable): permit which requires the protection of the water and and by whatever tools is necessary but we

[5:45:01] Trustee Grove (probable): should be able to issue that permit okay

[5:45:04] Trustee Luckham: so how can we do that well

[5:45:07] Voice 17: we aren't like i said the

[5:45:08] Voice 17: storm water is covered it's already in there 3842 confirmation from a qualified environmental

[5:45:13] Voice 17: professional the operation of the stormwater infrastructure will not pollute or otherwise

[5:45:17] Voice 17: and pair fish habitat values or water quality on the whole bird for soul creek it's faded in there

[5:45:25] Voice 17: say that under the next item is 3.9 the sewage disposal system it does require that it be

[5:45:33] Voice 17: operated within performance so it's it ties to performance it just doesn't bring the connection

[5:45:39] Voice 17: back to soul creek or pulpit so yeah so how

[5:45:44] Trustee Luckham: do we get him let him get to the design like i hear

[5:45:47] Trustee Luckham: that message really strong and clear

[5:45:48] Trustee Luckham: throughout this conversation is that if this moves we'll have

[5:45:54] Trustee Luckham: a lot more information about what we're doing so

[5:45:56] Voice 3: what has been missing to date from the technical

[5:46:00] Voice 3: expertise that the applicant has brought into this from the perspective of our senior

[5:46:05] Voice 3: freshwater specialist is a hydrogeologist right he's got civil engineer he's got a registered

[5:46:13] Voice 3: a professional biologist he's got ian ralston whose professional designation is a limited license

[5:46:20] Voice 3: yeah engineering license i believe within a specific field of practice but

[5:46:25] Voice 35: just back up

[5:46:26] Voice 35: because that's been a contention you brought it up again you brought it up at the very first

[5:46:31] Voice 35: and i think it's inappropriate that you're questioning because that was the senior

[5:46:35] Voice 35: freshwater hydrologist he actually questioned ian's professional accreditation and he's the

[5:46:42] Voice 35: premier he literally wrote the book on the system

[5:46:45] Voice 35: and and when it continually gets brought up to

[5:46:48] Voice 35: undermine the the capabilities of the technical team it's it's not fair and the the senior

[5:46:55] Voice 35: freshwater hydrologist could have got on the phone with my team and specifically discussed what he

[5:47:00] Voice 35: felt was going to be an appropriate way to resolve this and he did not show up for that forum call

[5:47:05] Voice 35: And he did not show up for this meeting. And so, you know, this is a way to, you know, bring confusion to a process that is really fairly explicit.

[5:47:19] Voice 35: that they a senior a freshwater hydrologist will be added to the team ian is already in prior uh

[5:47:27] Voice 35: testimony at he's talked about that we would we would necessarily need to bring a hydrologist in

[5:47:33] Voice 35: to do this work and we will provide that at the appropriate time but it is not a survey of

[5:47:40] Voice 35: fulford harbor it is not you know it is not us taking on a hundred and fifty thousand dollar um

[5:47:46] Voice 35: You know, the work that we've done at Weston Creek, I don't know why we're paying for that work, but we've paid for all this work on Weston to determine what the water catchment capacity is.

[5:47:56] Voice 35: And that's all

[5:47:57] Voice 35: gone back to the CRD and is effectively based on our work as CRD is now reviewing what the water capacity for the Fulford Water Service Area is.

[5:48:07] Voice 35: So we're leading in every respect in terms of the quality of this project.

[5:48:13] Voice 35: We're leading.

[5:48:13] Voice 35: And we've never shrunk or tried to mitigate the kind of quality that we're creating.

[5:48:19] Voice 35: We've moved into that space in every opportunity.

[5:48:24] Voice 35: So the buildings haven't been designed.

[5:48:27] Voice 35: The septic system hasn't been designed.

[5:48:29] Voice 35: The lighting hasn't been designed.

[5:48:31] Voice 35: The fire access hasn't been designed.

[5:48:33] Voice 35: um we need to design we need to go forward with this project or you know because somebody said

[5:48:41] Voice 35: death by a thousand cuts and they were referring to the environment but it's the same here

[5:48:44] Voice 35: like if i knew that this process um was going to be this difficult you know and damaging

[5:48:52] Voice 35: personally i would not have embarked on it it's it's been um it's been entirely thankless people

[5:48:59] Voice 35: People in the community think I'm, you know, some horrible person, and I'm not.

[5:49:05] Voice 35: This was always trying to bring something that was, you know, the Fulper didn't exist.

[5:49:11] Voice 35: It had stories to tell.

[5:49:13] Voice 35: It had a history for the South Island.

[5:49:15] Voice 35: The old-time Salt Springers knew Fulper.

[5:49:18] Voice 35: They knew what it was about, and we have lost that.

[5:49:21] Voice 35: And all I've tried to do is restore it and do it in a way that could be better than what we had before.

[5:49:28] Voice 35: So, you know, I don't want

[5:49:29] Trustee Luckham: to go down a different journey here. How do we provide some, I don't know what the right word is. You said that you're going to add a hydrologist to the team. Great. So where and when and how is that going to happen?

[5:49:46] Trustee Luckham: so

[5:49:46] Voice 3: yeah before i was interrupted there sorry sorry jason what i was going to say is that

[5:49:53] Voice 3: perhaps if if it sounds like trustee patrick is interested in including essentially what what is

[5:50:00] Voice 3: the provision of a water course assessment but basically you're looking for confirmation

[5:50:04] Voice 3: that pre and post development flows from the site are going to be as they are today right

[5:50:11] Voice 17: that's my understanding from what that means and

[5:50:15] Voice 3: and so perhaps it is a reasonable thing then

[5:50:19] Voice 3: in in looking to balance our definition of water course assessment with some of the recommendations

[5:50:24] Voice 3: from the senior freshwater specialists along the line that that confirmation come from a

[5:50:29] Voice 3: hydrogeologist like we specify who the professional is that we would want to well you can

[5:50:37] Voice 3: do you can

[5:50:38] Voice 17: do a similar clause like you have in the stormwater is this confirmation from a qualified

[5:50:43] Voice 17: environmental professional so you can have confirmation from a qualified hydrologist if

[5:50:49] Voice 17: that's the term you want to use that the operation of

[5:50:58] Voice 17: basically looking for confirmation that site conditions

[5:51:05] Voice 17: both switches including the diversion of grandma blah blah blah um do not cause an adverse risk

[5:51:15] Voice 17: to the receiving environment or something like that

[5:51:18] Voice 22: so

[5:51:19] Voice 17: it's basically turning that

[5:51:21] Voice 17: clause a into something similar to the confirmation clause that's in the stormwater

[5:51:27] Voice 17: i mean i'm just trying to put put something in a reasonable spot it

[5:51:33] Trustee Luckham: sounds like a reasonable

[5:51:35] Trustee Luckham: it does to me too and what i wonder is what's the act let's assume that that all happens and

[5:51:41] Trustee Luckham: we do this what's the next decision point for this ltc with respect to this project uh

[5:51:47] Voice 3: once the

[5:51:49] Voice 3: once the permit is in let's you're we're assuming the premise there are a number of of conditional

[5:51:56] Voice 3: checks and balances within the permit itself so i none of them result in decision points for the ltc

[5:52:05] Voice 3: but staff would be expecting the receipt of a number of documents as the development advances

[5:52:11] Voice 3: and

[5:52:12] Trustee Luckham: if there are any shortfalls there would have to be some remediation yeah

[5:52:16] Voice 3: and there's um there's

[5:52:19] Voice 3: a sort of a modest security set aside particularly for works around the streams right if it looks

[5:52:24] Voice 3: like you know sediment control and it's not being appropriately attended to there's some money set

[5:52:29] Voice 3: aside to for something to spring into action and put those hay bales there um if the ltc is intent

[5:52:36] Voice 3: on um amending the permit as as in line with sort of what's now been suggested i'd probably

[5:52:44] Voice 3: recommend a recess just to to workshop that a little bit and come back with something yeah

[5:52:50] Trustee Luckham: so are you talking 15 minutes half an hour we could say start with 15 minutes and see

[5:52:56] Voice 21: how it goes

[5:52:58] Voice 21: yeah presumably oh

[5:53:01] Trustee Grove (probable): yeah okay

[5:53:03] Trustee Grove (probable): let's get on with it this is so

[5:53:04] Trustee Luckham: trustee patrick

[5:53:06] Trustee Luckham: is this coalescing in the idea here i

[5:53:10] Voice 17: think so i think the two changes that we were related to

[5:53:13] Voice 17: were some sort of clause that captures this confirmation of that's similar to the stormwater

[5:53:19] Voice 17: okay and then do we need sort of the the monitoring and measuring just needs to have

[5:53:25] Voice 17: the barn door closed when it's required there's just no reporting feature okay

[5:53:31] Voice 12: so i'm kind of

[5:53:34] Voice 12: looking at louisa

[5:53:37] Trustee Luckham: now in terms of a process and protecting the quorum of this ltc um

[5:53:45] Trustee Luckham: can we have jason and laura have a conversation yes and peter and

[5:53:51] Trustee Luckham: i will go somewhere else and

[5:53:52] Trustee Luckham: and then we'll come back and he'll tell us what you've figured out.

[5:53:55] Voice 17: They always pick me.

[5:53:58] Trustee Luckham: You've got

[5:53:59] Trustee Grove (probable): this figured out because I've read the material.

[5:54:01] Trustee Grove (probable): But you did this work professionally, I believe.

[5:54:04] Trustee Grove (probable): Well, and

[5:54:06] Trustee Luckham: you've helped me

[5:54:06] Trustee Grove (probable): come to a better understanding of it.

[5:54:08] Trustee Luckham: And the applicant has helped me come to a better understanding of it.

[5:54:12] Trustee Luckham: And I think we just need to make some decision that we have as in Jason

[5:54:17] Trustee Luckham: words, words that we're confident that it meets the guy.

[5:54:20] Voice 35: can i interject just two two additional requests that i would just like if you're going to be

[5:54:25] Voice 35: drafting is is one um the landscaping security would be would be deferred until the building

[5:54:33] Voice 35: permit stage currently calls for landscaping security 60 days after approval of the

[5:54:38] Voice 35: development permit right that's that's a that's a substantial amount of money that's just going

[5:54:42] Voice 35: to sit there right and i think that's good so

[5:54:45] Trustee Luckham: can i just i think we've done this before can

[5:54:48] Trustee Luckham: Can the applicant not come back to us?

[5:54:49] Trustee Luckham: Let's just ask us in process, can we defer that until we clear that?

[5:54:54] Voice 3: It's a condition of the permit itself that says hand over the money within 90 days, but I'm happy to.

[5:55:00] Voice 35: And then the second thing is you can see there's a lot more work to be done.

[5:55:04] Voice 35: And I don't believe, I believe we need more time.

[5:55:08] Voice 35: The development permit is for two years.

[5:55:10] Voice 35: And I believe the LTC has discretion to amend that period.

[5:55:15] Voice 35: period and and so I I'd like more time how much more like like a year three years can we do that

[5:55:23] Voice 35: Jason can we do that um I

[5:55:27] Voice 3: was under the impression that it was that the two-year limit is a is a

[5:55:31] Voice 3: statutory requirement to the local government act but I will ask a little higher up the the

[5:55:37] Voice 3: pay scale see

[5:55:38] Trustee Luckham: if I can get some now you want half an hour

[5:55:39] Voice 3: I may need a half an hour okay

[5:55:44] Voice 12: okay let's do that are we good with this well

[5:55:55] Voice 21: okay

[5:55:56] Voice 3: i was going to ask him about the uh term limit anyways yeah

[5:56:00] Trustee Luckham: that's that question let's

[5:56:02] Trustee Luckham: recess for oh david marlin yeah i didn't

[5:56:06] Voice 13: see you there

[5:56:07] Voice 13: two years is the maximum through legislation uh but it can be renewed

[5:56:20] Voice 13: Yeah, but two years is the maximum.

[5:56:24] Voice 13: You're breaking up.

[5:56:26] Voice 17: We only got every other word there, David.

[5:56:29] Voice 13: Oh, sorry.

[5:56:30] Voice 17: I think you said it can be renewed.

[5:56:32] Voice 13: No, it is a maximum of two years.

[5:56:35] Voice 13: The legislation says that a development permit lapsed two years after data assurance.

[5:56:42] Voice 13: Did you hear that?

[5:56:43] Voice 13: Now,

[5:56:44] Voice 20: is that substantial work or any work?

[5:56:47] Voice 13: Any work.

[5:56:48] Voice 13: So to begin any kind of construction, then the permit, the clock starts ticking and the permit lapses after two years.

[5:56:59] Voice 13: So that is in the legislation.

[5:57:01] Voice 13: You cannot bury that.

[5:57:04] Voice 13: So if he starts digging or doing something,

[5:57:06] Trustee Luckham: that limitation

[5:57:08] Trustee Luckham: is no

[5:57:10] Voice 13: longer a problem?

[5:57:11] Voice 13: No, that's correct.

[5:57:13] Voice 13: Yeah, you have to start the work within two years.

[5:57:15] Voice 13: So, get a building permit, dig a foundation, and then halt the work or whatever, get supplies on site. As long as you're showing that you are advancing it, then that, yeah, you just have to start that within two years.

[5:57:34] Voice 13: you don't have to finish it you just have to start it and then you could halt it for whatever

[5:57:40] Voice 13: period of time is necessary for example you might be waiting for supplies you might be waiting for

[5:57:46] Voice 13: a permit something like that and

[5:57:49] Trustee Luckham: the clock restarts or

[5:57:50] Trustee Luckham: something no once you've started

[5:57:51] Voice 14: yeah

[5:57:52] Voice 13: once you've started construction you've met the requirement to begin

[5:57:56] Voice 19: construction within two

[5:57:58] Voice 19: yes let's

[5:58:05] Voice 12: go away and think about this

[5:58:07] Voice 21: it's

[5:58:09] Voice 35: cool i think in the

[5:58:12] Voice 35: context of reconciliation it would

[5:58:15] Voice 35: be favorable to provide us enough time to meaningfully engage with first nations and

[5:58:21] Voice 35: there's there's a lot of pieces that still remain on this

[5:58:23] Voice 35: project and it doesn't quite conform to

[5:58:26] Voice 35: the mandated uh two-year period it's a unique situation but my understanding based on consultation

[5:58:32] Voice 35: with legal counsel is that this is entirely up to you.

[5:58:36] Voice 35: You have total discretion,

[5:58:37] Voice 35: but you can pick this period of time.

[5:58:41] Voice 12: No,

[5:58:42] Trustee Luckham: David is our senior land use specialist, so.

[5:58:48] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, anyway.

[5:58:49] Trustee Luckham: We would

[5:58:50] Trustee Luckham: want to be certain,

[5:58:50] Trustee Luckham: like we wouldn't want to send you down a road.

[5:58:52] Voice 35: No, I will, you know,

[5:58:54] Voice 35: we'll deal with whatever the outcome is,

[5:58:56] Voice 35: but I'm just, you know, the reality is we still have,

[5:58:59] Voice 35: you know, responsibilities to maintain

[5:59:01] Voice 35: maintain what we've what we've agreed to do so in two years you will have substantially

[5:59:08] Trustee Luckham: completed the design yeah

[5:59:10] Voice 35: so if you think about the world the real world construction drawings

[5:59:13] Voice 35: are going to take approximately you know detailed construction drawings all that is going to take

[5:59:19] Voice 35: you know six to eight months yeah the building permit application process itself is five months

[5:59:27] Voice 35: yeah and

[5:59:28] Voice 35: so you know we will basically have about six months when we exit the room here should this

[5:59:34] Voice 35: be approved right to deal with you know some of the other kind of critical paths of the project

[5:59:40] Voice 35: for you i mean it's it's tight yeah it's tight i mean it would be nice to be able to have an

[5:59:47] Voice 35: during the

[5:59:47] Voice 35: summer but that's okay so we're going to recess half an hour all

[5:59:54] Trustee Grove (probable): right

[6:00:00] Voice 29: wondering if you still have a quorum to recover the last two items because they're really quick

[6:00:14] Voice 17: one is

[6:00:15] Trustee Luckham: coming back at a later date um do we have to do the temporary use permit today

[6:00:21] Trustee Luckham: is it yeah

[6:00:22] Voice 17: it's

[6:00:23] Trustee Luckham: going to expire

[6:00:24] Voice 17: yeah but

[6:00:25] Trustee Grove (probable): you and i could do that

[6:00:27] Trustee Grove (probable): is that point well actually he doesn't

[6:00:29] Voice 17: need me yet well

[6:00:31] Trustee Luckham: let

[6:00:32] Voice 17: him go to work

[6:00:34] Trustee Luckham: so do you have any concerns about the cup no

[6:00:37] Voice 17: but i mean

[6:00:42] Trustee Grove (probable): you're saying this jason okay

[6:00:43] Trustee Luckham: so then what we're going to do is let jason out of the room

[6:00:46] Trustee Luckham: for some time and we're going to continue we'll do this last thing and then we'll call

[6:00:52] Trustee Luckham: always. Suggestion. Otherwise,

[6:01:01] Voice 20: they'll just go home. Okay,

[6:01:03] Voice 18: so

[6:01:07] Trustee Luckham: let us just pause then on 16.1 or 16.2 rather. And let us look

[6:01:17] Trustee Luckham: at salt spring temporary use permit 2022.2 stress lower

[6:01:21] Trustee Luckham: energy's road temporary use permit for renewal i think we've all seen this at least once at least

[6:01:27] Trustee Grove (probable): once

[6:01:27] Trustee Luckham: if not twice in my case and it's it's absolutely an ongoing tragedy are you going to

[6:01:33] Trustee Luckham: introduce it can

[6:01:34] Trustee Luckham: you figure anything around the pulse there's nothing really to say

[6:01:37] Voice 29: i don't really

[6:01:37] Voice 29: have much to say other than this is just renewing the tup we did yeah and we didn't meet with uh

[6:01:44] Voice 29: pc hydro if you recall they originally said they are not going to renew this but they have a change

[6:01:50] Voice 29: apart so uh we will i guess it's good uses we will stay the best uses will be smaller for crane

[6:01:59] Voice 29: but we also have to live through the renovation which is okay we can deal with that so excuse me

[6:02:06] Trustee Grove (probable): i'm sorry we're going to have to do renovations so there's

[6:02:08] Voice 29: more to this than i'm aware of

[6:02:10] Voice 29: yeah but but that's not part of the tup okay yeah

[6:02:13] Voice 29: so we only just found out recently

[6:02:17] Voice 29: They only have three

[6:02:18] Voice 12: years.

[6:02:20] Voice 29: Yeah, the renewal is for three years. But in the meantime, as stated in the staff report, we are hoping to find a way to avoid having to do the TUP.

[6:02:31] Voice 29: I did explore the perhaps an amendment to the definition of the language firewall. So hopefully that can help addressing public use.

[6:02:42] Trustee Luckham: okay so there's a motion on page um i

[6:02:47] Voice 17: just i was gonna comment i mean

[6:02:50] Voice 17: probably two the last the

[6:02:54] Voice 17: only time i've got to go to a ubcm uh there one of the resolutions was to limit the time on how

[6:03:02] many times you could issue a temporary use permit it went down in flames and the argument was

[6:03:07] that rezoning is permanent

[6:03:09] Voice 17: you make a rezoning and it's forever and ever and ever

[6:03:13] Voice 17: and that municipalities wanted the right to issue temporary use permits as many times as they need

[6:03:18] Voice 17: to or while that use continues rather than have that have that permanent nature of rezoning so

[6:03:25] Voice 17: we're not you know i know while it sounds unusual we can also offer that to anybody else that's

[6:03:33] Voice 17: using you know that a temporary use permit it has to go through the process it has to be yeah

[6:03:38] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, well, they changed the legislation a number of years ago to allow that for those very reasons.

[6:03:44] Voice 17: Exactly.

[6:03:44] Voice 17: So, I mean, it's not like we're doing something we shouldn't be doing.

[6:03:47] Voice 17: This property was built by VC Hydro, who's immune to our local regulations because they're a provincial entity.

[6:03:57] Voice 17: And that's why they built it without the zoning that they needed to have for an office place.

[6:04:02] Voice 17: So it's not like we're, like I said, violating rules.

[6:04:07] Voice 17: needs.

[6:04:08] Trustee Grove (probable): Anyway, we have to press on. Just a matter of interest, the reduced space, will that be

[6:04:14] Trustee Grove (probable): adequate for us?

[6:04:15] Voice 29: We're going to work together on designing this space.

[6:04:18] Trustee Grove (probable): I will move the Salt

[6:04:20] Trustee Grove (probable): Spanyard Local Trust Committee approve issuance of temporary use permit SSTUP 2022.2. I'll second.

[6:04:27] Trustee Luckham: Moved and seconded. Any further discussion? No. All those in favor? I carry. There you go. That

[6:04:35] Trustee Luckham: welcome um all right we're recessed so we are now recessed and uh we'll be returning there was a

[6:04:49] Trustee Luckham: suggestion earlier about 4 15 so i don't know where we're at 5 to

[6:04:53] Trustee Luckham: 4 now can i have a word with

[6:51:41] Voice 21: Three minutes ahead of schedule.

[6:51:42] Voice 21: Is that it, David?

[6:51:50] Voice 21: Is that it?

[6:51:56] Trustee Luckham: I'm guessing we're live.

[6:51:58] Trustee Luckham: David, thank you for coming back.

[6:52:02] Trustee Luckham: And thank

[6:52:03] Trustee Luckham: you, everybody, for working a long day today

[6:52:05] Trustee Luckham: and contributing to getting us to a place where we're comfortable.

[6:52:10] Trustee Luckham: And the applicant as well.

[6:52:12] Trustee Luckham: And are you going to take the lead on this?

[6:52:20] Trustee Luckham: Sure.

[6:52:21] Trustee Luckham: sure i i will um hi

[6:52:24] Voice 13: david did you have something to share or say yes i do if you don't mind i just

[6:52:29] Voice 13: wanted to correct myself so during the break i was looking at the legislation and yeah i just

[6:52:36] Voice 13: want to let you know i do concur with the applicant that the local trust committee can

[6:52:41] Voice 13: establish a different term for when the permit lapses so the trust committee would like to

[6:52:49] Voice 13: have the permit go for a three-year period that is totally acceptable under the legislation it's

[6:52:54] Voice 13: your choice good okay

[6:52:57] Trustee Luckham: so does jason already know that or he's just been apprised to this at the

[6:53:01] Trustee Luckham: same time he knows

[6:53:02] Voice 13: that i just let him know earlier okay good okay jason okay

[6:53:09] Voice 3: so uh when we

[6:53:11] Voice 3: left off there were sort of three questions right the first was the permit term which i think

[6:53:19] Voice 3: director marler just answered for us right the ltc can extend the permit term

[6:53:25] Voice 3: the second was about um provision of the security uh director marler also had

[6:53:33] Voice 3: a suggestion about that which i don't david marler do you want to um sorry i don't know

[6:53:39] Voice 3: where the microphone is so i'm just yelling into here do you want to speak about the security david

[6:53:46] Voice 3: um essentially he had recommended or the question was would an irrevocable letter of credit be

[6:53:56] Voice 3: um a better solution for you like could you provide an irrevocable letter of credit

[6:54:02] Voice 3: within that 60 or 90 it's

[6:54:05] Voice 35: not going to be possible for me to resolve because that's

[6:54:10] Voice 35: about a half a million dollar cost yeah

[6:54:12] Voice 4: it's a gigantic and so

[6:54:13] Voice 35: in most uh municipal jurisdictions

[6:54:16] Voice 35: that's rolled into the building permit stage because that will be incorporated within a project financing structure.

[6:54:23] Voice 35: So typically, applicants like myself will, you know, pay all this through equity.

[6:54:30] Voice 35: So this is all equity. And then when building permit, that all gets replaced with financing.

[6:54:37] Voice 35: So anything that's, whether it's a letter of credit or any other kind of facility,

[6:54:42] Voice 35: it's preferable that it's happening as a part of the building permit because that

[6:54:46] Voice 35: once the building permit is issued you know

[6:54:48] Voice 35: all the project financing is in place and

[6:54:51] Voice 35: construction commences to do it now within the next 90 days is still a huge risk for the project

[6:54:59] Voice 35: um not just not just because there's so many other elements of the project that haven't completed but

[6:55:05] Voice 35: but that money just sits there

[6:55:07] Voice 35: and is effectively

[6:55:11] Voice 35: if for whatever reason

[6:55:13] Voice 35: the project doesn't proceed.

[6:55:16] Voice 35: And most every other municipality

[6:55:19] Voice 35: recognizing that is a fact

[6:55:22] Voice 35: of how projects are executed,

[6:55:26] Voice 35: make it as a part of a building permit issuance

[6:55:29] Voice 35: is that that security is delivered at issuance.

[6:55:34] Voice 3: So can

[6:55:35] Voice 12: we do like an effective date or something?

[6:55:36] Voice 12: Well,

[6:55:37] Voice 3: okay. So we don't, I mean, we're not the building permit authority, right? So that it makes it harder to tie our requirements to some other agency's process. We review building permits, right? Like there's no doubt when you submit a building permit to the CRD, it's going to get referred to us.

[6:56:00] Voice 35: And when you review it, what does that entail? Does that entail an authority?

[6:56:06] Voice 35: It

[6:56:06] Voice 3: is a referral from that agency, and it's the opportunity to ensure that the building plans align with our regulations.

[6:56:17] Voice 3: So

[6:56:17] Voice 35: could we make it prior to the CRD's, whatever your...

[6:56:24] Voice 3: Yeah, the building permit referral. Let me ask, David Marler, can you hear me?

[6:56:28] Voice 13: Yeah, I can. I'm just thinking it through.

[6:56:30] Voice 13: through. So the problem I'm having with this is the legislation does say as a condition

[6:56:37] Voice 13: of the permit issuance. So now if you were to write it in there as you have, I'm just

[6:56:44] Voice 13: thinking it through. If we get a building permit referral, we would tell the building

[6:56:50] Voice 13: department that it meets all the requirements, except they have not provided one of the conditions,

[6:56:57] Voice 13: which is the irrevocable letter of credit or the cash in the amount of and we would then ask the

[6:57:05] Voice 13: building inspector not to issue the building

[6:57:08] Voice 13: permit until we've received that in other words

[6:57:10] Voice 13: it hasn't met the terms of the development permit and I think if the development permit

[6:57:15] Voice 13: was written that way that would be okay there is a risk that the building inspector may just say

[6:57:22] Voice 13: well I'm going to issue it anyway so that is one of the concerns I would have there

[6:57:26] Voice 13: The other option is the Trust Committee could remove the limitation on how long, and instead, by resolution, just say that the development permit will be issued upon receipt of that irrevocable letter of credit, and then staff would wait and not actually issue the permit until that's happened.

[6:57:50] Voice 13: so there'll be no more decisions by the trust committee it's just an administrative

[6:57:55] Voice 13: hold on to the permit as it is until the applicant provides that money which could be

[6:58:01] Voice 13: three months or five months or when they're ready to go to the building department they could then

[6:58:07] Voice 13: come to us and say here we're ready to pay it and then we could register the permit

[6:58:12] Voice 13: land title office and then they can go to the building inspector so there's a couple ways you

[6:58:17] Voice 13: can make it work and

[6:58:19] Voice 19: just leave that with you which one you put there that

[6:58:26] Voice 21: makes sense to

[6:58:27] Voice 21: everybody yeah

[6:58:28] Voice 3: so so i'm hearing two options then we either uh write it sort of into the permit

[6:58:33] Voice 3: subject to um that that islands trust would not would not review a building permit application

[6:58:41] Voice 3: or something like that building

[6:58:43] Trustee Luckham: permit review

[6:58:44] Voice 3: will commence subject to the receipt of

[6:58:48] Voice 3: Or alternatively, as David said there, you can just make actual issuance of the permit conditional upon receipt of that security.

[6:58:58] Voice 3: Which means if the LTC were inclined to issue you the permit, you don't get to go home with it in your hand today.

[6:59:05] Voice 3: Rather, you don't have to tell your finance people that

[6:59:09] Voice 20: you've

[6:59:10] Voice 3: got a promise that they'll give it to you.

[6:59:14] Voice 3: I don't know which of those is.

[6:59:16] Voice 35: i mean i prefer one over two yeah yeah but i prefer two over the status quo

[6:59:23] Voice 35: in the worst case

[6:59:29] Voice 21: sorry i'm gonna have to do a little monkey work here just come up with a

[6:59:37] Voice 21: suitable language this one will be quicker good i'm

[6:59:46] Trustee Luckham: not wondering when it's gonna get

[6:59:48] Trustee Luckham: done i'm feeling empathy for you

[7:00:02] Voice 21: Well, what is the terminology that we use on building permits? We don't approve them.

[7:00:08] Voice 19: Issue.

[7:00:09] Voice 19: No, we don't issue them.

[7:00:12] Voice 19: Confirm.

[7:00:15] Voice 19: No, I think what I would suggest

[7:00:18] Voice 13: is that a condition of the permit is that either an irrevocable letter of credit or cash or whatever it is, is provided, is a requirement of the permit.

[7:00:36] Voice 13: right so it's a clause in that it clearly states that and until that has been provided the permit

[7:00:43] Voice 13: isn't valid right that is we would advise the building inspector that all the conditions of

[7:00:49] Voice 13: one of them has not been met right and that is the provision

[7:00:53] Voice 19: of the um of the security

[7:00:57] Voice 19: So maybe what you could say

[7:01:04] Voice 13: in there is before issues of building permits, the applicant must provide and then security in the amount of something like that.

[7:01:18] Voice 13: And then that will just close in as to when to look for it, because it may not be you and me here.

[7:01:23] Voice 13: Somebody else might be looking at this. They want to make it clear that they're not going to miss that.

[7:01:41] Voice 21: almost there okay uh how

[7:02:07] Voice 3: does well okay i guess it would be a it would be a resolution to amend

[7:02:13] Voice 3: how do we want to do this rob do you want me to just give it to you and you can put it up on there

[7:02:18] Voice 4: uh i don't know i mean it's it's short so can

[7:02:25] Voice 21: you email it to me

[7:02:44] Voice 21: Well, no, give it a shot, it's working up stream and that's what

[7:03:07] Voice 21: that's coming up again.

[7:03:24] Voice 21: I just sent it. Let me know if it comes through for you.

[7:04:11] Voice 21: That's what you forwarded.

[7:04:22] Voice 21: Yeah.

[7:04:24] Voice 21: So, David, I

[7:04:26] Voice 3: guess you can't see the screen, can you?

[7:04:28] Voice 13: no i can't that's

[7:04:30] Voice 3: right let's see if it

[7:04:33] Voice 13: works last time it didn't but that's right basically

[7:04:36] Voice 4: i have a

[7:04:36] Voice 13: clause replace an existing clause

[7:04:38] Voice 3: and so i've replaced an existing clause so now it says

[7:04:44] Voice 3: before islands trust approval of any building permits pursuant to this project the applicant

[7:04:49] Voice 3: must provide an irrevocable letter of credit or security in the mountain four hundred and forty

[7:04:54] Voice 3: two thousand five hundred dollars which if i'll just say for the ltc's benefit is a kind of a

[7:05:01] Voice 21: testament

[7:05:01] Voice 3: to the robust landscaping plan that accompanies this development right the the

[7:05:07] Voice 3: riparian planting plan and the landscaping plan generally is of a very high quality

[7:05:15] Voice 3: um yeah can you

[7:05:16] Voice 13: hear me yeah i would change that from approval of any building permits

[7:05:22] Voice 13: permits to issuance of any building permits remove islands trust just say before issuance of any

[7:05:28] Voice 13: building permits uh we all know the regional district issues them so we don't need to put

[7:05:33] Voice 13: that in there and that i think yeah before issuance we're going to

[7:05:40] Voice 19: make these changes

[7:05:40] Voice 19: one by one or what

[7:05:41] Voice 21: yeah i think that should we do

[7:05:50] Voice 21: that thank you i agree so should we go ahead

[7:05:57] Voice 21: with that one then jason

[7:05:59] Trustee Grove (probable): yep i would recommend uh making that a resolution so i'll move the

[7:06:04] Trustee Grove (probable): salt spring island local trust committee replace section 3.4.2.1 of proposed development permit

[7:06:09] Trustee Grove (probable): ssdp 2018.14 as follows colin colon before issuance of pursuance to this applicant must

[7:06:19] Trustee Grove (probable): provide an irrevocable letter of credit or security deposit in the amount of 442 500

[7:06:27] Trustee Grove (probable): I'll second that.

[7:06:28] Trustee Luckham: Moved and seconded.

[7:06:29] Trustee Luckham: Any discussion?

[7:06:31] Trustee Luckham: All those in favor?

[7:06:33] Trustee Luckham: That was the easiest $400,000 to make.

[7:06:36] Voice 21: All right.

[7:06:45] Voice 21: Yeah.

[7:06:46] Voice 21: Let's go on to the big stuff.

[7:06:47] Voice 21: Okay.

[7:06:49] Voice 3: So we have provided a number of amendments to section 3.9 of the proposed development

[7:06:58] Voice 3: permit.

[7:06:59] Voice 3: I will note that section 3.9 of the proposed development permit already includes some monitoring language and essentially we have just refined that monitoring language and made it more robust through these proposed resolutions.

[7:07:19] Voice 3: I don't know if there's much more to be said than is currently on the screen.

[7:07:24] Voice 17: And there's the, if you go down to the bottom of that, Rob, and then there's this, this

[7:07:33] Voice 17: is the, this addresses that report requirement, the

[7:07:39] Voice 21: 3.95.

[7:07:45] Voice 21: Find a

[7:07:46] Voice 17: typo, catch it,

[7:07:47] Voice 21: there's lots of them.

[7:07:48] Voice 21: Yeah.

[7:07:48] Voice 6: What do we got for typos?

[7:07:50] Voice 21: As described, 3.95.

[7:08:03] Voice 21: Is that it?

[7:08:06] Voice 21: Yeah, so that and the stuff above.

[7:08:10] Trustee Grove (probable): And David Philbrook, how do you feel about that?

[7:08:13] Voice 21: Can I just see the 3.9.5? Yeah, that's fine.

[7:08:30] Voice 21: So you're happy with that?

[7:08:31] Voice 21: Yeah, I'm happy with that.

[7:08:32] Trustee Grove (probable): Okay,

[7:08:32] Voice 21: then let's go for it. No, I'm happy to start off.

[7:08:41] Trustee Grove (probable): Can I,

[7:08:41] Voice 21: particularly from the

[7:09:00] Voice 3: relief or interception drains, is it possible to put

[7:09:05] Voice 3: that one in? So Rob, do you want to take this in real time just so we, where are we going?

[7:09:09] Voice 3: But

[7:09:09] Trustee Grove (probable): wouldn't the hydrogeologist do that automatically?

[7:09:12] Voice 35: Well, again, Jason, it's parsing, technical.

[7:09:19] Voice 35: I mean, the hydrologist is going to look at all that and provide.

[7:09:22] Voice 3: That's his job.

[7:09:25] Voice 3: Yes, as long as they consider the relief drainage and any interception drainage to be part of the system, I guess.

[7:09:37] Trustee Grove (probable): Well, can you put that, assuming what?

[7:09:39] Trustee Grove (probable): Yeah,

[7:09:39] Voice 3: so a confirmation from a qualified hydrogeologist that upon system operation, comma, including any relief and interception drainage.

[7:09:57] Voice 21: Tripo.

[7:09:58] Voice 21: Tripo.

[7:09:59] Voice 21: Trying to do dairy.

[7:10:02] Trustee Grove (probable): Comma.

[7:10:03] Trustee Grove (probable): Comma.

[7:10:05] Voice 21: Good.

[7:10:06] Trustee Grove (probable): Excellent.

[7:10:06] Trustee Grove (probable): All right.

[7:10:07] Trustee Grove (probable): Is everybody happy?

[7:10:09] Trustee Grove (probable): Sure.

[7:10:09] Trustee Grove (probable): Can we go to the top of the page?

[7:10:13] Trustee Grove (probable): So I'll start off.

[7:10:14] Trustee Grove (probable): I move the Salisbury and Local Trust Committee amend section 3.9 of proposed development permit

[7:10:19] Trustee Grove (probable): SSPP 2018.14 as follows, colon, amend clause 3.9.1 to replace on pages 3 and 5 of schedule

[7:10:28] Trustee Grove (probable): number 8 with in schedule number 8. Next line, insert new clauses 3.9.2 and 3.9.3 as follows,

[7:10:39] Trustee Grove (probable): Close, colon, 3.9.2, a qualified professional must develop

[7:10:43] Trustee Grove (probable): and provide to Islands Trust staff

[7:10:45] Trustee Grove (probable): prior to system operation commencing a metering

[7:10:49] Trustee Grove (probable): and monitoring plan that enables ongoing evaluation

[7:10:52] Trustee Grove (probable): of the sewage disposal system performance

[7:10:54] Trustee Grove (probable): and receiving environmental conditions.

[7:10:57] Trustee Grove (probable): Full stop, it should address, colon,

[7:11:02] Trustee Grove (probable): bullet, a baseline assessment of the receiving environment

[7:11:05] Trustee Grove (probable): undertaken prior to development commencing.

[7:11:08] Trustee Grove (probable): Semicolon, bullet. Daily discharge flow from the system. Semicolon, bullet. Treatment system performance measuring effluent quality objectives. Semicolon, bullet. Environmental performance of its receiving environment in accordance with performance standards in Schedule No. 8, paragraph 3.9.3.

[7:11:28] Trustee Grove (probable): 3. A qualified professional must meter and monitor the sewage disposal system in accordance

[7:11:33] Trustee Grove (probable): with the plan approved in 3.9.2 above and provide Islands Trust with a report on system

[7:11:39] Trustee Grove (probable): performance relative to the objectives identified in Schedule 8. This report must be provided

[7:11:45] Trustee Grove (probable): annually for the first five years once the system is brought into service and be available

[7:11:51] Trustee Grove (probable): in perpetuity as Islands Trust requests throughout the lifetime of the development. Monitoring

[7:11:57] Trustee Grove (probable): requirements must be adjusted to reflect the results of the ongoing evaluation adjustments

[7:12:01] Trustee Grove (probable): in evaluation adjustments in the monitoring program must be described in the annual report

[7:12:08] Trustee Grove (probable): paragraph renumber existing clauses 3.9.2 to become 3.9.4 paragraph 3.9.5 upon completion

[7:12:17] Trustee Grove (probable): of detailed sewage system design as described in schedule number eight the owner will submit

[7:12:22] Trustee Grove (probable): to Islands Trust at the owner's cost, COVID.

[7:12:26] Trustee Grove (probable): Paragraph 3.9.5.1, confirmation

[7:12:29] Trustee Grove (probable): from a qualified hydrologist that upon system operations,

[7:12:33] Trustee Grove (probable): including any relief and interception drainage,

[7:12:36] Trustee Grove (probable): pre- and post-development groundwater flows to Colford

[7:12:39] Trustee Grove (probable): so creek will

[7:12:40] Voice 21: remain constant.

[7:12:47] Voice 21: Good job.

[7:12:49] Voice 21: Yeah, well

[7:12:49] Trustee Grove (probable): done, you guys.

[7:12:50] Trustee Grove (probable): Laura, thank you.

[7:12:53] Trustee Grove (probable): There you go.

[7:12:55] Voice 17: well i'll second okay

[7:12:58] Voice 21: any discussion i think that captures everything

[7:13:05] Voice 21: um for

[7:13:09] Voice 20: that one david

[7:13:11] Trustee Grove (probable): for you okay yeah i'm fine with it i just just um yeah i'm fine

[7:13:17] Trustee Grove (probable): so rather

[7:13:18] Trustee Luckham: than doing the initial whole thing we're relying upon the professional yes uh work

[7:13:26] Trustee Luckham: um that will develop and evolve throughout

[7:13:31] Voice 12: the project and after the project and

[7:13:34] Trustee Grove (probable): i think that's

[7:13:35] Trustee Grove (probable): just fine yeah

[7:13:37] Voice 20: that's

[7:13:39] Trustee Grove (probable): why that happens that's why they're full professionals okay can you

[7:13:44] Trustee Grove (probable): vote and

[7:13:45] Trustee Luckham: second it yes

[7:13:45] Trustee Grove (probable): any further discussion you

[7:13:47] Voice 15: ready yes that was in favor can

[7:13:53] Trustee Grove (probable): i call my

[7:13:55] Trustee Grove (probable): no

[7:13:55] Voice 17: you're not done

[7:13:56] Trustee Grove (probable): right oh what are we supposed to do now i'm not

[7:13:57] Trustee Grove (probable): done i'm done

[7:14:01] Voice 4: what

[7:14:02] Voice 3: are we going to do yes if if uh if it is the ltc's intent to issue the permit today

[7:14:08] Voice 3: so you've now amended it if you want to issue it um i would take you to the alternative section

[7:14:20] Voice 3: of yesterday's staff

[7:14:30] Voice 21: and

[7:14:33] Voice 3: the purpose of these resolutions is to update the development permit to reflect the

[7:14:40] Voice 3: new sewerage system site plan that the applicant

[7:14:44] Trustee Luckham: so there's a schedule eight then uh yes you

[7:14:49] Voice 3: are amending we're amending schedule number eight of the development permit to uh would

[7:14:56] Voice 17: the item

[7:14:57] Voice 17: number three now be gone because of the change in landscaping laws or um

[7:15:05] Voice 3: no because we still want

[7:15:09] Voice 3: a and we can talk about an appropriate duration but we would still like an updated landscaping

[7:15:15] Voice 3: plan given that the landscape

[7:15:17] Voice 3: was going to change yeah

[7:15:19] Voice 35: can we do it in 60 days yes

[7:15:21] Voice 3: you can well

[7:15:22] Voice 3: sorry yes

[7:15:23] Voice 35: the answer

[7:15:25] Voice 21: is yes so we

[7:15:28] Voice 35: can we can try to do everything

[7:15:29] Voice 21: so is that the motion

[7:15:38] Voice 21: uh we can talk about those oh hold on message here oh yes uh

[7:15:52] Voice 3: sorry david was just reminding

[7:15:53] Voice 3: reminding us to amend the last date on the permit before it before you issue it but i don't even i

[7:16:02] Voice 3: don't even see where i don't know if that's a separate resolution or so i don't think it says

[7:16:09] Voice 3: it in the permit that its term is two years

[7:16:18] Voice 13: go ahead yeah so it's not in the permit the default is two years so if you wish it to be

[7:16:24] Voice 13: something different you'll need to add a clause into the permit that says this permit will lapse

[7:16:30] Voice 13: um x years after

[7:16:31] Voice 19: the date of issuing so something along that lines

[7:16:37] Voice 21: we were talking about

[7:16:45] Voice 4: does that have to be separate resolution it

[7:16:49] Voice 3: can go in there for sure um hold on can you just scroll

[7:16:52] Voice 3: lot can tell me what what's about this no um you need an amending uh amending resolution first so i

[7:17:02] Voice 3: would if i would add uh i would amend the proposed development permit to add a clause 3.13 okay

[7:17:14] Voice 3: We got that.

[7:17:14] Voice 21: That's all good.

[7:17:16] Voice 21: I guess that's my own amendment.

[7:17:23] Voice 21: All right.

[7:17:25] Voice 18: Amendment SSTP

[7:17:26] Voice 21: 2018.14.

[7:17:28] Voice 21: I'll add that.

[7:17:35] Voice 21: I think I'll add that later.

[7:17:37] Voice 21: Sure.

[7:17:38] Voice 21: To

[7:17:38] Voice 3: add a new clause 3.13.

[7:17:45] Voice 21: 3.13.

[7:17:49] Voice 3: Header development permit term.

[7:17:52] Voice 3: Like, you know, each one has a subhead.

[7:17:55] Voice 21: Development permit term.

[7:17:57] Voice 21: What

[7:18:02] Voice 3: shall we say?

[7:18:03] Voice 3: Well, I mean, that's between the LTC

[7:18:05] Voice 3: see in the applicant really to decide whether to be to

[7:18:07] Voice 3: be set at three years okay so what i might

[7:18:13] Voice 3: do then is um i would use the language that's already at the end of the permit it's just we

[7:18:18] Voice 3: typically fill it in uh if the development described hold

[7:18:21] Trustee Grove (probable): on this works

[7:18:22] Voice 3: to be set at three

[7:18:23] Voice 3: years oh or i was i was just going to suggest using the some language that's already in the

[7:18:31] Voice 3: permit yeah which says um yeah so back off the two as well nope uh go back back back back so

[7:18:42] Voice 3: so the development permit term is the subhead and then under that we would say if the development

[7:18:49] Voice 3: prescribed in this development permit is not commenced within three years is that what the

[7:18:57] Voice 3: ltc is

[7:18:57] Voice 21: happy with three years for the permit this permit automatically lapses i think you can get

[7:19:24] Voice 21: rid of um of the issuance of it well i guess not um

[7:19:39] Voice 13: if i may uh through the chair um where it says

[7:19:44] Voice 13: 3.1.3 i think that should be 3.13 okay

[7:19:53] Voice 21: now it makes sense to me thank you thanks david

[7:19:58] Voice 21: all right i think we're looking for a motion yeah can we

[7:20:09] Trustee Grove (probable): fix the dp 20 business so i move

[7:20:15] Trustee Grove (probable): that the salt spring island local trust committee amend ssdp 20 2018.14 to add clause 3.13

[7:20:28] Trustee Grove (probable): to the development permit term term code development

[7:20:33] Trustee Luckham: permit no no two it's no sentence

[7:20:36] Trustee Luckham: you

[7:20:37] Voice 21: don't mean two in it it's just the title anyway it says on the screen keep going all right

[7:20:49] Trustee Grove (probable): if the development that is described in the sorry if the development described in this

[7:20:54] Trustee Grove (probable): development permit is not commenced within three years of the issuance of the permit

[7:20:57] Trustee Grove (probable): this permit automatically lapses

[7:21:00] Voice 21: right moved and seconded um

[7:21:16] Voice 17: Okay.

[7:21:19] Trustee Luckham: Any further discussion? No. All those in favor? Yes. That carries. And now we need

[7:21:29] Trustee Luckham: to do that last issuance thing, which is one through five. Is that correct?

[7:21:34] Voice 17: Yeah. And I

[7:21:35] Voice 17: do have a few more motions, but they shouldn't be long. After

[7:21:40] Voice 17: this, I do have a few motions.

[7:21:44] Trustee Luckham: oh okay

[7:21:46] Trustee Luckham: um

[7:21:49] Voice 21: any other

[7:21:50] Voice 21: changes to this one other than the 60 days well um staff

[7:22:01] Voice 3: are recommending

[7:22:02] Voice 3: the provision of these more modest securities related to any emergency measures that must

[7:22:10] Voice 3: be taken to protect the stream in the event that that development does not go in accordance with

[7:22:14] Voice 3: the development permit i

[7:22:15] Voice 19: don't know how that sits with

[7:22:20] Voice 35: well generally i prefer the same way to deal

[7:22:24] Voice 35: with these as we deal with the uh security for the landscaping just that they're all

[7:22:30] Voice 35: uh the same so that we can manage them accordingly okay absolutely security

[7:22:44] Voice 17: before issuance of the building permit in the amount so where

[7:22:54] Voice 19: i might take

[7:22:55] Voice 3: those then

[7:22:56] Voice 3: we may even be able to remove them from this resolution and then just amend the permit

[7:23:06] Voice 3: again to capture the security requirement and just do it in the permit similar to the way we

[7:23:11] Voice 3: did with the landscaping so we want another another motion before

[7:23:15] Voice 4: we do the final issue

[7:23:17] Voice 4: that's fine yes

[7:23:18] Voice 22: yes so

[7:23:20] Voice 4: we're going to address these two items as another amendment yes

[7:23:28] Voice 4: Yes, you are

[7:23:30] Voice 3: using, you are

[7:23:32] Voice 21: understanding that correctly.

[7:23:45] Voice 21: And obviously, what do,

[7:23:48] Voice 6: yeah.

[7:23:49] Voice 3: We are going to add a new clause 3.10.4.1.

[7:24:03] Voice 21: And

[7:24:03] Voice 19: grab the same language that you did

[7:24:08] Voice 19: for the bigger landscape and security.

[7:24:09] Voice 19: However, we trace that.

[7:25:18] Voice 21: That should say, in

[7:25:21] Voice 3: accordance with 3.10.4, not 3.11.5. You know what, you can say, you

[7:25:27] Voice 3: know what, leave

[7:25:27] Voice 19: that, we'll address it on the next one, because that would be 3.10.5.

[7:25:38] Voice 19: Yeah,

[7:25:41] Voice 21: that can be 3.11.5 and the one below it is just 3.11.5,

[7:25:56] Voice 3: the one below it is 3.10.4.1

[7:26:02] Voice 3: because this shows up in two sections, one for Fulford Creek, one for Salisbury Creek.

[7:26:06] Voice 21: took a lot longer in the middle ages but not much longer

[7:26:51] Voice 21: quill and chop on the quill yeah find some ink monks i

[7:27:08] Voice 3: think that's what you were yeah i like it

[7:27:10] Voice 3: um we need any numbers so accordingly because they're not like there's already existing

[7:27:17] Voice 3: we're just it will now become yeah that's a good safety clause

[7:27:23] Voice 3: us yeah because

[7:27:25] Voice 18: otherwise we'll be doing an rwm and fix any errors and mistakes

[7:27:30] Voice 18: so

[7:27:32] Trustee Grove (probable): we have to do that

[7:27:37] Voice 21: yeah go ahead

[7:27:40] Voice 17: local trust committee amend ssdt 2018.14 to add clause 3.11.5.1 before issues

[7:27:52] Voice 17: to this project the applicant must provide an irrevocable letter of credit for a security

[7:28:00] Voice 17: deposit the amount of five thousand dollars to undertake emergency stream protection works in

[7:28:05] Voice 17: the vicinity of sultry to be held and deployed in accordance with permit clause 3.11.5 and add

[7:28:13] Voice 17: HAB-Masyn Moyer- At was 3.10 point 4.1 before.

[7:28:16] HAB-Masyn Moyer- project, the

[7:28:20] Voice 17: must provide your whole letter of credit or a security deposit in the amount of $5,000 to undertake emergency screen protection works in the vicinity of pulper creek to be held and

[7:28:34] Voice 17: deployed in accordance with perfect cluster.

[7:28:36] Voice 17: HAB-Masyn Moyer- Henry numbers over and on second.

[7:28:40] Voice 12: HAB-Terry Palmos- moved and seconded.

[7:28:43] Voice 12: with this any discussion no all those in favor yeah

[7:28:47] Voice 21: that carries unanimously so now do we jump

[7:28:57] Voice 21: back

[7:28:57] Trustee Luckham: to this other section or yes

[7:29:01] Voice 21: now is those so we're on is that it just the three items

[7:29:15] Trustee Grove (probable): Jason is that it yeah if the LTC

[7:29:18] Voice 3: so the permit has now been amended to address

[7:29:22] Voice 3: stormwater conversation to address the security question and to address the term the permit term

[7:29:30] Voice 3: and so this resolution here would enable permit issuance uh subject to the replacement of of the

[7:29:40] Voice 3: sewage disposal site plan with the new updated plan basically and just sort of fudging language

[7:29:47] Voice 3: language there rather than, so there is now a conflict between some of the text in the

[7:29:55] Voice 3: professional reports and the search system site plan as it exists.

[7:30:00] Voice 3: but rather than because I mean all those all those professional reports are predicated on

[7:30:04] Voice 3: the assumption that the sewage disposal field is located 10 meters from soul creek and so they

[7:30:09] Voice 3: speak about it in that way oh

[7:30:11] Voice 20: I see the

[7:30:12] Voice 3: the second resolution here is just sort of some

[7:30:17] Voice 3: fudging language so that we all know

[7:30:22] Voice 3: that despite the fact these professional reports

[7:30:24] Voice 3: say the sewage disposal field is 10 meters from soul creek it's not it's in accordance with this

[7:30:31] Voice 3: the plan over here and i mean this is mainly expedient because there's you know seven reports

[7:30:38] Voice 3: and landscape plans that would need to be updated to reflect this updated sewage disposal plan

[7:30:45] Voice 3: and i don't believe there is any material impact on the the substance of those reports right like

[7:30:54] Voice 3: mainly those were those reports are primarily about how to protect the riparian area of soul

[7:30:59] Voice 3: creep given the proximity of the septic field to it now that the second field is not adjacent to it

[7:31:06] Voice 3: uh the reports can

[7:31:07] Trustee Grove (probable): we go ahead with this motion yes

[7:31:11] Trustee Luckham: and we don't own those reports right so it's

[7:31:14] Trustee Luckham: not like we need to amend them or anything like that

[7:31:16] Trustee Luckham: it's just that because we have an issue to

[7:31:19] Trustee Luckham: permit yeah it's irrelevant yeah

[7:31:22] Voice 3: they the the professional reports still form they are all

[7:31:26] Voice 3: still in this development permit they are schedules for this development yes

[7:31:29] Voice 20: but

[7:31:30] Voice 3: um yeah

[7:31:32] Voice 3: they now just don't necessarily line up with the sewage disposal site plan but i'm giving you some

[7:31:36] Voice 3: language here so that we all know that even though the sewage site plan changed oh

[7:31:42] Trustee Luckham: yeah that's that's

[7:31:44] Trustee Luckham: a little too technical really but we can do that's the the the significant part of that is

[7:31:52] Trustee Luckham: is in accordance with appendix one.

[7:31:54] Trustee Luckham: Yeah,

[7:31:55] Trustee Grove (probable): I think that's good enough.

[7:31:57] Trustee Grove (probable): So I will move the Sultans Island Trust Committee

[7:31:59] Trustee Grove (probable): issue development permit SSBP 2018.14

[7:32:02] Trustee Grove (probable): as amended upon satisfaction of the following conditions,

[7:32:05] Trustee Grove (probable): colon one, that the sewage disposal system site plan

[7:32:08] Trustee Grove (probable): in schedule number eight be replaced

[7:32:10] Trustee Grove (probable): with the sewage system disposal system plan

[7:32:12] Trustee Grove (probable): shown in appendix number one of the staff report

[7:32:15] Trustee Grove (probable): dated August 8th, 2022.

[7:32:17] Trustee Grove (probable): Two, that despite all references otherwise

[7:32:20] Trustee Grove (probable): Otherwise, within the schedule to development permit SSDP 2018.14, the sewerage disposal field at 26614 Paganjus Road will be cited in accordance with Appendix 1 of the staff report dated August 8, 2022.

[7:32:34] Trustee Grove (probable): 3. Prior to permit issuance and within 60 days of this resolution, the applicant must submit to the SSLTC approval a revised landscaping plan consistent with Sections E24 and E28 of Development Permit Area 2 to replace Schedule No. 4 in Development Permit SSDP 2018.14 and reflecting the relocated sewage disposal field.

[7:33:00] Trustee Grove (probable): vote

[7:33:00] Voice 20: second that okay

[7:33:04] Voice 21: that sounds good um any discussion sorry i

[7:33:11] Voice 17: do want to go i think it's

[7:33:15] Voice 17: important that we kind of summarize where we are yeah um i mean sorry

[7:33:20] Trustee Grove (probable): first

[7:33:21] Voice 17: saw this application back in august of 2019 and we referred the application to the apc at that

[7:33:31] Voice 17: time who provided a favorable response back to us that they felt that the design um was was

[7:33:40] Voice 17: adequate and commensurate with the context of the property we saw the permit again in 2019

[7:33:50] Voice 17: and we did give the um the variance on the septic system i know i did that believing that we were

[7:33:58] Voice 17: or couldn't be causing more harm to the archeological site.

[7:34:02] Voice 17: Right.

[7:34:05] Voice 17: On the expiration of the development permit,

[7:34:09] Voice 17: we saw it again in February 22,

[7:34:11] Voice 17: along with the development permit.

[7:34:14] Voice 17: And this time with, you know,

[7:34:17] Voice 17: continuing path and learning of reconciliation,

[7:34:20] Voice 17: thought the decision for it was needed,

[7:34:23] Voice 17: needed input from First Nations on whether or not

[7:34:25] Voice 17: that was the right decision or needed their input.

[7:34:28] Voice 17: But we did forward it to First Nations and then gave them both projects.

[7:34:39] Voice 17: Also, the APC saw it again in March 2022.

[7:34:43] Voice 17: And again, they felt that the DPA guidelines were being met.

[7:34:49] Voice 17: I should point out this whole time that the permit, I understand both the applicant and staff were working carefully,

[7:34:58] Voice 17: closely together and the project was changing and evolving and we were responding to the issues that

[7:35:05] Voice 17: were raised

[7:35:06] Voice 21: to

[7:35:07] Voice 17: the to the design so the design has

[7:35:09] Voice 17: evolved since we saw it in 2019 to where it

[7:35:11] Voice 17: is today and even though revolved uh changed even over the weekend and um so you know i hear the

[7:35:20] Voice 17: voices i hear the people and i share their frustration that to this day our land use

[7:35:24] Voice 17: regulations are behind the times uh in particular into climate change we do have a 19 28 2008 ocp

[7:35:33] Voice 17: still has not been implemented uh through the land use bylaw um we did try to change that we

[7:35:40] Voice 17: did raise that back in 2019 to do the climate action planning activities but that project got

[7:35:46] Voice 17: replaced um i hope ganges village planning was going to address some of the sea level rise issues

[7:35:55] Voice 17: But again, that project is sore.

[7:35:59] Voice 17: I know a lot of Islanders believe that our OCP and land use bylaw are protective, but they're out of date.

[7:36:07] Voice 17: And we have a lot of work to do.

[7:36:08] Voice 17: And I think in Fulford, we have an opportunity to do some really good community planning, good community planning in cooperation with First Nations.

[7:36:18] Voice 17: And if we do this planning correct, not only do we help ourselves by saying what we want this community to look like,

[7:36:25] Voice 17: we help future developers because we're signaling what's okay otherwise if we don't do this big

[7:36:31] Voice 17: command in the planning we just continue to say you come with an idea and we tell you like it or

[7:36:35] Voice 17: not if we have good planning those ideas are the the groundwork is being laid and it's clear what

[7:36:43] Voice 17: we're expecting and i'll be making a motion in a minute in reference to community planning for

[7:36:48] Voice 17: forward thank

[7:36:49] Trustee Grove (probable): you that's helpful can we vote on this we

[7:36:52] Trustee Luckham: can the motion is on the floor

[7:36:54] Trustee Luckham: no further discussion all those in favor

[7:36:59] Voice 15: i

[7:36:59] Voice 17: did have three i sent them to rob did you get them or again it went mysteriously missing

[7:37:07] Voice 17: i'll just make the motions

[7:37:11] Voice 17: they should be self-evident i know that the salt spring island local trust

[7:37:15] Voice 17: committee encourage the proponent to consider establishing a local advisory group to provide

[7:37:21] Voice 17: local knowledge on environmental issues related to the design construction and operation project

[7:37:26] Voice 17: i use the word encourage and consider we can't

[7:37:31] Voice 17: i couldn't make it a requirement to permit

[7:37:32] Voice 17: it's

[7:37:33] Trustee Grove (probable): going to be a good thing to do i'll second that move seconded any discussion

[7:37:38] Voice 15: all those in favor no and

[7:37:41] Voice 17: the next motion is that the salt spring island local trust committee

[7:37:44] Voice 17: committee recognizes the proponents commitment to maintaining ongoing working relationship

[7:37:49] Voice 17: with the state of first nation in regard to further development related approvals design

[7:37:53] Voice 17: construction and operation and in parentheses i'm just referencing the july 27 2020 to letter

[7:38:00] Voice 17: i'll

[7:38:01] Voice 15: second that move

[7:38:02] Voice 12: seconded any discussion all

[7:38:05] Voice 15: those in favor

[7:38:05] Voice 12: two carries the

[7:38:07] Voice 17: third one doesn't

[7:38:08] Voice 17: directly relate to you i know that the salisbury island local trust committee requests staff

[7:38:13] Voice 17: to work with the CRD staff and the Fulford Water Service Commission to identify community planning

[7:38:19] Voice 17: opportunities that could be linked to any potential future expansion of the Fulford Water

[7:38:25] Voice 17: local service area and report back to the LTC.

[7:38:28] Voice 14: I'll second that.

[7:38:31] Voice 14: They moved and seconded. Any further discussion?

[7:38:35] Voice 17: The idea here is that there's lots of conversations

[7:38:39] Voice 17: going on and we should be part of it um and that linking any you know that they they can use those

[7:38:47] Voice 17: decisions they're making to leverage doing this community planning and pulver um you know we we

[7:38:53] Voice 17: can talk about it we can you know but we never get to it i know when we did the industrial bylaws and

[7:38:59] Voice 17: we had made that intersection of beaver point road and ganji's village road uh kind of a designated

[7:39:05] Voice 17: in an area for future commercial development the community was all up in arms but you know

[7:39:09] Voice 17: it's there so if there's a need to do colford village planning we need the community

[7:39:15] Voice 17: jumping up and helping us and supporting it and

[7:39:18] Voice 17: we need to be looking for leverages

[7:39:21] Voice 21: good time okay um all those together that's

[7:39:29] Voice 17: all i have good

[7:39:30] Voice 12: thank you thank you for my right

[7:39:32] Voice 12: does that conclude the work today well thank

[7:39:37] Trustee Luckham: you everybody thank you yeah

[7:39:40] Voice 22: well done everyone

[7:39:41] Trustee Luckham: so then um if there's no further business today just double check where we're at

[7:39:49] Trustee Luckham: oh so our next meetings just for the record all done so our upcoming uh meetings are scheduled

[7:40:02] Trustee Luckham: for 9 30 a.m tuesday september the 6th we have two public hearings coming up once the proposed

[7:40:08] Trustee Luckham: bylaw number 526 11 o'clock on thursday august 18th at the harbor house hotel and the second one

[7:40:17] Trustee Luckham: proposed those bylaw number 530 is scheduled for 4 p.m on thursday october 18th also at the harbor

[7:40:24] Trustee Luckham: house hotel good so that does it i'll call for a motion to adjourn move you up a

[7:40:28] Voice 20: second moved

[7:40:29] Trustee Luckham: and seconded all those in favor carried thank you very much anybody particularly staff

[7:40:35] Voice 21: wherever you

[7:40:36] Voice 21: are

[7:40:36] Trustee Luckham: online and in person and we're done for today thank

[7:40:43] Trustee Grove (probable): you thank you

[7:40:45] Voice 21: thank you thank you