Denman Island Local Trust Committee special meeting, April 25, 2023

[0:00:06] Voice 7: Just double checking while it resolves.

[0:00:14] Voice 7: Yep, we're good.

[0:00:16] Voice 7: Excellent.

[0:00:17] Voice 7: All right.

[0:00:17] Voice 7: Good morning, everybody.

[0:00:18] Voice 5: Thank you for joining us today for this electronic special meeting of the Denman Island Local

[0:00:23] Voice 5: Trust Committee.

[0:00:24] Voice 5: I want to begin the meeting by acknowledging that we are fortunate to be able to gather

[0:00:27] Voice 5: today in locations across the traditional territory of the Coast Salish people.

[0:00:32] Voice 5: I'm David Maude, Elector of Main Island and Chair of the Denman Island Local Trust Committee.

[0:00:36] Voice 5: I'm joined today by Deming Island trustees,

[0:00:39] Voice 5: David Graham and Sam Borthwick.

[0:00:41] Voice 5: Together we make up the Deming Island Local Trust Committee.

[0:00:44] Voice 5: This meeting is being conducted electronically

[0:00:46] Voice 5: and it's being live streamed.

[0:00:48] Voice 5: It's also being recorded and will be available soon

[0:00:50] Voice 5: on the Islands Trust website.

[0:00:51] Voice 5: We have some staff members joining us today.

[0:00:54] Voice 5: Renee Giratt, Regional Planning Manager

[0:00:57] Voice 5: for Islands Trust Northern office.

[0:00:59] Voice 5: Vicki Bookman, a minute taker.

[0:01:00] Voice 5: Narissa Chadmik, Island planner

[0:01:02] Voice 5: with Regional Planning Team.

[0:01:03] Voice 5: and Will Cottingham, our Zoom host.

[0:01:06] Voice 5: This meeting is an official forum

[0:01:08] Voice 5: for your local trust committee

[0:01:09] Voice 5: to make decisions about land use planning matters

[0:01:11] Voice 5: and discuss relevant business.

[0:01:13] Voice 5: I want to add that this is a place of employment

[0:01:15] Voice 5: despite the fact many staff are working

[0:01:17] Voice 5: in their own homes.

[0:01:19] Voice 5: Our staff have the right to a safe and respectful workplace.

[0:01:22] Voice 5: So going forward,

[0:01:23] Voice 5: we have the approval of the agenda as circulated.

[0:01:26] Voice 5: Does anybody have any additions to the agenda

[0:01:29] Voice 5: or shall we adopt it by consent?

[0:01:31] Voice 5: All right. We're good to go. So the first thing we're doing, I believe, is we're going in camera.

[0:01:40] Voice 5: So I believe it's going to be rather brief, 10 to 15 minutes, and then we'll come back with the live stream.

[0:01:52] Voice 5: So what we need is the resolution

[0:01:54] Voice 7: to go in camera if one of the two trustees wants to read that out.

[0:01:57] Voice 7: I'm

[0:02:06] Voice 4: happy to do that once I've got on my screen.

[0:02:08] Voice 4: Okay, I move that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee

[0:02:11] Voice 4: request an in-camera meeting in accordance

[0:02:14] Voice 4: with community charter part four, division three,

[0:02:17] Voice 4: section 91A, for consideration of the appointment

[0:02:20] Voice 4: of the Denman Housing Advisory Commission members.

[0:02:23] Voice 4: Do we have a seconder?

[0:02:25] Voice 4: Trustee

[0:02:25] Voice 5: Orphan call the question all in favor?

[0:02:29] Voice 5: That carries.

[0:02:30] Voice 5: And again, we will be now closing off the live stream

[0:02:33] Voice 5: and we should be back in 10 to 15 minutes.

[0:02:36] Voice 6: okay just give me a moment to stop the stream and um get that stream restarted

[0:02:47] Voice 2: maybe i can ask the minute taker what best way is to show the applicants because it's an in-camera

[0:02:53] Voice 2: report i can even paste it here oh

[0:02:56] Voice 3: right i could i could probably read i could get my agenda up on

[0:03:00] Voice 3: the other another thing and read that out from there i

[0:03:03] Voice 6: would prefer that screen share just so

[0:03:06] Voice 6: you know yeah okay

[0:03:08] Voice 5: so we're back up and going i'm

[0:03:11] Voice 6: just waiting for the um right the stream to

[0:03:14] Voice 6: resolve again for some reason oh there we are we're good now

[0:03:20] Voice 5: okay um we'll just uh rise and

[0:03:23] Voice 5: report out of the in-camera meeting um we have appointed uh members of the deminon housing

[0:03:29] Voice 5: advisory committee and i will defer over to trustee borthwick to read out the appointments

[0:03:34] Voice 5: yes indeed give me one second I have

[0:03:38] Voice 7: to get into that file apparently I didn't have it open in

[0:03:43] Voice 7: front of me

[0:03:43] Voice 8: yeah

[0:03:47] Voice 3: uh we are I think very pleased to have appointed uh Judy Armstrong Richard Day

[0:03:55] Voice 3: Carla Newfer Rhianna Silva Pamela Willis Virginia Spinney and Rosa Telegas to the

[0:04:02] Voice 3: Demmon Island Housing uh Advisory Planning Commission thank

[0:04:07] Voice 5: you very much and thank you

[0:04:08] Voice 5: to the applicants um we are looking forward to a great amount of energy and positive outcomes for

[0:04:15] Voice 5: the community all right so we'll move on to our business items um which is a housing action or

[0:04:22] Voice 5: housing project work project for discussion i believe that's planner chadwick leading that

[0:04:28] Voice 5: discussion it

[0:04:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): is indeed and um thank you uh chair mod and i'm going to share my screen because that's

[0:04:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): going to help us a little bit here.

[0:04:42] Voice 7: Okay so can you see the little arrow thingy?

[0:04:47] Voice 7: So

[0:04:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah so okay so what's interesting here is we're in a really interesting time

[0:04:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): where we've got a lot of things happening on the federal and provincial level funding and so forth

[0:05:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): And at the same time, we have through Maine basically been able to figure out a process that has informed the development of a toolkit for housing processes for LTCs.

[0:05:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): and um and that toolkit um is going to be introduced to the rpc um this week to the

[0:05:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): regional planning committee and it basically again it's sort of um informed by the process

[0:05:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): that maine has gone through and maine has been working on their housing um project for the last

[0:05:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): term and they're just continuing essentially to the next steps and so they're in a really good

[0:05:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): position right now to be applying for this funding that's coming from CMHC which will provide like

[0:05:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): quite a potentially quite a significant amount of money to build housing and we've been working with

[0:06:05] Planner Chadwick (probable): the CRD to figure out how that can happen but despite the fact that that Maine has actually

[0:06:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): already been moving forward the announcement of this funding is has required that we move a little

[0:06:17] Planner Chadwick (probable): little bit for a little that things move even faster that they would have originally in the

[0:06:23] Planner Chadwick (probable): in a perfect environment right so if we had all the time in the world and we weren't trying to

[0:06:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): chase funding then the basic project for housing is what you're looking at here where um and the

[0:06:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): timing of this is maybe six months or eight months of time potentially more where this is and this is

[0:06:43] Planner Chadwick (probable): is what we're calling the pre-planning phase before you actually start your big housing

[0:06:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): project. So in this pre-planning phase, you would see a first meeting where the staff would provide

[0:06:59] Planner Chadwick (probable): a report that would identify work that's been done before, housing need, and come up with a

[0:07:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): set of options based on a review of the OCP and a review of what we've now developed as an options

[0:07:13] Planner Chadwick (probable): table which which basically looks at every possible um option for ocp and lub amendment

[0:07:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): to support um more housing options in a community so this has been done for maine we've created the

[0:07:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): report and they've been provided with um with a list of the options and and that went to their

[0:07:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): last ltc in a perfect world if we had more time and we weren't chasing funding for maine we would

[0:07:39] Planner Chadwick (probable): would be looking to share that with First Nations and get some feedback before we moved to a review

[0:07:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): of actions but we don't because we are trying to move forward and be positioned to apply for

[0:07:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): funding in June we're not going to be able to do that here we'll find other opportunities to in the

[0:07:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): process but we will be so what we're we're moving towards now is developing an action plan that will

[0:08:07] Planner Chadwick (probable): be shared with the community so that's happening for maine at the end of this month um and because

[0:08:13] Planner Chadwick (probable): the community has been quite engaged in their housing project for the last four years um in

[0:08:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): this case that discussion is is more of an information meeting with with some opportunity

[0:08:25] Planner Chadwick (probable): for um questions and and um you know possible thing providing the community with an opportunity

[0:08:31] Planner Chadwick (probable): to maybe identify some of the things that the ltc can consider in in their meeting which will

[0:08:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): follow straight after that where they'll have to um they'll have to endorse an action plan

[0:08:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): so that staff me basically can then move forward and um and apply for the funding now in terms of

[0:08:56] Planner Chadwick (probable): staff resources for maine and for any other project that might be going this route um

[0:09:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): there is a requirement for this funding for an updated um housing needs assessment so there's

[0:09:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): a little bit of extra work that has to happen there um but for maine um you know they're they're

[0:09:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): pretty much on their way and um and then once the action plan is together we'll have another meeting

[0:09:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): to focus on business case for 2023-24 which will provide the opportunity to identify the priority

[0:09:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): areas um to move forward with so the so the the action plan which is over a four-year period

[0:09:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): that's what's required for the CMHC funding will go will be developed and then there's an

[0:09:44] Planner Chadwick (probable): opportunity to discuss the priorities for the next term and that's where you can also have

[0:09:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): further engagement. And then develop your project charter after, you know, in the new year. So

[0:09:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): that's, those are the basic steps for a project. And so I've described it, how we were expediting

[0:10:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): a little bit for Maine to be able to meet this, but Maine has been, you know, pretty much like

[0:10:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): well on their way. So in the context of an expedited process, and I looked at what an

[0:10:17] Planner Chadwick (probable): an expedited process would look like because i'd consider like this we have to look at this for

[0:10:21] Planner Chadwick (probable): a couple of other ltcs too and and we need to consider staff resources as well and um and so

[0:10:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): so if i can just jump in just

[0:10:31] Voice 2: for a quick moment here um what narissa is going to go through in

[0:10:35] Voice 2: this expedited process and for um the trustees listening years and for feedback is she's going

[0:10:43] Voice 2: going to go over the expedited process to meet the funding deadline application and what we want to

[0:10:50] Voice 2: get some feedback from you today is to highlight those pinch points for your direction yay or nay

[0:10:57] Voice 2: and some factors and considerations that you have about those those pinch points or the expedited

[0:11:03] Voice 2: process so just sort of listening out and and calling out any pieces that you have questions

[0:11:09] Voice 2: on for that expedited process what we want to come away with today is is a sense from you and

[0:11:16] Voice 2: a direction from you on which process you'd like to look at pursuing and how we can think about

[0:11:25] Voice 2: that if that's going to align with a potential funding application or if you want to stay the

[0:11:32] Voice 2: the course.

[0:11:33] Planner Chadwick (probable): Yeah, thanks for jumping in there, Renee. Sorry,

[0:11:38] Voice 3: I have to step away just for a

[0:11:40] Voice 3: second. I really want to hear what's being said, but I have to step away. Feel free to keep going

[0:11:44] Voice 3: if you need to. I'll be back.

[0:11:45] Planner Chadwick (probable): I'll wait because the next part's important.

[0:11:47] Voice 3: I will be right back.

[0:11:52] Voice 2: So perhaps, Nerissa, do you want to ask if there's any questions about this basic

[0:11:56] Voice 2: or this, you know, this process here?

[0:11:59] Planner Chadwick (probable): Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Yeah, I was moving a little

[0:12:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): little bit too far ahead thanks for thanks for bringing it back there um david uh david do you

[0:12:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): have any questions i

[0:12:11] Voice 4: am here yep i am here um so on demon i know we have we have one project that

[0:12:17] Voice 4: is desperately looking for money right now that's demon green

[0:12:21] Voice 8: um

[0:12:22] Voice 4: and obviously if there's any way

[0:12:25] Voice 4: that the local trust committee could could help them uh get that money we need to do that um

[0:12:31] Voice 4: They've achieved rezoning, so they've done all the work the community has been behind that project from the very get-go.

[0:12:39] Voice 4: And they're also incorporating a project which was stopped, unfortunately, the Pepper Lane, which was a seniors housing application.

[0:12:49] Voice 4: And they also achieved zoning, but the person that owns the land backed out.

[0:12:54] Voice 4: So that's an interesting dilemma that we have on DEMA.

[0:12:56] Voice 4: but at least five of the 20 units have been given over to that particular society for seniors

[0:13:04] Voice 4: housing so yeah any anything that we can as you say expedite for that what I wouldn't want it

[0:13:11] Voice 4: what I wouldn't want to happen is for the work that has preceded our our term the the housing

[0:13:18] Voice 4: review and those recommendations that we're looking at and those recommendations that we've

[0:13:23] Voice 4: that we've now got a housing advisory planning commission looked at i wouldn't i would want i

[0:13:28] Voice 4: wouldn't want to um i would want to make sure that that takes lead maybe in a parallel process

[0:13:35] Voice 4: yeah

[0:13:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): so so um david the the the program that cmhc has developed is entirely focused on

[0:13:44] Planner Chadwick (probable): on like, so the thing, the kinds of program areas

[0:13:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): that is interesting funding.

[0:13:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): So you need, the program areas need to focus on processes

[0:13:59] Planner Chadwick (probable): that will increase the potential number

[0:14:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): of future dwelling units essentially, right?

[0:14:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): So things like accessory dwelling unit,

[0:14:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): like flexible housing like Maine's done for example, you know, to allow additional dwelling

[0:14:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): units within a maximum square foot, whatever. Those are the kinds of programs that would

[0:14:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): get points. They're basically looking for increasing the potential number of dwelling

[0:14:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): units. That's the stuff that qualifies. And then the money can go to development of units,

[0:14:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): But it's it's based on targets a targeted number of units within this four year period.

[0:14:43] Planner Chadwick (probable): So then, well, any LTC would have to come up with a number.

[0:14:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): And the funding is allocated based on your target.

[0:14:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): You get a base amount of $20,000 per targeted dwelling unit, plus you get additional funding for multifamily, what they call a missing middle, which is kind of accessory dwelling units, affordable and non-profit led.

[0:15:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): um and so if for example you had a target of 100 units just to use a round number in four years

[0:15:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): and they were a mix of those things um you have the potential to get about three million dollars

[0:15:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): of funding so the question around how you would use that would have to be discussed like where

[0:15:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): would you get the most bang for your buck i mean as i understand that the denman green is sort of

[0:15:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): seven million plus project so depending on how they've figured out their financing model um you

[0:15:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): know we're putting a chunk there makes sense or you know the paisley place if that's something

[0:15:59] Planner Chadwick (probable): that could be done phased maybe there maybe there's opportunity to put there um put money

[0:16:05] Planner Chadwick (probable): there with the crd we're talking about for main island um the um possibility like they've been

[0:16:13] Planner Chadwick (probable): looking at developing a um accessory dwelling unit um subsidy program it's something that's part of

[0:16:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): their um it's part of their they've got a plan for they've actually got a uh a gulf islands um

[0:16:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): housing project that they want to get off the ground this would provide that opportunity

[0:16:31] Planner Chadwick (probable): and so it's likely that you know a good chunk of the money would be directed through this to the

[0:16:37] Planner Chadwick (probable): cid to deliver on that program because that's the e that would be the easiest thing to do

[0:16:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): the other because the other thing that the other consideration for Denman would be that there'd

[0:16:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): have to be conversations with the rural regional district to see how they could take our take the

[0:16:52] Planner Chadwick (probable): money and then redirect it because we as an organization can't do that we can't we are

[0:16:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): unable to just give money to a non-profit or what have you it would have to be directed through the

[0:17:03] Planner Chadwick (probable): regional district so that's a conversation to be had with the regional district like I said with

[0:17:08] Planner Chadwick (probable): maine becomes an easy one much easier as well because the crd has a program that they're

[0:17:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): developing they have a strategy that's politically supported um so they can they can um they can put

[0:17:23] Planner Chadwick (probable): their some resources towards development of that and it in the main con in the main context and

[0:17:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): this is and david you're probably like you're hearing some of this new because it's all evolving

[0:17:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): like these weeks we're having all these conversations so um um but uh uh Maine

[0:17:43] Planner Chadwick (probable): essentially is being looked at as a pilot for their their whole Gulf Islands um project so

[0:17:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): that's a bit of the context so so it's not um you couldn't just get the money and put it straight

[0:17:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): into a a specific product you'd have to think about it in terms of the of your action plan and

[0:18:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): And I'll show you kind of some of the action areas

[0:18:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): that I've drafted for Maine.

[0:18:05] Planner Chadwick (probable): So you can kind of get a sense of the kinds of areas

[0:18:08] Planner Chadwick (probable): and the kinds of things.

[0:18:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): So like on Denman, it may be a similar thing,

[0:18:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): like trying to look at like more of a,

[0:18:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): and it's about, so, you know, if your target is 50,

[0:18:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): then how do you, like, do you want to be directing part

[0:18:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): of that funding to like subsidizing the development

[0:18:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): of ADUs, for example, or bringing some of these, like the more, supporting the more unhealthy

[0:18:37] Planner Chadwick (probable): living conditions to be healthy, for example, you know, and, I mean, Denman has a unique

[0:18:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): circumstance, because you don't require building permits, so that actually provides a bit more

[0:18:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): flexibility, and I've talked to CMHC about, and that's the, that's the measure at the end of the

[0:18:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): the day but you get 75% of the funding regardless of whether you hit your targets or not but the

[0:19:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): measures is the setting and use permit so like I said it provides a bit more flexibility for Maine

[0:19:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): and we can you know we dig into the details of that through the as we start to have the

[0:19:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): conversation about the about the initiatives but it's a tight time frame to do that right

[0:19:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): it's very very tight time frame to do that and so can

[0:19:19] Voice 2: I just jump in just to recap so for the

[0:19:22] Voice 2: the funding application um we we qualify as being a rural community under certain population

[0:19:29] Voice 2: we um we need a housing action plan so that's part of this conversation today for your consideration

[0:19:37] Voice 2: um there's a lot of there's some pieces that nurse is going to go over to expedite a potential

[0:19:43] Voice 2: a potential work plan to be able to meet a funding deadline, whatever's in our action plan for Denman needs to equal siting use permits as targets.

[0:19:59] Voice 2: So the opportunity here is it sounds like there's different opportunities in the community that could fall within an action plan and we call those actions programs to implement them to equal siting use permits, which are the targets.

[0:20:20] Voice 2: it's the end of the end of the day we we achieve units built houses right dwelling units so i'm

[0:20:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): just

[0:20:29] Voice 2: trying to sort of help yeah um the end goal is getting the house yeah

[0:20:33] Planner Chadwick (probable): so let me just flip to

[0:20:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): here this will help you a little bit um so thank you so i've taken um i've taken main islands list

[0:20:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): of of options that i presented to them um and when they didn't say oh no absolutely not that one i

[0:20:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): I just looked at all of them and again they can and so under each one and I tried to find categories

[0:20:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): and this is also coached a little bit by the CMHC staff in terms of how you frame programs

[0:21:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): and you need to have a minimum of you need to have five for a small community and so we have

[0:21:07] Planner Chadwick (probable): the one program that I'm calling the living with the land program and that is where we look at the

[0:21:13] Planner Chadwick (probable): how we use the the data that we have available to identify where the better places to put additional density is so where there's water, and where it doesn't, when it has less less impact on the land so in Maine's case because the southern Gulf Islands have their have

[0:21:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): have done their groundwater availability assessments, we've

[0:21:39] Planner Chadwick (probable): been able to use that data, we're going to be looking at

[0:21:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): other data sources to to help improve our understanding of,

[0:21:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): like, you know, where the more vulnerable areas are like the

[0:21:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): no go areas, basically. For Denman, we would have to spend

[0:21:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): some of the sum of money, which we don't which probably be about

[0:21:56] Planner Chadwick (probable): $50,000 on doing the water availability analysis, because

[0:22:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): that's kind of like the minimum, I think, in terms of

[0:22:03] Planner Chadwick (probable): understanding that piece um and that is they've indicated that that is that is a supportable

[0:22:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): program for us because we're unique in that respect we kind of because it gives us an idea of

[0:22:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): of where to put the any additional housing um it helps us to pre-zone the land so for example

[0:22:23] Planner Chadwick (probable): if uh if we want to do some of like a an additional like um allowing um accessible

[0:22:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): donning units like not through TUP for example like then that would help to identify the areas

[0:22:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): where that would be more appropriate um so

[0:22:40] Voice 2: this program is a good example of the work that could

[0:22:43] Voice 2: fall under this yeah application funding that would help clear the way so to speak to get units

[0:22:50] Voice 2: on the ground yeah exactly

[0:22:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): so um and then the next three are the these are the planning

[0:22:58] Planner Chadwick (probable): These are the ones that are related to changes in the OCP and the LUB to facilitate more options for housing.

[0:23:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): So one of them, missing middle is the word they use.

[0:23:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): This is basically a success rate of dwelling units.

[0:23:18] Planner Chadwick (probable): So this would be that creating options for private landowners to develop additional dwelling units.

[0:23:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): And, like, you know, I keep referring to the flexible housing, so that whole, that's the idea of having number and additional dwelling units within a maximum square footage.

[0:23:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): So you've got the lens of, you know, limited land coverage there, conservation.

[0:23:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): I've identified one as alternative housing, and this is looking at alternative types of housing in alternative locations.

[0:23:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): So the alternative housing, you know, tiny homes has been a discussion for a while on Maine.

[0:24:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): I know I get the sense and I need to look, you know, I get the sense on Denman that maybe there's, we should be looking at other kinds of living arrangements.

[0:24:13] Planner Chadwick (probable): So, you know, allowing sleeping houses, for example, you know, in zoning, you know, connected to cooking facilities and all that sort of thing, as opposed to having to be all in one.

[0:24:31] Planner Chadwick (probable): And that's all got to do how we define dwelling and that's things that we can look at.

[0:24:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): But this also looks at expanding residential housing

[0:24:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): and other land designations.

[0:24:45] Planner Chadwick (probable): So, you know, community land estimation, you know,

[0:24:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): enabling the development of a coach house

[0:24:52] Planner Chadwick (probable): above the fire hall, for example, right?

[0:24:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): That kind of thing.

[0:24:55] Planner Chadwick (probable): So through these kinds of programs,

[0:24:57] Voice 2: by the program allowing us to do this research,

[0:25:03] Voice 2: activating the program,

[0:25:05] Voice 2: It allows the opportunity for people to apply for site and use permits to actually get the units built.

[0:25:11] Voice 2: To get the units built.

[0:25:12] Voice 2: Because

[0:25:13] Planner Chadwick (probable): they would be supported in the zoning through this program.

[0:25:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): They would be supported. Yeah, that's exactly. Thanks.

[0:25:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): Then there's a not-for-profit affordable housing.

[0:25:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): So that's where you're looking at providing the supports to processes, services.

[0:25:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): services like uh you know um for example or even building right i mean again i mean these are large

[0:25:37] Planner Chadwick (probable): projects so you'd have to think about how you can distribute the funding so you're going to get the

[0:25:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): most most bang for your buck most amount of units essentially at the end of the four-year period

[0:25:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): um on main we're going to be looking at rezoning for subdivisions in turn in in return for donations

[0:25:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): of land um for example we've got some opportunities possibly with habitat for humanity and um and i

[0:26:02] Planner Chadwick (probable): would be looking to having start having the conversations with habitat for humanity um that

[0:26:07] Planner Chadwick (probable): are in the sort of central island region for denman as well um and then and and so those are

[0:26:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): the land use those that's the work that i that planner would be doing right and we'd be working

[0:26:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): I'm working with you to identify the initiatives underneath those. And when I, you know, when I, my, my first looks through the Denman material a lot of the work that's been done in the past identify some very clear initiatives under those possible initiatives.

[0:26:37] Planner Chadwick (probable): And so then the other program here, this is the accessory, like, so this is again looking at the CRD's approach so and this is exactly their language they're developing this accessory dwelling unit incentive program so that that is the program to support the actual building of the dwellings that are the potential for which is created through the other programs.

[0:27:05] Planner Chadwick (probable): so the action program for denman would look similar to this um with with um initiatives that

[0:27:17] Planner Chadwick (probable): are suitable to the denman context so are there questions on what you're seeing here

[0:27:25] Voice 7: it's a lot yeah so

[0:27:29] Voice 4: what's jumping out at me is just the the time frame is totally is ridiculous

[0:27:36] Voice 4: I know how slowly any community works with change.

[0:27:42] Voice 4: Would

[0:27:42] Voice 2: you like to scroll to the expedited process and we can?

[0:27:46] Voice 2: Yeah,

[0:27:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): because the time frame is ridiculous.

[0:27:48] Voice 2: Just while you're sharing your thoughts.

[0:27:51] Voice 4: Yeah.

[0:27:52] Voice 4: So we have a very strong group of people on Devon who are conservation minded as we all should be.

[0:28:00] Voice 4: but if we don't tread carefully and at a pace that people are comfortable with we will be

[0:28:08] Voice 4: accused of ramming something onto our community and we don't want to do that so and I know that

[0:28:17] Voice 4: the government dangles these huge chunks of money and everybody scrambles and runs around like

[0:28:22] Voice 4: like we're doing right now like you're doing right now trying to fit but this won't be the only

[0:28:28] Voice 4: chunk of money that the government dangles this is just their first kick at the cat and i i just

[0:28:34] Voice 4: don't want i just don't want to put um the idea that we can pull this off with uh this this would

[0:28:43] Voice 4: be a miracle if we were able to get our five action plans approved and and our community going

[0:28:49] Voice 4: yeah great by june i mean it's it's almost may so

[0:28:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): and this is this is the kind of feedback we're

[0:28:56] Planner Chadwick (probable): looking for like we want we this is exactly the kind of feedback if it if it was like oh yeah

[0:29:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): this is a slam dunk we know exactly what we're doing our community will be right on board with

[0:29:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): whatever we decide there's

[0:29:06] Voice 4: a certain percentage of the community that would be right on side

[0:29:10] Voice 8: is

[0:29:10] Voice 4: it the majority i i couldn't say that and there'll be a there'll be another chunk of our

[0:29:15] Voice 4: community who are absolutely dead set against it because it looks like we're densifying for no

[0:29:20] Voice 4: particular reason other than qualifying for a chunk of cash and

[0:29:23] Voice 8: we don't want

[0:29:23] Voice 4: to go down that

[0:29:23] Voice 4: So I would rather go slowly, methodically, carefully,

[0:29:28] Voice 8: and

[0:29:29] Voice 4: not worry about the money this time around. That's just my feeling. As hard as it is for me to say that, because I am a

[0:29:39] Voice 4: Scotsman. Every penny is important.

[0:29:42] Voice 4: yes

[0:29:43] Voice 2: yeah yeah

[0:29:44] Voice 4: and

[0:29:45] Voice 2: the opportunity for um the good work that would be done through a

[0:29:50] Voice 2: a housing project process will still situate the community well for when the next opportunity comes

[0:30:00] Voice 2: up yeah

[0:30:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): exactly so so i mean this is an expedited process and the thing is if it's going to like you

[0:30:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): know if you have any feel like there's that feeling of oh my goodness this would never work

[0:30:10] Planner Chadwick (probable): for us this feels like a process that's being imposed on us and our community will feel like

[0:30:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): that then please absolutely you know this is what we'd be looking at you're still going to have

[0:30:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): you're still going to have you're going to have a you're still going to have a process where you're

[0:30:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): going to come up with actions and develop an action plan and it's just at the pace at a pace

[0:30:31] Planner Chadwick (probable): that works for the community i

[0:30:34] Voice 4: just know um historically the two non-profit organizations

[0:30:38] Voice 4: that have struggled so hard to to uh to create housing are thwarted a by the fact that there

[0:30:44] Voice 4: is no land available other than land that is given to them or sold to them at a ridiculously

[0:30:48] Voice 4: cheap price and and you know that's that's not something you can plan for um and b affordable

[0:30:54] Voice 4: Affordable housing has been provided by people that own land under the wire, illegally, let's just put it that way, for decades.

[0:31:04] Voice 8: And

[0:31:05] Voice 4: my hope is that with this revision that we're going through right now, we can finally admit that this is the way we are, in fact, living on Denman.

[0:31:14] Voice 4: And let's legitimize how we are

[0:31:16] Voice 4: living on Denman and make it easier for people who are providing affordable housing to do it with their heads above water and not underwater.

[0:31:23] Voice 4: water which is a little different than what this process outlines and i well

[0:31:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): not necessarily like

[0:31:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): i mean this

[0:31:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): process is is actually about exactly what you said and for denman the more i get my

[0:31:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): head into denman i feel exactly the same way is like you know that one of the first things i want

[0:31:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): to look at is um is uh uh those um the bylaw uh files right and let's see how we can legalize

[0:31:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): the things that that you know were potentially enforced on um so i think i'm actually i mean

[0:31:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): my perspective is similar from yours um trustee graham is that let's look at the thing let's look

[0:32:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): at legalizing what already exists and that's what

[0:32:03] Voice 2: come through identifying key actions for your

[0:32:07] Voice 2: housing action plan with that discussion and what do we want to help solve and then that could be

[0:32:14] Voice 2: a program or that can be a recommendation coming through that action plan right so

[0:32:19] Voice 2: yeah it's seamless where it's already identified in the housing action plan for um for us to act

[0:32:27] Voice 2: on and then if opportunities come up for funding they're already included in an action plan that

[0:32:32] Voice 2: we can pull into or pull from right

[0:32:35] Voice 8: yeah

[0:32:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah

[0:32:37] Voice 2: yeah

[0:32:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): totally yeah well so this is i mean this

[0:32:42] Planner Chadwick (probable): is great feedback because this is exactly what we needed to to know and hear um because there

[0:32:47] Planner Chadwick (probable): are other ltcs that are like that are saying what about us can we do this and what we're saying is

[0:32:52] Planner Chadwick (probable): oh my like it it creates great stress to to have to expedite a process so from a staffing

[0:32:59] Planner Chadwick (probable): perspective we need basically to figure out within the next couple of weeks um you know which which

[0:33:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): which LTCs we can move through this process.

[0:33:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): And we keep coming back to like main feels comfortable

[0:33:13] Planner Chadwick (probable): because they already have many of their ducks in a row

[0:33:18] Planner Chadwick (probable): because they've already been working on it for four years.

[0:33:21] Planner Chadwick (probable): And mostly other LTCs are just coming to their processes

[0:33:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): and beginning their processes.

[0:33:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): So, I mean, where you're coming from makes perfect sense.

[0:33:31] Voice 2: And we wanted to check in with you

[0:33:33] Voice 2: because you could be closer.

[0:33:35] Voice 2: so i'm just curious to hear from the other trustees on any questions or comments on the

[0:33:41] Voice 2: basic or the expedited process um

[0:33:46] Voice 3: yeah i mean i think i think um and

[0:33:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): this is the expedited process

[0:33:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): right so

[0:33:50] Voice 3: it's super yeah i think

[0:33:53] Voice 3: david graham makes a really good point in in terms of uh you

[0:33:57] Voice 3: know and really in in a perfect world uh we would absolutely be ready to move on on all this sort of

[0:34:04] Voice 3: stuff and and lay out plans and and do that sort of stuff it is a tremendous amount of work to do

[0:34:09] Voice 3: in a short period of time um and uh yeah we we run the risk just by the nature of doing it quickly

[0:34:18] Voice 3: regardless of whether the work can be done or not i think just by the nature of doing it it quickly

[0:34:23] Voice 3: we run the risk of of being um uh opposed on principle uh of of having done it quickly um and

[0:34:33] Voice 3: I think, um, we're still in a place of really needing to, um, rebuild connections with,

[0:34:42] Voice 3: with our community, uh, as, as the LTC. Um, and so I think, you know, this, we've done,

[0:34:50] Voice 3: we've done some really good work, I think so far to help ease some of the pressure for on,

[0:34:55] Voice 3: on the housing things in general. Um, but there's, you know, especially that the, the,

[0:35:01] Voice 3: i know that both david graham and i are very environmentally conscious like we're we both

[0:35:07] Voice 3: feel really strongly about making sure any choices that happen are are environmentally informed um

[0:35:14] Voice 3: we also care about housing but but the environment part is a really significant part and i think

[0:35:19] Voice 3: we've done some good work in terms of helping support the housing advocates on island uh or

[0:35:26] Voice 3: or moving towards that there's still work to do um but we do need to be really conscious that

[0:35:32] Voice 3: we're not alienating the other the other perspective um and yeah i mean i think and

[0:35:39] Voice 3: this is what what uh planner chadwick is talking about in terms of like and and what david graham

[0:35:46] Voice 3: is talking about in terms of yeah legitimizing the things that already exist the greenest house

[0:35:51] Voice 3: to build is always the one that's already there um so finding ways to to um encourage those

[0:35:58] Voice 3: those housing options to come in out of the cold as it were i think is a really is is a thing i

[0:36:05] Voice 3: don't know that i'm not and i'm maybe i'm being maybe i'm just wrong with this but i don't know

[0:36:11] Voice 3: that there's i think there's a lot of work that we have to do as an ltc to examine bylaws and to

[0:36:15] Voice 3: to examine that sort of stuff but i don't know that a lot of that is um like i don't know i'm

[0:36:26] Voice 3: still learning the process but i i don't know how much of that is i think a lot of that is actually

[0:36:30] Voice 3: just work that we have to do with with planners uh on on what our lub and ocp says as opposed to

[0:36:39] Voice 3: trying to come up with projects that we can pitch to cvrd and others um possibly yeah so

[0:36:46] Voice 3: So

[0:36:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): whatever, whatever happens with this project has to come from, like, it has to be based on the community.

[0:36:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): So, like, I don't want you to be thinking that I'm, I'm thinking of imposing anything that's not

[0:36:59] Voice 8: going to emerge from.

[0:37:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): So, so regardless of what process it, and I mean, what's coming through really clearly is that an expedited process is just not going to, it's just not going to feel good.

[0:37:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): and

[0:37:14] Voice 3: getting it

[0:37:15] Planner Chadwick (probable): it's

[0:37:16] Voice 3: i even if it was exactly what everyone wanted i fear that people would

[0:37:19] Voice 3: shoot it down just right

[0:37:21] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah yeah just yeah totally just be just because it's coming in so

[0:37:25] Planner Chadwick (probable): quickly and

[0:37:26] Voice 3: it would impact our ability to do good work in the same vein next year or the year after

[0:37:33] Voice 3: you know totally so

[0:37:35] Voice 2: through the chair perhaps if um there's any other questions it sounds like

[0:37:40] Voice 2: Like, we're leaning towards the basic process.

[0:37:45] Voice 2: This could be also an opportunity in the next few minutes to spend some time maybe talking about a little bit about that, Nerissa, if you would be okay with shifting gears to sort of familiarize ourselves with what the trustees can expect from the other, the basic process.

[0:38:03] Voice 2: From the basic

[0:38:03] Planner Chadwick (probable): process. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[0:38:05] Planner Chadwick (probable): yeah yeah so um with the basic process see with the basic process too like we're we're right here

[0:38:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): so we can we can also integrate the first nations engagement piece um and again this this is a

[0:38:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): process this is a a draft process right so this is a process that we would like present you know

[0:38:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): this is a process that i would present to you and say does this process make sense to you

[0:38:29] Planner Chadwick (probable): um like where do you see the engagement pieces in this process and and and it can evolve as well

[0:38:34] Planner Chadwick (probable): right um the first part we'll be drafting this discussion paper so i understand like your next

[0:38:41] Planner Chadwick (probable): you don't actually have a may meeting so if you're not looking at expediting the the process then we

[0:38:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): don't need to have a may meeting that'll give me more time to um to put this discussion paper

[0:38:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): together um and and that feels that feels good um um and also to think through a little bit what

[0:38:59] Planner Chadwick (probable): the first nations engagement piece could look like what the what your options might be for that

[0:39:05] Planner Chadwick (probable): And, and then that would be your June meeting I would actually try and come up to them in between now in June so that I can have a look at some of the, you know, some of those files that those properties that were that had by law files on them, as well as some of, you know,

[0:39:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): i'd like to you know meet with you like have a let's have a conversation and check out some of

[0:39:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): the other areas that uh um um you know are unusual right and so um um you know that'll help to inform

[0:39:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): actions ultimately right and if for

[0:39:40] Voice 2: example there's um there's comments or thoughts from the

[0:39:44] Voice 2: from from you trustees to how to or when um to include the housing apc members um in in addition

[0:39:54] Voice 2: to you know community information meetings at key junctures you know around the drafting of

[0:40:01] Voice 2: an action plan or you know running those those um those pieces out with them and getting their

[0:40:08] Voice 2: comments um narissa can build that into the work plan yeah so that yeah

[0:40:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): so basically like meeting

[0:40:16] Planner Chadwick (probable): two would be actually like developing yeah so it's having actions um potential actions but also

[0:40:25] Planner Chadwick (probable): a work plan for the what what will move forward right so in fact meeting one i think i would

[0:40:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): actually bring the discussion paper and and a you know draft sort of project plan for this

[0:40:38] Planner Chadwick (probable): pre-phase, which will include having these discussions about the engagement pieces and

[0:40:43] Planner Chadwick (probable): so forth, and then moving forward from there.

[0:40:49] Planner Chadwick (probable): So then we'd be having conversations about potential actions, exploring them a little

[0:40:57] Planner Chadwick (probable): bit more, and creating a work plan that will identify where you want the APC to be involved,

[0:41:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): where you want think the community should be involved like I mean on this is this here is

[0:41:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): really like uh like I said it's it's just a it's just a template um it's just a starting point

[0:41:19] Planner Chadwick (probable): right you can you could be like well I think we need like CIM earlier or or whatever or we need

[0:41:25] Planner Chadwick (probable): our our RAPC to be involved earlier we can work on this and just figure out what what makes sense

[0:41:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): to you if

[0:41:35] Voice 4: through the chair if i may so at our last uh local trust committee meeting i think you

[0:41:41] Voice 4: you saw narissa the the file that had been compiled by the housing um hag yeah housing

[0:41:48] Voice 4: and i've got i've

[0:41:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): been carrying around that like this much of paper with me like from home to here

[0:41:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): to because i work part and part and i've been carrying this chunk of paper around so so that

[0:42:00] Voice 4: That information chronicles the many studies that have happened on Demand and identified in hard numbers the number of rentals that we need.

[0:42:14] Voice 4: And I think the latest one was 2018, but there may even be something that's newer.

[0:42:18] Voice 4: So if all that data creates the plan, the plan is to build those.

[0:42:27] Voice 4: And how we build those, well, the track record of the two volunteer organizations is what it is. I don't want to qualify it. It's just what it is. It takes a long time, A, to find property, B, to go through the rezoning.

[0:42:45] Voice 4: And unfortunately, one of the unique aspects of land on Denman is almost half of it is in the agricultural land reserve, which adds another complication to any rezoning application because it involves an exclusion.

[0:42:57] Voice 4: And we don't have any control other than putting that application forward with, you know, pages and pages of please exclude this.

[0:43:04] Voice 4: And so the wheels can come off that wagon at so many levels.

[0:43:10] Voice 4: So the only land that's available to address our housing is privately owned.

[0:43:17] Voice 4: And the people who, because they have the mindset that they don't, that they have the, they look at values other than monetary values when they're looking at their community, those people are willing to share their land.

[0:43:28] Voice 4: And so the review that's been done really spells out the solutions, really, the solutions to our housing.

[0:43:36] Voice 4: And the Housing Advisory Commission, their job is really just try to punch holes in those recommendations or endorse them or add to them.

[0:43:46] Voice 4: And I want them to really focus on those recommendations because they do talk about the ones that are going to work on this island.

[0:43:54] Voice 4: And so what I'm suggesting is a narrowing of focus, a very, very focused work for the Housing Advisory Planning Commission so that we can take that to our community in a community information meeting and present a unified voice between the Local Trust Committee and the Housing Advisory Commission and saying, look, based on our experience and the work that has proceeded and this group of people who represent our community, this is what we think.

[0:44:23] Voice 4: what do you think and you know

[0:44:25] Voice 4: so i'm i'm a pragmatist and i i can appreciate the housing

[0:44:29] Voice 4: project and how it fits into more of a a higher level planning perspective but i don't want to

[0:44:36] Voice 4: do that i want to get some solutions done i want to get i want to empower people who own land and

[0:44:41] Voice 4: who are willing to share their land to start putting nails in wood like tomorrow yeah and so

[0:44:46] Voice 4: that that's i'm not discounting this work it's important this

[0:44:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): is that work um well i know

[0:44:53] Planner Chadwick (probable): So it is this

[0:44:55] Voice 4: language that you understand intimately.

[0:44:57] Voice 4: It's not language that I or my community understand.

[0:45:00] Voice 4: Right.

[0:45:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): My

[0:45:01] Voice 4: community understands when they hear in the background, bang, bang, bang, saw, saw, saw.

[0:45:06] Voice 4: That's what my community understands.

[0:45:09] Voice 4: And so

[0:45:09] Voice 4: when you talk about projects and housing and all this stuff, they don't understand.

[0:45:14] Voice 4: All they say is, oh, my God, more paper.

[0:45:16] Voice 4: paper and and I you know that's just the reality of how people who are not in your world are

[0:45:23] Voice 4: struggling to make a living on Denman Island and are struggling to find a roof over their head that

[0:45:26] Voice 4: doesn't leak and keep them warm and their children

[0:45:29] Voice 4: can be safe so I'm just sharing with you any

[0:45:33] Voice 4: reaction you're going to get from this community if we start talking about a housing project or

[0:45:39] Voice 4: or these high level planning ideas, it's, I'm going to have to run away. I'm going to run out

[0:45:47] Voice 4: of the room if that's what happens. Anyway.

[0:45:48] Planner Chadwick (probable): I totally, I totally hear what you're, where you're

[0:45:51] Planner Chadwick (probable): coming from. And I'll just say like, you know, the, the, the advantage, like, you know, you need

[0:45:59] Planner Chadwick (probable): to have a plan, you know, if you build a house, you need to know where your, your walls are going,

[0:46:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): how big your foundation is going to be and all that kind of stuff. This is basically that, right?

[0:46:09] Planner Chadwick (probable): Right. It's just figuring out the basics so that everybody knows what those basics are.

[0:46:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): So when your contractors come along there, they know that this is the size of the foundation.

[0:46:20] Planner Chadwick (probable): The walls are going here. The rooms are going, you know, that that's really what it is.

[0:46:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): And as you get into the project, things change, too. Right.

[0:46:27] Planner Chadwick (probable): Like you're like, oh, actually, we want a bigger bedroom or whatever.

[0:46:31] Planner Chadwick (probable): But this is this is what the plan will basically provide.

[0:46:35] Planner Chadwick (probable): But the other thing that an action plan will provide you with is flagging those things that are problem in your community, like the agricultural land reserve, for example, putting it in a place that says this is a problem that needs to be dealt with.

[0:46:50] Planner Chadwick (probable): This is how it needs to be dealt with. And whether you manage to deal with it in your term or it happens in another term, it's there and it's identified.

[0:47:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): And, you know, when the Agricultural Land Reserve decides to reevaluate their processes, you have it there, you know what you're writing in that letter or your delegation to the Agricultural Land Reserve, you know, so it provides that opportunity to move some of these things to take advantage of the opportunities that might present themselves to move these things, these types of things that have been a conversation in the community forever, right?

[0:47:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): Right. And through

[0:47:30] Voice 2: the chair, there's another opportunity or and the opportunity to, you know, for us to say, OK, how do we always relate this back to getting houses built, getting homes built?

[0:47:45] Voice 2: so that could be some of the ways that us as planners message that through this project

[0:47:52] Voice 2: and um and some ideas on how do we better communicate that for community members is

[0:48:00] Voice 2: through you know brochures for example or information or you know explaining that in

[0:48:06] Voice 2: presentations so lots of opportunity there some good comments and

[0:48:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): it's also when the you know

[0:48:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): when the funding comes around again like you've created the policies that have legitimated the

[0:48:17] Planner Chadwick (probable): things that currently exist in your community and maybe there needs to be um you know a little bit

[0:48:24] Planner Chadwick (probable): of help for those property owners that are providing those additional accommodations and so

[0:48:28] Planner Chadwick (probable): you know when the funding programs come around you have a you have you know what you're doing

[0:48:33] Planner Chadwick (probable): you're already like sort of working at it slowly and it's legitimate it's legal and then when the

[0:48:40] Planner Chadwick (probable): the funding program comes, you might get a burst.

[0:48:45] Voice 4: Thank you. Thank you for that. I'll just add one

[0:48:47] Voice 4: more little unique aspect to Denman Island. We have an up zone that went from one house to 15

[0:48:55] Voice 4: houses. There's over 40 people living on this particular 80 acre parcel. They get all of their

[0:49:02] Voice 4: domestic water from rain. So they didn't have to find out if the aquifer was strong enough to

[0:49:09] Voice 4: to handle the housing.

[0:49:10] Voice 4: They just went ahead and put some cisterns up

[0:49:13] Voice 4: and that's the water that they use.

[0:49:15] Voice 4: And that's the kind of grassroots solutions

[0:49:20] Voice 4: that demo knowledge have always done.

[0:49:22] Voice 4: We can't all afford the super duper

[0:49:26] Voice 4: three-stage septic systems.

[0:49:28] Voice 4: So we have pit toilets in our land use bylaw.

[0:49:30] Voice 4: Sometimes a pit toilet is the answer

[0:49:33] Voice 4: or a composting toilet.

[0:49:34] Voice 4: And I know that these things aren't necessarily allowed

[0:49:38] Voice 4: by the various regulatory bodies.

[0:49:41] Voice 4: But that's what happens on Denman Island.

[0:49:44] Voice 4: And that's people have been living with these,

[0:49:45] Voice 4: some would say substandard,

[0:49:47] Voice 4: the people would say minimalist solutions for decades.

[0:49:52] Voice 4: And the wheels, the world hasn't stopped.

[0:49:55] Voice 8: Yeah.

[0:49:55] Voice 4: Anyway, I don't want to get lost on the work

[0:49:59] Voice 4: that we just did in camera.

[0:50:00] Voice 4: So now we've got a housing advisory planning commission.

[0:50:02] Voice 4: I just want to make sure that they A,

[0:50:04] Voice 4: get the study or the review.

[0:50:07] Voice 4: and and also they get um the ocp uh portion of the ocp that deals with housing and the land use

[0:50:14] Voice 4: bylaw and so that they have all the tools in their in their basket and they also i believe

[0:50:19] Voice 4: need some direction from the local trust committee when do we give them that

[0:50:23] Planner Chadwick (probable): so um i'll put together

[0:50:25] Planner Chadwick (probable): a report that has exactly the things that you've identified in it um and and then that's the point

[0:50:32] Planner Chadwick (probable): at which you provide the direction so you'll you'll get a chance to review that material before

[0:50:36] Planner Chadwick (probable): And then you pass your resolution to pass it to the APC and then you can give them how much time you know identify how much time you want to give them or what have you.

[0:50:45] Planner Chadwick (probable): You can also identify the staff, if more information is needed so that so I'll provide you with basically, you know, an overview of all, I'm going to look through that stack and synthesize it in some, you know, in a way that's hopefully going to make sense.

[0:51:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): um and also look at the bylaws that's that's a that's a significant part of the process too

[0:51:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): and then you may decide you want some something more and i can provide that as well and you can

[0:51:12] Planner Chadwick (probable): also you know at that point um make a resolution to pass it on to the the apc for review can you

[0:51:19] Voice 4: give me some sense as to the time when when will we be able to uh empower the housing advisory

[0:51:25] Voice 4: planning committee another person

[0:51:26] Planner Chadwick (probable): june meeting june so uh june 6th

[0:51:32] Voice 7: is the meeting date okay

[0:51:42] Voice 7: wonderful so just

[0:51:44] Voice 5: to out to to further the the basic processor housing project timeline

[0:51:49] Voice 5: is basically what you're referring is that each meeting is an is a regular ltc meeting so when we

[0:51:56] Voice 5: go meeting one meeting two meeting three meeting four we're if we're meeting every two months it's

[0:52:00] Voice 5: basically an eight month eight month process depending

[0:52:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): right i mean it really depends on

[0:52:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): and you could also you might need you might want additional meetings for specific things but but

[0:52:11] Planner Chadwick (probable): yes i mean the the general sense is that it's it's following uh regular ltc meetings and again

[0:52:18] Planner Chadwick (probable): the timing of those specific it may not be one meeting after another right like i mean if

[0:52:22] Planner Chadwick (probable): if uh if if if ltc decides they want a whole other piece for staff to do a big chunk of work

[0:52:30] Planner Chadwick (probable): that's going to take a lot of time, then the next meeting, it may not be the next LTC meeting, it may be the next one after that or if there needs to be some kind of a community engagement or whatever, you know, so the timing of the meetings will be decided,

[0:52:46] Planner Chadwick (probable): will need to be decided as we sort of, as the project evolves, the project charter,

[0:52:56] Planner Chadwick (probable): basically the work plan will be, you know, identify these sort of point, decision points.

[0:53:03] Voice 5: So, but basically the progress is basically at the will of the LTC, not of the calendar.

[0:53:10] Voice 5: So if

[0:53:11] Voice 8: things

[0:53:12] Voice 5: take a little bit more time, that's what the LTC decides.

[0:53:15] Voice 5: if if they want to do a leapfrog type of thing we can have an extra meeting as needed so

[0:53:20] Voice 5: um the trustees are are basically in charge of the timing yeah okay so you guys

[0:53:27] Voice 5: know what you

[0:53:28] Voice 5: got to do if

[0:53:29] Voice 2: i may clarify through the chair so narissa you'd be providing a um this basic process

[0:53:36] Voice 2: you'd be um drafting something to share for the ltc to review as a as a work plan so to speak

[0:53:44] Voice 2: week with the you'll still see the key steps here and maybe attach some target dates for

[0:53:52] Voice 2: and some tasks of when the CIM would be when we would want Comet back from the HAPC would that

[0:54:01] Voice 2: come at the June meeting as well yeah

[0:54:04] Planner Chadwick (probable): just thinking about it right so this is a process

[0:54:06] Planner Chadwick (probable): in evolution and I think it would make sense for that to come at the June meeting understanding

[0:54:12] Voice 2: that this is something for feedback and it can be changed right and we can check in we can use that

[0:54:20] Voice 2: to check in to see how we're doing with what step we're currently in and what the next steps are

[0:54:25] Voice 2: so i think that will be helpful yeah yeah trust you graham

[0:54:33] Voice 4: thank you i know that the

[0:54:35] Voice 4: housing advisory planning commission members are keen to do some work and now we have the review

[0:54:42] Voice 4: we have the the finished review and we have uh our official community plan and a land use bylaw so

[0:54:48] Voice 4: there's there are three documents that we don't need a project charter we don't need uh anything

[0:54:53] Voice 4: more than those three documents and and those seven individuals to at least have an opportunity

[0:54:58] Voice 4: to start digging in to familiarize themselves i know i know many of the members of the

[0:55:04] Voice 4: hapc are already very familiar with ocp and land use bylaw that exists but others won't be

[0:55:09] Voice 4: So that would give them a chance in May, just to sit around and look at stuff and become more familiar with it. And then when we meet in June, I think it seems reasonable for our committee, if we can, be prepared to make the resolution to the HAPC to give them direction as to what we want.

[0:55:29] Voice 4: And by giving them some time in May to familiarize themselves with the review and with the OCP and with the LU bylaws that are pertinent to housing, we'll just push this a little bit faster.

[0:55:43] Voice 4: And that's not a bad thing at that stage to get them at least up to speed.

[0:55:49] Voice 4: I always worry about when we have to approve charters, and I know that's a very useful planning tool.

[0:55:54] Voice 4: I get that. But the changes that have to be made to enact what we need immediately are very simple.

[0:56:02] Voice 4: They really are. We're not going to be reinventing the wheel here. This is really simple stuff.

[0:56:07] Voice 4: In fact, if you look at our official community plan, it's full of really good language which works for the changes that we hope happen at the LUL stage.

[0:56:19] Voice 4: stage so if if you have the time i'm hoping that in may you you perhaps can send that information

[0:56:25] Voice 4: to the members before our june meeting i would really appreciate it if you can do that and i'm

[0:56:30] Voice 4: i'm willing to help too um i think paper copies just make it a lot easier rather than referring

[0:56:35] Voice 4: people to the website if that's also possible we don't need the whole ocp we don't need the

[0:56:39] Voice 4: whole lub just the sections that are pertinent to housing would work i think all

[0:56:49] Voice 7: right so is

[0:56:50] Voice 7: everybody sort of comfortable

[0:56:51] Voice 5: with the word for okay you got something more yeah so i'm

[0:56:54] Planner Chadwick (probable): just thinking we should get that direction kind of uh official um with a resolution

[0:57:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): to pro for staff to provide the apc with and you you identified a number of um resources so if we

[0:57:08] Planner Chadwick (probable): could just get that um i like down in a resolution i think that that would be helpful for staff

[0:57:14] Voice 4: thank you and i apologize to vicky bachmann because i'm going to do this without having

[0:57:18] Voice 4: having done the pre-work.

[0:57:20] Voice 4: So I move that the Demmon Local Trust Committee

[0:57:24] Voice 4: ask staff to provide the members

[0:57:31] Voice 4: of the Housing Advisory Planning Commission

[0:57:34] Voice 4: with the following documents.

[0:57:38] Voice 4: Let's just go with the OCP, the Land Use By-law

[0:57:42] Voice 4: and the Housing Review for their gap period.

[0:57:50] Voice 4: I don't think that needs to be more than that. I made it easier by saying the entire OCP and LUB because then you don't have to try and figure out what you're going to send them.

[0:57:57] Voice 4: Thank you.

[0:57:59] Voice 4: They'll find it.

[0:58:00] Planner Chadwick (probable): We did

[0:58:01] Planner Chadwick (probable): have one of our eager young new planners do a review of every LTC, so I may be able to pull on his work.

[0:58:14] Planner Chadwick (probable): so okay

[0:58:15] Voice 5: so is there a secondary okay any further discussion on that

[0:58:21] Voice 7: no ready to go so call the vote

[0:58:24] Voice 7: all in favor that carries thank you finer chat

[0:58:30] Voice 5: does that sort of tick your boxes yeah that's

[0:58:33] Voice 2: helpful thank you okay and

[0:58:35] Voice 2: if i quick question through the chair just to um clarify as well so

[0:58:40] Voice 2: to understand the hapc would have those so this direction gives the gives us the staff to

[0:58:46] Voice 2: to send the HAPC those documents that could include the discussion paper as well if that's

[0:58:54] Voice 2: ready based on we'll be ready until the June meeting so that's what that that direction will

[0:59:00] Voice 2: be so we can just go ahead and do that and send them their referrals and that sort of thing

[0:59:04] Voice 7: perfect all

[0:59:06] Voice 5: right is there anything else on this topic um

[0:59:10] Voice 3: just slightly related to to that and this

[0:59:13] Voice 3: This is an auxiliary thing, and I've just remembered, and this can be something that we address at a different time.

[0:59:20] Voice 3: I was talking with a resident on the island not too long ago.

[0:59:27] Voice 3: It seems that we used to have hard copies of the bylaws at our library here, but it seems like those are no longer there or they're incomplete or out of date.

[0:59:40] Voice 3: and it is valuable for a number of members of our community especially those who are

[0:59:45] Voice 3: less tech savvy to have hard copies of the bylaws so I was just wanted to my understanding is that

[0:59:53] Voice 3: it's not complete and I just wanted to know what what we need to do to address that well I see

[0:59:59] Voice 5: Renee has

[1:00:00] Voice 5: up so i think she has the address thank

[1:00:03] Voice 2: you through the chair um we can't so i i want to

[1:00:07] Voice 2: recognize the um the challenge with providing paper copies is it may not be the current

[1:00:17] Voice 2: active bylaw so the ocp or the lub so um that's something to be mindful of we could we could

[1:00:25] Voice 2: provide um some paper copies um i'm not sure if there would be a fee to print that or how that

[1:00:31] Voice 2: would work but that's doable so we can work out the details in the background um it would just

[1:00:36] Voice 2: be mindful that community members would understand and we can maybe add something there to say for

[1:00:43] Voice 2: the most current bylaws you'd have to go to the website 100

[1:00:47] Voice 3: absolutely i don't and i don't think

[1:00:48] Voice 3: that's the the question i think the thing was just that it um right i and i i yeah i don't

[1:00:56] Voice 3: i mean i'm interested to hear what what the thought is in terms of like costs on that

[1:01:01] Voice 3: obviously i understand there's cost to produce that material but i do think that there is a

[1:01:05] Voice 3: uh it's important that the community have the ability to access a version of that and i think

[1:01:11] Voice 3: there was some question too about um being able to to have some of the history of of bylaws that

[1:01:17] Voice 3: have existed prior. Obviously, I don't think it has to be exhaustive. I don't think it has to be

[1:01:22] Voice 3: every bylaw that has ever existed, ever. But it is important to have a version that is accessible

[1:01:31] Voice 3: here on island. And especially as we look into the future and with the understanding that there

[1:01:41] Voice 3: is the requirement now for us to have an accessibility committee at trust council level,

[1:01:46] Voice 3: I think it's really important to have that is a medium. The digital medium is not something that is universally accessible to everyone. And I'm not expecting us to get it all in Braille and also an audiobook version, but I think it would be really valuable to have a version.

[1:02:08] Voice 3: And absolutely, we can put disclaimers saying, hey, look, this may not be, you know, 100% up to date in life, in real time, but having a version, a complete version would be, even if it's just complete in the moment that it's issued, would be really valuable.

[1:02:24] Voice 5: I'm sure that can be accomplished. It doesn't take too much to put a cardstock cover on it, a Surlox bind, so it's something that's readily accessible to the community.

[1:02:35] Voice 5: I'm just thinking like our library on Main Island,

[1:02:39] Voice 5: they have the bylaws.

[1:02:39] Voice 5: It's that we always seem to have the bylaws right there.

[1:02:42] Voice 5: I've heard people comment about that.

[1:02:44] Voice 5: So I don't, the budget thing, that's a whole other thing.

[1:02:48] Voice 5: That's Renee's problem, but I'm sure we can do it.

[1:02:51] Voice 5: Yeah, it has existed in the past, apparently, so.

[1:02:57] Voice 5: In fact, you know, we might even be able to drill down.

[1:03:00] Voice 5: It might even be somewhere in trust policies somewhere.

[1:03:02] Voice 5: Anyhow, Trustee Graham.

[1:03:04] Voice 5: him

[1:03:04] Voice 4: yeah um we we as a past trustee we always had hard copies in a binder and just a cover page

[1:03:10] Voice 4: saying uh this may not be uh totally up to date but it's it's as good we only need one one binder

[1:03:17] Voice 4: for the lub and one binder for the ocp and if there's a cost we have a budget the local trust

[1:03:21] Voice 4: committee has a budget so you know do you need a motion to create those two documents send them to

[1:03:26] Voice 4: either of us and we'll make sure it gets in the library you don't even have to send it to the

[1:03:29] Voice 4: the library just send it to us yeah the

[1:03:31] Voice 2: chair if you want to make a um a motion and a resolution

[1:03:35] Voice 2: i can then figure out i can take care of all those details and just make sure it it lands to you

[1:03:42] Voice 2: wherever it may end up

[1:03:43] Voice 5: great trustee graham well i was gonna i think it was for your trustee

[1:03:47] Voice 5: brothway mine's

[1:03:52] Voice 3: linear so yeah i moved that the i'm sorry i'll vicky i'll slow down um i moved

[1:04:00] Voice 3: that the denman island local trust committee requests staff to

[1:04:06] Voice 7: i don't know how

[1:04:17] Voice 3: best to frame

[1:04:17] Voice 3: that am i requesting this of you renee or am i giving you a directive i guess is the question

[1:04:23] Voice 3: sorry through

[1:04:26] Voice 2: the chair it could um include something like request staff to provide paper

[1:04:31] Voice 2: copies of the ocp and lub bylaws um to trustees for demon island perfect

[1:04:40] Voice 3: yes um yeah i'll start

[1:04:42] Voice 3: again with the key um i move that the demon island local trust committee um requests staff

[1:04:49] Voice 3: to provide hard copies of the Demmon Island land use bylaws and OCP is that

[1:05:00] Voice 3: what I said yes and an official community plan to trustees

[1:05:08] Voice 7: to local to

[1:05:09] Voice 7: the local trustees perfect so Vicki you got that clear enough yes I do

[1:05:20] Voice 7: okay so secondary trustee graham i seconded any further discussion okay call the question

[1:05:26] Voice 7: all in favor that carries oh trustee graham you're i apologize

[1:05:39] Voice 4: um my my computer froze

[1:05:42] Voice 4: up after i made the the motion previous to this motion so i i don't remember if there was a vote

[1:05:48] Voice 4: i know i didn't i didn't vote because i i think i was frozen um so did that pass that was the one

[1:05:55] Voice 4: asking staff to provide the HAPC with the three documents that I requested I

[1:06:03] Voice 5: believe we did we'll

[1:06:04] Voice 5: check with our recorder yes

[1:06:08] Voice 7: that did pass excellent carried

[1:06:10] Voice 7: thank

[1:06:11] Voice 5: you I hate it because

[1:06:12] Voice 5: I think back I go did we or did we not so we did so I've done good I and I do trust that staff if

[1:06:18] Voice 5: we do ever do skip over something hesitate to yell at us and say you you have to go back so

[1:06:24] Voice 5: So, because I have been at meetings where it actually, they went back to the tape and

[1:06:28] Voice 5: we didn't actually vote.

[1:06:29] Voice 5: So it wasn't under my watch, but I've seen it in other local trust committees.

[1:06:33] Voice 5: So good, good to ask.

[1:06:35] Voice 5: Through

[1:06:36] Voice 2: the chair, as long as the vote has majority, it carries.

[1:06:40] Voice 2: So if trustee Graham was frozen and both trustee Borthwick and yourself voted, it would carry.

[1:06:48] Voice 5: Perfect.

[1:06:50] Voice 5: All right.

[1:06:50] Voice 5: Is there anything else for this meeting?

[1:06:52] Voice 5: Are we happily going off for lunch?

[1:06:57] Voice 5: I see lots of nodding heads.

[1:06:58] Voice 5: All right, so motion to adjourn.

[1:07:05] Voice 5: Trustee Mothrick, Trustee Graham, I'm all in favor.

[1:07:10] Voice 5: We're done.

[1:07:10] Voice 5: Thank you very much, everybody.

[1:07:12] Voice 5: It's a good and happy day

[1:07:14] Voice 5: and look forward to seeing you all soon.

[1:07:17] Voice 5: Thank you.

[1:07:18] Voice 7: Thank you.

[1:07:19] Voice 7: Take care.

ADOPTED
 
 
 
 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 1 
Special Local Trust Committee Meeting Minutes 
April 25, 2023 
 
Denman Island Local Trust Committee 
Minutes of Special Meeting 
 
Date:  
Location:  
April 25, 2023 
Electronic Meeting 
 
Members Present: David Maude, Chair 
 David Graham, Trustee 
 Sam Borthwick, Trustee 
  
Staff Present: Renée Jamurat, RPP MCIP, Regional Planning Manager 
Narissa Chadwick, RPP MCIP, Island Planner 
 Vicky Bockman, Recorder 
 
Others Present: 
Public participation was not available for this electronic meeting  
 
1. CALL TO ORDER 
The Chair called the meeting to order at 11:00 am. He acknowledged that the meeting was 
being held in locations across traditional territory of the Coast Salish First Nations. He 
introduced Trustees, staff and recorder; and noted that this meeting is being live streamed and 
recorded for viewing on the Islands Trust website.  
2. APPROVAL OF AGENDA 
By general consent the agenda was approved as presented. 
3. CLOSE THE MEETING 
3.1 Motion to Close the Meeting 
DE-2023-020 
It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee request an in-camera meeting, in 
accordance with Community Charter, Part 4, Division 3, s.90(1)(a) for consideration of 
the appointment of Denman Housing Advisory Commission members. 
CARRIED 
 
The meeting closed to the public at 11:04 am. 

ADOPTED
 
 
 
 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 2 
Special Local Trust Committee Meeting Minutes 
April 25, 2023 
3.2 Recall to Order 
The meeting was recalled to order at 11:11 am. 
3.3 Rise and Report 
Local Trust Committee (LTC) members reported that in the closed meeting the LTC 
appointed Judy Armstrong, Richard Day, Karla Neufer, Riane da Silva, Pamela Willis, 
Virginia Spinney, and Rosa Telegus to the Denman Island Housing Advisory Planning 
Commission (HAPC), commencing immediately for a term ending April 25, 2025. 
4. BUSINESS ITEMS 
4.1 Housing Project Work Program – for discussion 
Planner Chadwick provided an update on the requirements for application by land use 
authorities to Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation (CMHC) for grant funding. She 
explained that the timeline is short for completion of the required elements, which 
include: a housing action plan, HAPC review, business case development, and 
community consultation. She outlined the steps required for both the expedited process 
to pursue a funding application and the basic process for the current major project. 
 
Discussion followed with the following points noted: 
 Concern was expressed with the short timeline for the proposed application 
process. The expedited application process was not supported as the need for 
adequate, thorough community and HAPC consultation, and the importance of 
careful consideration at a pace that works for the community was recognized. 
 The LTC is in the process of beginning a Housing Review Project that will be 
examining bylaws and considering housing options. 
 Completion of the Housing Review process will place the LTC and community in a 
position to participate in future grant funding opportunities. 
 The HAPC will be tasked with consideration of a Housing Review referral. It was 
proposed that their review include a focus on the Housing Action Group report.  
 It is anticipated that a staff report on the forthcoming HAPC referral will be 
presented to the LTC for review at the next LTC meeting. In the meantime, HAPC 
members might be provided with Official Community Plan (OCP), Land Use Bylaw 
(LUB), and the Housing Action Group report to begin familiarizing themselves with 
background information. 
DE-2023-021 
It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee request staff to provide the members of 
the Housing Advisory Planning Commission with the following documents:  Official 
Community Plan, Land Use Bylaw, and the Housing Review. 
CARRIED 

ADOPTED
 
 
 
 
 
Denman Island ADOPTED 3 
Special Local Trust Committee Meeting Minutes 
April 25, 2023 
A Trustee observed that paper copies of the OCP and LUB are no longer available in the 
Denman Island library and proposed that steps might be taken to replace the hard 
copies in that location as digital documents are not accessible to everyone. 
Trustees proposed that a cover page might be included to indicate that the bylaws may 
not be up-to-date with the most current bylaws to be found on the website. LTC 
members supported funding the cost of producing the hard copies from their budget.  
DE-2023-022 
It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee request staff to provide hard copies of 
the Denman Island Official Community Plan and Land Use Bylaws to the Local Trustees. 
CARRIED 
5. ADJOURNMENT 
DE-2023-023 
It was MOVED and SECONDED, 
that the Denman Island Local Trust Committee meeting be adjourned. 
CARRIED 
The meeting was adjourned at 12:16 pm. 
 
 
_________________________ 
David Maude, Chair 
 
Certified Correct: 
 
 
_________________________ 
Vicky Bockman, Recorder