Islands Trust Council regular meeting, April 11, 2022

[0:00:05] Trustee Luckham: Okay, so good morning, everybody. Welcome to the Luskete Island Local Trust Committee meeting of April 11th. Apologies that we are late. There was a bit of

[0:00:14] Trustee Luckham: weather coming across the strait there to get to Luskete that slowed us down.

[0:00:21] Trustee Luckham: and of course the hike up to the health center here and then technology issues with getting us

[0:00:29] Trustee Luckham: connected but we're here now and so my name is Peter Luckum. I am elected on Laskiti Island or

[0:00:37] Trustee Luckham: on Thetis Island and that's in Penelaket and Lackson territory. It's a real pleasure to be

[0:00:45] Trustee Luckham: able to live and work in Salish Sea and it's a real pleasure for me here today to be on

[0:00:50] Trustee Luckham: on the Skidi Island in Tulyaman and Samanas

[0:00:55] Trustee Luckham: and many other territorial interests

[0:01:01] Trustee Luckham: that are on the Skidi Island.

[0:01:05] Trustee Luckham: So today with me in person is Tim Peterson

[0:01:12] Trustee Luckham: on my right-hand side here.

[0:01:14] Trustee Luckham: Good morning, Tim.

[0:01:15] Trustee Luckham: And off camera is Heather Kaur,

[0:01:18] Trustee Luckham: our regional planning manager.

[0:01:20] Trustee Luckham: And coming in remotely, we have Trustee Peter Johnson.

[0:01:23] Trustee Luckham: Good morning, Peter.

[0:01:25] Trustee Luckham: And also online here, we have Catherine Voigt, is it?

[0:01:29] Trustee Luckham: That is our minute taker today.

[0:01:31] Trustee Luckham: Thank you very much for joining us.

[0:01:33] Trustee Luckham: And sorry for the delays.

[0:01:35] Trustee Luckham: And of course, we have Director Andrew Fall with the Catholic Regional District in Klayaman

[0:01:45] Trustee Luckham: territory.

[0:01:46] Trustee Luckham: And thank you for joining us today.

[0:01:48] Trustee Luckham: Andrew, nice to see you again. We bumped into each other at LGMA recently. It was great

[0:01:55] Trustee Luckham: to see you there. But that's not true. I saw you at AVICC. We have an agenda before us.

[0:02:06] Trustee Luckham: I'm going to ask if there's any additions or deletions from the agenda or any late items

[0:02:14] Trustee Luckham: that need to be addressed today. Trustees and staff, anything? Nothing from staff? Peter

[0:02:20] Trustee Luckham: Johnson

[0:02:20] Trustee Johnston: okay and

[0:02:26] Trustee Luckham: you'll have to speak directly into the microphone I can't

[0:02:29] Trustee Luckham: know very well

[0:02:30] Trustee Johnston: potential tree cutting bylaws okay

[0:02:34] Trustee Luckham: so we'll put that under new

[0:02:36] Trustee Luckham: business then 12.3 tree cutting if that's okay with anything else a

[0:02:47] Trustee Johnston: very

[0:02:48] Trustee Johnston: very brief discussion i think about sleeping units that's

[0:02:53] Voice 5: on the agenda it's already on

[0:02:55] Trustee Luckham: your definition of sleeping cabin is that what you're referring to yes it's already at 12.2

[0:03:01] Trustee Luckham: thank you

[0:03:02] Trustee Luckham: okay tim no additions no additions excellent well then let's um let's adopt the

[0:03:10] Trustee Luckham: agenda as uh amended and and katherine um i don't know that you and i have worked together if

[0:03:17] Trustee Luckham: If there's anything that you need to know for clarity for the minutes, you just please interrupt and say, I need to know what that information is or what that motion is.

[0:03:29] Trustee Luckham: And thank you for your participation today.

[0:03:32] Voice 12: Okay, thank you.

[0:03:36] Trustee Luckham: So without further ado, then I'll call the meeting to order.

[0:03:41] Trustee Luckham: We've approved the agenda as amended.

[0:03:44] Trustee Luckham: We don't have a rising report from our previous in-camera meeting, so nothing there.

[0:03:49] Trustee Luckham: today and this will bring us directly to our reports and we'll start off with the trustees

[0:03:55] Trustee Luckham: and I can't remember who went first last time who would like to go first this time

[0:04:00] Trustee Luckham: let

[0:04:02] Voice 6: Peter go ahead

[0:04:03] Trustee Luckham: so Tim Peterson is offering the opportunity to you to you Peter Johnson go ahead

[0:04:08] Trustee Luckham: I

[0:04:09] Trustee Johnston: really don't have anything to report you know it's been very quiet both of us attended the

[0:04:14] Trustee Johnston: event a week ago at False Bay on the policy statement. The people there, the staff and

[0:04:22] Trustee Johnston: consultants were pleased with the response they got. I thought it was a bit thin, but

[0:04:29] Trustee Johnston: they were happy. The overall response, they said, was humongous. They had well over 700

[0:04:36] Trustee Johnston: survey responses at that time. That was a week ago, and there's a week more to go.

[0:04:42] Trustee Johnston: only other thing i can report is that the uh archaeology project that was

[0:04:47] Trustee Johnston: is gearing up for another year we're going to be having a week-long sessions here in may june and

[0:04:56] Trustee Johnston: july and during the june session on june it

[0:05:01] Trustee Johnston: will be we and bc parks will be hosting an event at

[0:05:07] Trustee Johnston: squiddy bay park to erect a plaque in honor of the ancestors the nations that were here in

[0:05:16] Trustee Johnston: previous times and still are around us and inviting them those nations to attend

[0:05:23] Trustee Johnston: so that's all i have for now okay

[0:05:26] Trustee Luckham: thank you peter um i'm going to continue on with the local

[0:05:31] Trustee Luckham: reporting but i hear your message and david you can't hear peter on the zoom call here because

[0:05:38] Trustee Luckham: we don't have a speaker i'm going to see if i can't get this to work as a speakerphone but

[0:05:43] Trustee Luckham: i think this is actually intended to bluetooth as a phone but i'll work on that while we're

[0:05:49] Trustee Luckham: listening to tim provide his report and take as long as you want

[0:05:53] Trustee Luckham: i

[0:05:54] Voice 6: don't have an awful lot to report either um uh for those that aren't aware there was a

[0:06:05] Voice 6: a small information session booth last week and a few people came by and i've i've heard from

[0:06:15] Voice 6: some members of public that they were they would have preferred an event and not during the work

[0:06:25] Voice 6: day that's certainly something we've heard in the past and uh so just uh put that in every

[0:06:32] Voice 6: launched that in everybody's brain on the LTC here that um daytime middle of the work week

[0:06:40] Voice 6: is not ideal for public engagement um and you know I do understand that the difficulties with

[0:06:48] Voice 6: making evenings and weekends work in terms of staff and and all of that stuff but I just wanted

[0:06:53] Voice 6: to share that again because I've heard

[0:06:55] Voice 5: that a number of times about that event um there's also

[0:06:59] Voice 5: a few inspections and sort of surprised that uh

[0:07:04] Voice 6: that there wasn't more sort of more awareness

[0:07:07] Voice 6: around the trust policy statement review but that's also one of those issues where i went

[0:07:13] Voice 6: back and looked at my trusty notes from the past couple years and uh some of the postings

[0:07:19] Voice 6: the email list and and in fact um all of the survey and uh online opportunities and in-person

[0:07:27] Voice 6: and opportunities that we have had in the past have have been mentioned in in public in the paper

[0:07:34] Voice 6: and online and stuff so it's difficult to get people to want to engage on something that sounds

[0:07:41] Voice 6: as exciting as policy statement um and of course uh I think LISC is not much different from many

[0:07:50] Voice 6: of the other items in the sense that um tell people start hearing something that they kind of

[0:07:58] Voice 6: find upsetting you know for example the tree cutting bylaw proposal um story uh that a lot

[0:08:08] Voice 6: of people sort of don't tune into what the policy statement is uh potential impacts of it and sort

[0:08:16] Voice 6: of until there's something that grabs their interest whether it's it's often in a negative

[0:08:22] Voice 6: way unfortunately rather than a positive way but that's it's sort of the nature to be said

[0:08:26] Voice 6: been using a lot about um public engagement and uh the difficulties and and i was reminded of

[0:08:35] Voice 6: actually sitting at the uh just before the pandemic i was in vancouver at the

[0:08:41] Voice 6: uh local government leadership academy and i was sitting with the mayor of langley uh in these

[0:08:48] Voice 6: sessions and the speaker was talking about the stp which is the same 10 people principle

[0:08:55] Voice 6: and wherein a lot of local governments

[0:09:00] Voice 6: have just a very few small segment of the population

[0:09:03] Voice 6: who are engaged in what's going on

[0:09:07] Voice 6: in municipal or local politics

[0:09:08] Voice 6: and

[0:09:09] Voice 7: how

[0:09:11] Voice 6: that actually is detrimental to the process

[0:09:15] Voice 6: because you're not getting a wider range of public opinion.

[0:09:19] Voice 6: And there's just the reality that people have lives and work

[0:09:22] Voice 6: And I sort of coined the phrase, you know, enraged to engage seems to be the only time that it's possible to get a wider segment of the population engaged is when there's some upset.

[0:09:42] Voice 6: And that's unfortunate.

[0:09:44] Voice 6: And, you know, throughout that discussion, there was, there wasn't, there were no good

[0:09:52] Voice 6: conclusions drawn about really effective ways to try and get more people sort of paying

[0:09:59] Voice 6: attention and engaging their own politicians.

[0:10:01] Voice 6: It's, it's, it's, it's not an easy task.

[0:10:05] Voice 6: And so the mayor of Langley told me that, in fact, yes, they have 10 people regularly

[0:10:11] Voice 6: at their city council.

[0:10:12] Voice 6: So I don't know what the size of Langley is, but it's quite a bit.

[0:10:16] Voice 6: So I was feeling pretty good that we often have, you know, six, sometimes eight here.

[0:10:24] Voice 6: So I think percentage-wise of the population of people actually attending our meetings

[0:10:28] Voice 6: were actually doing quite well.

[0:10:31] Voice 6: But how's the technical thing coming there, Peter?

[0:10:35] Voice 6: Keep talking.

[0:10:36] Voice 6: I could go on

[0:10:37] Trustee Luckham: for a while.

[0:10:39] Trustee Luckham: I'm just sending Mark Manbekel a message to see if he can get this to work.

[0:10:42] Trustee Luckham: as a speaker. I'm not successful in doing that.

[0:10:48] Trustee Luckham: My

[0:10:49] Voice 11: understanding is it's just for the phone.

[0:10:50] Voice 11: I don't know that. I

[0:10:52] Trustee Luckham: think that that's correct, too.

[0:10:53] Trustee Luckham: And I didn't, they never supplied me with a

[0:10:57] Trustee Luckham: speaker,

[0:10:58] Voice 11: and I don't have a speaker.

[0:11:00] Trustee Luckham: So that

[0:11:00] Trustee Luckham: is unfortunate. So I'll try to

[0:11:06] Trustee Luckham: paraphrase or repeat whatever it is Peter says

[0:11:09] Trustee Luckham: in order to help folks in the room.

[0:11:14] Trustee Luckham: Where's my meeting gone now?

[0:11:17] Trustee Luckham: There. In the meantime,

[0:11:19] Trustee Luckham: Mark may join us and figure something else out.

[0:11:22] Trustee Luckham: I can't think of anything else immediate to do.

[0:11:29] Trustee Luckham: For attendees here now,

[0:11:31] Trustee Luckham: I'm just going to go to my own report in a moment,

[0:11:34] Trustee Luckham: but just ask you to speak up so people in

[0:11:37] Trustee Luckham: the room have at least some chance of hearing what you're saying.

[0:11:42] Trustee Luckham: um i've got my volume turned up as loud as it'll go um and i'm advised that if we connect too many

[0:11:51] Trustee Luckham: laptops to this it'll just slow it down so chairs report holy smokes um to think about the last time

[0:12:01] Trustee Luckham: i was here really um but um not anything uh significant report locally uh at the skidi

[0:12:09] Trustee Luckham: but of course we've had islands trust council meeting at the beginning of march and we've

[0:12:14] Trustee Luckham: approved the budget and as tim has pointed out the islands 2050 uh community uh outreach program is

[0:12:22] Trustee Luckham: ongoing um we're visited uh i think we're expecting to kind of wrap up that visiting all

[0:12:29] Trustee Luckham: the islands in the island trust area in the next week or 10 days um i know that today they're on

[0:12:34] Trustee Luckham: the southern gulf islands they've been this they've been to they've come here and they've

[0:12:38] Trustee Luckham: been to Thetis and many of the other islands and getting tremendous feedback some of it

[0:12:46] Trustee Luckham: some of it in support and some of it critical and I think we need to hear all of that and we

[0:12:52] Trustee Luckham: need to determine what that means to us moving forward as a body and of course now we're getting

[0:12:59] Trustee Luckham: now it just starts to go it's cyclical we will start to prepare for our trust council meeting

[0:13:05] Trustee Luckham: in june um and there'll be some preliminary reporting i think on the 2050 but nothing

[0:13:11] Trustee Luckham: specific because it's going to take quite a while to digest the enormous amount of feedback we've

[0:13:16] Trustee Luckham: received and so likely be september before we actually report out on what we've learned from

[0:13:24] Trustee Luckham: this process um i don't believe i have anything else to offer um certainly there's lots of

[0:13:32] Trustee Luckham: activities that I get involved in with around the trust area widely. Less immediate interest to you

[0:13:40] Trustee Luckham: is freighter anchorages. That's an open file with us because the number of freighters that are

[0:13:45] Trustee Luckham: traversing and anchoring in the Salish Sea has increased dramatically. And of course, that's a

[0:13:51] Trustee Luckham: significant environmental risk that if there was an accident of some kind in the southern

[0:13:55] Trustee Luckham: portion of the strait due to a vessel, it would ultimately impact Laskete if there was any kind

[0:14:02] Trustee Luckham: of oil or fuel dispersal going on um and i think that's it that's it so

[0:14:08] Voice 1: i'll just go to the

[0:14:09] Trustee Luckham: electoral area director for his report andrew and i will ask you to speak up loudly if you can

[0:14:15] Voice 1: i'll try to speak loud is that loud enough yeah

[0:14:18] Trustee Luckham: i see it not in the back of the room

[0:14:19] Voice 1: okay i have

[0:14:21] Voice 1: three short things to report on one uh bcgeu local 702 which represents the vancouver island regional

[0:14:29] Voice 1: library librarians are on strike which has been unfortunate there have been

[0:14:33] Voice 1: efforts on both sides to reach agreement but also pickets at some branches and

[0:14:39] Voice 1: some affected operations sometimes the branches continue a little bit sometimes

[0:14:44] Voice 1: branches closed I'm hopeful that an agreement can be reached soon but it's

[0:14:50] Voice 1: hard to say with these things so it's just how it is second item is the

[0:14:56] Voice 1: the regional district has rolled out a survey

[0:15:00] Voice 1: on Mesquite Island Volunteer Fire Department

[0:15:03] Voice 1: asset management.

[0:15:04] Voice 1: Now, I agree with Tim's comment

[0:15:06] Voice 1: about getting people excited about policy statements.

[0:15:10] Voice 1: It's also hard to get people excited about asset management,

[0:15:14] Voice 1: but the basic issue is how we balance service levels

[0:15:17] Voice 1: with the LIVFD and the costs, both in short and long-term.

[0:15:21] Voice 1: For example, how old can we plan for our fire engines?

[0:15:25] Voice 1: Is it okay to have a fire engine that's 25, 30, 40, 50?

[0:15:29] Voice 1: How old?

[0:15:30] Voice 1: Should we continue to use trucks older than 25 years, which would be cheaper, but would affect insurance grading by the fire underwriter survey used by insurance companies, which would, of course, affect people who have, wish, or need insurance, especially those who need mortgages and insurance?

[0:15:48] Voice 1: Should we buy new trucks or secondhand trucks?

[0:15:51] Voice 1: Should we buy sooner with borrowing or later with savings?

[0:15:53] Voice 1: those are all big issues because there's interactions between these and it's a particularly

[0:16:00] Voice 1: important because the LIVFD service accounts for nearly half of the tax requisition from Laskiti

[0:16:07] Voice 1: to the QRD. It's 49% of all the taxes that Laskiti pays to the QRD are for the fire department. It's

[0:16:14] Voice 1: our biggest service. It's very important. So I've been encouraging residents to respond to this

[0:16:18] Voice 1: survey so the qrd can make decisions based on community desires and the response rate hasn't

[0:16:25] Voice 1: been as high as as hoped i keep kind of prodding but as as tim eloquently described it can be

[0:16:30] Voice 1: challenging to get engagement when there's not something excitement if you start putting out

[0:16:34] Voice 1: there the ali the qrd is going to borrow you know one and a half million dollars to buy new

[0:16:38] Voice 1: equipment that might get people excited but right now it's about planning forward how we do it and

[0:16:45] Voice 1: and what the community actually wants.

[0:16:47] Voice 1: And the last item, which does relate directly

[0:16:49] Voice 1: to Islands Trust business,

[0:16:51] Voice 1: the QRD will soon be releasing the coastal flood mapping

[0:16:54] Voice 1: data for Liskete and other islands

[0:16:56] Voice 1: that has been in the works for a little while.

[0:16:58] Voice 1: And as I understand, when that's done, when it's ready,

[0:17:02] Voice 1: it will be shared with the Islands Trust.

[0:17:04] Voice 1: So that will be something available

[0:17:06] Voice 1: to look at some coastal flood mapping risks,

[0:17:09] Voice 1: I guess, for planning.

[0:17:10] Voice 1: And in addition, the QRD has started the process

[0:17:14] Voice 1: to obtain updated high-resolution air photos

[0:17:17] Voice 1: for the entire regional district except Liskety Island

[0:17:20] Voice 1: because that's being funded through the planning service somehow,

[0:17:25] Voice 1: although the city of Powell River is not part of that.

[0:17:28] Voice 1: They get their air photos.

[0:17:29] Voice 1: So when I asked about this,

[0:17:30] Voice 1: I was told that the Islands Trust obtains such air photos.

[0:17:34] Voice 1: And as they are useful for decisions beyond planning,

[0:17:38] Voice 1: such as emergency services, emergency response, and so on,

[0:17:41] Voice 1: I'm hopeful that the Islands Trust will be willing to share air photos with the QRD

[0:17:48] Voice 1: when any new ones are obtained.

[0:17:50] Voice 1: And I don't know if there's any plans in the works for new air photos.

[0:17:53] Voice 1: The regional district gets them every couple of years.

[0:17:56] Voice 1: And they're not very cheap, let's say.

[0:17:59] Voice 1: It's quite a big line item.

[0:18:01] Voice 1: But with that, I will end my report.

[0:18:03] Voice 1: Thank you.

[0:18:05] Trustee Luckham: Okay.

[0:18:05] Trustee Luckham: Thank you, Andrew.

[0:18:06] Trustee Luckham: I'll just make a note on what you just advised us there.

[0:18:10] Trustee Luckham: two things is um you would have enjoyed a session at the local government leadership academy that i

[0:18:17] Trustee Luckham: was at last week because asset management was one of the topics which is i think you've characterized

[0:18:23] Trustee Luckham: it in the right way it's the it's the thing that is most important that we do um and but it's also

[0:18:30] Trustee Luckham: the one thing that we choose to ignore because we don't want to talk about it and yet it ultimately

[0:18:35] Trustee Luckham: ends up costing us more money if we don't manage it properly in advance. And so, yeah, I think you

[0:18:41] Trustee Luckham: need to talk about planning for the million and a half dollars you're going to spend. That might get

[0:18:46] Trustee Luckham: the excitement going. And then with regards to the mapping, we certainly have a kind of an open door

[0:18:53] Trustee Luckham: thing there. Any mapping that we get, we are well prepared to share it. People share data with us

[0:19:02] Trustee Luckham: and we share data with them so i think that just needs an inquiry to uh our mapping department

[0:19:07] Trustee Luckham: van beek would be more than happy to tell you what it is and how you might get access to

[0:19:13] Trustee Luckham: mapping and indeed what mapping you might have that you could share with us so um that's uh

[0:19:20] Trustee Luckham: that's out there so thank you again for joining us nice to see you again and now i'm going to go

[0:19:26] Trustee Luckham: to the town hall and so i apologize to everybody in the room here and that you've had to put

[0:19:31] Trustee Luckham: up the setting up the technology and talking too much and now it's your opportunity to to speak to

[0:19:37] Trustee Luckham: us so would you like to address the lpc sure yes it's your name you don't mind the name is chris

[0:19:45] Trustee Luckham: and i've

[0:19:48] Voice 7: got a number of things to say i'd like to respond to tim's report there about getting

[0:19:52] Voice 7: the community involved um i do think that i've been saying it for probably a decade now evening

[0:20:00] Voice 7: meetings um more accessible to people who are at work and i realize they're difficult but other

[0:20:07] Voice 7: municipalities and communities do evening meetings so we wouldn't be the first um

[0:20:14] Voice 7: and you know he has to cost money staffing that sort of thing but we just have enough money to

[0:20:20] Voice 7: have four people come set up a tent and glossy photos and display and all that there's money

[0:20:26] Voice 7: there to facilitate leading and another on a note on getting people engaged the

[0:20:39] Voice 6: forestry thing i

[0:20:40] Voice 6: picked up from one line and i had to ask for that to be explained what does that what does that mean

[0:20:45] Voice 6: and it shouldn't be that i should not have to ask for an explanation i'm not that bright but i'm not

[0:20:52] Voice 6: an idiot so i shouldn't have to ask explain that to me the toronto star was able to report this

[0:20:59] Voice 6: 18 months

[0:21:00] Voice 7: ago about the plan for restricting coming in um uh there's an article i found it

[0:21:09] Voice 7: online strong star nothing in our paper but it was spelled out clearly and concisely what the

[0:21:15] Voice 7: intention was um if

[0:21:19] Voice 6: you want community engagement spell

[0:21:21] Voice 7: it out clearly no

[0:21:23] Voice 6: bureaucratic gobbledygook

[0:21:26] Voice 6: give it to us straight

[0:21:28] Voice 7: the straight goods in communications since i've discovered this

[0:21:37] Voice 7: both trustees have stated that the community will have ultimate say but this toronto stars

[0:21:46] Voice 7: article contradicts that peter johnson

[0:21:51] Voice 6: you emailed me this morning and your

[0:21:55] Voice 6: um email that you sent to me doesn't line up with the statement on the email list from three days

[0:22:00] Voice 6: ago close but you you do say that there will be this will be ultimately decided by the community

[0:22:08] Voice 6: and the trust committee but in my the private email it says that they could go they could do

[0:22:16] Voice 6: without that they could still do with engagement but maybe they won't and the fact that there's

[0:22:21] Voice 6: even room for that um the fact that we're just finding out about that now is

[0:22:27] Voice 7: that's the most

[0:22:29] Voice 7: distressing thing actually not so much the content but the finding out 18 months on people

[0:22:35] Voice 7: and

[0:22:35] Voice 15: i

[0:22:36] Voice 6: posted a link to the email

[0:22:42] Voice 7: list and on hotwire to that drone

[0:22:44] Voice 6: star article it's not

[0:22:46] Voice 6: fake news or make-believe

[0:22:47] Voice 7: this is fact

[0:22:48] Voice 6: tree cutting on the ski what i stated this to peter

[0:22:57] Voice 6: monday when

[0:22:59] Voice 7: that display was up um you know that it's been going on forever here

[0:23:08] Voice 7: um we haven't gone ahead of it if

[0:23:13] Voice 6: that was ever the intention i think that would be ridiculous but

[0:23:17] Voice 6: there are more trees here more volume of timber here than 20 years ago i'm 25 whenever the last

[0:23:25] Voice 6: the last logging truck was unloaded in the chuck and that would export it nothing has left since

[0:23:33] Voice 6: then all of it has come from a private land and we're not getting ahead of it if that's the

[0:23:39] Voice 6: the intention not my intention so there's been to my knowledge correct me please if i'm wrong

[0:23:48] Voice 6: no research into the economic impact of i'm going to call it discouraging the use of private timber

[0:23:58] Voice 6: on mesquite i don't care about the rest of the trust i just care about right here this island

[0:24:04] Voice 7: the rest of the world doesn't have to exist to me it's right here where is the research that's

[0:24:11] Voice 7: been done there's been none to the economic

[0:24:14] Voice 6: impact of people here i'm going to say this is

[0:24:17] Voice 6: intentional to get rid of people like me in my tax bracket here and i mean you shake your hand

[0:24:23] Voice 6: and it's a ridiculous statement to make but why the secrecy why are people finding out about it

[0:24:28] Voice 6: elsewhere why are we not finding clear and concise simple english what is the intent

[0:24:34] Voice 6: 10. i've said it before i would say it again when you do stuff like this more trees will be cut down

[0:24:40] Voice 6: because of this sort of activity than if it if you go to the people concise clear explanations

[0:24:49] Voice 6: i said it on monday if you if the islands trust wants to promote keeping trees

[0:24:56] Voice 6: give us a tax break for every single one we leave standing everyone and i was told there's

[0:25:02] Voice 6: no mechanism for that the trust is going to the province right now and build a mechanism for this

[0:25:08] Voice 6: so if they can go to the the province for that to build this mechanism build one could give us

[0:25:14] Voice 6: a tax break to keep the trees standing

[0:25:15] Voice 10: i've

[0:25:17] Voice 6: got two sawmills seven or eight chainsaws my son's

[0:25:21] Voice 6: name is sawyer i have an uncle timber my family has been harvesting trees on the speedy for three

[0:25:27] Voice 6: generations and were there more trees on our property than there were when my grandfather

[0:25:32] Voice 6: bought this this sort of activity works against that give people a tax break i would take a tax

[0:25:42] Voice 6: break over and leave more trees standing but

[0:25:46] Voice 6: when this sort of thing happens i go buy a whole bunch

[0:25:50] Voice 6: of gas and a whole bunch of two stroke oil and a bunch of lengths of chain and i i've got 11 acres

[0:25:56] Voice 6: I could have that cleared in a day and a half, every single tree on the ground.

[0:26:01] Voice 6: I looked at it, how can I get around this?

[0:26:04] Voice 6: You can become a community, you can become a woodlot, a private woodlot.

[0:26:08] Voice 6: You can only do that if you have 60 acres.

[0:26:11] Voice 6: So it doesn't stop large landowners, but it stops every single little guy like me.

[0:26:17] Voice 6: This is an attempt at getting rid of people in my tax bracket.

[0:26:21] Voice 6: You can't tell me differently.

[0:26:23] Voice 6: they can't tell me that this was just dreamed up without any forethought to the consequences of it

[0:26:29] Voice 6: is that please tell me that's not the case please tell me that there's been uh forethought into what

[0:26:37] Voice 6: impacts will this what negative impacts will have on our community community we we can promote

[0:26:44] Voice 6: saving trees i i love trees standing as well as on the ground and then but we we heat with one here

[0:26:52] Voice 6: here. We build with wood here. You know, this, this, where,

[0:26:56] Voice 6: where is this coming from? Where has this directive come from?

[0:27:02] Trustee Luckham: You know,

[0:27:03] Trustee Luckham: one it's a real pleasure for me to kind of meet you here. Um, you know,

[0:27:11] Trustee Luckham: certainly I know of you on the Island here.

[0:27:14] Trustee Luckham: So it was great to actually see you and,

[0:27:15] Trustee Luckham: and really appreciate your excitement about what you do in your life and the,

[0:27:19] Trustee Luckham: and the life on the island what and the details of what you told us i'm really intrigued in the

[0:27:25] Trustee Luckham: article in the drama star i haven't seen it and i need to read that article to see what it says

[0:27:31] Trustee Luckham: because what is going to come to you is a complete surprise you're quoted

[0:27:35] Voice 7: fantastic

[0:27:36] Trustee Luckham: i love it

[0:27:40] Voice 7: well i

[0:27:41] Trustee Luckham: hope they quoted me right often as you know when

[0:27:44] Trustee Luckham: you're quoted in the media they often

[0:27:45] Trustee Luckham: and paraphrase or do some other thing leave out an important word here and there and it sounds

[0:27:50] Trustee Luckham: different than what was intended but honestly this is going to be a complete surprise to you

[0:27:57] Trustee Luckham: we don't know what the intent is we haven't determined what the intent is because this is

[0:28:04] Trustee Luckham: an idea let me go let me get through this this is an idea that came up

[0:28:09] Voice 15: let's

[0:28:10] Trustee Luckham: call it 18 months ago

[0:28:11] Trustee Luckham: And it came from the Southern Gulf Islands, where there was a lot of what was perceived as industrial scale logging activities going on.

[0:28:21] Trustee Luckham: And there was a concern about why the Islands Trust can't do something about this.

[0:28:26] Trustee Luckham: So out of respect for that, and out of respect for the same concerns being expressed across the Islands Trust area, we have simply asked the question.

[0:28:38] Trustee Luckham: question, what would a tree cutting regulation look like? What would it do? And what are we

[0:28:48] Trustee Luckham: talking about? Are we talking about stands of forest? Are we talking about hazard trees,

[0:28:53] Trustee Luckham: ornamental trees, you know, in cities? Because actually the notion that's out there from others

[0:28:59] Trustee Luckham: is this tree cutting bylaw will look like and feel like and smell like similar. In fact,

[0:29:05] Trustee Luckham: what has been said in our documentation is similar to that of municipal municipalities.

[0:29:12] Trustee Luckham: Well, municipalities don't have forests. They don't have that kind of thing. They have municipal

[0:29:16] Trustee Luckham: forests to some extent, but they are typically looking at individual trees on people's lots in

[0:29:22] Trustee Luckham: their yards and hazard trees and ornamental trees and all those kinds of stuff, heritage trees and

[0:29:25] Trustee Luckham: all that kind of stuff. So we have gone to the province to ask, what would a tree cutting bylaw

[0:29:31] Trustee Luckham: all look like for the for the island's trust and the problem just come back well what exactly

[0:29:35] Trustee Luckham: you know what is the intent what do you want to do and we are formulating that trying to gather

[0:29:41] Trustee Luckham: that from our trustees and from our citizens to simply deter and float and determine whether or

[0:29:49] Trustee Luckham: not an idea of this has has any merit and then i'm gonna daydream here a little bit if that was

[0:29:57] Trustee Luckham: was to actually get to somewhere where we said.

[0:30:00] Trustee Luckham: this is what it needs to look like and this would be the intent then indeed as peter johnson has

[0:30:05] Trustee Luckham: said that would come to every single local trust committee and this community would absolutely have

[0:30:11] Trustee Luckham: the opportunity to uh uh to influence that so that

[0:30:17] Voice 6: that's what i'm hearing from the trustees

[0:30:19] Voice 6: and i and i hope that's but that's not what i'm reading that's not what i'm reading in this

[0:30:25] Voice 6: it's from the media

[0:30:28] Voice 6: we've all seen what

[0:30:29] Voice 6: yeah

[0:30:29] Trustee Luckham: thank you for that

[0:30:32] Voice 6: it's I'm not

[0:30:33] Voice 6: going to ignore it it has

[0:30:35] Voice 6: been stated that this could be

[0:30:36] Voice 6: I trust trust

[0:30:38] Voice 6: why and

[0:30:40] Voice 6: it states in the article more

[0:30:43] Voice 6: clearly than I can articulate right now

[0:30:45] Voice 6: as to

[0:30:47] Voice 6: along those lines and so

[0:30:51] Voice 6: that is deeply concerning

[0:30:53] Voice 6: thing for me that and again i like trees standing yeah i think that if we want to if the trust

[0:31:00] Voice 6: would like islanders to promote keeping trees standing give

[0:31:05] Voice 7: us a tax

[0:31:06] Voice 6: break years ago they

[0:31:07] Voice 6: talked about taxing us for the trees that were standing and that backfired because people said

[0:31:11] Voice 6: well cut them all down and we don't have to pay the tax on them but so so

[0:31:16] Voice 7: they had it got backed

[0:31:18] Voice 7: up you know that that's it we gotta we gotta back up we didn't think that one through i'm asking

[0:31:23] Voice 6: before any consideration of this, the trust should be analyzing each. Again,

[0:31:30] Voice 6: Salt Spring is Salt Spring. Laskiti is Laskiti. Salt Spring is a round hole and round pegs fit

[0:31:37] Voice 6: there. We're a blob. We've said this for years. We're a blob and a lot of what the trust tries to

[0:31:43] Voice 6: ram into that doesn't fit us. It does not fit us. It might

[0:31:47] Voice 7: fit all of the other outlets,

[0:31:49] Voice 7: but we're we're different and and this is

[0:31:52] Voice 7: where the lack

[0:31:55] Voice 6: of acknowledgement of that

[0:32:01] Voice 6: creates animosity against the trust and i've seen it building here for a long time the amount of

[0:32:07] Voice 6: people it could be the demographic that's moving here but when people see these sorts of things

[0:32:12] Voice 6: where the perceived lack of community engagement and i agree with you tim that and i'm not i'm not

[0:32:19] Voice 6: trying to pick on you or peter about but but i did that i see it has

[0:32:24] Voice 6: to be said very clearly

[0:32:26] Voice 6: what exactly is happening rather than you know like even that display there but i had to get

[0:32:32] Voice 6: clarity on that one there was one little sentence and if i hadn't picked up on it that's it i would

[0:32:37] Voice 6: would have walked right by it wait a minute what does that mean which is that do

[0:32:42] Voice 7: you i don't i

[0:32:43] Voice 7: don't recall

[0:32:44] Voice 7: i should have taken a picture i took it

[0:32:46] Voice 7: i also you know that i can't believe this is

[0:32:50] Voice 7: lost on it but there's a

[0:32:51] Voice 6: bunch of glossy paper we're talking about trying to have a positive

[0:32:56] Voice 6: impact on reducing the number of trees that we take and then they go to hand with this glossy

[0:33:01] Voice 6: piece of paper

[0:33:03] Voice 7: i'm a total hillbilly and i think how

[0:33:07] Voice 6: ridiculous is that for you to lecture me on

[0:33:13] Voice 6: i walk away at that point i walk away i refuse to have engagement anymore that that to me

[0:33:18] Voice 6: is so bonehead that they couldn't see that so i think i really before we before anything goes

[0:33:25] Voice 6: forward i'd like to see the uh trust do some research on how the community would be impacted

[0:33:34] Voice 6: by such a um you know the trust isn't going to the province to try to build some sort of

[0:33:43] Voice 6: permitting system to make it easier for us to cut trees it's done in a manner to discourage

[0:33:47] Voice 6: and so

[0:33:47] Voice 7: what would the discouragement of that um what would be the result of that for our community

[0:33:54] Voice 6: also the trust must have access to this sort of information the volume of timber that was

[0:34:01] Voice 6: on the skidi 20 years ago aerial photos that's how they do all over there

[0:34:05] Voice 13: 40

[0:34:06] Voice 6: 50 60 years about

[0:34:08] Voice 6: how many the volume of timber on the skidi 50 years ago versus the volume of timber now yeah

[0:34:15] Voice 17: we

[0:34:16] Voice 6: haven't got that far you know that i've seen one small lot in spring bay where one individual

[0:34:23] Voice 6: individual who was homesick for alberta cut every bloody tree on their lot but that's the

[0:34:29] Voice 6: one law i

[0:34:30] Voice 6: see like

[0:34:31] Voice 6: that and they'll go back yeah it was fairly foolish but has the trust thought about

[0:34:40] Voice 6: the liabilities if

[0:34:41] Voice 6: i apply for a permit to remove a tree and i get denied and that falls on my house

[0:34:46] Voice 6: or i don't build next to it and i was denied i had to keep that up

[0:34:49] Voice 7: then i was told they couldn't

[0:34:52] Voice 7: cut that tree down. Now I know it's $100,000

[0:34:54] Voice 7: because it's... And

[0:34:55] Trustee Luckham: we haven't drawn it in that

[0:34:55] Trustee Luckham: deep because it's just an idea.

[0:34:57] Voice 7: Yeah. Okay.

[0:34:58] Trustee Luckham: Well, anyway, let's...

[0:35:00] Trustee Luckham: I will ask you, and Tim will have

[0:35:01] Trustee Luckham: something to say. Please stay

[0:35:03] Trustee Luckham: engaged. I've totally

[0:35:05] Trustee Luckham: enjoyed what you've just said and how you

[0:35:07] Trustee Luckham: said it. And this is recorded.

[0:35:09] Trustee Luckham: And so what you've said will be recorded,

[0:35:11] Trustee Luckham: not your actual person.

[0:35:13] Trustee Luckham: But I'm going to make sure that the staff that

[0:35:15] Trustee Luckham: are engaging in the 2050

[0:35:17] Trustee Luckham: process will review that because

[0:35:19] Trustee Luckham: what you've said is not

[0:35:21] Trustee Luckham: not uncommon and incredibly valuable. And I agree with a lot of what you said. But it's an idea. And

[0:35:28] Trustee Luckham: we haven't drilled into the depth of it yet to actually do any kind of justification. But if we

[0:35:34] Trustee Luckham: have to, to be honest, if we have to justify something, we have to wonder why, if it's not

[0:35:41] Trustee Luckham: broadly adopted as an idea. But the whole, what's really important and what I'm asking you to stay

[0:35:47] Trustee Luckham: engaged is because we need to understand your view on this, because we're not the only people

[0:35:52] Trustee Luckham: in the room.

[0:35:53] Trustee Luckham: We need to be able to get to that place to go, what you've said, yeah, I'll leave the

[0:35:58] Trustee Luckham: tree standings, but I also need lumber and firewood.

[0:36:02] Trustee Luckham: And so where is the place in the middle that is a best practice and a best ecological protection

[0:36:07] Trustee Luckham: and a best keep the community employed and cutting?

[0:36:10] Trustee Luckham: That's where we need to go.

[0:36:12] Trustee Luckham: So had

[0:36:12] Voice 6: this been spelled out clearly and concisely 18 months ago,

[0:36:16] Voice 7: when it was for people in

[0:36:18] Voice 6: Toronto, I

[0:36:19] Voice 7: would have been

[0:36:20] Voice 4: engaged for the last 18 months, I guarantee you.

[0:36:25] Voice 4: Well,

[0:36:25] Trustee Luckham: I'm afraid that I can't imagine how the Toronto Star could publish something that would tell you clearly what our intent is when we have not said it ourselves.

[0:36:35] Trustee Luckham: Fair enough.

[0:36:36] Trustee Luckham: So I'm going to read that.

[0:36:38] Trustee Luckham: And I have your email address, I'm pretty sure.

[0:36:40] Trustee Luckham: And so I might respond.

[0:36:42] Trustee Luckham: just to say hey i read that article and yeah and help because i think we need to work together

[0:36:47] Trustee Luckham: and please

[0:36:47] Voice 6: stay engaged tim so i have a comment first and then a question and so i will comment

[0:36:54] Voice 6: um uh for your benefit crystals that when this uh tree cutting authority was first kind of tossed

[0:37:00] Voice 6: around i believe first in the brainstorming session of victoria um there was there was a

[0:37:05] Voice 6: number of different ideas being passed around like things that we could ask the province

[0:37:11] Voice 6: and um uh i i spoke up out loud at council and said this is never going to fly on mesquite

[0:37:17] Voice 6: and i can't support it and when it came to vote on those individual um requested problems i voted

[0:37:23] Voice 6: against just just so you're aware of that my question is and this is this is a really

[0:37:28] Voice 6: important question so other than legislatively required um items and addressing things in our

[0:37:38] Voice 6: OCP and LUB that are directive policies for the policy statement are are there mechanisms for

[0:37:46] Voice 6: trust council to adopt let's just say a tree cutting regulation and impose it upon LTCs that

[0:37:54] Voice 6: don't want to have it is that in fact even legislatively doable in a hypothetical world

[0:38:02] Voice 6: like because if it's not then then we're clear and we're back to the back to this big

[0:38:08] Voice 6: completely in the community's court,

[0:38:10] Voice 6: and I think that would give some clarity

[0:38:14] Voice 6: and some comfort to the community.

[0:38:16] Voice 6: But is there any way that you can think of

[0:38:20] Voice 6: that Trust Council could impose a tree-cutting regulation

[0:38:23] Voice 6: on an LTC that did not want to adopt it?

[0:38:26] Voice 6: Is that even possible?

[0:38:29] Trustee Luckham: Well, the honest answer would be yes.

[0:38:31] Trustee Luckham: Okay.

[0:38:33] Trustee Luckham: But whether or not 26 members of Council would vote for that,

[0:38:38] Trustee Luckham: I would say it's unlikely.

[0:38:39] Voice 7: Right. But it is possible. It's good to get it.

[0:38:43] Voice 7: Yeah.

[0:38:44] Trustee Luckham: But at any level of government, federal, provincial, otherwise, anything is possible, including the draft, higher taxes.

[0:38:54] Trustee Luckham: Anything is possible. Pipelines. Anything.

[0:38:58] Trustee Luckham: So the honest answer is yes. Is it viable or feasible and would it gain support by a majority of trustees?

[0:39:05] Trustee Luckham: If we debate the words should and could endlessly, the LTC should do this, or the LTC could do this, or the LTC should consider this, we debate that over and over and over again.

[0:39:22] Trustee Luckham: And to be honest, you know, it depends on the more and less restrictive language is the more desirable, to be quite honest.

[0:39:39] Trustee Luckham: And so it would require, you know, the one thing that I know of as an example that is actually a clear no, and maybe people debate it.

[0:39:55] Trustee Luckham: we're not allowed to have casinos on the Gulf Islands that's one of the things that there's a

[0:40:01] Trustee Luckham: no no casinos on the Gulf Islands and in fact no fish farms in the southern Gulf Island area and

[0:40:09] Trustee Luckham: do they actually have any teeth maybe not legislatively but that those are the kinds

[0:40:16] Trustee Luckham: of no's that exist whether or not it would come to tree cutting I think it needs to be a managed

[0:40:22] Trustee Luckham: approach that meets the real needs of the community and the Islands Trust

[0:40:26] Trustee Luckham: to support. I'm being honest with you.

[0:40:31] Trustee Luckham: Peter Johnson, do you have anything to say? This is obviously the time for the

[0:40:35] Trustee Luckham: community to speak to us rather than us do a lot of talking, which I seem to do a lot of.

[0:40:40] Trustee Luckham: Peter Johnson, are you happy to continue to listen?

[0:40:43] Voice 13: Yes, I am.

[0:40:44] Trustee Luckham: Thank you. So really, honestly, thank you

[0:40:47] Trustee Luckham: for coming today, and let's keep the engagement up.

[0:40:52] Trustee Luckham: Is that somebody's phone there? That is.

[0:40:54] Trustee Luckham: Are you recording this?

[0:40:55] Trustee Luckham: Yeah.

[0:40:55] Trustee Luckham: Am I not allowed to do that?

[0:40:57] Trustee Luckham: Not without asking permission.

[0:41:00] Voice 9: Oh, really?

[0:41:02] Voice 9: You're not allowed to record a public meeting without asking permission?

[0:41:06] Trustee Luckham: Well, I don't know the nature of it.

[0:41:08] Trustee Luckham: And if he's, for instance, video recording you and you...

[0:41:13] Trustee Luckham: It's not

[0:41:14] Voice 7: video recording.

[0:41:15] Voice 7: The reason I do it is because I don't have the best hearing at times.

[0:41:19] Voice 7: And so sometimes I don't get everything.

[0:41:21] Trustee Luckham: You know, it's a courtesy.

[0:41:22] Trustee Luckham: Sorry, I...

[0:41:23] Voice 7: To ask.

[0:41:23] Trustee Luckham: And I would say, that's fine, because we are recording it and streaming it, and you can review it later. But it is something that we're a public meeting, and it's important for us to keep the public safe, as well as the staff.

[0:41:40] Voice 6: Where can I access it?

[0:41:42] Voice 6: So I can access

[0:41:42] Voice 6: this recorded meeting?

[0:41:44] Trustee Luckham: Yeah.

[0:41:45] Voice 6: It'll be available

[0:41:46] Trustee Luckham: on the Laskete Island Trust portion of the website.

[0:41:51] Trustee Luckham: Okay.

[0:41:52] Trustee Luckham: And it'll be, see previous meetings or something.

[0:41:54] Trustee Luckham: You go to the minutes and it'll have the recording there.

[0:41:56] Trustee Luckham: It takes a couple of days or a week to get it posted, but it'll be there.

[0:41:59] Voice 7: Okay.

[0:41:59] Voice 7: I was not aware of that.

[0:42:01] Voice 7: Yeah.

[0:42:01] Voice 7: That's fine.

[0:42:02] Voice 7: Yeah.

[0:42:02] Voice 7: I was not aware of all that.

[0:42:08] Voice 9: I would like to come home.

[0:42:10] Voice 16: Yeah.

[0:42:10] Voice 16: Yeah, so if you're done, we'll go to Tom.

[0:42:12] Voice 9: Is that written down somewhere that the public isn't allowed to record a public meeting?

[0:42:16] Voice 9: I

[0:42:16] Voice 6: think it is.

[0:42:18] Voice 6: If I can, I believe that.

[0:42:20] Voice 6: I mean, Peter touched on it really briefly, but I believe it's not about recording us, per se.

[0:42:26] Voice 6: It's more about recording other people in the public that haven't given their consent.

[0:42:32] Voice 6: I mean, we're public-facing, right?

[0:42:34] Voice 6: Right. So as I understand it, that is the that's the issue with recording publicly.

[0:42:44] Voice 6: It's not it's not your public officials. A private individual can't report.

[0:42:49] Voice 6: I believe that is correct. I'm not 100 percent on that, but I think that's the principle.

[0:42:58] Voice 6: that seems

[0:42:58] Voice 6: in

[0:43:00] Voice 17: Canada

[0:43:03] Voice 9: if someone wants to record

[0:43:05] Voice 9: a conversation

[0:43:06] Voice 9: with another person

[0:43:08] Voice 9: one person who's taking part

[0:43:11] Voice 9: in that conversation has to give permission

[0:43:13] Voice 9: you can record someone

[0:43:15] Voice 9: without their permission as long as

[0:43:17] Voice 9: you are giving permission to record

[0:43:20] Voice 9: that's how it is in Canada

[0:43:21] Voice 9: pardon me?

[0:43:23] Voice 9: I mean if I'm on the telephone talking to you

[0:43:25] Voice 9: and I want to record the conversation

[0:43:27] Voice 9: because I'm giving permission to do it.

[0:43:31] Voice 9: The other person doesn't have to know I'm recording it.

[0:43:36] Voice 6: It's changed

[0:43:37] Voice 6: in the last 10 years.

[0:43:39] Voice 6: I actually sought

[0:43:41] Voice 7: legal counsel because of a family issue.

[0:43:45] Voice 7: And the lawyer that I spoke to said,

[0:43:49] Voice 7: but not public meetings or anything.

[0:43:54] Voice 7: think this is just as long as i was part of the conversation that was allowed to record from now

[0:43:59] Voice 7: and i do not i never asked whether that had to do with public meetings i can't say that

[0:44:03] Voice 7: anyway

[0:44:04] Trustee Luckham: myself and

[0:44:05] Voice 7: another person talking about that was you didn't have to so i don't know if

[0:44:09] Voice 7: that is i

[0:44:10] Trustee Luckham: would have anything to offer but we as a courtesy ask if you're going to record the

[0:44:18] Trustee Luckham: meeting ask for permission and i should have maybe said that at the beginning it doesn't often come

[0:44:21] Trustee Luckham: up but it just catches me by surprise when i see something because um i

[0:44:28] Voice 7: just deleted it

[0:44:31] Voice 7: now now that i know that i can access that i didn't realize that yeah that's that's well

[0:44:39] Trustee Luckham: that's something that we've done in order to provide the opportunity for people to see it

[0:44:42] Voice 7: great yes that's excellent thank you

[0:44:44] Voice 9: okay tom over to you again so i want to be clear on this

[0:44:48] Voice 9: you're saying that a member of the public can't record a public meeting unless you give them

[0:44:53] Trustee Luckham: permission to um uh you brought a question up i need to find an answer to that so i'm not going

[0:44:59] Trustee Luckham: to answer that i will have to find out okay unless they ask permission to my understanding is that

[0:45:05] Trustee Luckham: that is but i

[0:45:06] Voice 9: will not written down

[0:45:07] Trustee Luckham: anywhere i think yes it is written down but i will have to

[0:45:12] Voice 9: tom well i'm trying to get a clarity on this because i believe the public should be allowed

[0:45:17] Voice 9: If it's not in your meeting's procedure by-law, and it's not written in any of the

[0:45:22] Voice 9: islands' trust procedure by-laws, then where is it coming from?

[0:45:27] Trustee Luckham: And what I've said is I need to find out what the details are.

[0:45:31] Trustee Luckham: I don't

[0:45:31] Voice 9: remember every single document that was ever printed.

[0:45:35] Voice 9: Thank you.

[0:45:36] Voice 9: I have another question about the meeting procedure by-law.

[0:45:39] Voice 9: office, your meeting procedures by law require you to supply the remote option when you're

[0:45:47] Voice 9: having an in-person meeting?

[0:45:50] Voice 10: No.

[0:45:56] Trustee Luckham: So I'm not sure the question requires, a trustee can, has the option to participate electronically.

[0:46:04] Trustee Luckham: And so is that

[0:46:05] Voice 9: what you mean by remote option?

[0:46:06] Voice 9: I mean,

[0:46:06] Voice 9: is it a requirement of your meeting?

[0:46:08] Voice 9: Could you say, no, we're not going to have any remote meetings.

[0:46:11] Voice 9: we're going to have in-person meetings or are you required because of your meetings procedure bylaw

[0:46:17] Voice 9: to supply the remote option no

[0:46:21] Voice 11: there's nothing in the bylaw that requires the remote option it just

[0:46:24] Voice 11: but we

[0:46:28] Trustee Luckham: are required to provide the opportunity for peter johnson to join the meeting yes i can

[0:46:32] Trustee Luckham: say that remote if

[0:46:34] Voice 11: all three of you were here i think the question is if all three of you were

[0:46:38] Voice 11: here in person would we still require there to be an electronic component where we're streaming

[0:46:44] Voice 11: no we don't

[0:46:45] Voice 11: but

[0:46:46] Trustee Luckham: we're trying to make the meetings more accessible for as Christos has said for those

[0:46:51] Trustee Luckham: that can't yeah

[0:46:53] Voice 17: okay

[0:46:54] Trustee Luckham: so I'll get to my

[0:46:55] Voice 9: uh I uh I believe that you should remove the requirement

[0:47:04] Voice 9: for some of the delegation to submit their presentation two weeks in advance.

[0:47:13] Voice 9: That serves only one purpose.

[0:47:16] Voice 9: I've heard all kinds of various reasons that they're serving.

[0:47:20] Voice 9: The only purpose that serves is to give the local trust committee a chance to edit and censor.

[0:47:27] Voice 9: Otherwise, what's the purpose of it?

[0:47:29] Voice 9: It's not to protect you from liability or anything, because you can cut anybody off in a meeting anytime you want.

[0:47:37] Voice 9: You don't have to accept someone's submission for inclusion in the agenda.

[0:47:42] Voice 9: I can see that if I wanted my presentation to be included in the agenda, you could require that it was presented two weeks in advance.

[0:47:51] Voice 9: But this is just totally undemocratic.

[0:47:55] Voice 9: credit. You really shouldn't

[0:47:59] Voice 9: assume the responsibility for editing and

[0:48:03] Voice 9: censoring a member of the public's presentation.

[0:48:08] Trustee Luckham: So I think maybe, you know, we're not the best, obviously

[0:48:12] Trustee Luckham: we're not the best at explaining ourselves, as Christos has just

[0:48:16] Trustee Luckham: mentioned earlier. And so I think, unless I'm

[0:48:20] Trustee Luckham: misunderstanding what you're saying,

[0:48:22] Trustee Luckham: name. Delegations are different than town hall conversations or people that come to just want

[0:48:32] Trustee Luckham: to speak to us. We do not require you to tell us what it is you want to come to us and tell us

[0:48:37] Trustee Luckham: about. If you want to be a delegation, it usually is where you are submitting materials that we

[0:48:44] Trustee Luckham: then publish in our agenda so that the public has the opportunity to see what it is that you

[0:48:50] Trustee Luckham: you want to present to the LTC. And the reason we want to see it two weeks in advance to include it,

[0:48:56] Trustee Luckham: yes, we are being sensory. Because if you're saying something defamatory about somebody in

[0:49:02] Trustee Luckham: the community, or staff, or myself even, then there's the ability to not do that. Because

[0:49:09] Trustee Luckham: otherwise, if we publish it, I see you laughing, and that's fine. But we don't have to publish it,

[0:49:16] Trustee Luckham: you're right but we try to because we want to and so I can tell you I've been involved in

[0:49:22] Trustee Luckham: situations where we've got a document that has said some not pleasant things and we send it

[0:49:28] Trustee Luckham: back to the person and go could you just change the language a bit and resubmit it that's all we

[0:49:32] Trustee Luckham: do we don't

[0:49:32] Voice 9: edit it because you censored it you edited it if I stand out and I'm making my

[0:49:38] Voice 9: delegation and I'm starting to say things that are libelous or defamatory you cut me off

[0:49:44] Voice 9: without even thinking about it and if i submit something that's inflammatory or inflammatory

[0:49:51] Voice 9: you won't accept it it's not in order to do those things that you want to do it's not required

[0:49:58] Voice 9: it's not a requirement you have it two weeks in advance that's the only purpose that serves is

[0:50:04] Voice 9: to give you guys a chance to censor and edit that's enough said about that

[0:50:09] Trustee Luckham: tom i don't think

[0:50:10] Trustee Luckham: have you heard what I said?

[0:50:12] Voice 9: If we're publishing your material.

[0:50:15] Voice 9: The regional district, they say about a week

[0:50:18] Voice 9: in advance, you have to give us the subject you're going to speak.

[0:50:21] Voice 9: You don't have to submit your thing.

[0:50:24] Voice 9: That's really overreaching.

[0:50:30] Voice 9: And I think you should remove that requirement. The other thing I want to address

[0:50:35] Voice 9: is the use of the term exotic and feral.

[0:50:40] Voice 17: you know

[0:50:41] Voice 9: that's expected

[0:50:42] Voice 9: well

[0:50:43] Voice 17: thank you

[0:50:44] Voice 17: for including me

[0:50:45] Voice 17: in our correspondence

[0:50:45] Voice 9: if you've all

[0:50:46] Voice 9: seen the

[0:50:47] Voice 9: email from

[0:50:48] Voice 9: the ministry

[0:50:49] Voice 9: of agriculture

[0:50:49] Voice 9: yeah

[0:50:50] Voice 9: and Peter Johnson

[0:50:52] Voice 9: has submitted

[0:50:53] Voice 9: numerous

[0:50:55] Voice 9: editing changes

[0:50:56] Voice 9: that he wants

[0:50:57] Voice 9: to make

[0:50:57] Voice 9: to the

[0:50:57] Voice 9: OCP

[0:50:59] Voice 9: right

[0:50:59] Voice 9: all this would be

[0:51:01] Voice 9: is an editing

[0:51:02] Voice 9: change

[0:51:02] Voice 9: yeah

[0:51:03] Voice 9: that the

[0:51:04] Voice 9: animals are not

[0:51:05] Voice 9: exotic

[0:51:06] Voice 9: and they're not

[0:51:07] Voice 9: feral

[0:51:07] Voice 9: they're not what

[0:51:08] Voice 9: they're not exotic

[0:51:09] Voice 9: and not feral

[0:51:11] Voice 9: I tried to phone the Mesquite Island Nation Conservancy Board.

[0:51:16] Voice 9: I was only able to get one member.

[0:51:18] Voice 9: I told them that I was going to request

[0:51:21] Voice 9: that the local press committee remove exotic,

[0:51:25] Voice 9: remove feral, change this stuff about exotic,

[0:51:29] Voice 9: some exotic things or blah, blah, blah,

[0:51:32] Voice 9: and just change it to herbivores.

[0:51:34] Voice 9: Herbivores, rigorous science, I could read it to you.

[0:51:38] Voice 9: As it is now, it says, if you want to, while recognizing that some exotic species have a value from the community and the source of local food, minimize the impact of invasive exotic species.

[0:51:56] Voice 9: All you have to do is take out exotic, while recognizing that some species may have value, but can be clammed in which it doesn't necessarily have as a food source, to minimize the impact of invasive species on native flora and fauna.

[0:52:10] Voice 9: Exotic is not the word you want in here.

[0:52:14] Voice 9: To preserve and support, this is E,

[0:52:16] Voice 9: to preserve and support and balance control

[0:52:18] Voice 9: of the local feral slash heritage sheep,

[0:52:21] Voice 9: you just take out feral slash and put in wild,

[0:52:24] Voice 9: the wild heritage sheep.

[0:52:26] Voice 9: In general advocacy policies,

[0:52:29] Voice 9: B, it says scientifically rigorous surveys

[0:52:31] Voice 9: of important exotic species, in particular feral sheep,

[0:52:35] Voice 9: are encouraged to estimate size

[0:52:37] Voice 9: and assess local ecological impact.

[0:52:39] Voice 9: impact, I would suggest that you take out important exotic species and do a scientifically

[0:52:46] Voice 9: rigorous survey of pergola growers, in particular, Caribbean sheep. That covers what Link is

[0:52:56] Voice 9: interested in. They wanted to highlight sheep, and it gets rid of these things that are really

[0:53:05] Voice 9: So I would urge you to make those changes in your own time.

[0:53:15] Trustee Luckham: Okay, and I appreciate getting that.

[0:53:18] Voice 9: One

[0:53:19] Trustee Luckham: thing

[0:53:20] Voice 9: I want to say about this is talking about engagement with the First Nations.

[0:53:29] Voice 9: This engagement with the First Nations has just stopped the OCP review as far as I can see.

[0:53:35] Voice 9: Hardly any change has been made. That's extremely irritating and frustrating.

[0:53:39] Voice 9: However, there's no way you can engage with the Native Americans and not have it be irritating and frustrating to people like us who are used to the old way.

[0:53:50] Voice 9: so if it wasn't irritating and frustrating i would be suspicious of your engaging process

[0:53:59] Voice 9: so i just have to say okay that's how it is it's going to be irritating it's going to be

[0:54:04] Voice 9: frustrating and that's how it is yeah

[0:54:10] Trustee Luckham: well i think we need you know we're obligated to come

[0:54:12] Trustee Luckham: to some kind of a common understanding and there's absolutely no doubt there's differences

[0:54:17] Trustee Luckham: was a viewpoint for you.

[0:54:19] Trustee Luckham: I'm really hard at this.

[0:54:23] Trustee Luckham: Just thank you. There's different

[0:54:25] Trustee Luckham: points of view in the room, and we need

[0:54:27] Trustee Luckham: to work through this in order

[0:54:29] Trustee Luckham: to get to a better

[0:54:31] Trustee Luckham: understanding. So I thank you for

[0:54:33] Trustee Luckham: what I'm perceiving as

[0:54:34] Trustee Luckham: your patience on

[0:54:37] Trustee Luckham: this process.

[0:54:38] Voice 10: Yeah.

[0:54:44] Voice 15: Okay. So that's it.

[0:54:46] Voice 16: Dave, do you have anything to say today?

[0:54:49] Voice 8: Yes, I

[0:54:49] Voice 8: do. I have a series of questions.

[0:54:51] Voice 8: So, yeah, my first question is to each of the trustees, and I'd like you to answer in

[0:55:02] Voice 8: the order that I request you to answer.

[0:55:05] Voice 8: So the question is somewhat simple.

[0:55:07] Voice 8: It's a little late into your session to ask this question, but the question is simple.

[0:55:14] Voice 8: Who do you represent as a trustee, and what do you base that belief of yours on?

[0:55:22] Voice 8: in terms of who you represent.

[0:55:24] Voice 8: So, Tim, I'd like you to answer first,

[0:55:27] Voice 8: and then I'd like Peter Johnson to answer,

[0:55:29] Voice 8: and then I'd like you, Sheryl Lopin, to answer.

[0:55:34] Voice 8: You look confused, so would you like me to...

[0:55:37] Trustee Luckham: I'm just wondering what the purpose of it is

[0:55:38] Trustee Luckham: in relation to the work today, but...

[0:55:41] Voice 8: Well, you're a public representative.

[0:55:42] Trustee Luckham: If the trustees are prepared to go there,

[0:55:45] Trustee Luckham: I'm not going to prevent them.

[0:55:46] Voice 8: It doesn't have to be an elaborate answer.

[0:55:48] Voice 8: I'm just asking a question that's pretty basic.

[0:55:50] Voice 8: Yeah,

[0:55:51] Voice 6: well, my perspective is, you know, I'm elected on Laskini, and in terms of the local trust committee business, I represent the electors of Laskini.

[0:56:05] Voice 6: In terms of the oath that all trustees have to swear at inauguration, it mentions upholding the object of the trust, which of course refers to all British Columbians.

[0:56:21] Voice 6: And so in that sense, I'm also representing all British Columbians in terms of the object of the trust. That would be my answer.

[0:56:33] Voice 6: Is that

[0:56:34] Voice 7: object written down?

[0:56:35] Voice 6: it is written down and in fact i'm pretty sure that the oath is is uh public publicly available

[0:56:40] Voice 6: yeah so peter

[0:56:45] Trustee Luckham: johnson do you want to answer the question i

[0:56:48] Trustee Johnston: will very briefly if

[0:56:50] Trustee Luckham: you can you speak

[0:56:51] Trustee Luckham: up

[0:56:51] Trustee Johnston: i i will i've lost your video i just see now a photograph of you not not you and tim sitting

[0:57:00] Trustee Johnston: there together i can handle that can you hear me

[0:57:03] Trustee Luckham: yes

[0:57:04] Trustee Johnston: and i'll try and recover the

[0:57:05] Trustee Luckham: video okay

[0:57:06] Trustee Johnston: Okay. I basically represent the landowners, taxpayers, residents, and other people connected

[0:57:16] Trustee Johnston: with Luskete, which does to some extent include all British Columbians. But as on the local trust

[0:57:23] Trustee Johnston: committee, that's who I represent, work for, was elected by, wasn't elected by, but elected by

[0:57:31] Trustee Johnston: by those that didn't also run and cause an election.

[0:57:34] Trustee Johnston: Is

[0:57:40] Voice 13: that answer going to be-

[0:57:42] Voice 13: Did you hear the answer?

[0:57:44] Voice 13: Well, you

[0:57:45] Voice 6: cut out the next question.

[0:57:46] Trustee Luckham: Oh, yeah, Peter, you cut out that

[0:57:48] Trustee Luckham: for a minute.

[0:57:48] Trustee Luckham: Can you just-

[0:57:49] Trustee Luckham: It should

[0:57:49] Trustee Luckham: be on the recording, though,

[0:57:50] Voice 6: regardless of whether we heard it in the room.

[0:57:52] Trustee Luckham: That's true, but I'm gathering maybe the answer

[0:57:55] Trustee Luckham: helps Pete the next question, but-

[0:57:57] Voice 6: Well, is that true, though?

[0:58:00] Voice 6: If he cut out-

[0:58:02] Voice 6: I think he cut it out just because of the,

[0:58:05] Voice 6: He was trying to adjust his cord here.

[0:58:06] Voice 6: I don't think that that recording was interrupted.

[0:58:09] Voice 6: Yeah,

[0:58:10] Trustee Luckham: well, maybe, Peter, can you just restate the answer?

[0:58:13] Trustee Luckham: I apologize.

[0:58:14] Trustee Luckham: That was my fault because you pointed out the video wasn't working.

[0:58:18] Trustee Johnston: Once again, the question is receding in time from my memory.

[0:58:22] Trustee Johnston: I feel like I have to represent the people connected to Luskete

[0:58:28] Trustee Johnston: and all British Columbians, so those who live here,

[0:58:32] Trustee Johnston: those who own land here, those who pay taxes,

[0:58:35] Trustee Johnston: here, those who used to be here and are still connected to the community, those who have never

[0:58:41] Trustee Johnston: even heard of it, but live far away, not equally, the more you're here and the more you're involved.

[0:58:51] Trustee Luckham: Sure. And so certainly, I try to represent an objective, because of course, I wear many hats,

[0:58:58] Trustee Luckham: I'm not elected here, I'm elected somewhere else. But when I am here as a chair of the local trust

[0:59:03] Trustee Luckham: committee. I try to represent all of the voices equally in the room and all the voices in your

[0:59:09] Trustee Luckham: community as what I like to think of as unbiased. I'm not elected here. I don't have too many

[0:59:17] Trustee Luckham: friends, although I know a few people. And so I'm not necessarily influenced by local politics,

[0:59:22] Trustee Luckham: so to speak. But I also, as has been indicated by my colleagues, represent the interests of

[0:59:27] Trustee Luckham: British Columbia in supporting the mandate, which is given to us by the provincial government,

[0:59:33] Trustee Luckham: the mandate and the object of the Alam's Trust is given to us by the provincial government,

[0:59:37] Trustee Luckham: and we are obligated to fulfill that mission, which these days involves us cooperating with

[0:59:44] Trustee Luckham: other agencies, including First Nations.

[0:59:48] Voice 8: Thank you. So my next question is,

[0:59:53] Voice 8: could you ask

[0:59:53] Voice 8: Peter Johnson if he can hear you?

[0:59:56] Trustee Luckham: Can you hear David? Yes. Okay.

[1:00:00] Voice 8: so Peter you wrote a public email on March 31st this past March 31st and the beginning of it

[1:00:09] Voice 8: stated I've posted a fairly long piece to correct some misinformation in our island times about the

[1:00:16] Voice 8: trust budget and taxes and then on the piece the fairly long piece that you posted the title says

[1:00:25] Voice 8: It says, misleading allegations about Ireland's trust, budget, taxes, and mandates.

[1:00:32] Voice 8: So I'm not going to read it all because it's lengthy, but I can tell you that I didn't understand it, which is why I'm asking the question.

[1:00:41] Voice 8: Since he wrote as a trustee, and in case you're not aware, I'm the editor and publisher of the Ireland Times here.

[1:00:50] Voice 8: So there's an allegation made against the newspaper that I published.

[1:00:55] Voice 8: So my first question is, and I have copies of the paper for people in the room, anybody who would like to see it.

[1:01:05] Voice 8: The first question, while I have these out, is what misleading allegation or allegations were made about the Island Trust budget?

[1:01:14] Voice 8: And just for your references, page 6 to 9 is what I believe Trustee Johnson is referring

[1:01:24] Voice 8: to.

[1:01:25] Trustee Luckham: Well, I'm going to say, honestly, this might be a better conversation to have with

[1:01:30] Trustee Luckham: Regent Johnson directly, and not having seen this up until this moment, and in order for

[1:01:36] Trustee Luckham: me to pause and read this to understand it.

[1:01:40] Voice 8: Well, it's not a question to you.

[1:01:42] Voice 8: Yeah,

[1:01:42] Trustee Luckham: but I think, you know, it's

[1:01:44] Voice 8: a question to the person who

[1:01:45] Trustee Luckham: you've just

[1:01:47] Trustee Luckham: given me a copy

[1:01:47] Voice 6: of it for some reason.

[1:01:48] Voice 6: I have

[1:01:49] Voice 6: a question, Chair, if I may ask.

[1:01:52] Voice 6: So it's just it's my understanding that town hall is about the business of the local trust committee.

[1:02:00] Voice 13: And

[1:02:01] Voice 6: it sounds like you're talking about what a trustee wrote, not communication from the local trust committee.

[1:02:12] Voice 6: Is that what you're referring to?

[1:02:14] Voice 6: I'm just

[1:02:14] Voice 6: trying to get clarity on what that is.

[1:02:17] Trustee Luckham: Well, I see that you've reprinted this in here,

[1:02:21] Trustee Luckham: which comes from the citizens of whatever Gulf Islands.

[1:02:26] Trustee Luckham: There's a lot of misinformation in there.

[1:02:30] Trustee Luckham: It's been distributed to the Gulf Islands, all across the Gulf Islands.

[1:02:33] Voice 8: Right.

[1:02:34] Voice 8: Yeah.

[1:02:35] Voice 8: And that's what I believe Trustee Johnson was referring to.

[1:02:38] Voice 8: so he says so do you

[1:02:41] Voice 8: want to have

[1:02:41] Trustee Luckham: an answer from peter johnson or your yes okay so what was

[1:02:46] Trustee Luckham: the question

[1:02:47] Voice 8: first question is what misleading obligation is made about the island's trust

[1:02:51] Voice 8: budget and

[1:02:53] Voice 6: again if i may chair the island's trust budget is actually not ltc business that's

[1:02:59] Voice 6: it's not that i don't think that you have every right to have these questions

[1:03:04] Voice 6: but I don't see that it's a local trust committee issue.

[1:03:08] Voice 6: I don't think the Islands Trust budget

[1:03:11] Voice 6: is something that really qualifies

[1:03:13] Voice 6: as a local trust committee business.

[1:03:14] Voice 6: My personal view, it's up to the chair to decide,

[1:03:17] Voice 6: but I just wanna say that.

[1:03:18] Voice 8: Right, so this is a public meeting, correct?

[1:03:22] Voice 6: But it's not in public meeting of the trust council,

[1:03:25] Voice 6: which decides the budget, the local trust committee.

[1:03:27] Voice 8: Are you a member of the trust council?

[1:03:30] Voice 6: Absolutely, but I'm not the trust council.

[1:03:32] Voice 6: no

[1:03:33] Voice 8: of course you're not i

[1:03:34] Voice 6: didn't i just i'm i'm just saying that i don't think that the

[1:03:38] Voice 6: trust council budget qualifies in my view as a local trust committee issue other than

[1:03:45] Voice 6: the times when we are asked to comment on the budget that sort of thing i mean

[1:03:54] Voice 6: it's up to the chair that's that's my feeling i i

[1:03:57] Voice 8: could explain why people on the speedy haven't

[1:04:02] Voice 8: heard anything about the islands trust budget until that newspaper came out so perhaps you

[1:04:10] Voice 8: want to change your ways it's a suggestion that you inform us locally about things that will

[1:04:17] Voice 8: affect us locally even if it technically is not part of your local trust committee's agenda

[1:04:27] Voice 8: because i can't believe that you would suggest for a second that the islands trust budget doesn't

[1:04:32] Voice 8: affect residents living on Mesquite Island. That's not what I'm saying.

[1:04:37] Voice 8: That's

[1:04:37] Voice 6: what I'm saying. I'm saying I don't think the trust council

[1:04:40] Voice 6: budget, I don't see as a local

[1:04:44] Voice 6: trust committee business.

[1:04:48] Voice 6: That's my personal view. It's up to the chair to decide.

[1:04:52] Voice 6: I've spoken what I have to say about it.

[1:04:54] Voice 6: I

[1:04:55] Trustee Luckham: think, Trustee Peterson, that in the town hall, the opportunity

[1:05:00] Trustee Luckham: for people to make inquiries of the LTC embrace things within the honest trust jurisdiction and

[1:05:10] Trustee Luckham: bring to our attention issues within the jurisdiction of the honest trust. However,

[1:05:15] Trustee Luckham: my discomfort is the nature of the inquiry, which is asking questions of one specific trustee about

[1:05:23] Trustee Luckham: something that he wrote, which is not something that was authorized by the LTC. And so it does

[1:05:30] Trustee Luckham: strike me that I'm not sure what your intent is here, which is perhaps also maybe unfair, but

[1:05:38] Trustee Luckham: this is a free public space. But I think that if you have some concerns with what Peter wrote,

[1:05:48] Trustee Luckham: So as an editor of a newspaper, you can certainly have that conversation one-on-one with Trustee Johnson.

[1:05:56] Voice 8: Well, I certainly could, but I'd much rather have a public conversation because then it's on the record.

[1:06:02] Voice 8: And so that way, there's no question about what is spoken and what is answered.

[1:06:07] Voice 8: so

[1:06:08] Trustee Luckham: can you peter johnson succinctly advise the uh the town hall uh speaker here what it is that

[1:06:17] Trustee Luckham: you found in here uh without a lot of detail uh that was objectionable i

[1:06:23] Trustee Johnston: will do that i think that

[1:06:25] Trustee Johnston: the screaming has ended it's it's gone from my screen i

[1:06:31] Voice 5: mean you stopped

[1:06:35] Voice 9: I want to thank you for having this freewheeling town hall.

[1:06:39] Voice 9: Pardon?

[1:06:41] Voice 9: The way you're running this town hall, I'm thanking you for it.

[1:06:45] Trustee Luckham: I'm not doing a very good job because the streaming has disappeared.

[1:06:54] Trustee Luckham: You know, I have no idea.

[1:06:59] Trustee Luckham: This is why this whole thing about us, the chairs managing these meetings,

[1:07:05] Trustee Luckham: is not a great idea.

[1:07:07] Trustee Luckham: Live on Custom Live Streaming Service.

[1:07:10] Trustee Luckham: This indicates to me that it is probably streaming.

[1:07:13] Trustee Luckham: It's at a minimum recording.

[1:07:16] Trustee Luckham: How do you know that it's not streaming?

[1:07:18] Trustee Luckham: Because it doesn't say so.

[1:07:19] Trustee Johnston: At the top of my screen, it said recording,

[1:07:21] Trustee Johnston: and then it said live streaming in addition,

[1:07:24] Trustee Johnston: and there was a tiny little tone,

[1:07:26] Trustee Johnston: and that live streaming disappeared from my screen.

[1:07:29] Voice 13: Oh, I see.

[1:07:34] Trustee Johnston: The recording actually started at 11 o'clock

[1:07:36] Trustee Johnston: when I first logged in, or 10 to 11.

[1:07:40] Trustee Luckham: okay so i've reactivated that maybe it timed out i don't know um so um it says it's preparing

[1:07:46] Trustee Luckham: the live stream so uh does it say that on our session so

[1:07:58] Voice 7: let me ask you a question

[1:08:02] Voice 7: um i just picked up as i walked in the door uh sleeping

[1:08:07] Voice 6: cabin definitions is going to be

[1:08:09] Voice 6: touch on in this meeting uh yeah i think trustee johnson asked for that to be on the uh agenda so

[1:08:16] Voice 6: i'm not quite sure we don't know what it's about i'm not sure okay there was i

[1:08:21] Voice 10: can answer that

[1:08:22] Voice 11: there was there was a question in the number of the public about whether or not sleeping

[1:08:27] Voice 11: patterns were the same as guest patterns which are defined in our in the lehman used by law

[1:08:32] Voice 11: so there's some question about whether or not they're the same

[1:08:38] Voice 7: sleeping

[1:08:39] Voice 11: cabin isn't defined specifically guest cabin is and there's something called a sleeping

[1:08:45] Voice 11: unit i think it is there's something something else and so um and they have different uh

[1:08:53] Voice 11: regulations around or different definitions um so i that's as far as i can go on memory sorry

[1:09:02] Voice 11: sorry.

[1:09:03] Voice 7: So there's

[1:09:08] Voice 10: some limitation on guest cabinets. And so

[1:09:14] Voice 11: I think the question came

[1:09:16] Voice 11: up about whether a sleeping cabin, if it doesn't have any kitchen or bathroom facilities, if it

[1:09:22] Voice 11: counts as a guest cabinet, therefore it's limited.

[1:09:25] Trustee Luckham: Okay. I'm going to say that we should resume the

[1:09:28] Trustee Luckham: meeting. We are recording it. It will be available later as a recording. I am unable to restart the

[1:09:34] Trustee Luckham: live streaming from here. I've asked Mark Van Beekle to try and fix it if he can. So we'll

[1:09:39] Trustee Luckham: just have to continue on. So it is being recorded and we will post it if we can, presuming that it

[1:09:46] Trustee Luckham: is being recorded. So we're still with Dave at the moment, Mr. Olson and Trustee Johnson. Did you

[1:09:53] Trustee Luckham: Do you want to respond to the question about the nature of what you wrote?

[1:10:00] Trustee Johnston: As I heard Dave say, he felt I was attacking him,

[1:10:06] Trustee Johnston: and I was just saying that in that paper there was misinformation.

[1:10:10] Trustee Johnston: He explicitly says that he doesn't stand behind all that information.

[1:10:15] Trustee Johnston: He's not responsible for it.

[1:10:16] Trustee Johnston: So I can't comment further on what I wrote two weeks ago

[1:10:20] Trustee Johnston: without having looked at it.

[1:10:22] Trustee Johnston: and if he wants to email me or talk to me, I'll respond to him

[1:10:26] Trustee Johnston: directly. It was the information that was

[1:10:30] Trustee Johnston: at least out of date and, I believe, misleading

[1:10:35] Trustee Johnston: from the Southern Gulf Islands Coalition.

[1:10:40] Voice 15: Okay, thank you.

[1:10:42] Voice 15: Mr. Olson, does that conclude your questions?

[1:10:45] Voice 15: No, I

[1:10:45] Voice 8: have other questions. So it sounds like Peter is not

[1:10:50] Voice 8: going to answer those questions.

[1:10:54] Voice 8: So it sounds like he doesn't have a memory of what he wrote, so I will skip those questions.

[1:11:05] Voice 8: And so I have questions for both of the trustees in the room regarding the 2022-23 budget.

[1:11:17] Voice 8: According to the information on page nine of the issue of Ireland's Times,

[1:11:26] Voice 8: times, it identifies Timothy Peterson and Peter Luckum as voting in favor of increasing

[1:11:35] Voice 8: the 2022-23 budget.

[1:11:38] Voice 8: And so my question to both of you is, were you aware that the budget was being increased

[1:11:48] Voice 8: by $2.4 million?

[1:11:49] Voice 8: dollars? And B, were you aware of the survey that the Islands Trust did, according to this

[1:11:59] Voice 8: information, that had 80% of residents not wanting any budget increase and 49% of all

[1:12:10] Voice 8: the residents not wanting a decrease in the budget? So were you aware of the survey with

[1:12:17] Voice 8: those results and if those results are incorrect please state it for the record and let us know

[1:12:22] Voice 8: what the results really were and did you indeed vote in favor of increasing the budget by 2.4

[1:12:29] Voice 8: million if it's not increased by 2.4 million please let me know when it's increased so i hope

[1:12:37] Voice 8: you're smiling at me so i don't know if that means you're clear or you're

[1:12:42] Voice 8: retooling? No,

[1:12:44] Trustee Luckham: the information that is contained

[1:12:46] Trustee Luckham: in that document is inaccurate. And

[1:12:49] Trustee Luckham: so to be honest

[1:12:50] Trustee Luckham: I can't, I would say

[1:12:54] Trustee Luckham: that I did not support

[1:12:58] Trustee Luckham: those statements. The questions you've asked

[1:13:04] Trustee Luckham: I don't believe it to be factual and I did

[1:13:10] Trustee Luckham: not vote for a budget that was $2.4 million because that's also

[1:13:14] Trustee Luckham: an inaccurate number.

[1:13:15] Voice 8: Okay, so what was the budget number?

[1:13:18] Voice 8: Just so we're clear here in this moment,

[1:13:21] Voice 8: it won't take long because I'm sure you know it.

[1:13:23] Voice 8: What was the budget that was approved?

[1:13:25] Trustee Luckham: You can look it up on the internet

[1:13:27] Trustee Luckham: because I am not going to quote a number

[1:13:29] Trustee Luckham: and have it wrong.

[1:13:30] Voice 8: Well, it doesn't need to be exact.

[1:13:31] Voice 8: 9.5 million, is that correct?

[1:13:33] Trustee Luckham: I think it's 9.2, 9.3.

[1:13:35] Trustee Luckham: Okay,

[1:13:36] Voice 8: so we'll agree that it's that.

[1:13:38] Trustee Luckham: No, it's order of magnitude.

[1:13:40] Trustee Luckham: It's around $9 million.

[1:13:42] Trustee Luckham: Right, okay.

[1:13:43] Trustee Luckham: Okay.

[1:13:43] Voice 8: And were you aware of a survey that suggested that

[1:13:46] Voice 8: residents were opposed to an increase in the budget this year?

[1:13:50] Trustee Luckham: You've just asked the question differently than you did before.

[1:13:54] Voice 8: Well, you're saying what I said before was inaccurate. It was.

[1:13:58] Voice 8: Okay. So are you aware that I was trusted a survey

[1:14:02] Voice 8: and the results of that survey said 80%

[1:14:06] Voice 8: of residents do not want an increase?

[1:14:09] Trustee Luckham: That is not true.

[1:14:10] Trustee Luckham: So

[1:14:10] Voice 8: that's not true.

[1:14:11] Voice 8: Are you aware that a survey was conducted by the IMS Trust?

[1:14:15] Voice 7: Yes.

[1:14:15] Voice 8: And was the result of that survey indicating a majority of residents

[1:14:21] Voice 8: opposed to an increase in the budget?

[1:14:24] Voice 15: No.

[1:14:24] Voice 8: No.

[1:14:25] Voice 8: So a majority of people responded saying they wanted the budget increased.

[1:14:31] Trustee Luckham: Do you see the trouble we're in?

[1:14:33] Voice 8: Well, I'm asking you a question, and you could elaborate.

[1:14:36] Voice 8: But

[1:14:36] Trustee Luckham: in your questions, do you see the trouble we're in?

[1:14:39] Voice 8: yeah sure what you tell me what the trouble is

[1:14:43] Trustee Luckham: you've said all residents you've said residents

[1:14:46] Trustee Luckham: and now you've said those respondents okay

[1:14:49] Voice 8: three

[1:14:50] Trustee Luckham: completely different things okay

[1:14:52] Voice 8: who would you

[1:14:53] Voice 8: like to speak to of would you like to speak of residents all residents or respondents respondents

[1:14:59] Voice 8: respondents okay so of the respondents i think your numbers are accurate the numbers are accurate

[1:15:06] Voice 8: I

[1:15:07] Trustee Luckham: can't say for sure they're close yeah okay

[1:15:10] Voice 8: so in

[1:15:11] Trustee Luckham: their interpretation so

[1:15:13] Voice 8: 80 percent of

[1:15:14] Voice 8: respondents said they did not want the budget to increase no

[1:15:18] Voice 16: that's not true it's done by

[1:15:20] Voice 8: okay so it says 49 percent of respondents wanted the budget to increase would you agree with that

[1:15:29] Voice 8: you know

[1:15:30] Trustee Luckham: something I think I disagree with that document entirely because it's a

[1:15:35] Trustee Luckham: A misrepresentation of the facts.

[1:15:38] Voice 8: Okay.

[1:15:39] Voice 8: Well, that's why I'm asking you the question.

[1:15:41] Voice 8: Can you please represent the facts actively?

[1:15:44] Voice 8: Yeah.

[1:15:44] Voice 8: No, you cannot represent the facts actively.

[1:15:47] Trustee Luckham: I don't have them in front of me.

[1:15:48] Trustee Luckham: Okay.

[1:15:48] Trustee Luckham: Because facts are facts.

[1:15:50] Trustee Luckham: Yeah.

[1:15:51] Trustee Luckham: And you should represent them correctly.

[1:15:53] Voice 8: That's right.

[1:15:54] Trustee Luckham: And you can find the facts on the Islands Trust website.

[1:15:57] Voice 8: So the survey that the Islands Trust did is on the Islands Trust website.

[1:16:02] Voice 8: Let me think about that.

[1:16:04] Voice 8: It

[1:16:04] Trustee Johnston: was not a survey, if I can interrupt.

[1:16:07] Trustee Johnston: A survey selects a number of people or a percentage of people and asks them.

[1:16:12] Trustee Johnston: It was a feedback session with anybody with an interest who wanted to could reply to it.

[1:16:19] Trustee Luckham: Yeah.

[1:16:21] Trustee Luckham: Honestly, I don't think I'm going to be able to answer you satisfactorily.

[1:16:24] Trustee Luckham: it, because certainly there are details about the facts of the survey are included, and

[1:16:39] Trustee Luckham: this is all from memory, are included in the package to the Financial Planning Committee

[1:16:46] Trustee Luckham: prior to March Council, and I believe that that information was also available to Council.

[1:16:52] Trustee Luckham: So it's in the information that's on our website associated with the meetings that were the financial planning committee meeting prior to council and the trust council package.

[1:17:02] Trustee Luckham: That information is there for you to read and interpret as you wish.

[1:17:06] Trustee Luckham: These folks are interpreting it in a way that I don't think is, it's their interpretation.

[1:17:13] Trustee Luckham: That's all I can say.

[1:17:15] Trustee Luckham: It's not

[1:17:15] Voice 8: the way I interpret it.

[1:17:16] Voice 8: So their interpretation, in your mind, then, doesn't necessarily mean misinformation.

[1:17:23] Voice 8: Misinformation is a word that has been used in the last few years quite extensively by people that represent governments.

[1:17:31] Voice 8: And so my question directly to you is, would you characterize this information that you are familiar with, you've stated that, as misinformation?

[1:17:43] Voice 8: Simple question.

[1:17:45] Trustee Luckham: Well, you know what? Simple answer. I'm not going to prejudice myself by answering that because I don't have a lawyer in the room.

[1:17:57] Voice 8: That's fine. That's your prerogative, I guess. You don't have to answer any questions, do you?

[1:18:01] Trustee Luckham: No, not

[1:18:02] Trustee Luckham: if I don't want to. I try to be frank and honest, and that information does not represent the picture that I would present to that.

[1:18:14] Trustee Luckham: that's all i can say right

[1:18:15] Voice 8: all right and tim i wanted to give you an opportunity

[1:18:20] Voice 5: to answer because i included you in my question sorry what's the question again

[1:18:24] Voice 5: did you vote

[1:18:27] Voice 8: in favor of increasing the budget uh according to 9.2 is possibly the size of the

[1:18:35] budget because we don't

[1:18:37] Voice 8: need to know because we can work on the island stress website but the

[1:18:40] Voice 8: the budget that just passed for the 2022-2023?

[1:18:44] Voice 8: I

[1:18:45] Voice 6: voted in favour of

[1:18:46] Voice 6: passing the budget.

[1:18:47] Voice 6: Yes, I did.

[1:18:47] Voice 6: Thank you.

[1:18:48] Voice 6: Yeah, I just wanted to make sure this information is accurate.

[1:18:51] Voice 6: Well, that part of it is, yes,

[1:18:53] Voice 6: I did vote in favour of passing the budget.

[1:18:55] Trustee Johnston: If I can interrupt again.

[1:18:57] Trustee Johnston: In

[1:18:58] Voice 6: fact, it was passed

[1:18:59] Trustee Luckham: by a majority.

[1:19:00] Trustee Luckham: Go ahead, Peter.

[1:19:02] Trustee Johnston: The information that was in the paper

[1:19:05] Trustee Johnston: was not information about the budget

[1:19:09] Trustee Johnston: that came before Trust Council.

[1:19:11] Trustee Johnston: It was information from the budget

[1:19:13] Trustee Johnston: that was decided on and voted on

[1:19:16] Trustee Johnston: by the Financial Planning Committee.

[1:19:20] Trustee Johnston: So those are two different votes

[1:19:22] Trustee Johnston: with two different imports.

[1:19:27] Trustee Johnston: Well, exactly.

[1:19:28] Trustee Luckham: It is, in fact, a misrepresentation

[1:19:31] Trustee Luckham: because the budget was revamped,

[1:19:34] Trustee Luckham: as is the right and authority of the Trust Council to do,

[1:19:37] Trustee Luckham: do. And it came in at a different number. So be it. And you can actually watch the recording

[1:19:45] Trustee Luckham: on, it's available on the website of that debate.

[1:19:54] Voice 9: Tom, back to you.

[1:19:56] Voice 9: I'll try to make this as short as I can. I wanted to discuss with you this issue before

[1:20:01] Voice 9: the meeting. At the last meeting, a member of the public raised the issue that the final

[1:20:07] Voice 9: law enforcement officer said it and she used the term uh it was grandfathered in that was great

[1:20:13] Voice 9: right yeah and you in in the minutes say the chair by legal non-conform conformance better term

[1:20:23] Voice 9: than grandfathered and thank the speaker for bringing the racist aspect of the term

[1:20:28] Voice 9: to our attention that's not what she's doing i've talked to her she was complaining that

[1:20:34] Voice 9: that the bylaw enforcement officer accused her of being racist

[1:20:38] Voice 9: because she used the term grandfathered in,

[1:20:41] Voice 9: which she doesn't consider racist.

[1:20:43] Voice 9: I don't consider racist.

[1:20:45] Voice 9: And I don't think there's very many British Columbians

[1:20:49] Voice 9: who think it's racist.

[1:20:50] Voice 9: But the grandfathered in is not a racist term.

[1:20:54] Voice 9: We are not Louisiana or Reconstruction Southern United States.

[1:20:59] Voice 9: So I think you just misinterpreted what she was saying

[1:21:03] Voice 9: and was in the minutes there, what she was saying is that it's not a racist term

[1:21:08] Voice 9: and that she resented the vital enforcement officer telling her as well.

[1:21:17] Voice 9: I think it's a mistake in the minutes.

[1:21:20] Trustee Luckham: Well, the minutes aren't accurate, actually.

[1:21:22] Trustee Luckham: It needs to be corrected and we'll get there at some point.

[1:21:25] Trustee Luckham: Is

[1:21:26] Voice 9: it a racist term?

[1:21:28] Trustee Luckham: It is considered...

[1:21:30] Voice 5: By whom?

[1:21:32] Trustee Luckham: by a broad selection of people that have thought about the topic.

[1:21:40] Trustee Luckham: Well,

[1:21:41] Voice 9: I've never heard it.

[1:21:42] Voice 9: I've never heard it either.

[1:21:43] Trustee Luckham: I've got lots

[1:21:43] Voice 9: of friends in the United States.

[1:21:44] Voice 9: My whole family is in the United States, not in the South.

[1:21:47] Voice 9: None of them think it's a racist term.

[1:21:49] Voice 9: The only people who think it's a racist term are super sensitive racists

[1:21:53] Voice 9: and Southerners.

[1:21:55] Voice 9: That's my opinion.

[1:21:58] Voice 17: Yeah, well, thank you for your time.

[1:22:00] Voice 17: Thank you, Christos.

[1:22:01] Voice 17: Really, thank you for coming.

[1:22:03] Voice 17: i

[1:22:03] Voice 7: would actually like to if tom's done i have to run but i'd like to say something as i'm running

[1:22:08] Voice 7: out the door yeah because i would really like to know the process of finding out this definition of

[1:22:15] Voice 7: um whether it's a sleeping cabin and what effects it will have and so i'm going

[1:22:21] Voice 4: to try and run and

[1:22:23] Voice 4: come back and find out what will the results of this when you determine uh or debate or whatever

[1:22:31] Voice 4: Yeah,

[1:22:32] Trustee Luckham: well, that'll be after lunch, which is coming up.

[1:22:35] Trustee Luckham: And it's a question that's come from Peter Johnson, so I don't know what the answer is.

[1:22:39] Voice 4: What will happen with that information?

[1:22:41] Voice 4: If you draw a conclusion today, what will happen with that?

[1:22:45] Trustee Luckham: Well, we're not likely to draw a conclusion, but we might get some advice or we might ask for some advice.

[1:22:51] Trustee Luckham: and unless we actually choose to embrace it within the OCP

[1:22:57] Trustee Luckham: or within policy and indeed provide a clear definition of it,

[1:23:01] Trustee Luckham: which would be the normal practice,

[1:23:04] Trustee Luckham: it may die on the table here.

[1:23:06] Trustee Luckham: It isn't a discussion that advances.

[1:23:08] Trustee Luckham: If it advances in some reason,

[1:23:10] Trustee Luckham: then there'll be some method of documenting how that unfolds.

[1:23:19] Trustee Luckham: And I would fully expect there to be a definition.

[1:23:22] Trustee Luckham: So, but we'll see how that will go.

[1:23:24] Trustee Luckham: Okay. Thank

[1:23:25] Voice 4: you very much.

[1:23:26] Voice 4: Thank you, sir.

[1:23:26] Trustee Luckham: Appreciate it.

[1:23:27] Voice 4: Have a great day.

[1:23:28] Trustee Luckham: Yeah. Okay. Are we done with town hall?

[1:23:34] Voice 9: That was the best town hall I've ever been in.

[1:23:36] Trustee Luckham: Well, good. Come on back next time. We'll do the best we can.

[1:23:41] Trustee Luckham: We're trying.

[1:23:44] Trustee Luckham: So then I'm going to now go to minutes.

[1:23:46] Trustee Luckham: minutes. And I see that we have a local trust committee adopted minutes February the 7th.

[1:23:54] Trustee Luckham: That's interesting. That's adopted. And it's funny when you read a document, you read it a couple

[1:23:59] Trustee Luckham: of times when you have a different opinion the second go around. Because I thought there was

[1:24:03] Trustee Luckham: a shortfall in the minutes, but maybe I'll just let it lie. So I think we're just going to receive

[1:24:12] Trustee Luckham: those for information but indeed I think that maybe the essence of the moment was lost and

[1:24:18] Trustee Luckham: now recording now me recalling what had happened with respect to the racist comments

[1:24:27] Trustee Luckham: is lost in translation in memory and so I'm just going to let it go for the moment I don't know

[1:24:34] Trustee Luckham: there's anything to be gained on improving that especially as it appears that I was I had

[1:24:39] Trustee Luckham: misinterpreted the question or the statement. So those

[1:24:43] Trustee Luckham: are the minutes. We'll just receive them for information. Is that all right,

[1:24:47] Trustee Luckham: Trustee Johnson, receiving minutes for information? Yeah, I

[1:24:51] Trustee Johnston: had a bunch of comments on them, but I'm not sure it's worth getting into them.

[1:24:56] Trustee Luckham: Well, these are

[1:24:57] Trustee Johnston: now adopted, right? So we've

[1:24:59] Trustee Luckham: already

[1:24:59] Trustee Johnston: had that discussion. Well, we didn't, actually, because they were adopted by

[1:25:03] Trustee Johnston: resolution without meeting, so there was no discussion.

[1:25:06] Trustee Luckham: No, but there's an

[1:25:07] Trustee Luckham: an opportunity for you to provide

[1:25:09] Trustee Luckham: corrections, and I do believe they would

[1:25:11] Trustee Luckham: have been received and amended

[1:25:13] Trustee Luckham: accordingly. So, yeah, no discussion.

[1:25:17] Trustee Johnston: I'm

[1:25:18] Trustee Luckham: going to say

[1:25:18] Trustee Johnston: that that comment

[1:25:20] Trustee Johnston: about the term

[1:25:22] Trustee Johnston: grandfathered comes from a racist

[1:25:24] Trustee Johnston: origin, but

[1:25:25] Trustee Johnston: it was news to me that

[1:25:28] Trustee Johnston: it's racist, and I don't

[1:25:30] Trustee Johnston: believe it's...

[1:25:32] Trustee Johnston: I don't think many people know

[1:25:34] Trustee Johnston: that it's racist if it is.

[1:25:37] Trustee Johnston: So, that's all.

[1:25:39] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, I can see what both you and what Tom are indicating there, but I guess, you know, what all of this stuff is begging us to do is to consider our use of language in a different way that we haven't considered before.

[1:25:54] Trustee Luckham: for. And I don't disagree that I'm not going to use that word. In fact, grandfathering is not a

[1:26:03] Trustee Luckham: term that we use in local government, although others certainly use it a lot, because it is

[1:26:08] Trustee Luckham: considered technically legal, non-conforming. It's simple. It doesn't have any connotation

[1:26:14] Trustee Luckham: of some prior use of that language and those words. And you can actually search it on the

[1:26:24] Trustee Luckham: internet and find out what others think. So section 26 resolution without meeting that's

[1:26:31] Trustee Luckham: your report for information. And you can see the minutes were adopted there. And there

[1:26:37] Trustee Luckham: was one other item on there as well, which was the meeting procedures by law adopted

[1:26:45] Trustee Luckham: on February the 3rd. Yeah, that was on March the 15th was the minutes. So we received that

[1:26:51] Trustee Luckham: report for information. That's all right. Advisory Planning Commission minutes, nothing

[1:26:56] Trustee Luckham: think today and the follow-up action list from March the 30th. And I'll ask Regional Planning

[1:27:05] Trustee Luckham: Manager Carroll if you have anything new to add to the follow-up action list. No. So what we've got

[1:27:10] Trustee Luckham: is there. And are there any questions for the Regional Planning Manager on the follow-up action

[1:27:15] Trustee Luckham: list?

[1:27:16] Trustee Johnston: I have a very quick question on the first item, October 28th. Staff to update the project

[1:27:25] Trustee Johnston: project charter bracket pj and i wonder what pj i mean it brings a bill with me but peter johnson

[1:27:36] Trustee Johnston: and it's repeated in there too is it is pj a abbreviation for project charter i

[1:27:42] Trustee Luckham: think it

[1:27:43] Trustee Luckham: means peter johnson but not

[1:27:46] Trustee Johnston: in this context i

[1:27:48] Voice 11: think it's supposed to be pc i think you're right

[1:27:51] Voice 11: It shouldn't be PGA.

[1:27:52] Trustee Luckham: Oh, Project Charter.

[1:27:54] Trustee Luckham: So it's Project Charter.

[1:27:55] Trustee Luckham: So we should actually

[1:27:56] Trustee Johnston: make a habit of

[1:27:56] Trustee Luckham: spelling things out.

[1:27:59] Trustee Johnston: Okay, thank you.

[1:28:00] Trustee Johnston: I've wondered that a few times when it's appeared.

[1:28:02] Trustee Luckham: Oh, I see.

[1:28:04] Trustee Luckham: It's the first time

[1:28:05] Trustee Johnston: it was used as

[1:28:05] Trustee Luckham: Project Charter,

[1:28:06] Trustee Luckham: and the second time it was used, it was PGA.

[1:28:09] Trustee Luckham: But we should just spell things out rather than

[1:28:11] Trustee Luckham: trying to be,

[1:28:12] Trustee Luckham: you know, you don't save much ink.

[1:28:15] Voice 13: It's true.

[1:28:16] Voice 13: Especially

[1:28:16] Trustee Luckham: when it's virtual ink.

[1:28:18] Trustee Luckham: And we definitely don't save any paper.

[1:28:20] Trustee Luckham: Okay.

[1:28:21] Trustee Luckham: so can you just fix that because

[1:28:23] Trustee Luckham: in 20 in 2023 or 2024 when none of us are here nobody will know

[1:28:31] Trustee Luckham: peter johnson will become famous yeah okay thank you peter good catch i'm glad somebody reads all

[1:28:38] Trustee Luckham: this stuff anything else on the follow-up action list no okay so we'll receive that for information

[1:28:48] Trustee Luckham: and ask for that correction.

[1:28:52] Trustee Luckham: Catherine Boyer, are you with us on that?

[1:28:55] Trustee Luckham: Remove P.J. in two places and replace with project charter.

[1:29:01] Trustee Luckham: Yes, yes, I have that.

[1:29:03] Trustee Luckham: Brilliant. Thank you.

[1:29:05] Trustee Luckham: All right, so now fees bylaw number 99,

[1:29:10] Trustee Luckham: and we have a staff report here.

[1:29:12] Trustee Luckham: So over to you.

[1:29:14] Voice 11: Yeah, so essentially you've seen this before.

[1:29:19] Voice 11: There is a wing model fees bylaw that has been recommended and staff are recommending that you adopt it.

[1:29:30] Voice 11: Well, that you give three readings and report it to the executive committee.

[1:29:38] Voice 11: So on

[1:29:42] Voice 10: page

[1:29:47] Voice 15: 20 of our agenda package.

[1:29:49] Voice 15: and

[1:30:00] Voice 11: Yeah, so just to be clear,

[1:30:01] Voice 11: there was a request by the trust committee

[1:30:04] Voice 11: to remove references to development permit fees

[1:30:08] Voice 11: since there are no development permits on the island.

[1:30:12] Voice 11: And so all the references

[1:30:14] Voice 11: that may have been development permit have been removed.

[1:30:18] Voice 11: So this bylaw doesn't include those.

[1:30:24] Voice 11: And that's it for me.

[1:30:26] Voice 6: Okay, Trustee Peterson.

[1:30:28] Voice 11: Yeah, I have a question

[1:30:29] Voice 6: and i'm not finding it on this table um today and so maybe you can help me we

[1:30:35] Voice 6: i know i brought it up at the meeting where we're looking at this

[1:30:42] Voice 5: the fees for um uh uh applications that have community benefits

[1:30:52] Voice 6: and i remember feeling that they were high and

[1:30:57] Voice 5: i'm not seeing them on this table yeah they um

[1:31:00] Voice 11: So the original model that was recommended

[1:31:03] Voice 11: had a temporary use permit fee that had community benefit.

[1:31:09] Voice 11: And after the model was disseminated,

[1:31:16] Voice 11: there was some discussion amongst some of the trustees

[1:31:19] Voice 11: and other areas that this was kind of problematic

[1:31:23] Voice 11: because a lot of the bylaws that we're dealing with

[1:31:26] Voice 11: don't define community benefit.

[1:31:27] Voice 11: benefit. And in order to take in a fee for a temporary use permit, you know, our planning

[1:31:34] Voice 11: team assistant is taking in an application for a temporary use permit. So she has to

[1:31:40] Voice 11: decide on the spot, does this have community benefit or not, in order to determine the

[1:31:45] Voice 11: fee. So it was determined to be problematic, which is why we have amended most of the bylaws

[1:31:51] Voice 11: is not to include that.

[1:31:56] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, we've had that conversation on other LTCs

[1:32:00] Trustee Luckham: and virtually anything could be considered

[1:32:02] Trustee Luckham: a community benefit in the

[1:32:04] Voice 6: broad scope.

[1:32:05] Voice 6: Yeah, and I suppose, I mean,

[1:32:09] Voice 6: is there, and I'm just thinking out loud here,

[1:32:12] Voice 6: is there a particular problem

[1:32:16] Voice 6: with the LTC of the day determining that?

[1:32:21] Voice 11: No, but you can do that when you're considering it.

[1:32:24] Voice 11: of the permit so um so if you know if you're if you're looking at an application and you you could

[1:32:33] Voice 11: say huh i'd really like there to be some community benefit with this and it'd be a condition of the

[1:32:38] Voice 11: permit well

[1:32:40] Voice 6: okay so um let me just back up here a little bit and maybe i've misunderstood here

[1:32:47] Voice 6: here. Let's just go hypothetical here and say that, you know, this place was asking

[1:32:55] Voice 6: for a permit or an application for something that's William shoulders fantasy, that we

[1:33:05] Voice 6: have a free drinking water dispensing area here. And, and I think that access to free

[1:33:15] Voice 6: clean drinking water could be widely viewed perhaps as a community benefit, that application

[1:33:24] Voice 6: fee could be reduced from the regular fee, or like I know we can waive 20% of the LTC,

[1:33:35] Voice 6: but that application fee could be reduced in the case where the LTC sees a clear community

[1:33:46] Voice 6: community benefit as opposed to the regular fee. Obviously, it's totally hypothetical

[1:33:51] Voice 6: here. I

[1:33:53] Voice 6: don't know if that would be a development variance permit at $1,900 or a temporary use

[1:33:59] Voice 6: permit at $2,150. But that was my concern is that LTC has some ability to make something

[1:34:11] Voice 6: that the LTC feels is clearly the community benefit,

[1:34:14] Voice 6: not being an extensive process.

[1:34:19] Voice 11: Yeah, I guess I have two responses to that.

[1:34:24] Voice 11: One is I'm not sure how we would mechanically

[1:34:26] Voice 11: make that work.

[1:34:27] Voice 11: So the applicant is applying for a temporary use permit.

[1:34:33] Voice 11: They've paid a certain fee.

[1:34:36] Voice 11: And I think mechanically how that would work is

[1:34:39] Voice 11: it comes from where the trustees and they say,

[1:34:41] Voice 11: hey this is community benefit we think they should be refunded some of their fee or or you have now

[1:34:52] Voice 11: in most cases where that i've dealt with with community benefit it's in your bylaw it defines

[1:34:58] Voice 11: it as a community benefit so if your bylaw defines it then it's easy enough for staff to go as

[1:35:05] Voice 11: they're taking an application oh they've predetermined what those community benefits are

[1:35:10] Voice 11: that are eligible for a reduced fee right but if that doesn't exist then there's not really

[1:35:16] Voice 11: a mechanism for us to say as staff taking in the fee and um i'm just i'm sorry i'm thinking a lot

[1:35:26] Voice 11: about how this would work um there isn't there's a provision in here about refunding a portion of an

[1:35:34] Voice 11: an application if it gets withdrawn at a certain point or work right um it that doesn't it doesn't

[1:35:42] Voice 11: apply to your the situation you're talking about um i'm wondering if we can yeah

[1:35:49] Voice 6: well that's that's

[1:35:50] Voice 6: what i'm wondering because i know i know that there was a yeah i understand

[1:35:54] Voice 6: that you guys have

[1:35:54] Voice 6: pulled them from all of them because it's problematic yeah what

[1:35:57] Voice 6: i'm wondering is if

[1:35:58] Voice 6: there's still a an opportunity and maybe it means that this ltc needs to think uh long you know hard

[1:36:05] Voice 6: about this and look at what uh appropriate definition in the land use bylaw might be

[1:36:12] Voice 6: as well and able to uh in order to enable us to have a provision in our fees by law that um

[1:36:22] Voice 6: can reduce fees for things that the LTC feels are clearly of community benefit,

[1:36:28] Voice 6: especially if we're talking, you know, like when we're talking about private individuals,

[1:36:39] Voice 6: generally, you know, subdivisions and stuff like that,

[1:36:42] Voice 6: we're talking about people getting material benefit for it.

[1:36:46] Voice 6: And I have no problem with the application fees being, as this is attempting to do,

[1:36:53] Voice 6: getting closer to cost recovery and i'm 100 in favor of that what i'm concerned about is

[1:37:00] Voice 6: situations where uh something that is a benefit to community um is hampered from happening by

[1:37:10] Voice 6: you know some of these some of these fees are are are would be large for a non-profit that has

[1:37:16] Voice 6: especially something that's just starting out let's say wanted to use a space under

[1:37:21] Voice 6: are temporary use permit or something so i guess it's it's not something you're going to be able

[1:37:25] Voice 6: to answer today but i kind of i feel like i want to um put that to the ltc that this is something

[1:37:34] Voice 6: that i'd like us to consider um perhaps doing some more thinking on and some more work on so

[1:37:40] Voice 6: that we have a mechanism in our feeds by law to be able to really encourage and help

[1:37:48] Voice 6: a community benefit use not incur uh you know a couple thousand dollars in costs

[1:37:57] Voice 6: and i just feel like there's cases where a couple thousand dollar bill for an application might be

[1:38:03] Voice 6: the end of it of an initiative that's just getting started it's different when there's a

[1:38:08] Voice 6: a non-profit or a community group that's been going for a while and has generated

[1:38:14] Voice 6: reiterated the interest and and and maybe some fundraising and stuff and then maybe that kind

[1:38:20] Voice 6: of an application um it might not be so onerous but it really you know what i'm trying to get at

[1:38:27] Voice 6: i don't have to belabor it anymore but uh um so i guess i'm gonna make a note to myself on that

[1:38:36] Voice 6: and uh and i'll let that go i'll let that be for now so

[1:38:42] Trustee Luckham: just want to check in with you

[1:38:45] Trustee Luckham: So can we advance this today and consider that some kind of an amendment

[1:38:50] Trustee Luckham: that we would consider at some point in the future?

[1:38:55] Voice 6: I would prefer that we do some work on it before we get to, I mean, I don't mind.

[1:39:04] Voice 6: It wouldn't bother me if we get first reading to it as it is today,

[1:39:07] Voice 6: but I actually would prefer to get some work done on it before we advance it all the way to reading.

[1:39:12] Voice 6: reading

[1:39:13] Voice 11: if i if i mean i mean

[1:39:16] Voice 6: yes we can always come and amend later yeah but

[1:39:19] Voice 6: my concern with

[1:39:20] Voice 6: that is that if we do that then as as our schedule gets busy if the ocp starts rolling again

[1:39:27] Voice 6: the problem with coming back to do something after it's been given third reading is sometimes

[1:39:32] Voice 6: that doesn't always happen

[1:39:33] Voice 11: so may i suggest that um i mean you could amend this draft to include

[1:39:39] Voice 11: to have those put back in.

[1:39:41] Voice 11: So the model by law did anticipate those fees.

[1:39:45] Voice 11: So those could be, you could amend it

[1:39:48] Voice 11: and put those back in.

[1:39:50] Voice 11: We might not have a mechanism yet, but maybe.

[1:39:53] Voice 6: Okay, and in terms of process,

[1:39:57] Voice 6: it seems to me that, I like what you're saying here.

[1:40:01] Voice 13: It

[1:40:01] Voice 6: seems to me that the best way for us

[1:40:07] Voice 6: then to go ahead and just is to go ahead and put those back in there and then we would receive

[1:40:12] Voice 6: another report from you guys right you

[1:40:15] Voice 11: could or you could amend it and then give it yeah

[1:40:18] Voice 6: my problem is since it's not here in the package it's hard i don't

[1:40:23] Voice 10: like

[1:40:24] Voice 6: i'm okay to amend it to

[1:40:26] Voice 6: put it back in here but then i want the opportunity to look at it before we go ahead and advance any

[1:40:31] Voice 6: readings at that point you know just so that i'm clear where we're at and what we're attempting to

[1:40:36] Voice 6: do so should i just go ahead and make the motion and then if other

[1:40:47] Trustee Luckham: trustees want to oh

[1:40:49] Trustee Luckham: yeah i think

[1:40:50] Trustee Luckham: that it would be good to make a motion sometimes you've asked a question come to a conclusion

[1:40:55] Trustee Luckham: and peter johnson may have something else to offer as well sure

[1:40:58] Voice 6: if i made the motion

[1:40:59] Voice 6: so i move that the community uh benefits um section of the proposed draft

[1:41:09] Voice 6: that fees by law be added back into the city local trust

[1:41:17] Voice 6: committee draft by law number 99.

[1:41:22] Voice 6: Can move.

[1:41:23] Voice 6: Do you have a seconder?

[1:41:25] I'll second it.

[1:41:26] Trustee Johnston: OK.

[1:41:27] Trustee Johnston: I actually

[1:41:27] Trustee Johnston: have a question about it

[1:41:29] Trustee Johnston: because it's partly in there.

[1:41:31] Trustee Johnston: I mean, it wasn't completely removed because on page 23,

[1:41:36] Trustee Johnston: community benefit is either defined, I guess,

[1:41:42] Trustee Johnston: says really a community benefit refers to an application results in the

[1:41:46] Trustee Johnston: vision

[1:41:46] Voice 1: of the many.

[1:41:50] Trustee Johnston: That is a value to the community and identified in the official community

[1:41:53] Trustee Johnston: plan as a community and many.

[1:41:55] Trustee Johnston: Now I don't think we have anything on our OCP that

[1:42:00] Trustee Johnston: identifies community amenities.

[1:42:05] Trustee Johnston: So that that's a lot of work if we leave that in.

[1:42:12] Voice 13: Yeah, so you know.

[1:42:16] Voice 6: I mean I realize that this could mean.

[1:42:20] Voice 6: you know, potentially a fairly lengthy delay in the passage of this fees bylaw.

[1:42:30] Trustee Luckham: Well, considering that probably you've only got two meetings remaining in this term,

[1:42:36] Trustee Luckham: three meetings with the most, I think that certainly does.

[1:42:41] Trustee Luckham: Just in reflecting on this, and I want to give Peter the opportunity to say some other things as well,

[1:42:48] Trustee Luckham: all is that there's no doubt

[1:42:53] Trustee Luckham: there's a corporate objective, federation objective to get these

[1:42:56] Trustee Luckham: bylaws updated so that we can ultimately be in a better situation.

[1:43:01] Trustee Luckham: It's not like there's a ton of applications that come from Mesquite. So does it make

[1:43:05] Trustee Luckham: a difference at the end of the day? No. However,

[1:43:11] Trustee Luckham: so that said, we can take as long as we want.

[1:43:13] Trustee Luckham: But indeed, if we included what was just discussed here

[1:43:17] Trustee Luckham: as in the Bible, clearly that process needs to be defined in the OCP, which is a body of work

[1:43:25] Trustee Luckham: that's underway already. There's no

[1:43:26] Trustee Luckham: doubt that Director, Regional Planning Manager Carver isn't

[1:43:31] Trustee Luckham: going to let that get by us at this point. It'll have to be included. So that decision and that

[1:43:36] Trustee Luckham: more in-depth discussion could actually happen in our OCP process. So we could actually just simply

[1:43:42] Trustee Luckham: simply put that back in, and we could give this three readings today, which would make me as a

[1:43:49] Trustee Luckham: process guy pretty happy. But I just want to toss out one, I think, important factor, and certainly

[1:43:56] Trustee Luckham: I'm all for trying to provide opportunities for the community to benefit from whatever

[1:44:02] Trustee Luckham: they possibly can. These fees are not a money grab, right? There's not actually any extra money

[1:44:09] Trustee Luckham: on the table. And so it costs that much money

[1:44:13] Trustee Luckham: out of our pockets to do that. So if we are

[1:44:17] Trustee Luckham: prepared to offset the fees in one area, that ultimately means

[1:44:21] Trustee Luckham: that somebody else has to pay. And in a good scenario, the

[1:44:24] Trustee Luckham: community that's getting the benefits pay. So the developers that are doing the

[1:44:28] Trustee Luckham: for-profit things are helping contribute for the community

[1:44:32] Trustee Luckham: benefit. So there's a whole conceptual conversation. But again,

[1:44:37] Trustee Luckham: Again, is there a lot of money on the table?

[1:44:38] Voice 5: No.

[1:44:40] Trustee Luckham: But if it costs us $21.50 to do the advertising and paperwork

[1:44:44] Trustee Luckham: and the printing and all this stuff,

[1:44:46] Trustee Luckham: the legal stamps and all that kind of stuff,

[1:44:52] Trustee Luckham: it costs $21.50.

[1:44:54] Trustee Luckham: And I know you are completely sympathetic

[1:44:57] Trustee Luckham: with our necessity to be fiscally responsible.

[1:45:01] Trustee Luckham: So I just toss that out.

[1:45:03] Trustee Luckham: It sounds to me like, given what we just identified here,

[1:45:07] Trustee Luckham: where it was Peter Johnson.

[1:45:09] Trustee Luckham: Thank you, Peter Johnson.

[1:45:10] Trustee Luckham: We could actually advance this pre-reading

[1:45:12] Trustee Luckham: and still catch it in the OCP.

[1:45:15] Trustee Luckham: Does the planning staff agree with that?

[1:45:17] Voice 13: Yeah.

[1:45:17] Trustee Luckham: Thank you, Peter.

[1:45:18] Trustee Luckham: Brilliant.

[1:45:19] Trustee Luckham: Okay.

[1:45:20] Trustee Luckham: Bonus points.

[1:45:22] Trustee Johnston: Yeah.

[1:45:22] Trustee Johnston: I have about five questions to ask about the draft.

[1:45:30] Trustee Johnston: Is it okay if I do these now?

[1:45:32] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, I think Tim is...

[1:45:34] Trustee Luckham: If Tim has more, we can come back to Tim.

[1:45:37] Trustee Luckham: You should get some air time.

[1:45:39] Trustee Luckham: Oh, no, we've got a motion.

[1:45:40] Trustee Luckham: So we have a motion on the table to, in fact, Catherine Boyd, did you get the motion?

[1:45:50] Trustee Luckham: And if you did, could you read it back?

[1:45:52] Trustee Luckham: Putting it on the spot.

[1:45:54] Voice 12: Aye.

[1:45:55] Voice 12: The motion is that the Luskete Island Local Trust Committee requests that community benefit be added to the Luskete Island Local Trust Committee Fees By-law 2022.

[1:46:04] Voice 12: 22.

[1:46:07] Voice 15: We're going to be we

[1:46:10] Trustee Luckham: we're going to do it.

[1:46:12] Trustee Luckham: Because otherwise it does get to be in the day right and so it's

[1:46:17] Voice 10: going to be

[1:46:17] Trustee Luckham: right and it's understood and

[1:46:20] Voice 10: then

[1:46:21] Trustee Luckham: and then I think we're probably comfortable

[1:46:24] Trustee Luckham: with that.

[1:46:26] Trustee Luckham: And you can see what the motivation is.

[1:46:28] Trustee Luckham: Okay, so that's the motion to we need to actually vote on this motion is any

[1:46:33] Trustee Luckham: discussion on this motion was seconded by Peter Johnson.

[1:46:37] Trustee Luckham: Any further discussion on the motion?

[1:46:41] Trustee Luckham: Catherine, you have a question about the motion?

[1:46:45] Voice 12: Oh, I was just wondering if you

[1:46:46] Trustee Luckham: wanted to change

[1:46:47] Voice 12: the word added to reinserted.

[1:46:49] Voice 12: Was that?

[1:46:50] Voice 12: Okay.

[1:46:53] Voice 7: Thank you.

[1:46:56] Voice 16: Are we clear on the motion?

[1:46:57] Trustee Luckham: Yeah.

[1:46:58] Trustee Luckham: So I'll call the vote.

[1:46:59] Trustee Luckham: All those in favor?

[1:47:01] Trustee Luckham: So that's all in favor.

[1:47:03] Trustee Luckham: That's unanimous.

[1:47:03] Trustee Luckham: So thank you very much.

[1:47:06] Trustee Luckham: So then that concludes that piece.

[1:47:08] Trustee Luckham: So now let's go to Peter Johnson with his questions, and then we can come back to Tim if you have more.

[1:47:12] Trustee Johnston: At the bottom of page 22216, an applicant for a soil deposit permit or a soil removal permit, I don't think we have those.

[1:47:25] Trustee Johnston: I don't think there's anything in our bylaws about soil deposit or soil.

[1:47:29] Trustee Johnston: No, there's no escaped soil removal bylaw.

[1:47:33] Trustee Luckham: That's correct.

[1:47:35] Trustee Luckham: The plan is confirming that.

[1:47:37] Trustee Luckham: So what you're saying is that could be also removed?

[1:47:40] Trustee Luckham: I

[1:47:40] Trustee Johnston: think it should be removed.

[1:47:44] Trustee Luckham: So where is

[1:47:45] Trustee Johnston: that on the...

[1:47:46] Trustee Johnston: The

[1:47:47] Trustee Luckham: second last one

[1:47:48] Trustee Johnston: on page 22.

[1:47:50] Trustee Luckham: Oh, so there is no fee

[1:47:51] Trustee Luckham: for it, per se,

[1:47:53] Trustee Luckham: but application to HARP, which one

[1:47:57] Trustee Johnston: is it on 22?

[1:47:58] Trustee Johnston: The second from the bottom, 2.1.6.

[1:48:07] Voice 13: Okay, so

[1:48:07] Voice 13: then certainly

[1:48:09] Trustee Luckham: a motion to delete that

[1:48:10] Trustee Luckham: would be appropriate but maybe you have some others that you've raised and we

[1:48:15] Trustee Luckham: can make these all one motion so I'm gonna keep a list here the reading

[1:48:20] Trustee Luckham: 2.1 6

[1:48:21] Trustee Luckham: okay

[1:48:22] Trustee Johnston: my next question is the bottom of page 23 table 1 number 2

[1:48:29] Trustee Johnston: minor for example regulation change without changing density or OCP

[1:48:33] Trustee Johnston: amendment I don't know what that means is that a LUB amendment yes okay yes okay should we say

[1:48:45] Trustee Johnston: that in there try

[1:48:50] Voice 6: and define those major and minor I

[1:48:56] Voice 11: don't remember I don't know I

[1:48:58] Voice 6: kind of

[1:48:58] Voice 6: feel like regional planning committee when we're putting this together did some definition on major

[1:49:04] Voice 6: and minor.

[1:49:07] Voice 11: My take on it is that's the reason that these parentheses exist. You know, the

[1:49:13] Voice 11: heading of this particular table is bylaw amendments, OCP and zoning bylaw. So under

[1:49:21] Voice 11: two, I take that to mean that if it doesn't include an OCP amendment, the only thing that's

[1:49:26] Voice 11: left is a zoning

[1:49:27] Voice 5: bylaw. Right. So

[1:49:29] Trustee Johnston: that would remain. Okay.

[1:49:37] Trustee Johnston: I they next one is table 2. First section development various permit

[1:49:42] Trustee Johnston: commercial or industrial institutional. My question is how are these different

[1:49:47] Trustee Johnston: from the Board of variance application table for number one.

[1:49:53] Trustee Johnston: There there's $300 difference from 1900 to 2200 are they different.

[1:49:58] Trustee Johnston: They

[1:49:59] Voice 11: are different. The Board of Variants application requires that the Board of Variants

[1:50:05] Voice 11: review the application. So there is more involved in that, and there is more cost associated

[1:50:14] Voice 11: with that.

[1:50:14] Trustee Johnston: Who decides on the Development Variance Permit?

[1:50:18] Trustee Johnston: The LCC.

[1:50:21] Trustee Johnston: How is it decided which one you need to do?

[1:50:26] Voice 11: applicant has the

[1:50:27] Trustee Johnston: choice of deciding which one they want to go through oh well why would anybody

[1:50:34] Trustee Johnston: chose chose the one that cost three hundred dollars more because

[1:50:38] Voice 11: they sometimes feel they

[1:50:40] Voice 11: have a better chance of getting an approval through border variance okay

[1:50:44] Trustee Johnston: if those nasty

[1:50:45] Trustee Johnston: local trustees don't do it that's

[1:50:48] Voice 13: right i know two of

[1:50:49] Trustee Johnston: them at least there's one that's fair

[1:50:53] Trustee Johnston: there. Other permits, number five there, a heritage alteration permit. What is that?

[1:51:01] Voice 11: You don't currently have one on Liskety, but a heritage alteration permit is essentially

[1:51:09] Voice 11: a, it's a kind of development permit for heritage issues. So it could include archeological

[1:51:20] Voice 11: sites or it could be heritage buildings or trees or that sort of thing but it acts like a development

[1:51:27] Voice 11: permit so

[1:51:28] Trustee Luckham: should we be deleting this if we don't

[1:51:30] Voice 11: you could unless it's something that you feel like

[1:51:32] Voice 11: you might adopt in the future keep it i

[1:51:37] Trustee Johnston: i think it's confusing to have it in since we don't have

[1:51:40] Trustee Johnston: any regulations about it so i would like to delete it i

[1:51:44] Voice 6: actually if i if i can i i just want to speak

[1:51:48] Voice 6: in favor of leaving it in there and um and the reason being is that i've actually had a number

[1:51:54] Voice 6: of discussions with people about the uh about uh the lack of of uh heritage designation on the

[1:52:06] Voice 6: island and that a number of people have spoken to me and think that that that is something that we

[1:52:11] Voice 6: should be looking at um and i actually don't see that having it there and not using this

[1:52:19] Voice 6: is problematic.

[1:52:22] Voice 6: Whereas if we're talking about that

[1:52:27] Voice 6: wanted to be something that people want to pursue,

[1:52:30] Voice 6: if it's then a matter of coming back

[1:52:31] Voice 6: and amending this bylaw,

[1:52:34] Voice 6: I just feel like leaving it in your moves

[1:52:37] Voice 6: that I've had an opinion for that.

[1:52:39] Voice 6: And so that would be an OCP amendment?

[1:52:41] Voice 11: It would, it would.

[1:52:42] Voice 11: And the regional planning committee

[1:52:45] Voice 11: is currently undergoing process

[1:52:47] Voice 11: process to develop a model heritage conservation area, and it is one of the only tools in our

[1:52:55] Voice 11: tool belt that can really help us help protect First Nations lands and cultural sites.

[1:53:03] Voice 11: So we are recommending the consideration of it.

[1:53:06] Voice 16: So did you hear that, Peter?

[1:53:08] Trustee Johnston: I did.

[1:53:09] Trustee Johnston: I don't understand how that works, because currently the archaeology branch issues or

[1:53:14] Trustee Johnston: doesn't issue a permit or makes conditions the rich the rich

[1:53:18] Voice 5: archaeology park yes that's right

[1:53:21] Voice 11: that's right and i'm saying that the only tool in in the island's trust tool belt in terms of

[1:53:28] Voice 11: regulation anyway um is our heritage conservation areas and

[1:53:33] Trustee Luckham: the heritage permit from the archaeological

[1:53:35] Trustee Luckham: branch is a different animal that's whether or not you can do something or not without much other

[1:53:43] Trustee Luckham: flexibility whereas our permitting process would require some kind of consultation mediation

[1:53:50] Trustee Luckham: that would be undertaken

[1:53:53] Trustee Johnston: but but we don't have one on luskete well we could

[1:53:58] Voice 16: consider one yeah

[1:53:59] Trustee Johnston: yeah yeah i just

[1:54:01] Voice 16: is is

[1:54:04] Trustee Johnston: somebody who who wants to apply to for the arc branch for a permit to alter

[1:54:10] Trustee Johnston: or build on or destroy or modify an archaeological site,

[1:54:15] Trustee Johnston: will they also have to have a Liskiti permit?

[1:54:20] Voice 16: Yes, if we have one.

[1:54:23] Trustee Johnston: Okay, but it doesn't imply that we have a fee for it

[1:54:26] Trustee Johnston: that we have one?

[1:54:28] Voice 15: That's correct.

[1:54:29] Trustee Johnston: We don't have any regulations about it?

[1:54:32] Trustee Luckham: No,

[1:54:33] Trustee Johnston: so if somebody applied tomorrow,

[1:54:35] Trustee Luckham: if we adopted

[1:54:36] Trustee Johnston: this, somebody applied tomorrow,

[1:54:37] Trustee Luckham: they wouldn't be subject to a fee.

[1:54:38] Trustee Luckham: Okay.

[1:54:41] Trustee Johnston: Okay. I find that a bit confusing that we have a fee for it. Table 4, the land use

[1:54:49] Trustee Johnston: item 2, this is also at the bottom of page 24. The land use contract amendment. Do we

[1:54:58] Trustee Johnston: have any land use contracts?

[1:55:00] Trustee Johnston: No.

[1:55:04] Trustee Johnston: It mentions them in the OCP, too. And what kind of thing are they?

[1:55:10] Trustee Johnston: they are

[1:55:10] Voice 11: a remnant of almost pre-zoning things

[1:55:14] Voice 15: are over yeah

[1:55:15] Voice 11: they are and they all will expire

[1:55:17] Voice 11: in june 2022. so

[1:55:20] Voice 15: we should mix that for sure

[1:55:21] Voice 11: yeah this is a good question because i'm not sure

[1:55:23] Voice 11: okay

[1:55:24] Trustee Johnston: any that we did have that would stop existing in june the end of june that's right

[1:55:31] Trustee Johnston: that's true okay yeah so i i let's take this one now yeah yeah i

[1:55:36] Voice 5: have an agreement with that

[1:55:38] Trustee Johnston: And, you know, I understand Tim's desire to leave in the heritage alteration permit,

[1:55:44] Trustee Johnston: but I really find that confusing, and I would like to take it out.

[1:55:51] Voice 13: Well, I guess that's up

[1:55:52] Trustee Luckham: for discussion further.

[1:55:55] Trustee Luckham: I think what staff are suggesting is that it's the only tool that we have

[1:56:01] Trustee Luckham: that we can actually support appropriate actions on the part of a landowner

[1:56:10] Trustee Luckham: or developer with respect to heritage sites and is there is a model bylaw coming to the federation

[1:56:16] Trustee Luckham: to consider including and if we wanted to include it if we include it now we don't have to amend

[1:56:23] Trustee Luckham: this again later in order to include it if we include it in our ocp project project which is

[1:56:28] Trustee Luckham: underway so we could include it through the ocp process and not have to reopen this if you took

[1:56:35] Trustee Luckham: it out now we would then be forced to reopen it if we ended up thinking it was a good idea

[1:56:40] Trustee Luckham: yeah

[1:56:40] Trustee Johnston: one if we're talking about archaeological heritage

[1:56:47] Trustee Johnston: that presumably the cost of having the first nation or several first nations involved come

[1:56:53] Trustee Johnston: over and do a site visit and to consider it and give us their input would be considerably more

[1:56:59] Trustee Johnston: than seventy nine hundred dollars or could well be and it's unclear to me how how this would

[1:57:06] Trustee Johnston: interface with like a lot of them permit but there'd be two separate permits that you'd need

[1:57:13] Trustee Johnston: both of if we

[1:57:15] Voice 13: do it i

[1:57:15] Trustee Johnston: mean i i can live with it i i just i find it confusing especially i mean

[1:57:23] Trustee Johnston: i guess we can't put in a note saying we don't have these yet uh

[1:57:30] Trustee Luckham: well that's true enough but

[1:57:31] Trustee Luckham: But the thing is, is the frequency of applications that we presently have on the island, it's

[1:57:35] Trustee Luckham: not like it's going to be something that's going to cause a lot of confusion.

[1:57:39] Trustee Luckham: And when they come into the office and they're looking for a permit, then the staff would

[1:57:45] Trustee Luckham: definitely be directing them in the right direction.

[1:57:47] Trustee Luckham: And I guess at this point, they'd be relieved to know they don't have to spend that money.

[1:57:51] Trustee Johnston: Yeah, okay.

[1:57:52] Trustee Luckham: My

[1:57:53] Trustee Johnston: final question is not about a detail that my understanding is that from the director

[1:57:59] Trustee Johnston: from trust council as we can vary the fees by up to 20% I assume that we would we might want to

[1:58:06] Trustee Johnston: vary them down rather than up uh do these already reflect that are these

[1:58:16] Trustee Johnston: fees 20% less than in the

[1:58:18] Trustee Johnston: model bylaw yeah

[1:58:19] Voice 13: do

[1:58:21] Trustee Johnston: do we want to adopt them as they are or do we want to vary some of them

[1:58:26] Trustee Johnston: down and some of them up or just accept them as they are it

[1:58:32] Voice 16: depends on how you voted on the

[1:58:33] Trustee Johnston: budget

[1:58:34] Voice 16: i suppose um

[1:58:35] Voice 6: i i actually wanted to vote or alter the community benefit fee lower but of

[1:58:43] Voice 6: course it's not in front of us today so that's going to be it have to be a discussion for another

[1:58:47] Voice 6: day right um as far as the rest of these i'm content with where they said

[1:58:53] Voice 6: um in line with

[1:58:56] Voice 6: law to bylaw, which, of course, is based on estimated application processing costs.

[1:59:04] Trustee Johnston: One of the things that comes with having higher fees is fewer applications,

[1:59:10] Trustee Johnston: especially because the disincentive, I can't remember what percentage it adds to it. Is it 20%?

[1:59:16] Trustee Johnston: It's pretty minimal.

[1:59:21] Trustee Luckham: I think a 20% reduction on fees isn't going to stop somebody that doesn't

[1:59:25] Trustee Luckham: want to get a permit from not getting a permit and we don't want to encourage people to do that

[1:59:30] Trustee Luckham: and it's got nothing to do with speech i think no

[1:59:32] Trustee Johnston: no i but isn't there if you're applying for

[1:59:35] Trustee Johnston: a permit to do something you've already done there's a premium of i believe

[1:59:39] Voice 6: yes there is

[1:59:40] Voice 6: there's a 20 surcharge that's on 4.1 at the bottom of page 24.

[1:59:46] Trustee Johnston: yeah yeah so i don't you know i'm i'm

[1:59:49] Trustee Johnston: okay with i you know the fees i'm i i'm okay with whatever they are okay

[1:59:54] Voice 17: so

[1:59:56] Trustee Luckham: if i might i'm

[1:59:58] Trustee Luckham: going to paraphrase

[2:00:00] Trustee Luckham: anything else. So then what I'm going to just say is that I heard that there was a motion and I'll

[2:00:04] Trustee Luckham: just help out because I know Catherine's listening and that I'll help out and ask the trustees to

[2:00:10] Trustee Luckham: move and second it is that section 2.1.6 being of the draft bylaw number 99, 2.1.6 be deleted

[2:00:23] Trustee Luckham: and in table four, item two be deleted.

[2:00:33] Trustee Luckham: We'll just ask if Catherine got that.

[2:00:37] Voice 12: Yes, I did.

[2:00:38] Trustee Luckham: Thank you.

[2:00:39] Trustee Luckham: So trustees wanna move and second that?

[2:00:42] Trustee Luckham: I'll move that.

[2:00:43] Trustee Luckham: Moved by Johnston, seconded by Peterson.

[2:00:46] Trustee Luckham: Any further discussion?

[2:00:49] Trustee Luckham: All those in favor?

[2:00:51] Trustee Luckham: None opposed, that carries.

[2:00:54] Trustee Luckham: Well done gentlemen.

[2:00:55] Trustee Luckham: So do you wanna advance this

[2:00:59] Trustee Luckham: this through the recommended three readings at this point, and that puts us

[2:01:02] Trustee Luckham: in a good place to move on to the OCP.

[2:01:10] Voice 6: Sure.

[2:01:12] Trustee Johnston: You mean to do all three readings?

[2:01:14] Trustee Johnston: Well, this

[2:01:15] Trustee Luckham: new technique here seems to be doing all three readings

[2:01:19] Trustee Luckham: in one motion.

[2:01:20] Trustee Luckham: I

[2:01:20] Voice 6: actually do have a reservation about that, but that's because we don't have the community benefit added

[2:01:26] Voice 6: back in, so I can't see it. I remember wanting to have a discussion

[2:01:31] Voice 6: about reducing it so i'd rather we don't go through all three readings today

[2:01:38] Trustee Johnston: well i move first reading we have to do them separately so

[2:01:41] Voice 16: let me ask you well let me just

[2:01:44] Voice 16: ask a question the bottle

[2:01:50] Trustee Luckham: can still be amended at adoption could we amend that fee

[2:01:55] Trustee Luckham: at adoption you're not changing the intent you're just

[2:01:59] Voice 5: changing the fee

[2:02:00] Voice 11: yeah you could but you're

[2:02:02] Voice 11: you're going to have your draft going to EC.

[2:02:08] Voice 11: So you're amending with Ella after EC has seen it and approved it.

[2:02:12] Trustee Luckham: So the chair of the

[2:02:14] Trustee Luckham: LTC can certainly represent that interest.

[2:02:17] Trustee Luckham: And maybe that's a manipulation of the process. I don't know.

[2:02:21] Trustee Luckham: Anyway, I'm just trying to advance the business of the LTC.

[2:02:25] Trustee Luckham: So I'm prepared to do whatever the LTC wants to do.

[2:02:29] Trustee Luckham: So we can certainly do first and second meeting.

[2:02:32] Voice 6: Let's do first and second.

[2:02:34] Voice 6: I thought it was a chance to have one more peek at it before we give it third reading.

[2:02:39] Voice 6: That way we don't, you know, send it to EC twice, which probably in terms of their time

[2:02:45] Voice 6: is probably a little nicer, although maybe EC wants to look at it.

[2:02:49] Trustee Luckham: Oh, you wouldn't have to send it to them twice.

[2:02:51] Trustee Luckham: No, if you amended it, we wouldn't have to send it back to you?

[2:02:54] Trustee Luckham: No,

[2:02:54] Voice 6: because you're

[2:02:56] Trustee Luckham: not changing the intent.

[2:02:58] Voice 6: Okay.

[2:03:01] Voice 6: I'm happy to take direction.

[2:03:02] Voice 6: But I actually think if we, if let's read it twice,

[2:03:07] Voice 6: we'll get it.

[2:03:08] Voice 6: We'll get a look back at it that way one more time with that fee reinstated

[2:03:13] Voice 6: in there, then we can make a decision and then we can finish it off.

[2:03:16] Voice 6: That's what I'd be happiest to do that. Okay.

[2:03:18] Trustee Luckham: So one of you would like to make a motion to give first and second reading

[2:03:22] Trustee Luckham: as one motion.

[2:03:24] Trustee Johnston: Oh, we can do that. Yeah. Okay.

[2:03:28] Trustee Johnston: I'll make, I'll move that.

[2:03:30] Trustee Johnston: we do first and second reading of or i should probably read the uh sure

[2:03:35] Trustee Luckham: so the motion would

[2:03:36] Trustee Luckham: read the liscudia and local church to me by the 99 side is the liscudia and local trust committee

[2:03:40] Trustee Luckham: fees by 2022 be given first and second reading period as amended thank you so move to have a

[2:03:51] Trustee Luckham: secondary trustee peterson seconded any further discussion all those in favor that carries

[2:03:59] Trustee Luckham: unanimously so we will see that come back for third reading and uh forwarding to the secretary

[2:04:05] Trustee Luckham: of the honest trust at our next meeting in june thank you very much so that concludes that item

[2:04:14] Trustee Luckham: um it is now 124 we indicated on the agenda that we were going to have a break

[2:04:20] Trustee Luckham: for lunch and i would suggest that i was hungry when i got here

[2:04:24] Trustee Luckham: And we will continue on with the Mesquite Island Official Community Plan after we've had some nourishment, which just sounds about right to me.

[2:04:35] Trustee Luckham: So can I suggest that we break for half an hour and come back at

[2:04:43] Voice 15: 2.05.

[2:04:51] Okay,

[2:04:52] Trustee Luckham: welcome back everybody to the Laskete Island Local Trust Committee meeting of April

[2:04:57] Trustee Luckham: 11th.

[2:04:58] Trustee Luckham: We are here meeting on Laskete in the territory of Staminaus and Clealmon and others.

[2:05:10] Trustee Luckham: I'm grateful to be here.

[2:05:12] Trustee Luckham: My name is Peter Luckham.

[2:05:13] Trustee Luckham: I'm elected on Thetis Island in the Penelope and Lai Action Territory.

[2:05:17] Trustee Luckham: I'm joined here by trustee Peter Johnson, trustee Tim Peterson, and regional planning

[2:05:23] Trustee Luckham: manager Heather Carr, as well as Catherine Vogt in the background looking after our minutes.

[2:05:29] Trustee Luckham: So thank you everybody for being here.

[2:05:30] Trustee Luckham: I want to acknowledge that broadly we're meeting across the Coastal Territory and grateful

[2:05:36] Trustee Luckham: to live and work here.

[2:05:38] Trustee Luckham: I wish to take a moment to reflect on the rich history and culture in this place, which

[2:05:44] Trustee Luckham: which there's plenty of opportunities for us to reach out and learn more about

[2:05:48] Trustee Luckham: the place we live in. I encourage that.

[2:05:51] Trustee Luckham: We've had a busy morning going through the initial part of our agenda.

[2:05:58] Trustee Luckham: Lots to discuss in town hall as well.

[2:06:01] Trustee Luckham: We are now at section 9.1 of the agenda,

[2:06:05] Trustee Luckham: which is the Luskeetee Island official community plan,

[2:06:08] Trustee Luckham: comprehensive review.

[2:06:09] Trustee Luckham: a review. And we have a staff report on page,

[2:06:15] Voice 15: sorry,

[2:06:19] Trustee Luckham: I lost track of my place in the agenda.

[2:06:22] Trustee Luckham: On page 27, the agenda package, thank you. And this is staff report attached, and so

[2:06:30] Trustee Luckham: I'm going to go directly to Reaching Client Management Power to summarize their staff

[2:06:34] Trustee Luckham: report, what their expectations are for today, and see what we want to talk about amongst

[2:06:41] Trustee Luckham: to ourselves

[2:06:41] Voice 11: thank

[2:06:43] Trustee Luckham: you

[2:06:44] Voice 11: thank you sorry um so you'll notice this is a memorandum and not a

[2:06:49] Voice 11: staff report and that's what we typically provide and we don't have a recommendation to have you

[2:06:56] Voice 11: pass a resolution um as i sort of mentioned this this project is kind of on hold in the sense that

[2:07:05] Voice 11: that we have been waiting for a response

[2:07:07] Voice 11: from Sonos First Nation.

[2:07:10] Voice 11: They sent us a letter back in September

[2:07:12] Voice 11: requesting that we meet with them

[2:07:14] Voice 11: and staff have provided comments or responses back.

[2:07:20] Voice 11: There was a letter sent in December.

[2:07:23] Voice 11: I have since tried to contact a staff person there

[2:07:27] Voice 11: and I have not gotten a response.

[2:07:30] Voice 11: At this point, and we might be able to talk about this

[2:07:33] Voice 11: little later but at this point it might be beneficial if the trustees themselves reach out

[2:07:39] Voice 11: in some way and that can be done in convertive ways um um the letter that we received in

[2:07:46] Voice 11: october or in september was actually signed by the chief and and there can be some expectation that

[2:07:56] Voice 11: responses to letters like that from the elected officials as opposed to from staff and so um it

[2:08:02] Voice 11: It might

[2:08:03] Voice 1: be a good

[2:08:03] Voice 11: idea to either reach out by phone or by letter or some combination of those, so kind of leave it to you to decide what you want to do with that.

[2:08:13] Voice 11: In the meantime, this memorandum does attempt to give some rationale for the comments that we received from Flynnburg for their referral.

[2:08:22] Voice 11: So as you'll recall, there were some comments that they made about their concerns about

[2:08:31] Voice 11: certain policies that were in the draft OCP, and it was our understanding that they would

[2:08:37] Voice 11: prefer that those policies be removed if they were problematic.

[2:08:42] Voice 11: And the trustees asked for some clarification to see if staff could in some way estimate

[2:08:51] Voice 11: estimate what they thought

[2:08:53] Voice 11: the Lord's motivations

[2:08:55] Voice 11: were. We haven't gotten a response

[2:08:57] Voice 11: from the Lord themselves. I did

[2:08:59] Voice 11: reach out to them a couple times to ask

[2:09:01] Voice 11: for a response. It's my understanding they have

[2:09:03] Voice 11: a large turnover of staff

[2:09:04] Voice 11: and a change in ministry, and

[2:09:07] Voice 11: so like a lot

[2:09:09] Voice 11: of places, they're experiencing

[2:09:11] Voice 11: those challenges, but we haven't received

[2:09:13] Voice 11: a specific

[2:09:15] Voice 11: rationale from them. So staff

[2:09:17] Voice 11: have attempted to provide

[2:09:19] Voice 11: rationale and um and as i've said in the memorandum kind of a summary of all of that is that um

[2:09:29] Voice 11: we can kind of guess that that a lot of these policies are policies that go against their

[2:09:37] Voice 11: existing uh procedures or policies or the authorities that they have so i can see where

[2:09:44] Voice 11: the ministry might think that in some way, you know, for instance, mining, the ministry of mining

[2:09:52] Voice 11: is in charge of mining. There's not much local governments can do about that. And so, and they

[2:10:00] Voice 11: have certain procedures that they're required to do. So they are not likely to want to see

[2:10:06] Voice 11: policies that hamper their ability to do their typical procedures. That's sort of the best

[2:10:14] Voice 11: explanation i can kind of give about each of those and there's more detailed explanation

[2:10:18] Voice 11: for each of the policies um in the memorandum but i um and i can speak to any of those if

[2:10:24] Voice 11: you have questions but i won't go through each of them um that's that's where we're at with those

[2:10:30] Voice 11: comments um and then um also attached to the staff report are comments that trustee johnston has made

[2:10:38] Voice 11: and many of them in the forms of motions.

[2:10:41] Voice 11: So presumably at some point there might be a time

[2:10:44] Voice 11: when he would make motions to amend the document

[2:10:47] Voice 11: based on those comments

[2:10:49] Voice 11: if the trustees want to consider those.

[2:10:54] Voice 11: So that's where we're at.

[2:10:56] Voice 11: I can answer questions.

[2:10:59] Trustee Luckham: Okay, any questions from the trustees?

[2:11:03] Trustee Luckham: I

[2:11:04] Trustee Johnston: have a question

[2:11:05] Trustee Johnston: and it's really about the ministry's comments

[2:11:10] Trustee Johnston: is that the following advocacy policy would be of concern

[2:11:13] Trustee Johnston: to the current provincial government.

[2:11:15] Trustee Johnston: Is that the extent of what they said?

[2:11:21] Voice 13: Yes, that

[2:11:22] Trustee Johnston: is the extent

[2:11:23] Voice 13: of what they said.

[2:11:27] Voice 15: Okay, anything else?

[2:11:33] Trustee Luckham: So I think the leading question here for me

[2:11:37] Trustee Luckham: is about how it is that we might choose

[2:11:41] Trustee Luckham: to try and reach out on an elected level

[2:11:44] Trustee Luckham: to this non-anonymous nation.

[2:11:46] Trustee Luckham: and um that could be a letter could be a phone call or something but i don't personally know

[2:11:55] Trustee Luckham: what any of the contact information that there is there i'd be happy to do that on your behalf

[2:12:01] Trustee Luckham: um i would try and figure out who the right person to contact would be and reach out and

[2:12:06] Trustee Luckham: try to get something going and then probably direct them to staff to if we get an agreement

[2:12:11] Trustee Luckham: to do that. But I'm also happy to let one of you follow that if you have, I think it's good to try

[2:12:18] Trustee Luckham: and build on existing relationships. And if there's an existing line of communication,

[2:12:22] Trustee Luckham: can we build on that? Because, you know, we are trying to respect their

[2:12:32] Trustee Luckham: requests, and we're absolutely interested in doing that. And certainly the timeline is our own,

[2:12:38] Trustee Luckham: That's for sure. But it would be good to try to establish a line of communication.

[2:12:45] Trustee Luckham: So any suggestions there from either of you trustees?

[2:12:49] Voice 5: Well, I know that Trustee Johnson has had some direct contacts in the past.

[2:12:56] Voice 5: And so maybe maybe I'll put it over to him and see what he has to say.

[2:13:02] Voice 5: OK, Peter Johnson, over to you.

[2:13:03] Voice 5: i

[2:13:03] Trustee Johnston: originally wrote to the chief whose name i can't i can't remember his first name that might be

[2:13:09] Trustee Johnston: gordon his last name is edwards and he actually wrote to the local trust committee asking for

[2:13:15] Trustee Johnston: the uh for us to pause until after we met him met with him and counsel i think it said

[2:13:22] Trustee Johnston: about the ocp amendment um i wrote to him originally when i heard i learned that they

[2:13:30] Trustee Johnston: had applied for or were in the process of applying for the forest land license or the sorry i can't

[2:13:37] Trustee Johnston: remember what it's called but anyway the the two two pieces on mesquite and other pieces

[2:13:42] Trustee Johnston: to make a small uh forestry on crown lands or previously uh and i got a phone call back from

[2:13:51] Trustee Johnston: brent edwards who is a counselor uh with the nation and i had a couple of phone conversations

[2:13:57] Trustee Johnston: with him and some email exchanges, but nothing other than that.

[2:14:03] Trustee Johnston: More recently, I wrote to Chief Edwards and basically said, you know, I was sorry that

[2:14:11] Trustee Johnston: it had taken us so long to respond to his request for a meeting and that I hoped that

[2:14:17] Trustee Johnston: that could happen soon and was there anything I could do.

[2:14:19] Trustee Johnston: And I haven't heard anything back from him or about that.

[2:14:23] Trustee Johnston: So I don't know.

[2:14:25] Trustee Johnston: I wouldn't say I had a channel of communication, although I have had a little bit with

[2:14:30] Trustee Johnston: the Councillor Brent Edwards.

[2:14:37] Voice 13: Okay. My

[2:14:38] Trustee Johnston: guess is a letter from you, Peter, as the

[2:14:43] Trustee Johnston: Laskiti, Chair of Laskiti Trust Committee would be most appropriate.

[2:14:48] Voice 15: Okay.

[2:14:48] Voice 16: Well, I'm happy

[2:14:50] Trustee Luckham: to do that. I would probably also attempt in that to attempt a

[2:14:55] Trustee Luckham: phone call maybe write a letter and follow it up with a phone call and try to pursue it yeah

[2:15:01] Voice 15: i

[2:15:02] Trustee Luckham: think i've had success with that in the past and it seems to be the most effective

[2:15:06] Trustee Luckham: way and in fact it's welcomed with gratitude sometimes so okay so perhaps a motion to that

[2:15:14] Trustee Luckham: effect would be helpful and then i know that i'm working on the direction of the ltc ask the chair

[2:15:19] Trustee Luckham: TO COMMUNICATE BY LETTER.

[2:15:26] Trustee Luckham: WE HAVE A

[2:15:27] Trustee Luckham: RECOMMENDED MOTION.

[2:15:30] Trustee Luckham: NO, IT'S NOT.

[2:15:32] Trustee Luckham: SORRY.

[2:15:32] Voice 11: I CAN READ IT OUT.

[2:15:34] Voice 11: PLEASE.

[2:15:34] Trustee Luckham: KATHERINE?

[2:15:36] Voice 11: THAT THE LISKEETEE LOCAL TRUST COMMITTEE DRAFT A LETTER FOR

[2:15:39] Voice 11: THE CHAIR'S SIGNATURE RESPONDING TO THE SEPTEMBER 21, 2021 LETTER

[2:15:43] Voice 11: FROM SNANOS FIRST NATION REQUESTING MEETING.

[2:15:48] Voice 11: GOOD.

[2:15:49] Trustee Luckham: MOVED.

[2:15:50] Trustee Luckham: SOMEBODY?

[2:15:50] Trustee Luckham: I'm at that Peterson second Peter Johnson any further discussion.

[2:15:55] Trustee Luckham: I was in favor.

[2:15:58] Trustee Luckham: I carry

[2:15:58] Voice 11: catch all that because

[2:16:00] Voice 16: he caught all that Kevin.

[2:16:05] Voice 12: No, I didn't catch the date.

[2:16:08] Voice 11: Yeah, it's it was a

[2:16:10] Voice 11: September 21st 2021.

[2:16:13] Voice 11: Some certain words

[2:16:19] Trustee Johnston: pulling in not in the motion, but in the letter a request

[2:16:23] Trustee Johnston: that that we meet soon so we can hear their concerns and their interests and yeah

[2:16:30] Voice 13: and

[2:16:33] Trustee Johnston: a zoom meeting would work yeah well by

[2:16:40] Trustee Johnston: whatever mechanism they would like they

[2:16:42] Trustee Johnston: prefer to in-person

[2:16:43] Trustee Johnston: meeting um

[2:16:46] Trustee Luckham: yeah and i would say that we'd be prepared to come to the council even and

[2:16:50] Trustee Luckham: speak to council and those are kind of the things that i would include in that letter

[2:16:55] Trustee Luckham: Yeah. Okay.

[2:16:58] Voice 11: In terms of logistics, do you want to draft it or would you like staff?

[2:17:02] Voice 11: We'll work together. Yeah.

[2:17:05] Trustee Luckham: Because you've got some of the details.

[2:17:07] Trustee Luckham: Yeah. And the contacts and stuff.

[2:17:11] Trustee Luckham: Some of it anyway. Okay. So I just want to note

[2:17:16] Trustee Luckham: that I certainly appreciate having this memorandum

[2:17:19] Trustee Luckham: and the bylaw the way it is

[2:17:23] Trustee Luckham: and that Peter Johnson's suggestions for potential changes are in here.

[2:17:29] Trustee Luckham: I just want to reflect that part of us sort of putting this on hold is,

[2:17:35] Trustee Luckham: and I think that what my intent would be is to not make any amendments

[2:17:42] Trustee Luckham: until we've actually heard what the concerns or interests are by the nation,

[2:17:46] Trustee Luckham: so that when we make further amendments, we can reflect those very values

[2:17:52] Trustee Luckham: and things that are important to them.

[2:17:53] Trustee Luckham: So I don't know whether or not

[2:17:55] Trustee Luckham: you want to have any further discussion

[2:17:58] Trustee Luckham: at this time about it or not.

[2:17:59] Trustee Luckham: I'm suggesting we just receive

[2:18:01] Trustee Luckham: this information.

[2:18:03] Trustee Luckham: But what's the pleasure of the LTC?

[2:18:07] Voice 6: Tim?

[2:18:08] Voice 6: I have something that I would like to ask.

[2:18:12] Voice 6: I'd like to make a motion

[2:18:14] Voice 6: to ask staff to add

[2:18:17] Voice 6: the finding community benefit

[2:18:18] Voice 6: to the project.

[2:18:21] Voice 6: Because I don't think

[2:18:22] Voice 6: that's not actually that's just asking for some some work on that and then the other thing is this

[2:18:28] Voice 6: uh in terms of definition and accuracy this information that we received from mr weiner

[2:18:34] Voice 6: from the livestock industry specialist at ministry of agriculture um maybe we can just uh

[2:18:43] Voice 6: maybe not staff that have a look at that and um perhaps make some recommendations

[2:18:52] Voice 6: my my take on this information is that i prefer that we're using accurate terms in the ocp um

[2:19:04] Voice 6: more than that i'm actually attached to i'm not proud to have a personal investment in in what

[2:19:12] Voice 6: terms we're using but if there is inaccuracy in the ocp with the terms that we're talking about

[2:19:17] Voice 6: um then let's let's fix that so i'd ask that maybe we would just refer that to staff and have a look

[2:19:23] Voice 6: at at this stage and then we don't have to uh we're not asking for an amendment at this moment

[2:19:33] Voice 6: if you are a member of chair i'd make the first motion and then we'll see how that goes and then

[2:19:38] Voice 6: we'll maybe i'll make a second one okay are you amenable to that peter yeah

[2:19:44] Voice 16: go ahead and then

[2:19:44] Voice 6: okay so i know that staff be requested to add defining community benefit to the ocp project

[2:19:51] Trustee Luckham: so moved seconded trustee johnson thank you and you got that catherine i think that's

[2:19:57] Trustee Luckham: straightforward is there any further discussion i think we talked about it in when we did the

[2:20:03] Trustee Luckham: bylaw so all those in favor that carries unanimously that's great thank you tim what else did you have

[2:20:11] Trustee Luckham: okay i move that staff

[2:20:14] Voice 6: be requested um uh

[2:20:19] Voice 5: how should i say this um examine

[2:20:31] Voice 6: look at i request

[2:20:34] Voice 6: that staff uh be requested to examine the letter forwarded um originating from christina forbes

[2:20:44] Voice 6: from the Ministry of Agriculture

[2:20:47] Voice 6: with information about the terms feral, invasive, and exotic

[2:20:55] Voice 6: in relation to their use in the OCP.

[2:21:00] Voice 16: Okay,

[2:21:01] Voice 6: so I have a mover

[2:21:02] Trustee Johnston: and a seconder.

[2:21:04] Voice 6: And I'm just...

[2:21:05] Trustee Johnston: I have a seconder, but I have a question

[2:21:06] Trustee Johnston: that's not particularly about this, but about the issue.

[2:21:10] Trustee Johnston: The original recommendation from the LCA Community Committee

[2:21:14] Trustee Johnston: was that we leave this as an unresolved issue

[2:21:18] Trustee Johnston: about which there is not agreement.

[2:21:20] Trustee Johnston: I can't remember how we got it

[2:21:22] Trustee Johnston: in a different way.

[2:21:29] Voice 16: Yeah, I think Trustee Peterson brought it as a motion

[2:21:32] Voice 16: to a meeting we had actually outside.

[2:21:37] Voice 6: At that point, yeah, I mean,

[2:21:42] Voice 6: I don't want to try and come up with details

[2:21:45] Voice 6: that I don't have in front of me,

[2:21:47] Voice 6: but i'm sure

[2:21:49] Voice 6: it's minute

[2:21:50] Voice 6: yeah good

[2:21:53] Voice 2: you know is is it appropriate to consider putting it back into

[2:21:57] Voice 2: the this is an issue the sheep is an issue about which there is not yet community agreement

[2:22:06] Voice 6: um i think that that i mean my feeling is that uh we've heard a lot a lot from the public around

[2:22:14] Voice 6: around this issue.

[2:22:18] Voice 6: And of course it's impossible to know

[2:22:21] Voice 6: what percentage of electors we heard from about this,

[2:22:27] Voice 6: but I certainly got a lot of strong requests

[2:22:31] Voice 6: that we make the amendment that we did.

[2:22:38] Voice 6: So, and I mean, in terms of our process right now,

[2:22:42] Voice 6: I'm not actually suggesting we do the amendment

[2:22:45] Voice 6: at this point but just basically ask staff to have a look at these terms this terminology so

[2:22:51] Voice 6: that if we are going to have it in the ocp as we do in the present draft that we're using

[2:22:56] Voice 6: accurate terminology that's my uh i think if we want to if we want to talk about reverting to

[2:23:04] Voice 6: no mention

[2:23:05] Voice 6: at all um then that's something we need to have uh we need to have uh you know

[2:23:11] Voice 6: fairly robust public conversation

[2:23:14] Voice 6: about that, if we're going to go back into

[2:23:15] Voice 6: that.

[2:23:21] Voice 6: Generally, I'm

[2:23:22] Voice 6: fairly content with the way it is, although

[2:23:24] Voice 6: I guess, you know, to be using accurate

[2:23:25] Voice 6: terminology,

[2:23:27] Voice 6: that's where I'm at with it.

[2:23:31] Voice 6: Okay.

[2:23:32] Trustee Luckham: Anything else, Peter?

[2:23:34] Voice 16: So I have a couple of remarks.

[2:23:37] Trustee Luckham: You know, absolutely, I don't live

[2:23:38] Trustee Luckham: here. You know, I have my own

[2:23:40] Trustee Luckham: points of view on the sheet, which may or may not be

[2:23:42] Trustee Luckham: material but i think that your point about using accurate references is important and understanding

[2:23:50] Trustee Luckham: what it is that we mean by that and i just wrote down here the sheep which i enjoyed you saying

[2:23:57] Trustee Luckham: because you know essentially it's about the sheep and for me accurate information includes

[2:24:06] Trustee Luckham: includes commonly held beliefs or ideas about anything and I think that if you talk about

[2:24:14] Trustee Luckham: the sheep or sheep it's a domesticated animal that is managed and cultivated in some way and

[2:24:23] Trustee Luckham: it just has that connotation about it oh yeah that guy farms sheep then they're kind of domesticated

[2:24:29] Trustee Luckham: and I like the little things that we got there which certainly made me think oh we don't want

[2:24:34] Trustee Luckham: want to use those terms i'd say that quite frankly um but what's missing in this is and i forgot what

[2:24:40] Trustee Luckham: the second one was i've got the one on my mind all this time but i couldn't remember what the

[2:24:45] Trustee Luckham: second one was and tom reminded me of what it was today and it's heritage sheep because i think

[2:24:51] Trustee Luckham: and i and i know i've learned this from people that are sheep farmers heritage sheep has its

[2:24:59] Trustee Luckham: its own definition. And you can't just apply it indiscriminately to an animal that is breeding

[2:25:05] Trustee Luckham: in the wild with other non-heritage sheep. Even if they were heritage sheep, they're not anymore.

[2:25:13] Trustee Luckham: So I'm just going to keep going here for a second. So there's heritage. The other phrase

[2:25:17] Trustee Luckham: is quite simply wild sheep. Because if they're not domesticated, what are they? They must be wild.

[2:25:25] Trustee Luckham: And so I would like to ask this person here, Forbes, Christina Forbes, at the branch of agriculture, although she's not using a proper address, but that's it, to help us with those two terms, heritage, Christine Forbes at gov.bc.ca, thank you.

[2:25:47] Trustee Luckham: So I'd be interested to know what the interpretation is of wild sheep and domestic and heritage, because I don't think we should use heritage and Tom did imply in today's thing that he wanted to retain that heritage sheep thing.

[2:26:06] Trustee Luckham: and i don't know so i think that perhaps if the ltc was willing i would make an amendment to your

[2:26:15] Trustee Luckham: motion to say and inquire of minister of agriculture on the terms heritage and wild sheep

[2:26:26] Trustee Luckham: and

[2:26:27] Voice 6: that would give us full information absolutely and if we're if we're striving for accuracy chair

[2:26:32] Voice 6: I think that's very worthy to look at.

[2:26:36] Trustee Luckham: So, Peter Johnson, would you support that?

[2:26:40] Trustee Johnston: I would support that.

[2:26:42] Trustee Johnston: I think that the word that describes a sheep is feral.

[2:26:45] Trustee Johnston: They are a domestic animal.

[2:26:47] Trustee Johnston: They're unmanaged.

[2:26:49] Trustee Johnston: And, you know, I can't remember what she said about feral.

[2:26:53] Trustee Johnston: I think they said they don't define it, didn't she?

[2:26:56] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, it says that

[2:26:57] Trustee Luckham: sheep are not designated as a feral species.

[2:27:00] Trustee Luckham: species. And I got to say, I've asked the question, well, who designated cats as feral

[2:27:06] Trustee Luckham: or dogs? How does that list get compiled? I don't know. Anyway, back to a more serious

[2:27:14] Trustee Luckham: note. If you're okay with that, then I would move to amend the motion to include asking

[2:27:23] Trustee Luckham: asking staff to inquire about with the Ministry of Agriculture

[2:27:32] Trustee Luckham: regarding the definitions of heritage and wild animals.

[2:27:38] Trustee Luckham: In regard to the sheep.

[2:27:39] Trustee Luckham: In regard to the sheep, yeah.

[2:27:42] Trustee Luckham: So did you manage to get that, Catherine?

[2:27:45] Trustee Luckham: Yes, I did.

[2:27:46] Trustee Luckham: Thank you.

[2:27:47] Trustee Luckham: So I'll move that if somebody wants to second.

[2:27:49] Trustee Luckham: Tim Peterson, secondly.

[2:27:50] Trustee Luckham: Thank you.

[2:27:51] Trustee Luckham: and so now on the amendment this is where it gets tricky on the amendment to the motion all those

[2:27:57] Trustee Luckham: in favor that carries

[2:27:59] Trustee Luckham: unanimously so i'm now back to the amended motion um uh can i call the vote

[2:28:05] Trustee Luckham: are we ready all those in favor that two carries that's fantastic this is a good bit of work to

[2:28:12] Trustee Luckham: move the dial a bit and i don't

[2:28:15] Voice 10: think that uh

[2:28:15] Trustee Luckham: offends

[2:28:16] Voice 6: our address and stuff i

[2:28:19] Trustee Luckham: don't think

[2:28:20] Trustee Luckham: that offends our work with the First Nations because we're just providing more information

[2:28:24] Trustee Luckham: in there that will help facilitate the conversation with them because indeed

[2:28:27] Trustee Luckham: they may have some concerns or issues with respect

[2:28:32] Trustee Luckham: to sheep as well, the sheep. Anything

[2:28:36] Trustee Luckham: else on the Leskete Island OCP?

[2:28:39] Voice 6: I have

[2:28:40] Voice 6: something I'd like to mention. I appreciate, Spav,

[2:28:44] Voice 6: thank you for your best estimation

[2:28:48] Voice 6: on uh the film rod comments um i'm wondering uh before i make a motion i wouldn't mind hearing

[2:28:59] Voice 6: trustee johnson stall on this but uh considering that these um the objectionable uh or the deemed

[2:29:09] Voice 6: objectionable um uh portions of the ocp came out of the community process i'm wondering if um

[2:29:19] Voice 6: Um, uh, referring this section to the APC for, for, for comment or, uh, suggestion is

[2:29:29] Voice 6: like a worthy part of just doing our diligence in terms of, you know, putting this, uh, letting

[2:29:38] Voice 6: the community have another crack at this before we've gone ahead and made the decision and

[2:29:42] Voice 6: then had, uh, perhaps here later, why, why did we do this?

[2:29:46] Voice 6: So what I'm considering, Peter, is referring this comments section and the staff estimates on it to the APC for some concerns.

[2:30:00] Voice 6: and comments to make

[2:30:03] Trustee Johnston: sure there still is community support for these things well

[2:30:07] Voice 6: we know there is community support to get them in the draft right what I'm

[2:30:16] Voice 6: unclear is how the community would feel about us going ahead and removing all of

[2:30:22] Voice 6: these without some further discussion

[2:30:25] Voice 15: that that's

[2:30:30] Voice 6: why I was thinking of

[2:30:31] Voice 6: referral to the apc might be a way to get some of that information back to the ltc uh without us

[2:30:38] Voice 6: trying to sort of guesswork and i sort of prefer that rather than just going ahead and deciding to

[2:30:45] Voice 6: move them without or remove them without any further community discussion about removing them

[2:30:51] Voice 6: oh

[2:30:53] Trustee Johnston: okay i'm i'm surprised to hear that there's consideration of removing them

[2:30:58] Trustee Johnston: because we've

[2:30:59] Voice 13: been asked by the ministry to remove them we've

[2:31:02] Trustee Johnston: been told by the ministry

[2:31:03] Trustee Johnston: that they have concerns with with them

[2:31:05] Voice 5: right okay well nonetheless and

[2:31:10] Trustee Johnston: they're they're all

[2:31:11] Trustee Johnston: all except uh the section on water i think let me see no they're they're all advocacy policies

[2:31:23] Trustee Johnston: and that's what we're doing is advocating to the provincial government

[2:31:26] Trustee Johnston: that they do this or not do that

[2:31:30] Trustee Johnston: and that those express the wish of the community,

[2:31:35] Trustee Johnston: which is what the OCP is designed to do.

[2:31:42] Trustee Johnston: I mean, and it might well be that if we don't, you know,

[2:31:47] Trustee Johnston: remove them at their request,

[2:31:49] Trustee Johnston: that the minister will not approve the bylaw

[2:31:52] Trustee Johnston: in municipal affairs when it comes to, you know,

[2:31:57] Trustee Johnston: referring it to him.

[2:31:58] Trustee Johnston: Well,

[2:32:01] Trustee Luckham: you know, in my opinion, anyway, you've hit the nail on the head there, Peter, because I think that when a ministry expresses a concern in a polite way to say in responding to your referral to vote, we're concerned about this.

[2:32:18] Trustee Luckham: it means they're concerned about it and when we in the process we submit our uh uh our ocp as we

[2:32:27] Trustee Luckham: think we want the minister our minister to adopt it we submit it to them and then that minister

[2:32:32] Trustee Luckham: goes out to looks through all this stuff and it goes out to the respective ministries and says

[2:32:36] Trustee Luckham: you got any problems with this and they go oh yeah and then the minister says well did you tell

[2:32:41] Trustee Luckham: them about it and they go yeah and what did they do nothing and so this will impact potentially

[2:32:48] Trustee Luckham: have impact so i think we need to do certainly consider them and reflect upon them and then

[2:32:54] Trustee Luckham: maybe either clarify what the what the um outcome of what the necessity of those amendments are

[2:33:03] Trustee Luckham: and whether or not we might consider altering it and maybe there's more discussion that needs

[2:33:08] Trustee Luckham: needs to be had. But I think that this is an early warning that when the minister comes

[2:33:13] Trustee Luckham: to them to ask them about the OCP, they're going to go, man, we're not in favor of those

[2:33:17] Trustee Luckham: sections 4.49 and 5.16 kind of thing. So I think this is an opportunity for us to reflect

[2:33:24] Trustee Luckham: on whether what the necessity for those are, how important are they to us, and whether

[2:33:31] Trustee Luckham: we want to continue to include them or not. But sending it to the agency is not a bad

[2:33:37] Trustee Luckham: idea i

[2:33:38] Voice 6: i i mean it's not like we've overworked them terribly i guess there is a when is the

[2:33:43] Voice 6: the new term for abc though june

[2:33:45] Voice 11: 22nd okay

[2:33:47] Voice 6: so that's or

[2:33:49] Trustee Luckham: it'll be information for whatever

[2:33:50] Trustee Luckham: you know sure yeah

[2:33:52] Voice 6: yeah even if it turns over that it's then for the new one but my thought

[2:33:56] Voice 6: was that if we send it to the abc then we're not just uh uh we're not just discussing this

[2:34:03] Voice 6: This just within our little LTC bubble and maybe some other minds put to it might help us come out somewhere where maybe the APC would recommend that we sort of have a little bit of a more public dialogue.

[2:34:21] Voice 6: I don't know what they would recommend, but.

[2:34:24] Trustee Luckham: Well, we could, you could also like this, this is your opportunity to ask a specific question to the APC.

[2:34:29] Trustee Luckham: and so your opportunity is to go do we want this do we not want this what what clarity do we need

[2:34:36] Trustee Luckham: to offer to shape it so

[2:34:41] Voice 6: that was my thought on referring this this section to them at this point

[2:34:46] Voice 6: i

[2:34:47] Trustee Johnston: just think we need to do more than just refer it to them we need to ask them

[2:34:52] Trustee Johnston: to give them some idea of what we'd like them to to think about to talk about to discuss to

[2:34:58] Trustee Johnston: recommend yeah

[2:34:59] Voice 7: and that's what i'm asking from what you

[2:35:01] Trustee Johnston: just said peter it seems to me that

[2:35:04] Trustee Johnston: first one about crown land we're just asking them to designate all encumbered crown land

[2:35:10] Trustee Johnston: as some kind of formal protected status i think having heard what you said and and understanding

[2:35:17] Trustee Johnston: that now uh we need to go on and say why we would like that for protection of the uh coastal

[2:35:25] Trustee Johnston: for Douglas for his own for connectivity for you know there's lots of reasons to do that

[2:35:30] Trustee Johnston: it's not simply so that they don't sell it off and it comes on the market uh you know that we

[2:35:36] Trustee Johnston: have reasons and you know they don't need to do that even if it's in there they're they're the

[2:35:41] Trustee Johnston: senior government they don't need to pay any attention well they need to pay some lip service

[2:35:47] Trustee Johnston: at least or or look at the plan but they don't need to follow it they're not bound or encumbered

[2:35:52] Trustee Johnston: by it so yeah i agree that some work needs to be done and i think we should maybe we should work

[2:36:00] Trustee Johnston: with the apc although we can't do that unless it's a trust committee meeting or at least give

[2:36:07] Trustee Johnston: them uh indication of what we'd like well

[2:36:13] Trustee Luckham: you know it's all about language i think and i'm just

[2:36:18] Trustee Luckham: thinking on what you've said there which is true but what the province it's a matter of figuring

[2:36:23] Trustee Luckham: don't know what the question was and what the answer was. And the province is unlikely to want

[2:36:27] Trustee Luckham: their land encumbered in this way. And the intent of this thing, as you've indicated, is general

[2:36:34] Trustee Luckham: advocacy policy, although a general advocacy policy isn't necessarily supported by the

[2:36:41] Trustee Luckham: provinces requested to designate. And so I think possibly it's a general advocacy thing. I'm just

[2:36:48] Trustee Luckham: using this as an example, that the Liskety Island Local Trust Committee work with the province to

[2:36:56] Trustee Luckham: seek protected status of unencumbered, of vacant crown land. And that might be something that they

[2:37:04] Trustee Luckham: wouldn't object to, whereas this, the way we worded it, they would object to. So I think it's

[2:37:10] Trustee Luckham: a matter of getting from where we are to getting where we want to be. And at the end of the day,

[2:37:14] Trustee Luckham: hey, we want to convince the province to support these kinds of ideas, right?

[2:37:19] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, so I think it needs to be a question to the APC

[2:37:24] Trustee Luckham: about what's the important value here

[2:37:29] Trustee Luckham: and what should we be asking the province for in light of this question

[2:37:31] Trustee Luckham: and this one and this one and this one and this one.

[2:37:33] Trustee Luckham: Because I think there's room for movement.

[2:37:36] Trustee Luckham: The province doesn't generally like to be told what to do.

[2:37:40] Trustee Luckham: And it's easy to read that as I told you to do this.

[2:37:45] Trustee Johnston: Well, it actually, that first one says request.

[2:37:50] Voice 11: Yeah,

[2:37:51] Voice 15: it's close.

[2:37:53] Voice 11: They're requesting something that they don't want to do.

[2:37:56] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, exactly.

[2:37:59] Trustee Luckham: Whereas they might stand behind protecting the coastal Douglas fir

[2:38:03] Trustee Luckham: values on crown lands, right?

[2:38:09] Trustee Luckham: And that would be a wonderful thing because, in fact,

[2:38:13] Trustee Luckham: they are kind of, they got their foot in the pond, right?

[2:38:16] Trustee Luckham: because they are part of the Coastal Douglas Spur Protection Association

[2:38:23] Voice 13: or whatever they call

[2:38:24] Trustee Luckham: themselves.

[2:38:25] Voice 13: So

[2:38:26] Trustee Luckham: looking for a motion then to send this to the APC to seek clarity on the intent or

[2:38:34] Trustee Luckham: something.

[2:38:35] Voice 11: Would it be recommendations for either removing it or

[2:38:42] Voice 11: specific modifications they would

[2:38:45] Voice 11: Or

[2:38:46] Trustee Luckham: support for, yeah,

[2:38:48] Voice 11: specific

[2:38:49] Trustee Luckham: support for.

[2:38:53] Trustee Johnston: And recommendations for more justification or argumentation.

[2:38:59] Voice 13: Yeah.

[2:39:01] Trustee Johnston: Support of those.

[2:39:04] Trustee Luckham: And in fact, you know, ABC members can be pointed to this recording,

[2:39:08] Voice 15: and

[2:39:10] Trustee Luckham: that could be helped.

[2:39:11] Trustee Luckham: This is one of the beauties, actually, of this recording process, is if anybody wants clarity about anything,

[2:39:18] Trustee Luckham: it's all here

[2:39:20] Voice 5: what did I say

[2:39:23] Voice 6: did I

[2:39:24] Voice 6: okay I'm just going to go ahead and make

[2:39:26] Voice 6: a couple little notes here

[2:39:27] Voice 6: and try to put together a list in here

[2:39:29] Voice 6: in the next couple moments here

[2:39:31] Voice 6: thank you if you take your time it's important for it to be

[2:39:34] Trustee Luckham: read so it's important for us to

[2:39:37] Trustee Luckham: catch the ferry

[2:39:39] Voice 6: you've got a couple minutes assuming we

[2:39:41] Voice 6: don't take forever on the next section

[2:39:43] Voice 6: you don't know how

[2:39:44] Voice 6: slow we walk

[2:39:45] Voice 6: I've got a truck with me right

[2:39:55] Voice 10: Oh,

[2:39:56] Voice 16: I think it will. And the wind will be with us as well. I think it usually

[2:40:06] Voice 15: turns.

[2:40:08] Voice 15: It is what it is.

[2:40:11] Trustee Luckham: You're a brave soul. Thank you for coming. Please come back. Come back,

[2:40:17] Voice 11: y'all. Lots of ginger next time. Yeah. Ginger's good. Yeah.

[2:40:21] Voice 15: Honestly, ginger cookies. I used

[2:40:43] Voice 17: 4

[2:40:44] Voice 15: o'clock.

[2:40:46] Voice 15: We should be leaving at 3.30.

[2:40:57] Voice 10: Okay, let's give this a try.

[2:41:01] Voice 6: I move that the LTC refer the section on

[2:41:05] Voice 6: Flunrod comments on the OCP

[2:41:08] Voice 6: to the APC

[2:41:11] Voice 6: for recommendations on removal,

[2:41:15] Voice 6: amendments, or additions to the proposed policies.

[2:41:19] Voice 17: That sounds good.

[2:41:22] Voice 16: you okay with that peter so moved by

[2:41:26] Trustee Luckham: trustee peterson seconded by trustee johnson

[2:41:29] Trustee Luckham: any further discussion all those in favor that carries this is great anything else on the

[2:41:36] Trustee Luckham: skidian official community plan i

[2:41:39] Trustee Johnston: i got a uh email recently from david and laura about specifically

[2:41:45] Trustee Johnston: not uh about the ferry and freight service on the ferry um and i don't i don't remember if it came

[2:41:52] Trustee Johnston: to all of you or if it just was me i didn't receive it

[2:41:56] Voice 10: did not

[2:41:58] Voice 10: regarding what

[2:41:59] Voice 10: my

[2:42:01] Trustee Johnston: proposed

[2:42:06] Trustee Johnston: yeah your voice just

[2:42:08] Trustee Luckham: peter your voice just fades out you

[2:42:11] Voice 17: gotta talk right at the microphone i'm

[2:42:14] Trustee Johnston: not sure where it is but i'm talking right that's

[2:42:16] Voice 17: perfect that's perfect

[2:42:17] Voice 17: don't turn your head don't

[2:42:18] Voice 17: turn it

[2:42:19] Trustee Johnston: was about not uh not it was about one of my comments in my extensive list of proposed

[2:42:27] Trustee Johnston: revisions to uh refer to baggage rather than freight on the ferry i'll i'll if it just came

[2:42:36] Trustee Johnston: to me i'll uh see if it's okay with them and forward it to you yeah

[2:42:41] Trustee Luckham: and that would be up to

[2:42:43] Trustee Luckham: to the ferry company to decide what they want to consider cargo

[2:42:46] Trustee Luckham: as another word.

[2:42:50] Trustee Johnston: The reason I suggested that is that it's a passenger ferry

[2:42:54] Trustee Johnston: that carries passengers and their baggage, not freight.

[2:42:59] Voice 16: Well, I don't know. Those sheets of plywood and two-by-fours look like freight.

[2:43:05] Trustee Luckham: Baggage is personal affection clothing.

[2:43:07] Trustee Luckham: You'd have to look up that definition. Maybe we can see some

[2:43:10] Trustee Luckham: Yeah,

[2:43:12] Trustee Johnston: I think cargo might be a better word to use because we're all encompassing.

[2:43:17] Trustee Luckham: That's

[2:43:17] Trustee Johnston: good. I can

[2:43:18] Trustee Luckham: make my mark on the OCP. That's great.

[2:43:21] Trustee Luckham: Okay, so you're going to look after that.

[2:43:24] Trustee Luckham: And so then therefore I'll accept that there's no further work on the official committee plan.

[2:43:30] Trustee Luckham: So meeting procedure bylaw amendments here for discussion.

[2:43:34] Trustee Luckham: And staff, are you prepared to start us off on this?

[2:43:38] Trustee Luckham: or do you want the trustees to go into this?

[2:43:42] Voice 11: My quick little intro is you have adopted

[2:43:45] Voice 11: your latest amendment to the procedures by law.

[2:43:48] Voice 11: So I understand there might be some more considerations

[2:43:51] Voice 11: that the trustees would like to talk about.

[2:43:53] Trustee Luckham: So maybe if you just ask the leading question,

[2:43:55] Trustee Luckham: what does that mean?

[2:43:56] Trustee Luckham: We'd have to open it up again and give it readings

[2:43:59] Trustee Luckham: and go through the whole process?

[2:44:01] Trustee Luckham: Yes.

[2:44:01] Trustee Luckham: And the next earliest opportunity might be,

[2:44:07] Trustee Luckham: it depends

[2:44:07] Voice 13: on how we prioritize it.

[2:44:09] Trustee Luckham: Yes. Thank you. That's right.

[2:44:10] Trustee Luckham: All right. So what are the amendments from the trustees that you think are important?

[2:44:18] Trustee Luckham: And should we be doing this now or we're passing it on as a little package to the next LTC?

[2:44:25] Trustee Luckham: Peter, Tim Peterson. OK,

[2:44:28] Voice 6: I have. I mean, I understand.

[2:44:30] Voice 6: I apologize that we allowed this to get to third reading, and we're now in that position

[2:44:37] Voice 6: of having to rescind two events.

[2:44:44] Voice 6: However, I have heard from a number of people, and I do think that it's fair, and I agree

[2:44:51] Voice 6: that there should be some stipulated timeframe on public notice of meeting time and place.

[2:45:00] Voice 6: now of course we generally have you know the whole year's meeting laid out so it's really

[2:45:07] Voice 6: only a matter of when we have a special meeting or have to reschedule a meeting

[2:45:13] Voice 6: and so i do have a motion but obviously we would have to rescind and all that first

[2:45:18] Voice 6: so that's that's one issue the proposal would be that we have a public notice of the meeting

[2:45:27] Voice 6: a minimum of 10 days prior to the meeting.

[2:45:31] Voice 6: So if

[2:45:32] Trustee Luckham: I might intervene, go ahead.

[2:45:34] Trustee Luckham: Is this an opportunity for standing resolution?

[2:45:41] Voice 11: Possibly, possibly, I mean, just in terms of procedure,

[2:45:46] Voice 11: the meeting procedures by law has been adopted

[2:45:49] Voice 11: as far as I remember, which means we're reopening it.

[2:45:53] Voice 11: So we'd have to draft and do a whole set

[2:45:55] Voice 11: of first, second, third, there's no rescinding.

[2:45:58] Voice 11: We're just

[2:45:58] Voice 11: amending it again.

[2:45:59] Voice 11: But if

[2:46:00] Voice 11: the amendments are simple enough,

[2:46:02] Voice 11: it might be possible to just do that again.

[2:46:06] Voice 11: But in terms of a standing resolution,

[2:46:10] Voice 11: that might be a possibility too.

[2:46:12] Voice 11: Just

[2:46:12] Trustee Luckham: to say that all notifications of public meetings will be...

[2:46:17] Voice 11: Where the meeting has been amended.

[2:46:19] Voice 11: Because I think that's what you're talking about.

[2:46:20] Voice 11: If the meeting time or date or any of those have been changed

[2:46:24] Voice 11: from what the meeting schedule says,

[2:46:28] Voice 11: that's

[2:46:28] Voice 6: correct and that's the you know i i i apologize that i missed yeah missing that

[2:46:36] Voice 6: in the

[2:46:36] Voice 6: first round um but

[2:46:39] Voice 15: i do think

[2:46:39] Voice 6: that's important and it's and it is something that

[2:46:42] Voice 6: i've heard from the public that they feel is important that be part of our of our process

[2:46:47] Voice 6: is that

[2:46:48] Voice 6: there is a statutory that we have decided that there is a minimum

[2:46:53] Voice 6: them a timeframe to get public notice up. So

[2:46:57] Voice 6: that's the one thing.

[2:46:58] Voice 6: The other thing of course is the,

[2:47:02] Voice 6: this question of the timeframe of submitting to delegations.

[2:47:14] Voice 6: Let's see if I can find my notes on that.

[2:47:23] Voice 6: So the complaints that I've heard about this is the 14 days.

[2:47:28] Voice 6: Now, of course, this is completely understandable in terms of the agenda preparation and for the delegation materials to make it into the agenda package, right?

[2:47:45] Voice 6: I mean, we all know that we, you know, us trustees aren't going to receive that, you know, we don't receive the agenda until about 10 days before the meeting.

[2:47:57] Voice 6: so 14 days kind of aligns with that um but that of course now i

[2:48:07] Voice 6: feel that i

[2:48:08] Voice 5: don't have my freaking

[2:48:09] Voice 5: mouse um

[2:48:15] Voice 10: uh so

[2:48:28] Voice 6: the um so i guess my question is then um if if it's uh uh if as it stands right

[2:48:43] Voice 6: now the meeting procedures bylaw says you know the material or an outline of the material to

[2:48:51] Voice 6: be presented and

[2:48:54] Voice 5: so we lined on the electronics trouble with the paper now uh oh of course

[2:49:06] Voice 5: um did i bring it up here maybe last

[2:49:17] Voice 15: today so what's the essence of it so the essence is

[2:49:25] Voice 11: And it's really just the written request.

[2:49:27] Voice 11: It doesn't say they have to turn over all of their materials to us two weeks in advance.

[2:49:33] Voice 11: It says they have to just make the request two weeks in advance.

[2:49:36] Voice 11: And the way that we typically work on, and this is very typical, is they make the request

[2:49:40] Voice 11: and then Becky works with them to see what their materials are.

[2:49:44] Voice 11: They submit materials.

[2:49:46] Voice 11: Those might be a letter, might be a PowerPoint presentation.

[2:49:49] Voice 11: And she checks them for defamatory statements.

[2:49:52] Voice 11: Sure, sure.

[2:49:53] Voice 11: etc. Yeah.

[2:50:01] Voice 5: And not in the presentation or

[2:50:03] Voice 5: an overview of the information.

[2:50:05] Voice 6: Right. That was the part I was

[2:50:10] Voice 6: looking for.

[2:50:18] Voice 13: Yeah. And the trouble is,

[2:50:26] Trustee Luckham: we have

[2:50:28] Trustee Luckham: had cases where citizens have said,

[2:50:32] Voice 15: why did you publish that live about me?

[2:50:37] Voice 15: Okay, so the...

[2:50:39] Voice 6: I'm talking to my lawyer. Yeah, yeah.

[2:50:41] Voice 10: So

[2:50:43] Voice 6: I guess the question is whether having a presentation two weeks in advance is, like,

[2:51:06] Voice 6: if we give somebody a town hall address or somebody does a delegation

[2:51:16] Voice 6: but gives us an overview and doesn't give us the, you know,

[2:51:20] Voice 6: doesn't include the defamatory parts.

[2:51:22] Voice 6: The question is what's the difference like in terms of what actually is

[2:51:30] Voice 6: allowed to be said at the meeting.

[2:51:32] Voice 16: It's what we publish in the agenda package.

[2:51:34] Voice 16: Right.

[2:51:34] Voice 6: But if there's an overview and not a detailed.

[2:51:40] Voice 6: Yeah.

[2:51:41] Voice 6: Right.

[2:51:42] Trustee Luckham: Yeah. We remain vulnerable, but the thing,

[2:51:45] Trustee Luckham: the key is it's about the materials in advance that we publish.

[2:51:50] Trustee Luckham: because many delegates understand the notion of delegation meaning that you're bringing some

[2:51:56] Trustee Luckham: materials and making a little bit of a powerpoint or something and a bit more fulsome and they get

[2:52:01] Trustee Luckham: the full kind of 10 minute thing whereas a town hall you just come to the town hall you just tell

[2:52:06] Trustee Luckham: us what you want and it's up to the chair at the time to go oh hang on you can't say that about

[2:52:13] tim

[2:52:14] Voice 6: okay i

[2:52:15] Trustee Luckham: don't really think there's necessarily a problem with the way it is but yeah

[2:52:19] Voice 6: i'm not so

[2:52:20] Voice 6: attached that the um i just wanted to flag that that you know like hearing about that i've had

[2:52:27] Voice 6: a couple conversations about it um but i do i do want us to uh be able to include some mechanism

[2:52:38] Voice 6: for having a minimum time for notification of public notification of uh

[2:52:45] Voice 6: of uh meeting time and place if it's if it's not in our set you know if something's been

[2:52:50] Voice 6: rescheduled or something new has been added so

[2:52:52] Trustee Luckham: perhaps we could ask for staff to either bring

[2:52:56] Trustee Luckham: back recommendations for a resolution standing resolution or amendments to the bottom and then

[2:53:05] Trustee Luckham: once we've got that we can decide if we really want to embark upon that journey okay peter

[2:53:12] Trustee Johnston: it appears to me that there's no minimum notice period for a meeting

[2:53:20] Trustee Johnston: because they specialize we set out the year's meetings at the beginning of the year and publish

[2:53:25] Trustee Johnston: that and then when we change there's there's no requirement for notice and when two of the

[2:53:32] Trustee Johnston: trustees want to call a meeting they can call it inform the third one and i believe i can't find

[2:53:38] Trustee Johnston: I'll just put this, it's section seven.

[2:53:46] Trustee Johnston: They have to deliver the time and purpose of the meeting

[2:53:51] Trustee Johnston: to the committee by telephone or written notice

[2:53:54] Trustee Johnston: at least 48 hours, except that notice

[2:53:58] Trustee Johnston: to local trust committee members

[2:53:59] Trustee Johnston: may be waived by unanimous vote.

[2:54:02] Trustee Johnston: And there's no mention at all of notice to the public

[2:54:06] Voice 13: of

[2:54:06] Trustee Johnston: any meeting, not a day,

[2:54:09] Trustee Johnston: no amount i actually think that 10 days is too long as a minimum notice i think we want to be

[2:54:15] Trustee Johnston: a bit more nimble than that although 10 days is is good nearly

[2:54:20] Trustee Luckham: you know i think actually

[2:54:21] Trustee Luckham: to put it all into context the intention is not that this is done on a regular basis

[2:54:27] Trustee Luckham: and it's done under urgent uh for urgent matters um and whatever they might be

[2:54:36] Trustee Luckham: but the reason for a regularly scheduled meeting agenda and even actually as we've done in the past

[2:54:42] Trustee Luckham: is include potential dates for a meeting which we may end up canceling so that it is clear to

[2:54:49] Trustee Luckham: the public what the regular meetings are i think this this is a special situation which we don't

[2:54:54] Trustee Luckham: wouldn't be doing all the time we would only be doing it under circumstances required immediate

[2:55:00] Trustee Luckham: immediate decision, like so-and-so's got a grant that needs to be submitted on Friday, and we need

[2:55:06] Trustee Luckham: some support from the LTC, and we need to discuss it, so okay, well, we'll meet on Wednesday, and we'll

[2:55:12] Trustee Luckham: make that happen,

[2:55:13] Voice 13: and

[2:55:14] Trustee Luckham: the meeting agendas for special meetings, correct me if I'm wrong, Heather,

[2:55:18] Trustee Luckham: are very specific, topical. We

[2:55:20] Trustee Luckham: are only going to talk about these things. It's not a full-blown

[2:55:24] Trustee Luckham: meeting of any shape or form. Special meetings, yeah. Yeah.

[2:55:29] Trustee Johnston: I understand that we have good

[2:55:31] Trustee Johnston: intentions but there's no minimum notice for meetings well

[2:55:36] Trustee Luckham: it's 48 hours or whatever it is

[2:55:37] Trustee Luckham: oh i see

[2:55:38] Trustee Johnston: what you're saying not in there

[2:55:39] Trustee Luckham: oh but in that

[2:55:41] Trustee Johnston: way so

[2:55:42] Trustee Luckham: we have a practice normally that

[2:55:44] Trustee Luckham: we post but yeah i get i get what you're saying so it could be a standing resolution to any meeting

[2:55:50] Trustee Luckham: be published uh five days before the meeting or as applicable as

[2:55:55] Voice 15: as

[2:55:56] Trustee Luckham: suitable because it's if it

[2:55:58] Trustee Luckham: it is indeed 48 hours later there's not much point in really publishing anything but it depends

[2:56:05] Voice 11: yeah i mean i i take it just operationally to mean some you know at the very least and i think

[2:56:13] Voice 11: we do this as sort of standard practice where we post a notice on the venue yeah right somebody

[2:56:19] Voice 11: comes and posts a handwritten sign even um but there might but there's usually staff will usually

[2:56:27] Voice 11: post something to the

[2:56:29] Voice 11: webpage and

[2:56:31] Voice 11: those

[2:56:33] Voice 11: do go out as soon as we know

[2:56:35] Voice 11: there's going to be a meeting. So there's

[2:56:37] Voice 11: a sort of standard practice

[2:56:39] Voice 11: that staff go through, but it's not

[2:56:41] Voice 11: codified. It's sort of as we can

[2:56:43] Voice 11: and as we have time and as soon as

[2:56:45] Voice 11: we know there's going to be a meeting.

[2:56:47] Voice 11: So

[2:56:49] Voice 11: there may be a way to codify that

[2:56:51] Voice 11: in here or in a standing resolution

[2:56:53] Voice 11: and yeah, we're glad to go

[2:56:55] Voice 11: in with your recommendations.

[2:56:56] Voice 11: yeah

[2:56:57] Voice 6: and i and i'd say i mean appreciate what you just said and i'd say one of the

[2:57:00] Voice 6: the uh a common theme here is because a lot of people

[2:57:06] Voice 6: don't don't have calm activity for

[2:57:08] Voice 6: one reason or another and that you know a physical um notice at the post office of the cafe

[2:57:17] Voice 6: say, you know, as sort of a minimum would be seen as being respecting the people that

[2:57:26] Voice 6: either can't or don't get, choose not to get connected.

[2:57:32] Voice 6: Some people simply can't on the side.

[2:57:35] Trustee Luckham: I think there's an opportunity for a standing resolution because we're not changing through

[2:57:39] Trustee Luckham: bylaw.

[2:57:40] Voice 7: And

[2:57:41] Trustee Luckham: then that would actually put this into place immediately, more or less, and would

[2:57:47] Trustee Luckham: would buy you the time to actually see how the new by-law even works out

[2:57:52] Trustee Luckham: and potentially incorporate additional changes as you saw,

[2:57:56] Trustee Luckham: and then indeed include that.

[2:57:57] Trustee Luckham: And standing resolutions sit on your agenda.

[2:58:00] Trustee Luckham: Every single agenda package that says standing resolution is listed right there.

[2:58:04] Trustee Luckham: So it's a constant reminder, which I actually like.

[2:58:09] Trustee Luckham: So did you already read out the motion?

[2:58:15] Trustee Luckham: Did you get that motion, Kathleen?

[2:58:18] Voice 6: No, I don't read it out yet.

[2:58:21] Voice 6: So the motion was about actually amending the bylaw.

[2:58:28] Voice 6: Actually,

[2:58:29] Trustee Luckham: I think I suggested it to be a motion first.

[2:58:31] Voice 6: And yeah, the

[2:58:32] Voice 6: motion I have prepared is about amending the bylaw.

[2:58:35] Voice 6: So to change it as a standing resolution.

[2:58:39] Voice 15: Or bring a bylaw.

[2:58:40] Trustee Luckham: Give them the option.

[2:58:42] Trustee Luckham: Give them the option to bring a standing resolution or a bylaw.

[2:58:45] Trustee Luckham: Okay.

[2:58:45] Trustee Luckham: Because if they can't do it by resolution,

[2:58:47] Trustee Luckham: resolution, then we don't want to hinder them by not being able to.

[2:58:51] Voice 10: Certainly. So

[2:58:53] Voice 6: I move that the LTC

[2:58:56] Voice 6: request staff

[2:59:04] Voice 6: to report back on

[2:59:12] Voice 6: either amending bylaw

[2:59:14] Voice 6: number 100 or creating a standing resolution

[2:59:22] Voice 6: regarding

[2:59:23] Voice 6: REGARDING MEETING NOTIFICATIONS, PUBLIC NOTICE OF MEETING, PUBLIC NOTICE OF MEETINGS.

[2:59:37] Voice 17: YOU'RE GOOD WITH THAT, PETER.

[2:59:40] Trustee Luckham: SO I'LL TAKE IT BACK.

[2:59:42] Trustee Luckham: IT'S MOVED, YOU'LL SECOND IT. ANY DISCUSSION?

[2:59:47] Trustee Luckham: ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? PERFECT.

[2:59:50] Trustee Luckham: AND I'M TRUSTING YOU GOT THAT, KATHERINE.

[2:59:53] Voice 12: YES, THANK YOU.

[2:59:54] Trustee Luckham: THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT.

[2:59:57] Trustee Luckham: All right, I'm going to move along.

[3:00:00] Trustee Luckham: I'm going to mention my own staff report on page.

[3:00:04] Trustee Luckham: Whenever it is 89.

[3:00:15] Voice 11: Essentially, yes, the Commission terms

[3:00:19] Voice 11: will expire in June 2nd this year.

[3:00:22] Voice 11: We are recommending that you send letters to them,

[3:00:25] Voice 11: thanking them for their participation and inviting

[3:00:27] Voice 11: their expressions of interest for

[3:00:29] Voice 11: your reappointment for the future.

[3:00:30] Voice 11: return, and advertise for public expression of interest for any members.

[3:00:40] Voice 5: Excellent. That sounds very normal and simple.

[3:00:46] Voice 17: You

[3:00:46] Trustee Luckham: know something? This is a great standing resolution, too. The expiration of an APC.

[3:00:53] Trustee Luckham: Let's do it.

[3:00:54] Trustee Luckham: Yeah, let's just do it. Because really, the decision piece is when you come back with the

[3:00:59] Trustee Luckham: thing. Anyway, let's get this one on the fly.

[3:01:02] Trustee Luckham: I'll

[3:01:02] Voice 6: make the motion that

[3:01:04] Voice 6: the Lusketeer Local Trust Committee request staff to A, send letters

[3:01:12] Voice 6: to members of the Advisory

[3:01:13] Voice 6: Planning Commission whose terms will expire on June 22, 2022,

[3:01:17] Voice 6: thanking them for their participation and inviting their expressions of interest for

[3:01:21] Voice 6: reappointment for another two-year term, and B, advertise their public expressions of interest

[3:01:26] Voice 6: for new members.

[3:01:27] Voice 6: Can

[3:01:28] Trustee Johnston: I ask why two-year term? The trustee's term is ending well before that. It's not

[3:01:37] Trustee Johnston: unusual to have somebody from the APC become a trustee and they need to be replaced. Is

[3:01:44] Trustee Johnston: it a good practice or a bad practice to let the new local trust committee appoint new

[3:01:50] Trustee Johnston: new APC members.

[3:01:51] Voice 13: I think you're a

[3:01:53] Voice 13: PC by law.

[3:01:55] Trustee Johnston: There's a term. Yeah. But that's when trustees were on two

[3:02:01] Trustee Johnston: year terms.

[3:02:04] Trustee Johnston: That's how old the bylaw is.

[3:02:08] Trustee Johnston: Okay.

[3:02:10] Trustee Luckham: So yeah, so the bylaw presently says three years. So

[3:02:17] Trustee Luckham: at this point, we're obligated to continue that practice unless

[3:02:20] Trustee Luckham: unless you want to amend the bylaw.

[3:02:23] Trustee Johnston: It's a bigger process.

[3:02:25] Trustee Johnston: The New Choice Committee

[3:02:27] Trustee Johnston: can remove any APC members

[3:02:30] Trustee Johnston: it wants to when they're elected.

[3:02:34] Trustee Luckham: Well, I think that exists anyway.

[3:02:36] Trustee Luckham: They really want to settle up to it,

[3:02:37] Trustee Luckham: but that's another story.

[3:02:40] Voice 11: Maybe I'll just add to that.

[3:02:44] Voice 11: The APC can start, I think this is where you're going,

[3:02:47] Voice 11: They can start their term whenever you decide to appoint them.

[3:02:54] Voice 11: It does need to be a two-year term.

[3:02:56] Voice 11: But yes, you could hold off on reappointing the APC

[3:03:00] Voice 11: and have the new LTC go through the appointment process.

[3:03:06] Voice 11: So that's theoretically possible.

[3:03:08] Voice 11: But it sounds like you have work that you might want to have them do in the short term.

[3:03:12] Trustee Luckham: But my interest might expire after six months.

[3:03:15] Trustee Luckham: Yeah.

[3:03:16] Trustee Luckham: That's another thing.

[3:03:17] Trustee Luckham: but anyway i think we can advance this is that all right peter yeah so then i think it was moved

[3:03:25] Trustee Luckham: and seconded and now sure thank you and so then any further discussion all those in favor and

[3:03:33] Trustee Luckham: carries um all right so if there's nothing further on that item i'll move along to definitions of

[3:03:43] Trustee Luckham: sleeping cabin in land use bylaw for discussion and peter johnson i believe you brought that

[3:03:50] Voice 6: Oh, we sort of skipped over it. I just wanted to quickly ask about the meeting for the correspondence from the BC

[3:03:59] Trustee Luckham: Electoral Boundaries Commission.

[3:04:01] Voice 6: Thank

[3:04:01] Trustee Luckham: you for bringing that up. I apologize for skipping over that. So yeah, before we go on to the definitions, then. So there is a correspondence there regarding the BC Electoral Boundaries Commission, Electoral Boundaries Commission.

[3:04:16] Trustee Luckham: Commission. Indeed, there's a lot of talk in local governments about this and whether

[3:04:21] Trustee Luckham: or not we should become interested or concerned about it. Do you have anything to report on

[3:04:28] Trustee Luckham: that? You just take the letter of face value. Yes. So, trustees, what are your thoughts

[3:04:34] Trustee Luckham: on this item? This would influence your electoral area director.

[3:04:42] Voice 6: sure yeah and and uh i mean it's interesting the uh i believe it's the the federal boundary that's

[3:04:51] Voice 6: um in discussion right now and and uh gabriola is it not this is

[3:05:01] Voice 13: there's

[3:05:02] Voice 6: one that's being proposed that would sort of put part of gabriola

[3:05:08] Voice 6: the fact that the the line goes through the middle or through part of the island is anyway

[3:05:13] Voice 6: Anyway, it's quite controversial from what I understand,

[3:05:17] Voice 6: not being from Gabriela, I don't remember the details properly.

[3:05:21] Voice 11: It's about the population, but Gabriela is a designated area

[3:05:25] Voice 11: when they go through the census count,

[3:05:27] Voice 11: and so that includes Mudge and DeCourcy,

[3:05:29] Voice 11: and because those are, so the population is estimated

[3:05:33] Voice 11: because it's a designated area and not a specific population center

[3:05:38] Voice 11: that's reported differently, the population changes.

[3:05:42] Voice 6: yes but then that's affecting

[3:05:44] Voice 6: the way it's it's getting allocated into the into the the boundary

[3:05:48] Voice 6: lines for the electoral district right

[3:05:52] Voice 11: well i

[3:05:54] Voice 6: mean that's that's what i understand like i don't

[3:05:57] Voice 6: like to say to pretend to know all the details but that there's

[3:06:00] Voice 16: that federal electoral area

[3:06:02] Voice 16: it goes all the way to ladysmith so

[3:06:06] Voice 6: i guess the the question is is like where they're redrawing

[3:06:09] Voice 6: the boundaries um as I if I if I'm remembering correctly it's it's taking a portion of Gabriela

[3:06:23] Voice 6: out of sort of the Nanaimo portion of that writing and apportioning it to further south

[3:06:30] Voice 6: anyway

[3:06:31] Voice 13: it's it's just one of those things I mean

[3:06:33] Voice 6: we all know the the joys

[3:06:36] Voice 13: of gerrymandering

[3:06:37] Voice 13: in

[3:06:37] Voice 6: some of these districts, especially in parts

[3:06:40] Trustee Luckham: of the U.S.,

[3:06:40] Voice 6: but just interesting that we don't have

[3:06:42] Trustee Luckham: to dwell on this.

[3:06:45] Trustee Luckham: Okay, so is there any action that needs to be taken with the provincial electoral boundaries?

[3:06:50] Trustee Luckham: I don't think so.

[3:06:53] Voice 10: All right, so

[3:06:54] Voice 15: then we'll just receive that information.

[3:06:56] Trustee Luckham: So now then, I do want to go to 12.2, definition of sleeping cabin,

[3:07:01] Trustee Luckham: and the land use bylaw for discussion, and Peter Johnson, I believe this is your option.

[3:07:05] Trustee Johnston: It's actually a sleeping unit, and I don't know what it means, as Trust Planner Cowher is correct.

[3:07:13] Trustee Johnston: It only occurs once, and it has to do with the hotel, and they're called hotel sleeping units, which I assume means rooms.

[3:07:22] Voice 13: And

[3:07:22] Trustee Johnston: I was surprised.

[3:07:25] Trustee Johnston: I unwisely answered an inquiry about them

[3:07:29] Trustee Johnston: and forwarded it to our planner

[3:07:33] Trustee Johnston: who had a very different view than I did.

[3:07:37] Trustee Johnston: And hers was that the sleeping unit

[3:07:39] Trustee Johnston: is the same as a guest cabin.

[3:07:42] Trustee Johnston: But I don't know what it means.

[3:07:45] Trustee Johnston: I don't, the definition doesn't,

[3:07:47] Trustee Johnston: it seems to me a sleeping unit

[3:07:49] Trustee Johnston: is a building with one room,

[3:07:51] Trustee Johnston: no kitchen in which people sleep

[3:07:54] Trustee Johnston: or somebody sleeps.

[3:07:58] Voice 11: Yeah, there was a question about whether or not a sleeping cabin was the

[3:08:04] Voice 11: same as a guest cabin. And my read of a guest cabin and the definition of it is that it does,

[3:08:13] Voice 11: it is a sleeping cabin is a guest cabin. And it does because it doesn't include any

[3:08:18] Voice 11: clarification about kitchen facilities or bathrooms. It's just a separate room where

[3:08:24] Voice 11: somebody sleeps. And so my take on it was that a sleeping cabin does meet the definition and

[3:08:30] Voice 11: therefore is regulated as a guest cabin is. The sleeping unit is defined but it's related to a

[3:08:38] Voice 11: hotel.

[3:08:40] Voice 6: And this is from the land use bylaw?

[3:08:42] Trustee Johnston: Yes. I don't know if there any exist now but there have

[3:08:47] Trustee Johnston: been a couple that I know of people who have a number of separate buildings in which people sleep

[3:08:54] Trustee Johnston: don't have a kitchen, they have a central

[3:08:56] Trustee Johnston: kitchen, a communal

[3:08:58] Trustee Johnston: place.

[3:09:00] Trustee Johnston: I don't know if that's

[3:09:03] Trustee Johnston: allowable under land use

[3:09:04] Trustee Johnston: by law or if that's a way of increasing

[3:09:06] Trustee Johnston: density beyond the

[3:09:07] Trustee Johnston: number of dwellings.

[3:09:11] Trustee Johnston: We don't need to spend much

[3:09:13] Trustee Johnston: time on this.

[3:09:14] Trustee Johnston: When we do revise the

[3:09:16] Trustee Johnston: land use by law, I would recommend

[3:09:18] Trustee Johnston: taking that definition out or

[3:09:20] Trustee Johnston: clarifying it.

[3:09:24] Voice 2: Okay.

[3:09:25] Voice 2: Okay so is there any action you want to take today? Nope.

[3:09:29] Trustee Luckham: Okay so 12.3 then is tree cutting

[3:09:32] Trustee Luckham: and Tim Peterson did you put that on there?

[3:09:34] Trustee Johnston: No I did. Oh okay

[3:09:36] Trustee Johnston: go with that. It was basically in

[3:09:39] Trustee Johnston: response to Christos's concerns and the end of his email that he sent to the community I don't

[3:09:47] Trustee Johnston: know if it's gone to the community yet, sorry, says he hopes for assurances from both our

[3:09:55] Trustee Johnston: local trust committee, from our local trust committee, that decisions about this will

[3:10:00] Trustee Johnston: only be discarded by Luskeetians and not by staff in Victoria. And that, as I understand

[3:10:08] Trustee Johnston: that, well, I was told actually by David Marler down last week that it would be up to each

[3:10:15] Trustee Johnston: LTC to decide what to do, but it could be that Trust Council will want to put something

[3:10:22] Trustee Johnston: into the directors' policies the next time the policy statement is revised.

[3:10:29] Trustee Johnston: Might it not?

[3:10:31] Voice 15: Well, I think that

[3:10:33] Voice 16: question remains

[3:10:35] Trustee Luckham: unanswered, because we haven't really crafted the wording

[3:10:41] Trustee Luckham: around the directors.

[3:10:43] Trustee Luckham: We've, we've done it. And so, and then of course the directives mean that when you open

[3:10:51] Trustee Luckham: up an OCP or an LUB you will take these actions.

[3:10:54] Trustee Luckham: If you don't ever open up the LCP or the LUB

[3:10:56] Trustee Luckham: doesn't mean you necessarily will change it. Right.

[3:11:00] Trustee Luckham: And I think many of these things would

[3:11:03] Trustee Luckham: would fall into development permit areas and those kinds of things,

[3:11:10] Trustee Luckham: more so than a specific tree-cutting regulation that would be applied federation-wide.

[3:11:20] Trustee Luckham: And Planner Cower may have something else to say.

[3:11:25] Voice 11: Yeah, I think maybe what David was referring to was a tree protection bylaw,

[3:11:30] Voice 11: which is not something that we have the

[3:11:32] Voice 11: authority to do at the moment.

[3:11:33] Voice 11: I was just can't do them. But if we were granted the authority to do tree protection bylaws, we would anticipate that each LTC would be considering those.

[3:11:45] Voice 11: Yeah.

[3:11:46] Trustee Luckham: So, yeah, I think this may simply get no traction, actually.

[3:11:52] Trustee Luckham: Yeah.

[3:11:53] Trustee Johnston: I'm not sure what you mean.

[3:11:54] Trustee Luckham: Well, it's just too early like we're hearing back now through the 2050 about that we there are discussions with the province that are going on.

[3:12:04] Trustee Luckham: And so it's hard to say, actually, whether or not we get support from the public or the province for such a thing, because certainly the Ministry of Forests likes to kind of manage all that stuff.

[3:12:18] Trustee Luckham: Do

[3:12:18] Trustee Johnston: you have a sense of when there might be a decision from the ministry or from the province, or what it's likely to be? Are they thinking about it?

[3:12:29] Trustee Johnston: um

[3:12:31] Trustee Luckham: they've asked some they've asked some questions and to seeking clarity on what it is that we

[3:12:37] Trustee Luckham: actually want to accomplish and and i think that part of that may only be answered by us

[3:12:43] Trustee Luckham: coming to a better place with the policy statement and considering what um our

[3:12:51] Trustee Luckham: our objectives are there so i don't have a sense of anything in particular i think it's just simply

[3:12:59] Trustee Luckham: too early to tell and of course council hasn't rubber stamped anything like we did that last

[3:13:06] Trustee Luckham: go around ourselves to say well what did you mean by tree cutting what did you want and so we

[3:13:12] Trustee Luckham: haven't actually had a conversation with council yet to say this is what we want so i think there's

[3:13:18] Trustee Luckham: going to be an opportunity in the near future that's going to be summarized as this is what

[3:13:22] Trustee Luckham: we've heard from the province this is what we've heard from the public um if you were going to

[3:13:27] Trustee Luckham: to consider something, these are the options that are open to you. And what do you want to do? And

[3:13:32] Trustee Luckham: then it may be the council goes, no, we don't want to do that, based upon public feedback. You know,

[3:13:38] Trustee Luckham: I think there's ongoing necessity, as I expressed to Christos, to have an ongoing conversation about

[3:13:44] Trustee Luckham: values and about what's important about trees standing and trees on the ground versus anything

[3:13:53] Trustee Luckham: anything else.

[3:13:55] Trustee Johnston: Thank you.

[3:13:58] Trustee Luckham: So does that do it?

[3:14:00] Trustee Luckham: Yep.

[3:14:01] Trustee Luckham: Perfect. Thank you.

[3:14:03] Trustee Luckham: So I'm just going to go through these other items here

[3:14:05] Trustee Luckham: at 3.17. I think

[3:14:07] Trustee Luckham: I really do want to be added at 3.30.

[3:14:10] Trustee Luckham: On stress conservancy

[3:14:11] Trustee Luckham: report, that's there for your information.

[3:14:15] Trustee Luckham: Certainly

[3:14:16] Trustee Luckham: any inquiries could be directed

[3:14:17] Trustee Luckham: to them or even

[3:14:19] Trustee Luckham: Sue Ellen Fast, who is our

[3:14:22] Trustee Luckham: Our executive is a representative on the Conservancy.

[3:14:29] Trustee Luckham: We've got an application report dated here March the 30th.

[3:14:32] Trustee Luckham: Are there any questions about the application report?

[3:14:35] Voice 15: Nope.

[3:14:36] Trustee Luckham: Okay, so we'll receive that for information.

[3:14:39] Trustee Luckham: Expense report there.

[3:14:40] Trustee Luckham: Usually I tell people if you've got any concerns about your expense report,

[3:14:44] Trustee Luckham: I'd like them to Nancy Rogers.

[3:14:45] Trustee Luckham: But are there any questions that you might happen to have about anything that's missing?

[3:14:50] Trustee Luckham: year and often these lag this is uh dated january and we're already in april so anything current

[3:14:57] Trustee Luckham: will is not reflected in it right

[3:14:59] Trustee Johnston: they i just received one within the last week that must have

[3:15:04] Trustee Johnston: been from march could be yeah

[3:15:06] Trustee Johnston: in my email and i've always believed and i think i've been told

[3:15:10] Trustee Johnston: that as long as we're not overspending the total amount it doesn't particularly matter if we

[3:15:14] Trustee Johnston: We overspend one section.

[3:15:17] Trustee Luckham: Yeah,

[3:15:17] Trustee Johnston: as long as the LTC broadly is not

[3:15:19] Trustee Luckham: overspent, yeah.

[3:15:20] Trustee Johnston: Right.

[3:15:21] Trustee Johnston: Okay, thank you.

[3:15:22] Trustee Johnston: And

[3:15:22] Trustee Luckham: it's never big enough numbers to worry about.

[3:15:27] Trustee Johnston: Okay, thank you.

[3:15:28] Trustee Luckham: Okay, adopted policies and standing resolutions.

[3:15:32] Trustee Luckham: That's where we're going to slot in that meetings thing if we do that.

[3:15:36] Trustee Luckham: So that's just there for your information.

[3:15:39] Trustee Luckham: Local Trust Committee webpage.

[3:15:41] Trustee Luckham: page. There's always a desire to do more, but not sure if you

[3:15:46] Trustee Luckham: have any interest at the moment. So I'll continue on if I'm not

[3:15:50] Trustee Luckham: seeing anything. So this comes to our top priorities report

[3:15:53] Trustee Luckham: dated March 30. That's what's presently on the list. And I've

[3:15:59] Trustee Luckham: just received that information unless you have something you

[3:16:02] Trustee Luckham: want to change, but wouldn't recommend it. Okay, so projects

[3:16:09] Trustee Luckham: list that's also there for your information and will be projects that you can be picked

[3:16:13] Trustee Luckham: up when the LTC has some spare time or prioritizes them so then I'm going to continue to our

[3:16:20] Trustee Luckham: next meeting is Monday June the 6th can you believe it'll be the year will be half over

[3:16:25] Trustee Luckham: by the time we meet the next time I can't believe it so looking forward to that meeting

[3:16:30] Trustee Luckham: and you know we will until things change we'll continue doing them in this electronic fashion

[3:16:36] Trustee Luckham: and hopefully the next go around won't be as troublesome as this startup and hopefully the

[3:16:42] Trustee Luckham: weather will be better both for us going home tonight and for us to meet again in june so

[3:16:48] Trustee Luckham: without further ado i'll ask for a motion to adjourn move and seconded

[3:16:54] Trustee Luckham: one

[3:16:55] Trustee Johnston: one thing i'd like to correct i said june 19th it's june friday june 15th is this event

[3:17:01] Trustee Johnston: in to Squiddy Bay. Okay. Okay.

[3:17:06] Trustee Luckham: So all those in favor. Thank you. We are adjourned. Thank you,

[3:17:12] Trustee Luckham: Catherine and anybody else out there. Well, whoever lives looking after us today.